Al and Robins 20x30 1 1/2 near Lake Eufaula, OK

Started by ajbremer, May 09, 2011, 04:01:01 AM

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Wednesday Morning - August 8th, 2012 Mid-Oklahoma

I got an email from the metal roofer installer after I emailed him some pics of my roof and rafter ends.

He wants me to put on the facia board and cover the 'raw' 2x6's going up the rakes.
Here's what he emailed me and wants me to do:

"The roof looks good , I was wondering if you are going to put soffit and facer board on , as for putting on the roof it does not need soffit but it does need the facer board on. I was also concerned with the raw 2x6's going up the rakes, if your not going to put a facer board on I would wrap them with metal."

My rafter ends were not cut and are at a 45 degree angle to the ground. My rafters are 2x8's.

QUESTIONS: What size facia board should I use? What should I cover those rake 2x6's up with?

Here's a picture of the ends of my rafters and a picture of my rakes:
(1 pic coming soon)

Click here to see our 20x30 and here to see our 14x24.


Al it all depends on what you are going to use for soffit and what you want it appearence wise.  I thought at one time you were going to put a porch on and tie the porch rafters to the roof with transition.  Personally I like a 90 deg (plumb) fascia to the ground. To me it makes more sense when you are installing guttering.    As for the fascia demensions it all depends on your soffit.  You want your fascia to cover the raw edge of the soffit material (ply, vinyle, 3/4 board or other) and then approx 3/4" below the soffit face (excluding vinyle). 

As for the rake board again what are you going to use for soffit.  That metal needs to be long enough to cover(45 deg bend at bottom) to cover the soffit.  You will also have to nail a false rafter(of sorts) against your sheeting on the gable end level with you ouside rafter to give you something to anchor or attach your soffit to.  As it looks now that rafter is the end rafter on the edge of your wall and will be covered with sheeting.  If you are going with strictly wood soffit and trim/fascia that needs installed before the rake metal or drip edge.

Your metal installer should ( most do) have metal breaks and should be able to break a piece of coil stock or flat stock color matched for the rake metal.  They also make the metal for that application that is color matched to the roof color but again you have to determine the demensions by the soffit material being used to know what width you need. They usually are in 10' lengths which are started at the bottom and run to the peak overlapped at the joints. 

So you have several steps and decisions to make before you are ready for your metal.


I cut my rafter tails like yours are shown as Al. I am now sorry I did not cut then plumb as John mentioned above. Originally I had no intention of installing rain gutters. Times change though. I did install gutters on one side so far. I was able to buy special hanger brackets, but they are more difficult to use than the normal methods of attaching gutters to plumb facia.

Our soffits are installed on the underside of the rafters. Another mistake, IMO. I now believe the soffits would have been better if framed out to permit the soffit to be installed parallel to the ground rather than parallel to the roof sheathing (under the rafter tails).

Food for thought....
Just because something has been done and has not failed, doesn't mean it is good design.


Wednesday Night - August 8th, 2012 Mid-Oklahoma

Thanks guys, I'm going to have to chew on that 'food for thought' for awhile and figure out what
I'm going to do as far as facias and soffits go. I wish it was easy but I guess that seldom happens here.

I've started to frame my gable ends. I'll be putting in 3' x 5' windows, one on each side - 4 in all.
(1 pic coming soon)
Click here to see our 20x30 and here to see our 14x24.


We talked about this a bit before, it starts around here;
If you are setting the porch rafters like you were talking about the installer likely has scrap sheets to do the temporary bottom. If you talk to him about setting it up for the porch later with the understanding that he will get the work he will  think through those details as he puts this phase of the roof on.


Thursday Afternoon - August 9th, 2012 Mid-Oklahoma

Because of the amount of work involved and time constraints, I have decided to NOT attach porch rafters to the main rafters. I'm just going to leave it as you see it now. BUT, I do still plan to have a porch but I'll be attaching a ledger board below the main roof line at a later date and that will serve as the place where the porch rafters will start.

Today, I ordered enough 1x8 cedar board to cover my rafter ends and be my eave facia board. As far as a soffit, couldn't I somehow attach a small ledger up there and use that to connect a soffit board to it and the 1x8 - even though the 1x8's are on a 45 degree?

I realize that I keep changing my plans about how I do a few things after y'all tell me so much information about how to do it - I really appreciate it.

Here's a rafter tail end cut plumb vs. angled question: Is there any such attachment thing or method where rafters that are not plumb can turn into plumb rafter tails? In other words a little piece of wood on a 45 degree angle that is attached to the end of the rafter. Or how about something like the attachments that StrongTie makes, some kind of metal bracket that attaches to the rafter ends and 45's out to a plumb bracket. Just a thought. I know that all that would probably cost more money than if the proper length rafters were used and then cut plumb...just musing some thoughts here.
Click here to see our 20x30 and here to see our 14x24.


Al there is nothing wrong with setting your rafters for the porch on a ledger.  That is what I did with mine. 

In regards to the facscia board I honestly think that you will be more satisfied with it being plumb and 90 deg to your wall.  If you set it with the 45 deg angle there will be that 45 deg angle space above your porch roof.  Then again if you attach a nailer against the house just below your rafter then the soffit will not be 45 deg but something else because of the ledger thickness.  Trying to add pieces to the rafter tails will be more work than it is worth.  Not to mention that your sub-fascia and fascia will be held by these pieces rather than the rafter tail themself which will be more sturdy.  If and when you decide about gutters a plumb cut will work better as MtDon mentioned. You will have to be up there to attach the pieces and or brackets(difficult to nail into the fascia from the back side) you just as well be up there cutting the tails plumb and be done with it.

The only major work in making the fascia plumb is cutting the rafter tails.  Your nailer will be level as well as your soffit. Just an occassional block to nail the soffit to as you move from one end to the other.  2' spacing would even work.  I think I mentioned this before as far as how to cut them. I failed to mention that you will need to use the level on the first one to get that plumb line to set your bevel square with.

" I would mark both end of the house at the point where the top of the plumb cut will be.  Then using a chaulk box snap that line.  That will give you a mark where the top of the plumb cut will be.  Then using a sliding bevel square set to the position that will be plumb toward the bottom.  Then go through and you will just have to mark each rafter with the bevel square.  No trying to hold the level plumb and occassionally being off a little." 

The example of the components is in your previous post with a plumb cut fascia.


If you add a ledger board under the roofline what pitch will that make your porch roof? 


Hey Mogie1,

My porch pitch would be around a 3:12
Click here to see our 20x30 and here to see our 14x24.


if your porch is full width you dont really need to.plumb cut because you wont need a gutter except on the porch.

if you plumb cut the ends you wilp also need to cut a few inches off the bottom horizontally because the 8" cedar you bought wont cover it.

personally the look of open soffets and angled facia. its a very cabiny type look. however my last house was like that and with no gutters you get lots of erosion on the ground from the rain sheeting off the roof. this time around i will plumb cut the ends and have open soffits. note: open soffets need to be pressure washed every so often because spiders and wasps like to make their home in all the nooks and crannies.

if you alread put osb to the ends then you may want to close in the soffits anyways since osb isnt a great open soffet treatment.

just more food cor thought


actually how are you planning to cover the 8" end rafters with 8" cedar


I think it was Peg who I seen first coin the term cover those tails!  Never seen why   ???   Maybe I shall PM him if he does not see this.  I have been in question ever since I seen that.................

I do know it scared me enough that I covered them on my shop!!! 

Proverbs 24:3-5 Through wisdom is an house builded; an by understanding it is established.  4 And by knowledge shall the chambers be filled with all precious and pleasant riches.  5 A wise man is strong; yea, a man of knowledge increaseth strength.


Saturday Night - August 11th, 2012 Mid-Oklahoma

Been pretty busy these past few days doing things other than the countryplan build. I guess
that happens to us all now and then.

You've all probably seen my 1991 Ford Festiva that I've used as my work truck in past post pics.

I've been a Festiva man for years but my little blue car has 336,000 miles on it and it's starting to use a quart
of oil about every 300 miles and it's getting a little slower going up the grades. I've put almost 150,000 miles
on it, hauled the concrete for my piers in it, hauled many 2x6x10 footers in it, and even 'almost' had a half
rick of wood in it. I'll always remember the look on the Lowes guys face when he looked around to see
where he should put those 8 bags of 80 pound Quickrete and I pointed to my little blue Festiva. I bought
it for $600 and it's never broken down and put me on the side of the road!

All that to say: My wife has been wanting me to get a much better car for awhile now so I went out and bought
a new 2013 Hyundai Accent with all the options. When my wife saw how cool those new Accents looked she
decided to trade in her 2009 Chevy Equinox for an Accent also but she got the one without all the options. So
we both got brand new, his and hers, 2013 Hyundai Accents!

So now I have a bigger car payment but not all that bad. I did have to come up with a little down payment
for the both of them so my countryplan may slow down for a few weeks - although I do have all the wood and
osb to frame up the gable ends so I have a week or so of work to do there.

So now my wife is happy cause shes got a countryplan build with a felt roof and a new car too! Oh ya, I'm happy

UPDATE December 6th, 2017 Years Later: We became very unhappy with the 2 new car payments so we let them go back to the bank. (Greatest financial mistake I ever made)

By the way, those Accents have a 10 year 100,000 mile power train warranty and a 5 year/60,000 mile bumper to
bumper warranty and 5 year road side assistantce...they got it all and to top it off - they get 40mpg or more on
the hwy!

Click here to see our 20x30 and here to see our 14x24.


AJ, congrats on the new rides. I had a Festiva that I bought for $300 and I put a used carb on it and I was getting a high of 43 miles a gallon, no AC. It would not win any beauty contest but it was a solid little work car.
I wish I still had it, we just bought a new Ford Focus and I am getting 39 - 41 mpg if I work at it.
Love the build pictures,

"You will find the key to success under the alarm Glock"  Ben Franklin
Forget it Ben, just remember, the check comes at the first of the month and it's not your fault, your a victim.

Pray while there is still time


AL every once in awhile you just have to break down and upgrade.  I keep hanging onto what I got.  Hate payments. >:(.  You might want to swap for your wifes car since it is a basic model cause building supplies load better into something that is not so nice.   ;)


or you can keep yours and just drive hers to lowes ;D


Monday - August 20th, 2012 Mid-Oklahoma

Finally got back to working on the house. Finished one side of loft gable end framing:

Click here to see our 20x30 and here to see our 14x24.



Al I was about to put an all points bulletin out on you.  Had no seen a post in several days!   ;)
Proverbs 24:3-5 Through wisdom is an house builded; an by understanding it is established.  4 And by knowledge shall the chambers be filled with all precious and pleasant riches.  5 A wise man is strong; yea, a man of knowledge increaseth strength.


Thanks mogie! Hi Rick,

Ya, I haven't posted in about a week. I bought those new cars and had to travel to the dealer about 3 times. Then I had to do other work at home like fix vacuum cleaner, and work on wifes computer. We also visited family a few times.

So now I'm back working on the build. It shouldn't take me long to frame the gable ends and then add osb and house wrap to them.

The down payments on those two new cars plus the tag/tax fees has slowed me down a little. Sometimes I think maybe I should have waited to do the new car thing till after I did at least the roof but...oh well. At least we are driving reliable vehicles.

The guy who put my septic in is supposed to meet me tomorrow to run the main line from the toilet to the septic. I don't have no plumbing done at all but I wanted a flushing toilet before anything.

It would be nice if I can be in there and at least slightly insulated by Christmas!

thanks for watching...

Click here to see our 20x30 and here to see our 14x24.


Tuesday - August 21st, 2012 Mid-Oklahoma

Just met the septic man who put in my tank. He also puts in the drain system under the build. He
came out and looked at my place and I told him where I wanted the toilet to be, the bathroom sink,
the shower, the kitchen sink, and the washing machine drain to be. He said once I had all of them
stubbed out and under the floor, he would run them all to the main line and run it to the septic
for $300 and he said it would take him less than half a day.

That sure sounds like a good deal to me. Of course I've never done any plumbing before and it seems
like it would be pretty easy to stub out drains from sinks, showers, and the toilet but the venting is the
part that I don't totally understand yet. I'll have to get some plumbing books. I want to try and vent my
whole system without going through the metal roof. I remember seeing a build or two here where the
vent pipe seemed to pop out under the eave...or something like that.

It would be nice to have a flushing toilet and a shower right off the bat.
Click here to see our 20x30 and here to see our 14x24.


Wednesday - August 22nd, 2012 Mid-Oklahoma

Got half a side done of the west gable loft framing:

Click here to see our 20x30 and here to see our 14x24.


OK Al you've had almost two weeks without a post. its time for an update !


I agree, its been unusually long in between posts for Al, I dont post much any more but I still keep tabs  ;) Hope everything's well for you Al


Monday - September 10th, 2012

Ok guys, I'm still here. Sorry for being away so long.

Instead of going metal like I had planned, I decided to go with shingles. Mainly because of finances
and also because a friend of mine at work had a few squares he sold me. I'm using Tamko Heritage
30 AR Shingles, Antique Slate shown here:

(4 pics coming soon)

And here is how far I got today:

Look at the above picture closely and you'll notice how the #30 felt is getting old and beat up now. It's held on
even though it has been windy a few days but I really need to get those shingles on because that felt is getting
old, wrinkely, and weak.

Working from that platform that I made makes it really easy to get up there and put shingles on
the 12:12 pitch roof. My plan is to build a wide ladder using 2x4's for runners and 2x6's for wrungs.
I'll then set that on the roof and build a stop at the bottom where the ladder will rest against. That
way I can climb up the wrungs, work from either side, and then slide it over now and then. I'll post a
picture as soon as I can. When I'm done with the shingles on this side I'll tear down the platform and
put it up on the other side.

I took the weekend off and made a small deck so that we don't have to climb the ladder all the time. People
would come over and some people have a hard time with ladders so I decided to make a little deck. It's 5' x 10' but
I can add onto it lengthwise and also add on another 5 feet out to make it a 10' porch later. I'll need to also put a
roof over it. I also plan to have a similar porch in the back.

And lastly, the ladder to the loft. We bought this ladder at a yard sale for like 10 or 15 bucks. I was using it for a long
time just to get in the house. I put it up to the loft and made some rails. It's not code but it's cute!

Click here to see our 20x30 and here to see our 14x24.