2 story universal girder

[cedarglen]

I am finishing up my work on the 2 story universal plans. We will be building it on a poured perimiter concrete crawlspace foundatoin. My question is about the girder under the house. We will be using a 13.5" Glulam girder. If we put that girder in a beam pocket we would need the foundation to stand over 2 feet out of the ground. (12" to get the beam 12" above ground level plus 13.5" for the height of the beam). Wouldn't it make more sense to put a Post Anchor (like a CB66) in the top of the concrete foundation and have the girder hight absorbed in the builtup cripple walls? Is this an unusual setup I am proposing? Will my very strict department of Building and Safty reject this idea? What is the typical way this is handled?

thank you
Charles

[John Raabe]

If the girder will be supported by a built-up post in a pony wall it will usually not need a post anchor. Just get full width solid bearing down to the foundation. If you are wanting to get the girder higher up into the floor system (perhaps so you don't have to dig the crawlspace out so deep) you could set it a bit under the tops of the floor joists and hang the joists from the girder spanning over it with the subflooring. Either of those should be checked with the inspector to make sure there are no surprise local requirements.

[cedarglen]

Would it be unusual to put the girder right on the sill plate in the buildup? Or whould it be better right on the foundation?

What about the girder in the cieling of the 2nd floor (in other words in the floor of the attic)? The plan technition at the dept of Building and Safety didn't like it because he said that it looks like a 3rd floor. 3 story structures require manditory engineers stamp here. There wouldn't be any probelms with full span 2x8's 16" o.c. there would there? It would not be living space. Just storage.

Charles

[John Raabe]

Charles,

The girder would normally sit on the sill plate fine. However, there may be some concern that there could be enough weight to have some crushing of the plate. It that case I see what you were considering with the metal base. I would let the inspector decide that one.

As for the attic, a 2x8 will not span the 19' that you would have without a center beam. You could however do attic trusses designed for the 15 psf that storage requires. I'm sure that would fly with the plans checker for a 2-story design. It would also make it quicker to frame.

[cedarglen]

John, thank you for your input. If you look at my floorplans you will see that I have moved the Master bedroom to the side of the house with the view. This puts my closet and bathroom on the other side. I have a 2x4 wall running the entire length of the house except for the stairway opening. Couldn't I just use a 4x header over my stairs and toenail my 2x8 cieling joists to the top of my 2x4 wall and omit that beam in the 2nd floor cieling? According to the chart provided my my local office building and safety 2x8 joists 16" oc don't need the beam at all, I was hoping to do 2x8's 24 oc over the 2x4 wall, if I were able to splice the joists on top of that wall would be even better (I will be building the house alone many times). Do you think that will fly with them? (I understand that that is a question to ask them, but they are 2 hours away and I have asked them so many questions that they are pretty sick of seeing me in there, they are very overworked) I like to go in there with everything pretty well thought out.

[John Raabe]

Charles:

Yes, you can do a load bearing wall as you mention and put a header over the stairwell as you suggest. This transfers the load to the beam in the first floor ceiling which now carries the second floor and attic loads. If there are beams in the second floor ceiling then the attic and roof loads are carried directly to the posts and not put on the beam below.

For your layout the area that might be overloaded by this would be the beam in the living room ceiling. That might need to be beefed-up.

[cedarglen]

How about I put a 4x8 beam right on top of the 2x4 wall (in the 2nd floor cieling)  since I have the 2x4 wall anyway the beam will be hidden from sight everywhere but over the stairs. I'll put 4x4 posts in the stairwell in line with the 6x6 posts below, and 4x4 posts at the ends over the 6x6 posts below. That way I'll take the load off of the beam below and get the best of both worlds and not have the exposed beam. The 4x8 according to my local header span chart is good enough for the 6'6" span over the stairwell.

[John Raabe]

I expect that would be fine (but I am not doing any calcs you understand).
I expect the plans checker will give it a good look at any rate. To be absolutely certain you can have a review with a local engineer who knows the snow and wind loads.

[cedarglen]

See my first post above (with the picture of the house with girder location). We will be starting our framing in a couple of weeks. Our stem wall is going to stick up 12" above grade. Our girder will sit right on top of the stemwall in Simpsons CB66's. The girder is a 13.5" tall Gluelam beam. I want to hang the 2x8 joists from the sides of the girder with joist hangers. Since the girder is 12" above grade and the girder is 13.5" tall, the 2x8 joists will be 18" above grade as needed by code.

My question is this: On the back side of the house we will need a 6" tall cripple wall, in the front about a 4' tall cripple wall. The 4' tall wall I understand how to build as I have seen many, but what do I do with the 6" tall wall? Just stack three 2x6's on the sill?

thank you,

[John Raabe]

I like your redesign of the Universal plan. Just what I'd hoped folks would do - customize it to their site and space usage needs.

Usually for something like your 6" high infill you would just use 2x's and perhaps plywood or OSB strips to get the level you want. This provides plenty of nailing area for the sheathing and helps stiffen the wall.