Private Property Rights and other stuff

[peternap]

I have been a pro gun person for 50 years.

Virginia has had good success keeping anti gun laws out and making improvements in what we have.

Much of the progress is due to Virginia Citizens Defense League. I am a member and until recently, had few complaints.

This year may be different. As a hunter and primarily a rural person, I am concerned with outdoor activities and property owners rights.

We have recently had a new kind of Pro Gun activists show up. These people live by their Concealed Weapons Permits, live in cities and are terrified to go anywhere without a gun. They even wear it at home.

I let my permit expire years ago. Here's why.
http://news.oldva.org/?p=186

This new breed of gunowners are believers in forcing employers to allow firearms on the property. On the face, sounds good...except it takes away the property owners right to say no.

Further, they are constantly pressing for greater rights for permit holders only.

This is about toi divide our ranks in Va. How can I support half an agenda?

[Redoverfarm]

Peter even half of a agenda in the right direction is better than one complete in the wrong direction.

I am fortunate in that I am given a lifetime concealed permit in state and with the states that WV has  reciprocity with. In fact I now believe that Virginia is a newly added member.  I could seek a National permit but it would require qualification semi-annually in Charleston.  I really can't justify the two trips a year. So in essence if you have one in VA it would be good here as well.  The other states are

SC
AZ
AR
FL
KY
MI
MS
MO
NC
OH
OK
PA
SD
TN
UT


So I have the surrounding covered.  That is about as far as I want to go when traveling anyway.

[NM_Shooter]

Sorry Peter, I'm not following your logic on this one.

By you not having a CCW permit, how does that help?

I think all private property owners have the right to exclude firearms from their premises.  I always check the doors for postings before I enter. 

Unless someone is willing to carry concealed without a permit in order to get caught and subsequently go to court to set a precedent, I don't see how not having a ccw helps the cause.

Regards,

-f-

[brian_nj]

Here in SC we didn't force the local stores so to say we just gave them an incentive to not care if we carry or not. How was that done simple we did not shop at the ones that would not let us carry. Is that bullying not in my eyes. Also in SC you can not carry into a persons residence without their permission, I have been asked a dew times if it was alright by people to which I respond "If I don't trust you to carry why would I let you in my house"

The only thing that I have been involved with that may be considered forcing is work. I work service and travel to new and unfamiliar places all the time sometimes in the middle of the night. When work passed a rule saying no carry on the job or in vehicles I and a lot of others told them straight up then we are gone, they very quickly changed their mind.  When it comes to my personal safety I will either do what I think is best for me or convince the powers that be to go along. If they dont agree with my thinking either I do what I feel is best or I go somewhere else.

I am also one of those people that carries everywhere I go and have been for many years, to me it is no different than going out the door and grabbing my wallet. I would hate to feel the emotions if I left it at home one day and something happened to one of my children that I may have been able to prevent, it is the one time you don't have it that you need it.

Don't mean this to sound like a flame if that's the way it comes across it is not my intent.  I am just a little passionate about the subject

[peternap]

Sorry Peter, I'm not following your logic on this one.

By you not having a CCW permit, how does that help?

I think all private property owners have the right to exclude firearms from their premises.  I always check the doors for postings before I enter. 

Unless someone is willing to carry concealed without a permit in order to get caught and subsequently go to court to set a precedent, I don't see how not having a ccw helps the cause.

Regards,

-f-

Sorry, I threw too many things in at once...Letting my CHP expire doesn't really go with private property rights. I was just fuming about a lot that day.

The CHP is because the state is granting privileges to CHP holders that aren't given to non Chp people. Virginia has had a long standing history of open carry as a right. It's in our Constitution.

By enticing people to get their CHP's, which is a privilege, not a right, they are chipping away at the right and can control carry more easily.
When they stop doing that, I'll renew my permit. Until then, I'll either carry openly ...or not at all. Of course I wouldn't think of carrying illegally. The fine is almost as much as a speeding ticket.

[harry51]

"...the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed." 

That's all we should have to know. We should be left alone unless we misuse the firearm.

Our acceptance of prior restraints on our exercise of our Constitutional rights, whether it is for alleged better gov't supplied security for us and ours, or to allegedly make law enforcment's job easier, or any of a hundred other reasons, is the precursor to the loss of those rights.

Gov't can't even guarantee a person's security in a maximum security prison. The excuses justifying the conditioning of our rights are lies. One truth is that the only rights we have are those we are willing to defend. It's time to start. We're already a long way down the wrong road.

[peternap]

Here in SC we didn't force the local stores so to say we just gave them an incentive to not care if we carry or not. How was that done simple we did not shop at the ones that would not let us carry. Is that bullying not in my eyes. Also in SC you can not carry into a persons residence without their permission, I have been asked a dew times if it was alright by people to which I respond "If I don't trust you to carry why would I let you in my house"

The only thing that I have been involved with that may be considered forcing is work. I work service and travel to new and unfamiliar places all the time sometimes in the middle of the night. When work passed a rule saying no carry on the job or in vehicles I and a lot of others told them straight up then we are gone, they very quickly changed their mind.  When it comes to my personal safety I will either do what I think is best for me or convince the powers that be to go along. If they dont agree with my thinking either I do what I feel is best or I go somewhere else.

I am also one of those people that carries everywhere I go and have been for many years, to me it is no different than going out the door and grabbing my wallet. I would hate to feel the emotions if I left it at home one day and something happened to one of my children that I may have been able to prevent, it is the one time you don't have it that you need it.

Don't mean this to sound like a flame if that's the way it comes across it is not my intent.  I am just a little passionate about the subject

It's not a flame Brian, and I agree completely with you.

My issue is with the Government requiring a property owner to allow firearms on the premises.
I put private property rights up there with gun rights.

The way you handled your work situation is the way it should have been handled. Good people are hard to find.

The way businesses are handled is the way it is supposed to be handled. Paying Customers are hard to get.

BUT HAVING THE GOVERNMENT MANDATE IT RUBS ME THE WRONG WAY.

[NM_Shooter]

I agree.  I wish the legislators would butt out of my life, and especially my pocketbook. 

Anybody should be able to set their own rules regarding their private property.  As a matter of fact, maybe I won't let anyone with Redwing boots on my property.  Whatever.  I may even institute "special" clothing rules just for women.  Ahem. 

I stick with the CCW because it allows me to carry without making a scene. 

[brian_nj]

BUT HAVING THE GOVERNMENT MANDATE IT RUBS ME THE WRONG WAY.

I can not agree more we need the good old boys up in Washington to spend more time chasing their interns and less time passing legislation

[peternap]

Well let me tell you about private property rights...

I went hunting today and surprise....dogs everywhere. Now the dog hunters are afraid to come close this year so they surround the property in their pickups. I couldn;t see them but I know about where they are all the time. They had torn my road up by driving on it while it was almost under water.

I was a little annoyed and it wasn't any use trying to hunt. I had 5 guns with me. 2- .22 pistols, a 45 auto, a 12ga/308 over and under and a 45/70.

all totaled I had about 1200 rounds of ammunition.

Target practice day!

I shot up everything I had. After the first magazine of 22's and some 12 ga rain, those idiots decided I was shooting at them and really tore the road up getting out of there. Then I concentrated in kicking dirt up at the dogs. That was very effective. Some of them may still be running.

After that, I just made as much noise as possible until dark.
Maybe now they understand PRIVATE PROPERTY RIGHTS!

[MountainDon]

 

Time to do some reloading again?

[peternap]

Time to do some reloading again?

Yep...We are going to ride the Whizzers in a parade tomorrow, and after that, I need to spend some serious time at the bench

[peternap]

I'll bet he can't see us here

[glenn kangiser]

That sounds like it was fun anyway, Peter.