Porch railings--trying to decide

[MikeT]

I need to land on a decision for the type of railing I will use on my entry porch.  I have enclosed a picture of the porch in its current state:



What I am trying to decide is the whether I should have an open railing (whether cable, or 2x2 posts or whatever) or should I create a railing height wall and sheathe it on all sides except the entrance from the steps  (which you can see in the foreground).  My thought on the sheathed railing height wall is this would give me a place to stack wood where it would it would be partly sheltered....

What do you think from an appearance perspective and a function perspective?

Thanks,
Mike

[glenn kangiser]

It would be more useful sheathed solid, otherwise you would likely be wanting to keep it cleared off all of the time. hmm

OK -- so my wife would.

[MikeT]

That was my thought too.  If I were to create something solid, should I make it out of outdoor wood or PT?   Also, how would you recommend I construct this, especially the attachment to the porch?  A smallish post and beam set-up? 

And as you can see, I am already staking out the territory that things will be left there!

mt

[MountainDon]

Hmmm. My take on this is that an open railed porch will be easier to clear the snow from. You get snow?

A ready use wood bin/box with a lifting lid would be handy in one corner or another. I don't like the idea of too much wood piled there on a wood deck for periods of time from a termite and other insect perspective.

Also I know that if this was the front porch on our cabin my wife would not be pleased with a bunch of wood and other stuff that would be sure to accumulate with there being walls to hide behind. Experience speaking. 

[MikeT]

Mtn Don: I am on the Oregon Coast.  Not much crystallized precipitation but plenty of the normal stuff--we have all the adjectives:misting, spitting, drizzling, showers, downpours--you get the idea.

[MountainDon]

Okay. If you don't have to shovel it, then make sure you have scuppers. 



Comments on the termites and clutter still stand though.

[MikeT]

Points well taken, Mtn D.   For my porch decking material, I am using 5/4" x 4" cedar, spaced at 3/8".  I was planning on letting the rain just run through and not worrying about scuppers.   Am I thinking incorrectly?

mt

[Sassy]

Looking good, Mike T!  And especially if you keep the clutter down when you finish the porch 

[PEG688]

   #1:    For my porch decking material, I am using 5/4" x 4" cedar, spaced at 3/8". 

   #2:   I was planning on letting the rain just run through and not worrying about scuppers. 

   #3: Am I thinking incorrectly?

mt

   #1: If you lay it when it's bone dry 3/8" will still be a big gap when it swells. If you laid it VERY wet , like 13%MC or higher , 3/8" wet will be pretty close to 1/2" gap in summer , to big IMO. 

  I'd advise a 16d Gal nail gap , not pulled super tight but just touching / holding the nail , you should be able to pull the nail out with two fingers , as in not have to use a hammer claw to extract the nail.

If you lay the deck this spring and the stock is really wet ,    in summer you'll have about a 3/16 to 1/4 gap , maybe 5/16th if it's a real dry summer.

   #2: Yes the rain will run thru, no scuppers needed.   

   #3: Yes and no , see above.   

[MountainDon]

Water running through sounds fine. I was more or less funning ya' on the scuppers, tho' you do get a tad more rain than we do here. 

And termites don't like the cedar all that much I guess too.

[MikeT]

Thanks, PEG.  Actually I did lay it out using the 16d shank as my guide.  I suppose that is closer to 1/8" isn't it? 

Any thoughts on the railings?

And Mtn Don, I was thinking you were referring to the stacked wood with the termites. 

[MountainDon]

And Mtn Don, I was thinking you were referring to the stacked wood with the termites. 

I was and was worried they might attack the deck, etc. You know... migrate from the wood piled on the deck to the deck, to the cabin, etc. Nasty things to deal with if/when you get them.

[Redoverfarm]

Mike are you going to lay it over the pressure treated that is in the photo? My mistake if it is not PT but your cedar. I couldn't tell from the photo.

It all depends on what your house style is, the wall coverings, and it's intended purpose.  I am like some others as I do not like the look of closed wall railing. If you want that look I would suggest you get creative with a picket design to make it appear semi-closed but not like a completely closed wall. The railing should IMO be a blend of the surroundings that enhance your home not hide it. That is unless you have nosey neighbors.  

[MikeT]

If I decide on something other than a closed railing, I will attach posts to the exterior side of my support beams with 5/8" through bolts and not have anything resting on top of the cedar decking. 

I see your point with the closed look.  I need to think about this some more.

mt

[PEG688]

 

#1: Any thoughts on the railings?

#2: And Mtn Don, I was thinking you were referring to the stacked wood with the termites. 

  #1:  Lots. With that big drop off I'd be looking at a 42" high guard rail / wall . 42" is a nice height to rest your elbows on to look off it but high enought for little kids to not be able to climb up on. If you like a wall look , side it like the  house.

You have that big beam you can  thru bolt or lag on with big lags , I know your wind , so tight in in well. There's  a lot of ways you could do it.

I think I'd use 4x4 corners , frame PT walls between , sheet with PT ply , I'd frame that wall 4" off the  top of the decking so they'd a be a wind space , speeds deck drying , also cuts down some on the wind beating it up by letting the wind go under.

I did a repair job on a similar deck this fall I posted the photos , did you see those?         

 

#2: Wood stacked near a wood building is never a good idea , bugs / mites  ,fire danger / fire bugs , ants etc. I agree with Mtn . D on that small wood box the rest stored away from the buildings  is best.   

[MikeT]

Thanks, PEG.  I talked over the options with my wife, and she does not want a sheathed half wall.  She prefers the idea of the cable railing between posts lagged onto the beams.  When I commented about having a place to put "stuff", she said, "What stuff? I can only imagine a plant there."   

So now that it's settled  , what spacing do you recommend for the posts?  I will go back to the deck photos you referred to.

mt

[MikeT]

PEG, can you give me a shortcut to your thread regarding the deck repair you did?  I have not been able to locate it as yet.

mt

[glenn kangiser]

Try this, Mike.

http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=1656.0

Note that of the 3 search functions available, the one on the Blue bar-  Home Help Search ----- is the best as it searches all forums.

[MikeT]

Thanks, Glenn.

I didn't see what PRG was referring to in your link.  But I did use the blue bar search function and found this thread:
http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=3482.0

I think this is what he was referring to.

But since Nancy wants to go with cable railings, I think the issue now is the posts and how they are lagged into the beams.  I will go with 5/8" through bolts lagged into the posts.  Should I go with cedar/PT/or outdoor wood for the posts (4x4s)?

[glenn kangiser]

Only my preference, but I would use cedar as I don't like the look of PT for something like that, and in 20 years you will likely find out that it will give you cancer -- about the time the patent expires and others can start doing that same type of treatment. (Follow the money-- yes -- it's true - everything is a conspiracy -- nothing is as it appears).

[PEG688]

Thats the one Mike ,  the one Glenn found was more about doors. But you see the problem with rain eh !

I'd use either Clear or TK Cedar for the post. Goggle cable rails you'll see different types of connectors , systems , etc . I'd keep the post under 6 feet OC which on your deck shouldn't  be a issue.

One "odd" think you'll have to work out is how the rail post and cables will intergrate with the 6x6 existing post , or if they just will be there and the cables just past by?? That's a "figure it out yourself , with your wife thing " what you guys , read SHE , thinks will be best .

You may even look at metal posts , you'll see those on the sites you goggle up.


Good luck , ask questions if you need ideas.

Get your wallet out as well S/S cable rails are spendy     

[MikeT]

Thanks again, PEG.  With regard to the expense of the s/s cables, I found a place here in Portland that is way cheaper than some of the specialty places I found on the 'net.  They are more of an industrial supply place for cables, large and small.  The key thing, it appears, is getting the correct measurement.  The expensive parts are the couplings and attachments.

I think I will need to have posts on either sides of the corners and let the cables run at a diagonal between the two posts to make the corners.

mt

[Sassy]

Thanks, PEG.  I talked over the options with my wife, and she does not want a sheathed half wall.  She prefers the idea of the cable railing between posts lagged onto the beams.  When I commented about having a place to put "stuff", she said, "What stuff? I can only imagine a plant there."   

So now that it's settled  , what spacing do you recommend for the posts?  I will go back to the deck photos you referred to.

mt

Your wife has the right idea, Mike!   

[glenn kangiser]

Possibly you may need to work on expanding your wife's imagination, Mike?

Some women seem to get a type of tunnel vision.

[CREATIVE1]

Seems to me that you could do a "combo" railing with a raised wood box in the enclosed area, and something more open in the rest.  Give yourself enough room to sweep leaves under the bottom of the railing.  I made that mistake with my first porch only, always had to sweep everything towards the steps on a 20 foot loooong deck.  Too lazy for unnecessary tasks!

Nice house.  Go Victoria!  Any pictures of the inside?