Reverse board and batten

[Billisnice]

Stain and stuff...If this good enough for spraying reverse board and batten?

http://www.permachink.com/shellguard.htm

How do you pros treat reverse board and batten for my log home? Thanks

[Redoverfarm]

Bill a little bit pricey.  Don_P has a more reasonable formula that contains basicly the same ingredents.  Maybe he will pick up on your thread. 

[Don_P]

Hey Bill,
If you download their MSDS you'll see that the active ingredient is DOT and the carrier is propylene glycol, PEG, and you add water as well.

You can go to a real farm supply and buy or order Solubor in 50 lb bags. Its a boron soil ammendment, a micronutrient. I had been paying $50/sack, but went to another store this last time and had to pay $70, haven't run out and gone back to the old store yet but that should be about the range. Solubor is chemically identical, DOT. It simply has an ag listing instead of an EPA insecticide/fungicide listing which ups the cost, it all literally comes out of the same hole in the ground.

The glycols have one purpose, to dry slow, the more you add the slower it dries. Borate travels by diffusion on the wet. As long as the cell walls are saturated and stay that way, it is penetrating. As soon as it dries it crystallizes and you aren't getting any more any deeper than that crystal wall. So the longer and wetter you can keep the wood, the deeper the penetration. That's all the glycols really do, so basically any glycol will work. Shellguard uses low tox glycols, RV antifreeze and PEG. If you've ever had GI surgery you've chugged PEG and will remember the trips, Dr Pepper has it too (Lord only knows why). Bora-care, another formulation, uses ethylene glycol, auto antifreeze. Works the same but is poisonous. I've used Solubor/EG alot, quite frankly I wanna kill the bugs by hook or crook and I'm not drinking it. Someone would have to eat a log or three later to get enough to hurt themselves and I figure the splinters will do em in first. But to each his own and now you know what the glycols do, so pick your poison.

If the wood is green, right off the sawmill then you don't need glycol, the wet is already there. So in that case I use 1 to 1.5 lbs of Solubor per gallon of warm water (mixes better with warm) Mix it and let it clear (dissolve) and either dip, spray, brush, mop, sponge, get it all over the wood, repeatedly if possible. (Google Timbor, that's what this mix is). This ain't fancy cologne lay it to it, I kept an old infested cabin wet for a month one time. The 1 lb mix is a 10% solution and is stable, at 1.5 lbs/gal you have a 15% saturated solution that will precipitate crystals, so if you mix it that stiff use it all up at that sitting (think rock candy). Either way if you use a spray rig clean it thoroughly after each use.

If the wood is dry, that's when you need some glycol to help keep it wet. I start with 1/2 gallon per 5 gallon batch of the above and tune it up or down according to drying conditions, no need to waste it, this is the most expensive ingredient and now you know what its there for, so monitor its performance and adjust accordingly. If you're just going to hit it once or twice at least double that glycol, if you are going to keep going over it wet on wet, then a lower concentration works fine.

I set up a dip tank at the sawmill and had just a borate /water solution to drop the boards into right off the mill. I had a couple of good splash spots on the ground and although its a micronutrient it did kill the grass. It also attracted the deer like crazy. It is a mineral necessary for metabolic processes in most things, we're just OD'ing the bugs and fungi in wood on it. In mammals the first sign of overdose in males is, umm, a lack of interest. One can only hope it works that way for deer. They learned this because there is a high concentration in the water in a few places in the world, Afghanistan is one.

[Billisnice]

Thanks, can you give me the basic mix for T1-11 siding at home depot? Do I stain after applying this mixture?

[Don_P]

Screech... slamming on brakes. I don't think I'd apply this to a plywood product, it takes a high moisture content to drive it and it won't like that. It must be applied before finishes so it can diffuse in. I believe LP is making a line of borate treated building products ( if its not them its GP) I came across the website once while surfing but haven't looked at the offerings hard enough to remember what they had available.

[Redoverfarm]

Don what is the mixture for my seasoned cabin.  I was going to PM you earlier and it just slipped my mind.  You mentioned crystals and it sort of scared me off some.  Do you have any idea of any residual left on the mortar chinking.  I had a pest company apply originally a Borate and then I followed up with a sealer before the logs were chinked.  That has been a couple years ago now.  What would you suggest to use in my circumstance with the chinking. 

Sorry Bill for Hyjacking your thread.

[Don_P]

John, one of the glycol mixes would work on dry wood except for the sealer. Once the wood is sealed it can't get through the finish. If at some point you strip it back to bare wood, or if mother nature does it for you, then it wouldn't hurt to hit it at that point. The crystals are a white have that can usually be removed with some water and a bit of scrubbing from the surface. If you remember the pics of the log restoration job I did, the homeowner didn't want any finish on the logs as they had never had one before. I built up the borate till I could see crystals on the surface, nobody else has ever mentioned noticing them. I chck it occasionally and when I see my telltale crystals have eroded away I'm going to sneak over and hit it again  .

[Redoverfarm]

Don Mother nature has been stripping the finish for over 100 some years now.  They are pretty dry and I doubt that the sealer accomplished a lot.  I will probably hit it again in a year or so.  Thanks

[Billisnice]

So with T1-11 you would just nail up and stain the outside will be fine? No treatment? If so, what type of stain is decent? Is z-flashing adequate to use on the seams?

Thanks...

[Redoverfarm]

Bill if it were mine I would use a good grade of either Semi-transparent or solid OIL based stain followed by a oil based sealer after the stain has dried.  I have had good results by spraying the stain and then back brushing.  I did the soffit area ( T111 like product) and the board and batten on mine.

[Billisnice]

Thanks, Do you have some name brands of the products you use?

[Redoverfarm]

Just don't skimp. Olympic and Cabot are a few.

[Redoverfarm]

Bill after I posted the other day I got to thinking of a possible solution to your finishing of the T111 and insect protection.  There was a B&B cabin built not to far from mine.  The owner got a stain with a insect repellent additive.  I am not sure what the name of the stain company was or what the additive was.  He is just a weekender and is not there full time or I would check with him.  If I happen to run across him in the next couple of days I will try to get the name of the stain and repost the info. 

[Billisnice]

Thanks

[Don_P]

I've worked for a company a few times that swears by this stuff;
http://www.logfinish.com/store/bugjuice.php

[Redoverfarm]

Bill I ran into the cabin owner today.  He said the product was "woodguard".  I goggled and this is the site I think.  Have no idea of the cost.  He said that he got it in a 5 gal pale and then a small bottle of coloring tint.  The product is clear and you add the tint of the stain that you want.

http://www.woodguard.com/woodguard/woodguard_features.htm

[Billisnice]

Thanks, do you need to treat the back of the t1-11 too?

[Redoverfarm]

Pro's and Con's on that one.  I think I would.   You wouldn't have to go to the expense as the face side though.