Lots going on right now

[peternap]

Watching Japan melt down (and I don't just mean their reactors) I'm especially interested in the fact that there is no looting going on. Maybe they haven't lost their heritage after all.

Bank of America emails to be released today.

Most of all though, has Japan ceased to be a major financial power overnight.

[Windpower]

A radio report said that the devastated area makes up about 8 to 10 % of their economy



more here

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1365546/Japan-earthquake-pictures-Devastation-rescue-workers-fight-fires-search-survivors.html

video of the tsunami

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hAE7GLE_cOc&feature=player_embedded


the Nikkei dropped 6% despite the Bank of Japan printing 200 billion overnight

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704893604576199261875222164.html

then consider that the damaged nuke plants will never be in operation again (after the sea water cooling, last act of desperation )
even if they don't go Chernobyl

but this second explosion was even worse than the first

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pIZKlaEZMLY

Got KI

http://www.ki4u.com/


Then there is the refinery fire for the north slope Alaska crude





this has all the earmarks of a world changing disaster

lots of red here

http://www.kitco.com/

except crude oil is still over $100

our church's missionaries in Tokyo are OK

[Windpower]

Just in

This is Number 2

1 and 3 have already had explosions that blew off the outer parts of the buildings

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/03/14/japan-quake-rods-idUSTKB00733720110314

"Nuclear fuel rods at a quake-stricken Japanese nuclear reactor are now fully exposed, Jiji news agency said, quoting the plant's operator, Tokyo Eletcric Power Co

The report referred to the Fukushima Daiichi complex's No.2 reactor, where levels of water coolant around the reactor core had been reported as falling earlier in the day.

The Jiji report said a meltdown of the fuel rods could not be ruled out. A meltdown raises the risk of damage to the reactor vessel and a possible radioactive leak, experts say."

[ScottA]

I would be careful about beliving everything you hear about this disaster. I doubt anyone really knows whats going on so I'm sure there's alot of speculation flying around. It may be much worse than they are saying but I hope not.

[peternap]

I would be careful about beliving everything you hear about this disaster. I doubt anyone really knows whats going on so I'm sure there's alot of speculation flying around. It may be much worse than they are saying but I hope not.

I think that's absolutely true Scott!
There's damage control going on here and there. They also don't have a clue about what the final damage will be and if I had to speculate, I'd say it's far worse than the estimates now. It's a small island, crammed full of people and very dependent on technology.

The farming industry in that part of the island has suffered massive pollution because of the debris, saltwater and probably, radiation.

The Fishing fleets have lost boats, infrastructure and I'm sure the offshore fish population will be severely limited for many years to come. 

[Windpower]

It is lookin worse all the time Scott


How Black is the Japanese Nuclear Swan

(seems to be a slow load  but a good one)

http://theautomaticearth.blogspot.com/2011/03/march-13-2011-how-black-is-japanese.html


snip

The incident is being described as a hydrogen explosion. The official line is that the outer containment building was destroyed, but that the reactor vessel itself remains intact:

Top government officials assured the nation that an explosion that took place Saturday at one of the reactors at the Fukushima Daiichi plant merely knocked down the walls of its external concrete building, and that the reactor and the containment structure surrounding it remained intact.

US Nuclear Regulatory Commission analysts explain the hydrogen production process under accident conditions:


Former U.S. Nuclear Regulatory Commission (NRC) member Peter Bradford added, "The other thing that happens is that the cladding, which is just the outside of the tube, at a high enough temperature interacts with the water. It's essentially a high-speed rusting, where the zirconium becomes zirconium oxide and the hydrogen is set free. And hydrogen at the right concentration in an atmosphere is either flammable or explosive."

"Hydrogen combustion would not occur necessarily in the containment building," Bergeron pointed out, "which is inert—it doesn't have any oxygen—but they have had to vent the containment, because this pressure is building up from all this steam. And so the hydrogen is being vented with the steam and it's entering some area, some building, where there is oxygen, and that's where the explosion took place."


A hydrogen release is very much part of a meltdown scenario, and difficult to imagine hydrogen explosion scenarios on the scale of what was seen at Fukushima 1 that would not involve compromising the reactor pressure vessel:

If hydrogen were allowed to build up within the containment, it could lead to a deflagration event. The numerous catalytic hydrogen recombiners located within the reactor core and containment will prevent this from occurring; however, prior to the installation of these recombiners in the 1980s, the Three Mile Island containment (in 1979) suffered a massive hydrogen explosion event in the accident there.

[Shawn B]

The aircraft carrier Ronald Reagan had to head further "out to sea" because it was in a radioactive cloud. If its bad enough to turn a carrier around....there's more happening than being reported.

[Don_P]

A friend called from Bangkok a little while ago, he had been on the ground in Tokyo for 28 hrs thru this morning, tremors the whole time, the strongest was a 6.1 just as her was getting ready to leave. He was getting ready to fly back in when we got off the phone. They are all in our thoughts.

[peternap]

Well, it can't compare with Japan but I just downloaded the Bank of America emails. That'll be late night reading.

[considerations]

I've been watching the developments at the nuclear plants, especially the ones they are pumping sea water into.   One has to wonder, where the sea water goes after its been pumped into the plant. I'm not hearing any discussions about that.  hmmmm.

[PEG688]

I've been watching the developments at the nuclear plants, especially the ones they are pumping sea water into.   One has to wonder, where the sea water goes after its been pumped into the plant. I'm not hearing any discussions about that.  hmmmm.

What I've read about it says it's like your hot water tank , the elements would be the  nuke rods.   And what they are doing with the sea water is filling the basement with water outside around the tank, not the best way to cool the rods but it's the emergency back up, to the emerg. back up , to the other emerg. back up  "plan".  So it's not the best way to cool the rods , but it's ALL they have left they can try.


Now with all the explosions and the levels of radioactivity going up and up who knows what really is happening inside the "containment" chambers.

  It's about as bad as it can get, baring another big quake or large after shock.
 

[muldoon]

considerations, the fuel rods are hot, the water is an attempt to cool them down, the water evaporates into steam in the process.  The buildup of steam and hydrogen is what caused several of the Fukishima plants to blow because there was apparently no way to vent the pressure of the steam. 

Things seem pretty bad, but the worst of it is the terrible news sources.  There are conflicting reports all day long.  There is open talk of outright meltdown, discussion about evacuations of the plant folks that never occurred, reports of new tsunamis that did not materialize, reports of new explosions, and it just keeps going.  These guys are frazzled beyond belief.  But the news does not match the observable facts.  Reports of radiation being elevated are there, but they are not elevated to the level that would match what is being described.  20x background may or may not be terribly dangerous..  to be honest it depends on a few things.  WEhat is clear is that you cannot have mox fuel or fuel rods exposed to open air and in melting state and have 20x radiation.  It would be closer to 3000x levels. 

I think the wait and see is still the only answer we have on this.  Saying a prayer for those guys isn't a terrible idea either. 

[peternap]

considerations, the fuel rods are hot, the water is an attempt to cool them down, the water evaporates into steam in the process.  The buildup of steam and hydrogen is what caused several of the Fukishima plants to blow because there was apparently no way to vent the pressure of the steam. 

Things seem pretty bad, but the worst of it is the terrible news sources.  There are conflicting reports all day long.  There is open talk of outright meltdown, discussion about evacuations of the plant folks that never occurred, reports of new tsunamis that did not materialize, reports of new explosions, and it just keeps going.  These guys are frazzled beyond belief.  But the news does not match the observable facts.  Reports of radiation being elevated are there, but they are not elevated to the level that would match what is being described.  20x background may or may not be terribly dangerous..  to be honest it depends on a few things.  WEhat is clear is that you cannot have mox fuel or fuel rods exposed to open air and in melting state and have 20x radiation.  It would be closer to 3000x levels. 

I think the wait and see is still the only answer we have on this.  Saying a prayer for those guys isn't a terrible idea either. 

Actually they can and have vented the steam Muldoon. The hot rods cause hydrogen to be made and in the zero o2 reactor chamber it is inert, however the steam buildup will explode the chamber if left unvented. when they vent the steam the hydrogen goes too and can and did in at least one of these, explode in the 02 rich chamber it was vented into.
That's the chamber Peg was talking about.
The steam is radioactive so if the explosion breaches the outer chamber and reaches the atmosphere, the wind carries it off.

Like you said, prayers are in order because even without the reactor problems, Japan is in deep trouble. With the reactors...it is a nightmare.

[Windpower]

Nikkei down 1015

[considerations]

I think I'll be shopping for potassium iodide today.  No one would ever have the cajones to tell 50 million people on the west coast of the US to head east.

[archimedes]

Building a nuclear power plant on an earthquake fault line -  what could possibly go wrong?

[Windpower]

I think I'll be shopping for potassium iodide today.  No one would ever have the cajones to tell 50 million people on the west coast of the US to head east.

http://www.ki4u.com/products1.php


LAST UPDATE: This morning (Monday, 10:32 AM CST, 3/14/2011):

NO NEW ORDERS ACCEPTED AT THIS TIME
WHILE WE FOCUS SOLELY ON GETTING OUT WHAT HAS ALREADY BEEN ORDERED!
We've been slammed very hard here and there will be inevitable delays processing & shipping current orders out. Please be patient & refrain calling & emailing about order shipping status, as we are 18 hr days here pushing it all out as fast to you as we possibly can.
Quick as we get caught up, we will be back up accepting orders.

Thank you for your patience & understanding, Shane Connor

(Read Trans-Pacific Fallout Here From Japan and Emergency Alternate Plan 'B' for any caught without KI in time.)

[MountainDon]

Building a nuclear power plant on an earthquake fault line -  what could possibly go wrong?

Not to say that it was not a potential issue, but I believe I'm correct to say that it was the tsunami that occurred after the earthquake that caused the cooling system problems. Similar to the 1906 San Francisco earthquake where the fires after the quake did more damage than the quake itself.

[Windpower]

Explosion and fire at #4

#4 was shut down during the quake/tsunami

the 'spent' rods in the holding tank caused it


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ge4YXknUios&feature=player_embedded

[Windpower]

[considerations]

NO NEW ORDERS ACCEPTED AT THIS TIME

Google KI03

[John Raabe]

I probably should have posted here, but I started another thread with good update information on the nuclear plant issues.

http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=10420.0

Yes, the initial problem with the reactors was loss of power to run the cooling system pumps. That was likely the result of the tsunami damage to the grid and backup generators.

[peternap]

NO NEW ORDERS ACCEPTED AT THIS TIME

Google KI03

Whoeeeee!
If you can find them, the prices have quadrupled except for one enterprising gentleman who went from $9.95 to $275.00

[rick91351]

Whoeeeee!
If you can find them, the prices have quadrupled except for one enterprising gentleman who went from $9.95 to $275.00

Enterprising yes, gentleman I doubt!

[considerations]

I had to satisfy myself about the question as to what having potassium iodide pills would do for me. I've tried to sift through the mass of gobbly gook on this crisis, let my curiosity get the best of me, and after wearing out my eyes came to the following conclusions.

So, what I understand is that Iodine 131 is what KI helps protect us from. 

Iodine 131 has a half life of about 8 days, and is an "expected" emission of even a small leak from a nuclear plant. Absorbing Iodine 131 is usually experienced by people near to the time and place of exposure.   There is lots of data on the net about the thyroid and body tissue uptake of iodine 131 and potassium iodide, so I'll spare us both the details.

What potassium iodide doesn't protect people from:

Caesium 137 with a half life of about 30 years, another "expected" emission of even a small leak.

Both the Iodine and the Caesium seem to be "expected" in the event of a leak, even if a "meltdown" does not occur.

It seems that the fuel rods being used are a plutonium/zirconium alloy.

It seems that the majority of the Plutonium isotopes in this kind of rod has a half life of about 80 years.

Some have said the rods also contain uranium. If they do, different uranium isotopes have wildly different half lives, and it looks like the "popular" fuel isotope is uranium 235, which has a half life of about 700 million years.

So, my conclusion is that that the potassium iodide would only help protect one's tissues and thyroid from the uptake of Iodine 131, which, with a half life of 8 days, would have to be leaked in a pretty heavy concentration to survive a trip across the Pacific on trade winds, in a fairly short period to arrive on the west coast in lethal or damaging concentrations.

And, if it gets here, the Caesium 137 would be here as well, and we'd have no protection from that.

As for the emissions from the plutonium and possibly uranium, it seems that would more likely come from more of a meltdown than is occurring or they've told us about, and if it happens I think we'd be discussing a totally different game than we are right now.

So, I have the potassium iodide pills, because I live within 100 miles of a nuclear sub base and their requisite munitions depot.  Unfortunately the pills are more like a shield than a full suit of armor. 

Up close the remaining workers at those plants are likely getting exposure to gamma rays, no protection for that.  What a tough choice to make.