My daughter is seeking input on how to handle a cheater.....

[NM_Shooter]

I'm torn, and too emotionally invested to be able to analyze on what is the "right" thing to do in this situation.

My daughter is a high school Jr, entering her Sr year this fall.  She is a bright kid with a sterling work ethic, and is currently tied for first in her class with a boy.  She is pretty upset right now, as this other kid is obsessed with getting valedictorian, and he has been cheating in his classes.  He is a smart kid, but a bit lazy.  This is not speculation... my daughter saw him and two other students copying papers to turn in for an AP Physics class.

So needless to say, my daughter is pissed.  She said that it seems like it would be better to be be 10th place than second, especially if it means losing to someone who cheated. 

So... the $50,000 question.. what to do?

I've already been through the whole deal that she'll always know that she did her own work, no matter what, and that second place with honor beats first place with dishonesty.  But that sort of consolation only goes so far. 

We've talked this through a bit, and the best that I can come up with is that she needs to confront him in private, send an email to him or whatever.  Call him out, and tell him that she knows he has been cheating, and that she'd like to finish the senior year on a level playing field.  Ask him if he does win valedictorian if he'll be able to stand behind the podium and not feel like a complete loser.  Kid's probably a sociopath so it doesn't matter. 

What do you think?  We've talked through other options too, but she is not the whistle blower type.   

[glenn kangiser]

Hmm... this probably won't help, Frank, but can she find any pictures of him pole dancing? .....




All seriousness aside, I agree with you, Frank.  Your approach is probably the best if she doesn't want to rat him out.  

The grapevine is a great way to get things done though if she doesn't want to do it herself.  A truthful rumor starting could be helpful to her and the kid, otherwise he may turn out to be a politician, or  if he gets corrupt enough even.... gasp.... the President of The United States of America....

OK - so he would have to get a Hawaiian certificate of live birth, but I hear anybody can get one of those.. [ouch]

[bayview]

   It probably won't do any good but, your daughter could inform the cheater anonymously with some sort of note.

   Confronting the cheater by your daughter will just cause more problems.   Obviously he doesn't care about anyone or anything but himself.   Expect your daughter to receive some trouble from him.   It will start with name calling, flat tires, threats, and then risk getting beat up.   Of course he will be innocent.   He will get his "friends" to do it . . .

   She should talk to the teachers and the principal . . .    Yes, rat him out.   They will keep an eye on him.   They will love it!  Power trip!



/

[muldoon]

Kids learn lots of life lessons in school.  This is one of them and it is very important one to learn.  In the real world, lots of people cheat, being better at a job does not necessarily mean you get recognized for it.  It does however mean that you have dignity and that is worth more than the money (in the real world) or valedictorian.   My advice is to learn from this and learn something from school outside of the standard curriculum.  I would not try to steer her into telling on him as that really doesn't seem to be effective anyway, and it just causes more trouble than it's worth in my opinion. 

If it was my daughter, I would tell her that he may be a cheat, but she was better than him and could beat him anyway if she works hard enough.  Encourage her to overcome lifes obstacles in a constructive way; instead of trying to bring him down (albeit from a false perch), focus on building herself up.  She will always have to fight this in the real world, whether being in business and competing against those who perform fraudulent accounting, or those who hire illegal immigrants, resell grey market products, etc.  Sometimes you just have to shine on your own and beat them even when their cheating.  Sometimes they win, sometimes not.  Having dignity and self respect could certainly help her get over this either way tho.

Just my two cents. 

[StinkerBell]

Hmmmmmm


ponder ponder ponder

I was reflecting about ratting someoneout..But then I thought if I was in line and someone cut in front of me I would speak up. If someone was cheating me out of what I earned I would be proactive and take back what I earned. I understnad why she is peeeed.

[NM_Shooter]

Thanks for the comments.  This is a tough one, huh?  I am not in favor of her "ratting" on anyone.  Worst case could ruin this other kid's academic career more than it should. 

I am in favor of her having a private conversation with him and telling him to knock it off.  She's a strong young lady and is not intimidated.  Think Sandra Bullock in "The Blind Side". 

She doesn't tolerate people who bully or cheat, and this is bugging her because she walks a straight line and expects those who compete with her to do so as well. 

[peternap]

Thanks for the comments.  This is a tough one, huh?  I am not in favor of her "ratting" on anyone.  Worst case could ruin this other kid's academic career more than it should. 

I am in favor of her having a private conversation with him and telling him to knock it off.  She's a strong young lady and is not intimidated.  Think Sandra Bullock in "The Blind Side". 

She doesn't tolerate people who bully or cheat, and this is bugging her because she walks a straight line and expects those who compete with her to do so as well. 

I guess I'll be the dissenting voice and I'm not sure it's good advice.

She will have to deal with this type of person as long as she lives. If she doesn't learn to stand up to them, she'll always be number two.

I don't believe in ratting people out. It always seemed cowardly to me. That's letting someone else do your fighting for you. I do believe in looking these people in the eye and telling them what I think. She doesn't have the privilege of stepping outside if he gets abusive and lots of my arguments ended that way....but at the same time, she does get to tell him just what she thinks. That in it's own way, is more painful than a punch in the eye.

I'd vote for a private conversation.

[JavaMan]

I'd be wary of having a talk with him in private.  Next thing you know, he has a way to get rid of his competition - rat her out as a cheater.  Granted, he has no proof, but, and I hate to say it, these days it's becoming more and more "Guilty until proven innocent".  And even once proven innocent, a lot of people just won't believe you didn't do something wrong.

I'd think she has two choices, really.

1.  Rat him out.  Go to the school admin and let them know he's dishonest.

or 2. Ignore him.

Yeah, she could start a "rumor" of truth about him, but that too, could come back to haunt her.

[MountainDon]

I've been puzzling on this. My first reaction was for her to let the other kid know that she knows what he did and that she expects him to decline is nominated or to even tell the school he is not interested because he cheated. No threats voiced. I thought of face to face or a note.

Then I began to doubt the wiseness of that.   


I've gone in a big circle and have come back to that. It should be done face to face in an open public space if possible. If not, a note would be second best.

Can't say I'm right.

[bayview]

   Kid's probably a sociopath so it doesn't matter. 

   Bingo!!!

NM_Shooter:

    How will your daughter feel if the cheater gets a university scholarship that he didn't earn?    A scholarship that maybe she would have received!

   Cheaters are liars and thieves.   Plagiarizing someone else's work is the same as stealing.   Wouldn't you call the police if someone had stolen something from you?   If she saw someone shoplifting, wouldn't she report it to the store owner and the police?

   Sorry, I don't think it is your daughters responsibility to have a "private conversation"  with the cheater.   This is what the school administration is for . . .   

   We would like to "turn the other cheek" and hope that the situation will go away. . .   It rarely does.   He will continue cheating throughout his life.   Generally, ruining others along the way . . .   

/

[kenhill]

Take the high road.  She should lobby to be student speaker at graduation.  Then she can talk about the 6 pillars of character.  She will know she has earned everything on her own and eventually cheaters get their due deserve.. 

http://charactercounts.org/sixpillars.html

[peternap]

I rethought it!

[NM_Shooter]

I rethought it!

Ahhh the Tonya Harding approach!  Nice. 

[muldoon]

Ahhh the Tonya Harding approach!  Nice. 

Yeah, I teach my kids that one too. 

I have continued to think about this.  I see the points of many of the posts here, and agree with most of them to some degree.  All I can offer to you or to my own children is my owns lifes experience.  Cheaters never get far, although they may win the contest at hand eventually they peter out and hit the wall.  The world is full of what were apparently "very bright" young people who were lazy and now do nothing except take up space on their mommas couch or basement.  Your daughter has the opportunity to look past the immediate battle and focus on the larger picture.  The larger picture is having self confidence and strong desire to excel and grow.  From my perspective, awards are nice to haves but the real reward is the experience from being underestimated and overachieving in spit of it. 

Then again, if she confronts him and cuts him down either verbally or with a big stick, I'll offer to chip in for bail money if needed. 

[NM_Shooter]

Then again, if she confronts him and cuts him down either verbally or with a big stick, I'll offer to chip in for bail money if needed. 

I was carefully and seriously considering your post, then I got to the last sentence and almost choked on my dinner 

[Homegrown Tomatoes]

Shooter, tough one.  Went through something very similar my senior year.  Had to do with the other so-called honor students cheating on the final exam in a math class.  I didn't join them, but I also didn't confront them or tell on them.  I still got offered a valedictorian scholarship from my university of choice and a few others because I had a good GPA and ACT score.  However, on graduation, I remember just burning up with resentment toward the cheaters... the final exam was heavily weighted and the material was new, and it hurt my grade considerably, even though I still came in second.  At least I had the satisfaction of knowing that I came by the grade honestly.  A few months later when one of the girls who'd cheated was talking openly about how they'd acquired the cheat sheet and passed it around.  It just disgusted me.     I don't know that I would do anything differently if I could go back and do it over, though.... the guy who got the cheat sheet for everyone else is now divorced and living back at home with his mom and dad working a menial job.  The others are bean counters and pencil pushers.  I wouldn't trade my life with any one of them!  Likewise, your daughter will probably look back on it in ten or fifteen years and still know she was right, but also realize that it didn't pay off for the cheater in the long run.