Cheater Outhouse Scheme

[db4570]

We just bought another small rural property close to home. Our plan its to occasionally weekend there, starting in our tent camper.

We are perfectly happy camping off-the-grid, using our propane camping appliances, solar panel, solar shower, etc. The one turn-off is always toilet facilities. I just can't suffer outhouses, and porta-potties and composting toilets aren't much better.

A simple outhouse is allowed by the town, so I had a thought: with the low-flush toilets available now, which can be as low as .8gpf, why not just have an outhouse with a toilet flushing into it? That way there is a trap seal between the inside of the outhouse and the pit. And who would be the wiser?

I understand that an outhouse pit isn't meant to be used for this, but we're talking maybe only four or five flushes over a weekend. Would the pit really know the difference between only normal waste, and adding a couple gallons of water to the mix? It would only be used for #2, and girls' #1.  (Although fantasies flit through my brain involving big parties with lots of pretty girls swilling beer all weekend, the reality is that my wife will probably be the only female there most of the time, and she doesn't go that often.)

Any thoughts?

David

[NathanS]

Will you vent the pit out and up above the outhouse?

The outhouses that the National forest and park service use  usually don't smell bad because the vent stack really does a good job. Those outhouses sit on a concrete slab, though.

I think you would need to make the rest of the floor air tight if you want a decent chance at keeping the smell out.

What about upgrading the travel trailer to one with a bathroom? They have no smell and are totally sanitary.

[Redoverfarm]

David I had a relative who got somewhat inventive.  He used a 250 gal used fuel tank which he elevated (standard legs) and gravity flow to the toilet tank.  But then again he made a makeshift septic system.  Of course he had a stream nearby that he pumped water out of for filling the tank.  It would be months at a time before he had to refill the tank.  Only problem using this set up was that an outhouse pit is not made to handle additional water (flush toilet) and I am not sure it would work.  Off the radar thinking would be a discharge line near the top of the pit to handle Greyish/black water    Solids do sink toward the bottom.

[UK4X4]

When we did our skiing trips in the RV we parked on the site we did'nt risk using the water system, as even RV antifreeze was frozen on arrival..

we simply used a small plant sprayer with the rv toilet stuff diluted in it

we probably only used 1 bottle every 4-7 days, for three people

[db4570]

I appreciate the answers and alternative ideas, but let's try to stick with the method I'm considering, and see what could go wrong with it. Here's the math:

Let's say four people use an old fashioned traditional outhouse. An average person pees out up to 1/2 gallon a day of liquid. That's 2 gallons a day of liquid a day, or 60 gallons a month. Presumably any traditional outhouse can handle this without a problem, plus the solids.

So let's say with my system I am considering, we only use it about 3 or 4 days a month. The men pee in the bushes, and girls use the toilet/outhouse. So maybe we're looking at maybe 7 flushes a day = 5 gallons/day = 15 gallons a month, or 1/4 the amount of liquid going into a traditional outhouse pit.

Why wouldn't that work?

David

[hpinson]

It's called a "Seepage Pit" or "Cesspit"

It's generally highly illegal, but can work if conditions are right.

It needs to drain well, and not be upstream of any water source or well - not sure what that distance is, that depends on the permeability and makeup of the soil and what is down-drainage.  A real no-no in poorly draining clay or bedrock, or where the water table is near the surface. Regardless, it needs to be far enough from a drinking water source that you don't poison yourself or your neighbors. Several hundred feet? 

Generally, the pit is lined so it does not collapse in on itself when water is introduced. The bottom would be lined with sand and gravel.  There is probably a best practice for designing these.

Seepage pits with poor drainage stink, attract vermin, and worst, can contaminate local groundwater if they are close to the water table, so they are pretty much frowned on.  But if use is as low as you say...

I remember that on Plumb Island, MA, where everything is built on fast draining sand - so many people were doing this at their cabins, that wells were being contaminated to the point of people getting sick.  One persons cess pit was 25-50 feet from the next persons well.  Fecal coliform was the problem.

[NathanS]

I know you're looking for advice on how to do your build, but I just want to show you this one other option in case you don't know about it:

http://www.campingworld.com/shopping/item/porta-potti-portable-toilets-curve/58980

They work just like an RV toilet. It has a freshwater reservoir so you actually have a water seal + flush. Very sanitary, no smell, self contained, inexpensive compared to smelly alternative. Would easily be big enough for weekend trips.

[db4570]

I want to be very responsible as far as keeping it sanitary. The nearest neighbor is probably 1/8 mile away so I don't worry abut contaminating their water. We would bring in our water for camping so wouldn't have to worry about our own well. Outhouses are perfectly acceptable here, so I think this is basically just an outhouse with a water seal. If our usage changes we would certainly change our method.

If it doesn't work then I'm out $150 for a toilet. I can still use it as a traditional outhouse.

I'll look at that camping toilet you mention, Nathan. If it really has a water seal that might be something I'd consider.

David

[Adam Roby]

You may want to consider a very small scale homemade septic system.
Might sound overboard, but would help eliminate some of the potential problems.
https://www.pinterest.com/charmedone469/trailer/

My brother-in-law had an outhouse with a standard toilet up at his camp in northern Quebec.  We would bring a bucket of water from the river with us and just fill the tank in the back with each use.  It was there for 2 or 3 years, but at one point the government stepped in and made him take it down and fill the hole.  They are pretty strict in these parts, and it was his uncle's land so am not sure if he also got a fine or not.

One of my ideas was to do a small septic system like above (also illegal but more sanitary I would think) and make the outside of the outhouse look very antique and rustic, then when you go in have a real toilet, ceramic floors, T&C cedar walls and ceiling, magazine rack...  make you think you are actually inside a nice chalet.  I will probably just build a standard outhouse though.  I've heard you can keep a bucket of sawdust from other projects and spread a layer over the pit which also helps to keep any odors down.

[JRR]

I don't see much wrong with your plan.

[tommytebco]

Just to add another voice for conventional outhouse:

The facility at Standing Bear Farm, a high use facility on the Appalachian Trail, has the sweetest out house ever!!

Their secret seems to be a bale of Cedar Chips kept next to the "throne". With a big scoop provided. No fecal odor at all. Only the sweet smell of cedar chips. I've seen bales of the chips at  Wallmart in the pet department. They weren't very expensive. 25 lb. bag at Lowes:
http://www.lowes.com/pd_4732-55854-I_0__?productId=50006484

[Adam Roby]

Does a little research, these are a bit expensive but have a 1-pint flush.
https://www.sun-mar.com/prod_flush_seal.html

I think it would take quite a while to fill a pit at that rate.