New Politics?

[John Raabe]

Here's an outline of some ideas I'm having about the changing political environment - your comments are appreciated... It seems pretty clear to me that the old political labels and motivations are not working well for people today. The floundering of the U.S. Democratic party (and to a lesser extent the Republicans) is perhaps a symptom of some sort of impending change. What might that change be? Could a new party develop? It has happened before when the landscape changed.

Sorry, this is a pretty sketchy outline - basically an idea in rough form. But I think you'll get that idea. And, like the old Right/Left polarity, most of us will find ourselves to be a blend of the new polarities as well. Someone said, "how is this different from extremists vs moderates?" - which I think is an interesting question (considering the shrinking supply of moderates in the world).

[size=12]Thoughts on Politics - 20th century ideas in the 21st century[/size]

20th century political poles
     Right - supports individuals/ pro business/ individual rights protected
     Left   - supports social groups/ pro labor/ social rights of "the people" trump individuals

possible 21st century political poles?
     Pragmatist - supports what works/ pro evolution/ pro trade/ pro communication/ politics is a non-zero sum game
     Ideologue   - supports what is right/ concerned with exercise of power & control/ politics is a zero sum game

A Pragmatist believes:
• The way it is is the way it is.
• We are where we are today because of evolving social and economic forces, trends and organizations. This natural conflict of interests must be worked with as we develop lasting solutions
• The future will be complex but probably better if we are willing to work with others
• The way to improve our situation is to understand these social and economic forces and use self-interest to create opportunities where all parties can gain (non-zero).
• Justice involves ignoring the past and encouraging a perspective where co-evolution and cooperation is possible.
• Us and Them

An Ideologue believes:
• The way it is is not the right way.
• We are where we are today because people control the political and economic system for their own enrichment. We can and should overcome this system, kick out the bad apples, and set things right.
• The future can be nearly perfect if we are strong and resolute
• The way to improve our situation is to clearly envision a goal in alignment with our beliefs and make the social and economic interests align with that goal. Take from the powerful and give to the oppressed (zero-sum).
• Justice involves making wrong doers pay.
• Us verses Them

Characteristics of the late 20th century and early 21st century political environment:

• Faster, easier and more targeted communication has increased the number of people
  who identify with political interest groups and its smaller subset of "the wronged".
  Examples:
   •  The rise of talk radio in the 1980's and the channeling and intensification
      of political anger.
   •  Websites, blogs and email allow very focused political and religious
      groups to unite and coordinate people of similar beliefs and commitment.
       •   Environmental eco-terrorist spiking trees
       •   Al-Qaeda martyrs
• Erosion of identification with one's nation state or country and greater identification with one's
  social, religious or special interest group.
   •   Media and marketing combine to create identity and support groups such as teens,
        Cuban exiles, etc.
   •   Text books in public schools must satisfy many special interest groups and result in
       "political correctness" and other "dumbing down" of the national culture.
   •   Internet communication allows both new ideas and conspiracy theories to quickly
        expand and multiply their effectiveness.

[Gerry Simpson(Guest)]

Thanks John,

Something like an autopsy on the body politic. We know its been sick. There has been ample warning it needed a change in lifestyle. We fear it has died of complications arising from willful denial of CONSENSUS; an untested treatment said to lower fever between individuals, ideologies, political parties, special interests, ego's, media and public perceptions. Alas, poor politic; We've known it well.

Like a crowded bar, it's become so overcrowded and smoke-filled we find ourselves shouting in one-anothers ear just to be heard. There appear to be so many destructive forces at work, a great many people are willing to leave. Its original thinking like yours that will create a platform for reason; a place where respected differences can ask for understanding and accept consensus as means to an end.

I've printed out your e-mail for a more lengthy look. A stimulating read.

Gerry  

[Sassy]

John, you should have known that if you opened up a topic to discuss politics etc, I'd jump right in with both feet!    

It seems to me that politics boils down to beliefs, which boils down to religious beliefs - we all have them whether we are atheists, evolutionists, Christians, Muslims, agnostics, Buddists, Jews etc.  I think most people are looking for "TRUTH" thus the exploration of religions, philosophies, science, materialism etc.  Our American society has become worshippers of materialism - which leads to greed & selfishness... coming from a "Christian" belief system, the following Biblical quotation seems to sum up the maliase that permeates our society...

"For men will be lovers of themselves, lovers of money, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy, unloving, unforgiving, slanderers, without self-control, brutal, despisers of good, traitors, headstrong, haughty, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God... always learning & never able to come to the knowledge of the truth."  2nd Timothy 2-5,7

No wonder the Muslim nations consider the United States "the Great Satan" ---after all, numerous polls report that the majority of Americans consider themselves "Christian" - but I would venture to say that only a minority have read the Bible or are as disciplined as the Muslims or many of the other religions...  

[Sassy]

What country should we invade next?  

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-2587661313510275113

John, do you think there's any hope for us?   :-/

[Amanda_931]

An evil little cat is going to help me write this!  Mr. Izzy Katz.  Sweet looking guy, but he bites and claws unexpectedly.  On the other hand if it gets colder than a two-dog night, he makes it a two-dog-and-a-cat night, and generally is nice and quiet about it.

I've been saying something sort of on that order for years.   Didn't get no respect for it a few years ago.  

Even though I think I remember reading that something very like that happened when the Republican party came into being before the Civil War.  That people coalesced around different poles.  Creating strange bedfellows from the point of view of ten years before.

Of course it has something to do with the fact that I'm the overeducated bum who worked in blue-collar jobs for over 30 years.

Tolerance is important.  But maybe the Hawaiian way--always recognizing the ethnicity of people, recognizing that culture and class do play an important role in how we live--is the way to go.  When I was there minorities were (or were close to) the majority (IIRC people of Japanese ancestry were the largest single group, somewhere around 45% of the population).  So everybody had quite a lot of experience with at least three or four different cultures, and, I expect, classes.  It didn't prevent the groups that came there last from being feared.  

(Maybe we should invade China, try to take over their central bank before they foreclose on us!)

[John Raabe]

Amanda - Tolerance is a good place to start. It can more easily arise in HI, I think, because of all the ethnic "invasions" those islands have experienced. But you are right, beyond tolerance is something more powerful.

Sassy - I do think there is hope. And that the human race is unstoppably headed toward higher evolution of the memes that have replaced genes for our further development. We do have many miles to go and the lessons might be hard - perhaps 2/3 of the current population will have to leave the planet for the perspective and healing to occur. That would be uncomfortable   for many - especially those of us who get our ticket punched.

But it's only our own puny physical life were talking about - not a big thing in the overall sweep of cosmic progress.

[glenn kangiser]

I'm not ready to try out my one way ticket yet, on the chance that it may go nowhere.  No one has been able to irrefutably prove to me that there is a next station.  I haven't talked to anybody that can prove they have actually been there or that it is there.

[Sassy]

Of course it has something to do with the fact that I'm the overeducated bum who worked in blue-collar jobs for over 30 years.

Amanda, just curious... you seem pretty knowledgeable in a lot of areas & have worked a lot of different jobs, especially building jobs... what did you major in?  And what types of jobs have you worked in/at?  (like Glenn, he's learned about a lot of things through the years)  I think it is interesting to find out about a person's background & experiences... especially, like here on CountryPlans where you feel like a community of friends.  Hope you don't mind me asking this.  
Kathy  

[John Raabe]

Glenn:

Yep, none of us know where the track runs. We get on board, watch the scenery go by, talk to the other passengers and then the conductor comes by, punches our ticket and we get off.

Nobody knows for sure what happens when we step off the train. The lights may simply go out, or we may catch another train, or there may be a town there with people and further adventures.

Lots of stories but very little certainty. "You pays yo' money and you takes yo' chances."

My own opinion is that somehow experience is recycled and becomes part of human evolution. But not in the sense of the preservation of the ego, or individual personality. Just like our molecules will become part of a tree that grows out of the graveyard, our experience is similarly flowing back to some reservoir of "life force" to become part of something else.

This is a less satisfying version of more traditional religious concepts such as karma, resurrection of the soul, reincarnation, etc.

It is just my observation that nature does not really throw anything out. Things are always being recycled and all of creation is food for some further creation object. I don't see why my experience should be an exception to that rule.

Kind of the ultimate conspiracy theory... The whole damn universe is listening in to my most personal thoughts, feelings and actions. And all will be ultimately broadcast and shared with all of creation!  

[glenn kangiser]

I hope to one day become fertilizer for a crooked, twisted spooky giant Oak tree.  I bet it will have nice large acorns.

[John Raabe]

Heaven is having more than two acorns. Sounds good to me!  

[PEG688]

 To much rain on the south end John.  Been a looooooong winter down south ,Eh

 Good luck with your therapy, PEG

[Amanda_931]

Not quite charter member of the Useless Degree Club, but pretty close.

Philosophy and Folklore/Ethnomusicology.  Don't know if either was a particularly good fit.

[Sassy]

Sounds like the type of classes I took when I 1st went to college... didn't have a clue what I wanted to be when I grew up...    also anthropology, poetry, journalism... never did get a degree, tho - worked as a reporter for aboiut a year for a small newspaper (it had newspapers in several small towns-I was the editor for one of them) interviewed people, wrote articles, took photos, laid out the ads & pages, even developed the pics but didn't make a whole lot of money... it was fun, tho... then worked other jobs & finally after several yrs went back to school at the insistence of a friend who was getting her nursng degree - glad I did, can't say I've ever been bored with it, always something interesting or new to learn.  

The ethnomusicology must have been interesting...

[PEG688]

.  

The ethnomusicology must have been interesting...

 Sounds like a real hoot What the heck is it  

 PEG

[Sassy]

 Sounds like a real hoot What the heck is it  

 PEG

I would gather from the word without looking it up - ethno would be the cultural origin & musicology would be the study of music - so it would be the study of different culture's/ethnicity's music... is that right, Amanda?  

[Amanda_931]

got it in one.

(want to try another?  I have a friend who is an ethnochoreologist--one of the very few in the country.  She's semi-retired, and head of a center for the same, although the word does not appear in the title)

[jonsey/downunder]

Balanchine was one, although I'm not to sure if the ethno bit applied to him or not.  

[Sassy]

Hey. Jonsey, you beat me to it!    I took several years of ballet so was familiar with the term, although I don't know whether Balanchine would be considered "ethnic" either...  Balanchine was a choreographer also...

[glenn kangiser]

Hey Jonesy, you still wear that pink tutu once in a while?

[jonsey/downunder]

Whenever possible mate, although it doesn't go to well with the Blundstone's and you need to watch it when welding, could end up like one of those GLENNA$$IFIERS!!!    

[glenn kangiser]

I guess you're right -- all that pink netting and lace has to be highly volatile. :-/  Not to mention what all those sparks will do to your nice white leotards.

[glenn kangiser]

You may have to quit wearing the leotards as you get older, Jonesy.  They tend to bunch  your Depends up very badly making very unsightly lumps in the back. :-/

[jonsey/downunder]

When you are round like me mate, the lumps don't show much.  

[jonsey/downunder]

Amanda, If you can get steaming radio, here is a link you might like to check out. This show is hosted by Lucky Oceans.
Lucky was born into a music loving family in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, USA in 1951. He married an Australian in 1979 and settled in Fremantle, Western Australia a few years later.
A co-founder of the group 'Asleep at the Wheel', he played pedal-steel with that group for most of the 70s, and won two Grammy Awards (1978 and 1993) for 'Best Country Instrumental'. He writes music for film and television and has toured and recorded with Paul Kelly and the Black Sorrows. Currently Lucky leads his own group, the Zydecats, and has received the accolade of 'possibly the most influential and imitated steel guitarist of his generation.'
The Daily Planet searches out good, inspiring music from around the world and if you are into ethnic music this show is well worth catching.
http://www.abc.net.au/rn/music/planetdaily/default.htm