With the help of the "Plans Support" board here, we've started building our Little House in woods.
Check out:
http://www.bellsouthpwp.net/n/i/nibblet/land/
We hope to get it out of the weather before fall and seem to be on track so far. It'll have a metal roof and probably metal siding with a porch wrapping around two sides. We plan to power with solar and heat with wood (and sunlight).
Thanks for looking,
PK
Nice pics and progress, PK --- I had to run back to your first post and see that this is South Central Missouri. Great job.
That foundation frame looks good and kinda familiar.
Hee Hee.....I like the Patent Pending at the end of the blog!
Thanks for the compliments. :)
QuoteHee Hee.....I like the Patent Pending at the end of the blog!
Yes yes, that's my patented adjustable spare-tire-deck-block beam support kit. We wanted to be sure we had the beam sitting on something sturdy and adjustable. With one medium sized male and one small female, we've got to use our heads as much as our backs.
PK
Heads do come in handy on a building project :D - and two are usually better than one.
Nice job on the foundation. And better pics than I was able to get on the original story on the website.
(http://www.jshow.com/y2k/listings/7.jpg)
PS - My original photos of the first Little House (http://www.jshow.com/y2k/listings/3.html) were taken with my first digital camera, a Sony Mavica that saved images to a 3.5" floppy disk at a maximum of 640x480 resolution. :) Looks a bit grainy today!
QuoteNice job on the foundation. And better pics than I was able to get on the original story on the website.
Thanks! I've got a bunch of photos for each stage of the process. You're welcome to them, once we get the cabin enclosed, to illustrate what to do and what not to do. :P
PK
Thanks PK for that offer of sharing the photos.
I think for now you're doing a great job of keeping your blog updated and we can just paste photos we want to discuss into the forum like this...
(https://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d184/glennkangiser/pat_pend.jpg)
:) Patent Pend. - Pa_Kettle :) How to do this... (http://www.countryplans.com/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1146802581)
QuoteI think for now you're doing a great job of keeping your blog updated and we can just paste photos we want to discuss into the forum like this...
Ok, but I'd rather not directy link photos from that bellsouth site. It's free and they will deny me access if they think I'm hosting images on their server or if I go over some bandwidth usage. I'd rather just post the link to the image in the forum and let people hit the link to view the image.
Or (I think) we can attach images directly to the forum, right? That'd keep the images around if I move (or redesign) the site.
Pk
We can copy them to Photobucket then they will not leach from your site -- I'll move the above one now. We can copy your image location -usually with right click the copy only once to Photobucket then you won't lose any bandwidth from there on.
There-- it's done and is now coming from Photobucket. :)
Lol, that was fast.
Thanks Glenn!
Pk
No problem - just checked in once before I had off for work. You can start a free account there and host photo's there if you want too -- then you can re-find them and they are always around with no problem -- that's why they are there. :) It also provides the image tags you can just copy and paste directly to this forum - much easier. Files linked or loaded here directly are one per posting - Photobucket links are about as many as you can fit in your message then they displaydirectly like the one above.
Got a little more done. :)
http://www.bellsouthpwp.net/n/i/nibblet/land/cabin/floor.html
PK
Wow -PK -- looks like someones excited about that new subfloor.
And american advertising would have you think it takes diamonds or flowers or proposals in Rome-really all it takes is a few sheets of plywood and a guy in a toolbelt! ;)
Judy
Pk
This is really funny. I have the same dancing pic at my place!
(https://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c371/casonjimmy/e.jpg)
(https://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c371/casonjimmy/d.jpg)
Wow -- must be something about freshly nailed wood that makes women dance. :-/
QuotePk
This is really funny. I have the same dancing pic at my place!
Hehe, too funny!
Well I can only image what will happen when we get the whole thing closed in...
More progress:
http://www.bellsouthpwp.net/n/i/nibblet/land/cabin/floor_2.html
Doesn't look like much more work, but we finished nailing down the sub-floor, all 1,000,000 nails... and got most of the foundation support done.
On to the walls!
PK
Cute critter, nice picture, too.
(frog, I guess)
QuoteCute critter, nice picture, too.
(frog, I guess)
Looks a lot like one ifin it ain't one ;D
Nice clean site to Pa , I like that :)
1,000,000 nails ya say :o ::) ;)
QuoteCute critter, nice picture, too.
(frog, I guess)
Yeah, it's a frog. Its species name is... wait for it... green frog. :D
Quote1,000,000 nails ya say :o ::) ;)
Felt like a million nails. I've figured out I might be using the wrong hammer. It's 16 oz. general use jobbie. I'm going to see if I can find a 20+ oz. framing hammer this week.
PK
Lookin good!
Made it a bit further this weekend. It was like really really hot...
http://www.bellsouthpwp.net/n/i/nibblet/land/cabin/walls_1.html
Looking very nice and clean.
Stay cool. It was 48º F this morning when I woke up. Wish I could send some of our NW cool weather to some of you. ;D
Opps... here comes the sun.
I'll trade some of that cooler weather for ours, 102 in the shade right now. ;)
Vern
Pa Kettle's exceeded his bandwidth for the day. Oh, well.
Only the bank thermometer got up to 100 today, and they're always high.
Out here in the country--and under a table--it didn't hit 90. But it sure felt like 90+ when I was doing a bit of yardwork.
The weather summary for Nashville in July said it had hit 100 once for the official heat-sink temperature, for the first time since 2000. (1980 was the horribly hot year for us)
Got the walls done! As you can see we put a bunch of windows in this puppy.
http://www.bellsouthpwp.net/n/i/nibblet/land/cabin/walls_2.html
Now for the roof... I'm thinking clipped rafters with a 2x4 tail that is at a lesser slope than the main roof and 12 inch overhangs on the gable ends.
Pk
Finally got shots of the roof (forgot the camera on that trip ::) ) Also got shots of the rafter extensions and the gable overhangs we did this weekend.
http://www.bellsouthpwp.net/n/i/nibblet/land/cabin/roof_1.html
Next we build the gable end walls. We so want to get this thing sheathed and out of the weather.
Funny thing, we figured we'd be seeing some cold weather by now. While it was cool at night, I think it got up to 90 degrees during the day.
PK
More progress...
http://www.bellsouthpwp.net/n/i/nibblet/land/cabin/gable_walls.html
We've got some fairly big windows in the gable end walls. Lots of cross breeze, we hope.
Next we'll try to sheath the walls. Looks like we have to do those before the roof.
PK
I get a big red Access Denied!
Judy
QuoteI get a big red Access Denied!
Judy
The site is on free webspace I get from my internet provider. There is a daily bandwidth limit, though I don't know what it is. If you check back a day or so later, it is usually back up.
PK
QuoteQuoteI get a big red Access Denied!
Judy
The site is on free webspace I get from my internet provider. There is a daily bandwidth limit, though I don't know what it is. If you check back a day or so later, it is usually back up.
PK
I've tried a couple days in a row now and still get the denied due to access limits message.
You will have more reliable photo posting if you host the photo you want to make your point with at one of the free hosting sites like Photobucket. Directions are HERE (http://www.countryplans.com/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1146802581). Most of the photos posted on the forum are uploaded from the posters computer to one of these services.
See step 2 in how to post pictures.
And here's another thread... http://www.countryplans.com/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1115032671
Yeah, I've thought of linking the images to an image server but I'd have to restructure things a bit and I'm not going to do that right now. Planning each step on the cabin and driving 4 hours each way to the build site while holding down a full time job has got my time maxed out right now.
The bellsouth site is pretty weak I guess, or else alot of people are hitting it. I think most of the traffic drops about 3 days after I post an update here. The site was up when I posted the response earlier today, but now it's down again. :-/
I may bite the bullet and purchase some web space. Then my website won't move with my ISP and I'll have more space to work.
Thanks for you patience.
PK
Both times I've tried to access the site since you posted it, I've been able to view the pictures without any problem. Lookin good!
I was able to get on the BellSouth site today and capture these images. It shows the initial clipped 2x6 rafters
(https://i56.photobucket.com/albums/g166/jraabe/clipped.jpg)
and then the 2x4 extensions.
(https://i56.photobucket.com/albums/g166/jraabe/clipped-2.jpg)
QuoteBoth times I've tried to access the site since you posted it, I've been able to view the pictures without any problem. Lookin good!
Thanks Sassy! I'm looking into buying web space as I type (well in between keystrokes). Guess it would be nice to get some breathing room web-wise.
QuoteI was able to get on the BellSouth site today and capture these images. It shows the initial clipped 2x6 rafters
and then the 2x4 extensions.
Ah the (soon to be) infamous PaKettle rafter work. ;D
PK
Ok, got it all on a new website. I'll probably modify things now that I have (alot) more room.
The new url is:
http://cabin.foxlore.net
Pk
QuoteOk, got it all on a new website. I'll probably modify things now that I have (alot) more room.
The new url is:
http://cabin.foxlore.net
Pk
Its worked fine for me on both sites, but I thank you for the efforts in showing us your progress...
Looks pretty cool so far... I'm sure much like you, I can't wait to see it finished product...
I really love watching these Cabins and Houses go up... Some of you guys really make it look easy...
PA, would you happen to have a sketch of the Floorplan or layout???
I can't wait to start on my cabin, but unfourtunatly, it might have to be a year or so...
I've got the land (really small land), but I need to get a buncha bills and credit cards paid down and off, before taking on a cabin project...
QuoteLooks pretty cool so far... I'm sure much like you, I can't wait to see it finished product...
Yeah, we would definitely like to at least get it out of the weather soon. I have a nagging suspicion that "finished" is something that will come a long time from now. The frame goes up quick but I think the detail interior work is going to take alot of time and patience.
QuotePA, would you happen to have a sketch of the Floorplan or layout???
I don't, because we really don't know how we want to lay things out yet. We know some sort of bathroom and kitchen area will reside under the large loft area. There will be a wood stove _somewhere_. Besides that, we plan to put a short platform for the bed, in the large loft.
QuoteI can't wait to start on my cabin, but unfourtunatly, it might have to be a year or so...
I've got the land (really small land), but I need to get a buncha bills and credit cards paid down and off, before taking on a cabin project...
Yep, that's the best thing to do, pay cash or have the building expenses be the only thing you borrow for. One thing I've learned is, once you get them paid off, _never_ carry a balance on a credit card. Once you make it a habit to consider credit card purchases that same a writing a check, it's much easier to live within you means.
Good luck with your project! Where about is your land?
PK
It is looking good PK - and thanks for sharing and helping others. ;)
QuoteQuoteLooks pretty cool so far... I'm sure much like you, I can't wait to see it finished product...
Yeah, we would definitely like to at least get it out of the weather soon. I have a nagging suspicion that "finished" is something that will come a long time from now. The frame goes up quick but I think the detail interior work is going to take alot of time and patience.
QuotePA, would you happen to have a sketch of the Floorplan or layout???
I don't, because we really don't know how we want to lay things out yet. We know some sort of bathroom and kitchen area will reside under the large loft area. There will be a wood stove _somewhere_. Besides that, we plan to put a short platform for the bed, in the large loft.
QuoteI can't wait to start on my cabin, but unfourtunatly, it might have to be a year or so...
I've got the land (really small land), but I need to get a buncha bills and credit cards paid down and off, before taking on a cabin project...
Yep, that's the best thing to do, pay cash or have the building expenses be the only thing you borrow for. One thing I've learned is, once you get them paid off, _never_ carry a balance on a credit card. Once you make it a habit to consider credit card purchases that same a writing a check, it's much easier to live within you means.
Good luck with your project! Where about is your land?
PK
My land is in Southern Missouri.... Around Fredricktown, Park Hills and Farmington area...
Nothing special, but we really enjoy it....
If it's going to be your home place, it is special.
QuoteIf it's going to be your home place, it is special.
For now, we wnt to build something just for weekends and summer vacations, but long term to be able to retire there; away from the city...
I'd so love to be able to get up in the morning and go for a about a 3 mile or so walk/jog/bike ride around the lake or just walk down to one of the docks and take a swim, then get on with whatever the day brings.... Be it spending an few hours working in the gargen or working out on the weight bench and punching bag... I want a bench and a bag outside and not have to worry about them walking away...
My long time best friend (lalmost 20 yrs) has a cabin about 300 yards off to one side of our land... We dug a big "Fire Pit" ehind his cabin thats about 4 foot in diameter and 2-3 foot deep... We spend a lot of nights out there just talkiing and enjoying the stars.... Can't wait to go back down there again...
More progress... I've tried to add useful tips in an attempt to make things more educational. ;D
http://cabin.foxlore.net/cabin/sheathing_1.html
Looks good PK, and sharing the knowledge is what this forum is about. :)
A bit more progress...
http://cabin.foxlore.net/cabin/sheathing_2.html
We actually did this work before Thanksgiving, but I got caught up with holiday plans and didn't get the update posted here.
We think we have a line on a crew that can do the roof sheathing, underlayment and the metal top surface. I think the roof is just too steep for me to tackle. Of course that is subject to change. ;)
We are heading out there this weekend to do the rafter blocking and hopefully finish up the walls. It's 8 degrees F out there tonight. :o Luckily it's going to warm up a bit this weekend.
Thanks,
PK
Yes, we are still alive... ;D We took the winter off and had a professional do our roof. It turned out WAY nice. :)
Here's a link where we finished up most of the sheathing last Dec.:
http://cabin.foxlore.net/cabin/sheathing_3.html
And here are some shots of the new roof:
http://cabin.foxlore.net/cabin/metal_roof.html
We've got a little bit of gable sheathing to do and then it's on to the windows. We just might be sleeping in this thing by May.
Thanks,
PK
Nice to see you here PK. Progress looks good.
We also had a pro do a roof on a house - much better than I would have done.
PK,
If you don't mind, how much did the roof cost to have it installed, materials + labor?
thanks,
QuotePK,
If you don't mind, how much did the roof cost to have it installed, materials + labor?
thanks,
We agreed on $2750 on the intial contract. I'm still waiting for the (itemized) bill before I send the check off.
PK
That seems pretty reasonable considering the quality of a job he did and the slope of the roof that I wouldn't want to be on... :)
QuoteThat seems pretty reasonable considering the quality of a job he did and the slope of the roof that I wouldn't want to be on... :)
You've got that right. 45 degrees is scary steep. It doesn't know if it wants to be a roof or a wall. ;D
He also did all of this without ever meeting us AND he ordered and delivered all the materials to the site.
I think we can handle most of the rest of the cabin ourselves... Although the sliding glass door is going to be fun. It's really heavy and needs to be lifted about 20" into place. May be time to haul out the patented concrete-block-tire-beam-holder-thing. :-?
PK
Quote[
the sliding glass door is going to be fun. PK
PK remove the sliding / active door , just open it 1/2 way then lift up on the door the bottom will clear the track. Set the fixed panel and frame in the opening, tack in place , reinstall the active door then continue to set the door / frame / unit .
QuoteQuote[
the sliding glass door is going to be fun. PK
PK remove the sliding / active door , just open it 1/2 way then lift up on the door the bottom will clear the track. Set the fixed panel and frame in the opening, tack in place , reinstall the active door then continue to set the door / frame / unit .
DOH! I would have kicked myself if I would have put it in, then announced how difficult it was and then found out about the advice above. Thanks PEG688!
Reminds me of an embarrassing story. My wife and I were out at some property we have since sold. We brought fixings for hotdogs, but when we went to make a fire to cook, we realized we forgot matches. So, we spent 30 minutes trying to do it the old fashioned way (stick, rope bow). After giving up, we drove 20 minutes each way to a gas station and bought matches.
Next day, I mention this to a co-worker. He says, "Why didn't you just use the car's cigarette lighter?"...
PK
Thats rich...
Got the doors and one window in. Only eight more to go... :o
http://cabin.foxlore.net/cabin/windows_doors_1.html
Woohoo! We will hopefully be sleeping in this thing next time up, but first we need to seal some openings up in the roof ridge... which these guys just love.
PK
Four more windows in. I sealed up the ends of the roof ridge and chased out (or killed) all the wasps. We are planning on actually sleeping in it next time out. Just four more windows to go...
http://cabin.foxlore.net/cabin/gable_kitchen_windows.html
PK
Lookin good pa 8-)
QuoteLookin good pa 8-)
Thanks! We are starting to get a little excited about our progress. We have gotten as much work as possible done everytime we've made the trip, so we are looking forward to being able to actually relax a bit and enjoy the property itself. We haven't even been to the borders since we bought the land. Once we have the cabin totally out of the weather we'll be able to take that time.
On that same (out of the weather) thought, we have decided to go with vinyl. I know that it is looked down upon by some, but I think it looks sharp when you don't try to make it look like anything it isn't. We want low maintainence and that means nothing we have to paint. Hopefully we will start putting it on during the long Memorial Day weekend.
PK
Looks really nice, Pa - what fun when you're able to relax & enjoy!
QuoteWe want low maintainence and that means nothing we have to paint.
Nothing wrong with low maintenance PK. It's becoming one of my favorite materials as I mature. :)
Just another update. We got all the windows in, woohoo! We also got the siding on site. It's "mist" color (except the for the white soffit material) which is probably going to end up pretty close the roof color. We wanted to go a bit darker than the roof, but this should look fine.
http://cabin.foxlore.net/cabin/south_bath_windows.html
Saturday nights was our first night sleeping in the cabin. Our inflatable mattress failed us, so we ended up on the loft floor. Ouch! We got to experience hot and humid and then cold and humid all in one night. Ah well, some fans and a matress and we should do OK next time.
Hopefully we will be knee deep in vinyl this upcoming long holiday weekend.
PK
Gotta love those inflatable mattresses.
Sassy will never forget the time we dropped down over the Sierra's in our plane to the little town of Lone Pine. She wanted to go to the motel -- I wanted to camp under the wing of the plane. No problem --- the inflatable mattress could be pumped up with the power from the friendly airport car battery.
Pumped it up -- a few hours it was flat. Pulled the car up -- pumped it up again -- all night.
At about midnight all the cows in the world broke out of the fenced rangeland across the street. Mooing loudly they attracted the attention of the local police who turned all their red flashing lights on and ran up and down 395, sirens blaring.
Very interesting night and I saved $50 by not having to go to the Motel a couple blocks away. ::)
QuoteVery interesting night and I saved $50 by not having to go to the Motel a couple blocks away. ::)
LOL! Yeah we had one of those, "I don't really think I slept at all" nights, but I must have dropped off for at least a few hours. :-/
To make matters worse, we both had particle board saw dust on us from cutting out the window openings. It felt like little bugs kept biting us but I'm fairly sure it was the saw dust.
I think we are going to get some of those foam mattresses, and set up an outdoor shower...
PK
A good reasonably dense foam pad, 4 inches thick works well as a temp mattress. For camping use I prefer the Thermarest or similar brand. Don't take up a lot of space and I sleep like a log on one. I use the 'camp" series, larger, thicker than the lighter backpack models. Not for everyone though.
http://www.thermarest.com/
Costco has a nice 4" pad that folds into 3 sections for approx $44 - very comfortable - they also have a handy outdoor shower setup for approx $120 - you could probably build it a lot cheaper - Glenn just took the hose & put a spray nozzle on it & a pallet to stand on for a quick setup - cold water :o but felt good when it was hot outside. (we put it close to the hot tub)
QuoteA good reasonably dense foam pad, 4 inches thick works well as a temp mattress. For camping use I prefer the Thermarest or similar brand. Don't take up a lot of space and I sleep like a log on one. I use the 'camp" series, larger, thicker than the lighter backpack models. Not for everyone though.
http://www.thermarest.com/
We tried a Thermarest, the kind that self inflates, for camping once but it ended up not fitting the small tent we had, so we returned it. They have some really nice stuff for light weight hiking.
QuoteCostco has a nice 4" pad that folds into 3 sections for approx $44 - very comfortable - they also have a handy outdoor shower setup for approx $120 - you could probably build it a lot cheaper - Glenn just took the hose & put a spray nozzle on it & a pallet to stand on for a quick setup - cold water :o but felt good when it was hot outside. (we put it close to the hot tub)
I'll have to look for that 3 section matress. Is it likely to be in the outdoor/sports area or ??
We like the "space age ::)" foam mattress pads. We use them for a bed, without any other matress, at home. (Yes we are weird) Sams Club has them, but the aren't cheap. Something like $150 for a queen. A couple of those on top of each other actually works pretty well.
For the shower we have one of those bags that you lay in the sun. It works OK but is kind of a hassle and even at 5 gals. it still runs out of water too fast. I friend of ours rigged up one of those square blue Walmart water jugs on top of a 8 ft. structure made from 4" diameter trees he cut down. If it's sunny, the water is just right for a shower late in the afternoon.
Thanks for the tips!
PK
On goes the vinyl!
http://cabin.foxlore.net/cabin/vinyl_1.html
It's pretty straight forward to install. The key is to nail it down correctly. The nails should just kiss the nailing flange (I think). If you nail it down any more than that, the vinyl will buckle as it expands and contracts with temperature.
PK
Looks good, PK. :)
Yes, it does look really nice!
Looks good Pa , ya even got the flashing details right 8-)
Will there be a deck off of the sliding glass door? If so, how do you plan to attach to house?
Looks awesome PK
Chris
QuoteLooks good Pa , ya even got the flashing details right 8-)
<elvis voice> Thank you, thank you very much</elvis voice> Of course I got corrent info from this site. ;)
QuoteWill there be a deck off of the sliding glass door? If so, how do you plan to attach to house?
Looks awesome PK
Chris
Thanks! There will be a deck, but seeing as I'm a serial task kinda guy, I have researched how it attaches to the house... yet. Usually you lag bolt a 2x onto the house below the window and then use joist hangers. I imagine I could run something at the bottom of the rim joist to install a deck thats even with the bottom of the house.
We plan to run a 3-4 ft deep deck from the front door around to the sliding glass window. Eventually we would like to continue it around to that triple window area and make that deep enough to fit a table. A deck deep enough to fit a table on that side (down hill) of the house would be like 8 ft off the ground at the end. Make for a nice view. :)
PK
Chris caught that one , you should have bolted on your ledger and "J" molded around it .
(https://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b299/PEG688/may303.jpg)
This is the red house with the deck stairs before paint / last year .
See the two ledgers on the wall.
Your problem with vinyl is you can't just bolt the ledger onto the siding , we do it that way on some remodels if the siding is on the place all ready.
We have to bolt on the ledgers , per code , with 1/2 x 4 / or longer in some cases, galv. or SS lags screws / and or bolts with nuts in some cases. 2 bolts Every 16 " , so two bolts between the joists .
If you bolt on the ledger before the joist are hung you need to lay out the joists becauce you'll play hell with the hangers and joist hitting those bolt heads , so either lay out the joist first or nail up the ledger , hang the joist and then bolt the ledger on after .
G/L PEG
Nice call Chris ;)
QuoteChris caught that one , you should have bolted on your ledger and "J" molded around it .
Hmm... good to know, thanks. It's going to be quite awhile before the deck goes in, but I think I can work something out. Is there anything that says we can't run the deck even with the bottom edge of the cabin? We could run the ledger up against the bottom of the rim joist, no?
Ah, the joy of learning as you go...
PK
What would the rise be ?? More than 8" ? By code max rise is 7 3/4" , min , 4".
You could built the deck under as you suggest , maybe attached to your beams / under framing for stability , and build a step / landing on that bigger lower deck. The landing should be a min of 36"x36" so it confortable / safe for your use.
You could also make it independent of the house - throw a few extra supports and a beam next to the house -- a bit more materials -- but another way to do it.
Quote
You could also make it independent of the house - throw a few extra supports and a beam next to the house -- a bit more materials -- but another way to do it.
He'd need some beams and post even if he attached it to the beams under the place , all he'd gain was some stablity from what little he'll be able to grab under there.
(http://cabin.foxlore.net/cabin/images/vinyl_se_1.jpg%20)
Looks close to 7 or 8" under that door .
BTW Glenn your post qualify's as one of those times it's ah trying times ;D
I realize that, PEG, but still had to do it. I have stuff like that laying all over the place -- a couple hours -- a few well placed rocks -- some old creosoted bridge timbers and a couple boat docks thrown in with the Bobcat, I'd have a deck.
Sorry PEG -- I'll go back to my underground room now. :-?
QuoteWhat would the rise be ?? More than 8" ? By code max rise is 7 3/4" , min , 4".
If you are referring to the height of the step up from the deck, the sliding glass door is on top the 3/4" subfloor which is on top the 2x6 rim joist so, .75 + 5.5 + sliding glass door frame = ~ 7" I'm guessing. Now that's to the bottom of the rim joist (top of the ledger). So if I put 2x material on top of the deck joists (that are even with the top of the ledger) the distance from deck surface to sliding door frame is probably going to end up in the 5-6" range. Of course if the rim joist is a 2x8... add two inches to that... ::)
PK
Very nice Pa. I've been following your progress as I'm planning on building the 12' x 18' Little House as a sleeping cabin to supplement my 28' x 30' main structure.
The plan is to build a covered deck on the side wall and I like your idea of a step down onto the deck from the door. This will give me a little more headroom under the porch roof.
Anyhow, how do you plan on attaching the ledger to the structure such that the top of the ledger is flush with the bottom of the rim joist?
I won't be able to use the beams as my deck will only be on a sidewall. However, I just had thought... could the beam be used as a ledger? Attach the deck joists to the beam with some hangers, you could even use some hurricane ties where the deck joists and rim joist intersect. I would have to use longer deck joists to account for the 2' cantilever, but in theory it should work. Would deck joist bridging be required in the 2' cantilever section? Could the beams and rim joist handle the extra load?
QuoteAnyhow, how do you plan on attaching the ledger to the structure such that the top of the ledger is flush with the bottom of the rim joist?
I won't be able to use the beams as my deck will only be on a sidewall. However, I just had thought... could the beam be used as a ledger? Attach the deck joists to the beam with some hangers, you could even use some hurricane ties where the deck joists and rim joist intersect. I would have to use longer deck joists to account for the 2' cantilever, but in theory it should work. Would deck joist bridging be required in the 2' cantilever section? Could the beams and rim joist handle the extra load?
Unfortunately, I don't have a detailed plan regarding my deck yet.
I think understand what your describing here. Just run joists under the house to hangers on a main beam. Seeing as I've never done anything like this before, all can offer is, "It seems reasonable to me".
Perhaps a resident pro can chime in on the wisdom of attaching a deck in such a way...
PK
Sounds do able to me 8-) , the load of the deck should not be enought to over stress the beams , nor the posts.
Code wise there could be some stupid rule / code. ::)
I think I would solid block it just outside the exterior wall , and I'd attach a 2x6 about every 4' to both the house joist and the deck joist with a couple of 1/2x 3" lag screws into each one , so I'd layout the deck joist right under the house joist .
Where you'd be running parallel with the rim I'd again bolt on a 2x6 /or 8 to a (prefferablly) dbl. up exterior rim , then thru bolt or lag screw the deck ledgr to those sticking down 2by's.
Sort of like this stair jack is setup.
(https://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b299/PEG688/sept17009-5.jpg)
(https://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b299/PEG688/sept17014.jpg)
That ledger should be maybe one size larger then the joist you'd be hanging off it , then it could run right up to and touching the rim for a more "solid " feel and look ;)
So now all you have to decide is which way run your decking , herringbone or a 90 deg. turn :-/
Thanks PEG. As always, you are a fountain of knowledge.
I like the 'stair jack' set up you describe not only for the for the gable end, but also for the side wall. It will save me hanging the deck joists from the beam. What is your thought on how many 2x's there should be sticking down from the rim joist to hold the ledger? One every floor joist bay and one at each end of the ledger?
BTW, I'm in an unorganized township - Ontario terminology for "no building permit required". :)
Pa, sorry to hijack your post, but this info will likely be handy for when you build your deck.
Quote
,[highlight] and I'd attach a 2x6 about every 4' to both the house joist and the deck joist with a couple of 1/2x 3" lag screws into each one , so I'd layout the deck joist right under the house joist .[/highlight]
;)
Another update...
http://cabin.foxlore.net/cabin/vinyl_2.html
We ended up doing lots of fiddly stuff, so we didn't get as much vinyl installed as we'd like. I started lag bolting the post and pier bracing. We also cut the 3/4" T&G for the 4' deep loft and put it in place.
As soon as we get the vinyl done, we will move on to insulating the ceiling and building the bath/kitchen partition wall. It will be 2x6 since all of the plumbing will be located inside and a 3" or 4" drain is called for.
PK
Your lag bolts will really increase the strength of the connection, PK. Seems it is about 800 lbs per inch of penetration - could depend on size but it's a lot. A smooth nail may hold around 80 - 100. Just going from memory - Ken Kern stuff. Ring shanks or screw nails hold much more.
bolting is the way to go.. they are time consuming and expensive...But they are able to withstand anything
Well worth the extra effort- and building without power using only hardwood that extra effort is considerable- as far as durability goes. Mine have stood up to almost 25 years of hard usage and very extreme weather conditions without even one needing to be replaced.
Hard work that way. Easier with modern tools - I use a 18v Ryobi drill to predrill and their little impact to put the lags in. About 30 seconds each that way. Predrilling with the proper drill stops splitting.
QuoteHard work that way. Easier with modern tools - I use a 18v Ryobi drill to predrill and their little impact to put the lags in. About 30 seconds each that way. Predrilling with the proper drill stops splitting.
Yeah, I predrilled a small hole as deep as I could (3.5"?) and then stepped up to a slightly larger bit and drilled the 2x4 with it. I used a ratchet, no big deal. Of course that's why I stated, "I've
started installing lag bolts." I do a few when I have some down time and then rest up. ;D
One reason I've started with the lag bolts, is because we feel some shifting and wobbling that makes us nervous. We've been in the cabin during some really strong winds and it's rock solid, but when you walk around, certain areas transmit bouncing to others. I suspect it's the cantilevered flooring and no big deal, but I wanted to be sure. I
have had nightmares of the whole cabin sliding off the footings. :o
PK
Your concerns are why I love cement...And basements
I could never build a house without a basement...All that free space for almost no extra cost
Just my opinion
benevolance: I hear ya' and that's what I used to think until I moved to Ottawa when I became more, how you say, "flexible". Here the soil changes from heavy clay to sand to fractious bed rock. If you aren't worrying about flooding you're worrying about frost heave or blasting unstable bedrock out of the way to get to the stable stuff. Personally, I would never build on anything but piers here because they are predictable and flexible. If you run into sand or rock or clay you can simply change the length or width of the pier to compensate. You can't do that with a traditional foundation.
Granted, having a basement is treat, especially one with a fireplace. As a kid, it made waiting out those long, cold Winnipeg snowstorms much more enjoyable.
Looking good Pa_kettle!
QuoteLooking good Pa_kettle!
Thanks!
For us, doing a full concrete foundation would have set us back quite a bit in our schedule as well as cost more. The backhoe dug the holes for our piers in about 40 minutes. Also, I didn't want to have this structure be my first experience with concrete.
We are happy with the post and pier foundation, we just want to make sure it's as strong and stable as it can be.
PK
That's a really good point, I keep forgetting that it's going to be much faster getting the piers in than framing up a full frostwall. I'm in the same camp as you, since this is my first structure I wanted to keep things simple. :)
Kodakjello
Another small update...
http://cabin.foxlore.net/cabin/vinyl_3.html
It was as hot as fire out there, so we had to slow down and douse ourselves with water periodically. I also got the blocking on the small loft done and the subfloor nailed down. Now we can use that small loft for actual storage.
I've been reading up on electrical and plumbing. I have a few plumbing questions, like where is the typical vent being run out on the little cabin, but I'll post in the general forum once I get my drawing together.
PK
Here's a photo grab from Pa Kettle's pages.
(https://i56.photobucket.com/albums/g166/jraabe/pa_k.jpg)
Looking good!
Can you please help me understand what a "J-channel, F-channel" is?
Yes- it is looking realling sharp...
QuoteCan you please help me understand what a "J-channel, F-channel" is?
Yes- it is looking realling sharp...
F and J channel are vinyl bits that hold/finish the various edges of the vinyl pieces. Attached are some shots. You typically need these around windows (unless your windows have built-in J-channels, some vinyl ones do), doors, up at the eaves, etc...
PK
Looking good Pa.
youngins...
Here's is a good vinyl siding installation manual. ABTCO had a condensed version (4 pages) but I don't see it on their site anymore. I'll search my files and upload it.
http://64.78.38.231/kp_abtco/docs/ABTCO_Vinyl_General_Installation_Instructions_.pdf
Page 9 in the manual shows a picture of both F and J channel. The rest of the manual explains where/when to use them. J channel is typically used as a trim piece to receive the siding around doors, windows and gable ends. Also used for soffit installation depending on the type eaves you have (closed eaves). F channel (sometimes referred to soffit receiver in the manual) is typically used for soffit installation on an open eaves. See page 35 for how to make F channel from J channel. I had to do this when I put soffits on my garage as I have an open eaves.
THANKS!
We're baaaaaaaack! ;D
It was a HOT summer so we didn't get much done, but now we are back on track.
I've re-vamped the website to make it easier to navigate. Our progress, as of last weekend, is near the bottom the "Vinyl Siding" page of the "Cabin" part of the site.
http://cabin.foxlore.net/index.shtml
We have a guy coming out in a couple weeks to talk about installing a chimney for our wood stove.
Here's a link to the stove we think we are going to install:
http://www.vermontcastings.com/content/products/productdetails.cfm?id=135
We'll be starting the partition wall for the bathroom next.
PK
Great progress, looks really nice!
I like it! Great collection of pics
What does the inside look like? How are you laying it out? The outside looks great so far.
I've heard nothing but good things about those vermont stoves. Everybody I've talked to who has one loves it, and says it puts out more heat than other woodstoves.
That's the same Vermont Castings stove I plan on using. Going for the plain flat black traditional finish. Those porcelain enamel finishes are sure pretty tho'.
I'm planning on getting the optional fresh air inlet. How about you Pa??
We had a VC Intrepid back home, '77 to '85 before moving south to NM. Great stoves. The bimetal thermostat air control works well.
QuoteWhat does the inside look like? How are you laying it out? The outside looks great so far.
Funny you should ask. We just got back from building the "wet" wall between the bathroom and kitchen. I'll update the web site once I've got more than just boring a shot of some wall studs. In fact, I think I'm going to split the site and have an exterior and interior section. So far the inside is just a box with the two lofts at each end. We plan to partition off the bathroom and that's it for interior walls.
QuoteThat's the same Vermont Castings stove I plan on using. Going for the plain flat black traditional finish. Those porcelain enamel finishes are sure pretty tho'.
I'm planning on getting the optional fresh air inlet. How about you Pa??
Yeah, I'm pretty much sold on the idea of a separate air intake for a stove. We are also looking at the the Jotul Jøtul F 602 CB. I agree the porcelain is smart looking but I think it's like $200 more. It's not THAT much nicer... :)
PK
I can't wait to see it all put together and look forward to your pictures. What you've done so far is great.
We picked up our wood stove last weekend. We decided on a Jotul 602. It doesn't have an external air intake, but it's such a small stove I don't think that will be a problem. We had a mix up with the stove pipe, so we didn't get to hook it up in the cabin, but we did do a couple small seasoning burns outside.
We've also started insulating but I need to run the wiring before we do anymore. After much deliberation I've decided to do the 12v runs with 10 awg solid "Romex". It'll be a bear to run but we'll live. The 110v AC runs will be 14 awg Romex.
Here's the newest page with the chimney and stove:
http://cabin.foxlore.net/cabin/stove.shtml
PK
Cabin looks really nice - those stoves are supposed to be very good - have researched them myself, in the past.
Your cabin looks really welcoming... imagine how nice it'll be with a little fire going on a chilly fall night.
Another update. [cool]
We got the wood stove hooked up. Good thing, because the temps dropped the night we were there and we would have been way cold. [cold]
http://cabin.foxlore.net/cabin/stove.shtml
Also, we started the wiring. We will be running as much as possible on 12v DC. [idea]
http://cabin.foxlore.net/cabin/wiring.shtml
Yeah... I went too far with the smilies... ;D
Thanks for looking,
PK
Question for you PK. What is that black stove floor pad anyhow?
Looking good. Bet you can't wait to get the walls insulated.
Lookin good Pa :)
Just think soon you'll be , WTH :o :o did Mtn. D and /or Glenn do with the extra smilies [noidea'
This is the only one in the [more] box [noidea' , Why I oughta >:( >:(
I'll take this the the smiley thread , >:(
Lookin real good PA keep it up [cool] [cool]
Yo Pa,
Checked out the stove installation part of your web site. That's a real nice little place you're building. It is almost exactly the same size as the cabin I'm working on (16 x 20). I installed a Tawain-built stove that is nearly an exact copy of the 602, (they call it a 301!) after rebuilding it to provide air-tight joints. Place was insulated at the time (Oct), and the temps were in the 20's. The stove warmed things up just fine. Think you'll be very satisfied with your 602. I used one for years in a little cabin I had in WI. Rest of your installation is almost exactly the same as mine - nice job.
Quote from: MountainDon on November 26, 2007, 10:29:59 PM
Question for you PK. What is that black stove floor pad anyhow?
It's one of these:
http://www.fireplaceessentials.com/c116/Black-Stove-Board-and-Hearth-Extenders-p31.html
I got it at our local Tractor Supply Store, but I can't find a link for it on their web site. It needs to extend beyond the stove 8 inches on the sides and back and 18 inches in the front. We will probably do something fancier in the future.
Quote
Looking good. Bet you can't wait to get the walls insulated.
Thanks! You bet. We actually got a few batts up and we've quickly realized we will need to cover them as quickly as possible. The kraft paper is really fragile... I've already poked a hole in one.
LOL, PEG... you seem to have a knack for those smilies.
PK
Quote from: Woodswalker on November 27, 2007, 12:02:47 PM
I installed a Tawain-built stove that is nearly an exact copy of the 602, (they call it a 301!) after rebuilding it to provide air-tight joints. Place was insulated at the time (Oct), and the temps were in the 20's. The stove warmed things up just fine. Think you'll be very satisfied with your 602.
Thanks for the info! LOL, 301 that's rich!
I've build the cabin with a large sliding glass door and three large windows facing south(ish), so we hope to get a boost from the sun on clear days.
PK
Yes, we ARE still alive and still building. Thing is; insulation, drywall, wiring and all the little fiddly things you've got to do to prepare for them, don't make for interesting content. Also, once we got the vinyl on, we slowed down a bit since weather wouldn't bother the structure anymore.
Anyhow, I've updated our website: http://cabin.foxlore.net/
I've added:
Wiring(updated): http://cabin.foxlore.net/cabin/wiring.shtml
Insulation: http://cabin.foxlore.net/cabin/insulation.shtml
Drywall: http://cabin.foxlore.net/cabin/drywall.shtml
Please let me know if there is something missing that you think would be informational on the website.
Thanks for looking.
Great to see you're alive and kicking. Work looks good too. :)
Quote from: MountainDon on November 13, 2008, 06:36:23 PM
Great to see you're alive and kicking. Work looks good too. :)
Thanks, Don. I'm looking forward to getting to the fun parts like solar and getting running water. :P
Thanks for the update, PK. Nice to see someone who is aware of the dangers if inhaling fiberglass. I had a couple dogs get large painful tumors and die from what I assume was cancer - they would get into the barn and tear up the insulation stored there and sleep in it.
Project looks good.
Still at it... ;D
Updated the drywall page and I added the beginnings of the bath page.
http://cabin.foxlore.net/cabin/drywall.shtml
http://cabin.foxlore.net/cabin/bath.shtml
We are going to use a simpe bifold door for the bath. It will anchor on the left side of the doorway (nearest the exterior wall). It should take up very little room when opened. Should give us that "airplane lavatory" feel... ;)
Thanks for looking!
PK
Pictures look good Pa. :)
Wow, great! my little place is the same size, but you are farther along. Thanks for the inspiration.
Your project is very similar to mine (northernmich) that I just have to bump it where I can find it again :)
snow-go away d*
Quote from: MountainDon on March 24, 2009, 09:17:02 PM
Pictures look good Pa. :)
Thanks!
Quote from: considerations on March 24, 2009, 09:45:41 PM
Wow, great! my little place is the same size, but you are farther along. Thanks for the inspiration.
Your metal roof is really similar to ours too. You even have a red Ford pickup! :)
Quote from: NorthernMich on March 27, 2009, 09:55:45 AM
Your project is very similar to mine (northernmich) that I just have to bump it where I can find it again :)
snow-go away d*
Looks like you have a good start on it. Our place is in S. Missouri, so that is why we didn't have to go real deep on the piers.
PK
And... we're back. Thought you lost us, didn't you. ;D
We've been taking it easy with the finances since the economy got so shaken up, but we are back into it full speed ahead now.
Here are shots of the new ceiling:
http://cabin.foxlore.net/cabin/ceiling.shtml
The same people who did our metal roof and chimney, did this ceiling. We like it a lot.
I also added a few shots to the bathroom page:
http://cabin.foxlore.net/cabin/bath.shtml
I started doing vinyl work on our overhangs, but I ran out of materials AND we already have our resident Pheobe sitting on her nest inside one overhang. I guess the warm weather has all the critters "doing it early".
PK
Great to see you again!
Nice ceiling work.
Those are super aren't they? We have the same one; shorter ceiling though. Whisper quiet and if you crank it up it sure moves the air.
Hi Pa_Kettle, I just read through every one of your post - great place. I'm glad to see your back posting again.
I realize that your title is: 14x24 but I thought I saw different measurements somewhere? Anyway, I was wondering, how deep and wide are your pier holes and all you did was fill them with crushed rock and then set the blocks on it? I would think that all the weight of the house would kind of move the blocks a little bit, push the rock into the dirt, etc..
Not using concrete would be cool. Does using the crushed rock end up costing much less than concrete? And last question for now: Did you use John's "The Little House Plans" that are sold here?
[cool]
just read your whole thread... now over to your website to look at the pics. thanks for sharing!
Quote from: ajbremer on February 24, 2011, 06:05:46 AM
Hi Pa_Kettle, I just read through every one of your post - great place. I'm glad to see your back posting again.
I realize that your title is: 14x24 but I thought I saw different measurements somewhere? Anyway, I was wondering, how deep and wide are your pier holes and all you did was fill them with crushed rock and then set the blocks on it? I would think that all the weight of the house would kind of move the blocks a little bit, push the rock into the dirt, etc..
Not using concrete would be cool. Does using the crushed rock end up costing much less than concrete? And last question for now: Did you use John's "The Little House Plans" that are sold here?
Thanks for the kind remarks.
The cabin is one of John's 14x24 "Little Houses". The pier holes are (going from memory), 14" deep, and 20"x20" wide. I think. We don't get the deep frost down in Missouri so 14" should be fine. The crushed stone is probably about 8" and fairly well compacted, sitting on un-excavated earth. That's key, you can't back fill if you over dig a hole. Then the blocks sit on top of that 8" base and are surrounded by crushed rock up about 1.5" below their tops. I've not noticed any issues with moving or heaving... so far. :)
I don't remember if the crushed rock was cheaper than concrete, but I'm sure it was easier. We don't have power for mixing and hauling enough water to make concrete would have been difficult too.
PK
Quote from: MountainDon on February 23, 2011, 11:49:51 PM
Great to see you again!
Nice ceiling work.
Those are super aren't they? We have the same one; shorter ceiling though. Whisper quiet and if you crank it up it sure moves the air.
Your not kidding. At 12V it really does the job. Someday we might put 24V to it but I doubt we'll need to. Maybe in summer.
Our down rod is Sched. 40 PVC. :D
PK