In the year 2029, if man is still alive

[John_C]

Someone sent me these so just for grins...

Ozone created by electric cars now killing millions in the seventh largest country in the world, Mexifornia, formerly known as California .  White minorities still trying to have English recognized as Mexifornia's third language.

Spotted Owl plague threatens northwestern United State 's crops and livestock.

Baby conceived naturally.  Scientists stumped.

Couple petitions court to reinstate heterosexual marriage.

Last remaining Fundamentalist Muslim dies in the American Territory of the Middle East (formerly known as Iraq , Afghanistan , Syria and Lebanon ).

Iran still closed off; physicists estimate it will take at least 100 more years before radioactivity decreases to safe levels.

France pleads for global help after being taken over by Jamaica

Castro finally dies at age 112; Cuban cigars can now be imported legally, but President Chelsea Clinton has banned all smoking.

George Z. Bush says he will run for President in 2036.

Postal Service raises price of first class stamp to $17.89 and reduces mail delivery to Wednesdays only.

85-year $75.8 billion study:  Diet and Exercise is the key to weight loss.
Average weight of Americans drops to 250 lbs.

Japanese scientists have created a camera with such a fast shutter speed, they now can photograph a woman with her mouth shut.

Massachusettsexecutes last remaining conservative.

Supreme Court rules punishment of criminals violates their civil rights.

Average height of NBA players is now nine feet, seven inches.

New federal law requires that all nail clippers, screwdrivers, fly swatters and rolled-up newspapers must be registered by January 2036.

Congress authorizes direct deposit of formerly illegal political contributions to campaign accounts.

IRS sets lowest tax rate at 75 percent.

Florida voters still having trouble with voting machines.

[glenn kangiser]

Seems possible.

[fourx]

Not surprising President Chelsea Clinton has banned smoking- Daddy was a dangerous man with a ciger in his hand, as she would well remember. No doubt she has banned blue dresses as well.

[glenn kangiser]

It's all good, Pete. :-?

[fourx]

I think that by 2029 the global warming scam will have gone the same way as the millenium bug, and WMDs in Iraq, the warning that we would run out of food and oil by 2000, the overreaction that banned DDT for nothing,  stuffed up all our car air conditioning for a naturally occuring occasional ozone hole , filled up your car engine with expensive anti-pollution gear, and told us 20 years back that we were entering a new ice age.
The Green zealots will still be peddleing their strange mixture of extremist politics, spirituality and superstition and laughing all the way to the bank and we will still be paying for it.

[Amanda_931]

Nice if true.  Without inducing a nuclear winter.  :-/

I think we're going to have to disagree on that.

Obviously we can both come up with good-looking sites that support our own ideas.  And criticize the other for doing phony science.  

I've had disputes with friends where we fire off what we think are unassailable arguments to the other, only to find them ignored.  

So I'm about to give up on that kind of thing.

[jonsey/downunder]

Not a fan of the global warming theory then xxxx?
And, I've got to say I am a bit puzzled as to why you would think that cleaning up the crap we are spreading all over the planet "extremist politics".

[MountainDon]

I do agree with Pete that there have been many, what were at the time, totally convincing arguments for taking certain actions, DDT, millennium bug, any number of foods I should or should not eat, etc. Every time something like comes along and proves untrue or much less of a worry, it lessens how much I believe of the next expert that comes along.

However, we have managed to clean up tailpipe emissions and we have all benefited from that. It took a long time. At first it didn't seem worthwhile, crappy running engines, poor fuel economy.... But it eventually brought us the advantages of fuel injection, electronic ignition, etc. and our cars run pretty good today as well. Too bad most of us can't do too much work on them anymore, but then not having to change plugs, etc annually is not something I miss. Every so often I am reminded of cleaner running vehicles... once in a while I get behind an older car with a maladjusted carburetor; stinky. [One of the consequences of the arid SW is old cars never rust away.... once again a good/bad thing] We've also cleaned up a significant number of waterways in the USA.

I would like to see a lessened dependence on fossil fuels; mainly the ones the US has to import from politically volatile areas of the world. Not only for self-sufficiency, but also to retain the improvements in air quality we've made. Other than making some mighty fine wines and brandies, one thing that France has done well is develop nuclear electrical power. They derive 78% of their electrical energy from nukes; they are the world's largest net exporter of electrical power, and they have done it safely and without much of the, well-ok-but-not-in-my-backyard mentality.

The Green zealots will still be peddling their strange mixture of extremist politics, spirituality and superstition...

I would like to see some of the extremist greens join, "The Voluntary Human Extinction Movement". Quote from their website, "Phasing out the human race by voluntarily ceasing to breed will allow Earth's biosphere to return to good health."
http://www.vhemt.org/   Green and very extreme group I'd say.

Close cousins of theirs, "The WildLands Project"  [The goal of the Wildlands Project is to set aside approximately fifty (50) percent of the North American continent as "wild land" for the preservation of biological diversity.]  
http://www.twp.org   and/or   http://www.wildlandsprojectrevealed.org/index.html   Also quite a bit over on the extreme side of things. Both have been around at least ten years.

[glenn kangiser]

I'm somewhere in the middle on some of this.  Propane has been a pretty safe refrigerant for years - listed in my 1944 engineering manual, and actual studies have shown that it is no more likely to toast you than that 20 gallons of gas you are sitting on, but DuPont came out with freon and lobbied to get it taken out of use.  The patent protection is expired now so time to find a hole in the ozone and switch to R134A -inefficient or Duracool (propane).  

Many things get an industry profit twist.  

We do need clean air but while we have ways to do much more, big oil wants it done their way.

[MountainDon]

Regarding WildLands Project... I couldn't find this before.... No human activity would be permitted in the red, and only highly regulated activity would be permitted in the yellow areas. from  http://www.discerningtoday.org/wildlands_map_of_us.htm

[glenn kangiser]

That's disgusting, Don.

[Sassy]

I've been ranting about that for awhile MtnDon - its part of the Agenda 21 "sustainable" (suspect   ) development... if you really get into what Agenda 21 is all about - it's not a pretty picture - its part of the NWO globalist agenda to corral the "common man" & dictate where & how we can live & whether we can have children & how many (like China)  All the cities are implementing the Agenda 21 guidelines because they get money from the Federal gov't (our taxes out of our pockets).

True sustainability is great but Agenda 21 is a wolf in sheep's clothing - again refer to the Liberty Garden site I posted in another thread.

[MountainDon]

True sustainability is great but Agenda 21 is a wolf in sheep's clothing - again refer to the Liberty Garden site I posted in another thread.

I just never jumped into this topic with both feet here before...  link to Liberty Garden  http://www.libertygarden.com/gateway/html/

...and the thing to remember about that map is the yellow zone would be "highly regulated"

It's hard to imagine how much more tightly regulated things could be... but one has only to search out one's own counties regulations regarding building and anything to do with building to see that things are somewhat out of hand already. Today I started adding up the various permit fees I should be paying. Some days I'm just a masochist, I know. The fees have multiplied it seems since the last time I scared myself with this foolish enterprise.  

[Sassy]

Flipping The Switch On Climate Change,Hoaxes & Cycles
I'm not familiar with Will Thomas but this article has a lot of food for thought - supporting Amanda's insistence that global warming is real...

[fourx]

Sure it's real- but it has nothing at all to do with a puny, short-lived species that only appeared in the last two seconds of the global clock. This quote from the site sums it up:
""For example, about 12,700 years ago average temperatures in lands bordering the North Atlantic abruptly plummeted nearly 5°C and remained that way for 1,300 years. The resulting Younger Dryas is named after a cold-loving Arctic wildflower that flourished in the US and European regions during an era that saw icebergs off the coast of present day Portugal.

Another abrupt warming took place about 1,000 years ago that allowed Norse voyagers to settle a northern green land. Three centuries later, the Norse abandoned their Greenland settlements when the climate chilled abruptly, with "profound" agricultural, economic, and political impacts in Europe. Over in the USA, the American revolution was nearly aborted by rapid climate shift as George Washington struggled to get his thinly-clad troops across the unexpectedly icebound Delaware River.

"Rapid changes in ocean circulation are linked to these abrupt climate changes," Robert Gagosian, President and Director Woods Hole Oceanographic Institution told the World Economic Forum at Davos, Switzerland in January 2003. "A growing body of evidence demonstrating linkages among ocean-related climate shifts, 'megadroughts' and precipitous collapses of civilizations, including the Akkadian empire in Mesopotamia 4,200 years ago, the Mayan empire in central America 1,500 years ago, and the Anasazi in the American Southwest in the late 13th century."

[MountainDon]

Sure it's real- ....  Anasazi in the American Southwest in the late 13th century."

Yup!  Climate change is believed to be a significant factor in the abandonment of the lands the Anasazi lived in. However, we don't know for sure; they left no written record. Warfare, disease, political collapse, religious failures and witchcraft are among some of the alternative theories. In any event having traveled the area and many of the sites from the huge well known Chaco Canyon and Mesa Verde down to countless other smaller lesser, hidden and unmapped dwelling areas it seems that climate must have been a factor. There's no water to speak of near many of their former settlements. Something just happened to them and I'm certain there was nothing they did that had sufficient impact on their environment.  

BTW, I love being an boonies tour guide. If I can ever be of assistance to anyone here, just shout. A good site with loads of info is at
http://www.desertusa.com/ind1/du_peo_ana.html

[glenn kangiser]

BTW, I love being an boonies tour guide.

Me too, Don, or others.  Maybe we can trade trips some time.  

[jonsey/downunder]

A natural and normal climate event, now there's a scary beast. A runaway freight train that our puny, short-lived species has no hope of controlling. How long would you envisage such an event lasting, a 100 years, 500, 1000, 10s of thousands? What do you reckon our chances of emerging from that unscathed, or even surviving it at all? Or perhaps you see it all blowing over in a few years, everything hunky dory and business as usual. The problem is that advocates of the "natural climate change" line of thinking more often than not would have us doing nothing until we are sure we are heading for extinction. They don't want to spend the money, or change the system, if they are right what will it matter. Are they going to eat all that money, drink it, buy themselves a little more time or maybe a place in paradise? And you can be sure that Mr average is not going to be holding to much of that cash. The thing is that at no time in humanity's short history have we been so reliant on a reasonably stable climate. While in the past it may have been relatively easy for us to just pull up stumps and move to a better climate, right now that is hardly possible. Imagine the logistics of moving most of Australia's population to Tasmania, (that is if Gunn's haven't already stuffed it). And when the doo-doo really hit's the fan and the resources, food and water start to disappear what do you think joe six-pack's chances of getting a seat at the table would be?
Me, I'm a dead-set fan of man-made global warming and getting on with the job of doing something about it. After all what have we got to lose, there is a least a chance of halting it or at the very least lessening the impact. Sitting on our butt's squabbling about who has the best theory is not an option, continue on like that, and I'm afraid it's "good night Irene".

Besides, Amanda has just built herself a shinny new tree-house, imagine how peeved she is going to be when she find's out she has to move it to the frozen north, She's going to make our lives a misery. Of course the frozen north probably won't be frozen by then.

[glenn kangiser]

I don't know Jonesy - you could be right - they could be right - and doing things to help prevent it could be good -  :-/

Do you think the oil companies will let it happen- seems it's a battle against a group that wants to act like they are doing something but really are only working to their own benefit.  The  hydrogen projects they are working on make a good story but are based on oil - not on water, and they are impractical and out of nearly anybodies price range - and it doesn;t look like they will change that -- they are just stalling to keep collecting on fossil fuel.  By the time we really need it they won't have made any progress with water as fuel.  That will come from small backyard experimenters -- if they can survive.  Seems that may be hard to do if you are really innovative and really do something provable.

If big oil has there way global warming may be with us for a while.  

Don't they also say that big dairy industry and their gaseous bovines also contribute to it.  Seems the small farms are less polluting but they can't make it and are locked out - laws against them selling their products even, so once again big industry rules to keep contributing to the problem.  The way our laws work and corporations are favored directly works to contribute to the cycle, I think.

http://www.ecobridge.org/content/g_cse.htm

Yup - there it is - bovine flatulence.

[jonsey/downunder]

It's a weird one for sure mate. We continually hear from our governments that to take any action that would harm the fossil fuel industries will destroy our economies, put use all out of work, extra. To me that sounds like rubbish. Most of the stuff we could get on with would be relatively inexpensive, provide more jobs and increase our wealth. At the same time this would push out our fossil fuel supply's into the future. Some of the things like more economical cars, solar panels, wind generation all have benefits outside climate change. Clean burning coal technologies, better forestry management, sustainable farming practices, mass transport and local food production, the same.

The thing is, to assume that governments are not taking this seriously may also be a mistake. Maybe I am being paranoid but it seems that over the last few weeks I have seen reports that at least two governments armed forces are preparing action plans for global warming blowback. Now is this to protect their people, the corporations, or is it possible they are working on making sure that the wealth gets a comfortable ride into the next life. :-/

But right now I want to know if you have a plan for handling a hopping mad Amanda when we tell her she has to move.

[glenn kangiser]

Just exactly how deep is it supposed to get, mate? :-?

I'm at near 3000 feet elevation - a bit short of 1000 meters out by the ol' black stump.

She could move her tree house here or build another one - would we drown?

[MountainDon]

If it came to elevation only I feel very comfortable with homebase being at 5422 ft and my mountain retreat to-be at 8689 ft. (Google Earth is amazing; I have to keep reminding myself it's not real time.) I dunno about the other aspects, food, water, etc?

[glenn kangiser]

We will always have enough food growing here  to be self sustaining if I have my way.  May have to fight the fleshy headed mutants from the cities for it though.  The ones of them who are still alive will likely be headed to the country and mountains to pillage and plunder. :-/

[fourx]

Just exactly how deep is it supposed to get, mate? :-?

I'm at near 3000 feet elevation - a bit short of 1000 meters out by the ol' black stump.

She could move her tree house here or build another one - would we drown?

Do I hear a distant moooooo....?

Yeah, it's quite possible- but not in water.

[glenn kangiser]

Some of those lagoons are pretty deep.  The methane emanating from them is so bad that many people have suffocated working near them, even ones who are aware of the problem.

http://ncsp.tamu.edu/reports/CDC/NioshFaceReports/1992/FACE%209229.htm

There are lots of these reports, so this could add to the problem -  tons of methane being produced.

Some fall in and drown besides being overcome.

http://ncsp.tamu.edu/reports/CDC/NioshFaceReports/1992/FACE%209228.htm