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General => Owner-Builder Projects => Topic started by: Nate R on September 16, 2020, 07:02:23 AM

Title: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: Nate R on September 16, 2020, 07:02:23 AM
I wanted to chronicle the build of my cabin. I've decided not to spend a ton of time writing the justification and philosophical stance behind every decision up front, but I'm sure some things will come up! Feel free to ask questions, I'm happy to answer anything. Trying to be very up front about my costs, too.

Design generals:

20x30 footprint on a concrete slab. About 100 SF of this will be covered porch. No loft, but scissors trusses for a cathedral ceiling. (6/12 outside, 3/12 inside.) 2 foot overhangs. Separated bedroom. Off-Grid (for now?) with wood stove for heat as well as a propane heater of some sort. No indoor plumbing, outhouse is already permitted and doing well.

Location: NE WI, family owns a larger plot of land a 5 minute walk away. 4 Acres of planted red pine, about 60 years old. Climate Zone 6, nearly zone 7.

Timeline so far:
Late 2015: Bought land (2 acre parcel), bought camper, had it set in small driveway on land from previous tree thinning.

2016: Firepit put in, got permit for and built outhouse/privy. (see post here: )    Bought 2nd 2 acre parcel (next door) to make 4 acres total.

2017: Red pines were logged/thinned (well overdue!). Also cleared a spot for a cabin, and used the proceeds to buy a shed.

2018: Not much new that year.

2019: Got my plans and building permit. Site was prepped, and foundation poured. Driveway graveled. Property endured a windstorm as well, heaviest in 40-50 years in the direct area. Lost a few trees, have a couple bent ones.

2020: Plan to  build and sheathe walls, put up roof trusses and roof sheathing, and add shingles. Other than that, install a door, and get window package delivered. Not sure what else I'll get done this year.

2021?: After finishing more projects at home, hoping to complete the exterior. (Window and door installs, siding, trim, soffits/fascia, gutters, skylights and wood stove chimney...propane heater too?)

Here's a few floorplan images. (Floorplanner.com has been great!)


(https://i.imgur.com/HyeM2rr.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/yCZBt0F.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/RQDnYzD.jpg)
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: Nate R on September 18, 2020, 04:11:18 AM
Late 2015: Bought a Jayco Camper and pulled a few hundred saplings in a driveway opening left from previous logging...and got the camper set there.

(https://i.imgur.com/YKOMHpN.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/gkYMQQW.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/Aj1wTDu.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/AD4umHL.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/EEabvZE.jpg)
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: Nate R on September 18, 2020, 09:24:58 AM
(https://www.small-cabin.com/forum/img/!pix.gif)In 2016, we built our continously ventilated outhouse.
(Thread here:URL (https://www.small-cabin.com/forum/3_7174_0.html) )

We also got a fire pit installed.

(https://i.imgur.com/MoEo4J8.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/THxehzU.jpg)


(https://i.imgur.com/DEt6fdr.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/ncK9uEs.jpg?1)
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: Nate R on September 18, 2020, 09:48:24 AM
In early 2017, I hired an independent forester after some advice from our local DNR forester. Our red pines were overdue for a thinning. The forester marked trees for cutting and put the job out for bid to loggers.

They cut 440+ trees (out of 1100+!) on our 4 acres, getting 101 cords of wood for both paper and lumber out. This also opened up a spot to put a shed, longer driveway, and the cabin.

Based on the mill it went to, some of our trees may have ended up as lumber at Menards.  :)


(https://i.imgur.com/ADYXwWh.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/pxMYEUc.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/F6mWcnD.jpg?2)

(https://i.imgur.com/XxLUXFz.jpg?1)
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: MountainDon on September 18, 2020, 01:14:22 PM
Good to see thinning being done. By western drought climate conditions and change there are still too many trees. That does vary with the local conditions.
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: Nate R on September 21, 2020, 09:27:11 AM
Quote from: MountainDon on September 18, 2020, 01:14:22 PM
Good to see thinning being done. By western drought climate conditions and change there are still too many trees. That does vary with the local conditions.

Yes, there are other plots that were once part of this red pine planting that have never been thinned in 60+ years....  :o

Yeah, probably too many trees for those objectives, I understand. Not been a huge concern in NE WI (yet)...Our objective is mostly aesthetic, and to help maximize the health /longevity of the trees.

(https://www.nrs.fs.fed.us/fmg/nfmg/rp/silv/img/stockingchart.png)


A bit of an eye chart, but we were outside of the recommended range for red pine stocking. We were at over 300 trees an acre, around 200 SF/arcre of trunk area, and an average diameter of 10.8 inches.
We brought it down to about 175 trees/acre, with the average diameter left in the high 11s, and about 130 SF of trunk per acre. So we took out something like 40% of the trees, and about 35% of the total biomass.  Should be another 20-30 years before we're outside that chart again if we do nothing from here.
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: MountainDon on September 21, 2020, 10:53:14 AM
Our mountains are dry compared to other places further north in the west and much drier than the east.  The aim is for about 75 basal sq ft per acre. Virtually everything is well over that except for the thousands of acres that have burned in the past  6 to 10 years and the areas that have been thinned. We have a fair amount of thinning going on near us, with some of the timber being used for beams, some for pallets and a lot being made into pellets for pellet stoves. A lot of slash to be disposed of though. But it is very nice to be able to see through the trees and see hills, etc where before all you had was a wall of green and brown/gray.
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: Nate R on September 21, 2020, 06:34:00 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on September 21, 2020, 10:53:14 AM
Our mountains are dry compared to other places further north in the west and much drier than the east.  The aim is for about 75 basal sq ft per acre.

75 is pretty sparse! Leaves lots of room for understory growth, and lots of time before the canopy closes back in.
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: Nate R on September 21, 2020, 06:36:51 PM
In June 2019, we had someone finish site prep work and extend our gravel driveway. They dug up a couple stumps, and added some sand to bring grade up (cabin site was a bit of a low spot.)
Then we had another contractor come in and form and pour our slab foundation. Monolithic slab with thickened edges, about 10-12" thick on the outer foot, and 4" thick in the middle. There's poly and R10 foam underneath the slab, R10 up the sides, and R10 extending horizontally out a foot on each side under the dirt. 

They were supposed to thermally break the covered porch portion, but there was a plan mix-up, and that didn't happen. There were then concerns about cutting the rebar and separating the 2 portions entirely, so a compromise was made with the help of our inspector and an engineer that used to work for the state.   
We had saw cuts made about 2" deep and 1 1/2 to 2" wide that will be filled with spray foam. A mild thermal break, but still keeps the rebar intact.

(https://i.imgur.com/h84Eiul.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/PbR4DCD.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/zymQLIQ.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/F16NWLd.jpg?2)


Future main window view (planning to move the snow fence we use as a dog enclosure in the future)

(https://i.imgur.com/TdXFYLo.jpg?1)
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: Nate R on September 22, 2020, 09:13:51 AM
OK, that's a bit of history, nearly caught up to the present now.

    I worked on other house projects at home this year, which was the plan pre-covid. Finally got enough done to put the house on pause, and get the cabin shell up (phase 1.)  Got most everything ordered from a nearby Menards.

9/12: Wife and I came up to the property to do a couple things. Wanted to get the side insulation foam trimmed to be more even with the slab in spots, and get some protection on the foam. (XPS needs UV protection. After 1 year, I could see where some of it was degrading at the surface.) I also wanted to take delivery of the sill plates and start working on those. It ended up raining all day Saturday, and we did our best to work through it. We got the foam exposed by digging the dirt away, trimmed, and replaced a couple pieces with new foam that had been damaged in the last year.

(https://i.imgur.com/xVwebU1.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/03uH6RE.jpg?1)

Then we started trying to install our foam protection. We chose Nudo's Groundbreaker product. It's basically a 50 foot roll of FRP. We trimmed pieces shorter to fit our exposed foam with a cordless circular saw with a finer carbide tooth blade. Seemed to work OK that way. Getting the Groundbreaker installed was a GIANT pain. I could not find an FRP adhesive that was OK for outdoor use AND would not melt XPS foam. The liquid nails version was water based, and implied it would not stay cured outside. The PL300 foamboard adhesive in a caulk tube was my original plan, but found it said to NOT use on 2 non-porous surfaces. So now we're left with mechanical fastening. OK, fine, Nudo sells 3" plastic rivets to use for this. I had a Hilti Roto-hammer drill to use. But, the rivets had a heck of a time expanding properly. In the fine print at the END of the instructions, Nudo talks about using a .257" drill bit instead of ¼" in concrete......I was trying to hog the holes out as it was, and that wasn't working. I didn't readily find an SDS bit in any of the oddball sizing they talked about. And the rivets apparently aren't UV treated/stable?

We struggled through as best we could to get the rivets in place. Broke the Nudo in one spot trying to tap rivets in.
I would NOT recommend this stuff after using it for this application, and I won't use it again. It's too hard to install nicely/properly over foam, it gets wavy when it expands in heat, the rivets are terrible, and the corner trims don't have a good way to be attached! AND the rivets and trims are a MUCH lighter gray, and are both NOT UV stable, but the FRP material is. Sillyness.

If I were to do it over again, I would've special ordered (6 week+ lead time) 2" XPS panels from Styro Industries that are pre-coated with some of their stucco-like material. Not an ideal option either, but I've worked with that before, and would much rather use that vs the Nudo.   I've heard of aluminum flashing being used for this too, but also often ends up wavy, and/or dented. We got no work done on the sill plates that weekend like I'd hoped. Ah well, I was able to come up the next weekend.

(https://i.imgur.com/Blclzci.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/qhMKIwi.jpg?1)
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: Nate R on September 24, 2020, 06:58:21 AM
9/19: Came up the night before after work and got some things moved around in the hour before it got dark. Got down to 34 at night, chilly! Had a campfire in the evening, and ended up lighting another Saturday morning to warm up a bit!  Saturday, spent the day laying out sill plates on the slab, squaring things up, and then drilling anchor bolt holes in the concrete and the sill plates. I hit rebar a few times and had to move some holes a bit to avoid it. I also drilled the hole for and installed the post base for the beam in the corner.  This was all tricky work.....I had to make sure I had measurements right to  overhang the foundation insulation some with the sill plates, but also make sure I nailed the truss span exactly enough. Since our sheathing will extend up to the truss slightly, there's not much wiggle room there! I installed the sill bolts temporarily, made sure it all matched up OK. Then added corner pieces to the Nudo Groundbreaker since I had an appropriate glue on hand now, and then cleaned up the slab itself. Since the sill plates are a bit like OSB, I don't want to subject them to unnecessary water. I labeled them all, pulled the bolts and put them away for now.
(https://i.imgur.com/g2nbnID.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/OCCwgtv.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/TDLlB4x.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/DQPcGbg.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/yq6FbpO.jpg?1)

9/20: As extra protection for the sill plates where they overhang the insulation foam, I wanted to add some thin flashing tape around the outside of the plate. I used the 3M 8067 flashing tape, 4" width. It's maybe a bit of paranoia on my part to do this, but I don't' think it could hurt. I did not want the sill seal hanging down over the foam and creating a weird gap for bugs and debris to get into. So flashing tape will protect the plate where it's hanging off the slab, and standard sill seal will be in place on the concrete portion.  I'll probably caulk the sill plate to slab joint at the inside of the wall.
Anyway, got that done Sunday morning, and did the annual outhouse cleaning. Vacuuming spiderwebs, wiping things down, etc. Packed up and headed home.
(https://i.imgur.com/yUG6KJT.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/wmYlIuQ.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/iZ8pVK9.jpg?1)
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: GaryT on September 24, 2020, 09:50:28 AM
OK, I'll bite:  why didn't you use PT 2X? for your sill plates?   If you explained, I apologize, just can't find it.  Seems like anything even remotely "like OSB" would be the last thing a person would use as a sill plate.   
Gary
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: Nate R on September 24, 2020, 12:54:17 PM
Quote from: GaryT on September 24, 2020, 09:50:28 AM
OK, I'll bite:  why didn't you use PT 2X? for your sill plates?   If you explained, I apologize, just can't find it.  Seems like anything even remotely "like OSB" would be the last thing a person would use as a sill plate.   
Gary

Ahh, I think I forgot to explain!

Because I can't get ANY PT 2x6 or 2x8s right now. Covid, the lumber import pauses, some mills paused, and then the surge of people doing projects has depleted the supply. The LP SolidGuard sill product is borate treated all the way through for fungus and insects, but from what I understand, I think it would still get puffy under repeated wetting, at least at the sawn joints. This was the only alternative I could find to PT that was available/in stock.  I suspect once it's dried in, it'll be fine as a sill plate in this environment. Sand soil drains/dries quickly, and I plan to use PT sheathing on the bottom foot or so. That and 2 foot overhangs (plus gutters, too), I'm hoping will keep the sills dry enough for the rest of my lifetime.
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: NathanS on September 25, 2020, 10:30:21 AM
Nice looking foundation. Saving cost with frost protected shallow foundation, and so so much better than piers.

I was wondering if the sills were a supply issue. Around here we are lucky to have the Amish sawmills. Tamarack/Larch are quite rot resistant. White oak or black locust some other options.. you may be too far north for those though. Just something to keep in mind when you need more exterior grade materials for deck posts/boards.


I think a lot of supply chains are stressed right now. Machinery dealers can't keep anything in stock because we're all trying to get our own excavating equipment now too. I waited 3 months for a backhoe attachment for my tractor in anticipation of doing a garage next year.  Never been so happy to write such a big check...
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: Nate R on October 07, 2020, 03:47:43 PM
9/25: Delivery showed up a bit early and went smoothly. Delivery guy did a good job, only a few inches to spare in a couple spots. Got the sill plates in plates, and new foam under the porch area sill plates done. Then got the first wall mostly framed.

(https://i.imgur.com/DpRCTTr.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/ENmSgxl.jpg?1)

See the bottom of the post for youtube links of timelapse videos from 2 days of framing work.

9/26: Had 4 of us working this weekend. Had rain much of the day Saturday, but still were able to get 2 ½ walls framed and up.

9/27: Finished framing the long wall and got another wall up. Then we found the gable end walls did NOT line up with the end truss......I had chosen to use math when framing instead of removing the trusses from their strapping and laying one down to use as a template....that was the wrong move. Had to fix the walls in place by removing the top plates and cutting some of the studs. We were able  to get the porch post and LVL beam in place before my help had to leave, and fix the first gable end wall.

Timelapse vids from those 2 days:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OmsXxwxPeAE (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OmsXxwxPeAE)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XX8eU0hR-bo (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XX8eU0hR-bo)


Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: MountainDon on October 07, 2020, 05:44:51 PM
Cool timelapses

Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: jsahara24 on October 08, 2020, 09:46:06 AM
Nice......Framing is enjoyable, once I get to the drywall I start to get frustrated!
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: pmichelsen on October 09, 2020, 11:19:51 AM
Quote from: Nate R on October 07, 2020, 03:47:43 PMThen we found the gable end walls did NOT line up with the end truss......I had chosen to use math when framing instead of removing the trusses from their strapping and laying one down to use as a template....that was the wrong move. Had to fix the walls in place by removing the top plates and cutting some of the studs.

Don't worry, if you're like me this will just be the first of many little slips  :) Important thing is to not let it get to you, they happen, you've just gotta learn from them and move on. Looks like good progress so far.
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: Nate R on October 12, 2020, 02:42:11 PM
Quote from: pmichelsen on October 09, 2020, 11:19:51 AM
Don't worry, if you're like me this will just be the first of many little slips  :) Important thing is to not let it get to you, they happen, you've just gotta learn from them and move on. Looks like good progress so far.

Thanks! Definitely been trying to keep to the mantra: "I'm building a cabin, not furniture.." It doesn't have to go together perfectly, just pretty well.  d*
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: Nate R on October 12, 2020, 02:44:08 PM
9/28: Forecast called for 0.10" of rain over 2 hours. Was really 0.77" of rain over 8 hours......Ugh.   That day was just me and my wife, my other help went back to their own lives. We were able to get the 2nd gable wall fixed, and then put more roof sheathing on.


(https://i.imgur.com/GzpxA94.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/zDKcEfT.jpg?1)
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: Nate R on October 12, 2020, 02:53:46 PM
9/29: Finally, a day with no real rain, just a few sprinkles!  Working alone, though. Was able to finish up attaching the rest of the lower sheathing pieces, put on the top plates, and start installing trusses! Was a relief to see them fit OK, as the foundation size screw-up, and our desired overhang ended up with some oddball one-off truss sizing. 

(https://i.imgur.com/JiXb6Ya.jpg?1)
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: Nate R on October 15, 2020, 07:15:41 AM
9/30: Finished putting up the trusses. No small task to do alone! Nearly 24 foot long, 6+ feet tall, and about 75 lbs each. Used MiTek "Stabilizers" for spacing and holding them in place on top, and used Timberlok 6" screws for the truss to top plate connection. Truss specs call for max of 155 lbs of uplift each, and these screws are rated for 410 lbs pull through in a SPF top plate.

(https://i.imgur.com/oIopemv.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/kXcS0f2.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/SiK0M9k.jpg?1)
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: Nate R on October 20, 2020, 03:39:57 PM
10/1: To make things faster, I paid the truss manuf to make ladder sets for the overhangs for me. I think it was worth the $150 or so I paid over the cost of raw materials.

So on 10/1, got those ladder sets installed, cut some and shimmed some rafter tails, and installed subfascia. I also added a "subfascia" to the rakes, as the overhang was a tad shorter than I'd ordered.

(https://i.imgur.com/5lPZtfw.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/9o5HTLT.jpg?1)
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: Nate R on October 21, 2020, 02:56:11 PM
10/2: Got a good portion of the roof sheathing on. The warped plywood panels made it tough to get them into place! A challenge I didn't anticipate when I was forced to go with plywood vs OSB. I struggled a bit with warped sheets on both the sheathing and the roofing.

(https://i.imgur.com/2qJm2mQ.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/CwJW5Ti.jpg?2)
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: Nate R on October 25, 2020, 12:22:52 PM
10/3 and 10/4: My wife came back up for the weekend. This was the last of my 10 days straight being able to work on the cabin.

We were able to finish the roof sheathing. and get the final 2 walls framed and mostly sheathed. Buttoned things up for the week. Happy with the progress made in 10 days, much of it alone, and not ONE trip to the home center required in that time! :)

(https://i.imgur.com/qZQKLIo.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/OPpYRMY.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/WiyhlB0.jpg?1)
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: pmichelsen on October 26, 2020, 05:54:26 AM
Quote from: Nate R on October 25, 2020, 12:22:52 PM... and not ONE trip to the home center required in that time! :)

Now that's a real accomplishment! I remember some early work trips where it seemed I was making daily trips to the supply house  d*.
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: Nate R on November 01, 2020, 03:42:54 AM
10/10 and 10/11: With the ladder set overhangs, there were parts of the roof sheathing that didn't have enough support. I knew that, and had bought H-clips, but kept forgetting to put them in when I was sheathing those parts of the roof!  :o   So, I cut 1/4" off some 2x4 chunks so I could wedge them in, and put solid blocking under those seams of sheathing.

I decided to use the "hybrid" detail from JLC of flashing my roof/drip edge/fascia. This protects against ice dams backing up AND bulk water. The downside was that I had to have the fascia in place before the roofing went on.

https://www.jlconline.com/how-to/roofing/drip-edge-and-ice-barrier-membrane_o (https://www.jlconline.com/how-to/roofing/drip-edge-and-ice-barrier-membrane_o)

(https://i.imgur.com/hE61Pv5.jpg?1)


For fascia, I had considered my options. PVC and engineered wood were about $28/ea for a 1x8 in my area. PVC was out as I couldn't paint it a dark color. The store we purchased from offers wood boards in "standard," "quality," and "select" grades. The select was also like $26/ea for a 12 ft 1x8. The quality was $12, and the "standard" board was $8.   So, I chose to go with the $12 option. I purchased a couple extras, so we had options. This worked out OK in the end, we ended up with enough straight enough boards for less than an engineered option.

So, all the fascia had to be painted and hung. We got that done on Saturday. I used Pittsburgh Paints' "Paramount" exterior paint, and had a great experience with it! VERY thick, good coverage and flowed well off a brush. MUCH better than the "high" end Behr paint I'd used on my house trim earlier this year.  We'll see how it holds up.

Sunday, we adding the flashing tape to the fascia/roof sheathing joint, and then installed drip edging. Ran into my first time needing something offsite. ....I had nothing to cut the drip edging with. I was able to borrow a snips from a neighbor, thankfully. Saved me a trip into town. Got the drip edging installed, and then started on the ice/water shield. I'd watched a couple videos on how to install it, and thought it'd be a snap. That was NOT the case. I realized later the videos were on a 3:12 or 4:12 roof, and my 6:12 meant I couldn't roll it out without it sliding off, even with a nail or 2 tacked in. So I ended up cutting 16-18 foot chunks instead of the whole roll, and did my best to keep it straight and unwrinkled. It was cold enough on Sunday that it wasn't adhering well, either. We WERE above the manufacturer's minimum install temp (w/o primer), but still wasn't sticking great. Eventually we got it on well enough, and I moved onto the roof underlayment higher up. Finished that up as it was getting dark on Sunday and headed home.

Oh, and forgot to add we met with an electrician on Sunday. Once the power company told me it would be FREE to have power run from the pole on the road to a meter pedestal, we decided it was worth it. I should've looked into it years ago! My local inspector required I have a licensed electrician then rough in my wiring in the cabin once she heard I'd be grid-tied. So I hired one to drop the meter pedestal with an exterior panel, and then trench to the cabin, put a panel in there, and do the rough wiring. We'll pay him about the same as we would've spent on a small setup of off-grid solar panels, wiring, inverter, battery, etc.... So I'd much rather pay the monthly cost, but be able to microwave my lunch, or heat with electric as a backup, etc :)   So I guess we won't be off grid, but now merely a "dry cabin."  Fine with me for that price...I'd always assumed it'd be thousands for the power co to bring in power. I get the impression our local company USED to charge a LOT more for new installs....neighbor nearby went from solar panels for 15+ years to paying to have power run over 1/4 mile a couple years ago.

(https://i.imgur.com/7d7MKzv.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/nZQOZnj.jpg?1)
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: pmichelsen on November 03, 2020, 03:49:33 PM
Quote from: Nate R on November 01, 2020, 03:42:54 AMIt was cold enough on Sunday that it wasn't adhering well, either. We WERE above the manufacturer's minimum install temp (w/o primer), but still wasn't sticking great.

I'd almost rather have that, it was around 100 out when I did it on my roof and when the Grace got within about a foot of the roof it was stuck (not really but it sure felt like it).
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: Nate R on November 15, 2020, 05:00:55 AM
10/16-10/18

A big storm come through on Monday, the day after the roof underlayment went on! Fortunately, a relative was in the area Tuesday, and was able to check for me that I hadn't lost the underlayment over the ridge or anything, so things were OK. Some wind damage in other areas, so I was glad to come out OK. :)

I took Friday off work, looked to be better than Monday as far as weather goes. Came up early Friday morning, was about 31 degrees, and a light dusting of snow had fallen overnight. I spent Friday (alone) putting shingles on one side of the roof. Started on the side where the snow had melted off early due to sunlight. I had to be very careful with the cold, stiff shingles. Made sure not to bend/crack them, etc. The weather was NOT as forecast, and ended up getting a bit of rain in the afternoon, that turned to snow, and then a bit more rain. :-p Despite that, I was able to complete one side of the roof on Friday. (about 410 SF of roof).

(https://i.imgur.com/sTJmmd0.jpg?1)

My wife came up Friday after she got done with work. Cold that night, about 31 degrees where we slept.
Saturday, rain was in the forecast. It was raining when I got up, and about 32 degrees. We worked Saturday morning on a couple remaining pieces of sheathing, and put in an entry door. This door is temporary, and eventually will just be an interior door between our entryway and the rest of the cabin.
By Saturday late afternoon, the rain (and a bit of snow!) had stopped, and things dried a bit. Got a start on shingling the other side. We tried to stay warm, keeping a fire going in the firepit, but was pretty miserable being 30s and wet/damp.

(https://i.imgur.com/4JEJF8K.jpg?1)

Sunday, I was able to finish the shingles, and put the ridge vent on. Got a rolled ridge vent, what a pain that was to align alone, and get nailed in straight! I wish I had used the ridge vent that comes in 4 foot straight sections, but too late. We hit our 2nd missing material/tool snag....I had no roofing cement! Hadn't even thought about it, but needed it for the ridge vent install. My wife was able to run to town and get some, fortunately. So we got the ridge shingles installed after the vent was on, right as the sun was starting to set.

Phew! Happy to have the roof done! It was a good experience to do it once, but not sure I'll sign up to do it again... But that's why I'm doing this, right? I wanted to build something myself in my life, but not necessarily make a career out of it! :-D

(https://i.imgur.com/6ENnBGw.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/nRtjwtW.jpg?1)
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: Nate R on November 15, 2020, 05:11:43 AM
Quote from: pmichelsen on November 03, 2020, 03:49:33 PM
I'd almost rather have that, it was around 100 out when I did it on my roof and when the Grace got within about a foot of the roof it was stuck (not really but it sure felt like it).

Hadn't thought about the other extreme.......Yeah, good point, that might be more of a pain if it's WAY warm!

I also felt WAY better when I watched a recent This Old House and saw even the pros weren't getting that stuff down wrinkle-free.  ;D
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: Don_P on November 15, 2020, 01:25:06 PM
Looks good, I'm sure you're glad to b dried in. There's really 2 good roofing days per year and I'm usually doing something else  ;D.
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: Ernest T. Bass on November 15, 2020, 05:39:19 PM
Cool project! Covering foam around the foundation has always been a problem area for me as well.. You're probably not too far from where I grew in Silver Cliff WI. Moved to the UP 15 yrs ago.
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: pmichelsen on November 21, 2020, 12:58:11 PM
Looking good! As much of a pain as it was to do my roof, it does give me a sense of pride every time we pull up and see that roof.
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: Nate R on December 03, 2020, 07:47:07 AM
Quote from: pmichelsen on November 21, 2020, 12:58:11 PM
Looking good! As much of a pain as it was to do my roof, it does give me a sense of pride every time we pull up and see that roof.

Thanks! I'm feeling the same now.


Quote from: Ernest T. Bass on November 15, 2020, 05:39:19 PM
Cool project! Covering foam around the foundation has always been a problem area for me as well.. You're probably not too far from where I grew in Silver Cliff WI. Moved to the UP 15 yrs ago.

Yeah, wish there was a better solution. Again, I think I'll be replacing some of this with the pre-coated panels from Styro. In fact, I damaged one of the FRP sections already, so I'll probably order some new foam next year already.  d*



10/24: With the freezing temps and no heat, my wife and I didn't' want to stay overnight again. We came up early Saturday morning. Collected cut shingles, plywood, plastic, and whatever we could fit into her car, and made a run to the landfill/dump, only open in the mornings on certain Saturdays. Got rid of 360 lbs of stuff that way. I've been surprised we haven't had more waste from this process so far.

Then we cleaned some things up inside and out, got things away from the walls so the electrician could work inside.  Also patched in the last small pieces of sheathing. We put up a temporary housewrap for the winter. (Just as an extra layer of protection, and overlapped the foundation insulation so it will stay dry this winter). Cold, we headed home Saturday evening.

(https://i.imgur.com/6alZ75b.jpg?1)
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: NathanS on December 03, 2020, 09:03:23 AM
Looks great. A good roof overhang is so important, not just for protecting the walls/openings from rain, but for aesthetic reasons.
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: GaryT on December 03, 2020, 09:44:27 AM
That's going to be a cool place, and a real point of pride for you and your wife.  Well done.  And always good to keep a jobsite clean!
Gary
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: Nate R on January 27, 2021, 09:15:57 AM
The following week, the electrician installed a meter base and outdoor panel, and trenched...ran conduit to the cabin and put a 100A panel inside. Inspector OK'd it and power co has been notified. Nice! We already planned to plant a bush between the cabin and the meter to obstruct that view.... So hopefully we won't see it soon enough.

11/7: Came up again just for the day. Hit the 60s during the week with sun, and the shingles have heated up and most have relaxed at least!  Came up to mostly get ready for deer hunting. Checked on the electrician's work, and then went to the family's land to check on tree stands and such. Power co still has to run the line from the pole to the meter, likely within the next 2-3 weeks. Electrician has run boxes and such inside, but no wires yet.

Windows and front door are ordered, and should be delivered up there around Thanksgiving. Still need a patio door.

(https://i.imgur.com/IehGVOp.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/TBpc91O.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/odMPeWg.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/OjyQE4U.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/h2tldF3.jpg?1)
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: Nate R on January 27, 2021, 09:17:17 AM
Quote from: NathanS on December 03, 2020, 09:03:23 AM
Looks great. A good roof overhang is so important, not just for protecting the walls/openings from rain, but for aesthetic reasons.

I agree, it never quite looks "finished" or "right" with no or too small overhangs.  ;D

Quote from: GaryT on December 03, 2020, 09:44:27 AM
That's going to be a cool place, and a real point of pride for you and your wife.  Well done.  And always good to keep a jobsite clean!
Gary

Thanks! And yeah, good to clean up! Wish I could KEEP it clean as I go.  d*
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: Nate R on January 28, 2021, 09:20:31 AM


11/20 Up for deer hunting, staying in a nearby rented cabin. Spent a few hours at our cabin place though. In the week prior, the Power Co was out, replaced a pole and transformer, ran underground lines to our meter base, and installed our meter. We had power! Got to check out the rest of the electrician's work, he did a nice job on it. Local inspector came by when he was done and approved the cabin work so far, as well as the rough electrical. I was worried about the inspection, as I did a few things that aren't 100% run of the mill conventional, but all was OK!

Got some red pine logs that were sitting for a year+ bucked and split, and confirmed that red pine MUST be under a roof in my woods if it's going to dry, seems it doesn't dry out. Splits were 40+% moisture content inside, starting to think about rotting. Wood shed, or at least temporary wood covering for now, is on the list for next year. My wife and I walked through some things for the interior walls and such, decided that the patio door in the bedroom will be sliding and not swinging for clearance issues. No deer for us this year.

(https://i.imgur.com/dTc101Y.jpg?1)
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: MountainDon on January 28, 2021, 05:41:52 PM
Looks good. Better than your average DIY tossed together cabin
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: pmichelsen on January 29, 2021, 09:14:46 AM
It's nice that everything is underground, I worry during every wind storm that my power it going to fall victim to a rouge limb.
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: Nate R on January 29, 2021, 09:24:55 AM
Thanks, Don!

Yeah, love the underground power, seems to be the standard now for the PoCo. At the road, the lines are above ground, but they've been moving some of those underground in the area as poles come up for replacement.

12/11 I was supposed to have the windows and front door delivered before Thanksgiving. Windows were in, but door manufacturer got delayed....12/23 was the new estimated arrival, a month later than originally quoted. It all worked out, as I then quoted a sliding patio door through that vendor, and they were cheaper than our other option for a black exterior patio door at our local Menards. So I added that to the order. Should have ALL of our windows and doors on site by the end of the year.  So, the vacation day I reserved for delivery was available.

Was a good day to take off work, and open for antlerless hunting. Also wanted to get more oak firewood on hand. During hunting a couple weeks prior, I had selected a tree on the family's 40 acre plot (just down the road) that broke in a 2019 windstorm. A slim red oak. Cut it down, bucked it into carryable logs, and moved some of them to the cabin land. I'm experimenting a bit with how fast I can dry this oak in a few places. Hoping the attic in my full time house will be a mini kiln....by my guesses, I need more dry wood set aside for next year. We'll see if I can get some of this under 20% by a year from now.

Did some hunting after that, no dice. Headed home.

(https://i.imgur.com/IZX9BmH.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/k15cmhq.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/ImuJiAS.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/dDDz19E.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/OFYlD0u.jpg?1)
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: Nate R on March 04, 2021, 08:13:52 AM
1/8/21
The patio door and entry door were at the vendor just before Christmas, and the windows already there too, but they could not deliver it all until after the new year. So took a day off work and met the delivery guy at the cabin. Paid an extra $275 to have them deliver them 170 miles away from their shop. This was WELL worth it, as it was all their responsibility until I had them inside.
We ordered Marvin's Essential (all fiberglass) windows, black inside and outside, as well as the jamb extensions in black. Also a black sliding patio door from Marvin, and a ThermaTru entry door, painted black. Not cheap, but windows and doors are an important design element to us. 
Was able to split some more wood and take delivery of the windows and remaining doors. They look great, and all appeared to be there and correct!  My main windows are a bank of 3 in a 9 foot wide opening by 6 feet tall, so getting those inside was a relief.

The way things are going, I don't forsee a lot of further work here until I finish re-siding my main house this year. So there might not be much to add/see until July-ish? But that was part of the agreement between my wife and I to start this project. I wanted a box up in 2020, and I got that. My goal for 2021 is to get the cabin to the point that it's comfortable (temperature wise) to stay in for next winter. Lots to do in order to get to that point:

Frame interior walls
Air sealing details around the shell
Install skylights  (2 going in )
Install chimney and wood stove
Add soffit vent chutes
Run a bit more wiring
Insulate
Install windows (and final house wrap)
Install patio door, swap outside door with the final one
If I get that much done, I'll start installing the final exterior parts, like window/door trim, siding, soffit, etc.


Window Example
(https://i.imgur.com/cdNayqF.jpg)


9x6 window bank and wood stove
(https://i.imgur.com/2P0MvSx.jpg)


Eventual front door
(https://i.imgur.com/6AUN8xr.jpg)


Patio Door
(https://i.imgur.com/8sclSSq.jpg)


Saw this little shrew, even got to pet it!
(https://i.imgur.com/ipcyOmb.jpg)


Got to see how much snow made it onto the porch.....not bad!
(https://i.imgur.com/8bCvC77.jpg)


Also got to see how well the 2 foot overhangs kept snow off the building.
(https://i.imgur.com/Lm0F46G.jpg)


Hoping to see a chimney and windows from this view later this year....
(https://i.imgur.com/NhYnt2T.jpg)
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: Don_P on March 04, 2021, 04:49:01 PM
Looking good, windows and doors are a big chunk.

One thing to think about is moving that wood away from the house before the bugs start moving this spring. I've had to do pretty extensive repairs to houses where the bugs moved from the firewood into the wood of the building. I'll stack about a weeks worth at a time on the porch through the winter, the rest of the time its in the woodshed.
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: Nate R on April 06, 2021, 09:38:44 AM
4/2/21
After nearly 3 months away, I was able to stop by for a few hours. Mostly checking on things, bringing up a few items, and getting some of my things organized for my turkey hunting trip at the end of the month. Everything looked fine, which was a bit of a relief. The weather has let up a bit, so I'm starting back on the siding project on my main/primary house now, so as soon as that's completed, I'll be back at the cabin work. (Hopefully by the end of July? )

I'll probably start a separate thread tracking my costs for this project soon.

Hope everyone has a great Spring!


(https://i.imgur.com/5pnJChF.jpg?2)
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: Nate R on September 28, 2021, 07:24:00 AM
After working on my main houses' exterior most of this year... And then a short break... We are back at the cabin project! :)

Brought the skylights up on a day trip in August.

Came up another day in August and installed 1 window after pulling off the housewrap, making sure sheathing nailing was good, routing out the window opening, and then installing new, permanent housewrap. Was good practice for the other windows.

(https://i.imgur.com/yiXeztR.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/YKdSRa6.jpg?1)
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: Nate R on September 28, 2021, 07:26:05 AM
Labor day weekend, my wife and I got to work.  First up was the patio door. The slab has a.. "notch" cut in it along the wall lines between the covered porch and the interior. It's about 1 ½-2" deep in the concrete, down to the rebar level, basically. This was supposed to be a full thermal break, but the concrete guy had a miscommunication, and I wasn't on site for the pour. So by the time we realized he hadn't put anything in to thermally break the porch, it was too late.

This was the after the fact fix: He cut out a v shaped notch with a saw along the wall lengths. Got the blessing that this was the best solution from the local inspector and a Structural Engineer that worked for the state. I cleaned and filled these with spray foam RIGHT as I put down the sill plates.

Cutting out the sill plate for the patio door, I was able to see how it did. Looked great! Filled the cavity! Cut it flush with the slab (as it had expanded beyond it a bit...), and moved on. So a.... "thermal break lite" to help a little with heat loss to the outside through the slab. Could be better, could be worse. If this was a full time place I'd probably have pushed harder to redo the concrete entirely in that section.

(https://i.imgur.com/7oyzrXG.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/jOgTSIi.jpg?1)


Anyway, we got the patio door put in. Marvin Fiberglass (Essential line). About $1600 for the 6 ft door. We moved on, and were able to get 4 more windows put in after cutting sheathing, housewrap install, etc. Not a bad 3 day weekend, but I only took a few pictures. Oops.

(https://i.imgur.com/eDaIZx4.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/pc0ac7I.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/ovTCeGf.jpg?1)
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: Nate R on October 01, 2021, 07:49:21 AM
I came up late the following week for a 11 day work marathon. My wife came up on the weekends. Had a couple family members come up and help for a few days as well. 
First order of business, I swapped out the entry door for the permanent one. We went with an outswing door, to not have to worry about door swing in our small entryway.  We also got another window put in, and took care of routing the openings, sheathing, housewrap, etc.

(https://i.imgur.com/Xi4kXIE.jpg?1)
   
(https://i.imgur.com/AJjKsIY.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/snANqpn.jpg?2)

(https://i.imgur.com/EEsfVPJ.jpg?1)

Next was work on the skylights. Our plan WAS to install 2. It ended up being just one. Struggled and struggled to get the shingles to release from each other. But, on that side of the roof, the adhesive strips were holding INSANELY. So often times the shingle would rip, or the one it was attached to would rip instead of being able to release the tab. Of course this was a special order color, and I only had so many on hand. After struggling to get one skylight in, I decided not to try the 2nd one. We'll leave it as it is. It would have been better to do these when the roof went on, but I was up against the weather and time off clock then, too.

I ordered laminated glass instead of tempered for the skylight. That way if a branch hits it, it won't leave an open hole for weeks when I'm not there, but instead hold together like a car windshield. And, being a venting skylight, I can replace that portion if ever necessary, fairly easily.

(https://i.imgur.com/NhItWhO.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/A0BEImh.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/Gk52BBs.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/90vK45f.jpg?1)
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: Nate R on October 01, 2021, 07:52:45 AM
Got a large delivery after that.. All the soffit materials, interior wall framing 2x4s, fiberglass insulation for the ceilings, soffit baffle material, etc.

Went with R38 batts that I'll stack R19 batts on TOP of where there's room..... Was going to do mineral wool, but the lead time more than DOUBLED as soon as I ordered it from 6 weeks to 12+...I didn't trust that would actually be correct. Cancelled that, tried to find R49 FG. No one had THAT in stock either. So moved to R38 batts and then the R19 where they'd fit.

Took hours to move everything around inside the cabin and out to get the new materials in a convenient spot and out of the weather.

Once that was done, and I had help, got the BIG (9 foot wide, 6 foot tall) window assembly installed. Was a relief to finally get that in, and be able to take in the forest view! It all worked out...the overhangs being any longer would start to block the top of the window view...and glad the window isn't any taller or wider. Happy with how that turned out!

(https://i.imgur.com/oFC7nbl.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/8OsXNUs.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/fB9UPv4.jpg?1)


The next day, we made a run to the local landfill and got rid of a bunch of building material leftovers.
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: NathanS on October 02, 2021, 07:00:23 AM
Your cabin looks top notch, Nate. Really nice design choices with window/door/entry placements. And those windows look top notch.

A cabin that size will heat up so quickly, especially with some attention to air sealing.
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: Nate R on October 04, 2021, 10:42:07 AM
Quote from: NathanS on October 02, 2021, 07:00:23 AM
Your cabin looks top notch, Nate. Really nice design choices with window/door/entry placements. And those windows look top notch.

A cabin that size will heat up so quickly, especially with some attention to air sealing.

Thanks for the feedback!
I hope so on the heat-up time... I know the slab isn't helping that, it will take some BTUs to heat up all that concrete....but it DOES mean that the inside won't be as cold as a raised structure to start with since it's more connected to the ground temp.....So it will be interesting to see how that does.   

I'll be recording some data on all that, so I'll have some fun graphs, eventually. Recording outside temp and humidity, inside temp and humidity, outside soil temp at 6" depth, slab temp at about 2" depth (2 feet in from the edge), and I'll probably have some wood stove temp data, and even the weight of wood burned over time.  I may or may not be nerding out on data a bit too much.   ;D
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: NathanS on October 04, 2021, 12:10:27 PM
Oh that will be cool on all the temp stuff. We have a weather station that also allows us to keep track of indoor temp while we're not home. It's also really cool to watch the temp spike and decay from making a fire in the woodstove.

I read some Canadian research a few years ago that soil typically "freeze locks" at only a little below freezing, which interestingly ties in with how acorns, chestnuts and other nuts that only survive to ~26F manage to germinate in areas where winter air temperatures reach -20F or colder. (One of my hobbies)
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: Nate R on November 29, 2021, 09:26:32 AM
Quote from: NathanS on October 04, 2021, 12:10:27 PM
Oh that will be cool on all the temp stuff. We have a weather station that also allows us to keep track of indoor temp while we're not home. It's also really cool to watch the temp spike and decay from making a fire in the woodstove.

I read some Canadian research a few years ago that soil typically "freeze locks" at only a little below freezing, which interestingly ties in with how acorns, chestnuts and other nuts that only survive to ~26F manage to germinate in areas where winter air temperatures reach -20F or colder. (One of my hobbies)

Yeah, I've been intrigued by the data so far.   

The last 2 winters here, soil didn't really drop below 31 degrees at 6" depth.
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: Nate R on November 29, 2021, 09:28:12 AM
I've been so swamped with working on things this fall that I've been behind on keeping track of what I get done when, and taking pictures, etc. Just trucking along whenever I can. A short list of what's been done:

Got the exterior T&G soffits stained and installed.

T&G porch ceiling stained and installed. (After exchanging bad material for good.)

Framed interior wall for bedroom separation. Decided to NOT frame a separate enclosed entry area.

Electrical wiring cleaned up/added onto a bit for more lights, moved some receptacles, etc.

Wood stove hearth tile installed and grouted.

Wood stove and chimney installed and in use.

Installed a 3000W electric wall heater.

Soffit baffles installed.

Skylight tunnel framed out and foamed.

Got rid of the camper, started sleeping IN the cabin! :)

Started installing insulation.

Rented a Uhaul truck and brought up some furniture, fridge, etc.

Bought 2 dual-sport motorcycles, one for the wife and guests, and one for me. :)

More later! Hoping to complete the main insulation this weekend, and start on the R4 XPS foam that will go on the ceiling between the trusses and the drywall. Once I finish the wall insulation this weekend, I should be able to keep it quite warm, and  get some more work done this winter. :)
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: Nate R on December 10, 2021, 05:57:32 AM
Continuing on that 11 day marathon, after the BIG window was in, I moved onto the chimney.

Previously had quite a time figuring out how to get the double wall stove pipe to adapt to my particular wood stove. (Jotul F100.)  With some help from the hearth.com forums, got a solution eventually that worked. 

Painted the exterior chimney parts black using special paint for stainless, and then special paint for galvanized. We'll see how it holds up.

Chimney is TALL....but has to be to get above the ridge enough for the 2-3-10 rule. So support legs were added to the top section.  I used Selkirk DSP for the stovepipe, and SuperVent for the chimney.

Also added the long leg kit on our Jotul F100....so the stove is a little over 2 inches higher.  So the chimney was in, but stovepipe wasn't set up yet. I wanted to get the hearth tile done first.

(https://i.imgur.com/ONofyQM.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/NEQtslH.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/wfwd9dX.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/giqRkvq.jpg?2)

(https://i.imgur.com/v7kNAcV.jpg?1)
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: Nate R on December 21, 2021, 06:52:52 AM
Getting too far behind real time to keep track, figured I'd just do some photo dumps and updates.

Since I used 2x4 rafter tails on the trusses (should've asked for 2x6 there....) and because I used 2x6s for subfascia.. that would've meant a LOT of shimming out. We decided to paint the subfascia instead and leave it exposed, nailing the soffit material to the 2x4 truss tails. This was WAY easier than the alternative. First added Cor-a-vent's soffit vent strips in black, which blend right in! For the soffit, used 1x4 beaded T&G, stained with a timber oil.

(https://i.imgur.com/P6ej2GF.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/VytEpXh.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/uvYl0RP.jpg?1)

We were going to use the same thing on the porch ceiling, but got a batch of defective T&G boards....the tongues weren't machined right. Returned them and got some 1x8 based T&G boards that were in stock.
Added 2x10  cedar on the front of our double LVL beam and 1x10 cedar on the back. The 2x10 was screwed in with proper bolts, so it can add a bit of extra load capacity.

(https://i.imgur.com/SxaOWFD.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/T2dezm5.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/jd7TUuy.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/sQLJevH.jpg?1)

Got the wood stove tile installed and grouted, and the finished the wood stove install.  The tile (tough to see in some of my pics) has an awesome embossed pattern in it.

(https://i.imgur.com/QPCopBt.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/bVbfzxc.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/keRsmMF.jpg?1)
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: Nate R on December 21, 2021, 06:57:50 AM
Installed soffit vent baffles. Made from 1" XPS so they are R5. Used 1 ½" spacers to make the airspace above. Also put R10 XPS against the sheathing that overhangs the top plates, and spray foamed the seams, so made a nice, airtight space for the fiberglass batts, and the first 2" over the top plates is solid XPS. We'll se how that does for preventing ice dams.

(https://i.imgur.com/qwlZHiM.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/ue9BY7l.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/ygQLfDx.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/mH8JMVR.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/SI3ZEUt.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/NKGGUj4.jpg?1)
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: Nate R on December 21, 2021, 07:08:06 AM
For more than 20 years, I've wanted to get some more off road motorcycle skills. I had a garbage dirt bike for a bit when I was 14, but it barely ran, so never got to do much riding off-road. I've had plenty of on-road motorcycles, but never a functional dual-sport.

Over the course of the fall, we bought 2 dual sports for eventual cabin use. We bought a Suzuki DR200 for my wife to ride, and later shaved 2" off the seat so she could fit better, and put on smaller tires. (Someone had crammed some oversize ones in.) We bought a Yamaha XT250 for me. Fuel injected, but still air cooled, small, simple.

I didn't' want something overly expensive or overly complicated to maintain, or something I'd worry too much about dropping. Also wanted it new/nice enough that It didn't need a bunch of work right away! These both fit the bill.

I got a little time on the DR200 here and there this fall, but the XT isn't at the cabin yet. Next year, I suspect we'll be taking little jaunts out on forest roads and having lunch somewhere in the woods. 😊 Looking forward to learning how to ride off road with an engine (vs mountain biking)

(https://i.imgur.com/Os2V1NX.jpg?1)

(https://i.imgur.com/gI5ChxL.jpg?1)
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: Nate R on February 15, 2022, 08:25:37 AM
After a 2 month break from working on the cabin, got back up for a weekend. First I got a few more outlets installed so we have 4 inside instead of 1. :)

I had 4 sheets of drywall delivered before for testing a few things with 5/8 thickness, etc.... We got sick of moving them around, and instead decided to put them up. Had enough 1 5/8" screws on hand to hold the sheets to the walls.....I'll add more later.

Moved on to continuing to put R4 XPS foam on the ceiling in the main room. I completed the foam install in the bedroom previously. By Sunday afternoon, got the foam all up in the main room. So now the bottom of the trusses have R4 3/4" foam on them, which will later get the large gaps spray foamed, and then the seams taped. This will be my air and vapor barrier in the ceiling, and I'll drywall over the foam.

Next trip, foaming/taping the foam, and air sealing/foaming/caulking around windows, doors and bottom plates.

Oh, and got pretty cold up there that weekend! I saw -6 overnight. I set the electric heater to 61, and got up twice each night to restock the wood stove. We were able to stay comfortable, and the electric heater only kicked on before stove refills at night. Thermally, things are so far about as expected. Wood stove on it's own wouldn't be enough for a weekend where we want quick warmup (with the slab), nor would the 3KW electric heater. But together, they're doing great.

Went through about 118 lbs of wood this weekend at about a 15% MC. Keeping track, so I'm starting to get a better idea of how much wood I'll need in a year. (Wood is about the same BTU/lb, so that is easier to track vs space since I use different species, split sizes, etc)

(https://i.imgur.com/A1CUUNH.jpg?1)


(https://i.imgur.com/wW6FQgz.jpg?1)
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: Nate R on February 15, 2022, 08:35:20 AM
Now I notice I hadn't caught the thread up to where I was at..... So since the late fall, I finished up some wiring details and insulated as well. That didn't work out exactly as I'd planned.....Couldn't get R49 batts anywhere. R38s I could, but was going to stack R19s on top where I had room.....but then found that was too heavy, and the R38s wouldn't hold up.

So, walls are R21 Fiberglass batts with R23 Mineral Wool in the bottom 10" or so. (Outside, I ran treated ply on the bottom 1 foot, so there's blocking at that point creating a separate bottom channel.)

Ceiling ended up being mostly R38 batts with a couple areas (like an end wall) with R19s above in the middle 10 feet or so.... And then the R4 foam on the bottom of the trusses.

Total assembly R Values (including framing fraction, etc).... Right at R30 for the roof/ceiling, and about R18 for the walls.
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: jsahara24 on February 17, 2022, 05:38:03 AM
Quote from: Nate R on February 15, 2022, 08:25:37 AM

Went through about 118 lbs of wood this weekend at about a 15% MC.

Looking good! Any idea roughly how many CF of wood you used to equate to 118lbs?  I never considered measuring wood consumption by weight, this is my first year burning wood full time and figuring out the best way to burn my catalytic stove. 
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: Nate R on February 17, 2022, 08:44:55 AM
Yeah, measuring by weight eliminates the stacking, air space, split size, species density variables, and easy to measure small increments (a couple splits can easily be weighed...)
I can measure moisture content fairly accurately, and I can back calculate roughly how much space I need for wood overall.

Right now, burning only red oak and red pine... MC is about 15%....

The wood database lists wood densities at 12% MC to be consistent.
Red Oak is avg at 44 lbs/CF @ 12%     https://www.wood-database.com/red-oak/
Red Pine avg is at 34 lbs/CF  @ 12%  https://www.wood-database.com/red-pine/

Some of my red pine is definitely NOT dense, so lets say I'm using wood about 36 lbs/CF on average at 12% MC, or about 37 lbs/cf at the 15% MC I'm at. 

So, 118 / 37 = about 3.2 CF of solid wood.
From what I read, a cord (128CF) of stacked wood is ABOUT 86 CF of solid wood, so figure 3.2 CF solid wood = 4.8CF of stored wood space, or .0375 cords.


Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: Nate R on February 28, 2022, 10:02:02 AM
Up recently for another work weekend. Not the most exciting stuff, but needed to be done.... Did a bunch of air sealing.
Got the R4 ceiling foam seams spray foamed where needed and taped. Taped the top plate seams and foam to the top plates. My wife caulked the bottom plate to the slab and between the bottom plates. We foamed and caulked around some of the windows, too.

Ready for ceiling drywall! :)

(https://i.imgur.com/nQchz7h.jpg?1)
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: MountainDon on March 01, 2022, 05:24:53 PM
Looking good. I bet you are looking forward to when the drywall is all done.
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: Nate R on March 02, 2022, 09:18:59 AM
Quote from: MountainDon on March 01, 2022, 05:24:53 PM
Looking good. I bet you are looking forward to when the drywall is all done.

Thanks Don! Definitely looking forward to that point! At the same time, far enough along now that I'm able to mentally slow down a notch and enjoy the work (and time up there) a bit more. :-)
Title: Re: 20x30 in NE Wisconsin
Post by: Nate R on March 14, 2022, 09:22:38 AM
Another trip in. With spring road bans on, and a snow-filled driveway, deliveries are not an option currently. So, spent nearly all day Saturday driving to home center, buying some drywall and a lift, renting a truck, loading it, buying a used temporary couch, hauling it back to the cabin, unloading, returning truck, driving back. Then hauling drywall and couch down the snowy driveway into the cabin.

Sunday, assembled the drywall lift and moved things around inside the cabin to make room. Was able to get the first sheet of drywall hung on the ceiling, but then we had to wrap up.

Somewhat slow progress this weekend, but progress nonetheless! Next time up we'll be able to keep working on ceiling drywall in the bedroom, and looks likely a lot of the snow will be melted. :-)