Author Topic: Glenn's Underground Cabin Update  (Read 1911657 times)

0 Members and 2 Guests are viewing this topic.

Offline glenn kangiser

  • The Troglodyte
  • Administrator
  • Journeyman
  • *****
  • Posts: 24,906
  • Central California Sierras- Home of Yosemite NP
    • Underground Cabin
Re: Glenn's Underground Cabin Update
« Reply #1050 on: November 10, 2008, 10:06:59 PM »
I can explain about the sign.   [noidea'

I didn't steal it and put it up at my place.

It was down near another neighbors place.

He came up to visit while I was away.  :(

When I came back ..... there was the sign. d*

He said he got tired of looking at it and thought with all the trouble I had fighting authority during the fire that I deserved to have it.   heh


Really..... like.......dude.... I couldn't make this stuff up.   [slap]
"Always work from the general to the specific." J. Raabe

Glenn's Underground Cabin  http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=151.0

Please put your area in your sig line so we can assist with location specific answers.

Offline Whitlock

  • Senior Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 691
  • In Gold We Trust
Re: Glenn's Underground Cabin Update
« Reply #1051 on: November 11, 2008, 09:29:01 AM »
Glenn you going to put your boards today d*
Make Peace With Your Past So It Won't Screw Up The Present

Offline glenn kangiser

  • The Troglodyte
  • Administrator
  • Journeyman
  • *****
  • Posts: 24,906
  • Central California Sierras- Home of Yosemite NP
    • Underground Cabin
Re: Glenn's Underground Cabin Update
« Reply #1052 on: November 11, 2008, 10:01:49 AM »
I forgot about them -- think I have to try Carla's pipeline first - hopefully Fresno tomorrow - possibly tonight I may work there a little.
"Always work from the general to the specific." J. Raabe

Glenn's Underground Cabin  http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=151.0

Please put your area in your sig line so we can assist with location specific answers.

Offline akemt

  • Junior Member
  • **
  • Posts: 99
  • Southeast Alaska
Re: Glenn's Underground Cabin Update
« Reply #1053 on: November 14, 2008, 09:17:36 AM »
Glenn,

Can you give me some information (or link me to it if it already exhists) about building costs for your place?  We'd do everything ourselves and could get the logs and perhaps some rough-cut lumber ourselves for nothing but labor, but things like car decking would have to be purchased.  I am just wondering about the cost comparison to countryplans-style stick framing. 

Thanks!
Catherine

Stay-at-home, homeschooling mother of 6 in "nowhere" Alaska

Offline glenn kangiser

  • The Troglodyte
  • Administrator
  • Journeyman
  • *****
  • Posts: 24,906
  • Central California Sierras- Home of Yosemite NP
    • Underground Cabin
Re: Glenn's Underground Cabin Update
« Reply #1054 on: November 14, 2008, 04:19:55 PM »
I scrounged most things, Catherine, but I had to buy some logs as I didn't have them  on the property.  I also bought plastic -nails etc.  I sawed my own boards.  I estimate that I spent around $5000 without the electricity and plumbing. 

We have around $25000 in the solar and wind I think.  It is hard to nail down the numbers here because I scrounged a lot of stuff and did a lot of labor or had a few guys that worked with me help once in a while.  I owned my own excavating equipment and crane truck so was not out money for it.

Depending on your needs and scrounging ability along with your natural resources - it could cost anywhere from a few hundred to $20000 or more.  Use an EPDM roof (pond) liner to eliminate many potential problems.  I think there is still a cheap source in Oregon.

Lets see what your needs are and figure something up for you.  Sketch out a floor plan keeping in mind things may change depending on your property.  Normal modules of Mikes engineering are 8'x8' or 8'x10'6"  Many can be combined to make bigger rooms with  posts in them.  I also have a way to get a larger space for a great room running braces diagonally - up to 21 x 16 less area taken by posts.
"Always work from the general to the specific." J. Raabe

Glenn's Underground Cabin  http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=151.0

Please put your area in your sig line so we can assist with location specific answers.

Offline glenn kangiser

  • The Troglodyte
  • Administrator
  • Journeyman
  • *****
  • Posts: 24,906
  • Central California Sierras- Home of Yosemite NP
    • Underground Cabin
Re: Glenn's Underground Cabin Update
« Reply #1055 on: November 16, 2008, 11:20:22 AM »
Upgrade to the Kitchen this weekend mandated by Sassy.  As Whitlock put it  "Early American Settler" style....





with screws.... [crz]


"Always work from the general to the specific." J. Raabe

Glenn's Underground Cabin  http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=151.0

Please put your area in your sig line so we can assist with location specific answers.

Offline Sassy

  • Journeyman
  • *****
  • Posts: 4,315
  • Calif Gold Country
Re: Glenn's Underground Cabin Update
« Reply #1056 on: November 16, 2008, 11:37:07 AM »
Needed more storage  :)  I still have to sand & finish the shelves, but gives me more counter space & shelves.  The discoloration in the floor area was under a small set of shelves that I moved into the master bath - will need to refinish the floor - I kept looking for shelves that would fit between the toilet & wall by the clawfoot bathtub - something kept telling me to not buy anything that I'd soon have what I needed for the area - the shelves I moved out of the kitchen fit perfectly in that spot  8) 

BTW, the roses are from the garden...   ;D

I even made DH some cinnamon rolls  c*
http://glennkathystroglodytecabin.blogspot.com/

You will know the truth & the truth will set you free

Offline glenn kangiser

  • The Troglodyte
  • Administrator
  • Journeyman
  • *****
  • Posts: 24,906
  • Central California Sierras- Home of Yosemite NP
    • Underground Cabin
Re: Glenn's Underground Cabin Update
« Reply #1057 on: November 19, 2008, 06:51:59 PM »
After Sassy's finish job, a similar picture to compare,



y otra lado....

"Always work from the general to the specific." J. Raabe

Glenn's Underground Cabin  http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=151.0

Please put your area in your sig line so we can assist with location specific answers.

Offline Curtis

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 125
Re: Glenn's Underground Cabin Update
« Reply #1058 on: November 19, 2008, 07:07:03 PM »
Looks nice!
-Curtis

Offline MountainDon

  • Administrator
  • Journeyman
  • *****
  • Posts: 16,695
  • Jemez Mountains, NM; that's pronounced HEY-mess
    • My 15.75 x 30 Jemez Cabin
Re: Glenn's Underground Cabin Update
« Reply #1059 on: November 19, 2008, 07:31:58 PM »
Is that some of the gnarly pine you spoke of?
Just because something has been done and has not failed, doesn’t mean it is good design.

Offline glenn kangiser

  • The Troglodyte
  • Administrator
  • Journeyman
  • *****
  • Posts: 24,906
  • Central California Sierras- Home of Yosemite NP
    • Underground Cabin
Re: Glenn's Underground Cabin Update
« Reply #1060 on: November 19, 2008, 07:34:43 PM »
Thanks, Curtis.  Some day when you are old and crazy this could be you.... :)



Yes Don.  They call it Bull Pine commonly around here.   They grow every way but straight.  This was from about a reasonably straight 16 foot section 20 inch or so dia log..  It had been down a year or so and had a bit of poor wood in it, but very colorful.
"Always work from the general to the specific." J. Raabe

Glenn's Underground Cabin  http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=151.0

Please put your area in your sig line so we can assist with location specific answers.

Offline Whitlock

  • Senior Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 691
  • In Gold We Trust
Re: Glenn's Underground Cabin Update
« Reply #1061 on: November 19, 2008, 07:42:26 PM »
Bull pine or Digger pine. They grow crooked as a dogs hind leg. Once made into lumber you better get it nailed down or the boards will walk off.
They have large edible pine nuts.
Not many people call them Digger pines anymore,I guess it insults the Digger Indians?
Make Peace With Your Past So It Won't Screw Up The Present

Offline glenn kangiser

  • The Troglodyte
  • Administrator
  • Journeyman
  • *****
  • Posts: 24,906
  • Central California Sierras- Home of Yosemite NP
    • Underground Cabin
Re: Glenn's Underground Cabin Update
« Reply #1062 on: November 19, 2008, 07:56:38 PM »
Digger insults the Indians, Whitlock, but I do hear it called that once in a while.  It wouldn't be bad but in the old days the Whites around here considered it derogatory so I guess that's what it became. 

I think it was just in reference to them hunting and gathering acorns - other food from the natural resources.  I have had friends come and show me some of the thinks of interest around us including how to make beads from the pine nuts.  My grandson loves the Indian History and we had a nice get together here where some of them came over and sang tribal songs and played the flute for his visit.  They even brought him gifts.
"Always work from the general to the specific." J. Raabe

Glenn's Underground Cabin  http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=151.0

Please put your area in your sig line so we can assist with location specific answers.

Offline Curtis

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 125
Re: Glenn's Underground Cabin Update
« Reply #1063 on: November 19, 2008, 08:01:08 PM »
Thanks, Curtis.  Some day when you are old and crazy this could be you.... :)



Yes Don.  They call it Bull Pine commonly around here.   They grow every way but straight.  This was from about a reasonably straight 16 foot section 20 inch or so dia log..  It had been down a year or so and had a bit of poor wood in it, but very colorful.

I'm on my way. Haha.
-Curtis

Offline glenn kangiser

  • The Troglodyte
  • Administrator
  • Journeyman
  • *****
  • Posts: 24,906
  • Central California Sierras- Home of Yosemite NP
    • Underground Cabin
Re: Glenn's Underground Cabin Update
« Reply #1064 on: November 20, 2008, 07:54:50 AM »
Thanks, Curtis.  Some day when you are old and crazy this could be you.... :)



Yes Don.  They call it Bull Pine commonly around here.   They grow every way but straight.  This was from about a reasonably straight 16 foot section 20 inch or so dia log..  It had been down a year or so and had a bit of poor wood in it, but very colorful.

Continuing the confusion...

The wood gets so hard in dried areas that I have actually seen sparks fly off of the blade on the band saw in the day time.  I had hit one hard knot on the log cutting the caps off slightly dulling the blade. 

After thinking that was it I decided to see how far the blade would go and with the diesel spray and lots of water, I think Whitlock said we made 260 board feet.

Replies to this may be posted on the other thread. [rofl2]

Actually I was feeling guilty for not posting anything in the other thread so put it there too, but I posted a different view here also. :)
"Always work from the general to the specific." J. Raabe

Glenn's Underground Cabin  http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=151.0

Please put your area in your sig line so we can assist with location specific answers.

Offline Redoverfarm

  • Journeyman
  • *****
  • Posts: 6,755
  • Applachian Mtns, West Virginia
Re: Glenn's Underground Cabin Update
« Reply #1065 on: November 20, 2008, 11:26:16 AM »
Talking about a fire starter.  If you can find a few bull pine knots to throw in the stove they will light with only a match.  Don't put too many in at one time or your stove will look like a foundry. ;D

Offline glenn kangiser

  • The Troglodyte
  • Administrator
  • Journeyman
  • *****
  • Posts: 24,906
  • Central California Sierras- Home of Yosemite NP
    • Underground Cabin
Re: Glenn's Underground Cabin Update
« Reply #1066 on: November 20, 2008, 06:17:44 PM »
Our old Round Oak stove is very efficient with under fire- mid fire and over fire air.  It starts easy and if you use dry bull pine cut small it will just about jump out of the cabin by itself.  It will heat it up in a very short time.  I havent cut any for starter wood though - I need to get some cut but it really builds creosote in the pipes as they exit underground. 

Anybody know any good uses for creosote granules?

Keeping it cut small and burning hot keeps it to a minimum but sometimes I get a bit lazy. [crz]
"Always work from the general to the specific." J. Raabe

Glenn's Underground Cabin  http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=151.0

Please put your area in your sig line so we can assist with location specific answers.

Offline Redoverfarm

  • Journeyman
  • *****
  • Posts: 6,755
  • Applachian Mtns, West Virginia
Re: Glenn's Underground Cabin Update
« Reply #1067 on: November 20, 2008, 06:27:26 PM »
Our old Round Oak stove is very efficient with under fire- mid fire and over fire air.  It starts easy and if you use dry bull pine cut small it will just about jump out of the cabin by itself.  It will heat it up in a very short time.  I havent cut any for starter wood though - I need to get some cut but it really builds creosote in the pipes as they exit underground. 

Anybody know any good uses for creosote granules?

Keeping it cut small and burning hot keeps it to a minimum but sometimes I get a bit lazy. [crz]

Flaked creosote is also useful to start the fire with.  Put a handfull in on top of the kindlin.  Keep the stove doors shut though until it get burning good.  Always look for pine knots when around pine.  Another old fire starter was to soak corn cobs in kerosene and then allow them to dry.  Lights easy.   

Offline glenn kangiser

  • The Troglodyte
  • Administrator
  • Journeyman
  • *****
  • Posts: 24,906
  • Central California Sierras- Home of Yosemite NP
    • Underground Cabin
Re: Glenn's Underground Cabin Update
« Reply #1068 on: November 20, 2008, 06:34:33 PM »
Cool.  I have one stack of pipe about 8 feet tall with a cleanout at ground level.  The creosote falls to the cleanout and piles up - it's a capped T, so easy to clean.  It is at ground level by the garden.  I put a stove pipe brush in at that point and pull it through to the stove with a rope keeping a dust pan, bucket and shop vac there to catch the rest. 

It is pretty easy to do but I have to do it about 3 times per year.
"Always work from the general to the specific." J. Raabe

Glenn's Underground Cabin  http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=151.0

Please put your area in your sig line so we can assist with location specific answers.

Offline dra

  • Apprentice
  • *
  • Posts: 4
Re: Glenn's Underground Cabin Update
« Reply #1069 on: November 21, 2008, 01:49:05 AM »
Been a while since I last stopped by to look in on your progress.

I am in envy of your sawmill. I'd LOVE to have something to turn the massive quantity of cedar and pine I'd have to clear on the land to make a decent house sight into the lumber to build with.

As it is, i'm debating doing an experimental hobbit hole with Cedar logs. I've got a number of standing and fallen dead trees in excess of a food in diameter that are bone dry, but sound.

I know that cedar will be ok for the verticals, but i'm slightly leery of using them for rafters. I know how easy it is to get the stuff to break. Do you think I should cut some pine for the roof, or would 8"-12" cedar logs hold the kind of weight that this kind of construction has to put up with?

Offline glenn kangiser

  • The Troglodyte
  • Administrator
  • Journeyman
  • *****
  • Posts: 24,906
  • Central California Sierras- Home of Yosemite NP
    • Underground Cabin
Re: Glenn's Underground Cabin Update
« Reply #1070 on: November 21, 2008, 07:45:32 AM »
I don't know where you are located, but the cedar will work fine if you just reduce the loading on the roof.  The tables in Mikes book were rated at 2 feet of dirt and a foot of water.  He suggested reducing the load to 18" of dirt but in other places he said 6" was enough cover.  I agree and would keep it at 6" to 18" as I have on my place.

I have lot of Incense Cedar rafters as well as pine.

Keep the girders to 12" or more - rafters 8" nominal but Mike said not to have a cow about it if some were a bit small as there was a good safety factor.  Reduce loading as mentioned.
"Always work from the general to the specific." J. Raabe

Glenn's Underground Cabin  http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=151.0

Please put your area in your sig line so we can assist with location specific answers.

Offline dra

  • Apprentice
  • *
  • Posts: 4
Re: Glenn's Underground Cabin Update
« Reply #1071 on: November 21, 2008, 10:14:01 PM »
I'm up in Nevada county. It's...roughly the same terrain as you have, but at a higher elevation. A lot more trees.

Thanks for the advice.

Offline glenn kangiser

  • The Troglodyte
  • Administrator
  • Journeyman
  • *****
  • Posts: 24,906
  • Central California Sierras- Home of Yosemite NP
    • Underground Cabin
Re: Glenn's Underground Cabin Update
« Reply #1072 on: November 22, 2008, 07:12:19 AM »
Please feel free to ask anytime.  Nice area with lots of history there.

Once again. EPDM is the recommended roof membrane now per verbal from Mike.
"Always work from the general to the specific." J. Raabe

Glenn's Underground Cabin  http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=151.0

Please put your area in your sig line so we can assist with location specific answers.

Offline akemt

  • Junior Member
  • **
  • Posts: 99
  • Southeast Alaska
Re: Glenn's Underground Cabin Update
« Reply #1073 on: November 22, 2008, 10:35:22 AM »
Alaska rainforest girl again looking for price estimates (really rough is just fine).  180" of rain a year is normal, along with high water tables on flat areas.  FYI, there are some hillside lots here and some flat ones, none of which we yet own, thus the earlier confusion.  Sorry about that!

You'd asked me to make a floorplan sketch.  I feel a bit like I'm thinking inside the box.  Stick-framing is cheaper built in squares and rectangles/squares are simpler to build so that is what I went with not knowing the lot we'd be using or knowing what works best with this building method.  Though, dh best be getting it for me the book for Christmas...  Anyway, with all our young kids at home and homeschooling (4 kids, oldest is 5 1/2, youngest is 2 months), I planned for the smallest place I'd go with without a need to add on later.  I don't know if adding on later would be as difficult and messy as I'm currently thinking, though, and if it isn't as bad as it sounds we could cut one slice of the below grid dimensions off of the small side, making the grids more of a square and thus cutting the initial cost.  Anyway, with 8 x 8 sections we could get what I'd want out of a 4 x 5 grid of them (4 x 4 if with plans for a later addition).  With 8 x 10' 6 we could easily fit in a 3 (10'6 side) by 5 (8' side) grid (3 x 4 with later addition).  I can work easily within the posts/grids for a floorplan.  I'm just looking for structure/dry-in cost comparisons right now.  Electric, finishes, and plumbing can all come later.

Our basic needs for a stick-built can fit in a 20 x 34 with bathroom, large kitchen, and family area down and 3 lofts for sleeping up.  Then I wouldn't feel an immediate need to add on, but could still get the structure built with a year's savings at our current pay level.  I don't know if that helps, but that's basically what our needs are for a house.  3 sleeping "rooms" with space for 2 each, a main living area (that can convert to dining with a table with leafs or wall-mounted fold down...something of that nature), a big kitchen, and a bathroom.  A storage/pantry will be necessary at some point but can be a stand-alone structure or addition.

Our house that has been for sale for over a year now is supposed to close this next week :) and then we can start really taking out all our medical and consumer debt.  We're already down by half, the house sale will then cut us down to a quarter and the last credit card we should be able to knock out within a few months.  Then we'll be saving for building costs and the down payment on land.  I tend to research the cheapest and best options and then make a plan for it.  Having some kind of a date/dollar ammount to shoot for to get out of my mother's house would be a good motivator to save!  [crz]  Just let inflation and my husband's pay not freak out too much before then.   d*

Thanks for your help and input, Glenn.  Sorry I'm so long winded!
Catherine

Stay-at-home, homeschooling mother of 6 in "nowhere" Alaska

Offline glenn kangiser

  • The Troglodyte
  • Administrator
  • Journeyman
  • *****
  • Posts: 24,906
  • Central California Sierras- Home of Yosemite NP
    • Underground Cabin
Re: Glenn's Underground Cabin Update
« Reply #1074 on: November 22, 2008, 11:38:44 AM »
So many variables - are you familiar with a spreadsheet, Catherine?  I sent you a link to a Google Doc I made for you to help figure this and easily change it. 


Here is a link to a generic one showing how it is set up.  Not a working model.

http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=ptYRe_ctDvOsI1pK_FRb9fA

As far as I know to get a working model I have to send you a link so if someone wants to play with it let me know
"Always work from the general to the specific." J. Raabe

Glenn's Underground Cabin  http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=151.0

Please put your area in your sig line so we can assist with location specific answers.

 

Templates: 5: index (default), Ads (default), Portal (default), Display (default), GenericControls (default).
Sub templates: 12: init, html_above, adsheaders_above, body_above, adsindex_above, portal_above, main, portal_below, adsindex_below, body_below, adsheaders_below, html_below.
Language files: 3: SPortal.english (default), index+Modifications.english (default), Ads.english (default).
Style sheets: 1: portal (default).
Files included: 38 - 1121KB. (show)
Cache hits: 13: 0.00232s for 40,590 bytes (show)
Queries used: 24.

[Show Queries]