too many children rant

[Dog]

I feel so bad for those children! Crazy mom even gave 2 of them the same name. Hopefully a full investigation of the physician involved will help avoid something like this from happening again.

[cordwood]

Once again I think that if people are trained or train themselves in many trades and skills needed for survival, they will be much more prepared to survive in any part of the world rather than just near cities and large population areas.  That would tend to make the world a much larger place.  Yesterday we went through a relatively nearby area with 50 miles between service stations.  The area would still be livable if people cared to live there.

Still... at least I know I have no need for that many kids. 

I'm going take a wild guess and say there wasn't much water in that 50 miles either!

If the population CURVE keeps going the way it is we will see the potential problem very soon. If the Owens Valley residents take back THEIR water and Az. and Utah decide they want more Colorado River water Southern California will be a war zone similar to the Gaza Strip!

And as for the lunatic that says she had a "Dysfunctional Childhood" but wants to raise 14 children in the same household!!!!!!!! No amount of college is going to fix that warped mind. Shes a parasite and should be dealt with accordingly! Her back was hurt to bad to work but not give herself 9 pregnancies (counting miscarriages) PLEEEEAAASSSEEE! And as far as the doctors and the hospitals,...We all know what would have happened if they "DENIED HER RIGHT TO BE A MOTHER"!!!!!

[cordwood]

 I just watched Dateline,...........Still think she is out of touch with reality and a classic "WACKO" !

[glenn kangiser]

Not a lot of water out there, Cordwood, but there were wells.  A better example - Our county - most livable -but not many people.  13 people per square mile but most are actually in town.

[tanya]

I don't think children need two parents or even one for that matter.  My grandma did a fine job of raising her children, all four of them after her husband died off on her during the depression, then her oldest daughter and her husbad died and she raised all of my cousins too all alone by herself years and years ago.  Parents are over rated!!!  As far as having a bunch of kids around it is a great thing, and the bible is just one of those books, dammned if you do and dammned if you don't.  Bye the way there are a lot of people worldwide who get along fine without the "necessities" our society vaules but for heavens sake I jsut can't see calling myself a god fearing person and then say well abortion is wrong, having to many kids is wrong, killing off the already dying is wrong, I could go on.  The point I am trying to make here is why does anyone else care other than these families immediate support systems How can it possibly be MY business if some woman I have never met is impregnated with fetuses? let alone how many, or if another has an abortion why would I even want to know that?  I have plenty of problems I am not about to take on the morallity of others. My own is solid as long as I keep repeating the part about  lead me from temptation over and over and over. 

[Terry]

I thought invitro fertilization was VERY EXPENSIVE? How could this mother afford this in the first place? Who's paying the physician bill? Who's paying the hospital bill?

WE ARE!?! 

[MountainDon]

She received a $100K settlement from some kind of dispute or on the job injury, and spent it on becoming a single Mom. More or less that's it without the fine details.

[Dog]

Oh...this is just crazy...$...Tanya I agree with your philosophy...however...I did hear about the settlement...$... and can't help but wonder where this doc was coming from... $...this mom is obviously not in her right mind...$...why would any physician go along with this?...$...it's not a good situation for mom and especially not for those children!!!!!!!!

[MountainDon]

Now she's asking for donations on her website.

[tesa]

sorry for not participating more, since i'm the one who started this thread, but have
been uber busy with many projects, but none the less keeping up with
this story

i saw she had a website, i think i heard it on the news.  personally, i just cant stand
any more of it.

shalom jens! i, at first did offer up prayers for the safety of her new babies, and herself,
but this business about her getting public assistance is too much.

i know we all have choices to make in life, and daniel and i choose NOT to have any more
children, because we can barley afford the ones we have. to bring more into the world
and to know we'd most likley have to go on public assistance is wrong

if you can't feed 'em, don't breed 'em

"touched in the head" she might be, but do the people of california have to pay for it?

do i have to pay for it? 'cause you know your tax dollars go everywhere, not just the state you
live in, eventually, my hard earded over taxed butt is gonna be payin' for her kids, before its
all said and done

my heart actually goes out to the people of california

tesa

[tesa]

and i'd like to add another thought, you know, i'm not really for population controll either, but
i think theres gotta be a limit to the number of children the state will care for if a woman/couple
continue to have babies they can't afford

i understand poop happens, and the system should be there to help folks who need a break/help,
but at what point does the system go broke helping people who have so many children they
can't feed them without help??

what would happen to those children if a disaster strikes? is that woman prepared to feed her
children if we have some sort of doomsday thing happen??

i am

ike proved it to myself, that i can tend to my family in times of need WITHOUT the government

we never got one MRE, we didn't need FEMA, the only thing we needed was a wee bit of ice, i lived
for 5 days on three bags of ice, for gods sake

i didn't even think about going into a store after ike 'till like day 6 or 7, i think

my point is, i can tend to my own, without government help, even during a major hurricane, and we
got a direct hit (literally, the eye passed 24 miles from my hone!)

lets see her tend to her children WITHOUT government help, and see how much she likes having babies!

after watching your children go hungry, maby she'll reconsider wanting such a big family

tesa

[tanya]

I think it is horribly mean to say that the govt. should not help with the children.  After all they are citizens, maybe they don't pay taxes yet but when they grow up chances are they will pay plenty.  I can also see why a person would choose to have several embryos implanted, I am going to advise my own daughter to do jsut that!!!  They want a large family but she will be lucky to survive even one more pregnancy why not make it count?  And they don't believe in birth control so saying she shouldn't get pregnant again isn't an option because the doc already said it.  Anyone can have a disaster and when that happens the govt should help out if they can whether one child or a dozen is involved.  This mean spirited taking out our social ills on large families is a political game of status baiting, much like it is all a certain races fault, or sexes fault, no!!! The reason our social ills are so intense is because instead of stepping in to help others people would rather complain.  I wonder WHAT Jesus would say when he returns, did he ask to much of his followers when he said feed the hungry, care for the ill, shelter the homeless?  MUST HAVE!!!

[glenn kangiser]

I'm pretty sure he wouldn't be for doctors irresponsibly planting embryo's into people who expected the state to take care of them.  Jesus did not say "Grab the turkey baster, be fruitful, become many and indiscriminately fill the earth."

In the old days - my grandparents days, it was common for families to lose the children they couldn't take care of.  Survival of the fittest - not welfare.  My great grandparents lost 5 of ten children - the state didn't help.

[MountainDon]

I think it is horribly mean to say that the govt. should not help with the children.... 

Well, first of all let me say that will never happen; the children will be taken care of by the state.

I hear all the people saying things like that, as their way of saying they believe it to be ridiculous that a single mother of six should have gone had IVF performed at all, let alone for the number 8. That is playing God, or at least meddling in the natural way.

And I'll go further out on this limb with a saw in my hand, and state that anyone who does not believe in birth control should not practice artificial means of getting impregnated. That would seem to be an inconsistent belief; this parts okay to meddle with, but not that other thing. 

[Ernest T. Bass]

And I'll go further out on this limb with a saw in my hand, and state that anyone who does not believe in birth control should not practice artificial means of getting impregnated. That would seem to be an inconsistent belief; this parts okay to meddle with, but not that other thing. 

I'll jump out on the limb with you and agree 100%.

[tanya]

See that is what I mean about mean spirited.  Where do you suppose turkey basters came from anyway?  where there is a will there is a way and that is because god says so!!!  And furthermore.  I jsut smile and laugh when I hear people yelling and screaming about taking care of little helpless newborns what a bunch of awful negativity!!!  And no one ever did say Jesus said for the state to feed, dress, house and cure the ill, now did he???  No that is a personal directive for each individual to do what they can to help the less fortunate and sometimes that is simply to say nothing if you have nothing nice to say.  That mother should be spending her time loving her children and not worrying about the gossip and hate mongers.  She now has a bunch of kids and nothing is going to change that now is it?  So then....  Bye the way there is plenty of real government misapplication of funds that could VERY WELL go to take care of some youngsters if we didn't have a bunch of ewwwww icky types sitting on thier butts collecting a paycheck for what?  For every single employee sitting at a desk in the welfare office that person's pay and benefits would feed two hundred people with the top food stamp allotment.  EACH MONTH  so maybe instead of blaming those who really do need to eat we should ask why are there a bunch of no good workers sitting around making it impossible for their clients to get assistance when it is simple enough for the govt. to see who is making money, who is poor, who is below a certain income level.  They do it at the federal level for everyone IRS tax returns so why shouldn't they have the same online system where if you are poor you type in your info and the food card gets charged up why do they have to have the most dispicable types sitting in a chair waiting to tell these moms that they are not getting any assistance beca8use a form wasn't filed properly or on time.  FYI 98 percent of all social assistance dollars go to the GOVT. workers, only 2-3 percent ever makes it to the people who really do need it.  SO when you start to complain about people needing assistance ask yourself is that the best you can do? 

[MountainDon]

And no one ever did say Jesus said for the state to feed, dress, house and cure the ill, now did he??? 

No. No argument there.

So I guess the state is off the hook then? The state shouldn't get involved in providing health care, food stamps low income rent controlled housing and all that other stuff the government insists on providing. Glad we got that out of the way.


Seriously though, looking at a couple pertinent points. She already had 6 kids. She had a $100,000 settlement. She could have used that money in any number or ways that would have brought more good to her family.

[glenn kangiser]

Just yanking your chain, Tanya.  I was only trying to get you to express yourself freely.  You seemed as though you were having trouble communicating your true feelings.

I for one think you are right on some points.  We have way too many government workers, and many of them should not be such a burden on the public either, but it seems the chickens may be coming home to roost...

With all of the citizens stopping building etc. due to the current financial ripoffs, there is not enough money coming in to government, and they are already laying them off around here.... but the parasites are now making noises about increasing taxing, ticketing and fining the public to continue to support their bloated lifestyles.  I think we should tar and feather them and run them out of town.

[tanya]

Well I can tell you this much you can't even SAY tar and feather them in a state welfare office... that is threatening a public servant 10 year felony!!!  They sure do deserve it though.  It's well posted too, they are afraid that is because they suck. 

I think that woman used her money that $100,000 wisely.  Those babies will bring in a lot, just the tv shows and stories but on top of that she has 8 babies if one gets tired of being held she can pick up another one and so on. There are plenty of wealthy people who have children and OK maybe they can feed them well but then what?  Do they take an actual interest and responsibility in their well being.  SOme do others take a far keener interest in the well being of their pocket book.  One thing that really ticks me off is parents who refuse to help thier kids with college and refuse to let their kids file for financial aid on thier own all the while collecting the earned income tax credit for them while at the same time kicking them to the curb.     

[Ernest T. Bass]

I don't know... My parents have 9 kids, and THEY think it is absolutely physically impossible that a single mother could even come close to raising 8, well adjusted same aged kids, not to mention the six young'uns that already need her. I don't know how it could be considered a responsible move in the childrens' best interests to try and raise so many at once. But then again, there's nothing we can do about it and our opinions are going to vary, so it's kind of a mute point/beating a dead horse.

[tanya]

Well you could use that same arguement for any kids who attend a child care center on a daily basis then.  They are there most of the waking hours, all with children thier own age cohort, and with no more than 1 teacher for five kids even in the best centers.  So are we to day that kids who go to child care centers are less likely to be well adjusted?  NO in fact with proper support and training one person does do it all.  And just think of when they are school age, 1 teacher to 30 or more children.  I already know it is irresponsible to send children into tht kind of "learning" environment but I rarely hear ANY talk of misused tax dollars there, and most of the nation raises their children in that very same environment. It is totally irresponsible.

[glenn kangiser]

[deadhorse] There you go, Andrew.

[Ernest T. Bass]

Well, we have some pretty strong views on daycare as well as public school, and "well adjusted" is a relative term by today's standards to say the least. Like I said, we're not going to agree, but it doesn't really matter...

Glenn, where do you find all of your appro-pro smillies? 

[MountainDon]

I don't know... My parents have 9 kids, and THEY think it is absolutely physically impossible.....

I like your parents Andrew. 

[Ernest T. Bass]

Yeah, me too....