what is wrong with are country?

Started by Mr_Iowa, June 09, 2012, 02:28:37 AM

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Mr_Iowa

I'm getting discouraged in finding a home. The past year I've been hammering away at my debt, saving money, and becoming more responsible for my money. Only to find out that when applying for a home loan i don't have enough "credit"  d* my mortgage Leander actually told me  it would look better if i had more monthly bills! ??? 

i was also told it looks bad when i have multiple jobs in a year because it makes me look unstable. well guess what $8.25 is a little bit less then $21.16 an hour and of course that was an opportunity i wasn't going to turn down.

I've all but given up on finding land in Iowa to build a cabin, and have instead been looking for small homes in the country to fix up. I've been living in my parents basement for the past 2 years, and well its just sad i make 700-800 dollars take home a week and i still live here.  you would think i could find a place to rent at lest but i have two 80# plus dogs, and so far haven't had any luck with that.  not to mention payments on a 100k loan would only be 650 a month, far less then what rent with 2 dogs would be. Just cant cant believe how hard it is to get my own home.

going to try to get pre approved for 70k next week, but that doesn't really help me when there aren't any properties in the area that fit the bill for 70k! just wish i could find land to build a small cabin that i could live in for a few years. at this point id settle for a large tent if i could just call it mine :-[

ok rant over...


MushCreek

You are a victim of the super-easy credit of the last few decades that got everyone in trouble with mortgages. Now the pendulum has swung the other way, and credit has really tightened up. This probably a good thing, as the market is still flooded with over-mortgaged properties that folks can't afford. I read a story from about the time the bubble burst about a single man making $13 an hour who was able to get a $250K mortgage- and the lender knew how much he made! The banks got greedy, hoping to flip houses like that in a booming market when the poor guy couldn't make his payments. Works great until prices suddenly reverse.

You're going to have to be patient- a year of working on your financial profile does not a track record make. Save, save, save, because when you do qualify for a mortgage, they are going to want a big down-payment. Building good credit takes years of light borrowing with a spotless payment record.
Jay

I'm not poor- I'm financially underpowered.


flyingvan

   I know your dogs are family, but so many people really limit getting started in financial life by taking on animals coupled with money challenges.  Our neighbors are losing their house because they keep adding horses and burros to their menagerie.  It's their choice to buy hay and pay the vet instead of the mortgage, taxes, car payment, and gas bill but when foreclosure is complete they'll be stuck homeless with all these animals.  Pets are expensive, and for responsible pet owners require a lot of time (which also represents money, or building sweat equity, which again represents money) and if they are your priority get used to the basement for a much longer period of time.
  You CAN have it all---home, family, dogs---it comes down to the order you do it in though, or how long you're willing to wait.    Getting the home would be easier to do before getting dogs, as I think you're finding out.  It isn't the country's fault, unless the country handed you dogs and debt and required you to keep both
Find what you love and let it kill you.

zion-diy

A lot of this revolves around banks. They do not want to lend money while the interest rates are low. I know this for a fact. The house in the Ozarks we built is ours, no owing anybody. We were  trying to buy a winter home in Fl. Had 30% for down payment, and a credit score  750+ and enough income, plus no car loans, etc. Several banks hemmed and double talked and said 30% was not enough. so, I offered 40%. more double talk, then finally one said 45% and they would loan on the remainder for 8.9% interest. Wtf? >:( I told them where to stick it. w Went back to the owners and for 20% down and 5% rate, I got them to carry the note. You might consider trying that route.
Just a 50-ish chic an a gimp,building thier own house,no plans,just--work,work,work,what a pair :}

Mr_Iowa

should add that i went to school to be a dog trainer and behaviorist, my dogs aren't just pets they are walking barking billboards (well they don't bark). they are pretty important in teaching clients how to properly handle a trained dog as well. Part of the reason I'm looking for my own place is because id like to start my own kennel...


alex trent

Quit whining.

1. This is a build site not a what's wrong with America site.
2. No matter what, we cannot help you.

MountainDon

#6
We are all free to grouse as much as we desire, as long as we keep it civil as Mr_Iowa did in his OP.  More of a lament than a whine, IMO.


I moved this topic to Off Topic as I thought it was better here than in the General Board where we try to keep the direction more directly related to building.
Just because something has been done and has not failed, doesn't mean it is good design.

glenn kangiser

Good move, Don.

Yes - we can whine ... and I don't have time to talk about the original question -
What is wrong with our country....

Nope - I'm not gonna bite on that one - no time.  [waiting]
"Always work from the general to the specific." J. Raabe

Glenn's Underground Cabin  http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=151.0

Please put your area in your sig line so we can assist with location specific answers.

glenn kangiser

Quote from: Mr_Iowa on June 09, 2012, 02:28:37 AM
I'm getting discouraged in finding a home. The past year I've been hammering away at my debt, saving money, and becoming more responsible for my money. Only to find out that when applying for a home loan i don't have enough "credit"  d* my mortgage Leander actually told me  it would look better if i had more monthly bills! ??? 

i was also told it looks bad when i have multiple jobs in a year because it makes me look unstable. well guess what $8.25 is a little bit less then $21.16 an hour and of course that was an opportunity i wasn't going to turn down.

I've all but given up on finding land in Iowa to build a cabin, and have instead been looking for small homes in the country to fix up. I've been living in my parents basement for the past 2 years, and well its just sad i make 700-800 dollars take home a week and i still live here.  you would think i could find a place to rent at lest but i have two 80# plus dogs, and so far haven't had any luck with that.  not to mention payments on a 100k loan would only be 650 a month, far less then what rent with 2 dogs would be. Just cant cant believe how hard it is to get my own home.

going to try to get pre approved for 70k next week, but that doesn't really help me when there aren't any properties in the area that fit the bill for 70k! just wish i could find land to build a small cabin that i could live in for a few years. at this point id settle for a large tent if i could just call it mine :-[

ok rant over...

I'll bite a little to make a simple explanation of your situation Mr Iowa..

We just went through the financial crisis (ahem... cough ...ripoff by financiers ...cough) where they cut back work and money supply and the ability to pay for over- inflated .. over priced houses so many many people lost their houses and their lifes savings and investments back to the banks who took them back... (cough... stole them from the lower and middle class overextended workers... cough... Bless Me... )..... and now they have nothing. 

Our good congress critters had their arms pulled to give our money back to the bankers who already got our houses but now they want to sell them again as well as keep the money we gave them.  The thing is they realize they already screwed us once and likely won't get away with it again in most cases, so they do not want to give you any money to buy a house with the money that the taxpayers gave back to them because they want to keep it in their own pockets and insure that they can pay for their own stuff...... make sense?


Hope everyone agrees that that is nearly a correct abbreviated explanation of where we are approximately now.  [waiting]
"Always work from the general to the specific." J. Raabe

Glenn's Underground Cabin  http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=151.0

Please put your area in your sig line so we can assist with location specific answers.


muldoon

I'll bite too.  But to be honest, you may not like what I have to say.

First off, you are not a precious little snowflake.  You are not special.  You were most likely lied to all your life in being told you can do whatever you want and be successful at it.  It was a lie.  That is not the way the world works. 

If one year ago your were making minimum wage living in your parent basement, I would not loan you 100 thousand dollars today either.  And no one else on this forum would either.  If I am wrong, perhaps someone will come forward with an offer.  I have no idea why you think anyone else should.  You seem to want to blame our country as failing you, when in reality, perhaps you should look at your own life choices. 

And by the way, it is our country, not are country. 

Yes, the banks did screw the economy.   Yes, there are plenty of things wrong.  But at the end of the day, you have to pick up the pieces and make a life. You have to make your choices in life for success.  Yes, people will screw you.  But if you screw yourself, you never even get out of the gate. 

glenn kangiser

I agree with you too, Muldoon.

During the bubble times we were able to make two good purchases and we sold our primary residence for a great price recently.  Deals are there but you have to work for them and not take them at inflated prices just because they will set you up to do it. 

For every dollar we can earn there are several scammers or profiteers looking to get it.  It is the American way, eh?
"Always work from the general to the specific." J. Raabe

Glenn's Underground Cabin  http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=151.0

Please put your area in your sig line so we can assist with location specific answers.

glenn kangiser

Also though I need to say... there are not enough of people being told they can do whatever they want.  They may be  successful without the hundreds of thousands charged for a higher education degree if they will realize they can do anything they want if they set their mind to it - take the initiative - study on their own.

Things such as nursing - doctor etc. require going through the system and leave you little time to study much else. 

Whether you are successful or not is determined by you... not what the government or other people give you. I am saying , don't limit yourself to a specialty just because someone tells you you are a "_______" because you got a degree in it.   No - look deeper.  If you do not stop yourself at others limits placed upon you, you can do nearly anything with as much success as you like based on what you are willing to invest in learning about it.  Maybe you want to go for more specialized education.  You have to make your own way in whatever you want to do. 

Remember that there are a lot of successful people higher on the ladder of success throwing rocks down at you as you try to climb up.  Use your mind to think of ways to shield yourself from the rocks.  A side job? Better more diligent shopping?  Alternative financing ideas?  Self employment? (... a hard one full of pitfalls- careful).
"Always work from the general to the specific." J. Raabe

Glenn's Underground Cabin  http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=151.0

Please put your area in your sig line so we can assist with location specific answers.

MountainDon

Quote from: glenn kangiser on June 10, 2012, 09:26:26 AM
  Self employment? (... a hard one full of pitfalls- careful).

Self employment does have its disadvantages, but also some perks. When Karen and I started out as self employed or private contractors in '85 it was tough; no bank would give us credit cards. Good thing the house was paid for. But then several years later after hard work and being responsible people things changed. For the past half dozen years we work 4 days a week; the last two only mornings. We enjoy entire summers off work, money in the bank, everything paid off. That did not occur overnight. For years we never took vacations at all.
Just because something has been done and has not failed, doesn't mean it is good design.

glenn kangiser

I agree with you, Don.  I have been in business for myself since 1974 because if I worked for someone else I would likely get fired for not keeping my mouth shut when they were full of crap or hot air.  [waiting]

Added to those perks are that things related to the business can be deducted from income.  Most trips can be business related with careful planning.  I have been invited to check out going into business in Myanmar (Burma) and since the US wants it's cut of overseas profits, that trip would be deductible also.  The person who invited me was sponsored by the US State Department to UC Davis.  He is in pretty big business in the private sector so is a great contact as well as friend.  I would love to help bring a country into the industrial revolution... they are at the start and still using carts and water buffalo due to their (mostly) past leadership. 

Lots of ways to use the system to your advantage even if you don't care for it, like some of us. :)
"Always work from the general to the specific." J. Raabe

Glenn's Underground Cabin  http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=151.0

Please put your area in your sig line so we can assist with location specific answers.


flyingvan

There's plenty of blame to go around, and before you pin it all on the banks keep a few things in mind----the ability to scrutinize who they lent to was taken away by Fair Housing legislation and Dodds/Franks's move to get everyone in a house regardless of ability to pay.  The evil banks would face criminal charges for turning down loans in different percentages for different areas...Any time you try to manipulate pricing and access, something's gotta give.  The banks weren't responsible for the housing bubble, either---blame low inventory coupled with mandated access to cheap loans for everybody.  Banks are easy to vilify---you point to CEO pay and extrapolate evil intent.  No one forced a loan on anyone, nor was it hidden what the terms of the loan would be.  The attitude of 'Just get your foot in the door, the market will always go up, you'll do OK in the long run' was wrong and if you bought into it you were foolish---don't expect taxpayers to bail you out.  The banks were mandated to make loans then accused of 'predatory lending'.  Now the banks are holding titles to lots of properties, not something they're particularly interested in doing, and people claim they're reluctant to make loans because the interest rates are too low to be profitable....They just don't want to be the ones to hold the bag if the market slips further, which it will if the Feds try to meddle further.
    Know what I'd do?  If I were Wells Fargo, or any other lender, I'd set up a database of ALL my defaulted properties.  I'd go to every borrower in default and work with them---"OK.  Turns out you can't really afford a $300,00 home after all.   Looks like you CAN afford a $180,000 home, though, and we just happen to have 300 of those in your area.  Instead of being homeless, and instead of us holding another property, let's honor the original terms of your loan but move you down into the cheaper house of your choosing, and cut your principal down to something you can manage".   The bank only gets stuck with the most expensive houses, and only the borrowers at the very bottom have to go back to renting, credit ratings are preserved, almost everyone wins.  (I have a fix for healthcare too but there's no way that fits anywhere on this forum)
   Glenn---I love your sentiment that anyone can do anything they want, I think this site is full of people who have done just that.  I also bet without exception, they've made some serious sacrifices to get there.  I'm putting in 14 hour days at the Cuyamaca Cottage, not pursuing promotions at work, missing more family time than I should, and subjecting my body to a good level of abuse.   I'll also add you can do anything, but probably not in the timeline you'd like, and probably not alone
Find what you love and let it kill you.

hpinson

For what it's worth Mr_Iowa, Lamar Alexandar and John Wells provide some very good public examples of what is possible in terms of building and owning a small home for very little money with no loans. You might look them up on Google. Granted, their lifestyle is not everyone's cup of tea.

John Raabe

Self-employment is a great teacher. Especially if you can't or don't need to have a big bankroll to open the doors. It quickly teaches you about honesty, money management, and how to live on not-so-much. If your business is something that started out as a personal interest or hobby, all the better. Then you may be able to stick it out when the going gets rough (such as now for most people).

To get good at almost anything you have to stick to it - 10,000 hours according to some recent studies of mastery. To do that kind of serious time you have to love the process not just the goal.

By the way, except for learning how to learn and communicate, higher education doesn't count towards very many of those hours. So unless you know just what you want to do and working in that field requires a specific educational degree or certification, you will often learn faster by doing the work rather than studying how to do it.


None of us are as smart as all of us.

Mr_Iowa

the point in the "whats wrong with this country" was simply OUR country makes it harder for one to live simple. I cant get a loan because i don't have enough credit cards in my name? my credit score is fine I've had vehicle loans before I've played that game. Yet for some reason at multiple banks i was told i don't have enough debt now. that i should go open some credit cards and wait a year, and possibly go take out a vehicle loan.

My point is i can live in a 300sqf home making minimum wage living off of scraps, but for some reason it feels like I'm being coraled into living above my means. 

anyway as far as my work history goes I'm not ashamed to admit to any of you i was fired from my job in Texas in 2010. As a dog trainer i had, had enough of the inhuman ways my boss was dealing with barking dogs in his kennel. i lost my ability to even try hard at work anymore, i was to the point where i hated it. I made a last effort to bring the issue up with him, but the end result was me being fired. The sad thing is he is a very respected retriever trainer in Texas.

I came back to Iowa expecting to land another training position fast. I was offered positions all over the country however the salary dint justify me leaving my family again (most places offered me 22-24K). the past few years I've been working my way back up the ladder in non training positions. I've surpassed all my past income levels i have ever had. There was never a time i dint have a job in my downfall, in fact what they see a weak job history really is a success.  There aren't many people who can go threw 4 jobs in a year and better themselves every time. 

rick91351

Please do not listen to what they are telling you as far as credit cards and credit history and all that.  Problem is you do not make enough.  You do not have a track record in business.  Strange they are actually requiring a down payment now days.  Gee just like the old days.  Why?  Because no one can afford 100 to 85 to 80% loan on $300,000.  A $100,000 loan at 6.5% (because you are a high risk) on a fifteen year note $871.11 then dump your escrowed requirements on top of that you are looking at over $1000 a month.  If you had stellar credit and a magic 4% loan $739.69 plus your escrow would still put you now over $850.

Budget it all out, every dollar and you are going to find you can not pay for the loan.  Quit kidding yourself, you just need to make more money.  To do that find another job one that pays.  Then do your dog training on the side.  You can not afford to be a dog trainer right now.  You told me one time that you were going to train like police dogs or explosive dogs or something like that.  Great!  Thank you.  But right now you are going to have to do that on the side until you have the right cliental.  Work two or three jobs if you need to.  Go back to the Dave Ramsey thing deliver pizzas if you have to.  The only time you go in a restaurant is if you work in there.  By the way drive inns are restaurants.  You budget every dollar you make, you give it a name and make it work for you.

My dog trainer is the coolest gal.  She trains you to train the dog.  She uses a city park, you pay her $225 dollars for two days a week for about ten weeks.  She works with the class of about 25 to 30 people and their dogs.  That is $5,600.  She is in very high demand does classes in Boise, Idaho and Nampa, Idaho.  Plus for private lessons and real problem dogs $75 an hour.  She is so busy.  She is knocking down between Boise and Nampa $11,200 or so for 10 weeks in the evenings.  Do that twice a year there is $22,400.  But she has been doing it since she was a little girl.  She was born into it.  I have put both my healers through the classes plus a Pom.  They are a joy when we finish.  I am not blowing smoke, here is her web site. 

http://scotchpinesdogtraining.com/index.html               

The talking heads in the banks are like personal managers in the job market.  OH son you are over qualified for this job.  Hate to blow wind up your pant leg, but you are not over qualified.  The SOB does not like the way you part your hair.  He does not like the mole on your forehead.  The bosses son is going to get the job, they are just going through the motions.  That or the job does not exist but for man power statements and budget reasons they show as a job, problem is no one has worked it since Moses was a pup.     

Proverbs 24:3-5 Through wisdom is an house builded; an by understanding it is established.  4 And by knowledge shall the chambers be filled with all precious and pleasant riches.  5 A wise man is strong; yea, a man of knowledge increaseth strength.

MountainDon

Quote.....our country makes it harder for one to live simple.....

I don't know... Living simple, to me, means not needing a loan at all. Debt complicates life. Karen and I bought our first home with 20% cash down, cash we saved up by frugal simple debt free living, plus several thousand interest free dollars from my parents. It does help to have a partner. :)   We saved my salary while living on hers for a year after we met. Then we bought our first home. That home was paid off way early because we plowed one salary into the mortgage, lived on the other. Paid my parents back first, then the mortgage holder (private deal).


Quote....i was told i don't have enough debt now. that i should go open some credit cards and wait a year....

That's not quite right.... the owing debt part, that is.   The ideal is to have credit card(s) with a large amount of available credit but to only use a small portion of it (and pay it off every month without paying interest). Never run up more than 25% of the available credit on any one credit card. Always pay off the entire monthly balance. That will make you look like a stellar credit risk. That also takes years of patient responsible fiscal behavior before the banks and credit card companies grant you that much credit.

Just because something has been done and has not failed, doesn't mean it is good design.


Mr_Iowa

Rick i now make 21.16 an hour and work 45-50 hours a week. (gross around 1100, take home is around 800) most of the interest rates i've seen are around 3.25 and 3.75%. My 100k loan i applied for was about 650 a month in payments. the 70k loan i'm applying for is around 500 in monthly payments.

I'm not a big fan on group classes. that's like saying you want your child to learn math so you take a math class and then try to teach them yourself at home. your putting to much of your reputation on the line by expecting people to work with their dogs on there own time. even if they do work with their dogs how much of what there doing is right?

I'm big on in kennel training, where i train your dog, and then i train you.

flyingvan

  Sounds like dog training is your passion.  People that follow their passions instead of seeking money ALWAYS have a rich life.  I'm with you on the classroom stuff too---I love learning, and if it's a subject that's interesting to me (botany, anything medical, physics, building) I can sit through a class---but start rambling about something I'm not interested in and my brain wanders to building projects.
   I have never owned a credit card.  I own 4 homes, (well, 3 and one's ALMOST completed) two major fixer uppers and two ground up projects with 100% sweat equity.  Two are rented full time.  My wife's and my own credit score are both in the high 700's.
   There is something wrong with your math---unless the term of your loan was less than 15 years.  For a 30 year mortgage at your higher number I get $463.12.  At 3.25 it's $435.21.  For a 70K loan the numbers are $324.18 and $304.64.  So either your interest rate is much higher or your term is much shorter.  When crunching numbers, be sure to add in your mortgage deduction against your federal income tax--it's a significant savings. 
    Scared of a 30 year mortgage?  Get over it----With the exception of buying gold, there's no better protection from inflation than a fixed rate mortgage (and a brick of gold is really hard to raise dogs in).  Why?  Because with inflation everything goes up and up.  But not your mortgage payment.  By keeping your loan term as long as possible you're letting inflation do the work for you.  Your income numbers will go up, but it won't keep pace with inflation.  I bet 25 years ago I could hire a dog trainer for $2 an hour....Now you're making 10 times that.  Eventually that mortgage payment is less than your dog food bill.
    Finally---My loan officer is a good friend.  She tells me she absolutely rejects applications due to spelling and punctuation errors.  She has so little to go by and wants to get people good loans but also wants a good reputation with the underwriters.  If I were shopping for dog trainers on a forum like this, I would mostly look at the content but would be influenced by how well written the posts were, too.  Human nature, I guess.   People that achieve higher learning degrees tend to write better, thanks to all the papers written and/or use of spell check.  Probably not worth the $100,000 in student loan debt, but so much of our interaction now is online.  If you were to follow every phrase with an 'lol' you're presenting yourself in a certain way.  If you don't have the energy to hold a shift key to capitalize when needed, same sentiment.
   I've never looked at life by what I feel I deserve.  Nobody cares what I feel I deserve, and it's where the Occupy crowd gets it so wrong.   Instead I've always asked, 'What will the market bear?'.  It makes approaching my goals far more realistic.
Find what you love and let it kill you.

NM_Shooter

Focus on your property first.  Buy that with a high down payment loan, and be diligent in paying your note on time.

BTW, use a small bank / credit union.  Get to know your banker. 

Then buy a trailer.  Even used mobile homes can be had pretty cheaply. 

It is going to take awhile, but it will be worth it!  Good luck.
"Officium Vacuus Auctorita"

flyingvan

Shooter--- You could expand your "Officium Vacuus Autorita" and add "Tamen ex a positus of usus" in my opinion

Find what you love and let it kill you.

muldoon

Mr_Iowa,

I see where you are coming from, but I don't think you are seeing where others are coming from.  No one is saying that changing jobs four times in one year has anything to do with success or failure.  No one is saying that is a weakness, the banks are saying it is a sign of instability.  Whether or not you improved your situation has nothing to do with the fact that changing jobs 4 times in a year is not indicative of stability.  There is no "right" to get a loan.  No one has done you a disservice by not giving you money to buy your house with. 

QuoteKnow what I'd do?  If I were Wells Fargo, or any other lender, I'd set up a database of ALL my defaulted properties.  I'd go to every borrower in default and work with them---"OK.  Turns out you can't really afford a $300,00 home after all.   Looks like you CAN afford a $180,000 home, though, and we just happen to have 300 of those in your area.  Instead of being homeless, and instead of us holding another property, let's honor the original terms of your loan but move you down into the cheaper house of your choosing, and cut your principal down to something you can manage".   The bank only gets stuck with the most expensive houses, and only the borrowers at the very bottom have to go back to renting, credit ratings are preserved, almost everyone wins.  (I have a fix for healthcare too but there's no way that fits anywhere on this forum)

I know this is getting off topic, but I thought I would point out the issue with this plan.  The banks do not own the houses.  Thats the underlying issue.  The banks sold those notes into bonds and sold them to insurance companies, other banks, pension funds and the like.  Get it, the bank does not own the loan anymore; they sold it and have already received the money.  When the bonds went south, they got paid in full again via bailouts on the bonds.  What the bank does is called "servicing", they collect the payments, pmi, insurance, taxes etc..  pay the people per their contracts.