FDA GIves ok on cloned meat.

[StinkerBell]

http://health.msn.com/nutrition/articlepage.aspx?cp-documentid=100188119&GT1=10815


ummmmmmm this is not good IMO

[ScottA]

The biggest problem with cloning, and it is a big one, is that it will lead to a lack of diversity of species. This creates a situation where a singles virus could wipe out the entire population of cattle or chickens or whatever. If no other species have been bread for many years there might not be enough survivors to start over. Then we are all screwed so to speak.

[StinkerBell]

Also consider that they may breed the same genetic issue that can be harmful to humans that are repeatedly exposed to it. 

[Drew]

Good heavens, what are we thinking?  Everyone wants more meat, even though it is a reverse factory process (Feed 8 pounds of corn to a steer for 1 pound of flesh.). 

"We appreciate FDA's careful review of the science surrounding cloning," James H. Hodges, president of the American Meat Institute, said in a statement. "Clearly, however, the cloning of animals is a new technology and our members will evaluate it, as well as consumer attitudes, very carefully."

Of course.  And whatever can be done to maintain that demand through efficient marketing practices will be embraced.  That will likely involve downplaying the fact that a meat product came from a cloned animal.  As the article said, it won't be selling the clones.  It will be selling the product of the clones.  Will they have to label a steak from an offspring of a cloned bull/cow (Let's call this Beef(1))?  Probably.  How about the offspring of an offspring (Beef(2))?  What about a can of chili or beef bullion?

Okay, so maybe you want to market clone-free animals.  The cloned beef business may lobby for the strictest tests in order to increase the costs of proving your beef is clone-free.  It might even make it illegal to label a product clone-free because it is too hard to prove or inflammatory to cloned producers.

Resting the entire argument on whether the food is safe (now) or not is in appropriate.  We as consumers can object to the methods used to produce our food and we need to maintain our ability to choose between products.  Consider conflict diamonds, child labor, and pollution controls.

[StinkerBell]

One of my big concerns is that they will not label the meat as cloned. Currently the diary community does not need to list the hormones they add to milk and other additives...

[Redoverfarm]

Cloning will probably only (?) occur to get the top breeding cattle. But that will eventually funnel down to the local farmer as he wants to own a top producing bull or cow to get the best price for his product. So it will hit home later.  Might be several years but that local farmer will buy a prize bull that is the descendant of the great grandfather prize bull. 

Or the same can be said for the dairy producer. His milk cows will be the most productive that he can get. So they will be the great grandaughter's of a prize winning cow.  And chances are that Her offspring will be direct decendant's of two cloned cattle. 

This could get very complicated. But what isn't.

[Homegrown Tomatoes]

Ew.  All the more reason, if you're going to eat meat, raise it yourself, breed your meat animals yourself, and know what you're getting if you buy at the store!!!!!!  Go squirrel hunting for Pete's sake (not likely USDA will start cloning squirrels any time soon, at least).  Ugh... I just lost my appetite.  Maybe I'll go vegetarian for a while.

[StinkerBell]

I think I need a re introduction into the wonderful world of Bean and Lentil cooking....Ok, I need a first introduction.

[tanya]

I don't like the cloned animal thing at all.  For a lot of the reasons stated here but also because the animals cloned will eventually have major issues which the industry cannot hide.  The hormones and antibiotics are already taking a huge toll on the health of human populations.  Many ranchers use artificial insemination, it has been around for years the best animals are bred and raised in the hopes of breeding healthy animals but nature has a way of hiding certain problems until the animal is just plain bad for you and you might not know it for a long time like antibiotic resistance or certain genetic defects.  I am thinking of bangs disease I think it is called for years mothers had ot be careful nto to drink whole milk from cows who were not tested for bangs disease because their children could be born with serious birth defects. And I can remember when the feed houses were putting cement inthe feed to make the animals heavier before slaughter too.  I don't even understand why the industry wastes the money to get into all this cloning, hormone, antibiotic BS because the people are very well informed these days and all they are going to end up doing is causing a lot of people to not trust anything they say about anything and they certainly are not going to buy their FOOD from these idiots.  And as far as the FDA goes they are probably the most hideous govt. agency around they were paid off by the tobacco companies for years to say their products were not harmful too.  And It hink that they fail to investigate anything that isn't going to pay or put them in a postition to collect somehow.  I watch the tv and all day every day they have these ads fro medicine that has caused people hard and the lawyers are haing a field day getting people to sue.  Well they deserve to be sued because their product is bad for humans!!!  It is my opinion that the FDA should have determined that before they allowed the product on the market.  Maybe the actual product from the cloning wont be any different but the processes leading to the cloning and the results of the cloning are going to be different and so are the outcomes.  And you know what else I was watching the animal planet today and saw those sea lions withthe fishing nets stuck into ther necks all gross and grown around then, those fishermen should be keeping track of thier nets and should be responsible for making sure they are not harming other sea life.  Now damn it if I leave my garbage lying around and a wild animal gets caught up in it I am going to have to pay fines, vet bills and probably have some sort of crimminal charge too so why are these corportations granted this special status? 

[benevolance]

8 pounds of corn for one pound of beef and worth every kernel of it if you ask me..

I love saving energy planting trees and trying to be eco friendly...But I draw the line at being a veggie tarian

No Effing way...

To be fair though people eat too much red meat and we need to embrace more fruits and vegetables as humans to make sure we protect the environment and have enough food to feed the world...

[MountainDon]

Nothing like a good steak! But we don't eat that much of it. Probably eat at least as much, if not more elk/deer in a good year. Buffalo is good too, but I haven't hunted any.

Undecided on the cloning at this point........

[Sassy]

I'd posted an article about that in "what's for dinner awhile back...  I'll have to read it again...

Quote from: Sassy on October 29, 2007, 20:19:11
Well, this just might make you lose your appetite...

Cloned meat/dairy make it to the dinner table...  http://www.examiner.com/a-1015939~Cloned_meat__dairy_make_way_to_the_table.html

[glenn kangiser]

I don't know why but all this talk of cloning reminded me of the redneck with a pig running around the house with only 3 legs.

A guest noticed it and asked what the problem was with the pig-- why did he have only 3 legs?

The redneck gave him a rather disgusted look and said, "He's a pet.  We  didn't want to eat him all at one time."

Hmm.  Maybe that wasn't cloning... maybe it was cannibalism... or something like it. hmm

[MountainDon]

What we need is to develop animals that could regrow legs, etc. Then we could eat them one piece at a time,over and over again. 

[Sassy]

where's the "groan" smiley when you need one?   

[glenn kangiser]

What we need is to develop animals that could regrow legs, etc. Then we could eat them one piece at a time,over and over again. 

...and never be without our favorite pet.

[benevolance]

Hey we could all grow genetically modified cows and clone them... Frankencows

Brilliant

[glenn kangiser]

Hey we could all grow genetically modified cows and clone them... Frankencows

Brilliant

What is cool about that is that they coul just splice on a couple extra legs to eat and the cow could still follow you around on all 4's.

[Drew]

This is a society that thinks the turducken is a good idea.  Can you blame Dr. Frankenfurter for filling the need?   

[Homegrown Tomatoes]

As someone said earlier, potentially the worst thing about cloning would be the loss of genetic diversity.  But of course, we've been doing that for years in huge monoculture factory-farmed plants... all it would take is something like a widespread potato blight or some disease affecting corn or wheat to devastate agriculture as this country knows it.  All the more reason why farmers and those with land should do their best to preserve heirloom plants and breeds of animals and those who live in cities need to make informed choices about what and how they are eating.  I think in our family (including my extended family) we're indoctrinating our kids early.  My niece was preaching at her grandpa here a while back that property taxes are evil (she was 4 at the time) and I heard my daughter telling relative strangers not to buy carrots at the grocery store because they don't taste nearly as good as the ones from Mama's garden, and if they wanted carrots that taste good, they should plant their own in their yard, too.  My daughter also told the owner of a local restaurant here a while back that he doesn't have to use those "pale" tomatoes in his cooking... he could grow his own and they would actually taste like tomatoes.  Sometimes I think something like a widespread blight or a total upheaval of the economics in this country could be a blessing in disguise... it would force people to look at things for what they are and question the way they're existing.  Sadly, it would affect a lot of people in the cities who don't have a way of producing their own food or moving to a place they could...  One thing I learned from my grandpa, who was a farmer in OK during the Dust Bowl... I remember having to interview someone who lived through the Depression for a school history paper.  When I asked him how they survived the Dust Bowl without moving west like everyone else, he looked me in the eye and said, "We didn't even know there was a Depression.  We were always poor, but we always had enough to eat."  His father and grandfather who'd farmed the land before him had built in steep terraces all over the land, and lo and behold, their land didn't blow away... those terraces are STILL there.  He told me that the key to staying on their land was the lack of debt, and the fact that they grew a little of everything.  Where crops that need a lot of water failed those years, and the apples and peaches were small, things like okra and black-eyed peas did fine.  They planted the orchards, under all the trees, with crowder and black-eyed peas.  They planted watermelon in the creek bed and had watermelon in spite of the drought.  They didn't buy grain to fatten their cows but finished them out grass-fed and traded the meat for things they did need from the grocer in town.  They used native prairie grass for hay instead of planting something less hardy. If you ask me, diverse agriculture (both plant and animal) and lack of debt are still two keys to survival when times are tough. 

[Drew]

That's it, HT.  But one of the things that concern me is this:  What happens when the blight comes and people need what we have?  Will we be able to protect it or will new laws come into play that allow the government to control or even redistribute our land?

The same thing could happen on the money front as well.  As a matter of fact, it is perhaps more likely than the above scenario.  What happens when our consumer debt situation gets worse and we end up with a large group of people who have underfunded "retirements".  Will our government look to those of us who have saved our money in a financial institution or company pension fund and redistribute it?  Put another way, if your job is dependent on making the most people happy and you see 100 people without and 1 with, what would you do?