3 way switch problem

[pioneergal]

Mike wired a light in the kitchen with a 3 way dimmer switch but we 've got a problem.

This is the layout:

We have a 3 way dimmer switch by the back door and simple basic 3 way switch ( no dimmer ) across the room by the kitchen / living room entrance.


If I come in the back door and flip on the 3 way dimmer switch ....light comes on....and thats good
When I go into living room and flip off the simple basic switch...lights goes out...and thats good

BUT the problem is.......

Example ......... Now Mike comes in the back door to flip on 3 way dimmer switch ....NOTHING happens!
Only if  he goes over and turns on the  simple 3 way switch at living room that I turned off going out of the room does the light get power again!

He has checked the wiring diagram that came with the switch plus a couple of other diagrams ....nothing solves the problem.
Last night he switched out the switches with 2 basic 3 ways  ....same problem.

So, he knows it is something  in the wire connections that he is not doing correctly and needs help to solve this puzzle.

He has wired the whole house and everything is working properly but this .....a thorn in the flesh


I hope that I've not confused anyone with this wordy post!

[Willy]

Sorta easy to fix. First you need to find the incoming power leg. Then you need to find the leg going to the light. These are hot wires the neutrals will be made up. Now they go to what is called the common the screw that has a different color then the other 2. In each box this wire goes to the common normaly a black colored screw. You will have 2 wires left in each box and they are called travelers and go between the 2 boxes/light switches. These wires conect to the other 2 screws and realy dosen't mater which wires go to the left over two screws. Most important thing it that you get the incoming power wire to the common screw on the light switch and the out going wire to the light on the other common on the other switch. Remove both switches of all the wires and read with a meter to find the power one. The other 2 wires in that box will be travelers. Now the other box will be a little harder but you can use a meter to find the light switch by measuring to ground if a light bulb is in the fixture. This can only be done safely if all wires are off the switches and you found the power wire allready. Mark H.

[pioneergal]

Willy,

Problem solved and all is working great!
Mike went back and retraced everything and as usual it was a small thing to fix but had been a MAJOR headache 

Thanks for your help!

Jackie

[Willy]

Willy,

Problem solved and all is working great!
Mike went back and retraced everything and as usual it was a small thing to fix but had been a MAJOR headache 

Thanks for your help!

Jackie

Problem with 3/Way switches you can wire them so many different ways. You can feed either switch box or even the light box. You can also go thru the light box and when you throw a 4/way switch in it get to be more fun. Mark H.

[MountainDon]

It's very satisfying when you do get it to work right!

[pioneergal]

Problem with 3/Way switches you can wire them so many different ways. You can feed either switch box or even the light box. You can also go thru the light box and when you throw a 4/way switch in it get to be more fun. Mark H.
[/quote]

No thank you Mark!
I was telling Mike to just forget it  and do a single switch but that only encouraged him to try harder at getting it to work.
That is the only 3 way in the house and probably the last.....I can't imagine tackeling a 4 way!

Again thanks for the help...worked just like you said it would!

Jackie

[pioneergal]

It's very satisfying when you do get it to work right!

Don,

You are so right!
When we started this house Mike had never built anything larger than an 8 x 10 deck.
Today he just stood in the house grinning and looking at the accomplishments we've made.
I am so proud of him!
Oh yeah, he's still crowing about fixing that 3 way switch

[JRR]

If anyone should need multiple switching on an electrical load, 3 or 4 ... even more switches; find a controls supplier that sells 120volt "ratchet relays".  The ratchet relay feeds the lamps, or whatever electrical load.  Any number of wall switches feed the relay's coil ... but the switches must all be "momentary contact"; that is, they reopen as soon as you remove your finger.

[wingam00]

JRR, I am still trying to understand what you said.    I understand the words but when I put them together I do not know what they mean. Maybe it is because I have not had my second cup of coffee.


On 4-way switches, one trick I have learned is that is to get the two 3-way switches working right first then connect the 4 ways one by one. 

Mark

[JRR]

This pdf file shows a bit about a ratchet relay:
.http://rkom.beta.qt.pl/www_dokumentacja/przekazniki/j070e13a_g4q_datasheet.pdf.

Each time the coil is energized, however briefly (...up to a point), the relay contacts change state. Pulse (energize) the coil, the relay contact opens.  Pulse the coil again, the relay contact closes.  Etc, etc.

Now to pulse the coil, provide voltage thru any number of paralleled (momentary) switches.  Wall switches are not usually seen in momentary configuration ... but they are available.  Of course, they could be wall mounted "push buttons" instead.

[PEG688]

   



  Or This way :

 

Oddly those look like two way switchs to me , as there are only two switchs    , a 4 way has three switchs I guess   . Go figure 

[MountainDon]

Nice pictures. Thanks Paul.

A regular switch, ON-OFF is a 2 way.... ON or OFF     

3 way would be 2 switches with three modes...  ON   and   ON  and   OFF