The American Nightmare

[glenn kangiser]

Thanks OBL  -- are you the real one or one of the fake ones from the new US movies now being produced to make the sheeple be scared and still believe you are alive?

At least you are enlightened to the monitoring of the net.

If you are really you, why, immediately after 9/11, did the real you release a statement saying that you were not responsible for 9/11 and that it was an inside plot by the US government to scare the people into allowing them to do things they would not do otherwise?

That is one of the only things I believe one of the many yous really said.  The rest are movies to this day.

Where were you on the day of 9/11?

Who met with you and where just before 9/11?

Why do you speak to the US in Arabic when you were educated here in the US?  Wouldn't speaking in English be better?  More of us could understand and be scared of you.

When did you stop working for the CIA?  I thought it was once CIA, always CIA.

[Proud_Poppa]

I've watched this thread with somewhat morbid interest without any desire to join in until now. I'm pretty sure this is a fruitless endeavor....it seems that anyone who disagrees with the 9/11 truther BS must be an un-enlightened Fox news watching member of the sheeple clan. You guys win soo many friends with your smooth even and fair treatment of the facts. This thread reminds me of a fellow at work who pushes all kinds of conspiracy crap...wants me to read articles from "American Free Press" and who can dispense facts for HOURS about how income taxes are un-constitutional. But when asked if he still pays income tax he dips his head and admits that he still pays all his taxes. He kinda loses all his credibility when he admits to paying taxes that he's trying to convince YOU that you don't have to pay.

So here's my challenge to you 9/11 truther adherents...GET OUT!! Go somewhere else! How can you stand to live in such an EVIL country? Put your money where your mouth is!! You go find a better place to live....I'm pretty sure the line waiting to get OUT is a lot shorter than the line waiting to get IN!! Go find us this better place and let us know where it is.....then maybe we'll believe you.

Until then, could you try a bit harder to be civil in your discourse with those who don't believe all the same things you do....please??

[glenn kangiser]

Nobody is attacking anybody or forcing them to read this thread.  Information is only posted for others consideration so that they may study the information that they have obviously not studied, will not study and do not want to consider.

Our problem is not with this country or the fact that most of our families gave their all and pioneered here.  Our families love this country and just plain do not like the elite and big business stealing it for fun and profit.  Patriotism is not unquestioningly supporting our treasonous leadership.  Patriotism is caring about the country for what is was meant to be.  The best country in the world.  

Not a place dealing death and destruction to the rest of the world in the quest of oil and minerals that belong to others.   Not a place that steals the lives of our servicemen who offer their lives for the protection of the country.  They did not offer their lives to support contractors profiting in Iraq, or poppy farming for support of the CIA operations in Afghanistan and other countries.

I will gladly support our country in the way it was meant to be... not the death for fun and profit version of it.

I support our servicemen.  I want them all home alive to protect our country in the case of a real threat as they have dedicated themselves to do.  My wife assists in  patching  their physically and mentally broken bodies back together on a regular basis as an RN at the VA.  I do not support the theft of their lives by big business under a fake threat created for profit by our government.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5l5bSxpCKEI

[glenn kangiser]

Note - edited the above several times - please re-read it.

[Proud_Poppa]

Nobody is attacking anybody or forcing them to read this thread.  Information is only posted for others consideration so that they may study the information that they have obviously not studied, will not study and do not want to consider.

Our problem is not with this country or the fact that most of our families gave their all and pioneered here.  Our families love this country and just plain do not like the elite and big business stealing it for fun and profit.  Patriotism is not unquestioningly supporting our treasonous leadership.  Patriotism is caring about the country for what is was meant to be.  The best country in the world. 

Not a place dealing death and destruction to the rest of the world in the quest of oil and minerals that belong to others.   Not a place that steals the lives of our servicemen who offer their lives for the protection of the country.  They did not offer their lives to support contractors profiting in Iraq, or poppy farming for support of the CIA operations in Afghanistan and other countries.

I will gladly support our country in the way it was meant to be... not the death for fun and profit version of it.

Perfect reply.....I'm with you %100 on everything you just said! No one that I know of believes that there aren't things happening behind the scenes. Things we would not approve of were we to know them. For example...I do believe that our Government may be positioning itself with a sizable military presence in/near the OIL producing states in preperation for the impact of "Peak Oil". However, the "Peak Oil" theory is one that makes sense from a simple mathematics standpoint. I simply do not believe the lying evil money grubbing retards in "charge" of things have a tenth the competancy required to carry something like 9/11 out.

Maybe you folks are right and I/we are wrong....we'll probably never know for certain. But I do appeal to all sides to keep the discourse civil and stop the belittling and name calling.

[StinkerBell]

The trail leads back to Glenn; Therefore this is all Glenn's fault. Issue answered!

[glenn kangiser]

You know it Stinky.... but you still love me in spite of it all..



Thanks, Proud Poppa.  

I hope no one takes anything said by anyone here personally.  It is meant to be for education only - enlightenment and getting others to look at things they may not have considered.  Blindly accepting the official lies is not acceptable to one who cares about their country for real. 

Lets not just pay our country lip service.  Lets look farther.  Do you think politicians are the most honorable people in the world and would not lie to you?  Hardly.

Personally I try to make my replies generic and not applicable to anyone specifically.  Where that fails is that some read the reply and apply it to themselves.  

That is not the way it is intended.  

There is no way anyone can know all of the facts in this situation because they were intentionally hidden.  What we can do is look at experience of other professionals who know that their portion of expertise says that the thing they know about couldn't have happened in the way it did without assistance at the least.

Windpower and I are pilots and while I went to professional level training - commercial pilot, I did not fly commercial air liners.  The protocols are the same though.  We have to follow the same rules under IFR flight.  That is how we know that this could not have happened without US assistance.  Many pilots and ATC controllers agree.  It is the end of a career tor an ATC controller to allow this sort of thing to happen unless they are under orders from above to let it happen.  It is not a small thing - it is their livelihood and all they have trained for.

So - please everyone - don't take anything personally here.

Please continue to voice your opinions and open mindedly look at evidence provided by both sides.  No personal attacks - that is part of the brainwashing - divide and conquer.  Label all who look into the lies as conspiracy theorists.  Do not allow them to uncover the conspiracy.

Sorry if anyone is offended.  This is not about attacking anyone.  This is about education and getting others to look at the acts we all find so repulsive and see not the ones we were told to blame, but find out who profits and who the real culprits are.  Just take a look.  It will not hurt.

For those who don't want to look, please know that my wife was like you, except she only looked into the facts to prove me wrong.

Sorry to say she has not been able to do that and she admits that.  Not a lot of facts but all evidence supports the fact that the government official story is a lie.

Her family was big military.  She is a military brat.  Her father was a B52 pilot and instructor and flew tons of secret missions including over Russia as well as escaping from an inverted burning aircraft.

He would not listen to the facts at all and he is now gone with his belief, but that does not change what we have found to be true.  Our elite had to assist for 9/11 to be carried out.

Please , all continue to discuss this and share your thoughts with respect and open mindedness.  Make your replies generic as though they are not pointed at anyone.

[Osama]

Mr Glenn. You ask many questions as you should. You also should know well enough not to believe everything you read or hear.  There is much smoke and mirrors about the subject which obscures the truth. Many of those truthers are just as blinded by what they believe as those who some claim have their heads in the sand blind to the injustices perpetrated by western governments.

Time to move on, strange white trails in the sky overhead.

[glenn kangiser]

Cool - another cave - another proxy.  Good Job, Osama.  

Don't drag your dialysis hose on a rock and rip it out - that would be catastrophic.  We need you.  Without you our government may lose control of the sheeple.  Please release your next video on our forum as we can always use more readership.

I have contacts who I think would be happy to link to the vid.

Please be careful as I think our government is getting a fix on your location. Careful moving to the next cave.   Looking forward to your next posting.  No more meetings with the CIA in the Dubai hospital- I think they have an agent watching the doors - but then again - they say your check is ready so you may want to drop in and pick it up.

Take care.

[peternap]

Just to take a little break here.....It seems most of the discourse and name calling is coming from a few new people. I strongly suspect some of these new people are the same old ones that have been reborn.

[archimedes]

Osama,
You have my grudging admiration.  You managed to pull these attacks off and get a portion (albeit small portion) of the American people to blame their own gov't.  - even though there is no proof.

Do you feel like Uncle Sam has stolen your thunder?  Any resentment?

[Windpower]

more FACTS

http://snardfarker.ning.com/video/architects-and-engineers-for

[glenn kangiser]

Thanks, Windpower.  I do not see how anyone can watch that video, consider the facts and not question the official conspiracy.

All I can see is that some will not watch it but will still doggedly hold on to the lies because they cannot face the fact that their government does not have their interests at heart.

It's true --- we are nothing but a nuisance and breeders of cannon fodder to them.

[Windpower]

Glenn

there is so much that is stlill great in the US

I flew the 170 an hour in the pattern this evening -- 8 take offs and landings - 122.8 was non stop  talk-- what a wonderful country that we can do this

it makes one even angrier that the PTB are trying to bring  it down

at least we have enjoyed the freedom of general aviation while it was still affordable (LOL)

Makes you want to give Clyde Cessna a hug

[glenn kangiser]

I spent a lot of time flying the years that I did it - 15 trips to Mexico  and all over the western half of the US.

Mine was a Cessna 205, but corrosion took it's toll and it was going to cost about twice the value of the plane to fix it.

I'm with you on anger at the ones destroying the country.  My aunt who is about 80 sees what is going on with them and just hopes that it is not true, but she knows it is.  That is why she talks about it.   She cannot deny what even she can see.

[glenn kangiser]

Article for your consideration with points from both sides - note that I have not had time to read it all but am posting it as I have to split....

http://www.ascertainthetruth.com/att/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=270:who-did-911-obl-bush-or-mossad-the-evidences&catid=58:the-911-event&Itemid=115

[archimedes]

more FACTS

http://snardfarker.ning.com/video/architects-and-engineers-for

Opinions and speculation, unsupported  by any emperical evidence.  You might want to look up Webster's Dictionary definition of a "fact".
If these guys are in fact architects and engineers then they are in the very,  very, very distinct minority.

Also,  if you watch the second video in that link,  you can very clearly see debris that is falling away from the towers falling faster than the towers themselves.  That debris is actually in freefall,   in stark contrast to the Towers which are not.  It disproves the whole freefall thesis.  And that's the video on their website.

And the truthers never explain why someone would need to blow up the towers after you have just crashed two jetliners into them.  What's the point?  Talk about wearing three pairs of suspenders and half a dozen belts.

Or,  looking at it another way,  why crash two jetliners into the buildings if you're just going to blow'em up anyway.  Why not just blow'em up and save yourself the trouble of hijacking two planes?  It makes no sense whatsoever.

Not to mention,  how the hell would you be able to sabotage the girders and plant all those explosives in one of the busiest office buildings with the best security in the city without anyone noticing?  

These are people who have just drawn the conclusion that the buildings were blown up and are deparately seeking any evidence (even if they have to imagine it) to support their conclusion.

I'll believe the truth,  whatever that is,  but it's got to be supported by credible evidence.  

[Osama]

Mr beeman, yes I do resent the USA, but not for the reasons you ask about. I resented the USA many years before our attacks. I resent the USA on religious grounds, on the facts that their military occupy my religious lands.   I also resent those who say they seek the truth, those who can not accept the facts that a few men could wreak such havoc on a nation by commandeering aircraft and turning them into bombs. It frightens them I think to accept that could be true and so they invent these stories that read like espionage thriller novels. It comforts them in some way to believe their is a vast deep reaching conspiracy and not simply a few true believers of the true god that has done this.

[SardonicSmile]

"Laws to make downloading illegal (ACTA), to outlaw the growing of vegetables without a government permit, to make jokes or to call people names illegal. The list is long and defies belief."

Anyone have any info on the second two?

[glenn kangiser]

Seems you are a fake taking the part of Osama,  Osama.  You now seem to say that these were your people but that is not what you said immediately after the "attacks".

A stretch of s510  due to its vagueness on the garden, SS.

[peternap]

"Laws to make   to make jokes or to call people names illegal. The list is long and defies belief."

Anyone have any info on the second two?

http://news.oldva.org/?p=57526
   
Can you be arrested in Henrico when you've broken NO laws.
It appears you can!
Facebook use gets Henrico woman arrested

Imagine getting angry. You're at the computer. Then, you give somebody a real piece of your mind on Facebook. In Henrico, police say that got a woman arrested. The question is: Will the charge hold up in court?

[dug]

Bmancanfly;

Just wondering what the motive might be for all these professionals to risk their reputations and careers?

Also - how would you dismiss testimonials from pilots such as these-  http://patriotsquestion911.com/pilots.html

Put options on United and American airlines 285 times the normal the day before the attack?

Way too many anomalies to not demand answers.

[archimedes]

Dug,  the answers to many of your questions can be found here.  It's a point by point rebuttal of most of the truther nonsense.  It also shows how dishonest and sloppy some of the truther theorists are;

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-3214024953129565561&hl=en#

There are ample rational explanations, from reputable sources,  readily available for any to wish to find them.  Asking question is a good thing.  Drawing conclusion based on false or fabricated infromation is not.

Peace all. 

[dug]

I've seen it, and most everything else supporting the commission report. I have done my best to obtain all information available to draw the most accurate conclusion.

No offense, but you seem to accept all the science supporting the commission report while completely dismissing the valid science that goes against it.

Yes, there are thousands of real live scientists and engineers who believe the commission's findings are a joke. Surprisingly, they don't make the national news.   

[MountainDon]

I promised myself I wasn'y going to say anything on this topic. Does this count?

[deadhorse]