20 X 36 1 1/2 story in north Georgia

[cbc58]

Christina,

Would you share your floorplan with us...   (other then what you posted at the start) ?

[williet]

Good info Mark. Where are you located?

[Willy]

Good info Mark. Where are you located?

I am located in North Eastern Washington (Okanogan) now. The one barn and shop I was talking about was in Western Washington. Even dry areas give you problems with steel along with the wetter Western Side. Mark H.

[CWhite]

Update on my building inspector nightmare. 

I had a guy come out this morning to quote a price for spraying blow-in insulation in the roof only this morning.  His price is $2.00/sq ft, which comes in at approximately $2400.00.   That doesn't include the walls of course, but my estimate for fiberglass batting for the entire house was only $1700.00.   I can always pull some of that back from the budget by getting back there and installing the fiberglass myself. 

Good side, is that he can document with manufacturer's specs on installation that the material is meant to be blown in directly touching the metal roof without baffles or an airspace, and will completely avoid any condensation from forming.  That budget gets blown all to pieces.

Next, the gas line guys came back and took a look at what didn't pass in their part.  They will be gathering papers to verify their methods to appease the building inspectors as well, but may have to come add some armoured plate parts for more protection through studs.  They do have plates over every stud the pipe passes through, but they cannot figure out why the inspector wants a 3" clearance or hard pipe in every wall.  Even with 2X6 studs, there would not be 3" clearance.  I asked them to provide the hard copy book of the course they took when learning how to install that type of pipe if they can find it.  I want to OVER DOCUMENT in order to get at least some of the work to pass.  The gas guys were very confident that they had put it in correctly. 

My builder was also present and he will see to it that all crews concerned see these projects through to the inspecting getting the permits.  He's a lot bigger than me, and gets along with them all really well. 

I'll let you know if we have some more progress. 
Christina

[williet]

Great Christina, I was hoping it could be worked out.

In the area I just moved from...Decatur,Al. and the county around it, Morgan county, There were several contractors who had the building inspectors sewed up. "IF" someone decided to DIY, and the inspectors found out, there would be hours and hours of needless JUNK to get them off your back....They would always "suggest"...(under the table)...someone who could do the work "right", usually a cousin or brother-in-law). When I did residential repair work, this made me so angry that I vowed to never do anything that had to be inspected again.

I also lived in an "Historical District"..so that group of old ladies had their noses in everything we did as well. Shape of fence boards...color inside closets...type of flowers to plant...ect....It wouldn't have been so bad, but I was there before it became an historic district....

With "home rule", they call it that here, ( every house in the county being under the direction of a building committee) ...I guess we'll all be under the thumb of the burecratic local government soon enough.

[CWhite]

Another update, for those interested in learning from my experience.

My builder has met with the building inspectors this afternoon, and they have agreed to "allow" spray in insulation the way we are going to do it. ...that is without baffles and directly onto the metal roof. 
It will cost me a fortune that was in no way projected in my budget, but it gets the work progressing again.

The gas lines, they wouldn't give an inch on, and they really didn't communicate their opposition to the methods used clearly enough for the gas line guy to understand, so he said he will come back on Monday and change out the yellow coated gas lines for the hard steel lines completely.  The inspector said they will come back as soon as it is all changed out and give us the go ahead to continue.  My builder has really stood behind the gas line guy, and I now know why.  He's coming back and doing the entire job at no extra cost to me. 

So, Yeah!  That's a quiet little yeah, so I won't attract any attention and we can get this done.
Christina

[glenn kangiser]

Don't know if I read close enough, Christina, but is that Icynene, or some other blow in insulation?

We used to put 2" UL-vinyl -  white vinyl on 2" fiberglass on steel buildings with steel purlins to stop condensation problems -sandwiched -but just info and doesn't apply here.

[CWhite]

The insulation that will be sprayed into the roof/ceiling upstairs is a brand called Durafill.  It is described as open-cell or polyurethane spray foam insulation. 
I just hope it doesn't give me something fatal.  It should keep the place dry and warm anyway. 
It sure costs a lot. 
Christina

[glenn kangiser]

Found a small PDF on it - thanks, Christina.

http://grizzlysprayfoaminsulation.com/pdfs/durafill.pdf

[williet]

So Christina,
How's it going with the house? Are you going to post pics of the insulation process?

[CWhite]

HI Willie,

The gas line folks are here this morning replacing all of the pipes with hard pipe. 
The insulation can't go in until after the inspectors come back again.  I'll keep you posted.
At least the weather warmed up around here. 
Christina

[CWhite]

The inspectors were here 2 days ago, but wouldn't pass the house again due to no pressure on the new gas lines...turns out there were 2 leaks at the new joints.., and they found a part of the water pipes they weren't happy with and made us brace them so they won't knock around in the wall when the water is on.  That was fixed yesterday and the gas line guy was here this morning.

We passed the inspection today.  We will be on to the next step next week.  YEAH!

Insulation in the roof, and walls is next.  Then, the sheetrock. 

Meanwhile, I have finished 2 of the carvings that will go over the entry doors.  One more to go. 
Christina

[Redoverfarm]

Glad to hear that you got the go ahead.  I guess I am fortunate as I have no inspections other than the septic in my area. Although those that have lend a hand from now and then say I am the worst as far as perfectionist than an inspector would be.  I am my worst nightmare when it comes to getting things right.  Looks like it will be housekeeping in the spring for you.

[Sassy]

Wonderful!   

[PEG688]

So they will allow the spray insulation with on venting?

[CWhite]

The insulation will be sprayed in directly against the metal roof.  According to the specs, it will not allow any condensation, because there will be no air space.  The airspace will be under the insulation, and will not be subject to temperature differences.  It makes sense.  I just hope it works. 
Venting it would create the same problem that the batting would cause by letting that air space condensate moisture.  The foam is also a moisture barrier. 

I'm beginning to wonder how they will be able to install it in temperatures that are predicted to be cold and wet that day.  I guess I'll find out. 
Thanks from sharing my enthusiasm, Sassy.  I'm excited too.

Redoverfarm, I wish I didn't have building codes here, but it's gotten pretty controlled up here north of Atlanta since they made the airport an international one.  Folks from all over the world live around here now. 
Christina

[PEG688]

 Yes I knew it SHOULD be done that way , I was just wondering IF the inspectors would agree. We had to educate our here a while back about that type insulation.

Good deal , press on 

[williet]

So...IF something should happen and the metal roof need to be replaced...say a high wind or tornado close by....what would be involved in replacing the roofing?

Not being negative, but I was just wondering about "long term" maintenance. I see the edges of metal roofs around here bent up sometimes after high winds. Will the several inches of sprayed in insulation help hold down the metal?

[glenn kangiser]

There would be some of that I'm sure.  Even with a tensile strength of only 5 lbs per inch which could be possible I think, it would have about 360 lbs hold down strength at each purlin (counting both edges of the purlin) appx per 3 foot sheet -- rough guess.  Unsupported or unfastened overhangs could be more of a problem.

I assume changing a sheet would destroy that portion of the foam below.  Something that will have to be dealt with if the need ever arises.

[PEG688]

  Sure IT MIGHT happen , and yes the foam would help some with holding the metal in place.

If it gets ripped off , MTL water will get in and sheet rock would get ruined etc . So like Glenn said you deal with it at that time.

We here in the PNW put in so much earthquake , hold down  ( ever hear of gravity  , type stuff IF we have a large quake will the places with it be "better off"  maybe , will they be inhabitable , MAYBE, they might just be less ruined. Maybe it will save one life as a total collapse "might" be averted. Lots of $$ for what if , it might happen , etc , IMO.   

Yes there's more to all the code stuff then that most due to poor workmanship by what really are unskilled "professionals " in the building trades

[williet]

I seem remember cars in the late 70's /early 80's that had to have the motor jacked up to change oli and /or spark plugs....It just seems the later maintenance of something needs to be thought out in the initial design....Still looking at options for myself and it looked like decking "might" cost more on the front end, but allow easier repair on the back end....

Thinking out loud 

[CWhite]

If you're going to deck it and put felt on it, why put a metal roof on?  Why not just go the less expensive route and do shingles?
Christina

[MountainDon]

Less expensive, but metal and metal over sheathing offers...

    Metal over anything or nothing...
... longer life
... less weight
... quicker install
... best fire resistance

    Metal over sheathing...
... better ability to resist deformation from walking on, impacts, etc.
... helps to reduce rain noise. still noisy tho; Icynene does same
...

[CWhite]

Those are really good points MTDon. 

I posted new pictures of small details to the snapfish.com account if anyone wants to see. 

http://www2.snapfish.com/share/p=244101197321181693/l=333239845/g=85820999/otsc=SYE/otsi=SALB

I got 2 carvings put in place this weekend over the doors, and started the paint so I could see if I wanted to change the color..I think not. 
I also got the wall finished in the staircase, and the blocking boards are   installed in the roof in preparation for the insulation to be sprayed in.  The framing crew came back today and did that. 
Christina

[cbc58]

looks really nice....