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General => Owner-Builder Projects => Topic started by: markert2523 on October 28, 2012, 11:27:13 AM

Title: 24x64 two family cabin
Post by: markert2523 on October 28, 2012, 11:27:13 AM
Howdy Folks,

Looks like the two family cabin is a go.  I've posted various questions along the way and finally it looks like we will break ground soon.  To re-cap, this will be in a rural club where there are about 25 other older cabins (built in 1920's-1950's) and an old central lodge building.  Sits on about 150 acres of land but the cabins are together in a single area.

The contractor has estimated a figure for a dried-in shell to include septic, bringing electric/water service to cabin, stepped concrete foundation with block wall, Advantech floor deck,  9' walls, Hardie siding, attic trusses for storage, metal roof, large covered front porch and large enclosed sleeping porch in back.  I plan to do most of the interior work and likely will do other stuff like the siding, porch decking, porch trim and anything else I have time for.  The contract is for time and materials and my contractor has always let his clients do chunks of work themselves.  I work a 7 day on/7 day off schedule, so likely I will be able to put in a lot of time on it. 

Rendering:
(https://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s315/spammeup/Cabin/Markert_Eagleton_Cabin_View1_CMUbase.jpg)

Floor plan:
(https://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s315/spammeup/Cabin/Markert_Eagleton_Cabin_FloorPlan1.jpg)

Hopefully breaking ground in 2-4 weeks. 
Title: Re: 24'x64' two family cabin
Post by: duncanshannon on October 28, 2012, 12:46:49 PM
congrats on getting started!
Title: Re: 24'x64' two family cabin
Post by: dablack on November 01, 2012, 01:40:30 PM
I'm building a 26 x 52 one story with attic trusses as well.  I have my trusses stick out 4.5" off the front of the building to make a little porch area and to give me a bigger room upstairs.  Yes, it makes the peak of the roof that much higher but it is something you might want to consider.  I have a 19' wide room upstairs. 

With all that being said, I think you design looks great and has a great cabin feel.

Austin
Title: Re: 24'x64' two family cabin
Post by: markert2523 on November 26, 2012, 06:28:35 PM
Well, folks, the two family cabin is underway.  The contractor who is building the shell brought in the backhoe today and started clearing some trees and digging the foundation.  Will prove to be one of the best things I've ever done----or the worst mistake I ever made.  Only time will tell ::)

Seriously, I'm really excited to finally move on.  I just started a 7 day work stretch so I can't get up there until next week to take some pics and it's driving me crazy.

More to come.
Title: Re: 24'x64' two family cabin
Post by: markert2523 on December 03, 2012, 11:11:40 PM
Finally some progress on the cabin.  The trenches are all dug for the stepped footer.  The cabin will be on a hill that slopes both toward the creek and down toward one end of the cabin.
(https://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s315/spammeup/Cabin/IMG_3253.jpg)

Everything slopes down toward the pretty creek
(https://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s315/spammeup/Cabin/IMG_3263.jpg)

(https://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s315/spammeup/Cabin/IMG_3275.jpg)

The low corner of the cabin is maybe 10 feet up off the ground so rebar and grouting of the block wall will be important.  I also plan to place some fill dirt along the outside of that end to shore it up.  Will likely need to place some fill on the "inside" of the wall to balance that out.  Anyway, I'm glad to be going with a full foundation as I'm not wanting this thing to slide down the hill!

The porch on the front will run the length of the cabin and will be on posts.  The sleeping porch that runs the length of the back will have a full foundation like the main building.
(https://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s315/spammeup/Cabin/IMG_3255.jpg)
Title: Re: 24x64 two family cabin
Post by: markert2523 on December 18, 2012, 05:35:12 PM
The concrete sub poured the footer yesterday.  I wasn't there but went up and took some pics today.  He poured it wide at 30" in most places.  The one thing that puzzles me is that he stepped it down at random heights.  Not sure why he didn't step it down in 8/24/32" increments, etc. 
(https://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s315/spammeup/Cabin/IMG_3297.jpg)

(https://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s315/spammeup/Cabin/IMG_3302.jpg)


Seems like the block guy will be sawing a lot of blocks to even the thing up.  Too late to do anything about it now but I hope it won't weaken the foundation.  Any thoughts?

Thanks
Title: Re: 24x64 two family cabin
Post by: Don_P on December 18, 2012, 11:32:07 PM
section 403.1.1 and 403.1.5 relate;
http://publicecodes.cyberregs.com/icod/irc/2009/icod_irc_2009_4_sec003.htm?bu2=undefined
"Best practice" on steps is to do them in 8" increments, no more than 24" rise per step, no less than 2' run between steps. Thickness should be maintained in the vertical portion of the step, the face and soil wall should be as vertical as possible.
Title: Re: 24x64 two family cabin
Post by: markert2523 on June 26, 2013, 10:28:01 PM
Well------It rained about every three days for the last 2-3 months so little got done on the cabin.  But now we're back to hot and dry, so work is finally getting done.  Four big guys who are all brothers came to lay the block wall on the footers.  They didn't blink an eye at the step dimensions.  Just took out a big saw and cut blocks like nothing.
(https://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s315/spammeup/Cabin/IMG_3684_zpsfcf646d0.jpg) (https://s155.photobucket.com/user/spammeup/media/Cabin/IMG_3684_zpsfcf646d0.jpg.html)

(https://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s315/spammeup/Cabin/IMG_3683_zps95400329.jpg) (https://s155.photobucket.com/user/spammeup/media/Cabin/IMG_3683_zps95400329.jpg.html)

They are doing good work.  Pinned everything to the footer and are putting durawire between some courses.  Then the whole thing gets filled.  Should be ready for I-joists soon.  Then advantech floor decking.

More to come
Title: Re: 24x64 two family cabin
Post by: rugger8 on June 28, 2013, 02:22:43 PM
Congrats on getting started!  I really enjoyed your Modern Manshed thread :)  So, I look forward to your progress on this new build!

Jeff
Title: Re: 24x64 two family cabin
Post by: markert2523 on June 28, 2013, 10:14:15 PM
Block laying continues.  I'm getting conflicting advice on whether to grout all of the voids or just the ones with rebar.  Below shows the final height of the tallest corner of the foundation wall. 

(https://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s315/spammeup/Cabin/IMG_3689_zps06a8d47c.jpg) (https://s155.photobucket.com/user/spammeup/media/Cabin/IMG_3689_zps06a8d47c.jpg.html)

Any thoughts on the grouting?

Thanks

Title: Re: 24x64 two family cabin
Post by: nysono on July 01, 2013, 05:38:42 AM
Not sure what you mean about grouting the voids.....Core fill all blocks with rebar in them, all corners and core fill all blocks where bolts for sill plate will be....If that isnt what you mean then im not sure, maybe someone else can help.
Title: Re: 24x64 two family cabin
Post by: rick91351 on July 01, 2013, 10:03:50 AM
Quote from: nysono on July 01, 2013, 05:38:42 AM
Not sure what you mean about grouting the voids.....Core fill all blocks with rebar in them, all corners and core fill all blocks where bolts for sill plate will be....If that isnt what you mean then im not sure, maybe someone else can help.

Grout is at least around here, a watery mixture of pea gravel, cement, and sand.  It can be either pumped or bucketed.  It is what most likely you are referring to "core fill".

Sounds as if they are grouting all the places that are customarily grouted.  Some people however do grout all the voids but I was never around where professional block layers were on the job that they did such.  I did ask a few why they did not do that and they mostly said grout adds no strength adds to the cost of the bid.  However that was many moons ago  :o  Like mid seventies....  OOOWWWW!!!   
Title: Re: 24x64 two family cabin
Post by: markert2523 on July 01, 2013, 10:28:32 AM
I think we all are talking about the same thing.  The contractor plans on using a pumper to fill all of the voids, not just the ones with rebar, corners or bolts.  I just worry that it adds a lot of weight, makes the wall top heavy, and adds little strength.  The cost isn't that much more since the concrete truck is already there and the gout isn't that much extra. 

Thanks
Title: Re: 24x64 two family cabin
Post by: rick91351 on July 01, 2013, 02:31:39 PM
Quote from: markert2523 on July 01, 2013, 10:28:32 AM
I think we all are talking about the same thing.  The contractor plans on using a pumper to fill all of the voids, not just the ones with rebar, corners or bolts.  I just worry that it adds a lot of weight, makes the wall top heavy, and adds little strength.  The cost isn't that much more since the concrete truck is already there and the gout isn't that much extra. 

Thanks

I would not worry at all about the weight and being top heavy.  It looks like you footings are more than adequate  [cool]  And the top heavy thing once that grout sets it certainly is not going any where.  It will set almost as fast as regular old cement.   ;)  Looking good!!!

 
Title: Re: 24x64 two family cabin
Post by: markert2523 on July 04, 2013, 05:24:05 PM
Thanks for helping me with my worries, folks.  But I have one more (for now).  The block guys have finished the foundation walls and they look stout, but I told my contractor I was worried he didn't use steel for the basement door lintel.  He says they built a bond beam with several courses of rebar over the doorway and, once it's filled, it will be plenty strong.  I still may have him put in a 2x12 header and a couple of jack studs to be sure.  The pic is below.  Any thoughts?

(https://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s315/spammeup/Cabin/IMG_3703_zps1e8d8243.jpg) (https://s155.photobucket.com/user/spammeup/media/Cabin/IMG_3703_zps1e8d8243.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 24x64 two family cabin
Post by: rick91351 on July 04, 2013, 06:21:31 PM
Sounds like to me your block guys did as they supposed are to do.  Worst I ever saw doing such was a commercial job and a couple header blocks blew when we were grouting them.  I killed the grout pump and the foreman with the hose tossed it over the edge both at the same time.  Sort if synchronized OH CRAP!!!  SO what they did is pretty common to the way it is done at least here.    All that aside if I were doing it that is how I would have done it.  Like I said before' Once that grout is set it is not going anywhere.  Dropping in a header and jack studs would only more than likely cut the size of the door down to a non-standard size and add a lot of $$$ for no reason other than peace of mind.  And your peace of mind is worth a lot.....           
Title: Re: 24x64 two family cabin
Post by: Patrick on July 04, 2013, 09:50:08 PM
Like Rick said several courses bonded and core filled super strong ,No need for additional wood or steel ,look at it as a massive steel re-enforced header.Sounds like the block guys are very professional.
Title: Re: 24x64 two family cabin
Post by: rick91351 on July 04, 2013, 09:55:26 PM
How many Wal-Marts and K-Marts, Home Depots and Lowes all depend on Lego - no I mean cinder blocks. ;)
Title: Re: 24x64 two family cabin
Post by: markert2523 on July 04, 2013, 10:47:52 PM
Once again....I sleep better.

Thanks all
Title: Re: 24x64 two family cabin
Post by: markert2523 on August 13, 2013, 10:57:41 PM
Howdy folks.

Just a quick question on design.

When I designed the cabin, I had the back sleeping porch exterior wall inset a couple of feet on each end, mainly for an architectural detail.  I thought it would look better than having the sleeping porch walls in line with the walls on each end.
(https://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s315/spammeup/Cabin/view2cmubase_zps10681d59.jpg) (https://s155.photobucket.com/user/spammeup/media/Cabin/view2cmubase_zps10681d59.jpg.html)

Unfortunately when the contractor poured the footings and laid the block foundation, he made them in line with the end walls.  Essentially he failed to account for the inset as shown on the plans.  Too late to change that easily and I'm going to roll with it.  However I'm not sure how it's going to look and I'm thinking of ways to better define the sleeping porch.  Maybe side the entire back with different siding such as cedar shakes?  Maybe some kind of trim detail where the main structure meets the sleeping porch?

Or maybe I'm over thinking it and the salt box look will be just fine.  Any thoughts?

Thanks
Title: Re: 24x64 two family cabin
Post by: Don_P on August 14, 2013, 06:27:17 AM
I usually run the main roof overhanhang down to what would be their level if no porch were there, producing that visual line, and run the porch roof overhang laying up on that. He can also repour the cross footings and tie them into the grouted wall and existing footing... his oops. I've had to have stuff cut out and replaced before, I've had plenty of those days myself, a bad day and you're back on plan. On the last big house an engineer friend stopped by to visit... and invited me over to dinner. The repair took multiple weekends, steel and welding and then a couple of days to wrap the new 2 story steel post that I had to insert after the load was on and the floors and roof were bearing on it, won't make that mistake again  d*
Title: Re: 24x64 two family cabin
Post by: markert2523 on August 14, 2013, 01:29:03 PM
Thanks Don, I think extending the roof line will help.

The contractor finally got the voids in the block foundation wall filled. 
(https://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s315/spammeup/Cabin/IMG_3873_zpsd25a4315.jpg) (https://s155.photobucket.com/user/spammeup/media/Cabin/IMG_3873_zpsd25a4315.jpg.html)

It has been slow going, and not helped by all the rain this year (although we sure needed the rain!).  When it rains the concrete low water bridge leading to the site becomes an underwater bridge.
(https://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s315/spammeup/Cabin/IMG_3874_zps0a4d6d27.jpg) (https://s155.photobucket.com/user/spammeup/media/Cabin/IMG_3874_zps0a4d6d27.jpg.html)



Title: Re: 24x64 two family cabin
Post by: John Raabe on August 14, 2013, 03:21:08 PM
That's an interesting bridge! And a nice looking classic cabin design. There are several things you could do to add contrast to the long end wall (if needed). You could box out the two windows on the main wall then put in window seats and perhaps bookcases between. Put a little shed roof over the whole pop-out thing.
Title: Re: 24x64 two family cabin
Post by: markert2523 on August 16, 2013, 06:56:44 AM
Thanks, John.

Looks like the bridge is back above water and the contractor is finally making some progress!

I-joists are in.  Squash blocks are being installed today.
(https://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s315/spammeup/Cabin/IMG_3899_zpsff9f2f33.jpg) (https://s155.photobucket.com/user/spammeup/media/Cabin/IMG_3899_zpsff9f2f33.jpg.html)

The piers for the beam to support the 24' span are in but posts and beams are going in after the I-joists.
(https://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s315/spammeup/Cabin/IMG_3892_zps20f0af98.jpg) (https://s155.photobucket.com/user/spammeup/media/Cabin/IMG_3892_zps20f0af98.jpg.html)

Advantech 7/8" delivered today.  Only got 40 of the 70 sheets needed.  Hopefully more on the way soon, but it has been a little hard to procure.  And not cheap at $40/sheet.
(https://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s315/spammeup/Cabin/IMG_3918_zps98d61697.jpg) (https://s155.photobucket.com/user/spammeup/media/Cabin/IMG_3918_zps98d61697.jpg.html)

I believe the contractor will start the large front porch deck next.  I think it will make framing easier if he installs the front porch up to floor level.  I'm going with 8"x8" posts and I think the post on the downhill corner will be about 14'.  The uphill corner post will be about 9'.  I am trying to decide whether to use PT pine vs cedar.  Cedar would be easier on the contractor's back but harder on my wallet!
Title: Re: 24x64 two family cabin
Post by: markert2523 on August 18, 2013, 05:56:57 PM
Contractor finished the advantech decking (except a strip he left to make ledger attachment easier).  Not much of a dancer, but here goes....
(https://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s315/spammeup/Cabin/IMG_3937_zps98803629.jpg) (https://s155.photobucket.com/user/spammeup/media/Cabin/IMG_3937_zps98803629.jpg.html)

Impromptu party broke out on the deck.  Probably not advisable but was fun!
(https://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s315/spammeup/Cabin/IMG_3932_zps5500f5f3.jpg) (https://s155.photobucket.com/user/spammeup/media/Cabin/IMG_3932_zps5500f5f3.jpg.html)

60x12 front porch next.  I could get used to this hiring contractors thing.
Title: Re: 24x64 two family cabin
Post by: markert2523 on August 21, 2013, 08:42:54 PM
Contractor started the porch deck today.  One interesting thing about having a contractor build things is that he does things in ways I would never have thought of.  Here he is putting up the joists before the posts.  I never would have thought of that.  I only hope that the splices will all line up over posts.  From what I can tell from the pics, he is staggering 2x12x8' and 2x12x16'.  The posts will be spaced at 8' so I suppose he can just stagger the second 2x12 in an opposite fashion. 
(https://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s315/spammeup/Cabin/IMG_3941_zpsff6d649f.jpg) (https://s155.photobucket.com/user/spammeup/media/Cabin/IMG_3941_zpsff6d649f.jpg.html)

(https://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s315/spammeup/Cabin/IMG_3942_zpsbaab85ca.jpg) (https://s155.photobucket.com/user/spammeup/media/Cabin/IMG_3942_zpsbaab85ca.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 24x64 two family cabin
Post by: Don_P on August 22, 2013, 08:49:14 PM
QuoteThe posts will be spaced at 8' so I suppose he can just stagger the second 2x12 in an opposite fashion. 

Hence the max allowable post spacing in DCA6, the deck guide, of 8'  ;)

Is there flashing between the floor rim joist and the deck ledger?

Just as a tip for owner builders, I do run a diagonal brace on the underside of the joists from house to deck outer rim area to lock the framing in square while working.
Title: Re: 24x64 two family cabin
Post by: markert2523 on August 22, 2013, 10:13:44 PM
Well, Don.  I discussed this with the contractor some time ago and he says he always does the flashing.  Unfortunately I'm on a work streak for several days and won't be able to get up and look at the work for a while.  He is always pretty good about sending pics.

Title: Re: 24x64 two family cabin
Post by: Don_P on August 23, 2013, 04:57:41 AM
Sounds good, I was looking at the pics and didn't see it from those angles but they weren't very clear in that area so just a reminder. One of the guys that's helping me this week is going to work on a log house next where they forgot, the rot got into the sill log, it's kind of an epidemic around here for some reason.
Title: Re: 24x64 two family cabin
Post by: markert2523 on August 27, 2013, 08:21:21 AM
I finally finished up my work shift (7days on/7 days off) and got up to see the progress.  The ledger hasn't been flashed yet--but it will be.  In fact it is only tacked up and through-bolted in a few places.  It has many simpson lateral load devices locking it into the ijoists also.  The contractor has a big box of ledgerlok screws that will go in soon.
(https://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s315/spammeup/Cabin/IMG_3945_zps72a91a17.jpg) (https://s155.photobucket.com/user/spammeup/media/Cabin/IMG_3945_zps72a91a17.jpg.html)

The first wall is built and ready to be tilted up--64' all at once--glad I'm not doing it!
(https://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s315/spammeup/Cabin/IMG_3951_zpsa48e8087.jpg) (https://s155.photobucket.com/user/spammeup/media/Cabin/IMG_3951_zpsa48e8087.jpg.html)

Contractor using some kind of mesh and roof coating for the block wall.  I don't know anything about it but I'm going with it.
(https://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s315/spammeup/Cabin/IMG_3961_zps12ab5f17.jpg) (https://s155.photobucket.com/user/spammeup/media/Cabin/IMG_3961_zps12ab5f17.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 24x64 two family cabin
Post by: markert2523 on August 27, 2013, 09:12:17 PM
And......one day later
(https://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s315/spammeup/Cabin/IMG_3969_zpsf7df2e5a.jpg) (https://s155.photobucket.com/user/spammeup/media/Cabin/IMG_3969_zpsf7df2e5a.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 24x64 two family cabin
Post by: markert2523 on September 06, 2013, 08:45:37 AM
Sheathing going up.  Trusses are ordered and will go up next week.  We are going to have attic room trusses over each end and scissor trusses in the middle common area.  That way each family will have some private storage.  I have three days of army duty and then off next week so I am finally going to be able to get my hands dirty and work on the cabin!  Better start limbering up to help hoist those trusses.

(https://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s315/spammeup/Cabin/IMG_3987_zps0cf534e1.jpg) (https://s155.photobucket.com/user/spammeup/media/Cabin/IMG_3987_zps0cf534e1.jpg.html)

(https://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s315/spammeup/Cabin/IMG_3988_zps6bed34e5.jpg) (https://s155.photobucket.com/user/spammeup/media/Cabin/IMG_3988_zps6bed34e5.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 24x64 two family cabin
Post by: markert2523 on September 12, 2013, 09:22:12 PM
Went up to the cabin site for a couple of days to help with roof trusses.  My contractor ordered a fork truck but it didn't get there.  So there was a big pile of these when I got there.
(https://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s315/spammeup/Cabin/IMG_4007_zps496a5b01.jpg) (https://s155.photobucket.com/user/spammeup/media/Cabin/IMG_4007_zps496a5b01.jpg.html)

So the five of us hoisted all of them up and nailed them in.  Not the easiest thing I've ever done but manageable.
(https://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s315/spammeup/Cabin/IMG_4015_zps5b927b75.jpg) (https://s155.photobucket.com/user/spammeup/media/Cabin/IMG_4015_zps5b927b75.jpg.html)

(https://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s315/spammeup/Cabin/IMG_4038_zps03f1750c.jpg) (https://s155.photobucket.com/user/spammeup/media/Cabin/IMG_4038_zps03f1750c.jpg.html)

(https://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s315/spammeup/Cabin/IMG_4040_zpsf0a53c2b.jpg) (https://s155.photobucket.com/user/spammeup/media/Cabin/IMG_4040_zpsf0a53c2b.jpg.html)

The middle of the cabin has scissor trusses for a vaulted ceiling.  Each end has attic room trusses so each family has some extra storage.
(https://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s315/spammeup/Cabin/IMG_4036_zps172b1c92.jpg) (https://s155.photobucket.com/user/spammeup/media/Cabin/IMG_4036_zps172b1c92.jpg.html)

I also got to lay some deck boards and the front porch deck is about half done.  The contractor let me use his board straightener.  Worked very well.  I'm not gapping the 2x6's at all since they were dripping wet and will gap on their own in time.
(https://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s315/spammeup/Cabin/IMG_4009_zpse62431ea.jpg) (https://s155.photobucket.com/user/spammeup/media/Cabin/IMG_4009_zpse62431ea.jpg.html)

(https://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s315/spammeup/Cabin/IMG_4016_zpse6faeb52.jpg) (https://s155.photobucket.com/user/spammeup/media/Cabin/IMG_4016_zpse6faeb52.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 24x64 two family cabin
Post by: Tickhill on September 13, 2013, 05:26:54 AM
Let me ask a dumb question, is that felt paper on top of the porch joists? I have never seen this done before, what are the benefits? Thanks, looking good!
Title: Re: 24x64 two family cabin
Post by: markert2523 on September 13, 2013, 05:37:09 AM
Yes, that is felt.  It supposedly keeps the joist from rotting.  There is an expensive tape-like material made for this but the felt was cheap.  I'm not too worried about water as the porch will be covered the entire length, but the contractor thought it was a good idea.
Title: Re: 24x64 two family cabin
Post by: MountainDon on September 13, 2013, 08:33:51 AM
It might help prevent wood on wood squeaks, but I can't see any advantage for wood longevity. Felt absorbs moisture just like wood does. That is how it allows water vapor to pass through a wall, inside to outside, when used as a weather resistant barrier.
Title: Re: 24x64 two family cabin
Post by: markert2523 on September 13, 2013, 01:48:25 PM
Don, I guess I'll file this under the "probably won't hurt" category.

Title: Re: 24x64 two family cabin
Post by: rick91351 on September 13, 2013, 02:07:21 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on September 13, 2013, 08:33:51 AM
It might help prevent wood on wood squeaks, but I can't see any advantage for wood longevity. Felt absorbs moisture just like wood does. That is how it allows water vapor to pass through a wall, inside to outside, when used as a weather resistant barrier.

I have seen that in a couple custom builds here in Idaho a while back.  (Pre building bust)  One explanation I liked was softer wood-fibers laying flat on a knife edge 2X8 or 10 DF joist is apt to or does wear a groove into the flooring.  So to prolong wear and ease the noise and lessen nail pops they used such a material between the two.     
Title: Re: 24x64 two family cabin
Post by: John Raabe on September 13, 2013, 02:57:22 PM
I think that the felt strip between joists and decking is a good inexpensive idea in wet climates. It will cut down the gross water that will be running down and soaking the joists. While probably not needed on a covered porch, it can extend the life of an exposed open deck - especially one where non-PT joists are used. While not a good practice, decks are still being built with standard lumber.
Title: Re: 24x64 two family cabin
Post by: markert2523 on September 14, 2013, 09:07:10 PM
Rafters for sleeping porch shed roof are up.  Fairly low slope at 2/12.  Any suggestions for what to put under the metal roof at this slope?  May have to spring for full coverage Grace ice & water shield but it sure is pricey and was like working with glue traps last time I used it. 
(https://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s315/spammeup/Cabin/IMG_4052_zps95a2b504.jpg) (https://s155.photobucket.com/user/spammeup/media/Cabin/IMG_4052_zps95a2b504.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 24x64 two family cabin
Post by: markert2523 on September 19, 2013, 09:47:42 PM
Contractor got the 8x8 cedar porch posts up today.  I'm really glad we went with 8x8 instead of 6x6, which would have been sufficient but would have looked skinny on the large porch.
(https://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s315/spammeup/Cabin/IMG_4059_zpscfc18f0c.jpg) (https://s155.photobucket.com/user/spammeup/media/Cabin/IMG_4059_zpscfc18f0c.jpg.html)

Roof sheathing going up.  I guess I better settle on a metal roof color soon.
(https://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s315/spammeup/Cabin/IMG_4060_zps86f67190.jpg) (https://s155.photobucket.com/user/spammeup/media/Cabin/IMG_4060_zps86f67190.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 24x64 two family cabin
Post by: pmichelsen on September 20, 2013, 10:24:28 AM
That porch is going to be really nice. Looks like you'll have room for anything.
Title: Re: 24x64 two family cabin
Post by: SouthernTier on September 20, 2013, 01:07:47 PM
Quote from: markert2523 on August 27, 2013, 08:21:21 AM
I finally finished up my work shift (7days on/7 days off) and got up to see the progress.  The ledger hasn't been flashed yet--but it will be.  In fact it is only tacked up and through-bolted in a few places.  It has many simpson lateral load devices locking it into the ijoists also.  The contractor has a big box of ledgerlok screws that will go in soon.
(https://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s315/spammeup/Cabin/IMG_3945_zps72a91a17.jpg) (https://s155.photobucket.com/user/spammeup/media/Cabin/IMG_3945_zps72a91a17.jpg.html)
Looking good.

Got a technical question not directly related to your build.  When I build my cabin, it will also be on a hillside and so would make sense to build the deck early on as a platform for working on the front.

if the deck is built at the same time the floor is framed, is it necessary to provide as separate ledger board for the deck?  Why not just make the rim joist of the house where the deck attached out of PT wood, and attach the deck joists straight to that?  Then wouldn't have to worry about flashing or the ledger board detaching.

There must be a reason why that wouldn't be a good idea, but I haven't figured out what it is.
Title: Re: 24x64 two family cabin
Post by: rdzone on September 20, 2013, 06:50:55 PM
I can't speak to all of your question, but my cabin is built into a hill as well.  I built a deck as a place to put the scaffolding so I could work on it safely.  It was a huge help, especially since the cabin is very tall on that side.
Title: Re: 24x64 two family cabin
Post by: pmichelsen on September 20, 2013, 09:35:09 PM
Quote from: SouthernTier on September 20, 2013, 01:07:47 PM
If the deck is built at the same time the floor is framed, is it necessary to provide as separate ledger board for the deck?  Why not just make the rim joist of the house where the deck attached out of PT wood, and attach the deck joists straight to that?  Then wouldn't have to worry about flashing or the ledger board detaching.

There must be a reason why that wouldn't be a good idea, but I haven't figured out what it is.

Doing this would leave your rim joist exposed to the elements, I'm sure there are other reasons but that is the first one that comes to mind.
Title: Re: 24x64 two family cabin
Post by: markert2523 on September 20, 2013, 09:40:01 PM
Southern,

I'm not sure about skipping the ledger and attaching straight to the rim.  I doubt that would meet code but I don't know enough to say why.  I've only seen the standard practice of rim and then ledger. 

Rdzone,

I agree the deck helps to provide a base to work on that side of the cabin.  We used the deck as a place to hoist a lot of the trusses up to floor height before hefting them up in place.
Title: Re: 24x64 two family cabin
Post by: SouthernTier on September 24, 2013, 11:43:30 AM
I can't say I've memorized the code book, but I don't recall anything there that would prevent this.  My recollection is that one is to treat a deck as if it were another room, and typically ledger boards are not used for regular "rooms".

I looked closer at at the AWC guidance describing prescriptive deck construction (http://www.awc.org/publications/dca/dca6/dca6-09.pdf) and they show ledger boards everywhere, but it doesn't say anywhere that they are required.

The house's band joist would be open to the environment, but that's what it would have to be pressure treated.

So I still can't think of a good reason not to.  I think the use ledgers is because in so many cases, decks are added on after the fact, rather than as part of the build, at least in the past.  Just seems like there is a lot of effort going into trying to keep the ledger board from detaching and to keep moisture away from the ledger-to-building/band-joist interface that it would make sense to eliminate this altogether.

Sorry if this is a thread hijack  d*
Title: Re: 24x64 two family cabin
Post by: markert2523 on September 25, 2013, 05:48:13 PM
At any rate, I have a ledger 8)

Contractor is notching the 8x8 cedar for the top porch posts.  He and crew are really doing a good job.  The shed roof over the front porch will go on as soon as the posts and top beam are up.  I delivered 14 rolls of ice and water shield to the site yesterday.  I plan on full coverage I&WS for both shed roofs/transitions and a synthetic underlayment for the 8/12 main roof.
(https://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s315/spammeup/Cabin/IMG_4111_zps06389fd4.jpg) (https://s155.photobucket.com/user/spammeup/media/Cabin/IMG_4111_zps06389fd4.jpg.html)

I've got to start thinking about the interior.  I have a bunch of 1950's metal kitchen cabinets that are in various condition.  I'm hoping to sand/paint them and maybe use them for the kitchen.  There are always mice in the nearby cabins and I think metal cabinets may prevent them from getting to my food.  If I can't use them for the kitchen cabinets, maybe I can put them in a pantry.  This one is an "Ampco" brand from the 50's and is in terrible shape.  I'm planning on sanding it down, spot priming and rolling on gloss Rustoleum oil base with a smooth foam mini-roller.  It may find a life as an outdoor cooking area on the front covered porch.
(https://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s315/spammeup/Cabin/IMG_4119_zpsf1da529d.jpg) (https://s155.photobucket.com/user/spammeup/media/Cabin/IMG_4119_zpsf1da529d.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 24x64 two family cabin
Post by: pmichelsen on September 25, 2013, 10:55:41 PM
Have you looked into having them stripped and powder coated? Seems like they might be primed candidates.
Title: Re: 24x64 two family cabin
Post by: rick91351 on September 26, 2013, 06:01:30 AM
Quote from: pmichelsen on September 25, 2013, 10:55:41 PM
Have you looked into having them stripped and powder coated? Seems like they might be primed candidates.

He beat me to it.   :o  If you would like to use the Youngstown Cabinets you might have them sandblasted and powder coated.  And you do not have to powder coat them in white.  Thought that was tradition.  There are a lot of nice soft colors that would look good with them and really high light them.    BTW they are making a come back in some circles and are very well prized and loved by some.  To me they are no more mouse / rodent proof than any other.  There is always those seams and holes and a drawer that is left ajar here or there.     
Title: Re: 24x64 two family cabin
Post by: markert2523 on September 26, 2013, 06:20:49 AM
Hey guys,

Likely the metals will end up in a pantry, so I probably would not put the money in them for powder coating.  I need to visit my Dad to see in what condition the rest of the metal cabinets are.  It's been a while since I've seen them.  They are in an old hospital that now serves as the family junk storage.  Back in the 1960's my dad was the small town doctor (and still is at 84!!) and he owned his own small hospital.  Many times small town doctors had to do that to in order to have a place to admit patients.  The city built a new, small hospital in the 1980's.
Title: Re: 24x64 two family cabin
Post by: markert2523 on October 27, 2013, 09:36:02 PM
I haven't posted for a few weeks, but the cabin progress continues.  The front porch is looking great.
(https://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s315/spammeup/Cabin/IMG_4227_zpsd6269d32.jpg) (https://s155.photobucket.com/user/spammeup/media/Cabin/IMG_4227_zpsd6269d32.jpg.html)

I had the contractor use 2x6 doug fir for the porch roof deck.  I bought a relatively cheap ($299) airless from Lowes and a buddy and I sprayed it with a light cedar oil stain.  I'll use the airless for exterior and interior painting as well.
(https://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s315/spammeup/Cabin/IMG_4168_zpsaf7a3540.jpg) (https://s155.photobucket.com/user/spammeup/media/Cabin/IMG_4168_zpsaf7a3540.jpg.html)

The attic trusses are going to allow a good amount of loft storage space on each side of the common room--one for each family.
(https://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s315/spammeup/Cabin/IMG_4203_zps48c856ab.jpg) (https://s155.photobucket.com/user/spammeup/media/Cabin/IMG_4203_zps48c856ab.jpg.html)

Metal roof finally going on.  Charcoal color.  Full coverage ice and water shield on the two low slope shed roofs--synthetic underlayment on the 8/12 sections.  I just hoisted panels.  The crew installed it and braved the edges!!  That low end corner is about 24 feet off the ground.  No one seemed to want to mess with a harness.
(https://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s315/spammeup/Cabin/IMG_4261_zps83783069.jpg) (https://s155.photobucket.com/user/spammeup/media/Cabin/IMG_4261_zps83783069.jpg.html)

Windows are in so they are next.  Then Hardie type siding.  Then exterior doors.  Then the interior fun starts.
Title: Re: 24x64 two family cabin
Post by: markert2523 on October 31, 2013, 08:22:14 PM
Windows in. The profile is wide enough that I don't think we will need trim. 

(https://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s315/spammeup/Cabin/IMG_4306_zps600d51b2.jpg) (https://s155.photobucket.com/user/spammeup/media/Cabin/IMG_4306_zps600d51b2.jpg.html)

(https://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s315/spammeup/Cabin/IMG_4305_zps1ed265e2.jpg) (https://s155.photobucket.com/user/spammeup/media/Cabin/IMG_4305_zps1ed265e2.jpg.html)