My wife and I bought 4.5 acres in a small town called Dalton in New York. The land is small and kinda awkward shaped but the views are to die for. It has alot of road frontage and was recently "brushhoged" So there is no trees >:( but it is level so building will be easy.
If the pictures are to big let me know and Ill resize them. Here are 2 pictures looking down the road at the land. Like I said gorgeous views
(http://micahzellers.com/Dalton/1.jpg)
(http://micahzellers.com/Dalton/5.jpg)
This is a picture looking catty corner from the road. I own all the way back to the tree line.
(http://micahzellers.com/Dalton/2.jpg)
This is a picture looking straight across. Again I own all the way back to the tree line.
(http://micahzellers.com/Dalton/3.jpg)
Here is a google map view of the land. I highlighted it and put dimensions on it.
(http://micahzellers.com/Dalton/site.jpg)
I have a family of 5, 3 daughters, my wife and I. Yes Im very out numbered. I haven't pinned down the size of the cabin I want to build yet. Our house is very small 1000sq feet, but we do all of our "living" in 1 12x16 room. It happens to be the room the woodstove is in. We have no cable and spend most of our time talking or just sitting on the couch and chair relaxing. I honestly think I can get away with building a 12x16 cabin with a loft for the girls to sleep/play. We dont have any plans on living there full time (yet) so we arent going to have water/sewer/electric hooked up. I do hower own an 80 watt solar setup. Also the guy I bought the land from said that its a prime location for a small windmill. As for sewer probably composting toilet and a greywater setup. Ill probably bring up a few 55 gallon barrels and harvest rainwater. Use that for watering the garden, and washing hands. Then ill bring a few gallons of water from home for cooking and drinking.
Thats all for now. I hope my post reads well. Im far from and english scholar, and my grammar sucks. Once this nasty winter is over I plan on starting the build. First things first I need to pin down the plans. I have a few ideas ill post once I get the drawn up.
[cool] It's beautiful, I love the views. Looking forward to you posting your build.
Oh, by the way...congratulations! :)
That is great. You can always plant trees - first year is good - get them growing.
Congrats on the land. Looking forward to seeing your project.
Thanks for the pix Micah. Looks nice. Where is Dalton in relation to better known New York cities and towns? My wife is from the Binghamton - Endicott - Johnson City area.
If I could make one suggestion about the pictures; I find 800 wide better than larger sizes. Not everyone has their monitor set to a wide enough resolution to view bigger without sideways scrolling. Some times wider is needed; at times like that I find it more convenient if there is only one picture to the post. That way the slider is not so far down the page. Makes it easier for folks with smaller displays.
Sorry about the last picture being so big. I fixed it. Not sure how that one slipped in there.
Dalton is in Livingston County. Its 140 west of Binghamton. About 57 miles south of Rochester. Its near Dansville, Nunda, Ossia, and Wayland area.
I do plan on getting some trees planted ASAP. Just not sure what kind. I was thinking pines of some kind along the road for privacy then lots of hard woods for future burning. [chainsaw] Where not sure where to locate the cabin. Here is a picture of where I was thinking about putting it.
(http://micahzellers.com/Dalton/site_cabin.jpg)
I need help finding plans. I read in a post here that there are a set of plans that has an open floor plan with no interior load bearing walls. I cant find that post again to save my life.
Here is a link to the plans page, Micah. http://www.countryplans.com/plans.html
There is a link at the top of the page here also where it says "Plans" in blue.
Near all of the plans except the Solar Salt box are open design.
Looks great ... I'm sure your aware but it's going to pretty windy up there ! [cool] Looks like a great spot for a wind turbine and some tree's to make a more comfortable enviornment around your house/cabin :0)
I'm sure in summer the place will look even more amazing..
congrats
looks great! In the old colonial we lived in for a year, we basically lived in the 16x16 foot living room, and the kitchen, with our four kids, so I know what you mean about being in the room with the heat, and thinking you can live in a house that size. My wife wouldn't go for it though, just too small for the future! I look forward to seeing your progress, and think the siting looks good on that oddly shaped property. gives a nice area around the house, and plenty of rec land left in that long strip.
Great views and looks like a great place to build. My husband is also outnumbered by three little girls, so we know how that works. Look forward to reading about your future project! w*
Beautiful property! I've got a similar vision for my land in VT - although the gray water system isn't _technically_ legal there.
Well after a lot of thought and searching and google sketchuping (is that a word). I have decided on a design. I have to give all credit to fritz because Im using his dogtrot design, but with a little modification. Im going to purchase the "Little House Plans". Here is a picture of the design.
(http://micahzellers.com/Dalton/cabin.jpg)
As you can see instead of using a roof inbetween the 2 buildings it will be what ever that is!? My wife has seen patios on hgtv with that style "roof" and she loves it. I was thinking of using 2 of the 10x14 cabins, but that might change depending in the finances when I start getting materials. I absolutely love the idea of the huge deck. I have visions of taking the kids out late at night and setting up the telescope.
The cabin on the left will be for sleeping and storage. I might put the toilet in there aswell havent decided yet. The cabin on the right will be the main living quarters. Small kitchen/galley, wood/propane stove for heat, and the rest of the area is dedicated to sitting.
I wasnt sure what the "standard" sizes are for doors and windows, so i fudged it abit. My door ways in my house are 84x32 so thats what I used for the doors. Now my windows are 74x44 which are way to big in the winter, so I decided to go with 30x30. We will be there a majority of the time in the summer so most of the time will be on the deck.
I need help with the foundation! I really don't want to pour concrete. There is no water hook up,up there, and home is a 2.5 hour drive away. I was hopeing to use dek blocks. There dirt cheap and seem very easy to use and setup. Any suggestions?
That little roof thingy is called a pergola :)
I would suggest that you have roof on the center portion of it to make a drip free walkway when it is raining. FYI, Pergola's generally are oriented so that the "rafters" run north-south, to block sun most of the day.
Why not use post and pier like the houses on this site? You could use a gravel trench, with the pier blocks on top of that, gravel trench will keep it from moving to bad with freeze/thaw. There would be nothing to hold it all down though in high winds.
check around for old barns you can buy and take down. Use the materials you want, sell the rest to furniture makers. There is a 50x50 oak barn in Nashville for $4k for example. It's kinda steep, but if I had the money, I'd use it for almost everything building a cabin. I guess I'd need a cabin site too!
When I dug the holes and mixed concrete for our cabin footing I had no on site water either. I hauled water in gallon jugs, old OJ and other type jugs I had collected in preparation. Then I also got hold of a 55 gallon plastic barrel. Filled it over a number of visits with water from the one gallon jugs. By the time I needed the water for concrete I had more than enough. Enough for tool clean up too. Might be something to consider.
while i like certain aspects of a dogtrot design/layout, one thing that i can't get over is the need for double the heat. that type of layout seems to be better suited to warmer climates.
i'm not saying that it can't or won't work, but i would rather consolidate the living space and not have to manage to two separate micro-climates.
beautiful land, btw!
What would be really cool, would be to build one large chimney, on the north side, between the two buildings that connects them. Put three flues in it. The flues would be outside, and so could be built after the house (chimney too), and safety (or money in stainless liners, be safe, always) may not be as high on the list of priorities. You could have and outdoor fireplace in the center flue, and a wood stove in each building that vent into the other flues. The brick would be part of the walls of each building. Being on the north side, would keep the cold north wind from bothering the deck space.
Great slice of heaven you got there Micah.
I love Northern New York in the winter.
Make sure you post lots of pics of your project.
All the best!
Tom
PERGOLA! Thank you!
I think Im going to do a post and pier foundation. I called the guy that owned the land and he said that it can get pretty windy and hes not sure that a dek block type foundation would pass an inspection. Im going to take MountainDon's advice and start saving water jugs. Hopefully I can come across a few 55 gallon barrels.
@mldrenen thank you for brining that up about dual heating. I never thought of that. Winter weather up there can get brutal and heat is a BIG factor. I guess its back to the drawling board. Im trying to avoid building a 2 story, but I would love to have the sleep quarters more separate from the main living area. I think I'll look in to a loft stye. Are they that much harder to build? All I would have to do is raise the height of the walls say from 8 foot to 12. Then Have a steep pitched roof.
You could build the two 10x14's, and a bathroom and hallway in between. The furnace, if you want one, could be in the attic above the bathroom. Defeats the purpose of most cabins (having a woodstove for heat), but would only need two short lengths of ducting. Or an outside woodburner, ducted either direction into each building, central type.
Maybe I'm not understanding the design...but would you have to walk out in the cold to get from the one room to the other? Summertime would be fine I guess but have you thought about spring, fall or winter? Also, what about a heavy rainstorm? Not shooting your idea down by any means...just trying to think out loud!!
Before I try to wrap my brain around this any further could you clarify a few things. Pardon me if any of this has already been posted and I missed it.
First and most important, do you have to meet any building code requirements? If you are subject to code/inspections check to see if a pier and beam foundation is allowed. Some place have issues with them; it's usually decided locally. Some places will not issue a building permit without a septic being installed. Things like that can drive you nuts, but do check on those details.
If you are planning on cool and cold weather use it's my personal opinion that you would be better off with a single cabin, probably with a loft. I believe you said you were not going to connect to the power company. That would mean heating by wood stove, or some type of propane convection heater. No blowers unless you install an off gris system that would accommodate it.
It takes longer than most people expect to raise the temperature of even a small cabin 40 to 50 degrees.
Ok I spent the morning talking to the zoning officer for the area, here is what I found out. 144sf is the max size for a non-permit building. To small so I asked about what it would take to get a permit. He said I need 4 things.
1. Heat: I'll be using wood for heat. Propane for backup. Check.
2. Electric: I want to be off grid. I asked him about Solar/WInd and he said that is fine. He also recommended haveing a gas genny there for when the inspection is done. Check
3. Sewer: Since Im not planing on make this a permanent residence for a very long time I said about a composting toilet or the old 5 gallon bucket and saw dust method. He said that hes not sure composting toilets are aloud. As for disposing of it my self hes not sure of. He suggested either having an underground storage tank and haveing it sucked out every once in a while or a macerating toilet. Im not sure what that is and google didnt come up with anything usefull.
4. Water: I do plan on having a well drilled but that wont be for a few years. I said about having a small storage tank that I refill every time we come up, and drain before we leave. Hes not sure if that will be acceptable because the tank will still be wet and bacteria can still grow. We are going to talk more about that on Thursday.
I asked about foundations. He said the common acceptable ones are floating slab, block and pier, and pole(?). Im going to get more clearification on that later. Post and pier is acceptable he said.
Since I im going to have to get a permit size isnt a limitation anymore. I thought about my previous design and have come to the conclusion that is just not gonna work. Just the thought of keeping 2 wood stoves going gives me a headache. Im going to stick with a more common design. Something with a loft.
I just got approval from the New York Env. Health Dep. to install a composting toilet! ;D The zoning officer said that everything I need to get a permit has been fulfilled. Im still going to order the "Little House Plan" but im going to build the 14x24. He also told me that since the house is under 1500sqft that he doesnt need to see any plans. All he needs is basic sketch of what the house will look like. When and if spring ever gets here Ill get my permit and start building!
That is great.
Way [cool] Micah!!
http://www.inspect-ny.com/
General Code for Composting toilets. The question is do you need to still get a septic system for any other plumbing?
For the well. Do you need to have it drilled before you get the building permit or before you get the certificate of occupancy?
Thank you Squirl for that website! I spent almost an hour and a half reading it and didnt realize it. There wont be any other drains in the cabin except a kitchen sink. For that Im going to use a grey water system. I have to talk to the zoning officer about that. As for the well. That wont be drilled for a few years. The zoning officer told me that he would allow a storage tank system. We will only be there 2-4 days out of any given month, so theres no need for a big store of water. I plan to bring 10-20 gallons up with us, and if we run out I can always go to the store and buy a few gallons.
Micah just took a look at your cabin projection. The Dogtrot does pose some problems but you can work through them. One suggestion is to connect the two cabins via a single or double sliding or french glass door. That will give you the illusion of being open but still provide the weather protection while moving from one cabin to the other. In the summer months just leave everything open. But you will still have to address the roof between the two.
Jens had a good idea as far as the mid centered fireplace flue. I am not real sure what the demensions are between the two cabins but for my Dogtrot I placed a fireplace mid center of the main area between the two cabins. The fireplace outside demensions are 80" wide which allowed approximately 38" on each side. There are three flu liners in mine and that is just about pushing the envelope as far as how many you can properly place in that amount of space.
As far as the doors. 36" is pretty well standard and the cost verses a 32" is very minimal when considering mowing things in and out. Also if for some unforeseen reason that anyone would need to get a wheelchair in it would be very difficult in a 32" door. I try to look down the road.
Well if nothing else you have a little more food for thought.
Thanks for the suggestions Redoverfarm. I think for the time im going to build simple. Im on a very limited budget so simple and inexpensive are my 2 best friends. I just ordered the "Little House Plans" can wait till they get here and I can rifle thought them. 14x24 with loft I think is going to be my best choice at the moment. My building permit application should be here soon. Once it gets accepted Im going start keeping a better eye on sales flyers and craigslist for materials.
Nice views and god work on the preplanning. If you haven't already done so, check out some of the pictures in the gallery section to get an idea of what some of the choices look like, several show their interior lofts.
Your views will drive site orientation and windows but don't forget how the sun can move with the seasons. I find my self moving to the sunny room and wish I had more of them.
The old houses and cabins were built around the fireplace for winter heat. You may not plan on being there winters for awhile but some early spring and late fall visits can get pretty cool.
Might start letting neighbors know that you are interested in downed timber and start collecting. It will be a long time until hardwood grows to firewood size and, by then, you will hate to cut it.
I found this thread very interesting, and wondered if you ever finished your cabin, Micah! Let us know!
[cool]
Quote from: Micah on January 26, 2009, 12:13:01 PM
Thanks for the suggestions Redoverfarm. I think for the time im going to build simple. Im on a very limited budget so simple and inexpensive are my 2 best friends. I just ordered the "Little House Plans" can wait till they get here and I can rifle thought them. 14x24 with loft I think is going to be my best choice at the moment. My building permit application should be here soon. Once it gets accepted Im going start keeping a better eye on sales flyers and craigslist for materials.