Dogtrot - 14x24 Little House + 14x18 Little House

[fritz]

Hi, sorry I missed this reply until now.

the 20 - 25 hours is actual burn time. That kind of use lasts 3 - 5 days depending on outside temp...so I run between 4 and 10 hours a day depending.   My average use has been a tank every 4 days through December.

Also, depending on the setting on the gas stove - i can have it set to low or high and that affects usage.  The Lopi is not terribly efficient: Overall Efficiency 80.1%, AFUE 67.8%

The other variable is the fill of the 20# cylinder.  I do a tank exchange, and some of the these services are filling tanks with 15 pounds of propane, and others fill with 17 pounds. I now try to do the exchanges at stores selling the 17 pound fills.  It's harder to find places doing tank fills rather than exchanges.

[river place]

Fritz,  We just bought the same Lopi LP stove as it was half off at our local fireplace/BBQ store and seemed like a good quality unit for the money.  It'll be used to heat an area of our barn which is 12'Wx20'Lx12'H until we get the cabin/home built.

It looks like you went with a horizontal exhaust without any rise.  Do you find the exhaust outside vent gets too hot?  We're deciding if we should go straight through the wall or go up higher before going though the wall. 

Your place looks great!

[fritz]

I don't know how hot it gets on the out side -- I  imagine too hot to touch -- like the stove itself.  I am guessing that with an inside rise you have more surface to radiate additional heat into the space...which could be a plus.

I found the installation to be very easy and quick.  Like many items like this, the first few hours of use had a oil smell as the oils from manufacturing burned off....do that with the windows open if you can.

Did you get the optional blower?  I did not.  I figured that I could put a fan near by if I really wanted to.

[river place]

Didn't get the blower option on the Lopi.  The stove was used in the store as a demo so I shouldn't have to worry about burning off the new smell so that's a plus.

We really like your Dogtrot design.  We'll be going with a modified Dogtrot as the place will be in an L-shape with a open area between the main section and and office/bedroom.

[fritz]

Frozen pipes. Not what you are thinking 

I have two water supply lines in the dogtrot:  one to each cabin.  Both protected by heat tape and when the ground thaws, I'm going to retro fit an enclosure buried 4 feet in the ground -- like a meter pit -- to further protect the lines.  But wait until you read this:

We've had a few days of -15 degrees in early January.  And a few stretches of 0 and single digits.  The little side cabin -- with nearly 3 feet of exposed water line, protected by heat tape, has performed flawlessly.  On Thursday, January 22, I left Orlando, Fl (it was 32 in Orlando!) and returned to Iowa (it was 51!)  On Saturday morning, the 24th, at 5 am, (temp of about 0 degrees) I flipped my small cabin faucet and --- nothing.  No water.  Frozen!    

So i began what turned into a nearly 13 day fix.  I started by replacing the heat tape.  Then, I started pouring hot water next to the pipe and then scooping it away -- along with the thawing dirt and clay around the pipe (the reason for the retrofit to come).  Over a day or two, I dug by hand down nearly 3 - 4 feet, completely exposing the water line, and then applying heat via light bulb (250 watt brooder warming light) space heater (1500 watt blower) and several choice - but "hot" words and phrases.

Nada.  Zilch.  Dryer than an alcohol-still free county.

Last Saturday we hit nearly 55 degrees.  Still frozen.  Monday, I put a light at the base of the hand dug hole and it ran non stop until Wednesday with no water.

Now the odd thing is the water line to the big cabin -- just 35 - 40 feet away -- and where we split off for each feed -- was still running.  And I checked my water meter frequently to be sure I didn't have a line break (no spinning meter = no water usage, a good thing).

I had been in contact with my line contractor who assured me that he had never had a line freeze (he is the best in the area and installs the lines for the water association, he also assured me his work was "guaranteed forever" and that surely it was frozen just beneath where I had dug.)

We made a plan to bring a back hoe out Thursday.  Wednesday night, on a whim, I cut about 20 feet (an arbitrary length) of copper ground wire from some romax and I disconnected my flex hose to the water heater and had a straight shot down the supply line.  I fished the copper wire to the end -- 20 feet, without hitting ice.

Things that make you go hmmm 

Thursday morning, with temps in the 40's, he began to dig.  He dug at the edge of the deck where the line sweeps back towards the main line.  This is 10 feet from the point where the water line exits the ground and goes up into the floor.....  The first hole he dug was 3 - 4 deep and 8 feet long.  Then he probed the non frozen soil for the water line.  We didn't find the line.

The second hole was another 8 foot extension of the first.  With frost teeth on the back hoe bucket, he scraped at the frozen 24 degree soil.  On the third scrape, about 3 - 4 inches under the surface, I waived him off to stop:  the bucked had just severed the very frozen water line.



Over the wet spring and summer, the line had formed an upside down U and had floated up to the surface.  Why any water flowed at all this winter is a miracle.

So, he dug down to where the line was buried 5 feet, and we cut out and replaced the section and then re-buried it.  As we talked through the original installation, we remembered that he had used a smaller wheel driven trencher for that section of line, before returning the next day with a larger, track-driven trencher.  The smaller trencher made a narrower trench and likely didn't have as much dirt fall into the trench on burial.

More photos and a similar story here:  http://www.smallfarmlife.com/2009/02/06/frozen-pipes-the-conclusion/

[fritz]

Hi all, here' a summer update.  I did a walk around and took images from all 4 sides of the dogtrot.  I ended up taking the eastern exposure in two shots.

Western Exposure:


Southern exposure


Eastern Exposure (each cabin)



Northern exposure

[Redoverfarm]

 fritz I must admit that it looks a little greener than the one you posted in December.  From the photographs it appears that your most severe weather is from the east. 

[secordpd]

Hi Fritz, great home!  How do the polycarbonate windows work in the cold. Are they as energy efficient as you thought?   Do you swim in your pond?  I live on a 3 acre pond and l swim most days it's above 75.  Do you have problems with weeds and algae? If so do you try to eradicate them? If so how?

[fritz]

Redrover -- you have a very keen eye.  There is a story about that.  The east side was the last side that I put siding on....but I had 2 sheets up last spring, the balance went up in fall so I had weathered siding and new siding, and I knew if I stained it, it would always look un matched.  SO I have not stained it - will do so this week, now that the tone - patina has mellowed.

[fritz]

secordpd,

the polycarbonate (longer windows) are okay --- not awesome but not awful.  I am pleased.  There are things I could hve done to make it more energy efficient all the way around, but with a few compromises, I am happy.
As for the ponds, I have two, the smaller older one, and a larger 1.5 acre one that is about 10 - 12 years old.  Both get some algae.  I have added grass carp -- who wont do much for algae, but help some with chara I think.

I have seen a build up of black anaerobic muck in the little pond, part of the aging process.....so I've added some bacteria to see ho it helps this season.

[secordpd]

Yea, my pond needs some work, to many over fertilized lawns abutting it.  I put a fountain in and it definitely seems to help, esp with circulation.  Trying to figure a way to get some of the weeds out of my swimming area. Was raking them out while on my raft in the middle but that is brutal on the body.  Let me know how the bacteria works.  I've thought about using, but kinda pricey...

[fritz]

I am not a pond expert at all.  But my thinking is, the fewer chemicals, the easier it is to control.  Most of the pond adivce on line is aimed at artificial ponds with liners -- but there is a site I think called PondBoss (do a search?) that has a great forum.

Grass carp should control your weeds, aeration is supposed to help reduce algae.  If you have the thick black muck of plant decay, then the suggested fix is bacteria.  If it works and if I remember, I['ll post back in a few weeks.  The package says initial results in 2 weeks, up to 90 days or longer for a fix.

[rick91351]

Wow Great Job!!  Thanks for the post you have really given me ton of new ideas.  To be honest I was not crazy about your layout when you started.  Just filed them under different strokes.  But now I love how you did it.  Will pass it along for sure to a friend or two that do cabins.

rlr 

   

[soomb]

by chance do you have estimated cost to get to where you are now?

Any updated interior shots?  Anything major you would change having lived in the cabin for a time?

Thanks

[fritz]

I am the kind of person who drives budget people crazy, I have not kept any kind of collected records  on my costs.  I know, that would drive many people to homicide!    I could run my bank records and identify all the charges if I had to.

Okay, lets see:  I bought most everything at retail or on sale -- I didn't do what many people do by re using or recycling.  If my memory serves correct I'm between $20k and $30k to date.  I spent about $3K in 2006, about $9k in 2007 and $13k in 2008.(Which includes most of the IKEA furniture)... So call it just over $50 a square foot for interior space.


On top of that there is the almost weekly trip to a Lowes or Home Depot and $100 for this tool, that item, and the other thing...some of which is reusable, some of which is one time use. 

I purchased things as I could, and built cheap, with the idea of upgrading in time.  For example, I bought the cheapest exterior doors ($100 each) knowing that in the next year, I would upgrade to nicer doors, and then reuse these cheap doors in a shed. 

Likewise on windows and siding. I have cheap vinyl windows and t-111 siding.  I imagine -- based on what I have seen, the t111 may warp in 10 years.  If it does to the point of looking really bad, I can re side and then decide if I want higher quality windows.  That may not make sense to some people -- but it worked for me.  In other words, I couldn't afford to go top drawer to start with, so I know I was setting myself up for expense down the road.  But I also do not have a mortgage on the cabin.


I will take some interior shots soon....I still do not have all the furniture I would like and there is lots of trim to do.

As for living and changes.....hmmm.....The breezeway space is interesting.  I used lattice for the roof there...the original design had a drop ceiling and a continuous roof line (see the first image in this thread of Steve Atkinson's original design.

I like the open lattice roof, but some rainy days, it would be great to sit on the deck under a closed roof and watch the rain.  I *may* replace the lattice with cedar tongue and groove in a year or two. I do not want to close it in or even screen it in.  Even in the coldest below zero weather, the walk from one ot the other is nice.

I will change out the exterior doors --- in summer, there is a screen door -- having a glass exterior door will help the space feel less closed-in in winter.

Living in a small space requires a reduction in "stuff"  ... and a reduction in consumption.  Collectors, garage salers, chronic eBay users, and nick nack lovers need to really think about living in less than 600 square feet.  I have enjoyed (most of the time) living and building in the same space.  Some days, moving the power tools to make lunch, or stepping over building materials to get dressed takes its toll.   Having the 16 x 44 deck makes a great "workshop" in decent weather.  That has been a major plus.

[fritz]

Ooops, forgot this.  This is probably obvious to the experienced builders, but I highly recommend finishing the ceiling before moving on to walls.  If I build again, I would say, do the shell, then insulate, finish the ceiling - then do the rest.  I insulated the ceiling and finished the ceiling almost last..and made work much harder on myself.

Oh, and this fall, I am replacing the lattice skirting with solid skirting, both for warmth and for looks.  In the end, I dont like the looks of the lattice, but that's just a preference thing.

[soomb]

Thank you.  I look forward to following your progress.
Laundry? (done in town?)
How is the gray water system doing this far?

[secordpd]

Thanx for the tip about doing the ceiling first, its info like that which makes this such a valuable website.  That is probably info you would not know unless someone experienced it and shared

[fritz]

soomb:  yes, laundry is done in town, about a block from my office is a laundromat which offers a wash dry fold service for $1 a pound.  I drop off in the morning and pick up in the afternoon.  Gray water system works great,   Art Ludwig's Greywater Oasis is THE book for learning about greywater systems.  I use about 300 - 500 gallons of water a month and am on a rural water system.  My well is contaminated and is a shallow dug (25 foot) well which is traditional for this part of the state.  it was not worth trying to keep up, the risk of re contamination is high. 

At some point, I will also post photos of my revisions to bringing my water lines into the cabins with a post and pier foundation.  I think I found a pretty slick solution based on ideas from this site and poking around.

secordpd:  I try and remember to share back -- so many people have helped me over the years year.  Feel free to ask either on line or via email private message.

I began (and still am) a novice.  But if I've done it, right or wrong, I'll share my experience....
 

[secordpd]

Hey Fritz, how did the bacteria you added to your pond work out?  Did it help?  I wish I could afford to keep my fountain running all the time, I think that would really help with the stagnant water at the bottom, and get more oxygen in there.   

[fritz]

Hi all!  Hey Secordpd.

Short answer, I don't know, but I'm optimistic? 
I did two rounds:  10 pounds in early July or Late June and then a second 10 pounds in  early August.  I added an aerator also in early August.

I am seeing less black muck at the edges on the bottom, still have water meal on the top, which seems to be slowing, but it is not gone or cured. 

The real test may be next summer if it returns.  I'll try and post an update in early fall.

[Arizona Highlander]

Awesome job fritz.
Another inspiration for me to do something on a small scale.

[soomb]

Fritz, any updates?

[fritz]

Hi all, and thanks for the nudge.  I confess I have nothing really visual to share but I may later in the year.  I've now been in the cabin full time just over 2 years.  It continues to be the best decision I've made and to be honest, the "work" still seems like fun.

This winter was filled with lots of snow -- but the higher snow was a good wind block around the foundation and that encouraged me to replace the lattice skirting with a solid skirt.  I think this is an obvious choice for many people...I liked the look of the lattice originally, then it lost it's appeal.  And the warmer cabin this winter sealed the deal I may get this done this summer or fall.  At the same time, I removed the lattice dog trot roof and am looking to put a solid roof up.  The lattice was great there as a roof -- but there were times I wished I could sit outside during rain and not get wet....so I'm looking at my options. 


I had no water line freeze this year.    And I did install a full size LP tank and used 150 gallons of LP between December and March.  As always, your mileage may vary.  The lp stove warms the big cabin, an electric space heater warms the little side.  I've thought about a small pellet stove or a second lp stove for the little side.....I may shp around for a cheap used one.

The composting toilet has continued to work -- I did mange to overload it when I had a handful of guests who drank a lot of beer.....I mean, a lot of beer.  One thing to consider if you use a composting toilet is what to do if you through a party.... I have the largest Sun Mar model, rated for use by 4 adults --- best advice may be to encourage the guys to discover their inner "wild thing" and have them pee in the woods.

The pond aerator ran all winter and this summer will be a good test to see how much less pond meal and bottom scum I have.

True confessions:  I still have interior trim to finish, around windows and I am replacing one of my temporary doors (on the small cabin) with a full pane glass window.

PPS>  every so often I think about building another cabin here -- a guest writer's retreat...Okay okay, I'll finish this one first....but then...... hmmmm

[MushCreek]

I'm planning on lattice (painted) around part of my build, but I was going to put something solid up first and paint it dull black so it would look like just lattice. Just a thought....