Author Topic: 24x36 Cabin with 10x14 Bumpout - SE Oklahoma  (Read 5967 times)

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Offline StreamDreamer

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24x36 Cabin with 10x14 Bumpout - SE Oklahoma
« on: December 06, 2012, 08:43:18 PM »
Hey Everyone!

Finally have a reason to start a thread after lurking in the shadows soaking up wisdom for what seems like forever. First off, just want to thank you all for sharing all your experience and knowledge with us "not in-the-know" folk.. what a blessing it is to be able to learn without forking out a fortune for practical and useful information! So thank you!

So, my name is Tom and I just turned 30 (sigh  :-[)  (cue the sarcastic "you're not old" comments  ;)). I am the type of person that LOVES to get in over my head, and so far.. it looks promising! After all, you only live once as they say, and things tend to work out in the long run anyway I've found.
I'm kinda the "jack of all trades, master of none" guy. Know a little about a lot and a little more about a lot less. Got some very limited building experience helping family and friends, but not a whole lot thats immediately helpful. I'm a car mechanic, an aircraft mechanic by trade, I've played ice hockey for 15 years, I am scary passionate about fly fishing, and love doing "stuff" myself. I've been married 5 years and have 2 kids, 3 and 5. We currently live in Milwaukee, WI.. but are looking to get back down south where we are from to be closer to family, position ourselves towards self-sufficiency, and to ride out the coming financial/political devastation... oh sorry... that's another thread  8)

Property: Well, I finally settled on some property in SE Oklahoma, near Sardis Lake. Beautiful 15 acres, and dirt cheap to boot! (around $1,250 p/acre) The property is about 1500 ft. altitude and slopes gently for most of it to the south. It is also pretty much completely covered in short-leaf cedar and oak, so naturally I originally decided to harvest all my logs myself to do my build... but that thought may have been temporarily shelved. More on that in a bit..




I am knee-deep in the planning phases and design work and it has consumed me! Haha. Anyway, the method I'm researching is a little... well... not normal. Basically, I'm looking into a "log" alternative by laminating 3 2x8x12's into a "log and staggering them to create a tongue and groove setup, then adhering and stacking them to build my walls up. There is a thread on this site (http://www.small-cabin.com/forum/2_599_0.html) that talks about it and MtnDon actually commented on! Small world! [MtnDon...you are DA MAN! How do you keep your head from popping with all that knowledge man?!!?  :D]

Here are a couple pictures of the way I am wanting to do the corners. I'm looking for opinions and concerns, just be gentle as I'm pretty worked up about it  :-\



Here is a few rough SketchUp's of my template for the house design and layout.



The front porch and bump out roof is 3:12, the front and back dormer roof is 3/12, and the front face is 11/12.

Here is my basic floor plan (sry, havent finished the second floor and am embarrassed to show this, but this will give you an idea of how it looks in my head  :-[)
First Floor walls

Second Floor walls

First floor layout


I'm hoping to be able to pull off a pier foundation for this build, which I'm still "self-educating" myself on.

So far, (when my clicking finger doesnt get tired of SketchUp), my questions are minimal until I get to:

1. how to attach the loft joists to the top plate of the walls?
2. Is it better to cap the wall on the first floor, then do the joists with a rim joist beam (as I have drawn up here..), or is it better to just continue the wall all the way up to the ceiling level of the loft and hang the joists between the two walls for the bedrooms and just have the one beam across the 22' span over the living room?


3. The roof setup. Ya know what... Let's tackle the joist/loft stuff first..  ???


I'm very anxious (like everyone..) to hear everyone's thoughts on all this. I'm not completely opposed to sizing it down, if needed... or if it would be better to just go back to the log method, as I'm not opposed to hard work, and free materials  c*

Look forward to getting to know you all better, and walking this journey with you! Thanks in advance!

Blessings,

-Tom
"the big dumb idiot noob"  d* d* d* d*
« Last Edit: December 19, 2012, 12:18:24 PM by StreamDreamer »

Offline MountainDon

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Re: 24x36 Cabin with 10x14 Bumpout - SE Oklahoma
« Reply #1 on: December 07, 2012, 05:58:40 AM »
Just because something has been done and has not failed, doesn’t mean it is good design.

Offline Don_P

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Re: 24x36 Cabin with 10x14 Bumpout - SE Oklahoma
« Reply #2 on: December 07, 2012, 06:09:19 PM »
Actually, by orienting the plies of boards in opposite directions while laying up large wall sized panels you get the latest trend, CLT, cross laminated timber panels have just been approved in the US and a few buildings are underway. These are factory made glued up panels of criss crossed boards but the original research was into glued or mechanically laminated (nailed) panels. Strengthwise it makes more sense to use the wood that way, and it is no more or less a log building than if the laminations all ran the same way. You could foam over the outside using the timbers' thermal mass inside and put the final ply, the log siding part, outside the foam. If the center plies are using low grade wood up it's probably not as resource consumptive as it might sound, it can be a good way to utilize low grade wood.

Offline StreamDreamer

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Re: 24x36 Cabin with 10x14 Bumpout - SE Oklahoma
« Reply #3 on: December 19, 2012, 09:22:34 AM »
Actually, by orienting the plies of boards in opposite directions while laying up large wall sized panels you get the latest trend, CLT, cross laminated timber panels have just been approved in the US and a few buildings are underway. These are factory made glued up panels of criss crossed boards but the original research was into glued or mechanically laminated (nailed) panels. Strengthwise it makes more sense to use the wood that way, and it is no more or less a log building than if the laminations all ran the same way. You could foam over the outside using the timbers' thermal mass inside and put the final ply, the log siding part, outside the foam. If the center plies are using low grade wood up it's probably not as resource consumptive as it might sound, it can be a good way to utilize low grade wood.

Thanks Don! What a great recommendation! I looked into CLT like you mentioned and the light bulbs went off. Orienting the middle layer of boards vertically makes sooo much more sense. I have no doubt that the strength of the walls would be much better this way, plus running the numbers and changing the middle layer to 2x10's makes is even more less expensive and resource consumptive than the other method. Although I believe the other method to be strong as well, this makes much more sense and I would think it will be "easier" in construction. The wall sections can now all be 12' long by 12-13 rows high and can be placed on the sill plates in sections, which makes the planning and estimations sooo much more accurate. Thanks again for your insight!

    My current estimations for the build (which are almost down to every single board needed) show that I can complete the entire shell (minus the roof system and foundation) with just over 1,200 boards, mostly consisting of 2x8x12's and 2x10x8's. I got a quote from a lumber yard within half an hour of the site and they quoted me at just over $8,000 for all of it! Not too shabby for shelling in a two-storied 24'x36' with a bump-out, if you ask me! And that's if I bought all of it brand new.. which I most likely won't. I'm very big on reclaiming usable resources and saving things from the landfill.
    Rough calculations for the concrete for the piers and floor joists was under $1,000 needing barely over 2 yards of concrete.
The part I'm having a hard time figuring is the math for the pier placement and beam sizes. As it is now, I'm running numbers waaaay over the maximums for code by spacing them almost a full foot closer and almost a full foot less span on the beams, based on a 70 lb snow load (which is ridiculously over what it actually is in SE Oklahoma.. the average annual for the last 50 years is like 2" a year or something). I'm running the numbers this way not only to be sure, but since this is an "outseid the box" method, and I calculate each wall section to be somewhere in the neighborhood of 1,200 lbs each. So, running those numbers, I came up with 3 rows of 9, 8 or 10" piers with triple 2x10 beams.

Thoughts? Any other calculators that might compensate for the increased weight of the walls a little better than my "over-shooting"?

As far as the placement of the bathroom and "office", I intended them to be that way. It's to deter my kiddos from infiltrating our bathroom and using their own for a change! Ha! And the office is Dad's (me) fly fishing/fly tying room... and made it that way so as to minimize disturbances both while I'm in there, and when I'm not. We will have a privy on-site as well to coincide with our composting toilet setups indoors so as far as guests go, there will be plenty of other options. Besides, the location is fairly remote so I don't anticipate weekly barbecues at our dwelling  8)


Thanks guys! Heading out to the site next week to do some marking and site planning.. maybe some clearing as well. REALLY excited!  :D

-Tom

 

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