final window question

[dug]

Sorry, I asked some questions about windows on a previous post but am still confused . I don't mean to be redundant- I promise I will shut up after this.

My situation is as follows- Ready to start wall framing but do not have funds for windows yet. I will be able to purchase them in about a month.

Trying to compare different options is leaving me frazzled. Opinions vary widely. Some say aluminum clad is the only way- others say vinyl clad is great. Every manufacturer seems to offer different sizing options, and most experts seem to look down on any brand other than Anderson, Marvin, etc. These people usually are working for clients to whom $500-1000 per window is no big deal.

At this point I am leaning towards Jeld Wen premium 600 series vinyl clad with low E glass available through HD. They seem reasonably priced compared to some other brands and best of all are available in any size, meaning I can go ahead and frame exactly how I want and order the correct size soon. I find no info on 600 series Jeld wen's official site. Does anyone know if this is an exclusive (ie: junk?) HD model?

The sun is tough on things here in the SW, is vinyl going to fall apart in 5-10 years?

We are pretty remote, so it is hard for me to shop around. The websites just confuse me more.

[MountainDon]

Well, I just upgraded to Windows 7 and am mostly pleased. Oops, wrog thread.   

If money was not a concern I would love to have Pella casement aluminum clad wood windows everywhere I wanted an opening window. But it is a concern.

I don't recall the U-factor and the SHGC numbers for the Jeld-Wen... we looked at them but bought the MW vinyl from Lowe's. One of our reasons was color choice. Karen liked the available tan/sand color better and it did have good energy numbers. We have some Pella aluminum clad wood caement windows down here on the mesa. Love them. I would like them everywhere, but for $$$.

I don't think modern vinyl should have any problems in the SW sun, but won't swear on that. For us in the mountains and among the trees we don't have as much direct sun and it's not as hot. MW does catalog windows by geographic area; maybe that is for accounting for different climate types? MW also makes windows to even inch sizes without there being an extra cost, I believe. Check with Lowe's on that.

Whatever you decide on, check the RO sizes, frame it up carefully and sheath the openings over. You can cut them out when you get the windows. I did that and wrapped the walls before cutting the openings as well.

[n74tg]

If I were you I wouldn't even think about making a purchase until I had all the information I felt I needed.  So, go ahead, keep asking questions until YOU are satisfied.  You are not bothering people (well, at least you're not bothering me)...I don't know about anyone else.  Questions like you have is what this forum is for.

Now, with that being said...how far and wide have you looked not just into "types" of windows (metal, vinyl, vinyl over metal, wood frame, etc) and relative costs of each, but other window alternatives as well.  Here, I am speaking specifically of other than just "new construction" windows.  In the building of my house I too started my window search like you did.  But, a strange turn of luck steered me to what I consider to be a better alternative (at least for me), and that being replacement windows.  

Long story short, we have two window manufacturers here in town.  They make both new construction and replacement windows.  In case you aren't familiar with the differences, replacement windows don't have the nailing flange around the outside.  They are installed via screws through the window side jambs into your wall studs.  Another turn of luck showed me how to add the nailing flange so that my windows, for all intents and purposes, become new construction windows.  

Replacement windows purchased through normal channels (usually a salesman comes to your home and gives you his pitch) cost about as much as store bought new construction windows.  Going that route isn't where the savings are.  But, these two window manufacturers here in town have from time to time "foul-ups in manufacturing"; read that as somebody (the salesman) communicated the window sizes wrong to the manufacturer.  After the windows are made to the wrong size they won't be installed.  So, these left over windows are sold cheap...how cheap...I got 13 new, still in the wrapper, double pane, double hung, low E, argon filled, Energy Star certified in all 50 states windows for $50 each.  Better yet, they were all the same size, and very close to the size I would have bought, had I got them from the big box store.  

My girlfriend bought these same replacement windows (from the salesman) about a year ago.  While she paid about $250 per window (plus cost of install), they have been good windows.  The house is noticeably more comfortable and the outside noises (read that as dogs barking) we just don't hear much anymore.  

Now, you may not have a window manufacturer in your home town.  Heck, you might even have to drive a hundred miles to get to one.  But, it just might be worth the trip.  Likewise, if you planned to spend $500 or more per window to buy really top of the line stuff, then disregard all the above.  

Sometimes looking outside the box is worth it.

Whatever you do, good luck, and take pics for the forum.  
 

[dug]

Thanks everyone for the help.

Likewise, if you planned to spend $500 or more per window to buy really top of the line stuff, then disregard all the above. 

I definitely can not spend that!

I am finally starting to get a handle on this thing. I think I'll be O.K.

[MikeT]

I do not know what the special rules are about this, but I thought I would add a variable to throw into the mix.  It may be moot, but then again it may be worth checking:

Up till the end of the year (Dec. 31) I notice that there is an energy tax credit available for purchase of energy efficient windows.  I do not know the specifics.  But I do know that tax credits are good deals.

mt

[dug]

Mike T- I looked into the tax credit deal but was informed that it was not available for me because of our 6000 ft. elevation, but thanks!

[MountainDon]

To clarify the energy tax credit matter:

The window energy credits are only for replacement windows in an existing home that is your primary residence, not new construction nor applicable to rental property. Ditto on biomass stoves, HVAC, insulation, roofing, water heaters and doors. Expires Dec 31, 2010   30%, $1500 limit

The solar PV energy credits are applicable to new construction as well as existing. They also apply to recreational or secondary residences. Ditto geothermal heat pumps and wind turbines. No rentals. Expires Dec 31, 2016   30% and NO limit.

[Dave Sparks]

Look at " serious materials .com " R9 -R11. This guy  (owner) is winning alot of awards.
Give some feedback on what you think? The one key to doing this right is correct orientation of the home to late afternoon  summer sun! If it is hitting windows you will have a hard time unless you build covered decks to keep the low angle sun off!
Good Luck!

[dug]

Look at " serious materials .com " R9 -R11. This guy  (owner) is winning alot of awards.
Give some feedback on what you think? The one key to doing this right is correct orientation of the home to late afternoon  summer sun!
Good Luck!

I checked them out, very impressive. Some of their window's efficiency ratings are off the charts! Their lower line vinyl seem to be on par with something like an Anderson 400 series window (efficiency wise). I requested some prices and will wait to see how they compare. A quick search did not reveal much info as to their overall quality, so I will try to do a little more research on that.

I have my house oriented directly South, with the front door on South wall. Gable ends face East and West. With a proper overhang and window placement I should be able to avoid any direct sunlight on the South windows during the summer, while receiving light in the winter for solar gain.

unless you build covered decks to keep the low angle sun off!

Herein lies a dilemma I am wrestling with and maybe you could offer an opinion. I would really like to build a covered front deck which would be very nice during the wet seasons as well as aesthetically suited to the home design and property setup. It would however negate any winter solar gain and somewhat limit southern views. I am torn.
 

[NM_Shooter]

I bought 4 of those Jeld Wen windows for my cabin, and I like them pretty well... note that they have only been installed for 4 months though.  I won't know how well I like them until next spring when the snow banks go down off the windows.  Here's hoping the inside stays dry.

I did buy one aluminum window from HD, and I don't like it.  The frame gets cold enough to generate a downflow draft, and I didn't like the flashing. 

[Dave Sparks]

unless you build covered decks to keep the low angle sun off!

Herein lies a dilemma I am wrestling with and maybe you could offer an opinion. I would really like to build a covered front deck which would be very nice during the wet seasons as well as aesthetically suited to the home design and property setup. It would however negate any winter solar gain and somewhat limit southern views. I am torn.
 

[/quote]

My opinion is to design for the worst season. It is simplistic but here is what I tell folks where I live. It is not alot different than your desert summer. Do everything for keeping cool in summer. The other seasons are easy. The deck could have slats that open for winter, or just solar hot water heat it with collectors up on the deck roof.

[rwanders]

I am a firm believer in covered decks----have had both and the ability to use decks/porches in all weather trumps heat gain equation hands down. Nice too when it gets too hot & sunny for comfort. My latest cabin has double decked 10x24 porches covered by an 11' overhang on a 12/12 pitch roof----you can see pictures on projects forum under rwanders.

[dug]

I'm convinced. A deck and porch it will be. That's what I really wanted anyway!

[OkieJohn2]

The cheapest aluminum windows are made from a single extrusion which conducts heat and coolth very well, can also cause indoor moisture problems, with aluminum windows you need to get the ones with a thermal break.
Some thoughts on window size, my parents wanted to be able to arrange furniture anywhere in the room so they build with windows with sills at least 4 feet above the floor, I always considered that house too dark.  I currently live in an apartment with 6 foot tall windows in 8 foot tall walls, I like it very much, you want lots of light, open the blinds, less light, close them, and yep, nothing wrong with furniture in front of a window.
Also, consider the cost of windows versus the cost of patio doors.  I was browsing at the local big box store and they had double exterior french doors for much less that the cost of a couple of low end double hung windows.