22 x 28 in Western New York's Southern Tier

Started by SouthernTier, June 04, 2018, 07:23:01 PM

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Quote from: NathanS on November 11, 2018, 07:38:13 PM
Recessed windows does mean jamb extensions...

after I posted I tried to edit - what about extending the jamb out an extra .75".  You'd be glad when it is time to do siding that you don't have to do the jamb extensions.

I see what you mean.  Will have to give this some thought.

Quote from: NathanS on November 11, 2018, 07:38:13 PMThis was a pretty terrible year weather-wise. We were getting snow on April 30th.. I was hoping it would balance out with a decent fall, but as soon as Oct 1 came we went straight from the 60s to the 40s.

And it has been unbelievably wet over here too. Our fields are like a swamp, but as of today it's been so cold I think it's starting to freeze up..

Yeah, the reason that electric isn't energized is because the utility came out with the wire, transformer and everything, but the only access to their pole (which is on my property, about 20 feet in from the road) is to cut over from my driveway (distance less than 100') as there is a ditch and tress right at the road.  Normally not a problem but right now it's a swamp.  They will have to come back with a piece of equipment with a track.


Did some more searching.  I found this detail:

from here: http://www.solaripedia.com/files/1004.pdf

That is pretty much as I have it so far, with the built-in bucks reaching as far out from the zip panels as the insulation I plan to add (3" in both cases).  This author doesn't look like he used jamb extensions (although he says that now does "innies" like you did Nathan and adds the extensions there), but on a photo on page 6 of that PDF it sure looks like he has the bucks extending one furring strip length farther out.  If I did the 3/4" extension, I am scratching my head on how I would install the furring frame around the window after the fact.  Nothing to attach it to except the OSB 3" behind the foam.  That was what my frame you can see now at my dormers was for, but I didn't think through the flashing.


Oh yeah, the "REMOTE wall," those guys know their stuff. Don't think anything's wrong with it as long as the window does extend .75" past the flange.

If you did extend the jambs 3/4", you should have king studs next to the window that you can use structural screws to attach the furring strips.


Quote from: NathanS on November 11, 2018, 09:18:37 PM

If you did extend the jambs 3/4", you should have king studs next to the window that you can use structural screws to attach the furring strips.

Well I overthought this since I had years to design it before I started building.  What I did was get a 2x10 board and then cut down its width above and below the window to 3.5"  So no king stud next to it.

Doing the math, 9.25" - (5.5" stud + 0.5" OSB) = 3.25" so I would just have to extend it by 1/2" to make it flush with 3/4" furring strips over 3" foam.  I will probably just do that and then figure out about the frame.

I suppose I could put 1x4 furring *inside* the wall next to the window framing, and then attach the outside furring frame with 4.5" structural screws.  They'd only bite 1-1/4" into solid wood (1/2" OSB + 3/4" inside furring), but that should be enough for those frames.  The vast majority of the furring strips will bite 1.75" into the studs using 6" Timberloks (neglecting the loss due to the slight upward angle).

The good news about all this, though, is I can get the windows installed now before I put the foam boards up.  That will move up the official dried in date.

Nate R

Just wanted to say thanks for documenting this build so well, AND your thought process as you move along. Good to see what you're thinking about and what decisions you're making along the way.

As I prepare for a planned 2020 build, with a fall 2019 foundation pour, I see a lot of similarities!  ;D 
Some time to plan yet for me, and as I think through some of the details, seeing some of what you've decided to to really helps.

Windows: As you mentioned earlier, I had similar frustrations with trying to decide on windows. My wife's request to have a dark color inside and out, and push to go with a prefinished interior window and jamb have swayed me towards Marvin's Integrity All-Ultrex (Fiberglass) line. Not cheap, but not the worst. For recreational, should be good enough, right?  :D


Quote from: Nate R on November 11, 2018, 09:59:42 PM
Just wanted to say thanks for documenting this build so well, AND your thought process as you move along. Good to see what you're thinking about and what decisions you're making along the way.

Thanks.  But my build and my documentation can't hold a candle to NathanS's project and documentation.  I hope you've read through his topic.  I go back and refer to it all the time.


Been a while since an update.  I started a new job last fall which really took up a lot of time, especially since the timing was somewhat informed by something really big they had me do all December, and after that got over I got a nasty cold.

But good progress.  Still not 100% dried in.  Just have to finish the blocking at the eaves and get the slider doors in.  And as you can see the roofing contractor only got about 95% done before the snow set in.  Pics:

From the back:

You can see I have all types of windows - casement for getting the egress size without a huge double hung, awnings for the dormers, and double hung for the rest.  So far no problems with the Andersen windows, but I would say this:  for the double hungs, we went with the 200 series, but for that small window on the back (bathroom) had to go with the 100 series because that was the size that fit (did the rough openings before deciding to upgrade to 200 series).  There was definitely a step up in quality from the 100 to 200 that wasn't noticeable in the showroom.  So I am hoping to have better luck than Nathan with these.

The front:

As you can see, I have my 3 inches of external foam board on the north side.  I need to add it to the south side still.  No foam board on the front gable as these are 2x8 framing and with rockwool insulation in there will get to R30.  No foam board on the back either because I am easily meeting code with rescheck without it (just the R-19 fibreglas inside).  I know some will say I should have put some furring strips for a rain screen on for these gables, but for the front, it would just drain onto the windows or doors except for the shear panels on the sides, and the back is pretty much out of the weather with the steep hillside and trees behind it.

Here are some shots of foam before and after the furring strips.  As you can see, I will have some limited conductive heat loss since I had the rafters still out 3" - I did that so that they wrapped over the top plates rather than just sitting on them, so I could fasten them better.  Not sure if that was an issue or not, but that's what I did.

More before and after:

So question time.

As you can see, a big part on the to-do is getting those slider doors in.  The main reason they aren't in yet is they are so heavy.  The delivery driver and myself could barely drag them into the basement, and doing that hurt my back bad.  I need to recruit a crew to help me haul them up to the deck.

I haven't finished the flashing yet for those openings, although you can see I have bottom flashing in (Zip stretch tape).  However, in doing my research, it seems like I would really do well by putting in a PVC rigid pan with positive outslope.  I was thinking something like the jamsill (http://jamsill.com/).  Has anyone used something like this?  Worth it?

Then there is the issue of size.  Here is the drawing from Andersen for the slider door:

So it looks like the door is 5-1/8" (or maybe 5-3/16" - about the same) wide, but 1-3/8" sticks out, so really the width is only 3-3/4".  Am I reading that right?  I ask because it seems like the standard pre-formed sills come in 4-9/16" and 6-9/16" widths.  That's what Lowes carries.  And those are the series that Home Depot has for the brand they carry (suresill). 

jamsill makes a 3-5/8" size, but I don't know where to find it.

Anyone have any experience with this?


No experience with it but it gets good reviews. I've bent flashing and used flex tape. On moving heavy sliders I've pulled the panels I can and carefully moved the frame then reinstall the panels, but yes many hands makes light work.


Your place looks great, everything is clearly well thought out. That was a great idea to use casement for the egress, I wish we had done that as our covered porch roof is going to need a pretty low slope to fit below our egress windows. I hope you have better luck with Andersen than we did, the 4th window just stress cracked a few weeks ago and they won't cover labor anymore. Not sure if I mentioned before that the one window I pulled and reflashed poured water out of the top miter joints when i leaned the window forward. Not good - you really want to flash the hell out of those rough openings.

I would flash the entire rough sill, jambs and head with tape, and then use a rigid flashing over top that. I rented a metal break and did it myself. One issue with aluminum is that it is so conductive it sweats a lot during the winter, I don't think the finger jointed jambs are thanking me for that. I think positive slope to the outside and backdams are also a great idea.

Lately I have thought in a perfect world I would flash all rough openings all the way back over top the interior surface (drywall, wood) and put trim over that so that if anything migrates inward I will see it.


Thanks Don and Nathan.

I ordered two sets of the 3-5/8" Jamsills direct.  They were very helpful.

For the windows, and the one (conventional) door (that door is located under the porch roof, but have been building as if it weren't), I have been putting the stretch tape along the bottom edge, and then the regular Zip flashing tape along the rest of the bottom edge.  For the sides and top, I have just been flashing the edges (one layer of the Zip tape).  After I install the windows with the side/top caulking and screws, on the sides I have a single row of Zip flashing tape on the sides over the nailing fin and onto the zip panel, but on the top, I first put one row in L-shape fashion on the top of the brickmould and then over the screws in the nailing fin, and then a second (flat-wise) row over that, covering where the nailing fin is and extending to the sheeting above.

This is for flush-mounted windows.  For the ones that butted out for solid insulation, I flashed all the way back around the butt:

So I kept the WRB behind the foam.

The Andersen instructions say to install a drip cap, but I can't seem to find them.  I think they put that in their instructions so they have an excuse to void the warranty if they leak.  I figure the first row of tape along the top of brickmould serves that purpose.  No one will ever be looking down onto the brickmould.

That said, for the sliders, I am thinking of building a short overhang above them.  Not only would that keep some water off those doors, but it would put a place where I could put some lights facing down above the doors, as well as some speakers for tunes on the deck.

Any tips on size and construction techniques for a short overhang hung off the wall?

I searched for "brow roof" and this is the closest I came up with:

But I don't want to necessarily tie it into the eaves on the side because, well, I can't as it too low.

Just trying to get some ideas on aesthetic slopes and how far to stick out. 

Nate R

Quote from: SouthernTier on February 28, 2019, 02:36:34 PM

I ordered two sets of the 3-5/8" Jamsills direct.  They were very helpful.

The Andersen instructions say to install a drip cap, but I can't seem to find them.  I think they put that in their instructions so they have an excuse to void the warranty if they leak.  I figure the first row of tape along the top of brickmould serves that purpose.  No one will ever be looking down onto the brickmould.

The Jambliner looks interesting....new to me.

As I've been browsing windows, I've seen drip cap sometimes as an option from some manufacturers when you spec/build/price the window out. Glass options, grille options, etc, and it will sometimes be part of the trim options. (Like jamb extensions.)


Your windows are so well protected by overhangs you could leave them open in a monsoon and not a drop will get inside.

Extruding roll flashing through scrap pieces of plywood or wood has worked well for me. You could do that to make head flashing, then cut to a couple inches longer than the window to fold over the jambs.

I am curious about what you come up with for the small roof over the french doors. I have thought about doing that over one set of ours for extra protection.


Guess what folks, I didn't disappear!  Turns out building a cabin takes a lot of time.  That plus the new job I mentioned I started in late 2018 got me plenty busy.  I just didn't have time to post, especially since I always got pulled into reading everyone else's projects' posts. 

Cabin is done (99.9%) - Certificate of Occupancy and all, and pics below.  But words first.  I came back to the forum because I have a new neighbor who will be building and he had lots of questions so I told him to check out this forum and sent a few links.  So of course doing that I fell into rabbit hole reading all sorts of interesting things technical-wise and watching great projects unfold.  I figured now was the time to pick up from where I left off posting-wise.

I was working really steadily on the cabin every free moment and made good steady progress throughout the build.  A year ago when COVID hit and my wife, who worked in a hospital told me she was afraid of catching the virus and bringing it home, I decided to move in (at her suggestion) to the not-quite-finished cabin full time since I had to "work from home" regardless.  Got a cell booster that got me just barely enough internet to work (forget uploading large files, though).  Interestingly by late 2020, I was working half time in the office back in the city, but my wife ended up getting a new job near the cabin and moved in full time!  Living here and not being able to do much else except go bike riding (my original impetus for building it - next to great MTB trails), made the finishing touches go much more quickly.  COVID sucks, but I found as many silver linings as I could.

So anyways, some pics.  Outdoor shots first, I suppose.  I took these last fall thinking I'd post then, and here it is almost spring  d*

That last one is before I stained the stairs and added the ballusters.  And also before final driveway grading.  Here are some shots after that:

Got to get rid of all that wood under the porch.

Some shots in winter

We had a *lot* of snow this winter.  It was great.  Had a great plow service.  XC skiing was fantastic.  Looks like the snow load calcs were right.  Definitely was tested this year.

Before I head into the indoors, etc. I'll point out that I hired someone to do the siding, mainly because I don't think I could ever have gotten those dormers done myself.  The contractor had a two man crew (and who were used to working on roofs) and were able to do it just by working No. 1  yelling down the dimensions to worker No 2 who then handed up the board that fit just right.  I'd be up and down 10 times for each board!  The siding is pre-finished LP Smartside engineered wood lap siding.

Indoors already looking pretty much "lived in" even last fall

MY wife was in charge of the kitchen (also subbed out - she handled all that).  I originally was skeptical of the island but now I think it's the greatest thing since sliced bread.  I would have really screwed up the kitchen if I were in charge.

Working from "home".  Practicing bass in the evenings.  No gigs these days, though.  Hopefully soon enough again.

View from the loft.  Those T&G paneling boards did indeed each take several trips up and down the scaffolding to get them to fit right.  I spent a ton of time on them but all those hours were worth it.


Upstairs loft is my wife's office.  You can see a bunch of frames on her sewing machine cabinet.  She is an excellent photographer and all those walls are now covered with beautiful pictures.

Here's some photos of the upstairs bedroom.  part of the .1% still to do are the closet doors for the two upstairs closets

I think the stairs came out pretty good.  Also a lot of work.

The wall along the stairs is also now covered with lots of beautiful photos.

My plumbing/heating contractor had a great idea to put the cold air return under the stair landing.  One of the many reasons to hire someone like that to do that work.  I'll have to get some pics of his work in the basement.  It is artistry with pipes and ducts.

Downstairs master bedroom

Deck and screen porch

Screen porch still needs the indoor/outdoor carpet we plan on putting down there.

Well, that should do it for now with the pics.

I would like to say a huge thank you for all the great folks on this forum.  I can honestly say that without you, I could not have done this project.  Thank you!!!


Really like the contrast of the drywalled ceiling and T&G walls in the main area. Also that screened in porch is going to be an awesome spot to work this summer. Your place looks fantastic.

We were able to preorder Starlink with expected service mid-late this year. Did you check if your area is served yet?


Thanks Nathan.  Yes, I signed up for the Starlink beta the first day it was open last year, but was not selected for the beta.  I did the pre-order on Feb 9 (day after they opened it up).  It seems like I use https://www.reddit.com/r/Starlink/ as my procratination destination these days instead of Countryplans.org (doesn't suck me too long so I can get back to writing reports sooner ;-) and it looks like only certain cells are targeted for the beta, even with the pre-order.  I wasn't offered the full order.  Hopefully later this year. 

Thanks for the comment on the ceiling.  My wife was the on pointing out the benefits of contrast.  I see more houses with the contrast being T&G on the ceiling and painted walls, but I did the opposite for a simple reason: It's way easier to paint a ceiling than put T&G up, especially while working solo.   The T&G ceiling in the screen porch was a bear to put up solo.


It's funny you mention the porch roof T&G. I almost subliminally knew that must have been painful. I learned my lesson on that with our eaves and gables - I had the "bright" idea to use up leftover clapboards to enclose them. I try to block the thought of that out these days.

It sounds like you know more about what's happening with starlink than me, I just knew I needed to sign up the day preorder was available. Time warner was actually in the process of pulling a permit to run broadband down our road back in 2016, but then Charter bought them out and that was the end of that. I still can't believe starlink is actually happening.


Wow!   That is a very nice-looking place!  It is all very nicely done. Even have A/C for those humid-hot summer days I remember all too well.
Just because something has been done and has not failed, doesn't mean it is good design.


Looking great!  Nicely done for sure...

I was able to get starlink going about 3 weeks ago down here in PA.  It makes Hughes net seem like dial up! 

You do have quite a bit of tree cover to overcome at your spot.  Good luck and thanks for the update....


Thanks JS.

At the risk of hijacking my own thread (!)  I have checked out the obstructions for starlink using the app and I have a good spot picked out with a clear north view.  However, I will have to extend the cable by 75'-100' or so, which isn't supported by Starlink.  Folks on the Reddit discussion have had mixed results extending the cable, so I will see.  The other option is to run power to a box 100' from the dish (since the dish comes with a 100' cord) put the Power-over-ethernet injector there, and then run unpowered ethernet back to the house.  But I would prefer not to have to pay for running power to a small box between the dish and the house.

I guess we will see.  I am not in a cell selected for beta so will have to wait.  Somebody in England with too much time on their hands punched in hundreds of addresses for signing up for Starlink and found which cells were active and which were not - https://www.google.com/maps/d/viewer?mid=1AyH8eXm36KZwsQ_oRg2JlhezrCToZLGN&ll=51.72175994224457%2C-1.887696829687524&z=7  Of course Starlink doesn't publish cell maps, but other people have figured out the hex pattern pretty well again by plugging in lots of addresses.  I think I'll just sit and wait.