out of square ...........

Started by astidham, February 16, 2014, 08:59:03 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

cbc58

don't feel bad.   i put a second story on a ranch house and went to put in the windows in and none would fit because the whole thing dipped 2" from one end of the house to the other and everything was out of plumb.  it took some big jacks, cables, a real carpenter, a sledgehammer, some shims, and some roses and wine for my wife to get out of that mess.

astidham

Since this is now the confession post,  its been almost a month since my last.
I decided to frame the window rough openings after standing the walls up, so I cut a board to the window rough opening height 60".
I went around to every window, held the board tight to the header, and marked where the bottom of the board was with a pencil.
I then measured from the floor to the line I made, and cut all the cripple studs.
I installed the cripple studs and the window sill on 5 windows before I realized I put the sill on the top side of the rough opening mark I made.  d*
"Chop your own wood and it will warm you twice"
— Henry Ford


Ernest T. Bass

At least from the sounds of it you made your cripples 1.5'' too long, rather than too short.. There are so many ways to make the old 'marked on the wrong side' mistake.. Some days it's just easier to visualize things than other days.

I think this is a healthy thread..

Our family's homestead adventure blog; sharing the goodness and fun!

North Sask

I think one of the more important lessons that I've learned since I came across this forum is that building a cabin (framing a house) is not the same as building a Swiss watch. I am an inexperienced builder and a bit of a perfectionist, so it will be important to remind myself that, in many instances, being off by a quarter of an inch or a half inch is just about perfect. Larry Haun reminds us of this fact in his writings. Even though he comes at it from a production framing perspective, the lessons apply to the do-it-yourselfer.

I look forward to making many confessions in the future.  d*
It would be greatly appreciated if you stopped by my thread and left your two cents.
Great Northern Saskatchewan Adventure...Round 2

MountainDon

I do have to remind myself that I am not making a piece of furniture at times when working on a house, shed, whatever. But I still really like to get things closer than 1/4"; an 1/8 is on the wide side of being okay.  .... there I go again....    ;D
Just because something has been done and has not failed, doesn't mean it is good design.


Ernest T. Bass

Well of course it's always going to be a game that we challenge ourselves with.. ;) Nothing like that rush when we occasionally do get something 'perfect', not because it has to be, but because we can (or just got lucky.. either way).

Our family's homestead adventure blog; sharing the goodness and fun!

flyingvan

If I aimed for perfection in my framing, I think I could let 1/8" go here and there... If I decided before building 1/2" tolerances would cut it, I'd probably ignore 3/4" variances. 

---If you mark your cuts with a lumber crayon, you're a caveman
---If you mark your cuts with a pencil, you're a tradesman
---If you mark your cuts with a razor, you're a craftsman
Find what you love and let it kill you.

OlJarhead

Oh how I feel your pain!  I once nailed an inset ledger to a wall before squaring it....decided to leave it...nailed it up and sheathed it....and tore it all down because it was so bad and I was made a had a chance to fix and didn't take it.

It's better now BUT....fighting weather etc (always seems the way) I failed to notice the top of a corner out of plumb and nailed it all up.....when it came to framing the roof I finally realized it.

I left it.  And now you know too ;)  d*

Ernest T. Bass

Oh, I just thought of a boo-boo that still haunts me... I'll spare you the details, but basically I drew a full-scale gable end on a loft floor deck to pull measurements from, and didn't realize until after I had framed the gable that I had failed to miss the target pitch by a fraction of a degree (drew the gable inside the 2nd-floor knee walls, and based the calculation on total building width..  d*). Wouldn't have been a big deal, except that the original roof is sitting nearby and when you stand at the right angle and try to line up the two steel roofs it doesn't quite work...

Our family's homestead adventure blog; sharing the goodness and fun!


rick91351

Quote from: North Sask on March 24, 2014, 07:30:08 PM
I think one of the more important lessons that I've learned since I came across this forum is that building a cabin (framing a house) is not the same as building a Swiss watch. I am an inexperienced builder and a bit of a perfectionist, so it will be important to remind myself that, in many instances, being off by a quarter of an inch or a half inch is just about perfect. Larry Haun reminds us of this fact in his writings. Even though he comes at it from a production framing perspective, the lessons apply to the do-it-yourselfer.

I look forward to making many confessions in the future.  d*

1/4 s and 1/2 soon turn into an inch and inches.  Bubbles in a level little off here and there soon are way off at the end of a 'pull'.  No it is not a Swiss watch but it is some thing you have to live with or worse yet someone else has to live with and wonder why the builder did not just make sure.

BTW I sure miss Larry Haun  and his articles and videos.  I really take it to heart when he is explaining the importance of coming on to a job site and making sure your head is on straight and you are safe for the day.  Whether you are in the back woods or the back yard.  I seen one video where Larry was explaining how to arrange your nail apron and wear it for the best efficiency like at one of his trade school lectures.  Then in that sort of high squeaky voice.  "Then when I drive up to the job site I want to see you all bent over just your asses and elbows showing."

Or the one he did for Fine Home Building:  "Now were doing this the old way with out nail guns."  Out came that old long California framing hammer it was just an extension of his body.  Long lanky and so graceful fluid movements.  No wasted motions.  Set a nail with power and authority even though he was on the down hill slide.   He had forgotten more about framing than most all of us will ever know.  Great he took time to train others and donate his time to construct things for others be it wheelchair ramps or railings or Habitat.             
Proverbs 24:3-5 Through wisdom is an house builded; an by understanding it is established.  4 And by knowledge shall the chambers be filled with all precious and pleasant riches.  5 A wise man is strong; yea, a man of knowledge increaseth strength.

Redoverfarm

I was very happy to get within 1/2" of an inch with anything when I erected the log cabin.  And yes it transfered to everything that attached to it.  Working with the 100+ year old logs was definitely a challange.  The bumpout was a real treat to be able to work with milled (mostly true) lumber.  But of course that was short lived when I mated it to the log structure.  Then there was the stairs.  Again working with less than true stringers mating them to the floor between the log & framed structure.  It just snowballs.

The my ghost came back to haunt me at the apartment.  When the framing crew set the stairway from the ground floor to the upstairs it wasn't a true 90 deg off of the wall.  Therefore the framing on either side at the top & bottom wasn't exactly true either which transfered to the wall coming off the stairway opening wasn't true either.  The bathroom coming off of those two walls are not exact as well.  I compensated as much as I could but I know it is still there.  Well you do too now but I am sure you will not tell anyone. ;)

But I found the key to success in dealing with these "almost sqaure" features.  Learn to hide them well in the finish work.  But I am happy with the results and in this world that is the only person that you have to satisfy. ;D

Patrick

I still watch him on you tube, he was a very impressive carpenter. he throws that huge worm drive saw around like its nothing, He was a true master.

NM_Shooter

Yeah, well... here's my confession.  I framed up all my wall sections in my garage.  Somehow, I managed to make one wall section 1"too short.  I felt like a fool.  We ripped a couple of pcs of OSB, crammed them in the gap, nailed it together, and put a top plate over everything. 

I will be long gone before that is seen again.
"Officium Vacuus Auctorita"

Don_P

We've gotten the floor back in on the remodel I'm working on. The joists were full 2x8 chestnut spanning about 15', well overspanned, then they notched the ends 4" to set over a doubled mudsill plate  ???. They were basically 2x4's and most of the notches had split. The grading was non existant, several were boards I would have thrown in the woodstove and never looked back. We took up and saved the majority of the 5/4 oak flooring, it was a little spooky walking those tender joists before we removed them. The new floor is 2x10 #1 SYP and worlds stiffer. We've removed the plaster and lath and are furring the walls and ceiling back plumb and level. Turn on the laser and then go find where it is in space  :D. I finished furring one corner at the end of the day yesterday, it was over an inch out of plumb. There were no headers and the top plate is a snake. I've seen one carpenter's tagline that has come to mind several times recently "They don't build them like the used to... we have laws against that now". It's a beautiful house but the framing sure leaves alot to be desired.


MountainDon

Quote from: Don_P on April 26, 2014, 09:26:00 PM
"They don't build them like they used to... we have laws against that now".

rofl

Just because something has been done and has not failed, doesn't mean it is good design.