quick help needed? a very rough rough in

[FrankInWIS]

after being totally bumbed out when I found out the fill wasn't high enough to build yet (to get my $500 Certificate of Elevation), things are back to moving forward.  HArd to manage a project working full time 3 hours away from the site.  More trucks of fill coming in on Monday and the slab will go in too next week.  
HEY...it's a garage, with "storage"   upstairs.  I need to rough in a line for waste and supply for the garage level.  First thing I'll probably do is sneak a toilet in after the inspector is gone (he told me, "if you can't build a house, call it 'storage' and do what you need to after I'm gone")  I can't build the house (John's 1 1/2) till 2009.  
SO, I 8-) I need to plop a toilet in for next year.  Cement guy knows, he said just put a pipe in for the waste and a smaller pipe to run the supply lines later.  So, I see a 3 ft of pipe, and elbow and then whatever it takes to get out from under the slab. Later will hook up to the stub sticking out of the septic mound tank.
:-/ :-/ :-/
Would you use 3' or 4" for the waste? (may have a toilet upstairs later, when it becomes  a ligitimate bedroom with entry from the house).  What would be good for supply?
I really want it on the far side of the garage, but that means it running under the slab for 28'.  I may put it on the not desired side, but that would only have to run under the slab a little bit... 14", yes?

I KNOW when I build the house it will be on piers like John showed us.  High groundwater here, hope I can convince the building inspector.
::)Comments very welcom!!!

[glenn kangiser]

You could run 1/2"  PEX under the slab - just unroll it and cover it with sand in a shallow trench.  Use ferule connectors and you won't need a tool.

I always use 3 inch waste lines in house applications.  Put a box of sand over the end of it and set the sand about 1/2 inch below grade -- they can finish over it then you can hook up the closet flange later.  Don't forget the vent and a line for the sink if you want it.

[FrankInWIS]

likw the box of sand idea!  would the vent come off the 3" waste pipe below ground?  and yeh, another waste for a sink.  about 4 feet away I'd guess.  I have a good plumbing book, gut I really appreciate the one on one.  You guys are great.  Nice community John, Glenn, PEG, Jimmy C., et al.

[Jimmy C.]

Would you use 3' or 4" for the waste? (

I had the same question when I put in my waste pipes.  I put in 4" lines.  
By my logic, This means I can Flush something one inch larger in diameter??!!!  

Here in Texas, my family has Burrito night once a week......nuff said..........

[glenn kangiser]

Yeah- 2 inch vent for a toilet - make it come up in the wall behind the toilet - toilet is usually 12 or 13 inches in front of the finished wall.  

Run a 1 1/2 or 2" over for the sink - all can come up in sand boxes if desired or if going up through the floor wrap them with cardboard or such to keep the concrete from gripping and possible breaking them.  Usually they are still grouted after the pour.  If no inspection I guess I wouldn't worry about it but the vents are supposed to equal the cross sectional area of the pipe leaving the building - to get closer to that you may want to run a 2 inch over to the sink then continue it out the roof also - or run one 3 inch toilet vent out then tie the sink vent in above to the toilet vent - 3" only leaves the building roof that way.  Make  the vents go up and the water go down in both cases-

I probably made that confusing, eh?  Easier to follow the plumbing book than to listen to me.

If you put the sink waste line on the toilet exit line it would be good to bring it in at a top 45 degree angle then add a 45 to send it toward the sink -- that would keep solids from flowing past it and plugging it.  Make any sense?

[glenn kangiser]

Would you use 3' or 4" for the waste? (

I had the same question when I put in my waste pipes.  I put in 4" lines.  
By my logic, This means I can Flush something one inch larger in diameter??!!!  

Here in Texas, my family has Burrito night once a week......nuff said..........

Well, Jimmy, I can sympathize with you on the super grande burrito -- funny they come out looking the same as they did when they went in. :-/

But -- consider this-- unless you order a special giant unchokeable (if there is such a thing) toilet, most of them only have a 2 1/2 inch or so throat in the trap.  Now -- where did I put the Super-Blaster plunger anyway?  Dang -- I think it's time for the snake.

[glenn kangiser]

Note that I am very experienced in the fields of both giant burritos and toilets. :-/

[MountainDon]

I think the decision for a 3 or 4 inch waste pipe is decided by the number of fixtures (toilets, sinks, showers, etc) feeding into the pipe, or local codes.

I can't see the need for anything bigger than 3 inch in Frank's particular situation.  :-/

[FrankInWIS]

  Thanks so much for the support.  Another great weekend at the property.  Your advice on the plumbing was very helpful, it's done and ready for the slab to be poured.  I told my sons you can do anything with the right book, and some good advice to go with it.  Here's my in slab closet setup, with vent of course.  Oh yeh, the first version had the waste going 180 degrees in the wrong direction!  

[FrankInWIS]

darn, just like my plumbing, read and be careful then still get it wrong the first time!  Trying to post the url of my image between the brackets. not working for me  :-/

[FrankInWIS]

[PEG688]

Double barrel spud gun :-/   w/ stand. :-/

[MountainDon]

WMD,   Weapon of Mashed Destruction       Like this....



http://www.spudtech.com/
http://www.americanaircannons.com/about.html

I had a small one many years ago. A combustion model, not pneumatic as this one appears to be. Could be a good winter project. Ya' know... to protect the mountain site from predators.  

[PEG688]

Now THATS a spud gun

We better hope  Frank doesn't  build one , he'd almost be able to hit us both from Wis.  

Your really becoming one of us "driftmasters " Mtn. D

[MountainDon]

 
I heard once that the reason a lot of "old"er folk talk so much is that everything reminds them of something they'd forgotten about...  

There's a video on the spudtech link, under the picture

[PEG688]

I heard once that the reason a lot of "old"er folk talk so much is that everything reminds them of something they'd forgotten about...  

Who you callin older ya ancient one, :-? :-? I'm jest a kid in comparision. Now Glenn , ya,  I can see that part of him , bein older like he is in all

[MountainDon]

I was meaning myself, Paul.    

...maybe Glenn too

[PEG688]

Heehhehehhehe  

[glenn kangiser]

I'm 392 in dog years. :-/

That's pretty old.

Depends, guys, just depends.

[MountainDon]

I'm going to double drift this thread....  

I'm 392 in dog years...

Or maybe not!

It is a common belief that 1 human year is equal to 7 dog years. That is not very accurate, since dogs reach adulthood within the first couple of years. The formula used above is from a canine expert and is a bit more accurate. (as accurate as one can judge these things)

The formula is: 10.5 dog years per human year for the first 2 years, then 4 dog years per human year for each year after.

http://www.onlineconversion.com/dogyears.htm

[glenn kangiser]

I just used the old rule of thumb formula as you surmised, and that was not real smart of me as I should have know that you, Don, my numbers man, would have the real poop on this.  

I'll try to refrain from hopping to rash ill thought out comments in the future.

[MountainDon]

You are forgiven.

I was going to let you stew over night, but thought you might need your beauty sleep.  

[glenn kangiser]

Thank you, thank you, Oh great numerical one...(grovel , grovel).

It is best for the world that you took care of it now.  You don't want to see me wake up ugly.

[PEG688]

You'll both no doubt notice how I stay above the fray Ah another thread drifted into the night, G-nite all

[MountainDon]

Accolades humbly accepted.

... and g'nite all