Speaking of Tiny Houses...

[DavidLeBlanc]

Jay Shafer, over at http://www.tumbleweedhouses.com/ has put up some new pics of the interiors of some of the tiny houses built to his designs. Mr. Shafer's idea of "tiny" is the 8x12 "cottage" he built and lived in for 5 years.

He's also posted an exerpt from a book (which I think he either wrote or had a hand in) and it's worth reading!

http://www.tumbleweedhouses.com/information.htm#

As a source of inspiration and resources, his site is great.


Not bad for 7x11'! Serious attention to detail! this is his "XS-House" design

[DavidLeBlanc]

Floorplan of above tiny house:

[Amanda_931]

If I were to try that I think I'd put a sawdust toilet where the bathroom sink is, use the kitchen sink for the sink.

A sand filter for the waste water treatment. (apparently a big loader tire with thebottom sidewall cut off, filled--not tamped, just filled maybe 3/4 of the way up--with sand, covered with almost anything works just fine, need to skim off the top 1/2 or so inch of sand off when it doesn't drain worth a flip, but not until then because the little organisms growing on the top are what are purifying your water.)  I've heard of 55 gallon drums mostly filled with sand and with screen and small holes in the bottom as well.

[DavidLeBlanc]

The round thing on the left is, I'm pretty sure, a toilet, not a sink.

The shower is where one would stand facing the toilet: i.e, it doubles as floor space and shower stall.

I think this is actually too small a design, at least for me. This one seems more doable:


With this one, I'd stretch it a bit, put the front door where one of those large cabinets is near the woodstove and put a couch in a bump-out where the front door is now. This is his 10x16' front gable design.

[glenn kangiser]

Please double check before use David. :-/

[DavidLeBlanc]

Huh?  

[John Raabe]

These are interesting designs but almost unusable by all but the smallest people. It would be like living in a tiny RV. Fine for one person who is not too tall or overweight and using it for short stays in good weather.

I would estimate the space between the two counters in the "larger" U-shaped kitchen to be 26" or so. You are pretty much wearing that kitchen.

A good friend of mine in architecture school would be perfectly comfortable in such a space. He was 5'-5" and about 125 lbs. He built a full studio and two level apartment into an 8x12 porch we had in a house we were renting at the time.

He went on to build a home and studio out of ferro-cement on the shell of a 14' steel lifeboat that he moored in Seattle's Lake Union for several years. He even lived there after he married his little wifey! I visited for dinner a couple of times and it was great fun but it would be too tight for me to call home.

Is this Jay Shafer?

[Chuckca]

John,

You have changed SO MUCH....we're going to call you Sir!

Cheers!

[DavidLeBlanc]

The pic I've seen of Shafer shows that he looks to be one of those slender, smaller people...

The 2nd of the two floor plans, above, might fit nicely into a Builder's Cottage with enough room for more average/large sized people ?

[DavidLeBlanc]

Just over looking at the "Under 200 sq. ft. Cabin" thread started by John... It's only 1' narrower than the 2nd floorplan, above. Puts the notion of a bathroom and kitchen side by side in a space that narrow into perspective.

I don't know about other people, but when I start dreaming about houses, they have a tendency to grow. Just one more little feature... and, before you know it, it's over 1,000 sq. ft - or 2,000!

I think looking at the tinest designs helps rope in this balloon effect. They're too small to live in, at least for me (although, "any port in a storm" keeps crossing my mind), but they do generate some ideas.

[Amanda_931]

Yep--start adding in everything you ever wanted and suddenly it's McMansion time.

If it helps, my mother thought that big houses were easier to clean, because they could be kept less cluttered!

On second look, that is a composting/sawdust toilet instead of sink.

[DavidLeBlanc]

Shafer sells the 2nd of the two floorplans above as his "Concord" model. $37,980 plus delivery charges.

At 160 sq. ft., that's $237/sq. ft. EEEEK!

[Naturaliving]

Howdy folks;

  I've been reading this forum for a while now and I find it very interesting and informative.  Also the people on here seem to be really down to earth and easy-going.  This is my first post and I have a question regarding the square footage of houses in general.  I really love these small houses and since most houses including these are sized by the square foot I was wondering if there is an accepted method of determining the square footage of a house?  Do you measure from the outside or the inside?  Do you include things such as dead space, floor areas covered by non-removeable interior structures such as cabinets?  What about decks attacted to said structure, are they included?  If there is a sleeping loft that is just big enough for the bed, is that included in determining square footage?    I know that many areas have minimum requirements for the size of a house you can build and also many have maximum sizes you can build without a permit.  Just wondering if there is an actual legal definition of the "square footage" of a house?

                                             Alan.

[glenn-k]

I was going to say it varies but here is an article to help confuse things.

http://realtytimes.com/rtcpages/20050607_calcuatefootage.htm

and another

http://homebuying.about.com/od/realestatecareers/ss/square_footage.htm

and an article about average costs.

http://www.homeplanfinder.com/docs/faqcostofbuilding.asp

[Bart_Cubbins]

Welcome Alan, I think you've provided a great summary of what this forum is about.

Most zoning and development bylaws will have a definition of "floor area". Typically it will be defined as measured from the outer surface of the exterior wall finish. Basements are often excluded but the definition of basement varies widely. Normally you have to include the full cross section of each floor including stairwells, utility chases, closets, etc. Sometimes the areas of rooms with overheight ceilings (such as 12 ft or more) have to be counted twice. On the other hand, low ceiling areas (perhaps under 4 or 5 ft) below the roof are often excluded from an attic level. Fully enclosed sunrooms are usually included. Partially enclosed spaces like covered balconies and porches are sometimes included, sometimes not. A loft area deemed to be a bedroom would likely be included. It might be excluded if you can convince the building department that it will only be used for storage.

Aside from local zoning and development regs, the only "legal" definition I can think of would be the surveyed areas of condominium units. I believe the surveyors measure from the outside surface of the exterior sheathing (not finish surface) and from the midpoint of any shared interior walls.

I don't think there is any real standard for floor areas given in real estate advertising. However for newer houses, real estate agents will often use the "official" floor area from the building or development permit.

Bart

p.s. Seems Glenn beat me to it. Reading his second link reminded me of a point I forgot...

For zoning and development purposes, small bumpouts from a wall, such as bay windows and fireplace enclosures, are often excluded.

[spinnm]

I didn't realize that these things are regional until the last few years.

Down here it's measured around the perimeter.  Heated square footage...but you're including the depth of the walls, be it 2x4, 2x6, adobe, straw bale.

The draftspeople who aren't architects, generally charge by the square foot.  A bargain, one thinks.  Maybe.  Depends.

[Amanda_931]

Things like running water (the well?), plumbing--including septic system, electricity aren't quite fixed costs--as in the same for the 400 sf cottage as the 4000 foot McMansion, but they are closer to fixed--and are often more expensive--than most of the other parts of the house.

So in general a large barn of a house will be lower in per square foot costs than a tiny well-designed cottage.

Especially one built with premium materials off-site and brought in, which I think at least some of those tiny houses--e.g. Tumbleweed--are.  Think classic yacht.

[Amanda_931]

Resurrecting an old topic.

From this morning's news.  No picture, though.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/9398215

A former tool shed built to fill a gap in the middle of a row of Victorian houses in what was once Dublin's poorest district has found a buyer at a startling price of $269,100 (220,000 euros).

At 10 feet wide and with a floor space of 280 square feet the building was last sold for 500 Irish pounds ($777) in the 1970s.

The red-brick house has no garden and no ground floor windows.