Author Topic: adjustable concrete pier  (Read 9761 times)

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Offline JRanch

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adjustable concrete pier
« on: October 26, 2009, 06:25:25 PM »
I can purchase the concrete pier and the simpson adjustable bracket now what do I do? ???

Could someone please give me some insight as to how I affix the bracket to my piers?

Thanks,
Keith

Offline RainDog

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Re: adjustable concrete pier
« Reply #1 on: October 26, 2009, 06:41:46 PM »
 Are those the kind you drill a hole for, and epoxy a bolt into?

 I must have done a hundred of those anchors in an earthquake retrofit I did. Isn't hard, if it's what I'm thinking it is.

 Like this? http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b299/PEG688/Mar16Chambers2.jpg

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Offline MountainDon

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Re: adjustable concrete pier
« Reply #2 on: October 26, 2009, 06:55:06 PM »
yes, it would be great to have a picture or a link to the items you are speaking of.

Just because something has been done and has not failed, doesn’t mean it is good design.

If you didn't have the time or money to do it right in the first place, when will you get the time and money to fix it?

Offline JRanch

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Re: adjustable concrete pier
« Reply #3 on: October 26, 2009, 06:59:58 PM »
Raindog,

That is what I am looking to fabricate and if you could pass on your knowledge of putting them together that would be fantastic.

Thank you both for the fast response time, you guys have our fire and police dept. beat, hands down. ;D

Keith

Offline RainDog

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Re: adjustable concrete pier
« Reply #4 on: October 26, 2009, 07:25:35 PM »

 What I was doing was bolting the bottom wall plates to the mudsill, and you'd want to be using heftier stock than the 5/8th that I used for that purpose. Someone here will certainly be able to give you more details, but it's just a matter of using a rotodrill to drill a hole, the depth of which will be determined by the diameter of your anchor bolt, down into the concrete. For my retrofit I bought 5/8 stock and cut it into lengths. Holes were about 6" deep. Blow the dust out, epoxy the bolt in. There are two part epoxy kits widely available for anchoring your bolts down.The size of bolt and depth will be different for you, but the basic mechanics should work just like that. I'd think you'll need to drill up into your wood pier as well, to house some excess bolt length for adjustability. Isn't a problem at all. You'll knock 'em out.

 Sorry I can't be more specific. I can only tell you generalities, not being able to actually see the bracket myself. I'm sure many folks here have done exactly what you propose, and will be able to answer you better shortly.

 Have a great day, and good luck.

 Parks
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Offline MountainDon

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Re: adjustable concrete pier
« Reply #5 on: October 26, 2009, 08:46:23 PM »
Unless the concrete is anchored a ways down in the ground, as in a poured column there doesn't seem to be much point in going to the trouble of using epoxy. A block of concrete just sitting on the ground provides no uplift resistance. The weight of the building sitting on the anchor and base is much greater unless the concrete is in the ground a good ways. Or so it seems to me, unless I'm missing something important.  ???
Just because something has been done and has not failed, doesn’t mean it is good design.

If you didn't have the time or money to do it right in the first place, when will you get the time and money to fix it?

Offline RainDog

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Re: adjustable concrete pier
« Reply #6 on: October 27, 2009, 04:23:35 AM »

 MountainDon: True, that! Depending on what he's building he may not really need the bracket at all.

 I'm waiting for someone who's actually done this to chime in. I too am interested in this. I mean, what size bolt stock would you need to support a house? That stuff in the photo looks a little small to me for much more than a deck.
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Offline JRanch

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Re: adjustable concrete pier
« Reply #7 on: October 27, 2009, 06:04:02 AM »
I am building a 12x16 small cabin.
I am trying to figure out how to assemble the piers as shown on this web site for the post and pier foundation. Many pople have used then in the past so I feel as if they have been tried and true.

I believe their was a thread on this site that went into small detail about drilling the peir and using epoxy but, I did not save the thred nor can I no longer find it.

Thanks in advance,
Keith c*

Offline RainDog

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Re: adjustable concrete pier
« Reply #8 on: October 27, 2009, 06:16:55 AM »

 This one?

 http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=3607.0

 Hope that helps.

 Parks
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Offline MountainDon

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Re: adjustable concrete pier
« Reply #9 on: October 27, 2009, 06:48:54 AM »
I'm going to go back to the beginning and ask a question.

Why do you want to use the adjustable bracket? There are other non height adjustable brackets to mount a wood post to poured concrete.


If the footing is installed at the proper depth for the soil/frost conditions there should be no discernible up or down movement of the post.


If it's because you are concerned about your ability to cut the wood posts off at the exact height required to make them all come out at the same level it is not all that difficult to do. I did mine with the aid of a water level and got the 15 posts to within 1/8" or less of the same levelness.


FYI there are 2 models: 5/8" bolt and 3/4" bolt. Rated at 3275 and 3670 pounds download respectively.

Just because something has been done and has not failed, doesn’t mean it is good design.

If you didn't have the time or money to do it right in the first place, when will you get the time and money to fix it?

Offline JRanch

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Re: adjustable concrete pier
« Reply #10 on: October 27, 2009, 04:10:12 PM »
If you look at the following page, this is what I'm trying to accomplish.

Thanks for both your input.

http://www.coyotecottage.com/cabin/cabinconstruction/foundation.htm

Keith

Offline MountainDon

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Re: adjustable concrete pier
« Reply #11 on: October 27, 2009, 04:59:06 PM »
This is one of those things that varies around the country. The concrete "blocks" are usually made nearby because o shipping costs for a relatively inexpensive, but heavy item. The metal parts in the photo appear to be a non-Simpson item, maybe locally produced as well.


Looking at the Simpson item for a minute... There are 2 ways to use them.

IF the bolts are epoxied into the concrete the metal base and post if installed is rotated to change the height. "To adjust after the epoxy cures, drill a hole in the center of the post and rotate the post base up or down to the desired height."

IF the bolt is not epoxied but just sits in the hole in the concrete, then a nut on the bolt can be turned to raise or lower the post. "Install a ... nut and cut washer on the threaded rod. (Nut and washer not supplied). Insert EPB44T into the hole (in the concrete) and adjust to the desired height (using the nut)."


It appears to me that Jan used the method where the bolt end simply sits in a hole in the concrete and he used the nut to move the unit up or down. It would appear he used the blocks to support the buildings, not to hold them down to the ground. The weight of the building is used to hold it down. The bolts simply allow or leveling the beams and keep the brackets from sliding out of place on the pads. That's how I see it.




I haven't seen Jan on here or some time. He used to drop in from time to time.

http://www.countryplans.com/nicolaisen.html

Here's a couple of links to some of his forum contributions...

http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=3428.msg37244#msg37244

http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=3728.msg42612#msg42612

Just because something has been done and has not failed, doesn’t mean it is good design.

If you didn't have the time or money to do it right in the first place, when will you get the time and money to fix it?

Offline JRanch

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Re: adjustable concrete pier
« Reply #12 on: October 28, 2009, 06:58:47 AM »
Mountaindog and Raindog, Thanks for the info and breaking it down to me. I was originally thrown off my thought train when they stated to add epoxy and drill jole in the center to adjust.

After further reading it, I now understand or can interrupt what they are saying to do.

Thank you both for your help.

Mountaindog, 1 more question.
If I use 2x8's built up for the beams with 4 piers on each, would that be good. I plan on goin in 1' from the ends and then 3'-6" O.C.?

Thanks, Keith

Offline wendigo

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Re: adjustable concrete pier
« Reply #13 on: October 28, 2009, 09:04:23 AM »
JRanch,

I recently used pier blocks to hold up my shed/cabin
http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=7712.0

I had 9 of the adjustable blocks (bracket held up with a washer, not epoxied). I did a dry run and found enough gap between the bracket posts and the holes in the pier blocks that the entire structure would be wobbly. If I epoxied the posts into the blocks that would eliminate the ability to adjust the posts. All of the blocks were buried to their full depth.

I solved the problem with a compromise. I used fixed bracket pier blocks on the corners (epoxied into place) the rest of the brackets were adjustable. This way I only needed to level 4 locations, out of 9.

The platform


To eliminate any sway in the structure I dug PT 4x4s into the soil a few feet, that brace the outer beams, they can be seen in the shadows under the platform.


Hope that info helps in some way!

Offline MountainDon

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Re: adjustable concrete pier
« Reply #14 on: October 28, 2009, 11:41:48 AM »

Mountaindog, 1 more question.
If I use 2x8's built up for the beams with 4 piers on each, would that be good. I plan on goin in 1' from the ends and then 3'-6" O.C.?


Keith, my memory gets confused with all the different projects. Can you refresh it with the cabin dimensions and number of stories. We need that along with the spacing of the piers at 3'6".  Thanks. Don
Just because something has been done and has not failed, doesn’t mean it is good design.

If you didn't have the time or money to do it right in the first place, when will you get the time and money to fix it?

Offline MountainDon

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Re: adjustable concrete pier
« Reply #15 on: October 28, 2009, 01:05:40 PM »
I had a look and it seems you mentioned building a 12 x 16. If that's it, the doubled 2x8 built up beam will be fine for a cabin with no more than a loft above the main floor.
Just because something has been done and has not failed, doesn’t mean it is good design.

If you didn't have the time or money to do it right in the first place, when will you get the time and money to fix it?