They are going after ammunition....

[NM_Shooter]

Actually, this is pretty clever.   

Very, very scary.

http://ammunitionaccountability.org/Legislation.htm

-f-

[MountainDon]

Frank you ruined what had been a fine day. I can't print what I just said. Not here.

These legislative attempts will raise the cost of ammo alone, even if the bills don't get passed, dur to the high costs of the lobbying efforts to kill the legislation.

[NM_Shooter]

I knee jerked and posted this before researching it a bit. 

It appears that it is being defeated by states such as AZ:  http://www.azcdl.org/html/2008_bills.html#hb2833

But this is just the start.  I guarantee you that the anti-gunners will be bolstered by their election successes.

-f-

[apaknad]

the SOB'S just don't give up on firearms.

[harry51]

They don't give up because guns and ammo they don't control scare the &%$^**#@ out of them. Why? Because they know they deserve to be shot!

[Homegrown Tomatoes]

Now fellas, watch your language....  I don't think most anti-gun folk are rabid communists or anything of the sort.   A lot of them are folks who've never had a gun and are under the mistaken perception that guns cause crime or that guns kill people, neither of which are true.  I know good, honest people who just don't understand that a gun is a tool and nothing more or less.  I think that a lot of people need an education about the hows and whys etc. of guns.  Rather than getting our hackles up every time there is an attempt to diminish the 2nd amendment, I think it would be to the benefit of gun owners and freedom lovers to gently explain some things to folks rather than jumping on our soapboxes immediately.   That said, better buy up some ammunition while the getting is good.     A lot of the same ones who are anti gun also don't want to be educated. 

[glenn kangiser]

People who were borderline on this are now buying out the gun stores and ammo.  Good move.

I heard months ago that Walmart was going to record and video ammo sales.  First time I heard it was actually tried was today - they tried to get Whitlock to voluntarily  fill out an ammo application and tried to get his ID.

[MountainDon]

I agree with Homegrown on her statement that a lot of the anti gun crowd have false ideas about guns. Many members of my extended family views guns as unnecessary and evil and think that the country (that should be read as Canada and/or the USA) would be better off if guns were harder to get. I have tried to convince some of them otherwise, but haven't had much success.  OTOH, some members of K's extended family are avid gun owners. My greatest success is within my own immediate family; K tolerates them, has no problem with people who want to own and shoot guns. Our son is a gun "nut".

As for buying up ammo while the getting is good; that doesn't really help the way these bills are read. To use the AZ bill as an example it would eventually become illegal for anyone to possess ammo that did not have the required serial number on the base of each bullet and on the inside of each casing, after a certain date.    If that bill had passed, let it be noted that this requirement would have applied to all calibers;  no exemptions. The AZ bill referenced all handgun and assault weapon ammo.

As well a half cent per round tax would have been applied. The record keeping would have become a horrendous task and MTL the act would have for all intents and purposes banned the sale of all applicable ammo in the state.

[MountainDon]

People who were borderline on this are now buying out the gun stores and ammo.  Good move.

I heard months ago that Walmart was going to record and video ammo sales.  First time I heard it was actually tried was today - they tried to get Whitlock to voluntarily  fill out an ammo application and tried to get his ID.

No problems buying ammo at Wal-Mart here in NM today. However, any merchant would be free to decide to record that info if they wanted to. Just like they can set the rules as to whether or not they will allow firearms to be brought into their stores. They just have to publicly post that info. The consumer has to make their own decision as to whether or not they will go by those rules.

The WalMarts are all a little different here with their ammo policy. We have three close by; the shotgun ammo is mostly on open self serve shelves, but in one of the stores the rifled slugs and buckshot are locked up. Go figure. 

[Whitlock]

People who were borderline on this are now buying out the gun stores and ammo.  Good move.

I heard months ago that Walmart was going to record and video ammo sales.  First time I heard it was actually tried was today - they tried to get Whitlock to voluntarily  fill out an ammo application and tried to get his ID.

I couldn't believe this They asked me to fill out a voluntary application to buy pistol ammo  
I refused But was told that I could buy ammo as long as I showed them my I.D. I took it out and covered my name.
I wish I would of asked some questions or took one of the apps. with me.
They did tell me that ammo sells are up 400% at wallmart and they might stop selling ammo?
When something is up 400% why would you stop selling it?
Then I came home and got on the forum and saw this

[Whitlock]

Were is the list of cailbers to be coded

[Whitlock]

They say it won't work-


http://www.nraila.org/Issues/Articles/Read.aspx?id=311&issue=100

[MountainDon]

I had a gander at several of the proposed bills. Most simply make mention of assault rifle ammo, some with all pistol ammo included. Some make note to exclude shotgun ammo... I wondered how they serialize all the pellets.    The WA state bill seems to address only pistol (handgun) ammo but does not list amy calibers. Does that mean 22 caliber is included?

The bills I read make no mention of reloading. However they say that each loaded round must consist of a bullet and casing that have matching serial numbers. That would seem to make it impossible to reload casings.  

The whole thing sucks big time.

[MountainDon]

They say it won't work-


http://www.nraila.org/Issues/Articles/Read.aspx?id=311&issue=100

Unfortunately, that an expert may testify to the deficiencies in a serialization system,  is absolutely no guarantee that such legislation will not introduced time and time again.

[harry51]

[quote author=Homegrown Tomatoes link=topic=5743.msg73933#msg73933 date=1228192700]
Now fellas, watch your language.... 
[/quote]

Hi, Homegrown, I was referring to the politicians who year after year keep trying to steal our rights. They took an oath to uphold and defend the Constitution, including the Bill of Rights. IMHO, they're at least liars, and arguably traitors. And you know what the punishment for treason is.........

[apaknad]

glen, are you saying thay whitlock did NOT have to fill out an app and show ID to purchase ammo at walmart? i haven't bought ammo at walmart so i just wanted to know as i am going to purchase .22 ammo there in a day or two.

dan

[NM_Shooter]

They say it won't work-


http://www.nraila.org/Issues/Articles/Read.aspx?id=311&issue=100

Whitlock, thanks for this posting.  I searched the nra site and came up dry. 

Here's hoping it gets soundly defeated in all states.  Looks like it has to have a 2/3 majority to pass; I think many democrats won't go for it, and I don't think any republicans will.  You never know with politicians though... cash talks.

-f-

[harry51]

Here's another interesting 2nd Amendment story:

http://www.nramemberscouncils.com/newsbriefs/

[glenn kangiser]

glen, are you saying thay whitlock did NOT have to fill out an app and show ID to purchase ammo at walmart? i haven't bought ammo at walmart so i just wanted to know as i am going to purchase .22 ammo there in a day or two.

dan

It was presented as voluntary...he didn't volunteer.  The girl required ID- he kept his thumb over his name - she, obviously a low dollar droid let it go and sold him ammo.  No telling how it will be elsewhere.

[apaknad]

ok, this is how it is in michigan 2 hrs. ago. just purchased a 550 block of .22(lr) hollow points for$16.97 and a box of 50 rds, .38 SPCL+P(JHP), 125 gr., for $18.97 no ID check, no asking for voluntary forms, no nothing. had a nice talk w/sales person and he told me that some guy from down south comes up and buys out all his ammo in certain calibers because it is cheaper up here. comes in 3-4 times a year. checked out a few rifle/shotgun prices and cabela's still has the best prices.

[NM_Shooter]

I remember when I was back in school in the mid 70's, I had a job at a small retail sort of place... called "Magic Mart".  I worked the sporting goods / hardware counter and all ammo that could go into a handgun had to be recorded on a form with a driver's license.... I think this was true for .22 ammo too, but can't remember for sure.  This was in Arkansas....

I just bought some pistol ammo for my CCW refresher qualification, and was not required to show any ID here in NM.

But the times, they are a-changing.

-f-

[MountainDon]

I could have the date wrong, but I think there was a federal law up to the late sixties maybe, that required recording that information. 

[MountainDon]

Somebody correct me if I'm out to lunch on this one, but I believe that some, or maybe most, of the people who are in favor of outlawing guns believe that doing so will make themselves and the rest of us safer.

One of the things that really irks me is that the efforts expended to make me "safer" from gun violence could achieve greater results if drunk drivers could be kept off the roads. I stand a better chance of being killed by a drunk driver every time I head up to the mountains than I do of ever getting shot.

[glenn kangiser]

That's what it is I believe but that's not the way it is.  So if the law abiding citizens can only fist fight and the criminals don't give up their guns, how does that make us safer?    hmm

[NM_Shooter]

What libs don't understand though, is that the 2nd amendment wasn't put in place to protect us from street thugs, it was written to protect us from our government.

(There's a high hanging pitch for you Glenn  )


I like this quote from C. Heston, directed toward Bill Clinton and his administration:

One of his most notable jabs was delivered in 1998 as the president of the NRA to the then-President Clinton, ''America doesn't trust you with our 21-year-old daughters, and we sure, Lord, don't trust you with our guns.''