CountryPlans Forum

Not sure if the funds are going to be there but I can wish can't I?  We had a friend help clear a cabin spot and it was amazing what he could do in a day of work!  His was a John Deere and I think about 50 hp.  It had a thing on the front end that I think is called a grappler.  Basically metal fingers that open and close.  He was able to grab some pretty decent sized logs and such and move them to a common area where we can burn or cut for firewood.   

Do you guys have a tractor you use around your property?  What do you have, how big, what attachments, and are you satisfied with it?  We would probably use it for spreading gravel, moving dirt, bush hogging, etc. 

I see some pretty nice looking 4wd tractors in the 30-40 hp range for 15-20k.

Thanks

You'll get as many opinions as there are folks registered here, but the answer is, it depends.

The quick answer is get a loader tractor with 3 point hitch and at least power steering if not 4wd.

I made 2 mistakes. Didn't get a 4 wheel drive and bought a grey-market (Yanmar). Please don't make those mistakes! I love my little Yanmar but smaller 2 wheel drive tractors are very limited in what they can do and the tractor establishment will treat you like a leper when you have a grey-market tractor.

I bought a Kubota b3200 FEL/BH and it has been invaluable in my cabin building adventure.  From drilling holes, grading, french drains, culverts, moving materials, dirt, trees, brush, etc.  I was just on it for 2 hours today and I could not imagine life without it.  I know that the BH is expensive and everyone says you can just rent one, but when you have one you will realize you use it all the time. hope this helps, good luck.

Mahindra 5010 with FEL (Front End Loader) for $19,900 (can't beat that!) -- it's 50hp and 4wd

Have a 60" brush hog, 72" box blade and a boom. Also picked up a set of old disks that seem to work well enough for what I need them for.

Love the Mahindra and the price :D

Quote from: Davegmc on May 06, 2013, 01:09:17 PM
I made 2 mistakes. Didn't get a 4 wheel drive and bought a grey-market (Yanmar). Please don't make those mistakes! I love my little Yanmar but smaller 2 wheel drive tractors are very limited in what they can do and the tractor establishment will treat you like a leper when you have a grey-market tractor.

By grey market do you mean off brand?  I thought Yanmar was a pretty popular tractor.  John Deere, New Holland, and Kubota are the big players I've see around here.  I've seen a few Mahindras on Craigslist.

Are all the attachments universal as far as fit or are they brand specific?

Yanmar makes John Deere (just most don't realize that)....

If any tractor is 'made in America' any longer I'm not aware of it though I heard recently that Mahindra is claiming that (didn't hear them say it though)...I know the FEL for my Mahindra was made in the USA though :)

John Deere's were too spendy for less power and not actually 'made in America' any longer so after over a year of research I went with the NUMBER ONE selling tractor in the world (your read that right):  Mahindra.

Quote from: grover on May 06, 2013, 04:43:20 PM
By grey market do you mean off brand? 

Grey market vehicles were never officially imported by the manufacturer and parts availability can be problematic

Quote from: OlJarhead on May 06, 2013, 05:04:26 PM
Yanmar makes John Deere (just most don't realize that)....

At one time Yanmar made all of the small Deere tractors, now they supply engines to Deere and are tied in with Cub Cadet for complete tractors

I really wanted a green tractor, but the comparable tractor in orange was 2500 dollars less, so I went with the orange.  I am very very happy with mine.  I think a tractor is definitely something that is needed, at least in my application.

You have some good responses so far.  Here are my thoughts:

Cabs keep you out of the weather and make the workday seem shorter
Four wheel drive adds about 10 hp to the tractor size
Front end loaders are a must
Remote hydraulics give you more options on the back
Hydrostatic transmission works better with a loader than a manual
Ag tractors seem to be built more durable
Consider implement options: rotary cutters, augers eyc
A good used tractor works too. Do you homework and do not pay too much for it.
Every tractor I have bought has held its value

I live in a farming community and have found Service readily available for my John Deere.

Good luck,
Tom

I find my geared 5010 is great with the FEL.  I've seen a lot of folks suggest Hydro is better for FEL work but then when you want to run something like a bailer it beats the hydro off the rig.

Quote from: Tome on May 07, 2013, 09:00:18 PM
You have some good responses so far.  Here are my thoughts:

Cabs keep you out of the weather and make the workday seem shorter
Four wheel drive adds about 10 hp to the tractor size
Front end loaders are a must
Remote hydraulics give you more options on the back
Hydrostatic transmission works better with a loader than a manual
Ag tractors seem to be built more durable
Consider implement options: rotary cutters, augers eyc
A good used tractor works too. Do you homework and do not pay too much for it.
Every tractor I have bought has held its value

I live in a farming community and have found Service readily available for my John Deere.

Good luck,
Tom

What do you mean it adds 10hp to the tracor size.  Does that mean if I thought I wanted a 40hp then I need to look for a 50 hp?

No he means a 40hp 4wd is like having a 50hp 2wd :)

Thanks Jarhead, that makes sense.  I'm not really sure what HP I should be looking for and I don't really know a lot about tractors.  I do want to go used if possible so I think I need to do some more research before buying.  I also have someone in mind I could take with me if I find something I'm interested in.   

Quote from: grover on May 08, 2013, 08:00:14 PM
Thanks Jarhead, that makes sense.  I'm not really sure what HP I should be looking for and I don't really know a lot about tractors.  I do want to go used if possible so I think I need to do some more research before buying.  I also have someone in mind I could take with me if I find something I'm interested in.

Trouble with used -- and the reason we didn't go that route -- is that they aren't much cheaper.  Tractors are at a premium and a 20 year old tractor typically sells for the price it was 20 years ago....

So, I was looking at the 30-35hp range (glad I didn't do that!) and saw many NH's that were used but THE SAME price as new!!!  So I looked and looked and finally concluded that if I could afford new I wasn't losing.  Sure there are deals to be found if one spends a lot of time looking and is ready with cash in hand to pounce but we didn't want to wait and could get more with the low interest rates we were seeing (some were 0% over 60 months!!!)....in the end I had been looking at a 35hp Mahindra (3 diff dealers) that was $18,900 but went with TWICE the tractor in the 50hp 5010 for $19,900.

When seeing the little 35hp tractor next to the utility 5010 I knew I didn't want the little one (made that mistake with an ATV once).....

Now when I want to drag 2000lbs of tree out of the woods I don't bat an eye...nor do I when I want to lift the lumber from a 1200bs log with the tractor ;)  Plow snow?  No problem!  Brush hog?  Easy peasy...pull your house down the block?  Yup, it will do that :D

Not saying everyone needs a big 50horse machine but I'm sure glad we have one :D

FWIW ---   My ex- always said that a 4wd tractor could get by with less HP than a 2wd tractor for the same job because it could get the power to the ground better.  ??? I dunno, I'm just regurgitating what he swore by.  And as a side note IF a front end loader was in the picture then 4wd was a must as the rear gets too light for traction on a 2wd with a full bucket. I think he said the HP needed was dependent on the width of the inplements being pulled.

I have a Deere 4120 with a FEL and 485 backhoe (Deere Powertech motor).  It will do anything I ask it to.  It is 4wd (must have with a FEL).  Power reverser (really want to have when loading).  Great tractor.  I had a Kubota L3010 before and it was fine.  It was not much compared to the Deere though.  My neighbor has the Deere 3320 and loves it (yanmar motor).  It has the same backhoe as mine and can do amazing amounts of work.  Mahindra makes a good tractor.  They will lift a lot of weight with their FELs but at about 1/2 the speed of Deere and Kubota.  Keep that in mind.  Buy a big brand and you will be happy.  Buy a grey market and you will get your work done.  It may just take a little longer and may require more effort.

Being relatively new to tractors, I can't offer long-term experience and the wisdom that comes with it, but I'll share a few thoughts.

Lurk at www.tractorbynet.com .
Figure out what you think your needs/uses are and will be.
Rent a tractor with some or all of the implements you think you'll want/need.
After using one, you'll have an idea of what that size can and can't do.
With that experience, re-evaluate how you might use a tractor of your own.
Research, research, research!
For a lot of things, bigger is better...but not all!
Find out which brands are close to you and get recommendations as to who is a good dealer.
Factor in whether or not you have a truck/trailer combo that is capable of hauling it to the dealer for service.  If you don't, and you're not going to be doing everything yourself, then realize that you'll be charged for travel time for service at your property.
As someone else said, many people will recommend renting a backhoe vs. buying, but you may find that you foresee lots of random projects/maintenance that will pop up periodically and can't be consolidated into one short term rental period.  I splurged for a backhoe.  Yes, it hurt!
Personally, I wouldn't even consider a 2wd.  4wd is a must on my property due to wet, uneven, hilly ground.
Your property will dictate your needs to a large degree.  One size fits all advice doesn't always fit.  For example, the Kubota L3200 I bought is the largest machine I'd want for my uses due to lots of tight areas.  Too big of a machine would make access difficult in some areas.  Are there times when more power and more weight would be useful?  Sure, but I feel I chose the right size for my overall usage.
Box scrapers are amazingly useful.
With more time, I could probably think of all sorts of stuff, but that's it for now.  Good luck!

I grew up on a small farm and we had a little 50 HP Deere 2WD, you can get yourself unstuck with the bucket out of just about anything.  It worked pretty well.  I just financed a Bobcat CT235 for a customer, they just started making the farm style compacts in 2008, I think from speaking with the local dealer about them.  I believe it is a 4WD, but not sure.  They sell for about $20k new and this one used was only $8k w/o attachments wholesale-what you would pay from an individual.  I thought that was a pretty reasonable price for what you get.  They seem to be pretty solid; I would guess that they are mainly subcontracted or licensed through another manufacturer, but that is just a guess.  That may be another brand to consider. 

I bought a used (slightly at 103 hours) diesel  (30 HP) JD 855 4wd hydrostatic drive with FEL

A nice feature is the FEL can be removed easily and quickly (about 5 minutes)

It is a compact tractor that runs a 6 foot rototiller and a 5 foot brush hog just fine

The compact size is very helpful for getting into tight places -- we have been using the heck out of it unloading the truck --really saves my back 

Highly recommended

I find it is my tractor of choice over my 3400 Ford with FEL because it is so much easier to use and can do virtually everything the Ford can


(https://i55.photobucket.com/albums/g135/Crockette/IMG_0216.jpg) (https://s55.photobucket.com/user/Crockette/media/IMG_0216.jpg.html)

Hey Grover.  NO ONE can answer the question of what kind of tractor you need but you.

-The first thing you need to do is be honest with yourself and decide what you need the tractor for.  Will you be pulling stumps and rocks?  Landscaping around the house?  Tilling fields? Clearing snow?  mowing grass? maintaining road?  Answer that question first an that will help me narrow down the machine you need, construction type backhoe loader or farm tractor.  There IS a difference.

Answer that question and we can move on to question 2....

Not sure if I really NEED one but I WANT one.  I would use it to pull fallen trees out of the woods or use the bucket to transport the wood to the cabin.  It would be used to level and maintain the gravel road, bush hogging.  Or I could use the money to buy an extra 5 acres next to me.  Oops, then I would really need a tractor d*

Buy the land next to you. :)  Rent a tractor as needed. ;)  Best of both worlds.

Quote from: grover on May 29, 2013, 08:16:26 PM
Not sure if I really NEED one but I WANT one.  I would use it to pull fallen trees out of the woods or use the bucket to transport the wood to the cabin.  It would be used to level and maintain the gravel road, bush hogging.  Or I could use the money to buy an extra 5 acres next to me.  Oops, then I would really need a tractor d*

Yup, sounds like a farm type tractor is what you need.  I would have suggested a construction loader/backhoe if you were going to be doing any digging.  IMHO farm tractors with backhoes are not worth the time or cost but it sounds like a TPH with various attachments is what you need.  In that case 4WD would be a good idea.  I'd be looking in the 40HP class or higher.

I know this thread is old... but I was just wondering if Grover ever did buy a tractor.

[ThreadJack]

I am also wondering about what kind of tractor to get, and if I really need one versus just want one.
Part of me wants a crawler to dozer the land, and I can find some old machines for relatively cheap... but most of the time the transportation fees are insane.  I think a farm tractor, that has the PTO 3-point would give me the best of both worlds.  I can rent a trailer with ramps from UHaul and as long as the weight is under what my truck can pull safely then it's only $50 for transport.

I want to find something with a loader, just to make things easier on the land.  My land was de-forested, and it hard to walk through due to logs and brush and stones all over the place.  It is 7.5 acres (almost square) so doing it all by hand is tough work.  I wonder, can you actually dig at all with a loader?  The land is relatively flat, but after moving some big stones and tree stumps, there will be some leveling to do... 

Since cash flow is very low after buying the land, I am looking at 1940's-1960's farm tractors.  I see a few here and there around the $1000 mark, which is right around where I want to be, factoring in $500 or so for the extras like changing old hoses etc.

(https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/3f/0f/fb/3f0ffb4dd01cce1fdbe5c1dde8e81741.jpg)

If they have been working for the past 75 years, figure they will still last another few years?
Other option is to go a bit more expensive, bit bigger machine, and once the land is done then sell it to recoup some of my investment.

[/ThreadJack]

Hi Adam. Parts availability is something to consider. I can't say I've seen a working tractor for 1K.  Whatever you might find in that price area you can assume it will need a lot of work. Mostly what is available in that price range is scrap. 

It seems a rebuilt tractor with low hours and in decent shape like a Yanmar or Mitsubishi, with 4WD and a loader would be in the 10-20 K range.  For the kind of work you describe, I'm not sure that the low horsepower older 2wd tractors like the Ford 8n, would be up to the task. I'd be thinking 28HP+ or even much higher.  A loader is not a bulldozer or grader!

If you are going to be pulling stumps, boulders, or skidding, find out what the loader lift capacity is.  Those smaller ones may only be able to lift 800 pounds!

My neighbor has a 115HP 4WD Deere and he uses it to maintain the road with a box blade and for harrowing.  It gets stuck from time to time.

Hi,  appreciate the feedback.

I was considering renting some equipment, but at $250+ per day for small machines, factor in the transport and possibly not being allowed to rent due to lack of permits or training documentation... makes it a bit hard.  I was hoping an older machine, while not in perfect condition, I can at least work at a more reasonable pace and not worry about the lack of time.

All of the ads I am seeing for $1000 - $2500 say they are daily workers...  while I am sure they are not in mint condition, I figured they were at least working machines...  I guess I would have to see them working, and get a feel for how the owner is. 

Why I was considering the farm tractor, besides the lower weight for transport, is because my best friend who also has land 1/2 mile away has an old Oliver, along with the mower attachment so we figured we could share and I could get a rake or whatever and just share as needed.  His was also in the same price range, and it was working good for the past 2 years but the gas cap somehow let in water last winter and the gas tank completely rusted out.  He is cleaning and treating the tank this winter and will probably get the old Oliver back up and running this summer.  They also have a couple dozers and a loader... although they are all being worked on.  So I get what you are saying, even a "working" machine will need repairs.  $10-20k purchase price puts it out of range.

Do you know if the rental companies will rent to just anyone?
Do they also provide trailers?  I could borrow a Ford F-350 to pull it... but don't have a trailer.

I started that way.  Was going to buy a used Massey but the more I researched the more I realized I was just as well off buying new considering what I needed.  Used tractors weren't much cheaper unless they were in need of a lot of work, had a lot less power and were 2wd which in my case wouldn't work.

I can get a tracked bobcat delivered and picked up for $750/week here. Unlimited hours, your kidneys will tell you when  ::).

If it has a loader or if you intend on one look at the size of the front spindles. On something like an 8N or my old Massey 35 if you work a loader in that environment you'll be looking for spindles.

I'd beat the rental equipment up and then buy a small tractor if needed to tend it.

Although to be honest, I'd have already been standing in the shop door holding a new tank  ;)

I have an early '80's Kubota 2850, 4wd, loader on front, 3-point on the back.  I have a blade, a rake and a bush hog for that.  I've always found it to be the perfect size for working in the woods (I cut my own firewood) and does a great job of snowplowing.  It can sit for months and start at the first turn of the key.  I have an in-line heater in one of the radiator lines that I plug in in the winter when I know I'm going to use it.  Helps a great deal in that easy starting.  I also make sure to put conditioner in the diesel fuel to keep it from jelling, etc.    Remains the best 13,000 I ever spent (bought used back in the '90's sometime.

Gary

I'm in the market for a tractor too. We have 7 acres of woods and a long gravel drive. The only two purposes I really have is maintaining the drive and pulling small trees out of the woods for processing. I want to thin the woods, and will be cutting a lot of trees that are 8" or smaller for firewood. Currently, I'm regrading the driveway with an old Gravely walk-behind, and I swear it's more work than just using a shovel!

Around here, 4WD seems to be standard, especially with a loader. We have red clay that gets slick when wet. No one uses a skid steer on tires; they are all on tracks. My issue is money, plain and simple. There simple isn't $10K+ available. I'll probably just get an older tractor in usable condition, and choose my battles. It would probably be worth my while to just rent a tracked skid steer from time to time for the heavy work.

Old tractors are dirt (pun intended) cheap around here. You can get a good running old tractor for $1500; sometimes less if you're willing to do a little work on it. The big issue I see with used tractors is tires. If the tires are totally shot, you can double the price of a bargain tractor by the time you put 4 tires on it. Tractor tires have gotten crazy expensive in recent years.

I am looking at exact that scenario right now. 
I need a tractor, something under my 3500 lb weight limit of my truck, with PTO 3-point and a loader.
I am looking at a 1954 Ford NAA, small tractor but runs well.  Problem is the rear tires don't have much left on them, and they have chains on them right now.

How well do chains work in the mud?  I am not doing a lot of work, mostly cleaning a 7.5 acre lot of deforested land.  Need to move a few tons of rock and left over logs and debris.  By hand it will take me years.  I can get this thing for around $1500, have a make-shift cabin on it so I can have some sun protection while I work...  just not sure if I will get stuck in the mud constantly.

(http://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/NjAwWDgwMA==/z/8I0AAOSw2GlXEiar/$_27.JPG)

I've been in the market for awhile too.

I think there are a few problems with those older tractors. Most of what I'm saying are just things my FIL (farmer) has told me.

The older tractors don't have the hydraulics to run a lot of stuff. I think one test is to see if the loader can lift the front of the tractor at, or just above, idle.
Parts.. some of those old models you might not be able to find parts for. This can be true for all brands.
Older diesel tractors will not start in cold weather without a block heater. The old gassers don't have as much power, but you can start them all winter.


It is kind of ridiculous how much tractors cost. Even a beater can cost $5k.. more than I spend on my cars. I'm not sure how people that don't earn income from their land justify purchasing a new compact tractor (with implements) in the 20-30-40k range.

Sometimes I also think 4wd is a double edged sword. It makes you do things you shouldn't be doing in the first place. If the land is really muddy, I think it's better to just wait for good weather.

That said, if you have a couple hundred pounds of stone in your bucket, your rear tires are going to have very little traction.

Thanks for the feedback, food for thought for sure.

Currently the PTO is capped off, and they have a bucket attached to the 3-point filled with cement.
I was planning to go see it, as soon as the seller can confirm that when uncapped the PTO is working.  He said it was, but needed to remove the counterweight to be able to show me so he needed some time to get it ready.

I know what you mean about the money factor.  I bought the land for $6000.  I go up only in the summer, and if I am lucky every 2nd the 3rd weekend, just for a day or 1/2 day depending on what other stuff is happening that weekend.  If I go by hand, 4 hours every 3 weeks, I estimate 22 years and 7 months before the lot is clear of debris (just an estimate).  I am willing to "suffer" with being stuck sometimes, or needing to take smaller loads if it means not doing things completely by hand.  But my budget of $1500 is about all I can see ever investing in this considering the amount of usage it will see.  $25,000 for 20 hours or work per year is just not sensible for me.

Tractors are amazing, the torque produced will get you out of trouble in the mud a lot more often than you think unless, of course, you get too deep into it.

Chains will help, but I'd just get new tires -- that's just me.

Old tractors do great, get some logging chains and cables and you can yank a lot of logs out of muddy spots without getting the tractor too deep into it or get a winch for skidding logs out that way...so many options.

Quote from: Adam Roby on April 24, 2016, 09:43:35 AM
Thanks for the feedback, food for thought for sure.

Currently the PTO is capped off, and they have a bucket attached to the 3-point filled with cement.
I was planning to go see it, as soon as the seller can confirm that when uncapped the PTO is working.  He said it was, but needed to remove the counterweight to be able to show me so he needed some time to get it ready.

I know what you mean about the money factor.  I bought the land for $6000.  I go up only in the summer, and if I am lucky every 2nd the 3rd weekend, just for a day or 1/2 day depending on what other stuff is happening that weekend.  If I go by hand, 4 hours every 3 weeks, I estimate 22 years and 7 months before the lot is clear of debris (just an estimate).  I am willing to "suffer" with being stuck sometimes, or needing to take smaller loads if it means not doing things completely by hand.  But my budget of $1500 is about all I can see ever investing in this considering the amount of usage it will see.  $25,000 for 20 hours or work per year is just not sensible for me.

Yep I hear ya and 1500 doesnt represent a huge investment.

I cleared out a bunch of spruce trees last fall and am still working on carrying them to where I want the logs stacked. If I had a tractor it would take an hour to do the whole job. If I don't find something this summer I'm also going to be carrying around 2 full cords by hand. That's going to be fun.

Also if I had a PTO driven chipper it would take a fraction of the time that the little gasser chipper I'm trying to use has taken.

Again, thanks to both for the valuable feedback.

My buddy has a place 3 minutes up the road and has the lawn mower attachment for the PTO, so we can share accessories which is great.

How does it work in NY state for tractors driving on the roads.  Here in Quebec, where I will likely make the purchase and bring it to my land in NY, nobody seems to have the registration papers anymore for these things (back from the 50's).  Will a trooper pull me over if I am driving on the side of the road?  I will make sure I conform to all state lighting laws etc, but if I don't have the paperwork... is it even worth buying it?

Quote from: Adam Roby on April 24, 2016, 01:35:15 PM
Again, thanks to both for the valuable feedback.

My buddy has a place 3 minutes up the road and has the lawn mower attachment for the PTO, so we can share accessories which is great.

How does it work in NY state for tractors driving on the roads.  Here in Quebec, where I will likely make the purchase and bring it to my land in NY, nobody seems to have the registration papers anymore for these things (back from the 50's).  Will a trooper pull me over if I am driving on the side of the road?  I will make sure I conform to all state lighting laws etc, but if I don't have the paperwork... is it even worth buying it?

Might want to look by county. In my county it is 'right to farm' which means you can drive tractors on the roads. I would be really surprised if you had any trouble driving a tractor anywhere in upstate, though.

My wife is Canadian and we have looked at buying at tractor in Canada then crossing the border with it. When we called, they said all we needed was a bill of sale and that the tractor should be clean. There are no extra import taxes because we don't earn income off the land. That is a federal thing. You might want to check to see if it matters that you're Canadian.

For anyone still looking for a tractor, I agree that generally speaking, a lot of used tractors sell for almost as much as a new one, but not always.

My 3 recommendations for buying used are:

1) Do your research; know what you want and the minimum tractor setup that you are willing to settle for
and the going prices.
2) Have your cash readily available.
3) Be diligent in checking all available ads, Craigslist, newspaper, Thrifty Nickel, etc.

Then, when that super bargain comes along, jump on it before it's gone, because it won't last long.
When I bought my tractor, I had been looking for over a year, and was starting to consider buying new
when I saw the ad for this Kubota.
By doing my homework, I knew it was a real bargain and it had everything that I wanted except
hydrostatic drive.
It was a Kubota L4200, 45 Hp, 4wd, loader, R4 tires, 3 sets of rear wheel weights, 2 rear
hydraulic remotes, just 700 hours, all for the grand total of $8000.

Now, you don't find a deal like that every day, but what I'm saying is that
sometimes patience pays off when used tractor shopping.

Arky

My thought process on this keeps evolving. I originally thought I would get an old tractor and tinker with it, but the old tractors I see aren't much good with a FEL. The loaders themselves are very weak, and the front ends of those old farm tractors weren't designed for a lot of extra weight. My budget has improved, and I think I can get what I want for under $10K. I could probably get by with 20-25 hp and 4WD, but I'd like to find something bigger, more like 30-35 hp. From what I hear about gas versus diesel, diesel is much better for equipment that might sit for months at a time. I'm constantly fixing my gas operated equipment that sits a little too long with gas in the tank and carb. I have a friend who had a Kubota of about 35 hp and 4WD, and I was amazed how much work it could do.

Here is where I stand at the moment.  The green tractor has no papers so I can't drive it on the street, no point.

Option 1:  1952 Massey Harris Colt
Cons:  It is gas, I'd prefer diesel.  It is quite rusty, but can be painted.  It is the oldest of the bunch, harder to find parts.
Pros: Asking price is only $1700.  It is close enough to drive over the border, which will save a few hundred in transport fees.
Label:  Most affordable model.

(https://i1034.photobucket.com/albums/a429/adamrobillard/My%20Land/MasseyHarrisColt1952_zpsm8ndbhru.jpg) (https://s1034.photobucket.com/user/adamrobillard/media/My%20Land/MasseyHarrisColt1952_zpsm8ndbhru.jpg.html)


Option 2: 1971 International B-275
Cons: Asking $2500 negotiable. It has an issue with the arm, owner says it is hard to raise, needs replacing.  Transport will be pricey. It is also quite banged up.
Pros:  It is diesel.  It is the newest of the bunch, parts are likely more readily available.
Label:  Newest Model

(https://i1034.photobucket.com/albums/a429/adamrobillard/My%20Land/InternationalB275_1971_zpsyd5c7q3b.jpg) (https://s1034.photobucket.com/user/adamrobillard/media/My%20Land/InternationalB275_1971_zpsyd5c7q3b.jpg.html)


Option 3: 1963 David Brown 880
Data:  It is right in the middle age wise.
Cons:  Asking $2500 firm.  One tire has a slow leak.  Looks like the arm was welded?  Have to see in person.
Pros: It is diesel.  From a dealer.  I can do payments, and they can likely delivery free of charge or I can negotiate that at least.
Label:  Dealer Model

(https://i1034.photobucket.com/albums/a429/adamrobillard/My%20Land/DavidBrown880_1963_zpsesaln8yj.jpg) (https://s1034.photobucket.com/user/adamrobillard/media/My%20Land/DavidBrown880_1963_zpsesaln8yj.jpg.html)


I know most would not go this old or this cheap, but this is where my budget lies.  Out of these 3, which looks like the most potential, least headaches?

Hey Adam have you thought about just hiring out an excavator for a day? Up in your area you could probably get a guy to do work all day for <$700. I think you'll spend less money, have less headaches and end up with a good result.

I think that in that $2k range you can get some good older tractors (Ford 8n, Massey 35 or 135).. but they really aren't meant to have loaders on them. Even if they have one, you are really going to push them past their limit by moving heavy stone. I was talking to a guy about his Ford 1700 (I Think? 27hp from the late 80s), a beefy tractor by all accounts with 4wd, he said the most that tractor could handle was 800lbs in the bucket. Not hard to find stones that weigh more than that...

Anyways that's just my two cents.. those old tractors are meant for farming not heavy duty site work.

Found a 1987 Belarus for $3000... might go have a look this week.  Looks big!
(http://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/MTIwMFgxNjAw/z/OVcAAOSwjMJXCnNA/$_27.JPG)

I had all but decided to just rent an excavator this spring, so I saved up abound $1000 cash to do so.
The thing is, I am not really sure what I want to do.  I am kind of winging it as I go.  If I blow the whole thing on a long weekend, I might do everything like I might only get 20 feet of road done.  I have never driven one before, no clue what even I want to do. 

Buying a tractor has a couple of purposes. 
1)  Get the work done at my own pace (might take 5 years). 
2)  Have a tractor to maintain the land afterwards (with lawnmower attachment and such). 
3)  Have some fun!  Its like a big Tonka truck, I want to play in the dirt!

Are parts available for the 87 Belarus? The tires look in good shape.

My 2 cents worth. I don't own a tractor, but have always been a bit of a tractor enthusiast, and have worked on them a bit.

Old tractors from the 40's and 50's are my favorite, but lately I have gotten a bit spooked about them not having any rollover protection. When I was a kid my farmer neighbor got crushed by a tractor and it was bad stuff.

All of the tractors you are considering would make me nervous for one reason or another. Mostly because they are brands that I never heard of, or only in the context of odd collector interest. Which doesn't mean they're bad, but finding parts could be a real nightmare. Now, maybe in Quebec the brands you are considering are very common.

The exception would be the International, which I am familiar with, of course. But that one seems real iffy. Bad arm? Does he mean the hydraulic part? Or the structural part? Either could be a real pain and $$$. Also, if it's a bit trashed, what's the diesel like? Nothing worse than a problem diesel, IMO. Gas I can usually tinker with and get running, but diesel is a whole different set of challenges, and potentially really expensive to fix. Like more than what you paid for the tractor.

I would probably recommend avoiding any older diesel. Might just be my personal prejudice.

If I were looking for an old farm tractor, I would stick with Deere, Ford, or IH/Farmall, just because of parts. Maybe Case or Allis, too. I think Farmall would be the best bang for your buck. I see them all over the place, and pretty cheap. And I have a soft spot for them. But it seems like Deeres are $$$. And I think a lot of guys like their old Fords, so they can be $$$.

A trashed tractor can be a real nightmare. But a good solid old one can be had pretty cheap and can be very reliable if you know what to look for and have some mechanical skills.

Have fun! I am eager to hear what you end up with.

David

Thanks for that advice, really appreciate it.  At the moment I am just looking at the cost standpoint, so the "experience" factor with different brands and what to look out for are helpful.  One really nice one came up on a Tuesday.  I called and there was already someone coming to see it that Friday.  I asked if I could come on Thursday, the seller was a bit reluctant since he already promised the other guy but then said OK.  He called me back the next day, it was sold.  I believe that one was an International...  didn't jump fast enough.  Now I have the cash ready, just waiting for the deal to come up.  Already have a transporter lined up, and I called the border and they recommended I transport to the border and I drive it across the line... otherwise I need all kinds of import paperwork to be done.

I will definitely post what I get when I get it... can't wait. 

I've been able to get a number of parts for my 60 year old MF35 from ASAP (All States Ag Parts), they carry a number of brands and run several scrapyards. I would want at least a 135 if it were to have a loader but when I look at the new stuff I wonder how many will be running in 60 years... and can be field stripped and back running usually in short order.

I've had the bobcat from work here this week... I'll have to go back to work next week so I can heal up  :D but man that thing is handy.

For me, I'll take a skid steer (bobcat, or other brand) over a tractor any day.  But then I don'thave any fields to tend, butwould like tomove dirt, dig,etc....

For sure a skid steer would be fun... but who has $25,000 - $60,000 spare cash for a used one?
They are wayyyyy too pricey for my blood.

I'm seeing a number of used skidsteers under $10K around here, but at that price, they scare me. For what I want, they would be great. I want to do some landscape work, grade my driveway, and haul trees out of the woods to process into firewood. I'm just worried about what kind of costs I could get into if (when) the thing breaks. I also see fairly large loader/backhoes under $10K, but the same concerns apply.

My neighbor has a Case he paid $8500 for 6 years ago.  No large repairs to date. Not used every day.

This one is a beater, 2 owners off rental, $7500, bucket, forks and remotes. It's ugly and could use a few hundred in parts but should have another few thousand hours in it. The Case 1845cummins is a tough, very common, machine.

My neighbors is an 1840  ;D

Whatever I get won't get much usage- probably 100 hours a year, although the first year will probably be a lot more. :D Is there any way to tell if something major, such as the hydraulic pump is getting ready to fail? Would a heavy equipment repair guy be able to asses one (for a fee) like when you bring a used car to a mechanic? I don't mind doing basic repairs and maintenance- hoses, cylinders, valves, etc., but if a major part or engine went, you'd have a heavy paperweight.

I took my new (used) truck to my mechanic. Seems like a good machine, should be fine for several years.  Both front half shafts, engine, transmission, fuel pump and lines... and I hope its good for several years now. Just sayin, it's what they miss... and I do need to switch mechanics unfortunately. For hydraulics an infrared thermometer would probably see major internal wicked bad blowby as a hot spot, then typical engine check/ roll of the dice. Check the chain drives on each side to see if they are full of oil, nothing... or water. Hit full revs and check against factory, if you can redline it from the cab, someone has. This one has too long a belt on what looks like a new alternator, I found it when the battery died, easy fix, I assume the new alt had a smaller pulley, somebody got in a hurry and forgot to get a new belt. The tilt pedal sticks. The owner thought it was a feature...  d* it's a kinked cable and it'll stick and roll it basswards if he gets in the wrong place and it sticks tilting. It looks like it'll probably take opening the cab so a long weekend once we round that up.  They are pretty simple if pre computer but parts can add up quick.

I guess the first thing you should ask yourself is what am I going to use it for.  I didn't go new on mine but it serves me well.  I have a 50HP Deutz Allis ( other green) w/ front loader bucket.  For me 4WD was a must.  Then there is the "green machines" which probably are a little over rated and price is paying for the flying deer symbol.  But... if you are searching for a small compact utility tractor they have some pretty good deals.  Not the biggest but some 4wd packages have mower decks, back hoe and front loader bucket for around $10K.  Several attachments can be added. Seems like New Holland in getting really popular as well considering the price comparison w/ the deer.  Massey Ferguson has those as well.  Just checking here 25HP compact utility w/ bucket 200hours 2009 for $10,500.

I would stay away from Belarus too many problems.  Zetor was a hit early in the 70's but had problems with hoses and seals. But they were purchased by John Deere so that might have changed.  I would check out my dealers "used" selection.  A lot of times tractors are traded just because of lack of HP by the owners shortly after buying.  Plus they would offer a warranty period if anything did develop.  Some of the new equipment requires a larger HP rating so those with the under rated HP tractors will trade up to gain that needed HP. 

Don't let the price be your deciding factor.

I'm going to an auction this weekend looking for a backhoe, and they have some tractors for sale:

http://www.teitsworth.com/items/live-auctions/?az_feed_pos=www.auctionzip.com%2Fcgi-bin%2Fauctionview.cgi%3Flid%3D2683909%26feed%3D129%26group%3D0%26state%3D%26kwd%3D%26zip%3D%26category%3D0%26nojava%3D0

Probably a bit of a haul for you, and it could cost $500+ to get it delivered, but supposedly there are some great deals to be had at this auction.

Anyone else in Upstate NY looking for stuff, they have a bunch of Bobcats, tractors, dump trucks, and other cool machines listed. I doubt I'll find a backhoe in my price range, though.

It sounds like you are eager to get something ASAP, but I vote for waiting to find just the right one at just the right price.

Good luck.

David

I am eager to get working, but at the same time I want to be sure I get what I need.
I think 40 HP would be around what I need.  I think 2WD would be fine, the land is flat and dry in the summer months.
I need a bucket that can lift rocks that I can't... and after back surgery that isn't very heavy before I hit my limit.  Anything too big will just be pushed to the side.  The skid steer does look like fun;  after checking the first time I later found a used one for $6k... but don't really trust it.  Besides, I need the PTO and 3-point in back for the grass cutter attachment to maintain the lot afterwards.  I guess I could get a riding mower... but anyway.

This Oliver came up, and after only 40 minutes of being posted (when I first saw it) already had 325 hits!

(http://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/NjAwWDgwMA==/z/s9wAAOSwvFZW7ZZ~/$_27.JPG)

Quote
Olivier 550 GAZ 1970 2600 hrs
Pelle, moteur refait en 2008
Mécanique A1 rien a faire dessus
Alternateur , Starteur , carburateur
Fils de bougies , pointes , silencieux neufs
Bon pneux
Chaîne Incluse

Translated:
Shovel and motor rebuilt in 2008
New alternator, starter, carburator, spark plug wires, points, and muffler.
Good tires, includes chains.  And it looks like a 6-8' scraper included.

They are asking $3000.  Doubt it will sit very long... I think I'd rather a diesel though, still might go see it.  1 hr 45 minute drive to go see.

(345 hits in the last 20 minutes)

... oh, I was wondering about going to an auction.  My fear would be to get caught up in the bidding and wind up going way over what I wanted to spend.  I guess it can go either way depending on the day... might look to see if there is one a bit closer to home.

Parts might be a problem with the Oliver.  I just think that's so important. One failure of a part that cannot be found, and the tractor becomes very expensive scrap. Think engine, drive train and PTO part replacement. If you know you can find the parts, great, otherwise...

Ford, New Holland, Deere, MF, Case, Kubuta, Yanmar, Mitsubishi.  Parts are available for those, though the older the tractor, the more difficult to source...

That might be a good idea, figure out what are the most common parts to fail, then when I see something interesting I first check to see if I can find all those parts easily before even going to see the tractor.  Like the Belarus... I was able to find the hydraulic pump pretty easily, but I didn't look for anything else... a few too many people telling me to stay away so I probably will.

I had forgotten the back, scratch the bobcat, you get pounded pretty hard compared to a tractor.
The saying around here about the Zetor's was that once you buy one, it's yours, the Belarus had about the same reputation.

I found a pretty nice Massey Ferguson 250 with a loader yesterday. $7K, and it's pretty nice, not beat. It's around 1985, diesel, 40 hp, 2WD, and weighs around 5K not including the loader. There are a lot of M-F around here; must be a strong dealer presence. I'm going to see if I can get a mechanic to look at it with me, as I know nothing about diesels. After thinking about skidsteers, I remembered how badly they tear up the ground when maneuvering.

That is a good point, I like to have one to use periodically but they are hard on the land.
Of course I guessed wrong on belt size so the skidsteer was down yesterday but I had picked up the Hilti and chisel bits from work so loaded the generator in the truck and went down to continue to worry the big rock by the drive... its hurt... but so am I  :D
Reading the recommendations here it does show some regional preferences. I think it is more uniform now but in the older stuff especially MF does seem popular in the southeast, Olivers, David Browns where the middle of the country is Deere green with AC's and Minnie Mo's, so I guess aside from advice here watch what's running around you, that speaks to parts and knowledge. For smallholders the old Gravely's do an impressive amount of work and there were quite a few attachments. I've worked one with chains and a 4' blade grading out piles of dirt in a yard. A single radial engine jug and a model A transmission, darn near indestructible.

Quote from: MushCreek on May 15, 2016, 05:48:58 AM
I found a pretty nice Massey Ferguson 250 with a loader yesterday....and weighs around 5K not including the loader.

That's a nice tractor.  There are a lot of them around here as well.  Same specs doing a quick check I am seeing $7500 so seems like a good price range comparison.

Does anyone know how much a loader adds to the weight? 
The TractorData (http://www.tractordata.com/farm-tractors/000/7/6/761-massey-ferguson-250.html) website shows that MF at  4585 to 5760 pounds.  I guess it depends on what options you've added, but when estimating the freight cost, I'm not sure a loader fits into those weight limits, or maybe they do? 

Seems I can rent a skidsteer for $308 for a weekend straight from Bobcat of Plattsburgh NY.
Does anyone know if they also deliver/pickup, and how much extra that could be?
Do they rent to civilians or only businesses generally?
Do they require you take some lessons or get permits first?
Would you recommend I try to rent one of these first, then evaluate my tractor needs afterwards?

Once the weather is a bit warmer at night, I could go up to the land with my popup camper and stay for the entire weekend.  The weekend rental would get used as much as my body could handle it.  I would like an excavator at one point also...  maybe 1 weekend could do everything I want, maybe I would be right back where I started... no clue.  I think the best option is to go there and talk to them directly.

They'll rent to you, no lessons but they will show you the basics. After that it just takes time for your body to train to it. You'll have to ask whether that included delivery. If you have a list of prioritized tasks to work down you won't regret it either way. Get them to drop forks and a bucket if you can, the forks come in handy. If there's stuff you need to move get it up on pallets if possible and just scoop and drop. The hilti chuck is jammed solid with rock dust and I'm not the least bit sympathetic yet  :P

The only thing to watch for rentals is that they now look at the hour meter. In the old days, you could pick it up Friday night and drop it off Monday morning, and only pay one day's rent (Saturday). Now, they go by the hour meter, so if you run it all weekend, it will cost you more. Around here, there are no requirements to rent one, and delivery runs about $50, depending upon distance. A bigger skidsteer is HEAVY; like 11,000 lbs., so you would need a serious trailer and tow rig to bring it home yourself.

I have one of those old Gravely's; that's why I'm looking for a tractor-loader! I swear grading my driveway with that thing is more work than just using a shovel. I'm going to sell it, and a few other toys to help the tractor fund.

Quote from: MushCreek on May 16, 2016, 05:38:45 AM
I have one of those old Gravely's; that's why I'm looking for a tractor-loader! I swear grading my driveway with that thing is more work than just using a shovel. I'm going to sell it, and a few other toys to help the tractor fund.

LOL, I do prefer riding to being pulled around the yard. I think this Scat Trak 1300D weighs about 6,000 lbs. It and my heavy trailer was about all I wanted behind the pickup slipping home on the back roads.

I have a Bobcat 963 and love it but as mentioned, repairs are expensive even if you do them yourself.  I had a fire a couple years ago and spent around $10000 to fix it.

I also have a Ford 3550 road tractor with a hydraulic ripper- box scraper and skip loader on it.  Most expensive was a diesel fuel injection pump rebuild, usually around $1500 plus or minus.

I suggest sticking with popular brands for an old tractor purchase - I paid $8000 and the going rate for a similar machine was about $15000 at the time.  I made some good money with it doing driveway repairs.

The small Ford tractors such as 8N or similar are rather light duty compared to the bigger models . You may find yourself unable to do things you want to do.

We found a Ford 1510 on Craigslist. 742 hours, loader, 22hp, 4wd. seems like it's in good shape. front tires could stand to be replaced and some of the hydraulic lines are a little dry rotted. paid 6k. was hard to find a flatbed rental but finally found one right in town. worked out well.

(http://i.imgur.com/YZnu8yi.jpg)

Nice well kept looking machine. The fronts aren't too bad, the rears look like they'll last quite a while yet... if you can keep the sun off them. Toys generate more rounds of building  :D

Cool, congrats!

Nice buy! I keep looking, but not finding much under $10K around here. 'Experts' tell me that the MF 250 is overpriced, but looking all over the country, there's precious little in that price range. It's still sitting there; I still haven't brought a mechanic to look at it. I'm just so afraid of buying a money pit. I can barely afford the price of admission, and will be sunk if something expensive breaks.

I took the skid steer back Memorial day and we opened up the cab. It took several hours to demuck the pan enough to dig out the worn out foot cable (Hey, I see orange down there, we must be getting close) The back glass had been shattered and although tempered there were still lots of sharps in the bottom. With the cab tilted we had good access to the engine, pump and motors. Looking from the backside the alternator's real problem was obvious. The plug in connector had been hot near the exhaust manifold gotten brittle and cracked. One of the leads had a arcing connection at best. So a crimp on connector, an $80 foot cable and a day, not bad. I got into a rock with one tire and tore a chunk out, we'll order a pair for that side and I'll pay for one, we can get inside that chain case easily then to look around and adjust it. I put around 40 hours on it in rocks and pretty bouncy terrain, by the end I was up on one cheek and supporting on my elbows for the many long runs between where I was digging and where I was depositing. They really should put a pair of gravity inversion boots on the back of the bucket for breaktime . The owner took it for a spin when we got done and said I broke the suspension  :D.

Nice Find.  Just make sure that you don't over work the bucket. Cylinders are your real concern.  It is really not rated that heavy.

   
Performance
   
The Ford 770 Loader provides a breakout force of up to 1,600 pounds with a dump clearance of 70 inches, a dump reach of 30 inches and a ground reach of up to 61 inches. The 770A and 770B offer a breakout force of 1,460 pounds with a 75-inch dump clearance, a 22-inch dump reach with a ground reach of 61 inches.

   
Dimensions
   
The Ford 770, 770A and 770B weigh 580 pounds and can accommodate a bucket width between 48 and 60 inches with a capacity of up to .30 cubic yards. The 770 offered a maximum lift of 700 pounds at a height (to pin) of 87 inches while the 770A and 770B produced a maximum lift of 820 pounds at a height of 93 inches

What do they mean by 'breakout force'? For example, the loader I looked it has a breakout force of 2800 lbs., but a lifting capacity at the pin of 1800 lbs.

Quote from: MushCreek on June 02, 2016, 05:19:20 AM
What do they mean by 'breakout force'? For example, the loader I looked it has a breakout force of 2800 lbs., but a lifting capacity at the pin of 1800 lbs.

That is usually a little confusing and is manipulated by each individual manufacturer.  I am not real clear either but maybe this will help clarify it.  There are a lot of factors which play into it such as, bucket demensions, front lip to pivot point, cylinder size and machine size as well as others.

The breakout force is the amount the bucket can exert in it's crowd back function ie. tearing out a tree root while rolling the bucket back , as opposed to trying to lift it with the loaders lift arms (lift capacity).

I thought that was when the bucket broke when I was bouncing the backend while pivoting on the front two wheels to remove a stuck whatever...  [ouch]

Quote from: glenn kangiser on June 02, 2016, 02:35:57 PM
I thought that was when the bucket broke when I was bouncing the backend while pivoting on the front two wheels to remove a stuck whatever...  [ouch]

Yes we have all been there.  Pushing it way past it's limits.  I recall unloading a truck full of building supplies when I did the garage addition.  Don't ask me what I was thinking when I tackled a complete hack of 5/8 sheeting.  Well it went just like I didn't expect.  I managed to lift it about 6" off the bed of the truck.  Told my friend (his flat bed) to just pull out from under it when I lifted it up.  The front axle was the pivot point.  The hack went quickly to the ground at the same time the rear wheel came off the ground.  My tractor is not a hobby one but not a big one either.  I guess the bucket is rated somewhere around 3,000#.  Determined the hack was about 5,400# containing 50 sheets.  Just lucky that something major didn't give way and damage the cylinders and what ever.  Now I am more cautious about lifting.  Well at least until another situation comes up. ;)

820lbs, that is good info for me to have. Thanks Redover. Tractor will be used for farming, moving firewood out of the forest, stones less than 820lbs... I can also see using it to position building materials when I start framing later this summer.

Quote from: NathanS on June 02, 2016, 03:33:16 PM
820lbs, that is good info for me to have. Thanks Redover. Tractor will be used for farming, moving firewood out of the forest, stones less than 820lbs... I can also see using it to position building materials when I start framing later this summer.

Might I make a suggestion.  You should pick you up a drawbar and clevis for the rear.  It just fits into the lift arms of your 3-point hitch.  Make it a lot easier to buck logs and trees around w/o depending on the front bucket.  Not that expensive but well worth the money.  Here is one.

http://www.tractorsupply.com/tsc/product/countyline-cross-drawbar-category-1-3-4-in-dia

http://www.tractorsupply.com/tsc/search/clevis

Quote from: Redoverfarm on June 02, 2016, 02:48:24 PM
Yes we have all been there.  Pushing it way past it's limits.  I recall unloading a truck full of building supplies when I did the garage addition.  Don't ask me what I was thinking when I tackled a complete hack of 5/8 sheeting.  Well it went just like I didn't expect.  I managed to lift it about 6" off the bed of the truck.  Told my friend (his flat bed) to just pull out from under it when I lifted it up.  The front axle was the pivot point.  The hack went quickly to the ground at the same time the rear wheel came off the ground.  My tractor is not a hobby one but not a big one either.  I guess the bucket is rated somewhere around 3,000#.  Determined the hack was about 5,400# containing 50 sheets.  Just lucky that something major didn't give way and damage the cylinders and what ever.  Now I am more cautious about lifting.  Well at least until another situation comes up. ;)

That makes for a great ride though John.  [ouch]

I remember moving a rock up the mountain to anchor my wind generator to.  Went up on the front rollers for the tracks of my John Deere tracklayer.   No wonder my stuff breaks...  :(

A plus for me though... I did keep the bucket sliding on  the ground most of the way....

Quote from: glenn kangiser on June 03, 2016, 01:40:58 PM
That makes for a great ride though John.  [ouch]

I remember moving a rock up the mountain to anchor my wind generator to.  Went up on the front rollers for the tracks of my John Deere tracklayer.   No wonder my stuff breaks...  :(

A plus for me though... I did keep the bucket sliding on  the ground most of the way....

Who needs to go to an amusement park when we have such a good time at home ;D. 

Quote from: Redoverfarm on June 02, 2016, 04:03:29 PM
Might I make a suggestion.  You should pick you up a drawbar and clevis for the rear.  It just fits into the lift arms of your 3-point hitch.  Make it a lot easier to buck logs and trees around w/o depending on the front bucket.  Not that expensive but well worth the money.  Here is one.

http://www.tractorsupply.com/tsc/product/countyline-cross-drawbar-category-1-3-4-in-dia

http://www.tractorsupply.com/tsc/search/clevis

Thanks for the recommendation, we will pick those up this summer. We have several cords of downed wood right now that needs to be dragged out of the forest and processed.

This tractor hunt is driving me a little bonkers.

Any tractor I find has to be plated (we register any equipment that can potentially be on the road - even if just crossing the street).
I need it plated because I need to be able to drive it across the border.
I need to drive it across the border, because if it crosses on a transport it is considered as importing farm equipment and it will be held until  it passes all federal paperwork for importing.  Too complicated.

My budget means I will be buying something in the 50's-60's, maybe early 70's.
Most of these old farm tractors have been bought and sold so many times, nobody every bothered keeping up the registrations, so it becomes useless to me because I need proof of ownership to cross at the border, and it needs to be plated to legally drive on the road.
This fact also limits me to having a wheeled vehicle...

I know I will eventually find something...  but I think I will need to rent that skid steer after-all.
Local place wants $350 / day, $100 for transport + tax.... so roughly $500 for a day.  If I take it on a Saturday, there's a 50/50 chance they will come pick it up on the Sunday, will only know when I go pay the down-payment.  If they only get it on Monday, they give 10 hours per day so I could more realistically do two days of 5 hours and get more work done than if I am limited to 1 day of 10 hours, because I will need to stop and rest, measure, figure things out as I go, etc.  Then again, if forced to do it all in one day then I won't mess around, maybe go up with someone to act as a second set of hands/eyes/brain.   

Adam not real versed with how things in Canada work but I would assume when you refer to "plated" you are talking about the nomenclature plate listing the serial, manufacturer and etc...   The registration threw me off as here none are required to be registered to be driven on the road.

In regards to the rental machine you might check to see how they calculate the time used.  Most machines are equipted with hour meters.  Some use this method to determine daily use.  8 hours is common for day use.  So even if you would get it over the weekend and use it more than the 8 hours they could charge you an extra day for hours that exceed.  But then again some don't and consider one day (Saturday) and you could use in on the following day to be picked up on Monday.  Have had it both ways.

Might keep the hour meter in mind.  Shut off the machine during " idle times with your brain " while figuring things out. 

Quote from: Redoverfarm on June 12, 2016, 01:42:35 PM
...The registration threw me off as here none are required to be registered to be driven on the road...

Actually in Quebec Canada, it is registered and plated (license plate) just like on a car.  If your wheels will ever touch a road, then you are required by law to have it plated (actual license plate on the rear of the vehicle).  This is a one time plating only when a new owner takes ownership.  The benefit of this is that I can drive it across the border, show my registration papers and that serves as non disputable proof that I am the owner and I am not importing it to be sold or whatever.  I am not sure what would happen if I tried to drive one across the border without some kind of proof of ownership...

This kinda just fell into my lap...  I know, she ain't pretty, and she needs some luvin, but by golly she'll be prettier when I am done with her.

(https://i.imgur.com/OchJdpO.jpg)

I.....hate.....you.....all
(http://i.imgur.com/I5BK5QC.jpg)

Made in India (pretty sure)

Well it's at least better than the alternative!

(https://i1034.photobucket.com/albums/a429/adamrobillard/CountryPLansForum/GaryO_zpsbwvlovv5.jpg) (https://s1034.photobucket.com/user/adamrobillard/media/CountryPLansForum/GaryO_zpsbwvlovv5.jpg.html)

I spent a good part of the day on Monday speaking with various government agencies.
I started with the border crossing where I always cross.  The person who answered the phone said I don't need any paperwork to cross so long as it is for personal use, and if it will return to Canada then I need to first register it with the Canada side so that I can prove I did not buy it on the US side when coming back.  The big concern for her was that it was clean, it could not have any dirt on it what-so-ever because of possible soil contamination.  She then spoke with her supervisor who confirmed what she said, and then suggested I call the main office to speak with an import specialist.  I called them, basically the same story but they passed me to their supervisor, who also confirmed and who passed me to the floor supervisor just to be 100% certain.  Everyone seems to have the same story.  The only catch I can see is if the actual crossing agent does not know the laws and then causes me grief, so I think when I am actually ready to cross, I will call the border crossing where I will cross (its a small one, 2-3 agents working at any given time), and I will tell them "I am crossing with my tractor in 1.5 hours, I just wanted to give you a heads up" and then at least its no surprise when I do cross.

After speaking with border control, I went on our local classified ads and I saw this tractor up top for sale, asking price of $1000.  I called the guy and he really didn't know what he had. He basically is a "do anything" kind of backyard mechanic.  This was part of a local farmer's barn that recently passed away.  He had emptied the barn and brought all kinds of different equipment back to his shop.  He had no clue how to start it, drive it, what the levers did or anything.  He thinks its a 1958 Belarus but on the placard it shows 1974.  It is a diesel, and other than some bad wiring and missing bolts, its looks good.  We managed to figure it out, and it runs like a top, engine is strong, actually used it to pull a truck out some mud on his lot.  I can't for the life of me find reverse, and the brakes seem seized or just very hard to press... a few things are rattling (alternator adjustment bracket is broken), but all in all it seems like a decent find.  Considering I will get a maximum of 20 hours of use per year, it fits well in the budget.  It was a 3 hour drive away, and it was too heavy for my Liberty, so I asked him to deliver.  He wanted $400, but I talked him down to $1200 tax-in for the tractor with delivery and he actually followed me back home so I got it right away.  Neighbors were giving me funny looks let me tell you.  Now I am just a little apprehensive to test it out, my driveway slopes towards the road and I don't think the brakes work and I can't find any of the gears...  we managed to test reverse and at least 2 forward gears but it was all by luck.  Front bucket has no problem lifting the wheels off the ground.  Rear tires are new, fronts are dry rot so I will need to maybe put some old car tires on there for now.

Anyways, that's the story for now.  I'll let ya all know how the restoration goes.  I have to start off by cleaning it, then changing all the oils and doing whatever maintenance was likely not done for many years.

congrats Adam. At that price there isn't a whole lot of risk. My wife is Canadian and we had considered buying a tractor in Canada and bringing it across the border (exchange rate has been so good). We talked to the US border people on the phone and they just needed a bill of sale, clean tractor, and since we aren't using it for profit there was no import tax.

Still, I understand your apprehension, I still get anxiety crossing because ultimately it depends who is in the station when you're crossing. Sometimes I get US customs officers that will give me a hard time coming into the US WITH my US Passport.

I think you will get it across no problem. Lots of people are doing what you're doing.

Keep us posted on restoration.

You probably already have her chocked, but just as a reminder...

CHOCK THOSE WHEELS!

Now I need to go see if this green coloring I have will wash off.

Quote from: ChugiakTinkerer on June 22, 2016, 04:24:39 PM
You probably already have her chocked, but just as a reminder...

CHOCK THOSE WHEELS!

Now I need to go see if this green coloring I have will wash off.

Yup, double chocked just in case.... green coloring?

Quote from: Adam Roby on June 22, 2016, 04:33:31 AM
Well it's at least better than the alternative!

(https://i1034.photobucket.com/albums/a429/adamrobillard/CountryPLansForum/GaryO_zpsbwvlovv5.jpg) (https://s1034.photobucket.com/user/adamrobillard/media/CountryPLansForum/GaryO_zpsbwvlovv5.jpg.html)

Now, THAT'S funny

Since you are new to tractors and live where freezing temperatures occur from time to time  ;D  I thought I should mention this.  Tractors have great torque. In freezing temperatures it is very practice to first move the tractor in reverse a couple of feet to break any frozen tire free from the ground. A tractor can have sufficient torque to rotate the front end up and over if the wheel can not turn and propel the tractor forward.

Good point, that applies to towing something as well, if you are dragging something and it stops, the machine can rotate around the rears and flip backwards. Situational awareness always, the wheels are just to move it around not to hurry, go slow.

Adam I am glad you found something.  With a little TLC I am sure it will serve you well.  I have been looking and I did find one but wasn't sure it was plated.

(https://i220.photobucket.com/albums/dd161/redoverfarm/scenes/country%20plans/untitled-balance.jpg) (https://s220.photobucket.com/user/redoverfarm/media/scenes/country%20plans/untitled-balance.jpg.html)

On a more serious note.  I would start off with a good power washing to reveal all the drain plugs and other maintenance points.  Changing fluids and filters are a must.  Especially the fuel filter.  There is bacteria that grows in the diesel and will ruin your day if not addressed.  They make additive that gets rid of it.  Probably in the fuel tank also if you can drain and flush it out.  I would not address the cosmetic stuff until you get it operating and use it some.  This will show you any leaks you might have with seals and the like then once they are tight then you can put some lipstick on the old girl.

I've been slowly getting to know this tractor as I do the maintenance on it.
Everything so far is in pretty decent shape.
Crazy how this was designed so well, for instance take the oil filter which I just cleaned out tonight.  It's a centrifugal system, all metal parts, it spins and collects the dirt/debris compacting it into channels that you clean out afterwards.  Works like a charm, no filters to swap, no waste, can be done in the middle of a field.  That's kinda the point with these things, they need to be repairable and are made to last.  Nothing like how cars are made today, I wonder if new tractors are still being built as well as these.

Still smells like cow crap, really need to take her out of the garage and do a proper pressure wash.

Quote from: Adam Roby on July 02, 2016, 11:00:47 PM


Still smells like cow crap, really need to take her out of the garage and do a proper pressure wash.

Adam that is why I mentioned doing that first.  A lot easier working on a somewhat clean machine.

It's a matter of chicken and the egg...  firstly, I just bought the pressure washer, was on special.
Secondly, I wanted to pull it out of the garage to wash it, but needed to lower the bucket, which meant starting it... but I can't start it with parts removed, plus it will stink up the house with exhaust...  but yeah, if the weather is nice this weekend she is going out for a well deserved bath!

Careful- if it really has a lot of crap on it, it might be a much smaller tractor than you thought! d*

It actually does look a lot smaller.... in the driveway compared to the garage.
Man there was a lot of crap, literally, on the machine.  Got most of it off now with the pressure washer.  I need to go over it with degreaser now and rewash tomorrow.  Then on Sunday my brother is coming over to measure the front tires, and remove them to install new ones.

I can't figure out this seat.
It is far too back and tilted back.
I added a boat seat to the metal frame, but still too far for comfort with the clutch.
I only see 1 bolt for an adjustment and I think it only controls the spring.
Everything is adjusted as far forward as possible...  I think.

Any ideas?

(https://i.imgur.com/WfnsU0B.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/tPRtmyG.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/qcU0mgZ.jpg)

Hard to tell from the pictures.  But it does have a pivot point toward the gauges.  That allows the seat to flip forward toward the steering wheel to keep the seat dry.  Have you determined exactly what make it is?  Once that can be established you should be able to use the VIN # to research it a little.  There are a lot of on-line manuels for even older tractors.  Hopefully you can find yours.

I'm fairly confident its a 1974 Belarus T25A, although... I still need to check the serial numbers, maybe contact Belarus and ask for a build sheet or something.  I think the seat is something that was added afterwards, because every picture I see of them looks different.  I was hoping someone might recognize it... it has no tilt mechanism that I can see for water.

In the first picture the tilt mechanism is the portion with the three bolts and the boxing.  It looks as if you force the front of the seat down it will lift the back of the seat bracket pin ( "A" bracket bottom) out of a recess in the lower back pin and should allow it to tilt.  Hard to tell just from the picture.  Maybe just the way I am looking at it.

Wonder what the two eared pieces on the front were.  Maybe holding a rod or bolts at one time.  Arm rest?

Do you know the procedure to follow with the bolts?  Do I loosen the two smaller side bolts and then adjust with the big center one?

It looks like if you pulled the top pin from the bracket the seat is attached to it would drop down into a better angle and be a little closer.  Hard to figure out how that seat is supposed to work though.  Seems way more complicated than it ought to be.

Adam maybe you can find some answers to some of your problems with this forum.

http://www.mtztractortalk.com/recent/

But this would definitely help you understand what you have.

http://www.jensales.com/Belarus-T25A-Tractor-Parts-Manual-BE-P-T25A_p_82879.html

These people might help you find parts.  I believe they have a branch in Canada as well.  I am sure if your particular model is not listed they can steer you to someone that does have it.

http://www.belarustractorstore.com/?gclid=Cj0KEQjw5Ie8BRCJ9fHlr_bH24cBEiQAkoDQcUO4GFPUZ_DwYQE_QS-3KSSbfJw8Lx6uh7ABwwHdab4aAttl8P8HAQ

Just FYI in case anyone was curious...

The whole mechanism is only to adjust the springiness, has no affect on height adjustment.
The person who had it last must have been a 7' giant.
I took the entire seat apart to figure it out.  There is a bottom plate that mounts to the tractor, it must have been flipped (upside down) because it raised and tilted back the seat.  By flipping that (right side up) and reinstalling the seat, it is now completely level with no tilt back.  I actually had to readjust the seat back one setting with 2 bolts.  Now it works great.

I sent the Belarus company my serial number and asked for them to give me the year and model of tractor, and any information they could provide me with to identify it.  Hopefully I get a reply soon.

So as I was cleaning mud from the tractor and I came across the transmission fill cap.  I figured I would open it and try to see the level and viscosity of the tranny oil (so far I only did the engine oil and filter).  Luckily I decided to reach for my oil pan... just in case... 
It was like I had a pump attached, so much pressure I couldn't get the cap back on.... water, 7-8 liters of water so far that shot out of the filler cap for the transmission.  It is either getting in from one of the shifter seals (they need to be replaced) or one of the other 100 seals on top of the transmission.  I won't be pressure washing it anymore... and I will definitely be putting on a canopy AND making sure I cover up every time I leave because as is the transmission might not last very long.
Guess I will be buying 10 liters of transmission oil tomorrow...

I also opened the hydraulic breather... found the dip stick to measure the level which is right next to the breather.  I need to take the breather apart, it is filthy... and it looks like the hydraulics are almost empty.  Probably 4-6" below the dip stick.  I think everything is in it's compressed state, I will double-check after the transmission issue is resolved.

Do I basically just make sure all the hydraulic pistons are in their most compressed state before checking level or is it the opposite?

I am wondering if anyone knows about banjo fittings?

(http://www.rotaryheads.com/modifications/images/GT35R-BanjoFittingKit.jpg)

There is one on the fuel pump that is continuously leaking oil.  The tractor is sitting so no pressure in there right now other than perhaps residual, I think it may leak even more when working.  I tried to tighten it but it is rock hard already, not budging.  I don't want to snap anything off... just wondering if the source of the leak is probably just washers, and if so where can you find copper washers?  Back in the day with our dirt bikes we would throw the copper head gaskets in the oven and they would swell just enough to be re-compressed when reassembling the engine (has to do the rings pretty often).   Figure that same trick might work here?

I am almost done painting, just have the engine pretty much to finish.  The fuel pump I cleaned but it keeps leaking, hard to paint something full of oil, and is much more obvious that it is leaking with fresh paint everywhere.

Did you take the fitting off to make sure there are washers on there? Or that someone didn't replace it and accidentally leave an extra washer that was stuck on there and all grimy?

Those things are a mess when doing a brake caliper job. Usually have to pry off old gunked up washers while the brake fluid is leaking everywhere. I have also gotten new copper washers that come with the caliper that don't fit over the banjo bolt.. yep. I have heard some guys say not to use the copper washers and if you still have the OEM that are usually stainless just re-use them.

Not sure that's much help.

I haven't attempted to remove the fitting yet, I am a bit worried it drains the pump and causes an even bigger mess and/or causes me to lose prime which will make it very difficult to start later on.  I might just wait to be outside on the land to remove it, just in case.  Wanted to be prepared for any eventuality when I do remove it though, so any feedback is good feedback, thanks!

A lot of the pumps have a priming lever to push fuel back into the pump.  Also you will need to bleed the air out of the line after you disconnect and reinstall the fitting.  Having a full fuel tank helps to force the fuel to the filter and pumps.

Were you ever able to find a Shop Manuel or owners Manuel?

I still haven't identified it completely.  I have a manual for a model the closely resembles it though, and 95% of it looks the same.  I contacted Belarus in Canada and in Russia but have yet to get any reply from either.  I figured with the serial number they could give me more info... I guess I am not important enough.  I know I can remove a connector up top and prime the pump but you must pump until fuel sprays out of the connector up top... again, not nice in the home garage so probably something I will do on the land where it won't be noticed by the missus. 

I deal with banjo fittings quite a bit.  The only place for them to leak is the washers assuming there are no defects in the hose above them or the fitting itself which would not be common.  Cracked hoses can be a  problem especially with the new hoses we get today... maybe from India or China but they can deteriorate rapidly.

A old friend of mine was running a backhoe and noticed a drip of hydraulic fluid at a fitting.  He reached down a gave it a twist without thinking. It turned out that the fitting had a crack and it injected hydraulic fluid into his hand. He was warring leather work gloves. He almost lost his hand before everything was all done. He did not have use of his hand for about a year It was quite a setback as he made his living repairing watches. Bob 

Big Red is done!  Breaking her in next weekend, a buddy needs to load a trailer with dozer parts (tracks, etc) and we're going to see if she can handle it or not.  Better I blow a line in the city with his mechanic father present than alone in the middle of a field.

(https://i.imgur.com/jL2369n.jpg)

 Doesn't look like the same machine.  Good job.  Hope you get a lot of use out of it.

Thank you... you would not believe the number of hours I laid under that thing scraping, sanding, swearing, painting...  I am sure it was around 100 hours of paint alone.  Crazy how much mud, crud, and other nasty things accumulate on a tractor over the years.

Wow incredible job, it looks great.

Wow!  That looks great! 

Quote from: Adam Roby on October 07, 2016, 05:13:34 PM
Big Red is done!  Breaking her in next weekend, a buddy needs to load a trailer with dozer parts (tracks, etc) and we're going to see if she can handle it or not.  Better I blow a line in the city with his mechanic father present than alone in the middle of a field.

(https://i1034.photobucket.com/albums/a429/adamrobillard/BigRed_zps65qnyr6h.jpg) (https://s1034.photobucket.com/user/adamrobillard/media/BigRed_zps65qnyr6h.jpg.html)

Quoting just because that picture deserves to be seen again.  Nice work Adam!

Thanks a lot everyone, its nice to see a plan come together and having everyone like it is icing on the cake!

very nice.

Very very nice!

Wow, looks incredible,  I'm actually taking mine to get welded tomorrow.  I don't think a paint job is in the cards though.

Photobucket seems to be down so I can't upload any videos.
I don't like to do this since not everyone has Facebook, but here is a Facebook video link of me driving the tractor off the trailer.
Was a bit hairy with the tilting mechanism and the clutch is jumpy, but I made it!

https://www.facebook.com/adam.robillard/videos/10153769725667024/

Couldn't get it.  Said it was unavailable.  Guess we will just wait.   :(

Notice that came up....

Sorry, this content isn't available right now
The link you followed may have expired, or the page may only be visible to an audience you're not in.

Check that it is world viewable. Change that on a little dropdown that should be near the content, usually somewhere near the top.

I just set it to public....  photobucket still seems to be down, if it doesn't work I will repost tomorrow.

It worked this time.  Still hard to believe that is the same tractor you started with.  Good Job.

Now that you're done with Big Red, you're ready for another project! Wanna work on Sven, a '65 Ford 3000? Needs a little TLC (OK, a LOT), but the price was right, and it runs like a champ.

(https://i84.photobucket.com/albums/k18/flgargoyle/IMG_3375.jpg) (https://s84.photobucket.com/user/flgargoyle/media/IMG_3375.jpg.html)

No welds on the bucket or arms, looks good... and fast  ;D

I've got the bug now too.  I'm working on my tractor-buying strategery and am on the fence about a backhoe attachment.  Here's a summary of my current assessment of needs and wants:

• Property is completely wild, 10 miles from any road.  I need to clear a site for our cabin, make some trails down to the lake, and haul gravel
• Access to property will be in winter, subject to state permit to travel across state land (needed for equipment bigger than an ATV)
• I'm hauling my sawmill out to the property, and loader w forks will make lumber management much easier
• I'll need to pull some stumps, a backhoe makes that much easier
• 4WD and loader are a must, looking at HST as preferred
• Will need to clear a large area to serve as helipad in case of emergency med-evac
• I like the size of the 25HP units with loader and backhoe, but worry they will be too small
• Not tied to new or used, but nice financing is currently available for most new models

I don't really have much need for a backhoe that I can foresee at the moment.  This is a remote cabin, so no septic or buried plumbing is likely.  Renting a backhoe is somewhere between impractical and impossible.  I think as I write this I'm talking myself out of buying the backhoe attachment, but I appreciate other folks' perspective on the idea.

I used to want  backhoe also, then I rented a TLB for the weekend.  After using it, I decided renting is a good option for a backhoe.  I also realized having your backhoe on tracks, aka a mini excavator is very handy.  A TLB is really suboptimized, does backhoe work ok, but not as fast as a dedicated mini xcavator.

Buried this a couple weeks ago, BX25D got it done, but I'd rather have a heavier tractor for loader work.
(https://i801.photobucket.com/albums/yy300/Mike_1894/Mobile%20Uploads/20161015_172342_zpsftzwrvbm.jpg) (https://s801.photobucket.com/user/Mike_1894/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20161015_172342_zpsftzwrvbm.jpg.html)

It takes a lot of machine to dig stumps. My contractor did some of the preliminary work with a mid-sized track hoe. He simply pushed most of the trees over, then dealt with them on the ground. He only had to dig around the bigger ones. Later, he was using a large tracked skid steer (over 100 hp.) and it was slow going by comparison.

It would probably make the most economic sense to just hire someone with an excavator to come out and do the heavy lifting. I have a half acre full of old pine stumps that may or may not be rotted enough to come out. If not, I'll pay someone to grub it off.

Good choice on the Ford. There is going to be plenty of parts availability for the 3000. I have been blown away by what my little 1510 can do. It has saved me hours and hours of painful labor.


Today it took the cake. That is a 900lb stove in that crate.

(http://i.imgur.com/0UKb84P.jpg)

Anyone know anything about Smart Trac tractors from Yecheng Tractor Co ?   might be same as Mahindra ?  Are they any good?  Someone is selling a model 354 w/loader near me.  Any info appreciated.  Tks

I'm new to the world of tractors, having just started my search for the perfect machine.  The Smart Trac brand is new to me, but I do know that a lot of the off-brand machines come from the same manufacturers.  If you can identify the engine and major components you may get a sense for parts availability.

After a little more research have learned that Smart Trac tractors are made by Jimna.  Quite a few negative reviews on them but there are some people who like them.   Someone locally is selling a 2006 Smart Trac 354 with 1,400 hrs with loader and backhoe for $4,800.  Sure sounded good.

After seeing that red beauty posted here - makes you want to buy a tractor.

Quote from: MushCreek on November 06, 2016, 06:29:44 AM
Now that you're done with Big Red, you're ready for another project! Wanna work on Sven, a '65 Ford 3000? ...

That's a sweet looking ride you got there, and it looks strong, arms are thick and should handle a fair amount of punishment.
Mine has welds everywhere, but for the price I paid it was worth it. 

It looks similar to mine in that the bucket can't actually pick anything up when flat to the ground, is that right?  When on the ground, mine at full pull back is level with the ground, makes picking up rocks quite difficult.  Its get a bit of an angle as the arms rise, and I can dump no problem but I never realized it could not lift from ground level... not sure I am explaining myself right.  I might be able to move some brackets around to compensate a bit.

Is your tilt cylinder fully closed at that point or is the bucket hitting the frame?

The tilt cylinder is fully closed...  there are some other spots to pin it but it seems its already at the more tiltiest spot, and much further would require some trimming of the brackets that hold the cylinder.

Are there different types of buckets, or tractor uses I suppose that would warrant this kind of setup?  Maybe snow or hay pushing?

I looked back for a pic of that end, is this it? If so the tilt cylinder looks like it might have been replaced, would a shorter cylinder give you more tilt or would the frame bind at the mounts... disconnect the cylinder and see if it can knuckle under more if it is not easy to tell. Next thing if that is looking right, would a shorter cylinder give enough travel at the extended end of the stroke.

(https://i1034.photobucket.com/albums/a429/adamrobillard/Tractor_zps6o1jefbk.jpg)

My bucket is kind of like that, too. In my case, the bracket on the bucket is hitting the cylinder body. There's still about 2" of travel on the cylinder. Mine has very crude brackets- either replaced at some point, or just crude work from the factory. When I take mine apart to rebuild it, I'm going to see if the bucket will curl more with better cylinder placement. My bucket is pretty rough; I'll either patch where it has worn/rusted through, or look around for a replacement.

Yup, that is mine.  There appears to be hold'off square pieces (circled in red) that sit in the channel (yellow) that would need to be removed, as well as either shortening the cylinder (it was newer looking) or moving it back to allow for more upward tilt.  Realistically doesn't need that much, but enough to scoop up some rock and make the driveway would be nice.

(https://i1034.photobucket.com/albums/a429/adamrobillard/HoldOffs_zpsk4kjf6zu.jpg) (https://s1034.photobucket.com/user/adamrobillard/media/HoldOffs_zpsk4kjf6zu.jpg.html)

We went to the LS dealer on Saturday and checked out some small tractors.  I'm still wrestling with a decision on what we really need.  I want to go cheap, but I also want to spend my time working, not wrenching on an old beater tractor.  I don't know where we'll end up, but I do know that my wife has her mind made up.  An enclosed cab with heat and a suspension seat made it onto her list of must-haves.

http://lstractorusa.com/compact-tractors/xr-series/xr3135hc/