War here, war there.

[NM_Shooter]

Well Ben, what you wrote was this:

"All of this is on the other side of the world and is of absolute no threat at all to America....."

That sort of indicates that you might be a bit out of touch of how things work globally. 

Sorry about it being one of the worst arguments you've seen.  My mistake for using logic, reason, and sober perspective.  I'll try to use more rhetoric, fabricated and/or distorted data, irrelevant material,  and questionable references from fringe websites. 

I noticed you never attempted to answer the question of the thread either.

[John Raabe]

Hey boys and girls: can we tone it down a bit?

This is a forum about living an independent and self-reliant life. While most of us are Americans or Canadians, we are not exclusively so. Any post on a forum such as this is a communication to the world - and to your children and grand children as well. Feel free to fly off the handle if you wish but remember you are leaving footprints.

American wealth, power and independence is grounded in the freedoms and rights that are granted to us in the constitution and bill of rights. Each of us is free to determine how we want to express that freedom so long as it doesn't harm the rights of another. In the most simple terms:

The Two Laws

1. Do all you have agreed to do.
2. Do not encroach on other persons or their property.

(from Richard Maybury, "Whatever Happened to Justice?")

If we have anything more than hamburgers and Desperate Housewives to offer the world it should be the concept of a persons right and obligation to stand up as a free and self-reliant citizen. I am all for encouraging my fellow Americans and all members of all countries, creeds, religions and races to stand up for their own rights.

In claiming that right for myself I must allow another the right to have their own ideas and beliefs even if they are very different from mine. Otherwise I am living a lie and my own freedom is only a charade, a mask that can be ripped off by the next thug who comes along with a bigger weapon.

[glenn kangiser]

I like that viewpoint and would like to see others viewpoints shared in a friendly way. 

I think those two laws could even solve the financial crisis   but we would need different people in there.

It  is my desire to expose others to other viewpoints and let them decide what is right. Not to convert them to mine.

Guess we could use some blood pressure meds here.

One thing I thought of about this topic is that while I think we should have a strong military here, I am not opposed to going there on intelligence of a  threat that is not fabricated.  That may have been open to misunderstanding.  I was not in favor of waiting for them to come here.

Other than that, I think we have this topic pretty well discussed. If we are only down to petty arguments, then per John I agree, we need to lighten up and discuss things in a friendly manner - myself included, eh.

[apaknad]

thank you john, it did seem to be getting a little tense for some.

[Daddymem]

The cut and paste philosophers were getting a little out of hand....

[glenn kangiser]

We can ignore what's going on but we can't prepare for it or make an educated decision about it if we hide from it, so I
feel it is better to look at all available information even if we don't believe it now.  It may make sense later.

We can ignore what doesn't fit at this time but at least we will remember something we read earlier if it in fact turns out to be true, and a decision based on that knowledge could help us.

If we don't look at all available information we will be taken by surprise, guaranteed.

[Sassy]

I tend to be very skeptical of the controlled mainstream media