cesspool construction

[AK fisherman]

Greetings,
I've been lurking for a year or so and finally decided to join up. I don't know if this is the correct forum or not, so moderators, move if necessary!

I live in CA and spend summers in AK as a commercial fisherman. I've got an offer in on a fishing operation that comes with a very rural cabin constructed on the beach next to the bluff well above high water. For the past 25yrs, the owner has just used an outhouse at the beach cabin as he had a home 10 miles away where they slept/showered/ate etc on days they weren't fishing.

I will need to live in the cabin with my crew of 4 for 5 weeks every summer and I need some improvements! I plan to add onto the 15 x 24 cabin (A frame type with 4' tall sidewalls) and put 2 more bedrooms and a full bath/laundry. I will use both the existing generator and propane for the needed utilities. Water is trucked in with 55 gal barrels but I think I can get some water from a spring up on top of the bluff and with a big enough storage tank, should get decent pressure. The cabin is built on pilings in the sand and just 15' or so feet away the sand turns to rock similiar to the rock used to lay leach pipe on. I would like to dig a cesspool in the sandy area that would handle the toilet/clothes washer/shower. The question is, how big to make it and out of what materials? I envision a large pit with the septic line running straight from the house to the cesspool framed with , railroad ties?, cinder blocks?, metal or plastic tank with the bottom cut out of it? Would this work? Any suggestions would be appreciated.

Thanks,

Lance
Kenai AK
Chico CA

[glenn kangiser]

Welcome to the forum, Lance. Chico -- home of Sierra Nevada Brewing?

Pressure will be .433 lbs per foot of elevation for every foot the spring is above the outlet - faucet etc.

http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=944.msg7274#msg7274

This thread is for an engineered system but has a lot of stuff that applies ot a normal system also.

Here, something similar would require 100 feet of 6 foot deep trench or 200 feet of 3' deep trench (min. 5 feet above ground water)--perforated pipe would be about 6 inches under the gravel on top with straw or filter fabric over the gravel and topsoil cover.

There is a tank before the leach field - usually 2 compartment to float or settle solids then give clean effluent in the second compartment.  Daddymem recommends a filter on the outlet side to prevent problems with the drain field.  Wastline dumps into the tank.  You may be able to get a plastic tank locally , buy or build your own concrete tank or done properly, you could do it with ferrocrete -- strong cement, sand and chicken wire -and or  concrete reinforcing wire.

100 feet min from wells creeks etc - 50 feet from seasonal streams, swales etc. 

If you have an inspection requirement, the local authorities will want to approve what you do.

More info will probably be necessary for you to make a safe functional system.

Cesspools I think of are normally drilled to about 30 feet here-- the leach line would probably work better for you I assume.

[Daddymem]

The problem with cesspools or cesspits is that you get all the solids in there and they will eventually clog up the soil pores and you will have to pump it out but you still won't get the clogged pores clean and pumping will become more frequent.  My old house had a cesspit in these same sandy soils I am in now with the new house and we had to pump 3 times a year (all that we were allowed, actually could have used it 4 or 5 times a year and our washing machine and shower were connected to a separate pickle barrel drywell).  Get a tank in between the cesspool/pit and now you have more like a leaching galley that will only have to handle the liquids if you use tees or filters in the tank.  Many places simply outlawed cesspools/pits for good reason.

For the pit itself you could go precast but materials transport might be tough on that.  They make blocks that you stack to form a honeycomb similar to the precast units.  I've seen series of pickle barrels with holes drilled in them, barrels connected to each other with pvc solid pipe.  I've seen cinder block used too.  One thing I've seen common in all these configurations is failure over time.  Your seasonal use may keep you ok for a while but eventually all the solids will clog up the system.  So the question is how long will you have before it will need attention and is it worth it to you?

I'd suggest instead plastic arches after a plastic septic tank.  A lot easier for self construction and easy to transport and will last you a long time.  Of course check with the locals too, they will give you the best advice for what works and what is allowed.

[AK fisherman]

Thanks for the info and yes, home of Sierra Nevada Brewing!

The problem with any type of traditional type system is that I could never get septic truck down on the beach to pump a tank dry. I think I'll have to go with a traditional cesspool/pit and just plan on having to dig a new one every few years if needed and reroute the pipe from the cabin.

No codes/inspections outside the city limits so anything goes and it shows, boy there is some junk built up there!

Thanks,

Lance

[peternap]

You might also want to consider a composting system. The price is not bad at all considering the cost of a conventional system and you can install it in a day easy.

Once a year, just empty the composted contents in the pan in your flower garden.

For 6 people and seasonal use, cost is about 2600.00.

[rdzone]

Just some information on Alaskas waste water.

http://www.dec.state.ak.us/water/wwdp/onsite/homeowners.htm

http://www.dec.state.ak.us/water/wwdp/onsite/pdf/installer_manual_02-08-06.pdf



Chuck

[AK fisherman]

Thanks for the info Chuck, perhaps the composting toilet or outhouse is the way to go for "legality" sake!

Lance

[Daddymem]

Another one for my collection, thanks Chuck.  Interesting to see the differences across the country, you'd figure poo was poo.  We use 110 gpd/br around here, Alaskans use 40 gpd more???  The environmental differences resulting in design differences is very interesting too, especially after having lived there.

[peternap]

AK, the Sun Mar's are the best I've found...
http://www.sun-mar.com/prod_flush.html

Don't forget to make a greywater filter too!

[MountainDon]

Ah, Peter. Another question for you...

Have you first hand experience with the SunMar? Or have you just arrived at that from research? My research has come to conclude the SunMar is the best commercially available composting toilet. We're giving serious consideration to obtaining one.

And any words of wisdom on a greywater filter?

[NM_Shooter]

What about routing your gray water to a different drain field?  It would probably make your cesspool last longer.

[AK fisherman]

I've thought of routing the grey elsewhere. I'm now wondering how big a pool/pit I need..... Sure seemed like the rental toilet we used last summer filled up quickly each week with 5 guys using it! May have to look into the composting/incinerating units.

Lance

[glenn kangiser]

A grease trap would be good on a graywater line if going to a drainfield.