Liability Insurance for Equipment Travel Across State Land

[ChugiakTinkerer]

All,

I've got a trip planned in a couple weeks to take a mini-excavator out to the property and I have one hang-up with my state permit.  I'm hoping somebody here will have some suggestions.

My plan is to walk the mini-ex over 4 miles of state land to our remote 27 acre lot and do some site clearing, dig some outhouse holes, etc.  Travel across state land with anything weighing over 1,500 lbs requires a permit.  I can satisfy everything in the state's requirements but for one thing, liability insurance.

I have contacted State Farm and a local agent that does a lot of cabin work.  Both of them said their underwriters have nothing to offer.  I'm thinking there must be something out there, at least for a commercial entity.  I'm not commercial and not interested in the going that route, as I'm sure it would be way too expensive.

I'm guessing there are some instruments out there that would meet this awkwardly constructed standard, I just don't know thw correct terminology.  Any suggestions?  Here's their requirement:

Insurance: Pursuant to 11 AAC 96.065 the permittee shall secure or purchase at its own expense, and maintain in force at all times during the term of this permit, the following policies of insurance to protect both the permittee and the permittor (the State, its officers, agents and employees). If the permittee's policy contains higher limits, the State shall be entitled to coverage to the extent of such higher limits. Certificates of Insurance must be furnished to the AO prior to the issuance of this permit and must provide for a notice of cancellation, non-renewal, or material change of conditions in accordance with policy provisions. The permittee must provide for a 60-day prior notice to the State before they cancel, not renew or make material changes to conditions to the policy. Failure to furnish satisfactory evidence of insurance, or lapse of the policy, are material breaches of this permit and shall be grounds, at the option of the State, for termination of the permit. All insurance policies shall comply with, and be issued by, insurers licensed to transact the business of insurance under Alaska Statute, Title 21. The policy shall be written on an "occurrence" form and shall not be written as a "claims-made" form unless specifically reviewed and agreed to by the Division of Risk Management, Department of Administration. The State must be named as an additional named insured on the policy with respect to the operations of the permittee on or in conjunction with the permitted premises, referred to as LAS XXXXX

I am planning on renting the unit and this all will take only a week.  I checked with the rental company and they seemed puzzled.  They suggested I check with my home insurer (State Farm).

[akwoodchuck]

You can drive a highway vehicle up to 10,000 pounds curb weight on state lands without a permit....so if you can get the thing on say a 4x4 flatbed pickup, that might work....
....might also talk to the folks at CMI Equipment or the electric utility...they must deal with this stuff all the time....

[ChugiakTinkerer]

Thanks for the suggestions.  I've got a request in to the state to give me some info on prior liability insurance they have approved.  I'm sure that any major outfit has something as part of their commercial operation, like the companies that do the cat trains for drilling on the north slope.  My fear is that whatever specific type of policy is used will be priced beyond the means of a private individual.

[AngeliqueS]

I originally had a really long reply to this, but decided to save some of the words and if you need more details I can pm you the really long reply.

From the blurb you copied from the state, it sounds like the state wants to protect itself from any lawsuit that could come up while you use the lands as they have permitted you to use them. If you are using the lands as permitted and there is a lawsuit against you, they can also name the state as a defendant in a suit because the state granted you these permissions.

1) If you have a comprehensive homeowner's or builder's risk policy (as opposed to a named perils), ask very directly to the agents what is excluded under the liability coverage of the policy. If this situation isn't specifically excluded, your homeowner's should count as a liability coverage.
2) If the mini-excavator is plated and road-legal, you can ask your auto insurance if the auto liability would extend to a rented mini-excavator as it would be to a rental car.
3) Personal Liability Policy (Umbrella), this might be the type of policy you are looking for. If a situation is specifically excluded from your home or auto policies, but not from the personal umbrella policy, they should cover from first dollar as well as the duty to defend and it's really common to have additional named insureds on these policies.

All of these would require you to name the State as an additional named insured on a personal insurance policy, which you may not want.

4) I wouldn't knee jerk and think that commercial is way too expensive. You have no premise to cover under a general liability policy (like a contractor, typically they don't have a brick and mortar space) but without the faulty workmanship exposure. Commercial policies have very large %s of credits that can be applied by the underwriter if the insured meets certain criteria, so this could make a commercial policy less than what you'd think. I'd look at some small mutual commercial insurers as the underwriters have more leeway in terms of underwriting guidelines. This might not be a real option however, as you are not a commercial entity and this endeavor is entirely personal.

Hopefully the state gets back to you with examples of what individuals provided as acceptable insurance vs what companies provided as acceptable insurance.

[ChugiakTinkerer]

I originally had a really long reply to this, but decided to save some of the words and if you need more details I can pm you the really long reply.

From the blurb you copied from the state, it sounds like the state wants to protect itself from any lawsuit that could come up while you use the lands as they have permitted you to use them. If you are using the lands as permitted and there is a lawsuit against you, they can also name the state as a defendant in a suit because the state granted you these permissions.

1) If you have a comprehensive homeowner's or builder's risk policy (as opposed to a named perils), ask very directly to the agents what is excluded under the liability coverage of the policy. If this situation isn't specifically excluded, your homeowner's should count as a liability coverage.
2) If the mini-excavator is plated and road-legal, you can ask your auto insurance if the auto liability would extend to a rented mini-excavator as it would be to a rental car.
3) Personal Liability Policy (Umbrella), this might be the type of policy you are looking for. If a situation is specifically excluded from your home or auto policies, but not from the personal umbrella policy, they should cover from first dollar as well as the duty to defend and it's really common to have additional named insureds on these policies.

All of these would require you to name the State as an additional named insured on a personal insurance policy, which you may not want.

4) I wouldn't knee jerk and think that commercial is way too expensive. You have no premise to cover under a general liability policy (like a contractor, typically they don't have a brick and mortar space) but without the faulty workmanship exposure. Commercial policies have very large %s of credits that can be applied by the underwriter if the insured meets certain criteria, so this could make a commercial policy less than what you'd think. I'd look at some small mutual commercial insurers as the underwriters have more leeway in terms of underwriting guidelines. This might not be a real option however, as you are not a commercial entity and this endeavor is entirely personal.

Hopefully the state gets back to you with examples of what individuals provided as acceptable insurance vs what companies provided as acceptable insurance.

Thank you so much for the helpful reply.  I'll cast my net a little further and see what might be out there.

[AngeliqueS]

No problem. Please feel free to ask or pm me any other questions while you try to get this sorted out. While I'm not an underwriter, agent or coverage expert, I have been working in the more background function of pricing insurance products as a career and I can at least give some insight into the semantics of insurance definitions and questions to ask those who are legally bound by their licenses to give you accurate information.

[Dave Sparks]

Can you pay the rental company or someone to deliver  

[ChugiakTinkerer]

Can you pay the rental company or someone to deliver

Sure, just about any problem can be solved with sufficient application of engineering and money.  My property is 10 miles from the end of the road.  A heavy lift helicopter capable of lifting 3000 kg ought to be sufficient to sling the mini-excavator.  It would only cost appx $5,000 per hour.   

I got a reply from the state that was basically a shrug.  I have contacted an independent agent in another town that says they can help me.  Just need to work out some details and learn what the cost will be.  Keeping fingers crossed...

[Dave Sparks]

I just asked? Never needed to hear the bit about the helicopter.... We have equipment delivered all the time so....

[ChugiakTinkerer]

That wasn't meant as snark Dave.

Slinging loads by helicopter is about the only way to accomplish a haul like this in remote Alaska.  It's not uncommon for mineral exploration, and has been done for hauling an entire cabin's worth of building supplies (paid for by folks wealthier than I).

[Dave Sparks]

Ok, I don't feel snarked. I have clients up in the Sierra that can't get in or out for months. I do not think they even care about going over federal lands. I know the native Indians don't. When I go up there, I do have to have a way out and so it is snowmobile or if it is that bad, and flyable, a helicopter.

Good Luck!

[Joe--H]

How are you getting it to the State land border? Are you driving it from the rental yard all the way?
If you're hauling on a trailer why not just keep on keeping on?
Joe H

[ChugiakTinkerer]

How are you getting it to the State land border? Are you driving it from the rental yard all the way?
If you're hauling on a trailer why not just keep on keeping on?
Joe H

Welcome to the forum!

I'm hauling it on a trailer about 150 miles to where the road ends.  After I unload from the trailer I am barging 6 miles across the lake.  At the far landing I have 1.5 miles of existing trail (not road, but a trail suitable for 4-wheelers) then I have 2.5 miles of new trail I have to create.  It's not country suitable to off-roading with my 3/4 ton truck, especially not attempting to tow a heavy trailer.

I got my permit today due to a persistent insurance agent that got me a commercial liability policy.  I can probably find a way to make it work with my homeowner's policy, but my homeowner's agent was no help at all.  It may be time to reassess that relationship.

I'll post updates on my build thread when we all make it back safely. 

[Joe--H]

Ah, makes sense now.
Joe H

[AngeliqueS]

Glad you got something figured out. I hope it wasn't too unreasonable for the amount of time you'll be carrying it. Also glad to hear you found an agent that worked to find you the coverage you needed.