Nebraska

Started by StinkerBell, December 03, 2007, 07:42:48 PM

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StinkerBell

Some insight. The state of Nebraska collects 336.00 a month child support for me and three children. I rarely see it. Its been about 6 months since the last payment, but that is not what this rant is about.

I have been informed that I have 10 days to decided how to receive any future support payments because state law says I can no longer receive a check. My two choices is I give them my checking account information and the direct deposit, sounds good? Nope, cause in the small print I am also giving them the right to debit my account if an error is made, and with no time line to withdraw. Thus they can over draw my account and cause me to pay back what they took back plus fees. Heaven forbid it also causes checks to bounce.  The other option is I can sign up for a visa debit card, I have to sign a paper saying I agree to the terms of this card. However I will not get those terms until I sign up. I bet it also says I give the state the same permission to withdraw if they made a mistake. So you say if they make a mistake they only take what they over paid........lol....Nope before I worked in the ER I worked for a bank. They generally withdraw the whole payment and it can take 30+ days to figure out if they overpaid you a 1.00 and then will try to fix it. They will not cover any cost if it causes you to overdraw your account or bounce any checks. Seen it too many times.

PLUS! say if you close your account they can still debit it forcing it to reopen. Thus making your bank institution a debt collector.

MountainDon

I'm not sure I see a question there. If it's do you choose to go with direct bank deposit or the debit card, there's not too much difference. I know it doesn't seem fair to force you to go electronic if you don't want to. But that is the method that's generally promoted. Unfortunately in some cases like yours they give you no real choice. (Ex-personal banker, and ex customer service department manager with a very large bank speaking).

My opinion is that IF they will issue you the debit card without any ties to any bank accounts you may have your name on, that may be the most comfortable route to take. If they don't know where you have bank accounts located they can't get money from it.

A normal debit card is always attached to a bank checking account. People with these cards overspend their accounts with regularity, mainly because of poor accounting on their part. Unless a person has really bad credit, is a chronic overdrafter, and is slow to repay the bank for overdrafts the banks will let checking accounts get overdrawn. It's a money maker for them.

The special cards like you're talking about can be setup without a bank account; the card account is simply credited with their deposit amounts and you spend until it hits a zero balance. These cards are in common use by state programs; child support, food "stamps" and so on. A number of banks also issue cards like this where a person in the USA can make a deposit to the card account, while the person with the card, usually in some other country like Mexico, spends the money there. When the card hits zero, that's it. These cards are usually very trouble free. The most common complaint is lost cards. Well, that and people not keeping the PIN number secure. If you write a PIN down anywhere it's a potential source of future problems. You might, or might not, be surprised at the numbers of people who write PIN #'s on the card itself.

In the case of direct deposit to your existing checking account you shouldn't have any problems IF you closely track all activity. What I'm getting at is you know more or less precisely what should be deposited into the account. It is the account holders duty to not over spend the checking account. Anyone can overspend a checking account if the expenditures are not tracked closely. If the state agency makes an error and deposits too much money somehow, don't spend it. But too many people spend until the card is empty. Then if there's a problem, it's too late. And you're on the hook.



Just because something has been done and has not failed, doesn't mean it is good design.


StinkerBell

Even with a debit card, if they withdraw it can create fees for me. Once again making the bank a debit collector. I am sure you know that bank branches earn their income on Over drafts and Bounce check fees. I have a good idea what the debit card option is, but the mere fact they want me to sign an agreement without being able to read the bank debit card agreement is just wrong. Who in their right mind agrees to a contract without being to read the contract and understand what they are agreeing to.


I hear what your saying, but I have seen the horror of what a State or IRS has done to peoples accounts. Yes it does not happen all the time but it does happen.

Yes it is my duty not to overdraw my account. However if the state deposits 338.00 in my checking account (lets say I have a separate accont just for child support, this is not welfare its child support from the ex) I note that the amount is a dollar or two more, but the ex is late alot and he gets to pay interest. So I go and spend 300.00 for kids clothes and things they need. The state realizes they over paid me 2.00 but they go back to withdrawl the whole amount and re issue a new amount, sometimes that re issue can and has taken up to 30 days. Now that account is overdrawn and I will be penalized with fees for that. Does that seem fair? not only that I need to place 300 back into that account so it does not stay negative but I just bought kids clothes and food how do I do that?

MountainDon

Can they at least tell you if the debit card they are offering allows you to withdraw cash at ATM's? If it does, are there some branded ATM's that you can use without paying a use fee?

If those answers are yes, then cash out the card and put it in a bank account that they have no rights to. Or keep it as cash if it's money that's going to be spent for everyday expenses. That's the only way to avoid those hypothetical cases. Not nice, but the modern reality. I often find it easier to look for my easy outs, rather than bloody my head against against the red-taped bureaucracy. Easier on my BP, too.

As far as bank accounts go, if you have your name on multiple accounts within the same bank, that bank can go and take money from one to pay off an overdraft on another. It's in the fine print agreement. The name thing applies to any account you name is on. That goes for example, an account that's really your mothers, but your name is on it just in case something happens to her. If you (that's a generic you, not you stink) are irresponsible and overdraw your persona accounts the bank can look for those other accounts your name appears on. Usually takes about 90 days for that to kick in. If you have accounts in different banks it becomes very difficult for them to collect.
Just because something has been done and has not failed, doesn't mean it is good design.

williet

The company I retired from had the same system on a direct deposit paycheck. IF we wanted our pay "on time", we had to agree to direct deposit ( and direct debet). IF we didn't agree to the direct deposit, it seemed our paycheck would be up to 3 weeks late.....on a company the size of BP Petro that was a HUGE amount of interest on pay owed but not paid on time.

Anyway.....I agreed after several late paychecks. I never had but one problem and it took several weeks before the deposits and debets finally settled down and I had a stable balance in my account.....AFTER I suffered all the crap, I started a seperate account for the check to be deposited into...and ONLY the one check. This account had overdraft protection and I never had another problem.....

It's a crock.....but they've gotcha ..... Sorry :(

My wife is owed around 60k and she can't get the state of Alabama to do anything...except agree the judge has given her a judgement in her favor..... he usually pays the min. to stay out of jail just before each court date.....


StinkerBell

Yes, 336 a month for 3 kids is not a lot, he is also suppose to maintain medical insurance and pay 50% of uncovered medical expenses. That has never happened. I also cover the cost of the Medical and pay the difference. I have never once complained to him or have ask the courts to up the support. He spends time with his kids for the most part. I think the relationship with the kids is the most important. BUT this does not mean I will let him off the hook. He still needs to pay and get caught up.

MountainDon

Right williet, the real difference between direct deposit and a check in the mail is the time it takes for the check to reach you. The check is usually put in the mail on payday. I really like direct deposit myself. I used it anytime my employer offered it. After the setup wait I can't ever recall a problem in receiving the money due me. No trip to the bank to cash/deposit a check. If you use online banking you can verify the funds deposit and track the account balance.


Unfortunately judgments are usually just that. A promise to pay.... sometime. Blood from a turnip.... You can hope that the reluctant payer hits a lottery jackpot. Most state run lotteries have mechanisms in place to catch things like that if it's family/child support related.
Just because something has been done and has not failed, doesn't mean it is good design.

peternap

You know....that's sad. I understand that marriages don't work out sometimes, but parents have responsibilities to the children. It doesn't matter if the marriage went west, the responsibility stays.

It's a shame that fathers (and mothers) have to be forced by the courts to make sure the children and the ex who is doing all the work of raising them, are well fed and cared for.

Just a sad commentary about modern life.
These here is God's finest scupturings! And there ain't no laws for the brave ones! And there ain't no asylums for the crazy ones! And there ain't no churches, except for this right here!

ScottA

Don't get me started on child support. Nothing against women here I know they need the money but the courts are so unfair about how they collect it it should be criminal. When I got divorced I had to pay $1350 a month in child support plus $350 a month for health insurance and 50% of all co-pays. After 2 years my ex decided to abandon the kids and I had to take them. She paid $0 a month and the state would not go after her for a dime. In fact I had to spend another $1000 to get the child support order changed or I would have still owed her even though I had the kids.

Scott


williet

I've seen it work from both sides. The system here is structured to favor a woman, but if the man is sorry enough, he can duck any responsibility to his kids. At least in Alabama. The debt owed my wife is for many years on non-payment. It has become a personal debt because the kids are grown. One, the youngest is mentally retarded and I assist with her.

My wife worked to provide for them and now he owes her his part. The courts say so and a judgement has been made. The penality here is jail time and the sale of his goods to pay his legal debt....the problem is the "system" will not follow through. The man has the money..he just knows this state will do nothing to him for non-payment. So...I'm retired and looking after his daughter and he's out having fun with his midlife toys.... OH WELL!!!!!

StinkerBell

336 a month for 3 children is not a lot to have to pay in child support. The courts will not go after him for medical insurance so that is on me despite the court order. So, once again 336 for 3 children is not a lot to pay.

Erin

What's the liklihood that they're going to make a mistake? 
The wise woman builds her own house... Proverbs 14:1

Erin

Not that they can't, I mean, once they have money in hand and have deposited said $336 into your account, why would they take it back? ???
The wise woman builds her own house... Proverbs 14:1

MountainDon

Quote from: Erin on December 05, 2007, 11:17:47 AM
... once they have money in hand and have deposited said $336 into your account, why would they take it back?
There one case I can envision, and it depends on how the state has their system set up.

Assume the state receives the money from the payer in the form of a check. The question is does the state verify that the funds are really available and that the check clears the other account, before they pass the money on to the designated recipient?

If they don't do that, and pass the money on right away, there would always be the chance the state could reclaim the money the money they paid out.

:-\
Just because something has been done and has not failed, doesn't mean it is good design.


Homegrown Tomatoes

As a kid who never had child support from my dad when I was growing up, I'd like to weigh in on this... he was supposed to pay $200 a month (he earned $25 an hour at the time, plus $100 an hour when he did frame work, which was a heck of a lot of money at that time.)  Of course, my mom never saw a cent of it.  She worked 12-hour shifts for a few cents above minimum wage, plus all the overtime she could get to pay bills.  I felt like an orphan because not only had dad abandoned me, but mom worked so much that I hardly saw her.  Dad never covered any part of medical bills, even the time he brought me home with scarlett fever and the time I got burned with a welding torch while I was at work with him... he refused to believe I was sick and just kept saying it was all in my head, and he wouldn't take me to the doctor.  When I was 13, the state decided to go after deadbeat dads who don't pay child support, and my dad was one of the ones they decided to press charges against.  He was so angry over it that he wouldn't even talk to me at the hearing (it'd been 6 months since I'd seen him, as I was only allowed to visit at his convenience) and when I ran up to hug him, he said, "Get out of here, kid.  You're going to get me in trouble."  So, looking back, I wish that the state had not even bothered going after him... it tainted our relationship (which was already  VERY shaky) for the next several years.  That was the last time I had contact with my dad until my senior year of high school when he decided to show up for the senior night halftime show to watch me march with the band and we went out for pizza afterward.  Of course, now dad thinks that giving us part of a goat he butchered or giving DH some tools makes up for all those years he didn't do a darn thing to help out... I don't tell him any different because it would just cause more trouble with him.  Stink, you're right that the relationship is the most important thing, and if the money gets in the way of the relationship, it's not worth it no matter how badly you need it.  I almost wish that mom had terminated his parental rights when I was a kid so that maybe as an adult I could have a somewhat normal relationship with him, but it is still strained.  It kills me when he comes along and suddenly wants to act like a dad when he's never given a darn the whole time I was growing up.  When I went on  a missions trip to India a couple of summers ago, he called up my husband and cussed him out for letting me go to India and started ranting about his "rights" as a grandparent and wanting us to leave the kids with them for unsupervised visits (ain't gonna happen.)  If the relationship is really important to the dad, he is going to gladly support his kids.  Otherwise, regardless of what he may say to the contrary, he doesn't care one whit about their well-being.  Parents who use withholding of child support to get back at an ex should be put in the stocks. :P  I think it is the lowest of the low... tells the kid that money is more important than the kid.  Heck, I'm nearly 32 years old and still have "issues" because of that stupid mess...anyone who talks about kids being resilient probably didn't go through a divorce.  I know that none of this has anything to do with HOW you get your child support (debit card or direct deposit) but more about how the state involvement in the beginning has the power to make things worse for your kids.  If you're remarried and the kids have a step-dad who loves and supports them, THAT is the relationship to nurture... and not waste a lot of time and energy on the deadbeat who refuses to take care of his offspring.  Even though I didn't have a step-dad, I was thankful to have a grandpa and several uncles who filled that niche in my life...

glenn kangiser

Thanks for taking the time to post that Homegrown.  Inner thoughts of this quality are hard to find.

"Always work from the general to the specific." J. Raabe

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Homegrown Tomatoes

Quote from: glenn kangiser on December 07, 2007, 12:31:33 PM
Thanks for taking the time to post that Homegrown.  Inner thoughts of this quality are hard to find.


You're welcome... and I hope I didn't offend anyone who has ever been divorced... and I hope also that it is encouragement to all of you who are step-parents.  In my opinion, step-parents who raise other people's kids deserve awards because it is a tough job, and often thankless.  I made a friend in highschool really mad one time when I said that it would have been easier to deal with (not that I wish it would have happened, by any means) if my dad had died rather than left us because there would have been a finality to it that made sense.  Everyone dies and it is inevitable and up to God when and how it happens... divorce, on the other hand doesn't make any sense, particularly to little kids who are hurt in the process.  Spending my whole childhood wondering what I did to make him hate me... because I wouldn't have treated my worst enemy the way he treated me part of that time... was much more difficult to me that having to wonder why God chose to let someone die when and how He did.  I can accept His sovereinty much more easily than I can accept actions of human beings which seem designed only to hurt others. 

glenn kangiser

I was divorced after 25 years, yup, 5 long happy years, and you didn't offend me.

Most of the time was consumed with the day to day grind of trying to make enough money to keep up with the demands of survival, equipment, bills, employees, customers, taxes, insurance and trying to get ahead - to have more for my family than what I grew up with, and I enjoyed working also. I allowed my wife to spend most of her time with her friends preaching as religion had convinced us that that was our duty-- to save those who would listen.  What I didn't realize was that men who give themselves power in religious circles all have their own agenda, and that the only two commandments are required, and they don't require a church.  That's about as far as I am going into that aspect.

I made the cut it off choice at the request of my children ages 15, 20 and 25 appx.  I paid the payments.  I put around 25% down on a separate new house as I figured raising the kids was half the work. 

I taught my kids my trade.  All worked with me on welding and construction before and after the divorce.

Yeah -- I may be an a-hole but at least I try to be fair about it.  Arrogant son-of a b---- I think was the terminology.  ;D
"Always work from the general to the specific." J. Raabe

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Homegrown Tomatoes

Quote from: glenn kangiser on December 07, 2007, 01:30:35 PM
I made the cut it off choice at the request of my children ages 15, 20 and 25 appx.  I paid the payments.  I put around 25% down on a separate new house as I figured raising the kids was half the work. 


I think it is a different thing when your kids are begging you to divorce... one of my college roommates used to say that she wished her folks would just split up because they were so bad together. It took her mom something like 5 years to get the divorce pushed through, and she waited until the kids were nearly grown to do it.  My point is that parents shouldn't let whatever came between them come between them and their kids, and they shouldn't take out their frustrations with the spouse/ex-spouse on the kids.

Robert_Flowers

 I use to build houses and had guys that would for three months and quit because here in Georgia it takes that long for the gov to find where you work a start taking out child support. 

An man who does not take care of his own  children is third on my list of people who need to put against the wall and shot.

Once again the IT'S NOT MY FAULT world we live in.

Robert


StinkerBell

Let me just add a few things to the pot (never saw the thread going in this direction, but what the heck). I was the same child Homegrown. However my mom had many husbands, my father was a drug addict who I saw maybe 6 times (that I can recall). My mom constantly told me how much I was so much like my father and in the same breath she would say how much she hated him. It was obvious to me I was a pond for many things with this woman......Anyways...When I married my ex it was for good. I stuck it out with him through thick and thin and went without. I would still be with him if only he could have kept his you know what in his pants. I lost count after the 4th one, and the final straw was  his own brothers wife. Why did it take more then one time? I forgive him for the first. The others came as a sprint. I never wanted my children to be without a father. So, yes that is why I allow him to spend time with his kids despite no payment. He is allowed every other Christmas and 60 days in the summer, that is what the courts have given him. I in addition allow the kids every other weekend, the Christmas Eve when its my turn. I have bailed him out during the summer visits when he has had his weekend warrior duty. I give and give. Cause despite my feelings for him I picked him to father 3 of my kids. PLUS....this is the key here IMO. He is not a great guy. Really i he is a schmuck. But if I keep our children away from him they will never see him as an average man with faults. They will idolize him and run to him if they think they can when trouble arises at home. I want to have my children in my life when they are adults too. Their childhood will go fast, but as adults is when I really believe I can enjoy them and their company. I hope my rant here makes sense.

Homegrown Tomatoes

Robert, that's exactly what my dad did when the state started tracking him down to try to garnish his wages... he worked in auto body shops and after having worked the same place for more than ten years started hopping around from place to place... then when he figured out they'd be looking for him at body shops, he finally moved to construction and managed to hide out there for several years before they tracked him down again.  Now he's a foreman for the construction company, and go figure, he gets mad when his guys quit showing up for work because they don't want their pay garnished (at least those of them who are legally in the states in the first place...) [noidea'

Sassy

Glenn's ex & I get along fine - in fact we agree on a lot of things  ::)  I once called Glenn a "cocky bast..." & he said, "My ex-wife called me something like that..."  ;)   c* (most of the time he's a sweetie  :-* )

And talk about "thread drift..."   d*

I also worked in a bank -- for 10 yrs - as a receptionist, loan processor & new accts rep & various other positions.  Glad to be out of it...  now an RN in ER - Stink, we have a lot in common...

Wasn't going to get into my story, but I guess everyone else is jumping on the bandwagon  :o  I was married 13 yrs, 2 kids - never got child support...  well, should clarify that, got $25 mo for about a year... went back to school to get my degree & RN - had to go on welfare - but even then didn't qualify for food stamps... after I graduated & was making good money working 12 hr shifts plus overtime in ICU, my ex decided to take the boys - we were at a school track meet, my youngest was running cross country.  (I'd just worked a 12 hr night shift & hadn't slept yet) My ex & his new wife showed up & asked me to send a lot of clothes - I allowed his wife & my oldest son to go by the house & pick up whatever they needed.  Anyway, I get a call a few hours later - my oldest son - 11 y/o at the time says "dad's not going to let us go home" - they were are the police station getting paperwork signed - during this time, my oldest escaped & ran home.  The police told my ex that "he was home free" & the ex couldn't take him. 

I ended up paying $250 a month for my one son, although I had him 1/2 time & the other fulltime & paid health insurance, bought most of the clothes etc.  My ex worked for CPS (I put him through school) & his wife also worked for CPS & they knew the judges - I didn't have a chance. 

During the years before he took the one son, he hardly saw the kids - in fact they would call on the phone & he would hang up on them when he knew it was them.  Then call me & cuss me out because I was putting the kids up to calling him  :-\  He had a problem with alcohol & violent temper (that led to the divorce)

But, the important thing to me was to provide for & keep a good relationship with the kids, not penalize them because their dad was being a jerk. 

Now their dad & I get along really well - he's doing good & it's only God's miracle!  He calls me frequently to discuss the kids & just talk, if I'm not around, he'll talk to Glenn... we do birthdays together for the grandkids... so it has all turned out well.  His mother gave me some of her homemade jellies & jams this year & she is a wonderful cook!   [cool] The boys (I should say "men" as they are 26 & 28) love it that we all get along.
http://glennkathystroglodytecabin.blogspot.com/

You will know the truth & the truth will set you free

glenn kangiser

Stink -- looking the direction of this thread over -- I see Nebraska as the title, but I don't see it as the subject. hmm

Seems like our own little CountryPlans therapy corner here. ;D
"Always work from the general to the specific." J. Raabe

Glenn's Underground Cabin  http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=151.0

Please put your area in your sig line so we can assist with location specific answers.

Sassy

Well, my dad was born in Nebraska & there's still a lot of his family living there - I used to like visiting - going out into the miles & miles of soft rolling hills of wheat where they had the combines out harvesting - used to like to eat the raw wheat.

My uncle was out harvesting one year when the combine jammed - he reached in to fix it - caught his arm - he was there all day, by that time gangrene set in, had to have his arm removed but he still farmed thousands of acres - could do anything a 2 armed man could do, just about  [cool]
http://glennkathystroglodytecabin.blogspot.com/

You will know the truth & the truth will set you free