Why are you building your own and how are you paying for it?

Started by Jared Drake, January 29, 2008, 12:50:44 PM

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Dougalew

Hello All,

I've been reading this site for a few months now and thought this would be a good topic to make a first post. 

My wife and I live in Charlotte NC and are saving for some land a bit west in the mountains.  We're planning on building ourselves and paying cash.  For experience we're building a garden shed in the back yard later this winter/spring.  I have much of the material already...donated from a friend who just had extra material from a house he just had build.  I'm sure I'll be posting questions/progress photos about that project in the weeks to come.

We are certainly not rich but I make a decent salary as an engineer.  We're able to save because we've never carried large debt and we do many things ourselves.  We live within our means and don't worry about the Jonses. 

I don't want to get too far aside but I read through Elpels' web site and respected much of what he's done.  I do have a big problem with the fact that he let medicare cover health expenses for his children and participated in the free lunch program.  It's great to want to live simply and debt free but in the same spirit I feel one should not be a burden on society in their endeavors if they can help it.  Elpel certainly seems capable enough to stay off the dole.

Peace,
Doug

glenn kangiser

Welcome to the forum, Doug.  I've been a bit busy and haven't read all of his stuff, theres so much there.

While I agree with you in a way, the abuse of our system being perpetrated by the Whitehouse with the illegal alien projects (big business), no bid Haliburton projects (Cheney), war machines (Bush- Bin Laden - Carlysle), Katrina Ice (Quale-retired  military), government arms contracts, $25.000.000 port renovation project (Feinstein's husband,Pelosi's husband), jobs sent overseas (big corporate profits) etc, make me want to say -- no matter who you are, if it will benefit you and you can do it and are here legally, go ahead , benefit yourself, take advantage of our failing system before the politicians steal it all.
"Always work from the general to the specific." J. Raabe

Glenn's Underground Cabin  http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=151.0

Please put your area in your sig line so we can assist with location specific answers.


Dougalew

Hey Glenn,

I definitely agree with you regarding the broken state of the system we live in.  I suppose we'll have to agree to disagree on what to do about it.  I feel that my small part of the solution is taking care of myself and my family without outside help because I can.  Anybody can play the system but they are then part of the system and part of the problem.  I want to be independent.

At any rate, at least this is a good healthy debate   :).


Doug


glenn kangiser

Actually, I agree with you, Doug, and that is the way I would do it too, but if someone finds it necessary to dip into the till to survive them I won't fault them for it.  Somewhere either them or their family has put into the broken system and will get beat out of it so I say don't feel bad about it, and if it makes you feel better put into it when you can while it is still slightly functional.  The politicians have already ripped off most of our social security funds so I think we are only going to be able to pick up a few crumbs once in a while.  I can get by without it and wouldn't stand in line for it.  I assume others in need will stand in line when they need to, but will get out of line and maybe put a little in when they don't need it.
"Always work from the general to the specific." J. Raabe

Glenn's Underground Cabin  http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=151.0

Please put your area in your sig line so we can assist with location specific answers.

Willy

Quote from: glenn kangiser on February 02, 2008, 02:30:47 PM
Actually, I agree with you, Doug, and that is the way I would do it too, but if someone finds it necessary to dip into the till to survive them I won't fault them for it.  Somewhere either them or their family has put into the broken system and will get beat out of it so I say don't feel bad about it, and if it makes you feel better put into it when you can while it is still slightly functional.  The politicians have already ripped off most of our social security funds so I think we are only going to be able to pick up a few crumbs once in a while.  I can get by without it and wouldn't stand in line for it.  I assume others in need will stand in line when they need to, but will get out of line and maybe put a little in when they don't need it.
Even I collected 2 weeks of un/employment in my life once when I got out of the service in 1973. They told me it would take allmost 6 weeks to get that check and I told them heck I will have to get a job or starve! I never figured out how to work the system yet but I sure know a lot of people who get goverment checks and still work on the side but are supposed to disabled?? To me it is just a pain to fill out all the forms to get the free money so I just earn my own however I can, and pay as less back into the system as I can cause I HATE supporting those kind of people with my hard earned money. Mark


StinkerBell


glenn kangiser

I agree with that too, Mark.  I put in as little as I can get away with and get whatever back that I can.

Stink, possibly use them for slave labor and take their money-- that way it makes a recurring income rather than a one lump sum but final income for each one that sells.  I've heard that it has been tried on Craigs list in Seattle? [crz]
"Always work from the general to the specific." J. Raabe

Glenn's Underground Cabin  http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=151.0

Please put your area in your sig line so we can assist with location specific answers.

n74tg

Well, maybe we shouldn't all live TOO close together.  With our luck, we'd form a militia (or at least be accused of doing so) and then they'd send in the FBI, and tanks, and flame throwers.  And then, the media would make us into a religious cult that had unwilling members held against their will.  It would be Waco all over again.  Either that, or we'd be labeled terrorists and end up in extraordinary rendition to some black site in Afghanistan.

Nah, I'm just kidding.  Though Glenn and I do think a LOT alike. 
My house building blog:

http://n74tg.blogspot.com/

glenn kangiser

There you go, Tony.  Did you check out he Survival video in off topics ?-- Oehler and lots of good Patriot stuff there.
"Always work from the general to the specific." J. Raabe

Glenn's Underground Cabin  http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=151.0

Please put your area in your sig line so we can assist with location specific answers.


akdreamin

A little background on myself.

I grew up in suburbia.  I grew up thinking that being successful meant that you would never have to do any menial labor (thats what C students did).  I realized my senior year college how wrong that mind set was, after taking over an hour changing a flat tire in the middle of nowhere.  I decide then that I would move as far away from civilization as I could get.  I got as far as Fairbanks before I ran out of gas.  I got a job with an accounting firm here.  After 4 years of renting from a slumlord and driving a hoopty, I had saved enough to start thinking about buying a house.  In that time, I had become obsessed with the Alaskan dream of building your own house.  My family laughed at me.  Up to that time, I had never so much as built a birdhouse, let alone anything as grandiose as a real house.  That made me even more motivated.  I bought the land in 2005 and started construction in May of that year.  I used the general idea of the Universal cottage but made alot of changes to get what I wanted.  Other than having to frame the first wall five times until I got it right, it went more smoothly than I could possibly have imagined.  I would put together wall panels at night and have friends help me lift them on the weekends.  I finally finished it on New Years Day of this year.  I spent approx. $115,000 and the final appraisal came in at $245,000.  Doing it myself, I was able to put in a lot of extras that I would not have been able to afford, namely my Rais woodstove and Viking appliances.  I also ended up with about $15,000 of tools and the skills to use them all.  It is amazing.  Now, I am working on building furniture to fill my house.  All from a guy who could barely change a tire 9 years ago.

glenn kangiser

 [cool] w* to the forum, akdreamin.

What a great success story.  I have seen your type but most never make it past the suit.  You are an outstanding example.

If you could it would be nice to get some pix of your project in the owner builder section -- Feel free to start your own thread if you have anything you can post.  We have a section for homemade furniture etc. also.
"Always work from the general to the specific." J. Raabe

Glenn's Underground Cabin  http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=151.0

Please put your area in your sig line so we can assist with location specific answers.

MountainDon

Dittos akdreamin.

Would also like to see pictures of any of your handiworks.

Just because something has been done and has not failed, doesn't mean it is good design.

Darrin

Quote from: Jared Drake on January 30, 2008, 11:13:49 AM
Ok, so far it seems like everybody is building/wanting to build for some sort of personal satisfaction. Here's why I want to build, even though it looks like it may never happen now: The economy. Things are going downhill fast, and this upcoming tax rebate makes things worse. The leaders of this country are so financially stupid that they can't see they're building a disaster. I don't want to be one more factory worker that is suddenly out of a job yet still has a mortgage and car payments and credit cards to pay for and kids and a wife to feed....I want to know that if need be, I can take a podunk job at the chicken processing plant here in town and still be able to live on 7.50/hr. Jared

You pretty much summed up my reasons.  Self Reliance and Independence.  Paying cash for the land and building materials. (the borrower is slave to the lender...) I figure that being here with a bunch of DIY'ers, I'm in good company.

considerations

I've lived on this land for 3 years in a 5th wheel with a portapotty and a chamber pot.  I telecommute, and well, so far so good.  The land was bought with cash and since then, I've been saving.  Spent 25 years in commercial credit in the steel industry, and have come to believe that it is not necessary to live with debt, and all of the potential consequences.  Got the plans today, breaking ground Monday.  So, why am I building my own?  Because mortages are a debt that trebles in size before you pay it off, if you pay it off, and because am unwilling to spend another winter in a 5th wheel.  and how am I paying for it? Cash.  Oh yeah, and I want an indoor toilet that flushes!


MountainDon

 w* considerations!

I can well appreciate the desire for a flush toilet having spent much time living/traveling in our RV. Fortunately we have only a few miles to drive to dump our portables.

Looking forward to seeing what you're doing.
Just because something has been done and has not failed, doesn't mean it is good design.

glenn kangiser

Please start a topic on your project as you get going, considerations.

I've been in the steel business since 1974 - started my welding shop then. 

Sounds like you have good reasons and thinking on getting your place started.

"Always work from the general to the specific." J. Raabe

Glenn's Underground Cabin  http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=151.0

Please put your area in your sig line so we can assist with location specific answers.

Jackson Landers

I might as well throw my 2 cents in, since the thread seems to have been revived.

I'm building on my own partially because I've wanted to build my own house since I was a kid. But now it's more because this is the only option available to me. Our house is an awful little cottage that should probably be torn down. We bought this place because it is on 6 acres and the plan was to live in this house temporarily while we build either a whole new house or a major addition that basically amounts to a whole new house. 

Then the economy and the real estate market pretty much collapsed right after we moved in. Financially, there's no way that I could take on a second mortgage to pay a GC to build the new house. Nor do I have any hope of selling the place in order to buy a better house on less land, given the real estate market now.  Meanwhile, I've got a wife, 2 kids and 3 dogs living in this horrible, tiny house that is falling apart, has no real kitchen or living room and costs around $1,400 dollars EVERY WINTER to heat.  We can't wait for a better economy. We need a new house ASAP.

So I just started building. I'm doing a 190 sq ft workshop first, in order to learn how to build a house by doing it on a small scale first. My mistakes will be less expensive lessons this way.  I'm building this basically to residential code in order to get the most useful building experience. We'll also probably need the workshop as a staging area for building the new house.  In a pinch, if we can't afford heating oil next winter then we can temporarily move into the workshop, since it will be insulated and set up to rapidly convert to living space.  It will have baseboard heating and a woodstove (both of which I got as free salvage).

The workshop is coming along well.  I just finished the ceiling joists. There is no budget. I just scraped together enough cash to put in the foundation with the assumption that a foundation demands completion more emphatically than a set of plans in a drawer does.  I'd figure out how to get materials somehow or other.  This approach has worked. It will be the same thing with the new house. This summer I'm getting the permits and I'll put in a pier foundation to get going on the 20x30 2 story little house. I have no idea how I will pay for anything from that point on. It'll get done eventually.  Maybe I'll get a credit card just for the project if it gets to where I need a really good shove of a couple thousand bucks all at once. 

No budget, no mortgage, no problem. I've got land and tools. A house will eventually materialize.

Albemarle County, Virginia

Sassy

That's a great attitude, Jackson!  Remember the old saying "necessity is the mother of invention"?  Sounds like you are figuring out creative methods along the way... 

That's what we've done on the Underground House...  it's definitely not conventional but it works!  We didn't want to get saddled with another mortgage so Glenn researched alternative building projects...  you don't need all new stuff if you can find used stuff in good condition - Free Cycle, sales, discounts, barely damaged goods all work...

Keep us posted on your progress, we love to hear ideas on how people get 'er done!  Lots of CP members who know lots of stuff if you have any questions! 
http://glennkathystroglodytecabin.blogspot.com/

You will know the truth & the truth will set you free

ScottA

Good plan Jackson. Keep moving forward every day and it will get done. Thats what I do.

considerations

Ok Jackson....you and I seem of similar ilk and place in the process.  One foot in front of the other, and eyes on the prize....always works.


Willy

Well mine is to make a few bucks off of by building it myself. I am into it 12 days so far and hope to have it all dried in within 3-4 weeks total. Using up all my extra money but hope to get it all back soon! It is further along than this but I forgot my camera last time and the roof is on now. Mark


Jackson Landers

Willy,

I love that framing.  It's the kind of thing that almost seems a shame to have to sheath.


Considerations,

One foot in front of the other AND the danger of total humiliation. That's what putting the foundation in is all about. Once you do that, you'll look like a complete idiot if years go by and nothing more ever gets done. That foundation will just be sitting there like some monument to broken dreams for the rest of your life.

That's been a pretty powerful motivation for me to find some lumber and get back to work.
Albemarle County, Virginia

Redoverfarm

Jackson  perfection takes time.  Seriously just do what your money will allow you to do. Once in a while you have to inch out further on the limb than you are confortable to get a needed phase completed.  Shoot I have been working on mine since May/06 and I will put a big dent in it this summer it is far from complete.  But there is alot there and it will not be debt free.  But I'm working on that too.

Drew

We're doing the same sort of approach on our straw bale lodge, Jackson:  Make the mistakes on the smaller building and hope to remember them for the next one.

We just finished the foundation and started on the floor last weekend.  It's 24'x18' of post and beam, and it took us odd one and two-day shots since November since we don't live there.  I have to admit that while I want to do a good job, I know I'm also going to post the pictures here so that adds a little motivation to make it look good.  I'll take it!  :D

Good luck on your project.  Please post some pictures when you can.  It's amazing how much help and encouragement you can get from people who never lift one of your boards.  :)

kenjal

We're building our own just because we can & the pure satisfaction of doing it ourselves. Where other people want the instant gratification, hence hiring someone to do the job, we are happy to do our own selves a little bit at a time. But we have the land & the ambition to do it ourselves. I know not everybody has the time or the know how to do this; but you can if you really, really want to. This I truly believe.
If we do it ourselves we get exactly what we want without trying to convey our ideas to a builder. Plus, if we pay for as we go we do not owe anybody any dollars. No debt. That is the way to go in my book.
Just my 2cents,
Ken