Hey there all,
Been lurking for a few months now, reading, learning...
I was pretty much drawn here through research related to the idea of building an underground House... and honestly, started following Glenn K's 'underground cabin' thread, but found a Lot of useful information spread all over the site....
I thank you all for everything I have been able to gather from you....
So, basically, a quick run down....
About 2 years ago I got really interested in the idea of minimal living... and that lasted until my external hard drive crashed and I freaked out because the laptop wasn't backed up on the desktop... so I figured it wasn't quite for me, but while watching a TV show about refurbished missile silos turned into houses got me thinking about living underground.... seemed the kinda concept I could latch onto, and heck... it seemed the total answer to zombie proof living!!! (small joke there!!!)
And a seed was planted....
I've been with a girl for a bit of 3 years now and I'm not quite sure if she really thinks I have some good ideas or just thinks she should humor me and let me run wild at times.... BUT.... (bless her heart) she seems good with the idea of living underground and not only gave me the go ahead to follow another half-baked idea, but actually got involved in trying to figure some stuff out.... LOL
So... after lots of hours of on-line research, I got my hands on Mike Ohler's books and DVD set and read, re-read, watched, and re-watched... studied lots of info on people who bury cement domes in the earth, and people who bury shipping containers in the earth, and... well, no offense to any of the other methods, but decided to go with Mike's... for the most part....
Next step... (in my mind) .... a floor plan.... after lots of discussion, and sketching and talking and sketching, we settled on an idea I thought was a little big and she thought was a little small, so that would make it perfect... LOL
(https://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb90/jeramiez/2010-08-13025829.jpg?t=1296351969)
And then some re-working and drawing to scale....
(https://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb90/jeramiez/2010-08-13025745.jpg?t=1296351969)
And then came the idea of building a scale model...
Cardboard was the first effort, just to get an idea of how it would "look"
(https://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb90/jeramiez/2010-09-06220705.jpg?t=1296357489)
(https://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb90/jeramiez/2010-09-06220723.jpg?t=1296357552)
(https://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb90/jeramiez/2010-09-06220529.jpg?t=1296357578)
(https://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb90/jeramiez/2010-09-06220621.jpg?t=1296357612)
And we agreed that we liked it... but some things needed to change, so we re-thought and re-worked a bit... and liked where we were headed.... so it was time to sit back and scale up the model a bit using wood dowels and such...
(https://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb90/jeramiez/2010-08-13025649.jpg?t=1296357737)
(https://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb90/jeramiez/2010-08-14100833.jpg?t=1296357769)
(https://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb90/jeramiez/2010-08-14100854.jpg?t=1296357795)
(https://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb90/jeramiez/2010-08-14100911.jpg?t=1296357819)
(https://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb90/jeramiez/2010-08-14100933.jpg?t=1296357868)
We have since added walls and windows and floors to the model using PVC board and some Plexiglas, mocked up a roof using fiberboard... could post some pics of that if anyone is interested....
But it led us to figure out some re-working of the general idea, like moving the 3 gable windows from the center hallway to 4 gable windows above each lower bedroom allowing light in and a second egress from each room... (just in case....) Moving the closet area of the lower 4 bedrooms to the 'upper' end of the rooms, also moving the stairwell to the "basement" under the circular master bedroom to the side wall to provide for a false wall in that area and hence, a "semi-secret" entrance to an underground room in an underground house... also, off the opposite wall, on the other side of the kitchen area, an off-shoot dug in pantry/root cellar.....
Which led to other ideas, see, she has 4 children, (the reason we needed the 4 lower bedrooms....) and I wasn't sure if the 1 bath at the end of the hall would accommodate 2 boys and 2 girls entering teen years for morning rituals.... so we are currently considering placing a bathroom in between each room on each side of the lower hallway allowing for a girls "powder room" and a boys "john"... and the end of the hall could be transferred to the heating room.... I... um/we... LOL like it to be in the mid 70's, and it would seem that all underground ideas report that the temp remains the average lower temp of the area.... fine, but if the area average is in the 50's... we definitely need more heat than A/C... and since the house is sloped on different levels, placing the heating unit... i.e. (wood stove) at the lowest point seems to make sense....
And with a firm idea in mind and something we could "see" in front of us... it was on to looking for a place to build....
We were lucky and got a great deal on e-bay and bought a nice 14+/- acres in southern Missouri... (Her mother lives in SW MO. go figure!!!!)
The land was bought sight unseen, but with these pics... (and lots of research of the area and google earth... LOL)
(https://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb90/jeramiez/374757771.jpg?t=1296359223)
(https://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb90/jeramiez/Trees.jpg?t=1296359245)
(https://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb90/jeramiez/Interance.jpg?t=1296359285)
(https://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb90/jeramiez/Myhill.jpg?t=1296359306)
(https://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb90/jeramiez/374757790.jpg?t=1296359327)
So there you are...
And since we are currently located in the great state of Texas.... (San Antonio) and it's winter, we know that it will be a few moths before we get a chance to even drive up and walk the land and see if our ideas could eventually come to fruition on that property....
So we are left to ponder and think and plan for the year ahead....
From some real shady math and rough calculations I figure the land has a rise of 1-5 at the south and 1-6 at the top, and the house was planned with a rise of 1-4... so that's a small issue.... (though the seller has another 20 acres just south but not bordering with a good rise of 1-4 (by my S#$%@y math mind you...) but on an exact opposite ridge face... meaning....
at present, morning light would enter the gables for the lower bedrooms, and afternoon-evening light would enter the kitchen/master bedroom wall of windows and uphill patio... (but not later evening due to the ridge to the west....) the other piece of land lays the exact opposite.... hmmm... to buy as a back up or not to buy... that is the question.....
(or to buy secretly and build a "MANCAVE RETREAT"..... LOL J/K)
The BIG issue.... I hear that that area of the Ozarks is mostly Clay and Bedrock... not the best digging at all...
Well, I've got lots more to say, and a ton of questions for the knowledge base here, and of course, a bunch more pics...
But I will save the server space until your interested in hearing/seeing more... LOL
Anyway,
I'd love to hear any comments or feedback, good or bad, that ya'll might have....
Best wishes!
Jeramie
w* to the forum, Jeramie. This is the best place to get ideas and answers as everyone will chip in here. Me too.
Please post all of the pictures you want. Everyone here likes pictures....
Every underground house needs secret rooms and passage ways... [noidea'
Nice to see the models. Makes it a lot easier for others and yourself to visualize what is going on. :)
That's pretty cool how you made the scale models! w* If you build underground you'll be able to benefit from lots that we've learned to do & not to do - Glenn doesn't play w/models - he just plays w/the real thing so sometimes it's trial & error d* :)
Post all the pics you want - we like em!
Thanks Glenn and Sassy!!!
I will say that I definitely think the models helped a lot not only for others to visualize our idea, but for ourselves in planning to see the slight but major flaws, or rather, the NEEDED "re-evaluations of the idea" Things seem to look good 2D on paper, then when it's 3D and in your face there can be a lot of: "um, well, hmmm, if only that was there, this would actually fit better over here, and.... "
it's currently a bit of work that keep evolving, but I hope to see it to fruition one day.....
(or I'll just end up as a guy living in my van down by the river.... LOL)
Jeramie
Just going back through my post and pics...
You can plainly see:
We use Lemon Scented Lysol spray kitchen cleaner, I like to go barefoot, We love Dr. Pepper, we just bought a head of lettuce and an onion, and we have a brake fluid leak.....
wow, the stuff you learn about people online... LOL
I started out in a horse trailer (w/RV built in) ..then a motorhome but quickly moved underground as it was too cold above ground.... :)
Caught some of that..... rofl
As you continue posting you will watch camera angles like I do to keep the 6 extension cords in one plug from showing (my place - not yours)... [ouch]
6 plugs in one outlet???
um, are you sure your talking about your place and not mine...
OH WAIT... that's right,
mine's not built yet...
right,
but you know, when it is and all... well, some things seem to need power where they seem to need power...
Just sayin.....
Yup... the cords are all UL approved so what is the problem [ouch] :)
Actually I wired the pantry and laundry the other day and don't need the plugs where they are - just didn't feel like changing them yet.
.....and the loads are all small so it's no big deal.... It's not like I'm running the shop down here..... the shop....
Now that's another story.... [waiting]
I seem to vaguely recall a pic of your wiring skills in your thread somewhere...
and if I recall correctly it involved a bunch of wires, :o and a garden hose ??? and a goat... :-\
or something...
WAIT.. that might have been a different set of pics... [rofl2]
J/K Just having a bit of fun.... ;D
Ummm ... I don't know if anyone has really seen my wiring skills when I care to do it right ...as opposed to.. that'll work....git 'er dun..... [waiting]
I actually did cable splicing for the phone company for a bit, and my uncle taught me how to do a great job wiring houses..... I wired sloper blades and A/C electronics on Caterpillar tractors.....
It's just that I use what I have... know what will work... and have a low sense of pride in my work when I do it for myself...sometimes.... OK ... most of the time.....I call my style, Rustic Functional....no obsessive compulsive disorder here..... [ouch]
Jeramie, I'm sure others didn't want to bring this up but... cardboard will not work for your walls underground. ???
Quote from: Weasel on January 30, 2011, 02:58:16 PM
Jeramie, I'm sure others didn't want to bring this up but... cardboard will not work for your walls underground. ???
What's with that waxed cardboard from the produce boxes? That might hold up better.
Darn it! and here I thought I was really onto a new technique, eco-friendly, recyclable, inexpensive...
Back to the drawing board I guess!!! LOL
There are a lot of above ground cardboard shelters in Fresno..... a growing trend with the burst housing bubble... the waxed ones would be considered a luxury. [waiting]
Here is a few pics of the model once I got the walls on, hadn't added the after-thought pantry off the kitchen, 'walled in' the upper room closets, put the floor in or the 'soil' levels, or mocked up the roof at this point, just trying to get a more visual idea of possible window placement and such...
(https://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb90/jeramiez/2011-01-30220004.jpg)
(https://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb90/jeramiez/2011-01-30220048.jpg)
(https://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb90/jeramiez/2011-01-30220115.jpg)
(https://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb90/jeramiez/2011-01-30220756_SanAntonio_Texas_US.jpg)
I think I got an approval from the cat...
(https://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb90/jeramiez/2011-01-30220900_SanAntonio_Texas_US.jpg)
(https://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb90/jeramiez/2011-01-30220923_SanAntonio_Texas_US.jpg)
The model is looking cool, Jeremie.
Nice to be in a world where all you need is the approval of the cat.... [waiting]
...I do kind of miss seeing the feet though.... [ouch]
A plan related question for the masses:
(please excuse the rough plan drawings using MSPaint)
ok, reconsidering the lower end of the house, the area planned for the 4 'children's bedrooms' and the second bathroom currently looks like this:
(https://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb90/jeramiez/present.jpg)
However, after some thought, perhaps another bathroom might be necessary for the 4 children...
preliminary thoughts are to place one on each side of the hallway...
the 'first thought' process says to place the bathrooms in between the bedrooms to provide 'equal access' and turn the end of the hallway into a location for a devoted water heater and a wood stove for house heating...
but no other real benefit that I currently see...
(https://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb90/jeramiez/middle.jpg)
on further thought, locating the bathrooms at the lower end of the house might place them closer to the 'considered' spot of the septic system below the house...
(and allow for easier modification of the model.... he he he)
but no other real benefit that I currently see...
(https://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb90/jeramiez/bottom.jpg)
or, placing them further 'uphill' might 'sound insulate' the bedrooms from the living room and laundry room areas and drive morning traffic towards the main part of the house... and allow a larger 'room' area at the end of the hallway, perhaps an area for a grey-water storage tank etc....
but no other real benefit that I currently see...
(https://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb90/jeramiez/top.jpg)
but then there is the idea of placing them in tandem on one side of the hall, allowing for another room to be added on the other side, or making the hallway branch like an upside down 'T' and placing them off the sides or with another room at the end of the hallway.... or more...
(It's probably late enough for me to be 'over-thinking' this really!!!!)
But I was wondering what other opinions might be.... if any...
personally I hate hallways, waste of space, the cabin I am renting right now has one, for no structural or design reason what so ever, that wastes about 40 square feet of a 600 square foot cottage, you have to pay to construct them, then it is additional volume you must heat cool and light.
jeramiez :
The land looks pretty awesome ...nice creek..very cool.
Land is so important. Keep you design fluid b/c a well done house will work with the landscape. Its impossible to fit a house without knowing what the land is about. Some book I've read have said to just "sit" at the land ...taking it in..this way you can make educated design that works with it rather then trying to fit the predetermined house into something that wont work.
Question. Who is building this? Are you paying someone or do you want to do a lot of it yourself? Be careful of making the project so big that you never finish it. I tend to like the idea of building a small initial structure..completing it (kids share rooms etc) then it will become aparent what next addition you can make. I have also seen those concrete bunkers take so much it almost kills the people trying to build. Working with wood allows constant adaption ...if your using wood you can take advantage of that. ;D
So excited...will def follow this with you..best of luck
jeff
I agree w/Speedfunk. We started small & kept adding on & we're still not finished d* :D
Initially we planned on building a regular stick house up on top of the ridge & started out w/just an 8'x8' for the batteries & a "real" bathroom! It evolved from there :o That's part of living on the land & seeing what your options are. We didn't have the money to build a conventional house anyway.
Your plans look good but it is really quite ambitious - digging all of that out of the ground, finding the logs - are you going to mill all your own boards? It's been an adventure for us - sometimes I get frustrated that there's still a lot to be finished but it is very comfortable & I really like the way it all looks (even if there is some uncovered insulation & other "details"). Glenn is definitely "rustic functional" as he described himself, c*
He has an incredible imagination & thoroughly researches everything he does but has a bit of ADDH heh so always has a million projects going! I'm just the gofer & clean up crew. I've done my share of digging, jackhammering, hauling stuff, stucco work, sanding, finishing doors, shelves, floors etc. I even sat up on the top of the logs pressure washing them w/the ground 16 ft below... my body is playing traitor now so can't quite do as much.
Make it a family project - the kids can do lots of stuff & it will be learning experience at the same time. There's a lot of people on the forum who've made it a family affair & it has really been a great experience.
Keep dreaming - I love how you've built models - one of these days your dream will come true! (that's kinda corny, lol)
Paint is a great tool for roughing out drawings.
I also am not a fan of hallways and prefer to arrange rooms - offset rooms from a main room etc to eliminate hallways.
We have 3 wood stoves so we can heat areas as we choose.
As Jeff mentioned - seeing the land and fitting the house to it helps. I find that wider is sometimes easier than long down hill due to elevation drops and keeping sufficient drainage. My lowest pitch is about 2 1/2:12
Well I have to say hello,
I am The other Half of this project and I am Most of the reason the house is a bit big... (But I tend to think Big..lol)
I Love The design of this house though Jeramiez has toiled away at trying to figure out how to make it a dream come true.. I love construction projects and cant wait to get this one started.. Even though Patience is not my strong suite...
You guys have alot of great comments and cant wait to read more... Hopefully we Will have more pictures for you as the model gets done and we get to visit the land...
This is shaping up to be a great adventure indeed ;D
PS.. Sassy I love corny [cool] so keep'em up...lol
w* Surprisetiger! Glad you came aboard :) This is a great forum - I was nervous about 1st signing on - didn't think I had much to say although I guess I've said a lot since then ::)
Glenn & I remodeled his house when we got married - totally gutted the kitchen, took out walls, put new flooring, carpet, cabinets, appliances, sinks - we'd get off regular work & then work on the house until midnight or later sometimes. We had a lot of energy back then being newlyweds & all heh
Anyway, we survived that & have been working on this place for almost 9 yrs... it's definitely a work in progress...
Thanks for the welcome Sassy,
I do have a background in construction so I cant wait to get started on this.. Though at times it seems overwhelming.
But working as a team I know it will be, not only hard work d*, but fun along the way. :)
I have so many ideas for the inside that At times I drive him crazy.. HE is always telling me "lets just get it built 1st" ..lol
Thats my Impatiences creeping in...But hey Like I said I love to dream big, but i guess thats why I have him, to keep me grounded most of the time.. ::)
anti corridor here too !
Note I only have 1 child that lives with me............so I'm no expert
but would kids not prefer a large kids clubhouse area, and just have small bed "caves' to sleep in
Thank you all for your input... Lots to think about here...
I have always been Pro-Hallway... (and yet always lived above ground as well.... LOL)
I feel hallways provide for a defining environment charge to areas... i.e. once you enter the hallway it should be a quieter area, because it states "bedrooms are present"... and I find that guests are less likely to wander down hallways then peer into areas offset of common areas... To me, hallways seem to provide defining areas for different 'energy' levels, and (although I may be a bit strict...) rule defining limits as well... i.e. "when you get up, teeth and hair should be brushed by the time you reach the end of the hallway, after 9pm all lights out past the hallway," stuff like that... LOL
living in a 2 story at the moment... and I find people seem to feel free to wander the ground floor during get togethers, but people rarely brave going upstairs, and telling the kids that in the mornings, they should have 1, 2, and 3 done before they come down stairs seems to work well enough...
Another concept that made me strongly consider hallways is that plumbing, electric, etc... could be routed along the hallway.... the idea being that it's easier to repair, replace, add something down a hallway then to have to work in a bedroom space for a while...
these are all just "first thoughts" mind you...
I agree strongly with the idea of actually being on the land and "feeling" it out before setting the build in stone as it were... LOL
and somehow I think the model will end up in a revered place in the house showing how much we actually deviated from a grand idea... LOL
Most of the work we hope to be able to accomplish and perform on our own, knowing that there may be things we have to seek hired help to accomplish.... and involving the kids is definatly a priority... luckily they have all been witness to the model build and a lot of communication on the project and all love the idea... and have GREAT questions all the time... like "if the house in underground, where does the driveway go?" and "if the front door is underground, can we build a slide from the top to the front door?" The youngest is 6, the oldest 11... but they are pretty excited to get their hands dirty on the project... the second child even did a school project on the house when they had to do a report about a famous piece of architecture, (even though the house isn't even built, or famous yet for that matter,) she still said it was famous to us and sited how there were many famous underground pieces of architecture and tied it together well enough to get an A from her teacher aside from the comments from classmates saying there was no such thing as an underground building... LOL
Anyway, I digressed a bit...
Like the "clubhouse/kids bed-caves" idea... something to think about....
The general plan is to rent in a small town... (less then 100 people) for what we think might be a year or two when we first relocate, our land being 9 miles away, and the large town being 15 miles away... (Thomasville and West Plains MO. respectively...) and build to a 'foothold' construction before moving in and living on site while we expand...
I say we start with the kid areas and have them share rooms and such while we build and complete the kitchen/living room/master, her idea is the exact opposite... (she'll probably win that one... ::) )
We def plan on building with wood and hopefully using some of the timber from the land itself... through my research I have found that in the small town, one of the last surviving businesses is a "wood products" company... basically a mill that sells timber of most sorts, and tools to work trees into timber... hoping to take advantage of that, buy needed tools, and perhaps rough-grade 'leftovers' to render into construction material and provide some cash flow into the small community....
Tried to answer as many ideas/questions/ and concerns as possible without dropping in quotes...
I am always happy to answer any questions or entertain any ideas on the topic... (or off the topic.... LOL) as it keeps the ideas growing and forming.... Got a bit of the adhd/ocd myself... and sometimes my better half comes home after working the night shift to a 20 minute 'spilling of the mind through the mouth' about something I've recently researched... she listens politely, then asks the important question of: "And how does the apply right now?" usually followed by my answer of "I'm not sure yet..." to which she usually asks: "how much sleep did you get last night?" LOL
Sounds like you are definitely giving it all some thought, Jeramie.
It is nice to support the local businesses when you can and you will find that most of the time it is to your benefit to network with the locals.
Exactly Glenn,
the small community we are thinking of moving into has seen a drastic decline in pop over the last couple of years...
lost their store and gas station and such... had near 1500 pop 10 years ago... that's why we are thinking of renting there... we could give 'brand name-X corporation' our rent money in the big town, or give our rent money to someone that may wish to keep the family house that's been through 6 generations but they may have to sell due to the times of today... that's our thought at least... and the old town school was turned into a library and civic/social center... so we started there on our search... the librarian didn't live in town and they advised us to contact a local rancher who knew everyone in the area and might have an idea of who owns/needs what... but advised us that the local minister and family just moved out of their home to go to another state.. so there are places available... we shall see where that lead leads as it were....
we plan on relocating around June so time seems to be on our side at this point, but time does pass rather quickly... LOL
People like that rancher are people you need to know. I find that and extra half hour or so shooting the bull often leads to discussions of other things that some day may be useful to know also.
Quote from: glenn kangiser on February 19, 2011, 06:20:58 PM
Sounds like you are definitely giving it all some thought, Jeramie.
It is nice to support the local businesses when you can and you will find that most of the time it is to your benefit to network with the locals.
The characters you will meet is just priceless.. From the guys at the local store in the back lot helping with materials huddled around the burn barrel when its 0 degrees... Good stuff
so, not really much has happened lately to require an update... aside from me dreaming and pondering and writing up lists of things to do, get, think about... LOL
then it happened, just sitting around the other evening, and the better half looks over and states that spring break is coming up... I'm like, ok, what's that all about? so she goes into describing how long her kids will be out of school, and such, and throws out the idea of us making a trip to go north and see the land....
so, we toss the idea around a bit,
and now the plan is to head up there in about a week and a half, drop off the "short people" with her mother who lives about 2 hours (the way I drive) or 20 mins (the way she drives) but actually 1.5 hours away (per mapquest....) and head up and tent camp on the land for a night or two, and hopefully in that time be able to...
1. walk the land and map out where the springs, rocks, cliffs, creek, flat areas, big trees, building sites, etc. are, get a "real" feel for the land, and have things to really fit into considerations for the next few months. (it will be our first 'in person' view/visit to the land we bought...)
2. take a look at the small town nearby I mentioned, and speak in person with "the guys at the local store in the back lot helping with materials huddled around the burn barrel" and people I have contacted on the phone about rental properties and such. LOL
3. take tons of pics and vids for reference and just darn viewing pleasure...
4. check out the larger town nearby and inquire in person about certain jobs we have looked up online, get a look at the schools, etc.
then, pick up the kiddos and maybe head back to the land to show them what we found and get their thoughts and excitement up... perhaps camp for a night, and head back....
so that was the plan... then I remembered it's barely march... and though warm/hot down south here... might still have snow there... LOL but she's ok with that, and says if it gets too cold, she'll just sleep in the truck... LOL
time to recall some of the winter survival outings I went on when I was growing up in MT, and dig out the winter survival kit I used to keep in the car... (it has the hand warmers and space blankets in it... LOL)
(she wanted to buy new sleeping bags...
I was like, "why? we have a bunch!"
she said, "ok then we have to dig them out of storage and wash them before we go..."
I was like, "why? they were clean when we put them in there 6 months ago!"
she just looked at me sideways and said "ew!"
I think that somehow she won that one... I'm just not sure how though!!!!!) ???
:) So We saw the land and it is sooo pretty and now we cant wait to get up there...JeramieZ made us a great camp and then we walked the majority of the 14 acres. He will post pics as soon as we get back on the computer.
The slope was a deep steeper than I thought (but I guess he knew..lol)...and alot more rock but I think it has great character and awesome engery I wish we could have just stayed....
More later...Smiles
It's great when you find that special piece of property :)
I totally agree....
Sounds great, you two.....
Finally got to see the land.
Reminds me of an old song by the Marshall Tucker Band... Property Line....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mmIZL5YqXrQ
Always love a new underground project to follow! Look forward to you getting started. :)
Alrighty.... Lets see...
Really good trip which started out at Suprisetiger's Mom's house about 2 hrs from the land...
While chatting and wandering her yard, we saw "smoke" billowing out of a beautiful tree she had just bragged about wanting to light up at Christmas... Being the brave guy I am, I dove into the lower branches trying to find the flame to extinguish... but could only find more smoke.... and after about 5 minutes of me rummaging through the branches... it was suggested that the tree might just be pollinating... an idea I refused to accept, and to prove my point, I jumped up and slapped a higher branch and was immediately "dusted".... and shortly there after discovered I was probably a bit allergic as I had uncontrollable sneezing and was breaking out in hives.... :( LOL (I can laugh about it now!!!) a short "decontaminating" shower later and some little white pill that was given to me and I was good as new... d*
I give you: The tree of DOOOM!!!!
(https://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb90/jeramiez/2011-03-12103929_Laneville_Texas_US.jpg)
(luckily none were spotted on our little piece of heaven...)
after some visiting and a bout of elevation acclimation, we headed up to the property knowing it was sleeting and the projected high was low 40s and a low below freezing....
A couple of pics of the "roads" leading to the place:
(https://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb90/jeramiez/2011-03-15153934.jpg)
(https://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb90/jeramiez/2011-03-15151735.jpg)
Arrived on sight, pitched camp just in time to think, "Wow it gets dark here fast!" ;)
spent a chilly night that wasn't too unbearable, and once the coffee had been percolated, we began to explore...
Some general pics of the place:
(https://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb90/jeramiez/2011-03-15113153.jpg)
(https://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb90/jeramiez/2011-03-15110719.jpg)
(https://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb90/jeramiez/2011-03-15120301.jpg)
(https://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb90/jeramiez/2011-03-15120805.jpg)
(https://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb90/jeramiez/2011-03-15121450.jpg)
(https://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb90/jeramiez/2011-03-15121427.jpg)
(https://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb90/jeramiez/2011-03-15110152.jpg)
And the stream:
(https://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb90/jeramiez/2011-03-15135605.jpg)
(https://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb90/jeramiez/2011-03-15104158.jpg)
(https://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb90/jeramiez/2011-03-15122123.jpg)
(https://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb90/jeramiez/2011-03-15122139.jpg)
(https://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb90/jeramiez/2011-03-15135657.jpg)
A rock formation we have began calling "The Grotto":
(https://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb90/jeramiez/2011-03-15130002.jpg)
(https://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb90/jeramiez/2011-03-15130048.jpg)
And a ledge nearby that I shall someday use to preach to my gathered masses: ;D (kidding of course!!! ;) )
(https://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb90/jeramiez/2011-03-15130956.jpg)
And just for fun, I should include;
our fearless companions who were small enough to take the journey with us... (the 4 big guys had to stay home...)
(https://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb90/jeramiez/2011-03-15131049.jpg)
They weren't quite so keen on the idea of breaking camp...
(https://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb90/jeramiez/2011-03-15144021.jpg)
One of the locals who showed up to introduce themselves...
(https://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb90/jeramiez/2011-03-15143929.jpg)
And finally, our very own Bigfoot sighting...
(https://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb90/jeramiez/2011-03-15120254.jpg)
Driving some of the backroads we discovered a couple of sleepy little towns and a few mills with stacks and piles of materials I am eager to start asking about...
After a long trip home, lots of conversation, and consideration, we have contacted the seller about the possibility of purchasing the 14 acres connecting to the north as well... we shall see how that goes...
and of course, the proposed date for relocation of this June could not come soon enough!!!
I might have videos to link after I convert and host them...
Well He forgot to mention how peaceful it was up there. It just takes your breathe way how quite it is.
Time almost stands still as you look down over the land or standing near the stream. The water taste like snow and is just as cold. ;)
I cant wait till We get up there and can be there all the time... Sooo excited but so much to do before June..lol
P.S. I was the one who suggest to "Captain Fire Man" That the tree was pollinating ::)
Huggles and ;)
Suprisetiger...
Pic of your property #8 would lead me to believe you have a natural spring there....
When advertised they stated that the land had a year round creek and several natural springs... I was hoping to do a real search for said springs but the leaf pack was just to intense for the time we had... the rock outcroppings like in #6 and #7 were dripping like sieves, but as I had mentioned, there was wet weather the day before....
Locating the springs would be #1 before thinking where to build...
My thought as well!!!
We plan to do a more intensive search/perusal of the land in June when we relocate near the property and have more time and hopefully better weather on our side!!!
This was our first view of the land, and more of a 'feel it out', 'see what we got ourselves into', kinda trip... LOL
Very nice land, Jeramie and Surprisetiger.
Any possibilities of water power from the creek? Enough fall to be usable?
The land looks awesome! Congrats . How long is the ride?
Very excited for you..It sound like your are too... :)
Glenn,
I'd have to do a little more research for a definite answer on that, but it seems unlikely, the creek seems to lie pretty flat at the lower end of the property... It is something we will look into... definitely have desire to use wind power, and possibly solar...
Speed,
The trip took about 12 hours each way,
(but that's because SHE was driving... LOL)
with me driving it'd be more like 16... LOL
There are a few towns we are considering for relocating this June, each about 15 - 20 miles from the land which we figure would be a good start to actually getting some work done up there....
I would plan on a hybrid power system... some wind - some solar. More than one chance of power that way.
you forgot about 'kid power' LOL
get a bunch of stationary bikes hooked up to generators and make them pedal for their dinner... LOL
While we were up there, we grabbed a bunch of the fallen leaves to bring back and identify the trees we had. We brought home about a dozen to find that we seem to have a large assortment of Maple, and Oak, and some Elm...
Anything important that I should keep in mind or consider when using these woods for building or burning?
WAIT... WAIT... wait......
Should I be pissed off that sundials do not "self adjust" for 'daylight savings time' ???
I think I should be.......
I would just reduce loading as Mike suggested - to say about max of 18 inches if dirt.. possibly more if organics, since not using species specified by his engineer, but he also reduced loading for his projects too.
sorry Glenn... you lost me there.... LOL ???
was that a response to me asking about the wood on our land..... d*
it's been a while so I'm not sure... lets get back on track...
apparently my jokes don't quite interpret well on-line... lol
so... what I get from Glenns last response is that although I might be dealing with what I have found online is determined to be "hardwood" I can't use it unless I reduce the load... but wait... it's hardwood.... not to be a prick here, but wait... it's hardwood... so I should be able to increase the load...
or am I WAY confused.....??????
Well Jeremie... I don't know what to say except that sometimes soft wood is more durable than hard wood. Possibly because it has more flex to it, it is not prone to sudden failure.... and you know, you don't even want to go there.... [waiting]
Quote
What Is Hardwood?
Don't let the name fool you; hardwood is not necessarily strong wood. Hardwood comes in various shapes, colors, and strengths.
Due to the seed process, hardwood (generally) has more density than softwood. This can often make it better for jobs that need support or strength. This does not mean that it will always be the best choice for strength, however. Balsa wood is a fairly brittle wood that is considered hard. There are various types of hardwood that could be good for your project. These include Oak, Cherry, Beech, and Maple. This also includes wood such as Ash, Holly, Boxwood, Ebony, and Mahogany.
What Is Softwood?
Softwood does not always mean "soft", as in weak. Softwood often refers to the fact that it is "softer" than hardwood, meaning that it is easier to bend and ply without breaking. While soft and malleable, it is still durable and strong. There are various types of softwood, but the most popular are Cypress, Larch, and any Evergreen tree.
Read more: http://www.doityourself.com/stry/softwood-vs-hardwood--whats-best-for-your-project#ixzz1KPEMeuYp
That site is for furniture, but Mikes engineer specified specific wood types so I would still reduce loading when dealing with unknown wood qualities unless you research it and find it to be superior in strength to the wood the engineer specified.. That's just my view , and of course... I am not an engineer... [ouch]
Gotcha Glenn... I'll look into it.....
still mad about the sundials though... LOL :P
a long time since an update....
Been busy boxing up the two housholds that will eventually become one... and saving money for the u-haul caravan that we will take in the beginning of July...
Found out recently that due to the severe weather Missouri has had the past few months, the main road to the land we purchased "washed away"... it seemed to be seepage rock filling in an old run-off creek bed anyway.... Thinking culverts might be something to consider down the road...
Other than that... it's just been getting ready for the big move...
but we are still out here, still breathing, still planning and researching....
and getting really tired of taping boxes.... LOL
Stay Dry, Jeramie. :)
Well, we are on our way... cleared out the house we are in, secured a place to live near our land... tonight and tomorrow we finish loading the u-haul trailer and start the 14hr trip that begins this great adventure!!!!
Thats very exciting!!
Congrats
A quick update from my phone, more and pics to come when I can locate my laptop...
Got up to mo just fine though it was slow going...
Secured a 28' travel traier on a property nearby that's not being used, a generator powerful enough to run everything but the a/c...
Unloaded the u-haul into a storage unit in town and set up camp...
Around day three I built a log structure holding a tote rigged with a garden hose to act as a temporary gravity fed solar shower and my 3 pit barBQ kitchen... lol
Scouted the land and found a perfect location for the house, marked a rough area to dig out and started removing some of the smaller trees...
Found a travel trailer that needs restoration for a few hundred bucks which will include having it moved to a small temporary spot near the build site...
Found out someone used to grow grapes up here a long time ago, but the vines have gone wild and are spred over the mountain, apparently in spring you can gather a good harvest...
Christy got her first tick of many and apparently horseflies think she's yummy....
The adventure begins... looking forward to updates, Jeramie.
thats pretty awesome. Glad you are moving closer. To build that house with a 16 hour drive I would imagine to be really tricky. Stay positive. Living in the travel trailer is not that bad...except the fact it heats up like a tin can and cools off like one to. I know my wife and I our looking forward to getting into a high mass thermally sound home lol.
GL with the next stages!!
Let's see if I can figure out how to get these from photobucket to here with my phone...
(https://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb90/jeramiez/imagejpeg_2.jpg)
(https://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb90/jeramiez/imagejpeg_2_2.jpg)
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With so many rocky shelf outcroppings
have you worried about depth ?
Ie the soil thats there seems to be only lightly covering the bedrock
One of the eroded vally's or the groto may end up being the only spots where you could dig in using the existing depth change from one shelf to the next and scap soil up and arround the sides, with the natural rock as the rear wall
It was something we considered... the rock outcroppings end mostly around 800 ft and we plan to build around 920 ft with the creek at 740 ft... the land near the ridge is mostly rock littered clay... C wanted to use one of the rock outcroppings as a natural wall, but we found that they drip and seep a lot of water durring the wetter seasons so it seemed impractical...
I do think the initial dig will definately lead us to discover what's actually under the top layer and we may find ourselves mostly berming as an alternative...
Looks like fun, Jeramie, and I see you have the barbecue going..... that's the important thing.
Just a quick update and more pics to come soon I hope...
Well, things have changed a bit but for the better and should be moving along a bit more soon...
As luck would have it a 20 acre parcel on the other side of the lower creekside easement road came available... and the advantages outweighed the negatives so we ended up signing a purchase agreement...
Met the guy who owns the land that the easement road dead ends into... nice guy, owns 200 acres he treats like a nature preserve... liked what we were planning on doing especially since we were keeping the big power lines out of the equation... dropped off a couple packages of beef short ribs, checked up on us after a pretty good thunder storm, and offered us a chainsaw he no longer has use for...
He also informed us the the creek has a tendency to wash out the road a bit during heavier spring rains and can be impassable for a few days... not cool...
Taking that into account and some other things mentioned by folks here, the new parcel seemed to fit a better bill... less large rock outcroppings with the ground mostly fist size and smaller rocks and clay... better access on the east side easment road with more of the creek and creek road to the west at the bottom of the slope facing our first purchase, a good clearing to set up a basecamp, and an outhouse less then 4 months old... LOL
Spoke with the guy that grades the road and fills the washouts and he mentioned that a spot on the parcel where he used to get road fill is down to a good clay base that should hold water and make a nice spot for a pond...
Did a rough flag marking of where we want the house on the new property, saving the old site for a later build or a little get-away cabin down the road... and looking to start cutting down trees this coming week...
Took a bunch of pics, but working from my phone at the moment, so will post them soon...
Great. Maybe room for a cow or two somewhere in there.
Quote from: jeramiez on January 31, 2011, 02:51:15 AM
A plan related question for the masses:
...
on further thought, locating the bathrooms at the lower end of the house might place them closer to the 'considered' spot of the septic system below the house...
(and allow for easier modification of the model.... he he he)
but no other real benefit that I currently see...
(https://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb90/jeramiez/bottom.jpg)
I actually registered here because I wanted to share my thoughts here but I kinda forgot... Fixing that now.
I liked this setup because first thing that came in my mind was simple central heating with water radiators. Granted, it probably is overkill* but similar has worked in my parent's house built in the 1932. System has no water pump, just the furnace is in the basement and hot water goes up to the living floor radiators and returns when it's cold. Because this house is planned to be elevated at one end, that setup would also work.
* I have no idea how hot/cold it can be there. We have enjoyed here almost +35C summers and -35C winters in the last two years. Even colder in Lappland part of Finland.
This system basically heated all hot water used. At first furnace was burning both wood and oil but I hardly remember ever oil being used, I do remember well carrying all the wood though. When I moved out ~20 years ago, they switched to oil after couple weeks that winter. I felt cheated a bit :D
Since my parents are nearing 60 now, system has been slowly upgraded in the last years. Electric heater for smaller water tank was added to allow showering at summertime without need to put on fire. Furnace was upgraded to use pellets instead of wood, oil wasn't been used for years before that.
As far as I remember, the house was originally built without running water, it had not wc but an outhouse behind the barn. The whole central heating was retrofitted later (60's) and a toilet added in the main floor, shower and sauna was built in the basement.
Trivia bit:
Last summer a movie was shot there and it made local newspaper at least (http://www.ts.fi/online/talous/150947_515h.jpg). Still waiting for premiere, should be in january 2012.
Since the house was built right after WW2, the foundation is really thick stone outside (about 40x40x70cm pieces) with concrete inside and the basement is designed to be shelter. Just add sandbags to the small windows in the foundation.
I don't mean that you should now do system as this is but it might give ideas to someone else reading these boards like I have done for a while now.
Quote from: jeramiez on July 25, 2011, 10:35:40 PM
Let's see if I can figure out how to get these from photobucket to here with my phone...
(https://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb90/jeramiez/IMG_20110722_144921.jpg)
[cool]
nice to see what I believe is an old school New Braunsfels "hondo" smoker owner.
I have a few smokers myself but love that particular design.
(http://www.loopy.org/pictures/galleries/.misc/_thumbs/640x480-2011-02-06_09.59.00.jpg)
(http://www.loopy.org/pictures/galleries/.misc/_thumbs/640x480-dscf6610.jpg)
It is indeed a New Braunsfels Hondo... brought with me from Texas, picked up years ago in Scherts, right outside New Braunsfels... (and San Antonio) it was one of the few items I insisted on bringing, (even over more shovels... lol)
As I was putting it in the trailer, Christy was asking if I "had" to bring it.... my simple answer was "um, yeah..." lol she is glad I did now though!
It has served me well over the years and hopefully will continue to do so...
(Hers is the boxy thing made by charcoal or something... it works as a decent backup I guess... LOL)
Nice pics by the way! Glad you shared them!
@KLF... thanks for your post! I had an uncle who built his house incorporating copper coils in the subfloor which he could circulate hot water from his water heater to provide radiant heat, a similar idea... not sure which method we will land on when the time comes but it's great to have as many ideas as possible!
Trying to be useful here :D
Underfloor heating was considered here as premium before and usually it was found only in bathrooms, if at all. It's more common now in new houses though, relative price has come down. However I think it's usually electric.
Most houses built from 60's to 80's had their water pipes built into the walls but since the 90's they are left visible. Reason for that is pretty simple, it's easier to detect leaks when water pours on the floor instead of inside the wall. My current apartment house I live in was built in -76.
https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-0TJyqY2HnlI/TkwsDZ7wMiI/AAAAAAAAAJ0/0B2j4rmEjlQ/s576/IMAG0261.jpg
Snapped a picture from my kitchen corner. Thermostat, little bit radiator and some water pipes that disappear into the floor... (this is actually 9th floor apartment, first in my family to live so high... :D). Windows were replaced couple years before I moved in. They don't fit 100% and they snap, crackle and pop when sun heats them and again when they cool down after sundown. That's the reason for the crack under the window.
I also edited my previous post, as mom called and I remembered to ask some details. That house was actually built in 1932, before the war (but expecting one) and water pipes were added 30 years later in the 60's.
KLF, wouldn't you know it, went into town today to just poke around since the kids are in school for their second day and we could have some "adult" shopping time... the town we went to only has like 900 people, but they have a second hand thrift store, the old school "looks like a disorganized yard sale inside" kind, (we asked them what the huge wheel and chain set up in the back corner was and they informed us it was the manually operated elevator to the basement...) and in the far back, there were 2 rather large, i'd say 2.5 feet tall and close to 4 feet long radiators, asked about them and were told they were the old steam radiators for heating that came out of the old school house.... wouldn't have even thought to ask about them before... they were reasonably priced and we plan to pick them up next week if they are still there... looks like we might use it for part of the system anyway...
That sounds great. I'm really looking forward to see how your project advances, I've been interested in underground-ish building myself as a thought.
I think I have a bad habit to write a lot and still forget what I was saying ;D
My main thought in one sentence was: "Properly designed system will work without electricity, so it's perfect for off-the-grid system." Just in case someone else reads this thread and wonders what the eff I'm babbling here with my long replies.
Lol, don' worry, your making perfect sence. And trust me when I say that I have been called wordy on more than one occasion!
Well, with winter right around the corner, we have focused on our rebuild project... rebuild is probably too gentle of a word here...
The travel trailer we bought felt it time to truley show us why we got it so cheap in that almost all the wood was rotted out.... spent most of the past week do a little more than gutting it... we got it down to the iron flatbed frame, setting aside anything and everything that was salvagable, from windows and doors to screws and hinges...
The next step is to start building on it...
We moved the frame over to a side spot on the
new 20 and drew up some rough plans for a 10 x 30 cabin to bebuild on top of it...
Now the fun begins...
Not meaning to dredge up old stuff, but guess who is still here making progress to our project...lol
Thought I would see if I could log in, and perhaps start to gather some update material to post soon...
Excited to catch everyone up...
Be back soon...
Cheers
We all like pictures...please update. :)
Yes definitely would like to hear more!