Illegal Immigration; where do you stand?

[benevolance]

Here in the Carolinas all the crops are picked by Mexicans....The wages are not that low...But good luck finding a white guy willing to squat out in the sun 100 degrees all day long picking crops...

They will live in squalor have their kids eat free lunch at school and  the mommies will get a welfare check... Instead of them picking crops.

Here in the south People are damned lazy! why work hard when the mexicans will do it... 200 years ago they had the blacks do it for them...

If we were willing to do a little more hard work...we would not need to have millions of illegals come here to work...

The illegals perpetuate the problem...without them tomorrow we would struggle for a little while but farming would go on... food prices would change a little...Big companies would get out of farming as it would not be a rock solid option for their financial portfolio... and the individual farmers might start to make a decent living again.

Sadly farming is big business now in America...And the mom and pop 40 acre farm is a thing of the past... farmers are multi millionaires now with thousands of acres of farmland...They are guilty of wanting mexicans to increase their profits...

I grow tired of the farm aid concerts when farms are getting larger and profits are going up for farmers... The mom and pop farms are in trouble... all the other farms are mega industry...making more money than they can ever spend.

[MountainDon]

I grow tired of the farm aid concerts when farms are getting larger and profits are going up for farmers... The mom and pop farms are in trouble... all the other farms are mega industry...making more money than they can ever spend.

Yeah Peter, and a contributing factor are the various government agricultural subsidy programs that were meant to help Mom & Pop, but are subverted by mega-farm corporations to enrich their coffers.

Another one of my fall-back stances... Government should not be subsidizing anything! The free market will sort out prices and supplies.! If someone can't make a buck, they will switch to another line of business, reinvent the wheel or whatever.

[glenn kangiser]

Please jump on in, Don.  The more the merrier.  you keep her busy and I'll sneak out the back.

I Googled it, Don and I wasn't satisfied with the results.  Hokey explanation.  

I knew an old guy who used to say something like, "I wish I had his car and he had a feather up his ar$e and we'd both be tickled",  but I don't think that means the same thing. :-/

[Sassy]

No problem, MtnDon    Our debates make for lively conversations   - when I spoke of the corporations, I was referring to their saving money on wages which is really at our expense.  They can hire illegal aliens for slave wages because our taxes pickup the rest  

You were wondering where "alien" came from?  There's a few verses in the Bible - Old Testament - Deut. 23:7 & Malachi 3:5 - if you care to read them... wonder if that makes my attitude wrong?  :-/

[glenn kangiser]

Now she's in trouble, Don.  She checked her bible and it told her she needed to take care of those Mexicans.  With religion in bed with government, I guess we know why Shrub is pushing to let them all in free.

[MountainDon]

Glenn, I knew I could count on someone rising to the occasion! Maybe we should complain to Google.  :-/

Sassy, ya' know I was sort of proud in a strange way when I had my "Resident Alien" card. I used to tell the preschoolers I was an alien. They'd be wide-eyed and I'd show them my card.  

and re "hire illegal aliens for slave wages because our taxes pickup the rest" that's what I mean I guess.... we'd save $$ on taxes but have to pay more for the lettuce, etc. It might even save money because we'd not have to have so much government bureaucracy involved. ?   :-/

I'll have to check out the biblical quotes.... have to admit I don't have one real handy....

[MountainDon]

I guess a shrub is a bush

[Sassy]

 :-?  whew, that one went right by me - didn't realize you were asking where the phrase "tickled pink" came from    thought you were asking where "alien" came from   - just worked a 13 & 17 hr shift at the hospital so haven't had a lot of sleep  

[glenn kangiser]

Google it Don -- several bibles will pop up - it will save digging one out.

Hopefully it will give you a better reference than it did for "Tickled Pink".

[MountainDon]

Wow! I Googled the verses and there they were!!  

I suppose if you were to take these literally one might be in trouble. But I do place national sovereignty pretty darn high on my list of priorities.

I feel comfortable. I'll live with my convictions.

[glenn kangiser]

Shrub is little bush.

[MountainDon]

Hopefully it will give you a better reference than it did for "Tickled Pink".

Google came up with a pink tickler but that's best left alone.

[glenn kangiser]

Sassy is amazed with that one, Don.  Couldn't not look. :-/

Do you think there are colloquialisms that are better off left for dead, Don? :-?  It seems that one of the older ones I know gives an explanation of the feeling of Tickled Pink.

[MountainDon]

...  better off left for dead, Don? :-?  

Probably so.

I have to sign off or the preschoolers will be more alert than me in the morning. Not always a good thing.

[glenn kangiser]

Yeah - guess you are right.  
Get your beauty sleep.  Don't want you to wake up ugly and scare the little rascals.

[benevolance]

I agree that illegals make it tough for our social programs to work properly..

My wife and mother in law are teachers and I tell you that they have it rough here in South Carolina with all the illegals...The school has to subvert resources to try and get language teachers to instruct the spanish speaking kids one on one  this is in addition to all the other teachers being capacitated with workloads...

There is no room for these teachers or interpreters in the Budget but the schools cannot function without them...and the teachers cannot teach the spanish kids anything but they have to try...and that takes them away from teaching the kids that speak english...It is a terrible mess...

Basically the system is not designed for illegals and their exploitation of the social program jeopardizes the level of education for everyone.

Same thing with health care... monies spent on illegals could be giving free health care to americans...

Imagine 12 million Americans having free health care tomorrow! That is a pretty big deal.

As for the crops the mexicans pick...If the mexicans were not there the farmers would have to pay a little more and white guys and black guys would pick the crops....They would get picked...There would be no unemployment in America at all... full employment...

What ticks me off is that the illegals are not even willing to spend the money in America that they make and pay no tax on... They send it all home to Mexico or Honduras or wherever...So none of the money they make goes back into the local economy...This is a serious problem...Our economy relies on spin off from residents making a decent living and spending their salaries on food shelter clothing automobiles etc...

We set our bank rates to it...Our economy is based on it...and when you have 12 million illegals taking all their monies and sending it out of this country you have a serious problem...

For that alone I say we round them up and throw them out... get a cattle brand and mark everyone of them on their way out so they are easy to spot if they sneak back across..

[benevolance]

I know that last post was harsh...But let me explain...

when our ancestors came here they learned to speak english... they paid taxes they built houses and became part of the economy and community. Their money did not get sent across the sea to Europe..It  stayed here and they built here.

Illegals for the most part want to exploit this country, They want the benefits.. but they do not want to commit to America or pull their end as consumers...

And for that they should be thrown out and branded...This country has been built on immigrants that wanted to become part of society...There has never been nor is their room now for people who choose not to do so...

Period!

[glenn kangiser]

At the other end of the spectrum, maybe we should do it to all the big business and political whores aiding and abetting them,  who are shipping the decent jobs overseas.  What is worse?  Illegal aliens coming here and spending at least 25% of what they make here, (come on Peter -- it has to be at least that much) or traitorous big business and politicians selling us out to India and other places to keep from paying a decent wage here.   :-?

[williet]

Now she's in trouble, Don.  She checked her bible and it told her she needed to take care of those Mexicans.  With religion in bed with government, I guess we know why Shrub is pushing to let them all in free.

ha ha ha ha

[MountainDon]

.... Illegal aliens coming here and spending at least 25% of what they make here, (come on Peter -- it has to be at least that much)

The available information can be confusing. I've read from one source that $60 Billion dollars are earned by illegal aliens in the US. The same report stated that $10 to $13.3 Billion are sent to Mexico annually. However some of that money being sent to Mexico is from US born Latinos and by legal immigrants. The estimate from the same source states that about 1/3 of the respondents in the survey were illegal aliens.

But that doesn't mean that 1/3 of the total dollars remitted to Mexico come from the illegal aliens. It is more likely that the born here and legal immigrants are sending a larger share to my way of thinking. (The illegals  more than likely being in the lowest paying jobs.)

But for arguments sake let's say the illegals did send the same proportion as the legals. That would then be 1/3 of $13.3 Billion, or almost $4.5 Billion dollars. $4.5B is 7.5% of the $60 Billion estimated illegal earnings. For the mathematically challenged, or calculator poor, that would mean they spend 92.5% of what they earn here in the USA. Some small portion of that might actually be withheld as SSN or MCARE deductions IF they have any legal jobs.

However, any way you look at the dollars leaving the USA it does affect the US adversely. When you add to that the Billions spent by US Federal, State, and local governments, city, municipal, school districts, etc. there's a huge amount of money being spent because of the illegal aliens being here.

Remittances sent to Mexico are second in dollar value only to the Mexican oil revenues. ($8 Billion)
Remittances beat out dollars earned by tourism from the USA to Mexico by a long shot. ($4.9 Billion)
(Numbers are a few years old so the total are higher today, but the proportions may be about the same.)

Sources:
Colorado Alliance for Immigration Reform
http://www.cairco.org/econ/econ.html

Federation for American Immigration Reform
http://www.fairus.org/site/PageServer?pagename=iic_immigrationissuecenterslist8e20

[glenn kangiser]

Thanks for the numbers, Don.  Seems all of this still pales in comparison to the billions of dollars of jobs sent overseas by corporate America, and the multi-billions spent on illegal undeclared wars on small countries in the middle east by unelected politicians and their corporate connected self serving political cohorts.

[benevolance]

Glenn

I am  with you man..I have told everyone I know and have done business with that they need to make sure tires they drive on... the toothpaste they use at night and the underwear they have on (hopefully no male goes commando....That is only okay for sexy ladies ) are all made in america...

I have a hard time buying clothing when I insist it be made by an american in America for americans...

I do not feel that  l I save anything or get a good value by buying the veitnamese made shirt at  Wal-Mart

I wish that every small town in america still had a sense of Community...I wish that everyone in this country understood the importance of buying american made products.

We can blame the companies...As you stated they are worthless profit driven whores....No question... But they will provide what the public demands....And if the public demanded american made and was willing to pay 15% more for genuine goods made here(with a higher quality)... I think we both know that the  mega companies will do anything if they can make a buck off it...

I blame a lot of this directly on Wal-Mart... with nothing in their store that is american made... being so successful as forced everyone else to follow suit and sell junk foreign merchandise to compete

If I was rich ..I swear to God I would open a Department store that would offer  North American made goods only...Food, clothing, hardware

The company might struggle for a little bit...But once people saw the difference in quality...Saw the employees getting paid better with more benefits... Like the Mom and Pop atmosphere where you took care of good employees and they really became part of the family

Sadly I am a dirt poor auto mechanic with back problems (in a lot of pain after a trip to the chiropractor) :'(

[glenn kangiser]

I know the feeling about American made, Peter, but I look at it differently.  If our jobs are given away and they bring in cheap Chinese goods etc.  I feel I have been beat down low enough that I have to go ahead and buy the cheaper workable foreign made stuff.  "Upper class" America doesn't give a rats s about the working class so I will spread my few extra bucks among the Chinese.

The US leaders should be leading the way by preventing our jobs from leaving or preventing illegals from taking them.  They won't do their part-- I can't afford to do mine.  I won't punish myself for their mis-leadership.  (I wonder if that's a word?) :-?
-

[MountainDon]

To buy American, or not to buy American. That is the question.

I'd like to but when there's no real choice why flagellate yourself? A quick check of my wardrobe reveals: underwear (Hane's, American name made in India), my shirts (Faded Glory made in Pakistan and Bangladesh, or some other shirts (Joe Boxer made in El Salvador), or here at last my shoes...no name sneakers made in China. Heck, even my Rockports and Florsheims are made in China. (Hey I was a banker!) To be honest I can not say that any of the above mentioned goods appear to have any manufacturing defects or quality issues.

IF I could have my choice of two equal products, one an American made product, the other an import,  for approximately the same expenditure I'd go American. But you can't find that in many (most) things. So why beat yourself up about it?

I believe in spending wisely, and for me that means getting the most/best return on the dollar. You have to do best by yourself, for yourself and family first and foremost.

What I DO want is jobs in America, staffed by citizens, born here or naturalized, OR LEGAL immigrants. The illegals can go back where they came from, or stay there when they know they can't sneak in and stay illegally.

[glenn kangiser]

That sounds similar to my view of the situation, Don.  I don't see much choice either.  As long as our companies are selling us out we may as well get the best deals we can for what we have.  If that means we get Chinese tools where they will do for one fifth of the cost --- so be it.