diy entry door

[diyfrank]

Has anyone here built their door?  I've been thinking on this.

I have a plan for a door thats made from pine.
I like the cabin look instead of the modern look if it could be done well.

A nice looking wood door goes for $$
I don't like metal.

What ways would you build a door and jam so it would be acceptable to what you could buy as far as shutting tight.
keeping wind, water out.

I was looking for ideas in building one instead of buying.

[Jens]

Pine is difficult, as it is always susceptible to moisture.  Because of this, even if it is dried very well, it will continue to move.  Part of the big problem, is that humidity levels on the inside and outside vary so much.  This means that the outside will absorb moisture from the ambiant air (even if given a good porch roof), and the fibers on the outside will start to expand as they absorb the humidity.  The inside will not take in as much, and the differential will cause the stiles (vertical members) to bow, binding the hinges, and causing the door to fail to shut properly.  In addition, The wood expands and contracts across the grain, meaning that it may jam in the opening.  If you do want to build a pine door, I would suggest going with quartersawn white pine, which in my experience, has a tighter grain than the yellow pine common in the south.  If you can, find old doors.  These are often pine, or fir, but are built out of the nice old stuff.  Take them apart, and use the pieces.  People are always getting rid of the old doors when they remodel old houses, and the doors can usually be had for free.  They will usually have to be stripped of their finish, but it's a deal at twice the price when considering lumber of the same quality purchased new (if you can even find it). 

Vertical grain douglas fir is a good choice for doors, without taking out a second (or first) mortgage.  Then again, a mahogany door only costs about $300 for the materials in most places, but you will have to mill the pieces square and uniform before machining. 

Make sure that the lumber you use, is dry (moisture content less than 8% in most areas), and acclimated to the environment before you do your finish machining and assembly.  I don't know if you live in an area where humidity is an issue, but it'll make wood move all over the place!

All that said, do not be dissuaded too much.  I built a door for our bathroom out of kiln dried fir 2x12, and pine 3/4 plywood.  Worked great until the washing machine had been run, and showers had been taken for a few months, then it started to move.  It was a great experience though, and I built it using a table saw with a dado blade, and a miter saw.  It can definitely be done, but can be risky (cash wise), although my attempt only cost about $40, it was a couple of days worth of work.

[diyfrank]

I can use a  better kind of wood, the reason I mentioned pine was it was use in the plan I have.

I don't want to post the plan for copy right reasons. They came as part of a cabin plan I bought and considered building.

What they did was take 3 planks vertical and nail planks at a diagonal to the back, making a door 2" thick.  Then cutting it to size from there. They included a window at the top.

It looked nice but, I   thought it would have the problems you mention with moister.

I have an old wood door I bought off craigslist this weekend and I'm stripping the paint on it today.
I paid $50.00 for it and it needs work to be usable.

Up here everything is a piece of gold. I've seen old used  doors that look bad and they were asking $150.00!

Nice wood doors for $500.00- $600.00 used

Nice new over $1000.00


Brings me back to diy door..



Let say buy good wood to start with..  Whats the best choice.  You say Doug fir.

What would your assembly procedure consist of?

Wouldn't a good finish help with the moister issues?

The climate is cold and snow for 6 month
Hot and dry 6 month.

I'll take some more thoughts on this before trash canning the idea.

[John_C]

I agree with Jens.  I've built a bunch of doors and hatches for boats.

I just did a work shed that has 9 doors.  4 sets of double doors and one 4' 0" single door.  I argued for us to buy garage doors but the owner wanted them to be like barn doors and more economical than garage doors.  I built them out of OSB and T1-11 with 2x cores, as per his request.  The owner is happy with them but they change shape alarmingly with changes in the weather.

Even well maintained varnished teak doors in sailboat companionways changed shape quite a bit from sunny to rainy weather.

Where are you going to find the better materials to build them?  It won't be in any lumberyards I've visited lately.  If it's a specialty yard you'll pay for it any probably need a planer and joiner to S4S the boards.

If cost is the factor keep looking around salvage yards, craigslist etc. 

[diyfrank]

Jens & John,

Thanks for your thoughts.

This is what I was asking.

So where does a wood door get its success.

Better tooling and top grade materials I take it.

As far as price, yes I'm cheap!  I could pay more but it hurts. 

If a door could be built to satisfaction,  I would be going that route.
I have a door that will work but it looks like a door from a house.

[John_C]

I'm not a big fan of wood doors.  I've lived in too many places where the weather was too hard on them.  The wood door on my Fl house faced due south,  Days of tropic sun followed by torrential rains.  Hot and humid outside and dry air conditioned air inside. I revarnished it twice a year and the glue joints failed in 5 years.  The replacement door also lasted about 5 years. 

The steel doors in my GA house have been trouble free for 20 years. They aren't as attractive & warm looking as a wood door but a coat of paint now and then is all they need.

The manufacturers do use vertical grain lumber, aka quarter saw, and they can control conditions during construction far more than the diy builder.  But a mediocre steel or fiberglass door will outlast two or three wood doors and is better insulated as well.

If I had to build one for my own house I'd probably go way overboard and make it very rustic and 4" or more thick.  Hinges, locksets and hanging it would be a giant pain and it wouldn't be cheap.  But I'd enjoy looking at it.  I've thought I'd like to have a door like the one on Bilbo Baggins' place Bag End....  gotta love those hinges.  The doorknob in the center of the door is pretty cool as well.

[MountainDon]

I like the appearance of wood doors. But that's about it.

We've had wood doors and so have my parents and assorted relatives. With seasonal changes in humidity they changed size. With bright sunshine directly falling on them the finish would go to heck. 

We have steel doors on the house and a steel door on the cabin. The most I've had to do to the steel house doors over 23 years is apply some paint, replace the rubber bottom "seal", and change the lockset as the original was too cheap and we wore it out.

They are not wood, but I tolerate them well in view of past experiences.

YMMV... don't let me discourage your dreams... just be open eyed.

Oh, my parents installed a top line fiberglass door. It stained well and withstood everything the weather threw at it. It looked like a nice wood house door.

[glenn kangiser]

I forgot....

I built my own door....




Not exactly practical for a regular house though.

[John_C]

Glenn,  I thought about your door when I was posting.  Can he get that in a pre-hung?  Your OEM version wouldn't be much fun to hang on a stick house.  I don't think Home Depot has the hinges either. 

[diyfrank]

Don,
I always appreciate your straight forward well thought out replies. Steel make more sense but I love a wood door. The weather on the west side is mild enough I've never had much problems with wood doors.
My cabin is on the east side and the weather may be an issue with one. Later on when I'm banging my hard head on it and rethinking my decision to use wood. I will think of you, Johnc. and Jens.   

Glenn, All I can say is I like it!
Extreme overkill, but very sharp.

I' ll bag the Idea for an DYI exterior but I think I will have to try a interior.

[Jens]

As far as success with the diy door goes, its all about wood selection, species, grain orientation, and joinery.  The best door, is going to be one that needs no glue at all to hold it together, then the glue is an added insurance policy.  In the old days, doors were built with mortise and tenon joints, and the tenons woul extend at least half way through the stiles of the door, or they would use 1/2", 4-6" long dowels, at least 2 per joint.  Between this, and the cope and stick profile of the mating surfaces, you ended up with a door that would stay together very well.  You still had to have the right kind of wood, in the right places though. 

Panels are best made out of plywood (IMO) as they won't shrink and swell like a solid panel.  Stiles and rails out of quarter sawn, or rift sawn boards.  Flat sawn boards shrink and swell along their width, QS and RS along the thickness, because movement happens parallel to the grain.  Keep in mind too, that the thicker the piece, the more movement it will have.  This is why solid panel cabinet doors so often have the panel at 1/2", instead of 3/4".  Just taking off that 1/4" makes a big difference.  The wider the board is, the more total movement it will have as well (this is all for flat sawn). 

You could get away with having a thickness planer, and a straight line ripping jig for a table saw, or a jointing jig for the router.  You will need either a dado set, or some straight router bits, and some kind of router table.  Could be done without it, but so much easier, can be easily and cheaply built too, I am proof of that, as I have had several different ones, usually built on a job site.

First, you need to cut your pieces to rough size (a few inches longer in each direction), and send them all through the planer.  Without a jointer, you will have to have boards that have no bow in them.  Then joint one edge on the table saw, or with the router (or jointer if you have one), and rip the other parallel with the table saw.  Your rails should be machined first (IMO), because they have the tenons on them (if using dowels, can be done after stiles).  Cut the tenons on the ends, making sure that the cheek cuts make all the finished surfaces the same length. 

Now you can set the rails directly on the stiles, and mark for the mortises.  Machine the mortises with a chisel mortiser, a router, or a drill chisels and sharp eye (patience helps here too).  Cut them a bit deeper than the tenons, so the glue has somewhere to go and doesn't spread the joist back apart.

Once you have machined all of you mortises, set up to cut the groove for the panels in all the pieces.  It is very handy if the groove is the same width, or smaller than the tenons.  It should be centered in the pieces, and will go from mortise to mortise. 

Dry fit everything, and see if it works.  the pieces will not have the profiled edges around the panels, unless you route them, but I would suggest just easing the edges with a hand plane or sander, much easier, and cheaper.  If everything fits well in the dry fit, take it apart, (sand the panels to finished grit now!), and reassemble with glue and clamps.  If you want extra assurance, you can dowel through the tenons to hold them in place, or run a long screw through a countersunk hole in the side of the stiles.

Frame and panel doors were developed to fight wood movement.  They are still not perfect, but I wouldn't put steel or fiberglass on anything.  Even the highest quality finish will not keep out moisture, and the best door will still move, but I'll still use them unless it's a last resort.  Unless the metal door were made to look like an old bank vault door or something!  That would be cool!

As far as species goes, I would choose either mahogany, vg fir, QS white oak, maybe cherry, although it isn't the hardest, it's so pretty!  Around here, I would pick up my stock from the local hardwood dealer, or  special order through woodcraft.  Either way, expect to pay between $300-$400 once you are done.  But that is for a $3000 door!

If you have a few days to kill, make a 1/2 scale of it out of pine or poplar.

[diyfrank]

This is why people pay the $3000. for a top quality wood door..
Sounds very humbling.

Jens,
If you've built doors this way then your quite the craftsman.

Thanks for taking the time to post it.

[Ernest T. Bass]

Love that door Glenn!

Only exterior wood door I've seen was made for a log cabin we had built a while ago. It was three layers of t&g pine, with the Z bracing in the center. It was a monster, and worked fine as long as we owned the cabin, but we never heated it in the winter and it had a big covered porch, so no rain on it.

We made most of the interior doors in our current house from green, rough cut spruce lumber:

(Before the hardware was installed)

The wood for that door was around $12...

The boards shrank a bit, but we had splines between them, so no gaps. The wider doors move a little, but we haven't had to re-adjust them too much.

[glenn kangiser]

Glenn,  I thought about your door when I was posting.  Can he get that in a pre-hung?  Your OEM version wouldn't be much fun to hang on a stick house.  I don't think Home Depot has the hinges either. 

It wasn't much fun to hang on this house.

[glenn kangiser]

Don,
I always appreciate your straight forward well thought out replies. Steel make more sense but I love a wood door. The weather on the west side is mild enough I've never had much problems with wood doors.
My cabin is on the east side and the weather may be an issue with one. Later on when I'm banging my hard head on it and rethinking my decision to use wood. I will think of you, Johnc. and Jens.   

Glenn, All I can say is I like it!
Extreme overkill, but very sharp.

I' ll bag the Idea for an DYI exterior but I think I will have to try a interior.

It wasn't really made to be heavy - I made it because I had the center slab from my sawmill and thought it was too cool looking to throw away so found some more and made them into the door.  It is about 10 inches thick at the butt of the center slab. 

[glenn kangiser]

Thanks Andrew. 

The hardware -latch and handle mechanism  is made out of Oak with a couple of homemade steel parts - shaft and cam plate --  and has been working with no problem for about 6 years.

[Jens]

Love that door Glenn!

Only exterior wood door I've seen was made for a log cabin we had built a while ago. It was three layers of t&g pine, with the Z bracing in the center. It was a monster, and worked fine as long as we owned the cabin, but we never heated it in the winter and it had a big covered porch, so no rain on it.

We made most of the interior doors in our current house from green, rough cut spruce lumber:

(Before the hardware was installed)

The wood for that door was around $12...

The boards shrank a bit, but we had splines between them, so no gaps. The wider doors move a little, but we haven't had to re-adjust them too much.

Thats a nice door Ern.  I love your door Glenn.  It is very possible to get good service from a board and brace door, but it will never compete in the long run with a frame and panel.  It the planks are not tightly secured with screw or nails, so that they can move, you will have a better chance.

If each plank is secured to the brace with two screws, one of the holes should be elongated, while the other stays regular.  On the outer boards, the outer screw should be static, and the inner one allowed to move.  This will keep the outer dimensions close to the same year round, because they will now be dependent upon the length of the braces, and boards do not usually move too much lengthwise.  The door will not stay as square though, because it won't be braced as tightly.  Then again, I have seen board and brace doors that were quite old.

I guess what I am saying is, go for it!  The worst thing that will happen, is that you may have to replace it in the future, but if you don't spend too much in the first place, that isn't a problem.  You could even replace it with a new door of the same construction if you want!  I was merely trying to let you know about the why's and wherefore's of the door making thing. 

I have made my own casement windows too, and although they are not perfect, I am still happy with them.  If my bathroom door hadn't move to the point that the hinges were squeaking horribly, I would've probably never replaced it.

here is the door I built for our bathroom.

[Pritch]

How about a wood veneer?  1/4" of wood glued to the inside and outside faces of a steel door could be stained, and dummy bolts could be applied.  Add some big, black hinges and you could have a very rustic looking door that (hopefully) wouldn't have the moisture-related issues mentioned. 

-- Pritch

[JRR]

On our weekender, we've installed a second set of redundant "security" doors.  Kinda barn-like ... not made as nice as Ern's.  Larger than the regular door frame by about 3" on each side ... just closes flat against the outside of building with no sealing ... swings outward, of course.  2" of bottom clearance.  Large fence henges and regular padlock hasps.  Hopefully will slow up a lazy burglar.  Helps to shield regular door and frame from sun and weather.