simple question, complex answer. Installing a toilet in a slab.

[FrankInWIS]

One thing got goofed up on my garage/loft build.  I put together a beutiful PVC pipe setup that was to serve as my undocumented toilet hookup in my garage (can't build the house for 1-2 yrs).  I couldn't be there when he did the slab....and he didin't understand placement and left out my work of genious (built to spec from the plumbing books).  He threw in a used elbow in a lame attempt to help me, but now I am left with all slab, and not toilet waste/vent pipe in the floor.   
I am worried....how do I bust up he floor with a jackhammer, put in the plumbing, and not affect the support for the slab (removing all that earth).  I have to go through the floor with the drain...and maybe through the 12" side of the monolythe slab.  I may be able to go at sharp angle from toilet to go under the 12" foundation edge (cause the septic pipe is about 15 feet away and 5-6ft down. 

This all is kind of temporary... I will have a house, and won't need toilet in garage.  My walls are 10' high. 
Should I do it the normal way and bust up the slab, or could I just build a platform above the slab about a foot or so high and have the toilet on top (with a shower near by) and he plumbing under the platform, exiting the garage through the wall?   

I would sure appreciate some thoughts here.  I just can't call a plumber.... I can't afford it, and it's not ok to put plumbing in there. 

[glenn kangiser]

What about a small attached building with the restroom built in it?

Could you score the floor with a diamond blade to keep from making an ugly hole - break out the center, - cut out a 2'x2' area -  dig down under the footing and take the pipe out under it -- or footing too deep?  Repour the square when done and pipes are set.

[MountainDon]

If you were to build a platform as described would there be a potential freezing problem during the frosty winter weather?

Other than that I could see it working. Ice could slowly build up each time the toilet was flushed if the pipe itself was at or below freezing temp. 

[rakuz66]

What about one of those upflush toilets?

[ScottA]

Busting up slabs to make changes is very common. That said it's also very hard work. If you can and as you said it's just temporary I'd go with the raised floor option that way when you remove it you won't have a hole in your floor.

[Willy]

I would do like Glen said on the floor and after you figure the grade of the drain use a rotor hammer drill to drill a series of holes in the side of the footing to place the pipe thru. By drilling the small holes you could chissle out the rest. Problem is you need to figure out the grade for you sewer pipe first to determin the hight of the pipe coming out. You will also need a vent to come up. If it is all going to be tempory then just build up a section of wood floor under where the tolet goes and vent to the wall and go thru the floor to the right hight for the proper grade of the sewer pipe. Then you could remove/cap pipe and patch with concrete later. Just remember water has to flow down hill at a certain rate to not lose the water and cause the solids to stay in the pipe. I beleive this rate of grade is a 1/4 bubble on the level in 10 ft. So you need to know where your septic tank is going, grade of it for the inlet, length of run ect to make sure you do not start off to low on the run to the tank. Mark

[Redoverfarm]

Frank I am a little confused. You said the concrete contractor put in a elbow. Elbow to what? Did you already have the waste line run through the footer? Sounds as if you are trying to go through it for the waste line. If it was put in and all he did was to put an elbow to bring it up without attaching your "work of art" then it sounds like a fairly easy fix to cut out the pour around the elbow then attach your plumbing to the waste line that has the elbow and go with it.  Maybe I am missing something?

[CREATIVE1]

Another thought:  Search the ads for a composting or marine toilet.  They're usually $$$$$, but who knows.  (and I don't mean a porta-potty--those things are NASTY)

A link: http://www.wholesalemarine.com/pc/ITT-29090-2000/33000504/Toilet+-+Head+Manual/Compact+Manual+Marine+Toilet.html

There's a new one on Craig's list in Seattle for $25.00 right now.  I don't think you'd need to go through the slab to hook it up.

[FrankInWI]

Willy, you said "Just remember water has to flow down hill at a certain rate to not lose the water and cause the solids to stay in the pipe. ".  Wow....did you help me out.  I assumed there was a minimum...but didn't know there was a maximum decent rate!  I was thinking pretty steep.... the field and tank were already put in.  It's quite a drop the the inlet too....   The drop increased even more as I had to build up the area for the slab (to get 2' over flood plain).  I'm guessing what I'd do is keep it in the perscribe pitch all the way to the septic (only about 15' away) and then a 90 degree bend and free fall to the inlet. 

The post after that asked about the elbow.  Yah, in an attempt to put "something" in, he put in a discarded elbow hoping he'd leave me something to work with.  It is the toilet base elbow, but I had used it before and it already has a pipe in it, but cut off at the elbow face when I discarded it.   I don't see how I could wittle out the remaining plastic pipe....and how I'd blindly connect a pipe coming through the monolyte 12" edge to line up with the already cemented in elbow. 
thanks SO much guys.... 

[Willy]

Willy, you said "Just remember water has to flow down hill at a certain rate to not lose the water and cause the solids to stay in the pipe. ".  Wow....did you help me out.  I assumed there was a minimum...but didn't know there was a maximum decent rate!  I was thinking pretty steep.... the field and tank were already put in.  It's quite a drop the the inlet too....   The drop increased even more as I had to build up the area for the slab (to get 2' over flood plain).  I'm guessing what I'd do is keep it in the perscribe pitch all the way to the septic (only about 15' away) and then a 90 degree bend and free fall to the inlet. 

The post after that asked about the elbow.  Yah, in an attempt to put "something" in, he put in a discarded elbow hoping he'd leave me something to work with.  It is the toilet base elbow, but I had used it before and it already has a pipe in it, but cut off at the elbow face when I discarded it.   I don't see how I could wittle out the remaining plastic pipe....and how I'd blindly connect a pipe coming through the monolyte 12" edge to line up with the already cemented in elbow. 
thanks SO much guys.... 

I had the same problem with my system due to a bank and the tank being below it. I kept the grade of the pipe correct till I got to the edge of the bank and 45 deg angled it right to the tank opening and 45 deg right into the tank. I have had no problems in 12 years with it working. The steep pipe is only about 8 ft long. Maybe a installer will chime in here on this subject also. Mark

[ScottA]

Standard grading for sewer lines is 1/8" per foot. 45 degrees down is considered vertical and doesn't count.

[Willy]

Standard grading for sewer lines is 1/8" per foot. 45 degrees down is considered vertical and doesn't count.

My main system was put in by a company but I did the pipe from the house and shop. It took some figuring cause under the ground was some bolders the size of houses it had to go over and I had to take my grade from those points first and work both ways. It worked out to where it was perfect but boy it was close! The pipe from the shop ended up going thru a V between 2 bolders but it cleared. All the lines were allmost straite till they droped into the tank spot. I did not go around the rocks but I did keep the grade right. These 4" sewer lines were also inspected and gven a OK for being right. Mark

[Redoverfarm]

Frank if it has only been a few days since the concrete pour then the cement around the waste line would probably be greener at the pipe. ( Looks cured on top though)  If you are going to try to salvage that line then now is the time to cut out the box surrounding the elbow.  You would be surprised to see how easily it would seperate from the pipe if it isn't completely cured.  You might salvage  the waste line after all. In essence all you need is 1-1/2" of good pipe to join to.  Just a thought as you mentioned cuting a square box and trying to angle another through the footer.  I wouldn't wait to long if you try this.

[PA-Builder]

... Just remember water has to flow down hill at a certain rate to not lose the water and cause the solids to stay in the pipe. I beleive this rate of grade is a 1/4 bubble on the level in 10 ft. So you need to know where your septic tank is going, grade of it for the inlet, length of run ect to make sure you do not start off to low on the run to the tank. Mark

I believe you will find that the old saying about "water outrunning the solids" is a myth.  Many municipalities do not even have a maximum slope in their sewer lateral specs.  No question a minimum slope is needed, but you will find a 10%-15% slope in 4" PVC will not be a problem.  Good luck !

[JRR]

Could you just abandon the existing pipeing and use a wall-mounted toilet on a outside wall?

[FrankInWI]

the more I think of it and consider feedback, the less likely I am going to put in premanent style in-slab toilet waste plumbing.  After all, I really am going to have real live toilet(s) in the house in one to three years.  So, I'll probably go with the temporary raised scenario, but will look into the wall unit option too
Thanks guys