More 'interior trim tips' by Peg needed and wanted!!!!

[Okie_Bob]

I've been back to read Peg's tips so many times the pages are starting to wrinkle! I was hoping he would be rested up enough
that he could continue that theme and maybe show us some stairway trim ideas or maybe even some fireplace trim ideas?
I've been working on my stairs way too long, it is a much bigger job than I would have ever thougth. But, it's coming along and I'll have pics when I finish, after the first of the year, I guess.

I did pick up a trick worth passing on. I can't recall where I saw this, might have been 'Fine Homebuilding' or one of those mags.
Take a roll of was paper, cut it into two pieces. Then as I put up a trim piece that will need stain, I slip the wax paper under that piece prior to nailing it in place. Then I can stain it without fear of coloring out of the lines! Works great and so much easier than trying to keep my old hands steady enought not to have stain all over the floors and walls!

Come on Peg...or Glenn, show us some new tricks!!

Okie Bob

[MountainDon]

That wax paper thing would work fine.

I used to stain and finish coat the long pieces, 16 footers usually, in the garage. Depending on type of wood the use of a pre-stain is recommended to avoid splotchiness (sp). Then with an sharp 80 tooth fine cutting blade on the miter saw I'd cut and fit the trim. Some corners I'd use a coping saw with a sharp fine toothed blade to cut a contour on the end of one to mate with the machined surface of the other piece. Nailed with a finishing air nailer and filled the tiny nail holes with a colored filler. Seldom ever had to do any touch up.

Re the fireplace:  what are you up against / trying to do?

[glenn kangiser]

BoB, I am not the finest carpenter in the world, but I think I could show you how to build a stairway with a chainsaw, an air nailer  and 1 inch plywood.  I'd probably get us both kicked out of the house though.

[PEG688]

 
I didn't realize anyone read those old threads Guess I should write down the # of looks to see if theres been much interest.

So what do you need help with Bob?

[Billisnice]

I was in woodstock, GA Sunday looking at the trim in the 400-750,000 price range at

http://www.hedgewoodhomes.com/

We talked with the architecture, he uses 12 inch high painted MDF board with a cheap trim on top of it as the baseboards. It looked fantastic, but really low tech.

[Okie_Bob]

Glen, get that chainsaw out of my house! Oh, wait, that was my wife screaming there.
Peg, I think  I have all your pics and comments memorized by now so at least one somebody has been looking
often and hoping to see more.
If you guys could go to my blog http://www.bobdanaslakehouse.blogspot.com/ the first pic is what I've got going so far.
But, it looks pretty plain and I have no clue where I'm going from there. The newell posts have me completely baffeled. My plan
is to use a round handrail at the top of each section and run cable in 4" intervals on down to the bottom of each section. How do I
attach the handrail to the newell posts? On the flat sections, I have an idea but on the angled ones, not a clue. Once the newell posts are finished, how do I attach the top end of each handrail? The bottom angle I can come in horizontal to the stairs and screw the handrail to the newell post. But at the top, I'd have to have a screw hole on the top of the rail.
Mtn Dan, on the fireplace, if you scroll down my blog you'll see what it looks like now. I have the fireplace insert installed and actually operational. I want to hang a flat panel tv above the fireplace and I thought about using fake stone from the floor up to the bottom of the tv. But, that doesn't really sound too good to me now that I can see what it's looking like. Any ideas?
Okie Bob

[glenn kangiser]

Pix look great BoB, but I better let PEG provide the guidance as I walk away, chainsaw in hand.  Not even my little 18V Ryobi one?  hmm

[MountainDon]

I don't have a picture, so I'll try a word picture.

The fireplace at my inlaws retirement community was redone a few years ago and I really like it. It's constructed much like yours, but wider. They used natural stone. It looks like sandstone flagstone material that were cut into about three inch wide pieces of assorted lengths. Thickness is about 1 1/2 inches or so. I did not see the work in progress but it has the appearance of dry stack, but it is not. Must be cemented/glued to the wall behind the stone. Where the stone work stops above the fireplace there is a thick rough sawn pine mantle that wraps around the corner.

[glenn kangiser]

Fred is working on a house near here and they are doing a remodel including covering the old brick fire place with real local slate.  I didn't take a picture of the fireplace but here is a column that is the same pattern as it is.



You do remember Fred, don't you, BoB? hmm

[MountainDon]

Nice mix with different orientations of the slate. 

[PEG688]

#1:  Mtn Dan, on the fireplace, if you scroll down my blog you'll see what it looks like now.

  #2:   I have the fireplace insert installed and actually operational.

  #3:  I want to hang a flat panel tv above the fireplace and I thought about using fake stone from the floor up to the bottom of the tv. But, that doesn't really sound too good to me now that I can see what it's looking like.

  Any ideas?

#1: It's Mtn DON , Bob . 

#2: Maybe a heath would look good out in front on the floor. Is that the flooring that cupped ? That was your place right Bob?

I think with that bumped out chase I'd stay away from the total stone wrapped look , it will be to wide looking sticking out off the wall like that.

Some either simple stone or tile about 8 to 10 " exposed on the sides and about 12 to 16 " above would look nice. The tile  could just have a simple brass edge border run around it , or maybe a simple wood stain grade or MDF paint grade mantal .

 

I did post this paint grade mantel here I think .

 

I have some const. photos of this one I could post if they'd help.



#3: With that bump out a simple 4 x 8 type flat simple mantel shelf only with the brass edged , or some how finished edged tile or stone might look better.

  Anyway theres a start on what you might / could do, what do you or more importantly does the boss think of those options?     

[PEG688]

#1: But, it looks pretty plain and I have no clue where I'm going from there.

#2:The newell posts have me completely baffeled.

#3:My plan is to use a round handrail at the top of each section and run cable in 4" intervals on down to the bottom of each section. How do I
attach the handrail to the newell posts?

#4: On the flat sections, I have an idea but on the angled ones, not a clue.

      (a)  Once the newell posts are finished, how do I attach the top end of each handrail?

      (b)  The bottom angle I can come in horizontal to the stairs and screw the handrail to the newell post.

      (c)   But at the top, I'd have to have a screw hole on the top of the rail.


#5:  Any ideas?

#1: Well your gonna finish it of course 

#2: Are those your finished newels ?? They look like PT / const grade / SYP  4x4







If they are your planned newels they need a lot of TLC     , maybe more than that You could build slip on newel covers I guess , do you have a photo of what you'd like it to look like?

I don't follow the "round rail look on top"  . Generally a round rail is mounted on brackets made for that diameter  hand rail, generally purchased from stair rail company like Johnson and Postmen . Goggle" hand rail manf." / stair systems / stair parts etc  and see what you get,  then pick a type and we can talk about specific  type rails.

A rail on top is generally referred to as " Over the post" rails that go post to past are called just that, "post to post" the stair companies have all sorts of double lag , double machine type connectors , some work better than others so pick a couple and again we can talk about specific types pros and cons .

There's also a lot of cable rail companies out there as well , I've onlt done one or two cable rails and they where exterior type systems , they could be used indoors IF a guy liked that look , so that's a MMV type thing.  


I'll skip right to five as I think I touched on the ones in between already  

[PEG688]

Here's a few links to stairs and stair parts ,

http://www.stairpartsusa.com/Stair_Parts_Newels_s/4.htm

http://www.stairpartsusa.com/Stair_Parts_Newels_s/6.htm

http://www.stairpartsusa.com/Stair_Parts_Handrail_6115_Handrail_s/157.htm

http://buystairparts.reachlocal.net/

http://www.johnsonpostman.com/index.htm

[PEG688]

  Yo Bob , you in there?

   So what ya think , to much info???

HELLOOOOOOOOOOoooooooooooooooo Bob!         

[glenn kangiser]

As I remember, I think BoB went to the lake but you can bet he'll check in as soon as he gets back. 

[Okie_Bob]

Yep, Glenn, I went to the lake and just got home last night to find my a/c out and it's cold here now.
Anyway, I'll have some more up to date pics as soon as I can download them to my blog.

Peg, you are right, the posts shown in the pics you have are just std 4"X4" and now have covers over them. They are very plain
and I stained a few on the bottom yesterday afternoon just to see how they look, not sure if I got more pics after staining.
At any rate, I think my stairs question has worked it self out and I can live with it. Only question remaining is how I attach the
round wood rail on between the newell posts, especially the ones on angles. Believe Peg has left me with a few links I'm going to go try and hopefully will solve that problem as well.

I'm sorry guys that it sometimes takes me a few days to respond but, I do read everything as soon as I can. When at the lake, I have no internet access. And I'm planning on spending a bunch of time down there between now and the new year.

Glenn, I'm sorry to say I don't remember Fred. But, I know the fake stone he used and probably the same stuff Mtd Don referred to as well. I found a company real close to me that makes and installs the stuff. He must have about 25 different stone types. Don't know what it is made out of but, it looks very much like the real thing and weighs much less and looks very easy to install. He quoted me
$4.85 per sf for material or would install for $12 sf complete, materials included. If I do like Peg suggested, I'd only be using about 30 sf so it would be less than $400 if he installs it for me. (I'm getting anxious to get this thing finished now and entertaining farming things out if the cost is realistic.)

Again, thanks for all the responses and forgive me the delays in responding back.
Okie Bob

[glenn kangiser]

No problem, BoB.  Hope you had a good time.

On Fred's job they used the real slate from the local quarry.  It looks great.

[Okie_Bob]

Glenn, I don't know of anything that is fake that looks as good as the original. Well, maybe!
If I had access to natural slate at no cost, you can bet you'd see a lot of it in my projects.

Anyway, I did upload some new pics with last weeks progress. Sure does seem to go slow.
I checked out all the links Peg left for stairway parts but, still did not see what I need to attach
the round railing to the newell posts. Even where the rails run straight, I'm not sure how to attach
them to the wall or the newell postgs and the ones that follow the angle of the stairs, I'm at a total loss.
I did see some strange screws, ones with wood thread on one end and metal threads on the other. But, my
post are too thick ( 6 3/4" ) to use them. Sure could use some ideas on this.
BTW, you may recall other discussions about my floor cupping? Well, the same material is what I used
on the stair tread along with the bullnose trim piece along the edges of each tread.

Also, a quick comment on another previous discussion. I put off trimming out the stairway to the very last simply
because I didn't have a clue how to do it. This has happened to me many other times too. It is really strange how
things sort of automatically start to take shape in your mind if you give them enought thought. I've worried myself almost
sick on how I was going to trim these stairs and almost called a trim carpenter I know to see if he would give me a bid to do
it for me. But, I kept going back to Peg's post on trim and looking at the pictures he left and somehow the fear of the job
started evaporating. I had ordered the bullnose trim with the flooring so I had something to start with and I had put the 4x4 newell raw posts up knowing I had to have them. And it was amazing how once I got started every morning and sitting and looking at what
I could do, one piece at a time sort of came to me as the logical way to put it all together.  Now, I'm sure there are much better ways to  trim stairs and my way is far from professional but, I'm damn proud of the way it has turned out and not the least embarrased to
show people that come over. Actually, they are so prominent it is one of the first things people comment on.  Anyway, John I believe has a tag on his signature that says something about sitting and visualizing what you plan to do each day and I'm a firm believer that if you can see it in your minds eye, you can probably build it given enough time to figure out a way.
Okie Bob

[Okie_Bob]

Glenn, I guess that was your comment about working from the general to the specific that I like!
I forgot to leave my blog address in case anyone wants to see the latest pics.
http://bobdanaslakehouse.blogspot.com/
Okie Bob

[PEG688]

Bob post a photo or link of the rail you want to use . We'll see what we can come up with . Will the rail be between the post ? Or as your saying on TOP of the post . I'm not following that part of it.

Those connectors with the lag (wood ) screw on one end and a machine thread on the other you drive the lag into the post and bore two holes one in the end grain to slip the rail into and one directly underneath to access a star type nut that you turn by pushing on the star coggs that pulls the rail tight to the newel then you put a wood plug over that hole.

If you need a bracket google bar hardware they sell round holed brackets made for brass bar rail , you'd have to find a bracket the same diameter as your wood railing.

Hopefully this helps , or will when all the piece fit together in your mind puzzel. Or you show us the round rail .

The stair looks pretty good so far I checked out your new photos .

Good job  Keep the faith bro! It all takes time !     

[PEG688]

Rail bolts ,


   


   


This bracket would attach to a round rail .




   


   

Link on the last two : http://www.vandykes.com/subcategory/36/

[Okie_Bob]

Thanks Peg, really appreciate all your help.
Yep, the top rail is round with a flat on the bottom. It is 1 3/4" OD. I want to put it between the newell post and the wall and the newall post and the next newell post. The two newell posts are several steps apart putting the rail at an angle. I can visualize the bracket you talk about as what I need to hold the rail where it is not angled. But, with the angle, I guess I can try to visually line up a 1 3/4 wood bit and try to drill an angled hole. Problem is I don't know how I'd get the rail into the newells since they are already installed and don't have much play or wiggle room!
I understand the screw/lag bolt you picture and that would work for a smaller newell. But, again, mine are 6 3/4" outside square. Could have done that had I known before I put the newell post cover on permanent.
Anyway, I'm taking your suggestion to see if I can google bar hardware and come up with something.
Went to pick up my bullnose material to finish up the stairs at lunch time. As usual, they had barely stared it and it was due yesterday!
Course it was promised yesterday! Story of my life.

[glenn kangiser]

You'll get it, one thing at a time, BoB.

If your rail is inside the posts and on the wall you could use something like these.

Handrail Brackets

[glenn kangiser]

Between the posts is a different problem.  I'll re-read your posting and try to think of something too.

I think you need to drill and counter sink screw holes on top outside - wood plug and sand if desired and underneath on the bottom  -dont try to set it into the newel posts - just make good cuts at the proper angles and have a good fit.  I'll sketch it and post it - unless PEG has a better idea.

[glenn kangiser]

Actually looks like he may have posted some better ideas I didn't see.