Can anyone here count to 3.1 TRILLION?

[williet]

"President Bush sent the nation's first-ever $3 trillion budget proposal to Congress on Monday, contending that the spending blueprint will fulfill his chief responsibility to keep America safe"

I would like to RANT, but I'm so angry....I can't think well enough right now!

Anyone here care to defend this moron ?

[ScottA]

1,2,3... No. Sorry.

[Sassy]

Ah, go ahead, Williet!   

[peternap]

I wasn't gonna get his tax credit/refund/economy saver/whatever  anyway. He needs to spend it somewhere.

I can't rant either....I'm just sick!

[glenn kangiser]

The leadership of this country doesn't even have a clue how much that is or where it will come from.  All they know about or care about is that a major portion will go to businesses they are invested in or have an interest in in one way or another -- the object is to get all you can from the peons before you leave office - if -- that happens.

[John_C]

OOOH, OOOH I can do that let see 1,2,3,4..

If I keep this up at one integer per second I'll be done counting in 95,129 years and a bit over 4 months.  Of course I might have to stop for food, potty breaks, death.

[williet]

The leadership of this country doesn't even have a clue how much that is or where it will come from.  All they know about or care about is that a major portion will go to businesses they are invested in or have an interest in in one way or another -- the object is to get all you can from the peons before you leave office - if -- that happens.

Glenn, They do know where it will come from...Saudi Arabia, China, Japan, Dubai, United Arab Emirates....The shrub will sell even more of our country to the people he REALLY cares about.

I do agree these tax cuts will go to the companies that once again made record profits last year. It's no surprise. The thing that's gonna save our country (according to Bush) ALSO just happens to be the thing that's gonna keep the oil companies from paying enough tax on their record profits.....that the keep saying they have no choice in making.

This is all the end result of the Reagan Trickle Down Economics....Make the rich sooo rich that the pennys falling off their table will fall into the waiting hands of the rest of us......A few hundred years ago,it would have been described as "Let them eat cake". 

Anyone have a working guillotine?

[ScottA]

Anyone have a working guillotine?

With the people on this forum I bet we could make one pretty quick. 

[Sassy]

 

[glenn kangiser]

Anyone have a working guillotine?

With the people on this forum I bet we could make one pretty quick. 

I can have one rigged in less than an hour --with stuff lying around the yard.  I have a 6 foot grader blade.  Seems it's impossible to get at the ones who need it though.  Too many jack booted thugs in the way.  Besides -- the politician blood would ruin the water supply -- nothing like gross pollution.

[Drew]

I bet you could pick one up at Home Despot.

[John_C]

A guillotine is so....  European.  If you want to return this country to it's roots a rope & tree are sufficient.

[MountainDon]

And rope is cheap. Really cheap and you can get it or a suitable substitute just about anywhere.

[John_C]

And we can celebrate the fact that due to the environ-mentalists we still have suitable trees.

[MountainDon]

Let's make certain we use a natural hemp rope, not nylon or some other man made rope.

[John_C]

Let's make certain we use a natural hemp rope, not nylon or some other man made rope.

I'll have to ponder this one.  I'm ok with natural rope, but there is also a certain poetic justice in the use of rope made from petrochemicals.

[peternap]

Does anyone have instructions for tying a proper Noose?

[John_C]

Yeppers.  Some say a proper noose should hae 13 turns.   Good news.. an improper one would probably work about as well.

[Drew]

Congress will never pass this budget.  I am no political analyst, but my feeling is that it is fodder for the criticism of the next administration.  "Money for that?  Oh, we had it in our budget, but nooooo!  That democratic congress threw it out!"

The best lies are the ones that are too boring to check up on.

It's going to be a rough road for the next administration, no matter who leads it.  We are not better off than we were 8 years ago.  They are going to face a lot of criticism while they try to undo the damage that has been done.

And as far as the rope?  That's all fun and stuff.   But I bet that some of these guys might want to take special precautions and consult their attorneys before they leave the United States.

[peternap]

We are not better off than we were 8 years ago.  They are going to face a lot of criticism while they try to undo the damage that has been done.

All joking aside Drew, I'm not sure we CAN fix the problems. Not with professional politicians from either party. This country is like an old house that has been lived in with no work done to it.. Paint won't fix the crumbling foundation!

[Drew]

I hear you, Peter.  I heard a lot of people, especially after the last election, talk about moving to Canada.  No one I know of did, and that is their decision.  Whether they couldn't make it work or found a way to cope, that's up to them.

I don't have the training, history, or resources to fix the problems we face on a national level, but I can and do things on a local basis.  Instead of moving out we're going to stay put and press our own agenda.  Self-sufficiency.  Local food systems.  Direct mentorship to young people.  I feel that the investment I make in these things are more efficient because there is no middle man (I'm not paying the teacher, I am the teacher) and I can correct my input based on direct feedback.  Some of the adults we know pick up on some of these ideas and find they fit very well with them.  It won't change an election in November, but it is more effective than donating to a political party or wishing for change.  We also end up with more people to talk to. 

[glenn kangiser]

It won't be fixed -- It will destroy itself while we stand by. 

At least you guys have nice thoughts.

[Drew]

There is no doubt, Glenn.  But who do you want to be when that happens?  The guy with a garage full of toys whose best skill is an above average facility with PowerPoint, or someone who can have everything taken from them and still survive?

It's a rhetorical question.  I'm singing to the choir here and I know it.  I just dig the harmonies.

There are various levels of collapse:

Maybe the government will make it more expensive to live.  County building permit fees.  Land re-assessments.  Income tax.  Water, sewer, power costs.  So we learn to operate with less of what the government wants to tax.  What does the government want you to do?  (Hint:  It motivates with tax breaks.)  What can you do to make what you need to do look like what they want you to do?

Maybe the poor planners vote in someone who will take your assets and redistribute them.  So we learn about foreign investment and/or hold assets that do not appear on the grid.  At the same time we don't acquire things that would jeopardize our freedom, like illegal drugs.  Think of things that are useful/valuable in a local economy.

Maybe our homestead gets too close or becomes part of an active combat area.  We learn what is important to pack with us, how to move safely, and make ourselves useful to a community outside of the affected area.  I guarantee you that they will not need PowerPoint skills.

[peternap]

I really think we're all on the same wavelength Glen.
I also feel like the country will self destruct. Watching doesn't have much to do with it because I can't stop it anyway.

My feelings are that there will be a BIG economic collapse. I also think it is in the progress NOW.

The people that will be least affected will be like You, Drew, Don, Myself and the others here that don't want anything from the Government anyway.

I chuckle at so called, survivalists who are preparing for the breakdown. We aren't preparing for anything, our lifestyles just allow us to be independant no matter what happens. We will hit a speedbump in our lives but it will be business as usual after we get over it. I suspect a lot of people will die when that happens just because they can't get food or medical help. While I have a mild humanitarian feeling for them....they simply aren't my problem. My family is first and friends second. Everyone else needs to work it out for themselves.

After all the hoopla dies down, who knows what will happen. My guess is a breakup. Many areas will split off and run themselves the way they want. The existing government will keep what's left and since it is smaller, reinvent the wheel. 

[williet]

Go back and look at Russia just before they murdered the Czar.The common man thought he'd benefit from the overthrow of government and all that was accomplished was a different, more harmful bunch of thugs took power.

Our military is of the mindset that they serve the Commander in Chief. NO MATTER what he orders. Their leaders seem to have forgotten it's the Constitution which makes the rules and not the person heading the Executive Branch of government.

IF there is an overthrow of this government, we can expect the end result to be our military, the United States military to force our citizens to bow to a Cheneysk type dictator. I hear more and more people say we've got the be a nation of military might and our leader must be a military leader. There are people here who actually believe the sole purpose of the working citizen is to fund the military( like say....John McCain). In fact, that's the 3.1 trillion dollar budget Bush has set forth. He cuts or freezes all domestic spending and quadruples military spending for his war. That's not the United States that I believe inand am proud to be a citizen of. It's not the United States of Thomas Jefferson and Benjamin Franklin.....We are better than that.

The person elected to be head of the Executive Branch, whomever it is, has got to be a President FIRST and Commander in Chief second. The nation has got to be based on the Constitution and belief that freedom is our most sacred gift as Americans.We can no longer continue to believe we're the ONLY so-called super power of the world and what we say rules the rest of the world.

When the other kids leave the playground, the bully looks silly shouting and kicking his heels......NO BODY'S LISTENING TO US ANYMORE...... 

I do believe, unless there is a great change, like an economic collapse, we are headed down the same road as Russia. We'll become a "Union" of workers that only exist to fund the military and the richest few in the land.

The North American Union.....Funded by U.S. tax dollars and enforced by the United States military.

Like I said..... We need a guillotine. The French had the right idea...let ALL of the existing government do-nothins loose their heads for what they believe.....SURE...there will be a few who are in the wrong place at the wrong time...but all in all.....the French Revolution went much better than the Russian Revolution. And Benjamin Franklin started the one in France too.....