Is there a plumber in the house?

[cedarglen]

I am building the universal 2 story and have the cripple walls, girder and joists framed up. I need to install the sub floor plumbing before my next inspection (inspector does not want to inspect the plumbing once the crawlspace is closed up). I think I have pretty much figured out how I'm going to run the plumbing, but since I am a novice I will bounce it off you guys. For your reference the deck is in the FRONT, and RIGHT, LEFT and BACK are referenced from there. The red arrow in the 1st floor plans shows the existing 3" waste line going to the septic. My plan is to continue that 3" line all the way across the house to the far wall (LEFT) and up the wall to the master bath on the 2nd floor. The toilet, sink and tub in the master can all drain into that and they can all share a vent to the roof. Under the house I'll have a 3" T (off of the main line to the septic) taking a 3" line toward the FRONT of the house near the right side of the deck and up that wall to the 2nd bath upstairs which all three fixtures will drain into and again all three will share a vent to the roof.  Now for the down stairs drains: The stackable washer drier will drain directly into the 3" main pipe with it's vent heading to the BACK of the house where it can meet up with the vent for the downstairs toilet and both will share a vent to the roof. The Downstairs toilet will dump right into the 3" main line. The downstairs tub and shower can come together before dumping into the 3" main line and they can share their vent line up to the vent for the upstairs master bathroom. The Kitchen sink can dump into the 3" main line and vent can hook into the upstairs 2nd bath vent line.

That has three roof penetrations and everything covered I think. Does anybody see any problems with that? Can it be done more efficiently? I am a little worried about fitting the plumbing for the 2nd floor hallway bathroom over the header for the slider to the deck? We are using 2x8 joists and a 6"x10" header.

All Input appreciated, I have never done plumbing before.

[peg_688]

I've never heard a insp. wanting rough plumbing installed before the sub floor / crawl space was closed up before :-/ :-?

How's he going to see a pressure test of your vent system ??

That waste line from the 2nd floor bath , IMO , should not , and will not "fit" above the header , it should run thru the joist bay , or thru the joist and go down that little exterior wall to the right of the slider.

Or maybe I don't understand why you want it over the header, generally there is no piping over headers , YMMV, or you have a odd situation.

 That insp. one lazy SOB  

I have heard of rough framing under floor insp , but NEVER rough plumbing under floor  :-/ :-? Whats next :'( :'(  

Rectal exams  
 

[cedarglen]

I was thinking of running the 3" drain line up along the side of the sliding glass door in the front. Can I run the 1.5" lines for the upstairs bath and sink through the floor joists over to the 3"? That makes sense. I would like to move the sliding glass door over a little to make room for the plumbing, but the prescribed locations for braced wall panels prevent me from moving it any farther. I think I can just squeeze the 3" in along the side of the door now.

Yes, we need to cap off all the drains and pressure test them before we can continue framing.



 

[JRR]

Good looking job thus far!

I'm not a plumber by any means, but have heard/read of some "minimum height" for connecting vents together.  I think it has to do with the vents being connected so low that back flooding can occur in a vent path.  This may only be problem if a pipe is a drain and a vent.  (Told you I'm no plumber.)

Be sure to take a look in this month's (July 2007) issue of Fine Homebuilding, page 62, "Better Undersink Plumbing ... Throw away the tradional p-trap to minimize leaks and maximize storage space".   If your inspector buys into this scheme, you may want to place your sink drain closer to the wall to maximize storage benefits.

[glenn-k]

Looks like PEG pretty well covered all of that.  

[wingam00]

I would suggest one thing for you from looking at your plans that I learned the hard way. For your bath room walls between the kitchen and the master bedroom use 2 x 6 and not 2 x 4s.  This will give your a place to run your 3" drain to the crawl space and vent to the roof.  You would then have a staright line from the crawl space up to the roof and which could be piped for drain and vent for both floors.

You may have already thought of this but I did not on my project and BOY was it a lot more work not having a straight line from the crawl space to the second floor to the roof.  

One more thing, be sure to vent the system well. When in doubt vent it.

I have never plumbed a whole house but  I passed on the first  inspection.  Not saying I am good my that God looks after kids and Fools and I am too old for the first one.

Good luck  Mark

[wingam00]

On your question "Can I run the 1.5" lines for the upstairs bath and sink through the floor joists over to the 3". "  
One has to use different size pipe depending on how far the vent is from the item being vented and the type and number of itmes being vented. (this is per code)   So depending how many items are on the vent and the type dictates what size pipe to use.  Most of the time 2" will do but to be sure I would check with your inspector and do some read via the web and your local libariy.  I would say that 1.5 would be too small.


One other item that almost got me. When supporting PVC pipe the metal straping with the holes it it that has been used for thousands of years (not realy that many) is not to Code. Code now say that you have to use plastic straps.  Why??? No one could tell me  but that what they said Code said.  Again check with your inspector, they are the ones that define the rules that you have to follow.

Mark

[peg_688]

Looks like PEG pretty well covered all of that.

 

Now if he could spell and not use the wrong words , such as who , for how etc   Eh I was in a rush , I don't do a whole lot better when I not though , Well some times  

[glenn-k]

The point gets across, so I'm not worried about it.

Onr thing to watch out for is wet venting - don't run waste water down a vent for another fixture.  They only make a few exceptions and I find it easier to pass if I just don't do it at all.

[cedarglen]

So when is 1.5 inch piping OK and when do I need to go to 2"?

Chuck

[glenn-k]

I found a Canadian checklist.  I usually make the laundry drain 2"  and shower tub combo 2".

http://www.markham.ca/markham/resources/plumbingroughinhousing.pdf

Part of info here - allowed fixture units -

http://www.hometips.com/articles/sunset_books/complete_plumbing/drainwasteventpipes_size064.html

http://www.masterplumber.com/Laws/UPCExcerpts.html#anchor988910  fixture units - scroll down on page - links don't work

[glenn-k]

http://www2.iccsafe.org/states/Seattle/seattle_residential/res_frameset.htm

Check the trap size info on this - chap 32

Note that there are several codes and the one for your area will be the correct one however most info is similar with a few exceptions.

[youngins]

I like that you have a full bathroom downstairs. Most builder homes only put a powder room - which would be kind of inconvenient when I'm in trouble ... I mean when guests are sleeping over.  

I'm also enjoying seeing the progression of progress: