14 x 24 little house; extend roof one end

[MountainDon]

The 14 x 24 (built as a 14 x 26) would suit me fine. However, I'd like to put the front entrance in one end (14 ft) wall with a back door in the other end. At the front end I would like to extend the roof overhang to about 5 or 6 feet with a porch under the roof. Let's see if I can paint a word picture to phrase my question.

I envision the porch deck being set a couple three inches lower than the main cabin floor, porch joists perpendicular to the end wall out to a beam supported by posts/piers with the decking on top. I imagine there would need to be upper beams extending out from the long sides for the rafters to rest on; the outer ends of these beams supported by a sturdy post at each corner under the end of the roof.

I can't picture how the rafter support beam would attach to the house structure. I don't want any exposed metal brackets. The area under the porch roof would not be closed in, but would be left open with the rafter collar ties exposed.

[jraabe]

If you will be extending the high gable roof for the porch then you would have support beams on the sides extending the weight bearing of the 26' long walls. These could be supported by bearing on the corner post framing of the house and then bear on 6x6 posts at the porch corners. I would use a 6x8 beam to look substantial. (The posts and beams could be 4x4 & 4x6 but they feel too wimpy to me.)

I would also sheath the exposed section of the porch roof with 1x6 t&g rather than plywood. It will look much better as a ceiling. Your porch joists could go either way depending on how you want the decking to read.

A porch deck is normally set 1" below the house floor so that screen doors and such work right and so there is blown water protection.

[peg_688]

#1: These could be supported by bearing on the corner post framing of the house and then bear on 6x6 posts at the porch corners. I would use a 6x8 beam to look substantial. (The posts and beams could be 4x4 & 4x6 but they feel too wimpy to me.)

#2: I would also sheath the exposed section of the porch roof with 1x6 t&g rather than plywood. It will look much better as a ceiling. Your porch joists could go either way depending on how you want the decking to read.

#3:  A porch deck is normally set 1" below the house floor so that screen doors and such work right and so there is blown water protection.

 #1: I agree the 6x6  post / 6x8 beam will look a lot better.

 #2: Again a great idea , remember you'll have to adjust either your rafter heights / birds mouth depth or "fir up" your truss's to compinsate for the 3/4" T&G or use thicker than "normal" roof sheathing on the main structure, for a "flush" line on your roof sheathing.

#3:  Another place to remember to figure in the thickness of your decking materials , and maybe a "Jambsill" under that door , if , wind blown rain is a issue.

 G/L PEG  

[MountainDon]

Thanks guys. I like the idea of 6x6 posts and larger 6x8 beams, as like you stated they just look like they're more up to the job.  Secondly, thanks for the idea of using 1x6 T&G for the roof sheathing over the porch; that will definitly look better and thanks PEG for the headsup regarding the thickness correction required. I want the deck a couple to three inches lower than the door sill partly because it does snow there; no real driven rain problem, though last summer broke that rule a couple times.

I may also see what I can work out using peeled logs for the porch posts, mirroring the same treatment using  smaller dia peeled native Ponderosa Pine for railings and ballusters. There's a lot of small Ponderosa that has to be thinned out to create a healthier forest. (I have the chief ranger as a neighbor; he's guiding me in that department.)

[peg_688]

#1:Thanks guys.


#2: I like the idea of 6x6 posts and larger 6x8 beams, as like you stated they just look like they're more up to the job.  Secondly, thanks for the idea of using 1x6 T&G for the roof sheathing over the porch; that will definitly look better and


#3: thanks PEG for the headsup regarding the thickness correction required.

#4: I want the deck a couple to three inches lower than the door sill partly because it does snow there; no real driven rain problem, though last summer broke that rule a couple times.

#5: I may also see what I can work out using peeled logs for the porch posts, mirroring the same treatment using  smaller dia peeled native Ponderosa Pine for railings and ballusters. There's a lot of small Ponderosa that has to be thinned out to create a healthier forest. (I have the chief ranger as a neighbor; he's guiding me in that department.)

#1: Your welcome  

#2: Large just does look better , 4x4's just don't match the scale needed , ussually.

#3:  Those little things , like different thickness sheathing can trip a guy up , some times the great idea can lead to a big AHHHH CRAP, when we lose site of the details.

#4: Best to keep it at  the inch , that extra 2" your thinking about becomes a trip hazard , the eye doesn't pick that up , so the feet tend to get caught up in that lil step.  There a wierd deal our eyes do to us between 1 1/2 " to 4" , we can't see it and it becomes a problem .  

   So I'd recommend either go to a 6" to no more than 7 3/4" step , or keep it at 1" or under

#5: These Lee Valley tools might be useful for the pine railing:

     

Tenoning cutters    Link : http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.aspx?c=2&p=42299&cat=1,180,42288,45539

 G/L PEG

[Amanda_931]

If you need big tenon cutters, Rockler has the kind that work with a router.  Quite a bit cheaper if you need more than two sizes.  there's another brand as well--Bailey's, that may not need the router table, just a bench.  I've never seen any of them in action.

(but I'd sure like a set of the ones that PEG shows there--I wouldn't have to get a router table and possibly another router, mine might be rusted solid or just not heavy duty enough for tenoning green hardwood)



http://www.rockler.com/product.cfm?page=11055

http://store.baileys-online.com/cgi-bin/baileys/1868?mv_session_id=5jfXR9U9&product_sku=16500

[MountainDon]

I like those Lee Valley / Veritas cutters. Not too bad a price if you're only buying one or two sizes. Have to file this away for the future. Thanks much.

Spent 5 hours picking up more deadfall, cutting, sorting and hauling some to the burn pile. Need a little snow so we can burn.

[borgdog]

The tenon cutters do a real nice quick job, but to my eye it just doesn't look right to have a rustic rail post with a nice smooth tenon cut on the end.  I'm contemplating doing a combination of hand tenoning with a hatchet, then the cutter to make for a perfect fit in the hole... may need to do in reverse order for right look.

[Amanda_931]

We've been using Lee Valley's (Lee Valley is home of one of the most miserable search engines I've ever met!) push knife for some inner bark peeling.  It's wonderful, nice thin sharp blade.  And they did forget to pass a law saying that it had to be used as a push knife.

It would work better for me than a hatchet for adding a rustic look to a tenon.  Since I'm so wild with hatchet or ax, using a drawknife would weaken the wood less.



http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.aspx?c=2&p=31070&cat=1,130,43332

Or, Lee Valley also has some tenon cutters that don't have the little round edges.  Including some I've never seen before that require a drill press.

They call these dowel makers, that are pretty expensive, and not over an inch in diameter.

http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.aspx?c=2&p=42331&cat=1,180,42288

and these tapered tenon jobs, which work like a pencil sharpener.  Size is the tip of the taper.

http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.aspx?c=2&p=54835&cat=1,180,42288

[borgdog]

Thanks Amanda, I hadn't thought of a draw-knife, and having had a hatchet stuck in the side of my knee once I should probably not use them either (short version - knot).   I should watch the Wood Wright Shop again as he uses draw knifes a lot and has that neat foot vise thingy that would be great for holding spindles.

[Amanda_931]

For those of us without TV's Drew Langsner's book on Green Woodworking is pretty nice.  Although I'd check alibris to see if there's a less expensive copy around.  He shows, not necessarily very well, some field-built clamp affairs that I need to see if I can use down at the barn.

(This is the guy whose first book Handmade was responsible for one of Glenn's neighbors becoming a homesteader.)

http://www.amazon.com/Green-Woodworking-Hands-Approach-Langsner/dp/0937274828/sr=1-1/qid=1167099667/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1/002-4170165-9831267?ie=UTF8&s=books