People seem to realize there's a problem now

[peternap]

I didn't go to the farm today. Jane and I were busy shuttling the Grand daughter back and forth between our house (Naps, feeding,Etc) and the hospital.
I'm also trying to maximize mt truck trips so I'll take a load of lumber this week.

Anyway...The traffic was so light both yesterday and today, it was more like Christmas day. It was almost spooky how little traffic there was. I guess it has started to sink in.

[glenn kangiser]

Yesterday I realized that I hadn't been off the mountain in about a month - some work locally - and cops apparently are cutting patrols -- didn't see one where we are nearly always guaranteed to see one in a 30 mile stretch.

[considerations]

We have very few law enforcement officers available for a huge area. 

Our little road got together informally at first and formed a neighborhood watch.  At first it was informal, because there was a lot of theft going on...a hobo (mostly homeless drugees) camp down the road.  Then, when the stealing got worse, we called out the sheriff and let them know if they couldn't handle the problem, we would. 

They actually got their acts together, a new sheriff was just in office.  Kindly suggested if we were going to organize that we do it more formally, and with support from official law enforcement.  It started a synergy between different agencies.

We got rid of the camp, and theft is no longer a problem.....some may say the less law around the better, but it was a real issue, about 10 years of no help from official sources.  We had a pretty strong support system before, but now we have a real network.

We had a toddler disappear here, and in 45 minutes we knew where he wasn't.  It did not turn out well, but the entire road mobilized within 20 minutes of his disappearance, which if nothing else served to shorten the agony of not knowing.

I got to get acquainted well with my neighbors, and we now have a basic plan in the event of natural disaster.  It has been a good thing.  We are isolated by bridges and distance from "services", and this is earthquake country.  We got a realistic estimate of 3-4 weeks before "help" in the event of a major natural disaster, so we now have a basic plan for cooperatively making it that long without "assistance".

Now every house has back up power (most of us did already), and staples and Rx stored, and a basic awareness of who needs child care, elder care, O2, etc...CERT and first aid training up to date, all free from the county.

If nothing else, the groundwork is laid for mutual support in the event of something bad happening.

Took about 18 months to settle it in, but I take some comfort in at least knowing everyone by sight, and how each of us can serve the whole.  Better to build the relationships in good times, they always get tested when the s--- hits.

[NM_Shooter]

Take a look at this... it is not so much the cost as the rate of the recent increase that has me spooked.

[desdawg]

Government agencies at what ever level should be cutting back and downsizing just like the rest of us. Here in my County the Board of County
Supervisors enacted an ordinance to collect impact fees along with building permit fees which effectively stopped all growth. Recently I met with the head of the Board of Supervisors and asked what the current level of permitting for residential construction was like today. He indicated it had dropped to about the level in 2003. So I asked if there had been any layoffs in the building department. His answer was no, just a moratorium on hiring more or not hiring replacements if someone chose to leave. I explained to him that in the private sector if we didn't have revenue we had to cut expenses to make the budget balance. These politico's want to do these things and be unaffected by their own actions. He is up for re-election this go round and is actually bold enough to run. If he ever pulls his head out of his a$$ you will be able to hear the pop all over the County. Our County has a large blue collar population, many of which are construction workers that are now out of work.
I am constantly amazed that these leaders, the guys riding the white horse that is leading the charge are unable to recognize what impact there ideologies have on their constituents. They seem to be so wrapped up in their own little worlds that they can't see the bigger picture and yet they were elected to oversee the bigger picture. Now building departments that aren't busy are not what I consider essential services like law enforcement and fire protection.

[peternap]

I talked to a woman from Richmond yesterday. The city is tightening their belts. They ordered the buses to quit using their air conditioners and open the windows. They also raised the fare.

[ScottA]

We are seeing less traffic here as well.

Shooter I wonder if that chart takes into account the fact that real earnings have been falling for the last 30 years. I doubt it. If not the situation today is much worse than in 81' at the last price spike.

[peternap]

We are seeing less traffic here as well.

Shooter I wonder if that chart takes into account the fact that real earnings have been falling for the last 30 years. I doubt it. If not the situation today is much worse than in 81' at the last price spike.

Scott, I also don't think people had nearly as much debt as they do now. This further drops their buying power.

[considerations]

My life is modest, but it's paid for. 

[desdawg]

My life is modest, but it's paid for. 

I wish I could say that.

[Homegrown Tomatoes]

The only thing I've noticed is that there are less RVs and boats on the interstate.

[benevolance]

it is a great time to buy a RV... they are selling for 50 cents on the dollar... well smaller older ones are... the ones that cost hundreds of thousands are owned by millionaires and they can afford fuel no matter what.... The Rest of us cannot

[ScottA]

I never understood this RV craze. We always went camping with tents and sleeping bags. If you need all the comforts why not just stay home and watch a movie? I remember once we went camping and the people next to us had brought a generator and a TV. Damn thing was so loud it was spoiling our natural experience. I told the guy If he didn't turn it off something bad might happen to it. They moved the next morning. Then there was the time a ranger on horse back rode into our camp at about 1 am. We where roasting marshmellows and he said we where disturbing the peace. I thought he was nuts. I found out later a friend of mine had put him up to hassling us.

[Redoverfarm]

Scott he probably didn't hear the marshmellows it was the graham crackers crunching when you were making the smores that he heard.  I would say that the camping experience now in a RV could get quite costly unless you were going to make an extended stay at one location. 

[peternap]

Scott, I think this country went through a short, lazy, spoiled period. I also think it's on it's deathbed now.

We seem to have fairly quick spurts that change our world...like RV's.

Think about it. In my lifetime, we've gone from no electricity, no TV, switchboard phones and sustenance gardens, to our current state. We have nearly destroyed our environment in one generation.

IMHO, we're on the verge of a giant step backwards and while it might be painful to some and inconvenient to most, it may well be a better place.

In the last 2 days, my wife and I have run errands, gone shopping and gone to see the grandkids. We traveled about a hundred miles doing it but used the Whizzers. We burned less than 2 gallons of gas between the two of us.

I also saw less traffic than usual and more scooters (No Whizzers) One uppity kid had the nerve to pass me on his sad little Honda Scooter and I was compelled to BLOW HIS DOORS OFF (in a manner)

We are changing our driving habits very quickly now.

[muldoon]

Up until about a year or so ago I would have agreed 100% with that Scott.  I was all tents and sleeping bags; however after a few dozen work trips with sweltering 100+ degree days in the summer, 20 degree nights in the winter, (including getting influenza and a jumping spider bite last winter making my foot swell up to a football and me with a 104 fever), mosquitoes the size of wasps, wasps the size of birds, scorpions, brown recluses, water mocs, and that little scare with the coral snake lookalike, I do see the benefit of having a structure to camp in.  And did I mention I HATE yellowjackets, not even gonna tell that story...

Anyway, I still like camping, and I still love all forms of nature and the stars. (except mosquitoes).  And I do want to instill that into my children while I still hold some influence in their interests.   But sometimes I ... understand.. the mindset that drives people to an RV.  Personally, I think an rv is ridiculous, I would rather build a cabin.  Which is why I am here!  Thanks everyone. 

Of course Peter went and posted while I typed this and made me feel like a total wimp. 

[peternap]

Of course Peter went and posted while I typed this and made me feel like a total wimp. 

Don't feel that way......I'm odd

[Redoverfarm]

It has been a couple yers ago since I went camping.  But I still used a tent.  But the sleeping bag was on top of inflatable Queensize matress.

Peter check your PM's

[benevolance]

my wife and I love to camp... there are amazing state parks here in the carolinas... cheap to stay... many of them are remote with a lake or river access to use...We see some people with huge motorhomes in the state park... But we usually take the station wagon...And pitch the tent... Our tent was the gift my wife gave me for marrying her... I did not need to give her a gift...I was enough

We use the tent 3-4 times a year

[glenn kangiser]

True Peter.  Sometimes we are our own reward.

RV's won't make it to where I camp.  I need a sleeping bag, maybe a roll out mat and if cold, a dog is nice.

[considerations]

Living here is basically camping.  I feel like I still have exploring to do here.  I set the lodge up in the summer.  Don't even have to get out of the blankets to start the coffee. 

It may seem silly, but there is something special about watching your breath on a crisp morning over a cup of hot coffee.

[MountainDon]

RV's have a place, or maybe have had a place, considering the price of fuel. In all the years we've owned our 23 ft. RV it never ever visited a commercial "campground" and it seldom ever visited a forest service campground. Rather we used it as a mobile cabin in the boonies, dry camping as it's called; totally self contained. It could tow the Cherokee off to UT, CO, AZ. Then we (or sometimes just I) could go 4-wheeling for a day or two or three and return to a nice hard roofed/sided, more bear resistant than a tent, place for a shower, fresh baked (frozen) bread, ice cream for desert and a good nights sleep. In air conditioned comfort if the weather was hot or heated comfort if it was cold. In the good old days of cheap gas and cheap propane we winter camped in places like CO & WY. Beats a tent any day in the cold and rain.

I don't like tenting anymore; I've spent many a wonderful night and too many wet ones. I prefer sleeping in the back of the Cherokee when not having the RV handy.

Now the RV though costs too much to run. For the past couple years it has been parked on our mountain property. It is quite comfy with pretty much all the comforts of a cabin. I miss not having a wood burning stove though. After the cabin is built we'll sell it if we can find a buyer. If not, it will become a guest cabin.

If I still wanted an RV today I'd look at something built on the Mercedes/Dodge Sprinter chassis/van, MTL.

[benevolance]

I love to camp in the fall when the bugs are not bad... it is cool at night so you can sleep out under the stars if you want... Yeah it is a little crisp temputure wise... but with a decent sleeping bag and a campfire you are cozy enough.

The sun comes up and everything starts to warm up pretty quickly...The leaves are beautiful...It is just an amazing time to be outdoors