Quick GFI questions

[cedarglen]

I'm building the 2 story universal. I am building in California. I know that recipticals in the bath rooms and outside have to be GFI, but:

1. what about the lights in the bathrooms (we're not installing fans)?
2. What about the outside lights?
3. The two bathrooms can be on one GFI circuit right?
4. The bathrooms can not be on the kitchen circuit right?
5. I saw mention in one book that some areas require that every other receptical over the kitchen counter should be on different circuits (2 GFI circuits for the kitchen alone) that is not used in CA is it?

thank you,

Chuck

[MountainDon]

Well, California is different in many things, a leader some say.    
You should probably check someone local to be certain what you need.

Going by the NEC though...
GFCI protected receptacles are required at kitchen counters, within 6 feet of laundery, utility and wet bar sinks, anything outdoors including balconies, outdoor grade level buildings, garages except for ceiling mount like for a door opener, crawl spaces, boathouses. NEC does not mention lights.

Receptacles within 3 ft of a bathroom sink, bath, shower need to be GFCI protected. The bath requires 20 amp service; more than one bathroom can be on one GFCI BUT only if only receptacles are connected to it, no lighting. If you put bathroom lighting on the same GFCI as the outlets for the bathroom, then you can not do any other bathrooms on that GFCI. I believe bathrooms cannot share loads with any other spaces, but can't recall for certain.

Kitchens require 2 circuits for small appliances that are outlet only, no lighting. The kitchen requirements can be confusing and I haven't got my info at hand. You need so many per foot of counter. Kitchens also require a ceiling light controlled by a wall switch, by NEC. PLus a light above the kitchen sink. You best check on the CA kitchen requirements; I'd be surprised if they were less stringent than the NEC.  As far as I know the every other on the other circuit is more of a convention than a requirement. I've some electricians split the top and bottom of each receptacle as well.


You'll also need AFCI breakers for all power in sleeping areas, FYI. Maybe you knew that already?

[glenn kangiser]

I'm not sure on the specs on that, Chuck - but the alternating circuits in the kitchen is a good idea due to possible larger loads tripping breakers.

[MountainDon]

And you do know that GFCI outlets can be wired to protect a series of downstream outlets?

And you can buy GFCI breakers that take the place of the GFCI outlets. They cost more, but the nice thing about them is all breakers and circuit interrupting devices are in the same place, the service panel. Sometimes the GFCI's are in unusual locations for something that doesn't work. EG: my front ext receptacle is protected by the GFCI in the middle bathroom.   

[davidj]

It used to be the case that the main light in the kitchen and the main light in the bathroom had to have a fixture that only takes fluorescent bulbs (CA title 24).  But searching on google, it looks like most lights need to be "high efficiency" in the 2005 code (or be on dimmers or occupancy sensors).  I think compact fluorescents don't count as they can be replace by regular bulbs.

[MountainDon]

davidj is right on the money with that. CA, once again, leads the nation.    FL fixtures are required in kitchen and bath. I Googled "CA Title 24". Mostly that came up with offers to sell books. Maybe a trip to the library is in order, if you are not up to speed on whatever other special CA rules there may be. Or maybe you know already.

[davidj]

There's a bunch of stuff here: http://www.energy.ca.gov/title24/2005standards/index.html

It looks like the compliance manual is way more accessible than the actual standard.

[JRR]

We all may want to look into "RMS Sensing" main breakers.  It seems most electrical fires go thru a phase that is arcing ... like in loose wireing, etc, ... or something melting into.  Since arcing is not a true sinusoidal waveform ... the "rms sensor" will open the circuit before the fire fully develops. 

GFCI breakers can be used for the branch circuits.

I couldn't find the best to read about the subject, but here is something:
.
http://www.geindustrial.com/publibrary/checkout/Service%20and%20Maintenance%7CGEH-5369A%7CPDF

[cedarglen]

I went ahead and emailed the inspector (again). I try to avoid bugging him, I'm afraid that if I look like a total idiot he'll look too closely at my work. Getting really close to our combo inspection now (after two years of working on this project every other day off). Anyway below are my questions and the answers he gave me.

1. My book on electrical says that some areas require two GFI circuits for the kitchen and the countertop outlets must alternate circuits, is this true here?
no, just 2- 20 amp GFCI circuits for small appliances.
2. The book states that GFI circuits are required in kitchens, bathrooms and outside plugs, but doesn't make it clear if the lights in those areas need to be on the GFI circuits too?
no
3. Can both bathrooms be on the same GFI circuit?
no
4. What about the plugs in the laundry area? Do they need to be GFI and can they share with any other circuits?
you need a dedicated 20 amp GFCI circuit for laundry room
5. What about lights, can they be cheap can lights with CFL's in them?
no must be fluorescent

[MountainDon]

Thanks for filling us in with the inspectors replies.

[glenn kangiser]

Good info- thanks.

[w6jmc]

Regarding the California requirements for Energy Efficiency, especially with regards to lighting, the easiest to read guidelines can be found here http://www.cityofcalabasas.com/BuildingSafety/Handouts/Title_24_Residential_Lighting.pdf there are also a few other documents regarding title 24 at the same website http://www.cityofcalabasas.com/BuildingSafety/handouts-Forms.html

[glenn kangiser]

Thanks, w6jmc and to the forum.