Building costs... again

[hhbartlett]

I know this subject is done to death on this forum. I've been going back and forth on a few plans, including using a mobile home as the "core". My original plan was too big to do cheap. So I'm going over a different plan now, and would love to have thoughts / input on it.

Back story: My goal is to build something that me, my wife and my 2 kids can live in comfortably and cheaply. I bought land last year. The land already has a fairly new well & septic system (less than 7 years old each, and not used for the last 6), the electrical entrance is already in place too on the barn that is still there, driveway established, etc. There was a house that burnt 6 years ago, so I am left with a nice level spot to build that has been filled in with mostly gravel. This is located in New Brunswick, Canada (state of Maine is next door, I can almost see it from where I am).

I came across a simple plan for a 24' x 36' single storey house:
http://prod-hw-dhs.optaros-mcas.com/house-plans/media/import/WebArt/common/plans/images/HPB0/HPB168/HPB168-LVL1-LI-BL-LG.GIF

So I made some rough estimates:

Foundation: I'll use a frost protected shallow foundation, essentially a monolithic slab that's insulated. I checked, it passes codes where I am. Because of where I'm building I think it may be my only option anyway, and the ground has excellent drainage anyway. Basically I'm almost building on a rubble footer.
I think I can get this done for $5000, with me doing all the forms, etc. It would be 6" thick, except 12" around the perimeter.

Exterior Walls: Standard 2 x 6, possibly using SmartSide panels to accomplish sheathing & siding all in one go, and fibreglass batt insulation. $2000

Roof: prebuilt trusses, osb sheathing and standard shingles, or possibly steel roofing. Trusses are $1500 (I checked), and maybe $1500 for the sheathing/roofing (steel is slightly more at about $1.25 sq. foot plus sheathing & felt). So, including nails & stuff, let's say $3500 for the whole roof

Insulation: $1000 for blown in cellulose in the attic (already counted wall insulation above) & 6 mil vapour barrier

Windows & doors: $2000 - I can get windows for $150 each on average if I buy discounted / mis-sized, need about 9 or 10, plus 2 pre hung doors

So, I can get dried in for $15000 by those estimates, adding another $1500 "extras".

For the interior and allowing for overruns:

Kitchen cabinets: I can get those for $1500 at the most, used & good quality. I see them all the time online from people remodelling their 5 year old kitchens.
Appliances: Used, $1000
Drywall & doors: I'm guessing this will cost $3000 with everything. Looking at discount centres for doors and trim.
Electrical: $3000. I can get panels already loaded with breakers for $400 (used but not old).
Woodstove & chimney: $2000 (less if I buy used, but I believe a good quality wood stove is worthwhile)
Flooring: assuming we don't just paint the cement, $1.50/sq foot should cover it so $1400
Water heater: $600 (propane on-demand)
Bathroom fixtures & plumbing: $1500 again, discount centres and what not

Total for the interior is $14000.00

So, adding another $1000 for permits and stuff, I come up to $30,000, or about $35 a square foot.

Does this look realistic?

Because it seems crazy to me that in 2012 you can build a new 3 bedroom house, to code, for that kind of money. Did I miss something really important?

Granted, it's a small 3 bedroom, so maybe that's the key. I counted no labour costs in the above because I'd be doing everything myself, with the exception of pouring and screeding the cement. It's not that big, and just one floor with pre-built trusses, so it shouldn't be that difficult to build. I can work on this full time this summer so I can't imagine it would take forever, either. I already own almost every tool known to man as well.

However, I've been reading and watching stuff on this forum. Alan says he has $70k into his, and his is about the same size. He super-insulated and has a fancier roof than I'm planning, but still... Then again, Eagles has low 30's for his awesome A frame with addition, apparently.

I guess the big question really is, where does all the extra money go, and is it possible to keep tight to your budget and avoid bleeding your bank account prematurely?

[Squirl]

I noticed that Alan opted for a few extras over the basics like a hip roof, cedar siding, nicer cabinets, extra thick walls, premium energy efficient windows etc.  He did a great job.

From a quick look, I would guess your estimates are about 25% less than what I would guess.

[hhbartlett]

Most of the pricing I have listed is from actual prices local to me. The one thing I sort of guessed at was drywall pricing; I know it's $10 a sheet for the ultra light stuff, beyond that it's just a guess except for interior doors. Most of the other estimates allow for a little extra, or were rounded up.

[Squirl]

One of the larger unaccounted for costs in my build has been tools or tool rental.  Larger equipment like a front end loader, power tamper,  and a backhoe. I under estimated the time I would need them or the cost.  My dirt was more like rock as I got deeper.  I just didn't know until I dug.

You will probably need some equipment to scrape of the first few inches of top soil and vegetation before you put down a slab.  By the time you set everything up and pay for the pour $5000 would be a good price if you can get away with it.

There are a lot of little things like fittings, fasteners, trim, pipes, tools.

Little things, like I looked at an on demand propane water heater for $650.  I would still have to pay for the propane tank, piping, ball valve fittings, pipe thread caulk, and chimney.  Each job has its little extras.

[MountainDon]

Our cabin came in at around $46 a sq ft. That included the propane fridge and wall heater, wood stove, kitchen cabinets, propane range, water heater and finishing the interior to the level seen in my topic. It was more than expected but then we did some things like a T&G wall and ceiling that was not originally planned. Ditto on the wood used for trimming out the door, windows and wall base. Included in that was about $500 of hired out casual labor. Electrical was included from the service panel in. None of the solar, up to the service panel, was included in that figure.

[bayview]

   We ran about $40.00 per sq. ft. - Not included was land, water, septic, dirt work - land clearing, landscaping . . .    Included was, full kitchen, full bath with fiberglass tub. . .    We built on a concrete slab with 6" walls (r-19), truss roof (r-30), with Hardie siding, and architectural shingles.   All work was "in-house" except slab and sheetrock.

/.

[hhbartlett]

One of the larger unaccounted for costs in my build has been tools or tool rental.  Larger equipment like a front end loader, power tamper,  and a backhoe. I under estimated the time I would need them or the cost.  My dirt was more like rock as I got deeper.  I just didn't know until I dug.

You will probably need some equipment to scrape of the first few inches of top soil and vegetation before you put down a slab.  By the time you set everything up and pay for the pour $5000 would be a good price if you can get away with it.

There are a lot of little things like fittings, fasteners, trim, pipes, tools.

Little things, like I looked at an on demand propane water heater for $650.  I would still have to pay for the propane tank, piping, ball valve fittings, pipe thread caulk, and chimney.  Each job has its little extras.

One thing I didn't mention is I have a tractor coming, not included in the costs. There's one I'm going to buy for $2500 that has a front end loader and a scraper blade. If for some reason that deal falls through, there's a couple of other's I'm looking at that are similar, so hopefully that will be a help for clearing the area, as well as lifting stuff like trusses up. Beyond building the house, I want the tractor for snow clearing and a few other things. Everyone with rural acreage should have one in my opinion!

I also have all the gravel I could ever want, the next door neighbour put a gravel road through the property just before I bought it. I think they thought they were buying it and jumped the gun. Anyhow, free gravel for me.

But, I know what you mean about fittings and fasteners. Also I didn't count fuel costs and things.

We ran about $40.00 per sq. ft. - Not included was land, water, septic, dirt work - land clearing, landscaping . . .    Included was, full kitchen, full bath with fiberglass tub. . .    We built on a concrete slab with 6" walls (r-19), truss roof (r-30), with Hardie siding, and architectural shingles.   All work was "in-house" except slab and sheetrock.

Sounds like a similar build, with a couple of upgrades so that's encouraging.

If it did come in at 25% more total, that's still within what I can do - but I'm aiming for $30k if possible.

[ColchesterCabin]

hhbartlett I know your in Nova Scotia but porperty is in New Brunswick. For your windows and doors there is this place in Moncton I came across... It is on Caledonia Road in the former Happy harry's Location I believe their website is... http://diybuildingsupplies.com/prices.html check them out. I belive they are carrying Silverline windows out of the states, but unbeliveable pricing. I just figured it was worth a shot as you'll be driving litterally right by on your way to the property from Nova Scotia I am guessing.

Call me either a cheap a$$ or inexperienced but I am holding true on my building cost projections for my 16x24 build. I was going through my numbers and to have a complete deck accounting for concrete, excavation, lumber and all materials to get to the final deck part will put me about $3000.00. (my $3000 traditional CountryPlans Jig) Then walls 2x4x10' $600.00, sheeting $1000.00, joists $1000.00, Metal Roof $1000.00, Windows/Doors $700.00. Should be roughed weather tight for this year for about $7300.00 which would make me happy and I figure on about another $5000 for intereior finishing costs starting next srping.

I could be dreaming but I am keeping track, be curious to know how close I can come.

[hhbartlett]

hhbartlett I know your in Nova Scotia but porperty is in New Brunswick. For your windows and doors there is this place in Moncton I came across... It is on Caledonia Road in the former Happy harry's Location I believe their website is... http://diybuildingsupplies.com/prices.html check them out. I belive they are carrying Silverline windows out of the states, but unbeliveable pricing. I just figured it was worth a shot as you'll be driving litterally right by on your way to the property from Nova Scotia I am guessing.

Call me either a cheap a$$ or inexperienced but I am holding true on my building cost projections for my 16x24 build. I was going through my numbers and to have a complete deck accounting for concrete, excavation, lumber and all materials to get to the final deck part will put me about $3000.00. (my $3000 traditional CountryPlans Jig) Then walls 2x4x10' $600.00, sheeting $1000.00, joists $1000.00, Metal Roof $1000.00, Windows/Doors $700.00. Should be roughed weather tight for this year for about $7300.00 which would make me happy and I figure on about another $5000 for intereior finishing costs starting next srping.

I could be dreaming but I am keeping track, be curious to know how close I can come.

Yup, I know about DIY, plan to do some shopping there. Also, Habitat for Humanity has a ReStore in Saint John. Plus, good old Kijiji now has a home renovations category - unbelievable deals there sometimes, especially on kitchen cabinets and stuff. I've found beautiful entry doors complete with sidelights for free, just go get them. There's a couple of other places around I've seen too, one in Fredericton with a line on really cheap rigid foam insulation.

You gotta shop the discount and used stuff, I believe. If you just go to Big Box Building store with a list, you get screwed.

Where yours is 16 x 24, it's obviously going to be less money, so I'm pulling for you to hit your budget. By the way, good place for metal roofing is MoneysWorth Liquidators here in Amherst. I had a complete metal roof delivered to my old house which was 20' x 24', 12/12 pitch, plus an 8' x 10' addition, complete with all the fittings, screws & washers, roof ridge & vent for $1500 tax included. Not galvanized either, but painted green (galvanized would have been cheaper).

The problem is nobody ever believes you. I have a hard time believing I can do it for this kind of money myself. I remember people oohing and aahing over my shiny new green metal roof, figuring it cost $10k or something. Wasn't fun sitting 30-odd feet in the air on a steep slippery metal roof, in the wind off the Bay of Fundy, but I put it on myself for no extra money.

I think the key is to watch every penny and keep track, like you say.

[considerations]

"Wasn't fun sitting 30-odd feet in the air on a steep slippery metal roof, in the wind off the Bay of Fundy, but I put it on myself for no extra money."

Yikes. Hope you made a little money when you resold the parachute in a garage sale. 

I looked and looked and looked at my 12/12 rafters....purchased the OSB, paper, and metal myself...and hired installers. 

[hhbartlett]

"Wasn't fun sitting 30-odd feet in the air on a steep slippery metal roof, in the wind off the Bay of Fundy, but I put it on myself for no extra money."

Yikes. Hope you made a little money when you resold the parachute in a garage sale. 

I looked and looked and looked at my 12/12 rafters....purchased the OSB, paper, and metal myself...and hired installers.

There were many times up there I wished I could have hired it out, but there was literally no money for it. My house sat up on a hill too; my basement window looked out straight at the neighbour's chimney, so it seemed higher than it was. I built a roof ladder that hooked over it, ended up painting it the same colour as the metal and leaving it on the roof permanently to easily get up and clean the chimney with. I've read a few other stories on this forum about people putting on 12/12 pitched metal roofs, not fun if you're scared of heights. Thankfully my new place will have a 4/12 pitch on a single storey 

[ColchesterCabin]

Yeah there is a spot in Debert called Community Metals and they have the metal for $3/linear foot and for them that is a sheet 3' wide x 1' ft tall, they will custom cut to any legnth required. I haven't run the true cost yet but I will keep money's worth liquidators in mind. We have one here in town I'll check there as well.

[hhbartlett]

Yeah there is a spot in Debert called Community Metals and they have the metal for $3/linear foot and for them that is a sheet 3' wide x 1' ft tall, they will custom cut to any legnth required. I haven't run the true cost yet but I will keep money's worth liquidators in mind. We have one here in town I'll check there as well.

So, $1 per sq. foot. That's not bad. Is that for painted colour, or galvanized I wonder? When pricing a metal roof, don't forget the matching (if coloured) bolts with neoprene washers, and all the other little bits. I needed around 1500 bolts for my last metal roof.

[ColchesterCabin]

Yeah that's colored metal, their price was $2.75 or something for galvenized. I figured I would worry about the roof as I get closer I only have the decking finished be a couple of weeks before I can get back to start with the 2x4 walls...

[hhbartlett]

Yeah that's colored metal, their price was $2.75 or something for galvenized. I figured I would worry about the roof as I get closer I only have the decking finished be a couple of weeks before I can get back to start with the 2x4 walls...

2 x 4? Not going 2 x 6?

Good price on the roofing, galvanized or painted.