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General => Owner-Builder Projects => Topic started by: Oljarhead on September 21, 2009, 02:53:09 PM

Title: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Oljarhead on September 21, 2009, 02:53:09 PM
So I've been looking at owner built cabins here for a while (maybe a year or more?) and after my wife and I bought a piece of land (20 acres) we decided it was time to get busy!  I ordered the Enchilada plans with the intent of building all of the 3 little houses (using decks to connect some and having some independently stationed around the property) as well as the Victorian (I think that's the one -- where you combine the 3 into one) but since you have to start somewhere, we started with the 14x24 near the well.

This will make for a nice vacation spot and maybe someday we'll complete the family get-away (we have 5 kids and figure they will all want a small cabin).

Our first step, after buying the land was to decide on what should be done with access.  The easement road is pretty steep and rough so we had a friend pull a small excavator to the property and work on the easement.  It's now smoother and wider so will be easier to get trailers of gear to our spot.  However, you can't get here with a trailer in tow unless you've got a good 4 wheel drive!  But the views....

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Land068-1.jpg)
A look from up top.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Land040.jpg)
Our driveway.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/DoubleMRanch022.jpg)
Fixing the easement

The drive is about 5 hours (from our home) so it's a bit of a haul to make every weekend, but that's what I'm trying to do as I want to get the cabin shell built and closed in before it snows!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Oljarhead on September 21, 2009, 03:01:39 PM
Once the easement work was completed as well as foundation trenches (we're using post and pier but figured the excavator would make easier work of getting down into the dirt since this is REALLY rocky ground), we trucked up the first components of the foundation - pavers and PT lumber -- and various camping/framing etc items that we might need.  The plan was to go the next day to the nearest Home Depot (an hour away) and get the rest of the supplies there or locally (nearest town is 30 minutes away).  However, my jeep had some issues and then the weather turned on us so all we managed was to drop off the supplies, trailer and tools and leave for another day.

(//i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/DoubleMRanch056.jpg)
Rain, hail, wind, lightning -- the works!  No cabin work this weekend!

And of course, the Jeep decided to overheat too!  So I had to do some major work on it before coming back.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/RandR-radiatorandpump002.jpg)
I ended up replacing the water pump, fan clutch, fan relay and radiator as well as a u-joint.   Yes access to our little cabin in the woods isn't exactly a Sunday drive :P
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Oljarhead on September 21, 2009, 03:08:37 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin-09-20-09006.jpg)
Jeep fixed and the weather much better we return to get started in earnest!  Here you can see the pier blocks in the trenches.  We had to work to get them level and set right.

Bearing in mind that I have framing experience (used to frame condo's some 17 years ago) I will admit that impatience does NOT pay off!  Squaring these on this ground was tough and time consuming but should pay off.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin-09-20-09004.jpg)
We then started making the beams.  I bought 2 14 footers and 2 10 footers for each beam.  The idea was to not have to cut anything and since you need a 4 foot overlap, well, hell, this ought to work right?

Laying the 2x8x14 down we glued it up, placed a 7 1/2" strip of 8' ply on it and then glued that and dropped the 2x8x10 on top.  Nailed it up, and then set the next 2x8x14 on glued up ply and nailed and then rolled.

The whole process didn't take too long since we had a good work surface in the ATV trailer :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Oljarhead on September 21, 2009, 03:33:27 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin-09-20-09008.jpg)

Once the first beam was completed we mounted it and leveled it on the posts.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Oljarhead on September 21, 2009, 04:10:36 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin-09-20-09010.jpg)
We got the first beam installed and began working on the next.

I set the highest post of this beam at 20 inches -- not really thinking straight I guess -- as I wanted a 24 inch crawl space at a minimum.  What I hadn't thought of was the grade overall but lucked out in the end!

Basically I wanted 18-24 inches of crawl space with closer to 24 at the lowest end of the space.  The idea being that I'm a big guy and that I want to install a self composting toilet below the cabin so will need a high side -- as you can see, I got it :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin-09-20-09011-1.jpg)
We got both beams installed and fairly level and square.  Squaring the big beams on piers and posts in this terrain was a bear!  We came within 1/4 inch and then finally with a little creativity got it to exact (as we measured) and called it a day -- only to find that we'd left two piers off level and one post off level -- we'll have to fix those when we go back to work on the floor!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Oljarhead on September 21, 2009, 04:17:59 PM
I should add that the trailer (Evolution One by fleetwood) and camper really make this a lot easier!  We arrive Friday night, pop up our weekend home and crash for a nights rest.  Then get up in the AM and can begin working after coffee and breakfast :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin-09-20-09020.jpg)
Our camp site

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin-09-20-09021-1.jpg)
The view from my chair while drinking coffee -- this is to the south and the direction the cabin windows in the kitchen and 'living' room will look :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin-09-20-09002.jpg)
My son got dinner for us :)  We love Grouse!

We've got a well so lots of water on site and using 'Luggable Loo's' and 'porta pots' with lots of digester will get us buy until the cabin is ready for the composter :)

Also, we won't be living here (unless TSHTF).  It's just our hide-away from the world :)  and we love it!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin-09-20-09038.jpg)
The Road Warrior -- our 1998 Jeep Cherokee with LOTS of work and upgrades!  

One thing that I keep thinking about is all the things we forget and what this takes:

1.  Get twice as many nails as you think you need.
2.  Plan to spend money on your car/truck etc if it isn't new!
3.  5 hour drives are long, don't forget anything!

Cheers
Erik

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Oljarhead on September 21, 2009, 04:24:49 PM
Now for the questions:

First note:  It's been a long time since I was framing (17 years) so my memory is failing...

1.  The metal ties from the posts to the beams:  do we need to put nails in EVERY hole provided?  I didn't think so but realized that maybe it's important??

2.  Nailing the beams off every 6 inches on BOTH sides seems excessive to me.  Is it?  I did 12 and 12 alternating so it's 6" spacing on opposite sides (nails, then 6 inches to opposite side nails, then nails again etc etc).

3.  Square of the beams:  I'm thinking that the beams have to be perfectly square becuase the floor is built directly on top of them.  You don't want a parallelogram after all!  Am I wrong?

4.  Plans for the 14x24 call for 2x6 floor joists.  Does this matter if using 2x6 walls?  Or should the joists go to 2x8 when using 2x6 walls?

5.  Plans call for 2x6 roof rafters but later mention 2x12's in heavy snow load areas.  I don't consider WA State a heavy snow load state (not in an area with only 15 inches of rain anyway) but am wondering about the comment as it pertained to higher walls (found in the section on using 12 foot walls).

6.  I plan to use 10 foot wall studs (if I can find them in 2x6) and am wondering if I should change anything specifically becuase of this -- I don't think so but wanted to check.

Thanks!
Erik
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: ScottA on September 21, 2009, 05:03:44 PM
1. I doubt it would matter since your piers won't hold the cabin down anyway. The extra holes would be to prevent uplift if required by code.

2. I'd nail them every 16" 2 rows staggered top and bottom so you end up with a nail every 8". If it's on the plans as every 6" then do it.

3. Get them close. You can play with the joists alittle if needed.

4. 2x6 should be ok.

5. Size the rafters based on local snow load. Find out what it is.

6. will give you less loft area.


Nice spot.  :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Oljarhead on September 21, 2009, 05:16:33 PM
Quote from: ScottA on September 21, 2009, 05:03:44 PM
1. I doubt it would matter since your piers won't hold the cabin down anyway. The extra holes would be to prevent uplift if required by code.

Thanks :)  I'm trying to keep this cabin close to code in case I, um, er, forget to permit changing the deck I just built into a cabin ;) -- actually no one in the area has anything remotely close to code much less permitted.  But that's another story.
Quote
2. I'd nail them every 16" 2 rows staggered top and bottom so you end up with a nail every 8". If it's on the plans as every 6" then do it.

I've done every 12" on each side which means there are 3 1/4" galvies every 6"  just not every 6" on each side.  The plans only show this in one section as an afterthought so perhaps that's why the confusion -- there was no way I could get a 4x8x24 beam out there!
Quote
3. Get them close. You can play with the joists alittle if needed.
Good point...I guess 1/4" isn't going to be an issue but 1 1/2" would be.
Quote
4. 2x6 should be ok.
Good -- and I figured as much since they don't really carry anything anyway -- that's what the beams are for.
Quote
5. Size the rafters based on local snow load. Find out what it is.
Probably better check that -- I was thinking that with a 12x12 pitch it wouldn't matter much anyway!  However, I once replaced a roof on a house that someone built in the 60's or 70
s with 2x4 rafters!  Yikes those things sagged!

Quote
6. will give you less loft area.
Why?  I figure it will give MORE loft area.  After all, you get 2 feet of straight wall then -- I might not have been clear though.  I mean to say I'm going to use 10 foot studs and put the loft at 8 feet thereby increasing the height by 2 feet.

Quote
Nice spot.  :)
Thanks!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Oljarhead on September 21, 2009, 05:32:55 PM
Some notes on our plans.

I did a lot of research and determined the best layout was to set the cabin with the long axis facing North and South.  This gives more sunlight exposure to the roof providing better winter heat and light in the windows.  This also means that we will put the entrance on the south wall (less icing and snow in the winter) and if we want access to a deck in the rear we'll have to have two doors (yes we're going to do that also).

We plan to deck around the entire cabin with one extended deck of at least 12'x12'.

Our plan is to be 100% off grid and this place makes it easy since there isn't any 'grid' around :) ;)

We'll install a self composting toilet (I've settled on two possibilities) and a Quadfire wood stove.

Also, the cabin will be built to match any codes provided they aren't insane (like demanding a septic system be installed which won't be used, will sour in a few years and then have to be replaced which would be both bad for the environment and costly -- seems the state doesn't understand that if you have a composting toilet and no septic tank it's actually better for the environment -- also, grey water can be run into a large settling tank and then used to water trees.  The state can't seem to conceive that a hunting cabin could be used in this fashion).

Anyway, I digress!  I'll post some links to the things I plan to use at the little cabin in the woods :)

http://www.sun-mar.com/prod_flush_cent2_acdc.html
Sun Mar composter -- serious toilet that will compost human waste which can then be placed in a compost pile -- incidentally there is so much cow manure on the property that I'd be more worried about it then a few humans visiting once ever few weeks/months!

http://thenaturalhome.com/greywater.html
Grey water system -- very good for many uses but in our case with limited time at the cabin this should be perfect :)

http://www.allowsolutions.com/naturesheadproducts.html
Another composter I've thought about.  A little less money (ok a lot) but also does less -- may be better for the short stays though.

http://www.countryplans.com/nash.html
And of course, the real inspiration for my plans and efforts!  These folks (as well as so many others) sharing their story really got me motivated!  THANKS!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on September 21, 2009, 05:37:17 PM
Here's my comments I was typing as the above was being entered.

1. Depends on the plates. Those look like "generic" use plates. IF they were the special post cap or post to bean Simpson things then, yes all nail holes would have to be filled.

2. The Southern Pine Council recommends many fewer nails; don't recall the exact number but it'd at least 126" spacing. More nails is not bad.

3. Ideally you should have the beams exactly square. It may be too late now, but the way I achieved that was to build the beams over length. After securing them in place I laid out the exact measurements and trimmed the beams to length.

4. Depends on the spacing of the joists. What is the exact distance between your beams? You can use the joist sizer to check how different sizes spec out. Remember if you are close to the maximum span on any size joist you floor may be springier than you really like. Deeper joists also allow for more insulation.

http://www.awc.org/calculators/span/calc/timbercalcstyle.asp

5. You can use the above tool to size rafters and add in different snow loads. 2x6 may work, but if you are building a loft into the design think about insulation. 2x6 doesn't allow for much insulation in the roof. I have an anecdotal (not scientific) comment on that. I'm going to be posting it later today. It'll be in my cabin topic.

http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=2335.msg97704#msg97704

6. You should be able to find them, at least around here they are available. Do you mean to use the 10 footers but have the loft floor at 8 eet above the main floor, in order to increase headroom in the loft? You would then inset ledgers in the 10 foot studs at the 8 foot mark.  







Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on September 21, 2009, 05:40:47 PM
Quote from: emcvay on September 21, 2009, 05:32:55 PM

... set the cabin with the long axis facing North and South. 

I get confused easy.  :-[  Does that mean the long walls will be on the north and south? ???
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on September 21, 2009, 05:43:45 PM
Composting toilet. We have a Sun-Mar. It works fine some of the year. Keep in mind that composting stops dead at about 50 - 55 degrees F (10 - 13 C).


% gallon bucket with a tight fitting seat/lid may be better depending on the temperatures.

The nice thin g about a Sun-Mar is they handles liquids with no user intervention.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: ScottA on September 21, 2009, 05:45:30 PM

Quote6. will give you less loft area.
Why?  I figure it will give MORE loft area.  After all, you get 2 feet of straight wall then -- I might not have been clear though.  I mean to say I'm going to use 10 foot studs and put the loft at 8 feet thereby increasing the height by 2 feet.

I guess I was confused. I understood 12' walls in the plans.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Oljarhead on September 21, 2009, 06:00:31 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on September 21, 2009, 05:37:17 PM
Here's my comments I was typing as the above was being entered.

1. Depends on the plates. Those look like "generic" use plates. IF they were the special post cap or post to bean Simpson things then, yes all nail holes would have to be filled.

2. The Southern Pine Council recommends many fewer nails; don't recall the exact number but it'd at least 126" spacing. More nails is not bad.

3. Ideally you should have the beams exactly square. It may be too late now, but the way I achieved that was to build the beams over length. After securing them in place I laid out the exact measurements and trimmed the beams to length.

4. Depends on the spacing of the joists. What is the exact distance between your beams? You can use the joist sizer to check how different sizes spec out. Remember if you are close to the maximum span on any size joist you floor may be springier than you really like. Deeper joists also allow for more insulation.

http://www.awc.org/calculators/span/calc/timbercalcstyle.asp

5. You can use the above tool to size rafters and add in different snow loads. 2x6 may work, but if you are building a loft into the design think about insulation. 2x6 doesn't allow for much insulation in the roof. I have an anecdotal (not scientific) comment on that. I'm going to be posting it later today. It'll be in my cabin topic.

http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=2335.msg97704#msg97704

6. You should be able to find them, at least around here they are available. Do you mean to use the 10 footers but have the loft floor at 8 eet above the main floor, in order to increase headroom in the loft? You would then inset ledgers in the 10 foot studs at the 8 foot mark.  


Thanks Much!

1.  Generic plates -- probably doesn't hurt to nail more and I may yet -- not the cap types as I decided those were too expensive for such a small project.

2.  126"?  Do you mean 12" or 6" or 12 1/2" hehe

3.  Good points on the beams!  Mine are damn near perfect when I left, so I'm not worried I just wanted to comment on it as it was something I had to really work at...it's done now though :)

4.  Spacing is per plans at 9'8"

5.  Good point on the insulation.  I was actually thinking of using 2x8's but one thing to bear in mind is that a 400-500 sq foot cabin will be WAY overheated with a small wood stove.

6.  Yes exactly.

Thanks!

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Oljarhead on September 21, 2009, 06:03:09 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on September 21, 2009, 05:40:47 PM
Quote from: emcvay on September 21, 2009, 05:32:55 PM

... set the cabin with the long axis facing North and South.  

I get confused easy.  :-[  Does that mean the long walls will be on the north and south? ???

It's ok I'm always confused! ;)

yes, the long walls.  You see, I was debating this a lot becuase it can get hot here and I didn't want to present a large area for the sun to heat up until I began to consider the maunder minimum and what approaching that could mean (maunder minimum was at the peak of the little ice age and associated with colder temperatures and we're closing in on it again).  So, changed my mind and decided that while it may be warm in the summer -- indeed hot -- I'd rather have more solar heat in the winter.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Oljarhead on September 21, 2009, 06:04:54 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on September 21, 2009, 05:43:45 PM
Composting toilet. We have a Sun-Mar. It works fine some of the year. Keep in mind that composting stops dead at about 50 - 55 degrees F (10 - 13 C).


% gallon bucket with a tight fitting seat/lid may be better depending on the temperatures.

The nice thin g about a Sun-Mar is they handles liquids with no user intervention.

I've heard that and was wondering what the impact of 25 -45 degree nights would be if the day time temps rose about 65-75 degrees?  Which is common here.

I can enclose the unit and keep it reasonably warm during cold times on the piece and can put in a privy for really cold weather I suppose but in truth we won't live here so it's unlikely we'll be there too often in the very cold weather.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on September 21, 2009, 06:05:15 PM
2. Oops. Typo.   16" is what I meant


4.  Depends on how stiff you want the floor to be.   2x6's are on the edge of going up to 2x8.




Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Oljarhead on September 21, 2009, 06:06:52 PM
Quote from: ScottA on September 21, 2009, 05:45:30 PM

Quote6. will give you less loft area.
Why?  I figure it will give MORE loft area.  After all, you get 2 feet of straight wall then -- I might not have been clear though.  I mean to say I'm going to use 10 foot studs and put the loft at 8 feet thereby increasing the height by 2 feet.

I guess I was confused. I understood 12' walls in the plans.

Sorry, I wasn't clear.  The plans have an addition that shows 12 foot walls to give 4 feet more in the loft but then make the statement about 2x12 rafters and 2x6's....I want to use 10 foot studs like the owner built in the link I left and was just curious about the difference -- not something that's in the plans but I'd noticed at least two others did this and it seems to work nicely.

Thanks
Erik
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Oljarhead on September 21, 2009, 06:09:00 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on September 21, 2009, 06:05:15 PM
2. Oops. Typo.   16" is what I meant


4.  Depends on how stiff you want the floor to be.   2x6's are on the edge of going up to 2x8.


Thanks.  So a little flex in the 2x6 floor do to the 9'8" span between beams?  I'm a 260lbs jarhead and plan to have a wood stove (read heavy) as well as other stuff...is it prudent to assume that the 8" joists would be safer?

They certainly will provide better floor insulation (more important to me then the roof actually).
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Oljarhead on September 21, 2009, 06:13:19 PM
I should also note that I'm learning a LOT all over again and you folks have been great!  Thanks!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on September 21, 2009, 06:30:16 PM
Myself, I'd go 2x8, 16" OC.   OMMV   :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Oljarhead on September 21, 2009, 06:35:11 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on September 21, 2009, 06:30:16 PM
Myself, I'd go 2x8, 16" OC.   OMMV   :D

I'm kinda thinking that way -- then with 2x6 walls and 2x8 rafters I'll have good insulation which should help with summer heat (I'm not worried AT ALL about winter!  I lived in a 600 sq foot cabin in Ucluelet BC one year and the little wood stove kept it roasting that even with 2 feet of snow on the ground I had to open the loft window to keep from roasting to death!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: devildog on September 21, 2009, 08:23:06 PM
OORAHHHHHHHH! emcvay, and  w*. Great job on your project. you mmove fast.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Oljarhead on September 22, 2009, 01:45:03 AM
Oooorah Devildog :)  You must have noticed the cover and the Jeep ;)

And thanks!  Not fast enough for me though!  But the 4 1/2 drive each way does slow us down!  They boys also comment that this old Marine and Sgt is a task master!  Semper Fi!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Yonderosa on September 22, 2009, 09:31:01 AM
Glad to see another "neighbor" underway here  [cool].  Thanks for sharing your progress with us.  Looks like the secret is getting out about this area - quite a concentration of forum members with projects in this neck of the woods.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: SkagitDrifter on September 22, 2009, 10:39:20 AM
Hey Erik-
Thank you for your service to our great country!

Wecome to a great site/forum.
Beautiful part of the world we have over there in the Okanogan.
Great to see you bringing your boys up right too.
Good progress on the cabin.
I did notice your piers however-
They seem to be a bit shallow in the ground.  Do you think frost heaving may become a problem?
Not to throw a monkey in the wrench but I have seen a few projects get thrown out of wack due to the freeze/thaw cycle.  I think the frost level in that area is about 24".
You may consider adding more backfill to bring the grade up thus covering the piers with more material.
Maybe some of the more experienced folks can chime in here.
Good luck and keep posting your progress.
Tom

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Oljarhead on September 22, 2009, 02:55:00 PM
Quote from: SkagitDrifter on September 22, 2009, 10:39:20 AM
Hey Erik-
Thank you for your service to our great country!

Wecome to a great site/forum.
Beautiful part of the world we have over there in the Okanogan.
Great to see you bringing your boys up right too.
Good progress on the cabin.
I did notice your piers however-
They seem to be a bit shallow in the ground.  Do you think frost heaving may become a problem?
Not to throw a monkey in the wrench but I have seen a few projects get thrown out of wack due to the freeze/thaw cycle.  I think the frost level in that area is about 24".
You may consider adding more backfill to bring the grade up thus covering the piers with more material.
Maybe some of the more experienced folks can chime in here.
Good luck and keep posting your progress.
Tom



Thanks and thanks :)

I thought a lot about the pier blocks but another little house builder http://coyotecottage.com/cabin/cabinconstruction/foundation.htm seemed to do ok with shallow piers in the NW (he's in WA also and higher in alt then we are).

I may be wrong, but the soil type where I am at doesn't seem to experience any issues with frost heave so I'm thinking that being down as low as I am should be ok.  One thing you can't see here, but will be seen in other photo's is that we back filled the trenches and are filling them to come just to the top of the piers.  Then will be building a deck all the way around the cabin so they will remain pretty dry also (15" of rain a year max).

The drainage here is excellent and while they do say 24" I'm not sure how accurate that is.  But hey, we'll learn!  ;)

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: chaddhamilton on September 23, 2009, 12:22:19 PM
Eric, Nice work so far.  Did you cast those piers yourself?   

Semper fi.
Chadd
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Oljarhead on September 23, 2009, 12:59:01 PM
Quote from: chaddhamilton on September 23, 2009, 12:22:19 PM
Eric, Nice work so far.  Did you cast those piers yourself?  

Semper fi.
Chadd

Semper Fi Chadd,

Nope -- I bought those from the Builders Supply in Tonasket.  The pavers I also bought.

I'm hoping to get up there to finish the deck this weekend if all goes well...not sure though, since the front drive u-joints might be going on me and I need 4 low to tow the trailer up the hills -- it's steep!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Oljarhead on September 25, 2009, 01:03:22 PM
Leaving soon for the 'shop' we're building in the woods :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Oljarhead on September 27, 2009, 08:15:18 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/9-27-09122.jpg)
After settling in we headed out to get supplies.  11 sheets of 3/4" T&G OSB, 19 2x6x14's, 4 2x6x12's, 4 2x4x8's, insulation, sheeting (moisture barrier for the ground and the floor), nails and more.  The load was very heavy and one grade is at least a 12% and runs about 1/4 of a mile.  I was a bit worried since I usually pulled up it in 4 low but with some U-joints started to make noise I decided to try the haul in 2wd.  We made it!  I was so happy!

Later I did have to put it in 4 high but she pulled fine and we got the load up.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/9-27-09128.jpg)
Thanks to a cheap (Champion) generator and my Makita Miter Saw we made quick work of the cutting.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/9-27-09129.jpg)
The boys used 14 1/2 blocks to space everything out.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/9-27-09136.jpg)
And we nailed it up.  You'll notice the 6" framing.  I decided that since this was not a permanent residence or anything like that it would be fine with the 6 inch floor joists.

I guess the state calls for 12" joists but whether you're building a small wood working shop or a cabin in the woods to use when hunting and fishing I just don't see putting in a 12" floor unless you can spare the money.  Heck, a 8" floor would cost about $100 more and still be out of code -- and when you want to frame the whole thing for under $3k and then use it about as often as you use your tent trailer (6 times a year at most) I'm thinking this will be fine.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Oljarhead on September 27, 2009, 08:16:38 PM
For those curious about the torn up Tyvex in the picture -- that's on a shed that was built several years (4 or 5) earlier by previous owners.  I plan to either fix it up or move it.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Oljarhead on September 27, 2009, 08:22:10 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/9-27-09151.jpg)
Got the insulation down and put down some vapor barrier and then dropped on the lid.

I made one mistake here (maybe two but the 2nd I'm unaware of still) in that I did not rotate the middle or end OSB to face the opposite way.

Why do this you ask?  So after you rip off the overhang of the first you can turn it around and install it on the second!  You need either 3 2' pieces of OSB with a tongue (in my case) or two with a tongue and one with a groove (which is what would happen if you rotate one section of floor).

I probably skimmed past this section of the plans in a hurry -- DOH!  Ahhh well....so I buy another piece of OSB.  Grrr...

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/9-27-09162.jpg)
A Deck!  WhooHoo!  I can see the walls already!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/9-27-09201.jpg)
I hear this is obligatory here at Countryplans so I'm doing a jig :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/9-27-09206.jpg)
It's hard to see but my 4 foot level shows well, level! :)  I love it!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/9-27-09207.jpg)
Dropped down the two footer running the other way for a single shot of the two which didn't work so here it is.

I'm please we were able to do this -- it's been since 1992 since I did any real serious framing are new to it.

We're having fun and knocking out a lot of work!  it's solid too but I want to put in more braces and much more effort underneath.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Oljarhead on September 27, 2009, 08:23:52 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/9-27-09203.jpg)

My favorite shot :)  Nothing like relaxing on the new deck!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: ScottA on September 28, 2009, 07:30:46 AM
Looks good. I bet it feels good to be started.  :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Don & Ginger Lundgren on September 28, 2009, 09:59:21 AM
Looks good so far to me. I forgot to do the jig on our deck when we got it done... darn it! Did put a chair up on it right away and try it out. Had my daughter jump around on the deck looking for any weak areas... That was funny because I knew there were none but she took me serious so was really checking it out.

Keep up the great work.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Oljarhead on September 28, 2009, 10:31:52 AM
Thanks!

It's been a long long time so I find my hands are sore and I forgot just how dry kiln dried is!  My hands were so dry I actually had to steal some of my wifes hand cream -- I remember 20 years ago when I started framing I had this problem for a short time until my hands got used to handling the lumber but today I ride a desk!  Time to toughen up.

Overall I'm sore but feeling great!  Who says fat guys can't build cabins!? haha

Anyway, I've found some windows and hope to look at them today, if they will work I'll buy the ones I want and be able to start planning walls.

Windows is a big one for me becuase I still haven't settled on what I want.  I am planning the wood stove ini the west wall (14' wall) in the center which means I have to change how I put a window in the loft above.  I'm thinking two small bathroom sized windows on either side of the pipe but that's kind silly, so I might move the stove a few feet north instead -- not sure yet.

The issue is that the stove pipe must extend 2 feet above the highest point of the roof within 10 feet -- so putting it in the center of the wall means I've got the entire wall and gable to tie down the pipe.  Whereas, if I put it to the side then I've got to guy wire it to the roof somehow and have a lot of free pipe hanging out there.

Many cabins I see here don't do this, but it's something I feel is important.  I might argue that 6 inch floors and 4 inch walls are fine, but you won't get me arguing about wood stove rules and regs!  I'll be installing a Quadfire catalitic to meet state codes (though with luck they will never know it) and put the insultated pipe all the way up to clear everything correctly.

The main windows I'm thinking could be the size of typical bedroom windows and I've found some 60"x36" aluminum storm windows that I think might work (and for $15ea who'd not?) and also found two 36x30 inches for $10ea.

Thoughts?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: SkagitDrifter on September 28, 2009, 12:16:46 PM
Looking good!

Something to consider about the stove pipe...
The closer you put it to the ridge the less chance you will lose it when the snow sheds off of the roof.
Before I installed mine I asked for some advise from the local company that does woodstove installs.
The guy told me that at least a few times a year he has to replace pipes that have been torn off the roof due to snow build up sliding down the roof.  On a small building it may not be that big a deal.
I put mine about 1-1/2 feet from the ridge.
Just a thought.

Tom

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Oljarhead on September 28, 2009, 12:46:36 PM
Quote from: SkagitDrifter on September 28, 2009, 12:16:46 PM
Looking good!

Something to consider about the stove pipe...
The closer you put it to the ridge the less chance you will lose it when the snow sheds off of the roof.
Before I installed mine I asked for some advise from the local company that does woodstove installs.
The guy told me that at least a few times a year he has to replace pipes that have been torn off the roof due to snow build up sliding down the roof.  On a small building it may not be that big a deal.
I put mine about 1-1/2 feet from the ridge.
Just a thought.

Tom



Hadn't thought of that -- I was just worried about tying it down so planned on putting it right in the center but running the pipe on the outside of the building from under the loft (90 through the outside wall) to 2' above the peak.  That way I've got lots of strength -- but I lose a center window in the loft (so need to offset the window there).
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on September 28, 2009, 06:01:22 PM
Another thing about wood burning chimneys...  A chimney that exits the wall and then rises to above the roof peak may not draw as strongly as a chimney that goes up through the interior and then the roof. That's because it's entire vertical run is colder.  Sometimes more noticeable with newer stoves with their internal baffles and twisted smoke paths than on older stoves. Just another thing to consider. 


What's that XJ got hiding underneath and between the bigger tires? I have one that's been worked over.  8)  Great vehicles.  :) :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Oljarhead on September 28, 2009, 07:09:29 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on September 28, 2009, 06:01:22 PM
Another thing about wood burning chimneys...  A chimney that exits the wall and then rises to above the roof peak may not draw as strongly as a chimney that goes up through the interior and then the roof. That's because it's entire vertical run is colder.  Sometimes more noticeable with newer stoves with their internal baffles and twisted smoke paths than on older stoves. Just another thing to consider.  


What's that XJ got hiding underneath and between the bigger tires? I have one that's been worked over.  8)  Great vehicles.  :) :)

Always a battle for space in a small cabin no?  Running it via the inside means I have to penetrate the roof (which I'd like to avoid) and will lose loft space.

It's cheaper, of course, and more efficient, but I'm thinking the Quadrafire 2100 series stove won't care -- after all, it's designed to heat a place 2 to 3 times larger!

Unless of course, I can find a smaller catalytic stove that's designed for something in the 400 to 700 sq/ft range?

The XJ has a Banks Torque Tube Header, High Flow Cat, Flow Masters, Rusty's TB Riser, K&N Filter on Rusty's pipe, DUI Dizzy cap and rotor, Firewire Coil, Livewire Plugs, HyperTech III Programming, New computer, new AC pump, new water pump, new fan clutch and relay, 3 core rad, E3 plugs...um....geez, you want me to remember? hehe....Those are Devino's (wheels) with 31's, OME 3" lift with ARB's and JKS quicker disco's, added rear leaf for towing, Warn 8000lbs winch and guard, custom rear bumper, Mastercraft seat.....probably forgetting a lot more.

Still need to change the gears since I'm still on stock ones and need to tweak a few other things -- it never ends!

But at 200k miles she runs great and hauls away!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on September 28, 2009, 08:12:39 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on September 28, 2009, 07:09:29 PM
Unless of course, I can find a smaller catalytic stove that's designed for something in the 400 to 700 sq/ft range?

Vermont Casting Aspen


Quote from: OlJarhead on September 28, 2009, 07:09:29 PM
Still need to change the gears since I'm still on stock ones and need to tweak a few other things -- it never ends!

My XJ has 32" tires. I swapped the stock 3.55 gears for 4.56:1 and added ARB's in both diffs at the same time. With the 4.56's the overall average fuel mileage actually went up. Add to that the automatic transmission doesn't "hunt" as much on grades. 4.11's would work well with 31" tires.

I believe there is a break point on the gears. By that I mean one carrier for up to a certain gear ratio and another from that point up. It varies with axle make/model and year. I know the 4.56's required a carrier change which was why I did the gears and lockers all at once.



The 3 core radiator is a cool change; literally.   ;D

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Oljarhead on September 28, 2009, 10:03:59 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on September 28, 2009, 08:12:39 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on September 28, 2009, 07:09:29 PM
Unless of course, I can find a smaller catalytic stove that's designed for something in the 400 to 700 sq/ft range?

Vermont Casting Aspen


Quote from: OlJarhead on September 28, 2009, 07:09:29 PM
Still need to change the gears since I'm still on stock ones and need to tweak a few other things -- it never ends!

My XJ has 32" tires. I swapped the stock 3.55 gears for 4.56:1 and added ARB's in both diffs at the same time. With the 4.56's the overall average fuel mileage actually went up. Add to that the automatic transmission doesn't "hunt" as much on grades. 4.11's would work well with 31" tires.

I believe there is a break point on the gears. By that I mean one carrier for up to a certain gear ratio and another from that point up. It varies with axle make/model and year. I know the 4.56's required a carrier change which was why I did the gears and lockers all at once.



The 3 core radiator is a cool change; literally.   ;D



You know I wondered about the hunting -- on hills it's a killer when cruising down the interstate -- it's got to be my next major job but since I got nabbed twice now for the fenders I just ordered Rusty's to solve that little issue!

I'll check out Vermont Castings for a stove.  I want one that draws fresh air from the outside and is highly efficient (far less smoke).  One of the things I'm facing is a dry climate (not more then 15 inches of rain a year) and high fire hazard times.  So I need to be very careful with the stove and want one that doesn't exhaust much of anything -- hence the catalytic.

Cheers
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on September 28, 2009, 10:14:00 PM
The VC Aspen is a non catalytic model. It does have an optional outside air kit. I have a coarse screen in the chimney cap. I've never seen any embers rising. We too live in an area that is very dry most of the year. I like the Aspen, it has good room clearances and is more than enough for our 15.75 x 30 cabin. The big difference between your cabin and mine is that I went the way of very good insulation (R45 attic), very good windows, etc.

This past weekend with the night lows dropping to 40 F I only built one fire, Friday night on arrival. The interior temp never dropped below 67 overnight and I had to open a window a little to get it to drop that far.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Oljarhead on September 29, 2009, 01:15:51 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on September 28, 2009, 10:14:00 PM
The VC Aspen is a non catalytic model. It does have an optional outside air kit. I have a coarse screen in the chimney cap. I've never seen any embers rising. We too live in an area that is very dry most of the year. I like the Aspen, it has good room clearances and is more than enough for our 15.75 x 30 cabin. The big difference between your cabin and mine is that I went the way of very good insulation (R45 attic), very good windows, etc.

This past weekend with the night lows dropping to 40 F I only built one fire, Friday night on arrival. The interior temp never dropped below 67 overnight and I had to open a window a little to get it to drop that far.

No loft?  

I'm learning Don!  I looked at this stove and you've sold one!  It's half what I was looking at and should do what I need -- I'll put the screen in and it's actually fairly efficient so that ought to help.

With the 14x24 and 6" walls, 6" floor, 8" rafters and vinyl how do you think this will do when it's below freezing?  I'm guessing just fine since it's rated to 600 sq/ft and I'm only 336!

In fact, I'm so motivated I'm bursting to get back to work!

Gotta love this forum!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on September 29, 2009, 01:50:27 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on September 29, 2009, 01:15:51 PM

No loft? 


No loft. There's just Karen & I. Our adult son comes up some weekends and he either sleeps in the RV (which is more or less permanently parked up there and had room for 3 - 4), or he uses the sofa bed in the cabin. Neither K or I have any desire to climb a ladder to get to bed. So, no loft.

With a loft you may find a ceiling an handy for breaking up the stratification of the air. RCH makes a great fan or off grid applications; 12 or 24 VDC. We have the 24 VDC with the airfoil blades, the Vari-Cyclone. Plus we have the speed control.

http://www.thesolar.biz/RCH%20Fan%20Works%20DC%20Fans.htm


As an occasional use cabin you should be fine with a VC Aspen in what you've planned. That said, I am very happy with what I've done with our cabin.  :D

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Oljarhead on September 29, 2009, 01:55:17 PM
Great stuff thanks!

I'm going to get one of these little stoves -- it makes perfect sense!

You mentioned the 24v system and I've been wondering about my place.  It's mostly on a north slope, albiet gradual, so exposure isn't as good for solar but it isn't bad either.  I do have a south slope up top but that's some 800 feet from the cabin and I don't know if even 48vdc would make that run.

My thinking is that I only really need a small system to run a few lights and maybe a radio so plan on putting in a one panel system with Gen hookup and a small battery bank.  Any thoughts on that?

Thanks again
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on September 29, 2009, 02:25:12 PM
The first step on the path to deciding what will be necessary for your cabin power is an honest assessment of the needs. How many lights of what size and for how many hours a day? How many cloudy days of use? What other power needs; water pump? microwave? fan? air blower on the stove? TV? ... and so on.

If there are no power hogs in use; microwave, well pump...., then you can MTL get away with a 12 VDC system. I chose a 24 VDC based system because of [1] microwave, [2], toaster, [3] the desire to run power tools w/o the generator running, [4] the desire to have a yard light and power at the gazebo, a 50 ft run and at the shed, a 25 ft run, [5] I know use will grow... there's a blender going up next weekend.

If you were to just run lights you could MTL get away with a 12 VDC system using Thinlite FL lighting.
http://solarseller.com/thinlite_low_voltage_12_volt_d_c__indoor_fluorescent_lighting_.htm
The low wattage units work well, but are best when close to the work area. We have some as under the cabinet lights. I also have one that lights the bathroom, mounted on the ceiling. It works as general lighting, but would never do for fine work like applying make up. That way you could dispense with an inverter and just run 12 VDC. I use a battery powered radio; a year or more on 4 C cells.

A couple, or four, 6 VDC golf car batteries (Sam's Club has the best $$ I've ever found) with a small panel and a cheap basic charge controller should keep them charged; properly sized of course. I ran the RV off 4 gold cart batteries for years and that included the forced air furnace. I used the generator to keep them charged and had a small PV panel to float them during our absences. That worked over the winter too.

800 feet would be a real stretch.  :o  For example at 5 amps maximum current from the panels, you'd need to use a 60 VDC panel array with #2 AWG wire to keep the voltage drop down to 3%. Three percent is a big drop at lower voltages.  




Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Oljarhead on September 29, 2009, 04:04:32 PM
Thanks Don,

I did some calcs a while back and the more I added the more I saw $$ go up!  Thankfully for this cabin I don't see much requirements -- I need a battery to run my 12v well pump (I use an RV battery and charge it with the generator when running it to power the trailer) and lights.  I was looking a system like this one:

http://www.siliconsolar.com/220w-dc-cabin-power-system-p-50117.html

Or

http://www.readymaderesources.com/cart/index.php?act=viewProd&productId=1177

There was one I found that should do the trick and was cheaper but being a newbie I've been just searching for systems that are turnkey solutions...perhaps I need to just get the pieces and start small?  I don't need much but admit it would be nice to have enough power to do a little more out there -- like run a laptop so I could get some work done maybe (would be nice to escape for a week and work at the same time)....

Anyway, that's where I'm looking...
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Oljarhead on September 29, 2009, 04:10:31 PM
http://www.altestore.com/store/Kits-and-Package-Deals/Off-Grid-Cabin-Systems/Off-Grid-Cabin-package-4-520W-PV/p5694/
Spendy unit but probably more then I need.

http://www.ordermo.com/ofsosy.html
These guys have a small 160watt system I was looking at that might be more in line with what I need?

http://www.alpinesurvival.com/off-grid-cabin_solar-systems.html#SPS%20Cottage%20115
These don't include batteries so I'd have to get those...

Anyway, one thing I've not mentioned is that I work from home and becuase of that I could possibly do work in the cabin when I am on my get-away weekends or weeks (I work a lot) so having enough power to run the laptop would be a good thing.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Oljarhead on September 29, 2009, 04:50:41 PM
How do you NOT go work on your cabin?  I can't really justify the money ($140) to drive there and back without SOMETHING to do and I need to get my windows and a door sorted before I start framing walls -- heck I need to finish the plan for the walls too!

But I'm so motivated I could scream!

I'm ready to go pound nails RIGHT NOW and it's only Tuesday!

Are you addicted?  Clearly I am!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on September 29, 2009, 05:22:56 PM
I have been highly addicted to work, work, work on our cabin and property since the all of 2006. I slowed a tad once the cabin was dried in. Now that it is just about completed I've slowed a little more, or rather shifted energy back to the task of thinning out the trees. I would still rather be up there than here.  ;D  Luckily I have only a 66 mile (one way) drive.


Quote from: OlJarhead on September 29, 2009, 04:10:31 PM

Anyway, one thing I've not mentioned is that I work from home and because of that I could possibly do work in the cabin when I am on my get-away weekends or weeks (I work a lot) so having enough power to run the laptop would be a good thing.

Back to my first point; do an honest energy assessment. Then add 50% to it.  :D  Once you know how many KwH you would use in a typical 24 hour day then you have a much better handle on what you really need. The good thing is that a laptop does not use much power at all. I once measured my laptop actual use with a Kill-A-Watt meter and ound the actual use on AC power was something like half the rated power on the AC adapter/charger. The Kill-A-Watt is great for measuring the actual power use on any AC appliance up to 1800 watts. It doesn't work on DC.


Personally, and this may simply be "me", I have an aversion to off the shelf kits. They come with the parts the vendor wants to sell, which may be different from what I really want. I took a couple years, maybe longer, in studying up on solar and I know that not everyone has the time or the desire to do so. I'm probably odd man out there. Glenn has a large investment in time and equipment in PV and wind power as well.

There are a lot of vendors out there, some better than others I'm sure. I've dealt with two mainly. Affordable Solar (http://www.affordable-solar.com/) in Albuquerque and theSolar.Biz (http://thesolar.biz/Our_Complete_Product_Inventory.htm) . The Solar.biz doesn't do kits. Tom can help in a system design. Affordable has been helpful too. I will admit to a bias towards them that is partly because they are located near me and I can pick up and save on freight on some items.


One thing I discovered was that many popular charge controllers and inverters may not work at some of the lower temps my equipment at our cabin is exposed to in winter.


Have you read our Of Grid power topic? It's not a be-all or an end-all to alternate power but there is some good info scattered about that topic.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Oljarhead on September 29, 2009, 05:39:34 PM
Thanks Don,

I started to calculate needs but am still unsure what they will really be.  I have camped for several days in our tent trailer and use it steadily on the property now and it has one 12v deep cycle RV battery (from Les Swabb) and that seems to be fine for what we need.  When I need AC I run the generator (so I cheat).

I've been looking at small solar charging systems as a means to get a 'cheap' start on things.  One that I've looked at was a $200 panel and a $30 charge controller that is supposed to charge a 12v battery in several hours and can have more then one panel added to it.  It's undoubtedly way too small but I fiugured it might teach me a thing or two.

I've also begun using solar powered outdoor spot lights (security lights) and am happy with them though my main one is burned out and I need to fix it.

I've been trying to read that thread as well as others -- but I'm getting ADD I guess and need to get doing something -- so I jump around.  Anyway, one thought I had was go small with a system I can expand on easily enough and then if it isn't enough, add more :)

I work in telecom and used to build MW sites for Cell backhaul -- what this means is that I'm familiar with installing power systems and battery backup systems with DC controllers and rectifiers (chargers) so I figure I can do the work myself but don't know enough to just go buying parts....

But I've got several months yet as I don't plan on getting the solar power stuff until sometime early next year :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Oljarhead on October 01, 2009, 04:13:22 PM
Well the wife and I went and looked at windows.  We were debating some pretty cheapo options for the cabin however in the end the Vinyl Low-E windows won out.  Why?  After all, I'm talking $1000 for windows instead of perhaps a few hundred!  Well, two things:  One the wife likes the look better (she wins) and two I'm thinking that with a VC Aspen the better insulation might actually be called for.  Let me explain:

When I lived in a 600 sq ft cabin the wood stove roasted me out!  It wasn't something I could easily dampen down and it was designed for a larger place.  Thus I assumed (silly me) that I'd have the same issue in this case.  It doesn't sound like it.

So, with the VC Aspen designed specifically for us :) (small cabin owners) then having good insulation will make a big difference.  

I also stumbled on a Jotul cook stove -- very tiny one -- for $895 (he's had it ten years).  It's probably not approved for WA State (shhh) which has very stringent emissions laws but it's nearly half price and would be excellent to have if the propane ran out! ;)

So I might convince the wife to let me get it too....
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Oljarhead on October 02, 2009, 04:38:18 PM
Ordered the VC Aspen today :)

I checked out several and found that this one was the smallest that also was approved for WA State.  The Jotul wasn't and the others I found were 30,000 BUT units which I think are just too big for a small 14x24 cabin.

One thing I've been considering is that I have the luxury of finding out.  After all, I'm going to build a 12x18 someday and if I feel the VC Aspen isn't big enough I can move it to this smaller cabin :)  If I like it, I'll get another for the 12x18!

Win win!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Oljarhead on October 05, 2009, 01:30:00 PM
OK Decided to put my drawings up that I've been working on -- for the walls.

I've scanned, cut and pasted from The Little House Plans I purchased from this site (John I hope this is OK to post here??  Please edit out if not and let me know what I need to do to post -- thanks).

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/CabinPlan_SouthWall.jpg)
This is the South wall -- the only door to enter the cabin.  It looks at both the driveway coming in as well as up the hill of the property -- it's the best view from down below and is south facing which should mean the door won't freeze shut and the snow will melt away easier :)

scanning and moving around throws things out of proportion a little and I modified the window drawings a little to try to match but basically this should be a 4x4 picture window with sliders a full sized door and a small window in the sleeping area (I'm still deciding if that shoudl be 3x2 or 2x2.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin_NorthWall.jpg)
The North wall shows a 2x4 window on the west side and a 4x2 over the sink in the kitchenette as well as a small bathroom window.

This side looks down the property towards the lowest portion -- and towards the creek.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Oljarhead on October 05, 2009, 01:30:58 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/CabinPlan1.gif)
This would be the East wall -- window over bed in sleeping area (more or less) a small 2x2 and a 2x2 in the loft.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Oljarhead on October 05, 2009, 01:37:15 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin_Westwall-1.gif)
West wall

Notice the offset fireplace.  I think this would be ok if it's centered between the lower and upper window.  The idea is to keep it as close to the peak as possible for support reasons but not to intrude on the windows themselves and to not run it inside the cabin to keep roof penetrations to zero (hard to leak if there are no holes in it) ;)

Any thoughts on any of these is appreciated!  After all, I've got to complete in the next day or so and then frame them!!!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Yonderosa on October 05, 2009, 09:12:45 PM
Since we do get a good bit of snow some years in this area I like the idea of some kind of 'cricket' over the front door to divert snow that slough's off.  Below the fascia the snow really piles up and is the last to melt away in spring.  Not knowing the floorplan if there was a way to move the entry door to the gable end would solve that issue too.  With your access winter visits might not be an option anyway so not sure how crittical it would be.

I'm also a fan of overhangs both at the fascia and at the gable ends.  I'm fairly protected yet wind can still drive snow and rain onto the porch.  Last year the snow remained about knee deep.  The overhangs kept the snow away from the building for the most part.  We've had some rain storms - sideways blowing rain storms - that managed to get most of the porch wet.  If you do decide to add some overhangs consider the steep (12/12?) pitch of your roof and how it might affect windows, trim, headroom, soffit, doors... etc. when figuring projection (probably didn't need to say it but just in case) to avoid interference.  

This is what my place looked like in February.  The quiet and solitude is absolutely glorious.  Very few souls within miles of me, just a few critters - surprising number of deer - and the temperature, in the teens, is quite comfortable outside with a hot beverage and a comfy chair.

(http://www.myhostedpics.com/images/Pathfinder/eb9snowcabin.jpg)

My roof (8/12) isn't as steep and holds a fair amount of snow.  When I visited in April most of the snow was gone except for below the eves.  This year is was very dry and easy shoveling.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on October 05, 2009, 09:36:45 PM
Congrats on the VC stove.  :D


I second the thought about the door on the long side. In our original versions, I was going to place our door there, but didn't want a shed roof porch on the side where snow sliding off the main roof would collect. Nor did I want to mess with a dormer type roof over a small porch. That was my personal thing; I didn't want to deal with cutting the metal roofing to it. Maybe a poor excuse, but there it is. Hence our door on the end with a modified shed roof.  I also like Yonderosa's porch and roof.


The amount of overhang (~26 inches) on the eves on our cabin would have been a problem with a steeper pitch roof. Raising the wall height would help. It keeps the summer sun out of the windows, in fact it shades virtually the entire south side wall in July & August, and now lets the sun hit the glass and brighten/warm up the interior. In winter it also gives a safe space to walk outside from one end to the other.


The only question I have regarding the chimney and stove placement is how close to that lower floor vinyl window will the stove be?


Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Oljarhead on October 06, 2009, 10:42:18 AM
Thanks guys,

What isn't seen in these drawings is the porch!

I put the door on the south wall becuase the south wall will get more sun and melt more snow.  I also will be building a deck around the entire cabin (ala Nash) and putting an enclosed porch in front of the door.

I will be putting a deck roof over the deck -- at least 4 feet anyway -- at some point and the drawings aren't to scale and don't include the 10' walls (sorry I was in a hurry).  So with 10' walls I figure I can get away with less overhang since I'm going to put a roof on the deck surrounding the cabin :)

I'll try to get the plans done closer to what I intend so it's easier to see but in the meantime I might try to find another countryplans builders cabin that inspired some of this...
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 07, 2009, 04:13:35 PM
I will be off to the shop site this weekend :)

Need to get walls framed up and maybe if the burn ban is lifted get some wood burned too.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on October 07, 2009, 04:25:58 PM
It's always good to get rid of or reduce the fire danger. We'll be doing the same thing Thursday thru Monday.

G/L
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 07, 2009, 07:25:51 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on October 07, 2009, 04:25:58 PM
It's always good to get rid of or reduce the fire danger. We'll be doing the same thing Thursday thru Monday.

G/L

I'm also planning on trimming limbs to about 6 feet off the ground but I figure it might take a LONG time to get there!  20 acres is pretty big and I've got LOTS of trees :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on October 07, 2009, 09:11:21 PM
Start around the cabin and make ever widening circles.  That's a great idea to clear of the dead lower limbs, even the living ones at times. That's know as ladder fuel; makes it easier or a ground fire to climb into the tree tops. We have some of that to do as well.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 08, 2009, 02:24:22 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on October 07, 2009, 09:11:21 PM
Start around the cabin and make ever widening circles.  That's a great idea to clear of the dead lower limbs, even the living ones at times. That's know as ladder fuel; makes it easier or a ground fire to climb into the tree tops. We have some of that to do as well.

That was exactly my idea!  Start with a 100 foot radius and work my way out.

need to get a trailer for the ATV to haul good burning wood back to the cabin site and to haul stuff from various locations to the burn pile spots.

But with the difficulty of getting to the property (hours) I'm always limited in time....but lots of camp fires should help!

:)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 08, 2009, 02:55:08 PM
Achoring walls.

One thing I don't see in the plans and my memory cannot bring back for me:  anchoring walls to the floor.

I'm thinking I need to bolt the walls to the floor but I just can't seem to recall what is required on a wood framed floor.

Thanks in advance.
Erik
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Bobmarlon on October 08, 2009, 10:29:45 PM
to my knowledge you need two nails between each two studs with the nails up close to the studs.   Im not sure which size nail though I used 3 1/4
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: SkagitDrifter on October 09, 2009, 11:15:53 AM

The sheeting should extend below the bottom plate and tie into the floor framming.
Nailing through the bottom plate into the sub-floor will hold the walls in place- but the real strength is in the sheets that tie the walls to the floor.  For engineered sheer walls I believe there needs to be some kind of bolt/mechanical tie-down- I'm sure $impson makes one.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 09, 2009, 12:28:54 PM
I was thinking that since it's 16 oc and nailing is 16oc the intent is two 16d nails into the joist.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: ScottA on October 09, 2009, 02:28:05 PM
I ran my sheeting down and attached it to the rim joist with 2 rows of nails.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 09, 2009, 02:56:36 PM
Quote from: ScottA on October 09, 2009, 02:28:05 PM
I ran my sheeting down and attached it to the rim joist with 2 rows of nails.

How far down?  I plan to do the same thing actually and was thinking of going the entire 5.5" down the rim joist with felt and sheeting.

I'm doing 10' walls anyway so might as well go to the bottom of the rim joists and the top of the wall (so 10 1/21 min).

Title: SNOW!
Post by: OlJarhead on October 09, 2009, 03:44:36 PM
Geez can't I catch a break?

I'm getting ready to head out to the property and discovered it would be 12-18 degrees (F) tonight in the nearest town (about 1500 feet lower in altitude too)...so it will be COLD tonight!

But then I read Monday SNOW is expected!!!!  YIKES!

So, now I'm fighting an issue:  If I frame up the walls and get them done and it snows and I have just a tarp on top of the framed up walls and floor the tarp will of course cave and the snow will land smack dab in the middle of my cabin floor :(

So, my thinking is that I've got to work fast and efficiently and frame the loft too so that I can at least have the tarp stop on the loft if it does snow and crash inward....then maybe the following weekend get it out and frame the roof -- which means I'd miss some of hunting season :(

I'd hoped to frame the walls, tarp it all and then wait until after hunting season to do the roof...maybe not such a good plan?

Seems the Canadian's are sending a massive cold front our way that aims to break low temp records....nice.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: ScottA on October 09, 2009, 06:53:25 PM
QuoteHow far down?

All the way down. Same with the tar paper.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 12, 2009, 12:21:15 PM
Quote from: ScottA on October 09, 2009, 06:53:25 PM
QuoteHow far down?

All the way down. Same with the tar paper.

Yup, once I looked at it I realized how good of an idea that was :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 12, 2009, 12:34:21 PM
Lessons Learned, remembering things, mistakes made, patience and impatience and oh ya, we'll deliver for 50 bucks!

What a weekend! ;)

So, there I was driving down the road happy as can be on my way to pick up materials for my cabin so I could get framing walls.  I had it all figured out too.

First, I'd load up all 72 studs...wait, 72?  Isn't that a bit heavy?  Yup.  Hmmm.....

So there I was driving back to the cabin site with half the load I intended having to turn around and go back to get the other half of the load and not being able to get ALL of what I planned for the weekend.  Oh and the Canadians decided to send down some artic weather to mix it up a bit -- can we say sub freezing cold as you know what flash freezing bloody cold weather?

How's 5 degrees grab ya?  In a tent trailer....

So anyway, after getting the second load of stuff on the trailer and preparing to roll off the yard I see what looks like a 1 1/4 ton offroad delivery vehicle extraodinaire...hmmmm... the exchange when like this:

"So I'm curious, do you deliver?"

Store worker "Yes, where to?"

"Totally off road up hill, around the bend and over the mountains -- what do you charge?"

Store dude "All the way up there?  in 4 wheel drive no less?  Hmmm.... how's 50 bucks?"

I picked my jaw back up and promptly determined my next trip would be more productive -- as in they'd do the delivery and I'd actually get something done!  DOH!

Back at the site we began in earnest to bang up a wall.  I cut the studs to 10' even knowing I'd gain 4.5" of wall height on them but thanks to John determined that the extra inches would be nice in the loft.

After the wall was built and squared I wisely (maybe not so) decided to nail on one sheet of sheeting to keep it square and then stood it up.  The sheeting helped to secure it to the floor (thanks Scott et al) and with braces in place it was plumb and we were ready for the next wall -- the tough one...and it was getting late and where did that frost come from?

So as I began to work on the next wall I realized I'd made a rookie mistake -- I made the wall the right size but making it the 'inside' wall (meaning the outer wall would nail to it so it was shorter by the thickness of the other wall) I'd made the rush/rookie error of nailing down a 'nailer' on it as if it were the longer wall -- DOH!...ok I'll survive right?  Ya Sure.

Anyway, back to wall number two...a simple affair of 10' wall with a 2x10 notched into it...um huh?  crap!  So there I was bent over with a skill saw cutting notches after the wall was framed 90%......(shouldn't you at least square it first?...nah we can do it...ya right).....

So, finally, frustrated, cold and in the dark (literally) I put the saw down and cleaned up for the night...we'll start at 9AM at the latest!

3AM -- it's cold!

6:30AM -- turn the heat OFF!

6:45 AM -- damn it's cold again -- turn the heat ON!

So the morning went hoping not to run out of propane and thinking it was not going to be a good day.  By 9AM I was thinking maybe we could start at noon becuase by then it ought to at least be warm enough to work right?  I mean it ought to have warmed up to FREEZING by noon anyway right?

Ya Sure Uhuh.....

More later ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Don & Ginger Lundgren on October 12, 2009, 12:47:27 PM
Man that had me laughing really hard. If anyone had seem me they would have thought I was nuts. I feel for you and the cold. I hope you have some little bit better weather to work in soon.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 12, 2009, 01:03:57 PM
Quote from: Don & Ginger Lundgren on October 12, 2009, 12:47:27 PM
Man that had me laughing really hard. If anyone had seem me they would have thought I was nuts. I feel for you and the cold. I hope you have some little bit better weather to work in soon.

*chuckle* Sorry couldn't resist -- I used to write for a car magazine (little known obscure one) and that was my style -- poke fun at myself becuase there is just SO much material there! ;) :P

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin-1stwall.jpg)
Fist wall goes up...it's within 1/16th of an inch square...of course that's the first wall and as you will find I'm prone to that most human condition "stupidity" in which I will do all manner of wonderful things like hammering ones thumb (not this time) or perhaps, shall we say, installing a loft beam before squaring the next wall...anyone have a fix for dumn man syndrome?  -- kidding, It's a cabin and I'm sure it won't fall down just becuase I can't keep one wall within 1/4 inch (John, if it will fall down don't tell me so I can finish it, go to sleep in it and then be crushed by the loft -- which would be fitting really but I digress...who needs square walls anyway right?  Seriously, have you ever seen....no never mind you probably have anyway....

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin-2ndwall.jpg)
Did you know that ten feet was longer then ten feet 5 1/2 inches?  Yup, sure is!  At least it is after you added one wall to another ;)

So there is my first loft beam -- wanna guess if it's level?  Hell I don't even know though the level that stuck to my hand (Erik Level Hands) should have been useful for determining that but I was too busy chasing cows (yes real cows) away from my favorite spot to try to catch deer winking at the new trail cam...but that's another story....

So anyway, yes, we learned some things ;) and no the level didn't really stick to my hand I was just kidding, after all it DID warm up to freezing by noon.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 12, 2009, 01:21:40 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/CowCam.jpg)
My property is in a 'Free Range' area and so the neighbors cows and horses come and hang out when they feel like it.

I have to put up a 4 wire fence to keep them out (if you use 3 wires then the neighbors don't have to pay for damages) and since my land was unoccupied for ever -- literally -- there isn't much of a fence (actually on on 3 sides and what's left the cows have pushed down in places to cross).

So, I've got to do some work to convince them to leave the mineral licks I leave for the deer!

Saw some Turkey's this weekend (nice big fat ones) and some White Tailed Deer (doe and a buck) as well as lots of Coyote tracks and of course the little howling buggers woke the gang up on Friday (not me though)....and say just outside the Tent Trailer howling away at my son who worried that if he complained I'd get mad at him -- ha!  Even see a coyote run?  Just rack the slide! ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 12, 2009, 01:23:53 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/HorseCam.jpg)
So I got this new 'HorseCam'.....

Yes here it is, early evening, it's dark and the deer, er I mean horses are out eating away...

No wonder the deer tracks are always heading past the blocks....

Actually they aren't and I'm hoping after a week of no nail pounding or camp fires the deer will be back.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on October 12, 2009, 07:55:29 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on October 12, 2009, 12:34:21 PM
"So I'm curious, do you deliver?".....
.... how's 50 bucks?"


That's what we did. The yard is about an hour away on a twisty, steep grades road. $50 delivery for the entire framing, sheathing, roof lumber, tar paper, etc. materials list package. We did have to shuffle the load once it was dropped, but it sure beat all the driving I would have had to do.


You definitely need a good livestock fence. I got tired of dodging cow pies. Lot of work though.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Yonderosa on October 13, 2009, 11:26:11 AM
Eric,
All this whining about the cold and just down the road from you were a bunch of hippies dancing nekkid at the annual microbus/hemp/tie-dye fair.  Can you believe the locals were getting $10 car to let them park in their fields?

All kidding aside, I was exactly the same spot last year - tarp the floor or get it dried it.  A gap in my employment allowed me to spend a week there to get it framed and roofed.  Delivery was worth every penny as it saved me at least a day of shuttling. 

I'm betting you'll do just fine this hunting year with a rifle leaned up in the corner of your new blind... er I mean shop.  Had this dude walk right next to my blind, er I mean shed... er, you know what I mean while we were up last weekend.  I was eating breakfast enjoying the view when he strolled by real casual like.  Had just enough time to grab the camera and take a picture through the window before he skedaddled off...  He's been killing turkeys on my property and leaving me a lot of feathers to tie flies with...

(http://www.myhostedpics.com/images/Pathfinder/obcat.jpg)

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 13, 2009, 04:55:30 PM
Saw some Turkey's on the property last weekend -- thought maybe I ought to bring some cracked corn for them ;)

Can't wait to get back and see what the Trail Cam reveals!  What a neat invention!!! :D [cool]
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: curlewdave on October 13, 2009, 05:50:43 PM
Lots of turkeys starting to show up over here.  Last spring I was walking up the driveway ( up  Empire Creek, just south of Curlew), heard a quiet shuffling behind me , turned and looked, to see a flock of 25-30 turkeys shuffling along behind me, as if I was the flock leader...I just lost my desire to shoot  any toms, as they like to strut by the place and wake me up every morning......
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 14, 2009, 06:13:03 PM
I am so stoked to get back to the land Friday!  Going to do some hunting but also try to get some walls up.  It's been raining and even a little snow so I'm curious to see how things are.

Going to borrow an air nailer and compressor to speed the process up too!  Been a while since I had to produce but with winter coming on fast I need to get the walls up and the floor finished (braces etc) and then get a roof on!!!

Going to order windows soon too and with luck can have it closed up for the winter in a month....but in the mean time I'm dying to see what the trail cam is taking pictures of!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: ScottA on October 14, 2009, 08:45:26 PM
You gotta love the pressue!  :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 15, 2009, 05:25:21 PM
Got to thinking last night that since I left the Tent Trailer popped up (with the door locked) that if a bear were wondering by and smelled anything inside that was of interest he might deside to go in and take a peak around...I'm hoping not!

Hadn't thought of that really since there hasn't been any problems there -- we're out of site out of mind -- but having seen bear prints on the land I do worry I'll show up to find the trailer trashed :(  I hope not!

But I'm heading there tomorrow!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on October 15, 2009, 07:09:10 PM
G/L on the bears.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Yonderosa on October 15, 2009, 10:00:49 PM
This year it seems we have a bunch of bears around.  So far (knock on wood) we've not had any issues with the two bears that frequent my place.  My neighbors that have had problems either left garbage out or had barbecues knocked around, usually it is the yearling bears looking for an easy meal. 

how far away is that salt lick from your place.  I put on in a stump this spring and the bears literally ripped the stump to shreds.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 15, 2009, 10:03:44 PM
Quote from: Yonderosa on October 15, 2009, 10:00:49 PM
This year it seems we have a bunch of bears around.  So far (knock on wood) we've not had any issues with the two bears that frequent my place.  My neighbors that have had problems either left garbage out or had barbecues knocked around, usually it is the yearling bears looking for an easy meal. 

how far away is that salt lick from your place.  I put on in a stump this spring and the bears literally ripped the stump to shreds.



I put mineral rocks up about a 1/4 mile from my cabin site and only noticed one set of bear tracks near it a couple weeks ago.

I also have some mineral licks about 100 - 150 yards away that the cows enjoy but haven't seen bear tracks there.

Seems the bears (knock on wood) have been staying away from the area but perhaps becuase we're there pretty much every weekend.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 21, 2009, 12:45:17 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin-hunting006.jpg)
Boy's went out to find dinner -- dinner escaped, left the county, moved out of country....darn dinner!

So I put up another wall.

One thing of note:  when impatient like me (don't be) try READING (read and you will succeed) the darn panels a little.

I was nailing away happily in my own world swinging my Estwing 22oz waffle faced framing hammer (made in the USA) and really feeling good about getting this wall done when I realized I'd put the OSB inside out.....um...ah....darn it!  I guess 17 years of not framing has cost me a lot of knowledge becuase I couldn't for the life of remember it being that way....smooth side in -- oops.

Ahh well, it's not like this is a house so I'll leave it and put the rest on the other way.

One thing of note, I did intentionally put the floor smooth side up -- why?  Becuase I want to put clear (ish) deck stain on it and leave it -- so did I screw that up too?

Off to go search for OSB knowledge like a 'newb' as the kids would say.....
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Yonderosa on October 21, 2009, 01:33:36 PM
Eric, If you would use a Hart hammer (made in the USA - probably been outsourced out of business since I bought mine..)  you simply wouldn't make as many mistakes...  :P :D ;) 

I've had mine for almost 20 years, it's on its fourth handle - only have one or two handles left in reserve...  :o  Despite the abuse I give it it has outlasted 3 or more nail bags as well.

Also, didn't you know that a waffle face is a sure sign of a rookie?   ;D ;)  Hopefully we won't have to read that you had to heat up an 8d nail to pierce the thumbnail that you smashed to relieve the pressure from the swelling...  :(  Of course a 16d would be more impressive... 

Just razzing you man.  Good to see those Deer weren't distracting you too bad to get some work done.

"All tools are hammers, except chisels - and they're screwdrivers."
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 21, 2009, 04:39:34 PM
:P  Used many but always found my Estwing (Made in America still) to fit me best.

Waffle faced hammers are for framers -- the ones that actually frame ;)  Only rookies or finishing men think otherwise.  Of course, all framers have hit themselves with big waffle faced hammers as rookies and gotten that out of the way -- me too.  Also shot myself through the hand with an air nailer back in 1992 -- ya I learned real quick!

On a side note I find smooth faced framing hammers (have one of those anti-vibe things too) to suck in comparison.  Just something about positive control....but you know all that ;) :P

The OSB thing bothers me though.  I guess becuase I was just in such a hurry I didn't pay attention -- funny really since attention to detail is what gets me success in my real job....

The little things you don't think about (like reading the dang wood for example) will get ya.  But thankfully this isn't a dwelling to be lived in so it doesn't matter as much -- I still want to get it right mind you, just not going to get mad over spilled milk so to speak.

If it were my home though, I'd rip it off and do it again! 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 21, 2009, 04:42:10 PM
QuotePanels should be installed textured side up with their long direction across the rafters or truss chords.
Found that here: http://osbguide.tecotested.com/faq14

But that is roof sheeting not walls...maybe it doesn't matter on the wall and it's only for footing on the roof?

Does anyone know?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 21, 2009, 04:44:03 PM
QuoteLay panels across three or more supports, keeping the side marked "This Side Down" on the supports when using T&G panels.

Now I'm getting more curious...I mean, why would it matter that it's T&G anyway?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on October 21, 2009, 04:49:28 PM
I believe there is no right or wrong side for a wall, it's all covered by weather barrier, etc on the exterior anyways. The only reason there is a right way for a roof is the textured side is much less slippery to walk on. I would not sweat the wall panel.


The bigger worry is overdriving nails or driving them too close to the panel edge.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 21, 2009, 04:51:21 PM
QuoteA: Tom Silva replies: It doesn't make a bit of difference from a structural standpoint. A wall, a floor, or a roof will be just as strong no matter which side faces up or out. But on a newly sheathed roof, leaving the lightly textured side up does give a bit of extra traction.

If the OSB has tongue-and-groove edges, there's another issue to consider. According to the Structural Board Association, the tongue-and-groove profile is not symmetrical, so the sheets must all be facing the same way for the joints to match. With those panels, look for the "This side down" stamp and follow that direction. http://www.thisoldhouse.com/toh/asktoh/question/0,,430695,00.html
Feeling more like maybe I'm not a moron -- it could be we knew that and didn't care -- hence my not thinking about it.

http://www.panelized.com/techlib/Documentation/pdf/Panelized/Which%20Side%20Up0001.pdf
That does it -- whipes brow -- I just had a moment of brain fartedness and it doesn't matter.

But so many years have passed I thought I really messed up somehow.  Ever done that?  Questioned yourself?  Doubted Yourself?  Of course you have, we all do but I do it all the time! hehe...damn me!

OK back to reality!  WhooHoo!  No screw up!  Now I just need to get cracking the weather is moving in!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 21, 2009, 04:56:44 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on October 21, 2009, 04:49:28 PM
I believe there is no right or wrong side for a wall, it's all covered by weather barrier, etc on the exterior anyways. The only reason there is a right way for a roof is the textured side is much less slippery to walk on. I would not sweat the wall panel.


The bigger worry is overdriving nails or driving them too close to the panel edge.

That is what I figured and of course read (posted here already) -- I do this all the time though, then go look it up and sometimes I'm good (like this time) sometimes not -- ce la vie

But, the good news is I will have them deliver the rest of the sheeting -- in the beginning of November as well as all of the rest of the lumber to frame the roof and the loft.  That way I can get it finished for the winter anyway!  I just need to close it in so I'll order windows within the next week probably too -- that way I can get them in once the roof is on.

I'm pushing my luck of course, since the winter is coming on fast and furious this year, but I'm hopeful for some dry weather for the next couple months (please!).....then I won't care :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 22, 2009, 10:20:03 AM
I'm planning the next phase of the build now.  My plan is to get all the remaining lumber needed to get the roof on brought in (for $50) and to drive up with an air nailer to speed the process up.

I can put on the last 1 1/2 walls in a day and get the loft done in the 2nd day -- at that point it might be easier to cover it with a temp roof then last weekend!

That leaves me one more weekend to get the roof framed and sheeted and then I ought to be good!  I'm really hoping to get all of this done before any big snow fall because I'd hate to fail to get the roof on and then end up with 3 feet of snow sitting on the floor!

But we'll see!

Pick the stove up today anyway :)
Cheers
Erik
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Yonderosa on October 22, 2009, 06:41:39 PM
Have tools  - including compressor, generator and nail guns, oh an of course, a Hart hammer  ;) :) -  will work for gas money and beer.   ;) d*
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 26, 2009, 10:10:55 AM
Quote from: Yonderosa on October 22, 2009, 06:41:39 PM
Have tools  - including compressor, generator and nail guns, oh an of course, a Hart hammer  ;) :) -  will work for gas money and beer.   ;) d*

Wow!  Thanks for the offer Yonderosa!   Very kind and I would probably take you up on the offer if you were local but wouldn't want you to have to drive the several hours from home to the area just to bang nails with me!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 28, 2009, 10:26:26 AM
Starting to get antsi now!  It's Wednesday and Friday is just around the corner!  I'm ordering the rest of the lumber soon so I can have it delivered on Monday.  I'll get there Friday night and try to frame up the remaining walls on Saturday and Sunday (shoudl be no problem) then that leaves Monday and Tuesday (I'm off all week actually) to frame the roof and sheet it!

I'm hoping I can get the roof sheeted and wrapped in felt before I leave.

one question about temporary roofing:  If I use felt (30lbs) and nail down 1x2 strips to hold it on in case of wind etc will I need to replace it in the spring"?  Will it leak much?  At all?

I'm really out of time but if there are any other ideas about how to protect my project through the worst of the winter let me know!

One idea i have is to install the wood stove and burn it each month when I get up there to try to help keep it dry.  This area is pretty dry but I'm worried about the snow and it's been raining a lot lately.

Erik
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Yonderosa on October 28, 2009, 10:51:30 AM
how much exposure to wind do you have?

I'd be half tempted to paper, and then tarp and then batten the heck out of it.   

Last year the snow was very dry and fluffy.  My neighbors say that is not typical.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 28, 2009, 02:02:42 PM
Quote from: Yonderosa on October 28, 2009, 10:51:30 AM
how much exposure to wind do you have?

I'd be half tempted to paper, and then tarp and then batten the heck out of it.   

Last year the snow was very dry and fluffy.  My neighbors say that is not typical.

I'd think very low exposure to wind -- we're on the north slope 100 feet from the top with a 30 foot drop to the bottom below us and BIG trees all around the lower section.

WE feel very little wind in the cabin site though it could pick up I suppose.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 28, 2009, 02:06:14 PM
Quote from: Yonderosa on October 28, 2009, 10:51:30 AM
how much exposure to wind do you have?

I'd be half tempted to paper, and then tarp and then batten the heck out of it.   

Last year the snow was very dry and fluffy.  My neighbors say that is not typical.

I was planning a ridge cap over felt and battens to hold it on.  The tarp idea has merit - maybe tied down over the battens even?  Certainly could nail battens along the ridge all the way around to keep the tarp on.

Or if time permits I could get the roofing done (preferred).

One thing I've noticed is the shed, which is at least 3 or 4 years old, has done very well despite only tyvex stapled to the sides and some exposed OSB.

It is rolled on the roof with a ridge vent but otherwise quite exposed yet still strong, clean and dry.  Perhaps the 14-15 inches of rain a year have something to do with that.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on October 28, 2009, 02:59:28 PM
FWIW, half our cabin walls were let over winter with just the felt secured with button cap nails. We had no problem there.

The roof sat for a month or so with #30 felt secured with the same button cap nails. Over the ridge I placed a 20 foot wide sheet of clear 6 mil plastic, centered on the 10 ft fold mark. I pulled it tight and screwed as assortment of salvaged 1x2 and 1x4 pieces around all the edges. That was in place for a short time, but I did it thinking I might get stuck by the weather and have to leave it over the winter. It was quite windy and held out well.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 28, 2009, 03:07:03 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on October 28, 2009, 02:59:28 PM
FWIW, half our cabin walls were let over winter with just the felt secured with button cap nails. We had no problem there.

The roof sat for a month or so with #30 felt secured with the same button cap nails. Over the ridge I placed a 20 foot wide sheet of clear 6 mil plastic, centered on the 10 ft fold mark. I pulled it tight and screwed as assortment of salvaged 1x2 and 1x4 pieces around all the edges. That was in place for a short time, but I did it thinking I might get stuck by the weather and have to leave it over the winter. It was quite windy and held out well.



Awesome!  This is the sort of stuff I need to hear to pick my spirits up!  Thanks Don!

News of rain and snow has me sweating bullets!  I am itching to get the walls finished (shoudl be done Saturday no problem as long is it isn't too foul of weather) and then the roof framed and sheeted -- If I can do that Monday then by Tuesday I can have it felted and will feel 100% better about the foul weather.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 28, 2009, 05:55:06 PM
Question:

I plan on insulating the roof on my little place and beleive I will need proper venting for both winter (cold) and summer (hot).  My thought was to install 2x vent blocks instead of just rafter blocks on top of the wall and then a ridge vent/cap at the top.

Does this sound right?  Should the vent blocks be every rafter opening?

Is 2x4x24" vent blocks correct for 2x6 rafters on a 12:12 pitch?

Thanks!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on October 28, 2009, 08:57:09 PM
I'm not an expert, okay. But since nobody else has chimed in, here goes...

According to code there is a minimum amount of vent area. It is calculated as no less than 1/150th of the area to be ventilated. There are if's and and's that allow that to be reduced to 1/300. (position o vents and vapor barrier enter into this.)

So you have a 14x24 = 336 sq ft. I we use 1/150 you need 336/150 = 2.24 sq t o vent. If we use 1/300 you need 1.12 sq ft. The area is the free area of the vent: louvers and screen reduce the area of the vent.

I've also seen recommendations that one sq inch of ventilation be provided for each square foot.

The total area is then divided between air in and air out, with air in being the sofits and air out being the ridge vent.  It would appear that with adequate vapor barrier and the soffit/ridge venting you could use 1 sq ft of soffit and 1 sq ft of ridge area. Note that soffit vents can also be exit vents if the wind is blowing.

I don't see anything that says the area must be equally distributed between the rater bays, unless I missed it. So my opinion is you need not place a vent in each bay. Each vent must have a clear path for the air though, and that is where those foam baffle things come in handy with a roof/attic like mine... insulation laying on the ceiling. The baffles keep a free path for the air to move from the soffits up into the attic space. The baffles are also called air chutes.

But your roof is different.  :D I imagine you mean to place insulation in between the rafters and place ceiling material under that to achieve a loft and/or cathedral ceiling. In that case You would need to provide ventilation from bottom to top of each rater bay. However, I think you can get away with every other bay IF there is ventilation between each bay, as in holes drilled through the rafters. ???

Another note: better ridge vents have baffles like below...

(http://www.oikos.com/esb/30/ridgevent2.JPG)

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on October 28, 2009, 09:02:19 PM
There are also methods to build a cathedral roof using unvented design.

(http://www.buildingscience.com/documents/digests/bsd-149-unvented-roof-assemblies-for-all-climates/2007-07-24.7947325648)

Building Science has information on this.

"Unvented roof assemblies, such as conditioned attics and unvented cathedral ceilings, are becoming common in North American construction.  It is estimated that over 100,000 have been constructed since 1995.  These assemblies are created by eliminating ventilation openings and moving the thermal, moisture and air control boundaries to the plane of the roof deck."

Full article available at...

http://www.buildingscience.com/documents/digests/bsd-149-unvented-roof-assemblies-for-all-climates?full_view=1

You can D/L it in PD at...

http://www.buildingscience.com/documents/digests/bsd-149-unvented-roof-assemblies-for-all-climates/?searchterm=roof%20ventilation

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 29, 2009, 12:21:45 AM
Thanks Don!

Wouldn't venting each rafter bay be better?  Specially in the summer when it gets VERY hot?  Like say 100 degrees out? 

My worry is that an unvented roof, while water proof of course, would not vent the hot air radiating in from the roofing thus the heat would radiate into the loft area of the cabin -- making it hotter and hotter?

I plan on reading the article too (thanks) but am thinking a vent block in each bay followed by a good ridge vent and the roof would 'breath' thus allowing hot air to be vented out of the roof in the summer.

In the winter I'm less worried becuase wood stoves tend to work VERY well in small cabins :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 29, 2009, 12:29:25 AM
Interesting article!

However, I can't see blowing in the foam in my location ;) so I'm back to standard venting I think.

My hope is that with fiberglass insulation (R19) in the 2x6 framing, 30lbs felt on the roof sheeting and a tin roof with some sort of interior covering (maybe some pine T&G on vapor barrier) and it will at least allow venting of hot air in the summer and provide insulation to keep the heat in during the winter -- that's the thought anyway.

My walls and floor will all be R19 -- nothing fancy sure, but with side skirts around the cabin and the wood stove I'm thinking we're good :)

Besides, the propane RV heater keeps the tent trailer warm when it's 5 degrees out! hehe  so the Cabin HAS to be warmer with the VC Aspen and 6" walls, floor and roof!

I can't wait!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on October 29, 2009, 12:31:38 AM
I wrote this before your last post and didn't feel like editing it.   ;)


Yes, in a cathedral ceiling roof like you would be building I think ventilating each bay would be best.

As for the building science article, it is a good one. However, to do the job the best way requires the use of closed cell spray foam. And that's best done by a professional installer. I threw it in as something interesting.

IF I was building a new full time residence I'd give serious consideration to many o the design ideas that building science has.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on October 29, 2009, 12:42:00 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on October 29, 2009, 12:29:25 AM

My hope is that with fiberglass insulation (R19) in the 2x6 framing, ...


One second on that. 2x6 rafters aren't deep enough for a ventilation space (1" recommended I think) and the R19, without furring out the 2x6 or some other plan.  ???

BTW, I really don't understand why all the stores carry R19 and sell it to folks like ourselves who have built with 2x6 studs. A 2x6 = 5 1/2 inches, right? The R19 that I see is all rated to be 6 1/4 inches thick.  When compressed into a 5 1/2 inch space it becomes R18.

From Owens-Corning

(https://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q75/djmillerbucket/oddsnends/compressedfibreglass.jpg)

The R21 which would be ideal is available locally here, but only from insulation installers who will only sell it with installation (but wanted a fortune to go up to the mountains) , or in minimum quantities that are too large for a simple cabin like mine.  d*

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 29, 2009, 05:42:50 AM
Interesting!  So R21 is what I need?  Seems too small also since it's 5 1/2 inches also.

Interesting.

Makes you wonder if there is greater benefit in using a R15 or something?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Yonderosa on October 29, 2009, 07:11:42 AM
I'm not sure what your plan calls for but here is what I did.  I used 2x8 rafters, vented every rafter bay (bird blocks) and used gable end vents.  The 2x8's allowed me to use R-21 on the vaulted sections gave me the 1" gap between the insulation and roof deck.  The collar ties/ceiling joists form a small attic and I was able to use R38 there.  My walls are 2x4 and I used R 13 because it all that was locally available at the time.  The floor uses R-21.  

(http://www.myhostedpics.com/images/Pathfinder/onstructionrafterview.jpg)

On our last trip the nightly lows ranged from 15*F to 18*F.  Running our "Big Buddy" heater for about an hour would heat the inside to a very comfortable 65*F at which point I would shut it down.  We would lose 2-3 degrees per hour so relighting  the heater every 4 or five hours was required.

During the warm weather the inside temperature would be around 15 degrees cooler than the outside temperature if we kept the windows and door closed. 95*F was the highest we saw this year.  The nights would drop into the low 40's and no heat was required.  

Conversely our TRAILER required heating year round at night and the warm days were not pleasant to be inside it.

Even though we didn't super insulate I'm pleased with the performance.  
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 30, 2009, 06:07:17 PM
Thanks guys!

No cabin work for me this weekend :(  In fact, it may be another week before I get there (not good) as work has suddenly interfered (and I do need to work).

I told my boss that I'm just a manager and if I have to work as a Director well then he knows what to do.

We'll see if anything comes of it but he did say "I can't disagree with anything you're saying".  Good then give me the promotion and the pay raise and I'll pay someone to finish my cabin ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 02, 2009, 01:49:03 PM


Survived the snow and rain barely - had 25 gallons of water in the tarp I guess...got it out and strung it a little tighter...not good!  I need to get back to work on it but work has held me off.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: considerations on November 02, 2009, 02:20:22 PM
I did the same dance with the water, I can relate, but it all turned out ok, so will yours.   c*
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 02, 2009, 05:44:52 PM
Quote from: considerations on November 02, 2009, 02:20:22 PM
I did the same dance with the water, I can relate, but it all turned out ok, so will yours.   c*
[cool]

Thanks!  I am really stressing but a lot of that is work!  I'm a key player in a startup with contracts with all the big boys in Cellular (ATT, Verizon, TMO, Sprint etc) and we broke the TMO network (all sites down) in Southern New Jersey last week :(  d*

Was very bad and stressful but we're getting through it -- if we succeed here then there is no stopping us :)

And I can get back to cabin building instead of looking at sites and circuits ;)

Cheers
Erik
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 06, 2009, 07:05:48 PM
This weekend!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Materials ordered for Monday delivery.  I plan to finish the wall framing Saturday and Sunday.

Wish me luck!!!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on November 06, 2009, 08:21:52 PM
All the best! May the weather cooperate!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 06, 2009, 09:53:35 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on November 06, 2009, 08:21:52 PM
All the best! May the weather cooperate!

Amen!  I picked up a compressor and nailer from a friend and need a box of 61d nails and a quick disco and I'm set to frame the walls a little faster ;)

I hope to at least get the walls done and the loft started but am hopeful the nailer will improve speed and we can start the roof before having to leave (work calls again) Tuesday evening.

Then the next weekend will see us back finishing the roof.  I'll pick up a kerosene heater to help warm it up and dry it out until the stove can be installed :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 07, 2009, 12:15:26 AM
 d*
Oops

OK just realized something I need help with.  I framed my first portion of the north wall (10 feet) and then stopped.  My next section is 14 feet and I intended to put the kitchen window in this piece.  However I need to put it RIGHT THERE.  In other words I had planned the kitchen window right in the joint without realizing it.

I can of course, move it into the 14 foot section but would like to frame it RIGHT at the end stud that will nail to the 10 foot wall (joining the two together).

So my question is:  is this an issue?  The top plate will cross both of course and I'll have headers in place (load bearing wall) plus cripples and will overlap the joint by at least 2 feet with sheathing.

Will this be ok?
Thanks
Erik
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: PA-Builder on November 07, 2009, 07:56:27 PM
Doesn't sound like a problem to me.

If you want, you could scab a piece of 2x6 below the lower plate to give it a little more strength !
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 11, 2009, 12:17:37 AM
So tired!  Just got in (4 1/2 drive back) and we managed to get the walls done (more on that later) and mostly sheeted.  We braced the walls (not enough I'm sure) and framed the bathroom in and then had to toss the tarp over and leave.

It's dark by 5PM so can't really work well past 4ish (cleanup takes time) and the boys aren't too willing to start when the sun comes up (snicker) and honestly, at 44 I'm finding it tougher to work in below freezing weather myself!  But we did get started today around 10AM and worked until 3PM then had to leave.

Yesterday was about noon to 3PM becuase the delivery was a little late (and I had to go find him becuase he can't follow directions) and Saturday was driving there while Sunday we framed a couple wall sections etc...it was a busy weekend and I'll post pics soon.

One note:  clamps are great for drawing wall sections together but NEVER frame the dang band joist before doing this (DOH!).

The long walls are plumb (in and out) but one is off square :(  I'm fretting over that a bit but hoping the 6" walls on such a small cabin may work in my favor (stronger).  Guess we'll find out.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 12, 2009, 03:23:32 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Cabin_Northwall_gap.jpg)
d*

The Northwall Gap.

So we've been working hard and trying to build our cabin piecemeal (clearly not the way to go) and ran across a couple of issues:

1.  Being in a hurry hurts -- stop it -- but wait it might snow -- I'm going crazy here.

2.  If you frame a wall with a Band Joist in it's really hard to square the damn wall.  Don't do it without squaring the wall first.

I've thought about cutting the Band Joist out to fix the walls on the North side of the cabin since I can't get them plumb.

Thoughts?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 12, 2009, 03:29:29 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Cabin11-10-09018.jpg)

OK the South wall we actually built right I think except there was a gap between the two sections.  We were, however, able to tighten it flush with clamps and the result was a plumb wall in all directions :)  We felt good about it.

So, while I can keep the North wall plumb I cannot keep it square without cutting out the band joist -- which I fear might ruin the 2x10.

One thing I did notice was I goofed on the door and framed it at 30 1/2" -- oops  d* ??? I realized I'd marked the trimmer/cripple on the wrong side -- doh! -- and the king on the other side of it...so I will go back, cut that out and re-frame the door (easy enough).

One thing however, that I also realized was the 4 foot window under the 6 foot loft means you don't have a band joist nailed to a king stud at the 5-6 foot mark.  The window header is in there and some jack studs/cripples.  My solution?  I'm thinking of putting in a 2x8 header in the same location and then some small blocks (cripples) between the band joist and the header so the weight is transferred to the trimmer studs on either side of the window.

Thoughts?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 12, 2009, 03:34:45 PM
Load bearing walls and cantilevers:

OK, so I'm reading (read and you will succeed -- I was told) and I find a statement in a framing book that reads:  Floor joists for load bearing walls should not be framed more then 1/2" less then the width of the joist past the cantilever to prevent sheering of the floor when used as a load bearing wall.

Huh?

The little house plans call for a 2 foot overhang past the cantilever which is clearly a lot more then the 5 1/2" of floor joist when making a 2x6 floor and even twice what a 2x12's thickness is.

Is this becuase of the bracing?  Is what I read crazy?  Does it only apply to more then one floor?  Many questions -- and worries.

Please let me know your thoughts.
Thanks
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on November 12, 2009, 04:02:46 PM
Last thing first   ::)

Don't worry about the floor joists overhanging the beams more than what the books say. Your joists are all one piece and are supporting a relatively low load compared to wider and taller structures. Something like that anyways.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on November 12, 2009, 04:12:13 PM
OK, I got it.  :-\   I was confused by a difference in terminology. "Band Joist"

I believe you are referring to those 2xsomethings that are notched into the wall studs at or above window header height.  :)   I think of them as Ledger Boards. A Band Joist to me is one of those 2xthings that run around the perimeter of the Floor Joists, also called a Rim Joist. There are probably other names or them in different parts of the country/world.

Yes it would have been easier to frame and square up the walls before those pieces were nailed in.

So, did I interpret things correctly or am I all wet?  ???

One more question. Is that Ledger Board supposed to stop there or go further. I think it is suposed to stop there at the window edge.  ???

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on November 12, 2009, 04:25:28 PM
So it seems you can get that north wall plumb, not leaning into or out of the cabin, but it is not square, as in a 4x8 sheet overhangs or underhangs some o the wall stud when you try to line things up.

I bet those Ledgers are nailed in real good with the air nailer.  ;D  The best solution may be to give them a hard whack with a big hammer to loosen them a little. Use a block of scrap wood to try to keep from damaging the Ledger. Then use a metal cutting blade in a reciprocating saw to cut the nails between the Ledger and the wall stud. Remove the Ledger, square the wall, apply exterior sheathing and then re-install the Ledger.

I've done that a few times. A nice long metal cutting blade should be able to slip in there.

AT least that's the way I see it. Then you should be able to have everything pretty much squared away, plumb and level too. 



You're not the first owner-builder who's messed up on a door either.

I hope that all helps a little.

G/L on the weather too. Here the weather guy is saying I might get snowed on Saturday up at the cabin. Or maybe not. He doesn't really know.  ???  I always start wondering when (if?) it will stop snowing when I get caught in a snow up there in the mountains.


Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 12, 2009, 04:31:26 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on November 12, 2009, 04:12:13 PM
OK, I got it.  :-\   I was confused by a difference in terminology. "Band Joist"

I believe you are referring to those 2xsomethings that are notched into the wall studs at or above window header height.  :)   I think of them as Ledger Boards. A Band Joist to me is one of those 2xthings that run around the perimeter of the Floor Joists, also called a Rim Joist. There are probably other names or them in different parts of the country/world.

Yes it would have been easier to frame and square up the walls before those pieces were nailed in.

So, did I interpret things correctly or am I all wet?  ???

One more question. Is that Ledger Board supposed to stop there or go further. I think it is supposed to stop there at the window edge.  ???



Somewhere I got the idea they were band joists (maybe from JR?) -- but yes the 2x10 notched into the walls.  It stops at 10' so there is an overhang past the last stud.  I could put a stud in there though to support the end but I thought there was so much support they way it's notched in that it probably doesn't need it.  ???

There are two in the walls -- one on the west end that is 6 feet long (not installed yet) and one on the east end that is 10 feet long.  The ten footer is well supported by 6 or 8 studs it's notched into but the 6 footer is notched into the first 3 studs and then goes out over the window.  One change I could make I suppose is to make the band joist go 7 or 8 feet so it gets to the next kind stud -- thereby having support all the way out.

While we are on the subject can anyone advise me on making the gang way between the two lofts?  My thought was to put in two doubled up 2x8's in double joist hangers and then hanging 2x6's between them for a 36" gang way between the two lofts.  I figured the two 2x8's nailed together would make strong enough beams to both support the loft and the gang way.

Thoughts?
Thanks!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 12, 2009, 04:36:15 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on November 12, 2009, 04:25:28 PM
So it seems you can get that north wall plumb, not leaning into or out of the cabin, but it is not square, as in a 4x8 sheet overhangs or underhangs some o the wall stud when you try to line things up.

I bet those Ledgers are nailed in real good with the air nailer.  ;D  The best solution may be to give them a hard whack with a big hammer to loosen them a little. Use a block of scrap wood to try to keep from damaging the Ledger. Then use a metal cutting blade in a reciprocating saw to cut the nails between the Ledger and the wall stud. Remove the Ledger, square the wall, apply exterior sheathing and then re-install the Ledger.

I've done that a few times. A nice long metal cutting blade should be able to slip in there.

AT least that's the way I see it. Then you should be able to have everything pretty much squared away, plumb and level too. 



You're not the first owner-builder who's messed up on a door either.

I hope that all helps a little.

G/L on the weather too. Here the weather guy is saying I might get snowed on Saturday up at the cabin. Or maybe not. He doesn't really know.  ???  I always start wondering when (if?) it will stop snowing when I get caught in a snow up there in the mountains.




Hmmmm that's kinda what I was thinking -- except I was so worried about the weather that I sheeted the wall anyway.  It's off square but you are correct, it's plumb (to inside/outside).

One sheet didn't line up with the studs -- only one sheet right under the ledger/band joist/whatever it's called.

So, pull the sheeting (it can be done) fix the wall and move on or leave it alone becuase it isn't big enough to matter -- after all it's a cabin....hmmm...I'm not so sure and am hopeful my choice now will be the right one as I don't want a roof landing on my head in the middle of the night! ha!

Thanks for the note on the overhang too!  I was thinking that it didn't matter that much becuase there really isn't a lot of weight there when compared to say a real house :P ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 13, 2009, 12:19:54 PM
At what point do you say "screw it" and leave the wall out of square?  And at what point do you say "heck no" and pull it apart and fix it?

The walls are 24 feet long and will carry a 2x6 framed roof.  Only one sheet out of 6 was out of square so other then ONE SHEET of OSB Sheeting they are all nicely lined up on the studs.  That one sheet was out by about 3/4" over 8 feet.  This tells me that stud was severely out of whack but the rest were damn close.

So, if that one sheet is enough to pull things apart I will becuase I don't want my cabin breaking on me, but if it's just me worrying too much then I'll stop it and move on!

I can get about 4-5 hours of work in on Saturday and Sunday and they are calling for snow!  So, if I can use that time to finish the sheeting, put felt down on the walls, plastic the windows real well and begin roof framing then I'd be 100% happier!

Thougths?  I'm checking every minute incase some of you smarter/more experienced folks will respond (gets down and begs)... d* :-\ :-\ ???
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: PA-Builder on November 13, 2009, 12:45:42 PM
If I understand your situation correctly, you are saying that the first five sheets (20') all hit evenly (in the middle) of your studs, but now the last panel is off center by 3/4".  

Are the 4' ends of the first five sheets in a perfectly straight line, with corners meeting at same point ?  If they are, then it sounds like your wall is pretty square.

I would do two diagonal measurements (from opposite corners) to see if the 24' wall is square.  

It sounds like you may only have one stud that is "out of whack",  and the entire wall section is OK.  If that is the case you could take the time to rip the stud out, and probably damage your OSB, OR why not just put another stud along side the existing "out of whack" stud so that your panel can then be securely fastened to both studs.  Either way, this doesn't sound like something that is going to "break" your cabin.  I'd be more concerned with making sure that your entire wall section, window openings, and door openings are perfectly square.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on November 13, 2009, 02:46:02 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on November 13, 2009, 12:19:54 PM

Only one sheet out of 6 was out of square so other then ONE SHEET of OSB Sheeting they are all nicely lined up on the studs. 

I thought the entire framed wall was out of whack, that it was more like a parallelogram than a rectangle. If it's that close you could likely leave it. You may be the only one to notice. Of course, you may also be reminded of it every time you go to do something in that corner.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 13, 2009, 07:16:14 PM
Of the 6 sheets the first 4 are lined up nicely with no noticeable difference.  Then the 5th is out of whack and the 6th is fine.

However, when I put a 4 foot level on the studs the first 16 feet is pretty close then the next 4 feet is out (at the join of the two walls.  The last 4 feet isn't perfect either but is close.  So only one sheet of OSB didn't line up on the studs and is out about 3/4".  Both sheets on that stud however are secured (toe nailed in spots to reach the stud cleanly and there are no gaps through the sheets (they touch studs all the way).

The 5th sheet that is out drops in one corner about 1/2" below the 6th sheet -- if I could draw it it would look like the 5th out of 6 sheets is a little cock-eyed.

The weather has gotten foul and I'm expecting at least 4" of snow on the tarp :(  Let's hope I can clean it off and finish the sheeting and top plates and start the loft so that at least I can strengthen the temporary roof!

Erik
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 16, 2009, 11:29:52 AM
We arrived to find snow built up on the temp roof/tarp and used brooms to get a lot of it off the night we got to the cabin.  Then the next day we got the ladders out and worked the snow and ice off the roof.

We then tore the back wall apart (it started with removing the band joist/ledger and then we took all the OSB sheeting off too) and hooked the wall up to the winch on my jeep.  A little pull and the wall squared up!  We put the level (4 foot) on pretty much every joist in every direction and son-of-a-gun the wall was plumb and square :) :)  [cool]

I then rolled the 2x10 ledger/band joist over (the other side was a little ugly from pulling the 16d nails out) and after some creative notching got it level and installed once again.

A comment here:  The 2x10 is resting on 5 or 6 studs and is 10 feet long.  I hadn't thought it would need support at the end of the ledger but others suggested it might.  So a question for the framers/engineers/generally smart guys out there is:  Do you think I need to slot a stud in there to support the end?  I will be putting a double 2x8 there and installing a gang way to the other loft.

The other ledger is installed (I need to look that word up *snicker*) and it too does not reach the next stud.  However, I didn't feel it was needed since it was supported by so many others.

I'll be installing 2x8x13ish loft joists between these ledgers (I think the plans call for 24" centers but I have a question there that I need to go back to older posts on).

The 6 foot loft on the west end -- and here I am thinking "why did I cut that ledger at 6  feet when a little longer would tie it into the stud that's RIGHT there.  I didn't fully nail it off so it would be easily removed if needed.

And this one!!!  d* ??? I thought maybe installing a doubled up 2x6 header with a shim to support the end over the wall might work but the more I thought about it the more I thought a 7 foot 2x10 ledger would be supported by the stud on the end -- so why not?

I don't think I'll remove the 2nd header unless there is a good reason to do so but you can see the struggle going on here.

My thought?  Get 2 2x10x8's and cut them to fit to the studs on the end and nail them down there just to be safe.  Then build the 6 foot loft as planned with doubled 2x8 joists on the end to hang the gang way on. (gang way I'm thinking 2x6 joists since the span is only 8 feet -- thoughts on that?).

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 16, 2009, 11:36:38 AM
At least we finally got the top plates on and sheeted the walls fully :)  And since I read that it didn't which side of the sheeting faced out and that I could run the sheets sideways (8 foot length down) along the tops of the walls I did just that!

We also got the temp roof installed a little better this time by putting up 5 2x8x14's and putting blocks between them to hold them upright and then pulling the tarp as tight as we could get it over them.

The tarp is taking a beating but it's holding up and I think I can get the roof framed in the next trip or too -- if I can get one of my framing buddies to help that is! DOH!
hehe

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin-11-14-09055.jpg)
And finally back on the road, tired and heading home -- the snow was only up above about 2500 feet I think.  Becuase it wasn't very far from there that it all cleared up and the drive home was uneventful :)

Now, next trip in two weeks after some turkey!  Wish us luck!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on November 16, 2009, 10:58:14 PM
Looks like a superhighway compared to my snow covered dirt    ;D ;D ;D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 17, 2009, 03:50:33 PM
I'm sure!  Did you see my questions on page 7?  I'm curious what you think and am hopeful I can address on my next trip.

We did pull that wall apart too and now the level is happy :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on November 17, 2009, 06:17:11 PM
No, I missed the end of page 7.


Well, first I'll say I like to see ends of things supported. But... here's a thought that might be worth investigating. (This is a very quick & dirty unscaled sketch. Please do not try to duplicate the wavy lines.  ;) )

(https://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q75/djmillerbucket/construction/emcvay1.jpg)

??? ???

I like the idea of replacing those 7 footers with 8 footers.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 18, 2009, 12:12:08 AM
Thanks Don.

Not sure I understand the catwalk?  I was planning on doubled joists at each end with a span of 8 feet for the catwalk.

Are you saying to put 2x joists partway down the catwalk to the wall supported on the ledger??
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on November 18, 2009, 12:55:01 AM
What I'm wondering about is this....

On the one end where you have 7' ledgers at present, go ahead and replace those with 8'. Install double joists across at the end of those ledgers.


At the other end of the cabin leave the ledgers as they are.
Double up the last joist you have already in place.
Run the catwalk between those doubled joists.

Fill in the space where the ledger ends do not connect to the studs with short joists from the ledger to the catwalk joist(s).

I thought of this because it would place load from the catwalk joists on a joist that is more fully supported by the ledger, than if the catwalk was connected to a joist at the end of the ledger (unsupported end). Not being a licensed engineer I can't say it's any better than just leaving the ledger ends unsupported and carrying the weight there.

I hope you can see what I mean.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 18, 2009, 11:40:04 AM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/wall.jpg)

OK here goes :)


You can see the ledger doesn't reach the stud but is supported by 7 studs along the span of 10'.  The slight distance from the last stud to the end of the ledger is about 4".  From a structural standpoint I do not think this is an issue even with doubled 2x8's right there at the end becuase of the 7 studs on the rest of the span and the floor pressing against the studs holding the loft.  Just as the last stud in the corner doesn't really do much.  It's like a header that has nothing in the middle but a stud at the ends to hold the weight -- I think the principle is the same -- no?

Now this one comes a little closer but I think it fine also:


It's actually held by a little more (I think 8 studs) but again at the end of the 10' span there is no stud.  I don't think it's an issue really but wondered what others thought becuase I'm not above putting in one more stud if a doubled 2x8 with a catwalk hanging on it might warrant such a measure.

But this 6 foot ledger worries me:


The ledger spans almost across the 4 foot window under it but not all the way and with only 3 studs carrying the weight I decided to put in another header (2x6 doubled) to help carry the load -- then realized that probably was in adequate (despite the 2x12 header behind it) and wondered if I just got a longer ledger (say 7 feet) and rant it to the stud and nailed it into that then at least it would be carried by the header and the king stud on the end.

Thoughts?

Finally, this one I think is ok because it is carried on 4 studs over the 6 foot span -- but making it longer couldn't hurt right?

Then, of course, doubling the 2x8's and putting the catwalk on them shouldn't be an issue right?

Also, for the catwalk I was thinking 2x6 DF#2's becuase it's only 8 feet of span.  I could frame those on 16centers and make it 4 feet wide.

Another oops of mine by the way was to decide to go to 16" centers on the loft joists and then forget and plan for 24" centers -- which is a little too weak for 2x8's.  SO I've had to go back and reconsider that.

Also, note in the drawing above that I don't show the 2x8's and where they are.  In the pictures you see only one on the 10' span and it's at 8' -- it was put there as a wall tie actually.  Since it will remain there for the loft floor (8 feet is on 16"c) and eventually there will be another at 9'4" and a double at 10' as well as back along the span.

I think it will be strong enough that way :)

Just need to think about those ledgers a bit more.
Thanks
Erik
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 20, 2009, 03:05:31 PM
Bumpity Bump --

Don?  Any others?  Just wondering if you can comment as I plan to buy the new 2x10's tomorrow to frame the small loft and the rest of the loft and roof material (I was a bit short) and will be driving up to do some loft work tomorrow.

Thanks!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on November 20, 2009, 03:54:11 PM
later   :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on November 20, 2009, 08:42:17 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on November 18, 2009, 11:40:04 AM

But this 6 foot ledger worries me:
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin-11-14-09041.jpg)

The ledger spans almost across the 4 foot window under it but not all the way and with only 3 studs


As this one sits you are depending almost totally on the nails securing it to the two studs above the window. If that 2x was longer and nicely notched into that stud to the left o the window it would be stronger and much better.


Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Jens on November 21, 2009, 07:52:43 PM
seems to me like the weight of the ledger is going to be supported by the jack stud in either case.  Judging by the top of the ladder, the window is about 2.5' wide?  I am no engineer, but I think that your header will be up to the job at hand.  Ledger is notched into the studs and sitting on osp shim on top of header, right?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 22, 2009, 12:17:12 AM
Quote from: Jens on November 21, 2009, 07:52:43 PM
seems to me like the weight of the ledger is going to be supported by the jack stud in either case.  Judging by the top of the ladder, the window is about 2.5' wide?  I am no engineer, but I think that your header will be up to the job at hand.  Ledger is notched into the studs and sitting on osp shim on top of header, right?

The window on this side is 4 feet wide so I added an additional header (double 2x6) with the OSB shim to help carry the load.  I figured the weight of the wall was supported by the 2x12 header and this might work but after some thought and Don's posts I've decided to yank that one out and put in a 2x10x8 through the next king stud (notched in of course).  That way I can be sure it will take the weight :)  I also bought another 2x10x8 for the other side to notch it one more stud also.

My generator quit today so we couldn't get the loft finished.  Instead we dropped off another $300 of lumber, pushed all the water off the tarp and tightened it a little, secured the site and headed home.

I'll service the gen before Thanksgiving weekend and we'll go back with an all hands crew (my two sons and soon to be son-in-law) to finish the loft and frame and sheet the roof.

I've decided to bring up some big lights too since our biggest issue is the lack of light.  If we start at 9am (which means below freezing) we can work to at least 3 without lights.  By 3:30 we had better be cleaning up though!  It was getting dark by 5PM last weekend so I'm guessing full dark will be around 4:30 next weekend -- makes for a short day but I do have 3 big halogen work lights and the gen should run those fine. 

That and a big fire and heat in the tent trailer and I think we'll do fine :)

By the way, for those interested I'm running very close to my goal of framing and sheeting the structure for $3000 or less.  I'm actually at $3300 right now but have spent more on tools, nails and a ladder which wasn't accounted for.

Still I'm happy with that!

We've gotten the stove and still need windows and a door, the roof (tin) as well as siding, wiring, plumbing, bath, kitchen and railings plus a lot of other things...my hope however is to complete the whole thing for around $10k or less :)  Wish me luck!

Now...to drum up another $7k...hmmmmm

hehe
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 22, 2009, 12:43:04 AM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin-11-21-09024.jpg)
Some critters were running around chasing the deer off it seems ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 22, 2009, 12:44:10 AM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin-11-21-09008.jpg)
Spike buck was coming around...this is the 2nd or 3rd buck the camera has seen.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 23, 2009, 02:05:21 PM
Heading off this weekend (after eating loads of Turkey) to try to get this roof on!  With luck we can at least get things sorted well enough to withstand a foot of snow (which is coming I fear).

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 27, 2009, 01:20:57 PM
20 degrees at night -- so the Tent Trailer will be a little on the cool side at night (we can take it) -- but mostly clear by the looks of it so it's a go!

We're off with extra lights and another body to try to get the loft done and the roof framed and at least partly sheeted!

With me luck!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on November 27, 2009, 02:05:36 PM
Stay warm   :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 30, 2009, 11:57:12 AM
Friday night we framed the big loft -- the big halogen lights made a HUGE difference!  It's so dark there in the winter that with these lights we finally did work after 5pm :)  In fact we worked until 9:30pm on Friday (no sales for us).

This picture was from the ground -- yes the blocking in the floor is crooked *snicker*.  I was in a hurry (you never should be) and didn't think to snap a line until I realized we were crooked -- hehe.,..ahhh well, builds character!
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Cabin_Nov_29030.jpg)
The 'big loft'

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Cabin_Nov_29032.jpg)
Looking down from the loft

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 30, 2009, 12:04:57 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Cabin_Nov_29044.jpg)
Finally started framing the roof.  I'd goofed on the first set of rafters and cut the birdsmouth above the line it was supposed to be below (DOH!)  d* d* ??? but eventually got it sorted and began getting the job done.

One note:  I did have to adjust the beam height a little as well in order to get 1" of space above it.  Then decided 1 1/4" was even better...(oh wait, that's what it ended up at after fixing the birdsmouth and I decided to leave it *chuckle*)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Cabin_Nov_29046.jpg)
It's 5PM Sunday and you smashed your left thumb full force with a 22 ounce framing hammer (on the side of the thumb), your knuckle is bleeding and the dust is making your eyes tear up...what more could you want in life???

We worked late Saturday (after a 2 1/2 hour run to Home Depot -it takes that long to get there and back) and then got a very early start Sunday but it just wasn't enough to get the roof framed and partially sheeted :(  We had to stop 2 rafter sets shy of the main roof framing, no lookouts and still needing collar ties, blocking and more!  Ahhhhhhhhh  :P d*

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Cabin_Nov_29054.jpg)
Put on the tarp and used some 1x4's to make temporary collar ties and tied everything down -- and began praying that the heavens wouldn't open up for a couple more weeks!!!!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Cabin_Nov_29055.jpg)
Blood, sweat, tears and a smashed knuckle but we're starting to feel like the end is near (for this year anyway)!  All we need to do is finish the outer shell well enough to make it a few months without much work -- here's hoping!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on November 30, 2009, 02:30:41 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on November 30, 2009, 12:04:57 PM

Finally started framing the roof.  I'd goofed on the first set of rafters and cut the birdsmouth above the line it was supposed to be below

That's why we cut a test pair and see how they work.  ;)  I had to make one set of adjustments on mine too.

We'll all cross our fingers and say a prayer for you regarding the weather/snow. I betcha it was nice to see those rafters up at last.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 30, 2009, 02:49:27 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on November 30, 2009, 02:30:41 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on November 30, 2009, 12:04:57 PM

Finally started framing the roof.  I'd goofed on the first set of rafters and cut the birdsmouth above the line it was supposed to be below

That's why we cut a test pair and see how they work.  ;)  I had to make one set of adjustments on mine too.

We'll all cross our fingers and say a prayer for you regarding the weather/snow. I betcha it was nice to see those rafters up at last.

You bet!

The funny thing is that I finally took John's advice (I'm a little slow at times) and laid them out on the floor of the cabin...that is what showed me the mistake!

It felt so great to get the rafters up!  But I also need to thank you and others :)

For one:  I fixed the small loft ledgers to your recommendations :)  Thanks!  It felt a lot better doing that and then proceeding.

For two:  the loft floor feels very strong!  With 4 of us up there (I'm 260lbs, Josh is 210 and Kurt and James make another 320lbs or so) it didn't move at all!  A couple creeks in the middle when I walk through so there is a little movement but overall very sturdy :)  I'm very happy!

I'm also confident the 2x6 catwalk will be fine too :)  it's a 7 foot span and I made a temp one and it's plenty strong (it occurred to me the floor was made with 2x6" over a 9 foot span so DUH it will be fine at 7 feet!

There is a lot more I'm sure (ridge beam talk, ties, and more)...but all in all we're so stinking close!

The toughest part will be sheeting and felting the roof but we can do it and we're a weekend away from that stage!!!!!

I am so stoked :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 30, 2009, 06:12:36 PM
One question:

When putting on the fascia 2x6 should it be installed 1/2"-3/4" below the rafter top so the sheeting covers it?  Can't the sheeting be overhung that far (about 1 1/2") and the fascia be installed later?  Like in the spring.

Thanks
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on November 30, 2009, 06:22:49 PM
Considering your time crunch I'd say your priority would be getting the roof sheathing and the building paper on before worrying about the fascia. As long as your overhang the sheathing enough you could apply the fascia later. Having the fascia in place before doing the roofing though, gives a better edge to nail the drip edge and  building paper/wrap to.

I will admit to being in a time crunch last year too and I left the fascia until this spring, months after the roofing was completed.  :-[
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 30, 2009, 06:26:50 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on November 30, 2009, 06:22:49 PM
Considering your time crunch I'd say your priority would be getting the roof sheathing and the building paper on before worrying about the fascia. As long as your overhang the sheathing enough you could apply the fascia later. Having the fascia in place before doing the roofing though, gives a better edge to nail the drip edge and  building paper/wrap to.

I will admit to being in a time crunch last year too and I left the fascia until this spring, months after the roofing was completed.  :-[

Thanks Don,

That is what I was thinking.  So THANKS!  :)  I'll ignore the fascia and get the sheeting on as soon as I finished the rafters, lookouts and the sheeting and collar ties and and and and....geez I need more time!

And a new Thumb!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 30, 2009, 07:20:16 PM
Hurricane ties:  one thing I decided to do on my end rafters (and maybe won't really help in any way but I thought it might) was to put the hurricane ties on the wall top and slide them into the rafter since I could not install any other way (normally you mount them on the wall and the tabs that the rafter fits in extend up into the rafter).  This allowed you to use joist nails to secure the rafter into the hurricane tie AFTER it's been toe nailed in place.  Of course since you used 10d or 16d nails to toe nail the rafter in this is probably not needed anyway but with the birdsmouth cut in I couldn't see any way to use the ties becuase they would have to be installed on the sheeting in places where there is no stud (24" centers on the rafters and 16" centers on the walls) and the birdsmouth makes the rafter fit lower on the walls (the ties are probably meant for trusses)...but anyway I did get one 10d joist nail into each side in addition to the toe nailing and the tie is secured to the top of the wall.  If nothing else it will provide some sideload protection -- and the area I'm in doesn't get much wind so I doubt it would matter.

Anyway that's something I have been trying but only on the outside rafters so far.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 01, 2009, 03:51:23 PM
Just ran out and checked my old Jeep battery (got a new one) and after running the 12v pump on our well for about two hours and then sitting in cold weather for a couple days it's still at 12.7vdc.  :)  [cool]

I'm thinking that while it was starting to lose cranking amps and didn't like starting the jeep as easily anymore (and that's partly why I replaced it -- really I needed a stronger battery becuase of the winch and the need to power a trailer from time to time -- or the camper etc which this battery didn't do well and died in one night) it will power the well for several hours I'm sure.  I need to check the draw so I will bring my amp clamp this next trip as well as my multimeter.

Once I know what the draw is on my well and on the camper (something else I've wanted to check) and the tent trailer with lights on and heater running I should have a very good idea of the kind of power I need and recharging power I'll need :)

Having that I can start seriously looking at solar panels when I'm not up there trying to get the roof done! ( d*)

But I'm stoked for now :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 01, 2009, 04:13:47 PM
I'm thinking of trying to get back this weekend to try to get the last rafters done and maybe the lookouts.  Then we could get a row of sheeting up and felt it :)  ANd put plastic on the gabled ends and felt the walls....it's somethign to consider anyway :)

Maybe do a window or two and a door while I'm at it -- oh wait, I said ONE WEEKEND right?  DOH!

I need to remember to get a couple pounds of joist nails, some 2x6 joist hangers, more lumber (did I mention to plan for more?  Probably not and since I don't listen to my own advice much less others I'll mention it again here just in case I do actually listen at some point -- get more)....

We bought a Kerosene heater last trip (smart move) since it's been ini the 20's a lot when there and it helps keep the cabin a little warmer (under the loft anyway) and at least makes you think it's not freezing :)

So, if I can just get back and do some sheeting and felting (without one thumb) we might yet survive the winter :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on December 01, 2009, 04:24:30 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on December 01, 2009, 03:51:23 PM

Having that I can start seriously looking at solar panels when I'm not up there trying to get the roof done! ( d*)


You have the whole winter to plan and think and re-plan. Don't make any sudden moves.  ;D  Starting a new topic, if you want, so all your thoughts, questions and answers can be easily referenced might be an idea.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 01, 2009, 05:06:38 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on December 01, 2009, 04:24:30 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on December 01, 2009, 03:51:23 PM

Having that I can start seriously looking at solar panels when I'm not up there trying to get the roof done! ( d*)


You have the whole winter to plan and think and re-plan. Don't make any sudden moves.  ;D  Starting a new topic, if you want, so all your thoughts, questions and answers can be easily referenced might be an idea.

My main focus is the roof and making things dry before it's too late...then while I've got time I want to get set up so I can recharge the batteries without a generator. 

I'm just like that though -- 100 miles an hour.....darn Marines ;)  d*
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 02, 2009, 02:31:05 PM
Lots going on but on a side note I've decided to insulate my tent trailer on the next trip.  The temps are hitting in the teens at night and are threatoning to get much cooler.  So in order to have a place to get warm and to stay warm at night and to assist in the heating of the place and reduction of propane required I've decided to pick up some 1" foam insulation for the pullouts (I can install the insulation using velcro under the floor between the ribs and probably hold it in with some bungies as well), some flexible insulation (Astro Foil maybe) in the windows (unzip the windows, install the foil insulation and zip the windows back up) and then install some 1" under the floor as well.

I also though about trying to find a farmer willing to sell some bails of hay nearby becuase I could take those and stack under the pull outs too and around the main body to add some insulation that way.

This leaves the tent pup-ups and the roof.  I figure the roof can be done with 1" foam held on with bungies but the pop-ups might be a bit tricky.  I'm thinking perhaps just a tarp over those held down by rocks on the roof and bungies.

The idea is to reduce heating needs and keep things a little warmer throughout the cold nights.  If the heat aint running she can get cold enough to freeze the water in the back of the drip coffee pop in a couple hours!

Anyone else had to do something like this?
Erik
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Camping_FathersDay002.jpg)
Evo1 trailer
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: csiebert on December 02, 2009, 04:15:16 PM
If you stack up hay bails, put rock salt between layers.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: SouthernTier on December 02, 2009, 05:03:43 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on October 29, 2009, 12:42:00 AM
One second on that. 2x6 rafters aren't deep enough for a ventilation space (1" recommended I think) and the R19, without furring out the 2x6 or some other plan.  ???

BTW, I really don't understand why all the stores carry R19 and sell it to folks like ourselves who have built with 2x6 studs. A 2x6 = 5 1/2 inches, right? The R19 that I see is all rated to be 6 1/4 inches thick.  When compressed into a 5 1/2 inch space it becomes R18.

From Owens-Corning

(https://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q75/djmillerbucket/oddsnends/compressedfibreglass.jpg)

The R21 which would be ideal is available locally here, but only from insulation installers who will only sell it with installation (but wanted a fortune to go up to the mountains) , or in minimum quantities that are too large for a simple cabin like mine.  d*


Here in NY State, the code says my cathedral ceiling would have to be R-49 (http://www.dos.state.ny.us/code/energycode/Forms_code/NYS%20ECCC%20Simplified%20Prescriptive%20Provisions.pdf) !  I hope they don't make me do that once I start building.  But still, I figure I'll have to go to 2x12 rafters for the <11-foot span ceilings even though 2x10's would do, just to be able to use that R-38C (with "C" standing for Cathedral, providing the venting space).  But of course, can't find R-38C anywhere around here anyway!

Maybe I can find a local builder who buys in bulk and get him to seel me some or something like that.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on December 02, 2009, 05:46:02 PM
LittleValley, I had a look at that document. It says ceiling. Frequently cathedral ceilings receive a reduced requirement.

For example when I run ResCheck on our cabin it comes out at 5.5% better than the requirements when checked with a conventional flat ceiling, but 7.1% better when run with a cathedral ceiling with same R-value.

You might be able to use ResCheck energy code compliance software in the design. It's pretty cool. Here in NM they want the plan specs to be run through ResCheck and submitted with the pass/fail document it can produce. That can speed up the approval process. If your inspection department uses ResCheck it is possible to do some horse trading with different values here and there to achieve a pass.

There is a link to ResCheck here (http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=6715.0).
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: SouthernTier on December 02, 2009, 06:10:15 PM
Thanks Don.  I was thinking about checking out ResCheck.  I think I'll also run into the problem with loss through the windows.  I'd like a lot of windows (if I just wanted to look at the inside of a cabin, I could build it in my backyard rather than an hour away out in the country  :) ) and I understand that is really going to cut down the rescheck score, even with low-U glass.

But I won't know until I try.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on December 02, 2009, 06:14:34 PM
When I ran it I ended up buying better windows than we originally wanted to buy ($$cost), but it allowed us to use a 6x4 ft and a 5x4 ft for the views.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 02, 2009, 06:18:42 PM
I've been thinking about my cathedral ceiling and insualtion and wondering what I need to do?  I've got 2x6 rafters but to provide the 1" gap for venting I'd need the insulation to be 4 1/2" this and I can't find that.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Beavers on December 02, 2009, 06:23:38 PM
Just an idea for insulating you camper...insulated concrete blankets.  

They are waterproof and as thick as R 7 1/2 at this website.
http://cover-tech.com/curingblankets.htm

Only 59 cents a square foot for the R7.5 stuff.  Seems like it would be pretty easy to wrap the tent ends of the camper with them.  

Looks like you could even get custom cut ones for a couple of more cents per square foot.  [cool]
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on December 02, 2009, 06:46:06 PM
camo coloring would be nice.    ;D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: poppy on December 02, 2009, 08:44:23 PM
On your tent insulation, you will gain some R value if the foam board is foil faced and facing in.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 03, 2009, 11:10:38 AM
Quote from: poppy on December 02, 2009, 08:44:23 PM
On your tent insulation, you will gain some R value if the foam board is foil faced and facing in.
That's what I was thinking too.  Reflect the heat back into the trailer.

I'm thinking that insulating under the floor of the main box (lots of room there I think) as well as under the pull out floors and then in the tent windows and perhaps wrapping the entire tent sections as well as on the roof all should help.

The hay idea was one I had becuase I know hay is a good insulator and I figured it might help even just stacked around or under the unit.

Temps are now in the teens at night her at 600 feet so I'm sure up at the cabin (3100 feet) it will be even colder!  Tent trailering in that cold can be tough.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 04, 2009, 03:28:48 PM
Quote
Saturday
Mostly cloudy. Highs in the lower 30s. Northeast wind 5 to 15 mph in the afternoon.
» ZIP Code Detail
nt_snow    
Saturday Night
Mostly cloudy with light snow showers likely. Lows 12 to 16. East wind 15 to 25 mph. Chance of precipitation 50 percent.
partlysunny    
Sunday
Partly sunny. Colder. Highs 18 to 23. Northeast wind 10 to 20 mph. Wind chill readings 7 below to 6 above zero.

Seems like this weekend will be chilly!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on December 04, 2009, 03:31:40 PM
That's still balmy.   ;D  Last night the remote in the Jemez mountains dropped to -4 (7 AM). 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 04, 2009, 03:44:32 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on December 04, 2009, 03:31:40 PM
That's still balmy.   ;D  Last night the remote in the Jemez mountains dropped to -4 (7 AM). 

Yes but you're not staying in a tent trailer ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on December 04, 2009, 06:10:33 PM
... and for that I am thankful.   G/L
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: NM_Shooter on December 04, 2009, 06:45:43 PM
I'd be tempted to insulate the shed and stay in there.  

I had an idea a long time ago.. back when we camped in a pop up.

My idea was to make a radiant heat platform for under the mattresses.  I thought that I could get some of that fairly dense sheet foam that also has a radiant barrier on it.  I would install the barrier shiny side down, and on the upper side I would route ¼" channels into it spaced every 4 or 6" or so.  Then rig up a small water pump and propane burner, and make a copper heat exchanger inside a small piece of galvanized stove pipe.  But in order to make it safe, you'd need decent controls, and by the time I figured out what it would all take, I lost interest.  Not sure if I could get much heat through those foam mattresses anyway.  

If it did work, it would use up very little propane and very little electricity.  I also was trying to figure out a way to do it only with convection, but couldn't get that to work.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 04, 2009, 07:10:44 PM
Got some clamps to clamp insulation to the tents.  Then might also get some 3/4" foam insulation to put under the mattresses and on the roof and under the floor -- maybe on the walls too.

A little elaborate so I may just do the tent canvas with insulation blankets and throw a tarp on top but we've braved sub freezing weather in it before :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 05, 2009, 12:24:41 AM
Heading out tomorrow :)  Got two more RV batteries from a friend so we'll have lots of power and got some insulation and clamps to insulate the tents as well as some foam insulation for the floors and walls :)

I think we might survive the 10 degree weather now :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: considerations on December 05, 2009, 10:10:57 AM
"You're not the first owner-builder who's messed up on a door either."

I am a sheepish member of this club myself.  Thank heavens for reciprocating saws!  :)


Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on December 05, 2009, 10:14:36 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on December 05, 2009, 12:24:41 AM
Heading out tomorrow :)  Got two more RV batteries from a friend so we'll have lots of power and got some insulation and clamps to insulate the tents as well as some foam insulation for the floors and walls :)

I think we might survive the 10 degree weather now :)

Be sure to take a few photos of the remodel. ;D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 05, 2009, 10:33:45 AM
Quote from: considerations on December 05, 2009, 10:10:57 AM
"You're not the first owner-builder who's messed up on a door either."

I am a sheepish member of this club myself.  Thank heavens for reciprocating saws!  :)




Gotta love the sawsall! :o

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 05, 2009, 10:35:24 AM
Quote from: Redoverfarm on December 05, 2009, 10:14:36 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on December 05, 2009, 12:24:41 AM
Heading out tomorrow :)  Got two more RV batteries from a friend so we'll have lots of power and got some insulation and clamps to insulate the tents as well as some foam insulation for the floors and walls :)

I think we might survive the 10 degree weather now :)

Be sure to take a few photos of the remodel. ;D

Will do!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 07, 2009, 11:06:51 AM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin_Dec_6013.jpg)
We put the aerofoil (?) insulation in the side windows and on top of the pop-ups then covered the pop-ups with a tarp which we wrapped around as best we could.  Then we stuffed insulation in other areas (behind sink, on walls of sleeping area etc) and were able to stay warm!

It dropped to 10 degrees overnight but the trailer stayed between 55 and 70...good thing we had lots of propane and 3 batteries to run the heater!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 07, 2009, 11:24:41 AM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin_Dec_6026.jpg)
Got the big tarp on the cabin in time to avoid the snow!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 07, 2009, 11:55:56 AM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin_Dec_6010.jpg)
Thanks to a buddy I had 3 deep cycle RV batteries for power :)

The heater used about 0.30 amps (checked using an amp clamp) when kicking on, then dropped to 0.1 amps and finally to 0.04 amps before shutting down.  It would run at 0.04-0.1 amps for as much as an hour at a time.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 07, 2009, 12:14:00 PM
When we arrived on site it was 29 degrees and falling.  The snow on the ground was fairly fresh (within 24 hours) and we knew that it could drop to 15 degrees at night or worse.  When leaving home I'd double checked temperature drops and saw that in standard atmospheric conditions the drop per 1000 feet was 3.57 degrees...our cabin site is about 2500 feet higher then our house and 160 miles north of us.  We expected the cold, but weren't sure if the preparations would suffice.

We got started right away and with a dozen trips in the last few months the boys are really into the routine.  They got stuff moved, the trailer popped up, the batteries in place and everything ticked right along.  We were set up by 1PM or shortly there after and the temp had dropped to 24 degrees.

We had picked up a 30 foot by 50 foot tarp on the way up and began to get it on the cabin since the shorter 20x30 tarp wasn't big enough to cover the roof.  This was tough becuase of the ten foot walls!  I had to stand on a ladder and hand up a corner to one son then get over to the other side with the ladder and hand up the other corner and finally I had to move to the middle and push the tarp over the tails of the rafters where it caught up.  Fun fun fun.

Once we had the tarp over the rafter tails I got inside the cabin and up on the loft and we began the dance of the tarp :)  Run to the right, pull hard, jog to the left and yank away...slowly moving the ladder, pulling, pushing, cursing, stuffing, cursing some more and we had the big tarp all the way over the 12x12 pitched roof :)  Then we shifted it until it covered most of each gabled end and was reasonably even on both long sides and finally got down and tied it off in the blowing snow.

Temperature 20 degrees.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 07, 2009, 01:48:49 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin_Dec_6050.jpg)
It was COLD!  But we had the clothes and the heaters to handle it -- inside ;)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin_Dec_6057.jpg)
I took a ride up the hill to look around -- it's cold but beautiful and peaceful :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 07, 2009, 01:49:58 PM
Damn that could be a post card :)  Or a Christmas card :)  Didn't realize how nice a pic that was until just now :)

You gotta love owning a peace of heaven huh?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 07, 2009, 01:51:57 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin_Dec_6059.jpg)
A view South East from the top :)  It's about 8:00AM and cold out but can you blame me?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 07, 2009, 01:54:39 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Cabin_Dec_6075.jpg)
We did actually get some work done....can you spot the mistake though?  DOH!

We managed to get the collar ties up (5 of 7) and a rafter pair up (before we ran out of usable 2x6 for rafters) and some blocking in -- and while I'm at it, I think I'm a moron....2x4 blocking stock for 2x6 rafters?  I think I goofed there -- someone tell me what I'm missing.

We got most of this gabled end wall done and then tied the tarp down really well.

We had tried to put in the felt but it was so cold it cracked on is so we stopped that too.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 07, 2009, 01:57:19 PM
There's actually more then one mistake there... ???

OK so we managed to get a bigger tarp on and we're hopeful it holds for a few months -- yes a few months.  I will get back to check on the place but with negative temps I don't think it would be too safe to stay over the weekend in a tent trailer.
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Cabin_Dec_6085.jpg)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 07, 2009, 02:01:35 PM
Also put in some cross bracing on the foundation since we've added a big sail up there ;)

My thinking is that I'll need more bracing to make things very stable but for now this should hold until spring (I hope).

Anyone think I'm crazy?  Will it hold in this dry cold climate?

There won't be too much wind since we're down in a bit of a valley with the hill top 100 feet above and lost of trees around to break the wind but it does sometimes get windy (I'm thinking windmill but nothing major)....
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on December 07, 2009, 11:40:24 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on December 07, 2009, 02:01:35 PM

Anyone think I'm crazy?  Will it hold in this dry cold climate?


With a little luck. I guess there's not much choice though.   :(
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 08, 2009, 12:38:37 AM
Quote from: MountainDon on December 07, 2009, 11:40:24 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on December 07, 2009, 02:01:35 PM

Anyone think I'm crazy?  Will it hold in this dry cold climate?


With a little luck. I guess there's not much choice though.   :(

Not much, unless the weather warms up a little and we can run back out to do more...but right now it's well below zero.  Last I heard it's about negative ten now....so likely it needs to hold for at least a month.

I expect cold temps and snow to plague us until March now :(
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 08, 2009, 01:04:23 AM
Just checked the weather...haha it's a blamy 0 degrees air temp about 1000 feet below our cabin and 9 miles west (warmer).....the nearest pass report (about 1300 feet higher in elevation (so perhaps 4-5 degrees cooler) is showing -7 -- so I'm thinking that we won't be sleeping in the tent trailer any time soon!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: considerations on December 08, 2009, 08:26:22 PM
It was 12 here this morning....I'm not sure I know what 0 feels like, this is plenty cold for me.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 14, 2009, 02:07:02 PM
12 is cold -- almost too cold, but 0 and negative temps are just too much unless you have to bear them and are well prepared.

The cold has kept us away for a week now...seems like a month!  I've gotten so used to driving to the property and setting up camp and then getting to work only to drive home Sunday to wait another week that spending a weekend at home is strange.

I did some work, rested up, and wondered if I could slip out next weekend to 'check' on things :)

Build a cabin is addictive!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 22, 2009, 12:11:35 AM
Wow!  Over two weeks since we've been to the cabin and I'm starting to have withdrawals!

I plan to go right after Christmas though :)  I figure it will be just a day trip to go up and check on things, but it will be good to get up one last time before we start the new year.

Then I'll plan a weekend in January (maybe - depends on weather) to go up and tinker and then perhaps another in February but in March I'm going to take a FULL WEEK!!! 

In fact, I'm already excited about taking an entire week to work on the cabin and the wife and I are planning to go look at windows, door and roofing before the end of this year so we can get those purchases out of the way.

Getting all of that in, plus the wood stove will be a huge deal for us (assuming we can do it in March) and perhaps set us up for staying IN the cabin in the spring summer and fall :)

We're excited.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 29, 2009, 01:35:43 PM
OK, this weekend will make 4 weeks without visiting the cabin :(  But we're planning a day trip (9 hours of driving round trip) just to go check on the site and make sure the tarped roof is ok.

I wish I was done the roof and the wood stove was in but I know I'll get there.  In the meantime I'm dying to get back and swing my hammer once again!

Grrrr....life!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Yonderosa on December 29, 2009, 04:39:15 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on December 29, 2009, 01:35:43 PM
Grrrr....life!

Hang in there.  I know how you feel.  Sometimes when I most want to "put the spurs to it" I ain't got a horse... 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: NM_Shooter on December 29, 2009, 07:34:08 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on December 07, 2009, 11:55:56 AM
The heater used about 0.30 amps (checked using an amp clamp) when kicking on, then dropped to 0.1 amps and finally to 0.04 amps before shutting down.  It would run at 0.04-0.1 amps for as much as an hour at a time.

This confuses me a bit... does your heater have a blower?  That is a teeny amount of current.  For example a muffin fan like the ones on a desktop draw about .75A.  Are you sure the amp clamp was functioning properly?

If your furnace is only drawing .3 to .1A, you can easily get by on only one 12V battery. 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 29, 2009, 09:21:50 PM
Quote from: NM_Shooter on December 29, 2009, 07:34:08 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on December 07, 2009, 11:55:56 AM
The heater used about 0.30 amps (checked using an amp clamp) when kicking on, then dropped to 0.1 amps and finally to 0.04 amps before shutting down.  It would run at 0.04-0.1 amps for as much as an hour at a time.

This confuses me a bit... does your heater have a blower?  That is a teeny amount of current.  For example a muffin fan like the ones on a desktop draw about .75A.  Are you sure the amp clamp was functioning properly?

If your furnace is only drawing .3 to .1A, you can easily get by on only one 12V battery. 

I think the amp clamp I used couldn't read currently the current it was seeing or the cold was effecting it.  I came away confused myself, then did some checking and it can't be right.

So back to square one.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 06, 2010, 12:03:02 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Cabin_Jan2010003-1.jpg)
My wife visited the cabin for the first time!  She commented "It's so tall!"

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Cabin_Jan2010001.jpg)
The 12x12 pitch kept the snow off :)  Had piles of snow on either side of the cabin so it appears that we'll survive through the winter.

I do plan to get back soon though to continue the process.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: poppy on January 06, 2010, 12:14:53 PM
Glad to see your tarp is working out.  Snow is predicted for tomarrow here, and my canvass "garage" doesn't shed snow very well, so I will need to get out there before is takes on too much.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 06, 2010, 01:02:41 PM
Quote from: poppy on January 06, 2010, 12:14:53 PM
Glad to see your tarp is working out.  Snow is predicted for tomarrow here, and my canvass "garage" doesn't shed snow very well, so I will need to get out there before is takes on too much.

I was soooo worried on our way up actually.  But was pleasantly surprised :)

Of course, we have lots of work to do yet, but knowing that the tarp is holding is a plus.  We used some of the felting nails to hold it down and tied some strings to it also.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 06, 2010, 01:51:41 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin_Jan2010021.jpg)
We took the jeep the 1/4 mile to the top of the property
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Pine Cone on January 07, 2010, 12:24:09 AM
Great to see that tarp roof holding up so well.  I can't imagine having to wait more than a few days to get back out to my cabin project.  I'm having difficulty even just waiting to go out on the weekends after many months of going out both weekends and during the week.  Today I got the chance to go out and check on things and couldn't resist! 

So now you have months to plan your first spring trip!! Roof sheathing, cabin wrap, insulation and all kinds of things to plan for. 

Looks like you can relax for now ;D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on January 07, 2010, 02:30:23 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on January 06, 2010, 01:51:41 PM
We took the jeep the 1/4 mile to the top of the property

Looks like you have less snow than we do. There is no way we could drive the last 3 miles now. Fortunately we can snow show 1.2 miles rather easily.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 07, 2010, 02:46:57 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on January 07, 2010, 02:30:23 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on January 06, 2010, 01:51:41 PM
We took the jeep the 1/4 mile to the top of the property

Looks like you have less snow than we do. There is no way we could drive the last 3 miles now. Fortunately we can snow show 1.2 miles rather easily.

I'm actually quite surprised but I was told that it's been a dryer winter the last few years.  It's colder, but dryer so who knows.

I've also been told that it can get over 4 feet of buildup but that's nothing compared to say Snoqualmie which can get over 45 feet -- and the altitude isn't much different...but again, I'm in an area that only gets around 15 inches of rain a year.

As for you, at that altitude you could get 70+ feet  :o assuming it had the moisture to drop anyway...look at Crater Lake (albiet a lot further north and closer to the coast)...
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 12, 2010, 10:14:25 PM
Getting excited again :)  We're planning another trip in a week and a half.  If the weather is agreeable we will work on the rest of the roof framing and sheeting :)

And maybe cut some wood to start getting it dried for the future wood stove :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 21, 2010, 11:17:35 AM
Finally!  I took tomorrow off work and have 3 days to get out to the cabin and install a door (YES!) and finish the roof framing and sheeting!  I've got a crew coming (well sorta -- daughters fiance, his brother and dad) and we hope to get serious work done as well as maybe a little shooting and ATV riding :D

Can't wait!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 25, 2010, 01:27:52 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Stores018.jpg)
My future son-in-law getting ready to pack out gear after our weekend at the cabin.  He and my step son both stayed IN the cabin :D  They were warm and comfy despite the fact that they had no door, no roof, no insulation and no fireplace.

So, where to begin?  I put that pic up becuase it was the first to get uploaded to photobucket but in truth I have a few to show.  All centered around the basic theme of 'nothing got done'.

You see, it all started back in...oh hell, in a nutshell we drove up the mountain and noticed that the road was getting pretty slick in spots.  My son-in-laws Dad was driving his Dodge 4x4 (with all seasons on it -- yikes) but I wasn't worried since two weeks earlier I drove up just fine and it wasn't too slick, just several inches of snow.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Stores013.jpg)
The boys getting gear rigged onto the 4 wheeler to haul it back to the rigs.

It was late afternoon and we were heading up the hill and around 2500 feet started to get into some ice but I kept thinking that it wouldn't be too bad since a couple people live further up then we have our spot.  However by the time we were approaching 3000 feet we were starting to get worried, the ruts were solid ice!

We made it to the easement road and with confidence I said (erroneously) we should be fine now.  I couldn't have been more wrong!  We turned onto the easement road and headed up only to discover it was a 300 foot long 9 foot wide treacherous skating rink!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Stores044.jpg)
We didn't realize that the snow melting off the trees in 35+ degree weather was freezing solid in the 20 degree nights and getting thicker and thicker and thicker on a very dangerous part of the road.  This part...

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Stores036.jpg)
Once we hit the ice we stopped cold, then began to slide back at about 20 miles per hour!  I told Mike to slow down!  He told me he was trying to!  We knew we were in deep kimchi right then and the truck was starting to drift sideways!

2 to 3 truck lengths (maybe 4) we stopped crossed up in the road with one tire almost off the road with a 20+ foot drop below it!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Stores038.jpg)
We said some thanks to the man upstairs and worked the truck carefully back down the hill.

Then we walked up and grabbed the ATV's and used them to get our camping gear etc to the cabin (about 1/2 mile away).  It was clear no work was getting done this weekend!

But that didn't mean we didn't have some fun, work on cleaning out the shed, rode the heck out of the ATV's and generally enjoyed ourselves.  I also put up the trail cam with fresh batteries and we even had a visitor we think.....

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Stores003.jpg)

That is one of the old prints (within the last few days before we arrived) and the snow was too hard to leave any prints this weekend (frozen solid pretty much) but something was snooping around Saturday night.

This putty tat is probably 150-175 lbs!  Big kitty kitty :D
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Stores009.jpg)

Anyway, perhaps in March we will be able to get some more work done.


Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on January 25, 2010, 01:36:35 PM
F&R chains would have been nice.  Too bad
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on January 25, 2010, 01:58:10 PM
My thoughts exactly Don.  I am constantly plagued with ice to the cabin.  Since I got a set of chains it is navigated with ease.  I got the ones with "ice bars" which are worth their weight in gold.

Oljarhead that is not a good feeling when you have no contriol backwards. Put a whole new meaning of "pucker power" doesn't it.

Glad you were able to get off safely.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 25, 2010, 02:42:02 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on January 25, 2010, 01:36:35 PM
F&R chains would have been nice.  Too bad

I was wondering how much they would help on sheer ice?  On the way down I hit a spot that kicked me into the old ruts and shot me down 500 feet of mountain road with no (to very little) control!  I told the boys to hang on and away we went like a toboggan ride from hell!

That was scary.

So it's either serious studs or some kind of chains that will get me up and down without issue.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 25, 2010, 02:54:43 PM
Quote from: Redoverfarm on January 25, 2010, 01:58:10 PM
My thoughts exactly Don.  I am constantly plagued with ice to the cabin.  Since I got a set of chains it is navigated with ease.  I got the ones with "ice bars" which are worth their weight in gold.

Oljarhead that is not a good feeling when you have no contriol backwards. Put a whole new meaning of "pucker power" doesn't it.

Glad you were able to get off safely.



I'll have to get a set of those!  I hate the idea of not being able to go up there and get work done.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on January 25, 2010, 02:58:45 PM
The V-bar chains from these guys would do the job.

http://www.tirechain.com/TRUCK-SUV-CHAINS.HTM (http://www.tirechain.com/TRUCK-SUV-CHAINS.HTM)

Mounting them on a Cherokee can be a problem. I have the stock rims with 32 x 11.5 x 15 tires. I do not have enough clearance between the sidewall chain and the rear leaf springs to allow the wheels to turn. A wheel with different backspacing would solve that problem. In the front I have a similar clearance problem. With the stock rims the tires rub the control arms at almost full steering lock. With chains that would be very bad. I believe greater backspacing would also solve that. However, I haven't looked any further than the theory. Chains would not help us right now at all. It's the depth of snow, last reported to be 30+ inches. A skinnier tire would be helpful as well; tall and skinny is good for snow.

(http://www.tirechain.com/images/2800large.jpg)

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on January 25, 2010, 03:34:02 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on January 25, 2010, 02:42:02 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on January 25, 2010, 01:36:35 PM
F&R chains would have been nice.  Too bad

I was wondering how much they would help on sheer ice?  On the way down I hit a spot that kicked me into the old ruts and shot me down 500 feet of mountain road with no (to very little) control!  I told the boys to hang on and away we went like a toboggan ride from hell!

That was scary.

So it's either serious studs or some kind of chains that will get me up and down without issue.


I have a set of what Don posted and they are great.  When my road was nothing but sheer ice they worked good up or down the hill.  I found though with going down hill it was better to keep at a constant speed (low) and not give it a chance to slide.  I never really had to worry either way though.  You might look at this post on a simple little aid for chains.  They work great.

http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=3613.msg81071#msg81071

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 25, 2010, 04:11:09 PM
Thanks and Thanks :)

I've used chains once (when pulling sleds up to 5000 feet)....looks like it's time to get some!

Funny thing, I used to have two sets for my last jeep but gave them away becuase I never needed them -- now they wouldn't work anyway though, since my tires are bigger now.

Anyway, I've got 31x10.5x15's with over an inch cut out of the fenders, Rusty's flares, 8" rims that are offset to the outside so all is well there -- the only issue I see is that I lack a little clearance at the seem for the front rockers -- need to cut an inch out of there too.

But it sounds like chains are the answer and if I could drive all the way up then maybe, just maybe, I can get my door on!

Cheers
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Sassy on January 25, 2010, 05:14:47 PM
 :o :o  That was quite a ride!  Makes me nervous just thinking about it   :o
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 28, 2010, 01:34:37 PM
Quote from: Sassy on January 25, 2010, 05:14:47 PM
:o :o  That was quite a ride!  Makes me nervous just thinking about it   :o

It was quite the ride indeed -- pucker factor all the way down!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 01, 2010, 01:01:30 PM
:)

Planning my next trip!  Going to pick up parts to get the chimney installed as well as the door and perhaps the remaining roof en gabled end walls :)

I figure it's time to get the air nailer and get busy!

Of course we'll need chains to get there but this time we mean business!  I'm planning Feb 20th for the next trip so lots of time to get prepped.

Always exciting though, to plan and get moving again -- in this case I've learned that I need to install chimney brackets and stuff into the framing of the roof and then sheet over them for a more watertight roof around the chimney and the stabilizer brackets :)  Was good to learn -- I spent about an hour with an installer turned salesmen at our local wood stove shop and learned a bunch.  But still have tons of questions:

1.  When installing the wood stove wall penetrations isn't it better to side the wall first?

2.  When installing windows in walls sheeted with OSB and sided with T1-11 wouldn't it best to sheet the wall first too?

More to follow I'm sure.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on February 01, 2010, 01:23:50 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on February 01, 2010, 01:01:30 PM

2.  When installing windows in walls sheeted with OSB and sided with T1-11 wouldn't it best to sheet the wall first too?

Here's the order I used.....

wall studs <> OSB sheathing <> building paper <> windows <> flashing <> siding

Your #1.... I'm not sure.... thinking.....     ???   Are you going to use a metal thimble?  Or...??
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on February 01, 2010, 01:29:01 PM
http://www.selkirkcorp.com/search-results.aspx?query=through%20wall
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 01, 2010, 01:33:00 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on February 01, 2010, 01:23:50 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on February 01, 2010, 01:01:30 PM

2.  When installing windows in walls sheeted with OSB and sided with T1-11 wouldn't it best to sheet the wall first too?

Here's the order I used.....

wall studs <> OSB sheathing <> building paper <> windows <> flashing <> siding

Your #1.... I'm not sure.... thinking.....     ???   Are you going to use a metal thimble?  Or...??

Metal Thimble?  Not sure what you are asking.

The windows (Vinyl Low-E) were installed after sheeting our addition here at home, then I added trim over that which nicely met the windows to give a flush appearance to the window trim.  I'll take a picture.

Anyway, so my take is that you install the siding first unless using lap siding.  In the case of lap siding you install the windows and trim and then install the lap.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 01, 2010, 01:34:36 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on February 01, 2010, 01:23:50 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on February 01, 2010, 01:01:30 PM

2.  When installing windows in walls sheeted with OSB and sided with T1-11 wouldn't it best to sheet the wall first too?

Here's the order I used.....

wall studs <> OSB sheathing <> building paper <> windows <> flashing <> siding

Your #1.... I'm not sure.... thinking.....     ???   Are you going to use a metal thimble?  Or...??

DOH!  hehe you were talking about the stove pipe not the window.

Yes, metal thimble / wall penetration -- which I think can be installed before the siding just like the roof penetration I'll be using.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 01, 2010, 01:40:21 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on February 01, 2010, 01:29:01 PM
http://www.selkirkcorp.com/search-results.aspx?query=through%20wall

Looks like I should finish that wall before making that penetration and installing the stove pipe.  Which is ok -- it's interesting to consider the options.

For the roof penetration, since it's outside the cabin in the lookout I don't have to have a box etc installed, just a roof penetration / thimble? that allows for the 12x12 pitch.  Then depending on the height of the pipe above it might need support brackets and metal braces -- which is likely since I'm off center by about 3 feet.

I'll be playing with this a lot over the next few weeks while we prep for the trip becuase I want to finish the roof off and now know to start with the wall the stoves on too :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 01, 2010, 05:31:19 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Westwall.jpg)
Just updated my drawings a little.

Here you can see the outside of the west wall (14') and the inside (sort of)...I wanted to show the stove pipe run and where the penetration will be as well as the loft, collar ties and a few other things.

Since John has commented on the rafter ties section I'll add hurricane ties to each rafter to help secure them to the wall.  Incidentally, I find the only way to install them is to nail them to the top of the wall and to the rafter rather then down the wall -- since doing that puts them in sheeting only at the bottom -- maybe it's just me?

If there is a better way, or a better tie I would be happy to see it -- I'm using 2x6 rafters on a 2x6 wall so with the birdsmouth there is still a ledge on top of the wall.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 02, 2010, 11:50:00 AM
Sometimes I wonder if I should just scrap the catwalk and put in a couple heavy beams or logs across the top of the wall (secured to rafters) to provide some kind of rafter ties.

I've been worrying a little about this becuase I've got the 2' knee wall and for some reason thought the loft joists were all I needed....and collar ties.

So, what to do?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Minicup28 on February 02, 2010, 12:05:33 PM
re: TIRE CAHINS

http://www.tirechainsrequired.com/
http://www.tirechainsrequired.com/atv-tire-chains.html

I got my chains from these folks. Got them on the truck and all four ATV wheels. V-bar diamond on the rear & V-bar 2 link on the fronts
Four inches of dried oak leaves feels just like wet ice going downhill with a load of wood.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 02, 2010, 12:11:43 PM
Quote from: Minicup28 on February 02, 2010, 12:05:33 PM
re: TIRE CAHINS

http://www.tirechainsrequired.com/
http://www.tirechainsrequired.com/atv-tire-chains.html

I got my chains from these folks. Got them on the truck and all four ATV wheels. V-bar diamond on the rear & V-bar 2 link on the fronts
Four inches of dried oak leaves feels just like wet ice going downhill with a load of wood.

Thanks -- out of stock.

I checked them about a week ago -- same deal, Out of stock.  Might have to check Les Swab and see what they have since I'm planning my next trip!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on February 02, 2010, 12:26:33 PM
Check these... in stock as of right now

http://tirechain.com/31X10.50-15LT.htm
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 02, 2010, 03:06:50 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on February 02, 2010, 12:26:33 PM
Check these... in stock as of right now

http://tirechain.com/31X10.50-15LT.htm

Thanks Don! 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 02, 2010, 06:02:30 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin3.jpg)

Played with Google Sketchup7 to make this.  It's pretty close though I'm pretty new to using it.

one thing I found was that building the outside dimensions first makes it tough to add interior -- I'm sure there an easy way to do it I just haven't figured it out yet.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 04, 2010, 12:27:02 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Cabinwith4-8deck2.jpg)

Did these to show a 4' deck/porch around the sides and back with an 8 foot deck out front.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Cabinwith4-8deck.jpg)
Another look.

Thinking about snow loads is scaring me a little though :(  I'm afraid that this deck might have to be REALLY strong to handle the potential snow load of our cabin at 3100 feet -- I've been told that we only get about 2 feet of build up right now, but used to get 4 to 5 feet.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on February 04, 2010, 04:56:54 PM
OlJarhead you are probably wise to err on the side of caution but IMO I don't see you having any problems with a 8' deck if you build your roof according to what your snow load would be.  This is an extremely bad year for snow. So far we have had probably between 5-6 feet this winter with the most at one time around 30" . We are anticipating another 8-12" tomarrow and even more later next week.  This is how it used to be before Al Gore started talking.  ;)  You will never be looked down upon if you went a little overboard on the roof framing and it would not be that much more than what you are considering.  As others will say "when in doubt build it stout".

With my cabin roof at a 10/12 and the porch at 3/12 there is very little remaining once it slides from the top.  In fact it usually occurs on the following day.  The snow slidding off the 10/12 pushes the porch roof snow off as well.  I am glad I am not standing under the eves when this happens.  I was working when the back slid off and it sounded as if a train had ran through the cabin. ;D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 04, 2010, 07:05:54 PM
Quote from: Redoverfarm on February 04, 2010, 04:56:54 PM
OlJarhead you are probably wise to err on the side of caution but IMO I don't see you having any problems with a 8' deck if you build your roof according to what your snow load would be.  This is an extremely bad year for snow. So far we have had probably between 5-6 feet this winter with the most at one time around 30" . We are anticipating another 8-12" tomarrow and even more later next week.  This is how it used to be before Al Gore started talking.  ;)  You will never be looked down upon if you went a little overboard on the roof framing and it would not be that much more than what you are considering.  As others will say "when in doubt build it stout".

With my cabin roof at a 10/12 and the porch at 3/12 there is very little remaining once it slides from the top.  In fact it usually occurs on the following day.  The snow slidding off the 10/12 pushes the porch roof snow off as well.  I am glad I am not standing under the eves when this happens.  I was working when the back slid off and it sounded as if a train had ran through the cabin. ;D

My 12/12 will be no problem :)  That much I've seen already -- nothing on the roof, 2 feet piled up on each side -- and that's with 2x6 framing and a tarp!  :o

My porch roof (as I've planned at the moment) will be 9 feet at the top and 7 feet at the bottom (a little low maybe but I felt a 2 foot drop was minimum for the 8 foot section) which I'm guessing makes it a 3/12 pitch? so that would be the same as yours.  The sides are only 4 feet as planned now anyway, making it a 6/12 -- so maybe you're right??

I only really worry abotu the snow coming off the cabin roof.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 06, 2010, 01:51:50 PM
Thanks to you all here I now know I can install the interior pine T&G without some kind of backboard  [cool] so that helps a little -- I'm pretty darn motivated but need to wait until the 20th to go up there.

Grrrr
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Solar Burrito on February 07, 2010, 10:54:06 PM
Great drawings and Sketchup models. I love that program but I forget it faster than I learn it. Is that the correct covered portch roof pitch in your model?

I'm going to do the same thing with my wood stove, not penetrating the roof I mean. It was a thru wall in my yurt and it worked fine for our needs. We inherited a cheap Harbor Freight stove and it works great for being there on the weekends.

I feel your pain about trying to get things done at a remote location! Forgetting one thing can ruin a trip!

Keep up the good work and I can't wait until you post some more photos!

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 08, 2010, 11:14:53 AM
Quote from: ebsworj on February 07, 2010, 10:54:06 PM
Great drawings and Sketchup models. I love that program but I forget it faster than I learn it. Is that the correct covered portch roof pitch in your model?

I'm going to do the same thing with my wood stove, not penetrating the roof I mean. It was a thru wall in my yurt and it worked fine for our needs. We inherited a cheap Harbor Freight stove and it works great for being there on the weekends.

I feel your pain about trying to get things done at a remote location! Forgetting one thing can ruin a trip!

Keep up the good work and I can't wait until you post some more photos!



Thanks:)

It's correct as it can be I think -- using the measuring tape function I measured up the walls to 9 feet and then set the front of the porch at 7 feet.  Which might be a bit low for some but I'm 5'11 1/2" so figure anyone close to 7' can duck!

We're planning Feb 20th for our next trip, will have chains this time!  Going to try to get the door on and do some wood cutting :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 15, 2010, 06:19:10 PM
Have chains, will travel :D

Actually I'm pretty stoked since I've got Friday off, have chains and a friend is joining my step-son and I on the venture.

If all goes well we should get the door installed and some more work done on the roof framing.

Also can't wait to see if we got the cougar in the trail cam!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 18, 2010, 06:55:38 PM
I'm stoked now :D  The hardware/lumber yard is going to deliver to our site tomorrow!  [cool]

Going to have them deliver the remaining lumber and sheeting as well as the door etc so we can get the door on and maybe get the roof framing done and start on the sheeting :D

Of course, the weather while clear and sunny, is still cold enough at night to freeze the water dripping off trees so there might be a lot of ICE.  However we will have them drop the load as far as they can get and then we will pack the it in the rest of the way in the or on the jeep (with chains of course!).

Wish us luck!  I'll take pictures....

Oh man, the cabin fever is about to be solved!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Solar Burrito on February 18, 2010, 10:25:21 PM
Good luck this weekend. Get your passenger in your jeep to take a video of your first assent up your icy road! Good luck with the cabin, I'm going to do a similar foundation to you near Lake Cushman, WA.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 18, 2010, 11:18:50 PM
Quote from: Solar Burrito on February 18, 2010, 10:25:21 PM
Good luck this weekend. Get your passenger in your jeep to take a video of your first assent up your icy road! Good luck with the cabin, I'm going to do a similar foundation to you near Lake Cushman, WA.

I might do that!  Should be interesting.

I'm just hoping the road isn't iced up like last time.  If it is it will be a LONG day!  We'll get the delivery as close as we can but if the roads are as bad as they were a month ago then we will be hauling 18 sheets of OSB, a door, several 2x6's and 2x4's all in the back of the jeep (Cherokee) which will take a while.

At least this time we have chains though and a pick ax to break up sheets of ice if it's as bad as last time and proves a problem.

We're determined so we'll make it but I'm hopeful we won't lose precious daylight hauling lumber and OSB...

The mission is to get the gear there for the next trip and get the door installed.  After that it's sitting around the fire, cutting wood and cutting pines for railings.

Should be fun (always is actually).

Let us know when you start your cabin and be sure to post pics!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on February 18, 2010, 11:23:05 PM
Take a bucket of sand oe kitty litter along too. If it is icy it's nice to be able to sand places you want to walk on. I carry a 5 gallon Homer bucket full of brick sand.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 22, 2010, 12:55:52 AM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/land066-1.jpg)
We have a door :)

With chains, food and determination we headed out to our place in the woods to try once again to at least get a door on the cabin and perhaps get some more supplies to the site, and we made it!

It all started Thursday when I realized I could be in Tonasket early on Friday, so I called the builder and asked if they would attempt a delivery.  They agree to give it a try since I agreed to offload the supplies at whatever location they could drive to and ferry it the rest of the way in my jeep -- if needed.  And away we went.

About 1 mile from our place the road began to get slippery but each uphill section was pretty decent with ruts down to the gravel so we were able to get all the way to the same spot we'd made it last month.  We then chained up the jeep and CUT our way up the hill :D  Those v-link chains are amazing!  Like ice chopping blocks tearing up the thick ice like no bodies business.  A couple trips up and down and the flat bed (1 1/4 Ford 4x4 dualey) made it up with just a little sliding.

We off loaded the gear and the fearless delivery driver slipped his way back down the drive - gingerly - and safely returned to the shop.

We also cut about 20 pines ranging from 1 1/2 inches thick to 3 inches (at the base anyway) and 5 feet to 10 feet tall.  All have at least 4 feet of usable tree (1 1/2" in width) for making the railings.  However, I figure I'll need at least 8 rails and at 1- 3 per tree I'm looking at around 30+ trees.  Although after cutting 20 or so out of one spot it was hard to tell and it's a spot I wanted to clear anyway since it will shade the place my solar panels should probably go :)

Anyway, aside from the 'Road Warrior' missing badly on #1, #2 and #6 by the time we got home (started on #1, then #1 stopped and #2 started (after I used injector cleaner) then #2 and #6 and finally all three -- errggg) we'd made it through a successful weekend and have a door with deadbolt and locking knobs :)  Seriously!  Now my wife can actually OPEN the door and look inside on our next trip (probably should clean it out then huh?).

Cheers
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: diyfrank on February 22, 2010, 08:23:59 AM
Hey OlJarhead, whats your elevation and does your place have a southern/northern exposer?
I'm planning a trip in may to curlew to do some road maintenance but as mild as this winter has been I'm thinking I may get in as early as the end of march. Maybe?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 22, 2010, 11:58:13 AM
Quote from: diyfrank on February 22, 2010, 08:23:59 AM
Hey OlJarhead, whats your elevation and does your place have a southern/northern exposer?
I'm planning a trip in may to curlew to do some road maintenance but as mild as this winter has been I'm thinking I may get in as early as the end of march. Maybe?

We're at about 3100 feet and the road is good up to around 2800-2900 feet then it gets pretty icy in the areas that are shaded.  It's been warm during the day and is melting everything off so perhaps if you aren't much higher then us you should be good :)

Our neighbor is at closer to 4000 feet (or higher) and he's making it up there no problem!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on February 22, 2010, 01:17:45 PM
OlJarhead glad you made it up and jilted the "cabin fever" for a couple more weeks. 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 22, 2010, 01:22:54 PM
Quote from: Redoverfarm on February 22, 2010, 01:17:45 PM
OlJarhead glad you made it up and jilted the "cabin fever" for a couple more weeks. 

Thanks :D  Now I need to do some Jeep work before going back.  But it's long overdue!  I need to fix the running issues and then swap out the 3.55:1's for 4.10:1's since upgrading the suspension and tires.

Also need to get the AC working and the stereo working!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on February 22, 2010, 01:43:43 PM
When I swapped my 3.55's for 4.56's (32" tires) my highway fuel mileage actually got better. Plus the around town drive-ability was better too.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 22, 2010, 03:10:28 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on February 22, 2010, 01:43:43 PM
When I swapped my 3.55's for 4.56's (32" tires) my highway fuel mileage actually got better. Plus the around town drive-ability was better too.

Yup -- heard that a LOT lately.  Makes sense too since the taller tires lower the RPM's at any speed you are traveling thus taking it out of optimum power range and making the jeep work harder to maintain speed -- funny how that works but it does (or so all my racing buddies tell me).

I'm planning 4.10's becuase I'm running 31's and have read that's the right adjustment to make and I really can't wait!  For one thing, I was getting worried becuase I was towing a heavy trailer a LOT and it seemed to put too much added stress and strain on the jeep becuase of the bigger tires - it towed but not so good.  Once the 4.10's are in I ought to be laughing ;)

Of course, I'm not doing it myself so the cost factor kinda sucks but I want it done right and the last time I did anything that delicate was a LONG time ago...so I'll let a pro install them but I'll get the parts myself.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 23, 2010, 11:42:59 AM
After cutting several pines for loft railings it was time to enjoy a fire and company :)  Biggy (Shawnee Thunder Pony Big Mountain -- Biggy for short) and Josh relaxing in the 25 degree weather -- around a rather warm fire :)
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/land082.jpg)

The driveway turned into an ATV fun zone on Sunday before packing up.  As you can see much of it was still ice -- actually it all was becuase the dirt sections were 3-4" of frozen ground unless in a spot where a LOT of sun hits.
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/land086.jpg)

Ice -- good thing we had chains :D
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/land087.jpg)

I took this view I think just because :)
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/land090.jpg)

One thing nice about going up there is that I get lots of pics to remind of why I like being there :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 24, 2010, 12:25:54 PM
Seems my Banks Torque Tube header is cracked at the welds so Quadratec is sending a new one (gotta love Gale Banks) and I'll swap that out this weekend.

Also should be ordering front end and read end parts soon :)  Can wait to get all the work done on the jeep -- don't like that it takes away from cabin funds but on the other hand means I can GET TO the cabin :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 24, 2010, 12:31:18 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/land093-1.jpg)
Figured I'd post a few more pics of 'the boys' playing before packing up and leaving on Sunday.

Wish I had more construction pictures but after the door was done I decided to take a break and enjoy the weekend (and worry about the jeep)....

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/land108.jpg)
Josh was spinning around to go back and catch Biggy -- later Biggy rolled the Yamaha!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/land113.jpg)
Biggy in front, Josh in the back -- both having too much fun :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 24, 2010, 01:28:10 PM
 :) ;D [cool]

Just pulled the trigger at Rusty's for 4.10:1 gears and rebuild kits (and carrier) to get the gearing done!

So, new header (again), new gears, fixed vacuum issues, AC and stereo -- heck next trip up ought to be one heck of a wonderful trip :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 02, 2010, 01:33:12 PM
Not sure how long (or the cost) of the diff rebuilds yet but the shop rate is excellent and the shop comes VERY highly recommended (Lynn St. James old crew chief recommended them :D )

Can't wait!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 16, 2010, 11:00:23 AM
We're almost there!  FRIDAY COME ON!!!

The jeep was done and runs like a new rig :D  I'm loving it!!!  Heck, the Road Warrior is a happy camper now!

So, I have ALL of next week off!  WHooHoo!  Just been planning the attack.  I'm thinking Sunday and Monday to complete the roof framing and sheeting.  Tuesday and Wednesday to complete the Window Installs, Thursday and Friday to felt the building completely (and finish any window left overs).

Might be a bit ambitious but we will have a compressor and there will be three of us.

I'm also going to go buy some rope (rappelling rope that is -- or climbing rope -- have to ask) so I'll have some safety.  No roofing ladder or hooks (couldn't find any anywhere) so will just have to wing it.  But with a good ladder, roof jacks and rope I should be fine.  Besides, I plan to do a boatload from the inside if possible.

We've got out work cut out for us but the days are getting longer and I'm ready to rock and roll!

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 17, 2010, 05:55:40 PM
Just left the wood stove shop -- had to go over all the parts I will need to install the pipe -- I'm dreading the price tag!

Looks like I need the 6"-90 from the stove to the wall, then a collar and tie to SS pipe and a wall thimble, plus an elbow support and SS 6" elbow with cap, then about 14 feet of SS pipe, a roof support, wall bracket/support, flashing and cap and roof support for the last 4' of pipe (approximate amount to stick out above.

I know the pipe is really pricey but I'm hopeful the other parts aren't too nuts...
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 26, 2010, 11:12:59 AM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Cabin-3-24-2010001.jpg)
My son contemplating the stairs we built on the 5th day -- it was his idea :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Cabin-3-23-2010051-1.jpg)
Roof!  Well almost!  We're getting there now.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 26, 2010, 11:15:30 AM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Cabin-3-23-2010045.jpg)
Bought a 24' ladder, got a 28' footer...was heavy and hard to move but VERY secure!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Cabin007.jpg)
Rigged up a safety line and got busy.

The first side we did mostly by running up a sheet, holding it in place, running up to the loft (me) and helping nail it down, then doing it all over again :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Cabin006.jpg)
It's only 20 feet up and that 2x4 is nailed with 16 penny nails...
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 26, 2010, 11:19:40 AM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Cabin011.jpg)

We arrived Saturday and got some grass seed spread on the easement (to help keep the bank together) and then met the neighbors (all but one for the 1st time).

We got set up but didn't do too much.  Then Sunday we managed to get the gabled en walls framed and the look outs framed.

Monday we sheeted the gabled ends and finished blocked the rafters, putting in hurricane ties and finishing off some of the wall nailing.

Tuesday was the big day and we sheeted over half the roof!  Crazy day!

Wednesday was a bit of a lazy day and we framed stairs (I goofed a little on those but they are temporary still) and did some ATV riding.  Also got some great poles for the porch :)

Thursday we did all but a couple spots on the roof sheeting and called it a trip -- completely smoked!

Ahhh it was a good week though :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on March 26, 2010, 12:47:20 PM
Looking good.  Make sure you get some titanium felt or tar paper on as soon as you can. Tarps have a short life span.  BTW did you take my ladder.  Have one exactly like it.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 26, 2010, 02:01:32 PM
Quote from: Redoverfarm on March 26, 2010, 12:47:20 PM
Looking good.  Make sure you get some titanium felt or tar paper on as soon as you can. Tarps have a short life span.  BTW did you take my ladder.  Have one exactly like it.

I wish we could have done so this trip but we just plumb ran out of steam!

We were thinking about the tar paper and wondered if the best way to put it down was top down.  Why?  Well, with the roof pitch as steep as it is it almost seems it would be easier to put the top piece in, then the next row by sliding up under the top before nailing it down, and so on until you are at the bottom and can install via ladder?

Also, how on gods green earth does one go about roofing one of these things? ha!  I need wings or something!  12x12 pitch is um, steep!

The ladder?  Funny story, I bought a 24' one but the store only had a 28 so they gave me it :)  I needed it becuase of my 265lbs...and you add some OSB and a belt full of nails and ya, I need the big boy ladder! hehehe

Cheers
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on March 26, 2010, 02:18:25 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on March 26, 2010, 02:01:32 PM
Quote from: Redoverfarm on March 26, 2010, 12:47:20 PM
Looking good.  Make sure you get some titanium felt or tar paper on as soon as you can. Tarps have a short life span.  BTW did you take my ladder.  Have one exactly like it.

I wish we could have done so this trip but we just plumb ran out of steam!

We were thinking about the tar paper and wondered if the best way to put it down was top down.  Why?  Well, with the roof pitch as steep as it is it almost seems it would be easier to put the top piece in, then the next row by sliding up under the top before nailing it down, and so on until you are at the bottom and can install via ladder?

Also, how on gods green earth does one go about roofing one of these things? ha!  I need wings or something!  12x12 pitch is um, steep!

The ladder?  Funny story, I bought a 24' one but the store only had a 28 so they gave me it :)  I needed it becuase of my 265lbs...and you add some OSB and a belt full of nails and ya, I need the big boy ladder! hehehe

Cheers

Yes you can run it in reverse order.  Just attach it to the lap marks (usually a white line laid out by the manufacturer).  Slip the next course under the previous and secure except for the lap portion.  So on and so on.

Didn't pay attention whether you are going with shingle or metal.  Shingle then you will need "roof jacks" which allow you to use them under the shingels as you climb to the top.  Metal it is best to use a chicken ladder and keep slidding it over with each progressive sheet.  The person on the ridge can just straddle to hold and adjust.  To make them feel better you can use roof jacks or nail cleats on the roof (back side) to keep from straddiling.

As for the picture. I don't really think he is thinking about the steps.  He is probably wondering how "dad" ever talked me into this. ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 26, 2010, 04:12:37 PM
Quote from: Redoverfarm on March 26, 2010, 02:18:25 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on March 26, 2010, 02:01:32 PM
Quote from: Redoverfarm on March 26, 2010, 12:47:20 PM
Looking good.  Make sure you get some titanium felt or tar paper on as soon as you can. Tarps have a short life span.  BTW did you take my ladder.  Have one exactly like it.

I wish we could have done so this trip but we just plumb ran out of steam!

We were thinking about the tar paper and wondered if the best way to put it down was top down.  Why?  Well, with the roof pitch as steep as it is it almost seems it would be easier to put the top piece in, then the next row by sliding up under the top before nailing it down, and so on until you are at the bottom and can install via ladder?

Also, how on gods green earth does one go about roofing one of these things? ha!  I need wings or something!  12x12 pitch is um, steep!

The ladder?  Funny story, I bought a 24' one but the store only had a 28 so they gave me it :)  I needed it becuase of my 265lbs...and you add some OSB and a belt full of nails and ya, I need the big boy ladder! hehehe

Cheers

Yes you can run it in reverse order.  Just attach it to the lap marks (usually a white line laid out by the manufacturer).  Slip the next course under the previous and secure except for the lap portion.  So on and so on.

Didn't pay attention whether you are going with shingle or metal.  Shingle then you will need "roof jacks" which allow you to use them under the shingels as you climb to the top.  Metal it is best to use a chicken ladder and keep slidding it over with each progressive sheet.  The person on the ridge can just straddle to hold and adjust.  To make them feel better you can use roof jacks or nail cleats on the roof (back side) to keep from straddiling.

As for the picture. I don't really think he is thinking about the steps.  He is probably wondering how "dad" ever talked me into this. ;)

Metal roof -- straddling the roof might be a good way for the top -- though there would have to be some kind of safety line I'm thinking...it's a good 20 feet to the ground!  I haven't found a roofing ladder yet but I think I'll do a net search and order!  That HAS to be better then what I was doing.

As for it being a chicken ladder this old jarhead learned a while back that not only is he mortal, but he's not unbreakable and prefers to not be any more broken! ha!  So, while I'm certainly no chicken (I did a jig on my roof) I'd prefer not to fall.

Speaking of falling, I did that too this weekend.  Only I was half way down the ladder (maybe still 7 feet off the ground) and had put on a rappelling break to rappel down the ladder (like a dumb ass jarhead would do) and wasn't paying attention to my rope (like an old one that forgot more then he likes to admit)...I hit the break just in time to realize the mistake I made -- while flying out over free air (or so I thought)...then I chose ground over wall and let the break out only to learn the hard way that my son moved in the same direction.

Poor guy!  265lbs of marine flying out of the air is tough to stop...but then again, he will NEVER look down at the ground again while holding my ladder! hahaha

Felt bad for crushing him into the ground like that though.  He's a big kid at 220 himself but flying jarhead is not something you want landing on you! *chuckle*
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: jdhen on March 26, 2010, 06:10:25 PM
Looking good, Jarhead!  Seems like you're moving right along!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Pine Cone on March 26, 2010, 10:11:01 PM
Looking good.

I got my roofing stuff at my local ABR store in Poulsbo.  They had the best price quote by a good margin on the metal roofing I bought.  They also sold me some synthetic underlayment that I liked.  They're on your side of the water as well.  They have a website here.   No interest other than being a satisfied customer.   Buy the kneepads they have as well.  Worth the $16 or so, and pretty sticky on the roof as long as the metal is dry.

http://americanbuildingandroofing.com/ (http://americanbuildingandroofing.com/)

My oldest son had experience with synthetic roofing felt when he lived in Florida, and it can be left on the roof instead of a tarp for far longer than normal tar-based felt, max of about six months.  It is also recommended for metal roofing, and since it is very lightweight it is much easier to apply if you are understaffed as I was.  The brand I got was Palisade.  It  has little slip-resistant dots on it that worked pretty well until it was very wet.  I don't recommend roofing in the rain, but I still got two chances thanks to my schedule.  The safety rope is a must.  Glad you had one on when you fell.

http://www.sdp-products.com/HTML/palisade.html (http://www.sdp-products.com/HTML/palisade.html)




Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: jdejarn on March 27, 2010, 09:38:58 AM
I don't say much, but I am building in your area also.  Spent last season on the build, and the roof is waht got me the worst because I too have a 12-12 pitch, metal. We tar papered from the top down, pushing the lower layer under the top. As for the metal roof, we set up a scaffold on the side of the house, attached an extension ladder to it with a 2x4 as a footer and ratchet straps, and used the ladder to access the sheet and the screws.  Attached the cap as we went.  Scary as can be and made some guys with experience nervous, but it only took about 5-6 hours for the roof.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Osprey on March 27, 2010, 08:35:22 PM
My roof is 10/12 and we used the angled jacks with a plank. We started at the far end and unscrewed and screwed the planks as needed. The saving grace was the less steep pitch over the deck. It was still a pain and almost impossible to get the metal up and on without scratching the metal. I went with the heavier 26 gauge metal so it was harder on the guys screwing the roof down than a normal 29 gauge roof. I hope if a limb hits the roof the heavier metal will make it worth the extra cost and trouble to install.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 28, 2010, 10:33:45 AM
jd -- you, yonderosa and myself (and any others) ought to meet for pizza in town one of these trips! :)

Thanks for the tips too.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 28, 2010, 06:44:05 PM
Osprey I've thought about putting the deck up first but decided not to in the end.

Probably would have been the better choice though!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on March 29, 2010, 01:21:54 AM
A couple years ago I purchased my property - 40 acres up near Okanogan... a bit south of Tonasket, but up in the hills.  I'm at about 4100', and am looking forward to building this summer (if the employment situation sorts itself out and I can afford it)

I'm reading with great interest your experience - and learning a  bunch about what to do (and what not to do  ;) ).

I have about a 4.5 hour drive once I get to Seattle (ferry ride from Bremerton), so I know what you mean about a long drive to the place.  I've been mulling over foundations, etc... for nearly a year.  I'm thinking that I'll use pier and post for the first cabin (I hope to build 3 on my property)

My biggest problem is finding someone to drill a well that won't cost me an arm and a leg ... or drilling it myself - which will take a long time.

Anyway, it seems like there are a LOT of folk building up in that area.  It would be interesting to get together an discuss our projects over a couple of beers sometime.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: jdejarn on March 29, 2010, 09:44:22 AM
You're on for pizza, or a couple of beers and compare notes and building scars.  Gotta start my own thread one of these nights and share the build with the group.  Been into my cabin weekends for about 5 mos, progress about like you have made, so I feel better that I am making average time!  I have a few details to go, then I can call in the 60-day cabin final inspection.  That is when I get to do the things I want to!  Hopefully I can have this good to go for a winter night stay this October.

I'll drop in here again and chat more later!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 04, 2010, 02:35:12 PM
Ordered Roofing and Windows last week and the roofing should be in this week.  I'll go up Friday, deliver the roofing material and get the roofing started.  Then I have a long weekend then next weekend so I'll get the windows delivered and try to finish the roofing.

Going to be a tough go with that pitch though, but I ordered ladder hooks and am looking for a 8-10 foot aluminum ladder now to put them on.  Figure that will work well enough.

Also will have to get new batteries for the drill (they are about 3 years old and dying regularly now).

Can't wait though!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 07, 2010, 09:49:22 AM
H Clips

Just a thought on these buggers.

When I began sheeting the roof I was in a bit of a hurry and totally forgot to include the clips.  I got 95% of one side done before realizing what I'd done.  I put them in the other side.

Now I have a dilemma on what to do.  I'm thinking of straightening up the tines on one side and pushing them through and then flattening them out again.  I know it's a cabin but I've framed the roof on 24" centers and think it's best to stop the OSB flex between rafters at joins.

Anyone else done this?  Solutions?

Thanks

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on April 07, 2010, 10:28:13 AM
Can't say that I have any solutions, but I do envy you being able to get up there this weekend.

Hopefully I'll be heading up sometime towards the end of the month for a few days
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 07, 2010, 11:12:34 AM
Quote from: JavaMan on April 07, 2010, 10:28:13 AM
Can't say that I have any solutions, but I do envy you being able to get up there this weekend.

Hopefully I'll be heading up sometime towards the end of the month for a few days

Turns out this weekend will only be an up and back trip to pick up the roofing and deliver it to the site.  I'll check the tarp and secure it better also.  My boss is off on PTO for the weekend so I can't be out of cell range and our cabin is definitely out of cell range! ha!

But the following weekend I have off (took Friday) so I'll go up Thursday night (15th I think) and stay to Sunday night.  That should be the big roofing weekend :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 13, 2010, 10:58:06 AM
Managed to race up (4+ hours) grab the trailer, drive to the builders store (45 minutes), get the roofing, drive back (another 45) and fix the tarp on the cabin, take a few pics and then drive home (4+ hours) on Saturday.  Ya, it was a long day!  But I had a friend along and it made the drive easier.

Honestly I hate wasting $100+ that way but it needed to be done.

This weekend we will get to work in earnest on the roof :)

Couple pics for ya:
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Cabin-04-10-2010020.jpg)
I've been trying to get a picture that gives a feel for our place in the woods :)  It's really quite secluded and tucked in between the mountains in a valley created by a little stream.  We own the hill to the south of us and to the north the mountains go up another 1000 feet or more.  All around the cabin are trees but there are also some meadows.

To the left of the cabin and behind it (Northwest) is an area that catches a fair amount of sun and I think will make a good garden plot of I choose to put on in some day.  The stream is 30-50 feet below the cabin and the Cistern is about 50-70 above it (above where this picture was taken actually).

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 13, 2010, 11:03:57 AM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Cabin-04-10-2010028.jpg)
This one is looking North through the trees.

One thing I've noticed is that in the winter the area is pretty brown and drab looking but in the spring and summer it comes alive!  I can't wait to see the cabin roofed and sided with windows and all that green grass around! :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 13, 2010, 11:05:39 AM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Cabin-04-10-2010018.jpg)
This one I wanted to shot the height of the trees!  Most of the trees appear to be Ponderosa Pines but there are also some Fir's on the property.  I'm still learning to identify them -- it's never been something I learned despite years in the woods!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 13, 2010, 11:09:43 AM
OK now I'm just getting carried away :D  But I'm hoping you are enjoying it...I am!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Cabin-04-10-2010015.jpg)

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on April 13, 2010, 11:52:47 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on April 13, 2010, 11:05:39 AM
I'm still learning to identify them -- it's never been something I learned despite years in the woods!

The short quick basics of the common three around my NM mountains.

Pines: needles grow in clusters of 2, 3 or 5 needles.

Firs: needles are individually attached and are flat in cross section.

Spruce: needles are individually attached and are square in cross section.

This gave me an idea for another topic..

http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=8793.msg113722#msg113722 (http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=8793.msg113722#msg113722)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on April 13, 2010, 12:05:25 PM
The property looks nice. I'd love to see more in greener seasons.


Looks like you need to do some thinning too   ;)   
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 13, 2010, 12:10:49 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on April 13, 2010, 12:05:25 PM
The property looks nice. I'd love to see more in greener seasons.


Looks like you need to do some thinning too   ;)   


I went back to look at the pictures from last June and WOW!  So green!  It will be amazing.

I noticed some shoots of grass coming up last trip :)  I also plan to bring a bag of seed each trip in order to try to get more grass growing on the easement road to keep the bank from caving
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on April 13, 2010, 12:24:06 PM
In a small town near us the old general store has bulk supplies of many grasses that are native to our mountains. We've spread some of them around.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 13, 2010, 07:10:00 PM
Good point Don -- I'll check locally to see what's natural and does well (since it's 160 miles north of where we live).

Jusst took the plunge and bought the Centrex 2000 AC/DC Sun Mar Composting Toilet system.  Pretty spendy at $2300 (with toilet and shipping) but we want an 'indoor' bathroom and this seemed to be the best option.

I'll be installing the unit outside of the cabin in it's own enclosure.  I MAY install it under the cabin (that was the original plan and part of the reason for the height off the ground) but Have to figure out the best way to get the vent stack up without running it through the roof as well as providing room to clean out the compost etc etc.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 14, 2010, 06:18:21 PM
Found an outhouse seat riser from Canada for $103 :)  Ordered it and after shipping was $160.

Considering the ones I found in the US were between $350 and $500 I think this is a great deal :D

It will be our backup.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on April 14, 2010, 07:17:23 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on April 13, 2010, 07:10:00 PM
Good point Don -- I'll check locally to see what's natural and does well (since it's 160 miles north of where we live).

Jusst took the plunge and bought the Centrex 2000 AC/DC Sun Mar Composting Toilet system.  Pretty spendy at $2300 (with toilet and shipping) but we want an 'indoor' bathroom and this seemed to be the best option.

I'll be installing the unit outside of the cabin in it's own enclosure.  I MAY install it under the cabin (that was the original plan and part of the reason for the height off the ground) but Have to figure out the best way to get the vent stack up without running it through the roof as well as providing room to clean out the compost etc etc.

So where did you purchase it from? I just received info from CTS in Newport as I am thinking of something similar for the cabin(s) I plan on building eventually
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 15, 2010, 12:17:14 AM
Quote from: JavaMan on April 14, 2010, 07:17:23 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on April 13, 2010, 07:10:00 PM
Good point Don -- I'll check locally to see what's natural and does well (since it's 160 miles north of where we live).

Jusst took the plunge and bought the Centrex 2000 AC/DC Sun Mar Composting Toilet system.  Pretty spendy at $2300 (with toilet and shipping) but we want an 'indoor' bathroom and this seemed to be the best option.

I'll be installing the unit outside of the cabin in it's own enclosure.  I MAY install it under the cabin (that was the original plan and part of the reason for the height off the ground) but Have to figure out the best way to get the vent stack up without running it through the roof as well as providing room to clean out the compost etc etc.

So where did you purchase it from? I just received info from CTS in Newport as I am thinking of something similar for the cabin(s) I plan on building eventually

Kaylx.com

Price wasn't too bad and the shipping was exceptable.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on April 15, 2010, 09:38:00 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on April 15, 2010, 12:17:14 AM
Quote from: JavaMan on April 14, 2010, 07:17:23 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on April 13, 2010, 07:10:00 PM
Good point Don -- I'll check locally to see what's natural and does well (since it's 160 miles north of where we live).

Jusst took the plunge and bought the Centrex 2000 AC/DC Sun Mar Composting Toilet system.  Pretty spendy at $2300 (with toilet and shipping) but we want an 'indoor' bathroom and this seemed to be the best option.

I'll be installing the unit outside of the cabin in it's own enclosure.  I MAY install it under the cabin (that was the original plan and part of the reason for the height off the ground) but Have to figure out the best way to get the vent stack up without running it through the roof as well as providing room to clean out the compost etc etc.

So where did you purchase it from? I just received info from CTS in Newport as I am thinking of something similar for the cabin(s) I plan on building eventually

Kaylx.com

Price wasn't too bad and the shipping was exceptable.


Thanks, I'll take a look over there.  The pricing that I received yesterday isn't too much different than what you paid - maybe a little more - but they are somewhat local, and I an trying to get info from them on any tips they may have to permitting, etc... in WA, since they are in this state.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 15, 2010, 10:33:20 AM
Quote from: JavaMan on April 15, 2010, 09:38:00 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on April 15, 2010, 12:17:14 AM
Quote from: JavaMan on April 14, 2010, 07:17:23 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on April 13, 2010, 07:10:00 PM
Good point Don -- I'll check locally to see what's natural and does well (since it's 160 miles north of where we live).

Jusst took the plunge and bought the Centrex 2000 AC/DC Sun Mar Composting Toilet system.  Pretty spendy at $2300 (with toilet and shipping) but we want an 'indoor' bathroom and this seemed to be the best option.

I'll be installing the unit outside of the cabin in it's own enclosure.  I MAY install it under the cabin (that was the original plan and part of the reason for the height off the ground) but Have to figure out the best way to get the vent stack up without running it through the roof as well as providing room to clean out the compost etc etc.

So where did you purchase it from? I just received info from CTS in Newport as I am thinking of something similar for the cabin(s) I plan on building eventually

Kaylx.com

Price wasn't too bad and the shipping was exceptable.


Thanks, I'll take a look over there.  The pricing that I received yesterday isn't too much different than what you paid - maybe a little more - but they are somewhat local, and I an trying to get info from them on any tips they may have to permitting, etc... in WA, since they are in this state.

There is a place over in your neck of the woods but their pricing was higher then suggested retail so I was a bit pissed.  That's why I went with the NY company.

I paid $2325 which included the 2000 AC/DC model, 510 Sealand toilet and $150 for shipping.  Will be coming straight from SunMar

Only thing I have to do is provide the pipe and the seat mountain flange I guess (need to reread that and try to understand why).
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on April 15, 2010, 12:28:03 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on April 15, 2010, 10:33:20 AM
Quote from: JavaMan on April 15, 2010, 09:38:00 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on April 15, 2010, 12:17:14 AM
Quote from: JavaMan on April 14, 2010, 07:17:23 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on April 13, 2010, 07:10:00 PM
Good point Don -- I'll check locally to see what's natural and does well (since it's 160 miles north of where we live).

Jusst took the plunge and bought the Centrex 2000 AC/DC Sun Mar Composting Toilet system.  Pretty spendy at $2300 (with toilet and shipping) but we want an 'indoor' bathroom and this seemed to be the best option.

I'll be installing the unit outside of the cabin in it's own enclosure.  I MAY install it under the cabin (that was the original plan and part of the reason for the height off the ground) but Have to figure out the best way to get the vent stack up without running it through the roof as well as providing room to clean out the compost etc etc.

So where did you purchase it from? I just received info from CTS in Newport as I am thinking of something similar for the cabin(s) I plan on building eventually

Kaylx.com

Price wasn't too bad and the shipping was exceptable.


Thanks, I'll take a look over there.  The pricing that I received yesterday isn't too much different than what you paid - maybe a little more - but they are somewhat local, and I an trying to get info from them on any tips they may have to permitting, etc... in WA, since they are in this state.

There is a place over in your neck of the woods but their pricing was higher then suggested retail so I was a bit pissed.  That's why I went with the NY company.

I paid $2325 which included the 2000 AC/DC model, 510 Sealand toilet and $150 for shipping.  Will be coming straight from SunMar

Only thing I have to do is provide the pipe and the seat mountain flange I guess (need to reread that and try to understand why).

Looking through the literature I got yesterday, I noticed that some of the pictures show the vent pipe exiting the crawlspace/basement before reaching the level of the floor above - specifically on Pages 16 and 17 of the SunMar catalog (covering the various Centrax 2000 models), so it looks like it can be done.  I would think that it would have to be affixed to the building/house/cabin on the outside in some way so it wouldn't get blown away on that rare windy day.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: SkagitDrifter on April 15, 2010, 12:31:25 PM
Sounds like a pretty good deal.
I have been kicking aroung the idea of a composting head from Sun Mar, in fact I think I looked at the same one you just ordered (the non-electric model).  I put the breaks on after I read somewhere that the composting or breakdown of the waste material comes to a grinding halt when temperatures dip below 55-60 degrees.  I have not done enough resrearch to know if that is true.  Anyone have any thoughts on this?

In our case, we'll only use the cabin a few times in the winter months, having waste sit in sub freezing tempertures will not be a big deal.  It's the spring and fall months that I wonder about.

You got the wheels turning OJ, good job- you're getting me pumped to get over there and get to work again after a long winter.  Talk is they may open the N. Cascade pass by this weekend- we can only hope.
All the best!
T
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 15, 2010, 12:41:02 PM
Quote from: SkagitDrifter on April 15, 2010, 12:31:25 PM
Sounds like a pretty good deal.
I have been kicking aroung the idea of a composting head from Sun Mar, in fact I think I looked at the same one you just ordered (the non-electric model).  I put the breaks on after I read somewhere that the composting or breakdown of the waste material comes to a grinding halt when temperatures dip below 55-60 degrees.  I have not done enough resrearch to know if that is true.  Anyone have any thoughts on this?

In our case, we'll only use the cabin a few times in the winter months, having waste sit in sub freezing tempertures will not be a big deal.  It's the spring and fall months that I wonder about.

You got the wheels turning OJ, good job- you're getting me pumped to get over there and get to work again after a long winter.  Talk is they may open the N. Cascade pass by this weekend- we can only hope.
All the best!
T

50-55 is what I understand the bottom temp range is but also why I bought the AC/DC model.  I want to use the internal heater element to aid in the composting.

I've read that they use them in Alaska but that they do so by providing heat for them when in use.

Don found that his didn't work so well at the elevation (and cold) he's in but the waste can freeze all winter just fine as long as when it thaws it gets rotated and can then compost.

but this is why I'm putting in a Privy too :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Solar Burrito on April 16, 2010, 11:35:42 AM
I've got one in my outhouse the non-electric model. We mostly use it during the summer so it works for us but I can tell you the composting does slow down during the winter. It's the least smelling out house people have ever used. ladies like it. I think the #1 goes out the back into some kind of drain field? I don't know because i didn't install it.

It's got 2 swappable containers inside that you can switch if the active one needs more "compost time" before you dump it out. Only one container is active at a time.

I can tell you we had a party with 50 people one memorial day weekend and a band off the grid. That thing really got some use and it was fine. In fact I haven't dumped it since after that weekend, it was 1 years ago. It's due and I'm sure the bucket behind it is composted.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 18, 2010, 10:44:31 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/th_IMG_0961.jpg) (https://s998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/?action=view&current=IMG_0961.flv)
All work and no play....

My son riding up 'The Hill'.  I took the jeep down and then back up it also :)

Great fun!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 18, 2010, 10:47:48 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Cabin-04-18-2010115.jpg)
Getting there!  I'll try to post more soon.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on April 19, 2010, 09:46:42 AM
Looking good!  I was anxiously awaiting your post - hoping for a bit of a snow (or lack thereof) report.  It looks like you didn't have any snow on the ground this trip - that's great.

I'm planning on heading up to my place the first weekend in May (leaving on April 30th) and hope to actually break ground for the first building! 

What did you get completed this trip?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 19, 2010, 12:03:00 PM
No snow!  In fact it hit 80 during the day in the sun :)  Of course as soon as the sun hid behind trees it dropped to 70 -- even 60 at times -- it was PERFECT!

Man it was so awesome I hated to leave!!!  What's worse?  I forgot I'd taken Monday off too...DOH!  Ahh well.

Back was hurting to stayed off the roof and got the windows in instead.  Also completed most of the felt paper on the walls and finished a lot of 'back framing' stuff (nailing off forgotten things mostly).

And played a little in the Jeep and ATV's too....what an awesome weekend! :D  Geez, I wish I'd not forgotten that I had put myself down for Monday too....what's even worse?  I make the darn schedule! hahahaha I'm the dang boss....ahhh well...next time!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 19, 2010, 09:52:50 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Cabin-04-18-2010020.jpg)
Getting rigged up for some work up high :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Cabin-04-18-2010029.jpg)
OK the window is installed now so we decided a shot of my friend standing in the small loft for reference.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Cabin-04-18-2010026.jpg)
The Big Loft :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Cabin-04-18-2010037.jpg)
Windows in!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Cabin-04-18-2010039.jpg)
The back side :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on April 20, 2010, 10:07:40 AM
Wow! It looks like you're going to be able to finish almost any weekend, now!  [cool]

Then you'll be up there, sitting on the deck, enjoying a cool one  :)

Did ya see any wildlife this time? Turkeys, etc...? I'm hoping I see a few up at my place.

I was a Lowes last night to buy a drain auger, and picked up a few of the solar "path lights" for $4 each - I figure, no power on the property, but I can have some sort of lighting so I can find my way in the dark, if I have to  ;D  I liked them because the battery is an 'AA' sized rechargeable and is easily replaced so it's not "planned obsolescence"

Hmmm, that reminds me, I should fire up the genset to make sure it's in operating order.

If you're going to be up there the first weekend in May, let me know, we can meet in Omak or Riverside and have a beer and swap stories.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 20, 2010, 10:25:11 AM
Quote from: JavaMan on April 20, 2010, 10:07:40 AM
Wow! It looks like you're going to be able to finish almost any weekend, now!  [cool]

Then you'll be up there, sitting on the deck, enjoying a cool one  :)

Did ya see any wildlife this time? Turkeys, etc...? I'm hoping I see a few up at my place.

I was a Lowes last night to buy a drain auger, and picked up a few of the solar "path lights" for $4 each - I figure, no power on the property, but I can have some sort of lighting so I can find my way in the dark, if I have to  ;D  I liked them because the battery is an 'AA' sized rechargeable and is easily replaced so it's not "planned obsolescence"

Hmmm, that reminds me, I should fire up the genset to make sure it's in operating order.

If you're going to be up there the first weekend in May, let me know, we can meet in Omak or Riverside and have a beer and swap stories.



Had 4 deer come through while we were taking a break.  They came up not 100 feet from behind the cabin and walked casually past us and up the hill.

Earlier we'd seen about 20+ throughout the area.

The bear hasn't been around or the cougar so not sure where they are but we did smell garbage Saturday night so it's possible a bruin was cruising past upwind from us.  I'm told by the neighbors that there is a 400 pounder hanging out around them -- they are on the next hill less then a mile away.

No turkey's though :(  But I had my 870 just in case :)  Saw a grouse though and LOTS of grouse mating calls/thumps which is good.  I'm hopeful they have a great mating season :D :D

Not sure which weekends we will be up right not but not this coming :(  Need to heal (back was out a bit) and do some gardening so probably the next and perhaps can manage the 1st weekend of May too :D  Wouldn't mind stopping at the shop in Omak that makes the great milkshakes!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 21, 2010, 12:26:35 PM
Going to have a LOT more time to work on the cabin now ;)

Just got 'riffed' from my job :(

Been here FIVE years and literally built the company but I've been phased out so to speak.

Getting a good separations package and all and we prepared for this over the last few years (because life is what it is) so now I'll spend a little more time working to complete the cabin :)

And looking for work of course!  ;)

Hey, how many Nationally Telecommunications Companies run their Network Operations Centers out of Tonasket? hahahahaha
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on April 21, 2010, 02:03:54 PM
Sorry to hear that, jarhead ... Glad you got a good severance, tho - that takes some of the sting off, huh?

I'm sure you'll find something fairly quickly - I know I've seen a lot of ads for network people on line.  The first shake in Omak is on me then  ;)

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Yonderosa on April 21, 2010, 05:13:20 PM
Bummer 'bout the job.  Seems like a sign of the times, I have a bunch of friends and family members that are "underemployed" right now.  I've been lucky so far, fairly steady comparatively but I've even been practicing my "do you want fries with that" line just in case...
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on April 21, 2010, 06:18:47 PM
Sorry to hear that news.  :(  Best of luck of finding something rewarding.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 22, 2010, 12:16:57 AM
Thanks guys!

I may have an opportunity already :)  Our sales director mentioned to an old colleague of mine that I'm on the market and he's asked that I send my resume to him so he can see if he can slot me in somewhere!

I'm keeping my fingers crossed! :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on April 22, 2010, 10:11:08 AM
That's the way it works these day - a lot!  Hopefully they'll be able to put you into a spot  :D  Meanwhile, what are you doing at the keyboard, shouldn't you be driving up there, or picking up supplies, or something to get it done before you have to go back to work!??! :)

Yeah, it's easy for me to say - and I would have done that myself, if it hadn't been for the idea that I had to actually look for a job, and didn't have money coming in for all those supplies.  One of the most frustrating things for me is not having time (while working), but having the money, then when not working, having the time, but no money for it....   Which is why I put together a building fund savings account  ;D

Speaking of which, I have an interview myself this morning ... gotta go study  :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 22, 2010, 11:25:09 AM
Good luck on the interview!

I'm actually still working (sorta).  I'm employed until the 14th of May since it's a RIF and not a layoff/firing.

I'll get a good separation agreement and my stocks etc so that's going to help and my wife and I worked pretty hard to pay the bills and get ourselves in a better financial spot (doing things like saying no to a new ATV for the property and such).

I also run a website kinda like this one which is recognized as one of the top sites in the world for it's field..and that helps me out by paying for the cabin :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 24, 2010, 01:57:20 AM
ANyone know a good source of Chimney parts?  I'm pricing out what I'll need and locally from the stove to the cover will run about $1600 -- I'm hoping I can get that down a little.

Thoughts?

I've got 14' of SS 6" pipe to run, plus a T, T support, roof support, flashing, extender, wall thimble and more.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: SkagitDrifter on April 26, 2010, 02:01:08 PM
Great pricing and service.  I got all my pipe and fittings from them and saved $ even with the freight charge.
Good luck.

http://www.lindemannchimney.com/
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 27, 2010, 11:52:09 AM
Thanks for the link, I'll check them out!

I just got a call that our Composting toilet arrives tomorrow!  I'm very excited!  I can get it up to the cabin THIS WEEKEND then :D :D :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on April 27, 2010, 04:49:37 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on April 27, 2010, 11:52:09 AM
Thanks for the link, I'll check them out!

I just got a call that our Composting toilet arrives tomorrow!  I'm very excited!  I can get it up to the cabin THIS WEEKEND then :D :D :D

Sweet!  That was pretty fast turnaround on your order!

Shakes in Omak on Saturday!  :)

I am planning on leaving at o-dark-thirty on Friday morning  d* and spending the weekend working until I run out of steam, run out of things to do, or just run out  ;)  The plan is to drop a bunch of stuff at the Ranch, and head for the building supply in Okanogan (if they have what I want - gotta call 'em tomorrow) and get back up there and working.

Saturday would be a good day for shakes or coffee, or what not in Omak since I will have to head in to the HD (and wally world) for more supplies
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: diyfrank on April 27, 2010, 05:20:48 PM
What time will you be coming through Omak? We'll be hitting the Starbucks on our way through Saturday morning around 7:00. c*
I'm bringing a load of plywood over and I have some tree's I need to plant.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 27, 2010, 09:40:43 PM
Quote from: JavaMan on April 27, 2010, 04:49:37 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on April 27, 2010, 11:52:09 AM
Thanks for the link, I'll check them out!

I just got a call that our Composting toilet arrives tomorrow!  I'm very excited!  I can get it up to the cabin THIS WEEKEND then :D :D :D

Sweet!  That was pretty fast turnaround on your order!

Shakes in Omak on Saturday!  :)

I am planning on leaving at o-dark-thirty on Friday morning  d* and spending the weekend working until I run out of steam, run out of things to do, or just run out  ;)  The plan is to drop a bunch of stuff at the Ranch, and head for the building supply in Okanogan (if they have what I want - gotta call 'em tomorrow) and get back up there and working.

Saturday would be a good day for shakes or coffee, or what not in Omak since I will have to head in to the HD (and wally world) for more supplies

Might be able to swing that.  I'm going up Friday afternoon and then might be feeling the need for a break in the afternoon on Sat.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 27, 2010, 09:42:01 PM
Quote from: diyfrank on April 27, 2010, 05:20:48 PM
What time will you be coming through Omak? We'll be hitting the Starbucks on our way through Saturday morning around 7:00. c*
I'm bringing a load of plywood over and I have some tree's I need to plant.

I'll be going through Friday night and then might be able to make it back Sat afternoon for old fashioned shakes.  My kid will like that. :)

Curlew...I see the signs for there but am uncertain how far away it is....
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on April 27, 2010, 11:32:42 PM
Sounds good!  If you don't call me first, I'll call you Friday afternoon.

diyfrank - I don't think I'd be in town at 7, but I'd probably be there around 10-11 "ish" (yeah, not real early - but it will depend on how tired I am from the night before)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: diyfrank on April 28, 2010, 07:07:54 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on April 27, 2010, 09:42:01 PM
Curlew...I see the signs for there but am uncertain how far away it is....

Curlew is a hour past Tonasket up 20 to republic then north almost to the border.

Where do you stop for shakes? Tonasket?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 28, 2010, 10:15:58 AM
Quote from: diyfrank on April 28, 2010, 07:07:54 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on April 27, 2010, 09:42:01 PM
Curlew...I see the signs for there but am uncertain how far away it is....

Curlew is a hour past Tonasket up 20 to republic then north almost to the border.

Where do you stop for shakes? Tonasket?

Hmmm...there's a place up there we almost bought (until we saw it -- what a mess)....

There is a place in downtown Omak that makes great old fashioned ones.

Republic has a nice little restaurant too actually :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 28, 2010, 02:50:57 PM
Got the Composter and Seat today :D

So this trip we will be bringing up the Composter, Seat and Riser for an outhouse with us :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on April 28, 2010, 05:11:45 PM
I hope it doesn't turn into a crappy trip for you  ;D

Sorry, I was channeling my dad for a minute....

You'll have to email me the name of the place with the shakes - I can't say I've ever been to anyplace other than the one place (I think it's called The Bread Line) ...
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 30, 2010, 11:24:06 AM
It's been a year but going west from Home Depot, cross the hihgway and keep going.  The road will turn to the south and downhill.  One at the bottom of the hill (short distance) you should be in town :)

On the left about 1 1/2 blocks in is a family restaurant with Disney characters and I think trains around the ceiling shelved....they make old fashion shakes.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 01, 2010, 04:44:13 PM
MaGoos I am on my cell so can't add much but we stopped by for lunch at 2
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on May 02, 2010, 06:50:14 PM
Well, I missed you! I was in town a bit earlier than 2, but would have been able to make it back (needed to make another supply run about that time) c*

Ah well, next time.  I am thinking the weekend of the 15th for my next trip.

Check out my thread in a few minutes for what I actually accomplished!  Decided to head home a bit early for various reasons, which are in my thread.

I'll just have to plan better and make sure that we've connected before the weekend  d*
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 05, 2010, 11:51:58 AM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Campics036.jpg)
Figuring out where to put things :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 05, 2010, 11:52:36 AM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Campics015.jpg)
Visitors :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 05, 2010, 11:53:43 AM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Campics032.jpg)
Locating where the composter will go
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 07, 2010, 11:33:59 AM
The itch is hard to resist but we're not going up this weekend....too much to do.

However, I bought a shock of ebay for our older ATV for $55 ($25+shipping of $30 from Hawaii) that saved us $300+!!!!!  It was a perfect match too :D

Now we're wating on front shocks and then I'll get a trailer too....they are like little tractors :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on May 07, 2010, 12:04:41 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on May 07, 2010, 11:33:59 AM
The itch is hard to resist but we're not going up this weekend....too much to do.

However, I bought a shock of ebay for our older ATV for $55 ($25+shipping of $30 from Hawaii) that saved us $300+!!!!!  It was a perfect match too :D

Now we're wating on front shocks and then I'll get a trailer too....they are like little tractors :)

I hear you on the ATVs - I've been wanting one for a while myself.  I've been looking at them on craigslist, but just don't have the cash for one yet. I think it would make a nice work horse up at my property and with all the various attachments you can get for them these days, I think they'd probably work better in the garden at home than the garden tractor we have, too!

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Solar Burrito on May 07, 2010, 12:11:46 PM
Ya they are serioius work horses. We used our Honda Forman 400 to drag a 500 lb stump out of the ditch to burn. It was so heavy the quad would barely move it up a steep hill and we had an extra person sitting on the front of the quad for extra traction to the front wheels oh and to steer!  ::)

Love that thing, it drags regular logs with ease.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 07, 2010, 04:05:35 PM
When we were dumb and using credit we bought a Honda Rancher 420 (2007) on the Honda card deal they had going.  We pay that off next month :D

We then had a friend who wanted to sell his 1996 Yamaha Big Bear 350 for $200 and a couch :D :D  [cool]

We bought that and found that it ran like a champ and just needed cosmetic work and tires etc.

Now with everything in it we're still well below $1000!!!  And we've used it for two years of HARD riding and stump pulling :D

We use them to get firewood, haul gear and more.

We plan to get a trailer (or two) and eventually a 750 4x4 with plow etc...but we also enjoy playing on them :)

One nice thing is that it's fast to go to the top of our place where cell coverage can be reached and the kids will drive to the store on them (3 miles of off roading).  Gotta love it
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 14, 2010, 02:53:34 PM
OK we're off in a couple hours to get some more work done -- changed plans because of a job interview I have on Wed (darn it  d* ).

But we ordered the greywater system and will be doing the roofing, toilet and chimney over the next two weeks!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Solar Burrito on May 14, 2010, 03:05:19 PM
 [cool] cool, I'm very interested in your grey water system and Chimney, take good photos, hahha. Have a great time, hope the weather over there is as good as it's going to be on the west side!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 18, 2010, 08:41:26 PM
We're back for a day or two then we'll be back at it again for 4 or 5. 

Didn't get much done though :(  Partly because of weather and partly because my old Tendinitis came back for a while (long story short it involves nerve gas and the desert) but then with some good supplements and perseverance we managed to get the composter's floor installed (below grade though it isn't recommended -- more on that later) and did a bit of siding to allow us to finish the composting toilet install.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/05-18-10_0935.jpg)
I forgot my camera (and cordless drill as well as a few other things) this trip so the cell phone camera was all I had.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/05-18-10_0932.jpg)
What started as a "I only need this much room" project turned into "oh wait but I need MORE" project and involved digging out a 4 foot by 6 foot by 18" deep hole then layering the bottom with 6 mil plastic, dropping pavers down and setting 4x4 PT floor framing and insulation (3/4" white foam that I had laying around) and finally some 3/4" T&G OSB that we treated with green nasty stuff. 

With the 'floor' level we were able to finally get the composter set and the piping roughed in (not glued yet).

Next we'll put in walls and like a root cellar we'll put some 6 mil plastic around the base to protect it a bit and clear the dirt pile from the front (ramp it) so we can get to the drawer etc.

Luckily the composter is designed to be removed if needed so we can always do something more permanent later.  For now this will suffice until we get the covered porch built at which time we'll not have to worry about moisture (which we don't much anyway).

We had to dig a french cesspit for overflow but managed to get that deep enough and finally are ready to complete the install....sheesh!

The interior we realized we had to plumb in Felxpex now as well as any romex so we can insulate and drywall the walls behind the toilet itself.

We hope to have that done on Friday so we can get back to the roof on Saturday....

I need more time though!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 18, 2010, 11:57:17 PM
One thing I'm trying to determine is whether or not I should use a clear sealant/stain on the rough T1-11 before the finish stain or not?

The area we are in gets very little rain (at most 15" a year) and I've seen a lot of exposed OSB that's been out in the open a LONG time and yet still seems to hold it's integrity (in appearance anyway).  Doesn't mean much to me because I will treat our siding but I'm curious at what your thoughts are?

Also I'm looking for that classic siding color that I can only describe as a 'honey' color...if anyone has a picture of what they think it might be (type of stain and color) I'd be grateful.  In the meantime the wife and I will go to Home Depot and pic up a few different stains and see which one we think has the right color for our tastes (light, honey -- we like oak -- type color)....

Cheers
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on May 19, 2010, 05:43:42 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on May 18, 2010, 11:57:17 PM
One thing I'm trying to determine is whether or not I should use a clear sealant/stain on the rough T1-11 before the finish stain or not?

The area we are in gets very little rain (at most 15" a year) and I've seen a lot of exposed OSB that's been out in the open a LONG time and yet still seems to hold it's integrity (in appearance anyway).  Doesn't mean much to me because I will treat our siding but I'm curious at what your thoughts are?

Also I'm looking for that classic siding color that I can only describe as a 'honey' color...if anyone has a picture of what they think it might be (type of stain and color) I'd be grateful.  In the meantime the wife and I will go to Home Depot and pic up a few different stains and see which one we think has the right color for our tastes (light, honey -- we like oak -- type color)....

Cheers


If you apply a clear sealant prior to the finished stain color it may prevent the stain from doing it's job.  I would reverse the process and apply stain first then sealant.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on May 19, 2010, 09:30:15 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on May 18, 2010, 11:57:17 PM
One thing I'm trying to determine is whether or not I should use a clear sealant/stain on the rough T1-11 before the finish stain or not?



As John said, but more emphatically. No, no, no.!

A true stain needs to soak into the wood, although those that are made semi-transparent will leave a fair amount of pigment on the surface. Any kind of a clear coat that seals the surface will block staining action.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 19, 2010, 10:06:14 AM
Thanks guys -- I think I misspoke so to speak -- I'd read somewhere (I think JR posted it) that there was a clear treatment for exposed wood siding that should be applied first (or maybe it was in a cabin building book).....

But I suspect it isn't as important as just getting a stain on and sealing it.

I also need to put down some ant bait!  And more mouse traps/bait.  I think there must be a million forest mice and the ants have invaded!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: John Raabe on May 19, 2010, 10:17:49 AM
There are penetrating clear coatings that can also be colored and used as a stain/sealant. This one is a two coat process.

http://www.weatherall.com/1047UVGII.html

If you are using a pure stain, it would go on first before any sealant coating.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on May 19, 2010, 10:19:05 AM
There are clear products that are meant to be applied to wood just before staining. They are usually used on furniture or interior wood. Their purpose is to stop or moderate the blotchiness that sometimes occurs when staining some woods. They ate applied, let to soak in and then wiped dry. The stain is them immediately applied while the prestain is damp.    There may some prestain treatments for logs, but I don't know much about using logs.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: jdejarn on May 19, 2010, 10:31:09 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on May 19, 2010, 10:06:14 AM
Thanks guys -- I think I misspoke so to speak -- I'd read somewhere (I think JR posted it) that there was a clear treatment for exposed wood siding that should be applied first (or maybe it was in a cabin building book).....

But I suspect it isn't as important as just getting a stain on and sealing it.

I also need to put down some ant bait!  And more mouse traps/bait.  I think there must be a million forest mice and the ants have invaded!

I have been there!!!  At the Ace in town (Tonasket) I have bought Terro spray, and have had great results w/ ants.  I have sprayed twice this year already, and will again this weekend when I go over.  Good luck!!  Those guys are nasty this time of year!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 20, 2010, 11:45:17 AM
Thanks JD

Didn't get the job I was interviewing for so it's back to cabin work!

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on May 20, 2010, 01:27:28 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on May 20, 2010, 11:45:17 AM
Thanks JD

Didn't get the job I was interviewing for so it's back to cabin work!



At least they told you right away.  Some I've interviewed with lately, seem to forget that it is a common courtesy to simply say, "sorry, we don't think you're a fit"

But, you get more work on the cabin done now! [cool]
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 20, 2010, 03:19:14 PM
Quote from: JavaMan on May 20, 2010, 01:27:28 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on May 20, 2010, 11:45:17 AM
Thanks JD

Didn't get the job I was interviewing for so it's back to cabin work!



At least they told you right away.  Some I've interviewed with lately, seem to forget that it is a common courtesy to simply say, "sorry, we don't think you're a fit"

But, you get more work on the cabin done now! [cool]

Amen!

I've got BIG plans for the cabin this summer :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Woodswalker on May 20, 2010, 09:12:16 PM
My cabin has rough-sawn fir T1-11 panels for siding.  I stained it last summer with a penetrating oil stain by Olympic, called cedar toner.  Sold at Lowe's in 1 & 5 gal buckets.  This siding really soaks it up.  Think I used 4 gal. to do 16' x 20' cabin.  Gave a color about what you describe.  My place is near L Curlew, so similar climate.  Personally, I intend to just keep repeating the oil stain, and not use any sealant.

My cabin-build thread does not have pics since the siding got stained, but I can send one if you contact me with an email address.  Am enjoying your postings of progress.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 25, 2010, 10:38:13 PM
Just got back today.  Pretty beat but we managed to make it home again safe and sound -- despite 4 or 5 construction projects on roads that didn't need it...hmmmm.....

OK, so we have the composting toilet in and working!!!  Yahoo!  No more bucket!  That's right, we were using a luggable loo for all this time and FINALLY have a toilet and no longer must use a bucket....has it really been THAT long?  Wow!  8 or 9 months!

OK, so we still have work to do -- TONS and TONS but having a toilet is just, well, awesome :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0017.jpg)
OK I never said the bathroom was done or anything *chuckle* and yes, we will put the linoleum in later, but for now, we can use the toilet and that's well, provincial (or some such thing).

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 25, 2010, 10:57:47 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0007.jpg)

We arrived on Friday with our new ATV trailer and once we were settled in for the next week we assembled our new trailer ($239 t Ranch and Home) and headed into the trailer for the night (we'd left the tent trailer up for the 3 days we were at home so we didn't have to set up much once we arrived).

The next morning while my step son slept in (I let him do that most days) I got up, had coffee and breakfast (fried bacon and eggs and toast) and then loaded up the trailer with dirt from our 'excavation project' for the composting toilet system.  I then towed it over to our easement road and used the dirt to fill in holes in the road.  It helped to smooth it out actually :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0003.jpg)
We also brought in an old tree that someone before us had cut up and left laying there.  It was pretty rotten but I felt we could dry it out and use it for camp fires.  The trailer was a BIG hit (with me anyway) :)  [cool]

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0034.jpg)
Of course trailering around with ATV's wasn't the main mission and this ought to be evidence that we actually worked!  Yes, it's a picture of a mess *chuckle*.  Sometimes when I'm working away I don't worry about how things look, I just want to get the work done and well, the more tired I am the messier I can be.

So ya, it's a mess, but we got a bunch done and cleaned it up later :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0032.jpg)
From this spot you can get 2-3 bars of Cell coverage!  It's rather amazing since there is NO COVERAGE ANYWHERE near us.  It appears we catch the towers in Omak (about 45 miles by road but more then likely only 20 or so miles line of site) through a gap in the mountains to the south west of us.  Just downright amazing.  I'd heard that sometimes others have found 'secret' spots like this too but it's rare in these parts....I think our land just went up in value ;)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0011.jpg)
Cleaning up the wood pile :)  Finally we have one!  We've burned a lot of wood over the winter just trying to keep warm but most of it came from slash piles.  Now with the trailer we intend to get ALL of the good usable wood stacked and dried so next winter we will have LOTS of campfire wood.

For the wood stove we'll start a different pile (and wood shed eventually) for drying/seasoning the firewood for the stove.  I'm told the local ponderosa pine is ok to burn as long as you burn it hot and that's a good thing because while we do have some fir and tamerac we've mostly got ponderosa and a lot of it is in need of removal (maybe 10% of the trees appear sickly or dead).

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0044.jpg)
The composting bin installed -- temporarily anyway.

We were in a bit of a rush (never should be though) when we did this install but I feel it will hold us for at least a year or two.  It will be completely enclosed in the 'shed' once done and the vent stacks run back to the cabin wall and then up above the eves and as high as I can get them and not have them blown off or look odd -- I want them to work properly.  I also plan to either install piping from the cabin to vent warm air into the composter shed during the winter or install an RV heater in the shed to keep it above 50 during the winter -- at least that's the plan.

We also plan a privy as backup however but honestly, digging this 4 foot by 6 foot by 2 foot 'basement' was darn well enough digging for me!  Sheesh....actually we also dug the overflow trench and french cess pit but that's covered now.

In fact, we even picked up the rocks for the pitt on the easement road after dumping dirt to fill holes....we're talking labor intensive here.

Actually, I'm lying.  I have more holes to dig :(  I have to dig a 41" deep hole for our grey water drain system and then a trench that goes at least 5 feet away from that hole to another that will provide the leaching for the greywater system....and then I have a privy to dig and a root cellar...am I nuts?

Anyway folks...there it is :)  We head back in less then two weeks to try to get the roof done (haven't I heard that before?) oh ya, and I noticed that my neglected post and pier foundation needs work :(  I meant to get more braces in there.....
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 04, 2010, 10:55:44 AM
Getting ready to head out again. :)

My list is a mile long but main elements of this trip (besides ducking weather) will be the roof and the foundation.

The weather has been VERY rainy (way more then normal) and 10-15 degrees cooler day after day.  The cool weather is nice but rain makes cabin work - um, wet.

;)

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on June 04, 2010, 12:48:12 PM
Yeah, I'm hoping for dry(er) weather by the time I get up that way on Wednesday.  I noticed that nearest town to my place got 1.49" last Thursday (a week ago) - that's quite unusual from what I've been learning with the historical weather data.  I'm wishing I had my rainfall harvesting set up and working already.

Of course, that would mean the roof would be on the shed, which would mean that for all intent and purpose it would be finished - at least on the outside, and I'm a ways away from that  :(

My plan this time up is to get the 2 walls up that are framed, plus the other two framed, up, and sheathed, and to do the roof - at least the ridge and rafters - hopefully the sheathing, too, and the shingling.  I also have some windows to install.

Ambitious, I know, but if I don't have it planned out, it won't get done.  I've found, the last 2 times up, that I can accomplish what I wanted to way faster than I think.  Then I'm sitting there with nothing to do and I get bored and head home.  So this time, I am going up with a plan to do more than I think I can, and hopefully I will utilize the entire time that I've blocked out!

Maybe we can get together for a lunch or shake this time, if we can get it co-ordinated  ???
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 11, 2010, 10:12:54 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0121.jpg)
Just a primer :)  Despite rain, hail, lightening and ridiculous weather we managed to get most of the roof on!!!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0125.jpg)
We also got the wood stove inside and began the chimney work but more on all of it later.

Cheers
Erik
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Solar Burrito on June 12, 2010, 09:29:38 AM
Any tips?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 12, 2010, 09:43:03 AM
Quote from: Solar Burrito on June 12, 2010, 09:29:38 AM
Any tips?

On the roofing?  *chuckle* Hmmm.....

We did the roof by the following method which worked nicely:

1.  Have Ryobi 18v cordless drill ready with two new batteries charged (that was a life saver).
2.  Pre drill holes in the panels at once (we stacked all 13 for one side and measured off the holes and marked with a sharpy, then pre-drilled all the holes with a bit smaller then the screws.
3.  Have main roofer climb onto the roof using the roofing ladder (Java you can borrow my hooks when I'm done if you like) and safety harness and position the ladder etc (I tie off my drill to my harness so it won't fall off the steep pitch and cost me a drill).
4.  Nail two nails on the gable edge 1/2" in from edge (depending on roofing material type, some is 1/4" etc) instead of chalking a line because you will find it much easier to square the panel to the roof that way).
5.  Son grabs panel and pushes it up to you, you grab panel and place it onto the roof in approximate place. 
6.  Son climbs ladder and positions panel with correct overhang and placement, you put the first 3 screws in and son goes to get next panel while you screw (in my case top down) the panel off.

I'm no expert and this is the first metal roof I've done but I'm very happy with the system we developed :D  It took us 4 hours to do the first half (26' length by 11' 6" panels) and only 2 1/2 hrs the second half.  It went faster once we got used to it.

The hardest part was the roof dance:

1.  Climb ladder to pitch
2.  sit on pitch
3.  move ladder to right spot
4.  climb down ladder to eve
5.  hoist panel into place
6.  climb ladder to pitch
7.  position panel & screw down panel while climbing down ladder.

Repeat ad nauseam or until roof is done :) :P
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 12, 2010, 12:19:32 PM
OK so here goes.....

After having returned to the USA in 1995 I've worked or gone to school (or served in the Army) all but a few months.  So in 15 years I've NOT collected all but perhaps 3 months worth of Unemployment Insurance despite paying into it often at rates much higher then those who have continuously extended their benefits of late.  So, after being laid off from my high paying (not that high) job I decided to make the system pay me and do some 'deck' work ;)

Then, of course, I didn't understand the system and botched my first weeks claim and lost it when the commies canceled my claim.  Now I'm told, after collecting just one week, that I MUST report at 8:15am to be schooled on how to find a job by Uncle Sam -- or he'll take my money away.

Amazing really, since Uncle Sam hasn't helped me get a job since leaving the Marine Corps in 1991 and that one lasted all of 4 months since the individual I worked for didn't like the military.  Ahhhh such is life.

Anyway, I digress!  I'm taking some time to 'look for work' up in the woods ;)

Josh (step son) and I left for the hills on Friday last and arrived at our site around dinner time.  We got set up and it started to rain so we relaxed in the Tent trailer and hit the hay early.

Saturday we got up and moving (after coffee for me) and pulled the tarp off the roof.  I had a lot of work to do and we hit it hard.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0001-1.jpg)

First step was to plug the last hole in the roof with a sheet of OSB and then to nail off the roof -- I hadn't completed that task when we dropped the lid on and so needed to go back over it all to make sure I hadn't missed anything.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0006-1.jpg)

Once the roof was nailed off (South side) I began to put the 30 lbs felt down on it.  I worked from the top down by not nailing down the bottom 1/2 of the felt and slipping the next row up under the previous one.  This proved very hard on a 12x12 pitch but I got it all but one piece done before the rains came!
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0009-1.jpg)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 12, 2010, 12:19:50 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0015.jpg)
By Saturday dinner time I was pretty much done but needed to complete the last row of felt.  That would have to wait as weather wasn't improving.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0068.jpg)
Managed to get all but one piece on the South side done and started the North side but the weather was not cooperating.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0024.jpg)
A friend of mine stopped out and after enjoying the fire, shooting clay (with 18" security barrel -- talk about fun and challenging) we got back at it and finished off most of the North side.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0020.jpg)
And set the little wood stove inside.  It's about two feet right of it's final location.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 12, 2010, 01:21:10 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0028-1.jpg)
Before we got too far, however, a hail storm came up and really whollopped us!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0042.jpg)
It started looking like winter and the hail was really sounding crazy on the tent trailer.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0046.jpg)
Thunder rolled and the rains let loose to really make this June look like winter!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0050.jpg)
I caught this pic of the storm over our mountain....it was crazy in there!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0054.jpg)
Lightning struck nearby too!  Caused an old stump to burn.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 13, 2010, 09:09:44 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Neighbor_bear.jpg)
The neighbor sent me this picture.  The bird feeder in the tree is 6 feet off the ground.  He's eating from one that is 4 feet up....15 feet from the front door of their cabin.

They decided to stop feeding the birds...er...bears....

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/BearatNeighbors.jpg)
I always carry something when I'm out there.  This is why.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 14, 2010, 09:44:17 AM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0078.jpg)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0082.jpg)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0084.jpg)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0089.jpg)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0094.jpg)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 14, 2010, 01:44:50 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/WolforCoyote-1.jpg)
Wolf!

Saw this on the game cam!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: ScottA on June 14, 2010, 02:00:28 PM
Congratulations on getting the roof on. Looks good.  :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on June 15, 2010, 10:02:01 AM
Thanks for the offer of the ridge hooks!  I didn't get everything done that I wanted to this trip, but that's ok.  I really need to find a building partner that can come and stay up there the duration I'm up there.

I wanted to say thanks for the offer to come and help with my walls :).  I hated to turn it down, but I just wasn't far enough along to use it  :(  But eventually we'll have to get together for a coffee, shake, or adult beverage of choice.

I won't get your thread off track here, but I did want to comment that your cabin looks pretty darn good!  Is that all new metal roof? or did you find it on craigslist?  I've been searching for some, but so far haven't found any in my neck of the woods.

The weather was a bit squirrely last weekend.

Oh, and yes, you do have to go to that job hunting "class" ... as if you didn't know how to fill out the claim every week, and your hunt record... I didn't one time and they wanted the money back for that week - even after we got it straightened out.  It's about a half day of listening to someone say most of what you already know, but you get a "job contact" credit for it for that week...  ::)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 19, 2010, 06:06:34 PM
Quote from: JavaMan on June 15, 2010, 10:02:01 AM
Thanks for the offer of the ridge hooks!  I didn't get everything done that I wanted to this trip, but that's ok.  I really need to find a building partner that can come and stay up there the duration I'm up there.

I wanted to say thanks for the offer to come and help with my walls :).  I hated to turn it down, but I just wasn't far enough along to use it  :(  But eventually we'll have to get together for a coffee, shake, or adult beverage of choice.

I won't get your thread off track here, but I did want to comment that your cabin looks pretty darn good!  Is that all new metal roof? or did you find it on craigslist?  I've been searching for some, but so far haven't found any in my neck of the woods.

The weather was a bit squirrely last weekend.

Oh, and yes, you do have to go to that job hunting "class" ... as if you didn't know how to fill out the claim every week, and your hunt record... I didn't one time and they wanted the money back for that week - even after we got it straightened out.  It's about a half day of listening to someone say most of what you already know, but you get a "job contact" credit for it for that week...  ::)

Yup new roofing.  Deciding to do it all new as long as I could....

Thanks for the tip on UI!  What a crock *chuckle*  you pay in for 25 years and use it for a few months and they act as if you need THEM to teach you how to work another 25 years.....go figure.  (of course, they also probably think you don't pay becuase your employer does -- nonsense, if they didn't have to I'd get it and need it even less).....but I digress.

We'll make that meet sooner or later!  Now, I've got some photo work to do!  My wife and I just returned...from looking for work in Tonasket that is!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 19, 2010, 06:58:11 PM
My wife and I stayed at our cabin site this week and got a fair amount of work done :)  I made sure to go into town pretty much daily to check for local jobs too!  (I was told that when on UI be certain to look for work everywhere you go -- as if I need their assistance -- so I did) anyway...

We arrived on Monday and after getting set up pretty much relaxed for the evening though I think we went out and did a bit of clean up work.  Then on Tuesday we set up the solar system for the well and got pumping water :)
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0008-1.jpg)
I mentioned this system in another thread but in a nutshell it's a Costco 60 watt system for about $269 plus Battery (Costco $62 for the 85ah one we got).  We got it because it seemed like an easier option then trying to run wiring from the cabin solar to the well over a long distance.  So far we're pretty happy.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0005.jpg)
The well head has two battery cables coming out of it -- like jumper cables -- that you just hook up to a car battery and it starts pumping.  I plan to rig these into a switch on the pump house and run the solar charger full time.  Then all I need to do is send a kid out to flip the switch in the AM and switch it off once the cistern is full or we don't need it anymore.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0004.jpg)
The charge controller seems to work pretty well but I can see an ameter in our future (I think -- or something similar to tell me the charge on the battery).

After the well was rigged up we began to cut up dead trees and started a new wood pile.  We decided the weeks long relaxing visit would include a full body workout ;)

These trees had fallen from our neighbors land onto our fence and we decided to help them out (they've all but abandoned their land) by turning them into firewood.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0029.jpg)


(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0031.jpg)My wife really got into loading up the ATV trailer (we got it at Ranch and Home for $239 and she wants a second now!) and usually had it mostly loaded by the time I was ready to help.  I always need a break after bucking up a tree...

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0030.jpg)
My 16" saw didn't do this in one pass -- took two per cut!  My wife decided I needed a bigger 'logger' saw.  I agreed :D  Seems like a 20" saw is in my future now :D :D [cool]

Truthfully, I need one though!  Some of these trees are hard to fall with a 16" bar!

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: John Raabe on June 19, 2010, 08:28:55 PM
I like you inventive system for the pump there!

I'm sure there are updates and refinements to come but you're pumping water without too much cost or hassle.  :D :D :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 19, 2010, 10:12:32 PM
Quote from: John Raabe on June 19, 2010, 08:28:55 PM
I like you inventive system for the pump there!

I'm sure there are updates and refinements to come but you're pumping water without too much cost or hassle.  :D :D :D

Thanks John :)

I'm planning a pump house but am serious about the idea of making a lazy Susan to rotate the panels. 

Anyway, we did some math and discovered that it wouldn't take long to pay for these panels when figuring the cost of fuel for the generator that was used to charge the battery before :)  And this is MUCH quieter! :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on June 19, 2010, 10:41:46 PM
Good stuff!

Now what would be nice for the pump setup is a low voltage cutoff switch, so you don't have to monitor the battery as much.

Don't know if these would do the job for your pump....   ???

http://www.polyperformance.com/shop/sPOD-Low-Voltage-Cutoff-Battery-Protector-p-25220.html (http://www.polyperformance.com/shop/sPOD-Low-Voltage-Cutoff-Battery-Protector-p-25220.html)

http://www.smarthome.com/77416/Enforcer-Low-Voltage-Battery-Cut-Off/p.aspx (http://www.smarthome.com/77416/Enforcer-Low-Voltage-Battery-Cut-Off/p.aspx)

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Yonderosa on June 19, 2010, 10:56:56 PM
GREAT stuff.  My plan is to drill a well next month so your insights are of great interest to me.

Is that a coyote or one of the hybrid wolves that the WDFW have been chasing around that area.  I've got a friend up in the A valley area that has been dealing with them.  One of them will bait his dog and when he chases him the others ambush em.  They almost got him last month but he managed to scare them off with a few shots.  Those hybrids and the cats have been real hard on the calves this year too. 

BBQ's and bird feeders = Bears.  A neighbor of ours came back from a walk to find a bear making himself comfy on their porch.  Took a posse of neighbors to chase him off.  If'n he don't get spooked by folks soon he may end up on one of those barbecues he's been raiding.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on June 19, 2010, 11:09:01 PM
hummingbird feeders = bear "soda pop"    ;D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 20, 2010, 09:09:55 AM
Quote from: MountainDon on June 19, 2010, 10:41:46 PM
Good stuff!

Now what would be nice for the pump setup is a low voltage cutoff switch, so you don't have to monitor the battery as much.

Don't know if these would do the job for your pump....   ???

http://www.polyperformance.com/shop/sPOD-Low-Voltage-Cutoff-Battery-Protector-p-25220.html (http://www.polyperformance.com/shop/sPOD-Low-Voltage-Cutoff-Battery-Protector-p-25220.html)

http://www.smarthome.com/77416/Enforcer-Low-Voltage-Battery-Cut-Off/p.aspx (http://www.smarthome.com/77416/Enforcer-Low-Voltage-Battery-Cut-Off/p.aspx)



Thanks Don, that might be something I could look into.  I can't run the pump all the time however, or the cistern would over flow.  But something like this would mean I could forget about the battery and it would prevent it from draining too low all the time.  I might add one inline with the on/off switch.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 20, 2010, 09:16:55 AM
Quote from: Yonderosa on June 19, 2010, 10:56:56 PM
GREAT stuff.  My plan is to drill a well next month so your insights are of great interest to me.

Is that a coyote or one of the hybrid wolves that the WDFW have been chasing around that area.  I've got a friend up in the A valley area that has been dealing with them.  One of them will bait his dog and when he chases him the others ambush em.  They almost got him last month but he managed to scare them off with a few shots.  Those hybrids and the cats have been real hard on the calves this year too. 

BBQ's and bird feeders = Bears.  A neighbor of ours came back from a walk to find a bear making himself comfy on their porch.  Took a posse of neighbors to chase him off.  If'n he don't get spooked by folks soon he may end up on one of those barbecues he's been raiding.

When I first saw the picture of the wolf I though "is that a big coyote" but then I did some research (since it's been a while since I've seen one -- though remind me later and I'll tell the story of the 3 wolves that visited us in Ocean Falls).  Once I did some comparison pictures of coyote and wolf I realized this one was a wolf but something about it made me wonder still....hence the picture name is 'WolforCoyote'.

I'd be interested in information about the hybrids?  I've seen (we had once) wolf/dog crosses but usually they don't look so pure.  In any case, wolves eat dogs and cats if the deer population is low and ini general wolves and cats (and bears) pretty much decimate the local bird and deer pop :(

As for bears (knock on wood) we've been fortunate so far but I think they don't like all the noise (ATV's and shooting).  I could be wrong however.  I've heard, in fact, that one ate a porta-pot recently and that worries me since the composter is pretty spendy!  I'd hate to come back and find it munched so if it survives the next few weeks I'm building a 'bear stopper' for it.

You see, bears can go through steel so you can't really build a bear proof anything except you CAN accidentally leave a very nailed up piece of plywood in front of what you don't want them to get...they step on it, go OUCH, and leave.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 20, 2010, 10:13:08 AM
Quote from: Yonderosa on June 19, 2010, 10:56:56 PM
GREAT stuff.  My plan is to drill a well next month so your insights are of great interest to me.



Our well was done several years ago by a previous owner but I contacted the well driller and discussed the well.  He actually remembered it.

Anyway, it's 205' deep and provided 2.5gpm of flow which I was told was about average for a residential well in the area though he told me it was shallow compared to some out there!  Apparently it is not uncommon to get 1.5 to 4 gpm in the area so I'd be curious to find out what you get.

When ours was done the owner put in a cistern which his son-in-law (the owner passed away after selling to the owner before us) tells me was a 'plastic' 1000 gallon cistern that's about 50-70 feet above the well head.  The well has a 12vdc pump in it (perhaps it's really 24vdc but I haven't checked yet) and seems to pump something like 1/2gpm to 1 1/2gpm into the cistern though I have no real idea.  I base this only on our recent experience in that we drained the cistern pretty dry then pumped for an hour or so and easily had the 26 gallons for the trailer and 5 for the bathroom plus more.  Over the course of the week I'd pump for a couple hours and each time the pressure at the spicket increased a little.  We used a LOT of water (my wife decided NOT to conserve to test the wells ability to keep up) and we always had enough water in the cistern.

I plan to run some real tests once I uncover the manhole to get into the tank which I'm told does exist -- it's just burried at the moment.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Yonderosa on June 20, 2010, 10:33:49 AM
I copied that picture and sent it to my friend just down the hill from you to get his feedback.  He's become quite the canine expert since he moved out there full time a four years ago.

"Officially" we only have two packs in this state...   ???
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 20, 2010, 08:56:37 PM
Quote from: Yonderosa on June 20, 2010, 10:33:49 AM
I copied that picture and sent it to my friend just down the hill from you to get his feedback.  He's become quite the canine expert since he moved out there full time a four years ago.

"Officially" we only have two packs in this state...   ???

Cool -- I'd be interested in the feedback.  I have coyote pics too but they don't look like that.  They are smaller with different markings and shape.

On a different subject my wife and I bought a Husqvarna 455 Rancher today! :D  [cool]  The Craftsman 16" saw might be good for smaller trees and limb work but I needed something a little better for falling larger trees and bucking up trees for firewood.  We looked at the Poulan Pro but decided it 'felt' too cheap and went with the Husky.

My bro in Canada then told me his Husky is 25 years old and though he recently tuned it up it's run like a champ for 25 years!  :o  I'm thinking it was $400 well spent dollars.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: dug on June 20, 2010, 09:08:23 PM
Speaking for myself at least, it really doesn't get a whole lot better than a brand spankin new saw. And a Husky to boot!  [cool]

Went through half a dozen tanks on my 026 yesterday and am contentedly fried. Great fun!

Happy cutting!  ;D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Yonderosa on June 20, 2010, 10:30:37 PM
My friend couldn't be sure by that picture but he felt it certainly could be a wolf.  He says the hybrids only differ in the ears and tail as well as being more bold near humans.

I suspect Wolf pressure is what is driving more Elk (according to the long time residents I've spoken with) into the Okanogan valley.  A rancher said that his open range cattle are getting a lot more wild (dangerous) in the last two years.  My brother-in-law's best friend is a game officer and when I asked him about it he just shook his head and said there have been some "incidents" in the area but wouldn't (couldn't?) elaborate.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 20, 2010, 11:16:06 PM
I went back and looked for the pics of the Coyotes that the cam got and cropped the two together.  They are the same resolution from the same camera and almost in the same spot -- distance to camera isn't the same but it isn't too far apart either.

The result?

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/WolfandCoyote.jpg)

The Coyote has a bushy tail and slightly different posture (typical yote) and the wolf, well it's just taller and not slinking with a thinner tail and more regal posture.

many have a hard time telling them apart but I think this shows a difference that suggests the one on the left is in fact a wolf.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 20, 2010, 11:20:08 PM
Though the look a LOT like the same animal I don't think they are -- what do you all think?

The coyote has a pointy snout that the one on the left doesn't seem to have but the color (black and white makes it hard) and haunches look pretty much the same.

However, the posture and size don't match and the tail appears completely different though hard to see.  Also, the wolf (left) has a longer neck -- that is normal from other wolves I've seen -- or appears to.

HOWEVER this could be the same animal and the posture is just chance -- so I'm still not 100% sure...it could be that they are the same coyote and that the left picture is just an illusion because of posture.

Dilema!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Yonderosa on June 21, 2010, 07:14:39 AM
I'm starting to think its just a well fed Coyote.

Some good Wolf info here: http://washingtonwolf.info/ (http://washingtonwolf.info/)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 21, 2010, 09:58:19 AM
Quote from: Yonderosa on June 21, 2010, 07:14:39 AM
I'm starting to think its just a well fed Coyote.

Some good Wolf info here: http://washingtonwolf.info/ (http://washingtonwolf.info/)

Looking at that site I'd say it could still be a wolf.  Lots of pics that looks very similar and there is at least one in Okanogan county on there.

Either way, I've heard there is a lone wolf running around from one of the neighbors and I've set up my cam on a very distinct game trail to see what might show up :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Woodswalker on June 21, 2010, 10:36:07 AM
I hunted deer in the Boundary Waters Canoe Area of MN for over 30 yrs, and observed wolves there many times.  Have also observed coyotes many times out here, including an adult male that I shot last summer at the cabin.  Adult wolves are about twice the size of adult coyotes, and colors/markings vary greatly.  In my opinion, you've got a couple of coyote pics.

I find attitudes out here about wolves vary puzzling.  MN has been managing a viable wolf population of 1500-2,000 for several decades, without significant impacts on the deer population.  When my father hunted the same area of the BWCA in the 50's & 60's, there were few wolves left, and few deer in that area.  After federal protection, the wolf population came back, as did the deer.  Best hunt I experienced there in 30+ years was in '92, when we got 7 deer, 6 of them bucks.  Largest one is on my wall.  I welcome wolves back to WA.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 21, 2010, 11:43:23 AM
Quote from: Woodswalker on June 21, 2010, 10:36:07 AM
I hunted deer in the Boundary Waters Canoe Area of MN for over 30 yrs, and observed wolves there many times.  Have also observed coyotes many times out here, including an adult male that I shot last summer at the cabin.  Adult wolves are about twice the size of adult coyotes, and colors/markings vary greatly.  In my opinion, you've got a couple of coyote pics.

I find attitudes out here about wolves vary puzzling.  MN has been managing a viable wolf population of 1500-2,000 for several decades, without significant impacts on the deer population.  When my father hunted the same area of the BWCA in the 50's & 60's, there were few wolves left, and few deer in that area.  After federal protection, the wolf population came back, as did the deer.  Best hunt I experienced there in 30+ years was in '92, when we got 7 deer, 6 of them bucks.  Largest one is on my wall.  I welcome wolves back to WA.

I suspect you are correct though the picture doesn't show size since the camera isn't shooting the same direction.  I'm leaning coyote myself actually.

As for attitude toward wolves in WA I think it has more to do with policy then the animal.  WA Wolf re-intro policies go far far beyond other states and while that might be ok, one never knows.  My experience with Government tells me that they will mess it up -- they always do -- so it's more then likely going to be a miserable failure one way or another.

As for wolves, I grew up with them around me and I don't have animosity towards them anymore then bear or cougar -- actually, bears piss me off but that's another story -- however I find it hard to beleive that increasing wolf populations will increase deer population.  That's nonsense.

In fact, records indicate that when wolves roamed the NW before Lewis and Clark came along, game was scarce compared to today.  This is not so hard to understand:

1.  Wolves eat deer and elk
2.  Coyotes eat deer (a male coyote will eat two fawns a year)
3.  Cougars eat deer and elk

The more carnivores you introduce to an area the less herbivores you end up with -- that DOES NOT mean you won't have a LOT of deer around though.  You see, the problem is that there are too many factors involved to assume that wolves alone will increase or decrease the overall population of deer.  Some factors involved:

1.  Winter -- cold winters = lower survival rate of deer
2.  Summer -- summer weather and growing seasons will impact herd sizes
3.  Drought -- less rainfall = less deer, becuase it means less forest fauna growth
4.  Wildfire -- this can impact deer populations
5.  Construction -- sometimes deer do very well in the suburbs -- in fact, it can increase the herds because of the LACK of predatory animals around (bow hunting has become popular in the suburbs back east because of this).
6.  Hunting pressure -- poor management of hunting areas can reduce herd sizes significantly.  Recently in WA a report came out about Elk population in the Blues.  The Tucannon herd was about 2000 animals until they changes the policy to only allow spike bulls to be taken.  They intended to increase herd size and now they have about 500 animals.

There is so much more involved.

I lived on Vancouver Island where they pretty much stopped hunting wolves and by the early 80's wolf populations were growing at a rate never seen before.  Something like 750 known packs by 1982.  Deer populations were fine and remained so.  Why?  Becuase the deer population would support larger numbers of wolves easily.  This is the key.

In Ocean Falls during a specially cold winter 3 timber wolves at 19 cats and 17 dogs around town (a town of under 1000 people) until they were killed -- because the town feared they would start eating kids when the dog and cat pop dwindled far enough.

Ranchers learn the hard way that wolves eat cows.

Personally, I don't like Coyotes at all but love wolves and my favorite book as a kid was Joseph Warton Lippencots "Wilderness Champion" -- King was the man!  Er Wolf!  And Reddy!  What a dog :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Yonderosa on June 21, 2010, 11:58:34 AM
Quote from: Woodswalker on June 21, 2010, 10:36:07 AMI welcome wolves back to WA.

I do to so long as "management" is on the table.  Sadly those making the rules aren't the ones affected.  This year Seattle had both Bears and a cougar to deal with.  Of course when they show up in their neighborhoods eating their pets it's OK to do something about it.  Don't much care for the double standard myself.

I can certainly understand the Ranchers concerns too.  Wolf pressure on free range stock gets makes them wilder which is a concern to me as my property is in open range territory and I have six acres of meadow that attract them.  Never had much of a problem with em and they do a good job mowing and fertilizing...  I'd rather deal with 300 pound Bears than a herd of spooky cattle though - makes riding my mountain bike dangerous.  Last year had a bull try to gore my dog just off the steps of my place.  She's older now and wasn't able to evade the attack.  She took a tumble before my wife was able to drive it off.  Didn't give it much thought at the time figuring it was just bad timing and a ornery SOB.  Not so sure anymore.

I personally like having critters on my place.  They are usually among the highlights of our stays there.  In my forest management plan habitat is the priority.  I'm hoping the Wolves push some Elk down my way, especially in September  :)

The re-introduction of the Wolf will no doubt improve the health of ungulates in our area but it is a fact that there are other deleterious issues with their return need to be addressed as well.  So long as it isn't only the Disney channel perspective ruling the land, I say "welcome back."    
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 21, 2010, 01:03:59 PM
Well said Yonder

OK, it's time to get back on topic!

Does anyone have a good source for shiplap or T&G pine paneling for the interior?  I'm looking around and trying to find the best prices.

Also, um, I'm dying!  I've been home two days and um.....I need to get back to work at the cabin!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 22, 2010, 11:41:08 AM
OK I'm getting ready to do some ordering and need opinions -- I've decided to post here in my cabin thread rather then the Off Grid Systems thread to keep it on track.

This system I found AFTER using Don's spreadsheet to design my own was almost EXACTLY what I was designing -- DISCLAIMER***  I am NOT buying this system *** -- and I wanted to post for comparison and to show where I got certain ideas in mine.

http://sunelec.com/index.php?main_page=615_watt_off_grid_system      
615 Watt Systems    $5.14 Per Watt
QTY.       DESCRIPTION    UNIT PRICE       AMOUNT    
3       Sun A-205-fa3 205W Solar Module    $ 356.70       $ 1,070.10    
1       Xantrex C40 Charge Controller    $ 145.00       $ 145.00    
1       PV3 Combiner Box    $ 79.00       $ 79.00    
1       20Amp PV Breaker    $ 15.00       $ 15.00    
1       MC4 30' Solar Module Cable    $ 37.00       $ 37.00    
1       Delta LA302DC Lightning Arrestor    $ 40.00       $ 40.00    
1       MNDC250, 250Amp DC Disconnect    $ 155.00       $ 155.00    
2       60Amp Din Mounted DC Circuit Breaker    $ 25.00       $ 50.00    
1       Xantrex TR1524 1.5KW 24Vdc Inverter/Charger    $ 698.00       $ 698.00    
8       US Power U225 6V 225Ah Deep Cycle Battery    $ 95.00       $ 760.00    
8       BC1 2/0 Battery Cable    $ 8.00       $ 64.00    
2       BC5 2/0 Inverter Cable    $ 25.00       $ 50.00    
                  
         Shipping:          
         Total       $ 3,163.10    

OK so here's my system:

No.   Item   Cost   Qty   Total
1   Costco GCB                                   $88            6   $528
2   SUN SV-X-200                           $364.00    3   $1,092
3   SUN-1012 Sinewave Inverter           $291.67    1   $292
4   Xantrex C40 Charge Controller   $111.18    1   $111
5   MC-4 50 foot cable                   $43.86    1   $44
6   PV Combiner Box                           $79.00    1   $79
7   Delta LA302DC Lightning Arrestor   $40.00    1   $40
8   60Amp Din Mounted DC Circuit Breaker   $25.00    2   $50
9   BC1 2/0 Battery Cable                   $8.00    10   $80
10   BC5 2/0 Inverter Cable                   $42.54    2   $85
11   20Amp PV Breaker                   $10.40    1   $10
12   Midnite Solar MNDC250             $188.00    1   $188
                                              Total --    $2,599

Some questions:

1.  Can anyone provide me with a better idea on a PV Combiner Box?
2.  Do I really need a 250amp Disconnect?  I thought Don mentioned 50amps before.
http://sunelec.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=34&products_id=349
3.  I plan to make my own battery cables to save a few bucks - I'll check local elec suppliers for 2/0
4.  Not sure I'd need a 20amp PV breaker??  I'll have to check the panels again.

All parts and prices are from the same source (for convenience) and I'm interested in better sources and prices from anyone who has them.

Thanks!
Erik

Charge Controller
http://sunelec.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=22&products_id=33
Disconnect
http://sunelec.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=34&products_id=349
Inverter
http://sunelec.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=6_40&products_id=788
Solar Panels
http://sunelec.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=5&products_id=810
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 24, 2010, 10:19:21 AM
It's quiet in here these days!  I know you're all out at your cabins and I'm stuck at home waiting to get back to mine...it's a killer!  But I'll do some work around the house to stay sane.  Besides, I've got to wait for a boat load of gear to come in!!!  We ordered a Granberg Small Log Alaskan Mill and I bought a Husqvarna 455 Rancher saw (mentioned elsewhere here) as well as all kinds of milling and sawing tools and essentials.  Then I bought all that solar power stuff including the charger and inverter mentioned in another thread as well as a tennon cutter setup to make furniture and railings.

So ya, I'm bored because I'm not at the cabin working and I'm now unemployed and work appears to be rather ahem, hard to find these days, but I figure if I can get the garden in shape and put some vents in the shed I'll at least feel somewhat productive at home.

Maybe I'll make some soap and some cheese to occupy myself.....

Oh and I have a plan to prevent boredom when not at the cabin now! :D  I'm going to bring rounds, slabs and branches back home next time as well as the tennon cutter setup and then I can make furniture when I'm at home and not at the cabin :)

That's the plan anyway.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: fishing_guy on June 24, 2010, 12:21:23 PM
Let me know how that chainsaw/mill combination works fo you.  I have that saw already, and have some pine and birch I'ld like to use for more than firewood.

Thanks
John
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on June 25, 2010, 03:01:09 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on June 24, 2010, 10:19:21 AM
It's quiet in here these days!  I know you're all out at your cabins and I'm stuck at home waiting to get back to mine...it's a killer!  But I'll do some work around the house to stay sane.  Besides, I've got to wait for a boat load of gear to come in!!!  We ordered a Granberg Small Log Alaskan Mill and I bought a Husqvarna 455 Rancher saw (mentioned elsewhere here) as well as all kinds of milling and sawing tools and essentials.  Then I bought all that solar power stuff including the charger and inverter mentioned in another thread as well as a tennon cutter setup to make furniture and railings.


Wish I had connected with you - you could have borrowed my Granberg Small mill for a bit to see how you like it.  It's brand new, and I haven't even attached my saw to it yet.  I was planning to last time I was up there, but got a bit lazy in that department.

The plan currently is to head up there on Monday (the 28th) and stay through Friday morning/noon-ish.  I am bringing some scaffolding to put up the rafters and then we'll see about the roof sheathing and anything else I can get finished.

Glad to hear you are progressing along well.  If you don't mind, can I ask how much you paid for the roofing (the steel) ?  I'm in the debate mode right now and want to try to come up with a better answer before the end of the weekend.

Also, I was wondering what well driller put in your well? I've had one bid so far for a well on my place, but I really think it's outrageous.  I think he included the "wet side" surcharge... d* (if you know what I mean)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 25, 2010, 03:06:14 PM
Quote from: JavaMan on June 25, 2010, 03:01:09 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on June 24, 2010, 10:19:21 AM
It's quiet in here these days!  I know you're all out at your cabins and I'm stuck at home waiting to get back to mine...it's a killer!  But I'll do some work around the house to stay sane.  Besides, I've got to wait for a boat load of gear to come in!!!  We ordered a Granberg Small Log Alaskan Mill and I bought a Husqvarna 455 Rancher saw (mentioned elsewhere here) as well as all kinds of milling and sawing tools and essentials.  Then I bought all that solar power stuff including the charger and inverter mentioned in another thread as well as a tennon cutter setup to make furniture and railings.


Wish I had connected with you - you could have borrowed my Granberg Small mill for a bit to see how you like it.  It's brand new, and I haven't even attached my saw to it yet.  I was planning to last time I was up there, but got a bit lazy in that department.

The plan currently is to head up there on Monday (the 28th) and stay through Friday morning/noon-ish.  I am bringing some scaffolding to put up the rafters and then we'll see about the roof sheathing and anything else I can get finished.

Glad to hear you are progressing along well.  If you don't mind, can I ask how much you paid for the roofing (the steel) ?  I'm in the debate mode right now and want to try to come up with a better answer before the end of the weekend.

Also, I was wondering what well driller put in your well? I've had one bid so far for a well on my place, but I really think it's outrageous.  I think he included the "wet side" surcharge... d* (if you know what I mean)

Got our roofing from Do It Right Builders wharehouse in Tonasket.  Their prices were better then the big box stores every time.  I got my windows there too -- gain, cheaper then the big boys.

The well was drilled about 7 years ago so I don't know what it cost but I can check the driller for you.

As for the granberg -- now that's funny!  Mine arrives today!  Together, perhaps, we'll be milling lumber like crazy!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 25, 2010, 04:17:40 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/InverterandCharger.jpg)
FedEx dropped this off today :)  FAST shipping.  Came with wires prepped for install (thanks Inverter Store) free of charge.

What a MONSTER!  I'm absolutely floored at the size and weight of this thing...sheesh.  OK I knew a solar power system needed an inverter that might last longer then your typical car unit but wasn't expecting this monster.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on June 25, 2010, 07:21:33 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on June 25, 2010, 04:17:40 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/InverterandCharger.jpg)
FedEx dropped this off today :)  FAST shipping.  Came with wires prepped for install (thanks Inverter Store) free of charge.

What a MONSTER!  I'm absolutely floored at the size and weight of this thing...sheesh.  OK I knew a solar power system needed an inverter that might last longer then your typical car unit but wasn't expecting this monster.

Tell me that those wires showing on the top of the box aren't the ones that go into the 2500W inverter!  There is no way they will carry slightly over 208 amps DC (under full load - and that's just for the output, not to mention the couple amps for the internal electronics).  How many amps does the manual say that thing draws under full load? ... of course it might simply be rated at 70.7% of DC current at full load, which would only be about 145 amps :o  I'd guess that the wire would be something close to the size of a regular battery cable.  Very cool that they sent them with the ends prepped  [cool]

Yeah, I know it won't be run under full load - at least not often and not for more than a couple seconds, but you'll need to have hefty wire, and short runs from battery to inverter to minimize the voltage drop.

Is that a "modified sine wave" inverter?

Very cool, tho.  That should just about power anything you'd want it to (except the beer cooler). :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on June 25, 2010, 08:06:28 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on June 25, 2010, 04:17:40 PM

What a MONSTER!  I'm absolutely floored at the size and weight of this thing...sheesh.  


If that impresses you how about the Outback VFX3524M (mine). 62 lbs.



javaman, no offense to you, but that's square wave, maybe a modified square wave. Sine waves are curves, no corners. "Modified" is adman talk. At best they should be named as being a stepped wave.

But for a lot of purposes they work well enough especially when price is factored in.

(https://i139.photobucket.com/albums/q305/djmbucket/oddsnends01/square_modified_sinewave.jpg)

I liken the difference to stomping on the gas and then stomping on the brakes instead a smoother application of gas and brakes like a good road racer. Or letting the door slam shut instead of having a hydraulic closer smooth it out. Motors prefer being treated smoothly instead of being slammed.



Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 25, 2010, 10:08:19 PM
Quote from: JavaMan on June 25, 2010, 07:21:33 PM

Tell me that those wires showing on the top of the box aren't the ones that go into the 2500W inverter!  There is no way they will carry slightly over 208 amps DC (under full load - and that's just for the output, not to mention the couple amps for the internal electronics).  How many amps does the manual say that thing draws under full load? ... of course it might simply be rated at 70.7% of DC current at full load, which would only be about 145 amps :o  I'd guess that the wire would be something close to the size of a regular battery cable.  Very cool that they sent them with the ends prepped  [cool]

Yeah, I know it won't be run under full load - at least not often and not for more than a couple seconds, but you'll need to have hefty wire, and short runs from battery to inverter to minimize the voltage drop.

Is that a "modified sine wave" inverter?

Very cool, tho.  That should just about power anything you'd want it to (except the beer cooler). :)

The recommended battery cables are 1/0 which those don't appear to be -- but I haven't looked close enough to them to be sure.

And yes, it's a modified sine wave inverter.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 25, 2010, 10:12:09 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on June 25, 2010, 08:06:28 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on June 25, 2010, 04:17:40 PM

What a MONSTER!  I'm absolutely floored at the size and weight of this thing...sheesh.  


If that impresses you how about the Outback VFX3524M (mine). 62 lbs.



javaman, no offense to you, but that's square wave, maybe a modified square wave. Sine waves are curves, no corners. "Modified" is adman talk. At best they should be named as being a stepped wave.

But for a lot of purposes they work well enough especially when price is factored in.

(https://i139.photobucket.com/albums/q305/djmbucket/oddsnends01/square_modified_sinewave.jpg)

I liken the difference to stomping on the gas and then stomping on the brakes instead a smoother application of gas and brakes like a good road racer. Or letting the door slam shut instead of having a hydraulic closer smooth it out. Motors prefer being treated smoothly instead of being slammed.





*chuckle* Of course that is correct but for laymens terms and how they sell the products they are listed as Modified Sine Wave.

QuoteSpecifications

    * Continuous output power: 2500 Watts. Use our 200 amp inline fuse.
    * Surge power capability (peak power): 5000 Watts
    * dc input / operating voltage: 10 to 15 Volts
    * Output voltage: 120 Volts ac +/- 10%
    * Output wave form: modified sine wave with phase correction
    * Output frequency: 60 Hz +/- 1 Hz
    * Battery low voltage alarm: 10.5 +/- 0.5 Volts
    * Battery low voltage shutdown: 10.0 +/- 0.5 Volts
    * AC amps: 21
    * DC amps: 208
    * No load current: .45 Amps
    * Full load efficiency: 90%
    * 1/3 load efficiency: 95%
    * No load minimum operating temperature: -15 degrees Celsius
    * Full load maximum operating temperature: 55 +/- 5 degrees Celsius (automatic shutdown)
    * AC Output Socket Type: dual Type 2 -3 prong
    * High input voltage protection: 15V-17V
    * Low input voltage shutdown: 10V
    * Internal fuse protection · Product size (L x W x H): 15"X 10.25"X 3"
    * Weight: 14
    * UL maximum recommended per outlet 1500W

On a side note, Modified Sine inverters can't run everything a Pure Sine inverter will but from my neighbors experience they will pretty much run everything you might need except maybe that lithium battery charger or high end microwave....oh sure, there are other devices but at $229 I decided to go this route and have the full 2500 watts of power.  If in the future I can afford a pure sine inverter I'll get one but for now I think this will work.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on June 26, 2010, 09:13:59 AM
Quote from: MountainDon on June 25, 2010, 08:06:28 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on June 25, 2010, 04:17:40 PM

What a MONSTER!  I'm absolutely floored at the size and weight of this thing...sheesh.  


If that impresses you how about the Outback VFX3524M (mine). 62 lbs.



javaman, no offense to you, but that's square wave, maybe a modified square wave. Sine waves are curves, no corners. "Modified" is adman talk. At best they should be named as being a stepped wave.

But for a lot of purposes they work well enough especially when price is factored in.

(https://i139.photobucket.com/albums/q305/djmbucket/oddsnends01/square_modified_sinewave.jpg)

I liken the difference to stomping on the gas and then stomping on the brakes instead a smoother application of gas and brakes like a good road racer. Or letting the door slam shut instead of having a hydraulic closer smooth it out. Motors prefer being treated smoothly instead of being slammed.

Don, no offense taken.  It's been close to 20 years since I was involved in inverter design.  Modified square wave was indeed what I actually meant  d*  My team had come up with a unique method of generating an actual sine wave inverter, but had troubles with the output FETs blowing.  We were trying to power a small refrigerator (like the size of a hotel 'fridge or dorm room fridge).  Ah, the good ol' days  :)

One of the advantages from a design perspective is that you really have no zero-crossing worries with the modified sine wave.  Plus the output devices are running at somewhere around 50% duty cycle, which helps keep them cool.

But as you point out, Don, they can be very rough on some appliances - especially those with motors in them.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 26, 2010, 06:32:08 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/IMG_0091.jpg)
Got the mill assembled today :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/IMG_0089.jpg)
And mounted it to the saw.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/IMG_0090.jpg)
Another shot.

I also bought two ripping chains and other goodies I think I mentioned earlier.

I look forward to trying to make lumber.

Some of the things I want to make:

1.  Blue Stained 1x6 or 1x8 siding for the shed -- plan to use old logs for this as I think they will be blue stained already and very dry (they seemed pretty dry anyway).

2.  1x6 interior knotty pine paneling.

3.  2x4 and 2x6 lumber for sheds, pump house, battery box etc etc

4.  4x4, 6x6 and/or 6x8 pine beams for deck

I'll have to look span tables up but I'm hoping a 6x8 beam made of pine will work for the deck.  I've got some LONG Ponderosa's out there and I read somewhere they are used becuase of their clear and straight trunks when they are tall.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on June 27, 2010, 09:56:34 AM
The angle on that second picture makes it look like you switched bars on that saw  :D  That looks about the same size as my Stihl - actually the wife's Stihl... long story on that one - I'll tell it to you sometime over coffee...

I still want to take my torque wrench to the mill and make certain that all the nuts and bolts are tightened to spec, but I think it's pretty good.

I hadn't thought of making siding out of the fallen trees around here ... I was wondering what I was going to side the place with!  Thanks for that idea!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 27, 2010, 11:15:03 AM
Quote from: JavaMan on June 27, 2010, 09:56:34 AM
The angle on that second picture makes it look like you switched bars on that saw  :D  That looks about the same size as my Stihl - actually the wife's Stihl... long story on that one - I'll tell it to you sometime over coffee...

I still want to take my torque wrench to the mill and make certain that all the nuts and bolts are tightened to spec, but I think it's pretty good.

I hadn't thought of making siding out of the fallen trees around here ... I was wondering what I was going to side the place with!  Thanks for that idea!

Nah optical illusion.  20" bar in all pics

I'm going to make siding and more if the setup works ok and if it does I might buy a bigger saw and a bigger mill ;) or a bandsaw mill if tax return is good ;)

I want to make ALL the lumber I need!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on June 27, 2010, 12:57:13 PM
Yeah, I bought mine because I needed something fairly "soon" and didn't want to wait until I saved enough for a bandsaw mill, which I will purchase once I stop spending money on the cabin for a bit and can save up for one.

Just missed one on Craigslist for about $700 without the engine ... so I know they can be had at a reasonable price, if I simply wait for it.

I picked up a door yesterday, and am pretty much loaded up and ready for tomorrow morning.  Are you heading up to your place anytime soon?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 27, 2010, 02:14:30 PM
Quote from: JavaMan on June 27, 2010, 12:57:13 PM
Yeah, I bought mine because I needed something fairly "soon" and didn't want to wait until I saved enough for a bandsaw mill, which I will purchase once I stop spending money on the cabin for a bit and can save up for one.

Just missed one on Craigslist for about $700 without the engine ... so I know they can be had at a reasonable price, if I simply wait for it.

I picked up a door yesterday, and am pretty much loaded up and ready for tomorrow morning.  Are you heading up to your place anytime soon?

Going up the 2nd I think.  Plan to stay to the 6th and then return the 14th or 15th for a week long stay.

Then it's hard to say.  Being home is killing me because I can work on the cabin, can't mill lumber and can't make furniture so the next trip I'm cutting 3" rounds for end tables, some slabs for coffee table (s) and some legs.  I'll bring it all home and finish them here with the tenon cutter and Forstner bits.  My hope is to make burl like end and coffee tables out of pine slabs and rounds and then see where that takes me....
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 06, 2010, 12:35:20 AM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0030-1.jpg)
Last trip we left these trees and planned to buck them into firewood on our next visit however....

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0001-2.jpg)
We bucked them into 8' and 6' (1) logs for milling instead.

I figured it was best to practice on old crappy dry logs before tackling something more worthwhile -- didn't want to mess up potential interior paneling!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0006-2.jpg)
We set up the new sawmill (Granbergs Small Log Alaskan Mill) and began making a cant.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0012.jpg)
Cutting the 2nd pass -- bottom of cant.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0016.jpg)
One more pass and we can mill lumber.

The boys did the heavy lifting and I did the milling.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0019.jpg)
First cant ready to mill into lumber.  I cut too much off of it but learned by my mistake.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0021.jpg)
1st board -- a 1x6.

Later I cut some 1x8 (same size log better planning) and we used the wood to side the shed.  I'll post more tomorrow but it's time for sleep!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 06, 2010, 01:28:53 AM
While waiting for my sinuses to clear I decided to toss these up too:)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0046-1.jpg)
We cut 10 boards before needing to sharpen the chains but I didn't have the right size file so had to stop :(

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0054-2.jpg)
So we used the lumber to side the old shed.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0056-2.jpg)
I think the boys enjoy this kind of work far more then the rest...specially with the gun.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0083-1.jpg)
I can't wait to mill this tree!  I cut 4 logs out of it ranging from 20 inches across to about 15.  I'll try to pull the rest of it out of the fence and off the pond (it's not in the pond but resting over it) and get a few more logs out of it.  I think the stained pine looks awesome and will make great interior panel plus perhaps floor.

I also plan to cut the trees that in the way of the solar panels and turn them into lumber.  Ones a big fir and I am thinking it will make great beams for the deck.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Don_P on July 06, 2010, 06:33:23 AM
Take a look at the shot of the log end. There is a small bullseye of heartwood. The other name for bluestain is sapstain, it does not infect heartwood. That shot also shows how it likes to travel in on the rays.

I have had one client that seemed to have trouble with allergies and bluestain.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 06, 2010, 10:38:12 AM
Would suck to have an allergy to bluestain but I'm wondering if once it's sealed with stain and verathane if it's still a problem?  Of course it is a mold right?  So that makes sense.

I have only just started to get allergies myself and seem to be allergic to the desert I live in so I'm hopeful the bluestain doesn't bother me -- hasn't so far.

Have a LOT to do to get milling right but so far I can at least make rough cut boards :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Don_P on July 06, 2010, 11:30:31 AM
it's the only time I've seen what we took to be a reaction and he had been sanding heavily stained wood. You mentioned your sinuses, just something to watch for ...without looking for. The mold in the news has a lot in common with the climate in the news. But yes it is a mold. We also go back a few million years together, side by side. Sealing it is probably better inside, I prefer a cleanable surface anyway.

I'm sawing through some black locust now. It has extractives within it that give many people trouble... and then there's a good bit of heartrot in these logs, yet another species of fungi. But most people in casual contact don't react.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 06, 2010, 10:54:10 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/th_MakingLumber.jpg) (https://s998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/?action=view&current=MakingLumber.mp4)
A two minute video chopped into 50 seconds (to reduce it's size a little) that shows me milling some 1x's.  Nothing fancy.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Yonderosa on July 15, 2010, 09:31:55 AM
That's some purtiful siding.  I'd be tempted to use it inside somewhere.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 21, 2010, 10:08:12 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0121-2.jpg)
Got a ton done this past week!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0115.jpg)
Chimney is in but needs finishing touches.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0095.jpg)
Siding is 90% done.  Just a few patches and the batting to do.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0122.jpg)
It was about 80 tops during the day and usually around 40 at night -- so awesome!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on July 22, 2010, 10:01:45 AM
Looking GOOD!  I bet you're happy to have it that far along!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 22, 2010, 10:03:17 AM
Quote from: JavaMan on July 22, 2010, 10:01:45 AM
Looking GOOD!  I bet you're happy to have it that far along!

THanks and yes :)  Congrats on the job too!  I'm out of work so more time to do cabin stuff but less funds of course...ahhhh life.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 22, 2010, 10:06:48 AM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0108.jpg)
One problem I have to sort out with the Chimney install is that the collar for the roof penetration seems to cause some issue with the flashing/gasket that goes over it and seals the roof.  I can't get it to lay properly because of the clamp.  I plan to go to the chimney shop today to ask about it.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0111.jpg)
Also, I'm pushing the limits a bit on the outside and intend to cut away a few inches of the outrigger rafter to ensure the 2" clearance around the pipe.  On the inside I'm ok with just over two inches but the outside I was at 1/2" at best....gotta fix that.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0109.jpg)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0110.jpg)

The idea was the keep the chimney away from the main roof so that leakage wouldn't be an issue.  I've done that but need to clean it up a bit.

This is a heavy chimney to install too!  The boys and I fought it for some time before getting it sorted and properly secured.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Shawn B on July 22, 2010, 12:55:42 PM
I can't tell from the picture what is keeping the flashing "up". But I have installed a few of those style flashing's and they don't lay down real good until you get a few screws in them. Be sure to space the screws correctly, and to keep them center on the soft metal flange. Also I try to seal them under the flange, then apply a bead of sealant on the flange edge, especially on the steep side. Lexan, Geosel, and Through the Roof have worked well for me. The Geosel is top shelf sealant if you can find it.

Are you short a piece of metal on the eve, or does the end rake take care of that ?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Solar Burrito on July 22, 2010, 01:47:31 PM
Great progress Lurker, you've been kicking arse on your cabin lately.

Question about your siding... since I hope to be at a similar step later this summer. Are you painting that plywood and going for a board/batten look?

So it looks like you installed the windows and flashed them with tar paper then put on  your siding. Did that work well? What size trim will you use to cover the gaps between the window and the siding?

I'm trying to figure out what order I will do, we have osb sheathing then building wrap then T1-11. I may do it your way as long as it's waterproof since we get way more rain.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Shawn B on July 22, 2010, 03:12:11 PM
OlJarhead,  Cabin and land looks like a good match.....and progressing nicely. Did you buy the plans from John? I hope to start a small cabin soon...maybe a 16' x 28'.


Thanks,
Shawn
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 22, 2010, 04:29:39 PM
Quote from: Solar Burrito on July 22, 2010, 01:47:31 PM
Great progress Lurker, you've been kicking arse on your cabin lately.

Question about your siding... since I hope to be at a similar step later this summer. Are you painting that plywood and going for a board/batten look?

So it looks like you installed the windows and flashed them with tar paper then put on  your siding. Did that work well? What size trim will you use to cover the gaps between the window and the siding?

I'm trying to figure out what order I will do, we have osb sheathing then building wrap then T1-11. I may do it your way as long as it's waterproof since we get way more rain.

We will be staining the roughsawn T1-11 (plywood) with Chestnut stain after we put in batten's to cover all seems and nail lines (every 16" we will put in a roughsawn pine batten that I'll make from old trees on the land).

Thanks to others here on CP I put the windows in after the sheeting and used tar paper to cover everything and do the windows.  I looked up a LOT of window install stuff and tried to do mine close to a median on what I read.  No tin flashing above the windows but there is a 1 foot eve and low rainfall so I'm hopeful it will be ok.  Here in the desert (eastern Washington) that's also common.

For the west coast I see no reason why this wouldn't work except that I'd flash all windows and doors because of the rainfall in the area (that's just me mind you and I'm no expert).

So in your case I'd say sheeting (OSB), 15lbs felt on the walls and 30lbs felt on the roof, windows done as per the link I'll post which I got from Don I think.... as soon as I can find it...and then siding.

I chose the roughsawn T1-11 because of cost ($27.95 a sheet) and looks -- the board and batten look is so 1900's :)  It was the cheapest way to go but a word of caution:  in wet climates it may not be the best idea.  In a wet area I'd look to see what Cedar siding would run or perhaps one of those new lap products that HD sells??  Might be worth a look anyway.  Otherwise, if cost is a big issue then T1-11 will work fine if treated well.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 22, 2010, 04:33:40 PM
Quote from: Shawn B on July 22, 2010, 03:12:11 PM
OlJarhead,  Cabin and land looks like a good match.....and progressing nicely. Did you buy the plans from John? I hope to start a small cabin soon...maybe a 16' x 28'.


Thanks,
Shawn

Yup :)  I bought the 'Whole Enchilada" plans and am very happy!  I've modified the build a bit and John (as well as many others here in the forums) has been a great help!  The 16x28 I'm confident would be an easy thing to do from these plans.

Things to consider:

1.  Go with the heavier floor!  I went with 2x6 floor joists and while that's ok for a cabin I kinda wish I'd taken the advice I was given and went with 2x8's.  For a 16x28 I might even go 2x10 -- but in WA if you want to build to code then you might have to go with 2x12 -- something to look into.

2.  Check span tables on your chosen floor joists, block them during the framing phase and try to reduce the cantilever (if going with code you'll probably have to go with no more then the depth of the joist so consider that when deciding on a foundation).

3.  Take your time, and know this:  How do you eat and Elephant?  One bite at a time!

Cheers
Erik
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 22, 2010, 04:47:27 PM
Quote from: Shawn B on July 22, 2010, 12:55:42 PM
I can't tell from the picture what is keeping the flashing "up". But I have installed a few of those style flashing's and they don't lay down real good until you get a few screws in them. Be sure to space the screws correctly, and to keep them center on the soft metal flange. Also I try to seal them under the flange, then apply a bead of sealant on the flange edge, especially on the steep side. Lexan, Geosel, and Through the Roof have worked well for me. The Geosel is top shelf sealant if you can find it.

Are you short a piece of metal on the eve, or does the end rake take care of that ?

In reverse order:  the Gable Flashing isn't installed yet.  I plan to install it last.

OK, the flashing is hiding the 'collar' type support which screws to the roof and holds the Chimney in place.  I think it also acts like a heat barrier of sorts but um uncertain about that.  I'll find a link to show one (http://www.fireplace-chimneystore.com/t//duratech_roof_support.jpg) -- but basically it has a large clamp with an angled bracket that bolts to the clamp and can be adjusted to the pitch.  The bracket is screwed to the rafters/roof and provides a two inch hold off for the clamp (to keep the chimney 2 inches away from combustible surfaces).  The clamp is the kind which goes around the chimney and then turns up at each end so you can tighten a bolt through it to 'clamp' the pipe.  That piece of the clamp is about 1" deep and 6" tall making for an almost knife like edge that the rubber flashing has to go over.

I'm guessing that if I secure the top of the flashing and then pull the bottom down tightly that I might be able to get it to fit the way it's intended but I'm uncertain....I think it may not cover as much as I cut out of the roofing :(  I'm planning a visit to the stove guys to ask about it soon.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Shawn B on July 22, 2010, 05:54:13 PM
Could the collar bracket be installed underneath inside the eve?   ???  I'm not familiar with that style bracket. 

When you have time I'm curious to see pics of the interior layout.

Is there a reason that you did not run the chimney pipe straight up and out? Less class A pipe that way. Anyway I think it looks good either way.

Shawn
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 22, 2010, 08:00:28 PM
Quote from: Shawn B on July 22, 2010, 05:54:13 PM
Could the collar bracket be installed underneath inside the eve?   ???  I'm not familiar with that style bracket. 

When you have time I'm curious to see pics of the interior layout.

Is there a reason that you did not run the chimney pipe straight up and out? Less class A pipe that way. Anyway I think it looks good either way.

Shawn

Yes the support can be installed underneath and I may resort to that but it will require some changes to the way I've put it all together :(  Funny thing is that I was originally going to install that way, saw that it would be easier on top and went that route....

I'll post some interior shots for ya since I just happen to have some ready :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 22, 2010, 08:07:28 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0087.jpg)
Vermont Castings Aspen (Thanks to MountainDon I was able to get a stove that fits the size of the cabin well I think).

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0090.jpg)
The stove is installed just off center about two feet to provide clearance for the loft window (which is centered).  The stove pipe goes out the wall to give more usable space in the loft.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0082-1.jpg)
The bathroom and 'kitchen' will be drywalled and the rest of the cabin will have knotty pine walls :)
Here you can see the makeshift kitchen and the area in front of the bathroom door will house a Futon couch/bed rather then the chairs and dog cage we had there this time (speaking of dog cages, we found cage training has been a blessing for our lab and he loves his 'den' which we take with us).

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 22, 2010, 08:09:31 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0078-1.jpg)
Another angle at the kitchen/bath/sleeping area -- I'll get better pictures one of these days when I remember my 35mm camera and 28mil lense

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0077.jpg)
This is basically the 'living' space but I'm using it as a bedroom for the time being....ignore the evil brown and black rifle in the corner.... :o
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Shawn B on July 23, 2010, 11:22:10 AM
Interior layout looks good....more room than some would think :) Do you plan on living there full time after it is complete?   Good luck on fixing the flashing problem. Oh and I like "evil black" rifles  [cool]

I wonder if the composting toilets are "legal" inside city limits? Cheaper than hooking up to the sewage plant in some areas.

I like the Aspen stove and also the Jotul 602.....from my limited research these are the only 2 small stoves that I can find for small cabins...say around 500-700 sq feet. I'm leaning toward the Aspen because it has a clearer view of the fire and a ash pan.

Ordered the Big Enchilada plans today.  :)

Thanks,
Shawn
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 23, 2010, 01:15:36 PM
Quote from: Shawn B on July 23, 2010, 11:22:10 AM
Interior layout looks good....more room than some would think :) Do you plan on living there full time after it is complete?   Good luck on fixing the flashing problem. Oh and I like "evil black" rifles  [cool]

I wonder if the composting toilets are "legal" inside city limits? Cheaper than hooking up to the sewage plant in some areas.

I like the Aspen stove and also the Jotul 602.....from my limited research these are the only 2 small stoves that I can find for small cabins...say around 500-700 sq feet. I'm leaning toward the Aspen because it has a clearer view of the fire and a ash pan.

Ordered the Big Enchilada plans today.  :)

Thanks,
Shawn

Atually, the loft is the real bonus :)  I'll post another couple of that here...it's BIG....

The evil black and brown rifle is an M1A Scout Squad :)  It's my 'bear and two legged critter repellent' ;)  Loaded with 165grain btsn bullets -- magazines of 20 each...think that ought to do it?  *snicker*

Don't plan on living in the cabin unless of course I'm forced to farm in order to survive...which might well happen if you follow economics at all...but I digress  d* It's a vacation/hunting cabin for now ;)

The Aspen is only one of those two allowed in WA State (though I shouldn't have cared since no one else does in my neck of the woods) so I went with that but the Jotul has a better reputation I think...however, Don is very happy with his Aspen so I got one too :)  Thanks to CP's forums!!

Composting toilets are legal everywhere as far as I know BUT (and it's a big BUT) the State might insist you hook up and pay sewage even if you don't use it.  In my case, if I asked them (as in went down and paid the tax to have paper that says I asked them *hint*) then they would demand that I put in septic or destroyed my well (or so a friend tells me who called them directly and told them he wanted to do what I'm doing in a far far place in the county ;) ) -- they thought the composting toilet was a quaint idea and I should do that AND spend the money to pay for permits to put in septic AND pay a contractor to put in septic and never use it because hey, they need the money, er I mean, hey, it's more sellable or some such crap.

So basically I think they can.....never mind I won't go there....I think building in REMOTE hard to get to places is a good option today.

The plans are great and what I like about them is that I have now plans for each different sized small cabin and how to put them all together to make a bigger one and more.  Lots of great info and John's done a great job.  Price is right too!

I intend to build ALL the cabins in the plans too :)  After all, my wife and I have 5 kids between the two of us and only one is still in school....so we need the extra room!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Sassy on July 23, 2010, 01:20:51 PM
It's starting to look like Home Sweet Home!  Nice job  :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 23, 2010, 01:40:39 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Cabin-04-18-2010026.jpg)
Large loft is 130 square feet.(10x13)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Cabin-04-18-2010029.jpg)
Small loft is 78 square feet (6x13)

My buddy Biggy (Shawnee Thunderpony Big Mountain) posed to give perspective :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 23, 2010, 01:41:19 PM
Quote from: Sassy on July 23, 2010, 01:20:51 PM
It's starting to look like Home Sweet Home!  Nice job  :)

Thanks :)  Starting to feel like home too!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Sassy on July 23, 2010, 01:44:48 PM
Those lofts really give you lots of extra room!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Shawn B on July 23, 2010, 02:52:02 PM
2' knee wall 12/12 pitch 9' at peak bottom of cross braces at 8' or 7' 6" ?  ???

I think Mtn. Don found a winner of a stove......maybe Vermont Castings could have a CP member coupon or something. Or do you just "drop" Mtn. Don's name when ordering  ;)

The M1A is a real nice rifle.....hard to beat 7.62x51 for a MBR.

Back to the stove does the cook plate thing on top actually remove or is it decorative?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 23, 2010, 04:55:39 PM
Sassy -- yes they do!  LOTS in fact my wife thinks that we should take one :)

Shawn -- bottom of the collar ties is at 7 feet but a note here:  There are no rafter ties because of the 2 foot knee wall so I put collar ties in on every rafter pair and I'm using light rafters (2x6).  Technically this is a 'no no' I'm told but I'm also told that lots of people have done it and it's been seen on old (read 50-100 years old) cabins that are still standing.  I think it's fine, which is why I did it, but the more technical engineering types will say it's not.

If one was worried, however, I guess you could go with 2x10 rafters and heavier ties and put two ladders into the lofts (individually) and then use beams between the lofts but I'm not worried -- I think the 2x6 walls and loft joists will do the job.

John ought to contact Vermont Castings and let them know what's going on here and maybe they will sponsor the site ;)

As for the M1A -- it is in my humble opinion anyway, one of the very best MBR's ever produced.  I hold it above the FN-FAL's etc which I've trained on even.  It's a fantastic rifle and in certain configurations (Whitefeather for example) is not only powerful and rapid firing but accurate at 1000+ yards!  Mine, being a Scout Squad isn't quite as accurate out that far but I'd take 800 yard shots if I had to!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Hi Road on July 24, 2010, 11:18:14 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on July 22, 2010, 08:07:28 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0087.jpg)
Vermont Castings Aspen (Thanks to MountainDon I was able to get a stove that fits the size of the cabin well I think).

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0090.jpg)
The stove is installed just off center about two feet to provide clearance for the loft window (which is centered).  The stove pipe goes out the wall to give more usable space in the loft.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0082-1.jpg)
The bathroom and 'kitchen' will be drywalled and the rest of the cabin will have knotty pine walls :)
Here you can see the makeshift kitchen and the area in front of the bathroom door will house a Futon couch/bed rather then the chairs and dog cage we had there this time (speaking of dog cages, we found cage training has been a blessing for our lab and he loves his 'den' which we take with us).



I have followed your fine project for some time now and I find myself checking your progress as my first assignment when I open the CP page. I know you take caution to heart.  I trust you will see my comment as constructive.  Now, you should be snug-as-bug come a cold day with that fine stove.  There is a very important safety device I would recommend.  Did you install the combustion air inlet device?  As you complete the house it may become very "air tight" and you may find yourself competing for oxygen with the stove.  Most stove shops sell a thru the wall volumetric damper that will solve the problem.  The one I have seen looks like a dryer vent but has a grill on the inside and a small two-way flapper door that allows fresh air in when needed.  Of course you can always crack a window too.  Check with the manufacture of the stove if you have any questions.  Keep up the good work.  Happy Trails, John
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 25, 2010, 12:20:36 AM
Quote from: Hi Road on July 24, 2010, 11:18:14 PM
I have followed your fine project for some time now and I find myself checking your progress as my first assignment when I open the CP page. I know you take caution to heart.  I trust you will see my comment as constructive.  Now, you should be snug-as-bug come a cold day with that fine stove.  There is a very important safety device I would recommend.  Did you install the combustion air inlet device?  As you complete the house it may become very "air tight" and you may find yourself competing for oxygen with the stove.  Most stove shops sell a thru the wall volumetric damper that will solve the problem.  The one I have seen looks like a dryer vent but has a grill on the inside and a small two-way flapper door that allows fresh air in when needed.  Of course you can always crack a window too.  Check with the manufacture of the stove if you have any questions.  Keep up the good work.  Happy Trails, John

Glad you brought that up :)

When I ordered the stove they mentioned the cold air intake (or whatever it's called) and I opted to wait to buy it at the time but intend to do so later.  Then honestly I forgot about it for a while (it was a few months or more since I bought the stove) but I remembered it when I brought the stove out to the cabin and continue to remind myself to get the intake because, as you suspect, our cabin will be pretty air tight and I don't want to run the risk of CO2 poisoning!

But thanks for bringing that up because it IS an important addition in a project like this.
Erik
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Shawn B on July 25, 2010, 09:47:34 AM
Erik,


I'm in the HVAC trade and have installed numerous combustion air inlets on wood stoves. I use the all galvanized steel air hoods with 1/4 inch hardware cloth in them. Also I usually use rigid pipe, warm air gauge (28 ga, though 26 would be just fine) over the z-flex "slinky" tube. If you go with the air hood DO NOT GET THE ONE WITH THE DAMPER. The damper is used for exhaust, for clothes dryers, range exhaust hoods, ventilation ext. Now if all you can find is the ones with a damper, you should be able to drill the rivets out that hold it in place....no big deal takes like 10 sec with a good bit. Also this pipe will/maybe sweat in unconditioned spaces, so if that is a concern it should be insulated.

One more thing if you do not want a air hood on the outside of the cabin, because of looks or whatever. You can run the pipe through the floor, cut out a cap leaving about a 1/4 of metal on edges then spot weld or solder some 1/4 hardware clothe in it. We make these a lot for commercial exhaust and intake applications. Also if bugs are a problem you might want to put some small opening window screen over the hardware cloth.


Thanks,

Shawn

sorry to post so much...thought it might be relevant
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 25, 2010, 10:33:18 AM
Quote from: Shawn B on July 25, 2010, 09:47:34 AM
Erik,


I'm in the HVAC trade and have installed numerous combustion air inlets on wood stoves. I use the all galvanized steel air hoods with 1/4 inch hardware cloth in them. Also I usually use rigid pipe, warm air gauge (28 ga, though 26 would be just fine) over the z-flex "slinky" tube. If you go with the air hood DO NOT GET THE ONE WITH THE DAMPER. The damper is used for exhaust, for clothes dryers, range exhaust hoods, ventilation ext. Now if all you can find is the ones with a damper, you should be able to drill the rivets out that hold it in place....no big deal takes like 10 sec with a good bit. Also this pipe will/maybe sweat in unconditioned spaces, so if that is a concern it should be insulated.

One more thing if you do not want a air hood on the outside of the cabin, because of looks or whatever. You can run the pipe through the floor, cut out a cap leaving about a 1/4 of metal on edges then spot weld or solder some 1/4 hardware clothe in it. We make these a lot for commercial exhaust and intake applications. Also if bugs are a problem you might want to put some small opening window screen over the hardware cloth.


Thanks,

Shawn

sorry to post so much...thought it might be relevant


Good post thanks :)

Don did something with dryer hose and I was wondering if I could do something similar myself...need to go look at the book for the stove before heading back to the cabin. 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Shawn B on July 25, 2010, 03:39:49 PM
Erik,

You can use dryer vent if you want. I have found that most people use the hard pipe in exposed locations, then transfer over to dryer vent in the craw space. Also you can paint the galvanized with stove paint too match the stove. Use a special primer for galvanized or simply wipe the pipe and fittings down with vinegar, let dry then paint. They might make 4" black pipe and elbows, but I don't remember ever seeing any. Check at a local stove shop.

Personally I think in your situation I would install a elbow on the stove inlet and go straight through the floor, install a cap cut out with screen installed. Paint the exposed fittings black or use black pipe if available. Then if you ever install a skirt around the foundation you can add the air hood, remove the screened cap, and run dryer vent from the pipe to the hood. Either way the materials are quite inexpensive.

Shawn
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 25, 2010, 08:14:09 PM
Quote from: Shawn B on July 25, 2010, 03:39:49 PM
Erik,

You can use dryer vent if you want. I have found that most people use the hard pipe in exposed locations, then transfer over to dryer vent in the craw space. Also you can paint the galvanized with stove paint too match the stove. Use a special primer for galvanized or simply wipe the pipe and fittings down with vinegar, let dry then paint. They might make 4" black pipe and elbows, but I don't remember ever seeing any. Check at a local stove shop.

Personally I think in your situation I would install a elbow on the stove inlet and go straight through the floor, install a cap cut out with screen installed. Paint the exposed fittings black or use black pipe if available. Then if you ever install a skirt around the foundation you can add the air hood, remove the screened cap, and run dryer vent from the pipe to the hood. Either way the materials are quite inexpensive.

Shawn

Not sure I want to go through the floor though (but it would hide it) since it's insulated.  But I guess it would be fine to punch through the insulation and put it there...then I could bend it out to the outer wall if I wanted but come UNDER them....I just planned on punching right out the (insulated -- doh!) wall behind the stove and put something in to keep the rain and bugs out...and maybe just paint it brown to hide it.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Shawn B on July 25, 2010, 08:33:12 PM
Erik,

Here is a link to the type of air hood I was referring to. Check at a local HVAC shop they should have them, some shops stock brown as well. The reason I recommended going through the floor is it would have the least amount of exposed pipe and IMHO would make a cleaner install. Going through the wall is fine as well. Don't worry about the insulation. We run the intakes in joist bays all the time. That way the insulators will insulate them and we don't have to spend the time and money to wrap the pipe with foil or fiberglass insulation.

http://www.hvacquick.com/products/residential/Ventilation-Accessories/Discharge-Caps/wall-hoods-

Shawn
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on July 25, 2010, 09:16:04 PM
OlJarhead on  my fresh air intake it was set in a masonry wall.  I used 4" schedule 40 pipe through the block.  Then I bought some 3" black stove pipe which was the outlet size of my stove ( Hearthstone) and used a black 4X3 reducer.  I had to make the 90 deg turn in direction before the PVC and used adjustable 3" elbow.   The fresh air intake will not get that hot and I only used hardware cloth to keep the critters out.  Bugs will only make it into the firebox and not into the room.  You may want to keep inspecting the pipe to make sure that wasp do not make a nest that will constrict the airflow.  
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Shawn B on July 30, 2010, 02:58:16 PM
Erik,

How did the roof flashing and support turn out?


Shawn
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 31, 2010, 11:12:37 AM
Admitedly I haven't done any cabin work lately :(  Been home about a week and a half and either trying to do gardening etc or looking for work.

Have some reloading to do and some cabin thinking to do...so maybe I'll get something going soon.

It's the hot time of the year and I hate it! hahahaha  I don't much like weather over 75...ok I can do 80 but more then that and your pushing it!  So I'll probably go out only once in August for a 4 or 5 day trip and MAYBE a short one day deal to do clean up...then it's wait for fall!!!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 31, 2010, 12:39:23 PM
Cut my finger reloading (actually drilling out primers -- DOH!) so took some time to surf and found this site: http://logdovetailjig.com/cutting_dovetail_notches.html

Cool
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on July 31, 2010, 12:52:37 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on July 31, 2010, 12:39:23 PM
Cut my finger reloading (actually drilling out primers -- DOH!) so took some time to surf and found this site: http://logdovetailjig.com/cutting_dovetail_notches.html

Cool

Sweet! I like it!  I've been looking for something like that for a while now.  That will come in handy when I finally start on the cabins next year.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 31, 2010, 10:10:36 PM
Our rack for the solar panels is coming along nicely! :D  It's going to be heavy, but sturdy I think.  My neighbor has a small business doing fabrication and welding and took a look at what I wanted to do and quoted me $325 for the pole and rack.  The pole is 3" sch 40 steel and 8 feet long.  We'll put it 3' in the ground with concrete (hoping that's deep enough to carry the load).  The panel rack will be 2" steel angle and welded (saw his progress and it's very nice work) together with the outside all nicely fit together in a ~10' x ~5 1/2' rectangle with two center bars (angle) running the length and two cross bars running side to side (so a double cross in the middle of the rectangle).  Then there will be a swivel head on the pole at the top that will also tilt from 33 degrees to 63.  This way I can rotate them into the sun as well as change the tilt in different times of year. 

My idea was to create a semi-fixed pole that could be converted into a tracking pole some day.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: glenn kangiser on July 31, 2010, 11:33:55 PM
Sounds like a good plan.  I do things similar sometimes. :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Tickhill on August 02, 2010, 07:03:24 AM
I buried 3" rigid conduit in the ground and used the threaded coupling as my swivel point. I currently have my 3 panels mounted on it and it has stood up to a good bit of wind during our tornado filled summers here in Mississippi. I found the "solar noon" point and drilled a 1/4" hold in both the coupling and conduit so I could pin it in position when I was not going to be around to manually track it and also to pin it so it would not swing in strong winds. I hope my 3 190 watt panels come in this week. I will be doing some retrofitting! God Bless
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 02, 2010, 10:21:57 AM
Quote from: Tickhill on August 02, 2010, 07:03:24 AM
I buried 3" rigid conduit in the ground and used the threaded coupling as my swivel point. I currently have my 3 panels mounted on it and it has stood up to a good bit of wind during our tornado filled summers here in Mississippi. I found the "solar noon" point and drilled a 1/4" hold in both the coupling and conduit so I could pin it in position when I was not going to be around to manually track it and also to pin it so it would not swing in strong winds. I hope my 3 190 watt panels come in this week. I will be doing some retrofitting! God Bless

Cool :)  What were you running before the 190's?

Oh Glenn, I got the 205's from sunelec also :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Tickhill on August 02, 2010, 11:45:53 AM
2 used panels I got off of eBay, an 75 and an 80 watt. My first experience with solar panels was a shattered 110 watt. FedEx ate that one but it kinda scared from interstate commerce with solar panels. I just ordered from sunelec and just found out they are shipping out today. I just could not keep the batteries, 4-- 105 Ah batteries charged enough with the 155 watts even with great sun here in Mississippi.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: glenn kangiser on August 02, 2010, 12:12:15 PM
Cool, OJ.  My experience with them has been good and no broken panes so far.

More panels, more power, more useful, more things to run, more panels, more power..... power corrupts... [waiting]
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 02, 2010, 03:54:11 PM
Quote from: glenn kangiser on August 02, 2010, 12:12:15 PM
Cool, OJ.  My experience with them has been good and no broken panes so far.

More panels, more power, more useful, more things to run, more panels, more power..... power corrupts... [waiting]

Absolutely? hehe

Ya, mine arrived in perfect order -- in fact, for blems I couldn't actually find any blemishes so I'm very happy with them.

I'd read a bad review on their shipping but quite frankly the stuff I got was well packaged on a pallet with blocking and lots of wrap.  No scratches dings or other worries :D  Heck, I'm more worried about my handling of them then sunelecs!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: glenn kangiser on August 03, 2010, 11:34:23 AM
Mine were double packed - no problems - likely problems would be with the shipping company anyway.

I have six arriving -maybe today if they get enough freight to come up here.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 12, 2010, 12:08:53 PM
Just got off the phone with Backwoodssolar.com and have decided to buy one of their timers and relays for my well :)  I'm excited!  You see up to this point it's been a guessing, waiting, pumping, guessing game at the cabin and I'm kinda tired of it!  Plus, I get busy and forget to pump water and the cistern starts to drain out...so I've been trying to decide how to deal with this and Backwoods has helped :)

I can set the timer to cycle on and off 8 times a day.  Each time it can come on for an hour and then go off for two hours (assuming my pump will pump 5 gpm and the recharge is 2.5gpm).  Of course I'll have to actually figure out what the GPM of my pump is when running 12vdc but Backwoods seems to think it's likely higher then theirs because theirs are designed to run off solar and be more efficient.  While theirs draw 2.9amps at 12vdc mine is drawing 9amps at 12vdc!  He told me that he thinks that's because it's typical to put in a pump that will do way more then required 'just to be safe' but with proper power management a more efficient pump will do the job.

Anyway, my plan is to install the timer to switch the pump on for an hour then off for two and to check it periodically throughout the day to see if I hear it go dry while trying to pump.  If I do I'll push the off period to 3 hours etc etc.

I'm also planning on getting one of those low voltage shutoffs MtDon mentioned here so that I can protect the battery from being discharged too much...with luck I can get my cistern full again!

Now I just need to plan a trip up to get more work done...it's been THREE WEEKS now!  Yikes!  Feels like forever...of course without working it's a bit tougher since we have to be careful on expenditures but thankfully we though of that a while back and prepped for such a situation ;)

Darn preppers hey?
*chuckle*
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 12, 2010, 12:18:03 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on June 19, 2010, 10:41:46 PM
Good stuff!

Now what would be nice for the pump setup is a low voltage cutoff switch, so you don't have to monitor the battery as much.

Don't know if these would do the job for your pump....   ???

http://www.polyperformance.com/shop/sPOD-Low-Voltage-Cutoff-Battery-Protector-p-25220.html (http://www.polyperformance.com/shop/sPOD-Low-Voltage-Cutoff-Battery-Protector-p-25220.html)

http://www.smarthome.com/77416/Enforcer-Low-Voltage-Battery-Cut-Off/p.aspx (http://www.smarthome.com/77416/Enforcer-Low-Voltage-Battery-Cut-Off/p.aspx)



Wonder what gauge the wires are on that SPOD switch?  Cutting off at 11.6vdc almost seems too low?  Isn't that pretty much fully draining the battery?  Just wondering.

Of course, with a timer on my well pump this might not be as much of a problem but probably a good measure none-the-less.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 15, 2010, 02:59:44 PM
Solar rack is done :)  Looks pretty awesome too!  It will swivel on a bearing at the top of the pole and tilts from straight up and down to flat (up to the sky).  I'll have to drill some new holes in the panel frames for secure mounting and will have to figure out where 33/48/63 degrees is but otherwise it looks pretty awesome :)

it's all steel though so I'll have to paint it to prevent rust -- I'm thinking rustoleom should work.

Any thoughts?
Thanks
Erik
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: TheWire on August 15, 2010, 03:20:14 PM
Do you have a picture of your solar mount?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 17, 2010, 03:00:54 PM
Quote from: TheWire on August 15, 2010, 03:20:14 PM
Do you have a picture of your solar mount?

I'll take some today.  Need to clean it off and paint it since it's just been completed.  I'm pretty happy with it too!

Also received the Timer and Relay for the well pump today!  Very excited about this puppy.  The Timer can be set to come on up to 8 times in a 24 hour period and remain on for a predetermined period.  The relay is kicked on by a small amount of power from the timer and provides the main power to the pump.

This will allow me to cycle the pump on and off all day :D  The idea being that if I pump for 1 hour and it draws the well down but then let it rest for two hours before pumping another hour the well will have time to recover from each period of draw down before pumping again.

My pump also draws around 9-10amps so having it run for 1 hour at a time allows the solar power (60 panels) to recharge the battery before it begins to pump again :)

So I get to kill two birds with one stone -- recharge the battery while the well recharges too :)

I decided to go this route because I was setting up the well to pump, then going off to do a bunch of work and coming back in 3-5 hours to find the well drawn down below the sump pump!  Grrr....so then I'd shut it off and have to guess when it might have water to pump again.

This is less a problem in the spring (I'm thinking anyway) then in the dry summer months but I want to be able to get my cistern full without having to worry about it.

So this way I'll hook up the power and timer etc and forget it for a while and see how that works out.

I may have to watch for a day though to be sure I have the rest time right.

Anyway, I'll do a schematic up today for it :) and include links to the parts.
Cheers
Erik
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 17, 2010, 03:39:29 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Wellsystem-1.jpg)
This is a quick drawing I did for my well system.  The Costco 60watt panels come with a charge controller not shown here.

I still have to get the low battery cut off -- something I'll have to add later.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 17, 2010, 07:18:37 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/IMG_0043.jpg)
These arrived today :D  $20 from Bailey's -- probably made in China (no idea) but since ONE of these is usually $20+ I'm happy with $20 for the set!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/IMG_0045.jpg)
This is the Pole Mount for our solar that my neighbor made.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/IMG_0046.jpg)
Center of the rack is designed to pivot to change angle to the sun.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/IMG_0047.jpg)
The Rack mounts on this pole head (for lack of better description).

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/IMG_0048.jpg)
And the head rotates on the pole using a bearing (it also has support under it).  It has a locking bolt to secure it where I want it or to release it if I put in a tracking device :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Yonderosa on August 17, 2010, 08:00:14 PM
Very nice!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on August 17, 2010, 08:00:36 PM
Nice looking? Be nice in powder coat.   :)


How far off the ground will it be?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 17, 2010, 08:53:25 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on August 17, 2010, 08:00:36 PM
Nice looking? Be nice in powder coat.   :)


How far off the ground will it be?

Planning on 3 feet in concrete and 5 feet to the top of the head.  That puts the bottom of the panels a little lower then I wanted but also makes it easier to put them on I think.

If I've done the math right (not sure since it's been too long) and the angle is the steepest at 63 degrees with a hypotenuse of 2.75 feet the  tip of the panel rack should drop ~2.45 feet down the pole and be 2.55 feet off the ground.

That would be in the winter.

In the summer with the panels at 33 degrees it would be 1 1/2 feet down the pole so about 3 1/2 feet off the ground...

On a side not I wanted a ten foot pole but was convinced that 8 feet might be better since it will be easier to install the panel rack and panels on....looking at the math I'm wondering if maybe I should have kept it at ten feet since that would make the bottom of the panels at 4 1/2 feet off the ground.

Thoughts?

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on August 17, 2010, 09:29:57 PM
Last winter I was wishing I had made the pole 1 to 2 feet longer, 1 to 2 feet more above the ground. Reason? I failed to take into account the amount of snow that collects at the foot of the panels and post. In reality it was no problem, just one of those things that in taking all the worst case scenarios into account might have been better. ???  If it snowed more then it might become a problem.

I was worried about the task of getting the panels up on the mount as well. I worked from the bed of my utility trailer to get a little boost up in the air with the ladder. I actually thought it ws easier with the panels in a vertical array. The lower panel was easy, the next one up (center) was not too bad and then for the third panel we flipped the panel over the top and had the empty space at the bottom again.

Are you going to use a gasket or something to separate the aluminum module frame from the steel? Something non permeable to water to reduce galvanic action.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 17, 2010, 10:08:01 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on August 17, 2010, 09:29:57 PM
Last winter I was wishing I had made the pole 1 to 2 feet longer, 1 to 2 feet more above the ground. Reason? I failed to take into account the amount of snow that collects at the foot of the panels and post. In reality it was no problem, just one of those things that in taking all the worst case scenarios into account might have been better. ???  If it snowed more then it might become a problem.

I was worried about the task of getting the panels up on the mount as well. I worked from the bed of my utility trailer to get a little boost up in the air with the ladder. I actually thought it ws easier with the panels in a vertical array. The lower panel was easy, the next one up (center) was not too bad and then for the third panel we flipped the panel over the top and had the empty space at the bottom again.

Are you going to use a gasket or something to separate the aluminum module frame from the steel? Something non permeable to water to reduce galvanic action.



Ahhhh......hmmmm....you mean Rustolleom won't work?  I hadn't thought about it at all actually....

I guess with the snow I'll hope that it will melt away from the panels!  If not I might be shoveling if it gets bad.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Texas Tornado on August 18, 2010, 06:55:59 AM
How sturdy are the panels?
Is hail an issue?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 18, 2010, 10:11:56 AM
Quote from: Texas Tornado on August 18, 2010, 06:55:59 AM
How sturdy are the panels?
Is hail an issue?

Hmmm....

The panels have an aluminum frame and seem pretty strong.

Hail does happen but it tends to be pea sized in our area (I hate to think what big hail would do to solar panels!).
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: SkagitDrifter on August 18, 2010, 10:12:11 AM
Nice frame/metal work Ol'-
Looking forward to seeing the whole rig installed.  

Are you in an open ag. area?  Do you have free range cattle on your place?
Cattle have a nasty habit of rubbing themselves on anything they can get to- directly proportional to the value, I think.  My friend had the side of his camper mashed in by cows who thought it was a good place to "scratch".

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on August 18, 2010, 02:38:37 PM
Hail.. IF a panel is built to UL 1703 standards it will have to meet certain impact resistance. UL 1703 allows the glass to break as long as the breakage does not expose any electrical components in a manner that could cause a safety issue to people. There is also ASTM E1038 standard is directed solely at hail damage. The bugger of UL and ASTM standards is that they are just like the NEC, IRC, and most other codes and standards. "They" want to be paid for viewing their documents. @$%^&*!!   

I did manage to find an online PDF copy of UL 1703 if anyone cares. It is at http://www.polar-pv.com/ch/UL%201703.pdf (http://www.polar-pv.com/ch/UL%201703.pdf)  This may or may not be a legally available copy. I did find it with Google, so it's not my fault. I found nothing on ASTM 1038, other than they use real ice balls that are air propelled.

What I have gleaned from here and there is that an approved panel should withstand hail up to one inch in diameter, traveling at 50 miles per hour.  That's from a site that has "interpreted" the standards.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 18, 2010, 09:50:04 PM
Quote from: SkagitDrifter on August 18, 2010, 10:12:11 AM
Nice frame/metal work Ol'-
Looking forward to seeing the whole rig installed.  

Are you in an open ag. area?  Do you have free range cattle on your place?
Cattle have a nasty habit of rubbing themselves on anything they can get to- directly proportional to the value, I think.  My friend had the side of his camper mashed in by cows who thought it was a good place to "scratch".



It is a free range area but they seem to pass right by our site.  In fact, it is common for them to walk RIGHT behind the cabin but I've seen no evidence of them using the cabin, camper or trailer etc to rub -- though they do like some of the trees in the area.

Not sure why they steer clear (no pun intended) but am hopeful that will last!  Although this rack mount will be STRONG so might withstand some of their punishment.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 22, 2010, 12:34:31 PM
WhooHoo!  Heading out for a four day visit to the cabin :)

Going to get some work done and enjoy the woods for a few days.

See ya next week :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 27, 2010, 11:14:10 AM
Got back last night from a somewhat unproductive trip to our cabin in the woods :(
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Nestled.jpg)

The trip involved both my back breaking down (something was out of kilter as they say) and my Jeep breaking down (The Road Warrior decided to take a break I guess).  Was a trip of trials and tribulations but then, aren't they always?

So where to begin?

We left Sunday with high hopes of arriving in time to set up in the cabin and relax a bit before really getting to work on the cabin on Monday.  The trip was planned to get the cabin wiring done and install the load center to prep for solar power.  After that we planned to finish the insulation in the kitchen area and get the drywall install done also (kitchen and bath)....

However when we arrived and began setting up we discovered the Tent Trailer had been invaded by Mice.  I'd kept them at bay for a year but despite leaving out poison (which they consumed) the little buggers invaded, built homes, crapped everywhere, chewed holes through some of the canvas and then died.

Now I'll have to pull that trailer back to get it fixed up -- luckily, however, we don't stay in it much anymore, if at all.

So, with the trailer trashed we decided to live out of a cooler in the cabin (we like to use the Fridge, Sink and stove in the trailer and sleep in the cabin) and prepped the big loft to sleep in (cots with sleeping pads on them).

The next day we managed to get the kitchen wiring completed, the insulation in and the drywall up, except that we could not find my screw bit for my drill to screw the drywall screws in.  So I pulled out my hammer and tacked the sheets down with galvies and moved on.

It was a bit of a long day and I was fighting a sore back so split some wood and set up to test fire the wood stove that evening.  Other then that the day was pretty much a waste -- did some reading.

That evening I started and burned the first of the 3 test fires in the stove.  It was nice to finally try the stove out though I was a bit disappointed by the output and fretted a bit at the little stoves ability to heat the cabin.

The next morning my back was killing me, absolutely nightmare.  So, other then lighting the 2nd test fire in the stove (at which time I learned I must always prime the chimney) I did nothing else.  Hour after hour went by and I either read, slept or tried walking and stretching but my back would not allow me any comfort.

3rd stove break in fire was made that night and went well.  Incidentally the stove was putting out very nice heat by this time and I was happy with how it was going.  Clearly I just needed to let it run in order to get up to full output but in the burn in phase you are supposed to let it burn itself out without keeping it going.  Once I got past that stage it was clear the little stove will do just fine :)
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/FiringStove.jpg)
By Wednesday morning it was time to pack up and my back was feeling much better (still sore but manageable).  I ran the stove one last time to give us some warmth in the morning (it wasn't as cold as it had been mind you) and we soon began packing up to leave.

Once on the road I noticed that the Jeep (we call it 'The Road Warrior' because it spends so much time on the highway and has 211,000 miles on it now) seemed a little unhappy.  It was running hotter then normal and down on power...hmmmmm

As the miles ticked off and we continued out progress towards home the temp gauge continued to climb.  I was pretty unhappy with that since I'd replaced EVERYTHING in the cooling system and ignition system not to mention exhaust and so much more.  Something was wrong.

Soon we turned off the AC (it was 97 degrees out) and were able to keep it down to around 211/212 degrees which is just slightly high.  But it would be nice to have AC right?  On we drove and I began to wonder if maybe it was time to pull the fuel system apart and replace everything....ba bump....uh oh

Something happened, don't know what, seems like the engine cut out and then came back.....on I drove now staring intently at the gauges...not here!

Then suddenly she died.  We were heading up hill in the middle of no where.  No cell coverage, hot as heck, loaded with gear, miles from the nearest town.....dead.
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0020-1.jpg)

I noticed a farm house about a mile away but first attempted to get cell coverage by walking to the top of the nearest hill.  No good.  Then back to the Jeep and then finally off trekking in the heat to the farm house.

Luckily we had water, food, firearms and just about anything else one might need (even ice) so I was able to hydrate well and my son kept a cool bottle of water with him in the jeep to keep hydrated while guarding the rig.
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0019-1.jpg)
The farmers wife let me use the phone and then borrow their farm truck to pull the trailer back to their house so it wouldn't get stolen once the wrecker showed up.  Then we waited in the heat praying for a breeze (which sometimes came) until the wrecker arrived.  He showed up about two hours into our wait.

It was another hour drive to the nearest town (yes, ONE HOUR, we really were in the middle of no where) and then another hour and a half until my friends came to pick us up, drive back to the trailer, then finally on to home.  We arrived home some 7 or 8 hours later then we should have, worn out, without the Jeep and trying to plan the next trip.

We think it was the fuel pump that quit or a clogged fuel filter and hope to find out today what the problem was but one way or another it will cost me.

As for the two?  They gave me a huge break and charged only two hours (could have got me for 3 with all of them as OT hours due to the time, distance etc etc) so the tow was $265.  Our insurance will pay it (thanks American Family Insurance!  Whoohoo!)

Just another adventure eh?

Lastly, while the yotes were out in force this trip I never managed to get a picture of them for some reason (I think they are camera shy now) but we heard two long and lonely howls!  While these did not sound like the haunting cries of the wolves I grew up with, they definitely were not yotes!  I think they were wolves and the air just wasn't cold enough to produce the chilling sound of wolves in the Canadian winter....




Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 27, 2010, 11:24:12 AM
On a side note I think I have my well licked :)

By pumping for short periods and then giving it a break to recover I beleive I can fill the cistern without running the pump dry (it sits around the 45 foot mark and the well is 205 feet deep)...but the cistern is about 50 feet above the well so the 12vdc pump is pushing water nearly 100feet and not deep enough to pump for long periods.

Basically I pump for an hour (or so) then stop pumping, allow the battery to recharge and the well to refill and then after a couple hours pump another hour.

Once the time is in place this will all be automatic.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on August 27, 2010, 01:19:32 PM
Jeep stops dead and/or gives fits, low power, hiccups.... crankshaft position sensor. I carry a spare. Bugger to change on a hot engine.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: John Raabe on August 27, 2010, 01:32:08 PM
"Crankshaft position sensor" - and he carries a spare!
(I didn't know there even was such a thing.)

I guess Don's a pretty good mechanic too??? ::)

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 27, 2010, 01:35:07 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on August 27, 2010, 01:19:32 PM
Jeep stops dead and/or gives fits, low power, hiccups.... crankshaft position sensor. I carry a spare. Bugger to change on a hot engine.



Another Jeep buddy suggested that though I just had mine replaced about 3 years ago...how long do they normally last?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: astidham on August 27, 2010, 01:59:59 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on August 27, 2010, 01:19:32 PM
Jeep stops dead and/or gives fits, low power, hiccups.... crankshaft position sensor. I carry a spare. Bugger to change on a hot engine.


Very True!
I just replaced the one in my jeep last week!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on August 27, 2010, 02:12:49 PM
Everyone of my 4 wheeling friends with XJ Cherokees carry a spare. They are not universal, many models over the years. It lets the computer know its position so the computer can tell the ignition and fuel system what and when to do. It's the only engine thing, other than belts, hoses and spark plugs that I have had to change since 1999. I have number five in the spares box; been there about a year, maybe 2. It's easiest to change with a very long socket extension and a flex socket, going in from the left rear side of the transmission. I forget the bolt size, but also have a couple spares. Experience counts for something.  ;D


As for heat these things always run hot, normal is 210, IIRC. An engine that runs hotter does get better fuel efficiency, but the stock XJ cooling system runs real close to too hot. There are many after market high performance radiators that will allow for cooler running; comforting if you 4 wheel in the heat of the SW desert.

Flowcooler (http://www.flowkoolerwaterpumps.com/tech_support/) makes a water pump that has double the flow at low speed. They make the high performance pumps for many engines. And someone, I forget who, makes a low restriction high flow thermostat housing and thermostat.

The heat is another reason I only run Mobil One synthetic oil.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 27, 2010, 02:33:51 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on August 27, 2010, 02:12:49 PM
Everyone of my 4 wheeling friends with XJ Cherokees carry a spare. They are not universal, many models over the years. It lets the computer know its position so the computer can tell the ignition and fuel system what and when to do. It's the only engine thing, other than belts, hoses and spark plugs that I have had to change since 1999. I have number five in the spares box; been there about a year, maybe 2. It's easiest to change with a very long socket extension and a flex socket, going in from the left rear side of the transmission. I forget the bolt size, but also have a couple spares. Experience counts for something.  ;D


As for heat these things always run hot, normal is 210, IIRC. An engine that runs hotter does get better fuel efficiency, but the stock XJ cooling system runs real close to too hot. There are many after market high performance radiators that will allow for cooler running; comforting if you 4 wheel in the heat of the SW desert.

Flowcooler (http://www.flowkoolerwaterpumps.com/tech_support/) makes a water pump that has double the flow at low speed. They make the high performance pumps for many engines. And someone, I forget who, makes a low restriction high flow thermostat housing and thermostat.

The heat is another reason I only run Mobil One synthetic oil.

I'll have to get a new CPS and put it in the kit then -- didn't realize they were that bad.

I've replace the Radiator with a 3 core all steel unit (last year) along with the water pump, fan clutch and fan relay so the cooling system should be up to snuff for my uses.  Of course, new they aren't great but at least with the 3 core it ought to be a bit better then stock.

I've also replaced all ignition components (twice now) and installed Banks Header, Flowmasters, new Cat, T Body spacer and intake with K&N and much much more...so the jeep has been good.

In this case it still tries to start, even jumps like it's going to now and then but simply won't fire.

They will check it out this afternoon and I've asked that they check the CPS while at it -- luckily the shop owner is a Jeep guy :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on August 27, 2010, 02:42:13 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on August 27, 2010, 02:33:51 PM

In this case it still tries to start, even jumps like it's going to now and then but simply won't fire.


Sure sounds like mine when the sensor goes south. If a person is really lucky it'll start back up after scaring the bejeebers out of ya'. But it is a warning best heeded with speedy replacement.  I buy mine from rockauto.com (http://rockauto.com)... Much better price than anyone local. (http://info.rockauto.com/getimage/getimage.php?imageurl=http%3A%2F%2Finfo.rockauto.com%2FSMP%2FPC308_FULL.jpg&imagekey=445627-0&width=450)

The connecting wire has got shorter and shorter over the years. The last one is about as short as it can get.  Talk about pinching pennies.

I can't understand why they give so much trouble on this engine.   ???

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 27, 2010, 04:57:38 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on August 27, 2010, 02:42:13 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on August 27, 2010, 02:33:51 PM

In this case it still tries to start, even jumps like it's going to now and then but simply won't fire.


Sure sounds like mine when the sensor goes south. If a person is really lucky it'll start back up after scaring the bejeebers out of ya'. But it is a warning best heeded with speedy replacement.  I buy mine from rockauto.com (http://rockauto.com)... Much better price than anyone local. (http://info.rockauto.com/getimage/getimage.php?imageurl=http%3A%2F%2Finfo.rockauto.com%2FSMP%2FPC308_FULL.jpg&imagekey=445627-0&width=450)

The connecting wire has got shorter and shorter over the years. The last one is about as short as it can get.  Talk about pinching pennies.

I can't understand why they give so much trouble on this engine.   ???



So it will crank but not start but sometimes almost start?  Spit once or twice?

I haven't heard from them yet but hope to soon -- I'll call the shop before close if they don't respond but it's about two hours from me :(
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on August 27, 2010, 05:41:06 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on August 27, 2010, 04:57:38 PM

So it will crank but not start but sometimes almost start?  Spit once or twice?


Yep. Sometimes it just won't quite go. Or start and run rough with little response to the throttle.

In the past I've had it stop dead in it's tracks on a 4wd trail, middle of nowheres, UT.  Thank goodness by then I knew enough to carry a spare. Also thank goodness it was on a flat and level, non rocky section.

Another time it would not respond well to the throttle, it would spit and sputter and only slowly rev up. Then magically it was okay, until it acted up again a day later.

I've also had it start and run rough and then even out and be okay, only to go back into the cough and sputter, no power thing and then be completely fine for a week or more.


We once were out in the boonies here when a friend's XJ quit dead after sputtering. My part had a different connector than his. He recalled hearing something about unplugging the computer connections and letting it sit for a minute and then reconnecting. That worked well enough to let us drive back to town. He did replace the sensor later though. I've never tried that disconnect/reconnect thing myself though.


I've only had to replace it once on the trail, once in the campground the next morning. The other times I've replaced it at home because it was giving indications of trouble.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 27, 2010, 06:02:50 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on August 27, 2010, 05:41:06 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on August 27, 2010, 04:57:38 PM

So it will crank but not start but sometimes almost start?  Spit once or twice?


Yep. Sometimes it just won't quite go. Or start and run rough with little response to the throttle.

In the past I've had it stop dead in it's tracks on a 4wd trail, middle of nowheres, UT.  Thank goodness by then I knew enough to carry a spare. Also thank goodness it was on a flat and level, non rocky section.

Another time it would not respond well to the throttle, it would spit and sputter and only slowly rev up. Then magically it was okay, until it acted up again a day later.

I've also had it start and run rough and then even out and be okay, only to go back into the cough and sputter, no power thing and then be completely fine for a week or more.


We once were out in the boonies here when a friend's XJ quit dead after sputtering. My part had a different connector than his. He recalled hearing something about unplugging the computer connections and letting it sit for a minute and then reconnecting. That worked well enough to let us drive back to town. He did replace the sensor later though. I've never tried that disconnect/reconnect thing myself though.


I've only had to replace it once on the trail, once in the campground the next morning. The other times I've replaced it at home because it was giving indications of trouble.

Thanks Don!  I'll be ordering a spare shortly then!

Still haven't heard from the shop -- and I'm getting impatient.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 29, 2010, 02:46:35 PM
Nope :(

We bought the CPS at Schucks/O'Reilly's and headed out.  Got the old one out and found we got the wrong one from Shucks.  Went to nearest Shucks and they didn't have one either.  Went to Autozone - nope but one 20 miles away.  Went and got the RIGHT part.

Got back, replaced CPS -- won't start. :(

Drove home in defeat.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on August 29, 2010, 10:23:10 PM
Uh-oh!   >:( >:(  It was a good shot; keep for spare.     ???

Do you have a fuel pressure tester? Can you hear the pump run for a few seconds when the key is turned to 'on'? Do you have a code reader?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 30, 2010, 12:46:20 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on August 29, 2010, 10:23:10 PM
Uh-oh!   >:( >:(  It was a good shot; keep for spare.     ???

Do you have a fuel pressure tester? Can you hear the pump run for a few seconds when the key is turned to 'on'? Do you have a code reader?

Pump comes on, no codes on the reader, smell fuel when it cranks...no idea at this point.

probably something stupid and I left it at the shop so they can fix it :(
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 02, 2010, 06:31:36 PM
Labor day is coming up :(  It's usually a weekend we go camping on, or in this case a weekend to work on the Cabin but the Jeep is STILL in the shop :(

The mechanic called earlier and told me he found no spark at the plugs and thought the coil might be bad but wasn't sure -- he wanted to swap it out to see (sorta lame).  It's a new coil so if it's bad then something made it go bad.

He also told me that he could only get 30psi on #2 during a compression test.  All other cylinders were fine (around 130) so I might have a stuck valve.

It's been more then a week and I'm starting to lose it -- not having my trusty steed is a bummer.

So, I'll continue to try to work on making furniture (started today) and pine away for the open road again.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: TheWire on September 02, 2010, 08:53:14 PM
Bummer about your continued Jeep delays.  Even though its a lot of work, I enjoy heading up to the cabin, maybe to the point of addiction d*  So its a big deal for a lot of us here when unforeseen circumstances cut into our cabin time.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 03, 2010, 10:34:13 PM
Quote from: TheWire on September 02, 2010, 08:53:14 PM
Bummer about your continued Jeep delays.  Even though its a lot of work, I enjoy heading up to the cabin, maybe to the point of addiction d*  So its a big deal for a lot of us here when unforeseen circumstances cut into our cabin time.

AMEN!

However, the good news:  I HAVE THE JEEP BACK! :D

The shop is the worst (Denny's Pit Stop in Ephrata WA) and after I told him to pull the plugs and check for spark he admitted there wasn't one -- I explained to him -- yes, that's right I explained to the so called mechanic -- that it takes only three things to make an engine run:  air, fuel and ignition.  It's the KISS method (Keep it simple stupid).  So after he begrudgingly checked for spark, found none and replaced the coil (because he thought it might be that) it fired right up.  Then promptly told me I needed to rebuild the head and it would cost me about $900-$1000 to do so.

I told him no thanks and I'd be there in two hours to get my jeep.  $200 later (and shorter since he charged me for 'diagnosing' the problem -- ya right) I was out the door and heading home but not before telling him that I should be charging him since I analyzed the problem and told him what to fix.  Amazing.

Anyway, drove the 100 miles home and the Jeep ran just fine.  I might need some head work but I might not -- it certainly ran fine at 75 on the interstate and during heavy throttle use when passing.

Now I can salvage the weekend somewhat :)  Won't make it to the cabin mind you, but will work on some other cabin stuff.

Already I've cut some tenons and when trying to drill 1 1/2" holes for the tenons (in a round) I realized I need a 'real' drill so my wife and I ran out and bought a big Rigid 9AM monster and a planer :)  Stoked now!

So, all is well as ends well eh?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on September 03, 2010, 11:50:45 PM
Glad to hear your XJ runs again. Too bad it was such a needlessly long ordeal.   I think it's rather odd for coils to go bad with such rapidity these days.   ??? ???



Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 04, 2010, 11:15:01 AM
Quote from: MountainDon on September 03, 2010, 11:50:45 PM
Glad to hear your XJ runs again. Too bad it was such a needlessly long ordeal.   I think it's rather odd for coils to go bad with such rapidity these days.   ??? ???





My thinking is that the short I have in the system is causing the problem.  I've ignored it as 'inconvenient' with the intent of fixing it 'someday' because I've poured all my energy into the cabin project...oops.

So, now I must find out why my flasher constantly tics at me (as if the blinker is on) and why my stereo quit.  Then I need to check the compression myself and see what I find.  Seems very odd that a stuck valve would allow me to run down the hiway at speed for so long -- perhaps a sticking valve might as it may loosen and tighten with changes in temps.  If there is a sticking valve I might try some MMO (Mystery Magic Oil) to get rid of varnish etc in hope that it will hold me over until the new year.

I could pull the head myself and rebuild it (it wouldn't be the first head I rebuilt!) but right now I'd like it to wait until March!  HAHA  d* :o  My website sponsors renew at different times and in March my 2nd largest renews so I'd have the funds to have someone do a complete top end rebuild (new valves, guides, seals, springs etc) rather then having to do it myself.  Why not do it myself?  Have you ever pulled the header off and put it back on!? hahaha  It is the worst job and I hate doing it and rarely get the darn exhuast manifold gasket to seal  d*

Anyway, here's hoping I can get the XJ to hang in there for a few more months!  I think it's been hanging in for a while and they are tough buggers.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 04, 2010, 10:27:47 PM
My son mounted the router on the logman tenon cutter (note to self, check the way he's mounting it before letting the holes be drilled).
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0025-2.jpg)

The setup works though :)
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0024-2.jpg)
We mounted it via clamp to an old reloading desk and cut some tenons.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0016-2.jpg)
We're still perfecting the tenon cutting process but they work.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0019-2.jpg)
I freehand cut some holes in this round to test fit the tenons and see how hard it is to make a small table.
The round was way too small and freehand drilling 3 holes equidistant with limited measuring tools (I used a string and pencil) doesn't provide very well angled holes or legs.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0013.jpg)
So, with the rounds too small I devised a plan to rough cut two rounds so they can be fit together -- I cut them with a sawzal.  Then drill two small (1") holes and use the logman to make two small 1" dowels to fit in the holes.  This allowed me to join the two rounds.  Then drill holes, cut tenons in legs and the result:
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0021-1.jpg)

Drilled both 2" and 1 1/2" test holes.  With my new Rigid 9am drill it was easy!
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0018.jpg)

Also, before fitting the rounds together I ran them through my new plane
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0026-2.jpg)

It worked like a charm!

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 07, 2010, 04:49:03 PM
Well I bit the bullet on an $1120 top end rebuild on the Road Warrior today.  The old Jeep has 212,000 miles on it and has been missing on either 1 or 2 (2 lately) off and on for about a year.  I originally thought I had an injector problem (after fixing a cracked header and replacing all ignition components) but recent events proved otherwise.

So I took the XJ into Autoworks in Kennewick WA where Jeff and Tina Bouvier operate.  They run a shop that is well known for their excellent quality and honesty.  Someone I know who set up Robby Gordon's car for road courses several years ago takes his stuff there -- nuff said eh?

Anyway, Jeff called me and advised that #2 was indeed sticking and after a compression test and wet test he's convinced the bottom end is fine but the top end needs an overhaul.  He's going to yank the head, clean it up, dissemble it, magnaflux it (for cracks) and machine it and rebuild it with new valves and springs and if any rods are bent he'll replace those too.

Sadly that's $1100 away from the cabin project but I need to be able to get there and back reliably.

Then I have to take the jeep into Les Swab as I've got a break dragging in the rear and I have their breaks and lifetime warranty.  With luck I'll have the XJ back on the road next week and be pulling a trailer up to the cabin on our way to get it ready for the winter and hunting season :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 09, 2010, 03:03:08 PM
Got word yesterday that the compression overall on the XJ was quite good at 160lbs average (156-165) except #2 which was 52 psi until a wet test which brought it up to 61psi -- indicating the rings are good but the valve isn't sealing.

So, with luck maybe I'll have it back for the weekend!  I hope so, but then I have to get the breaks done and finally, maybe tuesday next week, I'll head back to the cabin and get back to work.

Also visited my back cracker today :D  Got the tweak in my back and neck taken care of so now I should be back on the roof and finishing off the remaining exterior things before the snows come!  Exiting
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 10, 2010, 07:49:41 PM
No joy yet :(

The Jeep won't be ready until Monday now because the timing is slightly off -- the mechanic things it's because the timing chain is stretched (happens when you've got over 200,000 miles on it) and the dizzy needs to get modded slightly to allow them to correct the timing. 

I thought about replacing the timing chain but since I'm not working and he thinks it'll likely be ok for a year or more I'll take a chance and leave it -- the $300 or so to replace it is something I'd rather not spend since it wasn't budgeted.  None of this was mind you and we're pushing $1500 now.

Anyway, I can do it next year me thinks -- right along with the T-Case which is slipping under load in 4 wheel drive.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 12, 2010, 12:56:20 PM
While I wait to get my Jeep back and because of a recent conversation with a board member here I thought I'd post some pictures of my other project :)  A garden that spans one 20x20 spot, a 4x16 spot and a 4x4 spot in our back yard as well as a crab apple tree I planted to make my wife her favorite thing:  Crab Apple Butter :)

In 2007 I was beginning to worry about the economy and having lived through some depressed economies (local) in the last 20 odd years I've learned that it's best to be prepared for the worst while hoping for the best.  At the same time my wife and I have been changing our eating habits to more natural foods in a drive to live healthier (and perhaps longer) lives.

So we started with removing a tree from behind our shed and some arborvitaes and made a garden.

The tree, a birch, was dying of some beetle attack and the yard was in need of work anyway, so it came out and some off the arborvitaes were removed as well.  The year prior I'd actually started a smaller garden in a 4x4 section behind the house and a 4x16 section along the shed so this was really just an addition to those -- a big one!

My first plants were peppers because I wanted to make some Atomic Mushrooms (you have to try them!) and so that first year I learned a lot because of my desire to grow peppers -- this is a lesson to anyone who wants to do this:  if you are excited by what you are doing, you will likely learn a ton!  Those were the hottest cayenne's I've ever had!  But then maybe because they were grown right next to these guys:
The Habanero's have amazing flavor but OH BOY are they hot! :D

One thing we've done this year is to plant over a span of time rather then all at once.  This means I have corn still growing, carrots, rutabaga and parsnip as well as beans and tomatoes and of course peppers :)

Our new crab apple tree produced 13 crab apples this year :)  (actually I found a 14th that our dog was eating so I didn't count it) and I was able to make Crab Apple butter for my wife (though I had to buy 5lbs of apples to augment the sparse crop of crabbies.


Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 12, 2010, 12:59:02 PM

I've also taken up canning (and being out of work I have the time) and my tomato sauce is to die for!

Also did 20 jars of pears from a friends tree :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 15, 2010, 11:59:55 AM
Alright enough nonsense (probably not)!

The XJ is back (for a couple days) and I'm itching to get back to work on the cabin!  I've got the solar panel rack in the front yard and Josh and I cleaned it and then shot primer and painted (Rustoleum) it to protect it.

I plan to fit the panels and check voltages etc before hauling up to the property and want to drill any holes etc that need drilling before getting to our remote spot -- just to make life easier.

Of course, I have to check the breaks on the XJ first though -- the hazards of driving 500+ miles a weekend 2-3 weekends a month for a year eh?

This coming trip is supposed to accomplish a ton and I'm just not certain I can get it done but here's my list anyway:

First day:
1.  Frame and sheet porch

Second day:
1.  Install Solar Power Rack and panels.
2.  Install battery box and batteries
3.  Power up system
4.  Test power system
5.  Charge Batteries

Third Day:
1.  Finish drilling all holes for the wiring and pull all romex in.
2.  Install receptacles, lights, switches and AC load center
3.  Power up load center and test cabin power
4.  Insulate cabin

Fourth day:

1.  Replace #9 screws with #14's on the few panels I goofed up on the roof (don't ask)
2.  Install Ridge vent and cap on roof
3.  Cut away 2" of the lookout/outrigger rafter away from the chimney (need to get a little more clearance so will cut 2" of the rafter off (it's supported by lookouts) and install a metal strap to cover the gap.
4.  Install the gable flashing (that will finish off the roof)
5.  Fix/Finish the Chimney flashing and install the final brace.
6.  Drink Jack Daniels and Holler at the moon!

Fifth day:
1.  Recover from Howling at the moon.
2.  Finish small items left and clean up.
3.  Prep for return trip

I'm looking at this now thinking "Am I'm out of my mind?!?  I haven't done that much work in one trip in a while but I've got two potential jobs that I'm in negotiations for and while neither of them is ideal for me (they are not located in my home town) they both pay better then not working even after maintaining a second place.  So, while I don't want to take a job 240 or 650 miles from home I also don't want to sit on Unemployment (4 months is beyond my sanity point).  So, if I take one of these jobs (or get perhaps) then I won't be around to work on the cabin so much for a LONG time (6 months or longer in one case) other then maybe a weekend or two (if I get the closer job) which would be better spent with my family ENJOYING the cabin :)

Damn work! haha  If only some would come over HERE!  Geez...
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 15, 2010, 02:22:36 PM
Slight change in plans ;)

Day One:
1.   Install pole for Solar Rack
a.   Dig 3' hole
b.   Cement pole in hole & Brace
2.   Frame and sheet porch
a.   Set pier blocks
b.   Install posts and beams
c.   Frame floor
d.   Sheet subfloor
e.   Frame walls

Day Two:
1.   Finish Porch (Roof)
a.   Ridge board and rafters
b.   Sheet roof
c.   Felt roof and porch walls
2.   Install Solar Rack and Panels
a.   Stainless screws and rubber gasket
b.   Grounding wire – may need to run over to well for grounding
c.   Attempt to drive ground rod 8' down
3.   Install Battery Box and Batteries
a.   Wire with auto battery wires – to + and then to copper bars
b.   Vent to outside of porch – need vent
c.   Mount Xantrex on wall above batteries
d.   Mount Iota and AIM beside batteries on shelf
4.   Power up System
a.   Test xantrex and AIM
b.   Test iota charger on generator
c.   Consider building generator box

Day Three:
1.   Finish drilling holes and installing romex
2.   Install receptacles, lights and switches
3.   Install Load Center
4.   Power up Cabin and test cabin power
5.   Power to Composter

Day Four
1.   Replace #9 Screws with #14's on the 4 panels (5?)
2.   Install ridge vent and cap on roof
3.   Cut away 2" of outrigger rafter and install metal strap
4.   Fix/Finish Chimney flashing and install brace

Day Five
1.   Finish up left over items
2.   Return home or prep for return

Day Six
1.   Pack up and return home with Tent Trailer




I've also just ordered the copper bar to make my bus bars out of (1/4"x1" x5' - 2ea.).  I plan to drill them and install much like Don's shown us in his pics.  I felt that was the neatest method of installing the bus bars.  Now I just need to find stand offs to use and some pipe insulation.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Tickhill on September 16, 2010, 04:08:08 AM
OJ, you getting the bus bars from Storm Copper? Can't wait to see the pictures of your solar install! Tickhill
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Tickhill on September 16, 2010, 06:20:34 AM
OJ, I used SQD part# PK32DGTA for my bus bars, It will accept 7 - #6AWG - 350kcmil Cu or Al. SQD's Cu bus bar was considerably higher in $$$.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on September 16, 2010, 08:28:34 AM
Glad to hear you got the ol' Iron Horse (or is that iron mule?)back up and running!  I hope you have a productive time up there!  I know I went up with a long list of things to get done the last time, but barely got anything done - and that probably only happened because of my help (thanks again Frank!).  I think from now on, rather than taking only a 1/2 day off when I go up, I'll take the entire day.  I was still recovering on Saturday from the drive, and work - made it hard.

I know what you mean about the job situation.  I'm guessing the closer job is in my area someplace, so if it is, we'll have to get together for a beer sometime. 

I will be awaiting your AAP (After Action Post) to see how well your panels went up!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 16, 2010, 10:40:30 AM
Quote from: Tickhill on September 16, 2010, 04:08:08 AM
OJ, you getting the bus bars from Storm Copper? Can't wait to see the pictures of your solar install! Tickhill

Got it from online metals.  Went to Storm but couldn't find their 'products' section.  Decided that $21.56/ea wasn't bad for a 5 foot 1/4"x1" bar and I can drill the holes in it.

Just need a stand off for it now -- anyone have any good suggestions?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 16, 2010, 10:44:07 AM
Quote from: JavaMan on September 16, 2010, 08:28:34 AM
Glad to hear you got the ol' Iron Horse (or is that iron mule?)back up and running!  I hope you have a productive time up there!  I know I went up with a long list of things to get done the last time, but barely got anything done - and that probably only happened because of my help (thanks again Frank!).  I think from now on, rather than taking only a 1/2 day off when I go up, I'll take the entire day.  I was still recovering on Saturday from the drive, and work - made it hard.

I know what you mean about the job situation.  I'm guessing the closer job is in my area someplace, so if it is, we'll have to get together for a beer sometime. 

I will be awaiting your AAP (After Action Post) to see how well your panels went up!

I've had those days/weekends for certain but I keep trying to get MORE done and sometimes we're successful.  Right now the temptation is to just lite the fire and kick back...can't do it.

Couple jobs in Seattle but I'm not keen on it -- though if I do take one we'll definitely have to go out for a beer (Jack for me thanks)!


I can't wait to get the solar up and running!!!!  I'm so stoked but I need to build the porch first since I plan to use it as the battery box (more or less)...
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Shawn B on September 16, 2010, 12:36:16 PM
Standoff ideas for copper bus bar:



nylon bolts
plastic/nylon all-thread
solid plastic round rods

don't laugh  ???  rofl

buy a solid plastic cutting board at China-Mart for a couple bucks and cut some small squares out of it for standoffs.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 16, 2010, 01:08:29 PM
Quote from: Shawn B on September 16, 2010, 12:36:16 PM
Standoff ideas for copper bus bar:



nylon bolts
plastic/nylon all-thread
solid plastic round rods

don't laugh  ???  rofl

buy a solid plastic cutting board at China-Mart for a couple bucks and cut some small squares out of it for standoffs.



That's why this is such a great board!  Lots of great ideas.

I hadn't thought of any of those.

I'm no electrician but I think that wood isn't a good conductor but rather an insulator -- am I wrong there?  I'm thinking that bolting the bar to a wood wall board 6" from the other bar will not provide a path from one bar to the other right?

Standoffs to give you room to work and help isolate the bar.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on September 16, 2010, 01:58:22 PM
Wood, when dry, is an insulator. It is not commonly used as an insulator because if wet is can conduct electricity.

So especially in low voltage situations there is practically no danger


Just so you know, a proper insulating electrical standoff does not use pass through bolts. There are standoffs that do have pass through bolts but those are not meant for direct connection to things like bus bars or other live electrical componeents.

(http://ep.yimg.com/ca/I/yhst-18711434844524_2119_40945656)

The two threaded inserts are just that. separate inserts, one at each end. There is no conductive path through the standoff. Available at Storm Copper, assorted sizes.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on September 16, 2010, 02:19:00 PM
I've used nylon or delrin rod stock to make insulated standoffs. Cut a suitable length and drill/tap a hole in each end.

Be aware that nylon is hydrophilic, that is it does absorb water.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Shawn B on September 16, 2010, 03:22:53 PM
If you go with the nylon bolts, my experience with them shows that they work best when installed vertically. More precisely when they are not bearing any load, simply holding something together.

I used them extensively when I used to work on induction furnaces, inverters, SCR's, etc.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 16, 2010, 03:40:09 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on September 16, 2010, 01:58:22 PM
Wood, when dry, is an insulator. It is not commonly used as an insulator because if wet is can conduct electricity.

So especially in low voltage situations there is practically no danger


Just so you know, a proper insulating electrical standoff does not use pass through bolts. There are standoffs that do have pass through bolts but those are not meant for direct connection to things like bus bars or other live electrical componeents.

(http://ep.yimg.com/ca/I/yhst-18711434844524_2119_40945656)

The two threaded inserts are just that. separate inserts, one at each end. There is no conductive path through the standoff. Available at Storm Copper, assorted sizes.



This would be my preference -- where can they be found Don?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on September 16, 2010, 04:21:39 PM
They can be found behind my bus bars.   rofl

or at Storm Copper (http://store.electrical-insulators-and-copper-ground-bars.com/standoff-insulator.html), and probably other places I don't know about.  I used their part number, 1100-A1. Their prices include shipping and handling so the per unit price drops a lot as the quantity increases.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Shawn B on September 16, 2010, 06:13:47 PM
Erik,


If you have the time to cut, drill, and tap then these would save you some money over the pre-made "genuine" one.


http://www.fastenal.com/web/products.ex?N=0&Ntk=Search+All&Ntt=nylon+rods&Ntx=mode+matchallpartial&Nty=1&searchBox=1
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 16, 2010, 06:20:06 PM
Thanks all!  I'll order the Storm product since it's only $26 for 12 of them :)  That ought to be plenty for what I'm doing.

AWESOME
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 17, 2010, 10:20:23 PM
Scored three double paned aluminum windows - 3x3's for the porch today :)  All free with no cracks and 2 have screens :)

Then was informed I can have all the rest of the windows from the house too :D

One is a 10'x5' window and two are 6x4.5' -- I think they would be great for a green house!

I plan to scoop them all up and store them in the shed at the cabin so I can use them for other projects down the road :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on September 17, 2010, 10:33:41 PM
great deal!

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 18, 2010, 11:41:57 AM
Quote from: MountainDon on September 17, 2010, 10:33:41 PM
great deal!



Amen!  I'm pretty stoked.  Picked up the 3 windows yesterday and all are in excellent shape.  Now I'm just trying to get my head around the solar power and porch framing -- I want to complete both in 5 days!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 18, 2010, 11:44:50 AM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin092010.jpg)
OK the wife was harassing me about my porch and cabin drawing because I actually drew most of the porch board by board so you could see it from any angle (all framing).  It looked, she said, like the porch was holding the entire cabin up since I didn't have the foundation on the cabin -- sheesh...

But it gave me an excuse to play with sketchup some more :)

So now the cabin AND porch have a foundation (sans bracing).

This program is fun to play with but when I was using Mastercam years ago it was far far superior!  I could easily have drawn the cabin framing in Mastercam on an old Pentium 133 faster then I can draw it now in Sketchup with a 2700 and 2 gigs of ram!

Sketchup just isn't that bright a program but for free one shouldn't really complain :P
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 18, 2010, 05:35:41 PM
I used a rafter link Don posted in another thread: http://www.blocklayer.com/Roof/GableEng.aspx to calc my porch rafters (thanks Don).

With a 4:12 pitch the rise is just under 2 feet which should be perfect for what I'm trying to do provided I remember to make my walls 7' tall -- it is a porch after all.

I plan to build this porch with 2x8 rafters (now don't laugh!  I expect snow to be dropped on the roof unlike the cabin's 2x6 rafter which I'm not worried in the slightest about) and will install rafter ties (bottom 1/3rd right -- so a little above the wall should be ok in order to give more head room if I hand a light off of one).  Here is my materials list...see anything missing please poke me!

Thanks
Erik
1.   Posts – 4x4x8 PT – 3ea
2.   Blocks – Pier Blocks with saddles – 6ea
3.   Beams – 2x8x12 – 2ea
4.   Braces – 2x4x8 PT – 6ea
5.   Joists – 2x6x8 – 8ea
6.   Flooring – ¾"x4x8 T&G – 2ea
7.   Studs & Plates – 2x4x8 – 40ea
8.   Headers – 2x6x8 – 2ea
9.   Sheeting – 7/16" OSB – 5ea
10.   Rafters – 2x8x10 – 6ea
11.   Ridge board – 2x10x8 – 1ea
12.   Roof Sheeting – 5/8x4x8 OSB – 3ea
13.   Roof Felt – 30lbs – 1ea
14.   Wall Felt – 15lbs – 1ea
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Don_P on September 18, 2010, 08:50:22 PM
(https://i180.photobucket.com/albums/x109/windyhilll/beyerfoundandwallsSept17-1.jpg)

Keep playing with it, I've been quite impressed, there are shortcuts... I only drew one rafter on this sketch, made a component out of it and placed duplicates on 16" centers, etc. This is a plan I've been working on, the heavy timber trusses are supporting a ridgebeam. The hidden view is allowing me to trace the load paths. The drawing has 9 layers at present that can be turned on or off to look through and modify the building. Most blueprint shops support it.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 19, 2010, 10:43:27 AM
Wow Don!

I have been fighting with the way it allows me to move things and cut and paste...getting something on centers is like a nightmare for some reason.  Maybe I need to play with it some more eh?

WEATHER!!!????  What the.....

It's COLD and WET in the Northwest (even in the desert) and it looks like Winter has arrived (just skipped the Fall all together).  Temps at the cabin are down in the low 30's at night (or mids) and temps during the day are in the 50's and chance or rain is "bring a raincoat".

Ducks in the desert are wearing boots and carrying umbrella's and I'm supposed to get to work on the cabin!?

Sheesh...looks like it might be wet work next trip -- good thing the wood stove is in!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: considerations on September 19, 2010, 03:09:54 PM
I like rain...but I like autumn better.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Tickhill on September 20, 2010, 03:34:17 AM
I believe heaven will be in a constant state of autumn! Give me autumn almost year round.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on September 20, 2010, 06:14:56 PM
Quote from: Tickhill on September 20, 2010, 03:34:17 AM
I believe heaven will be in a constant state of autumn! Give me autumn almost year round.

If my dad hasn't fished it out already, I believe that fishing season will run concurrently with hunting season.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 20, 2010, 06:17:36 PM
Frustration!

I'm getting ready for our next trip and realized that I can't get all the porch supplies and truck them up since my trailer can only handle 1200lbs and I've got 6 batteries, the solar rack, solar panels, wheel barrel, cement and windows to carry not to mention our personal gear, food etc etc :(

So it looks like a trip up to unload the trailer then a trip to Omak to Home Depot, then load up the 900+lbs of supplies, then back to the cabin!  Grrrr

So, if all goes well we won't start until Wednesday but perhaps we can kick butt when we start.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Yonderosa on September 21, 2010, 09:51:58 AM
I just got back yesterday from an extended weekend trip.  Temps were mild 50-60's during the day but not dipping down to much at night.  Didn't need the heater at all.  Mostly overcast, some sun breaks, periods of rain and some impressive lightning.

Had a conversation with an old timer in the Colville tribe and learned a bunch from him.  I had noticed that all of the Ponderosa Pine in the area have their inner needles browning.  He said it happens when they have too much rain.  He said it happens every few years around there.  He also gave me one of those you dumb coastie looks and said "You got no idea what kind of treasure you got here do ya?"

I told him I felt mighty blessed to have property in such a beautiful spot.

He said, "That ain't what I'm talkin' about!  Look all around here.  You got a gold mine of 'Shaggy Manes' around here."  He then picked one and took a bite of the stalk.  "They're even better in gravy." 

He knew all kind of things, wished I had a note pad and a pencil.  I hope I've made a friend of him.  The dude is an encyclopedia with little exposure to formal education, a bit grouchy but has a lot of life experience and paid attention along the way.  This here ignorant WETsider got schooled and enjoyed every minute of it.  ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 21, 2010, 10:17:40 PM
Lost internet for most of the day!  Yikes!  However we did manage to get the solar panels ready for the final phase!  INSTALL!!!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Settingup_solarpanel1.jpg)
First had to clamp them to the rack, then carefully drill mounting holes and fit SS nuts and bolts.  Carefully!  I didn't have a way to stop the drill (and didn't feel like making one) so I just carefully drilled all 26 holes :)  No misshaps!  (whiles brow)....

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0018-1.jpg)
And soon they were all sitting on the frame and bolted down.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0017-1.jpg)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0016-3.jpg)
Of course we had to take them all off for shipping but it was nice to fit them and make sure everything would work.  Once we're at the cabin and the pole is in the ground in cured concrete we can mount the rack and install the panels!

615 watts of sun power :)

Also got the copper and standoffs for the battery bank and all the wires for the system -- just need to terminate the 1/0 (solder anyone?)....and we're set :D

Can't wait.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on September 21, 2010, 10:23:20 PM
 [cool]
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 28, 2010, 10:05:29 AM
We've got the power :D

OK, sorta.  Just got back late last night and will report shortly!

Cheers
Erik
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 28, 2010, 01:54:35 PM
So here is the problem:

You can put your solar panels approximately 30-35 feet from your cabin (50 feet of cable and you need some to go under ground and some to go up to the panels and inside of the cabin etc) and to the south of the cabin is a camper that's been there forever...and you have no truck.....the solution?
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Hillbilly.jpg)
Or is it just Hill Billy camping? hahaha

Anyway, we 'got 'er done' and the camper was moved to it's new (temporary) home without too much trouble (ok so Josh had to stand on the tongue to add some weight to it but otherwise....well those straps were useful and the PVC pipe came in handy but.....ahhh never mind!)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on September 28, 2010, 02:28:48 PM
Hey don't laugh too hard. That could be handy some day.   ;D


Actualy I have a friend who has a similar camper on the front end of a long gooseneck flat bed trailer. He carries his modified CJ on the rear portion of the trailer. Pulls it all with a Powerstroke.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on September 28, 2010, 02:51:38 PM
That thing any good inside?  about this time every year I start wishing I had one of those ... would make heading up to my place much easier ... of course, if I actually finished the shed, I wouldn't have to think about a place to sleep  d*
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 28, 2010, 03:47:51 PM
Quote from: JavaMan on September 28, 2010, 02:51:38 PM
That thing any good inside?  about this time every year I start wishing I had one of those ... would make heading up to my place much easier ... of course, if I actually finished the shed, I wouldn't have to think about a place to sleep  d*

Yes.

It's actually not too bad -- needs a little work (and a stove) but if you could use it you would be welcome to come pick it up and loan it as long as needed -- but if you want to bring it back you'll have to ask!!! hahahahahahahahaha

Seriously though, I might be willing to 'loan' the camper out to you.  It needs a tarp on top to keep the water out (we have one of those) or some kind of roof paint/tar to re water proof it.  The bed works, lights work etc.  We just took the stove out for the cabin :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 28, 2010, 03:49:04 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on September 28, 2010, 02:28:48 PM
Hey don't laugh too hard. That could be handy some day.   ;D


Actualy I have a friend who has a similar camper on the front end of a long gooseneck flat bed trailer. He carries his modified CJ on the rear portion of the trailer. Pulls it all with a Powerstroke.

haha Don!  No thanks.  It's already off the trailer and back on it's own 4 legs (and a couple blocks) waiting to be moved (or moved away).....we have a nice mouse infested tent trailer for camping :)  d* ???
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: dmanley on September 28, 2010, 09:12:44 PM
Erik, we were camping last year at a Tn state park and actually saw a family with a set up similiar to this.  The camper was mounted on a flat bed trailer, which gave them some front porch area.  The unit was held onto the trailer with rachet straps.  Talk about redneck.  Kept wanting to get a picture of the thing but they were always sitting on their porch.  They probably would have been proud to have someone take a pic but I just didn't have the nerve to ask.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 28, 2010, 09:33:14 PM
Quote from: dmanley on September 28, 2010, 09:12:44 PM
Erik, we were camping last year at a Tn state park and actually saw a family with a set up similiar to this.  The camper was mounted on a flat bed trailer, which gave them some front porch area.  The unit was held onto the trailer with rachet straps.  Talk about redneck.  Kept wanting to get a picture of the thing but they were always sitting on their porch.  They probably would have been proud to have someone take a pic but I just didn't have the nerve to ask.

haha we used rachet straps to keep it from falling off!

Hey, DManley...is this Don?  My cousin? 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 29, 2010, 01:12:26 AM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/SolarInstall6.jpg)
Once we got the camper moved we began digging our hole.  We needed to go down 3 feet in rocky ground!  It actually took HAND digging at times!  Yes, seriously.  But we managed to get the pole concreted in (5 bags of concrete) and then began to work on the porch.

Once the porch was well underway and we'd given the concrete a couple days to set we installed the rack and panels.
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/SolarInstall.jpg)

We used butyl (sp?) tape as a gasket between the panels and the rack and affixed them with all stainless steel bolts.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/SolarInstall3.jpg)
I didn't have the declination handy so set the poles to just past magnetic for now. 

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/SolarNoon.jpg)
I noticed that we got full sun around 10am and that lasted until about 2pm.  Prior to 10am we had some minor shadows and after about 2-2:3-pm we had some shadows but they are all from trees that will be turned into lumber eventually.

I think we'll get about 6 hours of sun in the spring and fall...not sure about the winter yet.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/SolarInstall2.jpg)
Our backwoods solar set up ;)  Actually this is more of an R&D type install and I'll be replacing some of the wiring and shortening the 1/0 cables by quite a bit.  I changed much in my original plan but for now it all works and the batteries are on float :)  By around 4:30pm I watched the bank go from 12.54 vdc to 12.58vdc in a very short time as the controller took over and the panels provided the charge -- this AFTER the time I expected useful light :D

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/SolarInstall4.jpg)
I finally managed to get the porch cleaned up and the temporary box more or less installed -- we were 4 hours past scheduled departure and I was very upset with the mess outside but alas, time was no longer a luxury so we rigged up and headed out in the road warrior for another 4 1/2 hour drive home.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/SolarInstall5.jpg)
I did get this last shot however, at just after 6pm on our way out...how I wish I had another day!!!

I plan to head back next week to clean up and finish the solar install....

but for now :D  We have POWER!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Tickhill on September 29, 2010, 03:59:09 AM
OJ, looking good! First class adjustable mount.  [cool]
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on September 29, 2010, 08:31:32 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on September 28, 2010, 03:47:51 PM
Quote from: JavaMan on September 28, 2010, 02:51:38 PM
That thing any good inside?  about this time every year I start wishing I had one of those ... would make heading up to my place much easier ... of course, if I actually finished the shed, I wouldn't have to think about a place to sleep  d*

Yes.

It's actually not too bad -- needs a little work (and a stove) but if you could use it you would be welcome to come pick it up and loan it as long as needed -- but if you want to bring it back you'll have to ask!!! hahahahahahahahaha

Seriously though, I might be willing to 'loan' the camper out to you.  It needs a tarp on top to keep the water out (we have one of those) or some kind of roof paint/tar to re water proof it.  The bed works, lights work etc.  We just took the stove out for the cabin :)

Well, one of the reasons I haven't yet pulled the trigger on acquiring one of these already is that if I did, it would mean I'd have to actually clean out the back of my truck!  So don't hold your breath on me coming to "borrow" it   ;D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 29, 2010, 10:43:12 AM
Quote from: Tickhill on September 29, 2010, 03:59:09 AM
OJ, looking good! First class adjustable mount.  [cool]

Thanks :)  My neighbor built it after we discussed what I was looking for -- cost was about 15% of what it costs to buy one!!!

I did break the stop nut for the rotating head though when I tried to tighten it too much :(  He'd welded the nut top and bottom and it worked fine until I decided I wanted it really tight  d*  So now I'm hoping it stays put until I can get someone with a welder up there to weld the nut all the way around.

Otherwise the mount works perfectly :)  Easy to rotate and tilt!  I can tilt those suckers at least 90 degrees!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 29, 2010, 10:44:17 AM
Quote from: JavaMan on September 29, 2010, 08:31:32 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on September 28, 2010, 03:47:51 PM
Quote from: JavaMan on September 28, 2010, 02:51:38 PM
That thing any good inside?  about this time every year I start wishing I had one of those ... would make heading up to my place much easier ... of course, if I actually finished the shed, I wouldn't have to think about a place to sleep  d*

Yes.

It's actually not too bad -- needs a little work (and a stove) but if you could use it you would be welcome to come pick it up and loan it as long as needed -- but if you want to bring it back you'll have to ask!!! hahahahahahahahaha

Seriously though, I might be willing to 'loan' the camper out to you.  It needs a tarp on top to keep the water out (we have one of those) or some kind of roof paint/tar to re water proof it.  The bed works, lights work etc.  We just took the stove out for the cabin :)

Well, one of the reasons I haven't yet pulled the trigger on acquiring one of these already is that if I did, it would mean I'd have to actually clean out the back of my truck!  So don't hold your breath on me coming to "borrow" it   ;D

Dag nammit!  ??? d*

Actually, that's ok, but if you want to borrow it I'd be happy to let you, though I would actually want it back!  We like having it actually and hope to fix it up some day.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Solar Burrito on September 29, 2010, 11:31:54 AM
Wow, what a power setup, very impressed I am.  [cool] Over 600 watts and all that power and being in Eastern WA you're going to get all the power you need, way more I suspect. crank up the Disco lights and the fog machine it's time for a vulgar display of solar power../  ;D haha maybe I got carried away but this will be a template for my ideal setup eventually.

Our new cabin is tall like yours and is currently blocking our 75watt panel on the shed.   d* We haven't run out of juice
though... not enough lights to drain it...

Dang you got alot of work done, nice work.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 29, 2010, 12:22:09 PM
Quote from: Solar Burrito on September 29, 2010, 11:31:54 AM
Wow, what a power setup, very impressed I am.  [cool] Over 600 watts and all that power and being in Eastern WA you're going to get all the power you need, way more I suspect. crank up the Disco lights and the fog machine it's time for a vulgar display of solar power../  ;D haha maybe I got carried away but this will be a template for my ideal setup eventually.

Our new cabin is tall like yours and is currently blocking our 75watt panel on the shed.   d* We haven't run out of juice
though... not enough lights to drain it...

Dang you got alot of work done, nice work.

Thanks :)

Really, it was MountainDon that got me going and taught me a ton -- and of course I studied his threads on solar power extensively :D  But I'm still learning a ton!

I used to build MW Backhaul sites for the cell carriers and it often involved wiring up DC power systems so that part of this job was pretty simple compared to those larger systems.  However, as usual I forgot too much!

My list of things to fix:

1.  Bring at least 20 feet of 10awg wire (to replace various other gauges -- all bigger -- that I scrounged at the last minute.
2.  Cut and re-terminate the 1/0 to fit better.
3.  Put the ground rod in and run grounds to everything (our neighbor tells us it will work out in the rocks because the ground rod will just wind it's way down past them all -- like a corkscrew).
4.  Clean up the darn mess!
5.  Seal off the porch and finish the gable end as well as rafter ties.
6.  Buck up the fallen trees and get the branches ready for burning in the winter

And so much more!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 30, 2010, 06:08:14 PM
Looks like I'm making a quick trip to the cabin this weekend!  I just got hired in a new job and will start Tuesday (my choice so I could go clean up the cabin and get the door on the porch)....less time to work on the cabin but that's ok :) :D

BACK TO WORK!  WHOOHOO!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on September 30, 2010, 06:38:12 PM
 [cool]  Happy for you here!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 30, 2010, 10:29:00 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on September 30, 2010, 06:38:12 PM
[cool]  Happy for you here!

Thanks Don :D  c*

It should be fun stuff; all Ethernet over fiber networks.  I'll start out fusion splicing fiber routes and doing 'as builts' and then move over to system commissioning and programming (all things I've done before except I've not spliced outside of training)...the awesome thing is that splicers make decent $$ :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on September 30, 2010, 10:56:14 PM
Do you still have to pass a color blindness test?  There were too many colors and combinations in the old copper wire systems for me to be able to sort them out.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on October 01, 2010, 12:46:34 AM
Erik great job, good to hear you found work!  Close by?  Your porch - I think you will find, will have the most functionality of any of the designs cussed and discussed.  It looks very good, goes well with the cabin.  It will certainly help keep the snow away from the door in the winter time, should decide to stage a little winter get away.  Looks like your days were very full as you had planed.  You power project seemed to really have come together well in the larger scope of things.   Your weather I see is cooperating nicely.  Ours down here in southern Idaho pretty normal for this time of year.  Indian Summer and in eighties and even nineties a few days.  Hardly a cloud in the sky... [cool]       
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on October 01, 2010, 11:44:50 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on September 30, 2010, 06:08:14 PM
Looks like I'm making a quick trip to the cabin this weekend!  I just got hired in a new job and will start Tuesday (my choice so I could go clean up the cabin and get the door on the porch)....less time to work on the cabin but that's ok :) :D

BACK TO WORK!  WHOOHOO!

Congrats!  I'm sure you'll bemoan the fact (like me) that now you don't have a lot of time for cabin jobs ... but the money coming in is always nice!  ;D

So details, man! Details!

Is it close to home or are you going to have to commute on the weekends?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 04, 2010, 09:52:40 PM
Just got in from a whirlwind trip to the cabin to try to button up a few things before starting the new job :)

The new job is at WindWave Communications and I'll be a 'Network Technician' (of sorts).  Going back to fiber back-haul stuff primarily (Ethernet over Fiber) and will start out splicing and working outside plant.  The job is close enough that I'll be home nightly (unless I have to travel to Eastern Oregon then I'll probably stay a night or two depending on the work).  Seems like a good gig :)

I've got pics and details of the cabin trip coming soon -- thanks all!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 04, 2010, 10:57:15 PM
We arrived Friday around 7:30pm (dark this time of year) and Josh (step son) asked if we could turn on a light!  So, we temp wired up the inverter and plugged in the drop lite/trouble lite with a CFL in it and...
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0017-2.jpg)
Inverter

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0018-2.jpg)
WE HAVE LIGHT!

The little CFL did well by itself actually, but we also lit up the gas lamps so we could move in for the weekend with plenty of light.

Once we were moved in Josh headed into the loft and kicked on the old TV and Playstation to enjoy a little 'Dark Alliance' before bed without having to worry about turning the generator off when he was done :)  He likes that  [cool]

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0022-1.jpg)
Not the best shot but hey, we have power :)

I can't tell you how satisfying it is to have your own power source!  No matter how much work you need to do to complete the install it's just darn nice :)

Saturday we got busy cleaning the place up and noticed a tree blocking the solar panels at 10:30am.  Since we planned on removing that tree anyway I got out the Huskvarna 455 and dropped it RIGHT where I wanted it :) Growing up in logging towns has it's advantages ;) Since we were at it we also bucked off the branches on a previous tree and bucked it into cant sized logs for milling at a later date.

We then got busy and installed our new door.  We'd goofed on the framing and framed the door opening 2" too short so pulled out the sawzall and pugged it into the solar power to cut out the framing and then fixed the issue -- so nice.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0029-1.jpg)

Sunday we had big plans but somehow I derailed those and got pounding in the ground rod.  At five feet down Josh and I ran out of steam and pliable earth!!!
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0043.jpg)

We could not budge the rod anymore so gave up for another day.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0050-2.jpg)
I did some cleanup work on the solar setup but still need to install some wire nuts, conduit, ground rod, clean up the wiring, shorten some of the 1/0 and on and on but for now it works.

Oh and who on earth puts robertson screws in electronics?  The iota charger has robertson screws so I couldn't hook it up because my drivers were 240 miles away....grrrrrr

Finally, we got the ridge vent in and I began installing the ridge cap...and realized I could not properly install it :(  d*  I will have to put scaffolding up I guess because there is no way to sit on it (I'd crush it) or hang a ladder off it (crush it again) so I screwed the ends on and got as many scews in as I could then placed the center on by standing on a ladder leaning against the roof from the porch while my son held it -- don't ask.

I think it will work for the winter.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0057-1.jpg)
We left the place after some cleanup and packing up all the main saws etc (hated leaving them up there for the last year and since we don't need them there they are safe and sound at home now!) and pulled the mouse infested tent trailer back home for repairs and winterizing (and introduction to the cat).

Was a good weekend though and I look forward to the next trip since it will involve very little work on the cabin -- just some minor clean up -- and lots of tramping in the woods looking for deer! :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on October 04, 2010, 11:12:03 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on October 04, 2010, 10:57:15 PM

Oh and who on earth puts robertson screws in electronics?  The iota charger has robertson screws so I couldn't hook it up because my drivers were 240 miles away....grrrrrr

Hmmm... mine uses hex socket. Probably different parts suppliers.

Back home in Canada, 25 years ago, Robertson were common in household wiring devices. I actually like them better than Phillips.


The porch looks nice.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Shawn B on October 05, 2010, 10:31:39 AM
Must fell really good landing a new job, and finishing off all the projects at the cabin  :)


I have a question, what is the big white box next to the charge controller ? I'm thinking disconnect ? Don't forget to vent the battery box to the outdoors also.


The porch looks like it will turn out real nice.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Don_P on October 05, 2010, 12:37:19 PM
I tend to either straddle the ridge or walk the screwheads along one side with a slack rope over the far side. Those are both pretty taxing. I've also set blocks of nailed together 2x on either side of the ridge and run a rope overtop to ladders that are tied together over the ridge (Tie the ladders down at the bottoms). That works but is a hassle. I've seen drawings or pics  ??? of a lightweight seat made of scrap ply that straddles the ridge and bears on either side, leaving room for the ridgecap to move around underneath. With 2 of these you can leapfrog your way down the roof.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on October 05, 2010, 01:59:19 PM
Quote from: Shawn B on October 05, 2010, 10:31:39 AM


I have a question, what is the big white box next to the charge controller ? I'm thinking disconnect ?


That appears to be a Midnight Solar disconnect cabinet.  Available with different sized DC rated breakers.  


Re: the ground rod; it might be advisable to add a second rod in another location and hope for better luck. It sounds like that one hit a rock dead center and no amount of pounding will help, unless the rock gives in and cracks. Connect one rod to the other and leave a single ground wire run to the system.


The batteries are on the porch? Is that right? Are those 4 vent holes in the back panel, behind the batteries? 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Shawn B on October 05, 2010, 04:16:16 PM
RE Oljarhead: Had to look up "Robertson Screws". Around here everyone just calls them 'square drive'.

Also on the ground rod. When I was living in Montana I saw electricians bury the ground rod horizontally, say 1 foot or more deep. Sometimes they used a braided copper cable and buried several feet of it along with the rod. This was in very rocky ground.

RE MTDon: After a short search you  are right that is a Midnight Solar disconnect cabinet. It looks like Eric has a 12 volt branch circuit set up too.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 05, 2010, 09:45:18 PM
Thanks guys!  I'll try to answer some questions as I got in late from the new job (had a GREAT! Day :) ) and had to make up some chow for the kids and I (wife is at work still) and just sat down.

OK first :)  YES!  It feels AWESOME to be blessed with both a new job and to have prepped the cabin for the winter (mostly).  My wife wants me to order the roofing for the porch to get it done before the snow! :D  Gotta love her!!!  I LOVE ordering new cabin stuff! :D  [cool]

Midnight Solar disco box with 250amp breaker.  I've since learned that the breaker matches the 2500 watt inverter and it's 1/0 cable because it can draw 208amps at 2500 watts.  So it makes sense.

To the left is of course the Xantrex C40 charge controller and on the cabin wall is the AIMS 2500 watt modified inverter (CFL's work nicely with it :D ).  Then below that is the Iota 750watt charger that will run off the generator.

I'll be pulling 12vdc for the composter and a ceiling fan and perhaps a small stereo someday -- and who knows what else -- still working on that.

The holes in the battery box were originally drilled for wiring but there was no way I was going to get the 1/0 through them so left them.  For venting I plan to run a large vent through the side of the box to the outside via the porch wall.

The idea was to provide security (somewhat anyway) and warmth to the battery box and solar power stuff -- the warmth via the sun and greenhouse effect (crossing fingers).  The porch gets quite warm because of all the windows and I'm hoping with insulation it might keep the batteries from freezing.

On the ground rod -- THANKS!  Don you are the man :D  I'll be pounding a second in somewhere nearby and if that doesn't work then I'll try the Montana special  ;D :o of laying something down a foot or more horizontally.

I've also got a Midnight solar box outside the porch which I'll post later.  So basically the panels are in series providing 60vdc (open) to the outside box.  There is a breaker there for them and the box is designed to add more sets of panels without having to add another box -- just plug in another breaker -- so if I wanted to add 3 more of the same panels/same votlage etc I could add a breaker and tie them together in the box.  I've left pull tape in the conduit going to the panels -- did anyone notice the goof there *snicker*?

Then the cables run to a breaker in the main disco box and the C40 and to the batteries etc...I'll have to post a diagram soon.

One thing I've learned:  don't attempt to run the 370 watt AC heater/dehydrator for the compost toilet system without planning to run the generator soon or installing a boatload more panels and batteries!!!  I wanted to test it out and soon discovered it drained the bank fast!  I then read it was drawing 370 watts not 3.5!  I guess the AC fan is 3.5 but the heater takes it up to 370 -- I won't be using that unless I'm running the generator.

Anyway, cheers!
Erik
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Tickhill on October 06, 2010, 04:21:09 AM
Erik, when you get the diagram done, I will be honored to do a Visio layout for you. It makes it alot easier to explain/troubleshoot if a large layout is printed and mounted nearby the system.

I had my first visitor to Dad's shop over the weekend to check out the solar panels. The gentleman was 73 years old and he has started putting some panels in place and "experimenting".

I certainly will be glad when engineers get capacitors to the point that you can meter their output and we can start using them instead/with batteries... Could you imagine charging your capacitor bank fully in a few seconds of full sun!

Enjoy that cabin!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on October 06, 2010, 09:35:54 AM
Quote from: Tickhill on October 06, 2010, 04:21:09 AM
imagine charging your capacitor bank fully in a few seconds of full sun!


I understand how capacitors build their charge very rapidly; no issue with that. Their ability to be put through unlimited (?) charge/discharge cycles would be a huge benefit by itself, when costs are reasonable. But here's where I get lost with that recharging in a few seconds thing. The capacitors can only charge as fast as the amount of power available. PV modules have a fixed maximum output; so much sun and so many square feet of surface area = so much electrical energy. So unless there is a change in PV module technology as well, it is still going to take more time than a few seconds to charge the capacitors, isn't it?  Or one could increase the number of PV modules, but then they would sit there un-used once the capacitors are fully charged; that's a waste. That's assuming the super/ultra capacitor storage system is storing the same total amount of energy as the present battery bank.  Or what am I missing?  ??? 

I believe we would reach full charge quicker with capacitors than with batteries, as the capacitors would do away with the very slow last phase of battery charging. However, the replacement of the bulk of the used energy would be governed by the power available, which is limited by the PV module. So I think we'd still be looking at hours to recharge, not seconds.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Tickhill on October 06, 2010, 12:41:01 PM
MtnDon, I guess what I was alluding to was that capacitors reach their charged capacity in a shorter relative time frame than batteries reach theirs.
Although it is an apples/oranges comparision, they both store and release energy, I read an article that stated this was going to be the next big energy storage device once the metered discharge was conquered.
Price may be prohibitive though.
If we could figure out how to product electricity from a dark sky...



Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on October 06, 2010, 02:43:55 PM
Quote from: Tickhill on October 06, 2010, 12:41:01 PM
MtnDon, I guess what I was alluding to was that capacitors reach their charged capacity in a shorter relative time frame than batteries reach theirs.
Although it is an apples/oranges comparision, they both store and release energy, I read an article that stated this was going to be the next big energy storage device once the metered discharge was conquered.
Price may be prohibitive though.
If we could figure out how to product electricity from a dark sky...





ZPM   ;D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 17, 2010, 10:40:39 PM
Just got back from a weekend at the cabin :)  We managed to get the rest of the drywall up and prepped for mudding and got about 1/2 of the lower portion of the cabin insulated which was nice since it hit 20 degrees Friday night and 18 Saturday night!  We kept warm with the woodstove going all weekend (all weekend!) and had a great dinner of buffalo chili that was warmed in the Dutch Oven on the stove for a few hours :)

Finished that off with some Single Barrel JD and Chess :)

Was a good weekend -- also spent some time walking around in the woods in Orange with Rifles pretending to hunt but what we were really doing was enjoying the mountain air and looking forward to getting back to the cabin to sit by the wood stove :D

No pics this time but maybe next!

My new job is of course taking me away from the both the PC and thinking and posting about cabins but I suspect it won't be long before I have time to do more and tell more.

Cheers
Erik

PS.  The solar power is running great :D  Batteries at full power when we arrived and remained there all weekend pretty much!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on October 18, 2010, 12:02:45 PM
Sounds like a sweet weekend, jarhead...

I plan on heading up to my place in a couple weeks with the bow and a few arrows to pretend that I'm hunting elk.  Then, I hope the weekend after Thanksgiving to do it again and pretend to hunt deer.

Of course, I won't have as warm a place to hang out in!  It sounds like your place is turning into a very nice retreat.  Good job!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on October 18, 2010, 07:33:25 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead link=topic=7672.msg124215#msg124215 date=1287373239

20 degrees
/quote]

Yeow!  We haven't even hit freezing yet, close but that doesn't count.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 20, 2010, 08:55:15 AM
Good luck Java!  You see, you shoulda picked up that camper from me ;)

Don, the coldest it's been when I was there was 10 degrees last December but I know it can get a LOT colder then that.  This year is expected to be colder with a lot more snow and the next three are supposed to be MUCH colder!!!

Gotta get that insulation in!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on October 20, 2010, 01:27:18 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on October 20, 2010, 08:55:15 AM
Good luck Java!  You see, you shoulda picked up that camper from me ;)

Don, the coldest it's been when I was there was 10 degrees last December but I know it can get a LOT colder then that.  This year is expected to be colder with a lot more snow and the next three are supposed to be MUCH colder!!!

Gotta get that insulation in!

Yeah, I've asked for snowshoes for Christmas!  I figure if I ever want to get up into the place before July next year, I might need them! And a snowmobile is a bit too much money to spend. Two years ago I still couldn't make it up there on Memorial Day weekend - I got to within about 3/4 mile and couldn't go any further.

The historical data for my place says the low average is around 5-10 degrees.  There are a few outliers at below zero temps, but not many ... maybe that's because I'm south of you? d*
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: upa on October 20, 2010, 02:51:01 PM
5-10 degrees  ??? that's like sweater weather or least open jacket weather in the Prairies(honestly, I'm not kidding :(). My cabin thermometer was down to -26F more often than not last year.

Ok, now we need to hear from you Alaskan types on how much colder it gets :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Woodswalker on October 20, 2010, 09:01:06 PM
Yo Erik,

Was over at my cabin this past week about 50 miles E of you.  Got to 17 degrees, and I was taking stuff out of the RV fridge to keep it from freezing so solid!  Nearly finished installing laminate flooring.  Moved some rustic furniture, rugs, bunkbed, etc. out of storage trailer and into the cabin.  Really starting to enjoy the place now.  Good insulation makes a huge difference.  Used the small woodstove on cold mornings until 10 AM or so, when sun took over warming things up.  Bagged a nice spike buck Monday morning.  Closed everything up for the winter.

Glad you guys got out into the woods some.  Really good to hear your solar system is working well.  Am sure the enthusiasm in your posts is motivating others to give it a go.

Steve
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 21, 2010, 09:46:09 AM
Snowshoes!  I told my wife I want a couple sets for 'just in case'....but big agressive V groove chains and 4 wheel drive will get you there!  Thanks to Don and others here for convincing me to get those chains when I ran into 4 INCHES of solid ice on our road...ya it was a piece of cake once the chains went on :)

Alaskan cold?  Don't know about them but when my family moved to BC in 1967 it dropped to -59 degrees at our cabin in Vanderhoof BC WITHOUT FACTORING WIND CHILL.  Dawson Creek hit -75 and killed all power in town.  Several lost their lives :(  That winter we lived in an A Frame cabin with no insulation and a wood furnace and wood cook stove...ice formed INSIDE and we slept above the wood stove to stay warm and not freeze to death (literally).  The next winter we stayed in a friends cabin that actually had insulation but it made little difference (so it must not have been good)...I'll post a pic of that cabin here :)

In Hazleton when I was 14 we had a lengthy period at -35 to -40 and I was so used to it that I thought it was beautiful when the air froze :)  Yes air freezes...but we lived in a small house by then.

Woodsman:  you lucky dog!  We didn't see a single Buck and this weekend my son wants to chase them in the wind farms out of Dayton so we're headed there Saturday Morning.  We'll hunt a draw we know of in the AM and the wind farms in the PM then do it again on Sunday.  We GPS'd some bucks the last two years so we know where they are but they tend to stroll up out of the brush (where we can't go) right before dusk...sneaky buggers!

Honestly, thanks to MountainDon I really went full steam on the solar (and probably drove Don nuts for months on end -- thanks for putting up with me Don!) and I'm ecstatic :)  Don's and Glenn have been a HUGE help!  ANd I have MUCH to learn yet, but it's up and running and I can tell you, it isn't really that hard to do.  It's the $$$ that makes it tough if you are on a tight budget, but it's worth it!

Cheers
Erik
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on October 21, 2010, 07:36:13 PM
Snow shoes. We have MSR Denali snow shoes.

I like them as there are different extension tails available to allow for different weights of user (&pack or no pack) and differing snow conditions. Metal 'grabbers' for ice traction. They work well for us. For those who are more adventuresome, steeper trails, sidehills etc) there is another model with more metal grippers.

(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51YSYYNC2KL._AA300_.jpg)

We got ours through REI but they haven't got them at present. Amazon does though
http://www.amazon.com/MSR-Denali-Classic/dp/B0009ROF32][url]http://www.amazon.com/MSR-Denali-Classic/dp/B0009ROF32 (http://[url)[/url]
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on October 21, 2010, 08:45:49 PM
Yeah, but do they have enough extensions for my weight? ???  Those might reach all the way across the mountains to my house! d*

I am working on getting rid of the excess, but it's not going very fast (I married a good cook!)

(We now return you to your regular oljarhead thread)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on October 22, 2010, 06:25:00 AM

http://www.sportsmansguide.com/net/search/search.aspx?r=MainHeader+KW+Box&s=&a=browse&k=snowshoes
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 22, 2010, 09:02:12 AM
Quote from: JavaMan on October 21, 2010, 08:45:49 PM
Yeah, but do they have enough extensions for my weight? ???  Those might reach all the way across the mountains to my house! d*

I am working on getting rid of the excess, but it's not going very fast (I married a good cook!)

(We now return you to your regular oljarhead thread)

At 260lbs in my birthday suit (scary sight!) I'm sure I need the XXXXXL set!  But I plan to look into it :P

Speaking of losing weight, I found a way that works well for me anyway :)

1.  Drink two 20-24oz bottles of water mixed with ACT a day
2.  Skip lunch 3 days in a row and then eat whatever the heck I want on the 4
3.  Repeat until you've lost enough weight
4.  Repeat as needed to keep the weight off.

I dropped from 280 to 260 in about 2 to 3 months and have kept that 20 lbs off for 3 years.  Doc tells me all my blood work has improved (High BP) and to keep it up -- though I know ACT is part of the reason.

You can check out ACT here: http://www.drinkactweb.com/19001444

I don't normally mention it and hope it's ok to do so now but this is a small business that I got into about 4 years ago and while I don't really make any money off of it (I suppose I could if I actually tried to) I drink the product twice daily and the doctor keeps saying:  I don't know what you are doing, but you keep doing it!!!

Sign up is a bit of a pain in the rear but signing up (for free) gets you the product cheaper ($1/drink with the Act Packs) -- just scroll to bottom repeated and hit 'skip this step'.  Or you can try it retail if you want.

I am also willing to send free samples to anyone who doesn't want to go through the hassle of signing up to try it but keep it to a dull roar please becuase I'm sending what I drink!  So it's MY SUPPLIES hehehehe.....and I need it to keep cabin building :D :D :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 28, 2010, 01:32:33 PM
Once again I have to thank MountainDon for his fantastic ideas and excellent engineering!  [cool]

I now think I know how I'm going to improve composting waste (Sunmar Centrex AC/DC 2000 model) during the winter!  I've been working on the enclosure for it and plan to complete it soon and have decided that Don's food heating idea is for me! :D

So, I'll steel the 6 gallon hot water tank from the camper (or get another one) and install it inside the enclosure with the Composting tank for the toilet.  I'll set it up with the pilot light running whenever we aren't at the cabin and will turn on the hot water when we are there (to improve composting).  I'll super insulate the enclosure also and use a heat exchanger (oil cooler/tranny cooler) to keep the enclosure warm enough to prevent the composter from freezing.

Also while at the cabin I can crank up the generator for 4 hours in the AM daily (if need be) in order to run the dehydrator which has an additional heater.

Between these steps (and insulating the vent stacks and sewage pipe) I should be able to continue composting long after daily temps don't get above 55 degrees :)

Thanks Don!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Shawn B on October 28, 2010, 03:10:45 PM
Erik,

You may be able to get a few feet of left over hydronic baseboard, just the copper pipe and fin, from a local plumbing and HVAC contractor for free or scrap price.  Some outfits throw out or recycle pipe if it is not a certain length. Get a few short lengths and solder them together. Either way good luck.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on October 28, 2010, 04:58:10 PM
Or maybe something like this, if you can figure out how to get it and some tile under the composter...

http://www.homedepot.com/Flooring-Under-Floor-Heating/h_d1/N-5yc1vZ1ximZapte/R-100607080/h_d2/ProductDisplay?langId=-1&storeId=10051&catalogId=10053
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 10, 2010, 10:06:52 AM
Josh and I made it up last weekend to try our hand at Elk hunting...this meant we spent loads of time just trying to find out WHERE the Elk were.  We did eventually find an area that looked very promising...at the end of hunting light on Saturday :(

But we have a place to start at next year I guess :)

One person once said to me "don't you just go out in the woods with your rifle, shoot your deer and then go home"?  Ya sure, and pigs fly too!

Anyway, we have been burning less then idea wood in the stove and it began to breath less efficiently by the end of the weekend.  So, upon coming home I read the manual and discovered I can do a few things:

1.  Clean out the air outlet/inlet (??) from ashes etc.
2.  Remove the ashes daily before refueling.
3.  Get some dang seasoned wood instead of burning somewhat still green pine.

Not sure if I'll get to #3 soon, but I've got a chimney brush and will clean the stove air inlets next trip.

We also managed to score a small sink and counter from work yesterday which will serve as a temp counter/cupboard/sink for the cabin until we have time to put in a larger counter etc.

And finally, we've decided that while the camper stove works, it's a bit dangerous becuase it needs to be rebuilt and leaks a little -- so you can't leave the propane on.  So we're thinking of looking at the Sears stoves that I think Don and Yonderosa bought. 

Besides, we'd have an oven then too :)

Cheers
Erik
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on November 10, 2010, 10:31:22 AM
With our VC Aspen I've found that if I pull and dump the ash tray every day I have virtually no ash spilling out of it and into the bottom area where it fits. When the ash piles up in the ash tray it can then be knocked off the top when the tray is extracted. In the depths of winter when we might be burning more wood I sometimes dump the ash tray twice. Dry wood makes a big difference.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: considerations on November 11, 2010, 01:39:10 PM
Dry wood makes a big difference. .....actually, its pretty much the whole show.   

I rattled my faith in my ability to get a fire going when I started camping in the cabin.  I had a heck of a time. 

After a few months, the cord I was working through got plenty dry....and fires became a piece o cake.. duh.

This year I stacked the first cord in June.  When the weather got cold, it was ready to go and fire tending is a breeze, and I'm going through a fair amount.  I think this winter will be colder than the last one.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Shawn B on November 12, 2010, 03:04:09 PM
Erik,

Did you install the fresh air intake yet? That may help things a little.

I second what Mt Don, and Considerations said, burn the most seasoned wood first.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on November 12, 2010, 03:34:51 PM
Erik, Trying to burn wet/green wood can be an exercise in frustration as well as accelerating the need to clean to chimney more often.

Our cabin range is a 20" Hotpoint we got through Lowes. There are many models. From what I could tell from reading do not get one with electronic ignition. Even though the burners can be lit with a flame when there is no power, the oven won't work at all, at least on one of the ones I investigated.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on November 12, 2010, 05:38:10 PM
Erik,

Sorry I didn't make it up there last weekend - I was caught up in a remodel of the downstairs bathroom!  Since I'm off work, there are a bunch of "Honey-do's" that are magically appearing.  So I figured I'd head up this weekend, but the truck tells me otherwise. it is missing badly.  I thought it might be one of the COP (Coil Over Plug)  modules but apparently not, so now I'm trying to track down what it actually is.

If I can't find it by Tuesday I have an appointment with the local garage.

I still am planning on trying to get in up there for late archery deer season in December.

Sounds like you had a good time, tho.  Sorry to hear that no elk were seen.  They were all probably hiding at my place, knowing that I wasn't going to be there.  d*
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 13, 2010, 05:54:26 PM
Thanks All,

Being an old camper I've had no trouble firing the stove.  With my set up it requires priming first but I've got that down (just put 3-5 crumpled pages of newspaper in the back of the stove, light with the door open and let burn out.

I try to use the driest kindling I've got and rarely have an issue.

But, perhaps two things got me:

1.  I didn't empty the ash tray every day -- for some reason I thought it better to let the fire die off first -- not so!
2.  Burning pine isn't great to begin with, burning wet pine is worse still!  But it's what I've for for now.  My neighbor tells me that it's ok as long as it's burned hot.

I bought a chimney brush etc so am set to clean regularily but didn't expect the loss of incoming air!  The draft is working fine as long as the door is ajar but that won't do so next trip I'm pulling the ash tray and air plate and cleaning everything before starting a fire.

I didn't get the intake installed yet either but haven't been concerned since the cabin is open at the peak until the ceiling is installed etc....but perhaps it might help anyway?

Anyway, I'm drying wood as we speak but it will take 12-18 months before it's truly cured so I may just have to break down and buy a cord or two of seasoned firewood...ug
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on November 13, 2010, 07:45:17 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on November 13, 2010, 05:54:26 PM
Thanks All,

Being an old camper I've had no trouble firing the stove.  With my set up it requires priming first but I've got that down (just put 3-5 crumpled pages of newspaper in the back of the stove, light with the door open and let burn out.

I try to use the driest kindling I've got and rarely have an issue.

But, perhaps two things got me:

1.  I didn't empty the ash tray every day -- for some reason I thought it better to let the fire die off first -- not so!

Seldom empty the ashes out until I see that the loading capacity is being deminished.  Even then I don't completely empty them all and leave an inch or so in the bottom as insulation and protection for the bottom of the stove to keep it from burning out prematurely.

2.  Burning pine isn't great to begin with, burning wet pine is worse still!  But it's what I've for for now.  My neighbor tells me that it's ok as long as it's burned hot. 

Burn very little of large pine.  Only use some small stuff as kindlin.  If it is extremely dry it will burn without too much cresote but wet I would try to stay away from

I bought a chimney brush etc so am set to clean regularily but didn't expect the loss of incoming air!  The draft is working fine as long as the door is ajar but that won't do so next trip I'm pulling the ash tray and air plate and cleaning everything before starting a fire.

Cold fllues will not operate efficently.  So unless you have burned alot of wet or semi wet at low draft it is doubtfull that the flue needs cleaned this soon after installation.  If you can start a light fire and leave the door open until the hot air draws up it should burn better until it is left to go out.  If I am lucky and catch a good day mid season I might try to clean mine.  If not it will burn from Mid Oct to March.  Occassionally if it has died down I may take the elbow/damper assembly off and give it a quick clean.  I have an alternate to divert the smoke when I clean the primary joints.
I didn't get the intake installed yet either but haven't been concerned since the cabin is open at the peak until the ceiling is installed etc....but perhaps it might help anyway?

Anyway, I'm drying wood as we speak but it will take 12-18 months before it's truly cured so I may just have to break down and buy a cord or two of seasoned firewood...ug

If you can split a portion of it smaller it will take less time to dry out.  Yes it may take a little more wood to fill it up but smaller pieces do dry faster.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on November 13, 2010, 08:58:05 PM
For John and everyone else's info... The VC Aspen has an ash tray under the firebox bottom. The firebox cast iron plate has slots for air to enter from underneath and for ashes to fall through. I think VC should have built it with a slightly deeper pan, but they did not. Under that is the cast iron stove bottom, then the sheet metal heat shield.  When the wood is thoroughly burned there is little left on the grate; it falls through into the pan. The VC Aspen is also not meant to be burned with the door open. With the door open the secondary chamber will not fire properly resulting in more smoke and gases out the chimney. It will also use wood faster and make more creosote.

I found a vast improvement in the burn after the fresh air kit was installed. And absolutely no need to open a door or window for draft.

I have mentioned this elsewhere before, but will repeat. I have a turbocharger on our air inlet. A muffin fan, approx 4 to 5 inch dia. It fits (is taped with aluminum tape) onto the vent hood I used. I place a good handful of pine needles in the firebox, a few pieces of kindling, then split wood on top of that. I hit the needles with a blast from my propane torch and they ignite quickly. Close the door and hit the switch to blow air into the stove. The fire never goes out, always gets of to a great start. I can not tell any difference in the stove operation with or without the fan left on the intake and turned off.

http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=2335.msg91874#msg91874 (http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=2335.msg91874#msg91874)

In many parts of the west there is not much choice in firewood, you choose between pine, spruce and fir. Not much difference there. I think Oljarhead is in the same boat as we are. We have no problem with creosote build up but I'm using wood that has sat through at least 2 summers.

FYI, creosote will not form on the chimney walls when the interior surface of the flue is 250F or higher. I haven't figured out how to measue that inside the flue with a fire going.  d* ;D  Wet wood will produce a lot of steam and that holds the temperature of the flue gases down.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 21, 2010, 11:29:01 PM
Looks like we may finally get back to the cabin next weekend :)  I've told my step son it will have to be a wood chopping winter prepping only weekend.

We plan to bring in a couple rolls of insulation to help with the cold; it looks like it will be -26 degrees on Wednesday night but warming up to 11 on Thanksgiving day and 9 Thursday night.  With luck it will be closer to freezing on Friday and not drop too much over the weekend!  We will need the warmer weather (yes freezing is MUCH warmer then MINUS 26) to get some wood chopped and stack and maybe cut down some dead dry trees (their wood will be drier then some of what we have now).

Once we've stuffed in a couple rolls of insulation we should set to make it through the weekend as long as we sleep near the wood stove (and I can get it cleaned out well enough).

Going to be a COLD COLD winter!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 21, 2010, 11:32:28 PM
QuoteFriday: A 40 percent chance of snow. Cloudy, with a high near 20.

Friday Night: Snow likely. Cloudy, with a low around 14. Chance of precipitation is 60%.

Saturday: Snow likely. Cloudy, with a high near 24. Chance of precipitation is 60%.

Saturday Night: Snow likely. Cloudy, with a low around 15. Chance of precipitation is 60%.

Sunday: Snow likely. Cloudy, with a high near 26. Chance of precipitation is 60%.

Looks like it might be nice and balmy this weekend :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 30, 2010, 07:50:39 PM
Still haven't made it to the cabin this month!  Grrr....but I think we'll make it this weekend.

I had to work most weekends which hurt a little (but pays off) and then needed a new alternator and header in the Jeep (Banks header broke for the 2nd time).

Now the XJ is happy and I might escape work for the weekend!  SO it will be serious wood cutting time and some insulation work to help keep us warm -- also have to clean out stove.

While I'm at it I decided to buy a BIG radio for the XJ :D  Ordered a factory refurb Galaxy DX 959 :D :D  My local 2-way shop told me to get the refurb because Galaxy does it right and then to bring it in to them for a peak and tune ($12).

Then he tells me he can do mild to wild on the radio :D  for those using CB's out there who aren't familiar with the 959 it's both the 40 CB channels plus SSB (Single Side Band) and is made on a 10m radio platform (sold as a 10m in Europe I believe) -- thus, this 11m (CB) radio can be tuned to 10M (Ham) also :D

Of course you have to have a HAM license to get it converted to 10M (theoretically).  In my case I won't be modding it to 10M but like that I 'could' have it done some day if I get my HAM license.

On a side note, the Single Side Band mode allows skip which means that when you'd up at the cabin and in trouble without cell coverage you can use skip (if weather/atmospheric conditions are right anyway) to reach out a LONG ways -- some have skipped 11M over 2000 miles!  (FCC allows only 155miles but um, ya right).

Anyway, with a full power CB and 12watt SSB you can talk to folks a LONG way off :D  And with a 108" antenna you will REACH out to folks....and that is what I want.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: phalynx on November 30, 2010, 09:39:39 PM
Hehehe,, you just took me back a few years.  I had a RCI-2950 with shoes.....  I loved that radio!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MikeOnBike on November 30, 2010, 09:51:20 PM
We don't have phone or cell service at our camp.  We do have a fairly good access to a Ham 2 meter repeater.  It's about 30 mi. north.  This allows someone in camp to communicate with someone in our home town a 100 mi. away.  In addition to communications for emergencies my wife who has been at camp all week can contact me to make sure I bring up ice and TP on my way up Fri. night.

The first level Tech license is real easy to get and if you can hit a repeater you can cover a lot of distance.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 30, 2010, 11:47:23 PM
Quote from: phalynx on November 30, 2010, 09:39:39 PM
Hehehe,, you just took me back a few years.  I had a RCI-2950 with shoes.....  I loved that radio!

From what I've read the 959 doesn't need the shoes :)  but then maybe with shoes it would really kick it out there!  I imagine the 108" antenna and the 959 peak and tuned will give me some serious 11m range...but I'll have it tweaked into the 10M band once I learn how to use it and go get my HAM>
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: phalynx on December 01, 2010, 12:30:56 AM
Quote from: MikeOnBike on November 30, 2010, 09:51:20 PM
We don't have phone or cell service at our camp.  We do have a fairly good access to a Ham 2 meter repeater.  It's about 30 mi. north.  This allows someone in camp to communicate with someone in our home town a 100 mi. away.  In addition to communications for emergencies my wife who has been at camp all week can contact me to make sure I bring up ice and TP on my way up Fri. night.

The first level Tech license is real easy to get and if you can hit a repeater you can cover a lot of distance.

A repeater with a phone patch is really useful.  I don't know if there are any around there but we have a couple around here.
Quote from: OlJarhead on November 30, 2010, 11:47:23 PM
Quote from: phalynx on November 30, 2010, 09:39:39 PM
Hehehe,, you just took me back a few years.  I had a RCI-2950 with shoes.....  I loved that radio!

From what I've read the 959 doesn't need the shoes :)  but then maybe with shoes it would really kick it out there!  I imagine the 108" antenna and the 959 peak and tuned will give me some serious 11m range...but I'll have it tweaked into the 10M band once I learn how to use it and go get my HAM>

Ham license is really easy now.  No code... I have a General license.  Rarely EVER use it.. :(  Internet is so much faster  :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 06, 2010, 12:36:51 AM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0028-2.jpg)
Friday night we arrived to find the inside of the cabin at 18 degrees.  It took two hours to get it above freezing and dinner was Ham and Potato soup from a can that was trying to burst and ravioli from another swollen can.  Figured better eat them now!  Defrosted them on the stove :)

Note:  A quick cleaning of the stove and using dried pine was the ticket!  The stove really cranked out the heat all night -- indeed all weekend! 

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0021-2.jpg)
We cheated a little in that we used the Kerosene heater in the back portion of the cabin where there was no insulation....good thing too!  It was 65 in there all night long :D

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0015-3.jpg)
We stuffed two rolls of R19 into the walls (which we will have to drill and pull wire in when it thaws so we didn't staple the bats down) and put 3 feet of R19 across the peak from one end to the other.  This worked to get it to 65 and keep it there.  The loft stayed at 50.

On a side note the porch (uninsulated and unheated) got to 50 degrees during the day!  It was 25 outside at the warmest.  When it was 4 outside the porch was 14 :D  With a little insulation I think it might even keep the batteries above freezing.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on December 06, 2010, 12:52:24 PM
Quote from: phalynx on December 01, 2010, 12:30:56 AM
Quote from: MikeOnBike on November 30, 2010, 09:51:20 PM
We don't have phone or cell service at our camp.  We do have a fairly good access to a Ham 2 meter repeater.  It's about 30 mi. north.  This allows someone in camp to communicate with someone in our home town a 100 mi. away.  In addition to communications for emergencies my wife who has been at camp all week can contact me to make sure I bring up ice and TP on my way up Fri. night.

The first level Tech license is real easy to get and if you can hit a repeater you can cover a lot of distance.

A repeater with a phone patch is really useful.  I don't know if there are any around there but we have a couple around here.
Quote from: OlJarhead on November 30, 2010, 11:47:23 PM
Quote from: phalynx on November 30, 2010, 09:39:39 PM
Hehehe,, you just took me back a few years.  I had a RCI-2950 with shoes.....  I loved that radio!

From what I've read the 959 doesn't need the shoes :)  but then maybe with shoes it would really kick it out there!  I imagine the 108" antenna and the 959 peak and tuned will give me some serious 11m range...but I'll have it tweaked into the 10M band once I learn how to use it and go get my HAM>

Ham license is really easy now.  No code... I have a General license.  Rarely EVER use it.. :(  Internet is so much faster  :)

Yup, no code (grumbles.... can you tell I'm an old timer?  ;) ) ... But seriously, I waited until the code requirement went to 5 WPM for all classes before upgrading from Advanced to Extra ... couldn't see putting in the work on the code for the tiny sliver of extra bandwidth.  Glad I did get the Extra tho...

I have a bunch of repeaters plugged into the radio in the truck that I can hit from my property.  Some consistently, others, not so much.  I keep telling Beautiful that I'm going to send her a message from the Ranch one of these days.  Maybe next year I'll get up there for Field Day and have some fun with the step-son.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on December 06, 2010, 12:53:38 PM
Jarhead,

I wish I could make it up to my place these days... but it will take snowshoes or a snowmobile (or quad) to get up there this time of year.

Yours looks great!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on December 06, 2010, 01:21:21 PM
That's cold!  Once all the insulation is complete it should warm up faster. With the Aspen going and the propane wall heater we can gain 20 degrees an hour in our 15.75x30, no loft cabin.  I remember well how long it took when the ceiling only had a thin layer of insulation.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 06, 2010, 05:02:49 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/IMG_0003-1.jpg)
This is what we did to help with heat loss :)

I think I might take Don's advise and screw in 1" furring strips and then install the R19 which will give me about 3/4" of venting. Guess that's kind of a 'drop ceiling' then....

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/IMG_0004-2.jpg)
When we leave now we always chop and stack a weekends worth of wood inside the cabin near the stove.  This location is probably pushing it a little (maybe a tad closer then called for) but seems to work nicely and the wood does not get overly hot.

It's nice walking in with a fair amount of dried wood and kindling.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/IMG_0006-1.jpg)
I call this shot my 'obligatory, we have to leave but I don't want to' shot :)

We'd love to stay a LOT longer but alas we also have to work in order to pay for the cabin build :) 

So, maybe in a week or two we'll be back to stuff more insulation, take more pictures and burn more wood :)  Oh and to keep warm of course!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 06, 2010, 05:12:38 PM
On a side note the chimney does not get hot at the wall penetration!  It's rather amazing.

I was somewhat worried about this because the manual on installation calls for 2" of clearance and in one spot I have 1" because of the way the chimney passes through the eves at the roof.  That 1" worried me until I discovered that the chimney isn't even hot where it passes through the wall much less 14 feet above there!

So we're good as gold I think :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Tickhill on December 06, 2010, 06:40:11 PM
It is like seeing an old friend when you return and it is so hard to say goodbye, even if for a few weeks. Nothing productive even has to happen, it's just the feeling of being there!
Looking good,
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 10, 2010, 01:43:24 AM
True enough!  I was day dreaming today about doing interior work!  Sheesh!  hahaha  Guess I'm hooked huh/
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 10, 2010, 02:03:09 PM
The bucks of Eagle Rock :)

So here we go with the first.  I thought he was a Doe until I saw the fork...
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Buck.jpg)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/209BUck.jpg)
This guy was captured (on camera) last year.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/3point.jpg)
Nice 3 point I think though it might even be a 4 point.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/4point.jpg)
A 4 point I believe

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/4point-2.jpg)
Another 4 point

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/WhiteTail.jpg)
This guy appears to be a Whitey.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/5point.jpg)
The best for last!  When I saw that rack I went "Holy Cow!"  That has to be one of the nicest racks I've seen.

Notice the times these were shot...not a one was shot during hunting hours!  Figures.
Erik
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: diyfrank on December 10, 2010, 02:29:10 PM
looks like one whitetail and the rest are mule.
Makes it hard when they only move a night.
All but one look legal. [cool]
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on December 10, 2010, 03:14:23 PM
Yeah, most of the pictures I've got have been during darkness, although there are a good number of a legal hour ones. But then those have been out of season mostly  d*


I'm told that in some places in Europe they can hunt after sunset. Never confirmed that myself.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 31, 2010, 10:16:55 AM
Almost a month since being up at the cabin and I'm gettin' the itch something awful.  It's New Years weekend and it has been kind of a tradition here to go camping this weekend....and it will be about -6 at the cabin (which really means about -10 if my experience serves me at all)....

But with lots of firewood, a good stove and a bit more insulation I'm kinda thinking it might be just right :D

So, if luck serves me I'll leave today around noon and make it up there fore dark....I hope so!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 06, 2011, 06:29:21 PM
Had a great New Years at the cabin :)  Got to -10 the first night but we stayed warm :D

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/MoreInsulation.jpg)
We stuffed insulation into the walls where it was missing.  We'll have to go back and pull it out to install the wiring but we were warm :D

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Panels.jpg)
Carefully cleaned off some of the snow which was on the panels.  One thing we never accomplished in the last two visits was changing the angle on the panels but the batteries were well charged and we barely use them at this point so it's ok.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/NewYears.jpg)
We cleared a path to the wood chopping area and managed to get some wood chopped

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/NewYears2.jpg)
and burned some slash -- note to self:  don't cover slash piles with tarps if you expect snow!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on January 06, 2011, 07:18:03 PM
Glad to hear you were warm.


Quote from: OlJarhead on January 06, 2011, 06:29:21 PM
-- note to self:  don't cover slash piles with tarps if you expect snow!

In our experience the piles should be covered to keep them dry in the middle where the fire can be started more easily. We do a couple things that have worked for us. Melting snow in amongst the slash makes it hard to get/keep going at times.
1. We use old pieces of tar paper to cover. Leave in place to burn after sweeping off snow.
2. Cover with old tarps, 6 mil plastic, old table cloths. Sweep and/or simply pull tarps and snow off. Have ropes tied into corners.
3. Use gas and old motor oil mixture to get going if piles were left uncovered. (70-75% old oil) gasoline vapor is heavier than air so it flows out from the place it is poured and will flow downhill. Something to keep in mind when pouring and getting set to light. Can be dangerous; I didn't tell anyone to do it.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Pine Cone on January 07, 2011, 02:13:41 AM
Quote from: MountainDon on January 06, 2011, 07:18:03 PM
Glad to hear you were warm.


Quote from: OlJarhead on January 06, 2011, 06:29:21 PM
-- note to self:  don't cover slash piles with tarps if you expect snow!

In our experience the piles should be covered to keep them dry in the middle where the fire can be started more easily. We do a couple things that have worked for us. Melting snow in amongst the slash makes it hard to get/keep going at times.
1. We use old pieces of tar paper to cover. Leave in place to burn after sweeping off snow.
2. Cover with old tarps, 6 mil plastic, old table cloths. Sweep and/or simply pull tarps and snow off. Have ropes tied into corners.
3. Use gas and old motor oil mixture to get going if piles were left uncovered. (70-75% old oil) gasoline vapor is heavier than air so it flows out from the place it is poured and will flow downhill. Something to keep in mind when pouring and getting set to light. Can be dangerous; I didn't tell anyone to do it.

While I prefer to use a propane torch to light my burn piles these days, I used a forestry drip-torch with a mix of diesel and gasoline for decades.  Normal ratios are somewhere from 3 to 5 parts diesel per part of gasoline.  4:1 is a good bet.  Gasoline by itself is way too dangerous.  Buy a drip torch from Baileys, Forestry Suppliers or Ben Meadows if you have lots of stuff to burn.  They are the safest way to light fires.

Cover the center of your piles with large pieces of cardboard and then you will have a dry place to light.  You will need to pile stuff on top of the cardboard to keep it from blowing off.  The denser the pile the easier it is to get it to burn.  If you are burning tree limbs, place them so the curve of the limb faces up.

Hard to beat a big fire on a cold day!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 07, 2011, 09:56:24 PM
Thanks guys -- the trouble I had was with ice.  Seems the snow must have melted at some point and then frozen into blocks of ice on the tarp -- and freezing it to the ground.

Once I managed to get the tarp off enough to begin to pull out the branches they were covered in ice.....perhaps they weren't dry when it began to freeze
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 17, 2011, 10:08:44 PM
Planning the next two trips and hope to get some logging and milling done:)  The weather has been warmer this last week (a big chinook blew in from the coast and warmed it up a bunch) so with luck the composting toilet drain thawed!  I can hope anyway, but we're going as long as the Jeep let's us!  Power Steering pump is failing but I think I can get it swapped out before hand.

Got the winch back on the jeep too and rigged up and ready to go :)  Will use it to drag logs onto the landing.  Then I just have to charpen the chain and get with it!

My wife plans a trip with me the end of the month too so it should be a good and active couple of weeks!
Erik
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 20, 2011, 12:57:21 PM
Got my Cant Hook in this week :)  and since the boys put the winch back on the Jeep we're planning a weekend of logging tomorrow! :)  Can't wait!

Also, the newest news is that I'm buying a Woodmizer LT10 Bandsaw Mill :D  [cool] ;D  I can't wait to get it purchased and headed our way!  We decided that it would be much faster to mill our lumber with that then the Chain Saw Mill (which we'll be using next weekend) and since we have other buildings in mind we decided that we'd get the mill and mill all our own lumber.

Then if my son gets good at it we figure he can use it as a side business -- milling lumber for cabins in remote places for those who want to turn their trees into their cabins :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on January 20, 2011, 12:59:35 PM
 [cool]
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 20, 2011, 01:04:26 PM
I mentioned last year (or maybe 2009) that I would try to video the drive up to our cabin and while I can't show all 3 miles (that's a lot of megs of video) I can show this short 500 foot section...enjoy :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/th_MVI_0134.jpg) (https://s998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/?action=view&current=MVI_0134.mp4)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: John Raabe on January 20, 2011, 01:19:12 PM
Enjoyed that ride. Nice bright day and I can feel the crisp air.

There are places on the way up where I wouldn't have wanted to see a logging truck coming down!  :P
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 20, 2011, 01:22:49 PM
Quote from: John Raabe on January 20, 2011, 01:19:12 PM
Enjoyed that ride. Nice bright day and I can feel the crisp air.

There are places on the way up where I wouldn't have wanted to see a logging truck coming down!  :P

haha ya the 9 foot wide road doesn't provide much confidence when driving around blind corners...then add 6" of solid ice on THAT stretch and you get the idea that wintering at the cabin involves 4 wheel low and V-Groove chains!!!  (Thanks Don for pointing me that direction, without them I was walking in!)...

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: John Raabe on January 20, 2011, 01:30:19 PM
Are these the type you and Don are using?

(https://i1009.photobucket.com/albums/af219/countryplans/chains.jpg) (http://www.tirechain.com/TRUCK-SUV-CHAINS.HTM)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 20, 2011, 01:31:57 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/th_MVI_0132.jpg) (https://s998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/?action=view&current=MVI_0132.mp4)
Thought I'd post this one too...the video quality is a poor but that's because it was taken on a Canon powershot 5 megapixel camera held by my step-son. 

Also, the road is a private drive so no logging trucks :)  3 miles of road to our cabin which extends to others at various forks in the road -- it also goes beyond us for at least a mile or more.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 20, 2011, 01:33:20 PM
Quote from: John Raabe on January 20, 2011, 01:30:19 PM
Are these the type you and Don are using?

(https://i1009.photobucket.com/albums/af219/countryplans/chains.jpg) (http://www.tirechain.com/TRUCK-SUV-CHAINS.HTM)

Yup :)

Depending on the conditions I will put either just two on the front (hasn't had much thawing so I'm less concerned with Ice) or all four corners (lots and lots of ice).  The grades I'm drive sorta warrants it! haha
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 20, 2011, 01:34:13 PM
You can get the same chains I have at Les Swab :)  For those in the NW anyway.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on January 20, 2011, 01:53:27 PM
Just a caution... using chains on the front only definitely helps with steering. However it does nothing to help keep the rear end behind you. Don't ask, but I only use 4 wheels at a time or rear only, never front only anymore.

It's similar to putting the better tires (2 out of a set of 4) the front of a front wheel drive car. There are occasions, like under braking, when the the rear tires with less tread than the front, will break away. It goes against intuition to put the better tires on the rear, but tire company testing has shown that drivers can have more issues with the better tires on the front than the rear. Same logic applies to chains and ice.

The Vbar are excellent chains. redoverfarm has them too I believe.


I have to do a video too. Thought of it many times; never acted.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 20, 2011, 02:01:57 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on January 20, 2011, 01:53:27 PM
Just a caution... using chains on the front only definitely helps with steering. However it does nothing to help keep the rear end behind you. Don't ask, but I only use 4 wheels at a time or rear only, never front only anymore.

It's similar to putting the better tires (2 out of a set of 4) the front of a front wheel drive car. There are occasions, like under braking, when the the rear tires with less tread than the front, will break away. It goes against intuition to put the better tires on the rear, but tire company testing has shown that drivers can have more issues with the better tires on the front than the rear. Same logic applies to chains and ice.

The Vbar are excellent chains. redoverfarm has them too I believe.

Ah ha! *chuckle* this is where my winter driving training and mountain recovery course comes into play :D

Several years ago (6ish) I was required to attend a course for technicians who, in the course of their regular work, might have to drive into the mountains to cellular towers.  The course was designed to teach some basic winter mountain driving techniques as well as safe snowmobiling (something I'd done plenty as a kid)....anyway this is where I learned something new!

When driving UP hill put chains on the front if you only have two.  When driving DOWN hill put chains on the rear if you only have two.

Apparently it is a common mistake that people make in putting chains in the rear when going uphill (something I always did too) but it was pointed out that the most critical place for traction when going uphill, specially when pulling a trailer, is in the front of a 4 wheel drive.  One, it's where all the weight is and two it's where the steering is -- there were other reasons but I've forgotten them.

Anyway, it is true the rear will not follow as well as if it has chains also but it's almost not noticeable, however, going up sheer ice with chains on the rear can be dangerous whereas in the front it's quite safe.

As a side note, I prefer all 4 but if I'm not too worried and in a hurry I go on the uphill side only.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 20, 2011, 02:09:31 PM
http://www.glinx.com/~sbest/4chains.htm
Great write up and test drive about using chains up front vs. in the rear.  His experience matches my own -- the only difference is that I was taught to use chains on the uphill side always (off road only applies).

Again, I prefer all 4 but the uphill side will get you there :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on January 20, 2011, 02:37:20 PM
Yes, I remember reading that years ago. Here's my take on 4WD and chains.

If there are tracks to follow and the snow is not real deep, no drop offs to fear and the like, then rear only works and the front steers okay in the tracks. If there is a need to turn out of the tracks, that could be troublesome.

Braking with chains on the front is excellent, no doubt there. That's why we have vehicles with discs on the front and drums in the rear. However traveling around curves or going downhill, in a forward direction, can be very exciting when the front (with chains), brakes and grips okay but the rear wheels (no chains) lock and slide causing the rear to come around. That probably won't happen if there are tracks/ruts, but on ice my personal experience was way too exciting to want to repeat. Rear breakaway will not always happen and front only does get you through a lot. I used to do that at times too. But after that one time; not again. If the snow is deep enough to drag the diffs then all 4 wheels with chains id preferred, IMO.

Conversely, when going uphill in a forward direction, chains on the front do nothing to improve motive traction at the rear. The front end becomes light on a steep grade and without rear chains the rear do not get traction and slip.  Even lockers don't help that. On flat or not very steep roads there is probably less of an issue. Maybe I have traveled on too many steep grades and have thus encountered more issues. Even in dry weather that last hill going up to our place can not be climbed in a front drive (front drive only car) without a run at it, as front wheel slippage occurs.

If a person has only one set of chains he should not have a 4x4. Harsh as it may be, that's my opinion.

Wet skid pan tests on street tires are where I got the info on worn street tires on the rear, and new on the front, of front drive cars. No link, it was in print years ago.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 23, 2011, 11:18:34 PM
We got to logging this weekend :)
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/JeepinLogs.jpg)
The road was narrow and the logs down a bank and about 200 feet from the Jeep...it was a challenge!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Winchinlogs2.jpg)
We didn't have a snatch block so improvised...it worked more or less.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/200feetout.jpg)
Down there somewhere...

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/chokinlogs.jpg)
Josh chokin a log

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0128.jpg)
Had to roll them onto a path on the way up.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/SkiddinLogs.jpg)
But rigged up like this we could drag those logs up out of any hole :)  Though we later put the chains on the rear too since we had plans to go down the hill and up and down another...Going uphill with the chains up front is always a breeze and with 4+ inches of solid ice our neighbors couldn't even get past the fork in the road a mile back...but we just crawled right on up as if it was a nice warm sunny day :D

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0110-1.jpg)
Josh rolling logs on the landing.

What surprised me the most was that the 8000lbs winch had trouble with the logs at times but the jeep just yanked them right up the bank once they were free of obstacles!  Wow!  Go Jeep!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 23, 2011, 11:29:38 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on January 20, 2011, 02:37:20 PM
Yes, I remember reading that years ago. Here's my take on 4WD and chains.

If there are tracks to follow and the snow is not real deep, no drop offs to fear and the like, then rear only works and the front steers okay in the tracks. If there is a need to turn out of the tracks, that could be troublesome.

Braking with chains on the front is excellent, no doubt there. That's why we have vehicles with discs on the front and drums in the rear. However traveling around curves or going downhill, in a forward direction, can be very exciting when the front (with chains), brakes and grips okay but the rear wheels (no chains) lock and slide causing the rear to come around. That probably won't happen if there are tracks/ruts, but on ice my personal experience was way too exciting to want to repeat. Rear breakaway will not always happen and front only does get you through a lot. I used to do that at times too. But after that one time; not again. If the snow is deep enough to drag the diffs then all 4 wheels with chains id preferred, IMO.

Conversely, when going uphill in a forward direction, chains on the front do nothing to improve motive traction at the rear. The front end becomes light on a steep grade and without rear chains the rear do not get traction and slip.  Even lockers don't help that. On flat or not very steep roads there is probably less of an issue. Maybe I have traveled on too many steep grades and have thus encountered more issues. Even in dry weather that last hill going up to our place can not be climbed in a front drive (front drive only car) without a run at it, as front wheel slippage occurs.

If a person has only one set of chains he should not have a 4x4. Harsh as it may be, that's my opinion.

Wet skid pan tests on street tires are where I got the info on worn street tires on the rear, and new on the front, of front drive cars. No link, it was in print years ago.



Fast vs slow perhaps?  I was once crossing a parking lot at over 50MPH in the mini behind the little race car.  I had made the mistake of putting Dunlop race tires on the front only (because we didn't have enough wheel lugs for the back) and hadn't considered the implication of sticky vs not sticky in a high speed weight shift...I soon found out!
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/NoBreaks.jpg)
As I made to dodge a cone in the center of the Autocross course the rear lifted as per usual only this time it swapped ends with the front!  At 50+ I twitched the wheel and stuck it through the cones right side front and kept going but learned a lesson I'll never forget ;)

However, High Speed driving isn't comparable in anyway to low speed crawling.

Granted, you're a master of the off-roading compared to me I'm sure, however I'll stick with my rule:  Chains on the uphill side when not using on all four but all four is always better then any two.

As a side note, my neighbor that has lived in our hills for the last 30 years came by today...he's driven this icy treacherous roads 5-6 days a week since 1979...and he has chains on the front only when going up the hill.... ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on January 24, 2011, 09:15:30 AM
Thumbs up MD and echos my experience especially the part  'Braking with chains on the front is excellent.'  Opps!!  Some times to good.

Quote from: MountainDon on January 20, 2011, 02:37:20 PM

Braking with chains on the front is excellent, no doubt there. That's why we have vehicles with discs on the front and drums in the rear. However traveling around curves or going downhill, in a forward direction, can be very exciting when the front (with chains), brakes and grips okay but the rear wheels (no chains) lock and slide causing the rear to come around. That probably won't happen if there are tracks/ruts, but on ice my personal experience was way too exciting to want to repeat. Rear breakaway will not always happen and front only does get you through a lot. I used to do that at times too. But after that one time; not again. If the snow is deep enough to drag the diffs then all 4 wheels with chains id preferred, IMO.

If a person has only one set of chains he should not have a 4x4. Harsh as it may be, that's my opinion.


Jarhead wrote As a side note, my neighbor that has lived in our hills for the last 30 years came by today...he's driven this icy treacherous roads 5-6 days a week since 1979...and he has chains on the front only when going up the hill....

I also agree with this as well to a certain point.  It works good as Don says on flat and not very steep roads.  By this a normal maintained mountain road or grade should not affect front traction all that much.  But a good case in point when you are climbing some of those washed out steep roads in the summer time have you noticed as soon as the rear wheels break loose you are done?  The front end can be spinning and jumping rock to rock and so long as the rear end has a bite you keep progressing.  In the wetter / slicker seasons that rule sort of compounds itself and things sure don't have to be as steep or tough doing to halt the wheels of progress.

Then there is the other point here, your neighbor as you say drives this same road and has for 30 years, 5 - 6 days a week.  With that experience he knows what works for him and his vehicle or vehicles.  Same as where my ranch is at.  Those guys drive in and out of that area all the time in the winter.  They know where to chain up and drop their chains when they have to.  They also can do it so fast that they are chained up and going while I am untangling mine.  I do not have and certainly do not expect to have the same skill level much less luck as they do, doing it twenty-four / seven.  Spring, summer and fall it is pretty much a wash, we all travel about the same.  Winter time they shine.             
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 24, 2011, 09:51:13 AM
I can see very steep grades being a problem if the front end is lifting due to excessive grades but I find it takes VERY excessive grades to do this.  Our 'mountain road' has grades way beyond anything you'd ever see on the road (one stretch rises about 50 feet in 300 - over 16%) and at no time does the front end lose traction due to grade.

However, I don't have a desire to turn my cabin thread into a dispute over winter driving, I'll let the experts at Winter Driving Schools to do that as I'd like to get back to building my cabin.

Erik
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on January 24, 2011, 10:24:15 AM
Looking at your logs!  So what are you going to do with the logs?  Boards or ???   How many do you have to get out and are they all in places like that?  That is sure a lot of work and can be somewhat dangerous but with a little caution.....  It is sure a lot nicer to have someone to work with doing that, and being able to work together rather than doing all the grunt work yourself.  It seems we never have time or the day light in the winter to get much done as we drag our cabin out over winter.  (Fifth-wheel)  And it is a minimum of another hour going and come in the winter time no matter how we go.  It must be nice to have your place where you can go now year around now.  Well some day maybe we will be so lucky!  

Did you find it a lot easier skidding them out in the winter with the frozen ground and snow than summer?  I always worry about fires in the summer time when we do that so winter to me would definitely be the best just from that alone.  In the summer most the time I will in fact go back in the evening and look things over most of the time.  I have never found anything but I figure an oz. of prevention is always worth a lb. of cure.  And it always give me chance to go on a four-wheeler ride.  This summer I really don't see us logging much at all unless we decide to thin some more and get in to some bigger trees.


       
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on January 24, 2011, 10:45:57 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on January 24, 2011, 09:51:13 AM
I can see very steep grades being a problem if the front end is lifting due to excessive grades but I find it takes VERY excessive grades to do this.  Our 'mountain road' has grades way beyond anything you'd ever see on the road (one stretch rises about 50 feet in 300 - over 16%) and at no time does the front end lose traction due to grade.

However, I don't have a desire to turn my cabin thread into a dispute over winter driving, I'll let the experts at Winter Driving Schools to do that as I'd like to get back to building my cabin.

Erik

Agreed and offer an apology if you took my post as such.  Sure never intended it to!  I also sent you another post right after that back on topic.  ;D    I also agree that sometimes this forum is worse than some others does sort of side bar out into other areas rather than staying on topic.  (One reason I found it so interesting.)  Sorry will watch that in the future. 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 25, 2011, 09:56:10 AM
Quote from: rick91351 on January 24, 2011, 10:24:15 AM
Looking at your logs!  So what are you going to do with the logs?  Boards or ???   How many do you have to get out and are they all in places like that?  That is sure a lot of work and can be somewhat dangerous but with a little caution.....  It is sure a lot nicer to have someone to work with doing that, and being able to work together rather than doing all the grunt work yourself.  It seems we never have time or the day light in the winter to get much done as we drag our cabin out over winter.  (Fifth-wheel)  And it is a minimum of another hour going and come in the winter time no matter how we go.  It must be nice to have your place where you can go now year around now.  Well some day maybe we will be so lucky!  

Did you find it a lot easier skidding them out in the winter with the frozen ground and snow than summer?  I always worry about fires in the summer time when we do that so winter to me would definitely be the best just from that alone.  In the summer most the time I will in fact go back in the evening and look things over most of the time.  I have never found anything but I figure an oz. of prevention is always worth a lb. of cure.  And it always give me chance to go on a four-wheeler ride.  This summer I really don't see us logging much at all unless we decide to thin some more and get in to some bigger trees.


       

The logs will be milled into lumber.  First about 2000 board feet of interior paneling and then siding/batting and finally, structural :)

Skidding them in the snow was actually very easy and with the ground frozen I'd say easier then in the summer -- during the summer I skidded 3 logs down from up top of our hill and while it was also easy (the jeep has plenty of pulling power) I'd say winter is the best time to do it this way.

We have a mixed bag of locations to bring logs in from and will have to winch them from lower portions of the property again - however I suspect a block and tackle/snatch block would make that much easier -- the thing I found the hardest was that dragging the logs with the winch seemed to double or triple their weight!  Once they were behind the jeep though, it was like pulling a sled :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 25, 2011, 10:03:21 AM
Quote from: rick91351 on January 24, 2011, 10:45:57 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on January 24, 2011, 09:51:13 AM
I can see very steep grades being a problem if the front end is lifting due to excessive grades but I find it takes VERY excessive grades to do this.  Our 'mountain road' has grades way beyond anything you'd ever see on the road (one stretch rises about 50 feet in 300 - over 16%) and at no time does the front end lose traction due to grade.

However, I don't have a desire to turn my cabin thread into a dispute over winter driving, I'll let the experts at Winter Driving Schools to do that as I'd like to get back to building my cabin.

Erik


Agreed and offer an apology if you took my post as such.  Sure never intended it to!  I also sent you another post right after that back on topic.  ;D    I also agree that sometimes this forum is worse than some others does sort of side bar out into other areas rather than staying on topic.  (One reason I found it so interesting.)  Sorry will watch that in the future. 

Not required :)  Internet forums are often hard to catch mood/intent/emotion and I'm certain that neither you or Don meant anything other then to be helpful :)  And I appreciate it.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Alberta Curt on January 27, 2011, 09:48:55 AM
Great setup!!  Looks good.  Are there not any issues with storing your batteries for the solar indoors?  I eas under the impression they had to be outside to prevent hydrogen buildup.

Alberta
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 27, 2011, 11:47:20 AM
Quote from: Alberta Curt on January 27, 2011, 09:48:55 AM
Great setup!!  Looks good.  Are there not any issues with storing your batteries for the solar indoors?  I eas under the impression they had to be outside to prevent hydrogen buildup.

Alberta

I asked an EE buddy of mine this question and his response was that as long as the batteries were not being equalized they would not exhaust hydrogen or something like that.  However, I intend to enclose the batteries completely and provide venting from them so that when they vent it's to the outside rather then inside.

The idea for putting them in the porch stemmed from the need to keep them warm in sub zero weather.  Batteries lose their ability to deliver power by something like 50% at freezing...more at 30 below :D  And at our cabin it can get THAT cold easily.  So I built the porch to provide a solar heated storage place for the solar power components and batteries :)  The FREE aluminum windows do this perfectly!  At 32 outside it will be 60+ inside during the day.

Erik
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 27, 2011, 01:27:13 PM
http://www.woodmizer.com/us/Products/ManualSawmills/LT10PortableSawmill.aspx

I'm dreaming too much lately :)  Getting my quote today!  I hope to order within the next couple weeks....
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: considerations on January 27, 2011, 04:24:22 PM
Wow, thats a spiffy saw.  I'll be hiring someone to make the siding for this place.  There are several folks in the area with "home mill" set ups.  This is, after all, logging country.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on January 27, 2011, 06:27:55 PM
Very nice Jarhead!

I miss getting up to my place... so I'm vicariously enjoying the trips to yours  ;)  I won't be able to get up to mine until the snow goes out.  I should measure the grade on some of the road in to my place, but there was one section of that first video that the road had drops off the side similar to my road in.

Good job on the logging.  I misses a deal on a bandsaw mill two years ago that I still kick myself for. $750, and all it would have taken was a drive to Boise to pick up.

My Alaskan will have to to for now.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 30, 2011, 11:24:51 PM
Making Sawdust!  We set off to the cabin bright an early (after I had 2 hours of sleep from work) on Friday and started milling lumber Saturday by 11am :)  We milled 22 1x10's (ok actually 3/4x9's) and thoroughly enjoyed the weekend :)
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/JoshMiller2.jpg)
I made my son do most of the hard work as my back was thrown out at work a week ago but I still managed to pitch in all weekend :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/JoshMiller.jpg)
Josh is getting proficient at this game :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Erik_Pine.jpg)
And the boards just kept coming off the logs :)  Takes about 4 minutes per board but a lot of set up time!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Pine.jpg)
We laid out a few of the boards we'd milled and took this picture to get an idea what the walls might look like :)  Man are we happy!  WHOOHOO!  But we're not thinking of using the 'Blue Stained' pine for the floor and the unstained pine for the walls....unless of course drying turns it all blue!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0046-2.jpg)
I just can't help but be excited!  I LOVE pine!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Pine2.jpg)
The Blue Stain is quite artistic!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Pine3.jpg)
More close ups of the Blue Stained Pine.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0048-2.jpg)
My wife insisted:)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0050-3.jpg)
And so I insisted :D

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0038.jpg)
Darci (my wife) brought rugs up and began making the cabin more 'homey'  we love it when she joins us up there!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 31, 2011, 02:27:50 PM
It's amazing really, but after 18 months of working on our cabin in the woods I'm still planning the next trip and next things to do!  I can't wait to get back and have begun to wonder if maybe there's a calling there?

Anyway, our next trip should involve finishing the electrical installation and doing some drywall work but with luck I'll have some other bodies and we might get some wood chopping done too :)  That's always needed in the winter.

Then, depending on bodies etc, we may also try to mill a log or two.  I'd like to get at least twice what I have done now by mid month (Feb) if possible but I can see it's going to be later most likely.

It's also obvious that I need to get the new mill ordered!  Once all the interior and exterior finish wood is milled then we will try to mill a ton of structural lumber to dry for future projects.

Erik
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on January 31, 2011, 08:43:21 PM
Do you get a lot of sawdust?


Good to see you're up there. I think we're going up this coming weekend. By the looks of the forcast we'll have more snow.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 31, 2011, 08:51:32 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on January 31, 2011, 08:43:21 PM
Do you get a lot of sawdust?


Good to see you're up there. I think we're going up this coming weekend. By the looks of the forcast we'll have more snow.

Tons of it!  9 boards out of one log gives us 8'x1/4"x 9 1/2" of sawdust per pass!  So about 11 times that...or shovel loads!  My wife used it to spread on the ice to make walking safer and the covering on the ground (you can see it in the picture) after taking much away for traction on the ice was still about 3-4" deep in places.  I'm looking for ways to use the sawdust :)

We are ordering a bandsaw soon so I figure less waste (less sawdust) but still figure we'll have more then we know what to do with.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: nathan.principe on January 31, 2011, 09:49:20 PM
A fun little project for the saw dust could be making fire starters.  Cut the bottoms off a paper egg carton to get 12 "paper cups" fill with the saw dust and pour melted wax over the exposed top to seal it, this will burn a pretty big flame for about 10mins, great for starting camp fires
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on January 31, 2011, 09:57:12 PM
Scatter it about and it will disappear.


Pine needles (dry) make great fire starter. That all we use. I have a 30 gallon plastic drum that I refill every year when they're good and dry; June before the rains is a good time to collect here.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on January 31, 2011, 10:02:38 PM
Pine knots are my choice if I can find them.  Years ago they used to soak corn cobs in Kerosene and then allow them to dry for fire starters.  But I usually don't need but a couple all year.  My fire has only gone out once since Mid October.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on January 31, 2011, 11:12:19 PM
Quote from: Redoverfarm on January 31, 2011, 10:02:38 PM
My fire has only gone out once since Mid October.

That's when you know it is winter!   ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: nathan.principe on January 31, 2011, 11:38:26 PM
Pine needles is a good idea! I will have to collect some from my cabin for fires out there.  Here in Dallas pine trees are pretty scarce since our soil is not conducive for them.  When I have fires at my house here in the city, indoors, I use the starters I mentioned above with either saw dust or dryer lint in them.  I make 2 dozen at a time and theyll last me quite some time
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: nathan.principe on January 31, 2011, 11:44:01 PM
Quote from: Redoverfarm on January 31, 2011, 10:02:38 PM
  My fire has only gone out once since Mid October.

it was about 65 today here in Dallas ;D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 31, 2011, 11:44:58 PM
We currently use drier lint for starting fires -- amazing stuff!  Just save it and use a handful even in the dampest conditions!  Don't need matches either, just a flint and steel :)

I've read on the forestry forum I go to (or somewhere else perhaps) that using pine sawdust and wax is an option the same way you just described it (hmmmm)....have to try that.

Also read (off topic here) that drier lint and wax in a tuna can makes a good sterno type stove :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 02, 2011, 09:14:12 AM
Ordered the WoodMizer LT10!  :D  I CAN NOT WAIT!  [cool] c* ;D :)

After milling 100 board feet of pine for the cabin last weekend I've got the bug big big time!  I want to mill 50 board feet, or  1000 board feet in a weekend!!!

Then I want to finish this cabin and mill the lumber for the next one -- all of it!

I'm totally stoked :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: ajbremer on February 02, 2011, 12:01:13 PM
I liked your pics where you show your floor/deck all done and your doing the 'Countryplans jig' on it. I posted a question yesterday here asking users to guess how much, on the average, it would cost to get to that point using piers or blocks, doing the beams, floor joists, and then the 4x8 sheets over the whole thing. I was wondering about how much you think it cost you to get to that point?

Here's where I asked the question: http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=10211.0
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: RIjake on February 02, 2011, 08:16:54 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on February 02, 2011, 09:14:12 AM
Ordered the WoodMizer LT10!  :D  I CAN NOT WAIT!  [cool] c* ;D :)

After milling 100 board feet of pine for the cabin last weekend I've got the bug big big time!  I want to mill 50 board feet, or  1000 board feet in a weekend!!!

Then I want to finish this cabin and mill the lumber for the next one -- all of it!

I'm totally stoked :)

I'm envious!  What I could do with one of those! [chainsaw]
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Barry Broome on February 02, 2011, 08:59:27 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KsouThHml1U (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KsouThHml1U)

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 02, 2011, 09:02:17 PM
Quote from: ajbremer on February 02, 2011, 12:01:13 PM
I liked your pics where you show your floor/deck all done and your doing the 'Countryplans jig' on it. I posted a question yesterday here asking users to guess how much, on the average, it would cost to get to that point using piers or blocks, doing the beams, floor joists, and then the 4x8 sheets over the whole thing. I was wondering about how much you think it cost you to get to that point?

Here's where I asked the question: http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=10211.0

Floor framing was right about $591 buying locally (cheaper then Home Depot actually).  I tracked all costs as well as I could :)

Erik
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 02, 2011, 09:04:04 PM
Quote from: Weasel on February 02, 2011, 08:59:27 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KsouThHml1U (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KsouThHml1U)



That video helped me decide :)  $3500 delivered with some extras :)  I can't wait to get milling at a faster rate then with a chain saw!  Did you check out the milling pictures on an earlier page (32 I think)?  It's really awesome and the CSM will do the job nicely but I wanted to move faster ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 02, 2011, 09:06:05 PM
Quote from: ajbremer on February 02, 2011, 12:01:13 PM
I liked your pics where you show your floor/deck all done and your doing the 'Countryplans jig' on it. I posted a question yesterday here asking users to guess how much, on the average, it would cost to get to that point using piers or blocks, doing the beams, floor joists, and then the 4x8 sheets over the whole thing. I was wondering about how much you think it cost you to get to that point?

Here's where I asked the question: http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=10211.0

Yup you GOTTA do the Country Plans Jig at that point :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Barry Broome on February 02, 2011, 10:30:53 PM
I saw the pics of the chainsaw mill. I've been eye-balling the 20" Husqvarna at Lowe's, I really like it. My family has a portable sawmill (gas driven) and my Father in law cut nearly all the wood used in his 20X30 cabin. If done right, the amount of money you save is well worth it... especially if you have more spare time than you do cash. A portable sawmill is on my wish list but I'm in no hurry. I can't justify purchasing one at this point.

Good luck with the new mill!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 03, 2011, 12:18:36 AM
Quote from: Weasel on February 02, 2011, 10:30:53 PM
I saw the pics of the chainsaw mill. I've been eye-balling the 20" Husqvarna at Lowe's, I really like it. My family has a portable sawmill (gas driven) and my Father in law cut nearly all the wood used in his 20X30 cabin. If done right, the amount of money you save is well worth it... especially if you have more spare time than you do cash. A portable sawmill is on my wish list but I'm in no hurry. I can't justify purchasing one at this point.

Good luck with the new mill!

Cool :)

I'm VERY happy with the Husky 455 Rancher (20") -- quite impressed and I think for the money it's worth every dime!  I've done a LOT of cutting with it and it's the best saw I've used in years and years....
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 08, 2011, 09:33:30 AM
The Mill has ARRIVED!  Muhahahahaha  NOW I'm going to get serious! :D

But first I have to get it to the cabin which will involve 4 tire chains, 4 wheel drive, a hope and a prayer!  It's 900lbs and will be trailered in...something I haven't tried on the thick ice to the cabin!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: considerations on February 08, 2011, 03:49:31 PM
"I'm looking for ways to use the sawdust"  It will insulate blocks of ice in an ice house and keep them from melting or sticking together and burn hot enough in a 55 gal barrel to fire functional (non-waterproof) ceramics such as raku or tiles. 

Pine cones (from certain trees) are awesome fire starters as well.

I want to see pictures of this mill production!...just a small request (OK demand).  :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 08, 2011, 05:41:27 PM
Quote from: considerations on February 08, 2011, 03:49:31 PM
"I'm looking for ways to use the sawdust"  It will insulate blocks of ice in an ice house and keep them from melting or sticking together and burn hot enough in a 55 gal barrel to fire functional (non-waterproof) ceramics such as raku or tiles. 

Pine cones (from certain trees) are awesome fire starters as well.

I want to see pictures of this mill production!...just a small request (OK demand).  :)

Oh you WILL get pics :)  I might even take pics of it on the crate :P
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on February 11, 2011, 01:03:00 PM
Yeah, a mill is on my wish list, too ... sadly, right now I have the spare time, but not the spare cash! (wish me luck tho - or if you're a prayin' type of person - say a prayer - I have one I'm waiting to hear on, one I'm waiting for when the 2nd interview is scheduled, and one I'm going to right now - so hopefully soon).... but maybe this spring you can bring it to my place and we can mill up a few things ... If I haven't gone a bought one myself by then.

Your place looks great! I am green with envy that you can drive in during the winter ... maybe someday the road will be passable up to mine  :(

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: astidham on February 11, 2011, 03:37:13 PM
Cant wait to see the pics of your mill!
I have been thinking about buying a portable wood-mizer LT28
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rniles on February 11, 2011, 06:29:30 PM
I just wanted to say "thank you" to OlJarhead, JavaMan, Yonderosa, DIYFrank, SkagitDrifter and everyone else who has posted information and posted their progress and headaches. You all are an inspiration ...and have inspired me to get some land and start working toward this dream that I've been fearful of jumping into!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Don_P on February 11, 2011, 07:40:06 PM
More uses for sawdust;
you already found out about traction on ice, I had to do that last week to get the trailer out.
We use it in between permanent beds in the garden, also a thick layer around the blueberries. have it around the dogwoods where the daffodils are (which is on of the few blooming things deer leave alone). We've used it to level walking paths through the woods, pin a fallen tree on the low side or the trail and fill the path with sawdust. Don't use it in permanent gravel roads it just gooks them up. Around building sites I'll use it sometimes to keep the mud down but usually it gets spoken for without leaving the farm. Planer shavings end up in the chicken coop. I have swapped fresh shavings for "used" shavings after the barn is cleaned out... the fresh smell better but the used is great fertilizer  ;D.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 12, 2011, 11:00:09 AM
Thanks all -- I'll get a couple pics today of the mill being transported up to the cabin but sadly none of it doing anything because we don't have time this weekend :(  Next weekend, however!!!!

So many col things about this mill!  1. the book explains all kinds of things about milling and drying lumber which is really nice since I'm a total noob to making lumber!  2.  They will give you 50 free double firs or 25 free red oaks just becuase you bought the mill! :) and finally they're customer service has been fantastic!

I can't wait to get started but must be patient as there are only so many weekends I can steal away.

Cheers
Erik
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 13, 2011, 01:31:02 AM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/2011-02-12_14-54-07_401.jpg)
The mill arrives!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/2011-02-12_14-55-02_554.jpg)
Chained up all 4 to make it up the ice covered drive with the trailer and 900 lbs of mill plus some pallets!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/2011-02-12_14-54-54_162.jpg)
Was 40 degrees when we made it up to the cabin but we had 8-10 inches of snow everywhere we hadn't previously driven or walked.

Only issue right now is that the composter for the toilet is in desperate need of a bigger roof and some better drainage.  It's not flooded (yet) but a few more inches of water and I'll have problems!  I didn't get pictures but this was something I knew could happen and just never got around to providing better protection so next weekend we'll have to address it before the snow starts to really melt.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 13, 2011, 01:35:23 AM
Notice the rear tire and how deep into the wheel well it is!  With 3+ inches of lift and an extra real leaf for towing it still isn't enough to give much clearance with the 31" tires and a loaded trailer but surprisingly enough the chains don't hit too much and then only the loose chains on the end (which you need a little long or you wouldn't get them on).

One thing I've learned is that the Old Man Emu suspension, even the heavy one, isn't the best if you are going to tow with much tongue weight.  I'm wondering if the 4.5" Rubicon or Skyjacker suspensions might actually be better when towing (Don?).
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on February 13, 2011, 02:06:39 AM
National Spring. You weigh the Jeep, both ends and also weigh the tongue weight of the trailer. Calculate or weigh the usual load to be carried. Give them a call and they make springs to suit.  I have Rubicon front coils (4.5) and National rear leafs. You don't need an add-a-leaf when National makes the springs. They ride nice. If the springs are made to carry a heavy load the Jeep will ride high when not loaded.


http://www.nationalsprings.com/ (http://www.nationalsprings.com/)

Next best would be the Rubicon leafs, IMO, but I hear they are temporarily (?) closed for reorganization.  I don't know anything about other brands other than some are way too stiff for me. I'd want to ask owners with other springs or ride in them.

Anything with more than 3.5 needs a slip yoke eliminator and a CV driveshaft. Tom Woods makes the best shafts  http://www.4xshaft.com/ (http://www.4xshaft.com/)   That will also permit the t-case to be moved back up to the stock position. That also requires rear axle shims to tilt the pinion up. A never ending list.  Only use steel shims; aluminum shims will break. Not might break, will break. Sort like water always wins.  ;D

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 13, 2011, 12:18:38 PM
Thanks Don,

I plan to put in the slip yoke eliminator when I get the T-Case rebuilt anyway, so that ought to set me on the right path to a little more lift if I want it -- or at least eliminate any issues with a slightly higher lift (say 3.5") with load capable rear springs.

Speaking of which, do you still have the rear anti-sway bar on?  I've read not to remove it when towing but often wonder how much lift you can get away without some kind of drop link like the fronts (jks quicker disco's on mine).

and back to the cabin..... I am pretty stoked to have the mill up at the property and now just need to get it assembled and milling lumber...we have MUCH planned!

Plan to start with 1/2" paneling (knotty pine), and 3/4" flooring (blue stained pine), then some structural stuff and exterior stuff (pine might not be the best but I have a ton which needs to be cut into something and I've read it's good for structural anyway).

Once we've milled a ton of lumber then we'll get back to working on the cabin -- this will give us time to finish wiring it out and finish back framing while the lumber is drying.

As spring approaches I also have to consider some other things on the list of 'to do' -- like planting a dozen fruit trees and two dozen Red Oaks :D  And then putting in a small well to provide them with more water since we don't get enough rain to keep them happy :D and then of course, fencing them in so the deer don't eat them before they are big enough to survive the deer!

So much to do and so little time!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on February 13, 2011, 01:53:01 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on February 13, 2011, 12:18:38 PM

Speaking of which, do you still have the rear anti-sway bar on?  I've read not to remove it when towing but often wonder how much lift you can get away without some kind of drop link like the fronts (jks quicker disco's on mine).


I have left the rear anti sway bar in place, because of trailer towing concerns. The Jeep seems to work okay with my 4.5" springs. A friend's XJ with same springs but no rear bar seems to act about the same ??? Another friend with an XJ has revolver rear shackles. With a setup like that the bar has to go.

I do have friends who don't own XJ's too.   ;D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Yonderosa on February 15, 2011, 08:59:37 PM
Will you be hiring out your sawmill services to the locals?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: jharleyhammond on February 15, 2011, 09:31:52 PM
Hey OJH - how deep are those trenches? I have land near Tonasket & want to do the same thing, but I'm on bed rock at the top of a 2800' hill.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 16, 2011, 01:49:13 AM
Quote from: Yonderosa on February 15, 2011, 08:59:37 PM
Will you be hiring out your sawmill services to the locals?

Yes!  Actually this is something I've been talking to the boys about and suggested that it might be a way to recoup some of the expense of buying the mill.

Need some lumber milled?

Of course, we have a few thousand board feet to mill first but then!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 16, 2011, 01:50:28 AM
Quote from: jharleyhammond on February 15, 2011, 09:31:52 PM
Hey OJH - how deep are those trenches? I have land near Tonasket & want to do the same thing, but I'm on bed rock at the top of a 2800' hill.

Which ones?  The ones dug for the post & pier foundation?  If so, my next question is:  will you be permitting?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Yonderosa on February 16, 2011, 08:06:53 AM
I do have some milling I need done  ;D 

That Ponderosa Pine tree that was killed by lightning last year and some Larch.  I've been looking for a sawyer on the Eastside, the guy I have been using is on Whidbey Island - he's excellent but the distance makes it impractical.

(http://www.myhostedpics.com/images/Pathfinder/sawmill.jpg)

It would be better for me to hire someone on the eastside.  Once you're established let me know what you need to charge out at.  I'm also open to trading if'n you're in need of cabinets.

I made these out of local Douglas Fir.  Building with materials native to and harvested on site feels cosmically correct to me.

(http://www.myhostedpics.com/images/Pathfinder/rawer.jpg)
Quarter sawn Doug Fir Drawer.  Mills beautifully.

(http://www.myhostedpics.com/images/Pathfinder/wall.jpg)
Here's one section of wall cabinets I built for our cabin.  Tried to incorporate the "defects" for rustic character

(http://www.myhostedpics.com/images/Pathfinder/wallc.jpg)




Quote from: OlJarhead on February 16, 2011, 01:49:13 AM
Quote from: Yonderosa on February 15, 2011, 08:59:37 PM
Will you be hiring out your sawmill services to the locals?

Yes!  Actually this is something I've been talking to the boys about and suggested that it might be a way to recoup some of the expense of buying the mill.

Need some lumber milled?

Of course, we have a few thousand board feet to mill first but then!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on February 16, 2011, 09:26:27 AM
There's an LT10 for sale in my neck of the woods, supposedly NIB for $3300.  Wish I had that laying around, but this last bout of unemployment has gone on too long and I'll have to take a pass on it ... Currently I'm working a 6 week gig (just started it yesterday), but a lot of that is budgeted elsewhere.

Your mill looks great Jarhead ... Once you get your lumber all milled, if I haven't bought one by then, maybe I can talk you into a weekend of milling a few trees for me.   :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 16, 2011, 02:07:55 PM
Quote from: Yonderosa on February 16, 2011, 08:06:53 AM
I do have some milling I need done  ;D 

That Ponderosa Pine tree that was killed by lightning last year and some Larch.  I've been looking for a sawyer on the Eastside, the guy I have been using is on Whidbey Island - he's excellent but the distance makes it impractical.

(http://www.myhostedpics.com/images/Pathfinder/sawmill.jpg)

It would be better for me to hire someone on the eastside.  Once you're established let me know what you need to charge out at.  I'm also open to trading if'n you're in need of cabinets.

I made these out of local Douglas Fir.  Building with materials native to and harvested on site feels cosmically correct to me.

(http://www.myhostedpics.com/images/Pathfinder/rawer.jpg)
Quarter sawn Doug Fir Drawer.  Mills beautifully.

(http://www.myhostedpics.com/images/Pathfinder/wall.jpg)
Here's one section of wall cabinets I built for our cabin.  Tried to incorporate the "defects" for rustic character

(http://www.myhostedpics.com/images/Pathfinder/wallc.jpg)




Quote from: OlJarhead on February 16, 2011, 01:49:13 AM
Quote from: Yonderosa on February 15, 2011, 08:59:37 PM
Will you be hiring out your sawmill services to the locals?

Yes!  Actually this is something I've been talking to the boys about and suggested that it might be a way to recoup some of the expense of buying the mill.

Need some lumber milled?

Of course, we have a few thousand board feet to mill first but then!

I would trade in a heartbeat!  Even just help with cabinets might be enough! ;)  Seriously, I'll pull my mill over there as soon as you want!! :D :D :D  And I LOVE the idea of milling the lumber for the cabinets right on the property...let's talk!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 16, 2011, 02:11:13 PM
Quote from: JavaMan on February 16, 2011, 09:26:27 AM
There's an LT10 for sale in my neck of the woods, supposedly NIB for $3300.  Wish I had that laying around, but this last bout of unemployment has gone on too long and I'll have to take a pass on it ... Currently I'm working a 6 week gig (just started it yesterday), but a lot of that is budgeted elsewhere.

Your mill looks great Jarhead ... Once you get your lumber all milled, if I haven't bought one by then, maybe I can talk you into a weekend of milling a few trees for me.   :)

The boys need experience :)  So we'd be happy to drag it over there.  One thing I'll need to do is figure out how to trailer-ise it.  I have an idea involving the use of a boat trailer modified to roll the mill up onto it and down off of it.  It is 'portable' in the sense that it comes apart but the head alone weighs a good 200+ lbs.  We almost couldn't lift it off the trailer deck to carry it into the shed!!

I'd like to have it set up so I can trailer it to a location, roll/winch it off the trailer and then leave it until the milling is done and finally winch/roll it back up onto the trailer to leave -- like a boat.  Just need to take a look at boat trailers and see if I can get an old used one that my neighbor can fab into a mill trailer :)  Then I'd also have a place to store fuel, water, tools and blades etc.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: SkagitDrifter on February 16, 2011, 02:30:47 PM
You're an animal 'Ol.
You never rest, do ya- always thinking and doing- I love that.
The mill is exciting stuff.  Looking forward to seeing what comes out of it.
With Yonderosa's craftmanship/help I see some nice cabinets in your future.
Good Luck with the new toy and remember saftey at all costs.
All the best!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 16, 2011, 02:56:56 PM
Quote from: SkagitDrifter on February 16, 2011, 02:30:47 PM
You're an animal 'Ol.
You never rest, do ya- always thinking and doing- I love that.
The mill is exciting stuff.  Looking forward to seeing what comes out of it.
With Yonderosa's craftmanship/help I see some nice cabinets in your future.
Good Luck with the new toy and remember saftey at all costs.
All the best!


Thanks man :)  I'm told that I wear people out as fast as I wear out a pair of shoes!  I'm never one to be able to stop if there are things I can do and when I can't do them I can't stop thinking about them...I'm one of those who can't shut down so I just look for more to do.

Safety first!  That's something I try to teach my kids always.  Being in a hurry won't get you no where, but where it gets you is usually quickly into the hospital.  So safety first.

Can't wait to use the mill and if Yonderosa is willing to help with our cabinets I'll be over at his place milling lumber as fast I can get the jeep to pull the mill there!  Are you kidding me?? haha  I'm so stoked I'm already trying to think of an easier way to get the mill loaded up because I'll be milling lumber like a madman so our interior paneling can start to dry...and of course I'll need some wood for the cabinets too...and then it's off over Yonderosa's way :D

Note to Yonderosa:  You do know I'm an animal right?  I'm told I'm like a bulldog and won't let go of something once I get my teeth into it!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: SkagitDrifter on February 16, 2011, 03:03:22 PM

Note to Yonderosa:  You do know I'm an animal right?  I'm told I'm like a bulldog and won't let go of something once I get my teeth into it!
[/quote]


Must be that good old Marine training.  My boy is getting a good dose of it down at 29 Palms Ca.  He'll be there for the next year or so.  OOH RAH!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 16, 2011, 03:39:29 PM
Quote from: SkagitDrifter on February 16, 2011, 03:03:22 PM

Note to Yonderosa:  You do know I'm an animal right?  I'm told I'm like a bulldog and won't let go of something once I get my teeth into it!


Must be that good old Marine training.  My boy is getting a good dose of it down at 29 Palms Ca.  He'll be there for the next year or so.  OOH RAH!
[/quote]

haha Yup, the Marines sorta instill work ethic into you whether you like it or not ;) but I wouldn't have it any other way! 

Tell him "Semper Fi!" for me!  and "Keep your head down and your powder dry"! and "Chesty Puller was a fighting Marine and a fighting Marine was he!!!  He called for his pipe, he called for his rifle and he called for his Privates Three!!  Beer, Beer, Beer said the Privates, and marry men are we, the Army is fair but it can't compare to Marine Corps Infantry!!!"  Ooorah!

And congrats to you for having a Marine son!  I'm so proud of our boys and girls in uniform and my daughter is a Navy Corpsman taking care of Marines...so we're in good hands eh??

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Yonderosa on February 16, 2011, 06:20:12 PM
We'll work out some kind of trade for services.

I ain't even got the trees down yet and I'm not sure how dry they need to be before milling.  No rush here.

You on the other hand look almost ready to move in so saw em up and git em dryin'  While that is happening we can figure out what you need and go from there.

Depending on how accurate your saw is it's a good idea to cut them 1" and once dry I'll plane them down to 3/4.  A little bit of blade scoring looks good if'n you're into the rustic look.  Something to think about. 

(http://www.myhostedpics.com/images/Pathfinder/rainbowoutpost.jpg)
That orange tree is the one that got hit by lightning. 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 16, 2011, 08:33:03 PM
Drop them and, mill them as soon as you can get them onto the saw platform!!!  :D  No waiting.

With the CSM I mill a lot over like that but I've learned (I've done a ton of reading as usual) that milling with the Woodmizer is different.  The blade cuts very smooth and Woodmizer claims (as well as tons of users) that at most you only need one light pass in the plane to get them ready -- if that!

The kerf is very thin also allowing for more wood out of each log.

I've got a ton of learning to do but noticed that Woodmizer recommends milling 5/8" boards for 1/2" paneling!  Now THAT is what I'm talking about :D  Less waste and more boards out of each log.

Luckily our kitchen is small and we don't need much in counter space (which will house the sink) but I'd like to have some overhead / wall mounted cupboards too.  It would be nice to mill some old knotty blue stained pine and make cupboards out of it :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Pine Cone on February 17, 2011, 01:03:48 AM
The guy who milled my logs up used a Woodmizer and we cut most boards 1" thick.  Ideally you would mill them up into boards ASAP to minimize damage from ambrosia beetles, flatheaded borers and roundheaded borers.  The borers get it quick once the weather is warm.  Peeling the bark off quickly will also help reduce insect problems.

Here is a pix of part of the milling process.  Getting logs to the mill takes some work.  You can see my son using a Peavy to roll the log uphill towards the mill.  Since I was paying the guy to run the mill I let him do that while we kept him will all the logs he needed to mill.
(https://i753.photobucket.com/albums/xx172/Pine_Cone/LogsWaitingToBeMilled.jpg)

On the last day we realized that it was easier to move the logs if we built a log/board road from scraps.  It probably took half the effort once we built our own skid road.
(https://i753.photobucket.com/albums/xx172/Pine_Cone/LogRoad.jpg)

We found that we needed a couple of Peavys to move the bigger logs (33' long, 10 to 20" in diameter).  You can get peavys and almost anything else you need from logging supply places like Madsens in Chehalis or over the internet from Baileys in Latonville, CA.

I normally run rough-cut boards through the planer twice on each side to make finished lumber.  My wood was western white pine, and almost all of my boards end up at 7/8" thick after drying for 4+ years before running them though the planer.  If they are too dirty I brush them off with a wire brush before planing them.  I think you could cut them to about 7/8" thick to start and still end up with most boards at 3/4" after planing.  With funky grained boards I sanded them on the finish side for my interior siding ceiling boards.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 17, 2011, 10:05:51 AM
Wow that's a LOT of wood!!!  I don't know if I have that much I plan to mill up...maybe 8-10 trees at the uppermost at this time...but perhaps that is roughly the same?? 

Dried 4+ years huh?  Long time!  But you're over on the wet coast too :)  Nice operation though!  He must have had one of the big WoodMizers?  LT40 maybe?  I've read those guys charge around 30-40 cents a board foot?

IN our case we've got the little guy (LT10) and no extension so at this time only can mill 8-10 foot logs but I plan to get at least two extensions for making 24' beams for foundations.  Got our cant hook (Peavy makes cant hooks and peavy hooks -- which most don't realize are different.  The peavy has a spike on the end while the cant has a hook on the end.  The Peavy was originally designed for water work I beleive...interesting though huh?).

Can't wait to get started though!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Yonderosa on February 18, 2011, 10:01:29 AM
Very cool guys!  Pine Cone, what is the best way to strip the bark? 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on February 18, 2011, 10:38:19 AM
Quote from: Yonderosa on February 18, 2011, 10:01:29 AM
Very cool guys!  Pine Cone, what is the best way to strip the bark?  

Don't want to step on PC's toes but I use a draw knife.  Depends on how loose the bark is ( time of year ) I have even used a mattock and/or scrapper for larger bark varieties.  The bark will strip a little easier working from the butt end to the top rather than vice versa.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Sassy on February 18, 2011, 01:23:50 PM
I stripped a lot of bark off of our logs - used a shingle remover (shaped like a peeling spud) & also a rotohammer w/a clay spade bit...  lots of work  :P  A lot of the bark was not ready to come off.  Glenn said it was good for me, worked off my oneriness  ::)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: glenn kangiser on February 18, 2011, 01:31:25 PM
If only the effect would last... [waiting]

Nice logs PC.  Lots of good lumber there.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 18, 2011, 03:55:20 PM
I mill them with the bark on.  The flitches will either get tossed or used for something later and once dry the bark falls off.  The Woodmizer can mill them with the bark on and the top woodmizers have debarkers to help keep the blade clean.

Anyway, I suppose I could ask the pros and see what they say but I know I've seen others mill with the bark on.

Erik
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on February 18, 2011, 05:10:03 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on February 18, 2011, 03:55:20 PM
I mill them with the bark on.  The flitches will either get tossed or used for something later and once dry the bark falls off.  The Woodmizer can mill them with the bark on and the top woodmizers have debarkers to help keep the blade clean.

Anyway, I suppose I could ask the pros and see what they say but I know I've seen others mill with the bark on.

Erik

The bark need to come off at some point either before or after sawed.  That is the first place insects will migrate to.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: jharleyhammond on February 19, 2011, 01:22:55 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on February 16, 2011, 01:50:28 AM
Quote from: jharleyhammond on February 15, 2011, 09:31:52 PM
Hey OJH - how deep are those trenches? I have land near Tonasket & want to do the same thing, but I'm on bed rock at the top of a 2800' hill.

Which ones?  The ones dug for the post & pier foundation?  If so, my next question is:  will you be permitting?

Yep the ones for the post & pier foundation. I think negative on the permit. We're way off grid and our current structure - "seasonal cabin" - is on skids & seems fine.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Sassy on February 19, 2011, 06:23:56 PM
If you're using the logs for beams & columns w/out milling, you'll have to take the bark off 1st - that's why I had so many to de-bark...   d*
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 21, 2011, 08:50:22 PM
Quote from: jharleyhammond on February 19, 2011, 01:22:55 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on February 16, 2011, 01:50:28 AM
Quote from: jharleyhammond on February 15, 2011, 09:31:52 PM
Hey OJH - how deep are those trenches? I have land near Tonasket & want to do the same thing, but I'm on bed rock at the top of a 2800' hill.

Which ones?  The ones dug for the post & pier foundation?  If so, my next question is:  will you be permitting?

Yep the ones for the post & pier foundation. I think negative on the permit. We're way off grid and our current structure - "seasonal cabin" - is on skids & seems fine.

*chuckle* in that case we went down about 16" in most cases though we're on a slight slope and some of the piers are up a little higher -- maybe only 12" down.

After 18 months and two winters (still in this one) no issue at all.  The frost really only gets down about 6" out here despite the cold and altitude so perhaps the 24" they claim in the area is for extreme cold (below -30) or pipes...but we've had no issue at all with the foundation.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 21, 2011, 09:06:43 PM
Josh and I arrived Friday night around 10PM and began warming up the cabin.  It got up to 45 by the time we hit the sack...it was ZERO outside!

The next morning I warmed the cabin up to 60 degrees (it never got above 45 during the night but was up around 55 when I finally got up (7am)...then we started our day putting the mill together.
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0119.jpg)
First we had to assemble the bed and get it straight.  It doesn't have to be level as long as the bed rails are even from one end to another.  However, next trip we will level it anyway just becuase I want it level :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0124.jpg)
Two of our neighbors stopped by (different times) and helped out.  Gordon (in this picture) rolled his truck on his way down the drive.  He wasn't using chains (this was a few days ago) becuase he wasn't having trouble making it up and down but hadn't counted on it raining and then freezing...he hit the last grade and it just went away.  He's ok though and still driving the truck which had minor damage:  note to self:  always use chains!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0129.jpg)
Took us most of the day so we didn't mill any lumber on Saturday but Sunday was a full day!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0143.jpg)
Got started around 9:30am and stopped for lunch at one.  Then picked it back up at 1:45 and milled until 3:30.  The days are still short and we didn't want to be stacking and stickering in the dark and had wood to chop and clean up to do so we called it a day but not until we'd milled a fair bit!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0145.jpg)
Very exciting really.  We were cooking right along!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0159.jpg)
Lots to learn still but we were able to mill quite a bit despite the short time we spent on the mill.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0168.jpg)
Even milled the flitches into boards!

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 21, 2011, 09:12:10 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0173.jpg)
40 boards milled 5/8"x9.5"x8'3" for paneling and a bunch of 1x stock and left overs which can all be planed or milled for various uses.

We found that clamping the logs must be done perfectly to keep them still but not so tight they lift on one side.  Otherwise, you can cut to about 1" from the deck depending on where the log clamps are set etc.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0183-1.jpg)
We can't wait to get back and get a couple days in!  We need about 170 more boards for paneling and then all sorts of dimensional stuff....all in all -- AWESOME!

Cheers
Erik
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rniles on February 21, 2011, 09:16:32 PM
Nice machine Erik! Those look like some nice boards. How long do you have to let them season ...to get the moisture level down?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 21, 2011, 10:41:43 PM
Quote from: rniles on February 21, 2011, 09:16:32 PM
Nice machine Erik! Those look like some nice boards. How long do you have to let them season ...to get the moisture level down?


Rule of thumb is 6 to 8 weeks but actually pine 'can' air dry in 15 days if the weather is right, the set up is right and all the stars are aligned ;)

I plan to let them go 4-6 weeks in the outdoors and then 2 weeks indoors to finish them all.  Being cold out I might need to let them go a little longer but we'll see.  I plan to plane and mill them into T&G after that but want to make sure they are dry enough to except the poly coat and be nailed up without any additional shrinkage (at least not enough to matter).

I've actually seen stuff done green by some.  They just mill them and slap them up and let them dry on the wall, but to do that you have to either overlap them like siding, or make shiplap that overlaps an inch or more -- that way when they dry and shrink you won't have gaps.

In my case I'm not in that big of a hurry :)  I just want to have the interior finished by late spring :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on February 21, 2011, 11:02:15 PM
Do you have a moisture meter?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Pine Cone on February 22, 2011, 12:09:48 AM
Quote from: Yonderosa on February 18, 2011, 10:01:29 AM
Very cool guys!  Pine Cone, what is the best way to strip the bark? 

Sorry for the late reply, but I've been out of town listening and playing Old Time Music.

My wife and I used bark spuds/shingle removers (a 3-4" flat blade on an 8-foot long handle) to clean the bark off the longer logs (34' long), and then I used a draw knife to do the final cleanup on cabin logs (8-feet long).  I ended up with both by the end of the project

A Peavy has a spike on the end that works well on thick-barked logs.  The spike is pointing in the same direction as the long handle and is meant to stick into the bark rather than the wood.  A cant hook is made for working with cants, squared-up logs, with the point perpendicular to the handle so it does less damage to the finished boards. 

There are two reasons to remove the bark before milling the wood.  The first is that if you skid the logs on dirt (instead of snow), the bark ends up full of dirt and rocks that damage the bandsaw blade.  The second is that if you leave the bark on between March and October it will encourage insects (bark beetles and wood borers) to lay eggs in your logs.  Wood borers live a long time.  Three years after cutting my cabin logs I discovered round-headed borer pupae in some of my logs.  For boards this is less of a problem, but for posts and logs it may mean that you have insects exiting your logs years after you have built things with them.   I was a forest entomology/pathology researcher for several years and have a good appreciation about how much damage insects can cause.

In your case, since you are skidding the logs over snow and it is still winter, I don't see any reason why you need to take the bark off first, but come spring it will be a different story.

My friends' WoodMizer was bigger than yours and mounted on a trailer so he could pull it behind his truck.  No idea what model it was, but it could mill logs longer than 16', had hydraulics to lift the logs onto the carriage, and the bandsaw part was pulled though the log with a motor-driven chain drive.  He had made a living with his mill in the past.  I met him in the kayak-building world so I already knew him before I started building our cabin.

Looks like you are making great progress.  I have found it very satisfying to build with boards that I helped mill up from logs.  You've gone one step further... 

Keep them pictures and post coming!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 22, 2011, 01:09:09 AM
Quote from: MountainDon on February 21, 2011, 11:02:15 PM
Do you have a moisture meter?

Not yet, but I plan on getting one :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 26, 2011, 10:40:17 AM
No work this weekend :(  Kids moving in (son-in-law was laid off) and I'm fighting a sinus thing.  SO it's stay home, eat soup and relax all weekend -- and plot the next trip!

I have plans to get more bodies to the cabin and get all the logs staged for the mill while a crew works the mill -- with luck we can get about 10-15 logs milled in a weekend if we have the bodies and stage well.

Then in the middle of next month we will have a family trip to the cabin :)  Mostly to enjoy the place (and work a little)...but come spring weather we'll finish the wiring and start on the interior finish!  WHoohoo!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 07, 2011, 01:03:38 AM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0087-1.jpg)
No time to report but I thought I'd toss this up :)

My step son on the left runs the mill and my son-in-law to be on the right is the helper :)  I'm the foreman!

We had a great weekend and despite it hitting 10 degrees last night we stayed warm :)

One issue we had however, was the sewer pipe freezing AGAIN!  I moved the heat trace to cover ALL of it this time and put it on the solar power in hopes it will be thawed come next weekend.

More to follow after sleep and work!
Cheers
Erik
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 07, 2011, 10:27:25 AM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0031-1.jpg)
I worked late Friday so we weren't able to head out until about 6:30pm which meant a LATE arrival at the cabin in the best of conditions...which we did not have.

After driving two hours to get home, then packing the jeep and heading out I was tired to start with.  Then we ran into a blizzard!  It snowed on us for the last 100 miles of driving and got worse and worse.  By the time we arrived at our private road to head into the hills my eyes were exhausted!  We chained up, however, and drove to the cabin as the snow finally let up...hmmmmm..

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0033.jpg)
Once at the cabin I plonked my butt into my comfy chair by the wood stove and got the stove lit while the boys unloaded the Road Warrior (Jeep).  It was 40 degrees inside the cabin and 20 out -- very nice!  Didn't take long to warm it up.

It was 1am before I passed out (which is WAY past my bedtime) and 4am before I stoked the fire again.  Ahh life in the cabin during the winter - but I don't mind.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0039.jpg)
Next morning we slept in, then had breakfast (Scrambled eggs with bacon and sausage with sourdough bread and coffee of course) and finally got busy around 11am.

We had to pull up logs that were burried in 15" of snow but the jeep worked as a skidder and the boys choked em up.  We managed to pull the last of one tree up leaving us 5 new logs and the old log we'd left on the mill.  Good enough for me.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0049-1.jpg)
Josh set to quarter sawing the old pine in hopes of giving us some nice quarter sawn blue stain for the cabinets.  This is by far the longest way to mill a log!  It took 2 1/2 hours to mill on 16" log this way!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0052-1.jpg)
I've read, however, that quarter sawn lumber is the best for furniture making etc so we milled this one up that way.  You should be able to see the grain better in these.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0053.jpg)
Or these.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0064.jpg)
We stickered and stacked the lumber up to 4 feet high before running out of stickers!  I'll have to make some now, as well as bring more pallets.  All in all we're very happy and milled the 5 new logs in 2 1/2 hours -- and we're still learning.

We did manage to come close to the 100 board feet an hour this mill can do but we have some learning to do still :)  Either way, the learning is making us pine to put in the cabin :D

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0074.jpg)
And so another weekend passes and we had to leave.  Staying for just a couple days isn't enough!  I want to stay for WEEKS!

Oh and I should mention that our sewer pipe froze again :(  The heat trace wasn't hooked up to cabin power because I haven't run the power fully yet.  I have plans to run romex back to the composter in the spring but for now it's either a generator or find a hole to stuff an extension cord through.  SO we opted for the genny -- mistake -- and the pipe froze on us!!!!

By Sunday morning I knew we were in trouble and couldn't use the toilet again and we set the genny running to warm the pipe.  However it just wasn't good enough!  Then I realized the problem was the way I ran the heat trace.  It was wrapped only near the top couple feet of the pipe because that is where I originally had the problem, so we unwrapped all the insulation and re-wrapped the heat trace and the insulation -- this time covering the entire pipe.  The boys then ran an extension cord under the cabin and up into the porch and plugged it into the solar power.

Now I think it will thaw out and be ready for the next trip :)  I hope so!  But with temps hitting 40 degrees during the day I'm confident -- it's just those 10 degree nights that worry me.

Cheers
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rniles on March 09, 2011, 10:57:04 PM
Love the pics ....got a lot of work done ..that mill really seems to be handy!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 10, 2011, 10:07:42 AM
Quote from: rniles on March 09, 2011, 10:57:04 PM
Love the pics ....got a lot of work done ..that mill really seems to be handy!

Thanks -- it is amazing :)  After milling some lumber with a Chainsaw Mill the WoodMizer is a Ferrari!  We actually enjoy using it, it's easy to run and the lumber coming off of it is promising :)

Going back this weekend to drag logs up and stage as many as I can -- 3 days this time!  WHooHoo!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on March 10, 2011, 10:55:11 AM
You might want to collect as many as you can now, if there is still snow on the ground. 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 10, 2011, 11:46:04 AM
Quote from: MountainDon on March 10, 2011, 10:55:11 AM
You might want to collect as many as you can now, if there is still snow on the ground. 

That's the plan Don :)  It has it's challenges but with all 4 corners chained up on the Jeep I should have no problem getting to the logs and dragging them back.  I hope to stage a dozen logs in the milling area (landing) so that we can get serious next trip and really get milling!

Then I'll get a router table made and start milling T&G sometime in April :D 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Sassy on March 10, 2011, 01:19:19 PM
Nice stack of lumber!   c*
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 10, 2011, 01:21:43 PM
Quote from: Sassy on March 10, 2011, 01:19:19 PM
Nice stack of lumber!   c*

Thanks!  We hope to have a few more soon :D  Then we will finish the cabin and get to work on out buildings all with as much (if not all) the lumber we can mill from our own trees.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 15, 2011, 11:01:38 AM
Had a good weekend at the cabin with my wife and kids and a nefew and his GF :)  We managed to get a dozen logs ready to mill and milled on old Blue Stained Pine for making end tables -- we milled it at 3" deep to make heavy tops but as it was a bit thin we'll have to use two pieces to make one top -- I'll drill holes in the side and glue dowels into the holes to attach two 8" boards together.

I plan to use small saplings for legs and coat it in poly.  Of course have to wait for it to dry mind you.

Also got the freezer hooked up and working on the solar power and used the iota charger as the sun just wasn't coming out.

Next I'll have to get some heavier gauge wire for the charger as all I had was 10awg which is MUCH too small (so I had to constantly monitor while charging).  I'll replace the wiring (just couldn't find the cables I bought for it in the first place) next trip.

I also plan to get two more GCB's for the system to increase capacity and with luck will be picking up a small fridge for it also.

I can't wait to get back and the next trip my son (Kurt) will be coming too! 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rniles on March 15, 2011, 11:07:45 AM
Sounds like you had a great time ...how was the snow up there?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 15, 2011, 11:42:18 AM
Quote from: rniles on March 15, 2011, 11:07:45 AM
Sounds like you had a great time ...how was the snow up there?

Snowing again this week  d*  Last year the snow was all but gone by now but this year we've had a LOT more.  Still up to 15" in areas and the road was out-of-this-world bad!  Even with all 4 corners chained up I slid on one corner!!!  I've NEVER had that happen before.

Seems the 8" of solid ice covered with a few inches of melting snow/slush makes for a slippy road.

Actually got to use the Winch for something other then logging this trip too!  One of the residents had slid off the road in her toyota truck and couldn't get back onto the road.  She was at the top of a steep steep part of the road and precariously on the bank stopped by rocks from going down the bank (a long way)....so we hooked up the winch and hauled her out :)

Jeep!  The Yota recovery vehicle :D  [cool]
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rniles on March 17, 2011, 10:48:56 AM
A good samaritan you! I've been watching the weather and it seems the cascades are just getting hammered ...I thought some of that would be spilling over in the Okanogan valley.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 24, 2011, 12:23:10 AM
Yup - the weather has been brutal this year!

I've been working on some solar power stuff and it looks like I can run a fridge and freezer 24x7 in the summer and 'should' be ok with 6-8 batteries (220ah gcb's)....it's probably safe since we get a lot of sun but I bet it could be touchy if the rains came on and it actually rained for a week straight in June which I have seen....though I doubt the freezer would thaw mind you, since it wouldn't get opened.

Anyway, just something I'm working on...might have to consider 1 more panel and 10 batteries to push the range out a bit...but I'm only planning on running these on low settings and the freezer only if actually needed in which case it would be full or partially full so ought to use less energy.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: glenn kangiser on March 24, 2011, 12:55:58 AM
Mill is looking good, OJ.

We use 50/50 diesel and chainsaw bar oil for blade lube.  Sprayed on while cutting it is not really noticeable on the wood later.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 24, 2011, 05:24:47 PM
Quote from: glenn kangiser on March 24, 2011, 12:55:58 AM
Mill is looking good, OJ.

We use 50/50 diesel and chainsaw bar oil for blade lube.  Sprayed on while cutting it is not really noticeable on the wood later.

Interesting combination.  Woodmizer recommends water for most milling and we haven't tried anything else yet...we're getting about the life we're told to expect out of the blades but we're newbies too.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 28, 2011, 01:33:13 PM
Got up this weekend and milled a little more lumber, burned slash and chopped firewood :)

Now I'm looking for a new charge controller :(  At $500 a unit more or less I'm a little sore that I already bought and put to use the C40 ($111) but on the other hand I'm kind of excited because with just about 200 watts of charging power I almost had what I needed with the batteries I have (6 now, soon to be 8) so I figure with an MPPT controller I will probably be doing the sun dance soon :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 29, 2011, 09:38:46 AM
Oi!  Got the controller coming :D  So now I'll have to make a trip to clean up the solar power and perhaps finish the battery box -- and I might as well add two more batteries while I'm at it...hmmm....so much to do!

I've got a few pics from the last trip :)  I'll post soon.  All in all, we've got a lot of work to do but it's nice to be able to go up and just relax a little too :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 29, 2011, 12:12:24 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0076-1.jpg)
Woke up Saturday morning and thought "someone please smack Al Gore!"

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0086.jpg)
But the snow melted (Global Warming?  *snicker*) and we got to work!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0087-2.jpg)
The boys were milling away before I realized I was out of stickers!!!  Yikes!  Well, maybe next trip I'll remember to make that happen -- as in I'll get the boys to make stickers out of cheapo 1x4's and take them up with us so we can mill the 9 remaining logs.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0092-1.jpg)
And then Global Cooling took place again....funny how that seems to happen a lot in the winter...wonder why...oh Al Gore, buddy ol' pal.....I wanna smack you!"

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0098.jpg)
Last year this time it was warmer by a bunch, the snow was gone, we were sleeping in a tent trailer and framing the gabled ends and sheeting the roof...hmmmmm......

Anyway, life is good and the retreat motors along :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Sassy on March 29, 2011, 02:23:41 PM
 heh heh  yeah, that Al Gore - it's all his fault!!!  Great pix, btw!  You're getting a lot of lumber piled up there.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on March 30, 2011, 04:31:47 PM
Good deal OJ ... I can't wait for the snow to finally let me up to my place. I have a feeling it's going to be like 3 years ago .. I could barely make it in there on the first of June... and when I went up and tried on the first weekend in May, I could get about 1 mile from my place and then the truck would be buried to the axles.

Your place looks like it gets snow, but it seems to disappear during the day ... nice.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Yonderosa on March 30, 2011, 06:00:10 PM
Some neighbors by me said their still getting snow but its on the retreat. 

Gearing up for another trip over myself.   ;D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 30, 2011, 07:32:25 PM
We're getting snow almost daily but it mostly melts during the day now and I could drive right up without chains!  It was dicey once or twice but not too bad.

I have had a little experience with deep snow and slush on top of ice and fully understand why you two can't drive up in the winter!  I'm VERY lucky to have a neighbor that lives full time above me (he's at 3600') and who keeps the road traveled.

When are you headed up Yonderosa?  Perhaps we might get together?  I plan to be up twice in April if all goes well and maybe once for a couple extra days.

Erik
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Yonderosa on March 30, 2011, 09:29:05 PM
no firm date yet.  Just need a window of opportunity. 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 01, 2011, 05:10:19 PM
Quote from: Yonderosa on March 30, 2011, 09:29:05 PM
no firm date yet.  Just need a window of opportunity. 

Well let me know when you head up and if we're going to be up the same time we might have to get together.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 01, 2011, 09:31:00 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/IMG_0113.jpg)
This arrived today :D

It's about 3 times the size of the Xantrex C40 and I can't wait to plug it in, get it up and running and get a laptop plugged into it too!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on April 05, 2011, 03:54:05 PM
You have internet access up there?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 05, 2011, 05:20:13 PM
Quote from: JavaMan on April 05, 2011, 03:54:05 PM
You have internet access up there?

Nope -- but if I did it would be sweet!

Just plug the laptop in to get stats etc...
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on April 06, 2011, 10:02:54 AM
Yeah, I might not come down from the mountain in the summer if I had the 'net up at my place... I'd work from there if I could. 

Good to see the progress you're making even with the white stuff going on.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: curlewdave on April 06, 2011, 12:42:42 PM
We headed  to Colville and got Wild Blue installed at our place over by Curlew...Works great.  If you look at the topic on homes under 500 square feet you'll see our cabin with two dishes on it, one for the satellite TV and the other for our computer....
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on April 06, 2011, 02:29:41 PM
Quote from: curlewdave on April 06, 2011, 12:42:42 PM
We headed  to Colville and got Wild Blue installed at our place over by Curlew...Works great.  If you look at the topic on homes under 500 square feet you'll see our cabin with two dishes on it, one for the satellite TV and the other for our computer....

Dave if you don't mind reveiling how much the installation and monthly fee is on the internet?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: curlewdave on April 06, 2011, 02:34:19 PM
At the time we got free installation and paid about 60 bucks a month on a 2-year contract.  That was a few years ago.  You might want to go to the Wild Blue site and check it out now...Dave
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: curlewdave on April 06, 2011, 03:01:32 PM
My wife just checked out the Hughes Net site and felt it had a better deal, but check them both out...
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 06, 2011, 06:54:35 PM
Neighbors have Satellite internet but told me it's limited until midnight (not sure how much) and $64 a month but they could get much better...I'll check it out.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 11, 2011, 09:07:24 AM
Next trip in the works :)

Supposed to snow all week....someone check the calendar but I think it's April isn't it?  With luck we'll scoot out of here Thursday night or Friday morning and have lots of time to mill lumber, make T&G for the walls and upgrade the solar power :)

We'll be going back the following weekend too so we can get more done and then again after that...spring is in the air! :D

It looks like the snow will be flying until Wed or Thur but then it's supposed to get above 50 for the weekend!  NICE!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 18, 2011, 01:18:03 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0234.jpg)
Got up this weekend and milled a bit more lumber for the cabin.  I'm hopeful that the last weekend of the month we will be able to make T&G and start hammering it up.  It would be a nice change of pace I think.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0245.jpg)
I have much work to do here also.  Namely, installing conduit and correcting wire lengths and types as well as getting the ground properly installed (we ran into rocks last time and then the ground froze).  However, I did manage to get the new charge controller in and WHAT A DIFFERENCE!  Amazing what the right parts to the puzzle can do.  Now the batteries should be easily kept to charge throughout the day and I just need to add two more now and I should be able to run a freezer all summer long :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0236.jpg)
Sleeping quarters for an old Marine :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0240.jpg)
The parlor ;)  This is where my evenings are spent reading.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0241.jpg)
Dinning Room :)  We salvaged an old table of my mother-in-law's for the cabin and it fits nicely.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rniles on April 18, 2011, 01:24:31 PM
It is looking like a wonderful home-sweet-away-from-home!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 18, 2011, 01:25:43 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/solar3.jpg)
The new controller is installed (mostly) and running.  I found it interesting to watch what it is doing and can't wait to get back and start tidying up the install -- I also plan to install the battery temp sensor so it can adjust voltages for temperature.

One thing I wasn't certain of, was what the settings for the GCB's should be so I chose flooded cell batteries and hope to get that sorted before returning in case I need to make some changes.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/solar2.jpg)
The sun kinda came and went (partially cloudy with times of full sun throughout the weekend).

One thing that disappointed me was that despite getting the batteries pretty much fully charged they dropped to a reported 0'30% charge over night.  It did, however, get below freezing but we only ran 3 CFL's and the inverter on Saturday night.  The lights ran about 6 hours and of course the inverter for 24 but I didn't expect the batteries to drop that much.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on April 19, 2011, 11:31:35 AM
Looking good jarhead ... wish my project was coming along that well !  Your place looks nice and cozy there by the wood stove.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 24, 2011, 06:23:31 PM
Quote from: JavaMan on April 19, 2011, 11:31:35 AM
Looking good jarhead ... wish my project was coming along that well !  Your place looks nice and cozy there by the wood stove.

It's cozy alright!

Helps that I can take most every other weekend to drive to the cabin and work on it...and that I'm an old Jarhead that refuses to let up! :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on April 25, 2011, 10:03:51 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on April 24, 2011, 06:23:31 PM
It's cozy alright!

Helps that I can take most every other weekend to drive to the cabin and work on it...and that I'm an old Jarhead that refuses to let up! :D

HA!  yeah, I suppose that hard-headedness of you ol' jarheads (read jar-he-ads) does prove useful ... some might say "too dumb to quit", but not me  ;)

Just funnin' with yah  :)  I know better'n to cross a jarhead, old or otherwise  ;D

Of course I have a stubborn streak in me, but never was a jarhead ... three years ago I was stubborn enough to try getting up to the property alone (around Mother's day) and buried the axles in the snow.  If it hadn't been for the neighbor that was just down the hill 1/4 mile I would have been stuck for a while.  I'm chomping at the bit to head up to the place now already (now that I have some $$ set aside for gas and building supplies). but it will still be about another month yet, I think. - been watching the snow mobile ads, too.

When I finally get up there, we'll have to meet for coffee or lunch.  Conconully might be good or Omak...

Keep working on that place - it looks like a great retreat! 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 01, 2011, 11:25:32 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Wall.jpg)
We have a wall!

Not much time to post but suffice to say we had a great weekend and managed to plane and router enough pine to cover one wall :)  Looks awesome, feels awesome!

More soon :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Pine Cone on May 02, 2011, 01:02:02 AM
Looks great!

Nothing like being able to say that the wood you're looking at came from your own property [cool]
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on May 02, 2011, 11:51:31 AM
That is absolutely AWESOME!  Looks good too.  I love how it looks up there on that wall... and from your own place, too... very cool  [cool]
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 02, 2011, 05:59:14 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Kurt_planing.jpg)
We started the weekend by planing down about 15 boards we'd milled at 5/8 x 8-9" x 8' to 1/2" in thickness (they didn't shrink much despite being well dried).

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/planing.jpg)
Planing them down was a bit of a chore and easiest with 3 of us doing it.  The Ryobi planer worked very well though!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/chips.jpg)
We captured most of the chips to save for the composting toilet :)

Then we ripped all the boards in half because I was worried about cupping as some (few) had cupped a little in drying.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/millingTG.jpg)
Then we began running them through the router table we made on the spot to make them into Tongue and Groove.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/KurtJosh.jpg)
The boys did a great job of this and we planed enough for one wall.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/MakingTG.jpg)
This is a shot of our crude but effective router table.  HEY!  It worked! :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 02, 2011, 06:20:09 PM
I might add that anyone with a sharp eye will notice all the Ryobi tools in this pick.  I have had very good luck with them and most of my power tools are Ryobi with the exception of my skill saws and my Miter Saw (and wood mill...)...they work well and many of them have years of use from them...all for a lot less $$ then Makita (my miter) or Dewalt (my sawzall)....
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Yonderosa on May 03, 2011, 08:11:44 AM
Looks mighty good!  I'm very impressed.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 03, 2011, 11:36:23 AM
Quote from: Yonderosa on May 03, 2011, 08:11:44 AM
Looks mighty good!  I'm very impressed.



Thanks Yonderosa!  I'm very excited and having now milled the trees we fell into lumber, dried it, planed it, milled it into T&G and nailed it up I feel a real sense of accomplishment!!!  Thinking back a couple years I had no idea I'd be doing this! :)

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 03, 2011, 12:26:01 PM
My next trip is in the works and should be a busy one!  I have SOOOO much to do still but I have to both budget what I do as well as prioritize it and pace myself.  So the next trip should include the following:

1.  Dig irrigation well, root cellar, outhouse hole and gray water drain holes.  We may also expand the area around the composting toilet shelter to improve it.  We will be renting an excavator and a friend will do the honors.
2.  Remove insulation from walls and finish drilling them for wiring and then pull in wiring.
3.  Continue to plane lumber for the walls and make it into T&G.
4.  Finish framing the wall behind the stove and mount the hardy backer board to it (need to shorten the board too) so we can finish the paneling on that wall.
5.  Put a cripple stud in above the door.

And with luck maybe we can get some more T7G on the walls and burn a bunch of slash and mill scraps.

So much to do!

We also have 18 more Red Oaks to try to plant (assuming my plan to save the saplings works -- I had the boys plant them in the garden in weed barrier sacks as we didn't have time to plan them all) and I need to get at least two apple trees planted up there also but I want to make sure they have the standard root balls so they will survive the colder climate of our property (it was down to 20 Saturday night but up to 60 during the day Sunday).

My plan was to have the interior paneling in by the end of spring but it's a slow process so I might have to shift that to well into the summer.  So, with that in mind I also have at least one more tree to drop right away (to clear the panels for more sunlight) and we could get that milled and dried for use this summer.

My son also wanted to make a night stand with lumber we milled so we may try to do some of that also.

I think I need a cabin party soon!!!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rniles on May 03, 2011, 12:50:19 PM
Very nicely done! Looks good and straight down from your own trees. Nice.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 03, 2011, 01:15:03 PM
Quote from: rniles on May 03, 2011, 12:50:19 PM
Very nicely done! Looks good and straight down from your own trees. Nice.

Thanks :)  I just can't wait to do more!!! We have a LOT of wood ready to finish and the idea of having a finished interior is very motivating!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 07, 2011, 09:47:52 AM
I've been going to the cabin every other weekend, for the most part, and admit that while I need to do things at home (like get some garden work done, laundry etc) I'd much rather be at the cabin milling lumber and turning it into paneling!  However I have to start gathering supplies for the next trip so what better time then now?

My current list includes:

1.  Romex Staples (my old supply is running low)
2.  Fresh Air Intake - I've not installed it yet but need to do so before the cabin is closed in.
3.  90 degree drill attachment (I've got some spots I can't get my drill into so plan to get something I can with).
4.  DC Fan installed in conduit for vent stack of composter (I broke the last one so need to get this one fixed and installed.
5.  Wire for composter fan (need to take 12vdc about 20 feet so I'm thinking I should use some decent wire)

I also plan to get some cereal rye and FINALLY found where I can buy it by the 200lbs bag!  It's a bit spendy but I think it will be worth it (it can be used for cover crop / soil fixing, grains for bread, grazing for deer and more).

And I also need to get a couple fruit trees and some fencing as well as 10 feet of 24" PVC pipe for the new well...man I have work to do!!!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: mogie01 on May 08, 2011, 04:55:50 PM
Wow, great work.  We wouldn't even attempt at try to make our own panelling  [cool]  - it would save us a bunch of money
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on May 09, 2011, 09:57:31 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on May 07, 2011, 09:47:52 AM
I've been going to the cabin every other weekend, for the most part, and admit that while I need to do things at home (like get some garden work done, laundry etc) I'd much rather be at the cabin milling lumber and turning it into paneling!  However I have to start gathering supplies for the next trip so what better time then now?

My current list includes:

1.  Romex Staples (my old supply is running low)
2.  Fresh Air Intake - I've not installed it yet but need to do so before the cabin is closed in.
3.  90 degree drill attachment (I've got some spots I can't get my drill into so plan to get something I can with).
4.  DC Fan installed in conduit for vent stack of composter (I broke the last one so need to get this one fixed and installed.
5.  Wire for composter fan (need to take 12vdc about 20 feet so I'm thinking I should use some decent wire)

I also plan to get some cereal rye and FINALLY found where I can buy it by the 200lbs bag!  It's a bit spendy but I think it will be worth it (it can be used for cover crop / soil fixing, grains for bread, grazing for deer and more).

And I also need to get a couple fruit trees and some fencing as well as 10 feet of 24" PVC pipe for the new well...man I have work to do!!!

Did you find that rye close to you or are you ordering it on the net? (my guess is close to you, but I thought I'd ask) ... I'm thinking a similar thing for up at my property, and in my garden overwinter.  I'm actually thinking wheat, rye, barley (I'd love to try malting and brewing from it), and oats (I have three separate gardens here at home).
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on May 09, 2011, 01:16:05 PM
Quote3.  90 degree drill attachment (I've got some spots I can't get my drill into so plan to get something I can with).

Ryobi makes a nice 90 degree 18 volt drill
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 09, 2011, 07:20:33 PM
Quote from: JavaMan on May 09, 2011, 09:57:31 AM
Did you find that rye close to you or are you ordering it on the net? (my guess is close to you, but I thought I'd ask) ... I'm thinking a similar thing for up at my property, and in my garden overwinter.  I'm actually thinking wheat, rye, barley (I'd love to try malting and brewing from it), and oats (I have three separate gardens here at home).
http://www.seedsource.com/catalog/detail.asp?PRODUCT_ID=8050

Found it there :)

Not sure how oats would do but I'm of the same frame of mind ;)

THe rye can be used for bread as well as wiskey ;) or just feeding the deer and fixing the soil.

I'd actually like at least an acre of everything you mentioned except maybe the barley and add corn :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 09, 2011, 07:45:24 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on May 09, 2011, 01:16:05 PM
Ryobi makes a nice 90 degree 18 volt drill

THanks Don!  I'll check it out.  I have a lot of their stuff and it's treated me well over the years.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on May 10, 2011, 10:30:09 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on May 09, 2011, 07:20:33 PM
http://www.seedsource.com/catalog/detail.asp?PRODUCT_ID=8050

Found it there :)

Not sure how oats would do but I'm of the same frame of mind ;)

THe rye can be used for bread as well as wiskey ;) or just feeding the deer and fixing the soil.

I'd actually like at least an acre of everything you mentioned except maybe the barley and add corn :)

Well, corn is going to get planted late this week and into next ... harvest will be in August/September time frame - at which time the entire 40' X 25' bed will get tilled, and seeded with one or two of the four I mentioned.

Like you, I'd love an acre of each - which is why I'm going to try a test plot up at the property this fall and see how it goes.  From all my research, rye and winter wheat (and barley, to some extent) will over winter pretty good and then take off in the spring.  Which means I'll have to plant here and run up there to harvest!  I think that's a good excuse to have to go to the Ranch, don't you? "Beautiful, I HAVE to go and get that wheat and rye off the property or it will simply rot!" :D

Another reason to get an ORV to get up there as early as I can...

Thanks for the link!  I'm going to run and check it out
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 12, 2011, 11:58:11 PM
WhooHoo!  Took the day off tomorrow so will be leaving early to get to the cabin and get working :) ;D [cool]

I'm pretty excited actually!  Why?  Becuase while we go every two weeks we don't always go with a lot of planning or things in mind but sometimes I have the chance to plan things out a bit and it's those times I get most excited about going :)  This time I plan wiring, paneling and more!

I'll take pictures :D

Seeya!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 15, 2011, 11:08:16 PM
Just got in but wanted to share some pictures.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Westwall.jpg)
We installed the wiring on the West wall (the one with the stove) and installed the hardy board.  Then put the insulation in and began nailing up our pine paneling.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/cornerwall.jpg)
We had a little trouble getting used to the new router table I bought on the way up and had to mill the paneling in 4' and 5' sections until we got used to it then went back to 8' pieces.  Overall we had a great weekend and you can see the results :)

I'll get more of all we did later but wanted to share this.

Erik
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 16, 2011, 08:59:19 AM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/wiring.jpg)
Once we arrived Friday and got set up Kurt and I set to planing boards while Josh and James (son-in-law to be) installed some wiring and stuffed insulation back in -- except this time they staples it and got the wall ready for paneling.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/hardy.jpg)
Saturday Kurt and I picked out a nice chunk of 2x stock, ripped it to 5 1/2" and then ran it through the plane once or twice to take the roughness out (didn't need it though) and then used it to frame the wall behind the stove for the hardy board.  Which we then installed over the insulation.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/install1.jpg)
With all that prep work done we began nailing up panel as it was made -- ok I let them make enough to get ahead of me and then Kurt and I installed panel while Josh and James made it.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/burningslash-1.jpg)
Saturday James spent much of his time burning a big slash pile.  It was great to get rid of it :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 17, 2011, 09:35:48 AM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/cornerwall-1.jpg)
Just something about being at this stage of the build that makes me want to take a week and go back and stay and work on it!  But I can't :(

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Stovewall.jpg)
So I guess these pictures will have to sustain me for a while.  I don't expect to have the interior done until mid to late summer but can't wait!!!  The day we drive up, pack in, and kick back for a weekend is the day I'll be in heaven :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Sassy on May 17, 2011, 10:09:01 PM
nice paneling!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 18, 2011, 12:21:14 AM
Quote from: Sassy on May 17, 2011, 10:09:01 PM
nice paneling!

Thanks Sassy :)  We think so too!  I just CANNOT wait to get it all done!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 19, 2011, 05:20:57 PM
Is it possible to be addicted to working on your cabin and being there?  I'm just asking!

Seriously though, I'm finding it very hard to be motivated to work or do other things right now because I can't stop thinking about getting more done!  Sheesh!  You'd think after nearly two years I'd at least be ok with a two week break...and it's only been 3 days!!!

Ahh well, guess I better get back to work...
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Pine Cone on May 20, 2011, 12:13:47 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on May 19, 2011, 05:20:57 PM
Is it possible to be addicted to working on your cabin and being there?  I'm just asking!

Seriously though, I'm finding it very hard to be motivated to work or do other things right now because I  ::)can't stop thinking about getting more done!  Sheesh!  You'd think after nearly two years I'd at least be ok with a two week break...and it's only been 3 days!!!

Ahh well, guess I better get back to work...

Been there, done that...

And you're in the wrong place if you want any sympathy ;D

My project is less than an hour away from home or work and in the last 5 years the longest break in visits was about 3 weeks and that was because the Hood Canal floating bridge was closed for 5 weeks, turning a 45 minute drive into a 2-hour drive.

Until this year when the cabin was pretty much finished I made 3 or 4 trips per week.  I can't imagine the additional stress I would have had if I couldn't go out at least once a week.  I used to spend my sleepless nights thinking about different ways of doing this or that.  I'm pretty sure I built my cabin more than a dozen times in my dreams/nightmares before I actually got it finished. 

In the end, all the pondering and obsessing resulted in a variety of great design changes.  The most obvious is our 16'x16' foot covered deck which wasn't even a glimmer of a possibility in the first two years of the cabin design ideas.  It showed up in part because I was thinking about what the view might look like if I stood on the porch I originally planned to build.  Didn't like what I seemed to be building, couldn't blame the design on anyone but me, so it was up to me to come up with a better solution.

Early on in my cabin project I realized that if I wasn't sure about what to do next, the correct answer was to do nothing but obsess about it until I figured out what the next step was.  Pauses and some deep breaths can often prevent some small problems turning into big ones...

This year I'm working hard at making sure I relax some most days I go out.  There will always be an unlimited number of new and old projects trying to get my attention. 

I guess I'm still addicted...  ::)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 20, 2011, 08:44:53 AM
OH boy I think we're related!!!

I can lay in bed at night and think about various parts of the build.....for HOURS!

Or on my drive to work...


Or at work.....

It's a sickness I guess :)  But I can't wait to get back and mill some lumber and and and
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: duncanshannon on May 20, 2011, 02:44:53 PM
Ha!

Love where this thread is going.  I'm suprised by how much I'm thinking, learning, and planning my home remodel 3 year plan!  Once home is done, THEN onto the cabin!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on May 23, 2011, 12:24:12 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on May 20, 2011, 08:44:53 AM
OH boy I think we're related!!!

I can lay in bed at night and think about various parts of the build.....for HOURS!

Or on my drive to work...


Or at work.....

It's a sickness I guess :)  But I can't wait to get back and mill some lumber and and and

When you run out of logs to mill at your place, I can probably fell a couple trees at mine for you to mill  ;D  I know what you mean about the addiciton - I haven't been to mine in nearly 6months, and it's driving me nuts (some might say that's a short walk, no need to drive)... and to top it off, I was planning on next weekend, but that has to change to the weekend after next (I don't think the snow is enough gone to get in there!)... then it will be 3-4 weeks before I can get back up there!

Ah well ... I'm looking forward to it, though! :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 23, 2011, 05:21:57 PM
Very little snow out there now...maybe traces up around 5k feet but I just can't there being that much up there now...none at all at the 3280 feet we're at or Gordon's 3700.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 23, 2011, 05:24:52 PM
http://forecast.weather.gov/MapClick.php?lat=48.60204136700653&lon=-119.75509643554688&site=otx&unit=0&lg=en&FcstType=text

Mid 50's during the day at 4500 feet west of Tonasket (don't know where you are but figured you're over there somewhere) and mid 40's at night...how high are you?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on May 23, 2011, 05:33:40 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on May 23, 2011, 05:24:52 PM
http://forecast.weather.gov/MapClick.php?lat=48.60204136700653&lon=-119.75509643554688&site=otx&unit=0&lg=en&FcstType=text

Mid 50's during the day at 4500 feet west of Tonasket (don't know where you are but figured you're over there somewhere) and mid 40's at night...how high are you?

I'm at 3900' - 4300' - but it's shaded pretty much all the way in once you get off the county road.  I'm  up north of Buzzard Lake ... between there and Conconully.

There is still snow in the Loup Loup pass web cam shots (although VERY little), but 3 years ago I went up the first of May because the web cam showed no snow, and gave up about 100 yards in from the county road because it was still axle deep.  I went back a month later and got to within 3/4 of a mile, and it was still axle deep at that point.  Last year the snow went out fairly early and I was able to get up there on the first weekend in May.  Still had some snow, but not so much I couldn't get in to the property and put the floor down.

I think I really do need a snow capable machine.  d*
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 24, 2011, 08:34:34 AM
Quote from: JavaMan on May 23, 2011, 05:33:40 PM
I'm at 3900' - 4300' - but it's shaded pretty much all the way in once you get off the county road.  I'm  up north of Buzzard Lake ... between there and Conconully.

There is still snow in the Loup Loup pass web cam shots (although VERY little), but 3 years ago I went up the first of May because the web cam showed no snow, and gave up about 100 yards in from the county road because it was still axle deep.  I went back a month later and got to within 3/4 of a mile, and it was still axle deep at that point.  Last year the snow went out fairly early and I was able to get up there on the first weekend in May.  Still had some snow, but not so much I couldn't get in to the property and put the floor down.

I think I really do need a snow capable machine.  d*

It would be good to have a couple sleds that's for sure!  You need to get Yonderosa to pop by and see if your road is open when he's in town :)  I think he's the closest.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 25, 2011, 08:42:55 AM
Ok!  I've worked 32 hours this week already :D  That means I won't work Friday (our holiday is only Monday) and most likely won't work most of Thursday :D

Which means I'll be leaving for the cabin Thursday afternoon and will have Friday-Monday to work on it!  WHooHoo!!!! 

We will mill a tree I fell, maybe fall another and mill it and we'll work on interior and wiring me thinks :)

I'm totally stoked!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on May 25, 2011, 12:57:03 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on May 25, 2011, 08:42:55 AM
Ok!  I've worked 32 hours this week already :D  That means I won't work Friday (our holiday is only Monday) and most likely won't work most of Thursday :D

Which means I'll be leaving for the cabin Thursday afternoon and will have Friday-Monday to work on it!  WHooHoo!!!! 

We will mill a tree I fell, maybe fall another and mill it and we'll work on interior and wiring me thinks :)

I'm totally stoked!

I hope you have lots of fun!  I made the mistake of letting Beautiful know that I wasn't going this weekend and she immediately scheduled something on Sunday, so that put the nail in it for this weekend.  That's ok, though, the pass-cam still shows a bit of snow up there which means there's a bit more up on the way to the ranch.  Planning on next weekend tho and can't wait!

Sounds like you're set for a good productive, fun weekend! ;D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 31, 2011, 09:05:26 AM
Had a great long weekend at the cabin :)  Finished another wall, milled some lumber and more.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/dining.jpg)
It's really starting to brighten up and looks amazing :)  A lot of fun too.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Walls.jpg)
Something about all that pine that I just can't get enough of.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/corner2.jpg)
I'm thinking a wrought iron wood bin would be nice too.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/shelf2.jpg)
Took some time to throw together a small shelf for the 'kitchen' too as I was tired of using boxes and bins.

I'm thinking of all sorts of things now :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 02, 2011, 10:47:04 AM
One thing I have to sort now, is whether or not to run a larger cable from the inverter to the AC panel.  I have a 12/3 cable running there now, which will allow up to 20 amps but more then that and it will likely be insufficient.  However, I'm not wiring the cabin to run a whole lot to begin with.

My thoughts?  Run the bigger cable so you can run 50amps some day if you get more panels and batteries and bigger inverter :)  I just need to sort the size and how to tie it into my inverter (probably the same way as right now which I'll have to shoot some pics of).

I need to also pick up some wire nuts as the small stock I have is for two wire connections and I have some 3 and even 4 wire connections I need to make (one box will have to switches - for two lights - and feed power to 3 receptacles).

I plan to finish all the wiring next trip and then get some clean up and organization done (as well as some milling).  Then later in the month or early next month I'll get back to paneling and try to get the lower interior completed.  Perhaps by the end of August I'll have the upper section done also.

And there is so much more to do!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 03, 2011, 11:38:11 AM
http://backwoodssolar.com/catalog/fans.htm#Remotely%20operated%20DC%20CEILING%20FAN%2012%20/%2024%20volt
Just ordered one of these :)

Can't wait to get it wired up and installed!  Of course we have to also insulate and panel the ceiling but the wiring for this has to be installed first.

I bought the 12vdc version so that if the inverter goes I can still run the fan :)  Also getting some other 12vdc items for the same reason and will be adding two more batteries in the next couple weeks.  That will take me to 880AH on the battery bank which should give me the power reserves I need to run the Fridge this summer.  I'll run it for two weeks, check the logs and then decide if I can run it all the time on the power I have or if I need 1000AH to do it...which may mean I'll need another panel but I'm uncertain at this point.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 06, 2011, 07:54:15 PM
http://www.dealtime.com/Danby-Designer-DAR1102W/info
WHooHoo!  Just bought one of these for $449 (free shipping).  I found that it used about 200 watts less per day then the ones with freezers that I saw.

I'm stoked!  Will have fridge and freezer and fan all working soon!  Time to get those two more batteries!  Also to remove the tree shading the panels at 2pm!

On a side note, I also found that the little camper stove (with small oven) is fine and indeed has a pilot light!  DOH!  So for now I'm nixing a cook stove and installing this one instead.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on June 07, 2011, 10:15:24 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on June 06, 2011, 07:54:15 PM
http://www.dealtime.com/Danby-Designer-DAR1102W/info
WHooHoo!  Just bought one of these for $449 (free shipping).  I found that it used about 200 watts less per day then the ones with freezers that I saw.

I'm stoked!  Will have fridge and freezer and fan all working soon!  Time to get those two more batteries!  Also to remove the tree shading the panels at 2pm!

On a side note, I also found that the little camper stove (with small oven) is fine and indeed has a pilot light!  DOH!  So for now I'm nixing a cook stove and installing this one instead.

Sweet!  I've bookmarked that fan site for later.  I think it will come in quite handy for all the other solar stuff on there - thanks for posting it! [cool]
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 07, 2011, 03:45:04 PM
Quote from: JavaMan on June 07, 2011, 10:15:24 AM
Sweet!  I've bookmarked that fan site for later.  I think it will come in quite handy for all the other solar stuff on there - thanks for posting it! [cool]

They are pretty good -- fast shipping, decent prices and lots of knowledge.  We bought a timer and relay for our well pump from them previously and will be buying a new well pump from them soon also.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on June 07, 2011, 04:03:42 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on June 07, 2011, 03:45:04 PM
They are pretty good -- fast shipping, decent prices and lots of knowledge.  We bought a timer and relay for our well pump from them previously and will be buying a new well pump from them soon also.

Oh for the day I have to worry about getting water out of a hole in the ground!  Last estimate I got was $14,000 ...  :o  Guess I'm up too high and they figure to go to the core for water.  ???

Looks like you are making good progress and getting some enjoyment out of it, too!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on June 07, 2011, 06:58:36 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on June 02, 2011, 10:47:04 AM
whether or not to run a larger cable from the inverter to the AC panel. 

I'd run as large a wire as needed to carry the maximum rated power output of the inverter. Not the surge as that is only of short lived duration.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 07, 2011, 07:21:21 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on June 07, 2011, 06:58:36 PM
I'd run as large a wire as needed to carry the maximum rated power output of the inverter. Not the surge as that is only of short lived duration.

Max power of this inverter is 2500 watts but I was thinking that some day I might want to increase that and don't want to limit myself with too small a cable...though I guess if I install conduit the whole run end to end then it would be easy enough to pull out and pull in a new one in one go.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 08, 2011, 09:55:11 PM
Picked up two more Costco GCA's so we'll have 880AH of capacity now :)

Need to get a Hydrometer/Hygrometer as Don has suggested, for testing cells and I need to check water levels, add distilled water and equalize as needed -- and program the controller to better match the batteries (though it's darn close as is I think).

Then when the Fridge arrives we'll be in heaven :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 09, 2011, 12:10:31 AM
Looks like I will be able, in theory, to go 4 days without any charging at all with both the Fridge and Freezer running, as long as nothing else is running....so far I've not seen more then 1 or 2 days of little to no charging but usually get 3 hours of equalization and 7+ of float with the new controller....which is astounding to me but I guess as long as the sun hits the panels then I'm getting something out of them (can someone look at the off-grid power thread where I've posted some screen shots of the controller to let me know if what I am seeing is correct).

If that is so then I suspect I won't use as much power from the batteries as I think as the sun should run the appliances for nearly have the day during the summer and in reality they would only need to draw off the bank during the night -- when, presumably, they would also draw less power.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Barry Broome on June 09, 2011, 09:12:48 PM
Looking good!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 10, 2011, 12:23:25 AM
Thanks Weasel :)

We head out again tomorrow to do some clean up and get some wiring done (and install the new batteries).

I also hope to update the software for the controller and will get some more data from it.

Can't wait to get back!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 12, 2011, 11:58:59 PM
Manged to get more wiring done this weekend (we now have 4 working lights and many outlets), the DC fan installed for the composting toilet (and more vent pipes to get it venting higher then we've had it), reprogrammed the charge controller (I'll have to post stuff on that in the off-grid forum) and re-stacked our lumber in a more organized and better protected (from rain) method.

Had a lighting bolt strike within 100 yards of us (that was a little exciting) visited with a neighbor for a bit and generally enjoyed ourselves for the weekend :)

We also rotated the panels closer to true south and tilted them up at 68 degrees (to the vertical plane) in hopes of increasing solar power production -- however I'll have to remove a tree soon!

Speaking of rotating the panels I thought I would say something about that here.  I always (ALWAYS) carry a Lensatic compass with me when I go to the cabin, go hunting fishing etc etc.  I might not have my GPS but I always have my compass.  Anyway, here we were at the cabin and I decided to adjust the panels a bit better since I didn't do a very good job of it previously (hurried install with too much to do and I knew the cabin faced mostly south so the panels faced that way and away we went).

To adjust the panels I first used a level and framers stair compass (not sure it's exact name) which has degrees on it from 0 to 90 (I think it's 0-90 anyway).  I set the compass at 68 degrees and tilted the panels until they were inline with the 68 degree bar and the vertical bar was level.  Then we locked down the angle.

Next I stood in front of the panels (20 feet south of them) and aimed myself to magnetic north.  I wasn't 100% sure of the declination in WA State as I hadn't checked it in a while but figured it was 19 degrees East of True North so had my sun swing the panels until they lined up with my compass at 340 degrees and called it good (was easiest to go with 20 degrees at the time).  Interestingly enough when I got home and double checked the declination it IS 20 degrees East.

One way to remember how to adjust to True from Magnetic North for those who don't know is to use the LARS rule (something I learned in the Marine Corps).  All maps face north is the first rule -- that is, the top of the map is NORTH on all military maps and all UTM Grid maps I've ever used.  Second, all declination diagrams (usually a pointed angle on the map somewhere) show magnetic either LEFT or RIGHT of True.  So using the LARS rule -- LEFT ADD RIGHT SUBTRACT -- you either add or subtract the Declination from Magnetic in order to get True.

Most civilians say (I think anyway) that the Declination is 'to the east/west' or 'east/west of' True North which works too but I'll never forget LARS :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 13, 2011, 12:18:33 AM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Shadeonpanel.jpg)
Around 2PM until about 3:30pm this tree feels the need to remind me that it needs to be cut down, bucked up and milled into paneling :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 13, 2011, 09:31:31 AM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0372.jpg)
The beginning stages of having power -- and a mess ;)

I need to trim the grounds I suppose and work on cleaning up the wiring coming into the box so it's at least a little neater but here is the beginnings of the cabin wiring.  I found a 100 amp panel with 8 breaker positions at Home Depot that was pretty inexpensive and grabbed it.  When installing it I found it did not have a ground bus!  So I bought one and mounted it where it is.

I ran 12/3 romex to the panel from the inverter temporarily but plan to run 10/3 as soon as I get some.  I also plan to install it in conduit all the way from panel to inverter so I can pull out the 10 awg wire in the future and pull in heavier wire for 50amp service if I want (incase I go to a bigger inverter).

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0373.jpg)
It's nice to finally get rid of the drop lights and start using overhead lights :D  And while I'm not happy with CFL's as a whole, I do value their low wattage and am used to the light now....though I think the trace amounts of mercury in them will be a problem when several million of them pile up in the landfills....but I digress...my hope is that someday an inexpensive LED will come out to replace them.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0374.jpg)
My step-son wired out 'his loft' and is very pleased :)  So am I!  It's his first wiring job and after having him get rid of shiners it tested out perfect.  He put the light switch near the edge of the loft so you could flick it on coming up the ladder and we'll put a light base in with a switch in it also -- to make it easy to turn off and on when in the loft.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 17, 2011, 12:00:54 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on June 13, 2011, 12:18:33 AM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Shadeonpanel.jpg)
Around 2PM until about 3:30pm this tree feels the need to remind me that it needs to be cut down, bucked up and milled into paneling :D

Heading up tomorrow with a snatch block :)  The snatch block will be attached to a logging chain which will be wrapped around a stump (after notching it to keep the chain from slipping off) and then a strong rope will be tied around the tree (doubled first) and run down to the snatch block, through the pulley and then to the winch on the Jeep which will sit 90 degrees from the desired location for dropping the tree shading the panels.

I've used this technique to fall trees close to the cabin.  The idea is simple:  you fall the tree the normal way but keep tension on the desired downward side of the fall so that when you've made the final cut the tree can't help but fall on the notched side.

I'll see if I can't remember to get some pics when I set the rigging.

Once down the tree will be bucked up into logs and rolled directly onto the mill.  We'll mill our 2x10's for the ships ladder and 2x8's for the rungs and then the rest of this tree (and 3 logs we have waiting) will be milled into 5/8th in stock for wall paneling.

We're hoping to have a productive 3 day weekend :)
Cheers
Erik
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on June 17, 2011, 12:24:31 PM
I've been thinking of felling a tree or two in my yard in this manner.  But Beautiful seem to think that I'll still squash the pump house, the chicken coop, or the house itself!

[rodney dangerfield]I tell ya, I don't get no respect d*[/rodney dangerfield] ... well, I do get a lot of respect, but I also give it - and while *I* think I could do it, it is a bit close and the margin for error is a bit to close.

I can't wait to see the ships ladder and paneling - looks like you're getting mighty close to a weekend where you won't have anything to do except BBQ, relax, and drink a few brews!   :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 20, 2011, 08:37:03 AM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/treesgone.jpg)
The offending tree came down :)

I forgot to get pictures because once the operation was underway I just got to it -- sorry!  Basically I climbed the ladder (28 footer) about as high as I was comfortable doing with it against the tree and tied a good sturdy rope to the tree (doubled) -- a climbing rope that I use for these kids of things and probably shouldn't -- and then ran the doubled rope out to a stump about 50-60 feet from the tree.  There I notched the stump on the back side with my chainsaw and then wrapped the logging chain around it with a snatch block attached to that.  I ran the doubled rope through the snatch block and then at 90 degrees to the direction of fall to my winch on the jeep.

Using the winch we pulled the rope taught and then I cut the tree down.  It fell exactly where the rope told it too ;)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Readytomill.jpg)
Once bucked up we rolled the logs over to the mill so we could start Saturday without having to move them first.

Friday finished around dinner time and we had a nice relaxing evening :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 20, 2011, 08:42:30 AM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/8batteries.jpg)
On Saturday morning we did a rush battery installed because I couldn't wait any longer to get these in, and then went back to the mill.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/paneling.jpg)
We managed to mill about 60 boards most of which were 5/8" thick and varying widths.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/2x10s.jpg)
But we milled 8 2x10's (2 of which will be for the ships ladder) and a few 5/8" boards 10 feet long (works that way sometimes) which will be used for paneling.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/sawdust.jpg)
We made tons of sawdust :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Fixingmill.jpg)
and at one point a bolt fell out of the mill and Josh had to put it back...but it didn't take long.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 21, 2011, 08:57:22 AM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/th_MVI_0432.jpg) (https://s998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/?action=view&current=MVI_0432.mp4)
Josh running the sawmill.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 26, 2011, 09:51:51 PM
Things are getting exciting!  My wife and I picked up all the tile we need for the floor (a linoleum tile - the easy install type with the glue edges) and all the cabinets (decided to just buy them as I don't have much time to build them and we'll like to get them in soon) and the bathroom and kitchen sinks and faucets.

My wife is VERY excited to get up there and start working on the kitchen etc :)

Can't wait for the weekend now!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: considerations on June 27, 2011, 07:21:23 AM
I'm watching....want to see how your interior develops.  c*
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 27, 2011, 08:15:29 AM
Quote from: considerations on June 27, 2011, 07:21:23 AM
I'm watching....want to see how your interior develops.  c*

Me too! ;)  Since 'The Boss' is coming up this weekend it should begin to take shape :)  She's very 'Americana' and rustic so our little cabin will have LOTS of wood, undoubtedly some wrought iron, anything red and 'country', bronze (taps and such) and what not.  Our home is much that way.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 05, 2011, 08:54:17 AM
We arrived late Friday as I had to work part of the day and my wife and son were delayed in loading the trailer.  The trip up was long and tiring as the old Jeep has decided that after 250,000 miles it doesn't really like pulling a trailer anymore and we had to turn off the AC and roll the windows down to keep it from getting too hot.  All we pulled up was a pantry, some floor tile, tools and supplies.

So, next on the agenda is a 'Ranch Truck' to haul gear etc to the property without having to worry the old Jeep anymore.  Which we will keep for light use until either we replace more parts or it gives up the ghost (I think that means we'll have it for a few more years!).

After a little clean up and some late dinner we crashed for the night and got up early Saturday to get started on our weekend of cabin building :)  It has been two years since we bought the property and one month shy of two years since we began our construction and while sometimes it feels like a LONG time, at others not so much because, perhaps, we love what we are doing :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Jeeplogging.jpg)
The first thing we did was to cut down a big pine.  It was more then 20" at the bast of the tree and took my 20" Huskvarna saw a while to notch out just right.  Once dropped we bucked it up and hauled it to the mill for milling the next day.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Kitchen2.jpg)
We brought the new pantry in to give us more storage room while we wait for the drywall to be finished (then we'll bring the rest of the cupboards in) and installed the floor in the kitchen and bathroom.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Kitchen.jpg)
After the floor was installed we applied a coat of mud to the drywall (we're not drywallers but hey, it's a cabin!) which cleans up easily of the new floor :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Bath.jpg)
The bathroom was a bit of a challenge as we had to install around the toilet but it worked out well enough.  We'll seal it around the toilet later.

Also, we installed the tile over 3/8" underlay so it will match the wood floor better once it goes in.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Curtains.jpg)
My wife was experimenting with curtains and wanted to make them herself so here is her first attempt.  They worked out nicely (made with a sheet of material to block out the sun) and kept the cabin cool but she's going to redesign them as she didn't like the look.  When done, the cabin will stay COOL all day in the summer :)  Just this set made a huge difference!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0512.jpg)
We found this sink at Home Depot and it fits perfectly!  It's a small cabinet that will fit in a little nook behind the door.

We also wired out the bathroom so we had light etc in there -- something we did not have before.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0496.jpg)
With the interior work on the cabin done for this trip, we began milling lumber while my wife experimented with some Chestnut stain (which is what we will finish the exterior with once all the siding is completed).

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0498.jpg)
The base of the big pine on the mill.  We had to jack up one end to get the heart in the right place.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0499.jpg)
We milled 5/9x12 1/2 x 8' boards out of this log!  They were awesome!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0502.jpg)
It was so amazing to mill such a big log on our little mill...and the lumber coming off of it is like artwork!

I cannot imagine doing anything else with trees we fall -- except the logs we use for the porch.  Too awesome.

We also used the jeep to haul a big log out of the 'bottoms'  where it had been resting.  The old Jeep just crawled down into the bottom corner of our property (to get there is about 1/2 mile around and across another piece) and then out with the log in tow.  It might not like towing a trailer anymore but in 4 low it pulls big pine logs out of the woods like a skidder :)

Next trip we will be working on exterior and if we're lucky the well for the orchard and greywater drain etc.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: John Raabe on July 05, 2011, 09:30:22 AM
Cool update on a great project. Coming along nicely! :D :D :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 05, 2011, 01:56:06 PM
Thanks John!

I can't believe it's been TWO YEARS already!  At least it's 2 yrs since we bought the property and 1 yr 11 months since we started the cabin.

Now I still have to finish the interior, finish the exterior, get the well water plumbed into the cabin, install the grey water drain system, build the wood shed, root cellar, outhouse, pump house etc, install the irrigation well and get the fruit trees in and so much more!

Heck, each trip I want to do more and more and more but I just never have the time.

Now we're looking at buying a truck (probably something within the last 2-5 years with under 50k miles on it) so we can haul more with less worry. 

So much to do, so little time!
Erik
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Sassy on July 05, 2011, 03:30:36 PM
Great progress!  It's looking like home inside the cabin  :)

We've been at it 9 yrs - have lots done but still have lots to do & are always thinking of new projects.  I try to tell my brain that this is a lifetime project, at least that's what Glenn keeps telling me, he always quotes "when a man finishes his house, he dies."  Good excuse, huh?   d*

Keep posting those pics  c*
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on July 05, 2011, 04:28:54 PM
Well that makes me feel better with 6 years and counting. :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 05, 2011, 04:33:24 PM
haha well um, thanks I guess!  Though BOTH of you have homes much more complex and large then this but I'll still take it :)  After all, I DO have to drive 4 1/2 hours in a Jeep with no AC just to get to mine :P

But maybe not after we buy a truck!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on July 07, 2011, 02:04:10 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on July 05, 2011, 08:54:17 AMThe trip up was long and tiring as the old Jeep has decided that after 250,000 miles it doesn't really like pulling a trailer anymore and we had to turn off the AC and roll the windows down to keep it from getting too hot. 

Cherokee's always run hot, the way they were designed.

Ditch the stock radiator for an all metal 3 row aftermarket type. There is also at least one company. Flowkooler is one. 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 07, 2011, 03:35:57 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on July 07, 2011, 02:04:10 PM
Cherokee's always run hot, the way they were designed.

Ditch the stock radiator for an all metal 3 row aftermarket type. There is also at least one company. Flowkooler is one. 

Oh I know Don, but I replaced the radiator with a 3 core all steel one a year and a half ago along with all the rest of the cooling components.  Worked well until recently and now it's just not happy.  Pegged and lit up the dash on the way up a hill running in 3rd (auto) pulling a light load with AC on.  Had to kill the AC and run the entire trip without it but that still wasn't enough and at one point I had to kick on the heater too.  In 82 degree weather that's just not acceptable.

Truth is, it's pulled trailers just fine and with the top end rebuilt last year I figured I'd be good for a while now, but it appears something else is amiss so back to the drawing board.

But don't worry, I'm keeping it!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 08, 2011, 06:51:04 PM
http://www.ajmadison.com/cgi-bin/ajmadison/SCK240.html
Could this be our stove!?  I think so!

I've been reading reviews and small appliances aren't always high on the list, and sadly too many write reviews with too little time owning the product but all in all I do think this might be a good stove for our little cabin.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on July 08, 2011, 09:07:50 PM
Have you checked availability at the big blue and orange boxes? When we were looking a few years ago they both had 30", 24" and 20" wide gas ranges with lower costs and delivery free to the store if not carried in stock.

One thing to check is what the electronic ignition really means. If you will run the inverter every time you use the range top or oven that's not a concern. But if the inverter is usually off or has to be turned on each time that could get tiresome. The range burners can be lit manually if necessary. However, one of the units we considered had issues with the oven. If there was no power the oven would not work. I found that deep inside the owners manual.

We bought a pilot light model.

Downside of a pilot light unit is the slight extra gas use and the heat given off in warm/hot weather. In cool/cold weather it a good thing. I installed ours with a gas shut off right behind and slightly about the upper rear edge so we can kill the pilots if we so desire; a relight is simple with one of those butane fire sticks.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 08, 2011, 09:21:00 PM
I found one or two at Lowes that I was considering but the reviews weren't very good so I began to look for something with some decent reviews and found this one.

The inverter runs all the time when we are there and will soon run all the time period as we will be installing a fridge next weekend.  I figure at least until winter we'll run the inverter 24x7 and even in the winter might if we want to run the heat tape to prevent freezing of the sewage pipe.

I also thought of setting a time to turn off the heat tape after 24hrs but am still in the 'considering' stage on that.

Our neighbor never shuts the inverter off, but then he lives there so I guess it's a little different.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 12, 2011, 12:42:43 PM
After a long and painful search I've finally settled on a 21" PVC pipe 11' feet long to build my irrigation well.  This, if cut to 5.5' and placed 5 feet in the ground side by side (and drilled full of holes) will give me a capacity of 140-180 gallons of water depending on the water level in the pipes.  The ground water in the area I'm placing the 'well' is often at the surface even at the driest part of the year so I'm confident I can get at least 4 feet of water in the well -- though until it actually is in and working I'll not really know.

I got the idea from a friend who's been doing remote watering wells for livestock and wild life.  Basically you get to a spot near a stream and dig a hole just far enough away from the stream channel that it won't disturb the stream itself but you'll get plenty of seepage into the well through the saturated ground near the stream.

Then you place a 75-100 watt solar panel above the well and a 12vdc well pump into the well and install and let it go.  The deeper wells (10+ feet) can be left to pump as long as the sun is out if that's what you want but since I KNOW I won't get more then 5 feet deep I'm doubling up the capacity and putting in a timer so the pump will only run 2 or 3 times a week (as needed) and for just long enough to deliver the water needed for my orchard and nut/hardwood trees.

This weekend we're heading up to get this done as well as get the grey water system installed, dig the privy hole and with luck and time, complete digging the root cellar.

The pipe I found for $240 which while sounding pricey turns out to be the best deal I could possibly find! 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Tickhill on July 13, 2011, 03:35:44 AM
OJ, can't wait to see the pics and description of your water project. Good timing as far as $ on any solar additions for your pump also.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Squirl on July 13, 2011, 08:48:58 AM
Have you thought about a reverse drywell for you irrigation well?  Holes, groundwater, and septic have been on my mind a lot recently.  You can build one out of block and gravel. It may be a little more labor, but not much.  You might be able to save a few dollars.  There is a good diagram of how to build one here:
http://www.oneontablock.com/PDFS/drywell.pdf
or here:
http://www.pumpseptic.com/septic.htm

If it is near a water feature you could probably get good bank run gravel nearby or maybe sift it out of the excavated soil.  If you are only looking for around 200 gallons, you could probably get away with a 36" inside diameter, or a 7 block course. For a 5 feet tall area you would need around 7 courses or 49 blocks. When I last checked they were around $1.50 from the big box stores. So around $73.  You would have to deal with extra weight over PVC though. Just an idea.

Are you doing all this excavation by hand?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: considerations on July 13, 2011, 09:08:54 AM
"Could this be our stove!?"

I've only found 3 Mfg's that make freestanding "gas" ranges that do not have a glow bar in the oven.  The one you reference is Premier, the other two are Brown Stove works and Crosley.  I've been leaning toward Premier also, but have a real attraction to the SMK model, which has sealed burners on the stove top.  I'm very attracted to spending a little more up front and a lot less time cleaning under the top of an open burner stove.

http://www.ajmadison.com/b.php?Ntt=Premier+SMK240   

Seems its on sale at this source making it only $9 more than the open burner model for the moment.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 13, 2011, 09:23:05 AM
Quote from: Squirl on July 13, 2011, 08:48:58 AM
Have you thought about a reverse drywell for you irrigation well?  Holes, groundwater, and septic have been on my mind a lot recently.  You can build one out of block and gravel. It may be a little more labor, but not much.  You might be able to save a few dollars.  There is a good diagram of how to build one here:
http://www.oneontablock.com/PDFS/drywell.pdf
or here:
http://www.pumpseptic.com/septic.htm

If it is near a water feature you could probably get good bank run gravel nearby or maybe sift it out of the excavated soil.  If you are only looking for around 200 gallons, you could probably get away with a 36" inside diameter, or a 7 block course. For a 5 feet tall area you would need around 7 courses or 49 blocks. When I last checked they were around $1.50 from the big box stores. So around $73.  You would have to deal with extra weight over PVC though. Just an idea.

Are you doing all this excavation by hand?


This is very similar to what we are doing but I think using the pipe will be much easier (less time consuming).  We'll have a bobcat do the excavating (a friend of mine will run that) and the goal is to set the pipe 10 feet into the ground so that you can get it full to the waterline.  If however, as is often the case with our ground, you can't go down past 5 or 6 feet then the idea is to cut the pipe in half and drop the two halves in side by side.  Since the water line is essentially ground level where I plan to put the well, or at least there is water trickling at ground level when the stream gets low anyway, then I should be able to fill both pipes in the shallow design.

Our hope is to get the well dug, set and backfilled in a short period of time so we can move to the greywater drain and other projects :)  Then within the next few months to get the pump and solar so we can have it all ready to go by spring.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 13, 2011, 09:25:46 AM
Quote from: considerations on July 13, 2011, 09:08:54 AM
"Could this be our stove!?"

I've only found 3 Mfg's that make freestanding "gas" ranges that do not have a glow bar in the oven.  The one you reference is Premier, the other two are Brown Stove works and Crosley.  I've been leaning toward Premier also, but have a real attraction to the SMK model, which has sealed burners on the stove top.  I'm very attracted to spending a little more up front and a lot less time cleaning under the top of an open burner stove.

http://www.ajmadison.com/b.php?Ntt=Premier+SMK240   

Seems its on sale at this source making it only $9 more than the open burner model for the moment.

I don't think I saw any sealed burners in the Premier 24" but I could be wrong.  We mostly were looking for highly rated stoves, ready for LP and at a reasonable price.  As it is we went from thinking we'd spend $350 (from last years prices) to over $500!  We bought from AJ Madison also.

Anyway, I kinda wish I'd paid closer attention and found the model you showed in 24" but wasn't thinking.  Oh well, we'll live with it :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Turkeyhunter on July 13, 2011, 10:16:22 AM
nice cabin build and like the potable sawmill, had a guy cut me a few 4" x 6" out of red cedar on one a couple weeks ago they work great.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: considerations on July 13, 2011, 12:41:28 PM
any functioning stove is a good stove 'specially when it has an oven!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 15, 2011, 12:05:35 AM
Quote from: considerations on July 13, 2011, 12:41:28 PM
any functioning stove is a good stove 'specially when it has an oven!

Amen!  I can't wait for the time we're at the cabin and can enjoy fresh baked biscuits with breakfast or fresh bread with dinner!

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 15, 2011, 09:06:21 AM
Have pipe, will travel :)

I'm getting pretty stoked!  The pipe, which weighs about 500lbs! Is loaded on the trailer and ready for transport and my buddy will be over in a few hours to head to the property for a long weekend (took some PTO for this weekend) of digging :)

With luck we'll come away with a new well, grey water drain system, privy hole and root cellar hole :)  Maybe even a shooting range and some yard work :)

Also plan to work on some drywall and get some clean up done.

It's amazing how excited I can get before a trip to the woods!
Seeya!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Sassy on July 15, 2011, 02:18:26 PM
You are very ambitious!   c*
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Yonderosa on July 18, 2011, 08:13:22 AM
We're very happy with ours.

(http://www.myhostedpics.com/images/Pathfinder/yonderosabreakfast.jpg)

Sometimes we'll pick up a u-bake pizza in town on the way up.  The next size down from the biggest fits just fine.

(http://www.myhostedpics.com/images/Pathfinder/itchen2.jpg)
I don't have a good picture of it or remember the model number.  I purchased it through Sears and picked it up in Omak.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 18, 2011, 08:13:39 PM
Just got back in and so much to tell!  We dug the well, just not the way we planned, we burried the old root cellar site and dug a new one, we dug tree holes, outhouse hole and so much more.

Also found our pump is the pump I was going to buy but really need to run at 24vdc not 12vdc in order to get it pumping.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 19, 2011, 09:35:51 AM
What a great and productive weekend!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/BlownTrack.jpg)
We got the excavator to the property Friday night and started after breakfast on Saturday.  However, as soon as we managed to get back to the area we wanted to dig the well we blew a track.  After borrowing grease and a gun from the neighbor up the hill we got the track back on and got to work.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Well.jpg)
Digging the well we hit water within 18" of the surface!  Was very promising.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/swiming.jpg)
My son in 2 feet of ice cold water arranging the pipes we hope to be able to pump water out of later.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Backfilling.jpg)
It looks a mess but we'll get it cleaned up in time (grass will have to be planted to hold things together at first I think).  At the time the picture was taken the well was holding about 100 gallons of water.

it's not pretty (yet) but it's working.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 19, 2011, 09:37:50 AM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Supervisor.jpg)
Josh watching Tom dig the grey water drain system in.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/GreywaterDrain.jpg)
Checking out the settling tank in the trench.  Once we have all the parts we can install the sink drains (2) and shower drain (1) into this tank and then from its filter to the dry sump.  I'll take pictures of the install when we get to it.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/ViewtoRoot.jpg)
Looking from the cabin back up the drive to the location of our future root cellar.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Rootcellar.jpg)
Ten feet deep!  That's an accomplishment in our soil!  Now to plan the structure and frame it up! :D  Be a while mind you.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/RootCellar2.jpg)
Looking out from the 'root cellar' you get the feel for just how deep it really is.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 19, 2011, 09:39:04 AM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/RedOak.jpg)
One of the 5 surviving Red Oaks.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/RedOak2-1.jpg)
These poor guys are getting only rainwater but I hope to water them with buckets from the well at least every two weeks in August.  It's no where near enough water but it's the best we could do at this point.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/WildCurrentBerries.jpg)
I'm told these are Current's.  No flavor really but apparently some people make jams with them.  I'm not too  sure myself and am still researching.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/ChokeBerries.jpg)
These appear to be Choke berries (or is it chokeberry's?).

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/WildStrawberries.jpg)
Wild Strawberries are EVERYWHERE on our land!  Makes one wonder if regular ones would take over?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on July 19, 2011, 02:02:49 PM
Are those wild strawberries? (in that last picture?)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 19, 2011, 03:27:28 PM
Quote from: JavaMan on July 19, 2011, 02:02:49 PM
Are those wild strawberries? (in that last picture?)

Yup!  I haven't eaten any yet but plan to try them when I remember and if any are left -- we have TON's of them.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 20, 2011, 11:08:15 AM
I hope to get back to the cabin this weekend to finish some drywall work we did this last trip.  Then if that gets done quickly enough (sanding and priming the kitchen) then we can do some cleanup (long needed) and perhaps fall a few trees that are dead and need to be cut into firewood and stacked for the winter.

I've been researching the well pump we have and discovered that it was the very same pump I wanted to get!  Seems it's a 24vdc pump that can pump 100 gallons an hour if the flow rate of the well will handle it (and it is supposed to handle 3 hours at 2.5gpm).

Anyway, if I can get a new set of batteries for the well (one of ours died) and a panel for them then I'll be set and  can fill the cistern!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Yonderosa on July 20, 2011, 11:14:27 AM
The plant in the picture above the strawberry is Buffalo berry
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 20, 2011, 11:48:18 PM
Quote from: Yonderosa on July 20, 2011, 11:14:27 AM
The plant in the picture above the strawberry is Buffalo berry

What kind of berry is that?  It looked like pictures of Choke Berries but I didn't know.  Is it edible?  Taste?  Good for?

Thank!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 20, 2011, 11:49:02 PM
We have a stove! :D  Can't wait to install it!

Heck, I can't wait for the morning in the fall when I make biscuits to go with breakfast!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 20, 2011, 11:50:30 PM
Quote from: Yonderosa on July 20, 2011, 11:14:27 AM
The plant in the picture above the strawberry is Buffalo berry
http://www.sd4history.com/Unit2/buffalo_berry.htm
Is there different kinds?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Yonderosa on July 21, 2011, 08:13:32 AM
In our area Shepherdia canadensis is quite common.  I've seen critters eat the berries and once ripe they don't seem to last long.  I have not found them to be palatable. My understanding is that when they were used by Native Americans they were typically mixed with other berries.

The other looks to be Wax Currant, Ribes cereum (Maple Leaf currant is also common in our area).  It was used medicinally by the local tribes.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 21, 2011, 09:11:00 AM
Quote from: Yonderosa on July 21, 2011, 08:13:32 AM
In our area Shepherdia canadensis is quite common.  I've seen critters eat the berries and once ripe they don't seem to last long.  I have not found them to be palatable. My understanding is that when they were used by Native Americans they were typically mixed with other berries.

The other looks to be Wax Currant, Ribes cereum (Maple Leaf currant is also common in our area).  It was used medicinally by the local tribes.

Cool thanks!  I found this link:http://montana.plant-life.org/species/ribes_cere.htm and one on the http://www.gardenology.org/wiki/Shepherdia_canadensis (actually plenty) so while not strawberries they are edible.  Just not something to write home about it seems.

I'll have to look for others as the place is overgrown with them!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on July 21, 2011, 10:07:52 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on July 21, 2011, 09:11:00 AM
Cool thanks!  I found this link:http://montana.plant-life.org/species/ribes_cere.htm and one on the http://www.gardenology.org/wiki/Shepherdia_canadensis (actually plenty) so while not strawberries they are edible.  Just not something to write home about it seems.

I'll have to look for others as the place is overgrown with them!

It would seem that there are two differing opinions on the flavor of the buffalo berries ... on one site linked from one of the other posts above, the quote is that it is sweet and makes excellent tarts - and on the link at gardenology, it says they are bitter ...

I guess there truly is no accounting for taste  ???

But I bet the wild strawberries are excellent - we have some strawberries at home, and I have to keep the slugs off them! (which reminds me, I need to get more slug bait - or beer)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Toyotaboy on July 21, 2011, 10:49:54 AM
Back here in Wisconsin, we had current bushes in our back yard growing up. My mom use to make some awesome current jelly. I don't know if yours are the same variety. Great, now I'm craving a jelly sandwich!

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: considerations on July 21, 2011, 06:35:14 PM
Those wild strawberries - if you can collect the plants and get them in good soil (planter box) and water them they will produce more abundantly...and taste miles better than even local U picks. Yum!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 22, 2011, 11:49:26 AM
Quote from: considerations on July 21, 2011, 06:35:14 PM
Those wild strawberries - if you can collect the plants and get them in good soil (planter box) and water them they will produce more abundantly...and taste miles better than even local U picks. Yum!

When would it be best to pick the plants?  I can put them in pots and transplant to my house anytime but wonder if there is a better time to do it.

I plan to taste test this weekend too :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 25, 2011, 08:28:27 AM
Pictures will be forthcoming :)

My eyes are burnt, so's my neck, I'm sore and hungry but what a great trip!  We hit the ground running on a two day sprint and finished somewhere near the top :D  OK, maybe not but sometimes it feels that way and this trip we really got busy and knocked out a few things.  I'll report as soon as I can get some coffee in me!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 25, 2011, 09:14:51 AM
Got in late Friday and settled for the night.  It was great to arrive, put stuff in the fridge and kick back :)  The cabin is getting downright civilized now :)

The truck was awesome too!  Got 17mpg with the back loaded up and driving, well, somewhat spirited on the way up.

Next morning I got out the Ryobi pole saw my wife and I bought at HD.  I like Ryobi tools and decided the 3yr warranty might be nice -- my wife snuck in the 2 yr extension on me when I was away from the counter looking for something but afterward I thought "their loss" because that thing is going to be killed trimming trees on 20 acres!  

While I ran the saw and cut limbs off every tree within 100 feet of the cabin (darn near) my son hit the drywall and got it nicely sanded and primered.  We finally had a wall that looked somewhat finished :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Kitchen2-1.jpg)
We dragged the stove out of the truck and set it up only to find it didn't have the right fittings, and I dug a hole and we concreted in the pole for the solar panels.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0660.jpg)
By Sunday we were rocking and I'd also cut down one tree (an ugly little one that caused me to want to cut it down and buck it up) and generally worked out buts off :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Frankenstien.jpg)
I wired up Frankenstein and thanks to a call to my wife (from a hill top) I was able to get the wiring sorted (I'd left something at home - DOH!) and the little Dietz timer kicks the relay as programmed, which sends power to the pump for a specified duration.  I also rewired the solar panels to 24vdc (open was 44vdc) and that was a chore!  The stupid manufacturer wired connectors differently at different locations -- note to self, never buy another 60 watt Costco setup!

With the batteries being charged at 24vdc and the relay working with the timer to turn the pump on and off automatically, I'll be able to pump the cistern full (assuming nothing is wrong) while we're away :D

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Frankenstien2.jpg)
A closer look at the monster -- I'll probably explain it in the off grid section.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/TheTaj.jpg)
My son and I grabbed the worst looking wood of the piles and framed up a pump house to house the charge controller, batteries, timer and relay for the pump.  It wasn't the Taj Mahal, but it ought to work :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/WellSolar.jpg)
With little time to spare we got the solar rack primered and painted and mounted and put the panels on, hung the wiring, put some stakes to help protect it and drove off in hopes the cows don't decide to destroy it before we can make it more permanent (more on that later).

All in all a productive two days!  Got home at 10pm last night exhausted but happy to be home :)  Only to find that my Mom was in the hospital :(  She's ok now though.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Tickhill on July 25, 2011, 11:38:14 AM
OJ I always look on Monday for your weekend updates! Thanks for your diligence in reporting. Tickhill
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 25, 2011, 04:01:23 PM
Quote from: Tickhill on July 25, 2011, 11:38:14 AM
OJ I always look on Monday for your weekend updates! Thanks for your diligence in reporting. Tickhill

Thanks Tic :)  It's become habit really and I often wonder if anyone follows it much! haha but then I remember Don saying something similar to which I though "well Duh Don!  I always follow what you're up to!  Where do you think I get ideas from?" lol
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 25, 2011, 04:31:47 PM
Looks like a pump rebuild is likely in the works for me next trip to the cabin. 

You see since we bought the place we've had an issue pumping enough water into the cistern to do much.  It's not been a major issue and I assumed it was a bad pump or a pump too high in the well but I've learned, having spoken with the 'Backwoods Solar' guys (very helpful) that it's common on these after 8-10 years to wear out valves which can both limit their ability to pump water but also allow the water to run back down the line into the well.

Two cures are:

1.  Rebuild pump ($100 if you buy new lower housing, diaphragm, bearing and valves or just $30 for the valves)
2.  Put in a check valve on the main line going to the cistern so the water can't drain back down into the well when you pull the pump or something goes wrong with the pump.

I'll do both! 

I've also learned thanks to http://backwoodssolar.com/ that the Surflow 9300 pump can pump more then 1GPM depending on pressure (how much lift).  With only about 80 feet of lift (100 max I think) it should pump more then 82gph (it's rated at 82gph @230' of rise).  That's encouraging as it should allow fairly steady pumping for extended periods to fill and keep full, the cistern.

Might not be some Grundfos super pump but with a 60watt solar setup and 2 deep cycle RV batteries I'm thinking I can make do if I rebuild the pump :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Turkeyhunter on July 25, 2011, 04:43:58 PM
looks like a great work weekend.........
ya'll lots of work got done for sure........
glad your Mother's Ok.....
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 27, 2011, 09:14:45 AM
Thanks Turkey.  We had a very productive weekend and next trip I will rebuild the well pump in hopes of solving the pumping problem we're having.

Once the exterior is completed on the cabin I think I'll have to relax a bit.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: considerations on July 27, 2011, 09:21:38 PM
"When would it be best to pick the plants?"

September
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Sassy on July 27, 2011, 10:44:09 PM
Feels good to make good progress, doesn't it?  Looking good.  We've had to replace 1 pressure tank & a pump on our well up here for the rental house & a pressure tank for the well in our valley house this year.  Those tanks weren't even 10 yrs old  >:(  Not sure how old the pump was... 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 03, 2011, 10:32:10 PM
You bet Sassy!

Well I went off to Home Depot with my wife to try to find the parts needed to hook the sink drain to the grey water system...to no avail.  I need a 1 1/2 Y pipe or two and couldn't find any...hmmmm

So I went over to the BBQ section to find an ACME nut for a 5 gallon LP tank and a 1/4 pipe thread to 9/16 non pipe thread (whatever the heck it's called) adapter and could not find either...nor could I at the brass fitting section....nice...so now back to the drawing board.

I have everything EXCEPT a way to hook up my 5 gallon LP tanks and there isn't propane in the 20 gallon tanks....so either I get them filled or I find a way to make the 5 gallon tank work.

What's more, I have to decide how to get through the wall?   ???  Either I run the hose through the wall (don't want to do that really) or I get a pipe bender and flare kit and flare fittings etc and run the copper pipe through the wall to the stove and connect it to the hose outside.

Suggestions?

This weekends trip will be busy but we are excited to get back and rebuild the pump and get the kitchen installed :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 04, 2011, 11:07:32 AM
Looks like I need to install some black pipe through the wall of the cabin with a connection to a flex hose for LP gas that will go to the stove and on the outside a connection to copper pipe which will go to a regulator and then to the tank -- seems you also need a regulator as the one on the stove is apparently not for the same thing but rather fine tuning -- so say the Propane experts I called.

More involved then I thought (of course) but will be right when I'm done so I can't complain I guess -- also learned there is pipe dope for gas/lp vs that which we all use for plumbing (Teflon tape) so I'll have to look at getting some.

We plan on leaving early tomorrow so I may have to find a way to get to a supply place today...even though I'm 1/2hr from home!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on August 04, 2011, 11:31:18 AM
I was meaning to reply but have been a little busy.  I was going to suggest black iron 1/2" with a flex hose connector on the inside. You might pu a ball valve for gas as it will make it handier than having to go to the outside to turn it off at the tank not to mention that you can disconnect the appliance without loosing gas pressure and having to bleed.  They do make teflon for gas it is yellow whereas water is white.  But I used dope too meant for gas/oil. Most hardware will have the copper tubing and some (here) they will flare it for you.  Just make sure that you slip the female end over the tubing in opposite directions before you flare  d*.   
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: pmichelsen on August 04, 2011, 12:09:59 PM
Around here we use RetorSeal for gas, and we call it baby poop, kind of a yellow consistency. As mentioned above the white would be used for potable water.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 04, 2011, 03:58:57 PM
Thanks Guys.

I went out to KIS (Kennewick Industrial Supply) and bought a 12" piece of black iron pipe (1/2"x12" nipple), two 90's, a 5" nipple (to go inside the stove to the regulator so I don't have to bend the flex too much), 24" SS Flex pipe/hose, ball valve and dope for gas:)

Then I stopped by HD and picked up a 1/2" MIP to 3/8" MIP adapter to go to the LP tank hose and a 1/2" to 1/2" FIP to FIP adapter as well as a couple small nipples to connect 90's and valves to the pipe.

The plan is to run the 1/2"x5" nipple from the stove regulator to a 90 degree elbow and then connect the flex hose at the elbow.  The flex then goes down to the ball valve which is connected to a 90 on the 1/2"x12" BI pipe going through the wall.

On the outside I plan to use the 1/2" MIP to 3/8" flare adapter to connect the LP tank hose (with regulator -- more on that in a sec) which of course, then connects to a 5 gallon tank.

On the Peerless Premier stove there is a regulator but the Propane Gas guys locally tell me it is for fine tuning the pressure for the stove and not meant to regulate pressure coming from a tank and that I should use one at the tank also.  This doesn't matter on the 5 gallon tanks because I have hoses with ACME nuts on them but for the 20 gallon tanks I'll need to change something.  As it is I have a hose with a 9/16" type fitting that I have not been able to find an adapter for yet, and a LP tank connector for the bigger tanks but no regulator.  So I'll have to sort that out too.

While at KIS I asked about my greywater drain system and how to connect it to the sink drains etc -- because I wasn't sure really -- and they helped me out there too :)  I was able to pick up an adapter to go from the 4" pipe into the grey water settling tank to 2" pipe going to the cabin, then a 3 into 1 Y piece to connect the two sinks and bath to the drain :)

Now I just need to grab some sch35 pipe (6') and some sch40 2" and 1 1/2" pipe and I will be able to start using the grey water drain system!!! 

Yes, I'm Uber excited about this trip :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 08, 2011, 12:30:21 PM
Another great weekend :)

We arrived Friday around 3PM and unloaded the truck for the weekend.  Our plans were to get the stove installed and working and then get the kitchen walls textured and primered.  We set right to it!

First we installed the kitchen stove with the black iron pipe going through the wall and all the correct fittings to hook it up to a 5 gallon tank (the 100 gallon tanks will be installed once filled).  After a minor hickup (forgot to tighten one SS flex hose fitting correctly) we had the stove piping 'soapy water' tested and with no leaks detected fired up the stove.  IT WORKS! :D  Yes, we can cook with a little more normalcy now and after two years that's kinda cool :)

Except that we could not get the oven to work still - seems maybe an electrical issue that we haven't found yet - and we need to tweak some of the burners a little more to get the mixture right.  However, for the most part we're pretty stinking happy :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Darci_texturing2.jpg)
Next was to move everything and get to texturing :)  My wife loves to do that and to paint so we pretty much left her to it and assisted by shaking cans and staying out of the way :)

Saturday morning we got up early and after breakfast checked the well water level -- it was 27 feet from the top of the well to the water line!!!!! WOW!  Having the well report, which states the water level rose to 40 feet, and considering all the issues we've had with keeping water in the cistern this was encouraging.

So, with the pump down 86 feet from the top of the casing and the water down just 27 feet and knowing that we've pumped at least 45 gallons per day for ten days one should assume we'd have 450 gallons of water in the cistern right?  Wrong!  Maybe 2-3 if we were lucky :(  Something aint right.

So we pulled up the pump and rebuilt it -- and it didn't work.  d*  We tore it down again and discovered we had squished a valve, replaced it and stripped some threads in the upper housing (just too brittle it seems) and broke the electrical connector outer casing too -- just a little but clearly the plastic is deteriorating.

However, the pump worked and we were pumping water again.

200 gallons pumped and no water in the cistern worth mentioning :(  I think we have a problem that may not be the pump but I'm guessing the pump needs replacing too.  So the next step is to put in a check valve in the piping to the cistern to make sure it isn't draining back into the well (which might be why the water level was so high) and test that.

One a good note, however, we discovered as long as we were pumping water we could get lots from the cistern -- just give it 10 minutes to get ahead of you and then get all the water you want -- so there is that.  [cool]

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0693.jpg)
While playing with the plump my wife was painting :)  so when we were done it was time to get busy with the cabinets -- after the paint was dry anyway.  My buddy John smiling away there -- he enjoyed helping put up the cabinets.  He's a sysadmin and this sort of thing always seems to entertain him!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0705.jpg)
So we set about getting dinner cooked and installing the kitchen cabinets -- the paint was a little soft still, but we had no time to waste.
For dinner we cooked two chickens in the Dutch oven (in about 1 1'2 inches of water) and let me tell you, if you have not tried this you should  :)  Best chicken ever!
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0702.jpg)
We also tossed in home grown turnips, potatoes, scallions and parsley just for fun -- was very tasty :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0696.jpg)
Dinner cooked, we worked -- life was good :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0698.jpg)
The cabinets are from Home Depot.  We just decided it was the fasted way to get cabinets and my wife and I liked the natural look to them.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0700.jpg)
With such a small space we think these will make a significant improvement to overall feel.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0707.jpg)
With the first part of the counter going in my wife just couldn't resist cleaning it :)  She's in love with the 'feel' of 'her' little kitchen in the woods....I think she is planning on coming out more now ;)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0719.jpg)
Sunday morning we'd completed as much as we could with sink cut in, counters cut and test fitted, cupboards installed (but in need of some more screws here and there and the handles finished) but all in all we had a great weekend and can't wait to get back and continue.

Oh and my wife has decided she will be going out once a month now :)

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on August 08, 2011, 12:49:55 PM
Very nice little kitchen there!  Looks like the place is shaping up quite nicely!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 08, 2011, 01:37:45 PM
Quote from: JavaMan on August 08, 2011, 12:49:55 PM
Very nice little kitchen there!  Looks like the place is shaping up quite nicely!

Thanks :)

Also forgot to mention that my wife brought up more curtains she'd been working on and the place is staying very cool throughout most of the day.  We arrived around 3pm and it was over 80 out but the cabin was still only about 70 inside :D

I never saw it go above 78 when it was mid to high 80's outside and my wife loved it!  Truth is, I didn't mind at all either ;)  I hate the heat and can see that once the work is done the cabin will stay cool in the summer and warm in the winter :)  I love it!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on August 08, 2011, 01:57:08 PM
I certainly hope I can get Beautiful up to my/our place once the building is complete.  She's not a "High Desert" kind of gal, even tho it's not really high desert - I think it's just that she doesn't like the heat.  And I can't blame her for that - I don't like it either!

I've even got a window that I can hang an AC unit in, if I have to, but I'm hoping that simply enough shade will help out tremendously.

Then, I've got to put in a well... I have a plan for a pool up there, but I need the water!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: mogie01 on August 08, 2011, 03:11:57 PM
Your place is looking great. :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 08, 2011, 03:23:42 PM
Quote from: JavaMan on August 08, 2011, 01:57:08 PM
I certainly hope I can get Beautiful up to my/our place once the building is complete.  She's not a "High Desert" kind of gal, even tho it's not really high desert - I think it's just that she doesn't like the heat.  And I can't blame her for that - I don't like it either!

I've even got a window that I can hang an AC unit in, if I have to, but I'm hoping that simply enough shade will help out tremendously.

Then, I've got to put in a well... I have a plan for a pool up there, but I need the water!

Heat?  What heat?  You saw the whole "no higher then 78" right?  Usually it's in the 60's -- 60 in the AM when we get up to have coffee and 68-70 when we go to bed.  I think it might even drop into the 50's in the dead of night but I don't think so.

Bear in mind this is without all the insulation and the roof isn't insulated except the top 18".  Once done I expect we'll keep a cool 65 degrees inside the cabin most days July and August...the rest of the year we will likely need to heat it up in the AM when having coffee :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Sassy on August 08, 2011, 03:49:28 PM
Very nice kitchen! 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 08, 2011, 03:54:13 PM
Quote from: Sassy on August 08, 2011, 03:49:28 PM
Very nice kitchen! 

Thanks Sassy :)  My wife pretty much decides on decorating, design and style and I just do the work ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on August 08, 2011, 04:58:40 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on August 08, 2011, 03:23:42 PM
Heat?  What heat?  You saw the whole "no higher then 78" right?  Usually it's in the 60's -- 60 in the AM when we get up to have coffee and 68-70 when we go to bed.  I think it might even drop into the 50's in the dead of night but I don't think so.

Bear in mind this is without all the insulation and the roof isn't insulated except the top 18".  Once done I expect we'll keep a cool 65 degrees inside the cabin most days July and August...the rest of the year we will likely need to heat it up in the AM when having coffee :)

Yeah, that's this year... or maybe it's because my place is further south and west of yours...  rofl  But the year she went up with me, the second time we went, the temp in Omak hit 100+  [shocked] ... and it was still about 85/90 up on the mountain.  The Nights were nice, tho - into the low 60's. But I don't think she's managed to get over that one, very hot, week.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 08, 2011, 05:10:36 PM
Quote from: JavaMan on August 08, 2011, 04:58:40 PM
Yeah, that's this year... or maybe it's because my place is further south and west of yours...  rofl  But the year she went up with me, the second time we went, the temp in Omak hit 100+  [shocked] ... and it was still about 85/90 up on the mountain.  The Nights were nice, tho - into the low 60's. But I don't think she's managed to get over that one, very hot, week.

For us each year has gotten cooler but I understand.  Funny thing though, we haven't seen triple digits yet this year that I know of, that THAT is amazing since we had 9 in a row ten years ago!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 08, 2011, 05:38:58 PM
Did a little reading on my well problem and it seems the issue may well be the Frost Free.  It seems these were not designed to be used the way I have been using mine and it's possible there is damage to the valve.  I can test apparently by putting my thumb over the spigot hole and seeing if there is a vacuum suction when i shut it off.  If not then the valve is damaged.

If the valve is not working properly it would allow the cistern to drain into the french drain below the spigot -- though I would think I'd see some signs of this??

Anyway, that's one thing I'll check, the other is to install a check valve at the head off the pipe leading to the cistern and finally to check the cistern itself to see if it might have any cracks, holes or other possible issues....sooner or later though, I'll figure it out.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on August 08, 2011, 06:03:48 PM
OJ noticed the range.  It looks as if there is a clock/timer on the face.   If so there might be an electronic ignition to the oven.  My range which was I ordered and is in but since there is no HD locally I will have to have someone pick it up for me.  It is the 30" with pilot oven and no electric.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 08, 2011, 06:55:13 PM
Quote from: Redoverfarm on August 08, 2011, 06:03:48 PM
OJ noticed the range.  It looks as if there is a clock/timer on the face.   If so there might be an electronic ignition to the oven.  My range which was I ordered and is in but since there is no HD locally I will have to have someone pick it up for me.  It is the 30" with pilot oven and no electric.

It's electronic ignition all around -- the top works great but the light and electric ignition in the oven doesn't work...I haven't had a chance to test any leads yet though.  I'm sure it's just a loose connector somewhere.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on August 09, 2011, 10:15:43 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on August 08, 2011, 05:10:36 PM
For us each year has gotten cooler but I understand.  Funny thing though, we haven't seen triple digits yet this year that I know of, that THAT is amazing since we had 9 in a row ten years ago!

Well, I know that the last few years, since that summer (2008, I think) have all been cooler.  And I am sure that it's been cooler up at my place this year, too (I've been watching the weather data at Loup Loup pass which is about 10 miles or less from the place) i just haven't had a chance to get there yet.  Hopefully later this month or early Sept.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 10, 2011, 04:56:58 PM
Quote from: JavaMan on August 09, 2011, 10:15:43 AM
Well, I know that the last few years, since that summer (2008, I think) have all been cooler.  And I am sure that it's been cooler up at my place this year, too (I've been watching the weather data at Loup Loup pass which is about 10 miles or less from the place) i just haven't had a chance to get there yet.  Hopefully later this month or early Sept.

Well I hope you make it up there soon!

I hope to be there next weekend (not this coming but the one after) or the one after that.  I only go up, typically, twice a month but might have some maintenance going on next weekend so won't be able to head up...

I'm also thinking 4 days this next trip so I can get some serious work done!  Been slacking TOO much lately.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Barry Broome on August 10, 2011, 07:25:42 PM
Is that a propane refrigerator in the kitchen?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 10, 2011, 07:30:58 PM
Quote from: Weasel on August 10, 2011, 07:25:42 PM
Is that a propane refrigerator in the kitchen?


Nope.  It's an electric with no freezer.  Uses about 500 watt hours per day give or take, so it runs fine on our solar power.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Squirl on August 11, 2011, 03:46:03 PM
Nice job.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on August 12, 2011, 10:10:00 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on August 10, 2011, 04:56:58 PM
Well I hope you make it up there soon!

I hope to be there next weekend (not this coming but the one after) or the one after that.  I only go up, typically, twice a month but might have some maintenance going on next weekend so won't be able to head up...

I'm also thinking 4 days this next trip so I can get some serious work done!  Been slacking TOO much lately.
Slacking? I've never seen you slacking in any of the posts!  you're a machine!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 12, 2011, 11:49:03 AM
Quote from: JavaMan on August 12, 2011, 10:10:00 AM
Slacking? I've never seen you slacking in any of the posts!  you're a machine!

LOL ya, I have been slacking...heck I have the roof to complete still, the exterior walls to complete and stain, the .....you see there is so much to do that if I sit down and relax for more then 5 minutes at the cabin then I'm slacking!

Seriously though, I'm ready for the trip that has no agenda, no plans, no reason for being other then for being there...then I'll have to kick back for at least 10 minutes! ;)

It's probably the ACT though -- Advanced Cellular Technology -- a natural energy drink that I drink twice daily and my Doctor tells me "What the heck are you doing!  Your numbers keep improving and you just keep on getting better!" to which I reply "Drinking Energy Drinks Doc" and he laughs, "ya that supplement ACT right?"

Seriously, the stuff is amazing and it is the reason I am always trying to do something.  It doesn't give me a buzz or anything, just makes me WANT to get up and do something...hence the not sitting around doing nothing ;)

Cabin building powered by ACT :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 13, 2011, 04:48:14 PM
Just got in from Spokane with our new tub :)  An 89 year old Claw Foot tub, 5 feet long that was made on July 25th 1922!  Actually welded into the bottom of the tub.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMAG0311.jpg)
Virtually no rust (probably a little around the drain I'm guessing but no where else.  All the feet appear to be 100% with a little rust to clean off and condition before painting.  Only one small chip in the porcelain and a little rub spot where the chain used to hang with the stopper.  Otherwise this tub is in excellent shape!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMAG0315.jpg)
Even the show rod setup appears to be in excellent shape which no rust or damage.  Simply awesome.

What's more is that it was installed and in use and demonstrated (get your mind out of the gutter you! d* ) before being removed before I bought it and brought it home. [cool]

So with a little cleaning and sanding we can repaint the base and feet and have it ready to install.  Also it came with a dozen or so seals for the taps which the owner tells me they replaced once a year but get from Lowes, and the hoses which have an oddball larger connection to the taps.  It's ready to install and use but we'll clean it up some and give it a paint job while waiting on the bathroom walls to be finished first.

Heavy sucker too!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: dug on August 13, 2011, 06:48:45 PM
Nice find Jarhead, looks great!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 13, 2011, 08:01:09 PM
Quote from: dug on August 13, 2011, 06:48:45 PM
Nice find Jarhead, looks great!

Thanks Dug :)  We're pretty stoked!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 15, 2011, 12:01:06 PM
Pretty much losing it...I'm in the 'it's been a whole week!' stage that I go through everytime I'm not at the cabin....so I'm planning the next trip ( for next weekend) which will be a 4 day trip to give me a little more time to work on the cabin.

Can't wait!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: timkel on August 17, 2011, 10:41:05 AM
How did you insulate the floor of your cabin? What type and what R factor? How did you secure it in place? How do you keep animals from pulling it out?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 17, 2011, 10:11:15 PM
Quote from: timkel on August 17, 2011, 10:41:05 AM
How did you insulate the floor of your cabin? What type and what R factor? How did you secure it in place? How do you keep animals from pulling it out?

I insulated the floor before putting the lid on so the batting (R19) would hold while waiting for treatment below.

I've not had a chance yet (sadly) to get the underneath done but I've been considering the possibility of just putting 1" foam under it and holding it up with chicken wire.

So far the critters haven't been too bad with removing the insulation and it's been plenty of floor insulation as we were warm in the winter without much wall or roof insulation despite VERY cold temps.

At this point my plan is to secure the floor insulation with either foam or something else that will deter animals and then enclose the outer wall of the 'crawl space' and insulate that with 1 1/4 or thicker foam board insulation.  I'm hoping that by doing that and insulating all pipes and putting heat trace on them for extreme cold protection that I'll be able to use the drains and toilet in -30 degree weather without issue :)  We've been ok down to -10 so far and that's without anything else :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on August 17, 2011, 10:30:39 PM
Note there are wire "stays" cut from spring steel wire, available is sizes to to be used with 16 and 24 inch OC joists. These are used to hold the insulation up in place.

Back home I've seen deer mice chew through foam as if it was cheese, not sure I'd recommend that. Three-eighths plywood will keep most curious rodents out. Ours has been left alone for a couple winters now. If they are determined they will chew through that.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 17, 2011, 11:16:14 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on August 17, 2011, 10:30:39 PM
Note there are wire "stays" cut from spring steel wire, available is sizes to to be used with 16 and 24 inch OC joists. These are used to hold the insulation up in place.

Back home I've seen deer mice chew through foam as if it was cheese, not sure I'd recommend that. Three-eighths plywood will keep most curious rodents out. Ours has been left alone for a couple winters now. If they are determined they will chew through that.

I thought about doing that too...figured it would be the strongest I could do.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: timkel on August 18, 2011, 05:35:09 AM
Quote from: MountainDon on August 17, 2011, 10:30:39 PM
Note there are wire "stays" cut from spring steel wire, available is sizes to to be used with 16 and 24 inch OC joists. These are used to hold the insulation up in place.

Back home I've seen deer mice chew through foam as if it was cheese, not sure I'd recommend that. Three-eighths plywood will keep most curious rodents out. Ours has been left alone for a couple winters now. If they are determined they will chew through that.
Originally I insulated my floor with 6" of fiberglass insilation held in place with the wire cross pieces. I actually did this 2 times. Both times animals pulled it out within few years. Next I tried the 4' x 8' x 1" foam panels. I cut the panels into 22.5" x 48" pieces and installed them between the rafters up against the floor. I used screws to secure the panels in place. This method has worked very well. The animals have not disturbed it at all in over 10 years. But I think my floor needs more then 1" of insulation. Now I am considering the 4' x 8' x 2" foam panels and adding 2" more insulation.
I think spray foam would also work well. But the cost is high. Chicken wire is also a good idea.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on August 18, 2011, 09:04:10 AM
Quote from: timkel on August 18, 2011, 05:35:09 AMBoth times animals pulled it out within few years.


The wires work but there still needs to be something else to keep the rodents, etc out. Hence the plywood. Chicken wire spaces are too large to keep mice out and the wire gauge is too small to be bite proof to larger rodents.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 18, 2011, 09:16:01 AM
Quote from: timkel on August 18, 2011, 05:35:09 AM
Originally I insulated my floor with 6" of fiberglass insilation held in place with the wire cross pieces. I actually did this 2 times. Both times animals pulled it out within few years. Next I tried the 4' x 8' x 1" foam panels. I cut the panels into 22.5" x 48" pieces and installed them between the rafters up against the floor. I used screws to secure the panels in place. This method has worked very well. The animals have not disturbed it at all in over 10 years. But I think my floor needs more then 1" of insulation. Now I am considering the 4' x 8' x 2" foam panels and adding 2" more insulation.
I think spray foam would also work well. But the cost is high. Chicken wire is also a good idea.

So perhaps using fiberglass bats held in by foam secured with something else?  Sounds like the foam did well for you.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on August 18, 2011, 11:05:39 AM
I was wondering, OJH, if you had any handle on what I am calling "fixed costs" - in otherwords, simply the costs of going to and from the site?

I'm working on a "budget", so to speak for what I hope will not be the first and last trip up this year and got to thinking about what it costs for gas, food, etc... other than lumber, nails, and other materials that I use.  I was wondering if anyone else has thought of what the costs were to get to the site and back.  So far I have about $225 in gas/food/ and other expenses of traveling.

Most of that is fuel for the truck (ouch!)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: timkel on August 18, 2011, 12:21:29 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on August 18, 2011, 09:16:01 AM
So perhaps using fiberglass bats held in by foam secured with something else?  Sounds like the foam did well for you.
I think if there is any kind of cavity above the foam, then they will get inside any nest, ect. I plan on using foam right up against the plywood floor.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on August 18, 2011, 12:39:50 PM
Quote from: JavaMan on August 18, 2011, 11:05:39 AM
thinking about what it costs for gas, food, etc...


Food doesn't count, IMO; we all eat no matter what. Unless restaurant food is chosen over prepare it yourself food.

Gasoline and the other associated vehicle costs do add up.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: hillsvillehermit on August 18, 2011, 01:44:58 PM
I've heard of using hardware cloth on the bottom of the joists to keep the insulation in and critters out, but I've never actually seen whether it works or not.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 18, 2011, 02:43:32 PM
Quote from: JavaMan on August 18, 2011, 11:05:39 AM
I was wondering, OJH, if you had any handle on what I am calling "fixed costs" - in otherwords, simply the costs of going to and from the site?

I'm working on a "budget", so to speak for what I hope will not be the first and last trip up this year and got to thinking about what it costs for gas, food, etc... other than lumber, nails, and other materials that I use.  I was wondering if anyone else has thought of what the costs were to get to the site and back.  So far I have about $225 in gas/food/ and other expenses of traveling.

Most of that is fuel for the truck (ouch!)

I budget $200 per trip.  About $100-$120 of that is gas and the rest is 'incidentals'.  Since i Have to eat no matter where I am I don't count food at all.  The only expenses I have besides gas are the occasional bag of chips etc but honestly we keep that way down because I go twice a month, every month and at that rate if I spent even $225 per trip for gas etc then I'd just not be able to do much else.  By sticking to $200 or less (most often much less) then I can use the excess for the various things you need to build the cabin.

It's like a cushion built into my cabin budget -- $400 a month for trips and $600 a month for parts but often it works out to $750 a month in parts and $250 a month for trips ;)  Just have to be very  mindful of how much gas you are burning and where you buy it (the Indian store in Omak is the best place to refuel).  I get about 17.5mpg in the truck as long as I don't smash the throttle nonstop ;) so I can squeak a trip in for around $105 in gas if I don't mess around...that leaves me a few bucks for snacks if we don't pack any (we usually do) and the rest for padding on the months budget or whatever we might need :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on August 18, 2011, 03:33:36 PM
About budgeting and food for trips to the property / cabin.  True you have to eat.  According to the budgeting gurus this should come out of the food money budgeted for the household for the month, half or week unless you can budget it from another source.  But you ar still trading $ for $ if that is the case.  The short of it is if it is causing a strain on the food budget look to lower your cost some how.  My wife and I have a bad budget braking habit stopping by and buying deli stuff from the place we fuel.  They have mongo good chicken strips and a couple other items I love.  We were able to knock the cost of a trip down by about $10 by packing a lunch and dinner of what we would normally eat.  That is forty a month easing of our food budget. 

Yes you have to eat.  I agree but with us our well we have to eat was turning in to a lot more than just at home eating.  Another thing we are a lot more better at selecting what vehicle to take.  My little Escort I drive back and forth to work.  Or am I going to have to move a trailer, firewood or lumber and need the pick up?               
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on August 18, 2011, 06:06:38 PM
Quote from: hillsvillehermit on August 18, 2011, 01:44:58 PM
I've heard of using hardware cloth on the bottom of the joists to keep the insulation in and critters out, but I've never actually seen whether it works or not.

Heavy hardware cloth will work to the extent of its ability to withstand sharp little teeth of mice and the larger teeth of like in this area of pack rats.  Also it is as good as the time that is invested in doing it right.  Seems the hard foam boards do a very good job plus sealing all holes with some type of foam sealer.  IE Great-Stuff.  Then still one needs to keep an eye out for activity.  Place that they might be chewing.  Fall and winter is of course when they are the worst hoping to find shelter and food.       

About rodent control with cabins that use piers.  Could you not fashion some type of shield that would not allow them to climb up the pier or chase in the first place?  Sort of like the rat guards you use to see around the mooring lines on ships.

http://www.alibaba.com/showroom/rat-guards.html

Rather than a rope or line the cabin pier!  Just a thought.
 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Don_P on August 18, 2011, 09:31:16 PM
Check out the norwegian farm storage buildings, stabbur. The piers are either logs carved sort of like a mushroom to prevent rodents from being able to climb them or the piers support a wide sill that accomplishes the same thing.
http://www.scandinavianheritage.org/stabbur.htm
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: timkel on August 19, 2011, 05:44:43 AM
Quote from: rick91351 on August 18, 2011, 06:06:38 PM
Heavy hardware cloth will work to the extent of its ability to withstand sharp little teeth of mice and the larger teeth of like in this area of pack rats.  Also it is as good as the time that is invested in doing it right.  Seems the hard foam boards do a very good job plus sealing all holes with some type of foam sealer.  IE Great-Stuff.  Then still one needs to keep an eye out for activity.  Place that they might be chewing.  Fall and winter is of course when they are the worst hoping to find shelter and food.       

About rodent control with cabins that use piers.  Could you not fashion some type of shield that would not allow them to climb up the pier or chase in the first place?  Sort of like the rat guards you use to see around the mooring lines on ships.

http://www.alibaba.com/showroom/rat-guards.html

I think that is a good idea. The link has several good ideas. My problems have been with squirrels. But they are just rats with a bushy tail.

Rather than a rope or line the cabin pier!  Just a thought.
 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: considerations on August 21, 2011, 10:30:35 PM
"I've heard of using hardware cloth on the bottom of the joists to keep the insulation in and critters out, but I've never actually seen whether it works or not."

I'll let you know in the spring.  My floors from top to bottom are:


Rodents are world class opportunists....
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on August 22, 2011, 10:41:11 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on August 18, 2011, 02:43:32 PM
I budget $200 per trip.  About $100-$120 of that is gas and the rest is 'incidentals'.  Since i Have to eat no matter where I am I don't count food at all.  The only expenses I have besides gas are the occasional bag of chips etc but honestly we keep that way down because I go twice a month, every month and at that rate if I spent even $225 per trip for gas etc then I'd just not be able to do much else.  By sticking to $200 or less (most often much less) then I can use the excess for the various things you need to build the cabin.

It's like a cushion built into my cabin budget -- $400 a month for trips and $600 a month for parts but often it works out to $750 a month in parts and $250 a month for trips ;)  Just have to be very  mindful of how much gas you are burning and where you buy it (the Indian store in Omak is the best place to refuel).  I get about 17.5mpg in the truck as long as I don't smash the throttle nonstop ;) so I can squeak a trip in for around $105 in gas if I don't mess around...that leaves me a few bucks for snacks if we don't pack any (we usually do) and the rest for padding on the months budget or whatever we might need :)

Unfortunately, my vehicle doesn't get that kind of gas milage.  I get about 14-15 on the highway - maybe 13 if I'm towing.  Then again I have at least 2 passes to climb over each way depending on the route I take. (don't know what passes you have to do - I'm guessing you do Bluett, tho). My gas costs work out to about $150 just to get there and back, not counting having to run to the lumber yard, etc...

Generally, I've been trying to budget $500 per trip (gas, construction supplies, etc...) - this year, with 0% inflation  [rofl2] it's been hard to put even that much together.  Of course, some of that is because of "pent up demand" after a long time out of work.  A lot of "deferred maintenance" around the house and on vehicles.

I had the money in the account a couple times this year, but once my sister was here visiting, and her travel plans got changed so I couldn't just leave for the property, and another time there was something else that needed doing.  Beautiful (and the kids) can tell that I'm a bit frustrated that I haven't been able to get up there yet this year.  I might have to change my username to "grumpy"  :o

It is good information, though, to know that my budget expectations aren't too far out of line compared to everyone else.

Plus, this weekend, Beautiful and I (in an attempt to figure out where to find more $$), discovered that I can probably save about $500/month on my commute - which will be awesome!  That's another trip to the property  ;D

Thanks to all (and especially to OJH for letting me hijack his thread for a bit) for the info on your budgets.  It was exactly the info I was hoping for.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 23, 2011, 12:07:56 AM
No passes for me bud :)  I live on the east side.  The driving is mostly small hills and flat east side desert until the last 100 miles then it's still pretty tame.  The Ford F150 (2006) that we bought gets great mileage for a big truck and we're pretty happy with it :)  As good or better then my jeep was!  So I feel ya there, I can make two or three trips to your one for the same money so I have a distinct advantage there.

Maybe things will work out to your advantage soon!  I hope so because I love to see folks live the dream :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Erik_Shed.jpg)
Speaking of living the dream :)  This is the start of our wood shed and possibly ATV garage and/or work space for splitting kindling etc in the winter.

I was basically tired of trying to pry frozen wood out from under a frozen tarp in order to heat the cabin in the winter so we began our log wood shed :)

The boys decided it could become a cabin someday! haha but I suggested that if they liked the style of construction then perhaps in the future once the main cabin is done we could tackle a more rustic log structure.

However, to make this skeleton we had to cut and peel 18 logs this weekend!  That's a lot of work and the shoulders, arm and back are sore today!

But honestly?  It's living the dream! :)  [cool]
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on August 23, 2011, 10:04:27 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on August 23, 2011, 12:07:56 AM
No passes for me bud :)  I live on the east side.  The driving is mostly small hills and flat east side desert until the last 100 miles then it's still pretty tame.  The Ford F150 (2006) that we bought gets great mileage for a big truck and we're pretty happy with it :)  As good or better then my jeep was!  So I feel ya there, I can make two or three trips to your one for the same money so I have a distinct advantage there.

Maybe things will work out to your advantage soon!  I hope so because I love to see folks live the dream :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Erik_Shed.jpg)
Speaking of living the dream :)  This is the start of our wood shed and possibly ATV garage and/or work space for splitting kindling etc in the winter.

I was basically tired of trying to pry frozen wood out from under a frozen tarp in order to heat the cabin in the winter so we began our log wood shed :)

The boys decided it could become a cabin someday! haha but I suggested that if they liked the style of construction then perhaps in the future once the main cabin is done we could tackle a more rustic log structure.

However, to make this skeleton we had to cut and peel 18 logs this weekend!  That's a lot of work and the shoulders, arm and back are sore today!

But honestly?  It's living the dream! :)  [cool]

Well, I don't know about 2-3 trips... My 2000 F150 has the small 8 and doesn't do too badly for it's vintage, but it's got over 150K miles on it and is beginning to show it's age.  Next time I think I will try to find a diesel ... from what I've heard they are getting better milage than the gas ones - enough to justify the extra fuel cost and then some.  For those of you east of the Rockies, yes, Diesel is more expensive up here in the PNW than gas is.  From all my midwestern friends (and from living there for a while) I know it usually is cheaper back east.

So, on to the questions about your woodshed!  How did you plant those poles?  I have an idea for construction at my place that I hope to accomplish next year that requires a number of poles stuck in the ground like that.  Did you simply dig a hole, stick the pole in and fill it back up? or was there more to it?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 23, 2011, 02:31:23 PM
Quote from: JavaMan on August 23, 2011, 10:04:27 AM
Well, I don't know about 2-3 trips... My 2000 F150 has the small 8 and doesn't do too badly for it's vintage, but it's got over 150K miles on it and is beginning to show it's age.  Next time I think I will try to find a diesel ... from what I've heard they are getting better milage than the gas ones - enough to justify the extra fuel cost and then some.  For those of you east of the Rockies, yes, Diesel is more expensive up here in the PNW than gas is.  From all my midwestern friends (and from living there for a while) I know it usually is cheaper back east.

So, on to the questions about your woodshed!  How did you plant those poles?  I have an idea for construction at my place that I hope to accomplish next year that requires a number of poles stuck in the ground like that.  Did you simply dig a hole, stick the pole in and fill it back up? or was there more to it?

Hmmm...mine is a 2006 F150 with the 4.6l Triton V8 and it gets 17mpg on average.  Maybe just a newer one some day?  I hear the new F150's can get 23mpg!  They shut down 4 cyls on the hiway when crusing.

On to the shed:

These poles, because they are for a wood shed and I'm not worried about frost heave etc, are set 1 foot down and concreted in place with really what amounts to a small amount of concrete (3-4 inches around the outside diameter of the pole on the larger ones).  It's very solid though and as it will only house wood for the stove I think this will work fine -- heck, probably could have just buried in dirt for that matter but I felt the concrete might help deter bugs a tiny bit ;) and make it slightly stronger.

The logs are 'nailed' together with 12" and 10" spikes and I tried to keep that at least as big around as my leg for the poles (ya it's that technical) and the diameter of the rafters about what I can wrap my hands around :)  Like that?

So figure the poles are 10-12" in diameter and the rafters are mostly around 6" in diameter...the beams are about 6-8" in diameter.

The boys did drag out two smaller rafter poles and peel them but I plan to replace them or place thicker ones beside them.  For now, however, they will help hold things together.

We are setting the rafters on roughly 16" centers and will strap with 1" boards to screw roofing too.  Then we will side with scraps from the mill.  I figure if there are holes and gaps in the siding that will be a good thing as it will allow air to move through the wood pile and help dry the wood or keep it dry.

Also I gave it a 24" overhang on the top of the roof and 18" at the bottom with 12" on either end.  That way it should keep things pretty dry and I shouldn't have to pull tarps out of the ice this winter in order to get to my wood pile :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on August 23, 2011, 02:40:14 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on August 23, 2011, 02:31:23 PM
Hmmm...mine is a 2006 F150 with the 4.6l Triton V8 and it gets 17mpg on average.  Maybe just a newer one some day?  I hear the new F150's can get 23mpg!  They shut down 4 cyls on the hiway when crusing.

On to the shed:

These poles, because they are for a wood shed and I'm not worried about frost heave etc, are set 1 foot down and concreted in place with really what amounts to a small amount of concrete (3-4 inches around the outside diameter of the pole on the larger ones).  It's very solid though and as it will only house wood for the stove I think this will work fine -- heck, probably could have just buried in dirt for that matter but I felt the concrete might help deter bugs a tiny bit ;) and make it slightly stronger.

The logs are 'nailed' together with 12" and 10" spikes and I tried to keep that at least as big around as my leg for the poles (ya it's that technical) and the diameter of the rafters about what I can wrap my hands around :)  Like that?

So figure the poles are 10-12" in diameter and the rafters are mostly around 6" in diameter...the beams are about 6-8" in diameter.

The boys did drag out two smaller rafter poles and peel them but I plan to replace them or place thicker ones beside them.  For now, however, they will help hold things together.

We are setting the rafters on roughly 16" centers and will strap with 1" boards to screw roofing too.  Then we will side with scraps from the mill.  I figure if there are holes and gaps in the siding that will be a good thing as it will allow air to move through the wood pile and help dry the wood or keep it dry.

Also I gave it a 24" overhang on the top of the roof and 18" at the bottom with 12" on either end.  That way it should keep things pretty dry and I shouldn't have to pull tarps out of the ice this winter in order to get to my wood pile :)
Sounds good!  I probably will want to go a bit deeper with mine, then ... but the 10-12" dia seems close to what I think I'll need.  From the looks of it, tho, I'll need them to be longer. I want a good 8' of head room - maybe even 9 or 10 depending on if I decide I want a floor or not.

And yeah, my F150 doesn't shut down any cylinders (I have the 4.6L as well), and I do think the newer ones get better mileage - best I've had on mine was 16mpg.  I still think I'll go with diesel if I can find one at a reasonable price (Brand new, it's a $45,000 truck for an F250 as far as I've priced - if I'm spending that kind of money, I'll pay off the house, first  :D)

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: timkel on August 24, 2011, 10:18:36 AM
Quote from: considerations on August 21, 2011, 10:30:35 PM
"I've heard of using hardware cloth on the bottom of the joists to keep the insulation in and critters out, but I've never actually seen whether it works or not."

I'll let you know in the spring.  My floors from top to bottom are:


  • 2 x 6 T&G
  • 2 x 10 joists - the spaces filled in with insulation
  • 1/4" hardware cloth overlapped and carefully riveted (picture "sewn") with a roofing nail gun so that there are (hopefully) no gaps (after multiple inspections

Rodents are world class opportunists....

that should work fine
fyi- I just spoke with a contractor. He says he has another idea. He will get back to me after he looks into it.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 24, 2011, 05:26:39 PM
I'll be interested in seeing his response.

At this point I really need to get this resolved too -- the chipmunks etc seem to be having a hayday down there....time to find a means of stopping them!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on August 24, 2011, 05:45:24 PM
Time to re-drop the link for the NPS Rodent Exclusion Manual (http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=2919.0)

Excerpt:
Hardware Cloth. Hardware cloth is the best, and one of the easiest, materials to use for screening foundation vents, open pipes, and other holes. It effectively excludes mice and most native rats. However, light-gauge hardware cloth is not entirely resistant to more aggressive animals, such as Old World rats.

Use 16- to 19-gauge, welded-at-each-joint, ½-inch by ½-inch-mesh, galvanized-after-welding wire screen to exclude larger animals or aggressive rats. This is extremely strong material, and will last 10 to 20 years due to its heavy zinc coating.

Use 19- or heavier gauge, galvanized, ¼-inch or smaller mesh hardware cloth to keep smaller animals (e.g., mice) out. Covering hardware cloth with metal window screening also keeps insects out.


The document has further info. Good stuff.

Much of the readily available hardware cloth is too light for larger or more determined rodents.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 26, 2011, 11:47:47 AM
Quote from: MountainDon on August 24, 2011, 05:45:24 PM
Time to re-drop the link for the NPS Rodent Exclusion Manual (http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=2919.0)

Excerpt:
Hardware Cloth. Hardware cloth is the best, and one of the easiest, materials to use for screening foundation vents, open pipes, and other holes. It effectively excludes mice and most native rats. However, light-gauge hardware cloth is not entirely resistant to more aggressive animals, such as Old World rats.

Use 16- to 19-gauge, welded-at-each-joint, ½-inch by ½-inch-mesh, galvanized-after-welding wire screen to exclude larger animals or aggressive rats. This is extremely strong material, and will last 10 to 20 years due to its heavy zinc coating.

Use 19- or heavier gauge, galvanized, ¼-inch or smaller mesh hardware cloth to keep smaller animals (e.g., mice) out. Covering hardware cloth with metal window screening also keeps insects out.


The document has further info. Good stuff.

Much of the readily available hardware cloth is too light for larger or more determined rodents.


Guess I need to look up hardware cloth and get some...is it something HD sells?  It sounds easy to use -- cloth being something you could staple to the joists....is it?

Thanks!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 26, 2011, 11:49:35 AM
Headed back tomorrow:)

Plan on buying 5 gallons of stain and really going at it!  I need to get the exterior stained and ready for the fall/winter as a year + of not being treated has shown a little water staining/damage that I'd rather not allow to get worse!

Perhaps while there I'll get a little more done but since I'll be leaving early am tomorrow it's unlikely.  Though my new well pump arrived so I might take an hour and install it too :)  Then at least I should get some water into the cistern!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Squirl on August 26, 2011, 11:52:23 AM
It's the stuff they build rabbit cages out of.  It is just like working with welded wire fencing, but tighter together.  It is thicker than poultry wire, but can still be cut with wire cutters. Watch out for sharp edges. I'd probably go for the .25 inch. They sell it at HD.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 26, 2011, 12:06:53 PM
Quote from: Squirl on August 26, 2011, 11:52:23 AM
It's the stuff they build rabbit cages out of.  It is just like working with welded wire fencing, but tighter together.  It is thicker than poultry wire, but can still be cut with wire cutters. Watch out for sharp edges. I'd probably go for the .25 inch. They sell it at HD.

You mean this: http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-5yc1v/R-100083687/h_d2/ProductDisplay?langId=-1&storeId=10051&catalogId=10053

It's 1/4" fencing but is also called 'hardware cloth'....
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Squirl on August 26, 2011, 12:13:47 PM
Exactly.  I had to buy it once.  I asked a half dozen sales people where the hardware cloth was.  They all looked at me dumbfounded.  I said you know, they use it as rabbit fencing.  Oh, rabbit fencing. They showed me it was in the lawn and garden section.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on August 26, 2011, 12:19:18 PM
The HD stuff is only 23 gauge though. Not as heavy a wire as the NPS recommends. It would probably do for deer mice, but be sure to get 1/4" mesh, nothing larger. Larger rodents can bite through the light gauge wire.  The 19 gauge and heavier can be hard to find and expensive. Somewhere here there is more info on finding the heavier gauge wire cloth. It gets pricey in heavier gauges which is why I went with 3/8" CDX plywood. I did vent the ends, on the inside of the beams by about 4 inches. Not sure why really, walls are sealed tight. ???
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 26, 2011, 12:23:12 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on August 26, 2011, 12:19:18 PM
The HD stuff is only 23 gauge though. Not as heavy a wire as the NPS recommends. It would probably do for deer mice, but be sure to get 1/4" mesh, nothing larger. Larger rodents can bite through the light gauge wire.  The 19 gauge and heavier can be hard to find and expensive. Somewhere here there is more info on finding the heavier gauge wire cloth. It gets pricey in heavier gauges which is why I went with 3/8" CDX plywood. I did vent the ends, on the inside of the beams by about 4 inches. Not sure why really, walls are sealed tight. ???

I  had that same thought, about walls, when thinking about insulating the floor of my porch and under the batteries.  I just thought "well, walls are sealed tight so why not a floor?"
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: John Raabe on August 26, 2011, 01:15:47 PM
There are two arguments for keeping the bottom side of an insulated floor less than completely tight.

First, the plywood or OSB subfloor is a good vapor barrier and should stop most moisture migration. Finish floors usually make this even more "tight" on the top side. Then you want it more vapor permeable on the other (cold in winter) side of the insulation in order to dry out the cavity. You want to restrict air movement in the insulation while allowing vapor movement.

Second, if a plumbing leak should happen you would want some drainage to alert you to the problem. You don't want a sealed bathtub on the bottom of the joists.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 26, 2011, 02:30:29 PM
Quote from: John Raabe on August 26, 2011, 01:15:47 PM
There are two arguments for keeping the bottom side of an insulated floor less than completely tight.

First, the plywood or OSB subfloor is a good vapor barrier and should stop most moisture migration. Finish floors usually make this even more "tight" on the top side. Then you want it more vapor permeable on the other (cold in winter) side of the insulation in order to dry out the cavity. You want to restrict air movement in the insulation while allowing vapor movement.

Second, if a plumbing leak should happen you would want some drainage to alert you to the problem. You don't want a sealed bathtub on the bottom of the joists.

Good point.

So I think the hardware cloth is the answer for rodents in the insulation and under the batteries a layer of foam board is probably just fine on top of an insulated but not closed in floor.

Why the insulation under the batteries?  Well I've put them on a 6" raised floor to make it easier to work on them and just thought it might help to insulate them better from the cold air underneath.  I plan to have the porch completely insulated before winter so the solar heating I get via the windows doesn't escape so quickly.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on August 26, 2011, 03:00:56 PM
Acid eats foam so try to seal the surface under the batteries, but leave a way to drain. I give our batteries a good wash down with clear water a couple times a year. I don't use any alkalies for cleaning as I have a fear about getting any into the acid. Hose 'em off with water.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 26, 2011, 03:36:37 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on August 26, 2011, 03:00:56 PM
Acid eats foam so try to seal the surface under the batteries, but leave a way to drain. I give our batteries a good wash down with clear water a couple times a year. I don't use any alkalies for cleaning as I have a fear about getting any into the acid. Hose 'em off with water.

Hmmm not something I ever thought about....and without a means of catching or draining the water I'll have to consider some options -- perhaps a rubber 'pan' under them with a drain in the center that prevents acid or water from reaching the foam insulation.

Worth a try I guess....but probably another year out from getting done.

At this point I'm thinking of adding 4 more batteries because I want to be able to run both the Fridge and Freezer all summer if need be but I'm afraid I don't have that much reserve power just yet....and with the solar panels tripping last trip and the MPPT controller flaking out I'm wondering if I don't have other issues that need resolving too.....ahhhh life.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on August 26, 2011, 05:41:39 PM
You might look for some rubberized or heavy rubber belting.  Like the type they use in gravel pits to move aggregate and sand on those conveyor belts.  I find it on occasion laying around at yard sales or construction auctions or ???  It is most times about 1/4 inch thick and would work well to line a place for batteries to sit on.  Most the  time it is pretty cheap!   
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on August 26, 2011, 05:45:39 PM
Rubber Stall mats at any farm supply store ( Tractor Supply, Southern States) 3/4" thick
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 26, 2011, 07:45:36 PM
Quote from: Redoverfarm on August 26, 2011, 05:45:39 PM
Rubber Stall mats at any farm supply store ( Tractor Supply, Southern States) 3/4" thick

That's a great idea!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Tickhill on August 27, 2011, 06:35:44 AM
I use an old rubber truck bed mat for the same purpose. OJ, waiting for some more pictures!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 27, 2011, 07:33:49 AM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0771.jpg)
OK it's time to get moving!

Today I plan to finish off the staining we started in this picture and maybe get a few more things done.

Seeya!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 28, 2011, 08:47:03 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0778.jpg)
This weekend we made a short trip up to the cabin (two days is REALLY short!) for a couple of reasons:

1.  Last trip I didn't have enough stain and wanted to get the staining done.
2.  I left the propane bottle hooked up and turned ON when we left last weekend  d*
3.  I was worried about the solar power as something seemed amiss last weekend.

So my son and I raced up early Saturday morning (yes we made the 4 1/2 hr drive just to come back the next day) with a load of supplies (insulation for the porch, composter, roof and some walls) and stopped at the 'Do It Best' on the way to grab some Chestnut stain.  We also had the new Sureflo pump with us and hoped to install it.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0773.jpg)
Once we arrived and were settled we set about staining.  We spent about 2 hours masking and staining the walls.  The hardest part was getting up to the loft windows to mask them and then going up and spraying the stain with the pump sprayer!  I'm glad I won't have to do that very often!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0777.jpg)
As usual we have a lot of stuff to clean up and remove but with the truck we're slowly bringing back junk.  Meanwhile we finished 90% of the staining!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0781.jpg)
The solar power seems fine except that I get a HVD alarm every day.  I need to investigate that but must admit that Morningstar support sucks.  I likely won't buy another piece of their equipment because with the exception of the first inquiry I made with them I've not had a SINGLE response in 6 or 7 attempts.  They seem to just ignore me.

Luckily the MPPT controller seems fine and I was able to log in (seems my Ethernet port on my laptop was the issue previously) and check things out -- all seems well.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0779.jpg)
I can't tell you how awesome it is to have a truck!  I love my Jeep but with a truck I no longer need the dang trailer every other trip!  The gas I'm saving alone is paying part of the truck payment monthly!  Who can beat that?

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0795.jpg)
The last thing I did was get the conduit stubbed up the wall and into the AC panel.  Now I can run the wires from the inverter up the conduit to the panel and if need be, replace them with heavier wire in the future without having to rip a wall apart :)

I also sprayed foam (great stuff) into the hole around the conduit and the black iron pipe through the wall for the propane.  OH and speaking of propane, the oven works great!  I just had to read the book once more and noticed the:  it may take 30 to 60 seconds for the oven to light.  We used it to warm left overs for dinner Saturday nigh and I used it to keep bacon warm today!  It's awesome!

And finally (no picture here though) I fixed about 30 feet of fencing today too :)  Only another 3000 or so to go!  Damn cows!

Cheers
Erik

PS.  It was totally awesome listening to the Seahawks game on the radio with my son last night.  I'm not a sports fan but relaxing in the cabin makes all things enjoyable :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 05, 2011, 10:03:46 AM
Timkel you'll have to start a new thread to show yours -- after all, I'd love to see more and I'm sure others would too.  Very nice looking cabin!

No cabin work for me this weekend -- had a child to marry off :)  So, relax today, easy week at work (I hope) and then it's off to the cabin again to get some weekend work in...have to try to get it ready for my parents to come out and do a little bird hunting and relaxing later in the month :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Tickhill on September 05, 2011, 03:39:33 PM
That was a pretty smooth hijack!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: glenn kangiser on September 05, 2011, 04:23:39 PM
No problem - moved it to it's own thread.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: duncanshannon on September 05, 2011, 09:05:11 PM
2006 F-150 SuperCrew is exactly the truck I want.  Lots of leg room in front and pretty dang good in back.

I like the re-design of the interior over the pre-2006 too.

Seems they cost $18k w/ 100,000-120,000 miles on them. oof.

how long will they go if you take care of them? Id hope to spend $12-14... seems like a 2002-2004 with 120k,
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 06, 2011, 08:12:00 AM
Quote from: Tickhill on September 05, 2011, 03:39:33 PM
That was a pretty smooth hijack!

LOL I brought him over from another forum actually, one in which there is only one cabin thread (mine) so it was an honest hijack :)
Title: Moved
Post by: OlJarhead on September 06, 2011, 08:12:35 AM
Quote from: glenn kangiser on September 05, 2011, 04:23:39 PM
No problem - moved it to it's own thread.

Thanks -- I'll have to point him to it :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 06, 2011, 08:15:00 AM
Quote from: duncanshannon on September 05, 2011, 09:05:11 PM
2006 F-150 SuperCrew is exactly the truck I want.  Lots of leg room in front and pretty dang good in back.

I like the re-design of the interior over the pre-2006 too.

Seems they cost $18k w/ 100,000-120,000 miles on them. oof.

how long will they go if you take care of them? Id hope to spend $12-14... seems like a 2002-2004 with 120k,

We got ours with ~$44k miles on it and paid $18K for it.  Might just have to look around for one in that range with lower miles.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on September 06, 2011, 11:22:25 AM
Quote from: duncanshannon on September 05, 2011, 09:05:11 PM
2006 F-150 SuperCrew is exactly the truck I want.  Lots of leg room in front and pretty dang good in back.

I like the re-design of the interior over the pre-2006 too.

Seems they cost $18k w/ 100,000-120,000 miles on them. oof.

how long will they go if you take care of them? Id hope to spend $12-14... seems like a 2002-2004 with 120k,
If you don't mind 150,000 miles or a 2000 model year, I have one you can have to 7 or 8K  ;)

Seriously, I spent around 10K 4 years ago on my 2000 when it had 74K miles on it.  I would think you'd be able to find one in the year/miles you want for under 10K

I have my sights set on an F250 with a diesel or a Dodge 2500 with diesel ... Of course, that will take a LOT of saving on my part, but that's ok - I think I can make the F150 last that long. ???
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 06, 2011, 05:22:56 PM
Quote from: JavaMan on September 06, 2011, 11:22:25 AM
If you don't mind 150,000 miles or a 2000 model year, I have one you can have to 7 or 8K  ;)

Seriously, I spent around 10K 4 years ago on my 2000 when it had 74K miles on it.  I would think you'd be able to find one in the year/miles you want for under 10K

I have my sights set on an F250 with a diesel or a Dodge 2500 with diesel ... Of course, that will take a LOT of saving on my part, but that's ok - I think I can make the F150 last that long. ???

If you are thinking F250 Diesel do lots of research first....I've seen a ration of bad reviews and reports on the Ford Diesel engines...I will get a Dodge if I go that route.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 09, 2011, 01:48:27 PM
Two weeks away is TOO long!  I'm heading back today!!!  [cool] :)

Hope to get some more interior work done, a little exterior staining and put the new pump in :)  Maybe shoot a grouse or two with the 870 and perhaps a deer (with the bow) if one wanders in close enough while I'm working :D

Seeya!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Pritch on September 11, 2011, 12:02:18 PM
The project is looking great, Jarhead!  Any elk near your place? 

I'm getting ready to move on to my third F-150 in a row.  (2010 SuperCrew) I tend to buy the same shoes over and over once I find something I like. 

Anybody want a loaded '02 Lariat Super Cab with 107k on it?   ;D

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 12, 2011, 08:49:40 AM
Quote from: Pritch on September 11, 2011, 12:02:18 PM
The project is looking great, Jarhead!  Any elk near your place? 

I'm getting ready to move on to my third F-150 in a row.  (2010 SuperCrew) I tend to buy the same shoes over and over once I find something I like. 

Anybody want a loaded '02 Lariat Super Cab with 107k on it?   ;D



Elk season is 'Any Elk' in my area but I haven't seen a lot of them yet.  I think Yonderosa has though.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 12, 2011, 09:10:05 AM
Showed up late Friday but felt good to be back at the cabin :)  Saw a Doe and her Fawn before going to bed (right in the yard) and worked on some arrows for the next days hunting but otherwise enjoyed the evening and cool air.

Saturday morning I slept in a little (was a long week) but finally got up at 7:30am, got coffee started and planned the day.  First we pulled up the old well pump and replaced with the new one -- and started pumping water right away.  Which was rather nice though it didn't last.

Then we set to milling lumber into Tongue and Groove paneling on the router table, table saw and plane.  We prepared about two dozen boards of paneling in various sizes (4", 5" and 6") because I wanted to use as much of the lumber we'd milled as possible and since it gets milled in different widths I decided to use different widths on the walls.

Then we took a break and hit the Cabin store a few miles away (it's actually in an old cabin) for icecream and super glue (for my new arrows).  It was hot out and the moon was full so the deer weren't moving but I didn't want to waste early bow season so brought the bow along.

On the way home we saw a covey (??) of about 8-10 grouse!  I've NEVER seen that many at once in the woods despite years of hunting them so this was exciting.  Of course, since my shotgun wasn't with me it was even more exciting -- I'd get my first show with the bow (50lbs recurve) at dinner.

This is when I realized it would have been much nicer to have had the Super Glue the night before because I had only one rubber blunt arrow on me and all my bird arrow heads were back at the cabin waiting on the glue!  Oh well, after them I went with one arrow and a hope and a prayer.

I got within 25 feet of the birds who were on a bank above the road and drew on two that were fairly close together -- I figured maybe I could get two birds with one arrow.  I let that blunt arrow fly in hopes of knocking them out but shot a tad low!!!  RIGHT between their legs!

Some feathers flew and then so too did the grouse but I was pretty happy despite the miss because I had feathers from the birds on the arrow shaft which tells me they got a shave and that my aim was fairly true -- it also tells me that if I had the claw arrow heads I would have gutted both of them right there with one shot.

That evening we finished off the wood, prepped 6 arrows with broad heads and claws and headed out in search for deer....

The deer weren't around so we settled for a Jack and Coke and a relaxing evening before bed.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Start.jpg)
We had to run the wiring from the inverter up the new conduit into the AC panel and seal the whole in the wall/base plate that was originally used with spray foam.  Then finish off the insulation on two walls (at least to above 36") and finally could get started putting up paneling.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/progress.jpg)
With everything prepped we got down to cutting and nailing up paneling.  My goal was to get the paneling at least high enough on the wall so that Dad and Mom could sleep on the bed (they are planning to come up in a couple weeks) and not have to sleep against the insulation like this old Jarhead has been doing.

We also discovered that the pump was not working :(  I think the electrical connector may be allowing water to seep past it and short out the power -- I hope that's all it is anyway and I have a new connector I can install next trip.  $700 for a pump is a lot of money to have it work once and then quit!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/fornow.jpg)
We finished up all we could do this trip, cleaned up and bailed out.  It was about 95 degrees and one of the hottest days ever at the cabin!  Yikes!  I can't wait for the cooler weather to return.

Cheers for now.
Erik


Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: BRUTAL on September 13, 2011, 01:36:27 PM
OLJ, Did you say you mad ethe tingue and grove panels with router table. I was thinking about doing that to save money but only using a dado blade in my table saw to step the boards. did you buy them at a big box? or? you said you planed them, where they that out?
I just ordered DIY spray foam kits to insulate a 1" air barrier and then batt over it. So just trying to think a step ahead:) ???
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 13, 2011, 07:06:58 PM
Quote from: BRUTAL on September 13, 2011, 01:36:27 PM
OLJ, Did you say you mad ethe tingue and grove panels with router table. I was thinking about doing that to save money but only using a dado blade in my table saw to step the boards. did you buy them at a big box? or? you said you planed them, where they that out?
I just ordered DIY spray foam kits to insulate a 1" air barrier and then batt over it. So just trying to think a step ahead:) ???

We milled the boards on our Woodmizer LT10 Sawmill from trees we cut down on the property and then after drying them we plane them and then use a router to cut the tongue and grooves in them :)

I bought the bit online from a source I found on the forestry forum I also go to and the router I bought on craig's list for $50 (is the Ryobi Plunge Router then normally sells for $100) then bought the Ryobi table from HD.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 13, 2011, 07:08:18 PM
Quote from: BRUTAL on September 13, 2011, 01:36:27 PM
OLJ, Did you say you mad ethe tingue and grove panels with router table. I was thinking about doing that to save money but only using a dado blade in my table saw to step the boards. did you buy them at a big box? or? you said you planed them, where they that out?
I just ordered DIY spray foam kits to insulate a 1" air barrier and then batt over it. So just trying to think a step ahead:) ???

If you scroll back about 8 or 10 pages you'll see the posts on the mill :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 13, 2011, 09:54:23 PM
Quote from: BRUTAL on September 13, 2011, 01:36:27 PM
OLJ, Did you say you mad ethe tingue and grove panels with router table. I was thinking about doing that to save money but only using a dado blade in my table saw to step the boards. did you buy them at a big box? or? you said you planed them, where they that out?
I just ordered DIY spray foam kits to insulate a 1" air barrier and then batt over it. So just trying to think a step ahead:) ???

I should add that I too was going to use the dado blade and do mine but switched to this method and am happy with it.

On cost reduction I believe I've saved ~$1500 on interior paneling and trim wood and will save that and more on other projects thanks to the mill.  The initial outlay was less then what I planned on spending on interior paneling and trim by enough that buying extra tools wasn't an issue either :)  But what's best is that I no longer have to buy lumber.  I may from time to time for special needs etc but for the most part I have trees and a mill.  nuff said ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on September 14, 2011, 11:22:43 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on September 13, 2011, 09:54:23 PM
I should add that I too was going to use the dado blade and do mine but switched to this method and am happy with it.

On cost reduction I believe I've saved ~$1500 on interior paneling and trim wood and will save that and more on other projects thanks to the mill.  The initial outlay was less then what I planned on spending on interior paneling and trim by enough that buying extra tools wasn't an issue either :)  But what's best is that I no longer have to buy lumber.  I may from time to time for special needs etc but for the most part I have trees and a mill.  nuff said ;)

Ah, someday ... someday.

There was a mill up at auction here last week or the week before, but we had something going on that I couldn't make it  :(  Who knows, I might have come home with a mill... probably a good thing, though.  They had a dozer, a tractor, the mill, and a couple other big items that are on my wish list
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 14, 2011, 12:07:39 PM
Quote from: JavaMan on September 14, 2011, 11:22:43 AM
Ah, someday ... someday.

There was a mill up at auction here last week or the week before, but we had something going on that I couldn't make it  :(  Who knows, I might have come home with a mill... probably a good thing, though.  They had a dozer, a tractor, the mill, and a couple other big items that are on my wish list

Tractor is DEFINITELY on my list!

I look at the mill as a money saving venture as well as an investment :)

One that has already paid off.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 18, 2011, 06:50:21 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/1922Tub.jpg)
Since I'm home this weekend I decided to get the tub ready for the cabin.  First we cleaned the whole underside and then used a metal prep and rust treatment on exposed parts.  Finally after a cleaning we used tack cloth and began painting.

The first coat was a pearl that we thought would be a white also but it turned out to be more of a clear coat.  Interestingly enough it claims to be a primer and paint in one (Rustoleum) but I can't see that with the clearish finish...anyway, after giving that the correct amount of time we sprayed with a glass white to set the base color.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/1922Tub2.jpg)
I wizened up and put on a mask for the next coat as being the typical dumb jarhead I failed to do so earlier...DOH!

With the white base coat down we waited the requisite time (inside of one hour) and then put on a coat of pearl again.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/1922TubPearled2.jpg)
The image doesn't really bring out the color so I'll have to get it in some light in a couple days so I can show off the colors :)

We decided not to sand it down completely (initial thought was to) because it is, after all, going in a cabin and we figured the older paint might have lead in it so decided to just scuff it and spray over it.  I've read that Rustoleum is fine for this kind of application....guess we'll find out!

The claw feet were wire brushed to bear metal, treated with a rust preventer and metal prep and then sprayed also.  I'll get a picture of them soon.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 18, 2011, 11:18:42 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/1922Tub_Ready.jpg)
Got the last coat on (for now anyway) and can't wait to see what it looks like in some real light!

My wife told me that she could see the pearl coat from the street when she pulled up  [cool]
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 18, 2011, 11:38:49 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0983.jpg)
The feet for the tub need a sanding and another coat or two of bronze

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/1922ClawFoot.jpg)
Figured it was time to see what we were creating :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: timkel on September 19, 2011, 05:16:48 AM
Looks great. What a difference.
Do you plan to reglaze the inside?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 19, 2011, 08:45:50 AM
Quote from: timkel on September 19, 2011, 05:16:48 AM
Looks great. What a difference.
Do you plan to reglaze the inside?

Nope.  The porcelain on the inside is in excellent condition so we're leaving it.  The exterior just wasn't painted (since new in 1922) on the side that will be showing and there was some light rust that we needed to address before installing.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: BRUTAL on September 19, 2011, 11:16:38 AM
THATS LOOKS REALLY GOOD. I THINK YOU MISSED AN OPPORTUNITY TO EMBELISH IT MORE. LIKE PAINTING THE BALLS UNDER THE CLAWS GOLD, AND STENCILLING "TITANIC" ON THE SIDE :)
AND ADDING A GOOD "FISHING STORY" TO ITS BEING FOUND, STILL NOT TOO LATE.......
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 19, 2011, 05:23:22 PM
Quote from: BRUTAL on September 19, 2011, 11:16:38 AM
THATS LOOKS REALLY GOOD. I THINK YOU MISSED AN OPPORTUNITY TO EMBELISH IT MORE. LIKE PAINTING THE BALLS UNDER THE CLAWS GOLD, AND STENCILLING "TITANIC" ON THE SIDE :)
AND ADDING A GOOD "FISHING STORY" TO ITS BEING FOUND, STILL NOT TOO LATE.......

Painting the balls would be pretty cool...I cold do it with gold paint for copper even...not sure what the wife would say mind you but I don't think I want to spend more time on it!

As for the story!  $300 is story enough :D  I've seen tubs in poorer condition for $1k!  This one, being complete and ready to use was a pretty good price I think :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 19, 2011, 07:33:55 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0998.jpg)
A few more shots of the Claw Foot tub we just finished painting.  Now we have to finish the bathroom in the cabin!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0987.jpg)
I can't wait to flip this heavy monster over!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/1922ClawFoot2.jpg)
I guess I also can't wait to install it.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0999.jpg)
After all, having a shower or a hot soak after a long day of cutting wood at the cabin will make the experience much more comfortable! :D  And of course, if my wife is happy, I'm happy :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: duncanshannon on September 21, 2011, 06:15:08 AM
looks really nice! 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 29, 2011, 08:59:36 AM
Thanks Duncan,

My last trip was strictly a 'hunting' trip with my 81 year old step father and 71 year old mom :)  We had a great time and my Dad shot a grouse not 40 yards from the cabin on a short walk.  It was actually quite satisfying that he was able to walk (almost shuffle really) down the old logging road, spot a grouse and shoot it and then walk back up to the cabin (about all he could take).  He was so tickled it was just, well, amazing :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/TheStrains.jpg)
Mom and Dad right after Dad shot his grouse.

We spent a 4 day weekend at the cabin and both of them really enjoyed the experience.  I doubt they will make it back to the cabin again but it was just one of those things I was glad they were able to do still.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/JohnATV.jpg)
Here my Dad is riding the ATV.  Something else he wanted to try and he really enjoyed. 

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Strains_Falls.jpg)
We also stopped by Dry Falls so they could play tourist.  Dry Falls was once the largest falls in the world -- about 10,000 years ago that is ;)

Anyway, next trip we will get something done but this one was about relaxing and just being together out in the woods and was a great success!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: dmanley on September 29, 2011, 12:49:12 PM
Those trips are special and I know you all enjoyed it.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 29, 2011, 07:31:10 PM
Quote from: dmanley on September 29, 2011, 12:49:12 PM
Those trips are special and I know you all enjoyed it.

Is this THE Don Manley my cousin?  If so then welcome to the forum cousin!  If not, well then ah, we might be related! hahaha
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: CjAl on September 29, 2011, 08:34:27 PM
That tub is nice. There is one on the local craigslist for $200. I want it but its so early in my build its hard to justify spending the money with so much other stuff needing money
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 30, 2011, 09:18:07 AM
Quote from: CjAl on September 29, 2011, 08:34:27 PM
That tub is nice. There is one on the local craigslist for $200. I want it but its so early in my build its hard to justify spending the money with so much other stuff needing money

I understand!  Though, if it's $200 and in good condition I might buy it and store it because good ones are hard to find...check for rust underneath and at the locations the feet mount...ours was good but many have problems.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: CjAl on September 30, 2011, 10:09:43 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on September 30, 2011, 09:18:07 AM
I understand!  Though, if it's $200 and in good condition I might buy it and store it because good ones are hard to find...check for rust underneath and at the locations the feet mount...ours was good but many have problems.
i know, that my delema. Im in seriousbsaving mode to buy an rv and pay for the septic but i keep coming across deals like this. Lol

ive actually been looking for an old metal cowboy tub with the wood rim but nice ones are spendy and rare
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: dmanley on September 30, 2011, 04:27:04 PM
Yes, this is THE DON MANLEY.  Thanks cuz.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 30, 2011, 06:52:21 PM
Quote from: dmanley on September 30, 2011, 04:27:04 PM
Yes, this is THE DON MANLEY.  Thanks cuz.

Cool :)  Did you start a cabin thread for your project?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: dmanley on September 30, 2011, 08:03:17 PM
I haven't yet, but will try to do that before too long.  I've got lots of pictures but just haven't taken the time to start a thread.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 01, 2011, 09:43:14 AM
Quote from: dmanley on September 30, 2011, 08:03:17 PM
I haven't yet, but will try to do that before too long.  I've got lots of pictures but just haven't taken the time to start a thread.

I look forward to it :)  I use (like a lot of folks) photobucket for my pictures.  Makes it easy to post in here.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Sassy on October 01, 2011, 10:48:16 AM
Nice bathtub!  It's always nice to have a good visit w/family.  Both my parents are gone, so enjoy it while you can  :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 10, 2011, 10:34:11 AM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_1068.jpg)
This weekend was a mix of shooting (Step son sighting in his Mini14 while son looks on) and making/eating a Thanksgiving dinner for my son who's living and going to school in Canada.  In this pic the chickens are cooking in the dutch oven :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_1078.jpg)
We also cooked summer squash with peppers this way and some grouse :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_1079.jpg)
Dinner included my traditional corn bread dressing (Dad says it comes from the south and the recipe came across the Oregon Trail), dinner rolls with butter and Crab Apple Butter (home made), cranberry jelly, mashed potatoes (from the garden), of course the dutch oven chicken and some roasted grouse, as well as turkey gravy to smother everything in :)  Yes we enjoyed the cabin this weekend!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Kurt45.jpg)
My son decided to do a little practice with the Vaquero (.45 colt) and is seen here shooting some pretty hot 300 grain sp's...ya it packs a whollop!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Kurt_M14.jpg)
He also decided to do a little shooting with the M1A (M14) Scout Squad I bought a few years back...yes it's an awesome rifle to shoot!

It's always awesome to have a decent place to shoot RIGHT at the cabin site thanks to a big hill we can shoot into :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/MakingSawdust.jpg)
We also got some work done :)  We planed about 60 pine boards for the walls and brought them home to make T&G for the walls.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/pine2-1.jpg)
It was raining hard when we got home (in the desert) so we brought the pine in to keep it from getting damaged.

Was a great weekend!!!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Yonderosa on October 12, 2011, 08:04:26 AM
Looks like more good times were had.  October sure is a purdy month over there.  Are you going to be chasing any Deer there next week?  Saw lots of Whitetails over on my side of the hill last weekend.  There are two active rub lines on my property.  I'm guessing the rut is getting close.

Oh, that Vaquero needs a leather holster!  ;)  Putting a Single Action in nylon is sorta like beer for breakfast - not that there's anything wrong with it, it just don't seem right and everyone knows it's Whiskey that goes with your AM coffee...  :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 12, 2011, 08:40:18 AM
Quote from: Yonderosa on October 12, 2011, 08:04:26 AM
Looks like more good times were had.  October sure is a purdy month over there.  Are you going to be chasing any Deer there next week?  Saw lots of Whitetails over on my side of the hill last weekend.  There are two active rub lines on my property.  I'm guessing the rut is getting close.

Oh, that Vaquero needs a leather holster!  ;)  Putting a Single Action in nylon is sorta like beer for breakfast - not that there's anything wrong with it, it just don't seem right and everyone knows it's Whiskey that goes with your AM coffee...  :D

We're trying archery this year so the first half is over and we're waiting for the late season :P and the Vaquero does have a leather holster :D  I have a nicely worn in Busquedero holster for it but the son's waist is a wee bit small for his old man's belt ;)  I personally prefer the lower slung busquedero's and as mines about 12 years old it's well worn in :D

Can't wait to get back there!  But one of these days we need to hook up...besides, you had some trees to mill I thought ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 12, 2011, 08:47:14 AM
Funny thing about that Ruger is that I can still shoot it accurately but cannot shoot my Kimber all that accurately anymore!  For some reason the blurry sites on the Kimber (the old eyes aren't focusing so well anymore) just seem to avoid getting lined up just right but the old peacemaker frame of the Vaquero seems perfect for these old eyes...back to the old Iron me thinks :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Yonderosa on October 12, 2011, 08:55:04 AM
One of these days hopefully, but the logistics never seem to work out.  With the economy like it is I'm soaking up as much work as I can handle while I can get it.  Don't know what I'll be doing in 2012, maybe asking if you want to supersize that at the Omak Micky-Deez.

I do enjoy reading your posts though and it keeps me inspired.  Haven't done much to my place at all this year.  Wife's giving me a pass so long as I'm still getting a paycheck.

I have a New Vaquero in the same caliber.  LOVE IT!  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4w3I6EisXHU (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4w3I6EisXHU)  It really shoots those Keith Style 270 grain (RCBS mold) bullets well.  I push em to a bit over 900 fps with Unique. 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 12, 2011, 10:54:56 AM
Quote from: Yonderosa on October 12, 2011, 08:55:04 AM
One of these days hopefully, but the logistics never seem to work out.  With the economy like it is I'm soaking up as much work as I can handle while I can get it.  Don't know what I'll be doing in 2012, maybe asking if you want to supersize that at the Omak Micky-Deez.

I do enjoy reading your posts though and it keeps me inspired.  Haven't done much to my place at all this year.  Wife's giving me a pass so long as I'm still getting a paycheck.

I have a New Vaquero in the same caliber.  LOVE IT!  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4w3I6EisXHU (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4w3I6EisXHU)  It really shoots those Keith Style 270 grain (RCBS mold) bullets well.  I push em to a bit over 900 fps with Unique. 

I thought the lighter new model was too light for anything hotter then the cowboy action loads? 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 12, 2011, 10:59:56 AM
Quote from: Yonderosa on October 12, 2011, 08:55:04 AM
One of these days hopefully, but the logistics never seem to work out.  With the economy like it is I'm soaking up as much work as I can handle while I can get it.  Don't know what I'll be doing in 2012, maybe asking if you want to supersize that at the Omak Micky-Deez.

I do enjoy reading your posts though and it keeps me inspired.  Haven't done much to my place at all this year.  Wife's giving me a pass so long as I'm still getting a paycheck.

I have a New Vaquero in the same caliber.  LOVE IT!  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4w3I6EisXHU (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4w3I6EisXHU)  It really shoots those Keith Style 270 grain (RCBS mold) bullets well.  I push em to a bit over 900 fps with Unique. 

Nice shootin' Tex ;)  We NEED to hook up :)  I'll bring my Model 92 (Puma .454 Casull that I shoot .45COLT out of all day long) and my Ruger Vaquero :)  and lots of cowboy loads!  Shooting Trail Boss and 250grain RN lead bullets for plinking....gotta love the old wheel gun!

One thing I like about mine is that I can shoot Corbon's .45 COLT Magnum rounds (now relabeled as .45 COLT +P+)...those pack a whollop but in bear country it goesn't hurt to have some extra punch ;)....though I have toned them down a bit by loading my own a little slower (1100 vs 1300fps)...and I'm looking at some hard cast 360grainers to try out....might be fun :P
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 12, 2011, 11:09:14 AM
Quote from: Yonderosa on October 12, 2011, 08:55:04 AM
One of these days hopefully, but the logistics never seem to work out.  With the economy like it is I'm soaking up as much work as I can handle while I can get it.  Don't know what I'll be doing in 2012, maybe asking if you want to supersize that at the Omak Micky-Deez.

I do enjoy reading your posts though and it keeps me inspired.  Haven't done much to my place at all this year.  Wife's giving me a pass so long as I'm still getting a paycheck.

I have a New Vaquero in the same caliber.  LOVE IT!  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4w3I6EisXHU (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4w3I6EisXHU)  It really shoots those Keith Style 270 grain (RCBS mold) bullets well.  I push em to a bit over 900 fps with Unique. 

I'm curious about the 30-30 they were shooting?  Loaded with unique and hard cast lead?  Interesting.  Never seen anyone use one at 400 yards but I'd love to try out my Canadian Centennial long barrel on that shot :)  though I'd have to hold way over I think.

I once took it out to the range to play a little and some guys were shooting a gong at 240 yards from the bench...curious I asked if I could take a shot at it, the smiled as if to say "ya right" and acknowledged.  I then stood up, jacked a round in and held over the gong and let fly......SMACK!  Then they kinda looked like I needed to leave as they were using .243's with big scopes and didn't seem to appreciate me with my .45 colt slung on my hip and my octagonal barreled 30-30 hitting their gong offhand....*snicker*
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Yonderosa on October 12, 2011, 11:40:59 AM
screwed up the links in my previous effort.  Brian Pearce wrote a couple of excellent article on the 45 Colt and its various loadings.  
http://www.riflemagazine.com/magazine/PDF/HL%20246partial.pdf (http://www.riflemagazine.com/magazine/PDF/HL%20246partial.pdf)

Excerpt:
Loads in the 20,000 psi range
will prove useful for U.S. Fire
Arms revolvers that are 100 percent
American made (after the
year 2000), Colt New Service,
Ruger New Vaquero and Smith &
Wesson post-World War II NFrames,
including Models 25 and
625 Mountain Guns. Loads in
the 32,000 CUP range should be
limited to Ruger Blackhawk, Vaquero,
Colt Anaconda or other
modern revolvers designed to
stand up to this pressure level.
The Freedom Arms Model 83,
Ruger Redhawk and Super Redhawk
are capable of handling
much greater pressure than will
be presented here but are safe
with all loads listed.


Unique is great for cast loads.  I use several pounds of it every year in the 30-30, 45-70, 38-55, 32-20, 45 Colt and 32 H&R Mag.  I bet there is even a good 308 load.  We used Unique for loads out to 1,000 yards.   This neighborhood might look familiar to you.
http://www.youtube.com/user/WhitSpurzon#p/a/u/2/HO6ihrcukcc (http://www.youtube.com/user/WhitSpurzon#p/a/u/2/HO6ihrcukcc)

sorry for steering the topic off course.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 12, 2011, 01:58:30 PM
It's ok, I love shooting my Ruger and tend to load it up fairly hot for carry in the woods....these days I'm looking for some 325 +/- hard cast bullets to load up for it and for my model 92.

My only issue currently is that my sons 92 doesn't allow loading of long (340 grain) buffalo bore bullets (44 mag) and my .454 might not either so I have to check that out....we'd both like to use these guns in the brush for elk but want some heavy punch out of them first!

Though, I must admit, 300 grains coming out of the Puma model 92 is probably enough for pretty much ANYTHING when it's coming out 1700+ fps!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 13, 2011, 11:01:38 AM
My new router bits arrived yesterday :) and I'll be ordering a 'portable' shed today I think (basically a strong tent) so I have a place at home to work out of the weather along with a shop vac to keep things cleaner while working.

I hope to get all 60 of the pine boards we brought home milled into T&G before next weekend (not the one coming this week) so we can just haul them up, cut them to size and nail to the wall.

One thing I've started doing is leaving them different sizes.  So, if the mill kicks out 6" (+/-) planks then I'll make them all 6" and mill them into T&G....if 7" then I'll keep them 7's....this means I have an odd assortment of T&G lumber but I've learned to install on a wall a layer at a time so I might have one row/layer that is 4", another then is 6" and on top of that a 5" row :)

I kinda like the mix actually.

I found that anything over 6-7" is a bit much so I rip them down to 4" when possible (or 5 or 6) to keep the paneling all in those ranges.  I hope/think this will help with both look and potential to cup, warp, twist etc....

Anyway, if we get these 60 boards turned into paneling then I'll finish the lower section of the cabin next trip :)  At least finish in the sense that all walls will be covered finally!

Then I will bring back another load to mill into T&G and will bring back all the Blue Stained stuff I have to mill it into window trim :)  And perhaps baseboards too.

Once I trim out the windows etc, I'll try to finish (with clear poly) the walls and get back to the bathroom.

One other thing I've considered is to finish each board with clear coat poly before packing them up and delivering to the cabin :)  I'm hoping this will help speed things along.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 14, 2011, 07:16:08 PM
http://www.woodwerks.com/tongue-groove-assembly-c-236_237_399_419.html

My new router bit!  It's simply AWESOME!  I was using a different style before and it always took a while to make a cut on an 8' piece of lumber but this new bit rips through the pine like it's butter! :)

Also the new Rigid 16 gallon 6.5hp shopvac is making light work of the sawdust coming off the router :)  Simply awesome.

I can't wait for tomorrow!  The rain started today but it's supposed to stop for the rest of the weekend and we should be able to get enough pine cut into T&G to finish the lower section of the cabin the next trip...in one day!  Yahoo!

I can see the light at the end of the tunnel now :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Rob_O on October 14, 2011, 07:28:32 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on October 14, 2011, 07:16:08 PM
I can see the light at the end of the tunnel now :D

Be sure it's not an oncoming train before you start celebrating...
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 15, 2011, 11:46:00 PM
Quote from: Rob_O on October 14, 2011, 07:28:32 PM
Be sure it's not an oncoming train before you start celebrating...

LOL not here buddy!  That trains been coming for two years now....I'm kinda used to it's bright light!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 16, 2011, 02:22:55 PM
Josh and I are about half way through the last 45 pieces of T&G -- or so -- 'bout an hours worth of routing and then we ought to be finished :)  I've also tried some wipe on poly coat and it seems to be excellent on the pine!  I'm totally stoked because it means I may be able to start finishing the interior now too!

When we head up next weekend we should be carrying right around 90 pieces of paneling with us :)  That is enough to finish the lower section to the lofts and to get some of the porch completed too!

I just can't express how excited I am to be at this stage of the build and to be able to take 'homework' home with me after each trip! :D

My plan is to get all of the interior paneling done in the next month, then to start on the floor!!!  Maybe I'll be ready for running water and decks etc by the spring :D :D :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: RIjake on October 16, 2011, 03:10:43 PM
OJH what model Kimber do you have? 

My EDC is a Stainless Pro-Carry with night sights.  It's wearing the stock black rubbery grips right now but I switch 'em out when I feel like a change.  Love that gun!

(https://i268.photobucket.com/albums/jj20/RIJake/DSCF3632.jpg)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 16, 2011, 05:11:42 PM
Quote from: RIjake on October 16, 2011, 03:10:43 PM
OJH what model Kimber do you have? 

My EDC is a Stainless Pro-Carry with night sights.  It's wearing the stock black rubbery grips right now but I switch 'em out when I feel like a change.  Love that gun!

(https://i268.photobucket.com/albums/jj20/RIJake/DSCF3632.jpg)

Mine is the Custom TLE II and I use it as an EDC gun also (even though it's bigger then the Pro-Carry guns).  Though I can't say I'm always carrying and I can't say I not!  Gotta love CCW :)

I love the TLE II but my eyes are starting to fade and I'm finding I'm shooting the old Ruger Vaquero better these days!  Go figure.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 16, 2011, 05:13:21 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_1084.jpg)
Yes I think we're ready to get busy at the cabin!  Can it be Friday NOW!  d*

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_1083.jpg)
It felt so good to get all of these planed and ready to nail up.  And to do it all with plenty of time to do other things :)

Also, the Minwax wipe on poly coat is looking very light and easy to use...I'm thinking it might just be the ticket for us :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on October 16, 2011, 06:26:01 PM
Pine Boards I love them!!  [cool]

Nothing triggers my want to get in a get a house or cabin done more than the feel and smell of them. 

Your planer does a good job on them.  I notice very little to zero sniping.  Did you use a router and routing table for the T/G?  I think I seen where you had a new router coming or arrived!

   
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 16, 2011, 08:16:49 PM
Quote from: rick91351 on October 16, 2011, 06:26:01 PM
Pine Boards I love them!!  [cool]

Nothing triggers my want to get in a get a house or cabin done more than the feel and smell of them. 

Your planer does a good job on them.  I notice very little to zero sniping.  Did you use a router and routing table for the T/G?  I think I seen where you had a new router coming or arrived!

   

Ryobi planer -- seems to work very well :)

Ryobi plunge router and Ryobi router table with Amana bits :)  Works like a charm and we did all 90+ boards this weekend in about 6 hours of work or less :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 19, 2011, 10:20:45 AM
I should have asked "what is 'zero sniping'"?

I was thinking about that and forgot to ask when typing my response.

One thing I have to learn is how to adjust the blades as I'm assuming that at some point it will need that.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on October 19, 2011, 11:27:24 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on October 19, 2011, 10:20:45 AM
I should have asked "what is 'zero sniping'"?

I was thinking about that and forgot to ask when typing my response.

One thing I have to learn is how to adjust the blades as I'm assuming that at some point it will need that.

That is at the beginning or mostly at the end of the board as it enters or exits leaving marks or lower planner cut.  An infeed and outfeed table helps some.

Not real sure but I doubt that adjustment will help. Some have a setting block for the correct heigth when installing the blades but do little on worn blades.  Try to PU a xtra set of blades and just trade off as they become dull.  While you are using the newer set have someone to sharpen the old set.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 19, 2011, 12:44:46 PM
Quote from: Redoverfarm on October 19, 2011, 11:27:24 AM
That is at the beginning or mostly at the end of the board as it enters or exits leaving marks or lower planner cut.  An infeed and outfeed table helps some.

Not real sure but I doubt that adjustment will help. Some have a setting block for the correct heigth when installing the blades but do little on worn blades.  Try to PU a xtra set of blades and just trade off as they become dull.  While you are using the newer set have someone to sharpen the old set.

Oh gotcha!  That happens whenever the 'outfeeder' (i.e. my son) doesn't guide the board out straight, level and smoothly but we don't much care to be honest since we will cut off the ends anyway.

I try to mill all the wood long by at least 3" and more often then not 6".  That way I can trim off the ends (which aren't square anyway) and have a nice clean 8' piece of lumber :)

Good idea on the blades, just like the sawmill then :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 19, 2011, 12:46:12 PM
Anyone know if you can have miter saw / table saw blades sharpened?  This is something I've just never considered frankly but the other day I was wondering if it wasn't a terrible waste to toss them.  I keep them hung in the shed just in case but I can't recall (even from years ago in the business) that anyone ever sharpened them.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 19, 2011, 12:48:43 PM
Just did a search and it does seem like people do this.....anyone use a service? ???
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 19, 2011, 01:02:28 PM
On a side note anticipation is building for the next trip :)

I have roughly 90 boards in widths from 7" to 4" and mostly in 8' lengths (though some are 4' and an equal amount are 6' -- we cut some 10' boards down) with an average overall of 4.5" face width (T&G) this gives me about 200 square feet of T&G and about 85-90 of it is needed to complete the lower section of the cabin (if my math is correct).

The porch is 6'x8' with 3 walls that need interior paneling and insulation.  Each wall has a 3x3 window in it and one has a 3x7 door in it as well as a battery box taking up about 8 square feet of wall, so....about 100 +/- square feet of walls to cover....that means I SHOULD have enough T&G to either finish the porch also, or come very close :)  Though not the ceiling of it.

I'll have to stuff insulation but we have some on hand so no worries there :)  I'm thinking it's possible that we might just get it done!  I also have the tile for the floor so that may also get completed :)  I hope so!

Imagine that, an insulated and mostly finished porch and lower section of the cabin all in one trip :)

Then we'll be bringing back a ton of dried pine for planing and milling into T&G as well as a bunch of Blue Stained pine for planing and making into interior trim. 

With luck, we will have enough pine to finish off the lofts and ceilings within a month or so :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on October 19, 2011, 01:11:07 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on October 19, 2011, 12:46:12 PM
Anyone know if you can have miter saw / table saw blades sharpened?  This is something I've just never considered frankly but the other day I was wondering if it wasn't a terrible waste to toss them.  I keep them hung in the shed just in case but I can't recall (even from years ago in the business) that anyone ever sharpened them.


Unless they are real expensive blades it will cost you nearly as much to have them sharpened as it will to buy new ones.  Carbide blades unlike the older steel blades are almost impossible to sharpen unless you have the right stones.  There are nearly always someone near a timber industry that sharpens tools.  Just look around or call a woodwork shop/mill and inquire where they get theirs done.  It might be cost effective to resharpen if you found the right person at a reasonable price.  As for router or shaper blades , sharpening will change the profile some so it is hard to match up previously shaped pieces with those recently done after sharpening.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 19, 2011, 01:33:23 PM
Quote from: Redoverfarm on October 19, 2011, 01:11:07 PM


Unless they are real expensive blades it will cost you nearly as much to have them sharpened as it will to buy new ones.  Carbide blades unlike the older steel blades are almost impossible to sharpen unless you have the right stones.  There are nearly always someone near a timber industry that sharpens tools.  Just look around or call a woodwork shop/mill and inquire where they get theirs done.  It might be cost effective to resharpen if you found the right person at a reasonable price.  As for router or shaper blades , sharpening will change the profile some so it is hard to match up previously shaped pieces with those recently done after sharpening.

Good to know!  Thanks...I was wondering about router bits because I have a couple sets of T&G bits now.  They both seem ok but I've done a lot of wood with them....any idea how long they typically last?  Heck, I've cut no less then 160 boards into T&G....that's roughly 480 feet of cutting so far.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on October 19, 2011, 01:39:39 PM
I've had 80 tooth carbide blades sharpened locally for about $25; less than buying a new quality blade.They can also replace tips that have broken and sharpen router bits.

I also did a quick Google and found an online service
http://www.burnstools.com/blade_sharpening.html
You scan your blade and send them the file and then...    Nah... pulling your leg on that, although they do blades sent to them.   :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 19, 2011, 01:53:05 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on October 19, 2011, 01:39:39 PM
I've had 80 tooth carbide blades sharpened locally for about $25; less than buying a new quality blade.They can also replace tips that have broken and sharpen router bits.

I also did a quick Google and found an online service
http://www.burnstools.com/blade_sharpening.html
You scan your blade and send them the file and then...    Nah... pulling your leg on that, although they do blades sent to them.   :D

$25 doesn't seem too bad.  I pay about $35 for Diablo blades at HD which seem to work very well and last a long time...saving $10 a blade might be worth the trouble.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on October 19, 2011, 02:02:46 PM
Right, and a good blade or a good sharpening will last a long time if stupid things don't happen. Cutting nails and the like. I've done that inadvertently with a $100 blade;  d* it actually survived quite well.  :)

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on October 19, 2011, 02:22:41 PM
About bench planers -- Sniping can be reduced by the use of a in feed and out feed tables.  The table needs to rise just a little on the out feed side this must be experimented with what a little is per machine.  The in feed as well but not as important as out feed.  Bench planers are known for this problem.  In our cases where we plan a lot of pine, and pine is not really expensive and you are not trying to get ever centimeter out of a a $100 piece of Rosewood it is true sniping is not a huge deal.

My current planer has power problems and needs some TLC.  So what do I do new motor or replace?

The Dewalt I want has two tables, but not included.  But heavily suggested that it would be good if purchased with the product.  Only another hundred dollars plus shipping.  Oh ya don't forget a second set of knives.   [waiting]  Anything else I need?  Like a bottomless wallet!

Check out blade return service.  The initial blade is sort of high but not bad.  You use it up drop it off at the lumber yard and pick out a replacement for a fraction of the cost.  The owners the replacement service are betting you will not.  The owner of our local lumber yard says it is a pretty good business for them.  The people that use it are good customers that buy lots of lumber even in this down time.     
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Ndrmyr on October 19, 2011, 06:28:15 PM
I've been running a 12" 100 toother on my Delta Miter Saw and have had it sharpened twice.  A local sharpening service sharpens in a CNC mill and frankly I think it is sharper than when it was new.  Just had it done last week and it was $16 for the 100 toother.  I'm using the gold Ridgid blade sold at Home Depot and it is made by Freud for Ridgid and costs less than the red Freuds.  Leaves end grain on a crosscut feeling like it was sanded. Buy better blades and sharpen them.  I'm not the biggest fan of narrow kerf blades since they deflect easily. Was cutting 3" foam board on the table saw and the foam would deflect the blade enough to get a crooked cut. Had to put a standard kerf blade on to solve the problem.  Nice looking boards, you'll love the look.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on October 19, 2011, 06:53:25 PM
Quote from: Ndrmyr on October 19, 2011, 06:28:15 PM
Leaves end grain on a crosscut feeling like it was sanded.


I liken the end grain cut to a glass like smoothness. Really amazing what a truly fine blade will do.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 24, 2011, 08:22:51 AM
What a difference a weekend can make :)

After bringing home a small load of lumber and making it into T&G and bringing it to the cabin....well a picture is worth a thousand words right?

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Sleep.jpg)
All the lower section of the cabin is now paneled or drywalled :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Door.jpg)
There is just something about seeing all that pine on the walls and knowing the insulation is no longer your main wall covering ;)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/AboveDoor.jpg)
One thing that was pure luck was that we matched up perfectly to the previous paneling we'd done despite the different sized boards!  I thought I was going to have to do some 'custom' work there but didn't have to :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_1125.jpg)
Even had enough left over stock to start on the porch!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_1129.jpg)
Ran out of time before stock so when we return we'll have enough stock to finish the porch and then all the new stuff we make and bring with us :)  I expect to have the loft done in the next month or two now too!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on October 24, 2011, 10:28:09 AM
Sweet progress!  I'm green with envy, since I haven't made it up this year at all...

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on October 24, 2011, 11:02:03 AM
Looks great!  Is that a 6" then 4" pattern?  I think that would also look good in a wainscot running them vertical.  Doing it over would you stick to the T&G or go with ship-lap?  I see advantages of both.  Your routed T&G patterned seems to have matched up very well.  It sure does not hurt that you did not run up a huge lumber bill either!  Prorating the router and planer into the project all tools you will have for years to come.  Your out lay will diminish with each project and phase you complete.       
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 24, 2011, 12:12:46 PM
Quote from: JavaMan on October 24, 2011, 10:28:09 AM
Sweet progress!  I'm green with envy, since I haven't made it up this year at all...



Sorry you haven't made it up there yet!  I hope you get a chance soon bud!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: BRUTAL on October 24, 2011, 12:27:36 PM
Man that looks really great, and even better since you produced it. I had alot of pines on my other piece of property I sold I could have used because they were everywhere. Now I just have alot of Oaks and Cedar Elms. Some of the Elms need to come down. Anyone know if this is a good Cedar to use for panelling? If so I may end up getting a sawmill and planer too. I like the idea of owner produced lumber. Gives something else to talk about in addition to "es I built this cabin by myself and no it wasnt a kit"  ;D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rniles on October 24, 2011, 01:31:01 PM
That looks gorgeous! Great job! [cool]
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 24, 2011, 02:29:51 PM
Quote from: rick91351 on October 24, 2011, 11:02:03 AM
Looks great!  Is that a 6" then 4" pattern?  I think that would also look good in a wainscot running them vertical.  Doing it over would you stick to the T&G or go with ship-lap?  I see advantages of both.  Your routed T&G patterned seems to have matched up very well.  It sure does not hurt that you did not run up a huge lumber bill either!  Prorating the router and planer into the project all tools you will have for years to come.  Your out lay will diminish with each project and phase you complete.       

Yes we actually did a 6"/5"/4" pattern....why?  Because it was easiest to make the boards that size and have some uniformity.  In truth we learned that after the first three walls where we had some 4" and 4 1/2" boards and tried to make them work.  It worked ok but it occurred to me fairly quickly that we had to standardize on something and settled on even sizes 4 to 6 inches.  I wanted to go as big as 6 or 7 inches to utilize boards milled to those sizes without having to go to 3" T&G which would take to long to install etc...but I didn't want to go larger for fear of 'cupping' in the wood when drying as inexperience made me think this would be more of an issue -- today however I have some very nice 12"x5/8" wood that is flat and dry and could easily be used to make paneling....truth is I'm tempted to use one row of it JUST BECAUSE!  After all, how cool would it be to have a row of 12" T&G stuck in there? :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 24, 2011, 02:31:53 PM
Quote from: BRUTAL on October 24, 2011, 12:27:36 PM
Man that looks really great, and even better since you produced it. I had alot of pines on my other piece of property I sold I could have used because they were everywhere. Now I just have alot of Oaks and Cedar Elms. Some of the Elms need to come down. Anyone know if this is a good Cedar to use for panelling? If so I may end up getting a sawmill and planer too. I like the idea of owner produced lumber. Gives something else to talk about in addition to "es I built this cabin by myself and no it wasnt a kit"  ;D

I love Cedar but am not familiar with Cedar Elms??  The oak would make nice trim though!  And flooring!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 24, 2011, 02:35:23 PM
Quote from: BRUTAL on October 24, 2011, 12:27:36 PM
Man that looks really great, and even better since you produced it. I had alot of pines on my other piece of property I sold I could have used because they were everywhere. Now I just have alot of Oaks and Cedar Elms. Some of the Elms need to come down. Anyone know if this is a good Cedar to use for panelling? If so I may end up getting a sawmill and planer too. I like the idea of owner produced lumber. Gives something else to talk about in addition to "es I built this cabin by myself and no it wasnt a kit"  ;D

http://www.wood-database.com/lumber-identification/hardwoods/cedar-elm/
Hmmm... it is useable actually and if it is stained it might be very nice.  However it sounds tough to work with but I've learned not to beleive or trust everything I've heard or read...for me?  I'd mill it and dry it and see what I could do with it :)

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 24, 2011, 02:36:56 PM
Quote from: rniles on October 24, 2011, 01:31:01 PM
That looks gorgeous! Great job! [cool]

Thanks :)  Can't wait to get back!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 25, 2011, 10:35:30 AM
I've just posted a new a new thread in the plans help section for those interested in answering there but here it is also:

Quote(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Wall1.jpg)
In this rough drawing I've shown approximately what I have to fix in my loft.  I have 2x6 walls and 2x6 rafters with a birds-mouth cut out in the rafters.  The issue is that the rafter's birds-mouth doesn't make the raft sit all the way across the top of the wall leaving a slight 'shelf' or 'ledge' there.  I've been contemplating how to correct this for mostly cosmetic reasons and have been thinking about installing a 2x cripple from the top of the wall to the bottom of the rafter like this:

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/wall2.jpg)
I could either screw or nail these on which would then give me nailers for the T&G pine paneling that I plan to install.  It would also mean that I could have the insulation pulled slight away from the bird blocking / venting at the eves giving it a larger area to enter the vent gap in the roof (if that matters at all)....

Thoughts?
Thanks!

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 25, 2011, 02:46:08 PM
Quote from: rick91351 on October 24, 2011, 11:02:03 AM
Looks great!  Is that a 6" then 4" pattern?  I think that would also look good in a wainscot running them vertical.  Doing it over would you stick to the T&G or go with ship-lap?  I see advantages of both.  Your routed T&G patterned seems to have matched up very well.  It sure does not hurt that you did not run up a huge lumber bill either!  Prorating the router and planer into the project all tools you will have for years to come.  Your out lay will diminish with each project and phase you complete.       

I think I forgot to answer:  shiplap would probably be easier to install but harder to make.  However, I prefer both the fit and look of the T&G stuff.  I'll stick with it :)  Specially not that I have an amana bit that seems to really eat up the work :)  [cool]
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on October 25, 2011, 06:04:06 PM
Like I say it looks very good, and I think the T&G is a real plus here because it holds things a lot better.

Many many years ago when I worked around planer mills there was a huge call for veed edge center match.  It was T&G but each edge had a part of the vee.  Slide them together and you had the vee.  We did many millions of feet of that mostly in white fir and mostly in 2X6.  2X8 and 10's we ran veed edge center vee.  The vee was only on one side of the board so if a home or cabin builder needed to have a flat surface for like a loft floor you installed it with the vee down.  I thought it was a very practical product.  Other than white fir on a floor is way way to soft.  

 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 26, 2011, 02:54:35 PM
Quote from: rick91351 on October 25, 2011, 06:04:06 PM
Like I say it looks very good, and I think the T&G is a real plus here because it holds things a lot better.

Many many years ago when I worked around planer mills there was a huge call for veed edge center match.  It was T&G but each edge had a part of the vee.  Slide them together and you had the vee.  We did many millions of feet of that mostly in white fir and mostly in 2X6.  2X8 and 10's we ran veed edge center vee.  The vee was only on one side of the board so if a home or cabin builder needed to have a flat surface for like a loft floor you installed it with the vee down.  I thought it was a very practical product.  Other than white fir on a floor is way way to soft. 

 

I was going to try to make that but the bits were all for 5/8" or thicker wood so went with straight T&G instead.  I actually like the V-Groove look though.

I imagine Ponderosa will be too soft for a floor too but I hope (d) that a thick coat of poly will solve that....if not I may have to use Fir instead...or Tamarack.....
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 26, 2011, 02:58:19 PM
(http://images.cabelas.com/is/image/cabelas/s7_210361_999_01?rgn=0,0,368,305&scl=1&fmt=jpeg&id=3g1D4D9DTpauQbpEflrJ7h)
Ya I think these are going above the door at the cabin :)  My Puma Model 92 .454Casull should fit nicely there :)


Found them at Cabela's for $21!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 01, 2011, 11:47:02 AM
Dropped in to say hi today as I was missing my cabin and work on it and noticed that you could sort the posts in here by replies....I must reply more in my cabin thread then anyway!  We're 3rd highest on the list :D

Anyway, popped in because I'm so darn excited!!!!!  We've (actually my boys) planed 47 (ish) boards for milling into T&G which puts us on par with the last trip :D  These 47 are mostly in the 8-10" range so in reality will make about 90 finished T&G boards...it takes about 70 to cover 19'x5' (based on the last section we did) so that means we've probably got enough now to finish half of the ceiling, but we're not done yet!

Hopefully before this weekend we will have close to twice that ready to cut into T&G and then this weekend we'll get them all done.  With luck we will be able to finish the interior paneling and bring back the Blue Stained pine I plan to use for window trim etc...and we're also working on the ships ladder :D :D :D

So ya, I'm basically stoked and can't wait to get back to the cabin and get to work!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: TheWire on November 01, 2011, 04:04:08 PM
Most people who get cabin fever are looking to get out more.  I think cabin fever for most of us here means getting to the cabin more. ;D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on November 01, 2011, 04:50:24 PM
Here it is getting stranded indoors when you are getting 30-36" of snow at one time to add to what you already have.  Can't go anywhere.  But we usually find a away.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 05, 2011, 06:06:45 PM
Well we've planed all the 1/2" stock we brought home and ripped it all into even sizes (4,5,6&7" widths) and ended up with 99 total boards :)

Next we ran them all through the router table to get the grooves cut in them which was easier since we installed a stop nut on the router -- it had the threaded rod but no nut (was a craig's list buy).  With the nut in place we're able to lock the router tightly in place and not worry so much about knocking it loose or having it fall a little (it's moved before on us).

Also, with the new RIGID Shop-Vac we've found the router table set up works much better and we're able to really run the boards through!  We were really 'groovin' today  d*

Anyway, tomorrow we plan to get the 99 boards finished off so we can head to the cabin with them next weekend :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Don_P on November 05, 2011, 09:56:55 PM
I was reading a page back, you were asking about sharpening the router bits. If you have a diamond stone rub the flat face on it stone to sharpen them... not the outer "cutting circle" but the face that builds up pitch and runs from the center to the rim. They are sharpened by removing thickness from the carbide, the pattern is then not changed.  Generally a few minutes of touch up will extend the bit for quite awhile between trip to the sawshop. Carbide is "dull" when you look down the cutting edge in strong light and see a white line on the edge... well that's true for any edge tool, a sharp edge splits the light, a dull edge has a land that reflects the light back at you. You can extend the planer knives by sharpening the edge with the diamond. Running dull knives in a planer can be real tough on the motor.

As far as sawing odd species that the texts dismiss, just be prepared for high waste. What makes it can be neat conversation pieces and the rest I call dimensional firewood. I've got some dogwood, beech, ailanthus, hophornbeam, slippery elm, sassafrass, black gum, and apple drying that will have very high waste but there are a few nice boards and you'll never see them coming out of Home Depot. Go over to the "my favorite recipes" thread... another use for some types of dimensional firewood is to plane ~ 1/4" thick and throw a  fish on em. Beech, cherry, maple, apple, hickory...
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 05, 2011, 11:42:43 PM
Thanks DonP -- I appreciate your posts!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 06, 2011, 11:44:01 PM
Sweet  [cool]

We've finished all 99 of our T&G pine paneling for the cabin :)  This will give us almost enough paneling to complete the interior I think and is almost all that we have left from milling last fall and spring.

So, once this trip is done we'll have to mill up the last of the logs we have waiting, let them dry and then repeat the process of making the paneling -- that means it will be late winter for those but that's ok :)

As it stands now we've got plenty to do and I plan to do some cabin enjoying this winter :D  So once this paneling is on the walls then the trips get cut down to about once a month at which time we'll burn slash and just hang out :)

And maybe mill some trees up and cut firewood etc :)

I can't wait for next weekend!!!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on November 07, 2011, 12:26:39 PM
I am reminded of a song ...

99 board of T&G on the wall, 99 boards of T&G ...

nah, doesn't work...

But you've given me an idea for a Christmas present (or three!)

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 07, 2011, 05:59:34 PM
Should have about 120 boards of T&G with the stuff left over at the cabin :)

So what presents are you looking to get from yours? ;)  Tent shed, planer, gun racks?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Kris on November 08, 2011, 12:24:37 PM
thats a really nice tub,,a couple pages back....
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 08, 2011, 07:39:51 PM
Quote from: Kris on November 08, 2011, 12:24:37 PM
thats a really nice tub,,a couple pages back....

Thanks Kris -- I can't wait to get it up there and installed!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on November 09, 2011, 10:01:11 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on November 07, 2011, 05:59:34 PM
Should have about 120 boards of T&G with the stuff left over at the cabin :)

So what presents are you looking to get from yours? ;)  Tent shed, planer, gun racks?
Well, a short list of what's on my Amazon wish list for Christmas ... Planer (brought to mind by this thread), Sawmill (yeah, as if that's likely), fish cleaning glove (yep, I'm all over the place), and a few books and other odds and ends.

I think the planer and the mill might be a bit spendy for this year.

"Free" things that are on my list are a guaranteed number of weekends to get up to the property and either finish, or restart the project.  I got an award at the new job which included an extra day off "pass", so that will come in handy when I want to go up for a long weekend
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 09, 2011, 11:25:45 AM
Glad to hear the new job is working out!  And getting an extra day off is, well, BONUS!  [cool]

The planer I'm using is the Ryobi 13" that you can get at HD for about $200 -- It's worth every penny too!

The Mill is spendy ($3k) but when you factor in T&G pine for the interior (for me that would run about $3.5k-$5k) and the added benefit of having plenty of lumber and the ability to make more and well...it just can't be beat!

Fish glove?  Not sure what you'd need one of those for :P  I just always used my hand! lol

Books are good :)  I have so many now that I'm beginning to think I'm building a college library (my books are about 90% history).

Anyway, keep the faith!  You'll get back at it and perhaps even begin to get more time there :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on November 09, 2011, 05:09:43 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on November 09, 2011, 11:25:45 AM
Glad to hear the new job is working out!  And getting an extra day off is, well, BONUS!  [cool]

The planer I'm using is the Ryobi 13" that you can get at HD for about $200 -- It's worth every penny too!

The Mill is spendy ($3k) but when you factor in T&G pine for the interior (for me that would run about $3.5k-$5k) and the added benefit of having plenty of lumber and the ability to make more and well...it just can't be beat!

Fish glove?  Not sure what you'd need one of those for :P  I just always used my hand! lol

Books are good :)  I have so many now that I'm beginning to think I'm building a college library (my books are about 90% history).

Anyway, keep the faith!  You'll get back at it and perhaps even begin to get more time there :)
Typical story - when I have time, I have no $$ when I have $$ I have no time... it'll come tho - once I get enough time in at the new job to actually get vacation (which I'll be eligible for 1 week at the end of Dec  ;D)  And another in June-ish ... so the extra day(s) will come in handy if I can get more of them.

Yours is looking mighty fine there, tho.  Makes me a bit envious.  It will happen tho.  Then I need to save for a well.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 14, 2011, 09:48:32 AM
We arrived around 10:30pm Thursday night and while Josh began to unload the truck I got to setting a fire in the wood stove.  It was about 22 degrees outside (3 degrees warmer then 600 feet below us strangely enough) and the cabin was pretty cold.

I kicked on the power too which was nice and charged for us -- it wouldn't stay that way though!

It didn't take too long to get the cabin to about 48 degrees and that's when we hit the hay.  Throughout the night though, I got up and stoked the stove -- burning pine really sucks in that regard I think!  I HAVE to cut some better firewood soon.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Slanted.jpg)
Friday we got busy early (I got up late because I went to bed late only to discover that my GPS enabled watch had reset the time off daylight savings for some reason -- so in reality I got up an hour earlier -- figure that out).  I ran to the builders place and picked up a few things to finish off the catwalk and Josh got to work on wiring and insulation.

By 9pm in the evening we were beat but the east wall in the loft was done!  You'll notice the slanted pattern...that was actually a solution to a problem -- the problem being that there was nothing to nail to at the top of the stud bays!  I guess when framing them I never considered that so Josh suggested slanting the boards and viola :)  Looks cool anyway!

On my way out the door I discovered SNOW!!!  This pic was taken the next day: (https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Cabin-1.jpg)

Of course at 9pm I wasn't happy because it meant a lot of work to protect all the wood that was on the trailer (and under a tarp) and what followed was a 1 hour rush to tidy up, chop wood, cover things etc etc.  I also noticed that running the lights inside the cabin ALL DAY had cost us on power and the controller was telling me we were around 80% already!  I told Josh not to read too late.

Next day we had about 2-3 inches of snow and it looked most likely that we'd get more...but we weren't working outside anyway!  We got busy on the loft catwalk and made a decision to make it 80" deep instead of 48 since we had the material and we'd been thinking about it for months.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_1186.jpg)
It didn't take long to get it installed and once done we were glad we did it!  So awesome to have so much space up there now!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Josh_loft.jpg)
Walking between the 'lofts' is now really just walking around THE loft.  Josh likes it a lot and we think we can sleep at least 6 comfortably up there now :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_1182.jpg)
Biggest issue with working and staying in the cabin is where to put stuff....Josh made a 'cave' around his end of the cabin so he wouldn't have to move stuff too much when we get back next trip...he'll just climb into bed and crash and the next day his 'room' won't be in the way or used as part of the 'workshop' :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/kitchen-2.jpg)
Another aspect of the catwalk being done is that it provides a ceiling for the kitchen and a place to put a much needed light :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_1166.jpg)
The snow had totally shut down the solar power on us Friday and Saturday and while we made it through Friday OK and well into Saturday but I was a bit worried about running the batteries down below the 80% mark and the fridge while not running much, was running, so I hooked up the iota charger and watched the power come back :D  WE HAVE THE POWER!  [cool]

I love having solar power with a generator back up!
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_1174.jpg)
The place is still a mess, of course, but we're getting there.

More later.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 14, 2011, 10:32:46 AM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/TruckLoad.jpg)
Once we began packing up Sunday I made the final decision to truck home some wood to make into flooring or window trim....so we tossed it into the back of the truck to haul over to the trailer (would save time we figured) but realized that we weren't pulling the trailer loaded with wood out of there....so strapped it down and left it in the back of the truck instead :D

Most of that is blue stained pine and a lot of it will require cutting out rotten sections while a bunch will need to be milled straight on the table saw with a 'joiner' jig.  With luck though, we'll get a lot of beautiful and useable wood out of it.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/waitingforsun.jpg)
The well solar was completely iced over until Sunday afternoon and the batteries were dead :(  I have to get that sorted as it seems the Xantrex charger is crapping out and the batteries are dying...not sure why but something is clearly amiss.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/ComeonSun.jpg)
The woodshed is working as planned it seems....hmmmmm.......

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/HomesteadWinter.jpg)
Winter is such a beautiful time!  Specially when the woodstove is cranking!

Speaking of which, I thought I'd started a chimney fire this weekend!!!!  It wasn't good!  My son was vacuuming the floor with a shop vac on Friday night after cutting a bunch of paneling inside the cabin (we planned it that way) and I noticed smoke.  I had him shut off the vac but realized it wasn't the vacuum at all!  The wood stove was really burning because I'd left the door open a crack -- I sometimes do that to make sure it gets burning again nicely when I let it die down...only I'd left it open long enough to really get it hot!  The double wall pipe going through the wall was hot enough to burn you (it's never been that hot before) and the chimney was ticking....I shut down the draft after closing the door and we watched in fear!  Josh went out and looked at the chimney outside but couldn't see anything unusual and we couldn't see anything inside either....and waited.

After a but it calmed down and stopped ticking etc and the smoke cleared...and I wondered.

One thing I've found with the little Vermont aspen is that it is a bit finicky.  You can't just put the wood in and open it up and let it go.  It has a plate above the door that is easy to bump and if bumped askew it shuts down the draft...also if it doesn't have a lively flame it shuts down the draft...I find it hard to keep at a happy medium but that may just be because I'm burning crappy pine.

We swept the chimney in the fall before burning season and after a winter of use it had a small amount of creosote in the chimney but it wasn't terribly bad so I don't think that's the problem...but who knows?  I need to try burning some fir or tamarack but I just don't have any yet.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 18, 2011, 05:51:40 PM
One thing I'm wondering is if nailing paneling to the ceiling under the lofts is adequate?  Seems to me they might need something better to keep them from eventually dropping....thoughts?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: EaglesSJ on November 18, 2011, 06:07:50 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on November 18, 2011, 05:51:40 PM
One thing I'm wondering is if nailing paneling to the ceiling under the lofts is adequate?  Seems to me they might need something better to keep them from eventually dropping....thoughts?

I just used finishing nails on my ceiling but it is 1x6 vs paneling. Not sure if you are talking about using T-111 siding type paneling or the thinner 1/8" wood type panels that used to be used in mobile homes.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 18, 2011, 06:54:42 PM
Quote from: EaglesSJ on November 18, 2011, 06:07:50 PM
I just used finishing nails on my ceiling but it is 1x6 vs paneling. Not sure if you are talking about using T-111 siding type paneling or the thinner 1/8" wood type panels that used to be used in mobile homes.

Using 1/2" paneling we made ;)  If you look back a page or two you'll see what we've done on the walls :)

I plan to use the same paneling.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on November 18, 2011, 08:45:24 PM
I wouldn't think you would have any problems using a 2" finishing nail in the tounge.  But if you are doubting you could get small trim screws and use them.  They come in a variety of lengths and the head is not much larger than the shank.  Finishing nails is all I used on my vaulted ceiling w/ 3/4" no problems.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: EaglesSJ on November 19, 2011, 08:40:20 AM
Glad I looked back a couple pages looks like you too have good taste in handgus. My ccw is a Kimber Stainless Ultra Carry with nightsights in a leather IWB.

As for the walls, that  stuff looks really nice and I dont see any reason at all why that wouldnt work on the ceiling. Id say youll have no trouble at all with it. It takes alot of force to pull the slightly oversized head of a finishing nail all the way through the board. I had to remove a couple of our ceiling boards a couple months ago when I was doing the living room fan install and it was pretty tough prying it off without completely destroying it in the process.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 19, 2011, 10:37:05 AM
Quote from: Redoverfarm on November 18, 2011, 08:45:24 PM
I wouldn't think you would have any problems using a 2" finishing nail in the tounge.  But if you are doubting you could get small trim screws and use them.  They come in a variety of lengths and the head is not much larger than the shank.  Finishing nails is all I used on my vaulted ceiling w/ 3/4" no problems.

Thanks -- I may go up to 1 3/4" then (remember I'm using 1/2" panels)...but I won't worry :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 19, 2011, 10:41:13 AM
Quote from: EaglesSJ on November 19, 2011, 08:40:20 AM
Glad I looked back a couple pages looks like you too have good taste in handgus. My ccw is a Kimber Stainless Ultra Carry with nightsights in a leather IWB.

As for the walls, that  stuff looks really nice and I dont see any reason at all why that wouldnt work on the ceiling. Id say youll have no trouble at all with it. It takes alot of force to pull the slightly oversized head of a finishing nail all the way through the board. I had to remove a couple of our ceiling boards a couple months ago when I was doing the living room fan install and it was pretty tough prying it off without completely destroying it in the process.

:D

Kimber Custom TLE II for me :)  I probably mentioned that earlier....

I have a friend with a Baby Desert Eagle (nice handgun) and we loaded up some new bullets (cheap HSM HP's) for plinking.  They wouldn't feed in his BDS for some reason....after much checking and resizing I got them to feed through a mag for him but when he went to the range he just couldn't shoot them...I found this odd but decided to load them into the Kimber...bang bang bang bang...hmmm....nothing wrong here :D

Seems the Kimber is not only an excellent pistol with excellent accuracy etc etc but it's also very forgiving...perhaps that's just one more reason to love them!

Usually people say "I don't make Kimber money!"...to which I answer "me neither but I put it on lay-a-way to get it because I'd rather have a kimber that I had to wait for then some crappy pistol I'm unhappy with" :)

But then I love my Ruger Vaquero too...and my M14...and my....

Do you know how many guns a guy needs?

........

Just one more!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: CjAl on November 19, 2011, 10:53:07 AM
i have had two desert eagles. both were finiky about what they would fire and thats being nice on my part. im a ruger guy, they shoot anything i throw at them. and im big enough of a guy to ccw a p89/p90
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: duncanshannon on November 19, 2011, 02:35:59 PM
nice progress OlJarhead!  glad there was no real fire!  yuk.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: EaglesSJ on November 19, 2011, 07:42:45 PM
I also have a rock island armory tactical and I really like it. I sold a springfield and an ATI 1911 to get the kimber. I couldnt have made a better choice. The springer was a nice shooting gun too though.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 20, 2011, 11:17:48 AM
Quote from: duncanshannon on November 19, 2011, 02:35:59 PM
nice progress OlJarhead!  glad there was no real fire!  yuk.

Thanks!  Scared me there for a bit but after cutting off airflow it stopped...it was just VERY hot and I'm always the worrywart!

On a side note I rechecked the book on the stove and was reminded that I'm also supposed to clean the primary air plate from time to time -- I then found a review in which a guy claimed that it was best to not glue it back down, just remove, clean and replace (after removing glue) and apparently the stove works better that way....

Problem with this stove is that it's one of the new low particulate models and it is prone to clogging up a bit when burning poor quality wood (don't know about good wood as I don't have any yet).  So, my next mission is to get some good wood, like Tamarack cut and stacked so I can burn it instead and see how the stove acts then :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on November 21, 2011, 04:21:49 PM
I've measured 300 F at the top of the single wall pipe (60") and have seen 500 to 600 degrees on the stove top front.

Quote.... because I'm burning crappy pine.

It's not so much the species, IMO, it is how well seasoned the wood is. We burn probably 90% pine and 10% aspen. I don't even think of burning either until it is at least a year old. Some of what I used this weekend was likely cut in '09 and has sat partially under cover most of that time. Low rainfall area so it's not difficult to get it dry. I also used ponderosa that was fire killed May '09. It was left standing till a couple of weeks ago. Nice and dry and burns great.   IMO, the wood you might be cutting now is to be burned next year, not this.


We've been using a muffin fan for a couple winters on the outside air inlet to get the fire going. Works like a charm and doesn't seem to slow down the intake of air with the fan off. It beats leaving the door open a little as I found that tends to make the room smell smoky, not to mention seeing smoke escaping into the room. The fan is not on the VC approved list of accessories but it does work very well.

To start a fire in goes a handfun of pine needles, then a few sticks on kindling, three or four 1 inch rounds and then split pine on top. Click the piezo ignition propane torch to light the pine needles, close the door, flip on the fan. Never fail method.

Also in the morning if there are some coals left I rake them forward, add a few small pieces of split dry pine/aspen, close the door, flip on the fan. Jump back into bed and twenty minutes later get up to a warmer room. Turn off the fan.

(https://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q75/djmillerbucket/jemez%20mountain%20property3/mini-P1000958M.jpg)

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 21, 2011, 05:02:28 PM
Thanks for the reply Don,

In my case I'm burning wood that was cut and stacked back in the fall of '09 and as late as June '10 so it's all very well seasoned.  Also starting a fire is never an issue for me.  I just wad up a few news paper pages and light them in the back of the stove as recommended, to get the draft going (from dead cold only) and then once those burn out I use some very dry pine kindling (often scraps from making paneling) and it goes right up.

I leave the door open a little when starting a fire but never have an interior smoke issue.

In the case mentioned I left the door open after putting a new log on the fire as I find when it dies down to embers it doesn't draft very well and it helps to open the door to get the draft really going to get the next piece burning -- but I think, from reading the manual that my issue is only that I need to clean the primary plate area.

I've been emptying ash every day (in the am) and keep the fire running 24hrs a day in the winter (So no dying down really except when working and I forget to stoke it).

I've read that Pine is only about 2/3rds of the BTU capacity of Tamarack so I plan to cut, stack and dry both Tamarack and Fir this winter and spring so next year it will be ready.

I also suspect that once I have the place completely insulated that I won't have as much of an issue as I won't need to burn so much -- a good fire once the place is warmed up should be able to keep it warm a lot longer then today -- today if I let it die at night (down to embers) then the cabin loses 10-15 degrees easily over night.  Then it takes a while to get it warmed back up because we don't have the ceiling insulated yet.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on November 21, 2011, 09:33:56 PM
It didn't dawn on me that the roof was not yet insulated; that will make a big difference. We first did R13 and noticed a big improvement. Now with R45 or so it is very cozy indeed.  Once we have our cabin warm it does not take more than maybe three 8 to 9 inch rounds (15 inch long) to provide heat for 24 hours; exterior temperatures from a low around 25 to a high of 45.

I thought you were having problems keeping the burn going, and unseasoned wood will put a "damper" on a fire.


I've never cleaned out the primary air outlet. I looked in there once at about the two year point, and there was only a tiny bit of ash. I believe our air inlet fan keeps it blown clear.  Without running the fan, and with a small bed of coals raked forward, closing the door with the air control wide open results in a mini blast furnace effect right there at the front. 

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Barry Broome on November 21, 2011, 10:55:53 PM
Tractor Supply is selling a wood burning stove for $269 but it doesn't have a window built into the door. If you are only using the stove for occasional weekend use is it important to have the window?

http://www.tractorsupply.com/united-states-stove-cast-iron-logwood-stove-large-3192571
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: metolent on November 21, 2011, 11:16:59 PM
Looking great!  I've been meaning to mention how cool it is that you're cutting/milling your own T&G.  And, I really like the idea of the multiple widths on the walls.  That section with the angled cuts looks great!   [cool]
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 22, 2011, 09:32:09 AM
Thanks Don!

That re-enforces my belief that I need to get the roof done!  I've got R21 to go in there but it will be about R19 when done because I'm putting in the vent baffles, but I'm sure with a fan and the wood stove going we'll be very toasty.

I suspect that since I'm plowing through loads of pine I've got a ton more ash then you!  I run the stove wide open the entire time we're there with a log going in every couple hours!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 22, 2011, 09:34:49 AM
Quote from: Weasel on November 21, 2011, 10:55:53 PM
Tractor Supply is selling a wood burning stove for $269 but it doesn't have a window built into the door. If you are only using the stove for occasional weekend use is it important to have the window?

http://www.tractorsupply.com/united-states-stove-cast-iron-logwood-stove-large-3192571

I've seen those 'boxwood' and 'logwood' stoves sold in Oregon and wouldn't mind trying one.  They aren't legal in WA but frankly no one has a legal wood stove up there in the mountains (except me) which means they all spent $1000 less then me on a wood stove  d*
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: sako on November 24, 2011, 03:19:28 PM
I sure love your pine that you've milled yourself.
When we burned wood heat at home i would burn out my pipes like that about once a month, i don't know if it's bad
or not but they were always clean. I would sweap the pipes every fall with not much build up at all. We also had
straight pipe through the ceilling.
We love to see your progress and pics, it makes us miss the cabin (aka) rv/shed. Hope to make it up there for new years.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 25, 2011, 12:34:57 AM
Quote from: sako on November 24, 2011, 03:19:28 PM
I sure love your pine that you've milled yourself.
When we burned wood heat at home i would burn out my pipes like that about once a month, i don't know if it's bad
or not but they were always clean. I would sweap the pipes every fall with not much build up at all. We also had
straight pipe through the ceilling.
We love to see your progress and pics, it makes us miss the cabin (aka) rv/shed. Hope to make it up there for new years.

Thanks!

We'll make it up there in a week or so and then again on New Years if all goes well :)  It's a great time to be there!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 26, 2011, 08:19:32 PM
Picked up two more rolls of R19 today so we can finish off the walls and any of the floor that isn't well insulated -- might have enough left to stuff in under the porch too :)

Also picked up some window and door "great stuff" so I can finish sealing the windows too (something not done yet).

And finally, as the temps at the cabin are now treading around 15-25 degrees at night and reportedly will be around 15 next weekend (at night) I picked up a new wick for the Kerosene heater.  Hopefully I an change it out easily enough after we arrive (and after the wood stove is going)....kerosene is running at a stupidly high price in HD ($8.79/gallon) so I need to find a source for it somewhere -- ace had it around the same price I think but I can't remember and I think Ranch and Home might have had the best price locally that I've found.  However, in PA I noticed that they sold it at gas stations so I'm hoping to find a similar source here so I can get it much cheaper -- it has to be at least half what HD is asking!

Anyway, the Kerosene heater (23,000btu's) helps get the cabin warmed up faster when it's only about 15-20 degrees inside!  So I'm hoping to have both fuel and wick ready for next weekend :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 27, 2011, 04:20:41 PM
OK I broke down and paid $40 for a 5 gallon bucket of Kerosene at Ranch & Home.  At least it was a little better then the HD price but still!!!  $8/gallon is highway robbery!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: nysono on November 28, 2011, 10:01:59 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on November 27, 2011, 04:20:41 PM
OK I broke down and paid $40 for a 5 gallon bucket of Kerosene at Ranch & Home.  At least it was a little better then the HD price but still!!!  $8/gallon is highway robbery!

Yes it is........4.25/gal here and you buy it at the gas stations....about the same price as diesel fuel
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Don_P on November 28, 2011, 10:50:30 PM
Wow, that is a crazy price. It's a bit over 4 bucks here at the gas station, slightly less at the fuel oil distributor. I should get about 100 gals to top off the Monitor's tank before the driveway gets too tough. When work dried up a couple of winters ago we went through about 5 gallons and kept the woodstove going. When we're away at work during the winters it'll go through about 100 gallons if we run the woodstove morning and evening. When I put the monitor in K1 was about $1.35/gal and I figured I'd never cut wood again. It about doubled by the next year  d*
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 29, 2011, 01:01:59 PM
I have to try to find a place I can get it in bulk!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 05, 2011, 11:26:07 AM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/woodshed.jpg)
We got back to the cabin this past weekend and managed to get some poles up onto the woodshed roof and tied them together with some old flitches and scrap from the mill.  We then tossed over our huge tarp (that wasn't in use) and weighted it down with heavy rocks.

Now, with luck, we'll have accessible wood next trip ;)  See the problem in the winter is that wood that is covered by a tarp only is almost impossible to get to because the tarps build up several inches of ice and snow on them and freeze to the ground -- they are impossible to pull up then.

We then moved most of what's left of our fire wood to the shed (it's really sad how little is left!) and began bucking up some old logs that won't get milled.  We'll continue to cut and chop firewood on our next trip and start to get more fir and tamarack stacked and drying.

At least next winter we should have a finished woodshed and lots of wood for the stove!

I should also add that all the effort inside the cabin has paid off and it was easy to keep it in the mid 60's all weekend despite weather in the high teens and low 20's at night :D  I can't wait for the roof to be completely insulated and paneled!

Cheers
Erik
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on December 07, 2011, 11:28:10 AM
Looking good!  How's the T&G paneling coming? 

I really should update my thread with what's been going on here as far as the plan to get back up to the property.  I've had a lot of time to think about "the plan" and hopefully next year will be much more productive. (hopefully as productive as this year was for you! [cool])

Keep the progress going! :)

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 17, 2011, 10:35:07 AM
Hey Bud, thanks :)

The paneling was going well but this winter I've cut back a bit on trips (down to once a month).  And the last trip was strictly a 'winterizing' trip.

My plan is to spend one weekend a month at the cabin until March when I'll pick the pace back up again -- then we can get the interior finished and start working on other projects like this one :

http://www.amazon.com/Eccotemp-FVI-12-LP-Capacity-Propane-Tankless/dp/B002Y0K6AI

I stole that out of another thread ;)  Have to make a 'pressure tank' but I think the answer is a gravity fed 55 gallon water tank/drum by the cabin sunk into the ground and sealed up tight with some kind of valve to stop the gravity fed water from overfilling the tank and then installing an RV pump into the tank and using that to provide water to the cabin.

Then we could have hot water and showers :)

I've also decided to remove the traps from the sinks and tub/shower (they weren't installed yet anyway) and let them flow straight into the gray water drain tank/settling tank.  Why?  Winter.

My neighbor tells me that they have done this and just use a rubber stopper mat over the drains to keep from venting smells back into the cabin -- and it prevents them from having exploding traps in the winter and allows them to use the drains in the winter.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Gary O on December 17, 2011, 11:31:05 AM
Erik
Really enjoying following this thread.
I don't think I could stay away a month at a time....unless distance is a factor...........
I'm intrigued in your thoughts and plans on the 55 gal drum for gravity fed water, as I'm considering the same.
Wonderful build, man, wonderful.

Looks like a dry winter up there too.....what's up with that?

Keep a fire
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 17, 2011, 12:46:02 PM
Quote from: Gary O on December 17, 2011, 11:31:05 AM
Erik
Really enjoying following this thread.
I don't think I could stay away a month at a time....unless distance is a factor...........
I'm intrigued in your thoughts and plans on the 55 gal drum for gravity fed water, as I'm considering the same.
Wonderful build, man, wonderful.

Looks like a dry winter up there too.....what's up with that?

Keep a fire

Thanks GaryO  (love your small cabin by the way!)...and crazy posts (that Mosquito one is funny as hell for those of us who have lived in areas where they really ARE that big! :)

Staying away for a month at a time is tough!  I almost can't do it and am always thinking up ways to go anyway....but then I'm disciplined enough to stop myself (read as:  my wife is disciplined enough! ha!  d* )

We made a decision to reduce winter trips in the dead of winter because honestly we get less done during this time of year and I need to make the trips productive if going twice a month (costs roughly $120 in gas each trip).  But it's ok, after 2 1/2 years of driving hard it's good to take some down time and do stuff here at home :)

Funny thing about the weather is that we had 12" of snow the week prior to those pics!  But it's common in the Northwest on this side of the mountains anyway, to warm up and thaw several times before 'the big freeze' which starts around now and extends well into March.  Heck, I've had snow and ice in shaded areas last well into April!

I'm expecting more snow this year then last though (we've already come close to last years I think) and imagine it's going to be chains all the way from now until mid-march!

So, next trip?  New Years!  My wife and I will be going up to light the wood stove and bring in 2012 form the comfort of our chairs in front of the fire :)

On to the tank....

What I plan is to run the water main line from the cistern into the drum with some kind of valve to stop it when the tank is mostly full.  Then install the RV pump from the top.

That way the Cistern should be able to refill the drum as it empties from showing etc.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Gary O on December 17, 2011, 01:14:06 PM
"So, next trip?  New Years!  My wife and I will be going up to light the wood stove and bring in 2012 form the comfort of our chairs in front of the fire"

Excellent
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on December 19, 2011, 12:09:13 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on December 17, 2011, 12:46:02 PM

So, next trip?  New Years!  My wife and I will be going up to light the wood stove and bring in 2012 form the comfort of our chairs in front of the fire :)

On to the tank....

What I plan is to run the water main line from the cistern into the drum with some kind of valve to stop it when the tank is mostly full.  Then install the RV pump from the top.

That way the Cistern should be able to refill the drum as it empties from showing etc.

Awesome on the next trip! I doubt that I could get into mine any more until sometime in May. (I WILL get a snowmobile this coming spring and then I will be able to next year).

So what you need for the tank fill so it won't over flow is something like what's in a toilet, huh?  A valve with a float to cut off the water when it reaches a certain level.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 20, 2011, 12:52:03 AM
Quote from: JavaMan on December 19, 2011, 12:09:13 PM
Awesome on the next trip! I doubt that I could get into mine any more until sometime in May. (I WILL get a snowmobile this coming spring and then I will be able to next year).

So what you need for the tank fill so it won't over flow is something like what's in a toilet, huh?  A valve with a float to cut off the water when it reaches a certain level.

Either that or a valve that can be shut off unless the pump is running -- or both.  I haven't really looked into it yet, just thoughts in the back of my mind ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 20, 2011, 12:56:21 AM
Quote from: JavaMan on December 19, 2011, 12:09:13 PM
Awesome on the next trip! I doubt that I could get into mine any more until sometime in May. (I WILL get a snowmobile this coming spring and then I will be able to next year).

I tell you Bud, I'd love to give it a try!  I've been up as high as you can get in the National Forest south of me and while it can get a little slippy it's nothing good tires, 4 wheel drive and good chains can't handle.

Now that's not saying that if you're on the north side of slope at 4000 feet and in that perfect spot that gets tons of snow that I could get in, but honestly if there is any traffic within a few miles of your place it's likely that it's passable for someone with the right rig and setup.

Maybe it's just me but unless there is two feet of snow (and even then it depends on how much freezing there was since the snow fall and a few other factors) I could get in.  With two feet of frozen snow I'd probably not bother unless I had to...but then I've also got a winch and will know within a few feet as to whether or not it's going to happen.....3 feet of snow and I'm putting on snow shoes!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on December 20, 2011, 06:23:12 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on December 20, 2011, 12:56:21 AM
I tell you Bud, I'd love to give it a try!  I've been up as high as you can get in the National Forest south of me and while it can get a little slippy it's nothing good tires, 4 wheel drive and good chains can't handle.

Now that's not saying that if you're on the north side of slope at 4000 feet and in that perfect spot that gets tons of snow that I could get in, but honestly if there is any traffic within a few miles of your place it's likely that it's passable for someone with the right rig and setup.

Maybe it's just me but unless there is two feet of snow (and even then it depends on how much freezing there was since the snow fall and a few other factors) I could get in.  With two feet of frozen snow I'd probably not bother unless I had to...but then I've also got a winch and will know within a few feet as to whether or not it's going to happen.....3 feet of snow and I'm putting on snow shoes!
Well, I can tell you that I did try one year, at the end of the season.  Loup Loup pass (http://www.wsdot.wa.gov/traffic/passes/louploup/default.aspx) was clear - completely clear, and I managed to get within 3/4 miles of the place, but the truck got stuck in the snow (which was still more than axle deep at that point).  And that was with a LOT of work to get to that point.  I've got the snowshoes, but the 5 mile + hike in isn't exactly my cup of tea (at least not yet - I'm working on getting in to shape for it).

I figure, tho, if I had a snow mobile, I could run up and down the road a bit, compacting that snow some so that it would let the truck pass.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Barry Broome on December 20, 2011, 09:48:47 PM
Don't forget to take a few pictures on New Years. Sounds like a wonderful way to bring in the New Year  [cool]
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 21, 2011, 09:42:26 AM
Quote from: JavaMan on December 20, 2011, 06:23:12 PM
Well, I can tell you that I did try one year, at the end of the season.  Loup Loup pass (http://www.wsdot.wa.gov/traffic/passes/louploup/default.aspx) was clear - completely clear, and I managed to get within 3/4 miles of the place, but the truck got stuck in the snow (which was still more than axle deep at that point).  And that was with a LOT of work to get to that point.  I've got the snowshoes, but the 5 mile + hike in isn't exactly my cup of tea (at least not yet - I'm working on getting in to shape for it).

I figure, tho, if I had a snow mobile, I could run up and down the road a bit, compacting that snow some so that it would let the truck pass.

I guess the hard part for you is not knowing what you will find.  That's got to be the toughest.  For me I know I can get within a 1/4 mile or so because someone drives past my place daily.

What you need is a plow blade on your truck :)  Then your set!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on December 21, 2011, 11:55:13 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on December 21, 2011, 09:42:26 AM
I guess the hard part for you is not knowing what you will find.  That's got to be the toughest.  For me I know I can get within a 1/4 mile or so because someone drives past my place daily.

What you need is a plow blade on your truck :)  Then your set!

That and a winch! 

Not knowing is tough.  I went up that one year expecting it to be completely clear, but it was still quite deep in some places and completely clear in others once you got off the county maintained road.

Funny you should say that - years ago when I lived in WI (and was still living with mom & dad), I figured to get myself a truck with a plow and earn a few extra bucks.  Never did it. d*  Now it would help get me to the property.

Plus it might come in handy since once the kids are grown and out of the house Beautiful and I are thinking of moving to a place that actually has seasons.  Again, I could use it to earn a little extra cash :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 23, 2011, 04:26:49 PM
Winches are a great idea, specially if you know how to use them and have a block and tackle (or two).

However, winches are always put on the front of a rig and rarely are swappable....so....always go with a buddy and let them go first so you can winch them out!  lol
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on December 29, 2011, 01:18:34 PM
I'm guessing you're getting ready to head up to the cabin (if you haven't already)... have a safe trip!  And ring in the new year in style!  We'll look forward to lots of good pictures  ??? :)

If revenue continues through the next 4-5 months, thee is a snow mobile sometime next spring with my name on it someplace.  THEN I'll get up to my place in the winter.  Of course that presumes that I have actually finished putting a roof on it, and it's buttoned up so I can contain any heat generated.

Have fun up there!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 29, 2011, 03:26:48 PM
Quote from: JavaMan on December 29, 2011, 01:18:34 PM
I'm guessing you're getting ready to head up to the cabin (if you haven't already)... have a safe trip!  And ring in the new year in style!  We'll look forward to lots of good pictures  ??? :)

If revenue continues through the next 4-5 months, thee is a snow mobile sometime next spring with my name on it someplace.  THEN I'll get up to my place in the winter.  Of course that presumes that I have actually finished putting a roof on it, and it's buttoned up so I can contain any heat generated.

Have fun up there!

We will!

Coll on the sled :)  You'll love it!

We plan on ringing in the new year in style :)  Got a roast to cook up for New Years too :
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 29, 2011, 10:40:54 PM
Wow!  I got my targets today and can't wait to put holes in them ;)  OK I figure the pistols might not actually put holes in them but we'll see.  They were made out of scrap my neighbor had on a different project and are mild steel 1/4" thick so unlikely to hold up.  He's looking into the armor plate normally used and will make me some from that soon....maybe even a Bin Ladin target is in order! :P

Also am having him make my wood rack for inside the shed!  I'm hoping it's ok to post his site here but again, it's my neighbor and he's doing the work for me that I think others might also be interested in -- heck I didn't know he bought the plasma cutter!  I just get eggs from him LOL!
http://lawmanonline.com/Past_Projects.html

Loren's a good guy and we've been neighbors for 2 years I think (maybe 3 but they moved in next to us and I can't remember when it was).  He's also the one that made my solar panel racks (well pump and main house racks) which are all steel and while they are heavy I don't think the wind is going to blow them down! lol

Anyway, I'm pretty stoked and now I think I'll have him make me a sign too :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 29, 2011, 10:43:34 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/12-28-11LogHolder1.jpg)
That's the log rack we're having built -- Darci loves hearts so I had Loren add them.

he's going to make a removable pan in the base of the holder so we can dump the chips and the two rings on the side are for kindling and paper.

Pretty sweet I'm thinking!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on December 30, 2011, 06:17:47 PM
That looks AWESOME!  I'll have to put in my order for a couple (we have two fireplaces at the house, not to mention the stove I'll have at the property once it's done)

Have a great weekend up there!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 02, 2012, 11:49:25 AM
Ugh!  Determined to enjoy the weekend no matter what (the hazards of not getting to the cabin often enough) we headed up Friday morning despite my having a miserable cold or flu.  Yes folks, I will go to the cabin no matter what!!!  d*

Once we arrived at the road to our driveway we ran into ice and my attempt to shift to 4 wheel drive was futile.  I was upset.  I hate the stupid modern switched used to 'turn on' 4 wheel drive.  Obviously the engineer who designed them has never actually HAD to use 4 wheel drive.  If he/she had then they would know that you do not rely on electronics to do what MUST be done.  With no 4 wheel drive I drove gingerly  and thanked god I had weighted down the rear of the truck with bricks and supplies.  I was about to need it very much if we were going to make it at all.

Once on our dirt drive which is 3 miles long I shifted in and out of 4 wheel drive to no avail.  I tried backing, shutting down, shifting in and out of neutral...nothing worked.  Finally, arriving at out first steep hill I stopped and chained up the rears.

Bit by bit we inched our way up the steep 3 mile drive to our cabin without a single mishap or even slip!  It was solid ice (that I would later slip and fall on as if to confirm that yes, Ice is slippery) but with a few hundred pounds of bricks and supplies in the rear and chains on the rear tires the truck walked its way up to the cabin just fine....thank god!
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_1519.jpg)

Arriving we found the batteries drained to somewhere around 11vdc (or less) and immediately dragged out the generator and hooked it up.  With the generator running and charging the batteries (and no time to figure out what happened) I proceeded to get a fire going and get the kerosene heater going.  It was 40 degrees inside the cabin and about 25 outside.

With the cabin warming up and the batteries charging we moved into the cabin finally.  It was around 5:30pm when we finally settled by the wood stove and could relax a little....it was in the teens outside but the cabin was above 50 and getting warmer.

Suddenly my wife informed me that we HAD to go to the store....the store?  Yes, right now.  It was about 7PM and the cabin was just getting warm.  It was about 20 degrees out, or less, and we had no 4 wheel drive but if you're married and a man you know that 'HAVE TO GO' means just that.  Clearly something important was forgotten and it was simply a matter of 'yes dear' and off we go.

I left the place secure with the stove running -- it's not like I could have shut it off anyway -- and the generator running and went out to start the truck......and a funny thing happened!  The 4 wheel drive was now engaged!  Huh?

We made the 1 1/2 hour round trip to the store without issue and didn't have to chain up on the way back as the 4wheel drive was working -- perhaps it knew that when my wife says we have to do something then she means it and it just better damn well not play games too!  d* ???

My cold was really kicking in and my wife was under the weather too so we just snacked a little and stayed by the fire and sipped on our favorite drinks (no hot buttered run for me, just plain old Jack Daniels and Diet coke -- and my wife went with a Rum Sunrise).

Eventually we succumbed to the evening, shut down the generator and headed to bed.  It was about 65 degrees inside the cabin.

The next morning the outside temperature was 11 degrees but we were quite cozy in our 65 degree cabin.  Seems the humidity (about 55%) helps make 65 degrees seem quite warm whereas in the desert at home it's quite cool.  Anyway, after getting ourselves moving I got the generator fired up again and used it to charge up the batteries.  I ran it all morning to ensure the batteries were topped off and the heat trace had time to get the sewage pipe well warmed up inside it's insulation.  I also ran the composter as well which has a heater inside and though it won't keep the unit 'composting' unless it is very well insulated it will thaw it out which is needed to prevent clogs from freezing.

One very nice aspect of having done more in the past is that I was able to walk straight into the wood shed and grab a handful of dry wood to burn :)  Nice!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_1516.jpg)
Once fed, pumped full of drugs (me) and ready to face the day we went out and started a burn pile to get rid of some slash.  It was actually fun (always is) and felt good to get something done.  I later put up some targets -- steel gong style -- and tested some .45acp loads I'd worked up.  They worked VERY nicely and I was thrilled with them because one of the bullets, an HSM, had given me a lot of trouble.  Not so now and it was smacking the steel target with ease at 25 yards.  Then all the chains broke and I had to give up with that set up for a while.
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_1518.jpg)

Most of the day, when not shooting or burning slash, we listened to Glenn Becks 'Being George Washington'.  My sister-in-law had gotten the CD's for me this Christmas as she knows I love history and while she hates Glenn Beck with a passion (I mean really hates him) she knows that I do not and bought the book in CD form for me.  So Darci and I listened to it and snoozed throughout the weekend.
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_1522.jpg)

For those curious, the book is quite excellent.  I've read a lot of history and his book is excellent from both a historical context as well as from a modern one.  I recommend it highly, even to the haters (*snicker*).
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_1525.jpg)

We also installed some spice racks and a shelf but otherwise did very little 'work' this weekend.  I also pulled the logs from the charge controller and discovered that it was not recording any absorption or float charging since the last weekend at the cabin a month earlier.  We'd been using about 300 watt hours per day but the system should have been able to handle it.  I suspect that the controller is damaged and will have to RMA it once I can get something else hooked up.
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_1530.jpg)
Anyway, at some point I brought out the old rifle, a Canadian Centennial Winchester 30-30 and tested out some loads with it and they went very well also :)  You can follow that on the thread 'reloading' if interested.

Eventually my wife and I realized that our weekend was coming to a close and it might be better to go home a day early to try to recover before having to work.  Yes it was nice at the cabin but with no hot shower or bath and no running water sometimes it's just best to call it a trip and head home a little early.  I vowed to work on the well and cistern in the spring and we packed up and headed home. 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Gary O on January 02, 2012, 12:59:41 PM
Geez, Erik, you remind me of me.
Did you reach that euphoric state with the JD cold helper (sometimes referred to as a warm fuzzy)?
Glad you could get in......and get out......
As I read thru, I wondered about the 3 mi trip down.....glad the Cherokee decided to cooperate.
I think I have faint recall of those 'must' trips...so who went into the store?

Still, worst day at the cabin beats a best day at work (most times).

Looks great up there.
Glad you got a dusting at least.
Nothin' like a tight cabin in winter.
Thanks for the wonderful pix.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 02, 2012, 01:18:51 PM
Quote from: Gary O on January 02, 2012, 12:59:41 PM
Geez, Erik, you remind me of me.
Did you reach that euphoric state with the JD cold helper (sometimes referred to as a warm fuzzy)?
Glad you could get in......and get out......
As I read thru, I wondered about the 3 mi trip down.....glad the Cherokee decided to cooperate.
I think I have faint recall of those 'must' trips...so who went into the store?

Still, worst day at the cabin beats a best day at work (most times).

Looks great up there.
Glad you got a dusting at least.
Nothin' like a tight cabin in winter.
Thanks for the wonderful pix.

Thanks Gary :)  The Cherokee was snug at home!  Grrr....I'd left it in favor of the more 'modern' and comfortable F150....the truck is nice but I hate the stupid 4wd switch.  The Jeep would have just crawled up in any gear or drive I wanted but it's radio is broken and it is in need of some TLC.

The JD was very nice, always is, but I only had 2 or 3 ozs....just enough to enjoy the warmth of that good old sour mash :D

We both went into the store though I was trailing behind....my wife was in a hurry ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Gary O on January 02, 2012, 01:54:33 PM
  Ah, I was wonderin', cause my 99 wrangler has the lever.

Yeah, I was usually the one that'd go in during that 'special' time.
Cashier'd ask, 'how's yer day', as she scanned the package. I'd say 'how do you think it's going?'
Neither of us miss the weekend surprise.

2-3oz, perfect.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 02, 2012, 02:08:11 PM
Quote from: Gary O on January 02, 2012, 01:54:33 PM
  Ah, I was wonderin', cause my 99 wrangler has the lever.

Yeah, I was usually the one that'd go in during that 'special' time.
Cashier'd ask, 'how's yer day', as she scanned the package. I'd say 'how do you think it's going?'
Neither of us miss the weekend surprise.

2-3oz, perfect.

Yup my '98 XJ has the lever and it never fails....NEVER.  and since the Limited Slip rear end was rebuilt by a pro I actually have 3 wheel drive when I engage the front.  Add the big honking tires (as my wife puts it) and lift, 4.10's etc etc and well, let's just say I'm not afraid of ice and snow or mountain roads :D

Yup that 'special' time can sneak up on you  d* she's ready for it to be done and constantly makes statements to that effect but alas, she's still cursed as it were....which can make cabin trips a little less enjoyable for her since there is no shower or bath etc...at least we have a working toilet!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 02, 2012, 02:09:32 PM
And yes, 2-3 ozs of JD is quite perfect!  Specially at the cabin after a long day of working or playing :)

In fact it's also perfect after a long day at work....hmmm.....since I have the day off it might also be good after a long day off! :D  c*
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on January 02, 2012, 02:10:32 PM
I forgot you had a Ford; was really puzzling over the electric 4wd ???     

Too bad about the batteries / charge controller. That's not good for the batteries at all. Glad you enjoyed your time though.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 02, 2012, 02:14:05 PM
Quote from: MtnDon on January 02, 2012, 02:10:32 PM
I forgot you had a Ford; was really puzzling over the electric 4wd ???     

Too bad about the batteries / charge controller. That's not good for the batteries at all. Glad you enjoyed your time though.

Yup, new 4x4 truck with new crappy switch...hmmm...how to fix that??

Am a little worried about the batteries as I suspect life has been shortened :(  But will prevail.  I plan to put the C40 back on the system and send the Morningstar in to have it fixed or replaced -- assuming I can get in contact with them which is a challenge.

I intend to buy an Outback as soon as I can.  I'm tired of the crappiest customer service I have ever experienced and will never buy another of Morningstar's products again!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on January 02, 2012, 02:21:31 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on January 02, 2012, 02:14:05 PM
Yup, new 4x4 truck with new crappy switch...hmmm...how to fix that??

Many years ago I had a vehicle with an electrically actuated overdrive, via a big solenoid. It didn't like the cold weather.  ???  I have no idea how the late model electric 4wd selectors work so I just threw that into the mix for something to say.  ???
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 02, 2012, 10:30:04 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/LogRack.jpg)
Almost done :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on January 03, 2012, 12:07:50 PM
Oh, THAT special time... yeah, isn't it "special".  Seems it shows up on every occasion we've managed to get shed of the kids for a few days.  Those times then evolve (?) into times where I get honey-do's done.

Cabin looks great, OJH ... can't wait to get up to mine this spring (and I WILL be up there this year).  I wasn't able to get up last year for a variety of reasons, but this year am planning on an average of every third weekend at least, with a few longer weekends thrown in for good measure. I want it done before hunting season rolls around.  The boy and I are going bow hunting this year.  Should be lots of fun.

My F150 has the 4WD shifter on the floor with high, low, etc... So far I've never had any troubles with it - the Explorer I had previously would do what your F150 is doing.  Reading the ford forums it seems that a loose wire to the transfer case (If I remember correctly) can cause this.  Make sure all the connections are good and tight.  And yes, the engineer that designed it should have to figure out how they're going to get up and down a mountain in 12 degree weather when it's acting up.

Hope you're feeling better!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 05, 2012, 10:57:13 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/RootCellar.jpg)
The plans for my root cellar might be coming together!

After a long talk with my neighbor about how to build it and discussions with others online I think I have the answer that will serve my purpose.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/RootCellar2.jpg)
The concept is to build the foundation and slab with concrete, then build Cinder Block walls and fill them with rebar and concrete and then use 10" diameter logs for roof 'beams' and affix them to the cinder/concrete walls with rebar pins and finally concrete around them (not sure if that will work but still working out details).  Then nail down a 2x6 roof on top of the log beams and cover with 60 mil plastic (after putting in vents).

Not sure of the spacing on the logs yet but I'm thinking I might be able to get away with 16-20" on center if not 24" on center if I use all 10" logs (which I will mill to exactly 10" end to end with the sawmill before dropping them on the walls (otherwise it might not work out so well).

Once covered and burried I'll build a garden shed on top of the entrance to keep out the snow and rain and give me a place to store the orchard implements etc :)

It will take a ton of blocks mind you and I have to look at that cost vs paying someone to form it up but I think this will work and will probably be cheaper then paying for someone to pour it all in concrete.

Thoughts?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 05, 2012, 11:00:51 PM
Rough calculations tells me I'll need about 800 cinder blocks (that will include the stairs out).
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Tickhill on January 06, 2012, 04:59:00 AM
OJ, good idea. My basement walls consist of cinder blocks with rebar from footing all the way up the blocks every 4 ft., and they are filled with concrete. Don't forget to stub up conduit from the cabin to the cellar for lights/power, also a water line might be nice.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Squirl on January 06, 2012, 10:34:25 AM
If I had to do it over again, I probably would have formed it and poured concrete.  I did 650 blocks.  The books I read on laying block said a good professional mason can lay 200 blocks a day and a well practiced amateur can lay 100 blocks a day.  My best was 75 blocks a day towards the end of the job.  The months I spent weekends doing it could have been saved by a few hundred extra dollars with forms.  The concrete itself would have cost around the same as the block and mortar without concrete and rebar fill.  I spent more in gas driving on weekends than the forms would have cost, and I would have saved months of time.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Bob S. on January 06, 2012, 04:04:04 PM
Would it be practical to not use earth between the cellar and the shed? Just super insulation. Like 3' or so of blown in cellulose. Might work as well and be cheaper to build.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on January 06, 2012, 11:00:04 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on January 05, 2012, 11:00:51 PM
Rough calculations tells me I'll need about 800 cinder blocks (that will include the stairs out).
That's a technique called "Dry Stack" and I've looked at it for under the actual log cabin I will build in the next couple years, once the starter shed/cabin is done.

Different from the "standard" method of mortar between the blocks it should stack up fairly fast.  The biggest concern that I've read about is getting concrete all the way down the voids that you pour it into.

I figure to do about 3 courses at a time, pour, and then with rebar sticking out of the top into the next course, stack another three courses.

I think that's a great alternative to a poured basement or cellar, and more cost efficient than insulated concrete forms (ICFs)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on January 06, 2012, 11:02:58 PM
Quote from: Squirl on January 06, 2012, 10:34:25 AM
If I had to do it over again, I probably would have formed it and poured concrete.  I did 650 blocks.  The books I read on laying block said a good professional mason can lay 200 blocks a day and a well practiced amateur can lay 100 blocks a day.  My best was 75 blocks a day towards the end of the job.  The months I spent weekends doing it could have been saved by a few hundred extra dollars with forms.  The concrete itself would have cost around the same as the block and mortar without concrete and rebar fill.  I spent more in gas driving on weekends than the forms would have cost, and I would have saved months of time.

Did you lay it up in the traditional manner with mortar and buttering each block? I don't think that's what OJH is thinking about - in a dry stack, you stack them without the mortar, put rebar down them, and pour into the voids in the block.  Usually, for "living spaces" and cisterns, they put some thin covering on the outside after it's finished to make it waterproof or seal it up.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on January 06, 2012, 11:05:12 PM
Quote from: Tickhill on January 06, 2012, 04:59:00 AM
OJ, good idea. My basement walls consist of cinder blocks with rebar from footing all the way up the blocks every 4 ft., and they are filled with concrete. Don't forget to stub up conduit from the cabin to the cellar for lights/power, also a water line might be nice.

Thanks for the reminder Tick ... I had been thinking about how to do this,but the voids in the blocks seem to be quite handy for running conduit and piping.  Gonna have to look into that.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 07, 2012, 10:18:30 AM
Thanks Javaman!

My neighbor did it this way I beleive.  He mentioned going up only so high and then pouring concrete in and then going higher again....but I never inquired too much about it at the time.

Now I'm thinking yes!  ANd with the 60 mill plastic outside it will/should be waterproof.

Tickhill -- the whole structure is already going to be completely below ground level (10 feet down at the floor) on a hill so by the time it gets to the sheds footings it will be pretty close to the surface (stairwell).  My plan is to possibly use the last wall of the root cellar as the base of the sheds footing ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 07, 2012, 10:26:42 AM
http://www.drystacked.com/sequence.html
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on January 07, 2012, 01:56:17 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on January 07, 2012, 10:26:42 AM
http://www.drystacked.com/sequence.html

Yup! I was going to go looking for that one and post it here. 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Squirl on January 09, 2012, 10:34:39 AM
I did the traditional mortar method.  Dry stack is great and was my original plan. You need to excavate enough to cover both sides of the wall with SBC for it to work.  Because I'm not that skinny this would have required extra excavation and backfill, which would have been an extra $600 of excavator time.  If you already have this done, it would probably be better than mortar.  I have read dry stacked is faster, but it costs a few hundred more in materials too.  SBC is around $15 a bag vs mortar at $4.  You also still need to mortar the first and last row of block with a drystack wall too. 

Surface bonding cement is also a water barrier, which would be good for a root cellar. In addition it has greater shear strength which would be good too.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 09, 2012, 12:31:58 PM
Quote from: Squirl on January 09, 2012, 10:34:39 AM
I did the traditional mortar method.  Dry stack is great and was my original plan. You need to excavate enough to cover both sides of the wall with SBC for it to work.  Because I'm not that skinny this would have required extra excavation and backfill, which would have been an extra $600 of excavator time.  If you already have this done, it would probably be better than mortar.  I have read dry stacked is faster, but it costs a few hundred more in materials too.  SBC is around $15 a bag vs mortar at $4.  You also still need to mortar the first and last row of block with a drystack wall too. 

Surface bonding cement is also a water barrier, which would be good for a root cellar. In addition it has greater shear strength which would be good too.

Luckily for me my excavator is a friend ;)  I asked him if he'd come out and dig the walls out a couple feet wider for applying the SBC and dig me some footings so I don't lose height and he's ready whenever I am.  Will cost me $250 for the excavator and another $200 for gas (for him) but I'll get a ton more done around there in the end so the money will be well spent ;)

I'll have him dig some trenches for the orchard and cabin water and maybe a hole for the pressure tank etc etc

Otherwise I'm liking this idea a lot.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on January 09, 2012, 01:11:11 PM
Hey, OJH!  Does your excavator friend do driveways, also?

I might have a project for him - especially if he's headed your way up 97 through Okanogan.  It wouldn't be much out of his way, perhaps.

If he's up for it, maybe we can co-ordinate a weekend once the snow is out.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 09, 2012, 02:01:00 PM
Quote from: JavaMan on January 09, 2012, 01:11:11 PM
Hey, OJH!  Does your excavator friend do driveways, also?

I might have a project for him - especially if he's headed your way up 97 through Okanogan.  It wouldn't be much out of his way, perhaps.

If he's up for it, maybe we can co-ordinate a weekend once the snow is out.

He would.

We rent the excavator in Tonasket and he hauls it up to my place.  I pay for the gas and rental etc and give him a stipend for his efforts ;)

But if done right, and only 8 hours are used on the machine then they will only charge for one day even if you have it all weekend.  So we pick it up Friday on the way there and use it Saturday all day then bring it back Monday morning -- gives us the option to use it for a 2nd day if needed.

The last time we ran something like 10 hrs but they charged only 8 hrs worth as per their statement to me when I picked it up.

Anyway, Tom's a great operator and has been doing it for nearly 20 years....good guy too.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on January 09, 2012, 11:06:57 PM
Well, Tonasket is a bit out of the way to be picking up here and then returning back up there.  I fear it would be a bit more time and money - probably 1.5 hours each way (minimum) plus time on site.  So, I think I'm going to try to tap a guy from church here that apparently is a wizard with equipment and rent an excavator out of Okanogan from the local place there.

Of course, if he'd want to meet me there some weekend that might work, too.  I'm just in the early planning stages on this driveway.  Gotta go to the top of the hill with it and then dig a basement/foundation.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 10, 2012, 12:25:17 AM
Quote from: JavaMan on January 09, 2012, 11:06:57 PM
Well, Tonasket is a bit out of the way to be picking up here and then returning back up there.  I fear it would be a bit more time and money - probably 1.5 hours each way (minimum) plus time on site.  So, I think I'm going to try to tap a guy from church here that apparently is a wizard with equipment and rent an excavator out of Okanogan from the local place there.

Of course, if he'd want to meet me there some weekend that might work, too.  I'm just in the early planning stages on this driveway.  Gotta go to the top of the hill with it and then dig a basement/foundation.

Getting the guy from Church would be great if you could.  That way you ride out together, haul the hoe and return etc....but you need a GOOD tuck.  Tom's Dodge 2500 4x4 hauled that Bobcat Trackhoe very WELL!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on January 10, 2012, 11:17:19 AM
Well, we wouldn't ride out together, most likely.  He's got a 3/4 ton Chevy (being a Ford man myself, I can't understand it, but, there's no accounting for taste...) and one of those gigantic dump trucks - which he uses to tow his matching backhoe when needed.  So I'm sure he'd be able to tow it.  I'm not sure my F150 would pull it much beyond the end of the county road (if that far)

I'd ask him to bring his own backhoe, but I fear the fuel for that trip would break the bank :o
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Buckeye on January 10, 2012, 06:37:46 PM
Are you pretty happy with the woodmizer? I was going to buy a kit and finish my own, but that LT-10 looks like about the best buy around. Anything you don't like about it?

Thanks-
Buckeye
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 10, 2012, 07:11:52 PM
Quote from: Buckeye on January 10, 2012, 06:37:46 PM
Are you pretty happy with the woodmizer? I was going to buy a kit and finish my own, but that LT-10 looks like about the best buy around. Anything you don't like about it?

Thanks-
Buckeye

I love it :)

For the money it can't be beat and the new ones have an even better table.

If I had the money I'd get a LT28 I think but I can't afford a bigger one.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Buckeye on January 10, 2012, 08:09:10 PM
Thanks for the feedback. I'm kind of in the same boat as you. I have to cut down 3 black walnut trees (about 16" diameter) on my homesite to pour concrete. Most loggers around here don't want to deal with only a few trees, and I don't want to drag them to a mill. I was poking around looking at some of the DIY sawmill kits when I came across the LT10. I don't think their price new can be beat!

Buckeye
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 10, 2012, 10:34:56 PM
Quote from: Buckeye on January 10, 2012, 08:09:10 PM
Thanks for the feedback. I'm kind of in the same boat as you. I have to cut down 3 black walnut trees (about 16" diameter) on my homesite to pour concrete. Most loggers around here don't want to deal with only a few trees, and I don't want to drag them to a mill. I was poking around looking at some of the DIY sawmill kits when I came across the LT10. I don't think their price new can be beat!

Buckeye

It can't be beat and mines paid for ;)  I mean, the knotty pine I milled on it would have cost me MORE then what the mill cost me.

That walnut would be fantastic to mill!  Send some my way!!!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 13, 2012, 09:41:24 AM
I'm sorta getting used to going less to the property this winter.  Though I'd almost decided to go this weekend I managed to force myself to wait one more.  Why?  Well just can't get enough done during the winter to justify the $150 in travel costs twice a month -- at least not right now.

It's not that I can't afford it mind you, it's just that the funds can be better spent elsewhere.

However :)  That doesn't mean I can 'work on the cabin' at home.  My son is back to planing lumber and I hope to have all the pieces of the ships ladder (the stair portion anyway) planed and ready to assemble this weekend.  I'll have all weekend to work on the rise/run angles since I took measurements previously just for this reason.  My hope is to have all the parts ready to assemble right down to holes drilled, grooves grooved and bevels beveled  d*

With luck, my next trip will involve installing the ladder as well as getting some siding done :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 21, 2012, 12:04:57 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_1672.jpg)
Got the log rack last night :)  Arrived with a dozen farm fresh eggs too!  Can't beat that!

Anyway, it's pretty darn nice if you ask me.  The wife LOVES it and I'll have a rack strong enough to stock all the wood we need for a weekends trip to the cabin :)

We load up before we go so when we arrive we're stocked and ready to warm up the cabin without having to start our trip by cutting kindling, searching for paper and chopping wood :)

This will also help in keeping things neat -- something I hate is when the logs leave dirt and chips everywhere!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Gary O on January 21, 2012, 03:20:20 PM
Nice

You're a busy guy, OJ.
Do you envision yourself (in a few years) headin' to the cabin one day, but not making the return trip?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 21, 2012, 08:14:52 PM
Quote from: Gary O on January 21, 2012, 03:20:20 PM
Nice

You're a busy guy, OJ.
Do you envision yourself (in a few years) headin' to the cabin one day, but not making the return trip?

YES!  Or at least not making the return trip for LONG periods of time.

I'm always trying to convince one of the kids to plan on living at home in our big house so we can keep a room and plan on being here when we want.  Then we can leave for the cabin and come back when we feel like it but we have bills to pay first!

Of course I'm also always trying to convince my step-son to farm the property so we can be there and have lots of milk, eggs, cheese, butter, fruit, canned goods, veggies and more without having to buy them ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 31, 2012, 12:29:56 PM
Well after a LONG wait (a month no less!) we're heading back this weekend!

Hoefully the Solar panels have kept the batteries alive (I'm worried) but I pan to get a new controller (outback) and then will RMA the Morndstar and sell it to anyone interested.

Going to go up with the MRS and burn slash, shovel snow and enjoy a weekend! I hoe there isn't too much snow though!  We're taking the truck and I haven't tried driving it in 12" plus of snow so it might be an adventure!

Can't wait to get the new log rank in place though!  and see if the wood shed tarp roof held up to all the snow we've had!  Temps look to be in the single digits at night and the snow has apparently just been dumping on us up there -- might need snowshoes!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 05, 2012, 09:12:23 PM
Too much to tell, too little time so I'll try to post more later....basically:  awesome weekend!  [cool]  Solar power was working, batteries were charged and I was able to correct some of the settings and improve things a little :)

Got the log rack in, had an awesome time and got lots of pictures :)

Here's a couple:
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Cabin_Feb2012.jpg)
New log rack doing it's thing

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/NewRack3.jpg)
Here it is just put in place.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Drive.jpg)
Our driveway (well ok, a short section of it -- in all it's about 1/2 mile long)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: sako on February 05, 2012, 11:44:36 PM
It sure sounds like a great weekend, cant wait to hear more. I dont think we'll make it up until march.
Looks like the weather could not have been better.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 06, 2012, 12:55:50 AM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Warming2.jpg)
When we arrived Friday I was sooooo happy to see the batteries completely charged and ready for use!  We got the place warmed up with the wood stove and kerosene heater (took about 4 hours) and had a light dinner.  Then just played crib until bed time :)

Another great weekend started!  Above is my wife staying warm by the wood stove.  It does take a while to warm the place but I hope that when it's fully insulated it won't take quite as long!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Darci_Erik.jpg)
I'm a lucky man :)  Not sure how I lucked out here but hey, I'm not gonna tell her! :P
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 06, 2012, 01:03:45 AM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Drivewayup.jpg)
This is the part of the driveway that you MUST be prepared for.  Chains are a must, big aggressive ones and best on the FRONT not rear...in this case I was in the truck and not sure if the front end had the clearance needed so I left them on the read....it was a little, interesting, to put it mildly but we made it up with a little faith and creative driving!  :o d*

Can't wait for the Jeep to get finished!  New T-Case (well, actually new to me anyway) and a welded up header and we should be back to a better snow driving rig!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/CoolChick.jpg)
Pistol packin' wife :)  Hey, if I get jumped by a cougar or somethin' she's got my back!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Erik.jpg)
Some fat $@@#rd....oh wait, that's me!  Ya, cheesy staring off into the blue yonder pose for y'all...and yes, I look a little scrubby but we all know cabin days are dirty days!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Darci2.jpg)
On top of the world :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Darci_Cabin.jpg)
All smiles, all weekend.  We both love staying at the cabin :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 06, 2012, 09:28:36 AM
The weather was fantastic Sako -- yes cold at night (down to 15) but warm and sunny during the day.  It hit 43 or 44 on Saturday.

In fact, anywhere there was direct sunlight the snow was only about 3 or 4 inches deep....in the ruts of roads it would get as much as 12" deep and where the sun didn't hit it as much it was 6-8" deep...crazy.

All in all it was a fantastic weekend and I miss being there already!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: sako on February 06, 2012, 07:09:02 PM
You guys have a beautiful place. October was the last time we were over, fuel is a killer.
Keep up the great post.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 06, 2012, 08:07:45 PM
Quote from: sako on February 06, 2012, 07:09:02 PM
You guys have a beautiful place. October was the last time we were over, fuel is a killer.
Keep up the great post.

Thanks :)

Ya fuel is tough isn't it?  Luckily I've been able to budget it in so we can make trips every month (twice a month in the warmer months).
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 09, 2012, 02:51:56 PM
For those following my troubles with the Morningstar controller I wanted to update you:  after the last trip I'd reset the controller to an earlier setting (June of last year) in hopes that maybe something wasn't working right with my current settings (based on battery manufacturer recommendations).  When I arrived at the cabin the batteries were fully charged and as usual the controller was in an alarm state for Battery High Voltage.

I reset the controller (I always do at this point to clear the alarm and start tracking while there) and we settled in for the day with full power.

Later I checked the logs and saw some odd things:
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/02052012mppt.jpg)
My volts max daily was way off showing volts ABOVE 15.5v which is the recommended equalize voltage.  I had not set the controller to do so.
The setting was actually set below the 14.8v absorption charge recommended to 14.5v so seeing the charger push the volts to nearly 16v was a bit disconcerting!
Battery temps were screwy with many not reporting correctly but rather with some number like 255 or 254 -- ??
Power output daily was also way off...something was clearly amiss.

I set the controller back to an earlier setting and everything returned to normal.

Then I noticed that the Battery High Voltage alarm was coming from the charger reporting 51v on the battery bank -- ah....NO!  So, the controller has an issue no doubt but it is working to charge the batteries now at the correct levels so I'm crossing my fingers that it is a move in the right direction while I wait to get another one.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on February 09, 2012, 03:16:59 PM
Temperature:  Is that reading supposed to be actual temperature in degrees F or C, or is it simply some arbitrary number that the remote battery sensor provides to the charge controller or log system? Outback uses a system where the number reported means nothing in terms of real temperature. It is relative to higher and lower numbers and can be referenced to charts.

The absorption and float columns are confusing as well. Are the values minutes? With some of the values very high I'm assuming minutes, but that would be good to verify.

Why are there so many days with values of zero or 1 for absorb? When I see that on our system it indicates a cloudy day and a battery bank that is discharged some. The system does not make it out of bulk, so the absorb time is zero. In that case float may be zero too.

But when we are not using power, our system quickly regains charge and then the system spends the programmed interval in absorb and then sits in float till the module output falls too low to be useful.

I wonder why float was zero so often? Was it so cloudy that there was not enough sunlight to trigger the system? That seems doubtful as some of the days with zero float also indicate 15+ volts on the battery. Float times seem odd. And under normal charging the voltage should not venture into the 15 volt range at all to my way of thinking. Of course the shortcoming with a daily max or min reading is we do not know for how long. Was that a brief spike or a longer interval? 

Is there an automatic, programmable, equalization feature? Could it be misbehaving? 

How does the fluid level hold up?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on February 09, 2012, 03:21:15 PM
Is there a weather station near you that could let you see if the weather might have been cloudy or sunny on certain dates? Mesowest (http://mesowest.utah.edu/index.html) may have some among its many.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 09, 2012, 05:31:27 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on February 09, 2012, 03:16:59 PM
Temperature:  Is that reading supposed to be actual temperature in degrees F or C, or is it simply some arbitrary number that the remote battery sensor provides to the charge controller or log system? Outback uses a system where the number reported means nothing in terms of real temperature. It is relative to higher and lower numbers and can be referenced to charts.
I think the temperature setting is supposed to be in Celsius but clearly some of the numbers are not.  I honestly don't know why those show up that way.

Quote
The absorption and float columns are confusing as well. Are the values minutes? With some of the values very high I'm assuming minutes, but that would be good to verify.
Yes minutes.

Quote
Why are there so many days with values of zero or 1 for absorb? When I see that on our system it indicates a cloudy day and a battery bank that is discharged some. The system does not make it out of bulk, so the absorb time is zero. In that case float may be zero too. 
These went to zero after I used my iota charger back in December and didn't start reporting again until New Years weekend when I reset the controller and changed some of the setup settings.  Not sure why this happened but we did have plenty of days where it should have gone into absorption.
Quote
But when we are not using power, our system quickly regains charge and then the system spends the programmed interval in absorb and then sits in float till the module output falls too low to be useful.

I wonder why float was zero so often? Was it so cloudy that there was not enough sunlight to trigger the system? That seems doubtful as some of the days with zero float also indicate 15+ volts on the battery. Float times seem odd. And under normal charging the voltage should not venture into the 15 volt range at all to my way of thinking. Of course the shortcoming with a daily max or min reading is we do not know for how long. Was that a brief spike or a longer interval? 

Is there an automatic, programmable, equalization feature? Could it be misbehaving? 
Wasn't too cloudy too often but certainly a lot of snowy days in there -- as for the settings, I do think they were misbehaving by just looking at the voltages.  They were way too high in December after my last attempt to adjust them and after I used the Iota charger.

Quote
How does the fluid level hold up?

Fluid levels are remaining stable without any need to add water.

Thanks for the reply!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 09, 2012, 05:34:22 PM
I sent a note to Morningstar and told them that their support sucked!  And guess what?  They responded!
QuoteSo far your support has sucked.
Hey Erik,
             you can send me your config file and I'll help you out. Sorry for the delay in our response.


Regards,
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Woodswalker on February 12, 2012, 08:03:13 AM
Erik,

That's a really nice log rack.  Great that you get up to your place in the winter too.  Having your spouse along, packing heat, makes the trip special (& safer).  A couple of young guys I know who guide hunters up near Whitefish, MT pack heat like that for grizzlies.  Those bears are probably not an issue where you are, but cougars could be.  Friends of mine who live up the hill from my cabin have been chasing cougs with hounds, and have treed 3 this winter.  They dart the cats and take a dna sample that is submitted to F & W.  Thanks for the nice pics, and keep up the reports.  Am sure you are an inspiration for many on the forum.

Steve
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 12, 2012, 10:35:06 AM
Quote from: Woodswalker on February 12, 2012, 08:03:13 AM
Erik,

That's a really nice log rack.  Great that you get up to your place in the winter too.  Having your spouse along, packing heat, makes the trip special (& safer).  A couple of young guys I know who guide hunters up near Whitefish, MT pack heat like that for grizzlies.  Those bears are probably not an issue where you are, but cougars could be.  Friends of mine who live up the hill from my cabin have been chasing cougs with hounds, and have treed 3 this winter.  They dart the cats and take a dna sample that is submitted to F & W.  Thanks for the nice pics, and keep up the reports.  Am sure you are an inspiration for many on the forum.

Steve

Thanks for the kind words Steve.  And yes, I agree 'safer'!  I taught my entire family to shoot (what Marine doesn't) and handle firearms to add to that.

We've got black and brown bears, cougars, wolves, coyotes and the occasional grizzly though I've yet to see tracks of either bear near our cabin (did see some black bear tracks up on top of the hill about 1/4 mile away a couple years ago though).

It's been my experience that the woodsman (or woman) who carries rarely makes the news...while the one that doesn't can -- if you know what I mean? ;)

Cheers and thanks again
Erik
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Yonderosa on February 12, 2012, 03:19:42 PM
Just a few miles northwest of you my bro-in-law has been tagging a Bear every year - mighty good eating Bears too - all within bow range of his cabin.  The last one was trying to push in the front door, so he went out the side and shot him right there on the front porch.  The neighbors were real glad to get rid of that one as he had become quite a pest breaking into vehicles and buildings.

All the Bears I've seen around my place have been pretty shy.  One was too busy with what he was eating to pay me much mind so we just gave him a wide berth and made our way by.  The critter that I'm most skert of is those winter starved Mooses.  They get down right aggressive and that is a lot of creature to get away from.  Haven't come across one on foot yet luckily and I don't think I could get outta the way quick enough.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: sako on February 13, 2012, 07:08:21 PM
I am only about a mile from Eric and we have them at our place all the time, skill saws running, hammering don't
seem to bother them a bit. We have a good size meadow and they come right out in the open, the only one to
ever run away was a small sow with a cub. They like the small ant mounds in the meadow.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on February 15, 2012, 02:15:14 PM
I still say we need to have an Okanagon jamboree or something like that.

Eric, just saw your comments over on the blog - thanks for the kind words!  One of them had a bunch of extra stuff in it that I couldn't figure out how to edit out (from the office anyway).   
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 16, 2012, 05:13:46 PM
Looks like snow this weekend but we might head up to the cabin to enjoy a three day weekend and get some work on the interior done.

Don't mind the snow at all really, since the insulation is mostly in now and the wood stove works great...course there will be limitted solar production but then that's what the generator is for ;)

Hoping to get up there Friday afternoon (before dark)...so wish me luck!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 20, 2012, 07:06:24 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Winter.jpg)

We arrived Friday at the cabin and were able to get settled in and the place warmed up in the usual fashion.  It's become quite a routine for us now.

Open doors, check solar power, turn on inverter, fire up wood stove, fill and light kerosene heater (when needed), move in and relax around the wood stove until warmed or it's bedtime :)

The weather was cold but not bitterly so and there was roughly the same amount of snow as our previous visit (6-8 inches) though in some places it was closer to a foot and still in others possibly deeper (I was walking on top of it at times so wasn't sure how deep it was).  All in all another winter trip.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/WestWall-1.jpg)
Saturday, after breakfast (Corned Beef Hash and eggs with coffee), we got right to work.  We had to finish off the insulation in the west wall, re-organize our junk and then cut and nail up the paneling.  We finished around dinner time and feeling good about ourselves took some time to relax after a long days work.

Of course this is when I lamented forgetting my jack and coke!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Westwall2.jpg)
I was much happier with the way this wall turned out and how we did the paneling.  Instead of doing one side at a time for the slanted section, we did both together.  This helped keep everything symmetrical -- at least that's my story!

When we were finishing off the wall however, I was reminded of an 'oops' we'd made when correcting the out of square north wall (some may recall my jeep, a winch and a lot of pulling being involved there)....the gabled end rafters on the North wall weren't perfect.  Why not?  Because someone nailed off the now square wall before checking that it was perfectly plumb floor to ceiling.

Yes, Yes I know, it's not good.  But then it's a cabin right?

Actually, in all fairness it sucks that we missed that and nailed the wall off and left it but it is what it is and only a short portion of the wall was out.  So, in the end we'll forever have a funny corner....but then it's a cabin right?  lol

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Footofsnow.jpg)
We got a few inches of snow Friday night / Saturday morning which made things a little interesting but that's why we chain up right?

Actually, on that topic I want to add this:  The first time I chained up the truck (late last year) I put them on the rear.  I did this because I'd read somewhere that some trucks don't have clearance in the front for chains (a friends dodge being one of them).  So rather then risk it I went with the rear.  We made it up to the cabin 'ok' but I didn't like the feel at all!  Nothing like driving my jeep with chains on all 4 or even the fronts.

This trip, having checked and knowing I can put them on the front (though it's tight) they went on the fronts and boy let me tell you!  WHAT A DIFFERENCE!  Yes sir, I know I've preached this before but in our truck it makes a TON of difference.

I cannot tell you how much better it was going up to the cabin and driving on level ground in the frozen snow when the chains are up front.  Try it, you'll like it.

Anyway, I digress!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Loftwalls.jpg)
Sunday we got cracking and insulated the north ceiling and wall (what wasn't already done) and began paneling.  It was a LONG day working on our knees but we managed to get up the 30" from the loft floor to the ceiling and an additional 22" up the ceiling too.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Loftwalls2.jpg)
Despite the 'wow' in the corner thanks to the goof up mentioned earlier we are pretty happy with the result!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Loftwall.jpg)
Nothing like home made pine panel!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Loftwall3.jpg)
I really can't get enough of it!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/LoftEastWall.jpg)
It also brightens things up a bunch!

Anyway, a couple comments:  insulation!!!  Yes, the ceiling only 90% insulated on the North side and less then 10% on the south side and WOW!  Hardly have to run the stove to keep the cabin warm in below freezing weather!  Heck, I actually had to turn the Fridge up! (to make it colder)!!!  Sweet!  I can't wait to have it all insulated.

Lastly, we realized that we will need between 120 and 200 more 1/2" pine boards to complete the interior and with just 30-40 on hand we've got some milling to do.  SO our next trip will have to be for milling more trees into lumber -- but we have a few that still block the solar panels!

For now
Erik
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Woodswalker on February 21, 2012, 11:20:14 AM
You guys did good with the insulating and pine board install.  That gable looks very nice - more work involved, but well worth the effort.  Chuckled about the "oops."  Did a similar one building my cabin.  At least I planned ahead, so that mine is on the least-visible end.  Next summer when it gets hot, you'll also notice the difference full insulation makes.

Thanks for the chain-up tip.  I'm from MN, so have installed chains on rear wheels.  Have not owned a 4 x 4 until recently.  Now have a '05 Nissaan Pathfinder.  Totalled my '96 Chev pickup last July on a trip home from the cabin.  Fell asleep at the wheel doing 70 on I-90, E of Moses Lake.  Drifted toward the median, and scraped along a cable barrier until stopped.  Took out a dozen steel posts. Niether me nor the dog (on floor) was injured.  Was my only accident in about 50 yrs of driving.  Patrol gave me a ticket for "driving with wheels off pavement."  Not going to do that again.  Felt like a miracle to be alive.

Steve
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on February 21, 2012, 02:08:50 PM
Some great pictures!  I'm hoping that the road into my place doesn't get much worse than what you're showing there.  I am hoping to get up there the second weekend in May... but that will only happen if there isn't a ton of snow between now and then.

Your pine paneling is looking GREAT!  Looks like you're making good progress. [cool]
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Yonderosa on February 21, 2012, 02:50:58 PM
Looks fantastic!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 07, 2012, 12:35:03 PM
Let the milling begin!

Probably going to be a COLD rain/slush on us but we're going up to mill some more paneling and blue stain this weekend!  Can't wait!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: sako on March 07, 2012, 10:30:32 PM
The pine walls look fantastic, maybe we'll see you around town were are going over
this weekend also, four days whoohoo.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: ajbremer on March 08, 2012, 04:50:30 AM
Your panels look great!

I'm planning the inside of my countryplan 20x30 1 1/2 story walls to look pretty similar to yours. Thank you for taking the time to post such great pictures.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on March 08, 2012, 12:15:07 PM
Looks great, OJH! 

I'm watching the pass cam at Loup Loup and getting excited - it hasn't been this "melted" this early in years!  I might just make it up there in May like I'm planning.

The savings is beginning for my own mill ... so hopefully this summer I'll have one and begin milling and planing myself!

If no one has said it already, I love the pine paneling  :) d*  For some reason I always thought it was darker, but it sure brightens up the place!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 08, 2012, 02:07:11 PM
Quote from: sako on March 07, 2012, 10:30:32 PM
The pine walls look fantastic, maybe we'll see you around town were are going over
this weekend also, four days whoohoo.

We ought to get together one of these trips -- we'll have to plan for it as we tend to go straight to the cabin and only leave on Sunday when heading back home.  So unlikely you'll see us around town.

Perhaps when the weather improves we should schedule a BBQ
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 08, 2012, 02:08:01 PM
Quote from: ajbremer on March 08, 2012, 04:50:30 AM
Your panels look great!

I'm planning the inside of my countryplan 20x30 1 1/2 story walls to look pretty similar to yours. Thank you for taking the time to post such great pictures.

Thanks :)

I love to look at it when I there and when I'm not so I take lots of pictures!  It's one of those things that's like fine art, you just can't help but to stare! :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 12, 2012, 02:49:13 PM
This weekend at the cabin was both good and bad.  The bad part was that my son was sick and fighting off an allergic reaction that might have also given him bronchitis so he was also fighting that off.  So for him the trip was mostly a lay around, sleep, take drugs and relax weekend ;)

At the same time my wife nearly lost a finger on our saw mill (not from the blade) when helping me move a log on it.  She thought she was picking it up and got a finger pinched when she realized she wasn't :(  Didn't break it though but pinched it very badly.

To make matters more exciting, the composting toilet backed up when it froze on us over night :(  Had to thaw it completely out before using again...ahhh the life! lol

Clearly we have work to do getting that secondary lou done :P

Anyway, after arriving, however, we did manage to get a window cased in blue stained pine and installed a dart board.  For those who don't know me (most of you I'm sure) I also run a successful website like countryplans.com -- only mine is dedicated to promoting the sport of darts!  sewa-darts.com or dartplayer.net are the urls to my site.  I used to play competitive darts I guess you could say and still enjoy the game with friends and family (no more dreams of being world number one!  d* ). 

So putting up a board in the cabin is a natural thing for us :)
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Dartboard.jpg)
Finally got a board up :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/BlueStain.jpg)
Started some interior trim -- that is blue stained pine from an old windfall we milled up.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/BlueStain2.jpg)
Closer look at the window casing.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/NewLumber.jpg)
About 300 board feet of blue stained pine we just milled.  Will use in a couple months after its had time to dry.

Hoping to get back soon to start falling and milling a few more trees.  It's time to get enough lumber ready for the remainder of the cabin!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: sako on March 13, 2012, 10:44:49 PM
Our weekend was a little crazy to,  put a little deck on our shed/mini cabin. Fell pretty hard a few times in the crummy snow.
Your pine in the window looks great, the grains and colors are wonderful. I work for a building materials company and it never gets old
looking at the knots and grains in the wood.
I think we passed you on the a valley road sun. around 10:30, we were going to the shower house by the store.
We will have to do that bbq sometime for sure. I think Karl and Yonderosa are pretty close?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 14, 2012, 08:42:23 AM
Quote from: sako on March 13, 2012, 10:44:49 PM
Our weekend was a little crazy to,  put a little deck on our shed/mini cabin. Fell pretty hard a few times in the crummy snow.
Your pine in the window looks great, the grains and colors are wonderful. I work for a building materials company and it never gets old
looking at the knots and grains in the wood.
I think we passed you on the a valley road sun. around 10:30, we were going to the shower house by the store.
We will have to do that bbq sometime for sure. I think Karl and Yonderosa are pretty close?

In a big blue dodge?  Not sure if that's the truck but I passed someone going the other way and for whatever reason I couldn't help thinking I should know them....the guy driving was looking at me while I was looking at him lol d*

What showers are those?

Sorry to hear about the falls!  That sucks, the ice and slush can be tough at times eh?  But being out in the woods is always good :)

Now I just need to get back in a week and a half and get back to logging some trees and milling them up and maybe case another window or two :)

Cheers
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Karl on March 18, 2012, 07:29:37 AM
We definitely want to get together this summer.

Right now we're living off your pictures since I'm on a project in Belfast.  Looks like the snow hasn't been bad at all and we could have gotten in if we'd been around.

I think sako's talking about the showers in the meadow that Sun Ranch members share.  Anyone know if others can use them for a fee?

-Karl
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: oifmarine on March 18, 2012, 02:15:12 PM
Looking good MARINE!   [cool]

Semper Fi
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 19, 2012, 08:50:03 AM
Quote from: Karl on March 18, 2012, 07:29:37 AM
We definitely want to get together this summer.

Right now we're living off your pictures since I'm on a project in Belfast.  Looks like the snow hasn't been bad at all and we could have gotten in if we'd been around.

I think sako's talking about the showers in the meadow that Sun Ranch members share.  Anyone know if others can use them for a fee?

-Karl

It's been deep enough to make you glad you have 4 wheel drive and chains but not so deep that if the 4 wheel drive quits you have to turn back ;)

I'm hoping to head back this coming weekend if all goes well.  Have to do some falling and milling to lay up some lumber for late spring and summer ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 19, 2012, 08:50:34 AM
Quote from: oifmarine on March 18, 2012, 02:15:12 PM
Looking good MARINE!   [cool]

Semper Fi

Thanks MARINE! :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Toyotaboy on March 19, 2012, 09:38:28 PM
OJh,

I've been watching your thread for awhile. Very impressive. I just started my thread it's the 24x24 Northern Wisconsin Cabin.

The reason I'm contacting you is about the composting toilet. We have to put one in due to DNR issues. What make and model do you have and what

problems have you encountered? The big question is how often do you have to empty it?  How bad is it when that has to be done?


The other question if I can ask, is how much did your solar system cost? How many watts is your system? My brother wants me to wire it for a generator ( he's

an electrician and thinks solar isn't worth the time or money).  I think that's his union viewpoint.

Thanks!

P.S. You know what MARINE stands for don't you?  My Ass Rides In Navy Equipment  (Hee Hee)!!!  I'm a a former Naval Photographer E-5! West Coast Navy.

Wimmie
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on March 19, 2012, 10:11:56 PM
The biggest drawback to composting toilets is that the composting action stops when the temperature of the compost material drops to about 50 - 55 F.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 20, 2012, 12:21:05 AM
Quote from: Toyotaboy on March 19, 2012, 09:38:28 PM
OJh,

I've been watching your thread for awhile. Very impressive. I just started my thread it's the 24x24 Northern Wisconsin Cabin.

The reason I'm contacting you is about the composting toilet. We have to put one in due to DNR issues. What make and model do you have and what

problems have you encountered? The big question is how often do you have to empty it?  How bad is it when that has to be done?


The other question if I can ask, is how much did your solar system cost? How many watts is your system? My brother wants me to wire it for a generator ( he's

an electrician and thinks solar isn't worth the time or money).  I think that's his union viewpoint.

Thanks!

P.S. You know what MARINE stands for don't you?  My Ass Rides In Navy Equipment  (Hee Hee)!!!  I'm a a former Naval Photographer E-5! West Coast Navy.

Wimmie

Thanks :)  I'll answer below (might be easier).

1. What make and model do you have -- Sunmar centrex 2000 AC/DC -- this unit has the central tank/composter and we installed one commode -- it can take more then one.

2.  what problems have you encountered? -- not really any serious problems but here is what we've experienced:  The DC fan should be allowed to run at least enough to dehydrate the unit sufficiently.  SO rather then just while you're at the cabin it's a good idea to let it run while you are gone if you or the family use a lot of water and return frequently.  We have gone every two weeks most of the time so leave it running in the warm months full time. -- The only other issue really is the freezing of the unit.  Ours is installed outside of the cabin in a small shed that is not insulated yet.  The sewage pipe is insulated but we and heat taped but we only run the heat while there.  So, this winter it's frozen up on us (and last) when someone doesn't make absolutely certain that it's fully drained before leaving for a couple weeks (leaving means no heat tape and no heat in the cabin with sub freezing temps).

3.  The big question is how often do you have to empty it?  -- Hmmm...I'd guess I emptied it maybe 4 times in 18 months?  Seriously.  It's amazing how much composting the waste reduces it!  Light use may only require emptying once a year, twice at most.  Whereas our level of use means it must be emptied (two drawers anyway) in the spring and then a couple times over the summer I guess....and maybe a drawer or two in the fall -- but this year I will empty more in the fall to allow more holding capacity.

That's one thing that we had to work with this last trip, the tank wasn't full but the mountain of 'stuff' that was frozen made it almost unusable until I thawed it out....very tough.

4.   How bad is it when that has to be done? -- no big deal really.  Honestly, it's not bad at all and you get used to the whole 'experience'.  But seriously, it isn't all that bad frankly.  Not much smell at all.

Only other issue is flies around the tank (when it was not enclosed etc) but I treated with Diatomatious Earth (sp) and usually that's enough to keep them down.

As for the solar I'd guess I have about $4000-$4500 into it (off the top of my head) and while I should really have a bigger battery bank it does work well for us :)  In the summer I can run the fridge 24x7 without even batting an eye :)  So it's always cold and ready when we arrive back at the cabin again.  However, in the winter it's touch and go, but that's what our $300 genny does for us :)  Just crank it up and let it charge the batteries for a few hours and we're good to go.

So, wiring for a generator is kinda what we have ;)  The generator is hooked to a 55amp Iota battery charger so I can fire it up and charge the battery bank when needed but I've only had to do that maybe 2 times in the last year or more....it's not a very common occurrence.

Erik

PS.  I'm installing a Privy for those winter visits just in case the composter gets frozen up -- if you can't do a privy, consider having a port-a-pot as a back up jut in case it's been 5 below and everything is frozen solid!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Toyotaboy on March 20, 2012, 09:07:56 AM
Thanks OJH,

That was the same model I was looking at. What drainage is needed? I didn't think that united needed drainage. I'll have to recheck your thread.

I plan to put the composting bin in the basement crawl space area below the cabin. I'll insulated it too. I could run the fan off a single battery with a solar battery recharger when I'm not there.

Thanks

Wimmie
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 20, 2012, 06:27:59 PM
Quote from: Toyotaboy on March 20, 2012, 09:07:56 AM
Thanks OJH,

That was the same model I was looking at. What drainage is needed? I didn't think that united needed drainage. I'll have to recheck your thread.

I plan to put the composting bin in the basement crawl space area below the cabin. I'll insulated it too. I could run the fan off a single battery with a solar battery recharger when I'm not there.

Thanks

Wimmie

Comes with a 1" hose (or maybe 3/4") that you run to a French cess pit for excess drainage when the unit is heavily used.

If you won't have AC power other then solar or a generator then it's possible to do away with the AC/DC model and go 'non-electric' -- then just install a PC fan into the 4" vent stack pipe and save a bunch of money :)  Actually, the salesman at Sunmar suggested that but I went with the AC/DC model so I could run the heater/dehydrator and AC fan with the generator in colder months or under heavy use.  Truth is, I use the genny for that more often then to charge the solar bank.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 22, 2012, 02:40:43 PM
Looks like I may have solved my cistern filling problem :)

For the longest time I've been trying to solve the problem of filling my cistern with solar panels, batteries, a controller and a timer/relay.  The idea was that I could set the timer to run the well pump for an hour a day pumping about 80 gallons per day and that after 10 days I'd have the cistern full (from nearly empty).  Then I could adjust the timer to match usage.

However I ran into some problems!  When first deployed I left the cabin secure in thinking that the cistern would be filled when I returned only to discover that something went wrong and the batteries were completely drained in my absence and little water was pumped.  Thinking the pump was faulty I rebuilt it, then replaced it but still the problem occurred.

I finally decided that maybe there was something wrong with the cheap Costco solar panels I'd rewired to 24vdc (instead of the original string setup of 12vdc/60watts) so I dismantled the system and waited to resolve the problem.  Then I discovered this:

P-LCB-7: 7 amp input includes connection for water level:
QuoteLINEAR CURRENT BOOSTER by SOLAR CONVERTERS
Tracks maximum power point of solar modules. Used with DC pumps powered directly by solar modules (without batteries) makes pump start and run slowly in low light of morning or overcast, when it otherwise would not start.

With this and a 190watt solar panel (24vdc) I could run the pump without batteries.

Furthermore, the LCB comes with two connections for a float valve.  You can wire the float even if it's 300 feet from the LCB apparently (confirmed by Backwoods Solar technicians).  So, by adding this: http://www.deanbennett.com/mechanical-float-switch-for-fill.htm

I'll have to run some small gauge wire to the pump to complete the circuit but once in place it should run the pump whenever the water is lower then 'full'.

I'm pretty excited because panels are running $1/watt at Sunelec right now!  So I'll be order all the parts this weekend and as soon as the ground thaws I'll install the float etc.

With luck I'll be able to keep the cistern full without having to turn the pump on manually or check the cistern visually.  I can then run a line to the cabin and one to the orchard and get my trees planted!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Toyotaboy on March 22, 2012, 04:10:43 PM
OJH,

Thanks for the info on the composting toilet. I'll check out both models.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 23, 2012, 01:39:04 PM
welcome :)

If it's in the basement and the basement can get to 50+ in the winter then chances are you will be glad you have it.  Only thing to consider is that the vent pipe (s) do have to go up above the roof to draft so placing in the center of the basement won't be good but near an outer wall will be.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 26, 2012, 08:26:18 AM
Picked up two rolls of barbed wire and 25 7' posts for the 'orchard'.  Also plan on taking other measures (like string, electric etc) to discourage the cows and deer from eating our trees).

Will order trees today :)

Also ordered a work bench and vise for home -- don't have one and really need one though it will be in a 'shop tent' because I also don't have a shop!  Am excited though because I will be able to clamp down the rail pickets and strip them of bark now :) and have a place to install the tenon cutter and such.

Kind of exciting :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 30, 2012, 12:15:58 AM
OK!  Got my Linear Current Booster and my Cistern Float Valve in and ordered my 190 watt solar panel to run the well off of :)

All I need now is the wire from the well to the cistern and a WHOLE lotta digging!

Can't wait!

Now I need to remember to print an order for my trees (they don't do online sales I hear) and then it's back to the cabin in a week to get back to work!  WhooHoo!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 03, 2012, 05:39:46 PM
I need a cabin trip!

:)  Just a couple more days and then I'm off!  Not sure what I'll get done but I'm thinking some milling and maybe a little logging.

Got my 190watt panel ordered along with cable and should be able to have it up and running soon!  Can't wait!

Also got my apple trees ordered and am planning a LOT of work over the next couple months :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 09, 2012, 09:14:03 AM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cleaner.jpg)
Spent Friday afternoon, Saturday and Sunday morning at the cabin and it was bliss!  Got lots of clean up work done, burned slash and did some reading...then had to head home for Easter dinner and to watch the grandkids find all the eggs.

Next weekend will be heading back for more cleanup work and perhaps finally, some milling!  It's great to be out there and I cannot describe how awesome I feel when working on the property!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: ajbremer on April 10, 2012, 06:05:25 AM
It's great to be able to spend time where you love the most. I'm going to feel the same way you do when I get my roof on!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 16, 2012, 12:31:23 PM
Had another great and productive weekend at the cabin!

We burned a TON of slash from around the cabin, moved the sawmill to a better location and milled up some 3/4" blue stain pine for future projects, fell, cut and chopped some fir for firewood, fell another fir for firewood (but didn't get to buck it up and chop yet), started on the orchard fencing and pumped about 350 gallons of water into the cistern -- and watched it run back into the well!  Can you say 'Check Valve'!?

Next trip I'll get the orchard fence finished and put in a check valve on the pipe to the cistern (there may actually be one there but it isn't working if there is) and begin the install work on the well pump power we're changing too.

We pumped a ton of water and were getting lots of the well when it was pumping and felt good about the results but then ran out later.....I then got the bright idea to check the level of the water in the well and discovered where all the water was going!

When we started pumping I didn't check the level but after 3 hours of solid pumping the water was at 54 feet (the pump is at 83 feet).  So I had LOTS of water still.  I pumped another hour and then checked the next morning and found the water at 21 feet!!!!

Only answer I can think of is that the water is flowing back into the well after we stop pumping.  I think it's time to install a check valve.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: pmichelsen on April 16, 2012, 01:45:18 PM
After dealing with faulty check valves at my place I will recommend you go with a ball check valve. I have had good luck with them.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 16, 2012, 04:56:17 PM
Quote from: pmichelsen on April 16, 2012, 01:45:18 PM
After dealing with faulty check valves at my place I will recommend you go with a ball check valve. I have had good luck with them.

Do you have a brand you recommend?  I've got 1" pvc pipe to the cistern so am looking for an inline valve that I can install, bury and forget ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 19, 2012, 08:31:00 AM
I've been negligent in posting pics lately...so here are some ;)

My daughter came out last week (from Chicago where she's stationed in the Navy) and helped burn slash and clean up the place:)
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/MyKid.jpg)

She brought a friend along (strapping young Airman) and with his help and a neighbors help we moved the mill :)  I like it much better in it's new home and can drag logs past it much more easily now (and the big dead leaning tree can't fall on it now).
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/IMG_2117.jpg)

On this last trip my wife and daughter were a riot!  They took the ATV and trailer and ran around picking up all sorts of slash to burn and laughed the whole time!  It was so good to see them having so much fun and working on the land :)
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/IMG_2126.jpg)

Anyway, it was a fantastic trip and we managed to clean up a lot of ground.  When the grass starts to grow it might look a lot different!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: CjAl on April 19, 2012, 10:04:43 PM
she must be at great lakes naval base. i know it well.

btw, what causes that blue staining on pine? i have noticed most the pineocally that we get milled turns blue
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on April 19, 2012, 10:40:39 PM
Blue stain is caused by a fungus found in/on mountain pine beetles. The fungus weakens a pine trees ability to fight off the beetle infestation. Many trees die from the beetle infestation. healthy uninfested pines once cut can be affected if the logs sit around with the bark still in place. The pine beetles love cut trees, burrow in and lay eggs. That leads to another round of new beetles looking for new trees to infest. nasty circle.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 19, 2012, 11:52:54 PM
Hmmm....thought it was a sap mold...either way, every tree I've cut and left laying on the ground for a long time has gotten it.

Trees I cut and mill right away never get it.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on April 20, 2012, 12:07:19 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on April 19, 2012, 11:52:54 PM

Trees I cut and mill right away never get it.

Yup!   :)

Read up here (http://www.forestbusinessnetwork.com/3104/the-biology-behind-the-lodgepole-pines-blue-stain/)

or here (http://www.southernpine.com/using-southern-pine_special-topics_blue-stain.asp)

Mold grows on the surface. Blue stain penetrates the wood; I guess that's why they call it a stain.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 20, 2012, 08:10:26 AM
Thanks Don, interesting stuff!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 20, 2012, 08:20:44 AM
Interesting article (the first one) until the writer loses me with the 'climate change' and 'greenhouse gases' (neither of which are a 'foregone conclusion' by any means -- actually the greenhouse gas theory has been shown to be completely false in that there is no 'greehouse effect' at all but that's a whole 'nother discussion!  Though I could add that trees breath CO2 and therefore LOVE the additional amounts that may or may not be in the atmosphere -- ok let me stop here because I could go on and on and on about the arrogance of man and the 'flat earth' mentality of the Global Warmingists.......but I won't).

So, the beetle and the fungi give us blue stain and may have come from Afrika....interesting.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: CjAl on April 20, 2012, 08:43:00 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on April 20, 2012, 08:20:44 AM

So, the beetle and the fungi give us blue stain and may have come from Afrika....interesting.
so its tree aids. lol

sorry, bad joke. funny, but bad




thats interesting. so can it be transfered to healthy trees is they are.milled after infected trees?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on April 20, 2012, 09:26:10 AM
Whether or not climate change, greenhouse gases and all that is real or whether or not the individual subscribes to any particular theory really does not matter. Mountain pine beetles were around over thirty+ years ago and we had the blue stain pine back then too. Back then my local lumber yard sorted the T&G 1x material into that with blue stain and that with no stain. They charged a premium for the blue stained boards back then as some people thought it looked pretty

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Don_P on April 22, 2012, 06:01:40 AM
Bluestain and wood go together from the beginning.
I remembered a fair micrograph of it in cells in Dr Wheeler's wood tech course material From NCSU.
http://legacy.ncsu.edu/WPS202/fungi/decay.slides/sld009.htm
The bluestain hyphae are the darker material running horizontally within the rays. It tends to follow those "spokes" in as deeply as possible first then either goes though the pits (the valves of the cell) that join the vertical wood cells (you can see some of the bordered pits as what looks like bubbles on the sides of the tracheids and along the lower edge of the rays) or the tip of the hyphea simply dissolve their way through the cell wall and go cell to cell slurping sweet water. There are some better slides at SUNY you could probably find if its of interest.
These are some shots from topside, the fruiting bodies;
http://www.pbase.com/laroseforest/sac
We had one client that requested blue pine on his log home logs (I bit my tongue). They happily gave him what he requested. When we had a long wet spell prior to roof, the logs bloomed. Once we were dried in he decided to sand them and didn't wear a mask.  Nothing permanent but it is not a good thing to suck in.

It does not have to come from a beetle attack, the spores are all around us. During warm weather if I don't get a freshly sawed surface below ~25% moisture within a day or so spores landing on the wood will have adequate conditions to begin colonizing.

To prevent bluestain in freshly sawn logs or lumber there are 4 factors at play. It needs moisture, dry the wood. It needs oxygen, pond or spray the wood. It needs food, poison the wood. Or, it needs the right temperature, cold or extreme heat stops it.

If you do not debark you can often see the innoculation that occured when the sawblade pulled spore covered bark down through the cut.  To prevent that turn the log and enter clean wood as soon as possible.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 26, 2012, 02:40:05 PM
Got a $10 1" PVC Check Valve today :)

Hoping to get it installed this weekend!  Also heard my 190 watt solar panel will arrive tomorrow!  I might have to delay leaving until the panel arrives so I can try to get it installed too!

WhooHoo!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on April 27, 2012, 08:53:25 AM
My trip is getting closer!  YOu'll have to fill me in on the snow and how much is left (if any) in the higher altitudes up that way.

Gonna start buying supplies this weekend.  Gotta get bearings for the front of the truck and put them in, too. >:(

I'm starting to get "itchy" to get up there.  I sure hope the snow is gone enough.

I'll be interested to see what you all get done this weekend :D


Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 29, 2012, 11:44:43 PM
No snow anywhere I could see so I think you'll be fine!  It was 71 for a moment or two yesterday (around 4PM I think) and otherwise in the 60's.  Very nice weekend!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 29, 2012, 11:55:11 PM
Headed out to the cabin in hopes of fixing the water pump issue (ok actually the water losing issue) with a check valve.

When I got to the cabin I began digging (after firing up the wood stove and moving in of course) and exposed the pump pipes coming out of the well.  I discovered I had the wrong size check valve so ran to town to get something else -- made it by 6:45pm and they were closed!  DOH!

Next time I'll borrow my neighbors phone and call!

Next morning I ran to town first thing and got a new valve and some different couplers etc to make sure I had all that was needed.  Got back to the cabin and put in the check valve.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/CheckValve.jpg)

At this point all was going well and I pumped water for 6 hours!  That should have put a good 350+ gallons of water in the cistern.......

An hour after pumping I had 'ok' water pressure....hmmm......a little later and it was even lower....something still isn't right but it was better then before.

In the morning I was almost out of water!!!!  No real pressure and just a trickle coming out of the pipe.  SO I got a shovel and started digging up the cistern.  It was time.

My neighbor stopped by and watched for a bit, made some suggestions and then left to get another shovel (bless his heart!).  When he returned I'd exposed the lid and outlet/inlet pipes but had a bit to dig yet and he jumped right in to help out.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Cistern.jpg)
Both Richard and Sharon are great neighbors!

After some work we exposed everything and found a leak right at the inlet to the cistern.  I was also starting to realize this was a much smaller tank then I had been told.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/325.jpg)
Yup, that's no 1000 gallon tank!!!!  That ticked me off something smart but I just shrugged it off -- what can you do anyway?

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Cistern1.jpg)
The pipes were put in TOTALLY wrong and one elbow wasn't even glued at ALL!!!  Grrrrr

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Full.jpg)
Hey wait a minute!  I thought I was out of water....not so, the cistern was completely full and I now suspect it ALWAYS was.  Or at least I'd filled it and overfilled it whenever I used any water...it was clear that as long as I put pressure on the tank by pumping water into it past the inlet line that there was enough pressure to force water past the leaks and down to the spigot.

I sort of put things back together enough to at least say it's better then it was and left it exposed until I can get back with parts to build it correctly (in two weeks).  Couldn't get the siphon action to start again though so only had a trickle coming out of the tank when I left :(  Oh well, I have to replace the inlet and outlets anyway so next trip I'll fix that, install the float valve and hopefully get the water moving again.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on April 30, 2012, 09:36:10 AM
I've lost track..... the cistern was in the ground when you bought the land?

Looks like our tank. You can get an extension for the manhole if you decided you wanted more readily available access.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 30, 2012, 11:02:21 AM
Quote from: MountainDon on April 30, 2012, 09:36:10 AM
I've lost track..... the cistern was in the ground when you bought the land?

Yes.  We were told it was a 1000 gallon cistern (I think the realtor may have said "pretty certain" but either way I KNOW he said 1000 gallons and we took his word for it) and it was installed on the hill above the cabin about 40 feet higher. 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 30, 2012, 12:02:08 PM
So here are my latest challenges:

1.  Fix the inlet and outlet connections at the Cistern.  (need proper fittings for that)
2.  Install the float valve (pretty simple) and a penetration (water proof) for the wiring to exit through.
3.  Install manhole cover riser to bring cover to grade (or just above).
4.  Install UG foam insulation above Cistern for frost protection.
5.  Find out if I need to insulate the manhole cover to prevent freezing??
6.  Install spigot on water main (temporary) and hose to orchard location for watering trees.
7.  Get garden timer to water trees off Cistern
8.  Set timer on well pump to refill cistern after each watering until float valve is hooked up.

I also need to learn more about the siphoning action of the system and how it works and can be improved (if possible).  Also if I can install a 12vdc RV pump into the line at the cabin to increase water pressure without the need of another tank?  After all, it will just draw off the cistern right?  But it is over 300 feet away and 40 feet above...hmmmm

With the water issue resolved I then have to learn how to put up a good barbed wire fence!


Ahhhhh cabin life!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on April 30, 2012, 12:10:08 PM
1. Look for "bulkhead fitting".

I've bought from these guys (http://www.aquacave.com/Search.aspx?k=bulkhead).

I've used both the traditional screw together ones and the Uniseal. Uniseal are good where it's not under dirt cover, IMO; hanging free in the air.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on April 30, 2012, 12:16:23 PM
Quote300 feet away and 40 feet above...

RV water pumps suck at lifting water. Or maybe that's RV pumps don't suck very good.   ;D


Six or seven foot max lift on the Shurflo we have, IIRC,  and that is really pushing its ability. It pushes water higher but I've never tried to see how high. Yes, it does lift a few feet, but it does it very slowly; the output flow is low and the pump makes more noise. My experience has been that an RV water pump inlet should be at the same level as the bottom of the tank feeding it.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 30, 2012, 12:24:14 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on April 30, 2012, 12:16:23 PM
RV water pumps suck at lifting water. Or maybe that's RV pumps don't suck very good.   ;D


Six or seven foot max lift on the Shurflo we have, IIRC,  and that is really pushing its ability. It pushes water higher but I've never tried to see how high. Yes, it does lift a few feet, but it does it very slowly; the output flow is low and the pump makes more noise. My experience has been that an RV water pump inlet should be at the same level as the bottom of the tank feeding it.

OK but what if it is 40 feet BELOW the bottom of the tank feeding it?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 30, 2012, 12:25:01 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on April 30, 2012, 12:10:08 PM
1. Look for "bulkhead fitting".

I've bought from these guys (http://www.aquacave.com/Search.aspx?k=bulkhead).

I've used both the traditional screw together ones and the Uniseal. Uniseal are good where it's not under dirt cover, IMO; hanging free in the air.

Thanks - mine is under dirt so I need to find the right kind for that application -- I'll check them out.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on April 30, 2012, 12:38:52 PM
This series (http://www.aquacave.com/075-Bulkheads-P395.aspx)

The fitting halves screw together and then pipe fitting screw into it from both sides. Lots of sizes.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 30, 2012, 12:59:26 PM
Found this: http://www.tank-depot.com/productdetails.aspx?part=FA0100PO

and this: http://www.tank-depot.com/engineerdata/fitting-installation.pdf

And read this:
QuoteA plastic tank must be operated at atmospheric pressure (air must enter and exit the tank as it is filled and
emptied).

This lead me to wonder if I have too small a vent on my cister?  The vent that was installed in the side is a 1/2" pipe and the inlet is 1 1/4" and the outlet is 1".

There is also a 1 1/2" pipe installed in the manhole cover/lid that is capped off but the cap is not sealed.  The bottom of the pipe is drilled as if to allow air to enter the tank but the holes are at the bottom of the pipe so they would be submerged -- leaving me to believe the purpose was for checking water level not venting.

Anyway, I'm thinking that I should install a much larger vent (1 1/4") to ensure pressure is atmospheric and well balanced between the inlet/outlet -- am I over thinking this?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 30, 2012, 01:10:13 PM
Here is one that really has me wondering -- and doing this:  ???

How do I activate the siphon on my cistern once I fix the connections at the tank?  The pipe is empty so there is no water in it down to the Frost Free Spigot/Hydrant so I can't open that up to get the suction working and the pipe in the cistern is not flexible so I can't just pour water into it and then place inside the tank.

So what to do?  Put a shop vac on the spigot?  Seriously!  I'm lost here.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on April 30, 2012, 01:27:53 PM
QuoteOK but what if it is 40 feet BELOW the bottom of the tank feeding it?

If the pump was pushing water up 40 feet vertically I would think there would be a pressure loss at least equal the gravitational induced pressure caused by the head... 0.43 x 40 feet = 17.2 PSI. Then I'd think there would be some friction loss in pressure from the 500 foot distance horizontally. If the RB pump puts out 40 PSI that may leave enough pressure to work. We run our house on 25 PSI and I'll admit the flow is slower than we'd have if I adjusted the pressure up.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on April 30, 2012, 01:31:22 PM
We use a 1/2" diameter pipe for a vent and have never had a pumping issue. Air flows easier than fluids. Plus I have a shrubbery irrigation bubbler as an insect screen and that restricts the air flow I'm sure. (Bubbler control screw is removed so it can't somehow be closed)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on April 30, 2012, 01:32:39 PM
I installed a bulkhead fitting in the lid to permit dipping to check water level with a wood stick.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on April 30, 2012, 01:35:17 PM
Further note on the pusher pump..... that line would be below frost line? But how to protect the pump from freezing.


Siphon... ???  Or you pressurize the cistern for a minute or two to force water "over the hump"  ???

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 30, 2012, 01:37:11 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on April 30, 2012, 01:27:53 PM
If the pump was pushing water up 40 feet vertically I would think there would be a pressure loss at least equal the gravitational induced pressure caused by the head... 0.43 x 40 feet = 17.2 PSI. Then I'd think there would be some friction loss in pressure from the 500 foot distance horizontally. If the RB pump puts out 40 PSI that may leave enough pressure to work. We run our house on 25 PSI and I'll admit the flow is slower than we'd have if I adjusted the pressure up.

I think you're confused.

1.  I have a sureflo 24vdc well pump that pushes the water INTO the cistern (up from the well water level to the Cistern - can be over 100')
2.  Water is then fed via siphon/gravity to the spigot down by the cabin.

I'm asking if I put an RV pump at the spigot by the cabin will it increase flow since it will be sucking DOWN from the Cistern.

Only lift it needs to do is from where it's installed (ground floor level) to the shower head).
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 30, 2012, 01:38:37 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on April 30, 2012, 01:35:17 PM
Further note on the pusher pump..... that line would be below frost line? But how to protect the pump from freezing.


Siphon... ???  Or you pressurize the cistern for a minute or two to force water "over the hump"  ???

I was thinking that might be the answer -- to pump until the water is above the level of the outlet but wasn't sure.

Once it's fixed it will probably work better then it did this weekend!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 30, 2012, 01:39:38 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on April 30, 2012, 01:35:17 PM
Further note on the pusher pump..... that line would be below frost line? But how to protect the pump from freezing.


Pump installed under the sink or similar -- drain cock below the pump, water main shut off below frost line.

Just turn off the water, drain the lines and leave :)  Like using an RV system
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 30, 2012, 01:41:07 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on April 30, 2012, 01:31:22 PM
We use a 1/2" diameter pipe for a vent and have never had a pumping issue. Air flows easier than fluids. Plus I have a shrubbery irrigation bubbler as an insect screen and that restricts the air flow I'm sure. (Bubbler control screw is removed so it can't somehow be closed)

Good to know, thanks.

This is what caught my eye:
QuoteIf 3" or 4" outlets are used or rapid
dispensing is possible, an additional vent fitting should be considered.

I was thinking that I might need a little more due to the amount of 'suction' as the siphon draws water down the long pipe to the spigot.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on April 30, 2012, 01:55:10 PM
QuoteI think you're confused.

Yes, I was confused.  That's why pictures and drawings are my best friend.   ;D

I think the RV pump should be happy as a booster pump.  Seems logical, for what that's worth.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 30, 2012, 02:21:56 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cistern.jpg)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on April 30, 2012, 02:31:52 PM
I think, in theory, it should work.

A limiting factor may be the ability of the 1" pipe to deliver the volume of water needed by the pump. ???  Is the pump going to suck water away from the inlet pipe faster than gravity can replace it?  I have no idea if that is a factor. Just something that comes to my mind. It won't be any problem if the natural gravity flow at the end of that 1" pipe, in GPM, at least matches the GPM maximum flow of the pump. I think. ???
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 30, 2012, 02:34:43 PM
Hmmm....I was thinking the problem would be the power of the pump to draw water from so far away?  Otherwise it would just keep the gravity pressure the same and do nothing....maybe??

Basically the pipe goes over 300 feet from the spigot to the Cistern so the RV pump would have to suck water from the cistern at a faster rate then gravity already provided in order to increase pressure to 30PSI or better.

Perhaps I'm asking too much of an RV pump and would need something a little more powerful  ??? ???
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 30, 2012, 02:40:33 PM
I should not that my reason for asking this is that I want to install an instant on propane hot water system and learned that I needed greater water pressure for it to work -- like 30-35psi -- which lead me to ask these questions.

I guess the next best think might be to install a small propane fired hot water tank instead.

Another issue I have ( d*) is that I ran my hot water lines OUT the back wall of the cabin.  At the time I was thinking that was the best option for what I wanted to do.  Now, today, I'm doing this  d* and wishing I'd resolved the issue BEFORE putting up dryway etc.

So, what to do???  I think the answer is to pull them back in, seal the holes and cut open the dryway (since it isn't finished anyway) then run the pex over to the kitchen (perhaps under the floor and heavily insulated and heat traced) where I can install a hot water heater of some sort or another under the kitchen sink.

Not sure what other options would be good -- I'll keep doing this:  ??? and this:  d* until I figure it out! lol
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 30, 2012, 02:43:15 PM
On a side note I replaced my MorningStar MPPT controller with a new one Sunday so next trip out I should hopefully be getting better readings off the darn thing :)

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 30, 2012, 03:44:20 PM
http://www.dynamicplasticsolutions.com/UndergroundTankInstall.php
Found that today.

I'm going to order the fittings and see if I can find a manhole extension to install on my tank so I can get the cover/lid above grade (where it should be).  Then get this thing working correctly and see what happens then.

If I find the tank is actually 40 feet or more above the cabin floor then I will plumb it in and see how well it works :)  After that I can worry about pressure since I have  A LONG time before it will be an issue anyway :)

Meanwhile, I need to order those parts and then start studying fence building techniques!  I have trees coming soon!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on April 30, 2012, 03:56:46 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on April 30, 2012, 02:34:43 PM
Hmmm....I was thinking the problem would be the power of the pump to draw water from so far away?  Otherwise it would just keep the gravity pressure the same and do nothing....maybe??

Basically the pipe goes over 300 feet from the spigot to the Cistern so the RV pump would have to suck water from the cistern at a faster rate then gravity already provided in order to increase pressure to 30PSI or better.

Perhaps I'm asking too much of an RV pump and would need something a little more powerful  ??? ???

Watch that pressure does not get confused with rate of flow or the volume delivered to point of use.

The pump is not going to have to draw any water. Gravity is the delivery agent to the pump. The pump is to boost pressure only.

If the cistern is 40 feet higher than the point of use the pressure is 0.43 x 40 = 17.2 PSI. That is the maximum the current gravitational pull can generate over that distance. That does not take friction in the pipe into account.

If the pipe is 1 inch in diameter or if the pipe is 5 inches in diameter, the pressure is the same at the point of use, without taking frictional loss into account. . However the volume of water that can be delivered is much greater with the 5 inch pipe.

A simple chart (http://flexpvc.com/WaterFlowBasedOnPipeSize.shtml) illustrates theoretical flow... It does not account for distance, bends and elbows, heights, etc.  Chart #2 shows a 1 inch straight pipe capable of 26 GPM at 20 PSI while 5 inch pipe is listed at 2895 GPM at the same pressure. That would be one heck of a shower! Pressure still the same but watch out for the volume.

Shurflo RV pumps models range from 1 to maybe 4 GPM delivery. That makes me think that the gravity fed volume through the 1 inch pipe should be able to keep up with the RV pump even with some distance and a few bends, elbows or valves in the length. Emphasis on theory, but probably worthy of an experiment.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on April 30, 2012, 03:59:59 PM
QuoteI guess the next best think might be to install a small propane fired hot water tank instead.

If you find any smaller than 30 gallons please let us know. I searched and searched for propane fueled tanks of ten or fewer gallons and have never found any.  I'd figure out what water heater will be used before making any changes to the pipes.


Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on April 30, 2012, 04:04:44 PM
From what I can see of the tank top in the pictures it looks a lot like the one we purchased from TankDepot. manhole extension from them too.

http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=2335.msg94915#msg94915 (http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=2335.msg94915#msg94915)

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 30, 2012, 04:25:16 PM
THanks Don,

It occurs to me that I need to know the lid size  d* 16" or 22" -- I think it's a 22" lid but now that I'm 250 miles away I can't say for certain
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on April 30, 2012, 07:00:51 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on April 30, 2012, 04:25:16 PM
THanks Don,

It occurs to me that I need to know the lid size  d* 16" or 22" -- I think it's a 22" lid but now that I'm 250 miles away I can't say for certain

I'm not sure, but I thought I saw a place across from Hamilton Farm Equipment in Okanogan (might even be them) that carried a lot of those "plastic" tanks.  They might have your extension ... it's not real close to you, but it sure isn't 250 miles away!  They were up the road from the lumber yard (south) on the east side of the river.

If you're heading that way ... you might check and see if the Cattlemans Cafe is still there (right next door to the lumberyard, in the old cattlemans auction building). Great food - decent prices.  At least the last time I was there
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 30, 2012, 11:23:46 PM
Quote from: JavaMan on April 30, 2012, 07:00:51 PM
I'm not sure, but I thought I saw a place across from Hamilton Farm Equipment in Okanogan (might even be them) that carried a lot of those "plastic" tanks.  They might have your extension ... it's not real close to you, but it sure isn't 250 miles away!  They were up the road from the lumber yard (south) on the east side of the river.

If you're heading that way ... you might check and see if the Cattlemans Cafe is still there (right next door to the lumberyard, in the old cattlemans auction building). Great food - decent prices.  At least the last time I was there

Thanks!  I'll check them out on my way back up.  Should be able to get a seal and other things from them I imagine.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on May 01, 2012, 02:18:47 PM
I think if you go to Their Website (http://www.hamiltonfarmequip.com/) you could get the phone and call to see if they had all the parts you need before you stop
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 01, 2012, 02:48:55 PM
Quote from: JavaMan on May 01, 2012, 02:18:47 PM
I think if you go to Their Website (http://www.hamiltonfarmequip.com/) you could get the phone and call to see if they had all the parts you need before you stop

Sweet!

Spoke with one of their reps and they keep bulkhead fittings in stock so I can pick them up there.  He said I could use silicone sealer on the gasket as long I get the potable water safe type and I think I actually have the riser at the cabin (am not 100% sure but there was one that I'd forgotten about and I'm hoping I didn't toss it out).

He also said that if you use the water a lot then it won't freeze but if you leave it for long periods in the winter then it's a good idea to put some insulation under the lid in the riser -- also saw somewhere that you can mound up the dirt around it to help also.

So that's the plan ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on May 02, 2012, 07:08:40 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on May 01, 2012, 02:48:55 PM
Sweet!

Spoke with one of their reps and they keep bulkhead fittings in stock so I can pick them up there.  He said I could use silicone sealer on the gasket as long I get the potable water safe type and I think I actually have the riser at the cabin (am not 100% sure but there was one that I'd forgotten about and I'm hoping I didn't toss it out).

He also said that if you use the water a lot then it won't freeze but if you leave it for long periods in the winter then it's a good idea to put some insulation under the lid in the riser -- also saw somewhere that you can mound up the dirt around it to help also.

So that's the plan ;)

For all the help I get from this place, I am glad I was finally able to provide someone else with some info that has helped out!   ;D

Glad to hear they were able to help you out.  I've always found them to be quite friendly and helpful.  I hope to rent an excavator from them later this summer. 8)  I fear I may have to pay to have it delivered, tho ... I don't know if my 4.6L 8 could pull it up the hill to my place.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 02, 2012, 08:10:18 AM
Quote from: JavaMan on May 02, 2012, 07:08:40 AM
For all the help I get from this place, I am glad I was finally able to provide someone else with some info that has helped out!   ;D

Glad to hear they were able to help you out.  I've always found them to be quite friendly and helpful.  I hope to rent an excavator from them later this summer. 8)  I fear I may have to pay to have it delivered, tho ... I don't know if my 4.6L 8 could pull it up the hill to my place.

Borrow a 5.7 from someone!  Cheaper then paying the cost to deliver (at least it was a TON when I looked around a couple years ago -- more then the cost of the rental).  Had my buddy do it instead.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 02, 2012, 08:10:55 AM
Heck, pick a weekend, offer to pay gas and $200 and have Tom drag it up there and run it for ya ;)  He's an excellent operator and a good guy.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on May 02, 2012, 09:18:52 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on May 02, 2012, 08:10:55 AM
Heck, pick a weekend, offer to pay gas and $200 and have Tom drag it up there and run it for ya ;)  He's an excellent operator and a good guy.

This might be the option.  I think it's $75 each way for delivery... and I'm assuming that's only if they don't have to leave the county road.  Which they will, for about 7 miles. d*  Oh, wait ... I just looked, that's $75/hour.  And I figure it's probably 1.5 hours round trip, so about the same.  Not much cheaper.  Plus, that's only one trip!

It would probably cost that much just to get it delivered and picked up.

Hmmm ... now I'm going to have to do some thinking and budgeting so I can pick a weekend   ??? :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 02, 2012, 12:48:34 PM
Quote from: JavaMan on May 02, 2012, 09:18:52 AM
This might be the option.  I think it's $75 each way for delivery... and I'm assuming that's only if they don't have to leave the county road.  Which they will, for about 7 miles. d*  Oh, wait ... I just looked, that's $75/hour.  And I figure it's probably 1.5 hours round trip, so about the same.  Not much cheaper.  Plus, that's only one trip!

It would probably cost that much just to get it delivered and picked up.

Hmmm ... now I'm going to have to do some thinking and budgeting so I can pick a weekend   ??? :D

They quoted me $600 to deliver and bring back.....I had Tom do it!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on May 02, 2012, 02:25:43 PM
Well, that is a pretty good savings.  I figure it'll cost me about $500 for the entire deal if I have Tom do it... which wouldn't be too bad.  I've got June 7th penciled in for the second trip up - which might make a good time to get my excavating done.

Guess I'll have to save a couple hours or so the first trip to mark what I want excavated next time  ;D  If I don't do it then, it will be waiting until August or Sept...

Thanks for the tip! [cool]
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 02, 2012, 11:05:08 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Stairs.jpg)
Got home today and figured out the angles I wanted to use for my ships ladder stairs.  Technically they won't actually be a 'ships ladder' because I beleive to be classified as such they'd have to be closer to 68-70 degrees whereas they are 58.5 degrees -- so hopefully a little easier to traverse.

Run is 60 inches and rise is just over 8 feet.  I plan to set the treads at 8" rise each which might be a tad shallow for such a steep stair but I'm thinking it should be ok???

Anyway, I'm loving the look so far!  They are HEAVY but I think that's a good thing though ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 03, 2012, 09:44:18 PM
OH CRAP!!!!!

Our 5 Apple Trees arrived today!  A little earlier then I hoped and with the warm weather we have down here I'm going to have to race up to the cabin tomorrow and plant them.

I'm going to fence each off with 5' farm fencing about 3 feet out from the tree and surrounding them in hopes that will keep the deer from eating them.  Haven't finished the barbed wire fence yet but will have to take my chances becuase I just don't have time to get it done :(  I'll do a little praying and hope that helps.

Then I have to get the dang water situation sorted so I can water the trees daily!  I should have enough water to do so for 10-14 days if I get the timer set right (again, pray) but luckily this is the rainy time of year up there so with luck the watering and the rain will be enough to get them going.

Then memorial weekend I can get the solar panel installed along with the float valve and controller for the well and perhaps even have it all working on a daily basis to keep the cistern full so the trees can be watered twice a week all summer.....hoping so anyway.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Pine Cone on May 03, 2012, 10:09:00 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on May 03, 2012, 09:44:18 PM
OH CRAP!!!!!

Our 5 Apple Trees arrived today!  A little earlier then I hoped and with the warm weather we have down here I'm going to have to race up to the cabin tomorrow and plant them.

I'm going to fence each off with 5' farm fencing about 3 feet out from the tree and surrounding them in hopes that will keep the deer from eating them.  Haven't finished the barbed wire fence yet but will have to take my chances because I just don't have time to get it done :(  I'll do a little praying and hope that helps.

We used 4' fencing around our 2 apple trees and it kept the deer out.  Might want at least three 6' posts to keep the fencing from getting pushed in towards the trees.  The problem we have had seems to be bears in the fall.   They go after the apples and crush the fence.  Not a problem until you have apples.

Sounds like you are making good progress with your water system.  We still don't have our cistern tank in the ground since we are in the rainy part of Washington and our hole didn't drain well enough.  Just got the the neighbor with the mini-excavator to dig our drain ditch deeper, so with luck our tank will be in the ground by Memorial Day.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: sako on May 06, 2012, 09:45:29 AM
We were up last weekend also, just a warning about the 5' fence on the apple trees we had this visitor.
(https://i780.photobucket.com/albums/yy89/sako85300wsm/SUNP0015.jpg)
It has taken two years to finally get a moose pic. Trail cams are like a treasure hunt, we can't hardly wait to check every time we go.
Like allways can't wait to see what your up two next.    Jeff
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 07, 2012, 08:38:20 AM
oh what a weekend!

As you know, I was working on my cistern set up the week prior but then something happened:  my trees arrived!

So off I went with grand plans!  I stopped in Okanagan and picked up the Cistern bulkheads and some fittings to go with them  (slip to thread) and a little knowledge and headed out to the cabin.

When I arrived I was armed with all sorts of things including a valve wrench (for a valve thats 4 feet down or more), a new spigot and fittings to attach it to the main water line stubbed up out of the ground but not previously used.

I was really in a panic becuase I knew the trees needed to be watered, soaked even, and planted ASAP!  So when I arrived at the cabin I double checked the planting book, cut out the trees (from their packaging) and stuck them in 5 gallons of water to soak overnight (I had to get half the bucket from the creek!).

I opened the main and managed to get SOME water out of the system but not nearly enough.  Things weren't going well.

I believed that I could get the cistern providing water if I just got the air out of it and went up to it to figure out what to do...things didn't look good and I realized I needed more parts!  SO I raced to Ace Hardware and picked up the missing ingredients and headed right back to the cabin.....

Once at the cabin I decided to try a few things first (namely run the pump and open the spigot and see if I could force the air out and get the siphon working again).  With that in mind I settled in for the weekend.

Once the trees were planted (my neighbor came and helped) I tried getting water to no avail so I began digging out the Frost Free Hydrant/spigot.  I felt that if I could dig it up and fix it then maybe I'd no longer have a leak or an air inlet and could perhaps solve the problem -- can you tell I have no idea what to do?  But I'm an old jarhead and digging holes I'm good at!  So I DUG and DUG and DUG!

Once I dug up the frost free I found it was not installed properly but it WAS working :(  I'll fix that later but for now it functions correctly so back to the cistern.  It was time to fix it.  But wait, how do you drill a 2 1/8" hole over a 1 1/4" hole?  Carefully (ba da dum).....I'll be here all week ;)

Seriously!  That's HARD!  HAd to hold the drill stead so the hole saw bit didn't tear things up but I managed to get the bulkhead fitting holes drilled and the bulkhead fittings installed.
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_2177.jpg)

With these in I could reasonably assume that the tank could be made to NOT leak and the connections to the tank from the inlet and outlet lines could be installed without leaking too....a plus on both accounts.

I then had dinner (after 8PM) and settled down for the night...I'd been working for 12 hours and was smoked!

Sunday I got up with a plan.  First I would siphon water from a bucket into the outlet line (after I cut it off) and try to force air out.  This worked a little as indicated by the geysers of water that came out at the most inconvenient time!  But clearly air was escaping.  Next I installed the flex pvc to the cistern from the pipes and once it dried I ran the pump to allow even more water to go into the siphon/outlet line.

Finally I installed the piping inside the cistern and let it dry.  Once done the system was, in theory, properly installed.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_2183.jpg)
Flex to the cistern is what the books and experts recommend.  Apparently the tanks can move/swell/flex a bit.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_2186.jpg)
No obvious leaks...the system holds!

My neigh came along and checked altitude....hmmm.....two readings on his GPS put the cistern 100 to 120 feet above the well!  Is it possible?  I never thought it was that much higher and always guessed at 40 feet which do to the crappy pressure at the bottom made sense......but wait.

First test on the spigot down below and water show out of the thing at a rate I've never seen!!!!  WOW!  PRESSURE!......crap.  THe pressure tapers off after about 1-2 gallons and then dies off only to build up a little later but not back to the high pressure of the start....hmmmm.

Shut off the spigot and it shoots out like crazy.  Clearly I have a problem still.  It cannot hold any reasonable pressure for long -- much be an air leak somewhere.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_2193.jpg)
Flow from the well is exceptional so I'm thrilled with that.  In fact, during a test I accidentally overfilled the cistern (as iin pouring out) while trying to let the water get forced out the outlet because of pumping in the inlet....hmmm.....damn air.

Anyway, so for now we're bucket watering the trees (my neighbor is helping while I'm gone) and I'll try some other ideas when I return.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 08, 2012, 08:13:01 AM
On the topic of trees, I didn't get any pictures (sorry!).  I was spending too much time digging  d* to remember.

However what I did was wrap them in a roughly 6 foot diameter 5 foot tall farm fence hung on posts that were driving about 2 feet into the ground.  I then wrapped the trunks (didn't get them all done yet though) with 1/4" hardware clothe.

I also picked up a fence stretcher and various parts for making corners etc so I could get the barbed wire fence done around the orchard next trip.

I'm very excited about the trees and very glad my neighbor was willing to both help out with the project but also drop by every couple days and water them for me since I'm still having issues with my cistern water system.

I'm hoping and praying it's just air in the lines but if it isn't I'm going to get a trackhoe up there and I'll dig the entire 300 feet of pipe up and re-install if I have to! 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on May 08, 2012, 08:52:44 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on May 08, 2012, 08:13:01 AM
I'm hoping and praying it's just air in the lines but if it isn't I'm going to get a trackhoe up there and I'll dig the entire 300 feet of pipe up and re-install if I have to!

ouch! ??? d*  Sounds like a LOT of work
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 08, 2012, 09:01:27 AM
Quote from: JavaMan on May 08, 2012, 08:52:44 AM
ouch! ??? d*  Sounds like a LOT of work

A TON!  I dug up the Frost Free which was down about 4 feet (maybe 5) which means a BIG hole since my rather large rear end needed to be in the hole digging! LOL
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 08, 2012, 02:07:02 PM
Well, I think I might just have to try to plan a weekend with a trackhoe/backhoe to solve my water problem.  I've been talking with a friend who's almost convinced me (it isn't hard) that the problem is the installation.  You see, so much was done poorly that I have to surmise that the 300+ foot run to the main, frost free and spigot was also done poorly and as such needs to be dug up and corrected.

If only it wasn't so hard to rent a trackhoe and pull it up there!  I think the last time cost me almost $300 for the hoe, $200 for my buddy plus gas etc.....so $600 easily.

But then with all the digging I've done and have to yet do I'm thinking maybe it's time to just DO IT.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 08, 2012, 03:14:51 PM
My wife says "just do it!"

So I'm starting to plan a track hoe trip now :)  Going to dig that sucker up!!!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on May 08, 2012, 03:58:59 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on May 08, 2012, 03:14:51 PM
My wife says "just do it!"

So I'm starting to plan a track hoe trip now :)  Going to dig that sucker up!!!
Cool  [cool]  When he's done, send him to my place to put in the road ...   ;D  HA!

Wanted to add a question for you ... where'd you get your steel roofing from? was it a good deal?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 08, 2012, 07:10:53 PM
Quote from: JavaMan on May 08, 2012, 03:58:59 PM
Cool  [cool]  When he's done, send him to my place to put in the road ...   ;D  HA!

Wanted to add a question for you ... where'd you get your steel roofing from? was it a good deal?

Tom would do it.

I got the roofing from the place in Tonasket (can't remember the name but can find out) and it was a much better deal then Home Depot!  So too for the windows, door and other supplies.

Erik
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Yonderosa on May 09, 2012, 10:06:56 AM


QuoteI got the roofing from the place in Tonasket

Was it Midway?

They seem to be very competitive in their pricing AND they deliver.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 09, 2012, 10:30:14 AM
Quote from: Yonderosa on May 09, 2012, 10:06:56 AM

Was it Midway?

They seem to be very competitive in their pricing AND they deliver.

Yes that's it, thanks!  Very nice and good pricing (and delivery was pretty cheap).
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 09, 2012, 10:31:51 AM
So the neighbor put a pump on our water main and ran it -- the report is that we now have more water but that it's dirty.

So, it seems that pretty much confirms my thoughts:  pipes are poorly installed and as such are simply coming apart at the seems (joins).

So, I have to get the trackhoe up there and dig it ALL up!

Guess I'll put in a bigger line while I'm at it then.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 09, 2012, 11:00:18 AM
Seems pipe is about $5-$6 per ten foot section which means I'd need about $150 of piping to replace ALL of the pipe from the cistern to the spigot..

Since it's one inch pipe now I could replace that (since I'm digging it up anyway) with 1 1/4 to 2" pipe (prefer 2" but not sure if I can get a bulkhead fitting into that cistern for that size of pipe) and greatly increase the capacity of the system.

With just the increase to 1 1/4" pipe I will have 1.57 times the capacity of a 1" pipe!  And if I can go to 1 1/2" pipe it will be equivalent to 2 1/4 one inch pipes.

Then I could use the old 1" pipe for spurs off of the main line to the cabin and orchard. :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 09, 2012, 11:20:59 AM
$222 for 2" pipe from the place in Okanagon for 300 feet.

They have the 2" bulkheads for the cistern and he tells me that I can drill a 3" hole in the side of the cistern 'bowl' and that it SHOULD form the side of the cistern correctly and seal because they have enough flex.

The size of the hole is the same for 1.5" to 2" bulkheads so going to 2" makes sense and I can just cap off the old 1" line.

Since I'll have to have a trackhoe I can also put this bulkhead down LOW on the tank and get rid of the siphon -- go straight gravity which has to be better.

I think that's what I'm going to do!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MikeOnBike on May 09, 2012, 11:29:25 AM
This is good stuff.  We are putting in a well this year and have to sort out cistern/no_cistern, well location, electrical for the well, how to supply three cabins with 160' of elevation difference between them, how to bury the pipe in our rock pile.   ???   The list goes on and on...

You thought you had a working water system, what you have is a 'project'.  It sounds like it is time to redo it.  Good luck!

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on May 09, 2012, 11:38:15 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on May 09, 2012, 11:20:59 AM
$222 for 2" pipe from the place in Okanagon for 300 feet.

They have the 2" bulkheads for the cistern and he tells me that I can drill a 3" hole in the side of the cistern 'bowl' and that it SHOULD form the side of the cistern correctly and seal because they have enough flex.

The size of the hole is the same for 1.5" to 2" bulkheads so going to 2" makes sense and I can just cap off the old 1" line.

Since I'll have to have a trackhoe I can also put this bulkhead down LOW on the tank and get rid of the siphon -- go straight gravity which has to be better.

I think that's what I'm going to do!

Sound good!  I like the idea of straight gravity feed, much better than the siphon.  Should work well (no pun intended) ;)

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 09, 2012, 03:22:37 PM
Might be able to get the pipe cheaper here at HD or Lowes (still have to check) but I can already see it's going to have to be done -- with an RV pump working we're only getting 1/2 gallon per minute!  That SUCKS!

So the entire 300 plus feet of pipe will get dug up and replaced with 2" pipe.  I can use the old 1" pipe for the wiring from the cistern to the well (might as well) and can change the course the pipe takes down the hill to make it run more directly to the cabin and orchard :)

So I like that A LOT!

I can also add another frost free spigot (at the orchard) or two (again, might as well right?) and plumb water into the cabin sooner then originally planned.

Time to get planning!!!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 15, 2012, 12:59:03 PM
Oh lord I have CABIN FEVER!

It's been a week and a half since I was last at my cabin.  I planted 5 apples, dug up everything trying to solve a water problem (lack thereof) and left with high hopes of returning with a trackhoe soon......

Thanks to my neighbors for watering my trees every day for me!!!  Without them the trees would have died.

Plans are to get the water problem resolved on the 8th of June (just in time for my neighbors to head back home for a couple months) and then the trees should make it through the summer!  And I can get back to milling lumber and working on the cabin.

Before that I'll go out Memorial weekend and build the rest of the fence to keep the cows out.  Can't wait!!!

Meanwhile, I work in the garden and around the house trying desperately to hold on for another week and a half -- man I have the big super bad!!!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: UK4X4 on May 15, 2012, 06:32:29 PM
You can buy decent water pipe on the roll, rather than individual lengths- makes for a joint free installation
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on May 16, 2012, 06:58:03 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on May 15, 2012, 12:59:03 PM
Oh lord I have CABIN FEVER!

It's been a week and a half since I was last at my cabin.  I planted 5 apples, dug up everything trying to solve a water problem (lack thereof) and left with high hopes of returning with a trackhoe soon......

Thanks to my neighbors for watering my trees every day for me!!!  Without them the trees would have died.

Plans are to get the water problem resolved on the 8th of June (just in time for my neighbors to head back home for a couple months) and then the trees should make it through the summer!  And I can get back to milling lumber and working on the cabin.

Before that I'll go out Memorial weekend and build the rest of the fence to keep the cows out.  Can't wait!!!

Meanwhile, I work in the garden and around the house trying desperately to hold on for another week and a half -- man I have the big super bad!!!
I hear you there, Jarhead... I am finding it difficult to concentrate at the office ... this nice weather we're having here on the wetside is getting me antsy to get out and doing something on the place.

The plan had been to be heading up this afternoon, but the truck needs fixin' first.  But that means I might be able to get some additional work done.  I may even add another day to the weekend.  And if I can convince my boss that I will actually get work done, I might try to telecommute a few days while I'm up there.

LIke UK4X4 said, you can get a roll of water pipe all in one piece. I saw a guy at the blue store with a couple rolls of it over the weekend.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: AdironDoc on May 16, 2012, 07:35:32 AM
Funny how the knowledge that you'll be going up to your camp on the weekend can brace you against just about any BS you encounter during the week! By Tuesday, I'm saying, "It's almost Friday!". Two days at the camp, five days milling around in HD or Lowes wasting money on parts that are never what I actually needed.. God I love it!  :P
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 16, 2012, 08:35:54 AM
Quote from: AdironDoc on May 16, 2012, 07:35:32 AM
Funny how the knowledge that you'll be going up to your camp on the weekend can brace you against just about any BS you encounter during the week! By Tuesday, I'm saying, "It's almost Friday!". Two days at the camp, five days milling around in HD or Lowes wasting money on parts that are never what I actually needed.. God I love it!  :P


hahahaha  aint that the truth! LOL
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 16, 2012, 08:36:29 AM
Quote from: JavaMan on May 16, 2012, 06:58:03 AM
I hear you there, Jarhead... I am finding it difficult to concentrate at the office ... this nice weather we're having here on the wetside is getting me antsy to get out and doing something on the place.

The plan had been to be heading up this afternoon, but the truck needs fixin' first.  But that means I might be able to get some additional work done.  I may even add another day to the weekend.  And if I can convince my boss that I will actually get work done, I might try to telecommute a few days while I'm up there.

LIke UK4X4 said, you can get a roll of water pipe all in one piece. I saw a guy at the blue store with a couple rolls of it over the weekend.

Oh to telecommute from the cabin -- I could if I had internet there! lol
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on May 16, 2012, 08:45:22 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on May 16, 2012, 08:36:29 AM
Oh to telecommute from the cabin -- I could if I had internet there! lol
I have a surefire way to get internet (and power and phone) at the cabin... just convince one of the wireless companies to put a cell tower on one of the corners of the place   ;)  they'll have to maintain the road in, too!

I doubt that I could get any of them to do that, though.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: CjAl on May 16, 2012, 09:36:05 AM
i will bet good money you have air in your line between the cistern and spigot. whrn i was looking into hydro electric setups this was a very comon problem in long runs of pipe. i believe they soldved it by t'n in a vent pipe in the middle of the run and extending it up above the water level. im not sur how this would work for you and youd have to find a way to keep bugs and dirt out of it
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 16, 2012, 10:24:39 PM
My neighbor has been using an RV pump to draw the water through the pipe which may be forcing the air out but he's still getting only about 10psi (rough guess) at the hose in the orchard and is getting about 1.5 gallons/min of flow.

My plan is to install the 2" pipe, fill it with water and then open the valve to get it working -- I think the key will also be to lower the siphon hose on the cistern so it's well below the half full mark.  This will insure the water is being forced down the pipe as long as the cistern is at least half full.

Or so I think!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: CjAl on May 16, 2012, 11:15:19 PM
the pipe needs to be as straight as possible. any sagging and it traaps air at the high points. as you say with the poor quality installation i am sure this is your problem. the high psi for a moment and then tapering off is indictive of an air blockage
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 17, 2012, 08:45:23 AM
Quote from: CjAl on May 16, 2012, 11:15:19 PM
the pipe needs to be as straight as possible. any sagging and it traaps air at the high points. as you say with the poor quality installation i am sure this is your problem. the high psi for a moment and then tapering off is indictive of an air blockage

Thanks -- that has been my thought.  I also think the line is leaking.

I think when we lay the 2" line we will work extra hard to make sure it's straight as can be!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 19, 2012, 04:22:49 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_2236.jpg)
Router setup for cutting 'slots' or 'grooves' in the risers for my stairs (no longer really a ships ladder).

Hardest part is getting each one the right distance from the other (8" rise) but I've got all of them within 1/16" of what they are supposed to be.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_2249.jpg)
Took a long time to finish this side because I had to reset the 'jigs' for each cut -- what I needed was a sheet of plywood with a 5 1/2" slot cut in it....hmmmm......I might have to make one as it would be MUCH faster.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Stair.jpg)
Test fitting a stair tread.  I did this for each one to make sure I had not goofed.

Then I proceeded to work on the 2nd riser and messed up :(  Good thing I have extra pine Milled up!!!!  I cut three slots into the 2nd riser before realizing I was putting them on the wrong side!   d* d* d*

No way to correct that so I'm going to have to plane a new piece of lumber, cut the angles, round the edges and get to slotting it.

I'm just glad I brought home 2 or 3 extra 2x10x10's!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 19, 2012, 04:28:37 PM
To answer someones question (that I think will be asked), I cut the slots 1/4 of an inch.  Why?  Well Scott (and I presume others) don't do this at all but I felt it would make the stairs stronger if I did.  I'll then drill 4 holes per tread per side and countersink them on the outside.  Once I glue and screw the treads in I'll cover the countersunk holes (and screw heads) with plugs so they are hidden.

I've decided to use 3 1/2" deck screws for the job of securely attaching the treads and a good wood glue (and clamps to keep it clamped and glued for 24 hrs.

I'm still debating whether or not I'll build them entirely here at home and then take to the cabin and install, or if like Scott I'll take the pieces and assemble on site.  The problem with doing onsite is that I'm not sure how well that will work doing it mostly alone but we'll see.

One thing I have to work out still is the lower mounting setup.  I think I'm going to use 1/4" steel plate bent 90" and screwed into the risers and floor (with bracing under the floor) and then 2x10 between the risers up top anchored into the studs behind it with the ladder/stair risers screwed into that 2x10 (same size as a stair tread and fit between the risers perpendicular to the stairs - parallel with the wall.

By doing it that way I have to believe it will be very solid.

Then I just have to put some nailers around the top section for the T&G pine panel.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 20, 2012, 01:30:58 PM
Well I should be reporting a finished (rough) set of stairs however I goofed big time  d* and am just now getting the 2nd stringer remade.  Once it's done I can test fit the treads all at once and see how it looks.  Then sand and stain for a couple days and poly coat before heading to the cabin :)  Wish me luck!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on May 20, 2012, 02:12:52 PM
good luck!

They are looking good though!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 20, 2012, 06:12:07 PM
OK, got the 2nd riser done and test fit all the treads.  I've also begun to sand everything and hope to start coating with stain this afternoon!
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Ladder1.jpg)
Here is the first shot of the stairs.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Ladder2.jpg)
Sort of a 'bottom up' view.


Now time to get some ibuprofen (lol) and relax for an hour or so before getting back at it.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 20, 2012, 08:17:41 PM
Let the staining begin!
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_2265.jpg)
First coat of 'Ipswitch Pine' stain.  It will need MORE!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_2262.jpg)
Some window trim I stained while I was at it -- same Ipswitch Pine stain.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_2267.jpg)
Unstained clear pine compared to the stained Blue stained pine.

Ya, I'm having fun :)

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Gary O on May 20, 2012, 08:36:11 PM
Lookin' good OJ, lookin' good
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 21, 2012, 08:04:56 AM
Thanks Gary :)

My wrists are sore from all the sanding etc and my hams are sore form the gardening I did while it tried to rain!  But all in all it's a good feeling to be this close to putting them up!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 21, 2012, 10:08:06 AM
Something else I decided on with these stairs (and other projects like them) is to NOT clean up the lumber too much.  The idea was to not sand all the saw marks etc out so they remain somewhat 'rustic' or at least obviously made from the lumber we milled ourselves.  Both my wife and I like the look but I also like the idea of having the story to tell some day ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: AdironDoc on May 21, 2012, 10:46:35 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on May 21, 2012, 10:08:06 AM
Something else I decided on with these stairs (and other projects like them) is to NOT clean up the lumber too much.  The idea was to not sand all the saw marks etc out so they remain somewhat 'rustic' or at least obviously made from the lumber we milled ourselves.  Both my wife and I like the look but I also like the idea of having the story to tell some day ;)

I like the look you're describing. When I was looking to make some rough cut boards, etc. someone said use an old beat up sawblade on the table saw. I had no old blades, so I went to Lowes. "I'd like your worst blade..one that will rip the h*** out of all my pine", I offered. Three associates just stood there rubbing their chins with eyebrows raised.  :P

I've refurbed some old tables and used an orbital sander with max grit. After the stain went down, plenty of dark lines. I like it.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 21, 2012, 02:24:32 PM
I remember those posts by you -- very cool.

I'm so stoked right now I can hardly concentrate on work at all!  I just want to head home and stain more lumber!!!!  Then I can get it poly coated on Wednesday/Thursday and ready to haul up to the cabin :)

Going to take lots of trim material too but need to remember I have other priorities!  So hard to though!

So, in order of importance:

1.  Install solar panel, controller and switch for well.  Measure distance from well to cistern for float valve wiring.
2.  Measure distance from cistern to cabin and orchard and measure any other piping needs for water to orchard/cabin project.
3.  Build barbed wire fence around orchard.
4.  Sand drywall mud and apply second layer in bathroom -- after dry sand again and prime -- paint if time allows.
5.  Install loft stairs
6.  Install window trim

Luckily my wife is coming this next trip and plans to do the bathroom work so that's not really for me :)  I hope she gets it done too because that means we will bring the tub and shower attachments on the next trip up and I can begin getting it installed!

Considering the water work happening June 8th weekend I'm starting to really get excited!  After all, I could have running water into the cabin by the end of June and hot water around that time too!!!!! Imagine that!  I cannot begin to tell you how cool that sounds :)  A shower?  You bet!

Nothing like getting clean after working all day getting dirty....relaxing at the cabin might just take on a whole new dimension soon :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 21, 2012, 02:40:46 PM
I should also add that my neighbor has been getting water out of the cistern with ease lately.  It seems that using the RV pump for a good 100 gallons or so did the trick and now it's flowing freely and with enough pressure to use a 150 foot garden hose to water each tree with 5 gallons of water (takes 3 1/2 minutes to get 5 gallons).

While that's encouraging, I'm still going to replace the 1" line from the tank to the cabin with a 2" line and install a second Frost Free.

I'm REALLY excited about that!

Also, the trees are very happy and all have budded out and grown leaves/branches etc.  I plan to get lots of pics this weekend.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on May 21, 2012, 03:01:36 PM
That's awesome, OJH!  Gotta love it when the trees are happy enough to stay alive  :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 21, 2012, 03:26:30 PM
Quote from: JavaMan on May 21, 2012, 03:01:36 PM
That's awesome, OJH!  Gotta love it when the trees are happy enough to stay alive  :)

Big thanks to my neighbor for watering them for the last THREE WEEKS!  He's been going daily and giving them 3-5 gallons per day (3 when the water system was not working well and 5 now that it is).

I'm SO happy with that!!!  All five are doing well and protected from the deer.  I figure if I can get the fence completed (to keep the cows out) and get the irrigation fixed then it will be back to milling and construction work :)  Might even have the privy done this summer (which would be nice in the winter months when the composting toilet is just a holding tank).
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 21, 2012, 09:32:15 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/UsingEpoxyResin.jpg)
I read somewhere that the way to protect and secure knots in wood was to use epoxy resin so I am trying some 1 minute epoxy here.

It's been close to 24hrs and still not 100% cured but very close now and didn't run or give me any problems.

With luck this will provide a simple and aesthetic means of keeping the knots from falling out, cracking or lifting in the wood I'm using for our cabin.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/UsingEpoxyResin2.jpg)
So far I like the look and can see how this might really present some attractive ways to keep the knots in place :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: AdironDoc on May 21, 2012, 09:51:30 PM
Can't concentrate, huh? lol. You've got the fever! There are weekends..then there are the 5 days you can use in planning them  ;D ;D

Glad you got some water running. I got clear water running into my springbox finally, and, like you, was able to use a 12V RV pump. That little shurflo I got off amazon not only lifted water through 1/2 inch PEX up a 50 foot incline, but managed to pump it 600ft to the cabin where it filled a 50 gallon rain barrel. Amazing what a small RV pump is capable of. Like you, I've got a solar panel that will connect to a set of batteries. Does the float switch you're using need anything more than thin wire? I've heard that they make relays that work on milliamps.

Well, it's Tuesday tomorrow. Only 4 more days until the weekend. Better stain those boards quickly!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 21, 2012, 10:49:38 PM
Quote from: AdironDoc on May 21, 2012, 09:51:30 PM
Can't concentrate, huh? lol. You've got the fever! There are weekends..then there are the 5 days you can use in planning them  ;D ;D

Glad you got some water running. I got clear water running into my springbox finally, and, like you, was able to use a 12V RV pump. That little shurflo I got off amazon not only lifted water through 1/2 inch PEX up a 50 foot incline, but managed to pump it 600ft to the cabin where it filled a 50 gallon rain barrel. Amazing what a small RV pump is capable of. Like you, I've got a solar panel that will connect to a set of batteries. Does the float switch you're using need anything more than thin wire? I've heard that they make relays that work on milliamps.

Well, it's Tuesday tomorrow. Only 4 more days until the weekend. Better stain those boards quickly!

No batteries!  I discovered they are a liability (as in they stop being useful too easily) so I ditched them in favor of a battery-LESS arrangement.

I have a 190watt 24v panel feeding a controller which operates the well pump as long as the panel has enough power.  The Cistern float valve will be wired to the controller to switch it on and off.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 21, 2012, 10:51:26 PM
And yes!  I have Cabin Fever!

Here is proof!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_2279.jpg)
More stain -- 2nd coat -- went on tonight.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_2286.jpg)
Quick Comparison

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_2283.jpg)
Hmmm.....this might be a problem....how to remove?

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_2282.jpg)
Some stained and unstained lumber in my 'shed'....oh the fun I'll have!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 21, 2012, 11:53:28 PM
I guess the oil in the wood stain softened the sap and caused it to run -- I read that all I need to do is wipe it off...I'll give it a try tomorrow.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on May 22, 2012, 05:20:05 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on May 21, 2012, 11:53:28 PM
I guess the oil in the wood stain softened the sap and caused it to run -- I read that all I need to do is wipe it off...I'll give it a try tomorrow.

OJ you will probably need some mineral spirits to remove the sap.  Chances are that you will have to restain those areas.  Not sure whether it will remove some of the stain and leave lighter spots.  You will have to let us know.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 22, 2012, 08:18:35 AM
Quote from: Redoverfarm on May 22, 2012, 05:20:05 AM
OJ you will probably need some mineral spirits to remove the sap.  Chances are that you will have to restain those areas.  Not sure whether it will remove some of the stain and leave lighter spots.  You will have to let us know.

Thanks I'll have to try that.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on May 22, 2012, 09:03:36 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on May 21, 2012, 11:53:28 PM
I guess the oil in the wood stain softened the sap and caused it to run -- I read that all I need to do is wipe it off...I'll give it a try tomorrow.

Pitch pocket.....goes with the territory.  They start to run most times when they get warmed up good. 

You can after it drains fill with epoxy as well, sand off any residue and pitch.  Then there is the option of side two.





Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: AdironDoc on May 22, 2012, 10:18:20 AM
Quote from: rick91351 on May 22, 2012, 09:03:36 AM
Pitch pocket.....goes with the territory.  They start to run most times when they get warmed up good. 

You can after it drains fill with epoxy as well, sand off any residue and pitch.  Then there is the option of side two.

Noticed the same on my half log porch steps. Sun must have warmed 'em up nice. Now it's been tracking around on people's shoes.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: AdironDoc on May 22, 2012, 10:23:19 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on May 21, 2012, 10:49:38 PM
No batteries!  I discovered they are a liability (as in they stop being useful too easily) so I ditched them in favor of a battery-LESS arrangement.

I have a 190watt 24v panel feeding a controller which operates the well pump as long as the panel has enough power.  The Cistern float valve will be wired to the controller to switch it on and off.

Been wondering about doing the same. I have a small 50W 12V I was gonna use. I also have a third main panel not yet in use. 200W, 27V, I could get a controller for. You'll need to let me know how it turns out. Since you're running straight off the panel, why not just let the pump overfill the cistern and eliminate the switch?

In my case, my spring box overflow pipe is clogged making the water more stagnant than I'd like. Instead of running a fresh pipe and digging a lengthy ditch for it,  I figure if it's pumped out daily, that would make up for it. The daily excess will just spill out, maybe even water some vegetables.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on May 22, 2012, 10:31:16 AM
Quote from: AdironDoc on May 22, 2012, 10:18:20 AM
Noticed the same on my half log porch steps. Sun must have warmed 'em up nice. Now it's been tracking around on people's shoes.

[cool]  Ya!  That what I'm talking about....... [waiting]   I am making a quilting frame for Ellen.  For the trestle that connects the two sides I had saved this 1X8 pine board for that.  One little pin knot in it and straight as a sting.  Then last night I was sanding it getting ready to attach it and  ??? Where the heck did that come from?  I will have to find another board today because I do not wish to suffer the wrath of Ellen if one of her quilts brushed up on some oozing pitch.   GRRR!!!     
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on May 22, 2012, 10:45:51 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on May 21, 2012, 10:49:38 PM
No batteries!  I discovered they are a liability (as in they stop being useful too easily) so I ditched them in favor of a battery-LESS arrangement.

I have a 190watt 24v panel feeding a controller which operates the well pump as long as the panel has enough power.  The Cistern float valve will be wired to the controller to switch it on and off.

How much water are you pumping?  I would real be interested in doing such with our low producing well.  We are looking at about a gallon per minute with a restrictor on it.  The well will do like three gpm is all.

If you needed to you could cycle water to a drip line and landscape plants and berry bushes, and of course your orchard.  From what I have been told by the pump guys it is way harder on them cycling on and off than just running.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: AdironDoc on May 22, 2012, 10:57:14 AM
Quote from: rick91351 on May 22, 2012, 10:45:51 AM
If you needed to you could cycle water to a drip line and landscape plants and berry bushes, and of course your orchard.  From what I have been told by the pump guys it is way harder on them cycling on and off than just running.

That's very interesting info, Rick. My lil' SHURflo 3.0 Revolution is rated for "intermittent use". I suppose the panels will run her from something like 11am to 3pm when the shadows block the panels again. That's intermittent I suppose. Of course at $89, it's not a big deal if it burns prematurely. OJH and I have similar setups and could be we have similar demands too. What's your pump rated for, OJH? Mine's 3gpm, which during the day would likely give me 10 times more than I could use. Also, what's your well's refresh rate? I tried to clean out my springbox, but despite pumping with a 110V high flow pump, she wouldn't drain to less than a foot. Amazing refresh, but not sure of the purity considering it's refreshing so quickly and sitting next to a bog and all.

The water looked so clear sitting in the barrel. If you could only have seen how it looked going in at the other end! Pass me the chlorine please  :P
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 22, 2012, 12:20:16 PM
Quote from: AdironDoc on May 22, 2012, 10:23:19 AM
Been wondering about doing the same. I have a small 50W 12V I was gonna use. I also have a third main panel not yet in use. 200W, 27V, I could get a controller for. You'll need to let me know how it turns out. Since you're running straight off the panel, why not just let the pump overfill the cistern and eliminate the switch?

In my case, my spring box overflow pipe is clogged making the water more stagnant than I'd like. Instead of running a fresh pipe and digging a lengthy ditch for it,  I figure if it's pumped out daily, that would make up for it. The daily excess will just spill out, maybe even water some vegetables.

Got this controller from Backwoods Solar and while it will run from a 75watt panel it's best to run 150 watts or more.

As for overflow, my cistern is buried completely so setting an overflow could be an issue but also, I'd not want the pump to run daily as it can easily pump 80+ gallons an hour.....3-4 hours of pumping daily with a full cistern might give me a lake!!!  lol

The Surflo 9300 series pump (also got from Backwoods) pumps 83 gallons per hour on 24vdc and up 100' or something like that....it's a good pump and with a well that can lose 2.5 gallons per minute without drawing down you can pump a LOT of water!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 22, 2012, 12:21:21 PM
Quote from: rick91351 on May 22, 2012, 10:45:51 AM
How much water are you pumping?  I would real be interested in doing such with our low producing well.  We are looking at about a gallon per minute with a restrictor on it.  The well will do like three gpm is all.

If you needed to you could cycle water to a drip line and landscape plants and berry bushes, and of course your orchard.  From what I have been told by the pump guys it is way harder on them cycling on and off than just running.

I'm pumping a LOT of water -- with the cistern down to about 50-100 gallons of water it didn't take long at all (maybe two hours) to fill it back up -- heck I accidentally let the pump run too long once and had the thing overflowing like crazy!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: AdironDoc on May 22, 2012, 01:18:56 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on May 22, 2012, 12:21:21 PM
I'm pumping a LOT of water -- with the cistern down to about 50-100 gallons of water it didn't take long at all (maybe two hours) to fill it back up -- heck I accidentally let the pump run too long once and had the thing overflowing like crazy!

Ah.. buried cistern. Makes sense you wouldn't run at that rate all day and flood the area. My 3GPM SHurflo was actually delivering 2GPM so I'm in the same boat. Over a 4 hour period of sun, it could conceivably pump almost 500 gallons! I wouldn't use that in a month of weekends. I suppose a float switch is the only way. I bought a bilge pump switch which turns on when the level rises. I thought I'd put it near the top of the tank, upside down, so its on until the water level lifts it and turns it off. Not sure it will work as planned. What kind of float switch setup are you rigging?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 22, 2012, 01:28:37 PM
http://backwoodssolar.com/catalog/pumps.htm#PUMP%20ACCESSORIES
using the float switch and linear current booster on this page.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: AdironDoc on May 22, 2012, 01:55:31 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on May 22, 2012, 01:28:37 PM
http://backwoodssolar.com/catalog/pumps.htm#PUMP%20ACCESSORIES
using the float switch and linear current booster on this page.

Nice link, thanks!  :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 22, 2012, 02:20:57 PM
Quote from: AdironDoc on May 22, 2012, 01:55:31 PM
Nice link, thanks!  :)

No problem :)  I'm running wire the 300+ feet to the cistern for this using the old 1" pipe they installed as a main line and then dropping in some 2" pipe for the main coming from the cistern.

The float switch basically operates as a normally open (NO) or normally closed (NC) switch (just like all my alarms in the Telco world) so the distance doesn't matter much (at all really).  I'm also installing a switch in the wiring so I can interrupt the float switch to turn off the pump if I want it off for repairs etc or I know there won't be a need for it to be on.  That way I can always also disconnect float and force the pump on if for some reason I want to -- all by the use of a switch.

Anyway, I came across this in my quest to solve my dying battery problem -- I'd killed a set of gel cells pretty much and a set of RV batteries are ok but were drained to zilch TWICE with my 60 watt solar setup....and with this setup cold doesn't matter either.

The nice thing is that I know I can water my trees with 5 gallons each every day (25 gals total) and the cistern won't get emptied.

In the future I plan on having more trees as well as gardens etc and will likely add a larger cistern but for now I'm confident this will work.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 22, 2012, 04:38:31 PM
I should clarify my comment on watering ;)

I meant that I water 5 gals per day right now but only need to provide 5 gals per week once the trees are well established.  I may be giving them a little much now though and will check the soil when I get up there to see if it seems saturated -- if so I'll cut back to twice a week and see how they do.

Next year it ought to be fine to give them 5 gals per week (which is what I budget my water on).
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 23, 2012, 10:56:03 PM
Well my wife convinced me that I needed more time and coats of varathane on the stairs (not to mention some sanding and stain too) and that this cabin trip isn't about the stairs -- darn it woman! -- and of course, she's right.  So I'm leaving them at home to be delivered at a later date once I've had time to get intimate with the 400 grit sandpaper, some varathane and pine......

But I have to admit, it's good to be sanding and coating again :)  There is just something about working a piece of wood until it has that deep 'I love this piece of wood' look to it, er I mean SHINE!

:)

And I'll go back to thinking about fixing water problems, fencing an orchard and working on gray water drain systems ;) -- and of course adding more coats of varathane to the stairs and window trim ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on May 24, 2012, 07:16:54 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on May 23, 2012, 10:56:03 PM
Well my wife convinced me that I needed more time and coats of varathane on the stairs (not to mention some sanding and stain too) and that this cabin trip isn't about the stairs -- darn it woman! -- and of course, she's right.  So I'm leaving them at home to be delivered at a later date once I've had time to get intimate with the 400 grit sandpaper, some varathane and pine......

But I have to admit, it's good to be sanding and coating again :)  There is just something about working a piece of wood until it has that deep 'I love this piece of wood' look to it, er I mean SHINE!

:)

And I'll go back to thinking about fixing water problems, fencing an orchard and working on gray water drain systems ;) -- and of course adding more coats of varathane to the stairs and window trim ;)

OJ that a little heavy on the grit if you are sanding between coats.  I use 220 or 000 steel wool after two coats.  Then I grab the alcohol ( not the sippin kind  ;) ) but rubbing kind to wipe off the dust and grit. Just takes a few seconds to evaporate.  Then follow-up with a finished coat.  I used Mimwax poly on my stairs (basement) but haven't been really satisfied.  After about 3 coats it doesn't seem to be holding up like it should.  But that set gets more dirt tracked than the one to the loft so maybe it is more traffic than the finish is designed to take.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 24, 2012, 09:11:30 AM
400 heavy?  *chuckle* do you mean to say 'light'?  I have all the way to 800 grit which is almost like using a soft towel but rarely use that unless I want a real shiny finish!

I have 220 also but decided to go even lighter to just knock the edge off between coats.

Also I'm trying a new type of minwax varathane -- the wipe on kind -- which seems to go on a lot thinner then I'd like.  I'm testing it though because it's want I want to use on the walls because of the ease of application and that it won't run going on this light.

Will switch to a brush on varathane though to get a much thicker coat so it lasts longer.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on May 24, 2012, 10:00:08 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on May 24, 2012, 09:11:30 AM
400 heavy?  *chuckle* do you mean to say 'light'?  I have all the way to 800 grit which is almost like using a soft towel but rarely use that unless I want a real shiny finish!

I have 220 also but decided to go even lighter to just knock the edge off between coats.

Also I'm trying a new type of minwax varathane -- the wipe on kind -- which seems to go on a lot thinner then I'd like.  I'm testing it though because it's want I want to use on the walls because of the ease of application and that it won't run going on this light.

Will switch to a brush on varathane though to get a much thicker coat so it lasts longer.

Too early in the AM for me on the East Coast.   I looked at it an swore it lacked a "0" d*.  I thought to my self why in the world would he ever use 40 grit.  Oh Well .  Think I will go to bed again.  ;)  Good thing I am not taken seriously.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 24, 2012, 11:01:44 AM
Quote from: Redoverfarm on May 24, 2012, 10:00:08 AM
Too early in the AM for me on the East Coast.   I looked at it an swore it lacked a "0" d*.  I thought to my self why in the world would he ever use 40 grit.  Oh Well .  Think I will go to bed again.  ;)  Good thing I am not taken seriously.

LOL I kept looking at it to make sure I didn't do that and was thinking "well, he's a better carpenter then I am so maybe I'm missing something!" lol  d*

Glad you woke up!!!  You might have had me scratching my head all day! :P  ???
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 25, 2012, 09:45:20 AM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/windowtrim.jpg)
I asked my wife what we should do for window trim.  It's something I've been fighting with for a while and I wanted something that might fit better with a 1900's cabin (that's sort of the theme here).  She came up with this idea:  slot the boards so they cross each other, keep them a little rough and use the old blue stained wood with lots of holes and saw tooth marks.

She's a genius!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/windowtrim2.jpg)
I made a set (seen closer here for the tooth marks) to take up to the cabin this weekend to try out.  I love the idea and think that if I ever get the siding done (board and batten) and the interior finished that this is the sort of thing that ought to add a LOT of character as well as make cabin guests feel like they're staying in a hundred year old cabin :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: AdironDoc on May 28, 2012, 09:19:17 AM
Hey Jarhead, are you making good use of your weekend? I suspect your up at the camp. Anyway, since you're good at getting wood to look rough, I'm wondering if you have any ideas for me. I'm ok at "beating up" the boards, making fake cracks, wormholes and the like. What I'm wondering is how to reproduce the sawmarks on the middle board on this table. I'm trying to make one of my own. I don't have a lousy blade but thought I could use a very rough grit on my sander for something similar. I figure the rough grains always grab more stain and will show up nicely. Secondly, I suspect the middle of the table was stained in light stain and the outer edges rubbed with a darker stain?

Best,
Doc

(https://i234.photobucket.com/albums/ee314/glennjakobsen/EndTable-BirchBarkwithBarwoodTop.jpg)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 28, 2012, 11:48:41 PM
Wish I could help!  However all mine are actually real.

I use a Woodmizer LT10 to mill the lumber so the saw marks are actually from the bandsaw blade.  Otherwise they are from a chain saw mill that I have also.  And the blue stain and termite holes all are natural in the windfalls I milled up.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 29, 2012, 08:26:08 AM
What a weekend!  We arrived Friday afternoon (late) and quickly began to settle in.  We had lots to do and wanted to get right to it however Friday wouldn't really be the day for that because it was mostly over.  So, once we were moved in I brought our new 7 gallon water jug to the spigot and proceeded to fill it.  The water was shooting out of the spigot like a cannon!  WOW!  I was surprised by the flow rate and the spray, clearly things were much better since my last effort to fix the problem and the air was sucked out!

I think it took all of 2 or 3 minutes to fill the jug and the flow never noticeably slowed.  I was then able to get 5 gallons for the bathroom (flush water) also.  Can't say how exiting that was!

Next I checked the trees and all but one appeared to be doing quite well though clearly the cold had 'burned' (?) some of the leaves on two of the trees, one of which appeared to be in serious trouble...also, I noticed that they were growing much slower then the crab down at our home (2600 feet lower in altitude).

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Crimson-1.jpg)
Another of our trees, the crimson beauty, was planted a little crooked (actually it was planted straight up and down but when packing it in it tilted a bit) and was far worse since the hardware cloth wrap had fallen over (3rd time I learned).  I pulled the wrap and decided to let the tree grow as is.  Hopefully when it goes dormant I can dig it up and straighten it out?

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Apple.jpg)
Another was going like crazy!  It was the biggest tree and doing very well.

Saturday morning arrived and I noticed that the two slowest growing trees were in the shade at least two hours longer then the rest.  I sharpened my saw and immediately planned to cut down the offending trees!    However I had a well to improve still.

My neighbor arrived to help with the well solar and we set right away to removing the old 60 watt panels and replacing them with the 190watt panel we'd bought from Sunelec.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/AWellPumpSolar.jpg)
It turned out that we didn't need to do anything other then drill 8 new holes in the rack and mount the panel! 

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Awellpumpsolar2.jpg)
I then connected the new controller and threw a switch in between it and the pump and when the panel was in full sun I just had to hit the switch and it would start right up :)

Can't wait to install the float valve!

With the well done I went back to the orchard and proceeded to cut down the trees that were keeping two of my apples in the shade and then bucked them up into firewood (except two big pine logs I left for the mill).  My wife hauled all the rounds off to the wood shed and moved the slash into piles and by the end of the day we'd managed to buck up close to a cord of wood!  I then chopped that and she stacked in the shed. 

We were smoked by the end of the day!  But it felt good.

Sunday morning the trees were no longer in the shade and after attempting to check water pressure (the gauge didn't work) I watered each tree.  Pressure was way down at the end of the 200 feet of hose but I was getting about 1.4 gallons of water per minute (tested in a 5 gallon bucket) so I watered each tree with one getting a bit more since it looked pretty dry around it.

Later in the day we began building the fence around the orchard.  It took a bit but eventually my wife and I got the system down :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Orchard5.jpg)
We finished the first two sections that night and planned to complete the rest in the morning.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 29, 2012, 08:38:19 AM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/DarcisCorner.jpg)
We also did a little interior work this weekend.  First, we added the window trim I'd made.  While it looked awesome it didn't fit -- I'd really buggered up my guess on what I needed  d* but we love the trim and left it in place knowing now that the best course is to do everything but cut the slots which need to be done to fit each window on site.  My wife added the 'sconces' and the interior continues to look more and more finished :)

My wife also worked on the bathroom which is nearly ready to paint!
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Bath-1.jpg)
Given a little sanding and touch up mud and the bathroom will be ready for primer and paint and then the tub...we can't wait!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Orchard.jpg)
Finally we tackled the fencing.  I set the last posts and corners and first strand while my wife was sanding drywall mud and then she came out and helped me set the last 3 strands.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Orchard3.jpg)
Complete with a simple wire gate.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Orchard4.jpg)
We hope it will keep the cows out of the orchard but need the wire separators between posts which we didn't have this trip....next I guess.

All in all is was an awesome weekend and we didn't want to come home!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 29, 2012, 03:55:43 PM
SCH40 PVC pipe is .66 per foot in Tonasket vs. .61 cents per foot in Hermiston (where it's made) -- but the cost savings in not having to pull a trailer full of 20' pipe is a savings overall!

AWESOME!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on May 29, 2012, 04:09:56 PM
Sounds good! ... I bet your getting stoked to get it in the ground!

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 29, 2012, 04:21:02 PM
Quote from: JavaMan on May 29, 2012, 04:09:56 PM
Sounds good! ... I bet your getting stoked to get it in the ground!

I am!

I need to get you and Tom on the phone too!  He works some crazy hours though so probably just have to send you his email address.  Then you guys can work out contact details and plans etc.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 29, 2012, 04:22:49 PM
Actually Java I'm so darn stoked I could just leave RIGHT NOW to go do it! hahahahaa

Once we're done I should have the float valve in place and working also and can hook up the garden timer and let it water the trees for me :)  No more worries then!

And let's not forget the whole:  "have water will shower" aspect of completing this part of the build!!!!

I CANNOT WAIT!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on May 29, 2012, 05:09:25 PM
Oh, I can certainly empathize with you about the "Have water, will shower" part... not having any water up at my place.  I've been researching many, MANY ways to harvest water, dig for water, drill my own well, etc... so we'll see.  Eventually it might happen. ???
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 29, 2012, 08:29:39 PM
Quote from: JavaMan on May 29, 2012, 05:09:25 PM
Oh, I can certainly empathize with you about the "Have water, will shower" part... not having any water up at my place.  I've been researching many, MANY ways to harvest water, dig for water, drill my own well, etc... so we'll see.  Eventually it might happen. ???

Need someone to witch some water for you probably, but in the meanwhile rain water harvesting is an option and frankly, with the right system you could get 500-1000 gallons stored in no time.  Just need a cistern installed underground and a rain water harvesting system on the roof of your cabin.  Then perhaps a Berkey water filter for drinking and cooking water to be extra safe (though I doubt it would be needed) and a way to pump the water from the cistern to the cabin....and you're set.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: alex trent on May 29, 2012, 10:23:14 PM
You will get about 200 gallons for every inch of rain from your roof.

Systems to collect are pretty inexpensive.  There are first flush systems (about $200) that automatically divert the first part of every rain event, so your roof gets cleaned before water goes in the tank.

http://www.rainharvest.com/

I realize you have temperature concerns...but with a buried cistern, i think you only have those 4 months at most...more likely 3.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: AdironDoc on May 29, 2012, 11:35:26 PM
The place looks great! In addition, I'm glad to see your water setup working as I'm using nearly the same components, right down to my sunelec panel. I also like the nice window treatments your wife (you?) chose. I'm enlisting the help of those around me with a better eye for that to add some color to the windows. Can't wait until the next trip up!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 30, 2012, 08:10:38 AM
Quote from: AdironDoc on May 29, 2012, 11:35:26 PM
The place looks great! In addition, I'm glad to see your water setup working as I'm using nearly the same components, right down to my sunelec panel. I also like the nice window treatments your wife (you?) chose. I'm enlisting the help of those around me with a better eye for that to add some color to the windows. Can't wait until the next trip up!

Thanks :)  And yes the water system is working nicely!  I'm pretty happy with it and can't wait to add the float valve and just let it go!  Not to mention increase the pipe size from 1" to 2" -- that ought to give me enough water flow for everything we want there.

And thanks on the window treatments.  That was all my wife :)  I just do the work, she does the design/planning for stuff like that.

Cheers
Erik
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 30, 2012, 08:14:34 AM
Quote from: alextrent on May 29, 2012, 10:23:14 PM
You will get about 200 gallons for every inch of rain from your roof.

Systems to collect are pretty inexpensive.  There are first flush systems (about $200) that automatically divert the first part of every rain event, so your roof gets cleaned before water goes in the tank.

http://www.rainharvest.com/

I realize you have temperature concerns...but with a buried cistern, i think you only have those 4 months at most...more likely 3.

Found this: http://thegoodhuman.com/2008/08/25/just-how-much-rainwater-can-you-collect-off-your-roof/

Using their calculation I figure I can get over 300 gallons of rainwater for inch on my roof!  With an average of 14 inches a year (roughly) then I ought to be able to produce 4620 gallons of water in a year.

I currently have two 55 gallon barrels that I haven't installed but frankly I REALLY like the idea of an underground cistern.  For one, it won't freeze -- if it's down below the frost line like my current one you will have water year round regardless of the temperature -- and for two it takes no effort once set up.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: alex trent on May 30, 2012, 09:00:57 AM
Yeah, I round down a lot in my calculations so as not to be too optimistic when talking about this.  It really is pretty simple and the water is really pure...unless you live next to some smokestack plant.

You get only 14 inches of rain a year?  Where are you?

You can also build a collector very inexpensively if you need more water...I have one posted easy on on my build site....and this is even a bit overbuilt because I have the tank above ground and wanted to put them underneath.

I watch my consumption is the dry season and amazing how much you can save being just a bit careful.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 30, 2012, 09:03:59 AM
Quote from: alextrent on May 30, 2012, 09:00:57 AM
Yeah, I round down a lot in my calculations so as not to be too optimistic when talking about this.  It really is pretty simple and the water is really pure...unless you live next to some smokestack plant.

You get only 14 inches of rain a year?  Where are you?

You can also build a collector very inexpensively if you need more water...I have one posted easy on on my build site....and this is even a bit overbuilt because I have the tank above ground and wanted to put them underneath.

I watch my consumption is the dry season and amazing how much you can save being just a bit careful.

What's your site address?

We're in WA State on the east side ;)  Over here it's desert where we live (7 inches of rain a year) but the cabin is in the mountains and forests of Northern WA State where it can get 14-15 inches a year.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on May 30, 2012, 09:04:50 AM
Quote from: AdironDoc on May 29, 2012, 11:35:26 PM
The place looks great! In addition, I'm glad to see your water setup working as I'm using nearly the same components, right down to my sunelec panel. I also like the nice window treatments your wife (you?) chose. I'm enlisting the help of those around me with a better eye for that to add some color to the windows. Can't wait until the next trip up!

Well, I think that might be a bit dependent on the size of the building/roof.  On mine it's only a 12 X 12, and I haven't done the calculations in a bit, but even if it was 200 gal, that would mean in the average year, I might get about 600 gallons from rain ... (It might be more, but it doesn't rain a lot up there) ... now if I could harvest the run off from the snow melt ... I'd be rich with water!  Of course, I'd have to have a place to store it all  d*

I probably am exaggerating a bit (on the low side), but it doesn't rain much up there.  I'm on the "other side" of the desert valley from OJH on the eastern slopes of the Cascades just as it turns from high desert to mountains/woods.

But this last winter, the ski bowl about 5 miles from me reported over 60" of snow!  :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 30, 2012, 09:10:23 AM
Quote from: JavaMan on May 30, 2012, 09:04:50 AM
Well, I think that might be a bit dependent on the size of the building/roof.  On mine it's only a 12 X 12, and I haven't done the calculations in a bit, but even if it was 200 gal, that would mean in the average year, I might get about 600 gallons from rain ... (It might be more, but it doesn't rain a lot up there) ... now if I could harvest the run off from the snow melt ... I'd be rich with water!  Of course, I'd have to have a place to store it all  d*

I get 12x12=144x2=288sq ft of roof x 0.6 gallons per inch and 14" per year (you might actually be more then that) for an annual yield of 2400 gallons per year off of your roof.

So, if you had a 500 gallon cistern dug into the ground with the cover set at about 15" down and a riser to ground level (so it wouldn't freeze etc) and some diverters you'd have that filled in no time!  Your biggest issue would be once it's filled you'd have to stop any more coming in.

Either that or put in a much bigger tank (like a 2500 gallon unit).

Truth is you could live a LONG time with that kind of water storage...but for weekend use 325 gallons would be more then enough.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: AdironDoc on May 30, 2012, 11:36:07 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on May 30, 2012, 08:14:34 AM

I currently have two 55 gallon barrels that I haven't installed but frankly I REALLY like the idea of an underground cistern.  For one, it won't freeze -- if it's down below the frost line like my current one you will have water year round regardless of the temperature -- and for two it takes no effort once set up.

My guest camp has two 55 gallon barrels coming off around 10ft of rain-leader. If I could do it easily, I'd bury them. If I don't continue chlorinating them, when they're opened, I notice green algae on the walls. As you added, they're frozen almost solid in winter. As for the water itself, it's not the worst for washing and flushing. Wouldn't say I'd want to drink a glass of it but then again, my water usually has hops in it.  ;D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 30, 2012, 12:43:50 PM
Quote from: AdironDoc on May 30, 2012, 11:36:07 AM
My guest camp has two 55 gallon barrels coming off around 10ft of rain-leader. If I could do it easily, I'd bury them. If I don't continue chlorinating them, when they're opened, I notice green algae on the walls. As you added, they're frozen almost solid in winter. As for the water itself, it's not the worst for washing and flushing. Wouldn't say I'd want to drink a glass of it but then again, my water usually has hops in it.  ;D

Crown Berkey :)  Best water filter you can buy :)  Would make that water more then drinkable!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: alex trent on May 30, 2012, 01:47:48 PM
Yeah, if you don't get rain, water collecting is difficult to say the least.

But, on the other hand if you get even a little makes the value of collecting it greater.

Drinking water is secondary..can always use some bottles or just use beer most of the time. so, the "purity" should not be a distraction.  And as OJH says, there are som good filters out there for the small volumes of drinking water you need.

In the "Daks", if you have algae problems something is amiss.  Not sure what, but should not. Anyway, a bit of bleach is no harm and takes care of that quickly.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: AdironDoc on May 30, 2012, 02:18:28 PM
Quote from: alextrent on May 30, 2012, 01:47:48 PM
In the "Daks", if you have algae problems something is amiss.  Not sure what, but should not. Anyway, a bit of bleach is no harm and takes care of that quickly.

I think the problem was that I hadn't been up to the guest camp in 4 weeks. Since then, it's been one hot day after another and, despite the brown sandstone plastic that's said to keep sun out, I could clearly see how bright the inside was. Warm sunny water and a month since chlorine. Not a great combo. I think at the very least, I'll put a box around them so they're in the dark and not heated by sunshine. That should reduce the amount of bleaching needed. It's one reason I agreed, underground is better. Still, great for toilets/shower/sink. For other uses, beer will suffice :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on May 30, 2012, 02:47:58 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on May 30, 2012, 09:10:23 AM
I get 12x12=144x2=288sq ft of roof x 0.6 gallons per inch and 14" per year (you might actually be more then that) for an annual yield of 2400 gallons per year off of your roof.

So, if you had a 500 gallon cistern dug into the ground with the cover set at about 15" down and a riser to ground level (so it wouldn't freeze etc) and some diverters you'd have that filled in no time!  Your biggest issue would be once it's filled you'd have to stop any more coming in.

Either that or put in a much bigger tank (like a 2500 gallon unit).

Truth is you could live a LONG time with that kind of water storage...but for weekend use 325 gallons would be more then enough.

Shhh ... that's one of the things I was thinking of doing with the "basement" in the cabin ... waterproofing it, and using it as a cistern  ;)  Not sure that's a good idea, tho ???
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 30, 2012, 03:09:21 PM
Quote from: JavaMan on May 30, 2012, 02:47:58 PM
Shhh ... that's one of the things I was thinking of doing with the "basement" in the cabin ... waterproofing it, and using it as a cistern  ;)  Not sure that's a good idea, tho ???

Bad idea if open, good if not -- have Tom dig a hole for your cistern since he'll be there and just plan to use it some day ;) easier to have it ready when needed then have to get him back to dig one when you get a tank.

Something to think about.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on May 30, 2012, 04:17:15 PM
That's one of the things I'm thinking about... as for open or not - definitely closed.  A couple years ago I drew up a plan for a place with a basement and a cistern underneath the basement! ???

Not sure what I was thinking of, but we're talking about 4 to 5 feet deep of cistern, in the order of 18' X 28' ... that's a LOT of water.   All with a concrete basement floor on top of it! :o

Yes, I do get a bit carried away sometimes.  But if I'm going to dream, I may as well dream BIG! ;D

Just did the math and that's between 15,000 gallons and 18,500 gallons - guess I wouldn't run out for a while...
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 30, 2012, 04:21:55 PM
Quote from: JavaMan on May 30, 2012, 04:17:15 PM
That's one of the things I'm thinking about... as for open or not - definitely closed.  A couple years ago I drew up a plan for a place with a basement and a cistern underneath the basement! ???

Not sure what I was thinking of, but we're talking about 4 to 5 feet deep of cistern, in the order of 18' X 28' ... that's a LOT of water.   All with a concrete basement floor on top of it! :o

Yes, I do get a bit carried away sometimes.  But if I'm going to dream, I may as well dream BIG! ;D

Just did the math and that's between 15,000 gallons and 18,500 gallons - guess I wouldn't run out for a while...

Sounds like we're birds of a feather -- I'll bring some JD to the cabin and we'll tell stories about being carried away next trip! LOL
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: AdironDoc on May 30, 2012, 04:48:16 PM
Quote from: JavaMan on May 30, 2012, 04:17:15 PM
That's one of the things I'm thinking about... as for open or not - definitely closed.  A couple years ago I drew up a plan for a place with a basement and a cistern underneath the basement! ???

P*** Poor Planning... It's the reason my 305 gallon cistern is sitting in my driveway, instead of buried in the basement. Didn't expect the first floor would go down quite as quickly as it did...  "What do you mean it won't fit through the front door?", I ended up asking the builder.  I was swearing at first.. now I just laugh.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 30, 2012, 04:53:29 PM
Quote from: AdironDoc on May 30, 2012, 04:48:16 PM
P*** Poor Planning... It's the reason my 305 gallon cistern is sitting in my driveway, instead of buried in the basement. Didn't expect the first floor would go down quite as quickly as it did...  "What do you mean it won't fit through the front door?", I ended up asking the builder.  I was swearing at first.. now I just laugh.

Chuckle - perhaps beside the cabin now?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 05, 2012, 03:54:24 PM
Trees are doing well I'm told :) 

Also have 500 feet of pipe ordered and the trackhoe reserved!  Heading up soon!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on June 05, 2012, 04:11:52 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on June 05, 2012, 03:54:24 PM
Trees are doing well I'm told :) 

Also have 500 feet of pipe ordered and the trackhoe reserved!  Heading up soon!
500 feet?!? :o

Somehow I got the impression it was shorter than that ... wow, that's a looooong pipe!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: SkagitDrifter on June 06, 2012, 10:56:38 AM

Good discussion on the water catchment systems.  I am thinking about catching some water also but can't get by the need for some type of gutter on the eaves.  In winter months the snow will rip the gutter right off the house.  How do you guys deal with that?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on June 06, 2012, 11:45:37 AM
Quote from: SkagitDrifter on June 06, 2012, 10:56:38 AM
Good discussion on the water catchment systems.  I am thinking about catching some water also but can't get by the need for some type of gutter on the eaves.  In winter months the snow will rip the gutter right off the house.  How do you guys deal with that?

Well, I don't know about OJH, but I haven't dealt with it yet, since the roof isn't on ! rofl  but I guess I will have to figure out something.  I'd hate to have to replace the gutters every spring.  On the shed, I'm not sure it's that important ... I could simply hang the gutters so that I could take them off in the winter (maybe), but the actual cabin - I don't know about that one.

Good question, I know I will have to think about it a bit.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 06, 2012, 12:25:31 PM
MountainDon addresses this in his thread -- basically you install a rail so the snow and ice go OVER the gutter and don't take it out.

Incidentally, I don't have that problem on my house and have no protection at all -- and while I DO live in a desert, we've been known to get two feet of snow  :o and it didn't take out my gutters.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MikeOnBike on June 06, 2012, 04:18:00 PM
Might depend on how much of this you get.

(http://matchbin-assets.s3.amazonaws.com/public/sites/635/assets/8ZTJ_snowcurl.jpg)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 06, 2012, 05:00:43 PM
That's what the rails MD put on his roof are for ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: AdironDoc on June 06, 2012, 05:08:30 PM
I've got a 6 ft section of plastic rain-leader under the rear portion of my steel roof. Roof angle is 16/12, quite steep, and the leader is hidden halfway under the eave. Ice and snow seem to bend the rain-leader, which being rather pliable, just knocks out of the way and snaps back in. One Adirondack winter later..seems fine.

Now a  rain-leader crafted out of a sheet of plastic that has a tendency to curl up into a U shaped channel would be superb. Stiff enough for water, but would open for ice and snap back. Imagine there might be a market for that...
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on June 06, 2012, 05:26:18 PM
Quote from: SkagitDrifter on June 06, 2012, 10:56:38 AM
Good discussion on the water catchment systems.  I am thinking about catching some water also but can't get by the need for some type of gutter on the eaves.  In winter months the snow will rip the gutter right off the house.  How do you guys deal with that?

This is what I used.

(https://i220.photobucket.com/albums/dd161/redoverfarm/hightop/100_4800-1.jpg)

(https://i220.photobucket.com/albums/dd161/redoverfarm/hightop/100_4790-1.jpg)

(https://i220.photobucket.com/albums/dd161/redoverfarm/hightop/IMG_0105-1.jpg)

We really haven't had a good snow to see how it is going to work.  Around here they call it "witches hat" but it is actually snow guard.  The price of snow birds are completely out of sight.  This is the next best thing that I could find at $12 for a 10' section.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 06, 2012, 05:45:14 PM
If I ever get my roof done I'll have to try that -- I want to get rain gutters up next year and start harvesting rain water.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 06, 2012, 06:00:46 PM
No excavator this weekend :(  Have to reschedule the work when my buddy can come out to operate it.  Probably just go up and try to get the water to run through the 1" enough to water each tree.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on June 06, 2012, 06:53:28 PM
Bummer... can't you lay the pipe on the ground at least?  Probably not - just be one more thing for him to have to avoid when he does get there.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 07, 2012, 10:31:01 AM
Nah, the store will keep the pipe until I need it :)

So I'm bringing up the bathtub (finally!) and going to get the bathroom painted and the tub installed :)

I'll probably work on the greywater drain system as well.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on June 07, 2012, 01:08:42 PM
Well, you'll be able to have a bath then, if you want to haul the water and heat it on the stove  :D  Just like the olden days  :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 07, 2012, 01:38:52 PM
Quote from: JavaMan on June 07, 2012, 01:08:42 PM
Well, you'll be able to have a bath then, if you want to haul the water and heat it on the stove  :D  Just like the olden days  :)
Be better then no bath at all! lol
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 11, 2012, 08:49:39 AM
Ouch, my back is killing me!

What a great and productive weekend though!  We cut down two more of the trees that were shading the orchard, bucked up 4 for firewood (two from previous trips), chopped some of the firewood, fixed the well solar system (except I need to check on something for that -- the wiring appears to be wrong in the instructions), put wire separators in the fence, finished and painted the walls in the bathroom and installed the bathtub!

So ya, I'm smoked!
(//i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Tub.jpg)
Here's the tub finally in the bath.  I'll have to move it around a little to install baseboards but for now it's at least in it's new home :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Bath-2.jpg)
Things are tight in there, but hey it's a cabin right?

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Bath2.jpg)
I'll get the base boards in, then get all the water lines done (finally) and do some trim work around the commode and window.

Then I'll make a door for the bathroom too (swing outwards though).

While up at the cabin I also invited Javaman to come out for a visit and warm up by the wood stove (it was cool and raining a LOT this weekend) and he showed up around 5pm.  First order of business was a relaxing sit by the woodstove with some lemonade to get the chill off (he'd been sleeping in his truck and working in the rain and hail!).  Then visiting until late into the evening and a good breakfast to send him on his way back to his cabin.  My friends and I offered to help get the rafters up on the top of the walls for him but he felt he wouldn't be ready for that on Sunday so we weren't able to help out.  Hope all went well up there Jeff!

Anyway, I'm pretty much soaking in Icy Hot now and thinking I need to get into better shape!!!  Sheesh.

Next trip will likely be a relaxing one for clean up, wood chopping and perhaps some interior work.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 11, 2012, 03:34:31 PM
While waiting on getting the trackhoe up to the cabin next I'm planning on this:

www.dripdepot.com

I've been watering by hose when present, or rain, or neighbor with hose or bucket while trying to fix the system, and put in some soaker hoses last trip to get them SOMETHING while I get a better system together so I'm going to try to get one of their kits and bring it out next trip.  I can then balance the system to provide 2 gallons per hour to the trees and have it water them at 6am for 2 1/2 hours.  That ought to get them 5 gallons of water each.

Once I get that done I should be able to set the time for max watering over a ten day period (since I'm only gone 10 days at a time usually).  So, with 325 gallons of water in the system (assuming it isn't leaking) I should be able to get 13 total waterings when the system is not in use before it's completely empty.

If that works out then I can water every 2 days throughout the summer which would give the trees 5 gallons each every other day and allow me to go for over 3 weeks of watering before I had to start worrying.

Or, put another way, I should be able to water them 5 times while I'm gone and not have to worry :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on June 12, 2012, 03:51:12 PM
Thanks for the sit by the fire,OJH!  It was good to finally meet you.

Got back to my place and worked on getting things ready for the next step (more in my build thread)

Got home about 2 hours ago and showered, shaved, and kissed Beautiful before she ran off to get the kids from school.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 12, 2012, 04:00:09 PM
Quote from: JavaMan on June 12, 2012, 03:51:12 PM
Thanks for the sit by the fire,OJH!  It was good to finally meet you.

Got back to my place and worked on getting things ready for the next step (more in my build thread)

Got home about 2 hours ago and showered, shaved, and kissed Beautiful before she ran off to get the kids from school.

Well get posting ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: AdironDoc on June 12, 2012, 09:37:27 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on June 11, 2012, 08:49:39 AM
Ouch, my back is killing me!

.... and installed the bathtub!

You didn't drag that cast iron tub in by yourself I hope! My old tub weighed more than my old Japanese compact car. I can hear those disks shouting  :-\


Quote from: OlJarhead on June 11, 2012, 08:49:39 AM
Next trip will likely be a relaxing one for clean up, wood chopping and ...

If that's your idea of relaxing, you're welcome to relax at my place any day of the week! Mine's having a cold one and watching the creek roll by.

Congrats on a fulfilling weekend.

Glenn
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 18, 2012, 04:50:02 PM
LOL -- I usually can't sit long in one spot unless on a computer but since I do that all day at work (most days anyway) I look forward to NOT doing it on the weekend.

Now I'm getting excited about the next trip and also about possibly getting a tractor in the next couple months!  I can't wait to mow the property!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 26, 2012, 02:20:51 PM
Next couple months turned into FRIDAY!

If all goes well I'll be mowing the property in July ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on June 26, 2012, 02:23:57 PM
Wow!  Friday? what kinda tractor did you find?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: alex trent on June 26, 2012, 03:48:13 PM
I bet the big red 50 HP
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 26, 2012, 07:25:14 PM
Yup :)  A BIG Red Mahindra 5010 -- will weigh in around 6000lbs with tires filled with balast!  It's a Utility tractor so I guess that's a full sized one (it's about double the size of a compact) and 50hp.  4wd, loader and more.

We are pretty excited and can't wait for Friday to roll around!  I spoke with the dealer for probably an hour today going over the tractor, implements and various things I'll need to know (like greasing the PTO shaft etc every two hours when brush hogging -- he says he can get 10 years out of a shaft that many guys replace every year or two just by, gee whiz, taking care of it by greasing it).

I have SOOOO much to learn but the salesman/dealer I'm working with has 220 acres up in the Northern part of the state also and, like me, spends a lot of weekends up their -- only he's actually farming his land -- and so we have a lot in common.

I've heard good things about him online also (at tractorbynet) and got a great feeling when I met him.  Frankly, he's been more patient with me and all my questions (like a machine gun firing away at him) and has taken the time to go into great detail about various aspects of what to do or not to do with the tractor, implements etc etc.

This will be a big expense but we look at it as an investment in our little homestead -- and after all, clearing out the brush, mowing the grass and removing the 'fuel' should greatly reduce the risk of losing our place to forest fires!  Not to mention getting some fields ready for cover crops and and and and.....

Now if only I had more then a couple weekends a month up there! lol
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 27, 2012, 12:53:37 PM
I hate waiting! lol

After over a year of looking at tractors and trying to figure out what we needed I'm not almost unable to contain myself!  I want to get that rig and start mowing, grading, plowing, moving and all manner of 'tractoring' at the cabin.

We're in a stage of the build where things have slowed down a little because I need to mill more lumber which means falling and bucking up more trees and hauling them over to the mill etc. and while I'm working, ever so slowly, on the stairs and railing it's a slower process.

The orchard is in -- 1st phase anyway -- and getting water (although it needs improvement the rainy season is on us so it's ok) so there is really just a lot of clean up to do and preparation for the remaining interior work, plumbing and such.

So ya, a tractor will be sweet!  I could get some mowing and cleaning done, skid logs to the mill, do some milling and what-not.

And maybe even plant that field of Rye this year!


OK I'm rambling...I'm just dying to talk tractors I guess....or better yet, BUY one!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on June 27, 2012, 03:22:40 PM
Ok, I'm green with envy (oops, wrong color - my wife wants to show me a place with a PINK John Deer... I keep telling her, there is so much wrong with that)...

I was dreaming over 8N's on Craigslist the other day...  Saw a fair one for $1500 ... then I saw an Allis Chalmers for around $3000 ...  ???  If I had the 3K I'd be tempted to buy it - Diesel, etc... but I think it's probably too big.

Like I said, I'm green with envy... I gotta find more income around here someplace!   [waiting]

Hopefully you'll post some pictures of your new toy soon!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 27, 2012, 03:36:54 PM
Quote from: JavaMan on June 27, 2012, 03:22:40 PM
Ok, I'm green with envy (oops, wrong color - my wife wants to show me a place with a PINK John Deer... I keep telling her, there is so much wrong with that)...

I was dreaming over 8N's on Craigslist the other day...  Saw a fair one for $1500 ... then I saw an Allis Chalmers for around $3000 ...  ???  If I had the 3K I'd be tempted to buy it - Diesel, etc... but I think it's probably too big.

Like I said, I'm green with envy... I gotta find more income around here someplace!   [waiting]

Hopefully you'll post some pictures of your new toy soon!

I started that way (looking at 8N's) but eventually graduated away for a number of reasons.  One of the main ones is the hills I have to work on/with and my lack of tractor experience.  I learned that four wheel drive was much safer.  I also wanted a bucket and the 8N buckets were pretty old and small.....but I understand the challenge of affording one!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 27, 2012, 03:41:23 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0009-2.jpg)
Here is one of my apples.  So far the farm fencing (which is kept close enough to the tree to prevent the deer from jumping inside of it but far enough out to allow it to grow and you to work inside the fencing) is working as well as the barbed wire.  The cows seem to be moving right on past the fencing and ignoring it and the orchard.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0014-1.jpg)
Another apple (I have 5 different types)

I'm drip irrigating them with my water system barely able to supply the needed water but it's been raining a ton so I'm not worried yet...I'm hoping to fix the water system before it gets too dry though!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0019-4.jpg)
Three weeks ago we got a bunch of firewood bucked up...now I just need to finish splitting it and stacking it into the shed for drying.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0020-2.jpg)
There's a little dude in there wondering what the heck I'm up to ;)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0006-3.jpg)
Packrats (woodrats) are a problem in my area and if they get into your shed......well let's just say you;ll shoot them too! lol

Now I have to burn my shed down I think ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: CjAl on June 27, 2012, 04:58:09 PM
didnt ford start making tue 8n new again? i saw a pic somewhere and it was pretty sweet.

i like the 8n but i like the farmall 160 better. and i am partial to any allis chalmers. they were built in my home town of west allis, wi and my grandpa worked at the factory almost his whole life
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 27, 2012, 05:16:22 PM
New Ford?  Ford was bought by New Holland which was owned by FIAT so I think FIAT makes them all....but still uses the New Holland brand name.

Same blue too.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: CjAl on June 27, 2012, 05:22:50 PM
ford, new holland. same difference. go to the new holland web site and there is a pic of a new 8N
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 27, 2012, 05:39:42 PM
Linkage?  I couldn't find it.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 27, 2012, 05:41:02 PM
(http://abcgroff.com/ic/pics/boomer8n.jpg)
Found it

COOL!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 27, 2012, 05:42:44 PM
Used at $28,000 on tractor house?  Yikes!  it's cool and all but for $8000 more then the $20k I'm paying now I'd rather buy implements!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: CjAl on June 27, 2012, 05:59:48 PM
ya i think its more of a collector thing. it may even be limited edition. i think you can get air conditioned cab in some brands for that much. lol
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 27, 2012, 08:01:08 PM
For that much I get a front end load and an AC cab and stereo and and and....

Actually after taxes and implements for a new Mahindra 5010 it's $24k -- but I don't have the cabin which would likely add 3-4k
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: CjAl on June 27, 2012, 08:25:07 PM
thats pretty much more then everything i own is worth with the exception of my semi truck. heck, that about what i paid for the truck
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 27, 2012, 09:26:03 PM
Quote from: CjAl on June 27, 2012, 08:25:07 PM
thats pretty much more then everything i own is worth with the exception of my semi truck. heck, that about what i paid for the truck

LOL - our land is worth a lot more then that, as well as our home and other things.

But ya, it's a BIG purchase for us but we decided to do it.  I looked at a lot of used rigs but the price on newer used ones wasn't much less then new (these days that's seems to be common for items like this) so we went new and said to heck with it.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 29, 2012, 07:23:39 PM
While we always wish that the only place we have to work on is out cabin, sadly that isn't always the case.  For us, it was a burst pipe and having the plumbers come out and take care of it -- ouch!  Nearly stopped the tractor purchase from taking place.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/IMG_0102.jpg)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/IMG_0104.jpg)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/IMG_0103.jpg)

Someone had spray foamed around the pipe which was badly rusted and I guess over time the rust won out.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 29, 2012, 07:27:53 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/IMG_0105-2.jpg)
At least we now have water and hot water at that....so I'll have to backfill the hole, put down some concrete and fix the drywall....

But it won't stop me from working on the cabin!  And we DID buy the tractor! :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: astidham on June 29, 2012, 07:44:26 PM
well, sorry to hear about your misfortune, but I'm glad you got the tractor!  I want to see pictures!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 29, 2012, 09:57:34 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/IMG_0106-1.jpg)
Concrete was a bit soupy in the lats bucket (yes bucket!  That's how I got it in there) but I hope not too much!

Anyway, got the patch in and with luck it will set nice and smooth.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 29, 2012, 09:58:14 PM
Quote from: astidham on June 29, 2012, 07:44:26 PM
well, sorry to hear about your misfortune, but I'm glad you got the tractor!  I want to see pictures!

Thanks :)

I may get a chance to get some pics this weekend as I hope to go over to the dealer and do a little learning but we'll see.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 30, 2012, 02:30:08 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/OurNewTractor.jpg)
That's the one :)

Now to get to work!  Oh wait, I have to actually trailer it to the property which means I need to borrow a trailer (have that covered I think) but also means I have to wait until the 20th of July (drat!) and they have to install the canopy before then (another week before it arrives) but once we arrive with the trailer we'll move implements onto the trailer and finally park the tractor and then roll on out and head to the cabin with our newest toy, er I mean TOOL! :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: astidham on June 30, 2012, 02:34:07 PM
very nice!
you will have many years of fun work with it.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 30, 2012, 02:52:36 PM
Thanks :)  Now I wish I could start the fun work with it NOW!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Yonderosa on June 30, 2012, 06:45:39 PM
That'll keep you busy!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: AdironDoc on July 05, 2012, 03:53:20 PM
Very jealous... Red is my favorite color too
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on July 09, 2012, 01:43:24 PM
Wow, I go on vacation and all heck breaks loose! [crz]  And the jar head goes and buys the tractor! 

Vacation put a sizable dent in the budget - I should know how big by tomorrow.

Congrats again on the tractor!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 09, 2012, 04:34:50 PM
Thanks all :)

I'm trying to arrange getting it to the property now!  d*

Seems if you want to rent a 16' 10k trailer in this town they won't do it unless you have a 3/4 ton truck!  What's that all about?  My 06 Ford is rated at just over 10k and I'm looking to tow right about 8k with it...seems like a no brainer to me....but who cares what I want to do with it for crying out loud??  If I'm willing to pay the fees etc then shouldn't I be able to pick it up in whatever I have that will tow it?  Anyway, nevermind! lol

I can get 16 foot trailers locally and really need a 20 foot trailer but my neighbor tells me that with creative loading the 16's will work -- just not with the mower attached to the tractor.

So, with luck I can get things loaded up and head to the property with the tractor in tow on Friday -- wish me luck!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: astidham on July 09, 2012, 09:50:16 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on July 09, 2012, 04:34:50 PM
Thanks all :)

I'm trying to arrange getting it to the property now!  d*

Seems if you want to rent a 16' 10k trailer in this town they won't do it unless you have a 3/4 ton truck!  What's that all about?  My 06 Ford is rated at just over 10k and I'm looking to tow right about 8k with it...seems like a no brainer to me....but who cares what I want to do with it for crying out loud??  If I'm willing to pay the fees etc then shouldn't I be able to pick it up in whatever I have that will tow it?  Anyway, nevermind! lol

I can get 16 foot trailers locally and really need a 20 foot trailer but my neighbor tells me that with creative loading the 16's will work -- just not with the mower attached to the tractor.

So, with luck I can get things loaded up and head to the property with the tractor in tow on Friday -- wish me luck!
If you are towing any distance, the 1/2 ton truck might make you a nervous wreck, unless you have trailer brakes.
pulling the tractor was not a problem for me with my half ton, stopping it was..
also when I bought my Tractor Package, the 18' trailer was only $600. more dollars to the package deal.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 10, 2012, 12:01:00 AM
Trailer brakes is the only way I'd do it frankly but I'm looking to get someone with a 3/4 ton truck to do it -- my buddy's 2500 dodge ram pulled a mini excavator from here up to the property 3 years ago without any worries at all -- and in august -- so I'm thinking that would be the best option.

Only problem is he's working weekends now so I'm looking at some other possibilities before I decide to use the F150.

If I have to use the F150 I think I'll pull the implements up on my ATV trailer first.  That way I'll only have the tractor and loader to deal with later.

Should take 1000lbs off the load or so.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on July 10, 2012, 10:29:39 AM
You wouldn't be attempting to rent a trailer from u-haul, would you?  Ever since some occurrence with an Explorer they seem to be quite reluctant to rent to anyone with an F150 - which is strange considering they RENT F150s... maybe they want you to rent their truck along with the trailer.

I tried to rent a car hauler one time with my F150 to pull a Fiero ... no go.  I could understand if they were concerned about towing with an Explorer, but an F150? 

Like you said, if it's under the weight limit for the tow vehicle, what's the issue?  But then again, it's their equipment, I guess, so they can do what they want.

Good luck with getting it up there.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 10, 2012, 03:59:18 PM
Hertz -- and who knows.

Looks like my neighbor will tow it up for me :)  and bring back the trailer while I stay there and play.

I'll probably tow up the implements to make it easier on his F250 and since the trailer will be a 16 footer -- which is big enough for the tractor alone but not the mower and box blade.

So with luck I'll be back Friday MOWING! [cool]
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 11, 2012, 07:18:47 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Mahindra5010-1.jpg)
WhooHoo!

Had my first drive today :D  Drove to Les Schwab to get the tires filled with 'Bioballast' and then back -- all of about 1/4 mile each way but much fun at 15mph :D

Also the canopy has been installed so we're ready to transport!!!!!

Tomorrow I pick up implements (be a nice way to spend my birthday I think) and then Friday morning we pick up the tractor :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Toyotaboy on July 13, 2012, 03:44:53 PM
What a sweet toy er..  tool!  It will be nice to have that bucket on the front. Wish I had a bucket for my Farmall!

Congrats!

Totoaboy
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on July 13, 2012, 04:49:00 PM
That bucket is the handiest thing I have around the farm.  Handy as a pocket on a shirt.  Just be careful that you do not lift more than the factory recommendations or else you will damage the cylinders.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 15, 2012, 10:24:58 PM
After an adventurous morning we finally loaded up and headed out!
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0236-1.jpg)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0235.jpg)
I couldn't wait to get our new tractor into action!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Fire2.jpg)
On the way up we drove by a big brush fire that burned right down to the hiway -- the fire crews were out and holding traffic to one lane as they fought the blaze.  Was pretty crazy.

When we had delivered the tractor and were returning to hook up the trailer to the tow vehicle (we couldn't tow it up the hill so I drove the tractor and Loran followed in his truck) we discovered Lorans truck had blown the water pump!  He spent the night and we fixed it the next day and sent him on his way -- then I got to work mowing and working the roads.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/BigRed.jpg)
Where the tractor is now parked used to be a brush pile :)  That rotting pile is now gone! :D

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0249.jpg)
I didn't have much time to take pictures (like I wanted to) because of the rain storm (lightening, hail the works!) but here is a shot of the property line road -- you can kinda tell that it's been at least partly mowed (most of it in view has) and the road has been worked over a bit.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0250.jpg)
I'm still learning (well dah!) but I'm getting it down I think ;)  in fact (a little tractor humor here) I'm getting REALLY good at knocking out sheer pins and replacing them!  d*

Note to self:  bring lots of Grade 2 1/2"x3" bolts with me next trip.....seems I goofed once (engage PTO at throttle!  DOH!  d* and then maybe mowed too many trees or hit a rock or something and sheered the pin a second time.

Picked up some lube and gear oil and changed out the mower for the box blade twice and played with the loader a bunch too....lots of fun and hey, the property is starting to shape up!

Can't wait until Friday comes!!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 15, 2012, 10:52:34 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Buck.jpg)
Nice two point on the game cam from about 3 weeks ago :)  Hope he sticks around!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/tractoring.jpg)
Off to work on mowing the upper section where I plan to build a 5+ acre meadow.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/mowing.jpg)
And mowing the lower section....well, the driveways and around the area -- so much to learn!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 17, 2012, 08:44:13 AM
In a discussion with my neighbor he told me that the water system I have (installed by his brother in law) wouldn't work as is and my plan to change it from a siphon system to a gravity system was a good one.  He explained that in a siphon there is always a problem of air building up (negative pressure at the highest point is how he described it) in a siphon and that it had to be bled off periodically or it would stop working.

This explains why my system always acted like it was empty when it really wasn't.

So, after pondering the problem a little more, and since my buddy who operates the excavator for me won't be able to come out for a while (and I might not be able to afford it for a while either) I've decided to get the bulkhead for the 2" pipe and install it at the lowest point in the tank I can reach, then I'll adjust the current 1" mainline pipe to run into that bulkhead (with a reducer from 2" to 1") and install it there.  I'll mark it with plenty of tape (so it's easier to find when digging it back up) and then bury it.

That way I can at least resolve the issue of my water always losing pressure before the summer months get hot and dry and leave the system indefinitely :)  Then when we're ready to fix the system we can head out and do so knowing what's in the ground at the time.

This Friday I start my vacation (10 days worth) and I plan to go out and finally get the hardware cloth under the cabin, seal any holes I might have left unsealed, install the grey water drain and counters etc and with luck get this done at the cistern and back fill all the holes I've dug.

Then I can concentrate on mowing the property, clearing brush, chopping wood (and maybe falling some more) and installing the stairs.

Should be a great week!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: CjAl on July 17, 2012, 08:51:06 AM
air lock, i was right. ten points for me. ;D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: AdironDoc on July 17, 2012, 09:45:07 PM
good call, CJ. BTW, those points are redeemable.. lol
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 17, 2012, 09:53:52 PM
Yup

Airlock it is...but I'll fix that in a jiffy!  At least I hope to!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 18, 2012, 06:55:05 PM
Picked up a box of 25 Grade 2 bolts (1/2"x3") for the mower along with the nuts and washers to go with them :D  $28 in total for all 25 sets which means I ought to be able to mow for at least a day or two :P  d*

Picked up a punch too (to knock out broken sheer pins or bolts).

Next on the list is a fishing license, a bulkhead for 2" pipe for the cistern, a 2" to 1" reducer and some more flex pipe (few feet anyway) so I can try to hook the water line up to the bottom of the cistern instead of the top.

Tomorrow will be packing day -- have to pack some tools and the stair risers onto/into the Jeep -- and then I'll leave early Friday for the cabin and a week of bliss :)

With luck I'll come back with lots of pics and stories to tell :D

Can't wait!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on July 20, 2012, 10:47:22 AM
A fishing license for hooking up the water?  ???  (sorry, I'm channeling my dad this morning it would seem  ;D)

Wish I was headed up to my place - looking forward to seeing all your great pictures and hearing the tall tails... er, stories you'll have  ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 29, 2012, 05:55:00 PM
After ten days at the cabin I have so much to tell and so little time!  So I'll try to be brief and post lots of pics instead :)

Arrived Friday and got settled in quickly, then got busy mowing with the brush hog / rotary mower until a big lightening storm came through -- then I read until a friend arrived.

Saturday and Sunday were spent mostly fishing (caught a bunch of trout) and Monday was a day of smoking trout (and chicken) and digging a hole for our grey water drain system.
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Digging.jpg)
The tractor made digging the system much faster but the rocks were just too much even for a 50hp tractor!!!  I eventually settled on about 3 feet and decided to level the ground a bit afterward and bring up the west side of the area the drain was placed in (the east side was fine the west side was a foot low).

On Monday my wife arrived and we spent the week mowing, working on a friends road and visiting, fixing our water supply (more or less) and installing the grey water drain, sinks etc.
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Greywater.jpg)

It was an awesome week (ten days for me)....here are some results of the mowing:
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/BigPine3.jpg)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Park_tractor.jpg)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Park.jpg)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Park10.jpg)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Park6.jpg)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on July 30, 2012, 10:25:09 AM
Looks great!  mowing really "parked out" the property.  Now you'll need to get a disc or plow in there and be ready to plant next spring! - or you could just plant some wheat for harvest next year.

This coming weekend, if the checkbook is willing, I'll head up to my place and put the rafters up  :) (I hope)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 30, 2012, 11:54:50 AM
LAID OFF!!!!!

I came back to work after my 10 day vacation only to find out I was laid off.

:o ??? :(

OK now what......time to get back up and start looking for work again....and maybe plan a flippin' trip to the cabin to work off the new stress.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on July 30, 2012, 01:33:12 PM
Ouch! That hurts. Very sorry to hear about that.   :(

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on July 30, 2012, 02:46:02 PM
That's a bummer................ ???   >:( :-\
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 30, 2012, 03:43:47 PM
Thanks guys.

This one really blind sided me!  I mean, I always knew it could happen in today's market but I really didn't expect this at all.  Not sure who all got laid off but I'm pretty certain it's just me and maybe one or two of the construction crew (if any).

They pay the splicer about 2/3rds of what they were paying me and he's pretty confident he can figure out how to engineer the paths etc so I'm guessing they decided that it was time to say goodbye to me since I trained him so well.

Nice huh?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on July 30, 2012, 04:10:03 PM
Well at least you did not get outsourced to Indonesia or Vietnam or China or Mexico    ;) 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 30, 2012, 04:36:10 PM
True enough but none-the-less it sucks!  d* :P

Now it's time to refocus, look for work and rework the budget.  As it stands we're probably ok for at least 3 or 4 months and likely can make that longer for a few but sadly we got complacent this past two years and didn't work as hard to protect ourselves from layoffs etc....not that we're unable to make it or anything (because we've been trying to protect ourselves for a while) just that we won't be quite as at ease with this lay off as the last one.

It if takes more then six months to find work I imagine we'll have to start dipping into things we'd rather not have to but for now, I'll keep moving forward with the cabin (I hope) and look for work -- and maybe offer tractor services and mill services to my neighbors for a decent rate to help with the costs....

Never know, might end up with enough work running the tractor to just do that! lol

one could wish!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 30, 2012, 05:02:11 PM
Hmmmm......running the numbers I think we can do 12 to 18 months without much heartache thanks to previous work preparing for this kind of crap (whipes brow)...so, now I just have to come to terms with the sudden impact style of lay off (not something you can ever get used to I think) and then maybe plan a cabin trip to get more work done and clear the mind.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: UK4X4 on July 30, 2012, 05:07:10 PM
Sorry to hear that - no one wants that news especially during a down turn - there are so many others looking for work.

At least it sounds like you were prepared financially !

Which is way more than most could manage.

Handy chap like yourself could probably make a living off of odd jobs , maybe not as much in the corperate world , but maybe enough to live happily and enjoy the work !

I'll be doing this cubicle sh$T as long as they keep paying me, but I'm far from happy,

I'd rather set up a little fabshop and make things for people- earn less but have a happy lifestyle
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on July 30, 2012, 10:58:02 PM
Wow! I am sorry to hear that.

A friend of mine used to always say that a guy with a truck was never out of work.  With a truck AND a tractor, you should be able to drum up enough to keep you busy - at least enough to help keep from dipping into the savings.

At least now you have a flexible schedule to get to the property!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on July 31, 2012, 08:29:01 AM
Quote from: JavaMan on July 30, 2012, 10:58:02 PM
Wow! I am sorry to hear that.

A friend of mine used to always say that a guy with a truck was never out of work.  With a truck AND a tractor, you should be able to drum up enough to keep you busy - at least enough to help keep from dipping into the savings.

At least now you have a flexible schedule to get to the property!

[cool] IDEA JavaMan 

Might even be one of those things that turns out to be a blessing.......

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 31, 2012, 10:49:05 AM
One of the things that helped convince me to buy a tractor, besides that we needed one on the property, was the possibility of using it to mow property for others or do work on driveways and plow snow etc etc....

No trailer means I can't tow it to anyones place but I can at least post a flier at the local general store and let folks know I can mow their property within a few miles of me...never know, might be able to pick up some work around me enough to pay for gas and expenses to the cabin.

Also plan on experimenting with moving the mill onto my ATV trailer with the tractor boom.  If I can do it alone easily enough (which I think I can) then I could also offer my services milling lumber for locals close enough for me to tow the mill to behind the tractor -- and with time perhaps I can get a bigger trailer that I could haul the tractor and/or mill on.

That way, if the telecom world isn't hiring perhaps I won't give a rats behind! lol
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 31, 2012, 12:28:09 PM
https://s998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/?action=view&current=Tractormowing_0001.mp4 (https://s998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/?action=view&current=Tractormowing_0001.mp4)

Thought I'd post this for y'all :)  My wife did some videos for the grandsons who love tractors.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on July 31, 2012, 02:31:59 PM
Oh heck yeah! I forgot about the mill!  (which is one reason I want to get my own mill before the year is out - just in case!)

You got PROSPECTS man!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: alex trent on July 31, 2012, 04:12:51 PM
The mill idea might just be the silver lining.

Or you could go back in the Corps..i hear they are still full of one good deal after another.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 31, 2012, 05:12:58 PM
Quote from: alextrent on July 31, 2012, 04:12:51 PM
The mill idea might just be the silver lining.

Or you could go back in the Corps..i hear they are still full of one good deal after another.

Nah, I'm too old for the Corps now!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Tickhill on July 31, 2012, 06:58:28 PM
Sorry to hear it OJ. It may not look like it right now but He has a plan for each of us. You may end up having to move to the cabin to keep up with landscaping business!!!
God Bless and good luck,
Tickhill
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 01, 2012, 08:22:04 AM
Thanks Tick :)

I'm usually not too worried but admit this time bothers me a bit since I have been looking for work since I started this job two years ago...and nothing has come out of it....two years and nothing?  Scary.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on August 01, 2012, 09:39:22 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on August 01, 2012, 08:22:04 AM
Thanks Tick :)

I'm usually not too worried but admit this time bothers me a bit since I have been looking for work since I started this job two years ago...and nothing has come out of it....two years and nothing?  Scary.
As the kids say ... "Word!" OJH.

Been looking myself for a while, and earlier this year the market heated up, but I have to say, it seems to have cooled in the last 6 weeks or so.  That said, I did get a call from a recruiter yesterday, so we'll see what comes of that.  It would be nice since it would increase my remuneration by about 30%

And yes, I know, I'm employed - and glad for it - but the job satisfaction just isn't there because I'm not doing what I built a career out of - programming.

Like Alextrent said - I think the mill is the silver lining.  Get yourself a 10 or 12 foot flatbed trailer to haul it around on, and you're all set.  Of course if you make enough with your "toys" you can expand and get a big enough trailer to tow the tractor, and then you've got mobility!

I'm headed up to my place this weekend for a quick trip, hoping to get those rafter trusses up - then up again the next, maybe we can get together for lunch or something one of those weekends
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 01, 2012, 11:15:23 AM
Possibility of a two month contract for nearly twice my old pay and halfway to the cabin....too bad it isn't closer to the cabin ;)  I could commute from the cabin daily and work on it at night...hmmmm....sent the recruiter a note suggesting Omak, Tonasket and Republic were all good spots for me! lol

The prospects aren't great but I know a fair amount of people in the business and if it gets bad I'll have to work somewhere else (which would suck) until I could get back here for work....but that will take 6+ months of not finding work locally first!

As for the mill and tractor, I've thought about that (trust me) and may try to do it but the issue at the moment is loading the mill and unloading it -- can't be done alone without the tractor.  So that's an issue.

Of course, I could get my neighbor to make that trailer for me ;) and tow it behind the tractor
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on August 01, 2012, 03:09:42 PM
Two months for 4 months pay?  ???

I'd say take it ... since it's only for 2 months.  Grit the teeth and sock away all the "extra" .  Plus you might be able to get them to give you part of the rate as a Per Diem since you'll have to be traveling away from home.  How you spend it is your business, but it gets part of the rate out from under the tax man  ;D

I've been known to do a short contract like that just to be still working while I'm looking.  Which is great.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 02, 2012, 01:29:15 PM
No word back from them since original contact.  Could be that the spot was already filled but I've seen plenty of these types of things come up in the last year or two.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on August 02, 2012, 02:22:04 PM
To bad you don't do web site programming and support.  I know where there's going to be an opening soon - once the job description is complete.

But then again, it would be a very loooooong commute for you  :o
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 02, 2012, 08:29:03 PM
Used to do that kind of stuff back when HTML was pretty much all you had to do...but with JAva and Ajax and php etc I'm pretty useless today.

But that's ok :)  I've had a lot of action on the job hunting front and am planning a cabin trip to get that in before I end up going back to work!  *crossing fingers*

I shouldn't jinx myself but I'm feeling very good today.  US Cellular is looking for someone with my qualifications right here locally (man wouldn't that be sweet) and I was just contacted about two positions in the Portland Area that I might consider just to get back to work....

and there are contract jobs being offered up also....let's hope this keeps up :)  Heck, I wouldn't mind doing some contract work for a few months (better pay)_and then taking some time to work at the cabin and then doing more contract work *snicker* -- wouldn't that be a sweet deal for a while ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on August 03, 2012, 10:02:19 AM
Yep, it would be sweet.  I have always lamented that I never had the situation set up when I WAS doing contract work to work things out that way (someone always spent that "extra" cash), but now, I know that Beautiful would budget things wisely and I could do that, but I'd like to stay someplace for longer than 18 months.  Altho - there is a contract possibilty for a 6 month contract extendable (in 6 month chunks) for up to 2.5 years...at 30% more than I make now ... that would be sweet! [cool]

Here's to you getting back to work in a situation that is optimal!  :beer:
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 05, 2012, 12:35:42 AM
Well I'm planning a trip back up to the cabin.  I've applied for a few positions (only one that's really interesting but you have to apply for everything and anything out there these days) and am in a but of a waiting game so figure it's time to take advantage of the down time.

Going to try to get some more mowing done and clearing of brush piles /slash piles to safer spots to burn when the winter rolls around.  Also have to work on trying to get the water lines clear of air and plan to put in a temp system to provide 'running' water in the cabin.  Bought an RV pump (self priming) for $69 after shipping and plan to use food safe 55 gallon drums that I'll fill first with the pump (to draw as much air out of the lines while pumping water from the cistern) and then use the RV pump to provide indoor water pressure from the barrels.  Should be an interesting challenge.

Anyway, I think I'll take another week up there (maybe 5 days but will be prepared to stay 6 or 7 or more) just to get away for a bit :)

Kinda get stoked now though :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on August 06, 2012, 10:51:15 AM
Too bad you didn't get the backhoe for the tractor (or did you?) ... you could dig up that old line and get it done!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 07, 2012, 12:07:46 AM
Quote from: JavaMan on August 06, 2012, 10:51:15 AM
Too bad you didn't get the backhoe for the tractor (or did you?) ... you could dig up that old line and get it done!

Ya would be nice but we just couldn't justify the expense frankly.  Maybe some day.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 14, 2012, 12:02:53 AM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Property.jpg)
Oh how there is so much to tell about my last 6 day adventure at the cabin!  Much was done all while I got a lot of 'down time' for myself.  But here are a few teaser pictures for you to ponder while I get some sleep.....and I'll update and add more tomorrow.

OK So I'll need to get the laptop out to share some of my journal of this last trip but for now I'll ad lib a little ;)

The above pic is just a setting picture taken mostly because things are SO different today then 3 years ago.  SO much brow mowed and clearing done and ground work done that in some ways it's like a whole new place!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/RunningWater.jpg)
I think you get the idea with this one but I'll add more and some explanation tomorrow.

So with the problems of the 1" line from the Cistern and being laid off work and unable to fork over the $1000 I'll need to install a 2" line (500' long no less) and the money for a bigger cistern while I'm at it I've settled on buying a Sureflo RV pump ($79 after shipping off Ebay) and using it to pump water from the Cistern Spigot (about 50 feet from the cabin) into a 55 gallon drum and then using it to pump from the drum into the cabin as needed just like you'd have in an RV.  It works like a charm!  I'll post some other pics shortly.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Stairs-1.jpg)
I'm pretty much stoked with how these turned out...more to come.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Irrigation.jpg)
What?  There's a whole lot of 'splainin' to do here ;)
I'll post about this shortly to...
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Shower.jpg)
OK two guesses....Skagit you first! lol
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on August 14, 2012, 10:27:33 AM
Great looking stairs!  an water in the house - wonderful.  I bet your wife is happy about that  ;)

I can't wait to hear (as Paul Harvey would say), the rest of the story!

Oh, and good luck on the job front.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: SkagitDrifter on August 14, 2012, 10:46:06 AM

Wow- Running water, now that's progress. Great Job!
I love the outdoor shower-
Feels as good as a $300 per night stay at a fancy Spa I'll bet.
Your place is looking good- almost like an old homestead from days gone by.
I'll bet it feels good to have all the comforts of home while being off the grid.
Sorry about the lay off from work but it sounds like you have a few irons in the fire.
Good luck and great work Erik-   
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 14, 2012, 11:19:20 AM
Quote from: JavaMan on August 14, 2012, 10:27:33 AM
Great looking stairs!  an water in the house - wonderful.  I bet your wife is happy about that  ;)

I can't wait to hear (as Paul Harvey would say), the rest of the story!

Oh, and good luck on the job front.

Thanks and thanks :)

My wife?  Heck ME!!!  You can't imagine (ok you can and will) how awesome it is to walk in and wash your hands in running water in the sink without a worry!  3 years of using diaper wipes, going out to the frost free or just getting by with a little left over dish water sorta makes you appreciate running water a LOT more! ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on August 14, 2012, 11:37:54 AM
Oh, yeah.  I can imagine that.  Wait - I don't HAVE to imagine that.  Lordy the grime I washed off me when I got home on Sunday!

Unfortunately, I don't have a well... I do have a 200 gallon tank tho that fits the back of my truck.  So, until I can do snow and rain harvest, I'll need to find a place to get water from.

Nice faucet, BTW.  So what's the story of the ladder and pallet (is that covering a hole so you don't fall into it in the dark?)

Oh, wait... I just looked, and it's your outdoor shower!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 14, 2012, 11:51:36 AM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Property2.jpg)
Arriving last Wednesday evening I wanted to get the cabin water running and wanted to mow more brush around the property.  I also wanted to measure the size of the land I have that I want to plant in the near future -- not knowing what an acre 'looks' like  I needed to get out the range finder.  Good thing too because what I thought 'looked' like a good 4 or 5 acres or even more turned out to be just TWO!  300 feet by 300 feet....Hmmm.....

So, after arriving I went to work right away trying to get the header installed in the 'water closet' (really a water box).  I realized very quickly I didn't have the right tools, parts or know how but figured a trip to HD would solve some of that.  So I visited a neighbor and then returned to mow for a couple hours.

The next morning, Thursday, I mowed again and then headed off to HD which was 45 minutes away.  I was pushing it budget wise since I hadn't planned for the xtra trip or parts and being out of work have only budgeted $200 a trip....and I pulled a trailer up with me to bring up finished paneling as well as the ships ladder stairs and to haul wood back for processes -- which cost me more gas.

I was starting to sweat it a little but figured I'd make it work.

Once back at the cabin with parts and pieces I was able to finally get back to work...only to learn the crimper I had sucked and I couldn't make a leak proof crimp on the sharkbites I was using.  So back to HD and more sweat.

Luckily I'd brought two 6 gallon cans of gas with me!  Sometime in there I called Jeff to let him know I'd blown my budget.  I really wanted to help but had to be disciplined with the finances now that I'm out of work...sorry!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/PexHeader.jpg)
My first order of business was to try to figure out how to make the $18 header I bought work in the tight space I left for it (and for a second).  I hadn't planned that well and if I had to do it over I'd make the location 1 1/2 times larger all around but it will work as is....just something to chalk up to 'learning'.

Anyway, I ran my Pex too close together and didn't want to try to chisel out the wood between each run of Pex (I'd drilled holes to stuff them up through) so creatively connected them to the header as best I could. 

Hey, it works!

Next was to figure out how to make the under sink connections work -- I'm no plumber by any stretch if you hadn't noticed -- and realized I needed to put 90's in and then run some pex out to the vavles.  Later I'll go in and put some treated pine boards in to cover the holes and secure the pex better.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Undersink.jpg)
The drain I'd put in when my wife and I were out on vacation and it works nicely, though was a challenge....

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Watersupply.jpg)
I then capped off all unused pex and installed the valves and then wired up the pump to the same set of wires I had installed for the composter fan (switched inside the porch conveniently) and ran the cabin water line to the pump.  I didn't have enough 90's to do this well but decided to do that next trip when I box it all in.  For now it was more a 'proof of concept' then anything else.

With a second pex run going into the barrel, and having filled up the barrel half way with well water using the pump and garden hose I had a system ready to test!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/RunningWater.jpg)
At first I didn't have water....something was wrong, then I checked the 'hose' I used for a siphon out of the barrel and replaced it with pex (the hose was too light and floated)....and RUNNING WATER!

Sounds just like our tent trailer when the taps turn on.

Oh and I also learned that the stupid sink didn't need to be drilled ;) just punch out the holes and install the taps.  Also sealed the sink to the counter while I was at it.

Next was to install the drain to the bathroom sink.
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Greywater-1.jpg)
My wife and I had installed the Grey Water drain system we'd purchased a year or two ago and used it during our vacation so all I had to do was add a drain from the bathroom to the Y pipe which feeds the system.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Drains.jpg)
This was a challenge alone but I managed it by hanging the pipes with strapping and then gluing them in place and tightening the straps to get the angle of drop correct.

I was VERY glad for the extra ground clearance under the cabin at this point!

I was not glad to find a lot of ants living in the insulation under the cabin though....

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Ants.jpg)
At some point I began waging war with Diatomaceous (sp?) Earth...I have less ants now

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Under.jpg)
At some point I realized I needed an extension for the drain in order to get it down through the 1 1/2" hole I'd drilled and into the coupler that connects it to the PVC drain pipes.....a trip to Tonasket got me the extension and some parts for the irrigation and deeper in trouble with the Budget Master (wife -- though she was very happy in the end as I knew she would be).

With the sink drain in I was able to test the sink out
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Water.jpg)
Oh yes how beautiful the sight and sound!!!!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Bath2-1.jpg)
Now I just have one more drain to install and one more valve to put in -- for the tub and shower -- and then I can do away with my outdoor shower:

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Shower.jpg)
Skaget, trust me, your shower is a million bucks!  Mine?  50 cents! haha but it feels like a million bucks when it's 95 outside and I'm dusty and dirty!  Just don't come by uninvited in the late afternoon without honking first! hahaha
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 14, 2012, 11:57:24 AM
Quote from: JavaMan on August 14, 2012, 11:37:54 AM
Oh, yeah.  I can imagine that.  Wait - I don't HAVE to imagine that.  Lordy the grime I washed off me when I got home on Sunday!

Unfortunately, I don't have a well... I do have a 200 gallon tank tho that fits the back of my truck.  So, until I can do snow and rain harvest, I'll need to find a place to get water from.

Nice faucet, BTW.  So what's the story of the ladder and pallet (is that covering a hole so you don't fall into it in the dark?)

Oh, wait... I just looked, and it's your outdoor shower!

The Navy seal who has a cabin above me uses Rain water collection and it gets him all the water they use year round I am told!  I think it gives them 300 gallons and could easily expand to more then that but they truck up drinking water.

Honestly, 55 gallon barrels in Tonasket are $32 (I got mine from a neighbor free though) and for $64 you could have two and easily hook up an RV pump to them.  One in the back of your truck for transport and one behind the cabin to fill from the transport tank (that way you don't have to try to move one).

You reverse the pump to draw the water from the tank in the truck to the tank on the ground.

55 Gallons will last 2 people a week if they bring drinking water and are careful.  Maybe longer.  For more people we've camped in our tent trailer with 38 gallons (26 on board and two 6 gallon jugs) for 4 days easily.  Maybe with 6 total users.  No showers though!

Something else would be to install an above ground 300+ gallon cistern and bring 55 to 110 gallons with you each trip to fill it (could use gravity and siphon to fill and save the pump also)....then at some point you'd have another for a few weeks with showers :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 14, 2012, 12:01:35 PM
So the next step for the plumbing is:

1.  Build an insulated box for the drums (I have two actually) and install the Pex neatly with 90's etc and insulation to the barrels and pump.
2.  Install two diverters in the pex lines so I can change direction of the pump from the barrels to the house to the cistern to the barrels or cistern to the house.
3.  Install the bathtub drain and valves etc.
4.  Cover all holes with treated pine.
5.  Install hot water (instant on) heater outside in the water box -- a neighbor uses an RV water heater in his and vents heat from his cabin into the box to keep it from freezing -- I might consider that too.
6.  Install at least one outside spigot for watering or getting water outside of the cabin for various reasons.

Probably more but I can't think of it right off -- except that we need to finish covering the grey water drain system and insulate the drains for the winter -- should help a little I imagine.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 14, 2012, 01:37:53 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Stairs-1.jpg)
Another mission of my trip was to install the ships ladder stairs to the loft.

I'd been working on them in the past but hadn't quite finished (too hot locally to work in a tent to finish them and I don't have a shop) but figured I could finish at the cabin.

I brought them up and went to work drilling the pilot holes for the 3" deck screws I planned to use to secure the treads in the 1/4" grooves I'd routered out of the risers.  I was using an HD portable drill press attachment which worked 'ok' but often locked up -- which ticked me off some -- but I got the job done and brought the stairs in.

The next step was to insert the treads and clamp the assembly together with it leaning against the wall -- where they would get installed (more on that later).

Then, with everything clamped together I planned to square as best I could and then drill.  I drilled away and even screwed on the treads only to realize later I forgot the whole squaring part -- DOH!  d*

I loosened up everything and squared the assembly and then secured the risers and tightened all the screws.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Shipsladder.jpg)

My first test of the stairs shocked me!  I was previously fretting over the 8 inch rise because of the near 60 degree angle of the stairs (which makes them not quite a ships ladder) but frankly it's PERFECT!  Ok, maybe it could be 8 1/2" or even 9" but I'm convinced it worked out perfectly for me!  Sweet!

ROCK SOLID is how I would describe them also.  Again, sweet!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/anotherlook.jpg)
Now I still have to do some sanding and trimming around but they are in and it's a heck of a lot easier to get into the loft.

Regarding placement: I've long debated (with my kids mostly) the placement of the stairs but settled on their opinion and left it as is.  They liked the idea of walking up to the ceiling and then over onto the loft because it gave more room in the lower section of the cabin.  I'll stick with it.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 14, 2012, 01:48:06 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Rail.jpg)
Another small project was to put a railing on our temporary stairs into the porch.  It will be torn down in the future and replaced when the deck goes on but for now, and for insurance purposes, I needed a railing...so I grab some logs and tossed one together.

Not the best work, but it does what it needs to I guess.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Orchard-1.jpg)
One problem I've been having is getting water to my apple trees.  I need to replace the cistern and main line down to the cabin and orchard but in the meantime came up with a new solution:

1.  Remove the current (and stripped thanks to a friend) hose connection at the first tree and then move the hose over to as close to the middle of the irrigation to the trees as possible.
2.  Install a T fitting and anti-siphon connection for the hose at the new location.
3.  Replace a broken garden timer with a new one that didn't restrict water flow.
4.  Fill cistern and water trees.

All accomplished as can be seen below:
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Irrigation.jpg)
New T and Anti-Siphon hose connection.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Dripper.jpg)
Seeing this just makes me smile!  It was a challenge getting all drippers working at all trees but as long as I have water in the tank I think they will all get water....I sure hope so!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Burnt.jpg)
This is the tree I thought I'd lost.  I hope it's done well enough to survive the winter!  Maybe one of you who's grown trees a while can let me know what you think -- this is the tree that was Frost burned early on.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Apple-2.jpg)
Another of our happy apples :)

Thanks to a neighbor for watering them by hand when I wasn't there to do it I think we've saved them all!  And they get free apples when they arrive in a few years ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 14, 2012, 02:18:34 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/BoardnBatten.jpg)
Yet one more thing I began working on (I know right?  I mean I was only there 5 days!  c* ) was to try to get the siding started -- or at least the batten boards and the window trim.

Couple things I realized:
1. Use 1" trim for the windows and 1/2" battens so they match.
2.  Maybe make the window trim slightly longer on the horizontal and change the upper angle to the opposite for appearance -- maybe.
3.  I need to mill more wood!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Batten.jpg)
One thing I have to say is that when you are making your own lumber things just take longer.  For one you have to cut down a god sized tree, then buck off the braches and cut it into logs of the size of boards you want plus 3-6" of waste ends.  Then drag/skid it to the mill, roll it up onto the mill and make a CANT and then mill the lumber size you want and stack and sticker it.

Once dried, about 8 weeks, you then can plane the wood and rip it to the size you want (unless using it rough then just rip it) and finally make use of it.

It's a long process but worth the wait!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on August 14, 2012, 06:31:04 PM
Looking great OJH.  Were your roads in dust(y)?  That's one of the reasons Beautiful doesn't like my place - the road is really crummy (erosion in the spring runoff) and then in August and September it turns to this fine powder that when you drive over it turns into a giant dust cloud.

I have a fine layer of grey dust over my truck bumper. :-\

I'd love to have some water to just spray the road with when I'm up there, but I'm afraid it would just turn to muddy muck.

I think someone up the road from my place is harvesting trees.  There are two tracked vehicles that have "grabbers" on them, one giant tractor with a backhoe-like attachment, but it's not a backhoe (looks like another kind of grabber), and a big truck of some sort.  They are parking them on the state land by Buzzard Lake.  I'm hoping they run up and down the road enough to crush it back into shape.

I'm looking at doing something like your ship's ladder for the access to my loft, so I'd be interested in hearing what the run/rise of it is?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: o-leander on August 14, 2012, 07:29:05 PM
... all the times you say
QuoteAt some point I realized....
or similar, make me laugh.  So much recognition in those few words.  Your place is looking great.  I love that you decided to listen to the young'uns about the ladder.  No big deal to change it later I would guess, and gives them good ownership of the process.  As for the tree, i planted a bunch of bare-roots on my lot this spring, so i'll just pray for yours along with mine for getting thru the winter.  I believe if it is looking that healthy now it should be fine as long as it gets water into the fall.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 14, 2012, 07:42:19 PM
Quote from: JavaMan on August 14, 2012, 06:31:04 PM
Looking great OJH.  Were your roads in dust(y)?  That's one of the reasons Beautiful doesn't like my place - the road is really crummy (erosion in the spring runoff) and then in August and September it turns to this fine powder that when you drive over it turns into a giant dust cloud.

I have a fine layer of grey dust over my truck bumper. :-\

I'd love to have some water to just spray the road with when I'm up there, but I'm afraid it would just turn to muddy muck.

I think someone up the road from my place is harvesting trees.  There are two tracked vehicles that have "grabbers" on them, one giant tractor with a backhoe-like attachment, but it's not a backhoe (looks like another kind of grabber), and a big truck of some sort.  They are parking them on the state land by Buzzard Lake.  I'm hoping they run up and down the road enough to crush it back into shape.

I'm looking at doing something like your ship's ladder for the access to my loft, so I'd be interested in hearing what the run/rise of it is?

Certain parts of the roads get that way and certain areas of the property can.  The problem is a lack of organic material in the soil so when it dries out it's just pure talcum powder dust!  So compost trees etc that you get off the property and spread them out into the road bed ;)  And add gravel.

The ships ladder was kind of fun to do since I went with the grooves instead of straight glue and screws.  IN fact, I didn't glue in the end but might some day.

What I did was work out the rise and run I had and then went with an 8" rise per tread.  Once done I laid it out per riser with pencil and mocked it up to see how it worked.  Once I was happy with it I started routing out the grooves (1/4" deep) to 'slot' the treads into so they would have some extra strength for my lard arse;)  Finally I drilled 3 holes in each groove and then a counter sink hole also -- that way I can hide the screw heads later.  Then placed the treads and drilled a pilot hole through the riser holes so I wouldn't crack the pine boards and screwed them up.

The result was pretty decent I feel :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 14, 2012, 07:44:11 PM
Quote from: o-leander on August 14, 2012, 07:29:05 PM
... all the times you say  or similar, make me laugh.  So much recognition in those few words.  Your place is looking great.  I love that you decided to listen to the young'uns about the ladder.  No big deal to change it later I would guess, and gives them good ownership of the process.  As for the tree, i planted a bunch of bare-roots on my lot this spring, so i'll just pray for yours along with mine for getting thru the winter.  I believe if it is looking that healthy now it should be fine as long as it gets water into the fall.

d*  Sadly it can make me laugh too!  I laugh at myself a lot frankly!  Sooo many times I've come to the conclusion that I've forgotten something, or don't have something or just plain don't know squat about something and have to find a way around it...or go spend more money! lol but I love the process in the end because I love to solve problems -- lifes problems.

Actually, it's what I do for work; I'm a problem solver for telecom ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on August 15, 2012, 09:18:14 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on August 14, 2012, 07:42:19 PM
Certain parts of the roads get that way and certain areas of the property can.  The problem is a lack of organic material in the soil so when it dries out it's just pure talcum powder dust!  So compost trees etc that you get off the property and spread them out into the road bed ;)  And add gravel.

Excellent description - talcum powder - perfect, in fact.   :D

So what you're telling me is that I should shovel the cow-pies off my property and put them in the road?  As for the gravel ... gotta cheap source? I need about 5 miles worth... ???

Thanks for the tip on the ships ladder.  I'll have to take a measurement of my stairwell and see how tall I need it to be.  I think I'm going to actually go beyond the loft floor, though, so as to have ladder to grab onto at the top while you're stepping off onto the loft.  I'm already finding it quite easy to simply keep going up the ladder if there is something (like a roof truss  ::) ) in front of me to grab on to as I'm stepping off onto the loft.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 15, 2012, 10:03:11 AM
I'll be installing a railing and grab rails for that.  Probably have my neighbor do the grab rails in mild steel and twist them like Iron...my wife loves wrought Iron works.

One thing about the stairs is that they are not like a ladder but rather, well, stairs.  You'll have to pop by and try them to see but once you walk up and down them you will realize it's a great way to go!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on August 15, 2012, 10:59:31 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on August 15, 2012, 10:03:11 AM
I'll be installing a railing and grab rails for that.  Probably have my neighbor do the grab rails in mild steel and twist them like Iron...my wife loves wrought Iron works.

One thing about the stairs is that they are not like a ladder but rather, well, stairs.  You'll have to pop by and try them to see but once you walk up and down them you will realize it's a great way to go!

Yeah, I figured they weren't really "ladder-like", but sorta in-between ladder and stairs.  Mine will be running roughly 5' (maybe 5'5" or so) with a rise of approximately7'6" (give or take).  I should be able to have something reasonably easy to walk up and down.  Actually, I just realized, I could actually measure it from the ladder I was using - just set it up the way it was at the ranch and take the measurements! d*

Hmmm... now I'm thinking about this a bit.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 15, 2012, 01:53:57 PM
Mine run 5 feet with a rise of about 7'6" so you will be very happy with that and an 8" tread rise I think.

At 5'6" run it would be even nicer to use but take up that much more room -- though my son suggested putting the stairs at the back of the cabin so they aren't in the middle of the room below -- and I think he has an excellent idea.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on August 15, 2012, 02:13:45 PM
Yeah, if you look at one of the pictures I posted from a couple weekends ago, you can see the "Stairwell" with the ladder peeking out of the top.  It's the "Back" of the building.

I put it there as a bit of an afterthought, since it plays well with the floor joists, and where the doors and windows are.  Also, since the peak of the roof is there, it works out reasonably that you can still stand up as you're climbing the stairs and get to the loft level.

My wife would have done this  [slap] if I'd put it just about any other way
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 15, 2012, 10:26:54 PM
Just unloaded a trailer of pine I brought back from the property.  Needs some work though!  Seems this batch warped more then any other....maybe I didn't have enough weight on them, or it was just too dry or too wet or,....who knows but it's in need of a jig on my table saw to saw it straight.

I'm thinking of cutting it all down to 4 foot lengths (for the flooring) to make it easier to work though and perhaps doing the same for the paneling in the loft since I most likely will be installing alone.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 16, 2012, 03:59:32 PM
NOTE TO SELF: DO NOT leave a battery in the back of your pickup without checking that it is UPRIGHT! Sadly, I was being an idiot and left a battery from the cabin in the back of the truck. Apparently it fell over (first time in 3 years of transporting them back and forth) and leaked ALL acid out. Said acid then dripped/poured down onto the gas tank and most likely a fuel line between the bed o
f the pickup box and the top of the tank (as in hard to reach spot)....fuel shot everywhere when starting up the truck! Yikes! So not I've used baking soda to neutralize the acid (hopefully) and then washed it out as best I could and the truck will get towed to the shop Monday to have the tank removed and any repairs needed done....so ya, it pretty much sucks big time. d* d* d* d*
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: UK4X4 on August 16, 2012, 04:08:32 PM
 "truck will get towed to the shop Monday to have the tank removed and any repairs needed done"

rumage in the garage and dig out those old high school tools- dropping a tank and checking a tank won't take more than a hour or two and save your money !
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 17, 2012, 11:10:57 AM
Thought about it but decided I didn't want to bother.  I'm changing out the rad, o2 sensor and a few other things on my Jeep though -- just for that reason (to save) but when it comes to fuel tanks I just don't like messing with them!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 25, 2012, 09:18:19 AM
Ouch.

The acid ate up fuel lines as well as the pump itself!  Had to have the entire undercarriage (pretty much) srayed with an acid neutralizer to make sure there wasn't any left anywhere...was a real mess and cost $1200 to fix (ever bought anew fuel pump?  Yikes!  Fuel lines? ouch!)...had a few other things done while we were at it but the final $1400 price tag hurt :(

Ahh well, lessons learned!

I've had a second interview for a job and am crossing fingers I'll get a 3rd in a week.

With luck I'll land this job and be back earning a living again soon :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on August 25, 2012, 09:28:23 PM
Wow!  I hope you get that next interview and job ... you'll be able to cover that repair in no time, and get back to working on what really matters... the cabin!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 26, 2012, 12:18:23 AM
Quote from: JavaMan on August 25, 2012, 09:28:23 PM
Wow!  I hope you get that next interview and job ... you'll be able to cover that repair in no time, and get back to working on what really matters... the cabin!

THanks :)  I hope so too!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 04, 2012, 09:21:39 AM
As the job search continues the cabin work slows down, but I'll have plenty to do here at home for the cabin in the coming months as I'll be working on flooring and wall paneling so we can finish it off this winter hopefully.

My next trip is planned for the coming weekend and I'll be picking up my son while I'm there.  Then we have another trip plan later in the month also.

First order of business will be to get ready for the winter so more wood cutting and such, then I'll have to try to get some work done on the roofing (finishing some things off) and if I'm lucky can get back to other areas that need work.

I'm getting exited though as it's been nearly a month since I was last there!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 06, 2012, 11:07:23 PM
Finally!  Heading out tomorrow for a week at the cabin :)  Can't wait to get there and well, just do cabin stuff :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on September 07, 2012, 10:35:14 AM
Nice!  Wish I could take a week up at mine... altho, I really wouldn't want to be able to because of a lack of employment! ???

Hopefully the job hunt is going fairly well.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 13, 2012, 08:26:51 PM
Back!

Not sure about the job hunt but might be in line to start with a crew putting in 4g sites in WA.  Hate to do travel work but need to work so will take what I can get.

Meanwhile, had a great week at the cabin!

Started out Friday by fixing the water supply system with some fittings to better run the pex etc and got the barrel installed that I'd had at home and cleaned out thoroughly.  So with that done had plenty of water :)  No real air in the supply line either so it was a quick fill up from the cistern.

Checked the orchard and the trees are AWESOME!  Growing like weeds.  Everything is dead around them from the dryness (always dry this time of year) but each of the 5 trees is an oasis of growth thanks to the drip irrigation I've installed.  Only downside was the crappy timer died from water exposure rusting the connections and I guess frying the board -- funny but you'd think a WATER timer wouldn't do that.  Ahh well, I think they'll make it now :)

Saturday I spent most of the day grading the road to our place and it really turned out nice!  That evening I decided to double check the disks my neighbor was going to leave for me but I thought she'd hacked up for scrap...a check discovered they were intact (albeit old) so we hauled them up to the top of the property and tried them out.  THEY WORKED!!!!  I was stoked.

Had a night of darts and JD :)  Was a good night!

Sunday I disked up about 1 1/2 acres for a Cereal Rye field I plan to get planted next trip (just over a week from now).  Also did a lot of clearing on it (small saplings).

Monday was firewood day :)  Cut down 3 or 4 dead pines and hauled them back to the woodshed (bucked up).  The tractor makes a great wood getter :)

Tuesday I picked up my son (he's moving back for a year) and we mostly hung out and relaxed as he was fighting a cold and had a long bus ride getting to Osoyoos from Victoria but Wednesday we chopped up about 3 cords of wood and did some hunting :)

We managed to get some poly on one of the interior walls today before leaving but all in all had a great week at the cabin :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 13, 2012, 10:57:34 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/disking2.jpg)
Here's a shot of me disking the field I want to plant Rye in.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Disking.jpg)
The full view. 

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/dusty.jpg)
I now understand why farmers have bandana's! lol -- actually add overalls and straw hats to that ;)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/1stfield.jpg)
The field is ready (I think) for planting.  I need to remove a few more trees (saplings only) and disk the areas those were in but shouldn't take long.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/woodhauler.jpg)
Another great use for the tractor :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 15, 2012, 05:11:00 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cougar2.jpg)
Here Kitty Kitty :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cougar.jpg)
Poor quality game cam picture (I need a new fangled one I guess) but still obvious what's there once I lightened it up.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OzarkBrandon on September 15, 2012, 06:57:35 PM
Tractor needs a wash after all that disking!  Maybe I missed it, but I was curious why you were planting rye?  Round here, I think it can be planted to build up soil, for ground cover, or as a food plot - was curious if one of those was the reason of if it served a different purpose in your neck of the woods...

I have been enjoying the build - thanks for taking and sharing the pics.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 15, 2012, 10:19:51 PM
All of the above actually :)

Cereal Rye can be harvested for the seed (bread making etc) when grown in a more dense amount then I'll plant but some day I hope to do just that.  Meanwhile, though, it's good for fixing the soil and my soil needs it!  It's also good for game animals and as a weed preventer.

I hope to put in some hay some day too :) and maybe some wheat.  Who knows?  Mostly I'm just having fun disking up the field and planting SOMETHING :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OzarkBrandon on September 16, 2012, 10:25:42 PM
Hey, you bought a tractor, you have to do something with it!  I'd love to have 4WD, but would settle for and old Ford 8N, because they are so common and would do most of what I want - I just need to buy some land and start a house first...
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on September 16, 2012, 11:30:03 PM
Glad to see that your trees did well!  Ours from St Lawrence did great as well, even in this summer heat we had.  We did increase the water to two five gallon waterings per week when it did get hot.  We did that for all the trees.  It was in the high 80 and 90s up there a lot of days weeks on end.  So I would suspect a couple days of 100.

Next couple weeks we will be mostly moved out of here and living up there in the little fifth wheel.  We should have lots of time to do trees guards and supports for the winter.  I think we will do some rebar supports with those apples.  Tie them off with jute string and see how that does.

 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 17, 2012, 10:28:07 AM
I was down to 6 gallons per week for the last month and this week they won't get any water but I'm hoping they will remain fine since they have done so well.  My timer quit (again) and I'm relying on my next trip to water them some more but I'll probably have to get a new timer to make sure they continue to get water until it starts to freeze all the time.

Going back next week to plant the rye and do a little clean up.  Can't wait!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on September 17, 2012, 10:34:22 AM
Good to see the trees did well!

I'm planning on this next weekend up to my place.  Gonna get the top on come what may.  I think I'm going to tell the boss that I hope to be in on Monday, but if not, I'm taking a vacation day to "git 'er done!"

You would think that the water timer would not have an issue with getting wet - what's up with that  ????

I'll have to look back in your thread to see how you did the tree watering system as we have some here on our property that need to be watered more regularly.  Lots of apples, but not very big.  Spent some time yesterday coring and drying them.

Good to see you made it back in one piece.  Sweet on the discer... nice deal!  ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 17, 2012, 01:48:39 PM
Our watering system is a simple and inexpensive drip irrigation system (thanks to Rick for suggesting it) run by a garden timer.

I think the timer should have been sealed better when closed up and left and rain must have gotten into it -- cheap and crappy design.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: SkagitDrifter on September 17, 2012, 02:17:26 PM

Nice- Lots of cats around this year, not so good for the deer.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 17, 2012, 03:49:51 PM
Quote from: SkagitDrifter on September 17, 2012, 02:17:26 PM
Nice- Lots of cats around this year, not so good for the deer.

Yup -- didn't see ANY last trip :(
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Runnerdave on September 23, 2012, 08:05:32 PM
OlJ, I think we're neighbors (if you call within 15 miles or so neighbors) and I've read your post from page 1.  This is my first posting/reply and I have a ton of questions for you but I'll save most of them for another time. Hopefully I'll get my own page started soon.  Looking at your page, you discuss adding to your structure or adding more structures in the future. From where you stand now, do you still plan to grow your current structure?  Or would you have just built a bigger structure to start with? I'm heading up to the Okanagan tomorrow morning for the week - putting in septic.

The support and sharing here is fantastic and I'm anxious to get started with both my structure and posting. Have a great week.  (Seeing those pictures of the cats have me a bit spooked). When you organize the Okanagan rendezvous, please add me to your list.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Yonderosa on September 25, 2012, 09:02:28 AM
It may not be the cats getting the deer spooked.  The "Stawberry" pack was recently confirmed as the ninth "official" pack in WA.  I had my first encounter with them four years ago.  Their territory is just south of OJH.  One of it's "suspected" members was recently collared near my place.  A 104 pound female. 

(https://i1115.photobucket.com/albums/k542/WhitSpurzon/NWColvilleWolf104pndfemale_zpscdeeb0ea.jpg)

They caused quite a stir on our side of the hill last spring.  I've not seen many cats as of late.  Probably all over at Skagit Difter's place now.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Yonderosa on September 25, 2012, 09:14:07 AM
OJH:  Sorry to hear about the job situation.  Unfortunately I know too many others in that same boat. 

I've been very lucky so far even though the pay has fallen back to what I was making in the 80's and early 90's.  It nets even less with today's fuel and insurance costs.  We're month to month for the last three years, not saving (actually dipping into the savings) even though we're working steadily.  "Twice as hard for half as much" seems to be the new normal.  I've been working on my "Do you want fries with that?" so I can ace the interview at the local BK.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 27, 2012, 12:44:19 AM
Yonderosa I hear ya!  Seems wages for Telecom guys are going down down down!

Thought I heard a lone wolf the other night at the cabin....just once and far away.  Only saw one doe when driving up the hill very near Aeneas Valley road and had NONE on the game cam.

Lots of cows, no deer -- but I did see plenty of tracks so I probably just need to move the cam.

Didn't however, see any during the day at the cabin and wasn't really hunting anyway.  Spent more time horsing around ;)

Will post tomorrow with pics etc.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 27, 2012, 10:37:27 AM
OK, finally have a moment for a short update :)

We left Sunday to head to the cabin with only a couple missions in mind:  1.  Plant cereal rye after disking up the rest of the field that was missed earlier.  2.  Chop and stack the remaining wood for the winter.

An alternate plan was to relax a little and try to enjoy our stay at the cabin and of course to replace the timer on the orchard and make sure the trees survived the week and a half without water.

We brought our 2nd oldest and her family with us which was the first time she'd been to the cabin in two years and her husband hadn't been in a year (he used to come and help out but work got in the way of that this past year) and our grandsons hadn't been at the cabin other then when the oldest was a baby.

I got the field prepped for the rye seed but must admit I didn't get it all planted :(  Sure, I spread 35 lbs of see but my spreader (a lawn spreader) sucked for the job and only spread the seed over about 2/3rds of the plot I'd guess.  It just put it down thicker then I needed.  When I find work I'll be buying a proper spreader!

The trees looked awesome so they weren't hurting at all and I made sure they were watered a couple really good times while we were there and set the timer to give them 6 gallons a week again so they should be fine now.  Next trip I need to put them to bed for the winter!

That left wood chopping and clean up -- the cleanup wasn't completed but the chopping was :)  We also improved the woodshed a bit.

Here's a few pics:
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Tractor.jpg)
The grandsons loved to put rocks in the bucket but didn't much like the sounds of the tractor when it was running....they sure liked to play on it though!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Helper.jpg)
Our oldest grandson (2 1/2 yrs old) loves to help :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Woodshed-1.jpg)
We figured this is two cords of wood chopped and stacked with the front row the driest (from a standing dead tree).

Did a little shooting and what-not.  Was a great but short trip.

Part of the reason so short, mind you, was because I had some job search stuff going on and needed (or felt I needed) to get back and continue working on that front.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 27, 2012, 10:50:22 AM
Quote from: Runnerdave on September 23, 2012, 08:05:32 PM
OlJ, I think we're neighbors (if you call within 15 miles or so neighbors) and I've read your post from page 1.  This is my first posting/reply and I have a ton of questions for you but I'll save most of them for another time. Hopefully I'll get my own page started soon.  Looking at your page, you discuss adding to your structure or adding more structures in the future. From where you stand now, do you still plan to grow your current structure?  Or would you have just built a bigger structure to start with? I'm heading up to the Okanagan tomorrow morning for the week - putting in septic.

The support and sharing here is fantastic and I'm anxious to get started with both my structure and posting. Have a great week.  (Seeing those pictures of the cats have me a bit spooked). When you organize the Okanagan rendezvous, please add me to your list.

I suppose if I were to start over today I'd take a few things into consideration more:

1.  The loft height is good but I think I should have included a header and framed doorway or opening (even if it was then sheeted and ignored) over where I might want to put another room at another time.

What I mean by that is that I think it would be hard to expand this builders cottage under the lofts without floor jacks etc in the future because of the inset ledgers -- but maybe not.  Either way, I don't really plan on doing that anyway but it's something I've pondered.

2.  The foundation should have been improved from the start and while it seems to be holding up I still want to improve it because I've put a heavier structure on it.  Had I given it more thought and been in less of a rush I'd have done something more suited for a building that sits higher off the ground and is heavier then planned.

3.  I feel I should have gone with 2x8 floor joists or even 2x10 joists which would have been much stronger -- insulation is not a concern (I know VERY warm cabins with none in the floors at all because of the large woodstove in the corner)  -- but putting heavy stoves and tubs on 2x6 flooring means (at least I think it does) more support for the floor.

4.  Yes to your question about more cabins but that's always been my plan.  Today I have in mind to build at least 2 or 3 'bedroom' or 'bunkhouse' cabins and building them will be both fast and more efficient because of the learning curve with this one ;)  I also plan a shop/shed and a root cellar as well as decks and carports and wood sheds and shop :)

My newest plan for cabins is to build them with expansion in mind more so then this one.  I plan to have them ready to add a bathroom or bedroom (or both) by framing the entryways into them from the start.  Sort of like putting in a back door on one side or the other which can be used for the bedroom later on and framing in another on the opposite side (with a wide header) so I can cut out the studs and make an opening for a dining room or bath or whatever I want later.

The cost of doing so is negligent but the benefit would be great!

Another consideration would be to frame, sheet and roof in that order and complete the exterior 100% before moving inside.

Today, 3 years down the road I've yet to complete the gabled end roofing and need to complete the siding!

Also, I'd put composting toilets on the south side to catch more sun in the winter and complete the under-skirting and insulation before worrying about the interior as well as putting the composting toilet as close to the wood stove as possible and plan venting from the stove (via duct and fan) to the composting toilet compartment to keep it warm and thawed when used in the winter)......

And these are just my first thoughts off hand! lol
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Runnerdave on September 30, 2012, 06:17:29 PM
WOW!  Glad I asked.  Helps to hear all that and hopefully it will keep me a bit more patient. Honestly, I've read all 59 of your pages (reads like a book) and while it gets me excited to get started, it's also a bit frightening. Overwhelming is probably a better word. I spent last Monday through Thursday up there (awesome weather) and while I worked long hard days like crazy, it seems like I hardly did anything at all. Thank you for your input and all the experience sharing. I've been hesitant to get my feet wet on here but will try to get posting my own experiences to date by next week.  At the moment I'm considering a 20' X 34' and am anxious to hear from Skagitdrifter about his choice (20' X 40'). Hope the job prospects are going well.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 01, 2012, 09:25:36 AM
Quote from: Runnerdave on September 30, 2012, 06:17:29 PM
WOW!  Glad I asked.  Helps to hear all that and hopefully it will keep me a bit more patient. Honestly, I've read all 59 of your pages (reads like a book) and while it gets me excited to get started, it's also a bit frightening. Overwhelming is probably a better word. I spent last Monday through Thursday up there (awesome weather) and while I worked long hard days like crazy, it seems like I hardly did anything at all. Thank you for your input and all the experience sharing. I've been hesitant to get my feet wet on here but will try to get posting my own experiences to date by next week.  At the moment I'm considering a 20' X 34' and am anxious to hear from Skagitdrifter about his choice (20' X 40'). Hope the job prospects are going well.

Thanks :) and I'm glad someone read it! lol

I find that realizing that you have to eat an elephant one bite at a time helps ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 04, 2012, 01:12:48 PM
Planning the next trip up which will be more of a hunting trip (for the boys since I'm bow hunting this year again) and more winter prep. 

On my agenda is to paint the trunks of my apples with white latex paint, place hardware cloth around their trunks, cut off the watering (it's getting down into the 20's now) and just clean up the orchard a bit.

Then I need to fix the frost free with a bucket and some gravel and re-bury it.

After that I'll do some work pulling logs to the mill and getting slash piles ready for burning when the snow falls....


And I'll spend hours in front of the wood stove reading too I think :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on October 04, 2012, 02:07:31 PM
When are you planning your hunting trip?  I meant to get out earlier this year (early bow), but couldn't... then Beautiful didn't want me going alone  ??? :(  (not sure if she thought I'd shoot myself accidentally with the bow or not... d* ::) )
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 04, 2012, 05:17:34 PM
Modern Firearms is 13th through the 21st of this month and we aim to harvest a deer or two if we can find them! lol

If the boys can't get any then we have one last show in the late bow season for me....we'll see
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on October 08, 2012, 10:42:42 AM
Ah, so the boys are going for firearm and then you'll try your hand at bow? 

Let me know if you'd like some company (if you go bow hunting), I've been meaning to get there, but haven't been able to.  I might have to put my foot down and go.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 09, 2012, 09:26:20 AM
Yes, except I can't bow hunt until later since the late bow season is November 21st to Dec 15th.

This trip, while the boys and a friend rifle hunt I'll be carrying a shotgun for grouse (maybe rabbit) and working on the cabin to winterize it better.

And hoping the boys shoot something!

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on October 09, 2012, 10:44:31 AM
Well I wouldn't be able to go until sometime after Thanksgiving weekend ... which limits it to the first half of Dec sometime... :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 09, 2012, 12:55:23 PM
Perhaps we could arrange something then.  Depends on my boys though as they have to be willing to pay the gas! lol

The problem with being out of work is that I can't afford the trips as much anymore :(  We're really cutting back now (down to $50 a week for groceries for at least a month and a half or two -- then we'll run out of meat in the freezer).

Times are tough and getting tougher but adding a buck to the freezer would help....too bad it's such a crap shoot these days!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on October 09, 2012, 02:20:53 PM
I hear you there, OJH ... Things are getting slim here, and I'm still working!  I can't imagine what it's going to get to be like.

Of course there are a few deer here, but no bucks that I've seen (maybe a spike, but in this county they aren't legal).

Hopefully your boys can put one in the freezer for you.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 10, 2012, 11:52:42 AM
Whoohoo!

Our new budget is done and the result is that we're taking in more then we're spending!  Of course it means we have to cut the food budget to $50 a week and gas to $35 which might be tough but we can do it.

It also means cabin trips are down to gas there and back only now :(  So won't do much besides keep an eye on the place and enjoy it etc....won't have much $$$ left over for gas to run the mill or the genny either so it will be tough but at least we're making it!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on October 10, 2012, 02:17:06 PM
Awesome!

It's always nice when you know you won't be going in the hole.

AND, you will just HAVE to relax and enjoy the place when you go up there.  Darn! ::)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 11, 2012, 03:21:05 PM
Relax, keep the stove going, read, play cards and wait for the boys to return with a buck ;)  Sounds like a plan!

Oh and they're paying for most of the gas too!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on October 12, 2012, 10:39:10 AM
Awesome plan! [cool]
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Runnerdave on October 18, 2012, 04:42:12 AM
Why paint the trunk of the trees with white latex paint? BTW, a couple weeks ago I saw several commercial man-lift trucks on the main highway. When I asked what they were doing they said they were running fiber optic lines between T and R in preparation to supply service for high speed internet and whatever else goes thru fiber optic lines. Does that sound like something up your alley? I'm sorry I can't remember what the company name was on the trucks. There was also a travel advisory on WADOT that mentioned the project.

On another note, did you have any problem with flys at your place this fall?  I swept them out by the bucket full the last couple months. What gives?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 19, 2012, 11:47:40 AM
Hinkles and McCoy is the company doing the install work -- install work isn't something I've done but I've done a lot of implementation of the systems (and installing them) and operating them etc  that utilize the fiber (and yes it can do internet, phone, TV and anything else like that)....

I'd be willing to work on that project though!!  Are you kidding? lol I'd live at the cabin while doing it....ya, that would be a dream!

Flies?  Yes.  Seems we've got our fair share this year too.  Not sure why but I use diatomaceous (sp) earth and fly strips to control them.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 19, 2012, 12:32:43 PM
On a side note I've offered my tractor services to my neighbors (two of them so far) for fuel and a little help getting up to the property.

I figured that if they'd pay for the fuel (which isn't much really) and kick in a little extra for help I'd do some small tractor jobs for them (a little grading work or mowing or snow removal).  If nothing else it will make the trips to the cabin cheaper for me :)  and perhaps it could mean folks ask about more extensive services (like grading a long driveway or plowing one etc) in which I could charger a little more (the going rate I'm told is $75/hr but I've seen cheaper and I figure even at $25/hr I'd be making something which is better then nothing!

I've also been giving some serious thought to milling lumber for people.  Problem there is that at $50/hr the cost might be more then most are willing to pay (though I'm learning it's a fair to great price) for a smaller mill.  I'm wondering though if I were to get a bigger mill if it would pay off?  After all, if I can mill 200 board feet an hour then $50/hr is a seriously good price!  That's just 25c per board foot if the mill is doing it's job and the logs are being loaded constantly -- and most remote millers charge as much as $1/board foot....so $200/hr for a job like that.

Of course,  to pay for an operation like that I'd have to have a lot of work coming in and I'm just not sure in this economy it's likely.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on October 22, 2012, 08:43:23 AM
To bad you don't have a trailer for your tractor and know where my place is.  I'd have yo head over there and grade a couple spots that I want cleaned up (move a few dead trees that are down, as well - you could use 'em for fire wood)... :)

Ah well, maybe next year.

I've seen that the HD here rents a micro excavator as well as a small tractor with a bucket and backhoe on it.  I just might have to rent it for a weekend and haul it up to the property in the spring  :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 22, 2012, 09:46:20 AM
Agreed!  I need to get a bigger trailer but it will have to wait.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 22, 2012, 12:13:29 PM
Well we put our ATV trailer up for sale on Craigslist as well as our tent trailer.

With luck we'll sell them both and then use some of the money to build a new 6 foot wide by 20 long sawmill trailer -- that we can remove the mill from and use as a flatbed trailer to haul ATV's, lumber etc -- and the rest can just go in the bank.

If we get that done then we might even get some business milling lumber for folks in the Okanogan though I haven't seen a reply in my post here which kinda surprised me.  I figured cabin builders would be the folks I did business with more then not but perhaps not.

Ranchers would be my next guess as I've heard they often buy all the rough cut lumber they can their hands on.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on October 22, 2012, 12:33:44 PM
Well, we'll have to talk a a bit about lumber milling.  I have a couple ideas, would love to get my own mill, but it looks doubtful in the near future (year).  It looks like it will be greater than a year out  :(

So maybe there might be something you might be able to mill for me - but I'll take that offline in a few weeks, probably.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 22, 2012, 01:05:14 PM
Quote from: JavaMan on October 22, 2012, 12:33:44 PM
Well, we'll have to talk a a bit about lumber milling.  I have a couple ideas, would love to get my own mill, but it looks doubtful in the near future (year).  It looks like it will be greater than a year out  :(

So maybe there might be something you might be able to mill for me - but I'll take that offline in a few weeks, probably.

Just shoot me an email and I'm certain we can work something out ;)

If I get my trailers sold and my new one built then I should be mobile in a month or so.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 26, 2012, 02:26:30 PM
SOLD!!!  My ATV trailer that is :)

So now the real work begins!  I have to get a 20 foot trailer made for my sawmill.  I'm planning a trailer that's 6 feet wide and over the wheels/tires so the logs can clear them when loading.  It will have a work deck (to walk on) beside the mill and a log deck on the other side (to load the logs onto the mill using ramps) and the mill will be extended by about 6 feet to get it to the full 20 foot length (so I can mill stuff 16 1/2 feet long if needed).

The deck will be flat so I can also use it to haul stuff (ATV's, lumber etc) and I'll get some ATV ramps for the back of it to load them etc (maybe use the same ramps that I'll have for the logs).

Will be able to haul fuel, blades and tools on the trailer also and it will have stands to stabalize it when in use :)

So, if you have followed my thread and are within 50 miles (ok maybe further, just shoot me a line) and would like some lumber made out of your own trees let me know!  Even if you aren't sure one way or the other because it helps me know how much work I might actually get.

So far I have a super small job that I can do (won't earn much at all but might help get the word out) and another possibility so don't be shy!  Rates for countryplans members might even be better then normal ;)

Though I do have to eat! lol
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 29, 2012, 09:26:24 PM
Looks like I need to head to the cabin to get the mill :)

Will have to make it a shorter trip, maybe 4 days, as my son has decided to join the service (Marines most likely) and wants to go to MEPS to do his testing etc sooner rather then later.

I could say all kinds of things about youth etc, but all I can really say is that I was there, at his age, and served both in the Corps (my Dad and Uncle did too) and later the Army and while at times it sucked, it was mostly a good, make that great experience for me.  I love the Corps too (can't you tell) so while I tried to give him advice about other options etc, in the end I'll support him and be proud of him no matter what!

Now, back to the progress on getting my mill portable (and hopefully earning a living at it so I can get back to cabin building!):  I may also now have our Tent Trailer sold too :)  I sure hope so!  Then I can really get cracking on having my mill put on a trailer and start advertising with it.

With luck I'll be working at least part time running the mill this winter or next spring at the latest.

And when I'm not working or doing that I'll get back to working on the interior of the cabin this winter :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 24, 2012, 10:01:03 PM
Almost a month since my last post!  Sheesh!

Went to the cabin and picked up the mill (was an over nighter) but must admit it was awesome using the tractor to load the mill :D  So cool to be able to do that!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Moving-2.jpg)
Here's a shot of the tractor with the mill head off loaded.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Moving2-2.jpg)
And another

So far the trailer has gone through a few designs and the latest is the simplest.  Basically we're building the trailer to fit directly under the mill bed frame with a slight overhang (1/2") for the mill clamps that help keep the head on the rails.  This means the trailer will only be about 36" wide except for the tires which will stick out wider but I hope to be able to walk around them (that's how the bigger mills are anyway).

I'll be ordering the bed extension to make the mill a full 21' long allowing me to mill logs of 18 feet (and a little longer -- like maybe 18' 4" overall).  I'll also be getting the LT15 anti-rollback loading ramps and will set the mill to be able to install a winch on the operator side so I can load logs by hand with no help.

With luck the mill and trailer will be ready to go by mid December then I'll have to take it in to get it approved by the state police (as a trailer) before finally being able to test it out.

I'm hoping to have it back in action in the new year.

Meanwhile, I plan to head back to the cabin soon to plow some snow (I think there's probably 5 or 6 inches up there now) which I hope to do monthly to keep the access better this winter -- after all, I hope to pull the mill back there in the early spring and get back to milling.

Erik
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on November 25, 2012, 08:30:56 AM
Eric the bucket is handier than " a pocket on a shirt".  Use mine constantly for everything. 

You might consider your design to allow you a little more width so that you can walk along side of the rail system(logs) while operating.  Looks like the total width of the mill head would allow you plenty of room for that on a 7-8' width trailer.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Tickhill on November 25, 2012, 08:48:19 AM
OJ, great to hear from you again. May you be blessed in your endeavor, be safe. Can't wait to hear more as you progress. Been missing your posts.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 25, 2012, 10:37:44 AM
Red, that was my original idea but after much reflection and study of manufactured mills on trailers I realized there was a reason they had the operator on the ground:  no or less bending over.

Basically you can reach right over at a convenient height and lift the board off after each pass.  Also, the cost of building the trailer the way Woodmizer does vs. my original plan (6 feet wide) is about half and with me out of work I think it's going to be better.

I've gone with KISS on this one and hope it's right!

Though, I'm putting a 3500lbs axle under it and tires to match so at least I'll be able to haul some wood on it too.

The plan ultimately is to hopefully do well enough to get a bigger model.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 25, 2012, 10:38:45 AM
And yes that bucket is handy! lol

Also used the boom on the back to move the mill head and I use it to skid logs etc too.

This month if I make it to the cabin I'll put the box blade back on and use it and the bucket to move snow :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 25, 2012, 10:41:16 AM
Quote from: Tickhill on November 25, 2012, 08:48:19 AM
OJ, great to hear from you again. May you be blessed in your endeavor, be safe. Can't wait to hear more as you progress. Been missing your posts.

Thanks Tickhill :)  I appreciate that.

It's been a slow go of late for me.  I'm now on my 17th week without work (something I have a very hard time with honestly) and while we prepared well for it it's still tough and the primary reason you see little posting from me.  I spend a lot of time looking for work and trying to plan my business and then a lot of time doing stuff at home (playing house husband).

The rest of the time I try to stay entertained without using much electricity! lol so that means less time posting about cabin stuff...but I'm still here ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on November 25, 2012, 11:03:42 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on November 25, 2012, 10:38:45 AM
And yes that bucket is handy! lol

Also used the boom on the back to move the mill head and I use it to skid logs etc too.

This month if I make it to the cabin I'll put the box blade back on and use it and the bucket to move snow :)

Yes once you figure out what works with the tractor you can get inventive.  I made a carrier for the 3-point hitch which is worth it's weight in gold.  You can haul your chainsaw, gas, chains, buckets w/o carring them in your bucket and having to offload once you get to a site and need to use the bucket.

(https://i220.photobucket.com/albums/dd161/redoverfarm/scenes/country%20plans/100_4055-1.jpg)

Also you will find that using the front bucket pushing snow has it's limitations.  You have to stop periodically and get the snow out of the road in front of you.  Unlike an angled blade that clears it to the side for continuious movement.  I solved that problem also but with a little more effort than someone that has a "quick connect" forks.  I made my mounts on the top of the bucket to accept a 7' truck snow blade.  I just roll the bucket pin the blade in place and utilize a chain lift by rolling my bucket back some or lifting the complete blade.  If you have a quick conect it would be much easier. 

These are just salvaged items.  You can pick up a used snow blade real cheap.  The carrier I modified from a Tractor and trailer under frame tarp rack.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 25, 2012, 12:23:31 PM
Cool!

So do you remove the bucket?  Of just put the blade on it?

I was thinking as I read your post that I bet I could get my neighbor to make something to mount a blade.  I have skid steer front end so it's easy to get the bucket off and on I'm told (haven't dont it) and maybe he could make an angle bracket for a blade...then I just need to pick up a plow blade in the summer (I bet they are cheaper then).
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 25, 2012, 12:28:04 PM
http://kpr.craigslist.org/for/3405342452.html

Hmmm....for $350 I might have to just go buy this one!  Maybe I can get it down to $250-$275

Will fit right onto my front end and maybe I can get the neighbor to put an angle into it (probably just remove the skid steer frame and then block one side up a few inches and then weld it back on I imagine).

Sure would be nice to take it up to the cabin this winter and get plowing!  Might even get some neighbors to help pay for the fuel by plowing there places too ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on November 25, 2012, 12:35:45 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on November 25, 2012, 12:23:31 PM
Cool!

So do you remove the bucket?  Of just put the blade on it?

I was thinking as I read your post that I bet I could get my neighbor to make something to mount a blade.  I have skid steer front end so it's easy to get the bucket off and on I'm told (haven't dont it) and maybe he could make an angle bracket for a blade...then I just need to pick up a plow blade in the summer (I bet they are cheaper then).

Eric I just remove the blade & mounting frame from my bucket.  My bucket is not "quick disconnect" and I have to remove the pins to take off the bucket.   I just welded mounting brackets to accept 3/4" pins on the upper portion and back side of the bucket.  They do not get in the way when I am using the bucket in the summer.  For you I would say all you need is a frame to mount the blade to with something that will mate up to your quick disconnect fork frames similar to the mounting brackets of your bucket.  I have seen some farmers do this relatively easy. 

Most snow plows have a swivel on them so a standard mount will work. The angle is done on the blade and framework for the blade.  Some have even incorporated hydraulic cylinder to angle the blade rather than manuel like I have.  A little enginuity will go a long way.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on November 25, 2012, 12:40:26 PM
Might work but I would be inclined for one that I can swivel to either side.  Come in handy when you need to switch direction or push staight occassionally.  You can find truck blades easily.  They are constantly upgrading for a bigger and better one and often just leave the old ones lying in the fields and around their garages.  I think I paid $150 for mine. 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 25, 2012, 12:51:32 PM
Thanks for the posts.  I'll have to keep and eye out -- again, probably best in the summer!  lol

Right now I'll use the bucket and save the money but I'll keep my eyes open.

One way or another though, I'm going to use the mill and the tractor to make a few bucks ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 27, 2012, 01:04:25 PM
Saying goodbye to the Evolution Tent Trailer today:
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Camping_FathersDay002.jpg)

It's been an awesome tent trailer frankly but the economy and the fact that we have a cabin has dictated that we let it go and bank the cash.

So, while we'll miss this awesome trailer we'll be glad to have the cash for it.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on November 28, 2012, 12:20:19 PM
Well, personally, I think you're sitting pretty ... what with a pickup, a tractor and a mill  ;D

I've put the mill I want on my Amazon Wish List ... but I seriously doubt that I'll get it for Christmas!  I have GOT to get the deck finished so I can start putting cash aside for it.   d*

Hope you and yours had a GREAT Thanksgiving!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 28, 2012, 01:59:40 PM
Thanks Java :)  We do love having the things we have and use them enough to justify them too ;)  The trailer, while we really liked it, wasn't being used so needed to go to help with surviving this horrible economy!  Seems Telecom Geeks like me are having a hard go these days.  Heck, I'm interviewing for a job doing cabling and fire alarm systems with a little PBX work on the side perhaps -- that's like having a serious programmer do IT support for High School students! lol  Ahhh well, have to earn a buck one way or another.

Which mill is that by the way?  Linkage?

Thanksgiving was great!  For us it involves more then just a meal!  We smoke and roast turkey's (2) and smoke a ham and then can what we don't eat as leftovers and boil the carcasses and can the broth and meats from those too....then we can have Turkey soup or casserole several months later :)  We also try to have as many family members around as we can :)  It's a big day though I was disappointed to learn that the November Thanksgiving is a creation of FDR's in order to spur people on to shopping -- spend money to help the economy.

Guess that idea isn't a new one but the original US Thanksgiving was celebrated in early October like much of the rest of the world it seems.  Consider that I'm somewhat of a traditionalist -- meaning I think the real reason we celebrate is more important then the modern reason perhaps -- and it's no wonder that I feel a little cheated when I learned of the real reason for modern Thanksgiving:  To get YOU to spend more money.

So sad.  But I digress!

I'm still moving forward with the mill operation and planning some cards soon ;)  Maybe a website.  Also the couple who bought the trailer have parents with 160 acres near Republic who might like to get some logs milled into lumber :)  I sure hope so!

At this point, however, I'm just waiting for the parts to all come in so the neighbor can begin construction the trailer -- then with luck I can have it on the road by New Years for our traditional weekend at the cabin :)  Or at least or somewhat traditional (we started camping that weekend several years ago and had a great time so try to do it every year now).

Cheers
Erik
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on November 29, 2012, 02:03:43 PM
Well, Beautiful found a great soup recipe for Turkey Dinner.  So good in fact, that I've suggested that she make an entire dinner sometime just to have the soup!

It's really strange- you simply take the carcass, make stock, put 1 bunch of it (20 cups or so?) back in the pot and dump in ALL the left overs - green bean casserole, yams, mashed potatoes, stuffing/dressing, some of the meat - especially what cooked off the carcass - whatever you have left goes into the soup (well, ok, not the cranberries)

It's awesome!  Of course, she makes a sausage dressing/stuffing that is very tasty.  And creamed onions and brussel sprouts!  (I hate brussel sprouts, but they are good in this soup) ... my brother says, "Saying you have fresh brussel sprouts and therefore they taste better is like saying the liver tastes better because it's fresher..." d*

She freezes the rest of the stock in ice cube trays for use later (like you guys)

As for the "real reason" for November Thanksgiving ... well, it doesn't work with me... I don't really start spending money for Christmas until about Dec 23rd... ;D

I have to check my Powerball ticket... I think I might have won ::)  Then I'll buy a bunch of acreage someplace :)  Complete with woods...

I was thinking of this mill: (http://www.lumbersmith.com/ (http://www.lumbersmith.com/)) mainly because it's A) less expensive, 2) very portable, and iii) because I can build the "rails" as long as I'd like them to be.  And I see it's on sale right now for about $500 less than it was before!  [cool]  Guess it's time to start putting the cash aside!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 29, 2012, 03:26:42 PM
Interesting mill -- kind of a cross between a Woodmizer and a chainsaw mill.....

Though my experience has taught me I'd rather have the woodmizer since that little mill doesn't look to produce straight lumber like a steel bed bandsaw mill will -- and I can add to length of mine also (going to get the 7 foot extension for the trailer.

But if I couldn't afford the WM I'd certainly, like you, consider this little machine as it may be a great way to start out.

Soup?  Interesting ;)  Might have to taste it sometime -- as for us, we can the broth (pressure) rather then freeze but I've heard of others doing the freezing that way too.

Now I'm dreaming about my mill again! lol
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on November 29, 2012, 04:36:18 PM
Yeah, that's probably the biggest reason I'm considering that mill... "affordability"

I've looked at the WM mills - would love one, but just can't put together that much cash at one time  :(  (I have teenagers, y'know  ;) )

Like you said, tho, a good way to get my feet wet and build from there.

As for canning the stock ... well, up until recently we've only had a waterbath canner ... then I spent the $$ to get a pressure canner and once this part of the deck is finished (this weekend, I hope) I'll do some canning.  I made some pickles last year in the water bath, which was great, but I want to put up a bunch of other stuff.  A friend of ours gave us 5 pounds of thin-sliced beef and we make jerky... pretty good, but I think it was too thin.

Beautiful said something the other day that had my ears perk up... "I think I could get into snowmobiling..."   I about fell off my chair.  Why she didn't say that in the spring this year I don't know, but now I know I have to look for a couple of descent machines and a flat trailer (I've been wanting a flat trailer anyway).  That would certainly get me up to the property in the winter!    ;D

Wish mine was done as much as yours so we could do New Years Eve up there... All the stars would be AWEsome
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 29, 2012, 07:55:48 PM
The only advice I'd give on the little mill is to not set your expectations too high. 

The problem we have, you and I and others like us who do most of our cabin work on weekends, is that we need more production and less cost.  So, a CSM or that mill, while great if you live where using them just can't produce in short runs when you need to mill up 1000 board feet of 1x's so they can dry and be ready for processing in a couple months.

That's one reason why I love the WM -- I've done more then 700bf in 5 hours of milling with half of the time spent on quarter sawing (which takes longer) though the figure is based on 1" boards rather then 5/8" (industry standard is apparently to count no less then 1" so if you were paying someone 40 cents a bard foot then the 5 hours would have cost $280 or $56/hr). 

My point being that it would take a long time with a CSM or that little mill to produce that much pine much less the 3500-5000 board feet I needed just for interior paneling and pine usually runs something like $2.70/bf if buying 1x4 at HD....Hard to compare 40 cents to $2.70/bf and hard to compete with portable mills like he WoodMizers when it comes to production rates for small operations.

Might be something to consider though I'd say still buy a mill, just bear in mind that it might not produce enough quickly enough so you may buy more wood product then you'd hoped in the end.

For me, I've not bought much in the way of wood (if any) since I bought the mill but we also produced a lot of lumber with it.  Once it's on the trailer though, I'll produce a LOT more! ;)

After all, I'll be able to set it up by the logs instead of having to always skid them to the mill.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on November 30, 2012, 11:17:34 AM
Well, I really don't have much in the way of expectations at all - other than to churn out some lumber.  But even using the numbers you did in your post above, if it took twice as long, it's still almost a $30/hour rate - or even if it costs me double the $0.40/bf you used, I'm still $1.90 or so in savings over buying it at HD ($2.70/bf)... heck, it could even be 3 or 4 times the 40 cents/bf and I'd still make out like a bandit... so lessee...

$1900 (not including shipping) divided by 1.90/bf = 1000 bf and it's paid for  [cool]  Of course that doesn't account for shipping and some other expenses, but even a half that savings it's 2000 bf and it's paid for.  Can't argue with that too much  ;D

I need roughly 10' X 12' X 4 worth of siding ... so that's 480 sq ft.  I'm thinking board & batten for siding, which would actually be more than that - call it 600 sq feet

Hmmm ... I'm going to need to find a bf calculator... [crz]  But that should put me on the way to paying for it fairly well - provided I can produce consistent pieces.

We've got a couple of 100' pines in the yard at home that Beautiful wants taken down (before they fall on the house or something), that I'm sure I could turn about half of it into a lot of lumber and the rest into firewood.  So there's the practice trees! (I just have to convince her to have some logs laying around until the mill would get here! [waiting])
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on November 30, 2012, 12:47:17 PM
What are the fuel and oil costs? Blades for when one breaks?  Just curious how that is being factored in.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 30, 2012, 04:47:51 PM
Java don't cut the trees and leave them lay unless you want Blue Stain -- then let them lay for a long time ;)  Otherwise, wait until you have the mill and then drop them and mill them right away.

MD:  Blades run about $300 for 15 (roughly) and last a long time but need to be resharpened after about 200-400bf of use.  Resharp cost is $7/blade.

Fuel isn't something I've worked out yet because I just didn't use that much.  I might have used 2-3 gallons producing 700bf.

As for BF costs that really depends on many factors.  For example, I'll be charging $50/hr if I can get work and that translates to anything from $1/bf to as low as 30 cents a bf depending on log size, help loading and off loading and a few other variables (weather etc).  I might even be able to produce 200bf per hour if I have the right logs and assistance etc..

Most bigger portable millers charge between 0.30/bf to 0.50/bf depending on a number of factors but also produce a lot more in a shorter period (300-500bf/hr or more).
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on November 30, 2012, 04:57:55 PM
Most portable mills in this area charge about $200-$250 @ 1,000 bf.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 30, 2012, 05:00:07 PM
Quote from: Redoverfarm on November 30, 2012, 04:57:55 PM
Most portable mills in this area charge about $200-$250 @ 1,000 bf.

That's pretty tough to beat -- are there a lot of them?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 30, 2012, 05:01:37 PM
Don't get me wrong though, I don't want to discourage anyone from doing what I've done!

All I advise is that it's a process that I've learned benefits a great up front (meaning more production) but many have been quite successful just using CSM's to produce their own lumber.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on November 30, 2012, 05:29:43 PM
QuoteJava don't cut the trees and leave them lay unless you want Blue Stain

While logs left laying about with the bark still on them could likely become home to some Mountain Pine Beetles there is also an excellent chance the live standing tree you are about to cut may have been attacked as well. In that case the blue stain will already be started. The blue stain comes from a fungus carried by the adult beetle. The Mountain Pine Beetle does not attack dead wood like dried firewood. It does not bore into fresh logs that have been debarked. It is not active from roughly October through spring. So over winter storage is not going to cause any increase in blue staining. It will attack any living tree, bore through the bark and lay eggs. Healthy trees can fight them off, but the conditions in many of our forests are such that many trees are too stressed already and will not survive.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 30, 2012, 06:47:05 PM
Every tree I've cut and left lay got Blue Stain.

Every tree I dropped and milled did not.

Just figure I'd add that.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on November 30, 2012, 09:49:41 PM
The little reading I've done on it, seems to indicate that part of the costing of the process ($$/bf) has to do with the type of wood it is - i.e. Pine vs Oak or Maple, etc...

So does climate have to do with the beetle attacking the tree? Because for the last 3 weeks it seems we've been living in the rain forest here  :o
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on November 30, 2012, 10:09:15 PM
This is from the USFS (http://www.fs.usda.gov/Internet/FSE_DOCUMENTS/stelprdb5304956.pdf), specifically one of the SD offices, but they have the same beetle there as we do in NM and you do in WA.

The one thing it does not mention IIRC, cause I didn't re-read this recently, is one method of killing beetles in logs with the bark still on them. It works in summer. Stack the logs and cover completely with 6 mil clear plastic. The bottom edges of the plastic must be buried in the ground. Let bake in the sun for at least 60 days, 90 is better. That kills the beetles and the larvae with the heat build up. The plastic must be clear. Dark plastic will have the beetles seeking out the smallest pinpricks to escape through. Using clear plastic there is no darkness under the cover and that confuses the beetles; they cannot seek out the light as they can with black plastic. We do that to any green cut logs we intend to keep for firewood. We uncover in late fall at the earliest and let season through to the next winter before using.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 01, 2012, 01:02:29 AM
Thanks Don!  THat's Great!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 01, 2012, 02:28:44 PM
Dying to get back to the cabin but also dying to get the mill done!  Sheesh, this winter is going slow.

Went to order the ramps today but WM was closed so I'll have to wait but with luck I'll start seeing progress in the next week or so!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 01, 2012, 02:31:13 PM
LOL was playing with the sorting today and saw that this thread has either the 2nd or 3rd most replies (think I noticed that before and think I commented that it's probably because I comment too often!!!  Funny thing is, I'm like this in person too for those who wonder).
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on December 01, 2012, 09:10:57 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on December 01, 2012, 02:31:13 PM
LOL was playing with the sorting today and saw that this thread has either the 2nd or 3rd most replies (think I noticed that before and think I commented that it's probably because I comment too often!!!  Funny thing is, I'm like this in person too for those who wonder).

Yah, I can vouch for that! ;)

Sounds like I might need to do something like what Don said ... except on this side of the mountains we don't get enough heat, even in the summer, to warm things up much.

Although the guy hasn't shown up yet to take a look at the trees, so we'll have to see what happens.

Adding on a room to a REALLY small shelter in the yard today and tomorrow - for the goats... then back to the deck stairs on the "front" of the house.  Then I'm taking a break for the holidays. d*

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 03, 2012, 12:31:23 PM
OUCH!
http://www.tirechain.com/16.9-34.htm

Was looking at getting some tire chains for my tractor so I could plow the snow and ice off the drive and am now thinking I better wait until I'm earning an income!!!

Sadly, though, I might have been able to earn a few bucks if I could plow snow for others but at $519 for rear chains and probably another $150 for the fronts I'm thinking maybe not this year :(
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on December 03, 2012, 12:39:28 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on December 03, 2012, 12:31:23 PM
OUCH!
http://www.tirechain.com/16.9-34.htm

Was looking at getting some tire chains for my tractor so I could plow the snow and ice off the drive and am now thinking I better wait until I'm earning an income!!!

Sadly, though, I might have been able to earn a few bucks if I could plow snow for others but at $519 for rear chains and probably another $150 for the fronts I'm thinking maybe not this year :(
Ouch! That would hurt. d*  I would think it might depend on how much you can charge!  But nearly $700 just for chains is a bit steep.  Have to plow a LOT of driveways to recover that cost
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 03, 2012, 01:32:49 PM
No doubt!

I was told that around here tractor services go to $75/hr but I can't imagine charging that (maybe that's my problem)....but even at $50/hr assuming I could get the work around our place (no trailer to drag the tractor miles away) it would still take a lot of driveways and roads to earn back the $600-$700 investment.

And I just really wanted them for my place but I may have to start chatting up neighbors to see if I can get some work with the tractor to help pay for the costs.

As it is the portable mill trailer is going to eat up much of my resources (that I'm willing to spend anyway).
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 03, 2012, 01:52:45 PM
Ordered my 7 foot bed section for the mill today :)  Takes it out to 21 feet in length and allows me to mill just over 18 feet.

Exciting stuff!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on December 03, 2012, 04:18:57 PM
QuoteSheesh, this winter is going slow.

Winter hasn't even really started yet.  ;D

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 03, 2012, 06:01:23 PM
lol Don, true enough but it feels like winter to me!

Seems to be snowing at the cabin constantly but not much in terms of accumulation.

-- on a side note Les Schwab has chains for my tractor at $417 for all 4!  Much better deal.

Now I just have to find the $$$ lol
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 05, 2012, 06:09:51 PM
Got the Road Warrior back from the shop today -- which makes me happy but not the paying them to fix it part.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/RustysFlaresLeft.jpg)
Had the skidplate modded to fit around the brush guard (not in this pic but you couldn't see it anyway), had the radiator replaced (3core heavy duty all steel), and put in the new fan shroud (it didn't have one for the last 3 years).

Also recently put in a new O2 sensor so with a little luck it will be happy and take me back to the cabin this winter (I much prefer the old Road Warrior in the winter because of it's 4 wheel drive system and limited slip -- it always works unlike my F150 which seems to sometimes NOT work  d* ).

It's good to see it running well and hopefully COOL too and with over 254,000 miles on it we've sorta developed a relationship :)  :o
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 06, 2012, 03:33:06 PM
Arggghhhh

Delays delays.  Had planned on heading back to the cabin on the 15th but it looks like my son will be working right up until Christmas and he's asked to go with me.  So we're planning the 26th instead and will make it a New Years cabin trip after all.

My hope this next trip is mostly to clear snow on the road to and around the cabin but I might also managed to get some interior work done too.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 12, 2012, 02:54:17 PM
WhooHoo!  I'm going to pick up 200lbs of Cereal Rye today!  Already grabbed 26lbs a couple days ago and got this order placed.

Now I'll be able to disk up the last couple acres I plan and plant the cereal rye as soon as the ground thaws this spring!  That will give me a pretty decent crop in the summer if all goes well!

Also seriously considering chains and a plow for the tractor and am wondering if anyone who reads this in the area would like some plowing done this winter?  As long as you're within driving distance of Eagle Rock I can drive the tractor over (as long as you're within a few miles of the general store I should be able to just drive over in the tractor).  Won't charge much either just hoping that I might get a little plowing work to offset the cost of the blade and chains.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 19, 2012, 01:09:14 PM
Looks like I'm going back to work!

Should get my offer letter today :)  Will be working from home and while the work isn't the kind I'd prefer (lots of spreadsheets and research) it will help pay the pays and allow me to continue working on the cabin too!

I also plan to continue to develop my sawmill business on the side :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on December 20, 2012, 05:54:45 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on December 19, 2012, 01:09:14 PM
Looks like I'm going back to work!

Should get my offer letter today :)  Will be working from home and while the work isn't the kind I'd prefer (lots of spreadsheets and research) it will help pay the pays and allow me to continue working on the cabin too!

I also plan to continue to develop my sawmill business on the side :)
That's totally awesome!   [cool] Glad to hear it!

That should give you some cash flow to get the things you'd wished you'd had this time.

Very cool. 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 20, 2012, 07:02:40 PM
Yup :)  Signed the paperwork today and while the money is less (again) then my last job it's still better in many ways though it's independent contract work so no UI benefits when done.

On the other hand it fits into my business plan in some ways.

Bottom line:  I'll be earning an income again!  And it will provide enough to work on getting things like the mill business up and running (I'm still doing that) as well as stuff for the tractor (snow chains just ordered and plow will be bought sometime this year I imagine).

All in all good stuff!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on December 21, 2012, 12:34:28 PM
Isn't that the way the economy is going? (less pay than last job)... well, as an independent contractor, you should have a goodly amount of deductions to "reduce" that even farther. ;D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 22, 2012, 11:54:30 AM
Last report had 14" of new snow at the cabin (or at least within a half mile of it) and more snow all this week and weekend right through Christmas and beyond!

I've ordered the chains for the tractor (all 4) and should be able to pick them up today.  The plan is to leave right after Christmas and spend New Years at the cabin and then return to start the new job.  While there I hope to plow all this new snow off the driveway and around the cabin so we'll have places to work and park etc.

Other then that we might burn slash and generally just relax and ring in the new year :)

All of this of course, assuming the old XJ can plow through the deep snow and make it to or near the cabin!!!  Good thing I have 4 chains and a winch and at least 3 wheel drive ;)  But I am told that a neighbors ranger has had no real trouble making it to the nearest spur road which is about a mile from our cabin so worst case scenario is we'll have to trudge in from there in nearly 2 feet of snow carrying chains for the tractor!  Good thing I've been walking 5+ miles a day to get back into shape! lol
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on December 22, 2012, 12:07:29 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on December 22, 2012, 11:54:30 AM
Last report had 14" of new snow at the cabin (or at least within a half mile of it) and more snow all this week and weekend right through Christmas and beyond!

I've ordered the chains for the tractor (all 4) and should be able to pick them up today.  The plan is to leave right after Christmas and spend New Years at the cabin and then return to start the new job.  While there I hope to plow all this new snow off the driveway and around the cabin so we'll have places to work and park etc.

Other then that we might burn slash and generally just relax and ring in the new year :)

All of this of course, assuming the old XJ can plow through the deep snow and make it to or near the cabin!!!  Good thing I have 4 chains and a winch and at least 3 wheel drive ;)  But I am told that a neighbors ranger has had no real trouble making it to the nearest spur road which is about a mile from our cabin so worst case scenario is we'll have to trudge in from there in nearly 2 feet of snow carrying chains for the tractor!  Good thing I've been walking 5+ miles a day to get back into shape! lol

Eric unless you are pushing snow you probably will not need the chains on your tractor.  Just tracking it through deep snow shouldn't be a problem.  Then once you get it to your XJ then put the chains on.  There is no way I would lug the chains for my tractor.   d*  Several hundred pounds with mine.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 22, 2012, 08:03:24 PM
Problem is that under all that snow usually sits anywhere from 2" to 8" of solid ice :(

Though it may yet be too early in the winter for that much ice it's still pretty likely as night time temps can drop to the teens while day time temps can rise to the mid 30's....so melt, freeze, melt, freeze -- repeat until you've got a skating rink! lol
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Yonderosa on December 23, 2012, 07:50:25 AM
Just over the hill we have 2 feet at our place right now.  The wind has blown it deeper in spots.  Snowshoes required.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 23, 2012, 10:34:07 AM
Hey Yonder, did you make it up?  How was it? 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on December 23, 2012, 10:47:22 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on December 22, 2012, 08:03:24 PM
Problem is that under all that snow usually sits anywhere from 2" to 8" of solid ice :(

Though it may yet be too early in the winter for that much ice it's still pretty likely as night time temps can drop to the teens while day time temps can rise to the mid 30's....so melt, freeze, melt, freeze -- repeat until you've got a skating rink! lol

That is sort of like up our way come spring there is a foundation of about two foot of ice that you just can't wait to see disappear.  Then one day it is gone and the over night it is green and the birds are back.

[waiting]  I'm already impatient for spring.......... 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 23, 2012, 11:56:55 AM
Yup :)

I might rip some of the ice out to reduce it a little but have no idea how well that will work.  I was just told the rippers on my box blade are good for that.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on December 23, 2012, 01:43:48 PM
Eric I too have ice problems on the road to the cabin but that is usually further into the season.  Biggest problem is heavy traffic (bear season) on the snow covered road which packs the snow then the freeze thaw starts and runs continuously until spring.  Previously I kept the roads plowed and eliminated the packed snow which kept it ice free.  As long as I had a good layer of snow I was able to travel in a tram mode (no plowing).  But once it was plowed to reveal the underlying ice I would have to chain up.  It was always safer to plow downhill.  Once your traction is broke up hill you are doomed w/o chains.  Ask me how I know this.   d* ;D.  Don't be fooled by chains.  Even on ice packed roads they can cause problems especially on the northwest turns where the sun never reaches.  The biggest obsticle that you will have will be using a bucket rather than a blade.  You constantly have to offbear the snow to the side that you are pushing. 

A couple years ago.  Skating ring.

(https://i220.photobucket.com/albums/dd161/redoverfarm/scenes/country%20plans/freezerain08.jpg)

Luckily the ambulance just stopped slidding before landing on top of another one that had already overturned in the turn.

(https://i220.photobucket.com/albums/dd161/redoverfarm/scenes/country%20plans/freezerain6.jpg)

(https://i220.photobucket.com/albums/dd161/redoverfarm/scenes/country%20plans/freezerain3.jpg)

That is just in one day.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 23, 2012, 04:35:28 PM
Scary stuff!  I think I remember you posting that a while back -- maybe a couple winters ago?

So far I've done well with the chains but I use the most aggressive ones I could find with the big V grooves in them.  Those as 3 driving wheels and I've been pretty solid even on thick ice going up or down hill.

The tractor has less aggressive chains but I'm hopeful with all the weight (tires filled too) and the teeth down on the box blade in case I need to drop it for added breaking power, I will be ok...guess we'll find out!

Bear in mind though, that we will be going VERY slow.  I drive the stuff in 4 low and just crawl along.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Yonderosa on December 23, 2012, 08:31:33 PM
It has been a while since we've been up.  The neighbors are keeping the road plowed.  We still have to hike in.  It has snowed (A LOT) more since.  Hoping to get back soon.  Stevens Pass was closed all day today.  A friend at the end of your valley told me there is about a foot at the highway.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 23, 2012, 11:58:23 PM
Our road is plowed!  The neighbor must have gotten his car out :)

Should mean we can make it all the way in or at least within a 1/4 mile!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 26, 2012, 09:22:30 PM
Still packing!  Tough time to head out (right after Christmas) but we're finally getting everything sorted and should be leaving in the early AM  ;D

Trying to make sure we have everything too since we'll be there nearly a week and it won't be easy to go get what we forgot once there since we'd have to de-chain every time we come off the hill :)

I promise lots of pics though!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Barry Broome on December 26, 2012, 10:20:20 PM
Hope you enjoy it!  :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 01, 2013, 09:33:02 PM
We made it!
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Drive-1.jpg)

Not much time but wanted to pop in and say hi!

We arrived at the foot of our driveway and promptly learned we could not drive further!  The 15" of snow and snow drifts that were deeper simply stopped us cold in our tracks -- and nearly driving off the road despite the chains!

So we bundled up, mounted headlamps on our knit caps, grabbed a sidearm each and headed off to the cabin with the keys to the cabin and tractor.

It took a few breaks and lots of heavy breathing but we made it to the cabin safely and got the tractor started as well as the wood stove.

Once the tractor was warmed up (about 45 minutes) and the cabin was warming (it took about 6 hours to get it to 60) I began slowly plowing my way back to the truck.

However I could not get the road cleared enough to make it up the hill in the truck so backed it out of the way and loaded as much as we could into the bucket of the tractor and headed back....after 5 hours we were secure in the cabin with most of our gear and ready to crash!

The next morning we got up and got started again.  This time I plowed the road almost down to the dirt in the last spot (dirt and rocks showing through the snow anyway) and had no problem getting the truck up that first steep and treacherous hill!   WE MADE IT!

I'll post some pics later and add to the tale but suffice to say it was a GREAT long weekend!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on January 02, 2013, 11:38:37 AM
Color me green with envy.  I wish I could make it even close to my place in the winter. 

Glad to hear you made it safely, and had a nice warm weekend
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 02, 2013, 12:37:26 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0748.jpg)
Friday after plowing the roads into the cabin and getting the truck back to it.

I was just starting a nasty cold when we left for the cabin so once we were fully settled I pretty much spent my time either bundled up on the tractor plowing snow or hiding in front of the wood stove relaxing :)  It was a great place to fight off a cold!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0757.jpg)
This herd comes around from time to time and I'm pretty sure they are wild.  Was kinda like having company!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/BigGuy.jpg)
Got to check the game cam after settling in and was surprised by this guy!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Bigger.jpg)
and then I saw this!!!

If only I could have been sitting in a blind above the road when he came trotting along!!  Must have been well into the Rut.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Cougar.jpg)
Not sure but I think this might be a kitty -- hard to see though.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0750.jpg)
Despite failing to get a roof on the woodshed it held up despite the constant snow!  It's been snowing for a few weeks.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Cabin-2.jpg)
Can't help but love to be there this time of year!  Warm inside, cold outside but the cold was dry and easy to handle.

The coldest it got down to was -2 on New Years day.  Most of the time it was overcast (so no solar production really) and warmer.

Speaking of solar, I've been seriously thinking that I need to insulate the porch and maybe even put a small wood stove (like the Dickson 8000 btu stoves for boats) in it to keep the batteries warmer when we're there.  After all, if a battery loses 50% when it's down to 32 degrees then my 880ah bank which is probably undersized to begin with, is even less useful when it's 32 degrees!  As in, only worth 440 AH.

We ran the genny a LOT in order to keep the batteries charged and the heat trace on the sewer pipe running.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 02, 2013, 12:53:04 PM
Quote from: JavaMan on January 02, 2013, 11:38:37 AM
Color me green with envy.  I wish I could make it even close to my place in the winter. 

Glad to hear you made it safely, and had a nice warm weekend

I actually wish I had a sled or two for this time of year because honestly, we nearly didn't make it!  But the big red tractor was there for us and once we had it running and plowing snow we were set for the week!  I also went and plowed a couple miles of road and into a neighbors place and cleaned up their parking spots so they wouldn't have trouble.  It's was a surprise for them too since they were off visiting friends.  Their road was worse then ours and when they came back it was almost down to the dirt! lol

Can't say enough how happy I was to have the tractor ready to rescue us from the snow!  It made this trip very worthwhile!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 02, 2013, 12:56:43 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/drive3.jpg)
Plowed and passable :)  It took several passes to make the road wide enough so the truck wouldn't fight the snow on one side or the other and before I got all the plowing done I'd broken a mirror by hugging one side and avoiding deep snow on the downside of the drive...just didn't see the sapling and the near 0 degree weather made the glass shatter!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/West.jpg)
This section I only made a couple passes on and took it down about 12" leaving a few inches packed hard to drive on.  Worked out pretty well and I could easily get the truck up to the 'phone' spot.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/sunrise.jpg)
Sunrise New Years Day on top of our place

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/lookingback.jpg)
A last look back down the driveway on our way out.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: John Raabe on January 02, 2013, 03:52:14 PM
Thanks for the great photos and for taking us along for the the trip. Great getaway site, I can almost smell the crisp pine-scented air.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: small cabin dreamer on January 02, 2013, 05:52:21 PM
Your place is very inspiring to me OJH, I have to ask a question about your composting toilet. Can you put toilet paper down it, or do you have to put paper in a separate container? I have seen some posted pictures where there is a 5 gallon container next to the toilet, and you do too. Just wondered if any of these will accept the toilet paper in them?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on January 02, 2013, 07:24:14 PM
Eric did you drag your chains from your truck to the cabin?  I see you had installed them on the tractor.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 02, 2013, 08:26:39 PM
Quote from: small cabin dreamer on January 02, 2013, 05:52:21 PM
Your place is very inspiring to me OJH, I have to ask a question about your composting toilet. Can you put toilet paper down it, or do you have to put paper in a separate container? I have seen some posted pictures where there is a 5 gallon container next to the toilet, and you do too. Just wondered if any of these will accept the toilet paper in them?

Toilet paper is GOOD for the composter ;)  The bucket is for water because I haven't hooked it up to the water system yet.

So no worries :)  Best to do the toilet paper test to be sure yours is ok but I find the cheapest double ply is excellent for the composting toilet.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 02, 2013, 08:27:49 PM
Quote from: Redoverfarm on January 02, 2013, 07:24:14 PM
Eric did you drag your chains from your truck to the cabin?  I see you had installed them on the tractor.

Nope!  I was dying without them! lol  Instead I plowed my way back to the truck and found that the tractor was fine going down the hill without them.  We installed them in the dark!  Sucked too!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 02, 2013, 08:46:39 PM
Thanks John -- I wish I could have smelled the pine!  I was too stuffed up but loved the place all the same :)  Always sad to leave!!!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on January 03, 2013, 12:27:22 AM
Amen to always sad to leave..............
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Tickhill on January 03, 2013, 05:13:02 AM
Thanks for sharing your trip OJ, I always look forward to your trips, probably not as much as you do but...
Tickhill
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 03, 2013, 11:37:42 AM
Thanks all!

This trip I tried a new recipe and while I wasn't completely successful I have what I now KNOW will work as 'cabin bread' for those who like sourdough and would like to make bread at their cabins without all the fuss.

It's so simple to make a kid could do it!!! 
Here is the recipe:

Quote6 Cups of Flour
1 Tablespoon of active dry yeast (I used instant and it worked great)
1 Tablespoon of salt
3 cups of room temperature water

What I do is I put all the dry ingredients into a half gallon canning jar and put a lid on it.  Then take it to the cabin and leave it for when you're ready to make bread.  Then, when you want to make bread you simply take out the jar and pour it into a large mixing bowl (bring one along if you don't have one at the cabin) and add the 3 cups of warm water (room temp is fine, a little warmer is better).  Mix it well and then store in the pot covered with plastic wrap and a towel -- best to store in a room temp location that won't get cold and isn't drafty.

Let sit for 8 to 24 hours (the longer the more sour the dough will become).
Here are the written details:

QuoteNotice there is no oil or sugar, just flour, yeast, salt and water.
Mix the yeast and salt into the flour
Pour water into flour and stir with a spoon. This will be sloppy, stringy wet dough. It kind of looks like you are making drop biscuits. Cover this with a cloth and let sit on the counter for 8-24 hours. I have used it in as little as 8 hours but it is better to wait.

When the mixture has set for at least 8 hours roll out into a greased cooking bowl or crock. The bread cooks better in a glass or ceramic dish and does not do well in a pan. I dust the mixture with flour lightly so I can roll it into the dish. It is very soft sticky dough and can not be picked up. Once in a baking dish I let it sit for 1 hour before baking. Bake at 375 degrees for approximately 45 minutes or until golden brown. My uncle recently made this bread and called to tell me we need to make the recipe bigger as it did not make enough or last very long at his house. Butter and enjoy

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0761.jpg)
Here is a picture of the dough more then doubled in the pot.  It had a very nice odor not unlike that of bear!  So you could smell the yeast pretty much.  The flavor was also very good and very sour. 

The only issue I had with this attempt was that I did not have any appropriate baking surface or dish and my oven seemed to be baking WAY too cool.  Set to 375 degrees it baked more like 250!  I suspect it was the cold propane tank or something.  Maybe the modified sign inverter?  Who knows.  Next time I'm going to try a couple different ways (like the Dutch oven or smaller loaves on higher temps)...but here is a shot of one baked at home (and not divided)....

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/IMG_0540.jpg)
This loaf was baked in a stone baking pan that was wide enough to allow for a low and long loaf of bread...the bread was gone in hours!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 03, 2013, 11:44:12 AM
Speaking of cooking, how many make Dutch Oven Chicken?  We cooked these up for a meal (actually more then a meal) and they are always excellent!  (though they take a lot longer in sub-freezing weather).

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0762.jpg)
We add about an inch of water and spice them up nicely.  Then bake with a couple dozen coals under the oven and a dozen or more on top.  Bake about 45 minutes in normal weather or up to 1 hour or longer in freezing weather.

They will pull apart when done!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0759.jpg)
In this picture we're using my newest cast iron pot to cook Speckled Hound Squash which we'll mash with potatoes (we love it that way) and have with the chicken.

Each trip we try to make at least one great meal like this ;)  Though we make what my son calls 'epic' breakfasts pretty much daily :) and often bring things like Venison Stroganoff (when we have it) that my wife makes ahead of time and we just have to warm up to eat. 

Speaking of breakfast, I also have a great 'cabin cakes' recipe I can share.  It's a home made 'instant' pancake recipe that blows all store bought stuff out of the water!  It's simply better in every way.  I guarantee it ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Woodswalker on January 04, 2013, 11:05:28 AM
Eric,
Thanks for sharing your trip pics, esp the mulies.  Your bread and chicken look delicious.  Am saving the bread recipe to try next trip over to my cabin in the spring.

I added a porch to my cabin last summer, and shot a nice 4 x 4 whitetail from it in the fall.  Had 25 lbs of summer sauage made.

Steve

(https://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u164/Woodswalker_WA/Porch%20build/bth_DSCN0382_zpsb037e684.jpg)     

(https://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u164/Woodswalker_WA/Porch%20build/bth_1028121358_zpsa291c5de.jpg?t=1357311079)

(https://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u164/Woodswalker_WA/Porch%20build/bth_306517_4306645617559_37223457_n_zpsc3122500.jpg?t=1357310527)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 04, 2013, 11:12:45 AM
Very nice! 

Those pics make you look like a neighbor to me! 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: roadtripray on January 04, 2013, 05:47:24 PM
Those beautiful snowy landscape pictures almost make me wish I lived where there is snow fall.  Almost.  Not quite, but almost :).
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 04, 2013, 08:24:18 PM
LOL RT -- truth is it's quite nice.  It's a dry cold in these parts which makes even 0 degrees more bearable then one might imagine....and the wood stove keeps everyone quite cozy once they are tired of the snow and cold!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on January 05, 2013, 05:29:15 PM
QuoteI've been seriously thinking that I need to insulate the porch and maybe even put a small wood stove (like the Dickson 8000 btu stoves for boats) in it to keep the batteries warmer when we're there.  After all, if a battery loses 50% when it's down to 32 degrees then my 880ah bank which is probably undersized to begin with, is even less useful when it's 32 degrees!  As in, only worth 440 AH.


I'm not sure how much difference it will make unless there is heat supplied to keep the temp up between periods of use. I find a very slow swing in battery temp because of the mass. All that acid, lead and the cases have to be warmed, not just the air surrounding them. You know how long it takes to warm the cabin and contents. The money might be better spent on more batteries.  ???   
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 05, 2013, 07:07:02 PM
Not really about my cabin build but kinda:  I pruned my first apple tree today.

You see I planted this crab about 5 years ago and about 2 years ago our dog ate the bottom branches before I realized what was going on and fenced in the tree.  So I had to wait for the tree to recover (or so I thought) and pruned it this year for the first time.

I'm a total newb here but think I got an ok start to fixing this little crab so it will produce better and grow into a nicer tree.  Meanwhile I'm learning as much as I can for next winter when I'll prune the 5 apples I planted at the cabin.

Speaking of which, I'm dying to get my next order going!  Is it an addiction?  The nursery sent their catalogue and after perusing it I'm thinking of ordering at least 1 or 2 more apples as well as two crabs, two cherries, a couple pears and perhaps some plumbs and apricots.  I'm also thinking of trying some peaches because even though we're a bit cold we're technically still zone 5 so I ought to be able to make them work -- and Peachland BC is NORTH of us (meaning we're further south so a little warmer)....

My goal is to have a nice assortment of fruit trees at the cabin and some day when the grandkids come out to visit in the fall they'll have their pick!  (pun intended).

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on January 07, 2013, 11:11:06 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on January 05, 2013, 07:07:02 PM
Speaking of which, I'm dying to get my next order going!  Is it an addiction?  The nursery sent their catalogue and after perusing it I'm thinking of ordering at least 1 or 2 more apples as well as two crabs, two cherries, a couple pears and perhaps some plumbs and apricots.  I'm also thinking of trying some peaches because even though we're a bit cold we're technically still zone 5 so I ought to be able to make them work

And a partridge in the pear tree ....  heh

Sounds like a good plan, actually.  Just don't expect many cherries from the trees for a few years. (the same probably goes for all the trees, actually) ... but you'll get some good stuff once they get to production age.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 07, 2013, 06:04:28 PM
No worries there :)  I started with a crab about 5 years ago here (Spring of '08 actually) and this will be the 4rd year of production.   However the first year we only got a dozen apples then maybe a couple dozen before the dog ate 6 of 10 branches and last year we actually got something like 40 but again, there weren't a lot of branches and it did a lot of recovering I think.

Now that I've pruned it a little (and I may do a little more) it hopefully will start to grow a little better and produce a decent, yet small, crop this year.

With all of that in mind who knows what those at the cabin will do.  The crab produced a handful the second summer but I think that's early so I'm not expecting any apples this coming summer at the cabin but figure the following I ought to see some...cherries etc I expect to take 2 to 3 summers to produce but with the higher altitude who knows....

One advantage we do have, however, is A LOT of sun in the summer so who knows? They may really like it.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rugger8 on January 10, 2013, 05:01:24 PM
OlJarhead

I wanted to congratulate you on a beautiful cabin and a great thread! :)

I am new hear and it took me about 3 weeks to read through all 63 pages, so all I have to say is well done! ;D

Separately, and I could go back and find it, but when you were using the chainsaw mill, what chainsaw do you have and what was the mill?

Thanks,

Jeff
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 10, 2013, 06:09:26 PM
Hi Jeff, thanks :)

The saw is the Huskvarna 455 Rancher with 20" bar.  It's a little small for that kind of work but DOES do the job, albeit slowly.  The mill is the small Alaskan from Bailey's.

Honestly, if a guy has lots of time it's not a bad way to mill lumber but I much prefer to use the Woodmizer!!!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rugger8 on January 11, 2013, 09:32:49 AM
I agree your mill is beautiful.  In the near term I won't be doing massive amounts of milling.  It will be more or less, one off trees that I could mill down into usable wood for furniture etc.  I have a crappy Homelite 16" chainsaw from HomeDepot, which is not good for much of anything, so want to buy a good saw that has the ability to in the future do mill work as well.  I am looking at the Husky 455 and 460 Rancher, but then am also looking at the 576 XP autotune, which has a bigger engine and can do a bar up to 28".  I figure this will be the chainsaw I use for the next 20+ years as I am not a logger or everyday user.  What are your thoughts?

BTW, I am ex-Army, so glad to see you served on the good side as well! ;)

Jeff
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 11, 2013, 03:55:41 PM
I like the idea of the 576 XP autotune if you plan on doing a little milling but not a lot.  Most guys would say to get a 90cc or bigger saw but my experience with the 455 which is 54cc I beleive, is that it can be done, with patience, with a smaller saw.

If I had to do it over I'd go with the 576 rather then the 455.

Don't get me wrong, the 455 is great little saw and I use it a LOT but I would love to have a 576 and may yet get one for those bigger trees that I sometimes run into.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 11, 2013, 04:00:45 PM
Yup ;) I was a Marine serving in the Army.

But honestly I enjoyed my time in both services and have many friends from the Army that I served with.  Good bunch of guys!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 21, 2013, 09:24:18 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Trailer.jpg)
First look at the new Portable Mill :)

OK the mill isn't new as I've used it to mill LOTS of interior paneling for our cabin and to mill dimensional pine for various projects but the trailer it's now being mounted to is new!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/IMG_0806.jpg)
21 feet long!  I will be able to mill logs that are 18 feet 6 inches long (just barely).
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on January 22, 2013, 12:39:53 PM
Sweet!

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on January 27, 2013, 11:13:19 PM
Ok, I hope you don't mind, but I'm posting these here in your thread, because I thought you might want to see what those 110' trees looked like once they were on the ground.

We figured they were between 55 and 65 years old.

(http://thechristianprepper.com/site/web/photo/photos/DE151054-600.JPG)

(http://thechristianprepper.com/site/web/photo/photos/DE151062-600.JPG)

(http://thechristianprepper.com/site/web/photo/photos/DE151066-600.JPG)

I have more, but this is a good sampling.  It broke my heart to see him load them on the truck and haul them off. They would have made some really nice lumber, I thought!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 27, 2013, 11:43:57 PM
I hope they paid you for them!!!!!!  Those are NICE logs!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on January 30, 2013, 11:28:35 PM
Well, to drop both trees was $350.  Altho I coulda kept them for $450... but Beautiful was concerned that it would take me until sometime after I retire (in 15 years) to get the yard cleaned up and the logs broken into firewood or milled.

The last estimate I had over 3 years ago was over $1000 (and take the trees.)

Gotta love it when the price is right.

He did leave me a couple of long-ish sections and a few 16" rounds for making firewood
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 26, 2013, 12:23:16 PM
Almost two months and no cabin trips!!!  Yikes!

I'm hoping to get another trip going soon but I've been busy with work and losing weight :)  Down 21 1/2 pounds now :)

The mill trailer is coming along and I should have pics of it soon.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 03, 2013, 11:44:45 AM
Finally! :D  We're planning a trip up to the cabin to burn slash, check over the place, see if the fields can be plowed and bring back the propane tanks to get them fitted and filled (we have two big tanks that we haven't made use of yet as we were just using the small tent trailer tanks -- but we sold the trailer so it's time to use the big tanks now :D

Can't wait to get up there!  Also planning an order of trees and maybe berry bushes for the cabin.  Thinking two cherries, two pears and a plum as well as blue berries and raspberries -- those I'm thinking of planting on the south side of the orchard about 10-15 feet away from the trees along the fence.  Will have to protect them from deer probably but that shouldn't be too hard.  Will also have to irrigate them but that's doable.

We also plan on fixing the water system this spring :D  May not put in a new cistern but will run 2" pipe from the cistern to the cabin site (1 1/2" spur to go past future cabin sites and to the frost free we have now, then continue the 2" pipe to near the cabin where it will split into a 1 1/2" pipe for the orchard irrigation and a 1" pipe to the cabin).

If we can get the irrigation sorted this year I'll be pretty happy.  Though it worked well enough to keep the apples alive last year I need it to work well enough to add 5 more trees - maybe 6 - and some berry bushes.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on March 03, 2013, 01:10:32 PM
If you are going to do blue berries test your soil for ph

http://extension.oregonstate.edu/catalog/pdf/ec/ec1560-e.pdf

Not hard to test for but until you get your soil right it very well can be a waste of time and $$$. 

Study the Saint Lawrence Nursery Catalog pointers very closely.  It will save you a ton of head and heart ache. 

Raspberries should work well up your way as well.  Ours went real well last year.   [hungry] 

I would not mess with black berries.  We tried them and the cold is a real problem.  Shy away from peaches unless you just have to try them. 

Try the Bali Cherries from S/L great little critters.  The Adirondack Gold Apricots work well but are very small yet worth a try for jams and drying!

:D Rick
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 03, 2013, 07:35:36 PM
Pines like slightly acid soil so I'm hoping mine is close to what the Blue Berries like -- but I'll try to remember to check.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 09, 2013, 10:08:47 AM
Cabin trip!!!!

It's a short one, but I can't wait to check the place out!  See ya soon!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 11, 2013, 05:07:42 PM
And a wonderful day it was!  These is just something about owning a piece of land and a cabin in the woods!

My wife and I arrived a short while after noon on Saturday and having not chained up at the start of our drive, and being somewhat lazy, I decided not to chain up even once I saw the driveway to our place was still quite treacherous.  Simply put:  why?  I have a tractor? lol
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0540640x360_zps1f7e8844.jpg)

It was a nice, warm and sunny day so we parked at the bottom of the hill and hiked in the last quarter mile or so.  Thankfully I've walked over 260 miles in the last few moths and biked over 100 so I'm in quite a bit better shape these days!  The hike in was one to enjoy, not a chore!
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0583640x360_zps95fe6b5c.jpg)
My wife and I at the top of our place -- hiking is once again something I want to do!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0552640x360_zps60a8e4fe.jpg)
After arriving at the cabin we fired up the big red beast and got the wood stove going.  Then after an appropriate amount of warm up time (for the tractor) and of course, gawking at the awesome place we have, we jumped on the Mahindra and drove back to the entrance to our place and I began plowing the snow and ice sufficiently enough to drive the truck the rest of the way in.  It was a breeze!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0550640x360_zpsd61b5bca.jpg)
Those that know me know that something is missing in this picture -- my gut! :D

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0570640x360_zpsaf12812f.jpg)
Once settled in we spent the day enjoying the place and when evening arrived we brewed up some coffee and noticed we still had some home made Kahlua a friend had given us :D  So ya, the coffee was even better!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0619640x360_zps9a1d04cf.jpg)
Lots of snow still hanging around despite the temps in the mid 40's!  Heck, I think I saw it up to 48 at one point, but I guess when you have 12-15 inches of snow still on the ground it takes a while to melt.  This pic is of our Rye field -- or perhaps our future rye field considering nothing is growing yet! lol

This trip was more about checking on the place and picking some things up to bring home for other projects but it was a great trip and we were just glad to be back!

In two weeks we return and hope to begin expanding the orchard fencing in anticipation of the new trees we're ordering!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 11, 2013, 05:15:35 PM
I should add that the batteries were nicely charged and ready for us and everything continues to work well :)  It's so nice to show up at the cabin and have full power!

So this year our list of 'to do's' at the cabin are:

1.  Fence in larger orchard section to add 2 more trees outside current orchard and 3 inside.
2.  Plant 5 more trees and possibly some berries.
3.  Install new 2" main water line from Cistern to cabin and orchard (probably July)
4.  Roof porch and finish exterior of cabin
5.  Build 'deck' in front of porch and possibly begin deck around cabin (depends on milling operations)
6.  Plant 2 more acres of Cereal Rye
7.  Begin fencing East border (no fencing to date) and fix the rest of the fence around the property
8.  Install gates
9.  Finish interior paneling and trim.
10. Install floor
11.  Add instant on hot water system and finish plumbing (tub/shower).
12.  Start on root cellar (need to dig some of the pit out and build forms for the foundation (s).

Of course who knows how much we'll get done but that's the current plan :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: new land owner on March 11, 2013, 08:30:59 PM
I can't wait to get back to my cabin as well.  I have quite a list of to do's for this year.

I was wondering how the wood stove worked?  I bought the same one last year.  My main concern is how long will a fire last?  My camp is going to be insulated well but the nights get cold up north.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 11, 2013, 09:32:38 PM
Depends.

If you are burning seasons ponderosa pine (about the worst firewood you can have) a good sized load for this stove on fully open damper will burn well for about 2 hours.  In 4 you'll have some coals left.

On the other hand I've tamped it down and had it burn 9 hours to coals.

My best guess is that if you are burning Tamarack or better it's probably capable of going 6 to 8 hours and a well insulated cabin should be quite comfortably suited for this stove -- in other words, we're happy :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 15, 2013, 10:07:09 AM
Getting exited!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Portable%20Sawmill/IMG_0977640x480_zps4c556734.jpg)
We pulled out some blue stain from the shed that we'd milled up a year ago and set it on the new mill setup in order to rip it down to square it up.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Portable%20Sawmill/IMG_0979640x480_zpse4422e58.jpg)
The new mill height is awesome!  And since I can use it to rip boards faster then I could use my table saw I'm pretty stoked!  The working height is excellent.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Portable%20Sawmill/IMG_0978640x480_zpse439d99a.jpg)
This is what we plan to make our flooring out of.  We'll stain it with a light pine stain and then use a heavy floor poly coat type finish to protect it.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Portable%20Sawmill/IMG_0981640x480_zpsa6cece4d.jpg)
This stuff was very wet from laying on the ground for years and when it dried it often warped so now we are milling it down to square it up.  Then it will go on the table saw for finish cuts and finally will either get a Tongue and Groove from the router or be turned into window casing/trim/boxes or whatever else we want.

I can't wait to get the mill back up to the cabin and may even drag it up there next weekend!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rugger8 on March 15, 2013, 10:40:29 AM
OJH - Not long, not long :)  The mill kinda looks outta place in suburbia ???  You will have to take her back to the cabin soon!

Jeff
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 15, 2013, 11:17:57 AM
Quote from: rugger8 on March 15, 2013, 10:40:29 AM
OJH - Not long, not long :)  The mill kinda looks outta place in suburbia ???  You will have to take her back to the cabin soon!

Jeff

Amen!  My yard isn't for mills! lol

This mill needs to be back at the cabin turning trees, which are too close together and need to be thinned out a little, into lumber!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 18, 2013, 10:05:36 AM
Did a bunch of clean up at the house today so I could get back to planing and staining trim wood for the cabin.  I also managed to rip down more of the lumber I had in the shed so it's now squared up :)  Gotta love having a mill in the front yard!

Now I'll have to start running the planer (tonight I think) so I can get enough of the blue stained, or partly stained lumber ready for a light sanding and coat of stain and varathane.  With luck I can have a bunch ready to take up to the cabin this weekend.

Weather at the cabin appears to be much colder this year then the last 3 and so it's unlikely I'll get plowing and planting my rye fields just yet.  Temps are dropping into the high 20's at night and only now starting to approach 50 during the day so the 12 to 15 inches of snow is likely to stick around a little longer.  However, the weather means I should be able to get a good slash burn going at least and with luck I can burn the biggest slash pile this weekend -- the one in the middle of one of our fields.  I also plan to get back to installing paneling in the loft if I have some time while I'm up there and can enlist my wifes help :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 21, 2013, 12:19:48 PM
Between work and weather I've struggled to get the wood ready for the windows!  Can't really do much up there because it's quite cold still so with luck I might be able to get some varathane on it today but again, work gets in the way! DOH!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 26, 2013, 09:54:17 AM
The best way to describe a productive weekend at the cabin?  WOW!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_1018640x480_zps071b3a3f.jpg)
We arrived with little planned because I hadn't finished the window box wood, the weather was too cold and snowy to disk a field or plant and I just wasn't sure what, if anything, we'd get done but we were going to go and have a good weekend regardless. 

Once we arrived, got the cabin warmed up and had a look around (our usual) we spent Friday relaxing and warming up the cabin in anticipation of temps in the mid teens overnight, which, without a fully insulated roof, means I'd be getting up a lot to stoke the wood stove to keep the cabin warm for the misses ;)

The next morning was bright and sunny (and 18 degrees) and we decided to work on paneling the loft.  We spent the next few hours insulating and paneling but had to break mid-day for a run to town, we then got back at it and finished up the wall to the ceiling before running out of things to do (I hadn't brought my table saw along which I'd need in order to start the ceiling).  It was late anyway so we relaxed in the now much warmer cabin!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_1015640x480_zps924286e7.jpg)
One thing we noticed RIGHT away was the humidity inside the cabin dropped!  It was down to 35% for the first time EVER.  WOW!  We didn't even have the ceiling completely insulated (about 95%) but it made a LOT of difference.  Time to put a pot of water on the wood stove.

That night I began to worry a little about the CO2 levels in the cabin and cracked the window over our bed.  Up to this point there was enough of a draft inside the cabin that we never worried about the stove sucking the oxygen out of the cabin but now it was a lot tighter and I worried, but only a little.  I cracked the window less then a quarter inch and went to bed.

Three hours later I woke up a little dizzy (I wake up often) and got up to stoke the stove a little out of habit.  I noticed that I felt dizzy and 'odd' so I cracked the window by the wood stove about an inch, stoked the stove and went back to bed.  After that I felt fine.  I can't be certain it was the stove that got to me but I wasn't taking any chances and put the outside air vent on my MUST GET ASAP list.  I wasn't having any of that again!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_1019640x480_zps51917c5a.jpg)
The next day I managed to get one window 3/4ths of the way boxed in.  We'd found we had enough left over Blue Stain pine to do at least that much.  Gotta love that stuff!

We also tried out my 'cabin bread' in our dutch oven :)
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_1027640x480_zpsc881e5da.jpg)
I use an old BBQ grate as a cook surface for the bottom of the oven (to get the coals off the ground) and used a LOT of coals because I wanted the oven around 500 degrees.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_1029640x480_zps4036a898.jpg)
This recipe is a simple one:  3 cups of bread flour (I used about 1/4 to 3/4 cup home milled whole wheat and the rest white), 1 1/4 tsp salt (sea salt, non-iodized), 1/2 tsp yeast and 1 1/3 to 1 1/2 cups of well water (non-chlorinated water).  I put the try ingredients into a mason jar and tote along in case I want to make bread.  Then dump them into a large mixing bowl, mix in the water until the mix is sticky and well mixed (no kneading) and then cover with plastic wrap and a towel and let sit at room temp for about 24hours.  Once read gently pour out onto a well floured cutting board, form into a ball with well floured hands and then place back in the well floured bowl (or a towel) and let sit for 1 to 2 more hours while you get the oven ready.  Bake at around 500 degrees for about 40-50 minutes, let cool for 15 minutes and then serve.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_1033640x480_zpsf4dc1711.jpg)
The bread was awesome :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0674640x360_zps0addd99c.jpg)
A pic my wife took of our little cabin interior

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0671640x360_zps77d958eb.jpg)
That's me relaxing after lots of cabin work :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0669640x360_zpsf471efa8.jpg)
HER kitchen! lol -- she calls it that

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_1024480x640_zpsdf752906.jpg)
We put the subfloor in the porch and tiled the floor (the HD type faux tile that you just put together with a glued edge -- supposed to be more durable then linoleum and water proof).

Manged to get a few other things done as well and all in all had a fantastic weekend!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 26, 2013, 10:43:09 AM
Just ordered the air intake :)  $45 off ebay!  Considering I held off previously since it was $150 as quoted.

Also ordered a Cherry, Pear and a plumb for the orchard :)  all self pollinators and won't cause me to have to make the orchard bigger.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on March 26, 2013, 12:17:31 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on March 26, 2013, 10:43:09 AM
Just ordered the air intake :)  $45 off ebay!  Considering I held off previously since it was $150 as quoted.

Also ordered a Cherry, Pear and a plumb for the orchard :)  all self pollinators and won't cause me to have to make the orchard bigger.

Good choice on trees.  Glad you had a good time up there 'roughing it' looks pretty enjoyable now.  Making great progress!  Hang in there!! [cool]
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 27, 2013, 04:13:47 PM
Looks like I have about 4 feet worth of pine paneling I can make for the cabin before my next trip.  It will all be 4" paneling though and since I've been alternating 4", 5", 6" and 7" paneling I'll have to mill up an additional 12 to 14 feet of the other widths in order to finish the roof off.  I try to get fairly even numbers of each but that can be tough with trees of different sizes.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 27, 2013, 04:40:42 PM
Hmmm my math tells me I can go up the ceiling about 5 feet with the boards we just ripped square :)  Of course I still have to plane them and rip them down to 4" widths and then take the router to them but it's nice to know that I can get about 1/3rd of the remaining ceiling done with this!  I also have about 3 or 4 feet of 7" paneling up there now so with a few logs milled up I ought to have enough to finish the ceiling!

Then, however, I have to wait 8 weeks of drying before I can rip them down and begin the process of making them into paneling but it gives me hope for a finished interior this spring/summer!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on March 28, 2013, 03:05:19 PM
Very cool!  Took me a minute to catch up because I've been busy around the house here...

Cabin looks great!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: astidham on March 29, 2013, 01:08:46 PM
looking good!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 30, 2013, 01:19:04 PM
We plan hot water this spring!
http://marey.com/product_pdf/english/6.pdf

They say not to install outside but I'm installing outside (sorry Marey).  My plan, however, is to box in the installation and put a roof over it (the stack will go up through that) and to insulate the box but otherwise it will be outside for the foreseeable future.

However, if I get my composter 'room' finished it will be more like a 'basement' with surface bonded dry stacked cinder block walls (filled of course) and concrete floor (insulated) with insulated upper walls and an RV propane heater installed in the wall to provide heat to about 50-55 degrees in colder months (to keep the composting action working).  If I get that built (in a year or two) then the hot water heater will go inside that space also.

Either way, I'm set up for this RIGHT NOW except the gas supply (which I'm close enough on) and so my plan it to get this in the next month or two and install it.  Then it will be downright civilized at the cabin!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 30, 2013, 01:30:37 PM
Just bought the Marey 10l Heater!  WhooHoo!  Got it for $209 with free shipping :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 02, 2013, 04:14:43 PM
Getting VERY excited about this next trip!!!

It all goes well I'll be milling a LOT of lumber for paneling, flooring, the deck and so much more :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 04, 2013, 09:27:46 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/IMG_0080640x480_zps1a43ab25.jpg)
Almost ready to tow up to the cabin :)

I really can't wait either! (can you tell?).  It's going to rain on us (60% chance) which I don't relish but I plan to fall at least two big trees (maybe 3) and drag the logs over to the mill.  We've also got 4 small logs ready for milling.  My goal?

75ea -  3/4" x 8' pine boards -- blue stain preferred -- for the flooring (I need about 200 square feet worth and have some of it already but extra will be nice)
150ea -  5/8" x 8' knotty pine boards -- for paneling
100+ - 2" boards (dimensional lumber but I may go with rough cut sizes too)

Overall goal is to mill a minimum of 150bf/hr for 10 hours -- though, honestly if we can mill 200bf/hr over sustained periods I'd be a LOT happier ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 08, 2013, 11:23:25 AM
Wow!  What an awesome weekend :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Portable%20Sawmill/IMG_0096640x480_zps4ff6a41e.jpg)
After getting the mill to the site late Friday night we crashed in the warm cabin (it was in the mid 40's) and started early Saturday after a few foibles.  First up was a couple blue stained logs for flooring.  These were small 8 footers but produced some very nice stained pine!

Next up -- BIG LOGS!
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Portable%20Sawmill/IMG_0097640x480_zps6aa4509d.jpg)\
Out first log measured over 16 inches at the small end and scaled out at 180bf on the International 1/4" Scale -- which means we would get over 200 board feet from it :) 

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Portable%20Sawmill/IMG_0098640x480_zpsed6bfb04.jpg)
This was the first 16 foot log we've ever milled so it was a learning experience but it was satisfying!  Loading it took some work but we'd get better ;)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Portable%20Sawmill/IMG_0101640x4802_zps26f8b849.jpg)
Something about a big pine on the mill that gets my blood pumping!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Portable%20Sawmill/IMG_0104640x480_zps65f98a97.jpg)
Burning slash gave us a place to make lunch ;)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Portable%20Sawmill/IMG_0110640x480_zps321fcdb6.jpg)
Making the can took a while on this first big log. 

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Portable%20Sawmill/IMG_0114640x480_zps24e2bc1a.jpg)
Whittling away at it.  Soon we'll have it ready to mill 5/8" paneling.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Portable%20Sawmill/IMG_0116640x480_zpsa474a5c6.jpg)
This log was about as big as we could mill with the little LT10 -- but at about 1200-1400 lbs I was pretty impressed with the mill!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Portable%20Sawmill/IMG_0118640x480_zpsfd4a6564.jpg)
Making the paneling :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Portable%20Sawmill/IMG_0140640x480_zps6514b404.jpg)
A days worth of milling.  It was a slow day because we had some learning to do but overall it wasn't a bad day either.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 08, 2013, 11:43:21 AM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Portable%20Sawmill/IMG_0141640x480_zps464f2c9b.jpg)
Day two started at 7am with me taking the tractor and chainsaw up to the Rye field I wanted to build and looking for a big pine to fall.  Honestly I hate taking down these big guys but I also wanted to open up this acre for Cereal Rye so decided I'd take this last 'big' pine and put it on the mill.  All the rest of the trees will be smaller unless they are somewhere I don't want them ;)  but again, I hate to take the big ones!  I'd rather take smaller trees around them so they can grow even bigger ;)

The snow was really coming down at times and made it a cold and wet day!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Portable%20Sawmill/IMG_0145640x480_zpsfc710b38.jpg)
After Saturday's 30 minute load time for a big pine Sunday's (this pic) 6 minute time for a 1200-1400 pound log was VERY nice!  We were getting it down!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Portable%20Sawmill/IMG_0149640x480_zps915f39d8.jpg)
We can handle logs up to 24" in diameter but that's the upper limit for this mill.  Anything that size or larger will likely need some chainsaw slabbing work to make it fit the mill.  In this case the big taper meant I had to slab off some bark so the mill could take it down to a CANT.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Portable%20Sawmill/IMG_0154640x480_zpsfa9d7248.jpg)
Making the CANT

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Portable%20Sawmill/IMG_0156640x480_zps8172cd7a.jpg)
A log this size takes us about 90 minutes to mill into 2x's but I suspect with time we could get that closer to 60 minutes.  Total lumber produced from this 16 footer was about 185 board feet.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Portable%20Sawmill/IMG_0160640x480_zpsb614a909.jpg)
It really wasn't a lot of fun milling in this weather!  And we had very little time to protect the lumber so we'll have to get back soon to improve the stack.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Portable%20Sawmill/IMG_0161480x640_zpsc6ef3d68.jpg)
The last log was milled at 1 3/4" to give us slightly larger then dimensional lumber though not quite 'rough cut' sizes.  When these dry they will likely come in at about 1 5/8" thick and will be used to build the deck and outhouse.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Portable%20Sawmill/IMG_0163640x480_zpscd0b1933.jpg)
Heading home!

I'm very happy with the mill and how easy it was to drag into our remote location! 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 08, 2013, 02:19:56 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Portable%20Sawmill/IMG_0140640x480_zps6514b404.jpg)
Looking closer at this stack and I realize the following:

2x6 studs run about 57c/bf so there's about $70 worth of 2x6's here (they would have to be ripped down to that size which is my plan).
1x6 pine boards run about $3.97/bf at HD so there's about $1100 worth of 1x6 pine boards in there (again, need to rip them down)

So to put this into perspective if I had to buy the lumber at HD or similar store it would run more over $1k whereas we just cut the trees down, bucked them into logs and rolled them on the mill :D  OF course paying someone to do this would run about $450 for the day (setup included) but that's still a savings of OVER $600!  Can't beat that!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: new land owner on April 08, 2013, 05:40:14 PM
Nice job with the mill.  My brother in law has a similar one and he milled all of the siding for my camp and enough wood for the ceilings and wainscotting.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 08, 2013, 07:38:56 PM
Thanks :)

Gotta love having a mill in the family!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 09, 2013, 04:55:08 PM
One thing that's become obvious to me over the last couple years is just how important a deck in front of the porch is!  So many times it's been raining or snowing (or slushing) and we can't help but track in mud and water SO all the milling we are doing over the next couple trips (minus when we go to plant the new trees) is going to be for decking once we get enough paneling and flooring done.

At this point I have enough 2x stock to probably do a small deck in front of the porch but I'm hoping to get enough to also do an 8x10 section next to the porch.  This is where I'll have to start my foundation work also.  So that's the plan!  A pine deck around the cabin :D  I'll have to roof it too but heck, it just sounds like a great idea and was always part of the plan anyway.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 10, 2013, 11:23:45 AM
Yikes!  I think our trees are coming!!!  and I'm not ready.

I wasn't thinking when I ordered and forgot to ask for a late shipment so the trees may be on their way and it's going to be touch and go I think!  It's WARM (low 60's or even upper 60's) here where we live but up at the orchard it is still freezing at night often enough for the orchard to be dormant still.

Hopefully the trees will be ok and won't get too frost damaged when I race up to plant them and hopefully the deer don't find them before I get them fenced.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: CjAl on April 10, 2013, 12:45:41 PM
Are they potted trees? You could always dig a trench to hold them temp. Dig a trench and lay them in it and fill the dirt over the top of the roots. You could hold them a few weeks like that, or pot them
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 10, 2013, 03:29:05 PM
Quote from: CjAl on April 10, 2013, 12:45:41 PM
Are they potted trees? You could always dig a trench to hold them temp. Dig a trench and lay them in it and fill the dirt over the top of the roots. You could hold them a few weeks like that, or pot them

I saw something about that on the site they are coming from as a way to hold them over but wasn't sure how to actually do it and when to pull them up to transplant...

So I guess I ought to call them and discuss! lol
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 14, 2013, 11:23:03 AM
Got a trip planned for next weekend now :) 

We'll be dragging the mill back up to get as much milled as we can (probably do some 3x stuff for the deck stairs I want to build) and with luck if the trees come in next week it will be later in the week.

Meanwhile I'm planning a new set of stairs (two actually) that I'll make out of 3" pine.  I figure that ought to ensure they are strong enough to last a long time!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 15, 2013, 11:38:56 AM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Cabin_withporchanddeck_zpsb2b035fa.jpg) (https://s998.photobucket.com/user/emcvay/media/Cabin/Cabin_withporchanddeck_zpsb2b035fa.jpg.html)
Finally figured out how to make cylinders!

My plan for the stairs is to build them out of 3" lumber we'll mill this coming weekend.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 17, 2013, 09:14:57 AM
Getting our mill trailer inspected today and with luck we'll get it licensed tomorrow :)  (or later today). 

Then we head to the cabin Friday afternoon and while we'll mill up as much lumber as we can we'll also meet with our first 'official' customer! 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 22, 2013, 10:05:27 AM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Portable%20Sawmill/IMG_9835640x427_zps20b22dda.jpg) (https://s998.photobucket.com/user/emcvay/media/Cabin/Portable%20Sawmill/IMG_9835640x427_zps20b22dda.jpg.html)
My dad took a pic of me with the mill on our way up to the cabin.  Was a great trip!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Portable%20Sawmill/IMG_9997640x427_zpsc592a5a0.jpg) (https://s998.photobucket.com/user/emcvay/media/Cabin/Portable%20Sawmill/IMG_9997640x427_zpsc592a5a0.jpg.html)
Milling 'Flitches' into useable lumber.  Each log yields about 8 flitches (lumber with bark on still) when milling to the 'cant'.  This is one way we get more out of a log than traditional mills.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Portable%20Sawmill/IMG_0071427x640_zps6cb9af98.jpg) (https://s998.photobucket.com/user/emcvay/media/Cabin/Portable%20Sawmill/IMG_0071427x640_zps6cb9af98.jpg.html)
My buddy rolling a log up onto the mill -- it's actually pretty easy.

All in all we milled 1200 board feet of pine for the cabin in about 11 hours of milling :)

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: astidham on April 22, 2013, 12:58:43 PM
That sawmill set-up is awesome!
I really want to get one.
we have lots of hickory and red oak on our property that I would like to turn into a pile of boards.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 22, 2013, 02:47:21 PM
Quote from: astidham on April 22, 2013, 12:58:43 PM
That sawmill set-up is awesome!
I really want to get one.
we have lots of hickory and red oak on our property that I would like to turn into a pile of boards.

We LOVE it :)

If you get a small WM like ours be sure to get the 10hp motor for those hardwoods and also get some 7 or 4 degree blades for it -- then that hickory and oak will turn into furniture in no time! :d [cool]
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 23, 2013, 08:34:38 AM
Our newest trees are on their way!  So I'm back to the cabin when they arrive (well I'm hoping they arrive Friday so I can leave Friday to plant them).
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Yonderosa on April 23, 2013, 10:22:45 AM
Inspiring and just plain awesome.  Thanks for posting.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 23, 2013, 10:45:35 AM
Thanks Yonderosa :)  I'll have to get pics of the 2 5/8" lumber I plan to use for our stairs!  I LOVE that stuff!  It's all #2 or better and some is clear I believe (can't remember) but either way will make amazing stairs!

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on April 23, 2013, 06:49:09 PM
Eric I caught some post where you were planning to use your milled wood on a porch/deck and stairs.  How are you going to preserve the lumber since it will be exposed to the elements.  Generally "white wood" doesn't stand a chance exposed.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 23, 2013, 08:26:54 PM
Quote from: Redoverfarm on April 23, 2013, 06:49:09 PM
Eric I caught some post where you were planning to use your milled wood on a porch/deck and stairs.  How are you going to preserve the lumber since it will be exposed to the elements.  Generally "white wood" doesn't stand a chance exposed.

Eventually the deck will be roofed though that might take a year or two.

I planned on coating it well with a good deck stain and hoping for the best.  I'd prefer Redwood but don't have any of those.  I figure the deck will look amazing for a few years and then with luck the roof will take over :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 23, 2013, 08:30:41 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/IMG_0056.jpg) (https://s998.photobucket.com/user/emcvay/media/IMG_0056.jpg.html)
This pine has held up really quite well which made me think that treated on the deck/stairs it would hold up.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 24, 2013, 03:19:51 PM
OH CRAP!  My trees just arrived and I have to wait TWO DAYS before driving them to the cabin!

I've asked the nursery for advice on keeping them during these two WARM days and hopefully they can survive!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 25, 2013, 09:22:01 AM
Soaked the trees overnight in a 'garden dirt tea' and am hoping they will be fine until Saturday.

I'll either heal them in today or just wrap them up well and keep the roots damp but one of the trees is awake and trying to grow!  ??? :o :(

It was over 70 yesterday and I'm afraid I can't keep them from coming fully away so I'm going to hope and pray that they have enough nutrients to stay alive before planting and that the weather turns warm at the property (where is Al Gore when I need him?).....

Luckily it's only 3 trees or I'd be headed there already!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: suburbancowboy on April 25, 2013, 05:58:22 PM
One thing you can do with your trees is to get a 3+/- gallon planter pot.  Put some kind of fabric/burlap in the bucket to line the bottom and outsides.  Next fill it half full of loamy dirt.  Put in the bare root tree.  Finish filling with dirt.  Water and relax.  This will buy you a whole year if needed.  When you get to your place because of the fabric it will just slip out.  Put all the fabric, dirt and tree into the hole where it's new home will be.  The fabric will break down in a few months and the tree will be happy.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 29, 2013, 10:04:05 AM
Oh how I long for a week or two straight at the cabin!  So much to do and so little can be done in weekend trips but after nearly 4 years of driving 4 1/2 hours each way and only getting a day and a half to get stuff done I'm only MORE determined to do it more often and MORE motivated to keep going!  For us it is truly a labor of love and we can't wait for the next trip (as always!).

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0211640x480_zps93a1a063.jpg)
Our primary focus this weekend was to get our 3 new trees planted in the orchard.  We did that and more :)

There was a lot of debris in the orchard because the previous year we didn't have the tractor yet and were in a rush to get things done, so this year we drove the tractor in and worked on cleaning up the orchard before planting our 3 new trees.  Once done we set the trees in the ground and gave them 5 gallons of water.  We then set up the irrigation so the 3 new trees would get plenty of water and two of the weaker apples from last year would get watered too (there is enough rain for well established trees this time of year and while we want all 8 to get at least 5 gallons a week we forgot to bring all our funny pipe and fittings so had to mod up the original 5 locations to catch the three new ones plus two.

Made some mistakes planting these trees (like not watering after half filling the hole) but I'm hoping all will be fine and they will take in their new homes.
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0208640x480_zpsdedd2d39.jpg)
Our next mission was to disk up another acre for our cereal Rye fields.  I brought up 50#'s of Rye seed just in case we could get the job done and we dragged out the old disks and began disking.  It took me about 90 minutes to get the field to this point and then the next day I hit it for an our.  Once done we hand broadcast and used a yard seed spreader to get the seed onto the ground.  I hope it takes!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0206640x480_zps9265e2cc.jpg) (https://s998.photobucket.com/user/emcvay/media/Cabin/IMG_0206640x480_zps9265e2cc.jpg.html)
Last years attempt at planting cereal rye 'may' have been successful but we won't know until it grows a bit more since the natural grass we have is always taking off everywhere.  I suspect there is a mix in this field and it will be interesting to see who wins out -- the rye is supposed to do just that.  We'll see!

We also pumped over 200 gallons of water into the cistern so it should be nice and full now and was watering the orchard nicely before we left :)  Our solar panel pump setup works like a charm!

We also got some of the trash cleaned up and did some shooting (my soon to be son-in-law just got back from Afghanistan and wanted to do a little shooting with the old Jarhead :) )...was a great weekend overall and I can't wait to get back!

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 02, 2013, 10:00:45 AM
Planning my next trip :)  Will be a 'clean up' trip with nothing more in mind then to try to sort out the mess we have and deal with minor things as well as perhaps getting the hot water system installed.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 05, 2013, 10:43:36 AM
Question:

I'm getting ready to install an instant on Hot Water Heater.  It is different then the one I planned to use (an outdoor shower type) after seeing the price of the indoor kinds -- it's an actual indoor heater (instant on) but only cost me $200 instead of the $650 I was originally looking at.

So here is my question:  what do you think of removing the sheeting and siding from the outside where the heater will be installed, then boxing in a 'bay window' style 'heater closet' on the outside of the cabin with access on the outside (insulated)?   My thought is that if I remove the siding/sheeting and insulation but leave the interior drywall then the heater will be in a warm environment in the winter and protected from the elements.  It will be accessible from the outside via an insulated (and locked) door and would not require me to run new piping.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Heaterhose_zps030668f9.jpg) (https://s998.photobucket.com/user/emcvay/media/Cabin/Heaterhose_zps030668f9.jpg.html)
In this pic you can see where I ran the piping for the hot water.  My intent was to install the outdoor shower type instant on hot water heater mounted to the outside of the wall and used only in the warmer months.  Now I'm thinking I could box it in like a bay window and give it a roof with a vent in it.

I'll draw something up
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 13, 2013, 08:55:41 AM
Our 'water closet' worked out more or less like I envisioned and can be seen here closed up:
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/0512130723426x640_zpsa83bc084.jpg) (https://s998.photobucket.com/user/emcvay/media/Cabin/0512130723426x640_zpsa83bc084.jpg.html)

What I did is I placed it directly behind the bathroom where I already had a cut out in the wall for the copper sharkbite water headers I installed last year (cold was already installed, hot waiting).  What we did is cut the sheeting and siding out from the opposite side (outside) to open that space up to the new water closet, then built two sides to the box, calked them heavily and screwed to the studs on the outside, then joined them top and bottom and installed some supports (which somehow ended up different sizes....I should ask Josh about that! lol

One thing I had to change was the depth of the box which went from 3 feet to 4 feet in order to put the black iron pipe and gas valve inside the box and protect the valve and gas line hose to the water heater from the elements.  This provided extra room so I installed the RV pump into the bottom of the 'box' and ran the water inlet from the 55 gallon water drum into the box from the side.  Then I split the water supply after the RV pump to the heater and cold water headers.

Only issue was that I had a gas line hose that was only 12" and I really needed 18" so next weekend we'll actually be able to use the system but didn't a chance this one :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/0512130735a_zps86d3d473.jpg) (https://s998.photobucket.com/user/emcvay/media/Cabin/0512130735a_zps86d3d473.jpg.html)
This is a pic of the 'cereal rye' field which I have no idea if it's really growing or not!  Lots of natural grasses are growing as well as wild flowers but I can't tell if the Rye has taken yet...ah well, maybe later in the summer I'll know ;)

Was a great, albeit short trip but we're back on Friday so that's ok :)  Can't wait to be back though!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Abbey on May 13, 2013, 11:30:12 AM
Are you going to raise the exhaust vent higher to get it farther away from the window?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 13, 2013, 11:33:13 AM
Quote from: Abbey on May 13, 2013, 11:30:12 AM
Are you going to raise the exhaust vent higher to get it farther away from the window?

I may.  I figured I'd wait to see how obnoxious it was first ;)  I still have to screw the exhaust vent down too so will be easy to add to -- had a VERY hard time finding venting though!  Took three stores and the last only had this much.  Seems not many people going this route but to me it seems the best route to go!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Abbey on May 13, 2013, 12:01:05 PM
I think most people go with the through the wall power vented style, which is what I was looking at, but then I went my own way...

Someone was walking by my office and farted, it smells bad.

Forgive the digression, I'm using the Triton 10L outdoor on-demand water heater and I've got it mounted on the bathroom wall right next to my tub that way I can make adjustments to the water temp. while still in the shower. I've noticed that when I first start it there is a little smell, but after that there is nothing. A few people have entered the house while the heater's been running and none of them have mentioned any smell. Honestly I think there is less smell with this heater than there was with my propane stove.

I doubt you'll notice anything if the window is open and the heater's running. The only problem you might face is dealing with a code enforcement person.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 14, 2013, 08:56:14 AM
RAIN!  It's good that it's raining at the cabin :)  The trees ought to really love that and I think I could dial back the watering schedule to once a week or for less time, maybe just 30 minutes every 72 hours (I think my timer might not let me go weekly).

Either way the temps have dropped back into the 60's for the highs and the 30's for lows and the chance of rain is in the 30% to 40% range.

Of course all that means is that next weekend when we go back up we'll likely want a fire at night and perhaps in the mornings and won't spend as much time outside cleaning up but it also means we should be fine to burn a lot of slash which we really need to do.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 14, 2013, 09:31:06 AM
Correction!  We will be milling instead.  Seems a customer wants us to mill for them this weekend so we'll be at the cabin but we'll be working in Waukonda milling for a customer instead of burning slash.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 20, 2013, 09:48:27 AM
OK that bites!  I had an entire post done, went to check it, hit the back arrow to go back to it and went DOH!  d* d* d*

It's gone :(

So here it is again in pics with less words.
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0298640x480_zps3266a547.jpg)
Arrived Thursday night so we could start milling Friday morning as early as possible.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Portable%20Sawmill/IMG_0976640x360_zps87bf86d5.jpg)
Started milling for our new customer in Waukonda and milled just shy of 1000bf on Friday in the pouring rain!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Portable%20Sawmill/IMG_0996640x360_zps5aaf1e27.jpg)
We milled pretty much non-stop for 8 hours except our 1/2 lunch break and really enjoyed the time spent working with the customer (they work along side us to help keep the costs down).

Got back to the cabin and installed the gas line to the new hot water heater.  IT WORKED!  After a lot of fiddling mind you.
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0299527x640_zpsf05c5314.jpg)
We had a mostly full tank of water so went about our evening relaxing and drying out...and noticed a leak in the evening -- perhaps the drain valve I'd accidentally messed with?  Shut the water off and crashed for the night.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Portable%20Sawmill/IMG_0303640x480_zpsc37e4e7d.jpg) (https://s998.photobucket.com/user/emcvay/media/Cabin/Portable%20Sawmill/IMG_0303640x480_zpsc37e4e7d.jpg.html)
Finished up over 1800 board feet of Doug Fir (little bit of Spruce in there and maybe a Tamarack or two) for the customer so he can build a shed :)  He was VERY VERY happy and we'll be back to mill again in the next month or so.  His friends are also asking to have us come and mill for them.  Seems a local miller won't move his mill -- his loss our gain :D

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0301640x480_zps68df05be.jpg)
Back at the cabin (without hot water) I took some pics of the orchard which is doing AWESOME!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0289480x640_zps7ea3f916.jpg)
This is one of our newest trees :)  It seems pretty happy with all the spring rain.

My cereal rye IS NOT growing :( however.  Not sure what's up but I can't see any evidence that either field is or will start producing...the forest grass however IS.

Managed to tear off the felt off the porch since we hadn't installed roofing yet  d* and installed new felt to save the wood.  We'll have to do that soon.

Then discovered the o-ring on the water drain of the hot water heater was broken and believe that is the leak we have so we'll fix that next trip.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 20, 2013, 09:54:12 AM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0305640x570_zps8f451b78.jpg)
Here is a shot of the 'water closet'.  I know it's not the prettiest plumbing you've all seen but it works and doesn't leak! :D

The water heater goes behind those headers and the two red pex pipes coming into the space from above will be removed (no longer needed).  I'll seal things up, paint surfaces to protect and insulate the heck out of the 'closet' when done.  I also suspect I'll install a much taller vent stack for the heater (maybe through the roof even) to give it lots of room to vent away from the bathroom window and closet but for now it works.

We have to install a vent cover and then see how the thing works over time but so far so good :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 21, 2013, 08:59:11 AM
One thing I forgot to mention is that our Cistern was overfilled on the last trip out to the cabin.  In fact I think it went about 2 hours past full :(  We'd set the pump and headed to town thinking we'd be back with plenty of time to spare, forgot about it and took twice as long.

Shut the pump off when we returned and sure enough we'd flooded the cistern.  Wasn't too concerned and took advantage of the overfilled tank to fill out cabin water tank -- I was surprised by the volume of water coming out of the hose and for the first time didn't need a pump to draw water into the cabin tank.

I watered the orchard and never really paid close attention.

This trip our son told us the water smelled funny so I went out and took a look -- sure enough it was 'brackish' looking :(  Seems there was a LOT of dirt drawn into the tank and since we draw off the bottom we'll be 'cleaning' out the tank by draining it.  However, the water pressure now is actually good!  The water comes out of the end of a 150 foot long garden hose VERY well!  I have pressure at all 24 drip heads in the orchard and can fill the 55 gallon cabin water tank in under 30 minutes (or around).  At the spigot/hydrant it literally blasts out of the spout!  So maybe, just maybe, we've cleared a blockage?  Don't know for sure but I think we've got the water pressure situation fixed for now.  I still want a 2" main pipe but I think it can wait another year or more.  I do, however, need to get the float installed!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 22, 2013, 04:47:54 PM
Going back soon :)

Got word we will be going back to mill in Waukonda so get to stay at the cabin again :D  I'll have to clean out the water supply and drain and refill the cistern beforehand and fix the hot water and put a hot water drain in....

I think a trip in a couple weeks is in order :)

That way when we go back to mill we'll have the place ready!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 28, 2013, 08:57:07 AM
OK next 'cabin trip' is planned!  This trip I'll replace the o-ring on the master drain valve on the instant on hot water heater and hopefully that will solve the problem I had with it and give us full time hot water :)  Then we'll install the drain for the bathtub, install the shower head and support and attempt to clean out the cistern and water tank by the cabin and refill both (minus the dirt).

I'm also hoping to get some trim wood finished before the trip so I can put some finishing touches on the water closet and then install the cover (air return style cover) over it to 'hide' it yet allow it to draw air from inside the cabin.

I'll also add to the chimney if I can get more 4" pipe and seal up the closet.  Then, maybe I'll get some insulation into the closet also.

Heck, I might even get a window trimmed out if I get lots done this week! :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 29, 2013, 11:37:14 AM
http://www.homedepot.com/p/Owens-Corning-Foamular-F-150-2-in-x-48-in-x-8-ft-Scored-Squared-Edge-Foam-45W/100320352?N=baxxZ12l0#.UaYsnZyyl8E
So I'm thinking of using this foam board insulation which is R10 in the 2" type.  I can cut and place inside the box I've made for the water heater and add 1" rigid foam to increase the value to R15 on the walls and floor and double the R10 for a 4" ceiling to increase it to R20.

My thought is that it would be better then fiberglass in the small space that I'm placing the heater and should assist in keeping the cold out.  Only issue I can see if that I need to add a water drain hose for the heater so I can drain all the water out in the winter when not in use but I don't see that as a major issue.

I figure I can silicone the seems before placing the foam board and make the enclosure pretty much air tight (except the chimney/vent stack).  With air being drawn from inside the cabin the only other issue is of course, air being drawn from inside the cabin  d* But we can always leave a window cracked in the winter and I'm installing outside air vent for the wood stove.

Thoughts?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MikeOnBike on May 29, 2013, 12:04:10 PM
I used the 2" Foamular 150 to insulate my shed floor.  After I had it cut and placed I used a can of the window/door/crack spray foam to seal the gaps.  It worked well.

http://www.homedepot.com/p/GREAT-STUFF-16-oz-Window-and-Door-Insulating-Foam-Sealant-248312/100068117 (http://www.homedepot.com/p/GREAT-STUFF-16-oz-Window-and-Door-Insulating-Foam-Sealant-248312/100068117)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 29, 2013, 02:11:50 PM
Yup I use Great Stuff a lot!

Good idea, I'll use it instead of silicone thanks!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 30, 2013, 07:21:28 PM
Stained up some window trim after sanding off the Ipswitch Pine stain that we decided we didn't like.  It's now an Oak.

Got some 4 5/8" wide pine boards planed and ready for the bathroom door trim too :)

Can't wait to get back, fix the water and maybe get some interior trim work done.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 03, 2013, 10:36:42 AM
Oh to spend more then a day or two at the cabin!  I haven't been able to spend a week there since last summer and I must admit it's taking it's toll!  Sure I get there every month and sometimes twice a month but man oh man what I could do with a week!

This trip, as mentioned, I wanted to fix the hot water and the tub as well as clean out the cistern and water tank at the cabin.  When we arrived and were settled we just had time to hook up propane and relax before crashing for the night, then the next morning we'd get started.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0365640x345_zps9d4502a7.jpg)[/URL]
First I had to cut off the inlet or siphon hose/pex from the tank to the RV pump as I'd not installed a method of disconnecting it in my rush to hook everything up and with the new water closet I'd left the siphon whole and stuffed it out the side of the 'closet'.  So I cut it in half and installed a disconnect for easy of removal in the future.

We drained the water barrel and put some bleach in it with water to soak and swish around to make sure it was clean and bug free.  We then checked the cistern which was empty from watering the orchard so we ran the pump to fill it back up and would check for dirt later.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0367364x640_zpsae1be15a.jpg)
We installed 2" R12.9 foam inside the 'closet' and then installed the hot water heater which I'd replaced a rubber o-ring on because it was leaking.  It's tight inside the box but there is actually at least 4 inches of clearance on each side and 4" in the front with more blow and above.  I'm not sure if that's a little too tight but so far it seems ok.

The closet isn't finished as I need to make a proper roof and push the pipe up higher (through the cabin roof I think) but for now it seems to be working ok).

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0368640x602_zpscf9f2154.jpg)
As mentioned before I installed the RV water pump in the bottom of the 'water closet' so I can leave it there and hooked up ready for use.  At this point I'm pretty ok with the set up :)  I'll ahve to work up a way to insulate the bottom of the box/closet and keep the pump where it is but I have some ideas (involving insulation under the closet).

In that pic you can also see the water shut off valve that I installed on the hot water inlet side.  This allows me to drain the hot water side and shut off the water to the heater for winter use (if I have water in the winter that is and don't want it running through the heater).

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0375640x537_zps35e7944b.jpg)
Inside the bathroom we trimmed out the air inlet with Blue Stained pine that was pretty much abused by bugs and weather (which makes it look even nicer to us).

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0379640x531_zpse665fe8c.jpg)
And then we installed a vent cover to hide the pipes and heater :)  Now it's just a vent in the wall :)  But it can draw air from inside the cabin which may help keep it warm in colder months.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0387640x480_zpsa50524fb.jpg)
Got another window trimmed out.  I managed to get one piece in another window also but it seems I've not had the time to stain and varathane all of the trim wood I have so probably NEXT trip I'll get all the windows done :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0395320x640_zps4815ec98.jpg)
Another shot of the blue stained pine -- also, I've dropped trying to use Ipswitch Pine stain and am now using English Oak stain instead -- my son informed me that's what he used on the original trim so I'm using it as we like the look better.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0397480x640_zps57af6bb4.jpg)
The bathroom door jam is also blue stained pine and will eventually sport a door too!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0401640x480_zps9285865f.jpg)
Since I wasn't able to install the tub (missing some hoses) I turned to cleaning up :)  The cistern was clean once refilled so no need to work with it and we refilled the 55 gallon water drum for the cabin and cranked up the tractor and began cleaning up slash, old wood, rocks and more :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0402640x480_zps7fe3ad90.jpg)
Used to look like a dump (to me) and now starting to shape up :)  Notice the pine drying nicely under the tarps :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0411640x480_zps9c87874e.jpg)
This slash pile I consolidated and cleaned up.  It was very rotten and made me ponder something Glenn was doing at his place (Glenn if you are reading this, let me know what I ought to do with this rotting pile of wood as I think I could use it as fill or something rather then burning it -- heck it's more dirt then wood now! lol)...

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0358640x480_zps19b6a333.jpg)
And finally the Cereal Rye is taking hold!!!  I've got two acres planted and am hoping it does well this year :)

So much more to do, so little time but I'm still loving it!

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 06, 2013, 09:27:01 AM
Picked up some shd80 1" conduit for free this week :)  I'll have enough to install my pump solar panel wiring under ground this spring and finish the run under the cabin as well as to the main panels :D

One challenge with the short trips is trying to get as much done as possible but I'm not seriously looking at Hugesnet Gen4 as an option for me to work from the cabin when I make my trips there.  If I can do that I can spend a week at a time (even perhaps monthly) instead of just a couple days and this would allow me to finish a LOT of projects!

So far it appears, however, that the phone line I'd have to install would run me about $35/mo after taxes and the Internet about $65/mo which means I'd have to deduct $100/mo from my cabin budget which i don't like...but the freedom to work from the cabin while there might make it well worth the funds since I'd probably save a lot in fuel costs by not having to travel back and forth so much.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on June 06, 2013, 10:02:46 AM
Eric have you checked on Dish Net.  Have a friend to just recently had it installed and likes it.  The price I think was lower than Hughs.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 06, 2013, 10:14:22 AM
Quote from: Redoverfarm on June 06, 2013, 10:02:46 AM
Eric have you checked on Dish Net.  Have a friend to just recently had it installed and likes it.  The price I think was lower than Hughs.

Never heard of them (other then their TV service) so will have to compare the two.  Looks like they have similar plans.

Frankly I'm not thrilled with the idea of using sat internet because of it's format.  It's compression (ala old modem dialup days) that allows them to get the higher speeds/bandwidth but when you run a VPN which I do for work, you get a LOT less speed (about 1/4th or less) because they can't compress the VPN -- and some VPN's just don't work over satellite.  However, having said all that, I CAN check my work email via satellite internet without the VPN and if I did things right I could probably download what I needed to after hours (or early in the AM) to reduce the headaches....then with a phone I can do my conference calls so perhaps it wouldn't be too bad.

The real issue is that they require two year contracts which I detest.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 07, 2013, 09:23:08 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0438541x640_zps21b29c38.jpg)
Thanks to another CP member I bought plans for Adirondack chairs and made one :)  I couldn't find the templates online (full size ones) so had to freehand the curves and missed one pretty badly (upper back support) so I'll have to rework that but otherwise I'm pretty happy so far :)

I plan to mill up some 1" pine to make more of these so we'll have plenty at the cabin for relaxing on our deck (that we hope to have some day).
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on June 07, 2013, 09:33:49 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on May 29, 2013, 11:37:14 AM
.....thinking of using this foam board insulation which is R10 in the 2" type.  I can cut and place inside the box I've made for the water heater ......
Thoughts?

??? susceptible to damage from high heat  ???   
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on June 08, 2013, 12:47:46 AM
OJ Our Exede is quicker than Hughes Enterprise that I was telling you the neighbor has. 

Exede is so far not over marketing their band width like the some of the others did / do.  So it is fairly quick.  I really am not all that shocked and disappointed   I do not like the idea of having to stay up late to do any 'heavy lifting' to keep my usage cost down.  I admit I do do so to escape running out of fast or quick internet and keep from being throttled down or buy more usage.

I think however if you got settled in to it you could make it work.  But I am like you VPN would not be doable in less  ???  I am going to throw this out there.  Our internet when we had a house.... well a rural house with no DSL or Cable.  But there were two companies that did internet over radio and these sort of small weird looking receivers that were usually some sort eve mount usually they were not dish type receivers. 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 08, 2013, 01:47:40 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on June 07, 2013, 09:33:49 PM
??? susceptible to damage from high heat  ???

Yes but I think I have the clearance and can cover with drywall -- or hardybacker.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: troy on June 09, 2013, 08:03:16 PM
Eric,

Have you checked with the PUD to see when/if wireless service will be available to where you're at?  It doesn't look like they're moving very fast, but that's typical of government (speaking from first hand experience).

Perhaps there are other options you can explore with local service providers.

If nothing else, find some neighbors who want service too, hire me, and I'll come out there and build a competing WISP.  I'm not 100% familiar with the area (grew up in Snohomish and lived in Grant for a few years), but I'm sure enough suitable private property can be found to build a private network that might even turn a decent profit.

I'd love to move up there... if only I had the money and the courage to walk away from my current life in VA.

-Troy

PS: Oh yeah.. and your rural broadband question was enough to get me out of lurking mode myself... been admiring your build for a while now.  Completely jealous of the area, the trees, and the peace and quiet I can only imagine.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 10, 2013, 12:21:19 AM
LOL Troy, I built networks for a living -- big ones :)  My biggest was Minneapolis St. Paul I think unless you count Richmon, Norfolk, a lot of Pennsylvania and parts of Jersy....10,000 T1's before we moved into Ethernet and mostly over MW fed by fiber rings.....I could set up a tower to shoot MW to the tower on the mountain south of me and hop from there into Omak and pick up a nice fat pipe back to Seattle if I could afford it! lol

But where our cabin is there just isn't enough people around to warrant it!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 10, 2013, 12:22:54 AM
Needs stain underneath still and in a few other spots
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0440534x640_zpsa3f70bc3.jpg)

and needs varathane and an ottoman
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0441507x640_zps6c492fb4.jpg)

But my wife is loving it :)
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0443494x640_zpse3c5157c.jpg)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 10, 2013, 06:25:30 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0446519x640_zpsfff6f4ca.jpg)
A shot of the chair now that I've fixed the upper back support that was causing me some trouble.  If you notice between the earlier picture and this one that the slats on the back are spread wider and better now it's not an allusion! :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0450582x640_zps75a53edd.jpg)
Getting some more stain

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0451640x633_zpsb9ec898e.jpg)
I'll admit that I'm really happy with this chair!  I have some changes I'll make to new ones but this is the very first piece of furniture I've ever made!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0452640x580_zpsca25c242.jpg)
Once it dries I'll varathane it and then get to work on the rest of them :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: troy on June 12, 2013, 09:54:40 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on June 10, 2013, 12:21:19 AM
LOL Troy, I built networks for a living -- big ones :)  My biggest was Minneapolis St. Paul I think unless you count Richmon, Norfolk, a lot of Pennsylvania and parts of Jersy....10,000 T1's before we moved into Ethernet and mostly over MW fed by fiber rings.....I could set up a tower to shoot MW to the tower on the mountain south of me and hop from there into Omak and pick up a nice fat pipe back to Seattle if I could afford it! lol

But where our cabin is there just isn't enough people around to warrant it!

I hear you on the people thing... our mountains are different from yours, we have people living in every hollow and other hard to reach places, but not enough to get cable or dsl.  Cell phones barely work out there, so forget 3g/4g.  Even with public money and grants, getting broadband into the sticks is a real challenge, and many folks don't understand why they'd have to pay for construction to get service to their particular hollow with 4 neighbors.

If you have a shot to a tower that has a shot to omak, it might be worth it to not have to deal with the outrageous latency and expense of satellite service.

Anyways, great build.  I learned a lot from reading through it.  When I get there myself, I think a saw mill would be one of my first major purchases... right after a small backhoe (since I'll have to excavate a basement/foundation before I get to framing and finishing).
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 13, 2013, 08:46:22 AM
Ya in our area it wouldn't be worth it as the cost is too much.  Heck the tower space rental would be killer.

As for the backhoe, I'd love to have one!  But I can rent a trackhoe for about $300 for 8 hours and that usually is enough to do whatever I need at the time.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on June 13, 2013, 09:02:58 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on June 13, 2013, 08:46:22 AM
Ya in our area it wouldn't be worth it as the cost is too much.  Heck the tower space rental would be killer.

As for the backhoe, I'd love to have one!  But I can rent a trackhoe for about $300 for 8 hours and that usually is enough to do whatever I need at the time.

Eric you might check around in the future and pick you up a 3-Point hitch backhoe for your tractor.  Mind you it will not do major things (most of which you already have done) but it still would come in handy.  I had a backhoe and sold it and upgraded for a 4WD tractor.  I needed to plow worse than dig.  I still have jobs every so often that I could use it for but end up contracting it out.  [shocked].  Eventually I will find one to use with the tractor and eliminate the middleman so to speak.  But my plate is full now so it will have to wait.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 18, 2013, 09:36:12 AM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0510640x619_zps620f08b4.jpg)
There is my latest pic :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0529640x480_zps9ae355ee.jpg)
The second chair ready for varathane

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0533640x562_zps53ea6974.jpg)
Something about this style of chair that I love -- and the wood.  My wife and I love pretty much anything made from wood.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0534640x480_zps7dee5791.jpg)
Soon the ottomans will be done and a little table, then we can enjoy coffee in the morning right here :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 25, 2013, 08:58:56 AM
Wow!  What a weekend!

My wife and I celebrated our 7th Wedding Anniversary at our cabin in the woods by taking our sawmill to a 'Forest Owners Field Day' (we missed our fellow CountryPlans Forumites but maybe next time!) where we met lots of land owners in the area (and some from other areas who drive over for the event from the coast).  Here are a series of pics of the event which was held on a 1000 acre ranch I called the 'Dream Ranch' (owned by a retired forester and his wife).

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Portable%20Sawmill/IMG_1059640x360_zps5f0dbb55.jpg)
The 'Log Deck' was mostly 'firewood' logs but we could mill up most of them for a customer it just takes longer to mill small logs and those with stress in them.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Portable%20Sawmill/IMG_1060640x360_zps4f1383e1.jpg)
The first log was an old Tamarack (Larch) that was very bushy and VERY hard!  It was like milling hardwood!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Portable%20Sawmill/IMG_1062640x360_zpsdc43cf50.jpg)
The beauty of the setting was very striking.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Portable%20Sawmill/IMG_1074640x360_zps069850fc.jpg)
Once fully set up we set to making rough cut 2x's

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Portable%20Sawmill/IMG_1075640x360_zpsae83620b.jpg)
We milled all of this stock 'on the evens' which means the 2x6's from this log were really 1 7/8" x 6".  We can mill them at 2" even but often do it this way as it's faster for the customer (on the evens means on the even whole numbers on the scale (2,4,6 etc)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Portable%20Sawmill/IMG_1081640x360_zps3b769aa7.jpg)
Another shot of the setup -- tractor was the land owners who was hoping to get some 2x stock for making fences to keep his cows off some water ways.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Portable%20Sawmill/IMG_1082640x360_zps7c87b61d.jpg)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Portable%20Sawmill/IMG_1083640x360_zpse54eb8e1.jpg)
This log was felled during the 'falling' course of the field day and they thought it would be a great log but it was pretty stressed so we bucked it off at 8 feet and milled it shorter.  Bent logs have stress in them that will make the lumber warp and twist.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Portable%20Sawmill/IMG_1084640x360_zps4f239518.jpg)
Josh (step son) relaxing in the shade while waiting to mill.  We spent a lot of the day relaxing as there were classes going on near us.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Portable%20Sawmill/IMG_1093640x360_zpse9e1470c.jpg)
Some of the bigger logs require a lot of messing around to get set up.  This 98bf log took us just under and hour to mill.  Then we milled 184bf in an hour :)  It works out in the end.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Portable%20Sawmill/IMG_1108640x360_zps920aa4f7.jpg)
Whittling down the bigger logs is sometimes required.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/Portable%20Sawmill/IMG_1112640x360_zps700b77b9.jpg)
In the end we milled just 3 logs during the field day demonstrating the mill but then the land owner hired us for a couple hours to mill a few more up for him so he could get more 2x stock for his pens.  He's planning on having us back to mill the rest of the log deck an some more logs he's thinking of dragging down.  Of course our rates are so low right now you can barely get your lawn mowed for what we charge! lol so of course he's thinking of having us back! (note: our ridiculously cheap rates end after the summer!)


Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 25, 2013, 09:22:11 AM
All that from a chainsaw mill we started with and an idea to make lumber for our cabin ourselves!

We arrived at the cabin late Thursday night and as always we were happy to have the cabin so far along!  Just open the porch, flick on the inverter and the porch light comes on with it :)  I leave the porch light on but turn off the inverter just for these late arrivals so as soon as the power goes on the light does too :)  Then we moved in and relaxed :)

Friday morning we burned some slash before having to put it out and head over to set up the mill
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0561640x480_zps650693e4.jpg)

Having a tractor makes putting out slash piles a synch :)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/IMG_1118640x480_zps9b93bada.jpg)
On Sunday we began doing a little tractor work which turned into a full fledged day long effort to get rid of some rocks and grade some of the property.  We were on a major cleaning kick (was needed)

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0578640x480_zps4730c531.jpg)
We dug up rock after rock and used the tractor to move the big ones into place along 'Darci's Wall' (my wifes rock wall) and my son and wife moved the small ones by hand.  We spent about 4 hours on this section and couldn't believe the difference!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0579640x480_zpscee89f47.jpg)
Once graded and with the rocks either removed or burried we ran an ATV over it with a chainlink fence section with some logs on top of it to rake it out.  It was VERY smooth!  I think that's because my step son liked riding the ATV too much! lol

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0580640x480_zps36cc5f74.jpg)
Then my wife decided to plan cereal rye on it because the rye is supposed to be weed control and will help 'fix' the soil as well as with water retention.  Not to mention you can harvest the rye seed and make flour out of it and the animals like the straw.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0582640x480_zpsf6541970.jpg)
Once we have this covered with grass it will make a very nice place to relax!  Of course, we plan to have ALL of the land around the cabin done like this.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0602640x480_zpsebbdb527.jpg)
Just behind the stacks of lumber we milled in the spring.  It's not as smooth as the section in front of the lumber but still very nice.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0604640x480_zps4935a922.jpg)
Once a replacement shed is finished then we'll get rid of this one (which was poorly constructed by the previous owner and is rat infested) and clean all that up also.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0606480x640_zps5af2145e.jpg)
Darci's wall

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0611640x480_zps1a1bd079.jpg)
Our little orchard is overgrown!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0624640x480_zps15d0d008.jpg)
We never finished burning the slash pile but you can see we cleaned up a lot of the area it was in also.  Now we plan to move this pile over to a low section that we want to fill in a bit and then we'll let it compost.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0631640x480_zpsfb712318.jpg)
Cleanup has been a big thing for me this year and I was glad to get so much done!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0632640x480_zpsfd55d29d.jpg)
Can't say enough about how much we love the place :)  Now I need to get cracking on some exterior finish work and some small roofing jobs (porch, wood shed, composter etc) as well as a new tool shed so I can get rid of the crappy one the previous owner built.

Perhaps I'll make a run out to mill up some Fir beams for the foundation of the new shed.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on June 25, 2013, 11:27:33 AM
Did you get much interest in your custom saw milling? 

Wow your place sure shined up nice!  Looks like you and the tractor are making friends.   ;)

   
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 25, 2013, 12:05:58 PM
I think we picked up about a half dozen jobs:)  We were a VERY popular part of the event though we were a side show and not one of the 'classes'.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 25, 2013, 12:07:03 PM
Oh and yes, the tractor and I are very CLOSE! :D :D :D  I love that big monster!  Can't say enough how awesome it is :)

Also can't wait to get my post hole digger / auger and back blade / plow blade.  Hoping to pick up a landscape rake too :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 26, 2013, 08:49:10 AM
It's a 'done deal'! :D  I'm going back the weekend of the 4th.

My plan from here on out is to drop at least one tree (Fir) each trip and buck it into saw logs and drag it over to the log deck area for the sawmill.  Then to carry on with the various other projects I have going.

For the 4th I'm planning to drop a nice big Doug Fir, then to work on the exterior of the cabin to try to get the window trim finished, batten boards put up and to work on the porch and a new set of stairs.

With luck I can get all of those things done :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 28, 2013, 11:06:37 AM
very excited!  I think I just scored a jointer planer!

A friend has been going through his father stuff (he passed away last year) and asked if I was interested in buying some wood working tools -- he doesn't do any wood working.  Seems he had an old craftsman jointer planer that is working and in good shape so I'll buy that from him (saves him from putting it on CL too) and possibly a scroll saw and a few other odds and sods.

I'm excited about the planer because I make my own lumber and it will be nice to be able to square it up!  I can edge it on the sawmill to take out any warping etc but getting a perfect 90 degree edge isn't going to happen on a sawmill.  Normally I have to use the table saw to do that and it isn't the best way either.  This gives me a way to square things up.

He also has a belt sander (bench mount type) but I'm not certain how much I'd use it.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 29, 2013, 08:47:06 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VQdz-GF1r4Q&feature=youtu.be
My Mahindra vs a Rock ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 02, 2013, 12:12:11 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/IMG_0655640x509_zps25520b62.jpg)
Got back to working on my chairs :)  2 coats of varathane on the Ottomans and 3 on the closer chair.  Once all of them have 4 coats I'll start working on making it thicker with clear.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/IMG_0661640x602_zpsac37f4f5.jpg)
I intend to make a few sets of these to have at the cabin on the deck which I hope to make one of these dart days!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/IMG_0667501x640_zps843ff340.jpg)
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/IMG_0668480x640_zps6dd17ad8.jpg)

Just got the details on my dart sales today :D  Looks like I should be getting a check for enough to buy a back blade and auger but not quite enough to get the rake I want also -- though I might go ahead and pay for it too in order to get a good deal.  Once I have the auger I'll put it to work right away digging holes for sono tubes to start the foundation for the deck.  I've got concrete for them already so it should be a matter of digging the holes with the tractor, dropping in the tubes, leveling off and then filling with concrete and placing simpson posts in.  Then I can frame up the deck in front of the porch and build a new set of stairs.

Meanwhile I'll also be able to rake the property and start to get all the debris that's laying around pulled/raked/pushed into burn piles for the winter and of course, with the back blade I'll be able to plow the snow better in the winter :)

I have to admit I'm really 'jonesing' for a cabin trip!  I need to get back to work on the exterior so that's the plan for my birthday (12th).  I'll go up as early as I can on Friday with hopes of at least getting something done in the evening, then will spend Saturday and Sunday ripping down rough cut pine and installing it as batten boards as well as using the dado to cut it for the window trim.  I'm really hopeful to get most if not all of it done since I have plenty of stock now.

If I can get that done on this next trip then I think I should be set to get the auger up there later in July so I can start on the deck though I also need to dig out the foundation I want to start as well as get the concrete and rebar for that and all the cinder blocks...with luck I can have that deck built by October.....who knows though!

Finally, with the heat coming on now I NEED to get to the cabin and mow so I'll try to get some mowing in next trip too.  If it gets hot and dry I may even do some grading to build some fire breaks (roads) along the fence-line and perhaps the driveway itself.  I know it isn't much but it's better then nothing right?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Carla_M on July 05, 2013, 05:21:41 PM
No images, or at least no images photobucket will let us see. :(     bandwidth issue. I have no idea if that shows up foir the thread author or only the rest of the world.
(open another PB account using another email?  Worked for me)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Yonderosa on July 05, 2013, 05:38:03 PM
No pictures for me either
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 05, 2013, 06:24:35 PM
First time this has happened to me.

Guess I pushed the bandwidth too hard...have to delete some stuff i guess! lol
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on July 05, 2013, 07:05:55 PM
I too have more than one PB account. Done with gmail email accounts and no bandwidth issues on them.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 08, 2013, 02:48:36 PM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Erikafter50lbs_zps01f72d45.jpg)
So I probably haven't mentioned my quest to lose 75lbs or more to the forum but thought I would share this striking picture with you today :)

On the left was take in October of last year and I weighed 282lbs (getting ready for an interview) while on the right I was at a nephews wedding (my step daughter is in the pic with me) and weighed in at 230.8lbs

It's taken me about 8 months (started in earnest in December) to lose the weight and has been a combination of changing my diet as well as LOTS of cardio (I road my mountain bike 14.3miles today for example).

Here's one of my honey and I:)
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/IMG_1150573x640_zps2e0f7fba.jpg)

I hope to lose another 25 pounds in the next 2 months (or less) and have averaged 7.5lbs per month over the long haul.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: kenhill on July 08, 2013, 04:17:54 PM
Good job.  I'm sure it was a challenge and you seem to have met it head on!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 08, 2013, 04:20:17 PM
Thanks Ken :)  Still is a challenge but I refuse to stop! :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: UK4X4 on July 09, 2013, 11:15:52 AM
Thats some great work on the yard- and your belly !

it will surely add some years to your life, lessen the strain on your heart, knee's,hips and ankles

Awsome job !

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 10, 2013, 12:17:06 PM
Thanks UK :)

I'm getting ready for my next trip (mentally anyway) and plan to work on the exterior the whole 3 day weekend :)  I'm hoping to finally get the batten boards done and the windows trimmed out....can't wait!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 15, 2013, 10:18:49 AM
(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0751640x480_zps5a91d18d.jpg)
We arrived a little after noon on Friday and temps were in the 70's so it was a great time to start work as soon as we looked around and settled in.

I fell a big doug fir that was blocking the panels in the morning and had split into two main branches (trunks) rather then one.  I was able to get 3 decent saw logs out of it which we took to the mill landing and the rest we set aside for firewood.  I also fell a pine that was blocking the panels in the am also and bucked it into firewood as it wasn't big enough for the mill.

That done we got the tractor set up for mowing and my buddy took off to start brush hogging the property.  Over the weekend he mowed close to 10 acres (maybe more) and taught me how to mow the steepest sections (in reverse).  I was amazed at how easily the tractor would go up the hillside backwards though admittedly I needed a seatbelt to keep from sliding forward!  It was STEEP!

Saw a badger run for cover during one of my mowing trips.  He was a monster too!  BIG!  Nice silver and black coat too.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0708640x480_zps29680430.jpg)
Our biggest apple seems to be quite happy :)  We pushed the fencing up last month and it appears we will need to do that AGAIN!

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0719640x480_zps5ad01185.jpg)
If you look very hard you will see the Cereal Rye!  It didn't take nearly as well as I'd hoped but I know why and next year we will fix that ;)  It's all about WHEN you plant it.  This years crop will be left to reseed itself after harvesting a handful of see just to see how hard it will be to do by hand.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0697640x480_zps23c0708c.jpg)
This is also rye that my wife and I planted after working on the land to clean it up.  In the spring it ought to overtake all other grasses (and weeds etc) and be good for the soil (as well as birds etc).

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0695640x480_zps790865ad.jpg)
The rye in front of the panels has done well also.  Now we have to see how it does in drought conditions as it's not likely to get much water until the fall now.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0713640x480_zps0ecb02a6.jpg)
What amazes me here is the flowers and growth in the foreground.  This is inside the orchard and was bear ground in April.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0742640x582_zpsea6145d9.jpg)
My main focus this trip was to get the battens up and trim out the windows.  I was unable to complete the lower level but should be able to do so next trip.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0736640x480_zpse53eaca5.jpg)
The hard part is ripping the stock down to 3" for the battens or 3.5" for the trim.  All my stock is self made (milled on our portable mill) and of different sizes (rough) so you have to then 'finish' it to the dimension you want.

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0737640x4802_zps746e6050.jpg)
Once you've ripped the window trim down to size then you have to change to the dado blade on the table saw to dado out the overlap -- the trim overlaps the T1-11 Rough Sawn siding about 1/2".

(https://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af102/emcvay/Cabin/IMG_0740640x480_zps6e843c6c.jpg)
After fitting I then coat the overlapping section of the trim with silicone sealer for window trim and nail in place.  This way all the windows are trimmed out and sealed well.





Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 15, 2013, 10:29:46 AM
Next trip (in three weeks) will be to finish the lower section battens and window trim and maybe get some staining done as well as fall another big fir.  I figure I've got enough fir down to give me about 15-18 2x6's for the deck and the next will give me about 24 (or more) so I'd have enough to get the deck framed in (I have quite a bit of stock now also) and the floor down.

My hope is that I can have everything ready for the deck and stairs etc when my son returns in the fall.  He's been working in construction this spring and summer and has learned a bunch so I plan to put that knowledge to work! :D  He told me:  "Dad, I got the job because of all you taught me and now I'm learning a lot more!"

It's good to be a dad :D  [cool]
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 15, 2013, 04:59:22 PM
Whoohoo!  Just bought 1000' of direct bury 18/2 wire for my cistern float valve!  I should be able to install it this summer and set it up to keep the cistern full at all times now!  That would mean the orchard can be watered better in the hot dry season and the cistern will always be ready to provide us water at the cabin :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 15, 2013, 07:07:50 PM
Looks like I'll be trying to get the float valve installed next trip too :)  Getting pretty stoked!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 20, 2013, 03:09:08 PM
ordered my 'Delta Rib XL ASC' roofing and accompanying parts today :)  $158 after taxes (which begs the question:  why did I wait?).

So I'm excited to get that done also except it looks like I'll be milling on the 3rd of August so might not get a lot of cabin work done
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 22, 2013, 04:50:57 PM
Score!

I'm down at my parents helping out for a week (working from their house so I can help out in the evenings and my step son can help out during the day) and my dad (step) asks me:  can you use a cement mixer?

YES!!!  it's not too big and not too old either and will fit in the back of the truck so will be easy to take home :)  I needed one for mixing cement at the cabin when I begin improving the foundation :)

A little later while chatting about wood working I ask if he has a bit brace...next think I know I've got one I'm taking home now too!  it was his fathers which dates it about 80 years old or more and still works :)  I've been looking for one for a long time and never thought to ask.

Gotta admit I'm pretty stoked about that!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on July 22, 2013, 05:28:11 PM
 [cool]  Some of those old braces used rosewood on the head and handle.  They are a great tool for around the farmstead.  New auger bits are readily available in a number of places though sort of spendy.  But don't over look pawn shops and used tool stores!   
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 23, 2013, 10:38:58 AM
Quote from: rick91351 on July 22, 2013, 05:28:11 PM
[cool]  Some of those old braces used rosewood on the head and handle.  They are a great tool for around the farmstead.  New auger bits are readily available in a number of places though sort of spendy.  But don't over look pawn shops and used tool stores!   

Amazingly (or not so) he even had the ORIGINAL box of bits too!  I'm going to have to picture this set to show off :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 29, 2013, 10:10:36 AM
Grrr....time to open a new photobucket account.

So this weekend of working on the cabin has changed to a weekend of milling (hazards of having a portable milling company). 

We'll be staying at the cabin but will be milling in Okanogan.

So I'll have to schedule extra trips in September now.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on July 29, 2013, 10:24:08 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on July 29, 2013, 10:10:36 AM
Grrr....time to open a new photobucket account.

So this weekend of working on the cabin has changed to a weekend of milling (hazards of having a portable milling company). 

We'll be staying at the cabin but will be milling in Okanogan.

So I'll have to schedule extra trips in September now.

I rented more space at photobucket...... [waiting]  Funny how it all adds up.......  Now I am looking at a different camera.   ???  Most likely then will have to add more space.   

OH NO!! NOT EXTRA TRIPS!!  [cool]  Glad to see you are getting some work for the portable mill.  If you can get the price point right everyone can be a winner.  How far is it from Okanogan to the cabin?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 29, 2013, 10:34:10 AM
Price right now is $55/hr which is cheaper then ANY AND ALL other millers ;)

Only that price won't last long (into August only) -- we're doing it as a promo to help get the business going.  Most charge $85 or more an hour.

Okanogan is on the way (since we're in Okanogan County) and about 60 miles from the cabin.  We'll drop the mill off on the way up and get it set up first, then head to the cabin to crash for the night.  Return in the early AM and mill all day and then return to the cabin.

probably pick the mill up on the way back as we may mill Sunday too depending on how things go.  This customer wants a tree dropped and some logs dragged to the mill too.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 29, 2013, 10:37:27 AM
New account started:)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 29, 2013, 11:11:07 AM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Tools/IMG_0785482x640_zpsee41e45a.jpg)
My 'new' Bit Brace and bits.  My Step dad believes his father bought this in 1925 when he rebuilt their barn.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Tools/IMG_0787633x640_zpsde2f0b17.jpg)
Notice the bits are all still there!

It amazes me that it's all still here and I have to admit that I'd rather frame it then use it!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 02, 2013, 12:31:05 AM
WOW!  I might get a chance to actually LIVE at our cabin! :d

Not much to tell yet and it's LATE so I'm off to bed but I have an interview Monday for a Supervisors position not far from our property (actually several towns in the area)!

If I get the position which, unless my current contract prevents it (non-compete clauses and stuff but I think I'm ok)  seems very possible, then I'd be moving up to the property TO LIVE! :D  OK, I'd be alone most of the time since my wife is a manager at the Macy's here and there is no Macy's near the property but we figure I drive twice a month to the cabin anyway so could just as easily drive twice a month to home instead and we're old enough to do that for a while (maybe a year or two) without much trouble.
The potential for the future is much better then working as a contractor like I am now and it would both get me back into management and get me LOTS of time to be at the cabin :D

Pretty excited!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on August 02, 2013, 07:33:23 AM
Hey that is great news other than being a way from each other sort of is a bummer.  We used to have those deals once in a while.   But then  ??? you do not have as many disagreements.   ;D  And when you do get back together for a little time  :D  Just a personal observation.   
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rugger8 on August 02, 2013, 03:28:19 PM
Best of luck with the new opportunity!  Hope it works out for you! 

Separately, how quickly do you have to mill wood?  The park at the end of my street has some 200+ year old oaks that were felled by hurricane Sandy last October.  Alot seem to be splitting already, but the biggest one is still all intact.  Wonder if it makes sense to try and get some boards off of her with a chainsaw mill.  What do you think?

Jeff
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 04, 2013, 11:58:06 PM
Quote from: rugger8 on August 02, 2013, 03:28:19 PM
Best of luck with the new opportunity!  Hope it works out for you! 

Separately, how quickly do you have to mill wood?  The park at the end of my street has some 200+ year old oaks that were felled by hurricane Sandy last October.  Alot seem to be splitting already, but the biggest one is still all intact.  Wonder if it makes sense to try and get some boards off of her with a chainsaw mill.  What do you think?

Jeff

You can mill stuff that's older, in fact some guys mill really old stuff.  If it's cracking and checking get some end sealer and paint it on to help reduce that.  Then mill as soon as you can.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Tickhill on August 05, 2013, 04:26:43 AM
Good luck on the job! I know it would be a dream come true. But it would require more postings!!!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 05, 2013, 09:53:42 AM
Thanks :)  First 'real' interview is today at 11:30am -- I'll let you all know how it goes!

Meanwhile I'm looking at this: http://www.theinverterstore.com/3000-watt-pure-sine-wave-inverter.html#
I've been using their 2500watt Modified inverter for 2 years now with no problems (and for the money it's awesome) and figure if I'm going to be living at the cabin I'll need pure sine to ensure no problems with the various things I'll need to run.  After all, those long winter nights will require some TV, computer time and a fridge and stove that will always work (don't want the mod sine to do any more damage -- my stove clock is fried and I'm sure it's the modified sine).

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0829640x493_zps9c8f42b1.jpg)
My son and I got to the cabin on Friday to mill for a customer 50 miles south of us but finished the milling job Saturday so we were able to get the porch roof done!  This has been two years in the waiting and for the price should have been done RIGHT away!  Heck it was under $150 for the roofing -- why the heck did I wait??

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0833640x480_zps7bf380ca.jpg)
I've wanted to get that roof done for a long time and the prospect of living there has spurred me into high gear :D  The roof on the porch protects the solar power and I darn sure want it protected!  Next I'll have to complete the insulation on the porch as well as interior paneling and a porch in front of it (open deck style with roof) then install an air vent with a fan to provide a little heat in there in the winter months because I'll want max capacity out of those batteries.  I'll also have to get that generator tuned up and installed right next to the porch under a roof so I can start it when I get home from work (assuming that becomes a need) on cloudy days.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0825475x640_zps4a907570.jpg)
While there I always inspect the orchard and WOW!  This tree is two feet taller I swear!

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0824640x480_zpscb689634.jpg)
One of our newest trees, a pear, is surviving but it's not as prolific as the apples.  Not sure why.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0821480x640_zpsda770a73.jpg)
I thought I killed this guy last year but it has two new branches growing out of the base of the tree and while the leaves on top have either been eaten or just died it's otherwise looking healthy.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0811640x480_zpsf6c79f69.jpg)
The rye has survived so far and the upper 2 acres has at least 1/2 to 3/4 of an acre that is taking well.  The rest we'll have to wait and see.

If I get the job I'll have my hands full as I'll need to get the water plumbed in from the cistern (installing 2" main to near the cabin and then 1" into the cabin) as well as a phone line, float valve for cistern and enclosure that's insulated and heated for the composting toilet.  But I think it can all be done in the evenings and on weekends if living there :)

I'll install a TV antenna and 32-36" LCD TV to give me some evening entertainment, Satellite internet and a car stereo for a radio :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 05, 2013, 01:23:51 PM
Waiting for my interview to start and I'm DYING!  It's a phone interview (a lot of them are for the first 1 or 2) and if it goes well I'll be off to have lunch with the Manager.  Then, if I get hired I'll be in a panic! lol

I would have to (and in no particular order):

1. Get pure sine inverter/charger and install
2.  Service generator and build permanent 'dog house' for it by the porch
3.  Build a new composting toilet and water drain/inlet 'room' and insulate to protect from winter cold
4.  build an insulated duct from by the wood stove to the composter closet and install fan to draw warm air to closet
5.  Trench in 2 water main pipe.
6.  Trench in phone line from PED to cabin (maybe 1/4 mile) and get address and phone
7.  Get internet! (sat only there)
8.  Bring all tools etc to cabin
9.  stock cabin better and clean out all crap etc to make it more liveable (maybe get second 'shed tent' to store stuff until tool shed is built).
10.  Finish exterior completely (roofing etc)
11.  Start on foundation and deck

And more I'm sure!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 05, 2013, 04:40:48 PM
Interview done....now I wait....I hate waiting!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: UK4X4 on August 05, 2013, 06:00:33 PM
If you can have phone why no internet ?

speeds on dial up V's reasonable priced SAT are pretty similar


oh and good luck on the job !
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 05, 2013, 07:23:11 PM
Quote from: UK4X4 on August 05, 2013, 06:00:33 PM
If you can have phone why no internet ?

speeds on dial up V's reasonable priced SAT are pretty similar


oh and good luck on the job !

Unless dialup has significantly changed since I last used it (years) I've never known it to reach 1.5mbps.  Satellite will work reasonably well I think since I won't be at the cabin that much (not like today where I work from home).

Heck, even to get phone I have to trench about 1/4 mile of direct bury cable from the PED to the cabin -- too bad the telecom I'd be working for isn't the local provider! lol
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 06, 2013, 10:10:31 AM
http://www.ec-securehost.com/positiveenergyconservationprod./VENTILATION.html#PERAP124
As I ponder all of my challenges with possibly living at my cabin soon I came across this site.  I was looking for venting options for my porch.  Basically I'm thinking of putting in two vents, one high, one low, to allow heat to flow freely from the cabin into the porch when the wood stove is running, or from the porch into the cabin when it's not (green house effect in the porch often makes it very warm during the day even in freezing weather).
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 06, 2013, 10:23:53 AM
Quote3.  Build a new composting toilet and water drain/inlet 'room' and insulate to protect from winter cold
4.  build an insulated duct from by the wood stove to the composter closet and install fan to draw warm air to closet

So this has me thinking a lot as I'd have to have the composting toilet ALWAYS working and my water system stay thawed in the coldest of climates.  Up to this point we haven't done that or had to worry about it as there are always work arounds for temp use.

My thoughts are this:

1.  Tear down the old compost 'hut' and build a bigger one that's fully insulated if not 'super insulated'.
2.  Run 6" insulated duct through insulated duct run from behind wood stove to the composter hut and supply 12vdc fan to draw air from the cabin into compost hut.
3.  Relocate hot water heater into hut or build hut to enclose hot water heater at current location (which has added benefit of increasing air flow in the hut through the vent in the bathroom).
4.  Install RV heater in wall of compost hut and set to 50 degrees to provide back up protection during the night when the cabin cools (because I'm sleeping and not stoking the fire).

This would also give me a means of keeping things from freezing when I leave for the weekend because I could leave the heater set to above freezing (so it isn't always running).

Thoughts?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 06, 2013, 02:39:42 PM
Interview TWO coming up!  I think this is getting serious!!!

They are moving FAST too which I would expect since they lost the last guy two weeks after hiring.  My suspicion is that I have the job barring unforseen circumstances -- in which case I have a LOT of work to do!

But can you imagine?  I'll be living AT my cabin now!  Might get a bit lonely at night since my wife will remain here at home (she's a manager at Macy's and we don't want her to stop that for some time yet) but we'll go back and forth to visit each other.

Anyway, time to investigate more of what I'll need to do!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 07, 2013, 07:40:15 PM
OK things are getting serious and I'm going into overdrive.  My current thinking is a two stage plan:

1.  Remove composting toilet system and build a new 'hut' as follows:

1st remove old system and replace old french cesspit with dry sump from Natural Home. https://www.thenaturalhome.com/drywellinstallation.htm
I'll have the excavator there so he can dig everything up and position a new spot for the drywell (which will be a more efficient system).

Dig out the area I hand dug previously and dig footings for a monolithic pour.  Install the steel/metal (and maybe insulation), pour concrete and let cure.  Then dry stack concrete cinder block walls to above ground level (approx 24") plus 1 or 2 courses.  Frame new room with 2x6 walls that will enclose the entire space including where the hot water heater is.  Re-install composting toilet and turn tank to better accommodate the space.  Then install Slim-Profile Direct-Vent Wall Heater 8000 BTU- Propane (http://www.ktonic.com/HouseWarmer-Slim-Profile-Direct-Vent-Wall-Heater-p/hwdv080dvp.htm) and connect to propane lines.  Set to come on at 50 degrees.  Insulate walls with R21 and roof with at least R21 if not R21 fiberglass insulation and R10 pink foam.  Install steel exterior door and locks.  Connect up everything and store composter bulking material in said room.

Oh and install 4" or 6" duct from behind the wood stove to the room and provide a 12vdc fan to draw warm air into the room for heating when the wood stove is running.  Insulate vent stacks and instal under eves and through roof.

2.  Install 2" water main from cistern to near cabin.  T off one 1 1/2" pipe to current frost free and install two 1"  spurs for future cabins.  T off 1" line to cabin and install water to cabin -- install 1" pipe to new frost free at orchard and one outside cabin.

3.  Trench in direct bury phone line to PED.

4.  Upgrade to pure sine wave inverter and 24vdc battery bank -- add 24vdc to 12vdc converter for 12v items

5.  Possibly purchase and install Generacs off-grid generator with an Auto Gen on switch and have the LP folks deliver a tank and install for me.

$$$$ will be required but the place would be MUCH more liveable in the middle of winter ;)

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 07, 2013, 08:11:50 PM
One thing I just realized is that the composter shed would not really need footings.  I could probably get away with a 4" thick pad -- maybe 6" at most -- because it wouldn't be part of the house.  It's just a shed.

As such it would reduce the cost of concrete needed!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 07, 2013, 11:41:37 PM
OK the wife has approved the Generac EcoGen off grid generator and auto start system as well as a pure sine wave inverter and TWO (not one but TWO) wall vent type LP heaters (1 8000 btu heater for the composter shed and 1 18,000BTU heater for the cabin).  The heaters are a combo of backup heat in case the wood stove goes out in extreme cold (it can get to -35 below though rarely does -- more likely to hit -10 to -20 during the coldest nights) or I leave for a long weekend in the winter and the cabin gets too cold for the fridge, freezer and canned goods.

I'm pretty excited about this as it means completing the cabin power system etc MUCH faster then originally planned and with the back up generator I won't have to worry about starting a generator when I get home from work in the dead of winter.  I'll just walk in and if it got too cool in the cabin the propane heater will have warmed it back up for me too!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 08, 2013, 12:59:31 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin_terrain_zps6defe7be.jpg)
Playing with sketchup today and while the terrain model isn't quite right it's close...just can't figure out how to excavate in it though.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Cabin_stacks_dish_etc_zpsa6c3f158.jpg)
Would have to move that generator up a little and put some brick around the back and outside to protect it from cows ;) and will have to put a roof over it so snow doesn't bury it coming off the roof.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 08, 2013, 02:11:40 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Cabin_withGenny_CompostShed_zps8405bfc3.jpg)
Last one for now :)

Fixed the terrain a little and moved the generator up a little to where it will most likely be.  Added the vent for the heater too.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 10, 2013, 01:50:31 PM
I've begun now to consider doing a double wall room for the composter room.  My thought is as follows:

1.  Pour floor (possibly insulate under it first)
2.  Build up dry stacked and surface bonded cinder block walls to above ground level
3.  Frame and sheet 2x6 exterior walls (R21 insulation) with no penetrations except where the vent for the heater will go.
4.  Build 2x4 interior wall (R13 insulation) and wire in void between two walls.
5.  Insulate interior side of exterior door.
6.  Frame and insulate double 2x4 walls under cabin to keep crawl space well insulated and place rigid foam on ground in crawl space to increase insulation in extreme cold.
7.  Double insulate duct passage from behind wood stove to crawl space and composter room.
8.  Roof composter with at least 2x8 rafters (I'm limited here because of placement and depending on depth of floor but think I might be able to use 2x10's if done right) and get R30 to R38 insulation in the ceiling.

My goal is to make the composter room and crawl space as well insulated as I can possibly make it so the heater doesn't have to actually run that much, just enough to raise the temp to above 50 degrees and then be able to maintain that without constantly running.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 10, 2013, 01:55:32 PM
Another consideration is that I'll have a generator backup and if I wire that into an AC panel I can then feed the room with a 120v receptacle and plug the composters dehydrator/heater into that as well as the inverter charger -- both on separate breakers/legs.

This way when the generator runs the composter AC fan and heater will also run which has the added benefit of helping keep it warm as well as rid the system of excess moisture.

I plan to install a dry sump instead of the standard french cesspit and will probably install a drain the floor of the room also.  This way should something go wrong and the composter drain plugs and backs up the waste water can go somewhere and the floor can be washed down and cleaned without worrying.  I'll probably have to paint the concrete with something too but that might have to wait.

One last benefit this room may or will have is that I could always put a 55 gallon water drum in the room with the RV pump setup I now have.  That way if something goes wrong with the water lines coming into the cabin from the cistern I'd have backup water and a heat sink in the room -- the 55 gallon drum of water will be warmed by the heater and will take a long time to lose it's heat so will provide the added benefit of a heat sink.   Something to ponder anyway :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on August 10, 2013, 02:17:57 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on August 10, 2013, 01:50:31 PM
I've begun now to consider doing a double wall room for the composter room.  My thought is as follows:

1.  Pour floor (possibly insulate under it first)

My goal is to make the composter room and crawl space as well insulated as I can possibly make it

Re: 1.    not possibly... Just do it

Re: the goal... use rigid foam. Single 2x4 framing for walls, sheath osb and apply rigid foam on the outside. The osb to offer fire resistance for foam or better yet apply type X sheetrock inside the framing with foam on exterior. Don't bother with batts in the framing cavities. Then screw furring strips into the studs and over the foam vertically and apply lap siding from your sawmill.

Ditto the roof; 2x4 is likely strong enough. Foam on top of osb, then another osb layer and the roofing material.


The heater may provide enough heat with just the pilot going.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 10, 2013, 02:30:49 PM
Not sure I understand -- let me try:

1.  2x4 walls (single not double)
2.  5/8" OSB exterior sheathing
3.  2" R12.9 Thermasheath 3 exterior foam sheathing on the OUTSIDE of the OSB
4.  Furring screwed through foam into OSB
5.  Lap Siding exterior
6.  NO insulation in the cavities (so an air pocket)
7.  Sheetrock interior

You think that's enough?  It's an R12.9 wall plus sheathing and drywall but why not include the R13 or R15 fiberglass also?

Re: the roof -- 2x4 on a 3x12 or 4x12 pitch would be too weak with the snow load without the steep 12x12 roof above dumping on it.  I'd think maybe 2x8 would be ok but pushing it.  Not sure I understand why an R12.9 would be enough?  Wouldn't something more like an R30 do better?

I like the idea of the pilot light keeping it warm enough!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 10, 2013, 02:47:11 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Brickwork640x430_zpsce99cb7a.jpg)
Looking at insulating techniques for the floor and cinder block walls has led me to think this is the way to go.  Basically put down some 6 mil (10mil if possible) plastic on the ground and cover with foam insulation (R10-R12.9) then place exterior foam (R12.9) on the outside of the cinder block walls to a level below glade down to the floor and below. 

Siding would have to go down below the insulation so I'm not sure how that's done to hide the insulation and still protect from bugs and water....but I'll do more research.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 10, 2013, 02:49:15 PM
And of course fill the voids with concrete and/or soil (I've read you only need to fill every 2nd or 3rd void depending on wall height, with concrete and the rest can actually be soil as long as it's sealed -- think thermal mass). 

I'm thinking that if I insulate the floor and walls well enough then I ought to be able to keep this room warm despite the exterior temps which can easily drop WELL below zero.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on August 10, 2013, 02:49:55 PM
Fiberglass batts offer the potential for more heat leakage in nooks and crannies for one thing. Rigid foam, seams taped and maybe caulked with the right material offer the most air IMpermeable insulation. Also seems to me that building multiple frameworks is more work.

1.  2x4 walls (single not double) [[simple to build and as long as extra thickness is not needed for something like a DWV pipe in a home wall for example, it is all that is needed.]]
2.  5/8" OSB exterior sheathing  [[1/2" is enough]]
3.  2" R12.9 Thermasheath 3 exterior foam sheathing on the OUTSIDE of the OSB [[2 layers, seams staggered offers greater ease of air tight sealing.]]
4.  Furring screwed through foam into OSB  [[NO, into the studs. Use Headlok screws. ]]
5.  Lap Siding exterior
6.  NO insulation in the cavities (so an air pocket) [[just because it's simpler to leave it out.]]


2" R12.9 Thermasheath......   their listed R-value includes an assigned R 2.77 value when using a 3/4" dead air space.  That is the theory; I am not certain it follows in actual real world practice in all cases. In a vented rain wall for example the air space is not sealed, not dead air.


FWIW, if I was building a new cabin/home now I would skip the insulation in the wall cavities altogether and go with multiple layers of exterior foam.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 10, 2013, 02:54:41 PM
OK I think I'm tracking.  So what you are advocating is 4" of foam exterior foam insulation (R20-R25.8).

So if the exterior foam was sealed/taped etc and the void was filled with R13 would that not be almost the same?  I ask because of cost.  Not that I can't afford the foam just always looking for ways to keep costs down.

2x4's are easier on me since I can turn all my 2x8's into 2x4's :D  and I can use all rough cuts (seeings I made them myself).

I guess I'm having a hard time with the voids -- seems like a lot of foam on the exterior.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 10, 2013, 03:00:36 PM
http://www.hgtvremodels.com/home-systems/foam-sheathing-on-exterior-walls/index.html
interesting short article.

Seems using the R12.9 on the outside of the wall sheathing, then furring and siding with lap siding while using fiberglass on the inside would work too. 

Using 2x4 walls has the added benefit of making it easier to solve the thick wall issue of installing a door because the 2x4 wall will be closer to the 2x6 door framing ;)

I'm planning on an exterior door with good gaskets and maybe even insulating the interior of it though that might be going overboard!

Using the foam in the crawl space would be much easier and doing it on the outside of the walls would be simple enough too -- and I wouldn't have to worry about weather.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on August 10, 2013, 03:04:21 PM
Plus the foam sheets remove the heat bridges the studs provide.

One layer of foam and some batts will work. The foam makes it a lot better. I have handled enough batts over the years to develop a personal fiberitch neurosis. My personal problem. ;D

If building a concrete block wall don't get caught up in the "need" to take advantage of thermal mass. In some ways it is overblown and in some ways can work against you. IE, if the mass is now cool and the space needs to be warmed the mass is a negative.  OTOH, once the space is warm and fossil fuel is being used to maintain the temperature, there should be no advantage to having more mass. Mass would be important to have if you were building a solar collector to provide heat for the composting space. 

Foam can be glued to the inside of the blocks. Foam can also be applied on the interior of the 2x4 framing and then sheetrocked for fire value.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: John Raabe on August 10, 2013, 03:57:36 PM
Ditto on the thermal mass. It acts as a flywheel and that can be a disadvantage in a cabin where you will be visiting occasionally and where you would like to bring the temp up quickly. If you are blessed with good sun during the heating season, the mass can then soak up heat when you can use it. But many places won't get enough sunlight. At my home in not-so-sunny WA the sunroom, with all its thermal mass, doesn't get comfortable as living space for about half the year. It never freezes, but you don't lay around in it when it's cloudy and 45-50º out there.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 10, 2013, 09:22:36 PM
Quote from: John Raabe on August 10, 2013, 03:57:36 PM
Ditto on the thermal mass. It acts as a flywheel and that can be a disadvantage in a cabin where you will be visiting occasionally and where you would like to bring the temp up quickly. If you are blessed with good sun during the heating season, the mass can then soak up heat when you can use it. But many places won't get enough sunlight. At my home in not-so-sunny WA the sunroom, with all its thermal mass, doesn't get comfortable as living space for about half the year. It never freezes, but you don't lay around in it when it's cloudy and 45-50º out there.

But this is about making it a place to live in.  I may be taking a position with a major Telco in the area and if so I'll be living full time at the cabin for a while -- 2-3 years possibly.  So the idea is to address the issues you don't have to when temporarily staying at the cabin.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on August 10, 2013, 10:11:38 PM
Re: thermal mass, flywheel effect, full time residence use........

IF the fuel source is something other than solar, I do not see any advantage to incorporating a thermal mass in the compost toilet collection drum chamber. Thermal mass is effective to temper the temperature swings with direct solar derived heating. If a fossil fuel is used (propane, nat. gas, kerosene, etc...) there is no advantage to having thermal mass. As long as the heater keeps heating the mass just sits there and contributes nothing. The propane heater in question will still automatically cycle on and off with more or less the same rhythm. Only adding insulation, slowing down the heat loss, will reduce fossil fuel use.

If OTOH, you had an air or liquid solar collector and were heating the mass during the sunny daytime, then the thermal mass could make a lot of sense. I'm just thinking of saving trouble, time and maybe some cash if the fuel used is fossil. At least I can not see any advantage in that scenario. Maybe I can't see the forest for the trees?

Unless you might add a solar collection unit at some date.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 10, 2013, 10:30:03 PM
Good point Don -- so in the cinder blocks put nothing?  Except the voids that must be filled?  This will be a surface bonded (dry stacked) wall.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 10, 2013, 10:33:10 PM
https://www.thenaturalhome.com/drystackblock.htm
This is what I planned on doing for my cinderblock walls.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on August 11, 2013, 09:44:15 AM
If going to the trouble, effort and expense to keep the poo warm, what about incorporating a warm place for the batteries?

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 11, 2013, 10:55:22 AM
Quote from: MountainDon on August 11, 2013, 09:44:15 AM
If going to the trouble, effort and expense to keep the poo warm, what about incorporating a warm place for the batteries?

That's part of the plan :)  First step is to fully insulate and complete the porch, then I'll add a covered 'deck/porch' in front of that and finally I'll put in some air vents, perhaps even with fans, to allow the wood stove to warm the porch in winter.  Not sure I'd do more though but with all the windows it's stayed 10 degrees warmer in the porch, in winter, then outside even without insulation.  SO I'm fairly certain with a little work insulating it I can keep it 50 degrees or so and the stove is more then capable of heating the added space :) 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on August 11, 2013, 11:20:21 AM
I was thinking along the lines of the batteries being in the compost bin area...
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 11, 2013, 12:13:41 PM
You know Don that would be a good idea.  I pondered that for a moment when I first started this exercise but then forgot about it.

It would free up the front porch complete and negate the need to warm it.  Only issue I can see if that I'd have to run an additional 16-18 feet of wire from the solar panels to the batteries but that shouldn't really matter since I'm just about 50 feet now and since I run about 60vdc rather then the 48vdc I calculated the run on I'm sure I have some fudge factor.

This would of course give me a LOT more room in the porch.

Hmmm to think about it for a few, after all, I'd have to run the AC wire from there to the panel which would be fine since it wasn't inside the walls anyway (goes from inside the wall down under the cabin over to the porch).  Only thing I can see that I would need to do would be to run AC to the porch but I could do that under the cabin easily enough and pop it up into the all that's not finished.

Of course then I would need a remote sensor for the charge controller and the batteries but that's not too much.

With the heater in the composter room it sure makes sense doesn't it?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on August 11, 2013, 12:36:51 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on August 11, 2013, 12:13:41 PM
With the heater in the composter room it sure makes sense doesn't it?

....more birds with one stone sort of thing   :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 11, 2013, 01:06:08 PM
Yep :)  Thanks Don, great idea!

I might have to add a couple feet to the room but perhaps not -- after all I could make a shelf to put the batteries on which would raise them off the floor and stack them two shelves high (4x4's ought to be strong enough with 2x6 flooring).  Would keep them from taking up too much room and ensure I get the most power out of them throughout the year.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 12, 2013, 10:49:42 AM
Big day tomorrow! 

If my in person interview goes well then I should know by tomorrow afternoon if all of this is going to be a reality.  As such I'll admit I'm not sleeping well.  LOL  My mind goes 100 miles an hour when it's locked onto something and right now it's improving the cabin.

With the compost room design nearly done I've been contemplating concrete work (do I put in expansion lines in such a small slab?), floor drain (thinking of a center drain because one never knows -- specially with a composting toilet in the room), running 1" drain line from Dry Sump to where composter will reside, installing new sewage pipe and toilet flange (Sunmar has one they recommend, the one I used was not overly stable but worked -- it was an HD flange with the sunmar gasket which I think was too thick causing the seat to rock a bit), putting in the crawl space enterance and possibly sealing it so the heater doesn't have to heat it up too and then running duct from the cabin stove area to the crawl space and so much more!

At least some things have been resolved like running main water line:  with composter removed and a new excavation going on for it's room it will be an easy matter to install the water line before putting in the floor and foundation and we should have no problem trenching the line in deep with the excavator (added bonus being that it won't rise before coming up into the cabin thereby giving us the very best water pressure we can get).

ya, the mind is racing...and tomorrow it will either become reality or won't....hang on!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: UK4X4 on August 12, 2013, 05:11:35 PM
Good luck for tommorow !
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 12, 2013, 06:47:29 PM
Thanks :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Tickhill on August 12, 2013, 08:11:57 PM
Wish you the best OJ! Let us know how it goes.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 13, 2013, 09:04:53 AM
Thanks Tic. 

Trust me!  You'll all know! LOL  for one there will be a FLURRY of activity as I order all kinds of stuff for the cabin! lol  and of course then a frenzied me posting all kinds of stuff as I try to get so much done!

Would be a cold winter if I didn't get a lot of wood cut and split too!  I've got about two cords now, maybe a little more, but there is enough dead trees around that I should be able to stack up a few more to be safe.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 13, 2013, 07:42:39 PM
The interview went VERY well today and I've been asked to meet with the VP of Ops for a 'meet and greet' which they prefer to do before making an offer.....which makes me think they are planning on making an offer soon! :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 15, 2013, 10:16:14 AM
Monday is 'breakfast' meeting with the big boss.  If all goes well I'll be ordering a generator and other items for the cabin shortly there after!

As of now I'm getting the address paperwork done so I can have that ready.  I'll need it to order a phone and propane etc.

Then I'll get up there next weekend and work on the outhouse (backup for the composter if it gets really cold) so we can use it when we take the compost toilet out to build the new room.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rugger8 on August 15, 2013, 02:03:54 PM
OlJarhead -

Almost there now, but don't take anything for granted, keep your game face on.  Do the small followups, thank you cards, etc. 

Good luck with the rest of the process!  We are all rooting for you! :)

Jeff
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 21, 2013, 10:42:14 AM
Thanks again all!  I'm waiting on the offer now :)

Meanwhile I'm working on my foundation plans.  Here is something I found that is close:
(http://oikos.com/esb/43/foundation.gif)
Only difference is that I plan to do a monolithic pour instead so I'll run the 2" foam under the 4" floor and right to the footing edge and then do the outside foam to above grade (I'll have to flash that).

On top of the slab I'll do dry stacked surface bonded concrete cinder blocks to 8" above grade then build 5-6 foot walls on top of those which will give me a 7 or 8 foot ceiling (I'm thinking 7 feet will be fine).

I plan to do a 4x12 pitch with the peek 4' in from the back wall of the cabin.  This will give me the best snow shedding capability on the compost room and prevent dumping onto the generator.

Now I need to research getting in a load of crushed rock.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 21, 2013, 11:28:19 AM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/ConcreteFloor_zpsdc71a8ed.jpg)
This is more what I'm trying to do.

I'll have to investigate some crushed rock which I think I need and I'll need a vapor barrier under the insulation with rebar going around the footing portion of the slab (3" from edge and top) and some metal in the floor.  I'll have to put rebar coming out of the footing up into where the cinder blocks will go but I think you only have to do corners and every 4th cavity (have to check that).  Then once poured I'll need to drop in J bolts so I have some way to secure the walls to the cinder block wall.

I'm planning on putting the door in above ground so it will have to be a short door -- all my efforts to do other wise present various problems (like flooding if it's set down below grade for example), more construction issues and so on.

But I don't like the idea of a 4 or 5 foot door either so I might have to compromise here somehow.  Perhaps  having one course of cinder block (8") then the door with a drain under the entrance and a 'porch roof' might work too.  It is a challenge.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: UK4X4 on August 21, 2013, 12:02:18 PM
Join the underfloor insulation to the wall down the slope- to fully encapsulate the foundation
and wouldnt you not have a wider perimeter edge beam- min 12" wide then slope up to the floor

like the LHS pic

(http://www.fao.org/docrep/s1250e/S1250E5E.GIF)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 21, 2013, 12:16:36 PM
DOH!  In my rush to draw I forgot that.  Was going to go with the width of the bucket on the excavator so either 12", 16" or 22" LOL

I think it probably should be 16" but I'm unsure when it comes to monolithic pours.  Of course this is for a shed though so probably 12" would be fine.

It will be down 2 feet below grade (maybe more if we can get it down lower) and a min of 8" deep at the footing and 4" of concrete slab floor over 2" insulation.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 22, 2013, 09:42:25 AM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/ConcreteFloor2_zps0cbaca5f.jpg)
This should be a little closer.  Bear in mind I'm not showing the footing on the facing wall nor the insulation that will come up the cinder blocks in order to show the shape of the footing and insulation under the floor.

I didn't put the 'pad' I will pour at the entrance and I think I'll put in a drain there also.  That way if I get some melt off or rain in there it will have somewhere to go.

I've added the insulation going down tot he base of the footing also though i don't think it should be under the footing.

One question I have is this:  do I need crushed rock under this floor?  It's a 'shed' type room so not the same standard, as I understand it, for a house but I'm uncertain if I 'must' have crushed rock there or not???

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on August 22, 2013, 02:21:36 PM
QuoteI've added the insulation going down tot he base of the footing also though i don't think it should be under the footing.

Lets look at that. Many of us build on soil that has a load bearing capacity of 2000 to 3000 pounds per sq FOOT

The common blue and pink foams available at every big box store are rated at 15 pounds per sq INCH. Multiply 15 x 144 sq inches and we get 2160 pounds per sq foot. If ya need more compressive capacity there are foams with greater capacity; 25 PSI is the next step up.  25 x 144 = 3600 PSF. Way more than needed for almost any residential application. Though as I learned a while back the insulation suppliers will try to get you to buy the 25 psi stuff. So will some BO's ;( building officials.) I've seen lots of slabs here in NM with foam under the whole shebang. Wish my old one was.

So with that, why not place the foam under footings too.

There are foams that go up to 100 psi for really big things.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 22, 2013, 09:30:05 PM
Thanks Don -- makes sense :)  and then the footing will be insulated as well.

My wife and I just got back from HD.  Hated to do it but dropped $450 on OSB, studs, PT lumber and the like for the Outhouse which I MUST get done ASAP.

Why an outhouse when you have a composting toilet?  In the long run as backup in case something goes wrong or if many guests come to stay and in the short run to provide a place to empty the composter so it can be removed for the new building and then a 'facility' for using when the composter room is being built -- and until I can re-install it.

My original cabin plan involved putting in the outhouse for winter use if the composter was getting overused as a 'storage' facility when it freezes and while I am to prevent that being needed it never hurts to have a back up plan :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 23, 2013, 10:36:03 AM
The excitement builds!!!!  I have the truck packed with lumber, have a 32" LCD ready to go and an antenna (yes I will need entertainment on those long winter nights) and just ordered a set of skid steer forks, back blade and auger (picl up the forks today).

Ya, I'm TOTALLY stoked :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 26, 2013, 09:14:26 AM
Got on the road by 3:30 on Friday with a bed full of lumber and OSB (probably pushed the limits of my F150!) and a trailer loaded with a new set of Skid Steer forks and some saws etc.  We arrived late and and got settled in for the night with plans to get an early start.

As usual I didn't sleep late and after breakfast etc was setting up by 8am!
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0003640x480_zps57d363a9.jpg)

Thanks to the forklift attachment for the tractor it was a simple matter to transport gear and materials to the location I'd chosen for the outhouse a few years ago.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0006640x480_zps21967450.jpg)
We constructed a shoring box out of PT lumber

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0007640x480_zpsac9ae8b3.jpg)
Then used the tractor to lower it into the hole we'd cleaned out (and had dug 2 years ago)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0009640x480_zps9a7db5ac.jpg)
Nothing beats having the right tools!

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0011640x480_zps30eadb17.jpg)
A little effort and the shoring was level and solidly placed.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0043480x640_zps406b9050.jpg)
Framing the floor and walls didn't take long and the rafters weren't too hard to sort though I was off slightly I figured no one would notice! lol

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0040640x480_zps2e8be6da.jpg)
Bee or wasp?  To me it looked like a beehive but my buddy thought wasp.  If it's NOT bees then it has to go!

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0054640x480_zps30a3e54a.jpg)
Not quite complete but it won't take much to finish off :)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0027640x480_zps293c4e74.jpg)
The riser I've had in the shed for 3 years in anticipation of this moment :)  Frankly, I'm very happy with it :)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0013640x480_zps09a9d577.jpg)
Skid Steer front end :)  LOVE IT!  It's a simple matter to swap out the bucket for the forks!

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0036640x480_zps002410b4.jpg)
The shoring worked nicely and I must admit I feel it's a shame to use it for this! lol but I'm hopeful it will last for years and years!

In reality this 'outhouse' won't get used much.  It is mostly just for backup and a place for me to dump the composting toilet this weekend when I remove it in order to construct a new room for it.  Then once the composting toilet is re-installed the outhouse will serve as a backup for emergency use or when there are more guests staying at the cabin then the composter can handle.  As such I anticipate the outhouse should last a LONG LONG time :)

Also, many ask why it's so far away?  Partly to keep the odor distant enough to not be an issue around the cabin and partly because it's tough to find good places to easily dig on our property near the cabin and lastly because it must be placed at least 100 feet from the nearest water source.  So, far away it is :)  But that's ok, it's a backup remember?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on August 26, 2013, 09:21:39 AM
Looks like a white face Hornet nest.  Nasty litle buggers.  Got a nest hanging on my porch at the cabin.  Empty of course.  ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 26, 2013, 11:57:07 AM
The last hurdle has been breached!  I'm clear to start this new position and have accepted the offer (I had to wait for my current company to release me from my contract - sort of - in order to start with CenturyLink).

So ya, it's a done deal now :)

While at the cabin I hooked up a TV and antenna and picked up ZERO channels.  Not even fuzzy ones.  Before going I'd checked online and it looked like all signals went over us about 600 feet up.....so no rabbit ears will work for me and I'll have to get DishTV or whatever is the best out there.  Considering I'll be getting Sat internet too I will probably look to see what I can do to get a cheaper setup (bundle it up assuming that will be cheaper).

This weekend will be trenching, water main, phone line and flooring/foundation work weekend :D  With luck I'll have the water done and composter room floor ready :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on August 26, 2013, 01:05:03 PM
Eric don't know if Imentioned it but with Dish they are advertising the net at $40 +/- if you have Dish TV. Suppose to be $10 off i  But then they get you back with a $10 equipment rental monthly for the Net modem.  Can't win.   ???
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 26, 2013, 01:56:55 PM
Quote from: Redoverfarm on August 26, 2013, 01:05:03 PM
Eric don't know if Imentioned it but with Dish they are advertising the net at $40 +/- if you have Dish TV. Suppose to be $10 off i  But then they get you back with a $10 equipment rental monthly for the Net modem.  Can't win.   ???

Thanks :)  Since I will be working for CenturyLink who owns Dish I might be able to get a deal ;)  Hoping so!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 26, 2013, 01:57:28 PM
Or maybe it's direct TV... ???
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: UK4X4 on August 26, 2013, 03:02:20 PM
Congratulations on the new job !
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: considerations on August 26, 2013, 04:26:05 PM
WHOOPEE!! On the new job...redover is probably right...in this region we call them bald faced hornets and they are big, foul tempered, agressive, and pack a whallop.  Suggest a stealth strategy, at night, when it is cool and they are sluggish. You cant run fast enough or far enough and don't want to miss your first week of work cause of a hornets' bad attitude. (Yes, i know this first hand)   :-[
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on August 26, 2013, 06:37:15 PM
Agressive is probably an understatement.  My FIL had once told me a story when he was younger decided to throw rocks at a nest some 60-80 feet away.  Yep you guessed it.  They followed the trail of the rock to it's launch point and zero'd right to the forehead. rofl  He since then had the upmost respect for there home.   ;D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: considerations on August 26, 2013, 08:44:27 PM
The first shed I built on this property is near some big douglas firs...things were going great till I started with the screwing down the roof. The nest was in a drooping nearby branch. Getting higher meant I got closer and they took exception to the vibrations...or so it seems. That being said, we do not know for certain what is in Oljarheads nest. I just do know of any other wasps that build like that and that big.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on August 26, 2013, 09:08:16 PM
When I was a teen doing some time in the 'woods' a bald face hornet hit me in the hard hat (one of those metal ones) so hard it rang like a bell and startled me so much I went to my knees.  My dad and his buddy about died laughing.  They said it was most likely a bald face hornet all I know was thank God for hard hats.  [scared]
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Pine Cone on August 27, 2013, 12:03:00 AM
Quote from: considerations on August 26, 2013, 04:26:05 PM
WHOOPEE!! On the new job...redover is probably right...in this region we call them bald faced hornets and they are big, foul tempered, agressive, and pack a whallop.  Suggest a stealth strategy, at night, when it is cool and they are sluggish. You cant run fast enough or far enough and don't want to miss your first week of work cause of a hornets' bad attitude. (Yes, i know this first hand)   :-[
I'll 2nd the stealthy, cool strategy.  I try and spray them 1st thing in the morning.  I would also wear eye protection.  Seems like they prefer to go for your head if they can.  A can of wasp spray will usually kill them, but it might not be as quick as you like.  They also seem to go for movement so I've had good luck being very still after I spray the nest.

One of the scary hornet moments I had was when I was collecting sugar pine cones for a research project.  I was about 60 feet up in the tree and heard some noise and saw movement below me.  I had climbed up past the nest and didn't notice it until I had climbed past it, bumping the branch it was on.  I carefully climbed up further, collected the cones I was after and then rappelled down the opposite side of the tree when it came time to come down. 

Hornets are mostly beneficial, they are predators on a wide variety of damaging insects, so I leave them alone if they aren't near anywhere I go on a regular basis.  If they are close to the house or cabin they get hit with wasp spray. 


Congratulations on the job offer.  [cool]

These are hard times.  I dropped by a local pawn shop/gun shop this weekend and was surprised at the number of rifles they had, maybe 50+   I commented that it was more than they had ever had at one time in the last 5 years.  Turns out most were from loans people couldn't pay back.  Not a good sign given that we are supposed to be in an economic recovery. 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rugger8 on August 27, 2013, 09:50:08 AM
Congrats on the job! :)  I look forward to seeing more progress on the cabin now ;D

Jeff
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 27, 2013, 11:52:55 AM
Yup :)

This weekend is water and concrete weekend which should make it interesting :) and thanks to another forumite from my area I found a guy delivering crushed rock for $175 a load (12 yards) and sand at the same price :)  He thinks he can get to my place with his truck (we shall see) but if not he can get just below us and we can use the front end loader for the rest.

What I don't use under the foundation/floor I'll use on the driveway :)

Ordered a battery meter (Tri-metric) and 24vdc to 12vdc converter from backwoods solar and am about to order my generator and auto gen start :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 27, 2013, 04:26:42 PM
$$$ Ka-Ching $$$ that's the sound of our savings draining! lol  d*  [cool]

So I've now ordered concrete, cinder blocks, rebar and mesh for the foundation and floor (still need foam and plastic), 4kw pure sine inverter charger, remote, auto gen start, battery remote, Generac Eco Gen (delivering to builders supply near our property) and probably a few things I've forgotten....money is flying out the door!  But I'm trying not to sweat it too much since this is for a great job and in the end the cabin will get seriously hooked up! :D

Now I need to do some planning for the weekend which is going to be stressful!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Tickhill on August 28, 2013, 04:30:42 AM
Congrats on the job, OJ.
A lot to do before winter!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 29, 2013, 12:14:27 PM
http://universalconstructionfoam.com/products/styrofoam-eps-sheets/floor-insulation.php
Bought that for the concrete slab.

As the dollars fly out of my wallet I cringe but know that the cabin will be awesome when done :D  Now I'm off to PT a bit before packing and heading out a little later in the day...wish me luck!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 03, 2013, 10:13:24 AM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0074640x480_zpsc3aa1894.jpg)
This picture about sums up the difficulty of trenching in over 500 feet of water pipe :)

And getting it down 6 feet?  and doing that inside 8-10 hours?  Ya, not gonna happen.

So I'm pretty hopeful that the 4 feet (for the most part) depth will be enough though I'm considering installing some 2" under concrete foam insulation on low spots as I'm told that sometimes 3-4 feet is not always enough in our winters.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0086640x480_zps8902c4d1.jpg)
The main and frost free installed.  Feeding the cabin with the 2" pipe (to the split where the Frost Free Spigot is T'd off and the 1" line to the cabin is given a main/shutoff) proved phenomenal!  Water pressure at the spigot was like a firehose!

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0068640x480_zps7953e599.jpg)
Temporary overnight water for the cabin :)  Works like a charm since it's basically what I had originally anyway.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0064480x640_zps29d01d87.jpg)
2" pipe from cistern to main/frost free then 1 1/2" to Frost Free (so we could tap into it and make a run to the orchard in the future) and 1" to the cabin.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0084640x480_zpse8deea17.jpg)
Had to drop a 100' tall Fir behind the cabin  as we needed to excavate into where it roots were -- it will become 2x6's for the deck.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0062640x480_zps0851ec20.jpg)
Crazy amount of work but worth the effort!

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0098640x480_zps56dba22d.jpg)
Got the float valve installed :)  Works like a charm!  So from here on out our cistern should be full :)  We've set the float to allow a 10" drop in water before kicking back on.

All in all the weekend, while insanely tough, was a success....ok except the whole part about the concrete mixer breaking after 38 bags of cement and our having to mix a few bags by hand in a wheel barrow and finally determining to stop a 1" below the top of the forms because it was 8:30pm and we knew we'd not be able to get the last 10-12 bags of cement mixed in a reasonable amount of time.

Question for concrete guru's:  can I pour in a 1" or 2" slab on top of the current slab?  Or am I just being silly?  This monolithic pour is basically for a shed that will be insulated.  It's 8x10 and only about 6" deep at the footings (2x8 forms) because we were unable to mix enough by hand in the time allotted in order to get it to the top of the forms.  So, with 32" of cinder block walls on top and 58" or 2x4 walls on top plus a roof, should I just leave it and not worry about it?  Or should I sweat it and get the last 1 of cement added?

Thanks
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 03, 2013, 12:48:21 PM
This 80 pound monster was waiting for me:
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0119640x254_zpsf83a8ffc.jpg)
:)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0120340x640_zps60c77cd9.jpg)
It is SO HEAVY that I couldn't easily remove it from the box for pics so opted NOT to remove it until I'm ready to install.

Insane!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 04, 2013, 12:06:52 PM
I'll have to take more time to get some pics this weekend :)

Meanwhile I'll be trying to get the dry stacked cinder block walls done (3 or 4 courses) as well as the tub drain and supply and putting the composter back in place.  Should be a good weekend and lead up to the 13th which will be a busy one too.

SO much to do!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: curlewdave on September 04, 2013, 04:09:09 PM
Thought of you and your projects as my wife and I went over Rainy, Washington, Loup-loup, and Wauconda passes on our way to spend a few days at our cabin near Curlew. it was the first time we've been able to spend time there since the big windstorm last year.  Lots of trees down, or sheared off, and the RV port is still standing, but in need of repair. My wife's health is good enough right now to spend a few days at a time, so we shall be over again some time this month to make the cabin more comfortable and enjoy the incredible fall weather that the Okanogan has to offer. We put in a little shower unit with a portable on-demand water heater ($129.00) , and it works great!  We left a Direct antenna on the cabin and haven't used it in 3 years, so it got beat around by snow sliding off the roof, high winds, etc, but when we hooked up the receiver--bang--the Seahawks magically appeared....Ah, what a few wonderful days!!!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: curlewdave on September 04, 2013, 04:27:13 PM
Just went back and read about the hornet's (or yellowjackets) nest.  When we got to our cabin we used 4 cans of spray and eliminated 11 nests is the first half-hour.   Things have quieted down, and of course I need to carry epi-pens with me...Those critters seem to know.....dave
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 05, 2013, 09:31:33 AM
Thanks Dave -- and I've got 3 cans of wasp killer ready to go!

So our cement mixer pretty much fell apart on us last weekend and I have to take the blame for it :(  My step dad gave it to me and I failed to do proper PMs on it!  DOH!  Bolts were lose and bearings weren't greased and in our rush to get going we (I) failed to check anything other then that it worked.  So after over 30 bags of cement it crapped out.

Back here at home we put it back together and after a little messing with it determined everything 'should' work with some maintenance and repairs (since the gussets on the sides bent in transit after bolts fell out) and tore it down.  We discovered set screws were backed out (hence the failure to turn the drum) and the design was seriously lacking (made in China kind of lacking) so the main carriage went off to the neighbors metal fab shop for a serious overhaul (going to put in new stronger gussets and weld the assembly together so it's solid).  Once the carriage returns we'll mount the drum and drive assembly back on it, tighten and grease everything and should be back in business :)  I sure hope so too since we need the mixer to pour the walls full of cement this weekend!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 05, 2013, 11:30:33 AM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0130640x510_zps447009fb.jpg)
I was going through some of the solar goodies I ordered to upgrade the system and have to admit that Backwoods Solar has done it again! :D  I ordered the meter which they stated had what you needed to install it but I hadn't expected the 2-0 cable that came with it!!!  Very excited by that actually since it means I won't have to make one :)  heck, the kit even came with an Alan wrench to make sure you were prepared for the install.  Top Knotch!

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0128640x458_zpse64b5a0e.jpg)
I hadn't installed a shunt yet and always meant to and with this kit I'll do so :)  which will be nice for some other uses besides the meter :)  I'm loving the detail here in all that they sent!

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0126640x480_zps309729e4.jpg)
This is my 24v to 12v converter :)  I plan to run the 12vdc to a fuse block so I can run my 12v stuff off one block neatly installed with the other components.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0129640x573_zps519b084e.jpg)
In the end this meter as well as the Auto Gen Start and the Inverter Remote (and some day the Charge Controller Remote) will all get installed into a 'command' center next to my chair :)  The Car Stereo will go in there also and it will reside next to my chair in front of the wood stove :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 05, 2013, 03:52:32 PM
Auto Gen start arrived today :) and since I pick up the generator this weekend I'm kinda stoked  [cool] though I can't run it until I get propane for it :(
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on September 05, 2013, 03:58:22 PM
Eric if you got the EcoGen or other Generac generator you will have to call in and get an activation code to enter into the controller.  Basicly I think that is their way to start the warranty period.  I believe it may start on Manuel w/o but may not work in the Automatic mode w/o.  You may even be able to get the code via the net as well.  My paperwork is not at the house and I am only guessing on that part.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 05, 2013, 04:10:49 PM
Quote from: Redoverfarm on September 05, 2013, 03:58:22 PM
Eric if you got the EcoGen or other Generac generator you will have to call in and get an activation code to enter into the controller.  Basicly I think that is their way to start the warranty period.  I believe it may start on Manuel w/o but may not work in the Automatic mode w/o.  You may even be able to get the code via the net as well.  My paperwork is not at the house and I am only guessing on that part.

Thanks for the note -- I bought the EcoGen and had it shipped to the builders supply locally (they are pretty nice that way) and pick it up Saturday.  However I won't have my propane tank installed until I get an address :(
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 05, 2013, 05:35:34 PM
Reading my ebook on dry stacking and I see I didn't get 'Lintel' blocks.  I'll have to pick up some 28 or so.  Then I think I have enough rebar to put into the top row (I'll have to check) and it looks like the cells are not all filled.  In fact it appears only my corners need to be filled since none of my walls are very long (10' for longest).

This goes back to Don's discussion on thermal mass but it would seem to me with the exterior insulation that filling the voids with dirt and capping with the top bond (8") should make sense as the heat from inside the room will warm the mass and in theory the insulation should keep it on the inside.  I think anyway.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 08, 2013, 11:50:27 PM
Just checking in  :)  Will post tomorrow but we now have a shower, the back room is underway and WE HAVE AN ADDRESS :) (which is really exciting as it means I can order propane etc)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 09, 2013, 11:03:53 AM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/0907132219480x640_zps30d7cbd0.jpg)
Installing the shower was one of the tougher things to do this weekend!  WOW!  The feet on our 90 year old tub kept falling off and you can't tighten them down too much or they will push off so it's a balance of tightening them JUST right and then not moving things.  But we had to move the tub in order to drill the drain hole...and using a floor jack were only able to shift it in parts -- first the front, then the back, then the front and back and so on.  Eventually though we got it moved, drilled the hole, moved it back and got it balanced on all 4 feet and solid :)  Then we had to get the drain installed to the grey water drain system -- at which time we learned WE NEED A VENT.  So we cut the pipe and I've contacted TheNaturalHome for advice on correctly venting the system.

I also had to find parts to install the taps etc to fit a 1/2 FIP to 3/4 FIP hose but that's was opretty easy thanks to sharkbites :)

Next up was trying to make the somewhat failed concrete pad work for us.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/0908131330640x383_zpsb7b071f9.jpg)
Failed because it wasn't thick enough and wasn't nice and smooth because the mixer broke and we finished as much as we could at night. 

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/0908131331640x307_zpsd882b030.jpg)
My neighbor, who did all his own masonry for his cabin 30 years ago -- and which he's lived in for that time -- told me:  "You aren't building a church".  And proceeded to give a little advice and encouragement.  His position was that this is a non-critical room that isn't living space and is more or less just a shed -- an elaborate one perhaps but still a shed.  As such the thin footings and floor won't make much difference in his opinion and I decided to accept his position since he's an excellent builder (his cabin is awesome).  So we began our dry stacking and despite a lot of shimming I'm confident in the end it will work out ok for our purposes and we'll chalk it up to a learning experience.  I'll admit though, that after 22 cinder blocks I was starting to get better at mortaring :)

Next weekend we will get the rest of the walls done and fix the grey water drain so we can use the shower and today I'm ordering a phone, Direct TV, internet and propane! :)  We have an address and that makes a difference! :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 09, 2013, 12:59:34 PM
Looks like I'll need to vent the sinks and the drywell for the grey water drain -- seems pretty simple though.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on September 09, 2013, 02:46:00 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on September 09, 2013, 12:59:34 PM
Looks like I'll need to vent the sinks and the drywell for the grey water drain -- seems pretty simple though.

Worse come to worse you can always go with a Studor valve.  Shoot I have even just use a "T" 4-6" piece of corresponding pipe size on the "up hill side of the trap" which will allow air to entry to drain. The trap if kept full will block the smell from reaching the studor or other.  But you should have at least one vent to carry the smells out but it may not have to go there if it doesn't work out maybe somewhere down the line.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 09, 2013, 03:08:33 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Drain_zpsa866d18c.jpg)
The kitchen and bathroom sinks were already installed (kind of hidden behind the falling insulation which I need to fix still) and the tub was installed but disconnected.  My thought was to install a vent pipe going up from the tub drain close to the Y pipe to provide venting for the sinks etc.  Then to include a vent in the dry sump.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 09, 2013, 03:16:50 PM
I should add that once the new foundation is done that pipe will be underground.  So much to do!!!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: PorkChopsMmm on September 11, 2013, 08:51:09 AM
OJH -- do you have any plans to insulate around your fixtures as they go into your crawl space? I have a near identical tub with the trap under the house in the crawl space. I added RV anti-freeze every time we got done using the tub. I think I am going to heavily insulate it to try and keep it from freezing in the winter (we live in Michigan). Any advice? You have a lot of work going on!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 11, 2013, 09:08:31 AM
Quote from: PorkChopsMmm on September 11, 2013, 08:51:09 AM
OJH -- do you have any plans to insulate around your fixtures as they go into your crawl space? I have a near identical tub with the trap under the house in the crawl space. I added RV anti-freeze every time we got done using the tub. I think I am going to heavily insulate it to try and keep it from freezing in the winter (we live in Michigan). Any advice? You have a lot of work going on!

I plan to install pony walls under the cabin (which will eventually be built on footings and become part of the foundation though this year they will be just there to insulate the pipes) and insulate them the same way the composter room will be done (2" exterior foam board and in fiberglass in the walls etc) and then insulate the pipes themselves.  Amazingly enough we didn't have any issues with P-traps freezing on either sink last year -- not sure why actually) and I'm hoping with a warm cabin and well insulated crawl space I'll not have an issue this year.

And yes LOTS of work.  I don't have much time either! lol
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 11, 2013, 09:16:58 AM
Quote from: Redoverfarm on September 09, 2013, 02:46:00 PM
Worse come to worse you can always go with a Studor valve.  Shoot I have even just use a "T" 4-6" piece of corresponding pipe size on the "up hill side of the trap" which will allow air to entry to drain. The trap if kept full will block the smell from reaching the studor or other.  But you should have at least one vent to carry the smells out but it may not have to go there if it doesn't work out maybe somewhere down the line.

Looked at how that was done and may consider it if the vent I show above doesn't work ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: PorkChopsMmm on September 11, 2013, 09:19:13 AM
Thanks for the reply OJH. That's a lot of work but a good way to get it done.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 11, 2013, 12:56:51 PM
Internet, phone and propane ordered.  Looks like I'll have two of them show up on the same day -- trying to get the 3rd there then also.

Next is TV
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 15, 2013, 08:16:00 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0163640x480_zpsc332c242.jpg)
After much shimming and mortaring we managed to get the 2nd layer of cinder blocks down and with little additional work the 3rd layer and the bond block layer (lintel?) set.  Then we managed to surface bond the outside walls (ran out of SBC) and while not the prettiest we think for an over glorified 'shed' it ought to work.  We then filled cavities (decided to go for thermal mass vs empty cavities) with dirt except those needed to be cemented for structural reasons and took a break.  Saturday was a busy day.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0166640x480_zps62cf2e16.jpg)
Rebar and cement done.  All we need now is to finish the inside walls with SBC and tough up the exterior and I think paint with a water proof paint (I'll double check that) and we're ready for framing more or less.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0164640x468_zpsc1b544de.jpg)
Picked up the generator too but we're not ready to install just yet ;)

While I was using the tractor to bring dirt to the back of the cabin to fill cavities I did some backfilling too :)
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0154640x480_zpsf963e0de.jpg)

Next weekend we will be backfilling the rest of the water line, trenching in a phone linie and installing a dry well for the composting toilet as well as finishing the SBC work on the cinder block walls, framing in walls and hopefully a roof and installing the composting toilet -- oh and putting in a P trap for the tub too!  Good thing I plan to be there 4 days instead of two.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on September 15, 2013, 08:36:58 PM
Eric that generator only weighs 387 #.  You would think that you will need the tractor to set it in place but a couple of able bodies can do it with a couple pieces of 1" pipe about 5' long.  If you notice there are two round holes in the base which match up from front to back.  Insert the pipe through and pick up both pieces per man per side.  At least that is how they move them here.

Oh yeah unless you remembered.  You will need a Group26R-525CC battery.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 15, 2013, 11:07:32 PM
Quote from: Redoverfarm on September 15, 2013, 08:36:58 PM
Eric that generator only weighs 387 #.  You would think that you will need the tractor to set it in place but a couple of able bodies can do it with a couple pieces of 1" pipe about 5' long.  If you notice there are two round holes in the base which match up from front to back.  Insert the pipe through and pick up both pieces per man per side.  At least that is how they move them here.

Oh yeah unless you remembered.  You will need a Group26R-525CC battery.

Yes but I have a tractor ;)

My motto is:  work smarter not harder ;) lol
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 15, 2013, 11:08:13 PM
And got the battery with it since it didn't make any difference for shipping and was about normal price.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 16, 2013, 08:01:40 AM
I have to admit that once we finished the cement work on the cinder block walls it really felt great!  I'm still quite stoked because I'm not a cement guy.  Concrete work is a weak point and while not really intimidating it's not somoething I look at with a great deal of confidence.  Now, however, I look at the work we've done and KNOW framing walls on top of it and a roof above them will be a piece of cake :)

The 'shed' will be done and the composting toilet, water supply, hot water heater and solar power systems will all remain warm in the winter.  THAT is worth all the effort :)

Won't be much extra room in there but it will make the cabin 'liveable' in the winter.

My biggest issue now is where to put the propane heater in the cabin!   d*  With a small cabin like this one there isn't a lot of useable wall space left and I'm starting to think the loft is going to have to work for me.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on September 16, 2013, 08:07:42 AM
Eric probably of all places you will not need a heater will be in the loft.  Remember heat rises.  If you put the heater in the loft you will probably have to stay there all winter to stay warm. ;D

About the generator.  I was just mentioning that if the location was not accessible with the tractor that it could be managed by hand.  Sometimes we box our self in trying to make things convient and in doing so we create other problems like access.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 16, 2013, 08:17:54 AM
that's my worry -- heat rises.  And in reality I need the heater mostly for when I'm not there to keep things on the lower floor from freezing.

This is my dilemma.

Amen on boxing yourself in! lol Been there and continue to do that!  Luckily in the case of the generator it won't be an issue though.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 16, 2013, 08:23:28 AM
Any idea how deep the propane feed line depth should be?  I'm planninig on placing the tank just over 10' from the Generator and trenching from the tank to the new room (Gas co will install), running the inlet into the wall (BI Pipe) and placing a T inside the wall to direct the feed to the generator so it comes out of the wall where I need it.  Then running down the back wall to a T where it will feed the 8000btu shed heater and continuing on the back wall to the wall next to the cabin were it will bend 90 degrees and com under the hot water heater where it will T off to feed that and continue on to the range (90 up through floor).

Just have to determine placement of the 18000BTU cabin aux heater before planning that run.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on September 16, 2013, 08:27:52 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on September 16, 2013, 08:17:54 AM
that's my worry -- heat rises.  And in reality I need the heater mostly for when I'm not there to keep things on the lower floor from freezing.

This is my dilemma.

Amen on boxing yourself in! lol Been there and continue to do that!  Luckily in the case of the generator it won't be an issue though.

If worse comes to worse maybe under a window.  Not ideal I grant you but.....   Another alternative which would cause a little more work would be to install in an interior partition and use double wall vent pipe to the roof if it is a direct vent.  Ventless could be placed on interior partitions.  I have two installed like that.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: PorkChopsMmm on September 16, 2013, 09:04:02 AM
I had the same problem -- limited wall space for installation of the a propane heater. In the end I went with a ventless unit and installed it on an interior wall. Works well, we have redundant carbon monoxide detectors and have never had an issue -- with air or moisture. We have a 1.5 story with an upstairs loft. I installed the heater on an interior wall with a cathedral ceiling above it. We lose a lot of the heat to the upstairs loft -- if I would have installed it on a section further away from the cathedral ceiling then I think our first floor would be warmer. We also use this heater to keep our pipes from freezing while we are away.

Your place is looking great -- congrats on the concrete work. Something I have not undertaken yet.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 17, 2013, 08:28:51 AM
Quote from: PorkChopsMmm on September 16, 2013, 09:04:02 AM
I had the same problem -- limited wall space for installation of the a propane heater. In the end I went with a ventless unit and installed it on an interior wall. Works well, we have redundant carbon monoxide detectors and have never had an issue -- with air or moisture. We have a 1.5 story with an upstairs loft. I installed the heater on an interior wall with a cathedral ceiling above it. We lose a lot of the heat to the upstairs loft -- if I would have installed it on a section further away from the cathedral ceiling then I think our first floor would be warmer. We also use this heater to keep our pipes from freezing while we are away.

Your place is looking great -- congrats on the concrete work. Something I have not undertaken yet.

Which one did you go with?  Any issues?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on September 17, 2013, 08:44:53 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on September 16, 2013, 08:01:40 AM

My biggest issue now is where to put the propane heater in the cabin!   d*  With a small cabin like this one there isn't a lot of useable wall space left and I'm starting to think the loft is going to have to work for me.

OK, I guess I missed something along the way or did not understand the concept of the heater. How is the heat going to get down into this new space from upstairs in the cabin?  Especially if the heater is in the loft? Is there an air movement system; fan and ducts?  I actually thought the heater was going to be located in the composting space you have built. 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 17, 2013, 08:56:57 AM
http://www.amazon.com/Kozy-World-GWD104-Vent-Free-Dual-Fuel/dp/B001XW6AZI/ref=pd_sim_hg_8/191-5454624-6974961

We found these and bought the 20,000BTU heater for cabin auxiliary heat (mostly for when I am not there) but that leads me to this question:  why could I not use this 10,000BTU unit for my composter room?

It would seem that with a well insulated space this heater should easily keep it warm enough and at the price of $142 (includes valve and line) vs the vent through the wall 'Housewarmer' for $427 w/o line and valve I have to admit that the $300 savings is pulling me towards this route.

Someone help me out here? LOL
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 17, 2013, 08:58:10 AM
Quote from: MountainDon on September 17, 2013, 08:44:53 AM
OK, I guess I missed something along the way or did not understand the concept of the heater. How is the heat going to get down into this new space from upstairs in the cabin?  Especially if the heater is in the loft? Is there an air movement system; fan and ducts?  I actually thought the heater was going to be located in the composting space you have built.

I plan on two heaters Don.  One for the composting toilet room and one for the cabin.

My thought was 8000BTU for the composter room and 18,000BTU for the cabin -- see above though as I work through this.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on September 17, 2013, 09:46:00 AM
Ss I said, I missed something.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: PorkChopsMmm on September 17, 2013, 12:02:52 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on September 17, 2013, 08:28:51 AM
Which one did you go with?  Any issues?

No issues. We installed a 30k BTU heater. On the lowest temperature setting (1 out of 5) it will keep the whole house (24x32 cabin with a lofted 1.5 story) above 50 degrees, even on the coldest nights that central Michigan can offer.

Linked here.
http://www.amazon.com/Mr-Heater-Propane-Radiant-VF30KRADLP/dp/B000UPNZR0/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1379437206&sr=8-4&keywords=mr+heater+30+btu (http://www.amazon.com/Mr-Heater-Propane-Radiant-VF30KRADLP/dp/B000UPNZR0/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1379437206&sr=8-4&keywords=mr+heater+30+btu)

I may not follow you... but if you are going to install these in an enclosed space than you will need a way for oxygen to enter the enclosure. The ventless model works for us because it is in our main living area and we are constantly opening a door, coming in and out, etc. That being said, we have left for 5 days + without any carbon monoxide issues. I could see a smaller and tighter space having problems.

BTW I live offgrid with a solar setup and our place is built very similarly (post and pier) and we live in a cold environment.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 19, 2013, 07:22:54 PM
Here is a dilemma:  Should I have much of an overhang off the roof on a roof that's only 56" off the ground?  With a 4" overhang (just enough for the snow etc to drip away from the walls) I can sheet with one sheet of OSB but much over that and I'll have to sheet with 1+

I had originally considered a one foot overhang but then realized I might not need it.  After all, this is a shed for the batteries and composting toilet drum and isn't something anyone will walk under.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 01, 2013, 08:22:26 AM
Moved in Saturday and have been 'living' at the cabin since :)  So far getting up at 5:30am and going to work hasn't been an issue but I need to get the composting toilet fixed!

So far I'm finding the cabin is well insulated enough to hold it's heat overnight without stoking the fire (33 outside this morning) though it isn't finished.  So I imagine once completed it ought to old it's heat very well :)  THat's been a concern.

THe shower etc works well too and now that I need it more often that's a big bonus :)

And o course, having internet, TV and a phone is a  big plus when you're living alone.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on October 01, 2013, 09:24:52 AM
 [cool]  I really hope it all goes well for you guys.  How is the new job going?  Who did you get for internet service?  We went over last month and I really could not tell much difference in service when it throttle back the last three days however I understand with Exceed if you do it a lot they will move you to the next higher rate.  I guess I will have to find out the hard way. 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: considerations on October 01, 2013, 07:23:12 PM
"Should I have much of an overhang off the roof on a roof that's only 56" off the ground?  With a 4" overhang (just enough for the snow etc to drip away from the walls) I can sheet with one sheet of OSB but much over that and I'll have to sheet with 1+"

I like overhangs...but then it rains a lot more here than where you are.  1' isn't enough on almost everything...4' is very cool cause you can shelter items if need be. 2 and 3 feet is where I usually end up...yup more OSB, but I've not regretted any overhang's except the 1' and less ones.  I add a rafter and run the beams or rafters out as far as needed so I can walk on the overhangs...and am getting ready to wall in one four footer for more weather protected storage.

I want to know the saga of your composting toilet...I'm still trotting to the outhouse for important events.  It is the last large improvement that I've not yet settled on (oh brother, no pun intended...no really!). Anyhow, Performance is important on this subject, so please post any progress/or not.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 02, 2013, 04:44:37 PM
Hugesnet -- so far it's working pretty well though not like cable internet lol

On the overhang, since it's so low to the ground (roughly 4 1/2 feet up) I've decided to keep it to about 4".

The weather will not wait for me and has been getting colder and colder!  But I hope to see more work done SOON.

Biggest saga so far is that I have yet to hook up the shower (so am using a bucket under the drain) though it ought to be done tonight AND the stupid (sorry) gas people have not come out yet.  They are starting to irritate me.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 03, 2013, 08:09:17 AM
Life at the cabin:  Well, with the boys here it's pretty easy ;)  They've been making dinner so it's ready when I get home and have kept the place pretty clean so I can relax after work :)  They are also working hard to get stuff done and promise to get the walls done on the composter shed today and start on the roof.  I hope so!  I need it done ASAP as winter is moving in fast!

I am finding it tough to do much wen I get home because so far I've been making it home around 6pm and it's starting to get dark.  However, we do go over things and sort out some issues so they can get back at it the next day.  Without them I'd be hurting big time!!  So a big THANKS to Josh Miller an Kurtis McVay for stepping up and helping out!!!  They will be back next week also and hope to get all the winterizing one or close to done by the weekend.

One thing I can tell is that the insulation and interior paneling must be done soon too.  t wasn't an issue before because I get up and stoke the fire at least once in the night but if I want to sleep all night and have a fire in the morning I'd have to get up before ZERO DARK THIRTY to start one since this stove doesn't burn longer then about 4 to 5 hours and when it's freezing outside the interior temp can drop to 60 in that period.  Clearly getting the insulation done will be a big bonus.

I've also got to get the toilet installed ASAP and get my propane installed ASAP both for fairly obvious reasons but with the propane it means I can then also install the new generator which iwill auto start any time the power drops to a certain level (one I set) which is key where there isn't much sun to generator power to charge the batteries.  Right now one day without sun can be a problem because it's dark using lights, even CFL's takes power) and I use a computer and TV in the evenings (and obviously in the AM like now) and the Fridge and Freezer are big users too.  Without the backup generator I couldn't leave for the weekend and would be running the as genny in the evenings for several hours daily if the sun doesn't show which lately it has not).

Otherwise, cabin life has been pretty god minus the whole missing my beautiful wife!  THat part downight sucks but we knew it would be the hard part.

I might add that the Marey water heater works but does seem very hard to adjust correctly and mostly only works when the hot water is on without the cold.  My shower last night was a balancing act between scalding and freezing water....I need to fix that!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 04, 2013, 08:01:00 AM
First full week at the cabin and it's going pretty well.  The hughesnet does strange things when you type fast (I suppose that's the lag) though this only seems to happen with FB and not other sites...hmmm...

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/IMG_0005_zpsc1fb9e5d.jpg)
With the room taking longer then I'd hoped to get done we've had to adjust to having no toilet inside the cabin (outhouse for emergency use) and we've survived with that but it's getting old fast! lol  Today being Friday and the boys needing to pack everything up to take home for the weekend (since we still don't have a generator backup in place I don't want to leave the fridge on when I'm gone) it is unlikely they will get much done today except maybe mill the 2x6 boards for the rafters.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/IMG_0001_zps92e40b8c.jpg)
Ferrelgas has really started to piss me off as they continue to not call me back.  I've had to call tem a few times and they assure me they are working on it but my guess is they are NOT a good company.  Problem is, everyone seems to use them in this area and claims they are cheaper than Amerigas -- I'll find out today when I call Amerigas and se if they can come out ASAP and deliver a 500 gallon propane tank etc.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/IMG_0007_zps4ef448cb.jpg)
If I can get the propane installed next week and we can get the composting toilet re-installed then we're almost there.  We'll still have to get a heater and install it in the new room and we'll need a door, an entrance way and roofing but those can be done later once the toilet is installed and the room is at least sealed up and protecting the toilet from the cold and the rain.

Speaking of cold it's 30 degrees this morning and that seems to be the trend right now.  I've had no problem keeping the cabin warm though and only get up once or twice in the night, if I am awake, to stoke the fire.  I don't really have to do that but I prefer a warm cabin and know that if I leave it warm it's less likely to be cold when I return ;) Of course, finishing the insulation and interior will help with that.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/IMG_0009_zps68fb3563.jpg)
Perhaps my biggest issue is the solar power.  I have 8 ol cart batteries (220ah each) in a series parallel configuration that gives me a 12 volt bank with 880 amp hours of capacity (at a 20hr draw rate).  With the batteries around 70 degrees this is enough power to run the fridge and freezer and some lights for 24 hours no problem and perhaps up to 3 days at 80% drain.  However I'm finding that this time of year with the batteries dropping to 39 degrees at night and our using the TV, laptop, hugesnet modem etc the batteries drop to 50% drain overnight!  That's a problem.

I have a new inverter (24v) and some other items that should reduce usage and improve efficiency once installed and the new room should keep the batteries above 50 degrees which will help also but I'm going to have to watch the power usage this winter or I'll be running the generator a LOT.  I figured I can run it 4 hours a day if need be over the coldest part of the winter but if the battery bank were well matched to the usage I have I'd only need the generator on cloudy days after abusing power without much solar ativity -- or like my neighbor on weekends when I'm home all day.

Not much I can do about that now but next year I'll need to get better batteries with more reserve.

Also, the AIMS Modified Sine wave inverter (square wave) is NOT adequate for my needs now.  It continues to crash on us whenever we try to increase the load on it.  Despite being rated at 2500 watts with a 5000 watt surge it doesn't seem to be able to handle running 2 CFL lights, the TV and Satellite box and say the fridge if i kicks on o the freezer....when that happens it dumps the power and we have to get up and reset it.  So I can't wait to get the industrial grade 4000 watt pure sine inverter installed!

Anyway, time to make lunch and pack up for work.  It's been a great week at work though and I actually look forward to getting in an starting my day :)  What could be better?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Squirl on October 04, 2013, 09:13:39 AM
Sorry I don't have any specific answers to any questions.  I just haven't commented in a while. It is good to see you living out your dream.  I remember when you started.  You have come a long way.  Also thanks for posting all the information on the transition to life at the new place.  The information on all the little things, from the water heater to the inverter, are great reading and very helpful.

Are those the same batteries from when you started?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on October 04, 2013, 09:49:08 AM
Having used Hughes at the neighbors and Excede the Wild Blue spin off or redesign which we have here....   ???   I think Excede has it hands down.  But that said here in this area there are no more subscriptions available.  But there is still that delay in up load and down load. Really not like to the local cable or DSL Hub. 

We had a meeting with planing and zoning up here the other day.  One of the things we talked about was is there any monies available to place or attract a or a couple cell phone towers up here.  People are willing to donate the land to use.  Two good issues were brought up one was E-911 is hardly of any use if you can not contact some one.  Second -  During the fires we had up here this summer and lack of good radios we could have had cell phoned between dozers and water wagons and trucks.  We queried are there any Obamba Buck$ available for such?  If there were then we could all bundle packages of phone, cell phone and internet.  Most of the phone lines up here are like Alexander Graham Bell meets the twenty first century and fail badly.  Planing and Zoning says they will look into it.  You might put some feelers out up there as well! 

         
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 04, 2013, 11:44:48 AM
Quote from: Squirl on October 04, 2013, 09:13:39 AM
Sorry I don't have any specific answers to any questions.  I just haven't commented in a while. It is good to see you living out your dream.  I remember when you started.  You have come a long way.  Also thanks for posting all the information on the transition to life at the new place.  The information on all the little things, from the water heater to the inverter, are great reading and very helpful.

Are those the same batteries from when you started?

Thanks.

Same batteries so I'm probably pushing them a bit more then I should.  If I could add a 3rd string I would but with the first 6 being about 3 years old now and the last two being 2 years old I don't think it's a good idea.  Having said that I plan to ride them out with the Generac until late spring then put in some L16's (or whatever I can get that's got long life and lots of power).  I'm budgetting about $3k for batteries now!

The hot water heater is almost working the way it should and I guess for $200 you can't expect it to be a Bosh! lol  But one pain in the rear is that despite having good water pressure it doesn't like it when I run hot and cold at the same time and shuts off unless I keep the cold down.  I suspect it has something to do with the install since I KNOW I have tons of pressure.  I'm thinking that the 1/2" pex to sinks might be the issue or perhaps the cheaper headers I've used.  Just not sure.  I'm feeding the cabin with a 1" PVC that gets T'd off into two 1/2" feeds.  One goes to the cold water header and one to the hot water heater which then goes to the hot water header.  You'd think that would provide plenty of volume and not drop pressure in the heater but it seems to dissagree!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 04, 2013, 12:08:27 PM
Looking at the Marey Hot Water heater Doc I see that it requires a min of 10psi (it will start at 8psi actually) and 3.1GPM to fire and continue running.

I think my problem is that it loses flow when the cold gets turned on -- and I can't see why that is considering it's fed by a 1" main which should easily flow 3.1GPOM out of 2 lines (if not more).  Maybe I'm missing something.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on October 04, 2013, 01:05:47 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on October 04, 2013, 11:44:48 AM
(or whatever I can get that's got long life and lots of power).   I'm budgeting about $3k for batteries now!


http://www.thesolarbiz.com/Trojan-L16RE-2V-1110-AH
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Squirl on October 04, 2013, 01:20:34 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on October 04, 2013, 12:08:27 PM
Looking at the Marey Hot Water heater Doc I see that it requires a min of 10psi (it will start at 8psi actually) and 3.1GPM to fire and continue running.

I think my problem is that it loses flow when the cold gets turned on -- and I can't see why that is considering it's fed by a 1" main which should easily flow 3.1GPOM out of 2 lines (if not more).  Maybe I'm missing something.

Maybe the shower head.  If the head has a 5 gpm output and 50% of the water from the hot side and 50% of the water from the cold side, you are only getting 2.5 gpm flow out of each side.  This just gave me something to think about.  I was going to install a low flow 1.2 gpm shower head.  Most tankless water heaters probably wouldn't even turn on.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 04, 2013, 04:03:15 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on October 04, 2013, 01:05:47 PM
http://www.thesolarbiz.com/Trojan-L16RE-2V-1110-AH

One of my guys asked me why I just don't use batteries like we have in the CO (3600AH 2v batteries) and I explained that size is a large part of it!  Those things are HUGE.

The L16 H AC (http://www.thesolarbiz.com/Trojan-L16H-AC-6V-Battery-435-AH) would run me $2600 for 870AH at 24vdc vs $3900 for 1110AH at 24vdc for those L16RE 2V 1110AH batteries so I'll probably go with the smaller ones.  That extra $1300 is just a little more then I can handle I think, but it's definately something I'll keep in  mind for next year.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 04, 2013, 04:29:08 PM
Quote from: Squirl on October 04, 2013, 01:20:34 PM
Maybe the shower head.  If the head has a 5 gpm output and 50% of the water from the hot side and 50% of the water from the cold side, you are only getting 2.5 gpm flow out of each side.  This just gave me something to think about.  I was going to install a low flow 1.2 gpm shower head.  Most tankless water heaters probably wouldn't even turn on.

d* d* d*

WOW!  I hadn't thought of that!  DOH!  It makes a lot of sense too!  If 8GPM is the min flow the heater will ignite on and if it must maintain that it stands to reason this is the issue as it will so,metimes quit even with just hot running (any time my aerator picks up sediment it can prevent the instant on heater from working and I have to clean it out).

My faucets are new and I don't doubt the shower head is newer too so it is likely that I'm killing the flow rate through the heater and when I turn on the cold it takes some of that flow from it because of the shower restriction.  I can perform a simple test by removing the low-flow aerators and then trying out the heater.  If it works with both hot and cold on then I'll try increasing the water flow dial on the heater and see what that does.

I had a plumber once who removed the aerator from a shower that was so low flowing it was pitiful.  It was then almost painful because of the high pressure we have at our house (maybe the city water guys increased pressure to overcome some of the low-flow stuff being forced on us??  Who knows?

Anyway, it's an encouraging place to start!  Thanks
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on October 04, 2013, 05:28:46 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on October 04, 2013, 04:29:08 PM
  If 8GPM is the min flow the heater will ignite on .....

But I am quite sure it is no where near that high.     The user manual unfortunately does not list the minimum required flow to activate the burner; at least not that I could find. Lots of other data, but not that. It does have temperature rise charts; where if the flow is this much and if the temperature setting is highest or lowest, the chart indicates the maximum degrees of temperature rise.  The flow columns go down to 0.5 GPM.  So if that means anything at all it would seem the minimum flow rate is somewhere between 0.0 and 0.5 GPM.  It does not make sense to me that the flow must be higher than the 0.5 GPM to initiate the burner.  Doesn't make sense but that does not mean it is not possible that the flow be higher and then turned back. Would be nice if the manual explained the flow required for ignition. 

I do see that at the highest flow rate the temperature rise is quite low; 30 F for the 10L at 3.0 GPM.   Is the burner actually cutting off or the water just going cold?

Have no other ideas... still head scratching...
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 04, 2013, 05:42:31 PM
Thanks for the reply Don -- I missed that chart.

The burner actually shuts off and I have to turn the flow knob to the lowest setting. 

Temperature rise is SO HIGH that I have to adjust it to SUMMER despite the VERY cold water coming into it and have the flame set to midway between the lowest and highest settings.  Then it gets about 115 to 120 degrees at mosts.  If I set it to WINTER and midway it gets scalding hot!

It will not run at all with the flow setting above the minimum.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 04, 2013, 05:45:33 PM
 d* d*
Quote4. Low water pressure start up function:
This unit requires only 8 PSI to fire, making it suitable for users with low water
pressure, or those who are using it to supply hot water to upper floors. Please note
that the water flow and water pressure are not the same. Sufficient flow is always
required to keep the overheat safety sensor from shutting the unit off.


8PSI not 8GPM

So the GPM's aren't the issue and I read that wrong.  It's 8PSI which I KNOW I have -- in fact I have a LOT more then that.

So now I'm really scratching my head.  I'll have to call them I think.
http://www.marey.com/product_pdf/english/6.pdf
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on October 04, 2013, 06:08:22 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on October 04, 2013, 04:29:08 PM
.....the high pressure we have at our house (maybe the city water guys increased pressure to overcome some of the low-flow stuff being forced on us??  Who knows?

The usual reason water utilities run very high pressures is simply to ensure there is sufficient pressure and flow at the homes at the end of the water mains runs. When we moved into our home in '85 the water pressure was 80 psi. We are within a mile of the well/tank. The pressure rose as the area further away from the pump/tank expanded. When the pressure got to being a consistent 120 psi we installed a pressure regulator after the city meter. High pressures are bad for the control valves on things like dishwashers, clothes washers and even refrigerator ice makers.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on October 04, 2013, 06:11:31 PM
Quote from: Squirl on October 04, 2013, 01:20:34 PMI was going to install a low flow 1.2 gpm shower head.  Most tankless water heaters probably wouldn't even turn on.

I believe Bosch fire up at 0.50 GPM (last time I looked at one) 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 05, 2013, 06:28:36 PM
Went in to HD and found a 'Full Flow' tap adapter with a straight screen in it.  I'll pop the screen out and replace the low-flow aerator with it and see if that helps.  I also found a 'soap and pause' shower head that I thought might be nice to try.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 05, 2013, 06:39:05 PM
WhooHoo :)  Ordered a 50 watt Pioneer car stereo receiver / CD Deck with an antenna and extra cable off Amazon.  When it arrives I'll install it and have a nice radio to listen to at the cabin :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on October 05, 2013, 07:07:40 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on October 04, 2013, 05:42:31 PM

Temperature rise is SO HIGH that I have to adjust it to SUMMER despite the VERY cold water coming into it and have the flame set to midway between the lowest and highest settings.  Then it gets about 115 to 120 degrees at mosts.  If I set it to WINTER and midway it gets scalding hot!

???
What type of shower control do you have?  A code compliant shower control has temperature/pressure compensation to eliminate the hazard of the head spraying out water that is too hot.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 05, 2013, 08:02:10 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on October 05, 2013, 07:07:40 PM
???
What type of shower control do you have?  A code compliant shower control has temperature/pressure compensation to eliminate the hazard of the head spraying out water that is too hot.

Not really sure but I suspect a very old one! lol  This tub was installed in 1922 in it's original location and removed by us to take to the cabin.  The taps and shower attachment are original as far as I can tell but the shower head appears to be newer though that's kinda subjective lol

The head I bought is a newer 2.5gpm head designed for houses with low water pressure (so it says) and a lever that will cut it out while you soap up -- which works for me as it conserves both water and propane.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: UK4X4 on October 05, 2013, 09:05:17 PM
In the UK and europe we use a lot of on demand water heaters

input and output are usually 25mm pipes or 1"

they don't like the 15mm or 1/2" pipes for some reason

Obviously with such an old tap setup - its probably just on off flat valves rather than a needle shape to give easy flow control

The other issue that hit me recently in the UK was the size of the shower hose, the tenant had been complaining for years about the shower flow

upped the hose size to 1" and I saved a 2000usd shower pump and install...

On demand heaters are a lot more fickle than a standard water heater arrangement
its all about balance.

probably worth a couple of pressure gauges and some needle valves to see if you can balance the circuit.

A bypass circuit can be used too.

We normally use it in the central heating system but can be used to maintain a steady heat in a on demand system too

If you have too little flow the heater kicks in and out causing fluctuations and scolding un maintainable heat

Add a circuit from the output of the heater to the input- allowing hot water to circulate, run it arround an area you want to heat too if you wanted, like a towel rail in the bathroom...the balance line should have a valve in it so you can adjust the flow to make the heater happy

This way the heater has a constant demand on it- it limits the on off syndrome and makes the heated water a steady 1 temperature stream
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 05, 2013, 10:47:05 PM
I was thinking that installing a 3/4" feed would help but realized the fittings on the Marey are 1/2" MIP so I'm not sure how much good it will do but I do plan to try to make that work.  I might be able to go from 3/4" pex to 1/2" MIP and then run 3/4" outfeed line to the header.  Perhaps that will at least maintain pressure a little better at the heater.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 05, 2013, 11:10:10 PM
This week will have to be a productive one but I'm not entirely certain how we'll do that! lol  I leave for work at 6:15am and return around 5:45pm which means I have about 1 hour (maybe 90 minutes) of daylight to work in if I want to do anything.  My son's though, will spend several hours in the day trying to get stuff done (they've done most of the work anyway lately).  What we are challenged with is:

1.  Place 2" foam board behind cinderblock wall under cabin and backfill.
2.  Place 2" foam board on the east wall (L shaped to push the frost zone away from the wall) and backfill as much as possible by hand.
3.  Place 2" foam board on the west wall but only about half way down the wall and backfill as much as possibly by hand.
4.  Build 36" x 48"x 4" concrete pad for entrance and pour concrete with center drain
5.  Cut rafters and frame and sheet roof
6.  Dry stack cinder blocks on entrance pad and make wood stairs
7.  Screw furring and 2" foam to outside walls (MountainDon -- should there be some vapor barrier there or is the 2" foam enough for that?)
8.  Put 30# felt over roof sheathing.

Then of course I need to order roofing material and start the boys on milling some live sawn siding which we will nail up green and we need to get a 28" solid door (ok maybe not solid but flat and we'll probably insulate it too)

We need to get the toilet installed again and will be ordering the heater for the room in the next couple days.

Also, I'm waiting on the propane guys to come install a 500lbs tank.  Once it's installed I'll insulate and backfill that section and then install the back up generator and move the solar power to the new space for it (once I make a shelf for the batteries and put some plywood up on the wall.

And of course I need to cut and chop some firewood.  I figure I have a month or so to get it all done!  YIKES!  d*
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Native_NM on October 06, 2013, 11:07:11 PM
Quote from: Redoverfarm on August 26, 2013, 09:21:39 AM
Looks like a white face Hornet nest.  Nasty litle buggers.  Got a nest hanging on my porch at the cabin.  Empty of course.  ;)

Could be worse -

http://slumz.boxden.com/f610/giant-hornets-attacking-chinese-citizens-not-faint-heart-1984499/

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 07, 2013, 10:48:57 AM
Replacing the low-flow aerator with a 'full flow screen resolved the issue of my kitchen sink not having enough flow and kicking off the hot water :)

However now my shower is not working right and the hot isn't staying on for it....grrr I'll put in a full flow screen there too I guess. 

Marey did respond to my question about the unit and this is what they sent:
QuoteActually, this is not a problem with the unit, per say. As the unit is pressure activated, once you start to add in the cold, you are actually diverting the pressure from the hot to the cold, so the unit shuts off. The way to correct this is to make the temperature as comfortable as possible, without adding in much cold, so the pressure stays consistent. Let me know if you have any other questions.

The only issue I have is that I have to seperate systems.  One for cold and one for hot and while they are both fed by the same 1" pipe the volume via that pipe should handle more then two 1/2" feeds easily.  So turning on cold shouldn't impact the hot at all.

My only guess is that the low-flow heads are restricting water flow so much that the unit thinks it's losing pressure and quits.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: small cabin dreamer on October 07, 2013, 02:39:47 PM
Your place is very inspirational!
I have followed your build, and think it is awesome that you get to live there full time!
I have a question, When you did your beams and joists how much cantilever did you use, and what do you recommend hindsight being 20/20? I saw that you would have liked to use larger beams and joists which I will use, but I cannot find anything on the cantilever above the beams. I will also have 2x6 walls, 10 feet tall. It appears that since the builders cottage is on a real cement foundation there is no cantilever listed.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 07, 2013, 03:40:28 PM
Quote from: small cabin dreamer on October 07, 2013, 02:39:47 PM
Your place is very inspirational!
I have followed your build, and think it is awesome that you get to live there full time!
I have a question, When you did your beams and joists how much cantilever did you use, and what do you recommend hindsight being 20/20? I saw that you would have liked to use larger beams and joists which I will use, but I cannot find anything on the cantilever above the beams. I will also have 2x6 walls, 10 feet tall. It appears that since the builders cottage is on a real cement foundation there is no cantilever listed.

What I did:  I used 2x6 floor joists and a 22" cantelever (sort of) but then supported every 4 feet with a 2x4 brace to the post and pier foundation.

What I plan on doing:  Installing concrete footings around the outside of the cabin footprint and building a cinder block / wood foundation wall up to the cabin.

What I recommend:  I recommend (when building a 14 foot wide structure) using ap-propriate floor joists for the span (2x10 min I believe) with a concrete foundation (this could be a concrete footing with dry stacked cinderblock walls which is what I'll eventually have).

In the end I'll have the original post and pier foundation and a perimeter concrete/cinderblock type foundation so the original will just support the floor and the walls etc will be on the new foundation (if I understand the load sharing right).

The post and pier DOES work but frankly I don't like it *snicker* but I won't beat it up too much since it got me going and I'm living in the place now :)

Thanks for the kind words and GOOD luck on yours!

PS.  Go bigger!  I recommend 16x24 instead of 14x24 and I recommend 2x10 floor joists in the loft too (then you can go with 24" centers) and larger rafters (say a min of 2x8 but maybe better at 2x10).

PPS.  A neighbor found that using two layers of 2" foam is all the insualtion he needs out here in the harshest time of the year -- I found that interesting in light of what I'm doing in my addition.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 07, 2013, 04:06:42 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20131006_171307_606_zps816ec114.jpg)
The boys managed to get the sheeting done on the new room and mill some 2x12's into 2x6's for the rafters before taking the weekend off ;)  We'll get back at it tomorrow.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20131006_171213_305_zpsf60b4c5f.jpg)
Installed a new porch light I got from HD.  Pretty simple really:  screw into wall, plug into panel.  Done.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20131006_193505_627_zpseae13532.jpg)
Works like a charm!  I think I'll get one or two more! :)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20131006_171126_333_zps1cea96f7.jpg)
Took a few minutes to install a dowell for hanging shirts/coats by the woodstove either to dry or for convenience.  Being that I have no closet and am trying not to use the loft until I finish it I'm going to have to come up with some creative space management ideas!

I'll be adding anbother one of these this evening I think.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 09, 2013, 07:53:34 AM
Another fine day at the cabin :)  It's supposed to be sunny and warm (around 55 degrees) so the boys ought to be able to get the roof on the new room framed and the composting toilet composting drum set back in place.  Which means, if I can sneak away early today (not really early unless leaving at 8hrs is early!) then I can get it hooked back up.

I let the fire go out last night (because I really needed some sleep) so had to start it again this morning which wasn't much of an issue other then there wasn't enough small wood in the cabin to get some coals built up so I had to go out in and get some.  Was about 30 degrees but the stars filled the sky and it was pretty motivating:)

Was able to shower again too!  Ya, that's a plus! lol  I replaced the shower head last night and while I'm still having an issue with flow through the heater it does work and only seems to be a problem in the tub/shower for some reason.  I'll have to tear the tub taps apart and see what's clogging them up.  Because of the flow being so restricted in the tub the heater shuts off unless you have another tap running so I have to have the bathroom sink hot water cracked a bit.  Needless to say I'll have to fix that soon.  Good thing I'm on well water!

Managed to get home early last night from Cheney too ;)  I was heading over the pass from Coulee Dam towards Omak when I decided to take Lyman Lake Road over the hump into the valley where our cabin is.  It's a 20 mile stretch of forest road that I hadn't driven in 4 years because it ddn't seem to save me much time but boy was I glad I did!  I arrived at the cabin just over 45 minutes later!  Considering I was a good 90 minutes out if I stayed on the pavement I was pretty stoked :)  Turned a 4 1/2 hour drive into a 3 1/2 hr drive (roughly).

Now it's time to get cracking!  Gotta get heading to work soon but am hopeful the boys will get some work done today (they were relaxing yesterday which is kinda bad since winter is approaching fast (plenty of timie to relax when the work is done!).
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 10, 2013, 07:45:00 AM
Cabin Life:  I managed to get home early yesterday because I took a visit to Oroville to help one of my techs at a job and to visit the CO Tech in the Oroville CO.  So, I managed to get home by 5PM.  When I arrived the roof wasn't framed on the new room because the boys were having issues getting the rafters cut right (I think they have that sorted now or at least how to get it sorted anyway).  So they were remounting the hot water heater on the outside of the cabin (they had removed the box it was enclosed in along with it earlier).

I was a bit worried about the heater being exposed and expecting a cold morning (as in freezing) but there wasn't much we could do so we affixed some plywood around the upper section of the heater and as a roof (temporary) and insulated the opening in the wall in the bathroom and hoped for the best.

One thing I was able to do, however, was purge the unit a little by opening the drain valve with the water running.  This seemed to improve the water pressure in the tub and gave me hope that I might actually have a good shower in the AM.

OH THE JOY!  By morning it was only 40 degrees out (warm) so I had no worries about the water freezing in the hot water heater (instant on but it has water in it all the time) and ran the shower.  I HAD PRESSURE!

You just don't know how good a HOT shower is first thing in the morning until you are living with a failing one in the middle of the woods and then suddenly you get it fixed and it's 5am and you need to wake up!  AWESOME!

Heck, it ought to be a great day! :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 10, 2013, 07:47:32 AM
I should add that the 'pause and soap' head is excellent for cabin use!  It allows you to stop the shower at anytime and then kick it back on easily when ready to use it again.  Great idea!   [cool]
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 11, 2013, 07:33:04 AM
Hard Freeze! Or at least a freeze hard enough to stop my hot water THe cold was barely running but I got it going by opening all the taps but the hot is just toast I sure hope the hot water heater piping is ok (which I think it will be since it's not THAT cold out yet).

SO, this morning I have no hot water at all. Good thing it's Friday and I am the boss! I'll call it 'casual Friday' and ...not worry about not shaving.

Cabin is nice and warm though I tamped it down last night at 10pm and then added a log at 3am so when I got up at 5:00 it was both warm and still burning with lots of life left in the log I put in a couple hours earlier.

Good thing the room is almost done! I MUST have insulated hot water or I will not make it through the winter wich can be VERY harsh up here!

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/room_zps4aa1bc68.jpg)
Luckily we are close!  THe boys have the roof framed  -- it ended up a 3:12 pitch but I think that will be ok as the rafters are on 16" centers and only about 4 feet long.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/room2_zps0b3ac6e8.jpg)
It's clear to me, however, that by tonight this room must be sealed and insulated or I won't have hot water as I'll have to shut it off until I get the propane installed (in just under a week) and can provide heat to the room!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on October 11, 2013, 07:50:21 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on October 10, 2013, 07:47:32 AM
I should add that the 'pause and soap' head is excellent for cabin use!  It allows you to stop the shower at anytime and then kick it back on easily when ready to use it again.  Great idea!   [cool]

As someone that has lived in a fifthwheel for over a year now.....  That feature seems second nature.  Yet oh how I want to have the ability to just stand there and let that warm to hot water rain and rain and rain.  Long showers are thing of the past with any RV hot water heater we have had!  Yet I remember when we got our first one up here and had how nice it seemed to shower after a day building fence, putting in the orchard or cutting fire wood.

I 'farmed' out the plumbing to a pro on my house build in the interest of time and knowing the tricks of the trade.  Getting it done right the first time and on and on goes my reasoning.   My mistakes cost a lot of money in time and material.  So we were going over our wants.  He asked 30 gallon water heater?  Long showers and hot baths ran helter skelter in my brain.  I replied nope 50 gallon.   ;)     
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 11, 2013, 04:39:38 PM
I think I just found some used Costco GCB's that are the same size and age as my battery bank.

I know it's not really good to add batteries to an existing bank unless about the same age and usage but I figured that these were old enough to likely fit in alright for the next year and would give me 1/3rd more capacity then I had already (I have 8 total now which will be reconfigured into two strings of 4 batteries in series to give me two 220AH 24vdc strings in parallel).  They are advertised as 1 to 3 year old batteries that were not used regularily and trickle charged every 2 to 4 weeks.  So while probably not optimal I figured they ought to be ok to add to my bank which is 2 and 3 years old.

My total capacity should then be 660AH at 24vdc (my current system is 880AH at 12vdc).

If I understand how the calculations work then I'll have 15840 Watt Hours of battery reserve with these 4 added and my research tells me that 3 parallel strings is fine.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 11, 2013, 05:01:07 PM
Looking back I see I instsalled the first 6 of my 8 batteries in September of 2010 (posted about them the 28th).  I then added two more in either October or November 2011 (still checking).  The used batteries on CL are from 2011 and 2013.

Of course the 2013's are a little new to be adding to a 3 year old bank but I'm optomistic that doing so won't be a problem if I don't plan to use them for years ;)  After all, I plan to pull the trigger on a bigger better bank of batteries (is that a poem? *snicker*) next spring/summer so I really just need these to survive the winter and allow me to live without running the generator 4+ hours a day every day (which is what's happening right now).
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: curlewdave on October 11, 2013, 06:25:17 PM
My wife and I returned to the west side from Curlew yesterday...  Since we have a place over near Bellingham (Samish Island), we came over 20....met an absolute army of hunters going east--towards your place!!!!  Good luck!   We did manage to lock our gates and repost our signs.  That will only slow them down a bit... A good time to be outta there, beats trying to dodge bullets............
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 11, 2013, 06:50:48 PM
Quote from: curlewdave on October 11, 2013, 06:25:17 PM
My wife and I returned to the west side from Curlew yesterday...  Since we have a place over near Bellingham (Samish Island), we came over 20....met an absolute army of hunters going east--towards your place!!!!  Good luck!   We did manage to lock our gates and repost our signs.  That will only slow them down a bit... A good time to be outta there, beats trying to dodge bullets............

I have my M1A and lots of Ammo ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on October 11, 2013, 09:50:06 PM
Stay safe out there!

The build looks great! 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on October 12, 2013, 09:32:48 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on October 11, 2013, 05:01:07 PM
......allow me to live without running the generator 4+ hours a day every day (which is what's happening right now).

Having to run the generator 4+ hours a day raises a question(s)  ???  I wonder why you think adding more batteries will reduce generator run time?  You add more capacity, okay. If your use remains the same you will still need to replace the power by running the generator. Maybe not as frequently, but it will then run longer. Or at least that is what it seems to me. So I'm not sure there will be any net gain achieved by adding batteries.

If the generator needs to run every day it would seem the PV capacity is insufficient. Or am I missing something here?  If the PV capacity is sufficient the PV system charge controller should be able to bring the batteries through bulk and absorb charge and into float every day.

I must be missing something if more batteries are going to solve the generator run time.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 13, 2013, 09:41:00 AM
If you have 10,000 watts of solar charging power (I do not but I'm using it as an example) and only 1 12v 220AH battery and plan to use enough power to kill the batter inside and hour then adding batteries WILL solve your problem because the solar charging isn't the issue but rather the capacity of the battery bank to hold the power.

In my case I know the solar panels can completely recharge the bank provided there is sun to do so and I'm not killing the bank every night however adding more capacity will increase the reserve that the panels can charge up.   

In another way, your spreadsheet gives a 'total batteries required' and a 'less capacty'.  I've always been in the 'less capacity' zone and would like to ncrease that to the 'total required zone'.

My neighbor who's been living on solar power since 1979 (yes) and has only ~500 watts of solar power (though he has a tracker so increase that by about 25% so I've read) uses a 1000AH battery 12v I believe but am not entirely certain) and runs his generator every weekend (which allows him to use more power and run things like driers etc) and often sits around 70-80% of battery reserve capacity during the week.  I beleive his situation is similar to mine in which he can't afford new panels and knows that he'll run the genny on the weekend to get the reserves up so having the larger bank gives him plenty of power to use during the week without needing to run the genny.

On a side note I'm not using my system the way I designed it and now must recalcuate what I need vs what my system will provide and then try to modify the two in order to find a happy medium.

One thing that I see is that with the boys home dring the day and using power and then watching TV at night has placed a demand on my system that I won't put on it when they are gone so it is likely I'll see less generator use when they leave at the end of next week.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 13, 2013, 10:48:17 AM
Using my current systems (I need to add the stove though it doesn't use much power since it's a propane stove) the calculator now shows the following when using a 24vdc system:

12 batteries (Costco GCB's)
4 Panels (205watt 12vdc panels).

I have 8 batteries and 3 panels so while adding the 4 batteries will bring me up to where i need to be for reserves the missing panel means tht on days I don't get 4 hours of charging I'll not likely have the solar power to get the batteries back to 100%.

My experience using this system for the last 3 years has taught me that is really just a guide and nothing more (a good guide perhaps but a guide none-the-less) and practice will be different.  Good sunny days will likely net no need to use generator....2-3 days without much sun and the genny will run.

I'll add the 4 batteries and next year upgrade the battery bank and add another controller and more panels.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 14, 2013, 12:09:09 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0019_zpsadf138c3.jpg)
After getting the roof sheeted on Friday but much of the room yet to be closed in and insulated we had to shut off water to the hot water heater to prevent it from freezing.  Next morning we were at it early and though it felt warm it was 30 degrees.  Guess it was a good idea to disconnect the hot water!

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0028_zps6a1ea977.jpg)
As Saturday progressed we managed to get most of the room covered in felt (wasn't sure I even needed it but had it so used it) and started putting the insulation on the outside.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0026_zps14511b07.jpg)
Needed some furring so grabed a handful of 1x6's and took them up to the mill where we ripped them down to 1x3's.  Gotta love having a tractor and a mill :)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0031_zps4fbd2212.jpg)
Because the store only had some pink 2" insulation and some of the R13 stuff I had to get both.  I figured it shouldn't make that much of a difference in the end.  Anyway, the exterior was insulated and the roof was also.  Though we have some gaps to plug insulation into and some backfilling to do.

Over the next couple days we have to get ready for the propane install, once it's in place then I can backfill the trench and up to the north wall of the room (left of the door).  The boys still need to pour a pad in front of the door and lay cinder block around it to provide the 'well' for the stairs to allow a person to walk down into the room from ground level.  Once this is done we can backfill the rest of the space around the room and start working on the interior a bit more.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on October 14, 2013, 12:18:45 PM
Eric if you are going to put a sunken stoop at the entrance you might consider putting a drain at that location. Little late for the floor in that addition which would have probably been nice.   Wouldn't take much more than a 2" line to drain it if you can get a line low enough to drain properly.

Also I would imagine that if you could put "underpinning" around the cabin it would probably make a difference in the heating of the cabin.  Not sure whether you insulated the floor but the underpinning would probably help in addition to that.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 14, 2013, 12:21:05 PM
Much craziness went on yesterday as I made trip after trip to town to get parts and pieces to try to finish off the hot water install and the penetration for the hot water heater.  Seems more just ruun them through the wall and then up but the placement of mine meant it needed to go through the roof.  In the end we settled on a wall thimble placed in the roof with two layers of R10 foam (drywall, osb, 2" foam, osb, 2" foam, osb) then two adjustable angle chimney pieces and a chimney cover and cap.  It will be water proof / weather proof once we add the collar required but not in stock, to keep the weather out (basically above the thimble you have the conical piece which gives a wide area of cover and then on the pipe itself is a collar which sheds rain and snow etc away from the middle portion of the 'thimble/collar'.

The hot water is not hooked up in it's permanent fashion as is the cold water and it should be better then ever before.

Once the room was pretty well insulated (on the outside with R10/R13 foam) we stuffed all holes with spray foam and sealed up the room as much as possible and then used some 2" foam and OSB to make a temp door.  This allowed the room to raise to 42 degrees when the hot water heater was running for dishes and showers etc however with temps dropping below 30 outside the room dropped to 36 fairly quickly so, in a bit of a worry I had the boys install the vent free backup propane heater in the room and set it at the lowest possible setting (barely on).  This brought the rooms temp up to 51-58 degrees while it was 26 outside.

I hated doing this because I only have a 5 gallon tank right now but figured it was better to have pipes that weren't frozen and have to buy propane today and tomorrow then to have lots of propane and need a new hot water heater.

So, with the wood stove running in the cabin and a 16x16 inch opening into the new room in the bathroom, with the heater running in the new room as described the cabin stayed about 80 degrees (yes) and the new room about 55 (51-58 as mentioned).

I'm confident now that once the room is completed the 8000 BTU though the wall vented heater should do the trick nicely BUT it occurred to me that I better darn well think about the batteries being in there.  After all, they vent Hydrogen right?  Open flame plus Hydrogen gas equals no more cabin.

Guess I better build a well sealed batter box with a vent -- though I'm uncertain just how smart it is even still to put the batteries in there.


Ahh the challenges of off-grid living!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 14, 2013, 12:24:52 PM
Quote from: Redoverfarm on October 14, 2013, 12:18:45 PM
Eric if you are going to put a sunken stoop at the entrance you might consider putting a drain at that location. Little late for the floor in that addition which would have probably been nice.   Wouldn't take much more than a 2" line to drain it if you can get a line low enough to drain properly.

Also I would imagine that if you could put "underpinning" around the cabin it would probably make a difference in the heating of the cabin.  Not sure whether you insulated the floor but the underpinning would probably help in addition to that.

The floor is insulated with R10 2" foam and I'll be running that out up to 24" to the sides (is this what you mean by 'underpinning'?) where it can be -- some spots I could not get that much (none in the area under the cabin and only 12" on the east side).

Was mad I didn't put in a drain in the room but lack of time and experience resulted in that.

For the stairwell I'd like to get one in but don't think it will happen -- shopvac will have to do I think and then maybe I'll cut one in later (or not)...I plan to cover the entire thing with a roof though in hopes of keeping water out.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 14, 2013, 12:29:22 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/newroom_zps700feff9.jpg)
Here is a shot of the east side of the room which has been backfilled.  On this side there is about 24" of the wall under ground with R10 2" foam on the walls and about 12" of R10 laying flat on the ground at the base of the wall.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on October 14, 2013, 12:42:26 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on October 14, 2013, 12:24:52 PM
The floor is insulated with R10 2" foam and I'll be running that out up to 24" to the sides (is this what you mean by 'underpinning'?) where it can be -- some spots I could not get that much (none in the area under the cabin and only 12" on the east side).

Was mad I didn't put in a drain in the room but lack of time and experience resulted in that.

For the stairwell I'd like to get one in but don't think it will happen -- shopvac will have to do I think and then maybe I'll cut one in later (or not)...I plan to cover the entire thing with a roof though in hopes of keeping water out.

Hindsight is always 20/20  ;).  But having a stoop lower than the surrounding land is inviting a ice skating party entering or exiting the room.

The underpinning that I was referring to is the cabin not the addition.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 14, 2013, 12:46:22 PM
Oy!  LOL I was thinking that wasn't quite right and kept thinking it meant a wall but was a little groggy  c*

Yes I do plan to put some underpinning (pony walls for now) under the cabin.  Eventually I plan to have the foundatioin go all the way around at the outside, then put the deck on etc.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 16, 2013, 05:13:05 PM
Propane installed! :)

Only 275 gallons in the tank so they will have to come out and add to it (to get it to 400 so I'm set for the winter and beyond).

This means I can get my new generator installed!!!!!!  I plan to get it installed this weekend (I'm not there now) and hooked up to charge the system as it.  Then I'll get the room finished and try to build a good rack and enclosure for the batteries :)  Once that's done and I can vent them, then I will install them and plan to add the 4 I found on CL (Still need to pick up).

I'm VERY excited though as it means I won't have to worry about keep the composter room warm for fear of running out of propane!  Plus, it will be a LOT cheaper to run this generator and it will run when needed, on demand :)  I like that!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 18, 2013, 08:02:04 AM
The 8000btu vented through the wall heater arrived too! :D  [cool]

I'm heading back up today after spending a few days at home (for work believe it or not).
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 18, 2013, 07:46:08 PM
So I arrived at the cabin and suddenly realized that I did not have the cabin keys.  I was furious with myself and with the boys since they had the keys last and didn't think to make sure I got them. 

So there I was, 4 1/2 hrs from home (and $120 worth of gas) and no keys to get into the cabin.  Then I remembered that there may still be the spare main key in the truck and the broken key that we replaced with two more (one Darci has and one the boy had).  I rummaged through the truck and found the roken key and the spare to the main door.  Then, after some serious messing arround with a small gerber and a broken key I got the outer door open and was able to get into the cabin.

I realized that I did not have my tractor keys either, so rather pissed I looked about at the mess and dirt and just walked out and began back filling the propane trench by hand.  I'd asked the boys to give me 6 to 8 inches of dirt on top of the propane line but I guess that was too difficult for young men to accomlish and the 3 to 4 inches barely piled on top had to be covered.  So I spent the 30-40 minutes they should have spent backfilling the trench by hand.  Alone I did more then the both of them did and probably in half the time (unless they were just screwing off -- most likely).

I thought at least I'd be able to have a diet coke this evening (since Kurtis drank the last few drinks worth of JD I had -- thanks son, you owe me).  However, the empty diet coke bottle et me in the porch as if to say 'screw you buddy, get you own' --- but it WAS my own.  Grrrrrr kids piss me off some times.

I then set about sweeping up the pig stie that was left for me and after an hour of working away I had the cabin at least somewhat ok to stay in with a fire going and most everything put away.

Next I got out the car stereo and ran power to it, hooked it upand turned it on :)  Nice!  Now at least I have music/radio that not only sounds good but gets stations in easily and can play CD's too.  Life is good eh?

Now if only I had a drink and a little less mess....oh and keys to my tractor so I could backfill the trench and install the generator.  Oh well, you can't have everything I guess.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on October 18, 2013, 08:44:26 PM
Key bimmer!  Re-key the cabin locks to match the house keys.   Just an idea... leave home and lock up, drive, use same key to open up.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Tickhill on October 18, 2013, 08:44:46 PM
OJ, chronic fatigue syndrome is rampant among those born after 1975. Don't ask how I know.
Tickhill
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 18, 2013, 09:02:02 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on October 18, 2013, 08:44:26 PM
Key bimmer!  Re-key the cabin locks to match the house keys.   Just an idea... leave home and lock up, drive, use same key to open up.

Great idea! How does one do that though?  Guess I could ask my locksmith buddy.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 18, 2013, 09:03:18 PM
Quote from: Tickhill on October 18, 2013, 08:44:46 PM
OJ, chronic fatigue syndrome is rampant among those born after 1975. Don't ask how I know.
Tickhill

Seriously!  And they seem to think they are hard done by!  Sheesh.

Now my Champion $300 generator is stating to die.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on October 18, 2013, 09:40:26 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on October 18, 2013, 09:02:02 PM
Great idea! How does one do that though?  Guess I could ask my locksmith buddy.

Remove the keyed lock cylinders from the door and take them to a locksmith or a good hardware store like an Ace or True Value. Most of those do re-keys at $5 a pop. So does Big Blue and Orange for that matter. Might be easier to re=key the home locks to the cabin keys as the doors have to be left with no locks for as long as it takes to go back and forth to the lock shop.  It also reduces the number of keys on your keyring. Small element of danger having everything using same keys I guess, but I think it is a non issue. Axes on doors and concrete blocks through glass trump keys any day anyhow.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 19, 2013, 09:04:37 AM
Quote from: MountainDon on October 18, 2013, 09:40:26 PM
Remove the keyed lock cylinders from the door and take them to a locksmith or a good hardware store like an Ace or True Value. Most of those do re-keys at $5 a pop. So does Big Blue and Orange for that matter. Might be easier to re=key the home locks to the cabin keys as the doors have to be left with no locks for as long as it takes to go back and forth to the lock shop.  It also reduces the number of keys on your keyring. Small element of danger having everything using same keys I guess, but I think it is a non issue. Axes on doors and concrete blocks through glass trump keys any day anyhow.

d* That makes perfect sense!  Thanks!  I could do that easily enough.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on October 19, 2013, 09:40:29 AM
I wasn't this brilliant naturally. I became this smart after driving 1 hr 45 minutes to our cabin and finding myself without keys.    ;D ;D

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: UK4X4 on October 19, 2013, 10:10:40 AM
I have a set left at my site and a set with a friend in the nearest town


after flying for 12 hours the idea of leaving the keys behind makes you a tad paranoid !
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 19, 2013, 08:31:38 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on October 19, 2013, 09:40:29 AM
I wasn't this brilliant naturally. I became this smart after driving 1 hr 45 minutes to our cabin and finding myself without keys.    ;D ;D

LOL a drive that 'short' I'd make!  But alas I'm a good 4+ hours from home so no driving for me.  I took the broken key to Ace and had them make me a new one :D  IT works nicely.

Now to change how I keep keys (as in a set on each vehicle keys) and to plan on changing out the locks some day soon.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 19, 2013, 08:36:17 PM
It is definitely tough sometimes when working alone in a remote location in a building you must also live in.  However I am finding that as long as you remember to take the time to sweep the place up and put things away it isn't too bad.  Of course you must also except that you cannot do everything at once so you pick your battles, for battles they are some times, and take each challenge on one at a time.

Today I'd hoped to get the new heater in place along with finishing the composting toilet install, mortaring in the cinder blocks at the entrance to the compost room and to backfill the area around the room as much as possible.  However, the best laid plans of mice and men as they say and I found myself heading to Home Depot in Omak to pick up a few things I could not get locally.  I did, however, take back $29 worth of valves I didn't need to the local hardware store and while there got a key made for the porch door using a broken key (it works perfectly).  So now we have an extra set of keys that I will put on my truck keyring along with one tractor key when they arrive.  The other set I'll put on my Jeep keys and in that way I will always have a set of keys regardless of what rig I'm driving!

While in Omak I went by Walmart and bought some fruit and salad stuff so I could get back to eating salads and fruit (fruit I started last week thanks to Kurtis McVay).  I arrived back at the cabin around 1PM and set to the task of getting ready to mortar the cinder blocks in.  This is when I discovered I had to have an additive for cold weather so I shifted gears and did some back-filling (shovel work) to work off frustration.

Realizing that I'd not yet started the composting toilet work I set down my shovel, having worked out my frustration at not being able to mortar, and set to figuring out what needed to be done with the 4" vent stack.  That's when I realized that the boys hadn't testing the sewage pipe for clearance.  Can't blame them though as they'd not installed one of these things before.  So, after some testing I got out the sawzall and cut off some of the inlet pipe so it would clear the drum when rotated. 

Next was the vent that I wanted to run up next to the cabin so it could be properly secured to the roof and to do so I needed to add some 45 degree elbows and secure the stack to the rafters.  Once I had the first part done I drilled a 4" hole through the lower portion of the roof (our roof is 1/2" OSB followed by 2" foam board and another sheet of 1/2" OSB) where the vent would go through it and then went onto the roof and offset drilled the next hole so the stack would rise up vertically without any issue.  Once done I was able to work the vent into place and secure it with straps. I was able to wrangle the vent pieces together (I'd already glued most of it on the ground) and though I forgot the rubber seal on the roof side I was able to go back and install it.  Finally I used spray foam to fill the gap so I wouldn't lose any heat out that way  While on the roof I also sealed the propane hot water heater vent with high temp vent sealer.

So, with the 4" stack installed and the sewage pipe installed by the boys earlier (and tailored a little by me) I just needed to put in the overflow and the 2" stack.

The overflow was pretty straight forward and took little time to complete.  It was fortuitous that I decided to set the compost bin on top of 2" foam insulation as it made it easier to ensure the overflow would be at the right height for the outlet we'd installed in the floor.

Next I learned that I would need to find all the parts from the original install of the composter 3 years ago because I would need at least one coupler in order to get the vent going up to the roof at the right spot.  As it was getting late I set it in place, covered it and tested everything as is.  Nothing leaked (thank you Kurtis and Josh Miller) and after a little silicone I was ready to use :) (no I didn't but I now have a functional bathroom again!).

I still need to run some power to the vent fan (easy) and find the parts for the 2" vent (should be in the shed but they aren't really needed anyway so it can't wait).

I didn't get to the heater despite putting in 6 good hours (3 hours I was driving/shopping) but that leaves tomorrow and I did get more backfilling done.  I also prepped the concrete for mortar work and hauled all the bricks over from the stack in the wheel barrow (no tract means I am the tractor).

Finally I made dinner, which thanks to my beautiful and awesome wife, Darci, was really just me warming up meatballs and roasted pineapple and habanero sauce over rice (Darci takes care of me).  For the rest of the evening I'll relax a bit, have a drink and listen to music on the new car stereo, or perhaps watch some TV.  I'll likely be in bed early too -- like last night -- as staying up late burns electricity and I can't afford to do that!

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 19, 2013, 09:18:00 PM
So last night I thought the 6 or 7 year old $300 Champion generator was crapping out.  It was running very roughly and I didn't think it would last the week.  I added oil and hoped for the best since I couldn't install the new backup generator until the weekend now (at the earliest).  So I was stuck hoping the old genny would hang in there.

Then, tonight after my shower I had to go out and set the heater in the composter room and close it up tight for the night and decided to crank up the generator to see if it would run ok after a good warm up.  It started fine as usual and ran ok for a few minutes.  Then it began to run rough again and for whatever reason I decided to hit the choke and see what happened.  The choke lever was loose!  As I went to move the choke I noticed it was moving freely and had no stiffness to it.  I moved it about and the generator struggled, then I held it open and the generator run great again.  Hmmmm......so I wired it open an gee whiz if this old El Cheapo Chinese generator didn't go back to running like a Champion (pun intended) :)

So all is well with the genny and I'll be able to leave the internet running while I flick on the TV to see what's on tonight :D  Sweet!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 20, 2013, 09:01:13 AM
Ahhh Coffee!  Worked hard yesterday so treated my self to some French Vanilla flavoured coffee today :)  See Cabin Life isn't all that rough ;)  Heck I even watched TV last night and am listening to classic rock this morning.

My day will be full though as I need to visit a customer this morning and help them out a little and pick up the stickers I loaned them) then assuming Home Depot has a mortar additive for cold weather I'll make the attempt to lay some bricks.  If I can get that done then I can concentrate on prepping the area the new generator will go this week and if I get the new heater installed (today hopefully) then I can get the auto generator switch installed as well as the battery monitor.

It's going to be a full day!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 20, 2013, 06:57:16 PM
Ahhhh how I want to smack myself d* d* d* d*

I had not checked my batteries in a while, a long while, and knowing that they were not holdin a charge well I finally got around to clearing them off (note to self:  don't use the box as a storage place) and checking them.  Let me put it this way:   d* >:( :(

The plates were showing on all cells of 6 of the 8 batteries.

I kept thinking "Damn I wish I paid more attention to MountainDon's posts!"  and to others.  So to those of you who have stressed battery care and maintenance my hats off to you.  I feel like a dunce really because you simply cannot ignore things like this and I KNOW IT!  But still I ignored the batteries for too long and undoubtedly am paying for it.  So, I added water.  Pure water (the best I had was 99% pure eye wash water I brought from work because they were going to toss it (it was 2014 dated but they wanted 2016).  I topped all cells off, started a charge with the genny (since the sun is starting to drop behind the trees and then read NOT to top them off just yet  d* d* d* d* d* d*

OK so at least I didn't overfill but it seems it's best to cover the plates THEN after fully charged to top them off to 1/8" from the bottom of the well.

I guess better over then under.

Now I need to know what Glenn puts in his batteries (Hydrogen Peroxide?  Something like that?) to descale them (right?) 

I still plan to get the other 4 which are about the same age (sounds like some are the same age and some are a tad newer).

On a side note the 2 yr old batteries were not down much in water whereas the 3 yr old ones were.  I found that interesting.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 20, 2013, 11:18:40 PM
This morning I ran to a customers in Okanogan to pick up some stickers I'd loaned them after milling up about 600 board feet of pine this summer and I brought along my plane since they were having issues with one they rented.  The Dewalt they rented just wouldn't plane anything and after some fiddling around I pulled out my trusty and beaten up Ryobi and what do ya know?  It worked like a charm and I left it with them on the agreement that they would return it when done with a bottle of Jack Daniels as payment ;)

We had a nice chat an then I headed to HD to check on additives for mortar in cold climates.  You'd think they would have that sort of thing since this is a place that can get cold...but no luck.  SO I headed home and determined to go ahead and do the mortaring anyway.  After all it was very warm out and likely to be warm all night (might get to freezing in the morning but certainly not for a while. and the mortaring had planned was for a retaining wall anyway.  So with that in mind I set to the task and completed, mostly, the work I needed to get done.  I then spent a little time cleaning up before tackling the batteries (posted above).
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 20, 2013, 11:28:15 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/composterentrance_zps51eb0ea1.jpg)
The retaining wall entrance to the new room.  It aint fancy but I think it will work.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/cabinadditions_zps925005a2.jpg)
Here you can see the propane tank (50 gals), the new addition and the now heavily covered and insulated retaining wall structure.  With luck it will be ready for backfilling as son as I get my tractor key and am here to do the work (have to go to meetings Wednesday and Thursday).
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 21, 2013, 09:23:16 PM
Hmmmmm......

So I got home and whipped out my voltmeter and checked voltages on each battery, then pulled out my hygrometer and came up with the following:

1. 6.34 - 1.200/1.225/1.225
2. 6.36 - 1.200/1.200/1.225
3. 6.36 - 1.225/1.225/1.225
4. 6.34 - 1.225/1.225/1.225
5. 6.33 - 1.220/1.220/1.220
6. 6.37 - 1.225/1.225/1.220
7. 6.35 - 1.220/1.220/1.220
8. 6.34 - 1.187/1.187/1.187

Interestingly enough the 1.187 battery was NOT one of the batteries that had low water  ???

So if memory serves Trojan recommends equalizing if there is a 0.015 deviation between cells after fully charged and while I cannot be certain they were fully charged I'd say it's high time I did some equalizing.

So I got the generator fired up, used a hand pump to syphon gas out of an ATV because I was about out of fule in the Genny and the can, set the Iota charger to equalize (so I thoiught) and flipped the breaker.  I marked the time and 20 minutes later checked voltage and found the ban k at 14.2.  Hmmm  ???  Checking the book I discovered that I was wrong and the Iota does not equalize. d*  It just has two settings:  13.6 and 14.2 

So with that I took it off the 14.2 setting and let it drop back o 13.6 figuring that the batteries were supposed to be charged when I arrived (which we will see they were not so I'm not sure what I was thinking).

Anyway, looking at the voltages I see that according to trojan a voltage of 6.31 should be 90% of charge and all of my batteries showed 6.33 or better (see above).  This would stand to reason since the sun wasn't hitting the panels at all and I had a fridge and freezer running.

Next looking at the specific gravity Trojan shows 1.217 at 70% of charge and all mine were 1.220 or better except that one battery mentioned above.  ???

OK Admittedly my eyes are getting tired and I had to switch to my 2.50x readers in order to read the numbers on the hygrometer (or is it hydrometer ??? ) and I didn't get specific (no pun intended).  If it was within a line of 1.220 I called it 1.220 etc.  Only time I noticed a real difference was when I saw the one batter well low of the others.

So, either my SG readings are off or my votages are off or the SG readings are more accurate and I ought to go with them but then it begs the question:  If it was just 5:30PM and the panels had sun at least a couple hours ago then shouldn't they be higher then that? Well of course.

And thus I'm worried about the batteries.

Worst still is that I cannot equalize until Saturday or Sunday since I won't be here during peak sun hours to do so and need the inverter to remain on.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 21, 2013, 09:34:41 PM
Typing away I left the door to the wood stove open (I was starting a fire to warm the place up and had left it cracked a bit to get it going) an heard a roar.  Strange I thought, is someone coming?  Then I heard cracking and popping in the stove pipe and realized OH CRAP!  I left the door open and probably came VERY close to starting a chimney fire!  I'm only guessing but I'm sure it was creosote burning in the flue.  Maybe not, hopefully not but I tamped down the stove and it eventually stopped and the hot smell the stove pipe was giving off started to lesson.

Dammit!  I can't get careless like that can I?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 21, 2013, 09:39:16 PM
Back to my batteries.

Looking at the log on my MPPT controller I see that I had only 133 minutes of absorption charging today with a max voltage of 14.56 an a low of 11.84 (which I presume was during the fridge or freezer cycling which of course drops the voltage).

I'm running Linux on this laptop so I don't know if I can get MSView to work on it easily or not but I'll have to try so I can get more data.  The panels produced 1720 watt hours (122.8 AH) of charging today.

The voltage suggests they dropped to about 65% discharged though I'm not certain of that since I know when the Freezer stops the voltage pops right back up.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on October 21, 2013, 10:53:45 PM
QuoteIf it was within a line of 1.220 I called it 1.220 etc. 

Temperature corrected??

Cold raises the sp gr. Hydrometers are calibrated at 80 F. Electrolyte temperatures
above or below 80 F must be adjusted. For every 10 F increment below 80 F, subtract 0.004
to the hydrometer readings, and for each 10 F increment above 80 F, add 0.004 to the
readings.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on October 21, 2013, 10:56:08 PM
Quoteeither my SG readings are off or my votages are off or the SG readings are more accurate

SG are the most accurate, when read accurately. Voltages are always suspect because of the way they change with charge and discharge currents.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 21, 2013, 11:20:32 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on October 21, 2013, 10:53:45 PM
Temperature corrected??

Cold raises the sp gr. Hydrometers are calibrated at 80 F. Electrolyte temperatures
above or below 80 F must be adjusted. For every 10 F increment below 80 F, subtract 0.004
to the hydrometer readings, and for each 10 F increment above 80 F, add 0.004 to the
readings.

No.  So if I understand then  need to subtract about 0.008-0.010 from those readings so my SG of 1.200 is really 1.192?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 21, 2013, 11:22:13 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on October 21, 2013, 10:56:08 PM
SG are the most accurate, when read accurately. Voltages are always suspect because of the way they change with charge and discharge currents.

It seems that I need to completely disconnect power for 6 hrs before checking accurately but I can't do that.  As it was I killed the power so there was no draw when checking but again, probably not nearly as accurate as I need to be.  THis weekend I'll see what I can come up with after fully charging and equalizing.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 25, 2013, 11:26:59 PM
I have been very busy this week!  But not on the cabin.  I had to travel to Spokane for meetings with the management team for Eastern WA and left Wednesday to return today.  I was a little worried because I had to leave the fridge and freezer running and the batteries are just barely keeping up with demands but I was happy to see them fully charged (or mostly) when I arrived tonight.  They had dropped to 11.7vdc each morning but charged back up during the day so while that's deeper then I'd like to see them discharged each day I picked up 4 batteries to add to the bank and plan to get the backup generator installed this weekend so I can mitigate that by having it run when the batteries are down about 50%.  I'm hoping the magnum auto gen start is able to be set for the right voltage to do that but am not certain it will.  However with the additional batteries I'm hoping it will. 

My plan is to equalize the battery bank tomorrow and with luck I'll get the cables to add the 4 batteries I picked up.  Then with luck I'll see some improvement.  One thing I noted was that I'm not getting the full absorption minutes I need on the bank right now.  I'm getting around 120 to 135 minutes of absorption and no float so having the batteries hang in there with that I think I'm doing ok.

With the new genny added I should be ok for the winter.

Also, the new room is working!  I has stayed between 48 and 60 degrees despite freezing weather and without the proper heater installed (the one that is in there is set very low so it could be raised a bit to warm it up more but I'd prefer to finish the room and install the right heater first).

Cabin was 50 degrees when I arrived tonight but I've gotten it warmed up nicely with the wood stove and while the water is low I now have the weekend to resolve that issue also.  So, I'll be busy this weekend but happy that the batteries are doing their thing ok since I added water.

Tomorrow I'll fire up the generator in the morning to charge them up a bit before the sun hits the panels, then when I have full sun I'll start the equalize.  I have to do that with the 8 I have installed because I don't have cabling for the new ones but at least I should, I hope, get the bank in better shape in the meanwhile.

Next weekend will be the real test since I'll be gone for 5 days for my daughters wedding.  THen I'll be back a week before taking a long weekend again so I better get the 2nd heater installed and the backup generator!  I'm really hoping that when all is said and done I can keep things energized without seeing the batteries nearly die over night!  Wish me luck!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: considerations on October 26, 2013, 08:58:11 AM
I am watching with interest. This will be my first winter with a new solar array and battery bank as well. Conditions change radically in winters here, shorter daylight hours, colder panels, colder batteries...who knows how things will turn out?

Brace yourself for a lecture from at least one of our emeritus members about letting your bank dip down below 12 volts. They got me to set the low battery cut out level at 12.1.  ;D

Oh yeah...and I got religious about changing the oil in the gens.

The adventure continues... c*
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 26, 2013, 09:03:41 PM
Oh I know!  I HATE to see the batteries dropping like that and only hope they will hang in there until late spring.  Meanwhile I did some work today :)

First I got out and started the generator so the batteries would be relatively charged up before the sun hit the panels.  THen when the sun was hitting the panels hard I set up the charge controller to equalize and let it go.  THat was a bit of an adventure becuase you have to set the controller to do so, but tell it to run every 0 days so it won't auto equalize, then you can hit the button for 5 seconds and start the cycle.  That took me a bit to figure out and some readin.

I marked the time when I started and since I'd aleady been out backfilling the propane line trench and around the new room I took a break, sharpened up my chain saw and went and dropped 5 ot 6 trees that were blocking my well pump panel.  Then I checked the specific gravity of the batteries to see where they were after 45 minutes:

1.  1.235/1.225/1.230
2.  1.250/1.235/1.245
3.  1.250/1.250/1.250
4.  1.250/1.250/1.235
5.  1.250/1.250/1.245
6.  1.260/1.260/1.250
7.  1.250/1.250/1.230
8.  1.235/1.250/1.235

I went back to backfilling and working the ground around the back room where the generator was going to be installed and checked the batteries again at 58 minutes.

1.  1.250/1.260/1.250
2.  1.250/1.250/1.250
3.  1.250/1.255/1.250
4.  1.250/1.250/1.250
5.  1.250/1.250/1.250
6.  1.250/1.250/1.250
7.  1.250/1.250/1.250
8.  1.250/1.250/1.250

THe equalize stopped at that point so I ran it again for 15-20 minutes but remembering something about overheating the batteries I shut it down.  At least my last readings were very good (Fair on the SG meter but good because they were within tollerance of one another) if not 'GOOD' for batteries that have been equlized for over an hour.

So with the batteries equalized and the sun still out and charging them and having reconfigured the controller to better match the batteries according to Trojan I went back to work on the back room and backfilling the space for the generator. 

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20131026_135017_388_zps2705ecd0.jpg)
Luckily I have a tractor and forks for it and I was able to move the generator into place.  I hooked up the line provided by the gas company but need to get some BI Pipe and do it right.  I'll work on that in the future but for now I managed to get the line ran into the generator and leak free.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20131026_135024_567_zps2a68bbd1.jpg)
You can see the backfilling.  Some of it was done by hand but mostly the tractor did the work.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20131026_135031_920_zps540b188e.jpg)
Not the best lighting but you get the idea :)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20131026_173208_624_zpsd3645d73.jpg)
Blurry but this is the Iota 55a charger now hooked up to a wall outlet which goes outside.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20131026_173416_418_zpsf1d5d71d.jpg)
I temp ran some romex from the outlet to the genny -- originally this outlet was meant to be run to the portable generator inside a dog house so I could just run it and charge the batteries as needed but living here calls for some changes.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20131026_173433_368_zps2596b8f9.jpg)
Again, just a temp set up until I can get a breaker box installed on the outside of the room and then run into the room and to the charger from there.  That will take some time though.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20131026_173450_964_zps79fee117.jpg)
A closer shot of the ground work and genny

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20131026_173515_041_zpsf1d2eac8.jpg)
ANd the cabin as it sits tonight

I'm running the generator now and it's nice to be able to kust go out and flip the switch.  WIll be nicer though when I can let the auto start do the work c*
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 26, 2013, 10:47:52 PM
Ran the genny for 3.4 hrs today and am hoping the batteries will hold above 12.1vdc tonight.  We shall see!

Meanwhile I noticed the back room seems to have a more stable temp since backfilling around it.  I'm hoping that once I've completely backfilled the area around the room that the insualtion will make it easier to hold the temp above 50 degrees for the composter since it was dropping to 48 on cold nights.  Might need to increase the setting on the heater but then it's not the right heater for the room and I need to get the right one installed which I HOPE to do tomorrow after getting the generator auto start configured and fixing the well pump.

Wish me luck I guess!

Meanwhile the TV is off, the wood stove is loaded and I'm thinking it will be an early nice since I don't want to waist too much power with lights (not using power for the laptop until the batter dies and I'll be done before then though I am leaving the modem and wireless router on since I am the manager on call this weekend -- just got notified today -- and need to know if anyone is trying to contact me via email in the middle of the night since my cell doesn't work other then on the net out here.  I need that network extender!  But that takes more power....ahhh the life).
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on October 27, 2013, 04:49:11 AM
Sounds like you are living the life.

I hate to say this but remember the temps now are not what they will be especially with Gore-lobal warming kicking in.  For a few months you and us as well will be in the cold zone.

According to the 'Almanac' we have a couple more good weeks then it will go to POT..... oopppsss sorry forgot you live in Washington.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 27, 2013, 09:02:49 AM
Oh I know!  I have a lot of wood to cut and chop and put away too :(  No rest for the weary!

I am happy to report that the batteries were at 12.33v this morning!  So after about 10 hours of runing the fridge and freezer as well as the HugesNet modem and the wireless router the batteries are still sitting at about 65% of capacity.  I'm thinking that when the frige or freezer are running that will report lower like possibly sub 12v) but once they are done cycling the bank recovers to this level.  I'll have to play with the generator setting so it doesn't come on every tiime the fridge sparks up.

Of course I'd like to see that up around 95% but considering the abuse they have taken and the length of their life (golf cart batteries are only about a 3 to 5 year battery when used like this - so I'm told) I'd say that's pretty good.  And considering I'll be adding 4 more to the bank (taking it from 8 to 12) then I'm guessing I should be able to make it more then one long night before the generator needs to run ;)

Speaking of which, it was nice to just walk out and hit the 'manual' button and hear it come to life and start to power the cabin again (which means charging up the batteries).  I'll run it a couple hours this morning to get the batteries back up 85-95% and then let it rest while I work on the auto start.

Only bad news I have this morning is that it rained last night and is still drizzling a bit.  Why bad news?  Becuase if the sun doesn't come out today I won't have much luck getting the solar panel charging system running.  I do have a backup pan though for today:  4 golf cart batteries that I can wheel over to the well and maybe hook up in series to give me the 24vdc I need to run the pump.  Only problem I see at the moment is that I'm not sure I have cables to hook them up with.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 27, 2013, 09:55:21 PM
First up today was the well.  I did a fair amount of digging and found the broken wires.  Fixed those, rewired the float into the pump and buried the wires as well as the conduit to the solar panels with all the wire running through it. 
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20131027_101723_972_zps56d1aebd.jpg)
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20131027_110212_145_zps6d3fd703.jpg)

WHile doing that a nice 2 point buck and his mate came by to visit.  THey hung out for at least an hour!!!  Pics to follow.
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20131027_102338_900_zps61b9daf6.jpg)
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20131027_102225_212_zps448cb9c5.jpg)
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20131027_102044_343_zps10fb3fac.jpg)

Next the generator experience went into overdrive today.  First I tried to wire it up so it would charge off the inverter since it needs 120vac for the generator charger on the battery.  After much farting around I finally realized that is why they say you MUST have an inverter in order to run the generator...and inverter/charger in fact.

So realizing time was running out I ripped into the battery bank and converted to 24vdc, reconfigured the charge controller and hooked up the new inverter.  Once done I got the generator rewired for the new inverter and finally had both the battery charger on the generator hooked up and the generator hooked up to the inverter to power the cabin.

I then set to hooking up the Magnum Auto Gen start switch and after many trips back and forth and downloading manuals and diagrams I realized I could not use the autogen start until I got more wires.  I need one more to run over to the generator for the gen running sensor in the autostart switch.  Once done I should be set.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 28, 2013, 07:33:41 AM
Good morning world! 

Can't say I slept well last night, nor that I wanted to get up wen my alarm went off but it is what it is right?  Seems my sinuses DID NOT like me climbing around under the cabin nor digging and backfilling lines etc and punished me over time last night.  So at around 2am having only slept a few hours so far and fitful at that, I took some afrin actually the Western Family version) and cleared up my sinuses :)  THen it was off to bed and SLEEP!  Then my alarm went off and it was 5am and time to get the coffee going, and oh that coffee tasteth the best!!!

So after shaving I went and cranked up the laptop and waited for the fridge and freezer to stop cycling.  Once they quit I checkd power and it was 24.38vdc and rising!  Saw it climb to over 24.4v as I went out to hit the start button on the generator to kick it into life and give the batteries a short recharge before heading to work.

Last night as I was laying in bed I realized that I had about 50 feet of speaker wire and that the wire I needed for the generator didn't need to be big -- a match made in heaven perhaps ;)  But I also took bag over $40 of stuff to Home Depot recently that I didn't have receipts for and the girl got confused when I wanted the credit on our account and gave me a gift card with the credit on it instead.  So I'll pick up the romex and stuff I need today and fix the recepticle problem for the freezer and wire up the last wire to the auto gen start while I'm at it.

THen if I could just figure out the stupid lights on the charge controller I'd be set! :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: considerations on October 28, 2013, 08:00:26 AM
Electrical and plumbing both seems to require more trips to the store per project than any other type of work on these little houses. I can relate, but sounds like you are getting more comfortable by the day. Wouldn't I love to have a push button gen.  [cool]
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 29, 2013, 12:00:39 PM
So while fighting the 'how to hook up' bug with the new Auto Gen Switch etc I went into a panic when after seeing my inverter quit charging I put my multimeter into the socket the generator feeds and saw voltage readings around 135vac.  I was in a panic and thought maybe the inverter stopped excepting the power from the generator because of this.  After all, it's designed to cut off shore power that is in the excess of 135vac or below 90vac (that can be adjusted to a tighter range if needed).

Later out of curiosity I tested the output power again and it was 140vac and climbing!  YIKES!

Atill later I checked the inverter power and it showed over 140vac  ??? ??? ???

I began to suspet my 10 year old Greenlee Multimeter.  Today I bought it into the shop and tested the jacks on the wall.  First read 118vac, uh oh I thought, but dilligent in my testing (I'm known in my field as a good troubleshooter) I tested another outlet and got 121vac, then 125vac, 129, 130, 135....something aint right.  One of my techs pulled out his Fluke and it read 120vac on the same outlet my Greenlee was reading 129.9vac.

My meter went into the trash and I felt a LOT better about my readings!!!!  Now time to buy a new meter ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 29, 2013, 01:39:46 PM
Had a very good chat with Magnum Energy about the auto gen start switch and it's settings.  One thing I've often struggled with is the voltage levels shown on my MPPT controller.  Often the low voltage is around 11.9vdc (when it was a 12v bank) and while I knew that was likely under a load without specifics one cannot tell.  Then this discussion confirmed what I thought and likely what someone like Don or Glenn have or would say which is 'don't trust the controller!' lol

So, with Magnum on the phone I discussed what setting to use on my system with my inverter and the consensus was 11.5v (which is really 23v on a 24v bank) so that when the batteries are under a load for more then one minute or when the bank is depleted to 23vdc the switch will kick on the generator and recharge the bank.

Which confirms my previus belief that my system was not as depleted as I thought it was, it was just running the freezer or fridge and showing lwer.

Now to fix some other issues.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 29, 2013, 03:52:17 PM
The answer to my inverter question (why it stopped charging) was to use setting #1 so the inverter would kick to AC power and charge the batteries, once fully charged it would go into float on the batteries until the generator stops and remain on AC from the generator until that time allowing me to run various other things on Generator AC only circuits.

In the other setting (o) the generator remains in inverter mode and stops charging once the batteries are topped off.  which means it detected a fully charged condition each evening and determined that it did not need to keep charging the batteries.

On a side note the two wire start on the inverter was designed for AGM systems aparently which on a 12v battery their engineer tells me, at 10.9v it is still not fully disharged.  In fact he claimed it was at 50% which shocked me.  Not sure I agree but I'm not an electrical engineer! lol

So, I'll switch to setting 1 and let you know what happens :)  I've also got a new voltmeter (multi) and some fuses to complete my Magnum install.  With luck I'll get that done this evening and be fully operational! :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on November 01, 2013, 11:16:50 AM
So what is the status?  Did you get it all ironed out?  Inquiring minds would like to know.  ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 02, 2013, 10:56:07 AM
Wedding weekend for daughter so no time.  But in short no.  Had to leave and get back to it next week.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on November 02, 2013, 07:05:15 PM
Quote from: Tickhill on October 18, 2013, 08:44:46 PM
OJ, chronic fatigue syndrome is rampant among those born after 1975. Don't ask how I know.
Tickhill

I'm usually fortunate enough to have access to my kid.  When he does what he calls a "hard hour of work", I'll go out and do a hard half hour of work and then grab him and point out to him that this 58 yo fart just did 4 times as much in 1/2 the time as the 16 yo strapping young buck did.  Then I ask him, "You gonna lat a 58 yo, broken down old man show you up?"  (if his GF is there, it's even better).  Usually, I'll cut him a little slack since he doesn't have the 'experience' that I do and let him do as much in an hour as I did in a 1/2 hour.  ;D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 04, 2013, 12:41:40 PM
Back at the cabin after a 5 day period away and I discovered some things I didn't like!  One I'd left the stove on (under the coffee pot)!!!  It was on low and the coffee pot was a little smelly but otherwise all was ok....just something I cannot afford to do again!  Yikes!

To top that off I saw the battery bank in alarm and the logs show my 24v bank had dropped to 17.9vdc on day and 20.1vdc another!  YIKES!  I ran the generator for about 3 hours and got the bank mostly charged up before bed but worry that I'm losing time to get this resolved.  On top of that my generator had a warning to 'inspect battery' and my charge controller was not working correctly.  It showed voltages for each day but did not show charging.  Odd that the voltage showed fairly high but at no time did it show absorbtion or float time so either it never got out of bulk or it's having issues.  I'll check it today when the sun is up but I'm a little worried about that and the interface was not working correctly.

I'm about ready to buy a new controller frankly as I'm tired of this Morningstar controller giving me issues.  As it is it shows alarms when there shouldn't be one (yellow red condition when it should be green/yellow and I can't get it to change).

Hate to have to spend the hundreds of dollars a new Outback would cost me but then I hate to lose the battery bank or constantly use the generator to keep it charged up....something must be fixed soon!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on November 04, 2013, 02:15:05 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on November 04, 2013, 12:41:40 PM
On top of that my generator had a warning to 'inspect battery' and my charge controller was not working correctly. 

Eric I wouldn't worry too much about the battery.  I set my search watts at only 5W and I used to get that all the time.  Each time for a bit I would check the voltage and it was OK so I knew it was something else.  Probably it occured when you bank dropped off. 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 04, 2013, 08:53:46 PM
My laptop hard drive is GOOD!!!!! Thanks Eric Mehling!  Seems it had just come loose because it is shorter then the slot it's on on this laptop and there isn't a noticeable le way to secure it.  So I re-inserted it and folded up some cardboard to jam behind it so it won't come loose again!

Now I need to get back to getting Wine to work in Linux so I can run the software I have to configure my charge controller and with luck I can get that sorted too :)

Got home this evening a little early since I was up in Oroville and so I ran up to the cistern on the ATV (the Cistern is full now) and backfilled the dirt around it to help prevent icing up in this mid 20 degree weather.  I then got into the back room and turned up the heat on the hot water and tried venting it a bit.  Still something is causing the system to run a little slow but I'll figure it out.

Then I went to the wood shed and peeled the bark off a few loads of firewood and hauled it into the cabin.  Peeling the bark off reduces the creosote build up and makes it easier to keep the cabin clean).

Finally I set about making dinner which easy because my wife loves me :)  I just warmed up some mixed rice, gravy and roast beef while eating a salad :)  Mmmm the taste of home :)

I should also mention that earlier today I came up to check on the power and noticed that at 1:15pm there ere shadows forming on the solar panels.  This explains much and whole I dropped some small trees today to help with this I have a few big pines I need to remove (which were marked for removal a log time ago) in order to get another hour of charging during the day this time of year.  So I fired up the generator which was clear of alarms and left it to fully charge the battery bank.  It's still charging now though I suspect it's not in bulk or absorption any more.  ANYWAY, all of that is good news so I will do some relaxing tonight :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 04, 2013, 08:54:48 PM
Quote from: Redoverfarm on November 04, 2013, 02:15:05 PM
Eric I wouldn't worry too much about the battery.  I set my search watts at only 5W and I used to get that all the time.  Each time for a bit I would check the voltage and it was OK so I knew it was something else.  Probably it occured when you bank dropped off.

Yup., I think that's it.  IN fact I think it might also be (or is only) my sleep mode in the inverter .  To test that I shut the sleep mode off and left the inverter on all day and the alarm cleared and has not come back.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 04, 2013, 10:59:33 PM
OK!  With WINE working on my laptop I was able to install MSView and download the logs off the controller and reprogram it with some slight setting changes.  I did this to see what it will do when off the generator and back to battery bank power and solar panels only.

I'm also happy to report that the change I made to the hot water (increased the flame setting) worked to increase the water temp significantly :)  I needed this with the very cold water I get from the cistern in the winter.  I'm also happy to report that my shower is working again too! :)  So ya, just a few more things to iron out and maybe I'll be able to startliving a little!

Meanwhile I'm going to reconfigure the Magnum Auto Start Switch to two wire start only and let it just start and run the generator for a few hours if the bank drops below 23.5vdc.  This should buy me some time I think.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 04, 2013, 11:40:31 PM
 d* d* d*

You cannot wire the auto start that way.....DOH!  I need the sense wire so I'll have to work on it this weekend.

Been running the gen for about 7 hours today.  Probably longer then I should but I wanted to give the battery bank a good charge and then float it for a while to see if that makes a difference come morning...and while doing that I'm watching TV so don't want to switch it off just yet.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 05, 2013, 01:04:53 AM
Quote13-11-05T05:34:00.035+00:00","26.31","Green"
"2013-11-05T05:34:05.034+00:00","26.28","Green Yellow"
Logger showing the state change going to 'Green/Yellow' well above 100% SOC

Quote"2013-11-05T05:35:05.035+00:00","25.88","Green Yellow"
"2013-11-05T05:35:10.035+00:00","25.85","Yellow"
Just above 100% and it drops to Yellow

Quote"2013-11-05T05:40:30.035+00:00","25.29","Yellow"
"2013-11-05T05:40:35.033+00:00","25.28","Yellow Red"
Close to 95% and it gets to Yellow/Red

I stopped logging then because the normal state these days is the Yellow Red state and while I ought to find out when it drops below Red I think I can deal with that alter.  At least I now have something to show Morningstar.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 05, 2013, 08:40:18 AM
This morning the batteries were better then a 60% state of charge (the fridge or freezer was running so I'm guessing the voltage which was at 24.41vdc would have bounced to 24.5 or better when they cycle off) which I'm happy with but I am running the gen for an hour anyway to ensure they stay that way while I am at work.

Why you ask?  Because it's snowing!

Yep, that's right, it's snowing and a big wake up call for me.  I must get a lot done this weekend (since it's getting too dark to do much of anything after work):

1.  Fix generator auto start switch wiring so the auto start works.
2.  Insulate pipes under cabin to prevent freezing
3.  Install 8000 BTU heater in the compost room and install 18000 BTU heater in the cabin as backup heat.
4.  Buck up downed trees and drag logs to the sawmill
5.  Buck up tree left overs and haul to wood shed for drying
6.  Cut poles and install on open side of woodshed and finish roofing.
7.  Roof new room
8.  Seeks out dead standing trees, fall, buck, split and stack in wood shed.

and that's just a taste!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: considerations on November 05, 2013, 09:28:06 AM
"and that's just a taste!"

Yeah, but if you hated it you would have rented an apartment.   c*
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 05, 2013, 04:04:13 PM
Quote from: considerations on November 05, 2013, 09:28:06 AM
"and that's just a taste!"

Yeah, but if you hated it you would have rented an apartment.   c*

no doubt!  ;D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 05, 2013, 04:12:32 PM
Looked at the Generac wiring diagram and after some thought have decided that I have the sense wire to my generator wired correctly and so, giving that I've decided that I need to run a ground from the battery bank to the generator battery - (Neg) terminal and see what happens then.

I also picked up some ground rods since I have only one installed and that one inadequately (hit rock about 5 feet down and stopped cold.  Decided to get back to it later and never did).

With luck the 10awg stranded wire I have will be fine for a ground between the two batteries and I'll run the heavy copper wire I have for my ground rod to the ground terminal in my Midnight Solar panel (yes it's without a ground at this point).

Then I can finally start pounding in some new ground rods and perhaps with 3 of them I can get a decent ground at my rocky place and perhaps, with luck, the system will perform just a little better.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on November 05, 2013, 06:09:13 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on November 05, 2013, 04:12:32 PM
Looked at the Generac wiring diagram and after some thought have decided that I have the sense wire to my generator wired correctly and so, giving that I've decided that I need to run a ground from the battery bank to the generator battery - (Neg) terminal and see what happens then.

I also picked up some ground rods since I have only one installed and that one inadequately (hit rock about 5 feet down and stopped cold.  Decided to get back to it later and never did).

With luck the 10awg stranded wire I have will be fine for a ground between the two batteries and I'll run the heavy copper wire I have for my ground rod to the ground terminal in my Midnight Solar panel (yes it's without a ground at this point).

Then I can finally start pounding in some new ground rods and perhaps with 3 of them I can get a decent ground at my rocky place and perhaps, with luck, the system will perform just a little better.

There should be a DC/Neg bus bar under the cover of the control panel.  I would ground it there as the generator battery ground terminates at that as well. Not real sure but if something goes aray you could end up loosing something by tieing the grounds on different voltages together.   ???    In addition as long as you are breaking rock you might consider grounding the generator as well.  There is a ground lug on the back ouside housing I think right behind where the selenoid sits on the inside. That should protect you a little more by tieing your grounds to the generator buss which is rod grounded .   Stands to reason that there needs to be a ground to the AGS as you are pulling a pos off of the fuel selenoid and there is nothing to make that completed circuit.  I believe mine goes to the prewired DC/AC breaker before going to the AGS from that neg DC buss.  Being that you have a different inverter it may wire differently than the Magnum inverter. But it looks like Position # 4 is that neg from the battery bank as well as the Generator battery & Hour meter fuel selenoid.

This should have been with your AGS but in case it wasn't then here it is. Pretty straight forward on the connections.

http://www.magnumenergy.com/Literature/Gen%20Wiring%20Diagrams/Generac/ME-AGS-N%20%28Generac%20ECO%20Generators%29%20Rev%207-14-2011.pdf

This is from an engineer that sets these up.  Just a little more helpfull

Your battery bank connects to position 3 of the AGS. Position 2 is for the signal coming from the hour meter. Magnum's documents show a 5-amp fuse. That's larger than necessary, but 5-amp automotive fuses are easy to get. While installing the fuses, remember they should be near (within a few inches) the battery end of the wire - not near the AGS. While the drawing shows the wires going directly to the batteries, I connect them to the bus bars in the breaker enclosure. That way only the large cables are being connected to the batteries.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 05, 2013, 06:40:18 PM
Did a little research and it seems it's ok to have different voltages grounded to the same rod.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on November 05, 2013, 06:58:55 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on November 05, 2013, 06:40:18 PM
Did a little research and it seems it's ok to have different voltages grounded to the same rod.

Yes the ground rod I would have to agree.  I would just be worried about grounding your battery bank to the generator battery.

I also sent you a PM
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 05, 2013, 10:32:40 PM
Quote from: Redoverfarm on November 05, 2013, 06:58:55 PM


Yes the ground rod I would have to agree.  I would just be worried about grounding your battery bank to the generator battery.

I also sent you a PM

Looked it up and only references I found so far were related to robots and logic circuits but all of those seemed to think that unless there is a high voltage and low voltage circuit and logic is involved then it would be ok....guess I don't know for sure though.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 06, 2013, 12:25:20 PM
Going to stop by the cabin today and check voltage on the battery terminals on the controller and on the batteries themselves and then report that back to Morningstar.  They are wondering if there is a voltage drop somewhere causing the LED's to read incorrectly.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 06, 2013, 11:54:52 PM
Tried reprogramming the controller and forcing an eprom update.  Maybe that will solve the issue with the LED's but if not I'll install the battery monitor this weekend :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: UK4X4 on November 07, 2013, 07:57:44 AM
 
you can often get wandering voltages and signals with electronics when the equipment does not have a common earth

All systems should have their earths common bonded

You can have multiple earth rods -as long as they are all tied together

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on November 07, 2013, 12:10:13 PM
Try to find some flat braided wire (http://"http://www.amazon.com/Tinned-Copper-Braid-Bright-Length/dp/B003HGHQYM") for connecting the grounds together.  1/4" is ok, but 1/2 or wider would be better.  Use this to tie the ground rods together and the equipment to the ground rods.

If you tie the equipment to a ground close to it, and then tie the rods together with a heavy (thick) strap, the voltage drop between grounds will be negligible and should not affect your circuit.  Tying the battery ground to the rest of the DC ground shouldn't be a problem.  If I recall, you don't want to mix the DC and the AC grounds together.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 07, 2013, 03:55:51 PM
I'm using solid copper wire for my ground wire to the rod and using copper bar between the batteries.

On a side note I've begun to consider the flaw in my compost room design.  You see, I planned to put my solar power in there and keep the batteires nice and warm but then I thought:  what about hydrogen gas?  It occurred to me that the heater is basically an 'open flame' and flames and batteries don't mix well unless you want them to go BOOM.

Once I realized this little flaw I first thought I could build a sealed 'closet' for the batteries to reside in but the more I think about it the more I think it's probably just not a good idea.  So, for now I'll leave them on the porch as is and use the room for storage.  Maybe I'll put the freezer in there as it will be cooler then on the porch in summer and warmer then on the porch in winter.

This also puts me back to square one in which I have to once again consider how to keep the batteries above freezing in the winter.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on November 07, 2013, 04:10:30 PM
A good, hefty solid wire is good, too.  The braided stuff is a bit easier to work with because it's a bit more flexible, and other reasons as well (which I used to be able to say, but without researching it again ... it's heck getting old) Back in the day, when I was in Tech School, I could have told you exactly what to use for best results ... but I think with what you've got going you'll be fine.

As for your batteries, the idea of putting them in the new "room" would have been great, as you said, but for the "open flame".  Hopefully you'll be able to figure it out ... how about a "grow" pad or two underneath them - or would that use too much of that stored electricity?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 07, 2013, 04:40:52 PM
Spent 30 minutes on the phone with Backwoods Solar and the conclusion was to NOT put the batteries in the room even if they were to be placed in an enclosure of some kind -- though they say many do this I personally do not want to.

Next we discussed the current location and agree that it's probably best as is (which makes life a little easier for me anyway as I don't have to move anything then).  Only possibility is to build a box around them and insulate with R10 foam and then place a vent in the bottom of the box to draw air into the box and put in a vent fan that will run when the batteries reach 28vdc and begin to exhuast hydrogen.

Seems there is enough heat generation in general use of the batteries that they will likely stay pretty warm that way and I can insulate the room itself and use the bottom vent (since Hydrogen is lighter then air) to draw from inside the porch.  The exaust fan will mean I'll lose heat out that way but that can't be helped.

One thing I can do is add a heat lamp in the room and hook it up to the generator so it will only come on when the genny comes on.  This will provide some backup heat in the porch if the batteries drop to 23vdc and the genny comes on.

This also leaves the space in the new room that the batteries would have taken up and I'm thinking I'll put the chest freezer in there instead.  Sure it will mean I'll have to go out to it when I want something but it won't be on my porch which gets warm in the summer and cold in the winter neither condition probably the best for the freezer.

In the future I'll probably have to do like Don and build a battery box beside the porch (but outside).  Perhaps if I insulate it really well with R10 foam then maybe the batteries won't drop to freezing as they should heat it up through charging and discharging which generates heat after all.

On a different note, it's snowing up in those hills and here I am waiting on UPS and praying they get here SOON so I can take off and do some plowing before it gets too late....besides, the wood stove is likely out too and I'd like to clean it out, brush the chimeny and crank it up again so the cabin is toasty again tonight.

Ahhhh life off the grid (sorta since I do have a phone after all, and TV).
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on November 07, 2013, 05:26:50 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on November 07, 2013, 03:55:51 PM
that the heater is basically an 'open flame' and

If you are using the heater I think you are using... Housewarmer 8000 BTU, the flame is enclosed in the burner assembly. The inside of the burner assembly connects only to the exterior via the concentric inlet and outlet tubes. That is what makes it direct vent and what makes it safer for the people in a home than any non vented heater.  IF you have some other non vented heater everything above is still true; just would not apply here. I may have lost track of what was/is going on.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: UK4X4 on November 07, 2013, 05:59:30 PM
"Perhaps if I insulate it really well with R10 foam then maybe the batteries won't drop to freezing"

remember insulation only slows the transfer of heat- It does not stop it even if its 20" thick eventually the temp inside is the same as outside if there's no heat within.

Like returning to an unheated cabin after a week...every thing inside is the same temp as outside if there's no heating from the sun and radiant heat

if you have for example a 100watt old style bulb and 20" insulation yep it will keep warm inside,

even the charging process makes batteries warm, well insulated I think you'd easily keep the diurnal temperatures above freezing within the enclosure, you have a large warm mass of batteries.

Something like this would give you a clear idea of whats happening inside your enclosure
, set the rate- every 5 mins would be fine- leave logging and then watch the diurnal change
5 mins would get you 55 days of logging !

http://www.amazon.com/Lascar-EL-USB-1-Temperature-Logger-Interface/dp/B00074UZ4A/ref=pd_cp_pc_0

Does your charge controller not have a battery  temperature input ?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on November 07, 2013, 08:31:26 PM
I hope the big brown truck of happiness got to you and you made it back up the hill...  I totally spaced on a heat lamp - sounds like a great solution.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 07, 2013, 09:58:37 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on November 07, 2013, 05:26:50 PM
If you are using the heater I think you are using... Housewarmer 8000 BTU, the flame is enclosed in the burner assembly. The inside of the burner assembly connects only to the exterior via the concentric inlet and outlet tubes. That is what makes it direct vent and what makes it safer for the people in a home than any non vented heater.  IF you have some other non vented heater everything above is still true; just would not apply here. I may have lost track of what was/is going on.

You are correct.

Maybe I need to take a closer look at this heater as I hadn't realized it was enclosed and the flame wasn't 'open' - if that's the case then I should be ok thought he Marey instant on hot water heater might be an issue...but then it may also be enclosed.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 07, 2013, 10:06:24 PM
Brown truck arrived early :) - took off and found I had less snow then I expected :) so I cranked up the tractor (after topping off the tank with Diesel which I had neglected earlier) and pulled out the chimney brush to clean the chimney while the tractor warmed up.

I was surprised to see how much creosote had built up in the chimney and glad I cleaned it out.  I then cleaned out the stove and as it was nice and warm still (and inside the cabin) I lit another fire and headed out to plow the driveway section that most concerns me.  That done I gathered up a load of wood after starting the generator and headed in to finish making dinner which I'd started earlier by placing it in the oven to warm (it takes a while so I had time to make some rice since the generator was running now).

Didn't bother with the batteries yet but will soon (like this weekend).  With luck I can get my grounds sorted, install the 4 new batteries and get the back up generator working correctly.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 08, 2013, 08:52:51 AM
Cabin Life: Ahhh Cabin life in the winter! Seems I will likely have a simple routine of arriving home, restarting the wood stove, plowing the driveway, bringing in wood and kindling and then starting dinner. It's not too bad really,as it keeps me busy and once I settle down if I'm no longer busy then I have time to think about my family back home so keeping busy helps prevent loneliness!

It can get lonely at times but I'm thinking that's when I need a good book to read since TV mostly isn't worth watching (or spending the money on watching since power isn't cheap in the winter when the sun isn't up long enough to make much and you have to run the generator to charge up the battery bank).

One odd thing I find occurring is that my water doesn't always work on all taps. I'm sure it's air in the lines but am uncertain how to force it out. This morning, for example, the bathroom sink had plenty of pressure but he shower did not. I ran the shower and had to turn on the bathroom sink hot water to a trickle to get the hot water heater to kick on, then after a couple minutes the air came out of that line and the pressure at the shower was great, but only on the hot. I then messed with the cold until it was working but later, in the shower the cold stopped again...grrrrr.....I'll fix it sooner or later but it poses a challenge!

Last nights dinner was great though I had warmed up the roast and gravy in the oven while plowing the snow and when I got back, since I was on generator power I used my rice cooker to make a bunch of rice (two batches). Now I can take some for lunch and try to get back on my diet as well as have more for dinner each night. But I need to start watching what I eat as it's easy to overeat out here I think!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 09, 2013, 10:43:32 AM
For the start of 'The Big Day' (I'm calling it that since it's the day I add 4 batteries to the bank and try to get the generator wired up right and working correctly as well as install the 2nd heater etc etc) I was greeted with 24 degrees an overcast sky's (it may snow) but the temp has risen to 29 degrees since then and I'm hopeful I might even see temps in the high 30's or low 40's by afternoon which is common here.

So it's off to the races for me!  Wish me luck!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 09, 2013, 06:26:17 PM
While I smacked myself in the foot (near the ankle) with a hammer while driving a ground rod in I was able to get the rod over 7 feet into the ground at a 45 degree angle before it just stopped and would go no further.  At that point I dug a hole and bent it into the hole and tied the cooper round wire I'd run from the Midnight Solar breaker box ground which I'd previously tied into the Midnight Solar DC panel ground where everything else is grounded to,  That being done (and well over due it was) I set to getting the batteries I was adding installed.  They were near the same voltage as the bank when I added them (after making copper tie bars etc and a platform to put them on) so I'm thinking it was a good time to add them. 

As I was putting the new batteries in front of the original bank which would make it more difficult to reach the DC panel etc I decided to add the shunt and wiring for the Tri-Metric battery monitor.  This meant once the new bank was installed I was able to hook up and program the monitor.

Next up is the generator but my batteries needed to be charged as well as my drill batteries so I took a break to eat lunch (at 3pm no less) and get things charged.  Lunch done (and my foot pretty sore) I think I'll pop some Ibuprofin and go down and see Jeff and Tammy at the store and get a treat, then I'll get back and see about cleaning up the place.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: considerations on November 09, 2013, 08:08:46 PM
"While I smacked myself in the foot (near the ankle) with a hammer while driving a ground rod in I was able to get the rod over 7 feet into the ground at a 45 degree angle before it just stopped and would go no further."

The first scar I got on this property was nailing my shin with a fence post driver while sinking the ground rod for the telephone guy. Never let them see you sweat, but the air sure turned blue when he left.  >:(
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 09, 2013, 08:32:25 PM
Quote from: considerations on November 09, 2013, 08:08:46 PM
"While I smacked myself in the foot (near the ankle) with a hammer while driving a ground rod in I was able to get the rod over 7 feet into the ground at a 45 degree angle before it just stopped and would go no further."

The first scar I got on this property was nailing my shin with a fence post driver while sinking the ground rod for the telephone guy. Never let them see you sweat, but the air sure turned blue when he left.  >:(

Luckily know one was around to hear this Marine cussin' and swearin'! d* d*
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 09, 2013, 09:09:04 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/IMG_20131109_140959_559_zpse1bb0573.jpg)
Ground road -- bent the last 10 inches down into the ground as I couldn't drive it any deeper.  Then attached the ground cable and buried it all.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/IMG_20131109_140950_143_zpsbfa63337.jpg)
You can see where the ground goes here.  Runs into the Midnight solar box and ground bus bar.  Then I run a ground from there into the main breaker panels bus and tie my inverter and charge controller grounds to that bus.  Imagine, I never had a ground for the last three years!  I KNOW this isn't good but I just never got it installed as the last rod never made it down more then 5 feet (I need to pull it out with my tractor).

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/IMG_20131109_141748_589_zps33cebe2a.jpg)
Buried.  I still need to extend the conduit from the solar panels up into the box but that will wait for another day.  Hopefully not year though!

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/IMG_20131109_170144_883_zps4cbe0c12.jpg)
New batteries installed and charged up.  This gives me 660AH at 24v (compared to my old 12v system of 880AH this would be 1320AH with the 4 additional batteries)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/IMG_20131109_170250_538_zps6eb35220.jpg)
New Inverter/Charger.  It's an 24v AIMS 4000watt Pure Sine Inverter with a 1000watt charger and the option to run it in Battery Mode which will always inverter from the batteries or 'Shore Power' mode which will switch to the Generator supplied power while charging the batteries and then remain on generator power with the battery charger in float until the generator shuts down.  I prefer this mode as it means I can run the generator for longer periods for various reasons without drawing off the batteries.  Then when I shut down the generator it kicks over to Inverter mode.  It also has a 'sleep' mode which sends out a pulse of power every so many seconds and continues until something kicks on and needs power, then it runs until the item kicks off.  This is helpful when I am away as it will just sleep until the freezer or refrigerator comes on then powers them and goes back to sleep conserving power.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/4b50decc-fb17-415b-ad5b-46f690014934_zps3f6fe582.jpg)
Started charging off the inverter with the generator running and dialled in the inverter to about 85% charging capacity.  What's showing is watts (positive) during bulk phase of charging. It' s interesting how sensitive the charger settings are but I was able to dial it in to roughly what I think would be good for this bank based on the solar calculator's suggestion on how many panels I'd need using my 205watt panels.  It tells me 4 so I dialled in the inverter to run about that much power.  What was also interesting was watching the inverter/charging dial up the charge from start and then back off in steps as it went through bulk to absorption and then float.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/IMG_20131109_171919_240_zpsd7ba86f5.jpg)
TriMetric monitor showing 101% of charge after running the generator and charging from the Inverter for a couple hours.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 09, 2013, 10:44:29 PM
Fixed the cold water in the shower! :D  Turns out the valve was just stuck out a little and a slight push inward on the nearly 100 year old tap and it worked!  Oh how awesome it is!  I can now take a shower with the hot and cold on at the same time and with LOTS of pressure!  Oh yes!  It's the little things folks ;)

I also noticed that after two hours of running without the generator the battery bank is still at 98% capacity which is great since I've been running my modem and wireless router while charging up my laptop battery and with the TV and DVR plugged in but not on.  I'm kinda stoked that the new batteries are making that much difference!  I'm really hoping to cut generator use in the winter to no more then two hours a day and with the charger set at about 85% it seems to only take a couple hours to recharge the bank.  I also saw the solar charge controller working on the bank at the same time as the generator (it is supposed to do that but without the monitor I couldn't be sure it was without logging in and seeing it do so which I hadn't done during daytime before).

If I get the generator autoswitch working tomorrow then I'll really be set!!!  I could then concentrate on insulating the pipes under the cabin and getting the new room ready for the batteries.

On that subject I learned that the heater I'm installing is NOT an open flame heater so it will be safe to have in the same room as the batteries though I'll enclose them and add a vent fan and switch to exhaust the hydrogen they make when bulk charging and equalizing.

At this point, if I get the generator and heater finished then I can relax a bit and won't worry on my weekends home to see my beautiful wife :)  I will also then be able to start putting up firewood for the winter so I won't run out and finally, once all that's done I can start using my time on weekends to make panelling and finish the interior.

It seems things are staring to work to plan :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 10, 2013, 10:11:29 AM
Last night I posed a question in the Off Grid thread about my meter showing 94% of capacity in the battery bank yet the voltage was 24.4v.

I then sorta answered the question (to myself) when I went and realized the freezer was running.  I waited for it to stop and saw the voltage increase to 24.6, then when I shut everything down for the night and put the inverter into 'sleep' mode I saw the volts jump to 24.7 (and perhaps they went higher as I didn't stay to watch).

Then I realized Trojans table says 'open voltage' which I take to mean no loads attached to the batteries which is not a state I'll be in, the TriMetric meter on the other hand looks at capacity (that you've programmed) as well as charge volts and amps and perhaps more data and then uses a scientific algorithm to calculate capacity remaining.

So with that in mind I looked at the meter this morning and it showed 89% (very stoked to see that) and a voltage of 24.6v when I kicked the inverter out of sleep mode.

All I can say is 'whoohoo'!  I think the new battery addition made a big difference!  [cool]

Nw that I've swept off the solar panels (snow) I should be able to get some production this morning which ought to keep the bank around 89% until either I get full sun (it's snowing so I doubt that will happen) or I run the genny for a couple hours.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 10, 2013, 01:43:29 PM
Contemplating 'state of charge' stuff and wondering where I can find specs on my batteries.  I've search a ton and can't seem to get what I need.

When I bought the first 8 batteries, which are labelled exactly like the ones I just added (4 more) the label in Costco said "220AH" but reading MountainDon's post has me wondering ???

It would seem to me that the two things I need the most, in order of importance:

1.  The actual manufacturer's specs and charging information for the batteries.
2.  The correct AH rating of the batteries.

With those I can be sure my TriMetric is actually programmed appropriately.

At last check they were still at 24.5v and the TriMetric had changed to 87% of charge (which I found interesting since it changed from 94% to this with little change in the battery voltage (so that makes me think maybe it knows best! lol).
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on November 10, 2013, 03:06:02 PM
Golf cart batteries range from 210 to 225; at least that is what I have noticed. The only ones I have seen any charge info for are the Trojans.


I don't have personal experience with operating the Trimetric, but their info is only as good as what is entered. I don't know if it getd motre difficult when starting with used batteries and a new meter setup.  ???



Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 10, 2013, 05:00:31 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on November 10, 2013, 03:06:02 PM
Golf cart batteries range from 210 to 225; at least that is what I have noticed. The only ones I have seen any charge info for are the Trojans.


I don't have personal experience with operating the Trimetric, but their info is only as good as what is entered. I don't know if it getd motre difficult when starting with used batteries and a new meter setup.  ???

Thanks Don and goo points as always (Note to all reading this:  Don has NEVER steered me wrong and frankly, he Redoverfarm, Gary and others have been generous with their assistance!)

I noticed this morning that often the voltage would change a little down but the meter simply remained reading a steady percentage, then I'd see the voltage come back up and realized somethin was cycling.  I think the meter is just smarter then me! lol

Meanwhile I HAVE SUCCESS!!!!  THe Magnum Auto generator start switch is working!!!  [cool].  It was just the battery ground which I suspect forces the fuel solenoid to polarize with the battery bank thus giving positive voltage!  I was so excited to see it actually work right and set it to 24v for good measure.

IT will only come on once the voltage drops to or below 24v or a full two minutes then it will come on and I set it for 3 hours to make sure the bank is fully charged (I plan to watch it).  Of course, despite the clouds and rain (sometimes snow) the batteries have received some solar charging and so the bank has remained above 24v but I'm now using it a little more with the internet, lights etc and, wait for it....THE RADIO! :)

Yes I also wired up the 24v to 12v converter and now have radio and the composter fan :)  [cool]

Haven't hooked up the new heater yet but frankly I wanted a break after the last 5 1/2 hrs of steady work as I started my day plowing snow for an hour then set to working on the power.  I also got rid of the temp wiring to the generator (old 120v plug stolen from a washing machine years ago for use with the old inverter).  SO now I have romex going all the way to the genny.  THough it's also temp since I plan to move everything I at least feel better about it.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 10, 2013, 05:20:29 PM
The generator auto started at 2:13pm with the battery bank at 24.1vdc and under a load (by me).

Now I'll watch it and see when it stops and if it fully charges the bank in under three hours.  I'm hoping it's done around 2 hours as I can then set the switch to give me two hours of charging which will fit my propane budget a little better.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on November 10, 2013, 06:41:58 PM
Eric although my set up is a little different than yours you might extend the maximun run time to  stop a little more.  Mine is 6 hours.  It never runs that much because it is fully charged in about 2 hrs & 15 min but Magnum told me to set it higher than actually what it needs.  Also unfamilar with  your inverter but mine has to establish a full charge as set before it will establish what the SOC actually is.  Mine will indicate "Thinkin" until that is met.  It will cycle way too often until that high SOC perimeter is met and established.  It uses my 220AH as a basis of what that SOC and voltage should be. The voltage on mine is 48V.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 10, 2013, 07:50:26 PM
In my case the inverter doesn't control the gen run time but the Magnum switch does and it can be set from 1 to 5 hours.  I've set it for three but am thinking you might be right on the time as it's been over two hours and the charger is still going strong with voltage only now breaking above 28vdc.

The SOC utilized the 220AH setting (x3 for three banks so 660) to determine % of charge once it's determined the bank is fully charged.  It does this with the voltage setpoint of 28.6v and the Amps setting (based on AH rating of the bank x2 /100) which in my case is 13Amps.  When the meter sees the charger has dropped below 13Amps and the bank has reach 28.6v it determines the bank is 100% full.

At least that's how I understand it however I'm not certain it would be accurate if the generator stops with the bank at 28.6 but absorption now completed and charging into float....in this case the bank might not be fully charged though I'm not certain about that.  I'm going to switch the meter to 4 hrs and see if it goes past 3 now that it's already been running 2 1/2hrs and not yet into float.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 10, 2013, 07:55:31 PM
Found this cool magnetic protractor at HD recently and finally got to try it out.
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/angle_zpsed299827.jpg)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/panels_zps3035a8c4.jpg)
It allowed me to accurately set the angle of my panels to 63 degrees which is what I need this time of year.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/panels2_zps9487712f.jpg)
Pretty steep but then the sun is pretty low on the horizon these days and will be for the next few months.

It will be interesting to see how much production I get on sunny days vs what I was getting at 55 degrees which is roughly where I was when I last adjusted the panels using the old 'eye ball' method.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 10, 2013, 08:01:12 PM
One of these days I'll get this entire system moved into the new room and when I do I swear I'm going to ix the wiring and make it neat and tidy!  But for now, this will have to do as I have many pressing issues I need to resolve first before moving the system.
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Rewired_zpsb6151fea.jpg)

Of course, when moving the system I will have to rewire everything and that will be a perfect time to correct this horrible job!

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/SwitchInstalled_zps4219ada7.jpg)
It's not pretty but it gets the job done and I'm glad I now have the auto start working as well as the 24-12v converter.

Now I need to get serious on the back room, installing the heater, finishing the interior, insulated etc etc....once done I'll then move the power plant and free up the space on the porch.  Then maybe I can get some firewood cut too!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on November 10, 2013, 08:25:36 PM
When you move / rebuild the battery setup you should try to not have any electronics over the batteries.  For a couple reasons...

1.... some inverters, chargers, charge controllers do have relays in them and they are not necessarily gas tight. Hydrogen could be ignited by a relay sparking. A long shot but...

2.... I have a friend who has 4 GC2's on a low shelf against a metal shed wall. After 3 years of use you can see a distinct pattern of slight rustiness on the metal wall above the batteries. I believe that is from the batteries; maybe from acid vapors from high level charging.

3.... Inverters or charge controllers mounted above batteries does not meet code. For the above reasons? Not sure...

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 10, 2013, 08:31:40 PM
Thanks Don!  That makes a lot of sense though I hadn't thought of it before.

In Telecom battery banks (small ones and probably AGM now that I think about it) it is common to have the rectifiers and DC shelf directly above the batteries so I never considered that it might not be a good idea.  I'll have to rethink the way I planned to install a little but to be honest I don't like all that stuff above them anyway because it makes it hard to reach anything and dangerous.

I must admit that having 12 batteries now and using them a lot more gives me pause to think about the Hydrogen gas a LOT more.  What was once only a passing thought that I figured I'd need to do something about has now become a more pressing issue as I watch the batteries charge at over 28v and know that means they are gassing (though I don't know how much).
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on November 10, 2013, 10:47:04 PM
Eric you might consider one of these to vent your batteries.  This is what I have in mind when I get around to it in addition to isolating the battery bank in an enclosure.  The guy that spec'd out my equipment advised that since I am using a generator a relay could be installed to activate the vent when the generator is running which in essence is charging.  The specific type of vent escapes me now but apparently it is one that prevents ignition of the fumes which a standard vent fan will not.  The name will come to me later.

http://zephyrvent.com/

But I got to looking at a ventilation fan which is spark free as well similar to a computer fan which could be adapted to PVC pipe.  Probably work for about half or less of the price this company wants. 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 10, 2013, 11:17:44 PM
Quote from: Redoverfarm on November 10, 2013, 10:47:04 PM
Eric you might consider one of these to vent your batteries.  This is what I have in mind when I get around to it in addition to isolating the battery bank in an enclosure.  The guy that spec'd out my equipment advised that since I am using a generator a relay could be installed to activate the vent when the generator is running which in essence is charging.  The specific type of vent escapes me now but apparently it is one that prevents ignition of the fumes which a standard vent fan will not.  The name will come to me later.

http://zephyrvent.com/

But I got to looking at a ventilation fan which is spark free as well similar to a computer fan which could be adapted to PVC pipe.  Probably work for about half or less of the price this company wants.

That's the same one BAckwoods Solar has and they have a switch that you can get with it if your charge controller doesn't have a 12v power take off lead (some do,some don't - mine don't).  You adjust it to just below 28vdc where the batteries will start to vent and then it will run as long as they are above that voltage and shut down afterwards.

They advised me to put a air inlet vent in the bottom of the enclosure to draw in fresh air and put this vent up top.

Makes sense to me.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 10, 2013, 11:32:03 PM
Couple notes on the auto gen start and inverter/charger as well as TriMetric meter.

1.  You can adjust the timer on the Magnum AutoGen Start switch while the generator is running.  I changed it from 3 to 4 then 5 and left it at 5.  The Generator ran for 5 hrs an 10 minutes.
2.  The Inverter/Charger was running at about 60% for some reason (perhaps I bumped something - the setting is very sensitive and I was nailing a wire staple into the wall under it.  I need to adjust it back to about 85% I think (it is a 50amp charger at 24v which I take to be a 1200watt charger and I've had it adjusted to 850watts but today it was down around 770 for some reason).
3.  The Inverter/Charger using a calculation to determine the amount of time in Absorption based on the amount of time it takes to get to Absorption voltage, so for whatever reason it decided it need longer today then it did last time -- this tells me that I will likely have to run it on manual at least once a week to make sure the system goes into float which it did not do today.
4.  Thank to the TriMetric meter I was able to watch voltage until it hit 29.9vdc (which I thought was a bit high but there isn't a way to adjust that and it's based on lead acid batteries at 24vdc) and then switch to watts and watch to see when the watts began to drop from its high around 770.  Eventually it should drop to float wattage but unfortunately today it was running about 400watts when the generator shut down so I'm guessing I was 30 minutes from float or so.
5.  The TriMetric meter saw the drop in amps from the charger when the generator stopped and read that as 100% of charge which I know isn't actually quite right.  Unfortunately I'll have to wait until I actually fully charge the bank to be confident in the meter reading but I think this is just what happens when you first start out with this setup. 

Anyway, so far so good!  Tomorrow will be the big test as I'm going head home for the afternoon and night to see my wife then go to meetings all day before returning likely after dark.  I'm going to record the hours on the generator and see if it runs at all while I'm gone.

One thing I noted today was that it took about 21 hours of abusing the system to get the bank voltage to drop to 24vdc and stay there long enough to kick on the generator.  Tonight I've shut off the TV not long after the generator quit and while I am listening to the radio it takes a lot less power I believe.  I also only have one light on (rather then 2 or 3) etc etc...my intent last night and this morning was to abuse the system a little to see what happened, now I'm going back into a semi-conserve state (hey it would be a little tough out here in the woods alone if I couldn't at least watch TV now and then!)

Anyway, that's enough for now ;) 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on November 11, 2013, 07:19:31 AM
The controller of the generator has a history & run log that you can look at to determine when it ran.  Mine shows "ready to run".  Push the escape buttom and four catagories show one being history.  Use the scroll arrows to get to history (blink) then run log then push enter.  It will show you when it came on and when it went off.  That is if you have set it up to the correct time when you activated the generator. Then just push escape to get it back to the "ready to run" status.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 11, 2013, 09:53:19 AM
Thanks -- I knew it would tell me the hours but I hadn't thought of the history setting!  DOH!  d*

This morning the bank was at 24.7v under load and the meter was reading 97%

I can see that the open voltage of the bank would likely rise a little when not under load but I am not sure it would go up 1/2v  ???
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 11, 2013, 01:27:46 PM
This morning the TriMetric monitor read 91% of capacity at 24.7v under load.  I think that's a little off but have decided that I may switch to 210AH on the batteries as 220AH might be a little off since these are commonly shown from 210 to 235AH (if memory serves me right).  So, saying they are 210's is probably a safe bet and might get me closer to reality ojn the monitor.

I've also been thinking of shutting down the freezer as I don't really need it and would rather not have to run the generator as much as I think it will this winter.  I go home every couple weeks anyway (actually I'm going home today and again on the weekend) and can always stock up then.  After all, I find I don't get things out of the freezer much since it's just me anyway.  Heck, I still have leftovers my wife sent me with that I need to eat so it's likely I won't pull anything out of the freezer this week anwyay.

Killing that ought to save me a lot of energy and give me an extra day or two on the batteries if I'm wise and don't abuse them.

Not running the generator daily would save me propane which would be good since there is NO refilling the tank until the spring (acess is a real issue in the winter for anything other then a jeep (or other good 4x4 or tractor) so no propane truck is making it to my place until March!

I must admit that I'm still wrapping my head around battery capacity and SOC.  Seems to me a 24v system ought to be still pretty well charged at 24v but then I'm not a battery guy and I do know that Telco systems don't like running much below 48v...perhaps a call to some pros would be good.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on November 11, 2013, 02:08:49 PM
QuoteSeems to me a 24v system ought to be still pretty well charged at 24v but ...
Is a 12 volt system pretty well charged at 12 volts?  12 volts on a 12 volt system means somewhere between a 40 to 50% SoC. Double the volts for a 24 volt system.  Not pretty well charged.

And what is going on when that reading is seen? How long since the last significant load or charge current? As always that has an effect on the reading and what can be discerned from it. How about the specific gravity reading? 

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 12, 2013, 11:00:33 PM
Received this informative reply from Bogart (TriMetric Meter folks):

QuoteHello Erik
My basic response is that it's hard to determine from voltage of a battery how charged it is.  The exception for that is when the battery voltage goes above 14.4V while charging it's pretty well charged, or under 11.2  while discharging it is almost empty.  In between those voltage readings can only be somewhat relied upon when the battery has not been either charged or discharged for a half a day or so. Trojan also mentions this in the "fine print" accompanying these charts--often not noticed by people using voltage to determine charge.

Incidentally, I just looked,and  I now see in Trojan's "users manual" that they don't even SAY CLEARLY that this is the case. They used to-- now they  just say it is the "open circuit" battery voltage.  This is VERY CRITICAL--and in older literature they said that is only applies after the  batteries have been standing for 24 hours.

This is taken directly from Trojan in a different place on their website (much too hard to find):

For accurate voltage readings, batteries must remain idle (no charging, no discharging) for at least 6 hrs, preferably 24 hrs.

That's why the TriMetric uses "% charge" based on a measurement of how much charge is removed from a "full"  battery, rather than using voltage--because people using the meter generally are charging or discharging the  battery.
  A better way is to use a hydrometer to monitor the specific gravity of the acid. Even for that, the battery needs to be recently charged at above the gassing voltage to make sure the acid is sufficiently mixed to give a good reading.

In short-- unless you follow Trojan's condition (above) the only time voltage is useful is when it is either very high, (while charging) or very low (while discharging).

Ralph  Hiesey
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on November 12, 2013, 11:58:34 PM
QuoteA better way is to use a hydrometer to monitor the specific gravity of the acid.

Seems to me someone here has been chanting that for years...   ;D ;D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 13, 2013, 08:55:54 AM
Quote from: MountainDon on November 12, 2013, 11:58:34 PM
Seems to me someone here has been chanting that for years...   ;D ;D

Yes true, though I noted this key to that statement:
Quote... Even for that, the battery needs to be recently charged at above the gassing voltage to make sure the acid is sufficiently mixed to give a good reading.

None of my readings were taken after charging above gassing voltage except maybe one and that was during not after actually (though I might also add that those readings were not overly good.  I think they were 'fair' on the hydrometer.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 13, 2013, 11:40:23 PM
I CAN rebuild it! I just tore apart the valve assembly on our 1922 clawfoot tub that's here at the cabin and found the little plastic valve at the end of the valve plunger was off the cold side and plugging up the valve. I was able to get it back on (the little screw was no longer screwed into the end of the plunger) and it works perfectly now HOWEVER the hot side plunger cap (plastic seal disk on the end) was completely off, the screw missing and the cap tore up. I removed it and can turn on the hot with the main valve behind the tub but now must find replacement parts. I believe this is something I can actually find though and am searching for one now.

Meanwhile the shower works better then ever now!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on November 14, 2013, 12:05:19 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on November 13, 2013, 11:40:23 PM
I CAN rebuild it! I just tore apart the valve assembly on our 1922 clawfoot tub that's here at the cabin ...............snip........

Meanwhile the shower works better then ever now!

Sounds a lot easier than the electrical thing you are going through......
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 14, 2013, 08:40:03 AM
LOL Perhaps but I think the electrical thing is now limited to, well, the limit (of power that is).  I just need to get it dialled in now and then I should be good to go.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 19, 2013, 08:36:04 AM
Morning world!  The cabin is a nice 70 degrees this morning (76 by the stove and 60% humidity which is nice) and I'm happy to say I had a nice and long sleep ;)  Oh sure, I was up a couple times stoking the fire but then don't you wake up 2 or 3 times a night too?

Battery bank was at 24.6vdc which is where it was when I went to bed and that means this is now day 3 since the generator last ran!  Clearly the freezer was eating up too much power and now without it the sun and batteries are able to keep up for the most part (at least on weekends when I am gone and that's a major plus in my book).  SO as it stands the generator ran the 14th (Thurs) and the 16th (Sat) and may or may not run today (my guess is that it will run but probably not until this evening since the sun will come out and boost the bank back up a bit before it gets abused when I make it home and want to watch some TV while making/eating dinner etc.

Since I found an assortment of valve seals for old taps at ACE (the Hardware Place) I plan to try to rebuild our nearly 100 year old taps on the tub/shower and then may even bring one valve into ACE since they have a gauge to check which exact size and style of valve you have (yes, even for the 100 year old ones).  Once done they can actually order replacements which totally amazes me.  No guarantee of course, but still frankly that's awesome and amazing and maybe those old tubs and valves were better then what we have today....just saying that a nearly 100 year old tub/shower and valve assembly that STILL WORKS and is rebuild-able seems a lot better then our modern THROW AWAY crap.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on November 19, 2013, 09:21:17 AM
'Morning world!  The cabin is a nice 70 degrees this morning (76 by the stove and 60% humidity which is nice) and I'm happy to say I had a nice and long sleep ;)  Oh sure, I was up a couple times stoking the fire but then don't you wake up 2 or 3 times a night too?'

[waiting] Yep..... but not to put a log on the fire.  Nuff said  ;)

So glad to read that you are getting stuff sorted out and nailed down.  Not easy to do when you are trying get'er done in a couple weeks......
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 19, 2013, 10:47:22 AM
Ya not quite at the 2-3 times a night for that reason yet but I doubt it will be long -- no drinking at 10pm helps! lol

It sure does feel good knowing that I CAN make this work :)  Getting things sorted feels pretty darn good!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 19, 2013, 10:21:44 PM
Day three and the generator has no run yet but I've reset the switch to start at 24v and run for 5 hours as I know the sun isn't giving me quite enough charging power so I suspect it will run this evening and give me a full charge :)

And for more good news :) I've fixed the tub facets!  The seals I bought at Ace worked fine!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 20, 2013, 09:32:33 AM
Yikes!  Got into my old XJ this morning and fired it up but noticed something odd, the headlights didn't seem to be working.  I messed with the switch a little but to no avail.  So here I sit, it's dark out, and all I have are parking lights!  d*

What worries me is that the lights worked fine last night on my way home and I shut them off when I arrived so I know there was no issue at that point.  No reason for a fuse to blow between now and then I'm thinking, which leaves the switch (most probable), pack rats (possible -- they've chewed through a fuel line on an ATV once) and a loose wire (less likely since the vehicle didn't move once I turned off the lights) and perhaps lastly the cold (was a bit chilly this morning so maybe something is frozen up a little (can't imagine what mind you).

Either way, I MUST get that fixed as I leave in the dark and return in the dark most days.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: jsahara24 on November 20, 2013, 10:04:06 AM
Get out the multimeter!  Possibly corrosion?  Love the old jeeps, so simple to work on compared to the new vehicles. 

Sent from my XT907 using Tapatalk 2

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on November 20, 2013, 10:48:06 AM
OJ most likely the cold weather blues having their effect and their way with your XJ.  Nothing to do with the Jeeps lights but those of us who try and keep up with your build.  Remember to run some fuel additive now or gas line antifreeze.  And those of us who do diesel and if you are in the great white north anti-jel in every tank.  Especially if you are down south where they do not add it at the bulk plant and planing a trip up to the great white north.  Save yourself some headache.     
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on November 20, 2013, 10:59:29 AM
XJ Headlights:   Been there done that as have a few friends. Sometimes it is the switch on the steering wheel stalk (I had that go) and other times it is the dash switch (have seen that a few times).  We ran a vehicle "sandwich" down the highway a couple of times when one XJ or another had lights crap out while on a trail run.  G/L
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on November 20, 2013, 11:31:16 AM
Quote from: MountainDon on November 20, 2013, 10:59:29 AM
XJ Headlights:   Been there done that as have a few friends. Sometimes it is the switch on the steering wheel stalk (I had that go) and other times it is the dash switch (have seen that a few times).  We ran a vehicle "sandwich" down the highway a couple of times when one XJ or another had lights crap out while on a trail run.  G/L

Sort of same issue only a motorcycle.  We had been working up at the ranch and going down after dark.  I / we did that a lot because of driving into the setting sun and the shadow blind spots on the windshield in a very bad area.  And it is easier to drive at night when all the tourists, fishermen and rafters and such are out of the way.   So it was dark or a black night going out.  I caught a shape in the middle in the road.  I slowed down it sped up when I caught up to it it was a motorcycle without any headlights.  I stayed a comfortable speed behind him and was his head lights for about 10 miles till he got to his hauler which was over the worst part of the road.       
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 20, 2013, 12:44:13 PM
I suspect the switch but can't be certain as the lights started working as I came down my road (which is much like a jeep trail with associated bumps, rocks, dips etc).  Went by a shop to discuss but as they were working nothing can be done really, so I opted to wait and see what happens and plan to install a set of offraod aux lights in the meantime (since I need them anyway).

Could well be the cold too though as the switch is original and might have been effected by the cold -- or not.  I'll find out!

This old XJ is definately taking it's lumps these days as the suspension is getting noisy (replaced about  5 or 6 years ago) and the doors are loose....guess that's what you get with over 260k on the clock!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on November 20, 2013, 01:15:33 PM
That is exactly the way mine and my friends acted. Sometimes okay, others not. The steering column switch is a PITA to change. And not cheap either. I doubt the cold had anything to do with it. The failures I know about all happened in warm to hot weather. But who knows for certain.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 20, 2013, 02:48:07 PM
Thanks MD -- I replaced that switch a couple years ago so am loath to do it again even if paying someone else to do so.

I'll have to wait and see what gives...meanwhiule aux offroad lights will have to do.

Luckily I only drive the jeep a couple times a week as the rest of the time I'm in my company rig.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 21, 2013, 08:42:27 AM
Cabin Life:  Temperature is in the single digits outside which I can tell because the porch was 19 degrees when I went out and checked the battery bank and it is usually 10-12 degrees warmer then the outside temp, so the weather man might just have been right.  The WSDOT weather station down in the valley is reporting 7 degrees right now too.  SO I KNOW it's cold out there!

Inside?  74 degrees :)  My little experiment gave me 6 hours of uninterrupted sleep and while I could have slept one more hour and likely had enough hot coals remaining to get the fire going again, I decided to get up at 4am and pt a log, some kindling and a smaller split into the firebox to get it going again.  Then went back to bed as the flames lit up the cabin :)  It was 71 degrees inside.

Biggest issue I face today is the back room losing heat at a rapid pace!  It did fine when temps were just below freezing but now it's losing heat at a rapid pace!  The heater runs and gets it up to as much as 74 degrees (which is higher then when I originally set it at 60 so I need to check it out) after work today) and then kicks off only to come back on 10 or 15 minutes later because the temp has dropped to below whatever the threshold is (usually 10 degrees below the high).  I find it strange that it's changed what temp it runs at but then I don't even have it fully on so perhaps having it only partially on has something to do with that.

On a better note, my water was working this morning :)  I was a little worried that single digit weather might be enough to cause me problems since I don't have all the backfill over the main coming into the cabin yet.  I need about 12-16 inches in one area still and that could pose a problem though I have insulation over the pipe.  My guess is the insulation is doing its job ;)  So, if the water doesn't freeze, the drains don't freeze and if the heater keeps up while the stove assists and I don't run out of propane then I'll be fine this winter!  hahahaha 

Ahhhh Life at the cabin in the woods at 3200 feet in the Okanogan and near the Great White Northern Border.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 22, 2013, 08:36:46 AM
Cabin Life:  Another night that I only got up once (and probably didn't need to but old habits die hard).  I tend to wake up a few times in the night and being no exception I woke up last night a few times, one of which was 1:30am and being awake, although begrudgingly, I rolled out of bed and walked over to the stove which I saw was down to coals.  I added a round and a split and crawled back into bed.  The cabin never dropped below 70 and this morning I was met with the remainder of those pieces of wood and some good coals so two kindling sticks (dry pine) and a split went into the stove and I opened the damper.  The flames sprouted as if by magic and I had to smile :)  It's good to have fire in the wood stove when it's 3 degrees outside!

The cold will reek havoc on my battery bank and I am guessing I'm down to about 50% or less capacity, however the generator did not come on last night (making this day three) so I'll increase the start voltage to 24v and let it come on and run this morning to give me a nice full charge before I return.

I'm finding I use less TV time by recording shows I want on the DVR with it 'off' and the TV off.  Instead I get my internet time in.  Which reminds me, everything I read about the HughesNet modem said that it used 74watts of power (which is LOT) however the TriMetric Battery Monitor tells me that it's really only using 24watts so I'm pretty happy about that :).

So there ya go, another day in the life of a cabin dweller :)  Maybe this weekend I'll even get some pics for you.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 22, 2013, 08:44:23 AM
On a side note, and being the 3rd day without generator running, I checked the bank and saw it reading 82% and 24.0v (which we now know is under a load and not at rest for over 6 hours) and at 20 degrees F so I adjusted the Magnum switch to 24v and waited to see if the generator would do it's thing which I am happy to report that even at 3 degrees F outside the generator kicked on and the transfer switch switched to generator power.

I've been watching the bank and seeing that each day it gets a little less charge.  Once the generator finishes today the charge controller will be able to float the batteries for a couple hours off the sun and the bank will be at 100%.  Then tomorrow, if typical, the sun won't quite give me 100% charge...maybe 95%....and the next day 90% (I'm just using these numbers as an example of what's happening since I do not know for sure)..then on the 3rd day the bank is low enough to draw down to 80% and the generator will kick on.

I love this thing! :D  I also realize it's unlikely I'll see it run much in the summer! :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 22, 2013, 09:11:56 AM
Weatherman was wrong...I should have known when I saw the porch temp was about 25 degrees....when I went outside and looked at the thermometer it read 14.  Now he's saying 7 degrees tonight.  We'll see but either way it's cold, just not 3 degrees cold ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 22, 2013, 04:43:36 PM
Must admit I'm a little excited to have the boys back at the cabin tonight.  One thing it means is company!  The other is that we'll get more work done this weekend :)  I can finally get that heater installed and maybe even some roofing done.  Then, if time allows we'll cut and split firewood.

Can't wait!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: UK4X4 on November 22, 2013, 05:37:39 PM
We saw a similar thing in the winter on our batteries in the trailer even if I ran the geny for 8 hours we never saw 100% on them by the third week we often had to jump start the trailer in the morning

Even took the batteries back to the supplier- of course they tested OK

We did'nt have panels just the generator but getting that float charge was dificult

Not sure if its the cold - my batts were in a front locker unheated

The generators big enough for 2 AC units and the whole trailer...not a small one but it just seemed we lost a bit of power everyday
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 22, 2013, 10:58:26 PM
I can get them back to 100% by running the gen, it's only when they don't get past absorb on the MPPT controller that I have that problem.  Basically I can go about 3 days and then have to run the generator for 4-5 hours to get past absorb into float, then I know the bank is 100% of current cap.

THe issue with the cold is that it lowers the batteries capacity to deliver power if I understand it currently.  In essence a 210AH batter is about 25% less capacity at 32 degrees or in other words becomes a 155-160AH battery. 

Suddenly the bank has less ability to run those appliances...now take it down to 20 degrees and it's probably 35-40% of capacity:
Trojan says:
Quotefor every 15oF below 77oF, capacity is reduced by 1

At that point my bank which is a 630-660AH battery bank at 77 degrees becomes a 400AH bank.....

So I need more sun and or more generator power because I've lost 40% of capacity just because of the cold....
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 24, 2013, 09:18:27 AM
Got the new heater installed in the composter room (actually the boys did that) and found that it could not keep up with the cold!  8000BTU's is not enough for an 80 square foot room that doesn't have a permanent door and isn't fully insulated despite being 2 feet below grade and surrounded in R10 2" foam.

So we stuffed the walls with R19 insulation (I planned to do that anyway) and will stuff the ceiling with R21 today.  The R19 helped out and the heater brought the temp to 43 degrees in the room (at it's highest setting) so I'm hopeful the R21 will let it get above 50.  We also plugged the gaps in the entrance/door to the room a bit better so less heat will be escaping that way.

I'll do a little research as I might need to change the jets for higher altitude and with the added insulation it should be able to handle the cold -- we'll see.

While the boys were getting the heater installed I started bucking up trees that had been fallen previously.  Anything not worth milling into lumber was bucked into firewood and I managed to get the shed organized and the wood stacked nicely (that was already in there) and started chopping what I'd bucked up also. With a couple hours effort today I think we can get the shed packed full of wood again and then I ought tot be god for the winter :)

We'll roof the compost room too :)

I did a little reading on propane tanks and cold this week also and learned that just because the tank reads 78% does not mean it has 78% of the potential 500 gallons.  Why?  The cold.  At 32 degrees the tank can read significantly lower because the propane as condensed due to the cold.  So I'm guessing I've got about 400 gallons, probably more, in the tank and should be good for a long time ;)  With the boys here we use a little more but then I'll be gone for most of the next week (going home for Thanksgiving) and when I come back will be alone for at least a week or two and use a LOT less propane and power when I'm alone.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 24, 2013, 09:34:40 AM
Ruh Roh!

Seems having the boys here is REALLY abusing power!  The generator just kicked on after less then 24 hours! 

I try and try and try to explain the need to conserve but frankly they don't seem to get it.  Perhaps because it isn't their wallet the propane payment comes out of!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on November 24, 2013, 10:17:08 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on November 24, 2013, 09:34:40 AM
Ruh Roh!

Seems having the boys here is REALLY abusing power!  The generator just kicked on after less then 24 hours! 

I try and try and try to explain the need to conserve but frankly they don't seem to get it.  Perhaps because it isn't their wallet the propane payment comes out of!

True, but they don't have the incentive like you do to conserve and see how well you can make your system work.  And if they were being lounge lizards and wallowing in the power is one thing.  Then if they are working their tails off and then watching a little TV and have all the lights on in the place and using all your internet band width to wind down that is another issue as well.

How warm is you composter  room going to have to get to efficiently work?  All in all it seems as if you are enjoying your new life.   [cool]

How are the trees and all doing.  Might check and make sure the guards are tucked in so the rodents will not make a feast of the bark this winter.  I have a whole bunch to make and put around yet.  I am changing over to the hardware cloth type.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 24, 2013, 09:02:06 PM
Pretty Beat! While the boys worked on the back room and got it pretty well done for now I spent the day cutting, splitting and stacking wood!

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/addingwood_zps4e18dee6.jpg)
THis was after a day or so of cutting, splitting and stacking wood but I got a lot more done....

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/splitting_zps6e72523f.jpg)
I actually like splitting wood :)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/splittin2_zpsdc007ab7.jpg)
Love the smell if FIR being split too!

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/shed_zps710c169d.jpg)
Getting there

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/woodshed_zps1ab562b5.jpg)
Just about done -- I'd cut own one more dead pine and decided to buck it up and split it before calling it a night.  I was done about 5PM and dark...time for a drink!


(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/roof_zpsbf881891.jpg)
Heater vent installed -- just need some siding now!

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/roof2_zps2d7fa839.jpg)
Still needs siding and a door and some sealer in spots but the boys did a great job getting it this far!

Temp as I type is 53 degrees and slowly climbing - I need the room to stay above 50 degrees.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/plow_zpsc96d668e.jpg)
Got the show plow on the tractor so I'm ready for the snow!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 02, 2013, 10:04:12 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/pochview_zps4a0364cf.jpg)
After a week away I've returned to my home in the woods and some cool weather.  It was about 32 when I got home today with expected lows tonight around 10.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Temp_zps9fb4b6e8.jpg)
My first concern was the temperature inside the cabin since I'd left it for a week in the winter with just the backup heaters working.  Clearly I have nothing to fear now :)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Propane_zps0045ba9c.jpg)
Next was propane use and generator run time.  Since the fridge was off the entire time (nothing in it) and the freezer wasn't running either the only thing using power besides the inverter was the 12vdc fan and the 24v-12v converter.  The generator did not run at all over the last 8 days (and still has yet to fire up) but the propane was down to about 72% and given the temp I'm thinking that's a 13% drop in a month and a bit.  All in all that's not too bad considering I was running the gen like mad at first and then ran the heaters to hot this past week.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/BAckroom_zpsc023049f.jpg)
I still need to order the door but least I know the insulation is working and the room is staying warm.  I've even had to turn down the heater and suspect I'll turn it down even more this week.  I only need the composter to stay above 50 degrees to keep working.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Woodshed_zps64563c62.jpg)
I really wanted to tackle the roof (you can see the poles I've added for rafters) but was only able to add a little wood to the shed before getting back to work.

All in all I'm happy with the way the cabin has been weathering the winter and am confident it will make it through ok :)


Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 04, 2013, 08:24:53 AM
Gettin' cold now!  Going to be in the negatives this week and I am now seeing the lack of insulation in a couple spots and it's effect on cabin interior in near sub zero weather.  Last night, for example, the cabin dropped to 65 degrees when normally it would not.

I have just two rafter bays that are not fully insulated and all of them have about 6" that is not insulated where the transition from the new R21 insulation rises to meet the temp R19 I placed at the peak a few years ago to stop warm air from escaping.

Of course, 65 isn't bad, it's just that I have a loss of heat that means $$$ when I am not here as the propane heater will come on more then it should.  Gotta get that fixed!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 04, 2013, 11:04:05 PM
6F outside now and getting colder. Te back room is now down to 38 degrees and I doubt turning up the heater will matter as it's likely running constantly now That room is WELL insulated (R30 walls, R32 roof, and R10 floor and subgrade walls). Got feeling it's going to be below freezing before long but am hoping it doesn't get that cold in there. Currently it's 32 degrees above outside temp but that would make it drop to 28F if the temp gets to the -4 they are calling for.

Gives me something to ponder anyway.

Did an experiment with my Multimeter which has a temp sensor: Placing the temp sensor near the hottest part of the wood stove shows it above 270 degrees, but just a few feet away it's 65. Back by where the heater is on the back wall (not running) it's 59 degrees and the floor is 39.

Yup, going to be an interesting night!

I should add that the generator came on tonight too which I expected. Just glad it actually started! At least now the batteries will be well charged -- speaking of which, the porch is 26 degrees so that's something
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 05, 2013, 12:35:26 AM
OK it's getting a little serious now.

I went to rinse something out in the sink and the hot water did not run.  I then turned on all the taps and finally the tub started to run, I was happy until I saw the water coming out of the drain pipe onto the FLOOR!  Ooops.  One P Trap frozen solid.

I turned off all the taps and decided I better get back and check the back room out a little closer.

Outside Temp is 2 degrees and the back room was down to 36 so I went out and opened it up (a task since there is no door but rather insulation and plywood etc) and checked to make sure the heater was working, it was but I turned it all the way up (which was too high before) and repositioned the thermometer to a position by the water lines going into the hot water heater (about 3 1/2 feet off the floor).

THe room now reads 29 degrees after dropping to 28 because the 'door' was open for a few minutes.  I'm encouraged to see the temp rising and hoping it will rise above 32.  I repositioned some insulation around the entrance (on the inside) to try to block off heat loss but the 4" composting toilet vent and 2" vent coupled with the 4" hot water heater chimney has to be having a negative effect in there.  My guess is that I'll have to shut those all down in weather where temps drop below 10 degrees.  I'll also have to protect that P Trap a little better (clearly).

Cabin temp is 70 and I just noticed the back room dropped to 28 again -- looks like it's going to be a long night!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 05, 2013, 08:31:11 AM
Got up this morning to no running water :(  Temp at the sensor which is right behind where the water enters the hot water heater, reads 22F :(

Cabin temp dropped to 65 in he night but I kept the stove going (not roaring but still burning slowly) and turned on the aux heater this morning to help warm up the place a little.  I'd like it warmer as it would have a greater chance of warming pipes etc during the day (if it gets warm enough out that is) and is easier to keep warm then it is to get it warm from freezing.

Took out my temp probe and did some readings.  Air in the opening of the window (I cracked a window by the stove this morning to get some air circulating) read 0F inside the screen (can't push the probe out of the screen).  My guess is that it's a little colder then that but not much.  I'll check soon.

So, no running water (I saved some in pots and jars etc last night), a frozen P Trap, composter room needs some insulation work and a heater running 24x7 -- not good.

I'll get the boys to bring me up a 6 gallon jug of tap water and a 7 gallon jug of purified water so at least I'll have those and I can refill them at work until the pipes thaw and I have a bathroom etc at work so at least there is that ;)

I've got some heat tape somewhere around here and I'll take that and run it around the P Trap that's frozen and re-insulate.  I think I also have some of the silver insulation blanket like stuff that I can wrap around the P-Trap and over the Heat Tape, then I'll have to box it all in but I think that would keep it from freezing and I could turn it on only when it's going to drop below about 10 degrees since it did ok down to there.  It was temps that dropped well below that which caused the problem I think.

Now I guess I should check the batteries and porch temp to see where they are at (out of curiosity more then anything else and stoke the fire in the wood stove.  I'd like to leave the place at 70 or close to it today if I can)...heck, maybe I'll come home early today and work from home.  We'll see.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 06, 2013, 08:50:36 AM
The clouds must have rolled in to save the day :)  We had dropped to about 2 degrees but a little later it was back up to 5.  Then overnight I noticed the back room was up to 28, then30!  That's almost warm enough to start melting the frozen pipes (specially if we get some fans installed to push the warm air down to them).

Won't last though as the weather man claims it will clear up and be sunny today.  Good for solar production, not so good for keeping things warm as the sunny sky's bring out the colder weather and the prediction is 13 with wind chills down to -17 (note to Kurt and Josh, dress warmly!).

The good news is the tractor radiator test showed it was good to -15 or so and I was able to add a bunch of antifreeze so it should be good to -30/-35 now.  Also the water line to the main valve and frost free is clear and I'm able to get water out of the frost free with good pressure.  SO this tells me the problem is in the cabin, perhaps in the walls or just at the ground level where the water line comes up into the back room (and where it was about 15 degrees the other night). Hopefully today or tomorrow we'll get that sorted and fix the freezing trap under the tub and I'll be able to go back to having showers *crossing fingers*

Life in the woods aint for everyone! lol
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on December 06, 2013, 11:31:03 AM
Seriously Erik you are 100% correct Life in the woods aint for everyone.  Sounds like you have a pretty good grasp of what is going on and why.  To me that is most important.  You may have to stumble through this a little this winter.  But come spring and summer I bet you will have things pretty well over hauled by first frost next year even if you do not attempt to stay there next year.

As one of my best friends up here says in a low deep voice.  "Winters up here aint no bed of roses.  And these once a winter warriors that come up here really don't have a clue."   
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 06, 2013, 01:20:46 PM
Amen to that!

I grew up in cold climates so I'm at least no newby to the issues I'm facing but admitedly I'd not worked hard enough to be ready (and winter came on harder then I expected -- but my life up north should have told me to prepare for that).

At the moment the only real inconvenience is the lack of a shower but I'd sure like to resolve that over the next couple day!  Sponge baths just don't cut it! lol

With the boys up helping out though, I should get some real work done.  The only issue I have really is that my job can be demanding of my time and energy so while I'd like to get out early today to start working the problem it's unlikely to happen....good thing the boys are there to get stuff done in my absense!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 06, 2013, 04:51:12 PM
Got a report from my sons that they added a layer of insualtion to the pony wall that seperates the crawl space under the cabin (which is open) and the new composter room.  My son thought since it was coldest there the added insulation would make a difference and it did.  The area that was in the 20's today and rose to 30 was up to 45 when he called me and told me the results of their efforts.  So, if this sollution makes the difference then at least the lines should thaw out.  Specially when we get the air moving in there with some fans.

Next they tackled the roof of the wood shed and last report was they were going to get the roofing on after lunch :)

I can't say how glad I am there are here doing the work for me!

I know sometimes kids can frustrate us parents but most of the time they make us proud!  And this is definately one of those many times :)

Sounds like I'll be arriving at the cabin around dinner time with it warm and dinner cooking -- ya, it's going to be a nice evening me thinks ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 07, 2013, 09:57:46 PM
-12 in the valley and -5 here at the cabin.  The water is still frozen but at least we have some heat tape on the pipe in the back room so hopefully it will thaw out.  We worked on the insulation under the cabin and boxed in the p-trap and added heat tape to it too.  With luck we'll have running water soon but I'm not holding my breath!  The temps are just TOO cold.

We added two small 12v fans in the composter room n hopes of moving the air around a bit but they are pretty small (about 3") so I'm going to look for something a little bigger that should do a better job of moving the air around.

Burned a slash pile today and was surprised how fast it went up!  I guess it's so cold it dried everything out so it was like tinder.  Good thing I have a tractor to push it around and control it better.  It's still a lot of hot coals and will likely burn all night but it is contained so I'm not worried about it.

Franky I'm more worried about the cold!

I added some anti-gel treatment to the tractor fuel as it was REALLY hard to start today (when it was about 14 degrees out.

I'm now hoping to fix some insulation inside the cabin tomorrow so it will hold the heat better specially when I am not hear. 

I have to say though, the cold is really killing the propane!  I sure hope it starts to warm up soon!  It's supposed to get up to a low of 19 on Wednesday so that would be good because I could possibly thaw out the pipes and keep them thawed out then.  We'll have to see.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Frank W on December 08, 2013, 01:11:06 AM
I'm on page 35. Very interesting :)  Can't wait to read the rest of the thread. [cool]
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 08, 2013, 10:46:19 AM
Thanks Frank, it's been an adventure!

~~~~
Yesterday at around 6:15pm it was -5 on the trucks thermometer....it was 0 on the cabin window thermometer....at about 10:30pm it was -5 on the cabin window thermometer.....which means, by deductive reasoning, it may have been -10F outside which wouldn't surprise me because it was -12 down in the valley at 6pm.

The back room was dropping to 32 near the cabin wall about 4 feet off the floor (which means it was below freezing where the water pipe comes through the floor) and I pretty much figured I'd have to wait for warmer weather before I'd have a chance to get running water back.  But this weekend is supposed to be warmer (19 at night) so perhaps I can get the proper jet for the heater (it needs a different one because of the altitude) and an efficient fan to move the air around in there.  Then with heat trace (and some luck) I'll get the pipes thawed and have running water again.  Meanwhile, I'll go down south to see my wife this week and will get a shower then ;) 

Noticed the temp on the window is now reading +3 and the back room is up to 44 degrees so at least there is that and quite possibly we'll see it rise into the 50's again today as the day warms up.  Meanwhile, I'll work on insulation inside the cabin to continue to improve it.

On a side note my sinuses are killing me!  The cold has made the air VERY dry and despite putting a pot of water on the stove to add some moisture back into the air it's still only around 25% humidity!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 08, 2013, 11:00:09 PM
I can't help thinking, as a large pot of water sits steaming on the woodstove, that in some ways I'm living a lot like they did long ago. Sure I have a truck outside and a job but in this modern world (ok I have internet etc too) to be without running water is almost unheard of! Yet, I'm not worried! I'm clean shaving, have washed hair and took a bath of sorts

You see, long ago when I was just a teen I often dreamed of living in the woods but never really imagined I'd do it some day. Certainly not now! So after a lifetime of wondering what it would have been like here I am in the middle of nowhere with a shotgun by my bed, a .45 near my chair and no neighbours within 3/4's of a mile (unless you consider the critters neighbours). And you know what? It aint half bad

I will however admit that I miss my wife a LOT and this WILL NOT be my life forever, not even close! I do, after all, prefer company, time with my family and modern conveniences etc but for now, I'm enjoying living he way few get to do anymore.

So, while you read about my lack of running water and worried about power etc bear in mind that I'm not grumbling! Not at all, in fact I'm enjoying the challenge and living 'the life' right now Of course, I also get to go see my wife and have some modern conveniences every week or two and without that 'probably go crazy! LOL but for now, I'm relaxing by a warm fire, savouring a strong bourbon and contemplating an early night because, well, that's what you do when you live in the woods and the woodshed is nearly full, the fire is hot, the cabin is warm and you can't really go out and get more done.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on December 08, 2013, 11:56:35 PM
A crackling wood stove and full wood shed.  Some vittles stored and a few good books and snuggled down for the winter evening.  Things could be worse....   ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Frank W on December 10, 2013, 01:14:25 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on December 08, 2013, 11:00:09 PM
I can't help thinking, as a large pot of water sits steaming on the woodstove, that in some ways I'm living a lot like they did long ago. Sure I have a truck outside and a job but in this modern world (ok I have internet etc too) to be without running water is almost unheard of! Yet, I'm not worried! I'm clean shaving, have washed hair and took a bath of sorts

You see, long ago when I was just a teen I often dreamed of living in the woods but never really imagined I'd do it some day. Certainly not now! So after a lifetime of wondering what it would have been like here I am in the middle of nowhere with a shotgun by my bed, a .45 near my chair and no neighbours within 3/4's of a mile (unless you consider the critters neighbours). And you know what? It aint half bad

I will however admit that I miss my wife a LOT and this WILL NOT be my life forever, not even close! I do, after all, prefer company, time with my family and modern conveniences etc but for now, I'm enjoying living he way few get to do anymore.

So, while you read about my lack of running water and worried about power etc bear in mind that I'm not grumbling! Not at all, in fact I'm enjoying the challenge and living 'the life' right now Of course, I also get to go see my wife and have some modern conveniences every week or two and without that 'probably go crazy! LOL but for now, I'm relaxing by a warm fire, savouring a strong bourbon and contemplating an early night because, well, that's what you do when you live in the woods and the woodshed is nearly full, the fire is hot, the cabin is warm and you can't really go out and get more done.
[/quote OJH, I'm living in a 12x24 manufactured cabin. I do have a drilled well but only outside. We are in the process of building the 20x34 cottage. In the mean time, 288 sq ft, a home made sprayer shower, and cooking on a grill or hot eye will have to do and I love it.
Your cabin has made quite a impact on me. LOL
I'm think of buying a wood mizer LT10.
BTW, we have a eccotemp fvi12 water heater but I haven't had time to hook it up yet. Post more pics!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: troy on December 10, 2013, 02:19:51 PM
Eric,

You probably already know this, but you might want to talk to your distributor about some options to get enough evaporation through the winter months.  A second tank might be in order, or possibly burying the tank, or even burying two tanks.  LP can only evaporate so much so fast, depending entirely on temperature and surface area.  If your distributor knows the business, they'll know what you need to get through the winter.

Good luck!

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 11, 2013, 12:04:22 AM
Quote from: troy on December 10, 2013, 02:19:51 PM
Eric,

You probably already know this, but you might want to talk to your distributor about some options to get enough evaporation through the winter months.  A second tank might be in order, or possibly burying the tank, or even burying two tanks.  LP can only evaporate so much so fast, depending entirely on temperature and surface area.  If your distributor knows the business, they'll know what you need to get through the winter.

Good luck!

Unfortunately the biggest issue (besides $$$) was that I really had no idea how much I'd run the 8000BTU heater.  So, even with a room that has R30 walls and an R32 roof the 32" of concrete walls (filled) with R10 on the outside is just too hard to keep warm.  At least when there is no door (R10 foam stuffed in the opened with backer boards to hold it in place and OSB pinned to the outside with screws and then various coverings on the entrance space acts as a door for now) and when one corner was not backfilled in time leaving the R10 exposed for about 4 feet.

Furthermore, I hadn't really considered the cold down draft from the 4" vent stack and 2" vent stack which despite one fan in the 4" stack operating 24x7 (until it quit recently) seem to really have an effect.  Add in the 3" stack for the heater and, well, the floor is COLD.  latest room temp was 68 at the highest and 49 at lowest but that's 4' off the ground.  I have to do some more work in there to keep the floor from freezing.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 11, 2013, 01:24:21 AM
http://www.amazon.com/Cooler-Master-MegaFlow-200-Computer/dp/B008G3OLRQ/ref=sr_1_2/175-7720524-6667726?s=pc&ie=UTF8&qid=1386742861&sr=1-2&keywords=12v+fan
I'm seriously thinking of adding two of these to the back room instead of the two 90mm fans I have in there....I'm not sure they move enough air though and am still looking for some options...
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 29, 2013, 12:36:01 PM
Hi All!

I'm back after a 3 week absence from the cabin (and somewhat from the internet - though by choice) and can report that we only have 2-3 inches of snow (so getting here was easy).  It's snowing now though so perhaps I'll have more to plow soon ;)

My truck battery had died so I couldn't bring it from the garage (I leave it in the garage at work when I leave for business which I did three weeks ago -- rather conveniently since business was by my home ;) ) and since my 'jump box' (a heap Chinese one) didn't work to get it started I just repacked my work rig and headed to the cabin hoping I wouldn't need chains since I don't have any on my work rig (just studded snowies).

Arriving here I found that my inverter sleep mode didn't wake up to charge the generator battery and while it was at 13v it wasn't strong enough to get the genset running right away.  I had to wait for the inverter power to charge it enough to crank the generator long enough to both start and start providing power.  It would fire and then shut down because the battery dropped to a low voltage and give me an insufficient voltage alarm.

Once the gen was running though, all was good :)  I had already cranked up the backup heater (just left both heaters with pilots on) and the wood stove so getting the temp in the cabin up was a synch :)  In no time (ok a couple hours anyway) it was 60 degrees and comfy.

THe back room temp rose to above 40 degrees at the floor too :)  THis was very nice as it meant my newly heat taped water line would thaw! 

I ran the generator for 5 hours and gave the batteries a good charge, then set the auto start to 24v and 5 hours knowing it would come on in the AM because the heat tape was on and draws a fair amount of energy.  I went to bed reading a good book and stoking the fire throughout the night (this is always a first night routine as I do not run the back up (vent free) heater when I'm in the cabin unless in an emergency or just when heating on arrival as the door is always opening and closing so no worries about it.  So, with the back up heater off and a still warming cabin I get up every two hours to stoke the stove.  Usually by late morning (now) the cabin is above 70 which it is :)

The snow is coming down harder now.

This morning I went out and turned on the water and grabbed some more wood.  I'd had the main valve off while I was gone.

I have running water!  Though I also have a broken pipe (I think inside the instant on hot water heater :(  However, it wasn't a real expensive one ($200 vs $700) so replacing it is doable.  I'm just thankful the pipes aren't frozen under the ground or worse!  Now I have to put a plug in the water line to the hotwater heater so I can turn the water on and not get a shower, then I'll have running water again and can at least heat water on the wood stove etc.  Next I'll gert a 3/4" water valve to install on the main going to the hot water heater so I can turn the water off to it when needed (I had one before but removed it when I switched from 1/2" pex to 3/4" pex.

I'll have to order a replacement hot water heater but in theory should have hot running water within a week or ten days.  Meanwhile I'll start to dump extra snow from plowing, over the water line by the cabin to add some insulation there and I'll continue to work on the various things that need doing to better survive the winter :)

All in all I'm pretty happy though because it's a LOT easier (and cheaper) to replace the hot water heater then to dig up the ground and replace split pipes!  Not to mention there won't be ANY digging until the spring thaw since the ground is now hard as concrete
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 30, 2013, 08:47:54 AM
While the place is looking pretty Wintry it's actually kind of warm being at or slightly above freezing at the warmest part of the the day ;)  Which is more normal for this area this time of year.  Slightly above freezing during the warmest part of the day and into the teens at night which means lots of ice after things start to melt and the reason one needs heavy duty chains to get here unless some guy with a tractor keeps the road open ;)
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Property_Dec29_zps7aab9790.jpg)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Mill_Dec29_2103_zps7fa8daf6.jpg)
I fired up the mill an warmed it up and also removed the frozen water lube bottle and thawed it out.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Mill_Dec29_2013_2_zps9a36d68f.jpg)
I'm hoping to get back to milling soon (maybe Wednesday to ring in the new year) and this is maybe 1/3 of the logs I have to mill.  The rest have yet to be bucked up and hauled to the landing which is ok since I am planning on re-arranging things a little so I can use the tractor to do all the log loading.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Propane_Dec29_zps588078bd.jpg)
By far my biggest concern is the setting on this tank.  At 32 degrees it's reading just above 60% and it's only the end of December.  I have two more months of 'hard winter' ahead of me and I've used about 25% of the tank in just over two months with only one of them being 'hard winter'.  My hope is that the sub zero weather won't be back and I'll not drop the tank to 40% before the spring when I can get a truck in here to fill i back up.  I believe I'll need another 100 gallons to make it through to the fall.

I've also noticed that the power bank is not holding long enough :( Maybe because it was Sunday and I had the inverter on all day along with the radio, fridge at at times lights and modem etc etc.  I did a lot of reading but no TV watching.  Still, I'd run the generator in the morning and in under 24 hours it was back on again (it's running now).  My hope is that with the inverter in sleep mode (which won't be an issue since the fridge will fire it up periodically throughout the day) the power will be well enough charged via the gen and the sun today that it won't come on when I'm back tonight after work and won't come on in the morning.  I need it to run no more then every other day (that's what I budgeted).

Ahhh well, cabin life eh?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on December 30, 2013, 11:17:24 AM
OJ I feel your pain..... You might want to form a battle plan now just in case it is a long winter.

You might ask about rental of a couple 100 pound tanks just in case.   Then also find out about a regulator and a automatic switch over valve between the two 100 pound tanks like on an RV.  I think that is where I would go to an RV place repair place.  Or check with you gas jobber.   Then when one empties it will show red and automatically swap over to the full one.  Flip the selector valve to the full tank and disconnect the empty and take it to work with you for a refill.   

My concern is when they put the fifthwheel on the large 500 gallon tank they sat a regulator for that tank and disconnected RV regulator.  I can do the same just have to be ready to crawl under and unhook and reconnect to the smaller bottles.  The 100 pound tank will run the skirted fifthwheel for a week in single digit weather to high minus.  That is furnace, water heater and  stove.  The refrigerator / freezer is set to electric when available.  Being on grid we do supplement the RV heat with an electric EdenPure type heater and one of those small sealed oil units in the sleeping area as well.  ??? (I really don't know what they are called)  They sort of look like a steam heat register only puny.   :D  We like a cool sleeping quarters but when it is zero out side the nose on one of these can get pretty cold....
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 30, 2013, 12:49:55 PM
Hmmmm I do have two 100lb tanks (20 gallons each) that I could use but I'd need a regulator of some kind for them.  I guess I could ask FerralGas if they have a regulator that would work.  I would probably be able to just disconnect the 500 gallon tank and swap over to the 20 gallon tanks in an emergency.

The issue I see is that if I actually used 10% of the 500 gallon tank in one cold week (or a little longer) then two 20 gallon tanks won't last me very long! 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on December 30, 2013, 01:05:43 PM
There is another way out and that is talk to your propane jobber.  I think you can legally haul a 150 gallon full if placards are displayed.  You would have to work over your road and make sure you could make it of course with the pick up and trailer with a 150 loaded on it.   

About the hundred pounders I would talk to an RV parts place about the regulator and switch valve.  Yes you might have to shuttle them a lot but at least you would have gas......  Stay away for the big name RV dealers and repair places unless you are just comparing prices.  I have found them to be stupid expensive. 

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 30, 2013, 02:22:24 PM
http://virtualmark.net/wx/pressure.htm
Found this chart and it makes me wonder if my 60% at 32 degrees doesn't mean I have a LOT more propane then I think I do???  According to the chart the LPG at 60% will be 100psig while at 32 it will be 55psig which, if the guage is really reading PSI and not %of fill then showing 60% may well be inline with a pretty full tank.

When it was filled I think it was overfull as it showed 85% and it was a cold day.  I was told it would only be filled to 80% which it may have been when he arrived to fill it but when I arrived later (and possibly warmer) it was at 85%....so, if the temp drops well below freezing the % of fill should also drop if I understand how propane reacts to the cold and how the guage reacts to cold propane.

Perhaps reading 60% in 32 degree weather isn't an issue...or perhaps I'm full of it! lol
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 30, 2013, 02:54:49 PM
http://www.ehow.com/about_6339059_cold-propane-tank-level-gauge_.html
According to this (I have no idea how valid it is but my research suggests it is correct) my guage will read lower at 32F then when at 60F so, regaurdless of how much lower that might be I can extrapolate that I more then likely have more then 60% remaining in the tank which amounts to about 300 gallons of propane (so I'd have more than 300 gallons remaining of the approximately 450 gallons I had when it read 85%).

I was told by Ferrallgas (my supplier) that I can run the tank dry if I needed to so not to worry about that (they want you to call them with a two week supply to give them time to get there so they ask you call around 30% remaining).

So, if in fact I've used about 100 gallons since it was installed (October sometime -- I need to go back and check) and if the cold is what has the tank showing as low as it is rather then use, then I at least have 300 gallons which SHOULD last me about 3 times as long as I've had already.  Basically I should have 6 months of propane in the tank which should see me through to  the summer (and likely well beyond).

My guess is I have little to worry about but it's just a guess...barely even a SWAG....
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on December 30, 2013, 03:21:51 PM
I was sort of using our area as a gauge.  When the snow starts they lock themselves out of this this area.  In fact the driver was surprised they sent him up here to fill our tank a couple weeks ago.  They did send him around and top off people tanks though while he was here.     
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 30, 2013, 03:31:11 PM
It's like that here too, at least from now until March.

I can clear the road for them but the super steep grades and tight turns are too much for a bobtail.  Heck, even in the summer they don't like driving to my place! lol
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: flyingvan on December 30, 2013, 08:01:24 PM
http://www.homesteadingtoday.com/general-homesteading-forums/homesteading-questions/111888-quick-question-about-effects-temperature-propane-level-tank.html

   Good discussion on this topic.   The ehow article you linked mis-worded one thing, saying 'the gas will contract as it gets colder'...I think the author meant the liquid, not the gas.  The vapor state area expands as the liquid layer contracts.  The first conversion chart you linked to doesn't really matter---your gauge doesn't work off of pressure, just liquid level.  It does illustrate two things, though---the pressure in a tank will vary wildly, and when you get down around -44F propane won't vaporize anymore.  The rate of vaporization will depend on the surface area of the liquid in the tank, the temperature, and the pressure.  You drop the pressure whenever you use some propane, so it boils off a bit to equalize again.  When it boils off, the temperature drops a little too---which is why you can sometimes 'see' the level of the liquid by the condensation on the tank if it's in use.  If the tank is horizontal, and down to about 10%, and really cold out, sometimes pilots start going out.  The assumption is there isn't enough pressure, but really there just isn't enough surface area at that temperature to maintain demand.   (Not to go too Cliff Claven here, but this is also why you can't run a big on demand water heater on a little propane tank.  THe little tank won't have enough liquid surface area to keep up with demand)
    An interesting point in the linked discussion is that the tank itself expands and contracts also
with temperature changes, so a chart showing propane's expansion/contraction by temperature won't tell the whole story.  Maybe you need to mount your tank on a scale and just go by weight.

An optimist sees the glass as half full.
A pessimist sees the glass as half empty.
Really, the glass is completely full---half of it in a liquid state and half in a vapor state
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 30, 2013, 11:22:22 PM
Thanks for the link, I'll check it out.

I think I've solved one nagging problem with my back room:  the small heater in there was trying to heat up the whole cabin through the 16x16 'return air' style vent I installed to allow cabin heat to get back into the room.

I suspected this might be the case as the heaters thermostat was cranked all the way up but it just ran and ran and ran.  The room at floor level was stabilized at 44F this evening (that is where the remote sensor for my thermometer was so I could see what the temp was at the bottom of the composter and the water main line coming into the room) and I began to suspect that its setting was higher then needed but that for some reason it just wasn't getting there.  My suspicion was that the heater was set to a temp that it couldn't reach with the cabin sitting at 60-70 degrees and allowing the hot air near the roof of the room to enter the cabin to help warm it -- the air vent was at the ceiling of the room (near enough) but at waist high in the bathroom.

So, on a whim to see what would happen I put some R10 foam insulation in the vent and plugged it up.  The temp at floor level jumped from 44 to 46F in minutes!

It's currently at 46 and indicating that it is rising (which it may or may not because it indicates that until the temp either stabilizes for a while or begins to drop.

So, with fingers crossed I wait to see what happens and hope that the heater can finally shut down once it reaches the temp it wants to get to and then MAYBE it won't run that often afterwards.  If this is the case then I can be assured I have enough propane to last much longer!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 31, 2013, 08:31:20 AM
The temp at the floor in the back room is now 54!!!   [cool] c* ;D

I will turn the heat DOWN tomorrow when I have a chance to open the room and then I'll keep and eye on it and see how it does.  Amazing how something so small can make such a difference!

One of the reasons I had that vent open was my thinking that I wanted the room to be 50-55F and the cabin was 60-70 which is warmer so the warmth in the cabin would help the room but I wasn't taking into account the rise of heat to the ceiling of the back room and then out into the cabin.

Funny thing, the cabin is 71F right now and maintaining nicely also :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: considerations on December 31, 2013, 09:21:35 AM
"Funny thing, the cabin is 71F right now"
That has got to be a relief! I know I start to tense up if the place gets below 55. Bundling up just makes me claustrophobic. Think Pillsbury Doughboy with bug eyes.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: UperJoe on December 31, 2013, 10:04:50 AM
Come on ya'll - it was -19F and wind chills of -57 and I just pulled out my winter coat ;D
before that it was a long  sleeved tee under a sweatshirt under a wind shell and a lightweight vest on it all. Gloves came out last week and ol' baldy cheated and tossed on a stocking cap 2 weeks ago.
It's only cold - I can deal with cold. Heat and humidity - no way no how :-[
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 31, 2013, 10:53:52 AM
Quote from: UperJoe on December 31, 2013, 10:04:50 AM
Come on ya'll - it was -19F and wind chills of -57 and I just pulled out my winter coat ;D
before that it was a long  sleeved tee under a sweatshirt under a wind shell and a lightweight vest on it all. Gloves came out last week and ol' baldy cheated and tossed on a stocking cap 2 weeks ago.
It's only cold - I can deal with cold. Heat and humidity - no way no how :-[

I was that way when I was young and living in the North.  Never thought anything of riding a snowmobile in -40.  It was just fun!  but after decades in warm climates 10F and lower is COLD to me! lol....and we were down to -12F.

But, regardless of what we think of as cold, not having running water or a indoor toilet can be a bear to handle when also having to work for a living in an environment where shaving and showering and wearing clean presentable clothes is important! lol
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 01, 2014, 01:56:59 PM
Well things just got harder at the cabin for me :(

You see, when we installed the grey water drain system, which works great, we did it for weekend trips and week long get aways primarily in the warmer months.  It wasn't intended to be a full time system but it did work in the warmer months just fine for one person.   It worked so well I didn't give it much thought.  After all, if I could do dishes, take a shower, brush my teeth etc then I had nothing to worry about.  The grey water drain system was designed to handle that kind of load no problem, even twice that and could easily be expanded to hand more.

However, I hadn't counted on it freezing solid after two months of freezing weather and I should have.  I guess I just had too much on my mind and too much to do with too little time.  So here I am with the settling tank completely frozen.  As far as I can tell there is about 50 gallons of frozen solid grey water in there.  What's worse is that I hadn't realized (and clearly didn't have the common sense to consider) that the tank was freezing up.  Sure I new it had some ice on it but when it was really cold it only had a light skim of ice on top.  Probably because I was using it and the water was flowing though it constantly melting the top layer and allowing it to refreeze and then melting it again.  However I was gone for three weeks and I guess the lack of use allowed it to freeze completely and since I didn't know I kept adding to it...and that water froze in the 4" main....an I'm sure more water froze up in the 1 1'/2 inch pipes...

My guess is I have no grey water drain now for at least 2 to 3 months or longer....worse yet?  It's on the North side of our cabin :(  Had I thought about it I would have placed it on the South side so it could get warm from the sun and thaw when it was cold...I might also have drained it some before leaving for a few weeks.

So now I'll have to remove the trap from the sink in the kitchen and put a bucket under it for grey water.  I can do the same for the tub too (that's what I did before I hooked it up to the drain system) so I can at least still have showers though they will be always a challenge since I'll have to go out and drain the bucket before having another (meaning each day I'll had to add that to my routine)....if I do it when it is not frozen I can dump down the outhouse, at least until it fills with ice too!

Life at the cabin full time aint ever easy.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 01, 2014, 04:31:26 PM
It appears that only the top 6" of the tank is frozen.  The problem is that the inlet and exit are there also -- so frozen.

I believe the solution (in the late spring) will be to dig up the system and lower it by a second tank.  I can excavate down about 3 more feet and add a lower tank section (the manufacturer makes these) and then lower the outlet by a foot or more and lower the dry sump by the same.  This way I'll have the inlet coming in well above any freezing level and the outlet may also then be low enough to allow water to flow out below the freeze point.

I can then insulate the inlet pipe as well as the top 2 or 3 feet of the tank and cover it with an insulated lid.  I'll also insulate the top of the dry sump.

I think if I do this and keep the pipes all insulated then I shouldn't run into this problem next winter.  My hope is to be able to live here full time for at least another 18 months or so.  Then perhaps we can sell out home down south and buy one where I work.  Then the cabin can go back to being a vacation home!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 02, 2014, 01:41:21 PM
Not to be outdown I found my wash tubs and was able to do dishes, wash up, shave and generally feel civilized again ;)

It's amazing how something so simple can feel so great!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on January 02, 2014, 01:48:52 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on January 02, 2014, 01:41:21 PM
Not to be outdown I found my wash tubs and was able to do dishes, wash up, shave and generally feel civilized again ;)

It's amazing how something so simple can feel so great!

BOY OH BOY OJ if that is not the truth.  Back when I was a 'back woods rat' nothing felt so good as a nice hot bath or shower and a shave. 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 02, 2014, 03:46:53 PM
Quote from: rick91351 on January 02, 2014, 01:48:52 PM
 

BOY OH BOY OJ if that is not the truth.  Back when I was a 'back woods rat' nothing felt so good as a nice hot bath or shower and a shave.

Using tubs in a sink isn't quite as nice as a hot bath or shower but it's a sight lot better than a canteen cup, a rag and a pint of water!  This old marine can attest to that ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on January 03, 2014, 02:58:10 PM
Re the info from FerrelGas that you can run the tank dry....  It may vary by state I suppose, but here in NM if you run a stationary tank completely down to zero content the propane company can not fill the tank until the system has been checked for leaks. I would do a double check on that before getting it down to empty.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on January 03, 2014, 02:59:48 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on January 03, 2014, 02:58:10 PM
Re the info from FerrelGas that you can run the tank dry....  It may vary by state I suppose, but here in NM if you run a stationary tank completely down to zero content the propane company can not fill the tank until the system has been checked for leaks. I would do a double check on that before getting it down to empty.

Here they do not like it to get below 20%.  Give or take a little.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on January 03, 2014, 03:26:41 PM
Hey thanks I did not know that.  Good to know.... 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 05, 2014, 10:22:22 PM
I checked with them and all they said was that the air had to be purged from the lines if the tank is completely empty -- which is of course ALWAYS the case.  Why?  Pilot lights can't light until the air is purged from the line which is usually done by opening the line until the propane pushes all the air out.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 06, 2014, 07:46:58 PM
Quiet back here at the the cabin. It;'s warming up nicely though and already up to 64 degrees (it was 59 when I arrived). The power is good though the generator will kick on this evening as it usually does when I return.

I'll have to get more wood in soon and make sure I have everything else out of the truck (my usual routine) and then it will be dark and time to make dinner and settle in for the evening.

I'll admit that it's a bit lonely, specially when I first return and I always miss my lovely wife while I'm gone but the cabin has become a second home for me over the last 4 years, specially the last few months and it is becoming much easier to arrive as it's kept warm by the back up heat, the water works and while the stove can be a bear to start after a long break it's going nicely now an warming up the place well.

It's also very nice to be able to work from here on afternoons like today as the internet works pretty well ad I can get on the VPN easily enough so all systems are available here as if I were in the office

Started work on the speaker boxes sort of -- designed them and started working on them -- and hope to have both car speakers mounted in the ceiling by weeks end or at least the weekend. This weekend I plan to do some milling also provided the weather agrees.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 11, 2014, 11:18:56 AM
The warm weather has struck!  It seems a storm on the coast caused a Chinook affect (my guess since it's not uncommon) and we're experiencing the benefit!  It was 39 when I last checked and we've had some melting!  [cool]  I heard the grey water drain and the sewer pipe may also have melted some -- all good news for me.

On the other hand whenever we get  Chinook the wind picks up and this is no exception!  I'm getting some big gusts so will have to keep and eye on the trees in case they decide to come down.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on January 12, 2014, 12:48:40 AM
Warm and windy here as well OJ for another day then promises to get cold at night.  This global warming here is not bad just need moisture....
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 12, 2014, 11:00:06 AM
hahah Global Warming  d* Just like the global warming that gave us -10 to -15 degree nights just a few short weeks ago....I heard recently the same principle can be used to show the economy is improving:  we're losing jobs so it's getting better ;)  d* ???

This is quite normal out here but I hadn't expected it this winter (I should have).  It's what we call a Chinook an always happens after a big dump of moisture on the coast, it's also (I realized yesterday) what causes all the ice build up on my road out of here.  The warm Chinook winds thaw the snow and leave slush and water on top of ice, then the night time temps below freezing turn it into solid ice -- repeat until it's freezing again day and night and you have a THICK layer of dangerous ice on the road.

I plowed a bunch with the tractor but will have to chain up for the next month or so unless I get lucky.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 12, 2014, 12:13:07 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/IMG_20140109_062332_971_zps57906a4a.jpg)
This is what my commute looked like this week ;)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Jan12-2014_zps069d2002.jpg)
The result of yesterday's melt off and plowing.  I hope to get more plowing done today and while I'd like to also buck up some logs and drag them to the mill I just won't have the time :(  Heck, I still need to get into the back room and try to change out some fans!  Sheesh,  not enough time and it's snowing again.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/corner_zpsb3ac8093.jpg)
This is where I spend most of my time.  I hate the dust but I think it won't get better until I get the tool shed built an the deck as well as complete the interior.  Then, at least, I'll not be coming in and out looking for tools or parts and the insulation won't be able to contribute to the dust and of course, the deck will act as a buffer.  I plan to put those but brushes on the deck so boots can be cleaned off before entering the porch, then they come off!  With luck I'll be able to keep the floor clean once I install it ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 24, 2014, 08:01:34 PM
I'm really getting this wood stove down :)  Here are some of the things I've learned living with a Vermont Casings full time as my only source of heat:

1.  Clean out the ash box daily.
2.  When the stove is reasonably cool an after 2-3 days of use in a row remove the air intake plate an brush out any ash that's in there.  If completely cool vacuum out the ashes that collect in the air ducts (I do this every week or two).
3.  Once you have the place warm and a very good bed of coals tamp the stove down all the way after adding a good round or two.
4.  Before bed put in a good round and tamp down the stove.
5.  Use half seasoned wood when the stove is hot and the cabin warm enough.  This will extend the burn time.
6.  Use drier lint to start the stove with good pine kindling and a split.
7.  Keep lots of 2-3 inch splits for getting the coals built up after the stove is lit and running well
8.  Small pine limbs make good small pieces for initial burn and start up.

I find that I can leave the stove with a full bed of coals and a good round (and maybe a split beside it if there is room) for 10 hours and it will be hot with some coals still burning after 10 hrs.  This is key for me as I leave the cabin around 6am and return around 4:30pm.  Having a hot stove with some hot coals still in it when I get back home from work makes it much easier to start and the cabin temperature in below freezing weather remains about 63 degrees.  It still takes a couple hours to get the temp back up closer to 70 but when it's 26F outside an 63F inside after being gone for over 10 hours it's pretty nice and I can wait a couple more to get it above 65 (probably takes 3 to approach 70).

I still have finish work to do on the ceiling and some missing insulation so I suspect that when the cabin is finished I will have no problem maintaining a warm inside temp even when I am gone!

One a side note I have had no problems with the stove during the night when I shut the window and go to bed.  I leave the window open in the evening (just a crack) to allow more air to get into the cabin but have learned it isn't nearly as tight as I thought it was!  I still plan to install the outside air intake but am grateful I haven't had any issue without it.

On another note, the KozyWorld vent free heater has been a god send for me!  I have no worries about moisture as I keep a pot on the stove with 1 1/2 gallons of water in it at al times and that has to add a LOT more moisture than the propane heater might and while I don't us the heater when I am at the cabin except when warming it up after a period away or perhaps some day in an emergency in extreme temps outside (haven't had to yet even with -12 to -15F nights but who knows right?) but it has not been a problem.  I used a site to calculate the required cubic feet of volume in an enclosed space for it's use and I'm about double what it requires so that may have something to do with it.  Again, I don't use the heater when I'm hear though (unless as mentioned if I had an emergency like if the stove went out and I wasn't well and it was very cold outside etc) but knowing that I could is always nice.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 24, 2014, 09:28:17 PM
Correction, 1 hour to 65F and two hours to 70F :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 25, 2014, 03:57:11 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Loading_zpsedc06ed0.jpg)
Getting some milling done finally.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Loading2_zps50fe4b8c.jpg)
The tractor makes loading easy but the going is slow otherwise

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Milling_zpscc04ec34.jpg)
Probably the toughest part of winter milling is the frozen logs though it's always tough milling alone

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/ManleyMill_zpsd73c51cf.jpg)
Big Fir log on the mill.  I'm milling siding for my new room.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: new land owner on January 26, 2014, 09:54:05 AM
I have the same stove and it seems that I have to keep the door open slightly to get the fire going. 

Do you have the same problem?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 26, 2014, 10:53:57 AM
Quote from: new land owner on January 26, 2014, 09:54:05 AM
I have the same stove and it seems that I have to keep the door open slightly to get the fire going. 

Do you have the same problem?

For the first few minutes perhaps and only if the stove hasn't been cleaned.  There is a steel plate right in front of the door on the floor of the stove with a screw in it.  Remove the screw and lift the plate.  The first time it might be hard because they put some hitemp silicone or glue on it (this is a Vermont Castings officially recommended cleaning procedure) then brush out the dust that has gathered under the plate.  Once done, if the stove has not run for a while and is completely cool, vacuum out the air ducts which can get clogged with ash over time.  Finally put the plate back (I do not glue back down as I remove it often).

You will be amazed ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: new land owner on January 26, 2014, 02:39:21 PM
Thanks, I will give it a try next time I go to camp.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 26, 2014, 11:21:46 PM
You won't regret :)  I live with my Vermont Aspen full time now and find that I have to clean the ash pan every couple days or so (I burn a lot of pine) and I sweep the chimney every couple months too.  I also burn a mix of woods with the driest splits first when getting the cabin warmed up after being gone, then dry rounds once I have a good bed of coals and don't need as much heat from the box to keep the cabin at comfortable temps.

I also debark the firewood of the thickest barks (pine is bad). 

At night I shut the stove down all the way and let it smoulder through the night.  If I don't care about the morning temp in the cabin then I don't get up to stoke it at night because I can get it burning for a good 10 hours these days :)  But to do that I have to let the cabin temp drop to about 63F which I prefer not to do and then I have to restart it if I'm unlucky and it completely burns out early and with only an hour to get ready and head to work I don't want to do that so I usually get up once or twice in th night to fill it back up
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 05, 2014, 08:29:40 AM
Coldest night at the cabin so far! I kept the stove going with the damper all the way open not something I usually do) and the backup heater came on several times! When I got up this morning it was 57F inside the cabin which is 5 to 10 degrees cooler than usual. I have the stove going and the backup heater going and it's now up to 60 in here.

No idea yet what outside temps are but down in the valley below me it's -9F (-22.7C for my Canuck friends). So ya, it's cold. Going to be colder tonight too but I'll clean out the stove and keep it going as hot as I can all night.

I also dragged out my 0 degree sleeping bag that Darci and I like to use a blanket in colder weather but that I don't normally need at the cabin and put it over the bed. I was pretty warm under the covers but getting up to stoke the stove was a bit chilly! As was my morning bath! lol
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: dablack on February 05, 2014, 10:27:39 AM
I really appreciate the reporting on the use of your VC.  I've never used anything like that and like to hear how it goes.

thanks
Austin
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on February 05, 2014, 10:48:28 AM
Yes, reports of how devices and techniques perform are always good. With some things like heating or air conditioning you do have to consider the building footprint, whether one floor with 8 ft ceiling vs. cathedral ceiling and loft space, insulation levels, number of windows, type, quality, and probably more.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on February 05, 2014, 11:20:41 AM
Are you getting any snow up your way?  They are penciling in a good storm here finely than might pull us up to 60 -70% of normal.  It is because of a good flow of moist tropical air and the cold temps you are having.  Thanks  [cool]  Our temps are dipping into the single digits as well with a light snow falling.  We might have a a foot on the ground now maybe.   :-\
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 05, 2014, 12:25:12 PM
Snow this weekend they say....can't come soon enough!  The minus temps are killing me! lol

On the VC:  I think this stove is a good little stove for those who have to buy low particulate stoves (or want to -- I like the very little smoke it gives off myself) and have a small cabin to heat and it WILL run for close to 12 hours (I think Vermont Castings claims 8 or 9 hrs but I've had mine go longer now that I'm learning to use it more efficiently).

The biggest trouble I have today is a combination of failing to get the last bists of insulation installed and being too lazy to bring in more seasoned wood when it gets very cold out.  You see, I have two full 24"x10' roof/ceiling bays that have not been insulated except a few feet at the bottom and 18" at the top and then I have each of the bays along the entire roof on both sides that are only insulated with R21 up to within 2-3 feet of the peak and then some temp R19 for 18" at the peak leaving a gap.  This means I lose a lot of heat.

I keep saying I'm going to fix that and I keep putting it off for other things.  d* d* d* d* d*

Had I completed the insulation and interior paneling etc then I would not have the problems I have now with these cold temps as the VC stove works well.

On the seasoned vs half seasoned wood:  I burn both.  I try to use nicely seasoned wood to get the stove going and warm up the cabin but once I have a good bed of coals and the place is warm I start burning half seasoned Fir which burns longer with a little less output (much of the BTU's are used to dry the wood out first)...why?  To conserve fuel.  You see, it takes a lot longer to burn through half seasoned wood and when you don't need the BTU's it's a great way to keep the stove going for longer periods of time (like overnight or during the day when I'm not there).

Of course, doing this probably means you should clean the chimney more often but I do it every couple months anyway.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rugger8 on February 05, 2014, 01:04:23 PM
OJH - Sometimes it is easier to see things from far away, rather than being there and doing it.  But I would have to think that you are spending an awful lot more time cutting and chopping wood to make up for a partially insulated roof.  Just saying the couple hours it would take to finish insulating probably saves days worth of wood over the course of a winter.  I hate insulation too, but your a Marine!  Get on it!

Of course, that's just a friendly suggestion from an old Army guy!  Or is it too easy there, so you have to make it harder on yourself, that sounds like a true Marine, ha ha... :)

Keep up the good work!

Jeff
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 05, 2014, 01:11:55 PM
LOL

Truth is most of the time it isn't an issue and the two bays are above the opening to the lower floor which means I'd have to construct a catwalk to get to them -- which is why they were left.

This cold has me thinking I might just have to get to it today!  I have some 10' long 2x8's around and could set them up to give me access...I keep thinking:  go by HD and get the darn insulation you idiot!

Luckily though, I'm not using much wood actually.  I had about 2 1/2 cords or so and have only used about half of that so far this winter.  I'm fairly sure I'll have a cord left by spring or maybe 1/2 a cord. 

Next year though I'll have more and will need less :)  Much better place to be!

OH and no splitting wood anymore, it's all split, I just have to haul it in.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 05, 2014, 01:24:41 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Milling/IMG_0480_zpsaf88dbbb.jpg)
Pulled the mill down off the hill yesterday as I have a job milling Walnut this weekend.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Milling/IMG_0488_zpse937c423.jpg)
You can't tell the grade here but I've caculated it at 16%...it's very steep and in the winter almost scary.  Dragging the mill down was something I worried about but it was no problem thanks to my plowing it constantly this winter and the ice chains on the truck.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Milling/8467cbff-92e9-4374-a3ec-85cdaad02198_zpsc6c163ee.jpg)
Maybe a better shot...where the truck is the drive is only 9 feet wide.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Milling/IMG_0498_zpsc12eba07.jpg)
The last section of our private road was washed out a bit and the stream froze solid leaving 12" of ice with deep ruts in it.  Almost lost the mill here!

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Milling/th_MVI_0493_zps00fcb88b.jpg) (https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Milling/MVI_0493_zps00fcb88b.mp4)
A little video of me dragging the mill down the last big grade.  It's another one that's about 16% but you can't tell in the video
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 05, 2014, 01:28:14 PM
Hmmm not sure why that pic doesn't rotate...it is rotated on pb
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: UK4X4 on February 05, 2014, 01:28:38 PM
You'll be loosing a lot of heat, even though it looks to be a small area, insulate it !,

In our RV at -20oC just putting silver double bubble over the windows at night made a huge diference with comfort, even the fan hole pillows made a diference to the heat escaping through the skylights.

also are you running a fan ? to circulate the heat back down and arround ?

its critical in a high ceiling room, to get that movement

heat rises.....put a digital thermo on a 2x4 and see what it reads up there in your heat chimney !

I use one of those cheap ones with a seperate remote sensor to check on temps

Under the RV, in the hold, in the garage, skylight holes
we used it everywhere to track down the heat leaks.

If we did a whole winter in the RV we'd definitely stop wind from comming underneath, and tape all the slide seals.

the double bubbled windows made a huge diference, we remove the south facing in the day and leave the rest on 24hrs

We can get 16-17oc inside in the day just from the sun through the south main window, no heating, but come sundown.....its drops like a stone !

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 05, 2014, 01:44:19 PM
Thanks to heat loss the loft is often cooler than down below  :o :o

OK OK!  I'll get that insulation fixed....I need to anyway because I heard propane is $5/gallon and I'm down to about 45% on my tank....
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rugger8 on February 05, 2014, 01:57:51 PM
See, I knew all you needed was a little push! ;)  You've only been talking about it for 2 years now.  Thw whole place is almost complete, except for 2 rows of insulation, ha ha.  Just having a little fun!

Jeff
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 05, 2014, 05:36:17 PM
You inspired me :)  as did others.  I'm going to get that sorted tonight (the cold has also inspired me as has the loss in propane)....

On a side note, I also have a 12vdc ceiling fan I need to install...hmmmm
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 05, 2014, 05:39:14 PM
I got lucky and had to run north passed the hwy to my place so took lunch and ran by the cabin.  The fire was almost out and the inside temp was 56F so I cleaned out the stove and got the fire going again :)  Also brought in some 2x6 to make a catwalk with for when I install the insulation.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 06, 2014, 12:51:28 AM
Got those two bays insulated and a few other spots plugged up.  More work to do tomorrow though.

Holding at 69 inside the cabin after getting to 70 with the backup heater helping out for a few minutes.  I'm going to stock up the stove and hit the hay  It will be interesting to see how the heat holds throughout he night as it's VERY cold outside!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 06, 2014, 08:36:52 AM
Down in the valley it is reading -13F so it's around there here though usually it's a little warmer.  I'll know as soon as I go start the truck ;)

Meanwhile back at the cabin it was a nice 63 when I got up this morning (for the last time as I got up periodically throughout the night to keep the fire going strong) which is a 5 degree improvement over the day before and considering it's as much as 5 degrees colder outside I'd say that's a win!

I'm at 66F now which is comfortable and while I'd like it to be 70 before I leave that just isn't going to happen.  So I'll stock up the stove, tamp it down in hopes that it will burn all day and leave the place with the curtains open on the south side to catch some solar heating.

Life at the cabin below zero :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 06, 2014, 10:26:31 AM
It turned out to be -18F (yes Minus eighteen) outside and it was -22 down the hill from me!  Good thing you guys spurred me into working on that insulation!  :)  More to be done tonight and I might even work on that fan.

Sure was nice waking up to 62F inside the cabin this morning!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 07, 2014, 12:40:39 AM
Completed half of the roof insulation (with foam vent boards) and stuffed left over R19 that I removed from that half of the roof (the top 18" that I'd placed there a couple years ago to plug up the vent) into the gaps on the other half so while the North side still needs to have the top 24" of venting and R21 installed it is at least for now, filled with R19.  Next chance I get I'll remove that last bit of temp R19 and replace with the vent foam and R21.  Then I can get back to installing panelling.

Having that catwalk makes a huge difference!  I can now work anywhere up there which was the reason I'd not completed it before.  Now I just need to fire up the table saw and rip some panelling at a 45 degree angle so I can place it where the roof pitch hits the straight walls.  Once done I can get back to installing the panelling up the ceiling.  I only have enough to do a couple feet at most but that will get my through a couple weeks since I only have nights and the occasional weekend.

Once I have the last of the panelling used I'll have to start planing and routering more panelling.  Hopefully it will be warmer weather, or at least sunny!  I'll probably have to get the gas generator fixed too so I an use it as propane is more expensive than gas right now and I need to conserve it for a while.  At least the insulation should help cut down the propane use ;)

Temps outside are about 9 degrees and it looks like it will snow tonight and stay warmer.  We need the snow so that's a good thing but if the roads are bad I won't be able to pull the mill down to the Tri-Cities and do the milling job I had lined up for this weekend.  I guess tomorrow will be the decider -- if the roads are bad I'll just go home for a weekend at home, but if they are good I'll go do a milling job :)

Oh and it's now 70 inside the cabin :)  I noticed a difference as soon as I began filling gaps with insulation, now I just need to sweep up the mess, pack and clean up before getting some rest.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 09, 2014, 12:56:22 AM
Saw a grey wolf chasing a deer yesterday...just a glimpse and within 1/2 mile of my cabin.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on February 09, 2014, 11:21:14 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on February 09, 2014, 12:56:22 AM
Saw a grey wolf chasing a deer yesterday...just a glimpse and within 1/2 mile of my cabin.

No thanks we have plenty here.   We had some smaller black wolves here.  Even though the US Fish and Wildlife said we did not.  They were pretty good neighbors.  We never minded them so much, they pretty much stayed up high.  Then came this type or breed we have now.  Twice too a third larger - they visit here way to much.  I think we ought to sue the Feds because the smaller blacks that hung around here have vanished.....  But then they never existed so it is claimed.

   
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: new land owner on February 09, 2014, 02:55:36 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on January 26, 2014, 10:53:57 AM
For the first few minutes perhaps and only if the stove hasn't been cleaned.  There is a steel plate right in front of the door on the floor of the stove with a screw in it.  Remove the screw and lift the plate.  The first time it might be hard because they put some hitemp silicone or glue on it (this is a Vermont Castings officially recommended cleaning procedure) then brush out the dust that has gathered under the plate.  Once done, if the stove has not run for a while and is completely cool, vacuum out the air ducts which can get clogged with ash over time.  Finally put the plate back (I do not glue back down as I remove it often).

You will be amazed ;)

   Just a note of thanks.  I did pull the steel plate you were talking about and found this area to be full of ashes.  Once I cleaned out the ashes it could not have worked better,  Thanks again.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 09, 2014, 08:28:09 PM
Rick - they just keep adding them.

NLO -- you're quite welcome :)

Back at the cabin and getting it warmed up, spent the day plowing the little bit of snow we had in anticipation of more this week.  With luck we'll start getting some up in the hills for summer water!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 11, 2014, 08:58:39 AM
It's been a little warmer out and this week I've even thawed out the kitchen sink cold water :)

Now I'm waiting on up to 6" of snow tonight.  I had about and inch yesterday -- just enough to make things white again -- and was glad I'd plowed on Sunday.  Now I'm hoping we get a full 6" tonight.  Then I'll go into work late and take the time to plow it off first :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rugger8 on February 11, 2014, 06:17:06 PM
OJH - First off, I am glad we were able to help provide a little motivation, that's usually the hardest part.  But secondly and more importantly, I am glad it is making a difference.   :)  Would have felt bad if you did the work and did not see a difference, but somehow I thought you would. ???  Besides, now you have the inspiration to finish the paneling, which is the fun part!

Jeff
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 11, 2014, 11:05:01 PM
Quote from: rugger8 on February 11, 2014, 06:17:06 PM
OJH - First off, I am glad we were able to help provide a little motivation, that's usually the hardest part.  But secondly and more importantly, I am glad it is making a difference.   :)  Would have felt bad if you did the work and did not see a difference, but somehow I thought you would. ???  Besides, now you have the inspiration to finish the paneling, which is the fun part!

Jeff

I appreciated it :) and yes, I can't wait to get to panelling!  But I need the weather to improve a little first as I have to work on some panelling first and planing, ripping and routering out of doors demands less snow and more sun!

Speaking of snow, the DOT site predicts up to 10 inches of new snow in the mountains (which means me)...weather underground says up to 5 but that's what the DOT says is in the valley's below....we'll see!  I'm prepared however, to start work from home tomorrow so I can get out and plow as soon as it's light.  That way if I get 5-10 inches of fresh snow I won't have to worry about it in the morning (would suck to have to chain up to get down from my place and then do it again to get home without enough light to plow in.

We shall see!  But I'm kind of excited because 10" of new snow is what we need!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 12, 2014, 08:33:53 AM
So much for the weatherman! lol it went above freezing last night (just) around 8pm and then stayed there all night.  Snowed about 1" at my place and that's it.

Snow level is supposed to be at 3500 feet now which is a few hundred above me....I guess we can hope they got a good dump in the mountains above me.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 13, 2014, 08:30:32 AM
Wanna save electricity? Easy! Put the Olympics on TV and toss in a bunch of reruns and I pick up a good book! Hey, the generator has gone 3 days without running and I see a 4th in the works Give me a little sun and I'll go a week!

Of course it helps that a Chinook blew in and the weather has been warm. It's 34 down in the valley below and supposed to get above 40 again today. The only real downside is that we don't have enough snow in the mountains to provide water in the summer....good thing our well is deep! Shouldn't affect us but it will others.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 13, 2014, 01:12:48 PM
Already very warm today and while they are predicting snow tonight I'm doubtful.

I may, however, try to sneak out early and plow the road a little more.  I'm hoping to get there when the snow is snoft and the ice is slush, that way I can remove it before it freezes again overnight.

Now I just need to find where folks are talking about cabins and stuff ;)

Can you tell I'm bored today? lol
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on February 15, 2014, 12:43:20 AM
snow level at 3500' you say?  If so, the ranch is still snowed in.

Good to see you're making it work out there.  I'm still looking for work (again) ...

Say, do you know anyone that is good at finding water (dousing or simply reading the signs)?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 15, 2014, 10:30:48 PM
Don't know about water wishers my friend but I bet someone around us would.  Sorry about the work situation!  Did you ever contact EZen?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 15, 2014, 10:32:14 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Aubmqc0VpRA
Milling black walnut today
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on February 15, 2014, 10:43:46 PM
Quote from: JavaMan on February 15, 2014, 12:43:20 AM
snow level at 3500' you say?  If so, the ranch is still snowed in.

Good to see you're making it work out there.  I'm still looking for work (again) ...

Say, do you know anyone that is good at finding water (dousing or simply reading the signs)?

Usually not that hard.  I have been doing it fairly well for a number of years.  I just use 2 bronze brazing rods.  Bend a 90 deg handle on each end about 6-8" long.  Hold the rods at an equal distance apart on both ends.  Rest your elbows against your sides.  Grip them just strong enough to keep them from spinning.  Test yourself by walking over a culvert or water line.  The rods will cross each other 90 degrees in the opposite direction when you are directly over the spot.  If it doesn't happen right off try again.  But then again there are some people that are not able to do it.  Don't ask me why.  ???
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on February 15, 2014, 11:56:29 PM
Quote from: Redoverfarm on February 15, 2014, 10:43:46 PM
Usually not that hard.  I have been doing it fairly well for a number of years.  I just use 2 bronze brazing rods.  Bend a 90 deg handle on each end about 6-8" long.  Hold the rods at an equal distance apart on both ends.  Rest your elbows against your sides.  Grip them just strong enough to keep them from spinning.  Test yourself by walking over a culvert or water line.  The rods will cross each other 90 degrees in the opposite direction when you are directly over the spot.  If it doesn't happen right off try again.  But then again there are some people that are not able to do it.  Don't ask me why.  ???

Yeah, I've tried.  Had a friend that could do it.  Showed me how and pointed out where the water line from the well was here at home, but after he had hip surgery, he couldn't do it anymore.  My theory is the metal in the body does something... and if I'm right, I won't have any luck either with a 250mm rod in my left arm  d*

OJH - I think I did give them a call or something a while back (that was maybe nearly a year ago) ... maybe I should try again?  can you send me contact info via email?

Milling that walnut looks good!  I still wish you'd had that on the trailer when we felled those trees.  Stay safe!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Yonderosa on February 16, 2014, 09:39:46 AM
Javaman: If you're drilling Bill Moomaw (Moomaw Drilling) is the guy I've used and would recommend.  He finds it where it's best and then figures out a way to get his rigs in there, which is opposite of the couple of other drillers I have experience with in the area. 

Another thing I like about Bill is he charges for what he does.  If he only puts in 40' of well casing, that's all he charges for - again, some others charge you whatever they put on the estimate whether they use it or not.

He's saved me some money on the projects I've used him.  The wells are better (volume and static levels) at shallower depths than other wells in the area.  He's gotten that old rig of his into some pretty tight spots that others wouldn't go.  I know of some happy cherry farmers in your area that Bill helped out too.  I wish I could find a guy like him over on the wet side.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 17, 2014, 08:59:07 AM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Milling/Snapshot22-15-20146-25PM640x360_zps6fbbe579.jpg)
Milling this weekend
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Milling/Snapshot32-15-20146-25PM640x360_zpse2aae485.jpg)
Black Walnut

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Milling/IMG_2807640x480_zpsd438dede.jpg)
Some was pretty challenging

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Milling/IMG_2806640x611_zpsbc16bf85.jpg)
The Results :)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Milling/IMG_2802640x480_zpse604fc2e.jpg)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Milling/IMG_2797584x640_zpsa822fe18.jpg)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Milling/IMG_2796640x419_zps6bf20feb.jpg)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Milling/IMG_2792640x480_zps0e50ec74.jpg)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Milling/IMG_2791640x480_zps048dd1f2.jpg)
While not strictly about my cabin build it all ties together as the more I mill the more I learn ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: astidham on February 17, 2014, 11:08:31 AM
very nice!
I love walnut, has a great cutting smell too!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on February 17, 2014, 06:06:36 PM
Thanks for the tip, Yonderosa!  I did have one of the "local" guys out about 5 years ago (has it REALLY been that long?) and the estimate I got then was $13,000 ... of course he guessed a 300-400 foot well and really didn't look the site over very well (no pun intended).  I should probably resurrect my thread and carry this on over there... Apologies to OJH for the small hijack

Quote from: Yonderosa on February 16, 2014, 09:39:46 AM
Javaman: If you're drilling Bill Moomaw (Moomaw Drilling) is the guy I've used and would recommend.  He finds it where it's best and then figures out a way to get his rigs in there, which is opposite of the couple of other drillers I have experience with in the area. 

Another thing I like about Bill is he charges for what he does.  If he only puts in 40' of well casing, that's all he charges for - again, some others charge you whatever they put on the estimate whether they use it or not.

He's saved me some money on the projects I've used him.  The wells are better (volume and static levels) at shallower depths than other wells in the area.  He's gotten that old rig of his into some pretty tight spots that others wouldn't go.  I know of some happy cherry farmers in your area that Bill helped out too.  I wish I could find a guy like him over on the wet side.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on February 17, 2014, 06:15:37 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on February 17, 2014, 08:59:07 AM

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Milling/IMG_2797584x640_zpsa822fe18.jpg)

The one on the right looks like the one we went to buy over in Port Townsend (I think) to use as a fireplace mantle... 2 full inches thick.  It had two live edges and I trimmed on off (so it would fit against the chimney).

I puit 4 anchor bolts into the chimney blocks, measured, remeasured, and measured again before transferring measurements to the edge of the board and drilling holes.  Beautiful comes in as I'm about to drill the last hole and asks, "Have you ever done this before?" ... hehh ...  ???   "uh, no, but I got it right"...

And I did.  Breathed a sigh of relief when the holes went onto the anchor bolts.

Beautiful stuff you got there.  That'll make some nice furniture or fiddles  ;D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 17, 2014, 11:02:21 PM
I think they planned one or two for mantles also...

But I don't have any :(  Should have cut them a deal but needed the $$$ to pay for expenses to do the work! lol
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on February 18, 2014, 01:10:14 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on February 17, 2014, 11:02:21 PM
I think they planned one or two for mantles also...

But I don't have any :(  Should have cut them a deal but needed the $$$ to pay for expenses to do the work! lol

Not that I'm into that eastern religion stuff, but...

When the fireplace is ready the mantle wood will appear ...
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on February 18, 2014, 06:00:37 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on February 17, 2014, 11:02:21 PM
I think they planned one or two for mantles also...

But I don't have any :(  Should have cut them a deal but needed the $$$ to pay for expenses to do the work! lol

Good point and a problem with some woods is I want.  Pretty soon you would have a nice collection of slabs and no profit.  Others will come along.....
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 18, 2014, 08:43:52 AM
Quote from: rick91351 on February 18, 2014, 06:00:37 AM
Good point and a problem with some woods is I want.  Pretty soon you would have a nice collection of slabs and no profit.  Others will come along.....

I thought of doing an extra log for them on a 50/50 deal but it was raining hard and I was soaked.  Time to call it a day!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 20, 2014, 08:11:05 AM
Back at my place in the woods and the snow hasn't built up too much.  In fact, most of the new snow has melted off already, however I hit the driveway with the tractor and box blade (broken plow for two hours and moved a surprising amount of snow.

The propane was just below 40% when I arrived also, which is awesome!  It was just at 40% when I left a week ago so I'm pretty happy with that.

Now, come on spring!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 22, 2014, 03:55:11 PM
I decided today would be a good day to change the angle of the solar panels to match the sun which is higher on the horizon now and found this site: http://solarelectricityhandbook.com/solar-angle-calculator.html which helped determine a good angle to set the panels at.
Using my magnetic angle meter makes this VERY easy to do.

I then got into the back room and replaced the little 90mm fan I'd placed over the heater to help push the warm air down into the bottom of the room.
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/200mmfan_zpsba0cf7e4.jpg)
This fan actually moves a lot of air and doesn't take much power to run.  It's basically a big computer fan.  Once the room is finished I'll probably make a more permanent place for it with perhaps some boxing to both protect it and help it move more air.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/8000btuheater_zpsde59928e.jpg)
This 8000BTU vented through the wall heater seems to heat the room quite well and now that I have the fans in place it doesn't seem to run nonstop anymore.  I also have the proper jet for it though I don't know how much difference it will make.  I'll replace it the next time I get into the room but have bigger fish to fry now.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/CrackedHeater_zpsc6c251ec.jpg)
I pulled the instant on hot water heater down and found the crack right away (on right).  Strange that it was at the top rather than lower down.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Crack_zpsae590817.jpg)
Better shot of the crack.

I'm going to take it into someone (if I can find someone) who can replace the damaged pipe.  If they can do it for less than the $200 it would cost to replace the heater then I'll have them do it.  If not I'll order a new one and have hot water again within a couple weeks (which would be rather nice).

The propane was at 39% last check and I only used about 1 or 2% in the last week so I'm thinking that all things being equal I should be able to make it into the spring or perhaps even the summer before having to refill the 500 gallon tank which would be nice since propane will be much cheaper then.

I think now, with all that I am doing, I should be able to easily make it through the winter and into the summer with propane to spare in the future.  This year I was trying to heat the room before it was insulated and using a much bigger heater in the beginning before installing the one above.  I'll also get a door installed (still trying to decide if I'll have one made for the room or just make my own).

I was also able to add some bulking material (hemp chips) to the composter and rotate the drum.  It's done just fine in the room since it stays warm enough and since I only use it a couple times a week at most it isn't even remotely taxed out with me living here (I use the bathroom at work during the week).

Now to relax a little and contemplate the rest of the day.  I may go out and do some work cutting logs into smaller logs for the mill and maybe burn a little but honestly I'm kinda in the mood to just listen to music and read ;)  Sometimes you have to do that right?  Though I've also debated some other small projects.  We'll see!

One other thing, I slid three times yesterday on my way down the mountain.  I was in 4 low, 2nd gear and have studded snow tires but the ice was just too slick and the road too steep.  Each time I slid about 20 to 30 feet to a section where there was no ice so I got lucky!  Otherwise the trees an I would have had a more intimate relationship!  Iv'e debated taking the tractor down there and trying to dig up some of the ice but I'm also worried it would slide too much too so may just pass and put the chains on for when I go to work Monday.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rwilly on February 23, 2014, 11:36:03 AM
What a great thread!
We have some acreage in the Okanogan as well, in Wauconda. Hopefully we will be able to build something like what you have done.
I love the area.

Ron
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 23, 2014, 11:40:30 AM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/ANewSnow_zps0a63699e.jpg)
Old man winter refuses to give up!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 23, 2014, 11:41:33 AM
Quote from: rwilly on February 23, 2014, 11:36:03 AM
What a great thread!
We have some acreage in the Okanogan as well, in Wauconda. Hopefully we will be able to build something like what you have done.
I love the area.

Ron

Then I'm not far from you ;)  Just south in fact.  Another member of the forum now owns the General Store in Aeneas Valley too.  Perhaps this year will be the year of the get together! lol
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 23, 2014, 02:41:19 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Backroom_zps36aed171.jpg)
I think the snow on the roof is a sign the R31+ insulation is working ;)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/BigRed_zpsda2ad7df.jpg)
Nothing like a big red tractor to remove the fresh snow with :)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Feb2-23-2014_zps6c4b77b2.jpg)
The sun came out and I was inspired to shoot some pics while out turning on the well pump

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/SolarPum_zpsb25e701c.jpg)
195watt solar panel I use to power the well pump.  This is a 24v panel and the cost was around $200 plus shipping...in other words, the cost of this panel with a charge controller is only slightly more than a Costco 60watt panel and controller.  Hence my suggestion in another thread to not bother with Harbor Freight or Costco panel setups.  Better to just go to sunelec and order 1 or two panels like this and make your own.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/SolarPump2_zps8f1633ac.jpg)
I spent a lot of money getting to this point.  First it was about $260 for the 60watt Costco solar panel/charger set up plus the $100+ I spent on a switch and timer and then batteries etc all of which didn't do the job...I finally did more research and went with a solar pump charge controller from Backwoods Solar and this panel from Sunelec and what-do-you-know it works like a charm :)

Only issue I've had is with the float valve which had the wires cut and now which my be stuck in the 'low' position but I can get to because the top of the cistern is frozen solid....no worries, spring is coming!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 23, 2014, 03:36:50 PM
One thing about having a BIG inverter :) is that it has NO PROBLEM running the shopvac (or a skillsaw etc for that matter).

My old 2500watt inverter just didn't have the oomph needed but the 4000watt pure sine inverter does and will peak at 12000 watts to get something powerful going :)  Heck this thing could run an AC unit if the batteries had the juice!

Speaking of the batteries I definitely think this will be the year I replace them.  They just don't have the power reserves to run the inverter etc all day when the clouds are out and the generator has to come on at night to top off the batteries.  I'm thinking Trojan L16's and only have to decide if I'm going to run one 24v string or 3.  Everything I've read tells me that 3 is not only fine but could be an advantage because if you install cutoffs for each string than they can be shut off if a cell goes bad leaving you with two to continue to run the cabin on.

I'm also looking at doubling the capacity of the bank and while the solar panels won't have the power to charge it fully in the winter I can make it a year and then get a new string and charge controller to add solar charging capacity.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 23, 2014, 08:57:36 PM
Ended up with another 6" of snow today and had to get out and move it off the road.
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/ATractor_zps11442845.jpg)
I would not be able to live here without my tractor! 50hp and 4wd with ballast in the tires and it moves the snow like a pro :)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/BackBlading_zpsa428ec8a.jpg)
Backblading is the only good way for me to plow since I busted my snow plow but this works pretty well.


(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/BackBlading2_zpsdf7c371f.jpg)
That box blade is about 18" tall so you have some idea of the snow depth and what I'm moving.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Driveway_zpsdd36642d.jpg)
The driveway here is about 15 to 18" deep on either side.  About typical in January but not usually this late in the winter.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Readytogo_zpsff3fe94c.jpg)
The road has turned to ice below our driveway and it's TREACHEROUS so I've chained up the truck and will have to take it in 4 low tomorrow.  It's going to be a nail biter! 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on February 24, 2014, 12:35:10 AM
Can you hang chain all the way around.  I got 'dem never been where I had to.   :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 24, 2014, 08:32:29 AM
Quote from: rick91351 on February 24, 2014, 12:35:10 AM
Can you hang chain all the way around.  I got 'dem never been where I had to.   :D

Yes and I've had to several times but one of my front chains is broken (ok they aren't 'front chains' but I have some on the back so what else would I call them? lol) so I left them at home telling myself I needed to fix them  d* d* d*

Perhaps I ought to do that this summer!  :o ;D :) d*
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 24, 2014, 08:32:52 AM
Note to self:  Always check that the inverter kicked over to sleep mode correctly and will 'wake up' and charge the batteries if needed when the generator comes on.  Seems last night after I went to bed the batteries must have dropped below the threshold and the generator came on and ran for three hours but the inverter/charger didn't wake up so the batteries were pretty low this morning.

Luckily I set the generator to come on early and there was plenty of power this morning an I was able to reset the inverter and adjust the generator to come back on.  It will now run for 5 hours giving the batteries a full and deep charge - something they need because I've had very little sun lately.

Life off the grid.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 24, 2014, 11:25:23 PM
The snow is still coming down and we got another 6" today (or more) so I had to chain up to get home and then get the tractor out and plow for a couple hours.  That got me to the private road which is still another 2.7 miles from the pavement but at least I can get there easily now! 

Still haven't put extra lights on the tractor or I might have plowed down to the road but with the chains on I can pretty much go anywhere as long as the snow doesn't get too deep.

I think I've got about 2 feet of snow now too!  Which is really good for the water table :)  Now lets hope it doesn't just suddenly melt off and cause flooding!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 02, 2014, 10:59:48 AM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0631_zps91e91135.jpg)
Taken a few days ago on my way to work.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0635_zps51e7a313.jpg)
In places it's up to 24"

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0638_zps761404f8.jpg)
I have since widened out the road a little with my 'new' plow blade (neighbor loaned it to me since I plow the whole road and it probably wasn't new in 1950 but it works great!)

Supposed to get another 2-7" today/tonight and then traces all week following so I'm glad I took the time to get the road cleaned up before leaving but will need to pick up some ice melt on my way back because the first big hill is so bad I couldn't get back up with my tractor and had to take a long detour around to an easier hill to get back!  Several inches of ice on the worst sections of that hill and chains that don't fit the tractor well means some pucker factor situations!

Ordered a new Marey hot water heater to replace the one I broke (water froze inside and split the pipes) and a boot tray for under the wood rack.  I think I'll get some plexiglass for behind the wood rack to protect the walls too.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Rone Warrior on March 04, 2014, 02:07:02 PM
Howdy all.

Love the thread.

Just wanted to say "Hi" to all the surrounding neighbors in the OH (Okanogan Highlands). I'm another westsider that picked up some property (5 acres, Mt.Hull) last summer, and have delusions of cabin building. The plan is to get out there sometime in July, and build a 16x28 - 16x30. Still trying to decide how exactly I'm going to throw it together, since budget is certainly an issue.

That said, I did have a question on the pier and block setup you used. It appears you dug down a few feet, placed some level pavers and used pier blocks on top. It's now been a few years, and a few cold winters. I wonder how that is working out for you? Any shifting or heaving that you've noticed? I guess the question is: If you had to do it over again, would you sink the posts into sonotubes?

I'm leaning towards sonotubes, but wanted to see how this setup has been holding up for you.

Sorry for such a OT question.

Cheers,
-RW





Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 05, 2014, 11:54:46 AM
No movement that I can tell of.  Perhaps it's the soil which is very dry before winter, or perhaps it's the small size of the cabin but I have no frost heave that I can tell.

However, I plan to change the foundation to a footing/cinderblock/SBC foundation this year (or at least start on it) becuase the build I built is heavier than the foundation was designed to hold for one, and for two I plan to hang a deck out there and finally, because I want it enclosed completely for better winter insualtion :)

My advice?  Look at surface bonded cement and a footing.

I also didn't go down very deep but that was a function of the insane rock.  Lots of moon dust and BIG rocks under that cabin ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 06, 2014, 08:47:28 PM
Score!  I was in one  my CO's that had a decommissioned battery shelf in it.  No batteries left as they had been replaced with a new gel cell bank of batteries on a different shelf...and there still attached to the 'scrap' shelf was a Specific Gravity tester that was no longer in use with a complete mount with beaker style catch to prevent the acid from dripping onto the floor after use.

It is now re-purposed :)
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/SGTester_zps0d00946c.jpg)
Original tester in mount -- notice the 'bottle' or 'beaker' at the base to catch the acid.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/SGTEster-2_zpsbfa025df.jpg)
Another shot

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Beeker_zps5ac3ae5e.jpg)
Pretty simple system which can be removed to dump the acid after use.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/New-SGTester_zps5467099f.jpg)
My tester is newer and I trust it but I'll run some comparisons on the Telco one to see if it still functions correctly (don't see why it wouldn't).

Now I have a place to keep my tester where it is less likely to get broken.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on March 06, 2014, 09:42:43 PM
Cool. The rubber parts last longer if rinsed after use. At least that has been my experience.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 07, 2014, 08:32:11 AM
I was thinking the same thing.  In fact I think a good cleaning on the old one and it will likely be good to go since I didn't see any cracking.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 13, 2014, 07:37:33 AM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/ASpring_zpsdaaf7288.jpg)
As spring approaches fast one thought comes to mind:  I SURVIVED!  [cool] ;D :)

It has been a tough winter with lots of pitfalls, not the least of which is my still frozen grey water drains.  I'll fix that issue before next winter ;)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Awoodrack_zps29b41890.jpg)
Meanwhile I found this 'boot tray' on Amazon and after going through several sizes found one that fit perfectly under my wood rack :)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Boottray_zpseb7ce7ea.jpg)
It does a great job of catching debris falling off the wood when I set it in the rack -- a problem I've had all winter.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on March 13, 2014, 08:03:15 AM
OJ your Survivability was never an issue in my mind..... nor was ours.  Yet the reality of it we both had a remarkable winter.  We did not receive our usual three foot of snow and -20 to -30 degrees here.  Yet the rains have caught us up on moisture pretty well.   I see where yours was colder than ours.  We had a few days of -0 but not bad.  The fifth wheel did well - we are learning the ropes - but then this is our second year in it. Hopefully the last. 

Days are really getting longer and now I would think you will be able to invest more time on the I should have done it this or or thats.  All and all I would say you and the small cabin did well.  Really well.....    [cool]


Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 13, 2014, 10:56:41 AM
Quote from: rick91351 on March 13, 2014, 08:03:15 AM
OJ your Survivability was never an issue in my mind..... nor was ours.  Yet the reality of it we both had a remarkable winter.  We did not receive our usual three foot of snow and -20 to -30 degrees here.  Yet the rains have caught us up on moisture pretty well.   I see where yours was colder than ours.  We had a few days of -0 but not bad.  The fifth wheel did well - we are learning the ropes - but then this is our second year in it. Hopefully the last. 

Days are really getting longer and now I would think you will be able to invest more time on the I should have done it this or or thats.  All and all I would say you and the small cabin did well.  Really well.....    [cool]

Thanks Rick!  And ya, the -20F I saw was pretty darn cold!

Lots to do in order to be better prepped for next winter but it's great to have pulled through this one!  I don't expect to do more then 2 or 3 but who knows right?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 17, 2014, 08:07:08 AM
I thought I would report on the propane:

First, yes when it gets warm the gauge goes up.  I've seen it fluctuate as much as 5% which is a good thing ;)

Last look I was sitting just above 30% in the warm afternoon (40+) and since I'll only be back for two days this week (Wed/Thu) it won't be used much other than to keep the back room warm which is does every day.  This means, with luck, I ought to make April with just a little less than 30% I think.

With luck that means I'll be able to push it until propane drops to at least $2/gallon before filling. 

Next year it ought to be even better because I am improving the place a lot so I'm thinking the 500 gallons will be perfect.  Just have to watch generator use in the dead of winter a little more and keep the place well insulated (skirts around the bottom if I don't get the new foundation done for example).
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on March 17, 2014, 09:28:53 AM
Skirting is key OJ - Well insulated skirting and some plastic sheeting or house wrap that was laying around made a world of difference here in the fifth wheel this winter.  When we unskirt it when the house is finished.  I plan on using the skirting which is 4x8 sheets of OSB and some 2X8 OSB sort of 2x4 framed SIPs to do a shed or chicken house. 
   
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 26, 2014, 07:32:21 AM
Weather is improving and I have the sawmill back up here.  I planned to get it set up yesterday but had a bought with a nasty big (gone now I think) so the mill sits waiting for me to clear the landing with the tractor and get working.

I have given this springs work much though and can't wait to get cracking! 

And propane?  Still at 30%! :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 27, 2014, 07:45:29 AM
Propane prices are high still ($2.99/gallon delivered) so not going to fill the tank yet.  Maybe May if I can make it there which I think I can.

Got the landing for the mill cleaned up a bunch yesterday so it's about ready for me to place the mill back in it's spot and start milling again :)

And since Spring is here I'm dreaming of all the work I hope to get done!  Though, without more propane I have to watch the fuel usage so can't run the big generator that much -- might have to get the old gas Champion repaired to save Propane -- after all, I run that a gallon or three at a time which is easier on the budget than filling a 500 gallon propane tank.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 01, 2014, 09:17:18 PM
Back at the cabin after another 5 day visit back home.  These 'visits' home have saved me a TON in propane :D  I'm still at 30% and while LP is $3/gallon still I'm thinking I can make it to June before I really have to fill up and by then it ought to be cheaper.

I think my drains are thawed now too!  [cool] I dumped a gallon or two down the drain an didn't see any leakage and checking the grey water tank and it appears 'wet' in the pipe leading into it...so I'm thinking I'm good!

But wait, there's more!

My metal working neighbor took a look at my damaged heater and thought a friend of his who repairs HVAC systems might be able to fix it....$50 later and it was repaired!  He had to do some careful heating of the thin walled pipe and then silver soldiered it back together and it's good as new!  Tested it with City water pressure and no leaks.

Only issue I see now is that I have an almost empty cistern and though I left the pump in the 'on' position while I was gone it didn't appear to get enough sun to pump any water (at least that's what I hope the problem is!)....now that I'm here for a couple weeks I'm hoping to resolve that issue.  If I can, then I can get the hot water installed and with the drains working, heck, it might almost be like living in the big city!  What with water, hot water, showers and all :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 02, 2014, 08:13:00 PM
 d* d* :-[ :-[ >:( >:(

Grey water drain pipe is in fat cracked in a few places.  I had dug some of it up (or down to it more like) and today dumped a gallon and a half down the sink and ran outside to check to see where it was going and much to my dismay it was both coming out of the Y pipe (right where the cabin drains meet the 4" mainline and out of the 4" sewage mainline pipe going to my grey water tank.

So, this means I'll have to dig up about ten feet of pipe (and I'll have to break through some frozen ground tough it's pretty shallow frost now) and cut out several feet of the drain and replace it.  However, once done it will be clear and working again.

Once it's much later in the spring I plan to lower it a bunch.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 06, 2014, 08:07:32 AM
After some fidding I found out what was wrong with the wiring on the solar pump controller and got it sorted so it will only run when the float is down and the switch in 'on' however the line is frozen and there is no pumping for another week or four :(

I realized that putting in the one way valve I installed a year or two ago was a bad idea now.  Sure it kept the water from flowing back into the well when the pump shut off but it kept the water in the line so it could freeze too!  So now I have to plan on removing it once things finish thawing out.  With luck I'll be back to pumping my own water in a month or less.  Meanwhile here is my solution:
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/ATractor_zps753d3eb6.jpg)
One tractor, one set of forks, one barrel on a pallet and one neighbor with lots of water equals this old Jarhead has water again! :)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Atractor-water_zps22ad15eb.jpg)
Drove up to the neighbors (slowly) filled the barrel and drove back to my place and up to the cistern, then siphoned the water into the tank and now I have 50 gallons more :)  Will do this again today, maybe twice.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Ice-in-cistern_zps1c21d6bb.jpg)
As you can see there is still a little ice at the top of the tank.  It's about 2-3 inches thick and goes down about 12 inches on the sides (or did).  At one point the melting made me think I was pumping a little water because I could hear dripping into the tank....then I took the lid off and found this melting block of ice...must be a gallon or two there.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/AGreyWaterPipe_zps1ffdfa05.jpg)
Once I'd dealt with the water situation I set to digging up the frozen drain.  It's 90% ready to cut out and today, once it's warmed up I'll cut it out and replace it with a new pipe and then should be back to using my grey water drain.  Then I'll install the hot water tank and add water to the cistern and I ought to be living large then!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 06, 2014, 08:17:32 AM
For my grey water drain system I plan to lower it another 18" then place a heat trace down the length of the 4" drain line and insulate the line with silver insulation.  I then plan to place R10 foam about 6 inches above the pipe and about 3 feet wide before fully burying again.

I'll insulate the tank also and add R10 radiating out from it 3 feet and build up the ground above it some and add R30 (3 layers of R10) foam above the lid with a second decorative lid above that.  With luck and a little engineering I might get the tank situated so it doesn't freeze again.  After all, in the dead of winter there was only about 6" off frozen water on top of the tank so if I can keep that from happening then I can keep it from plugging up.

For the cistern I have this solution:  Remove the one way check valve I placed at the well so the water can drain back into the well when not pumping.  This will prevent the line from freezing in the winter.  Next I'll dig down and place R1 foam radiating out away from the tank 36" and add some R10 to the underside of the lid somehow.  This should give me enough insulation to prevent freezing up since the tank is down 24" to the top of the tank and another 12+ inches to the water level but I also think I'll build a 'tank house' on top of the tank with a big south facing window in it.  I find my uninsulated porch stays 10-15 degrees warmer then outside air temps so if I build 4 walls and a roof over the cistern with a big south facing window it ought to provide some solar heating that will help prevent freezing in the winter.  If I build it right I'll have enough room to go inside when working on the tank with places to store things like cleaning brushes, hoses etc.

I would then also have a place to some day install a solar panel and components for a power system to give me lighting at night and perhaps a pump to draw water off the cistern for watering a garden up near the tank -- something I've thought about doing in the past.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Adam Roby on April 06, 2014, 09:37:00 AM
I am in no way an expert here... but I am wondering if you could install bypass valve so the water in the line could be emptied when you close up for the winter.  Something like this:  (The red box being the 1 way value, with the orange pipe adding air to the main pipe in order for it to drain).

(https://i1034.photobucket.com/albums/a429/adamrobillard/BackwaterValve_zps2ac86c7f.png) (https://s1034.photobucket.com/user/adamrobillard/media/BackwaterValve_zps2ac86c7f.png.html)

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on April 06, 2014, 10:15:37 AM
In the great white frozen north there is no such thing as I don't need to bury it that deep nor over preping - Funny the only way you find out if it was good enough at the end of winter.  It is did it freeze?  Nope  Then it was done right!  Seems it is just pass and fail.  Here at my digs - Did we bury the water line to deep?  They never have froze.  So they pass but ....  I guess there is no real - but what if we would have went __ deep?    Did we have enough fuel? Yep then we did it right!  Did we have to lay in and loose work?  Nope.  Then it was done right.  I would certainly also would want to know - Did I have enough food and supplies stored to last two to three weeks or more if the huge blast from the north comes sweeping through.  Or land or snow slides take out the road and strands you.   

If you do not want to build a shed over your cistern you might take all your collected sawdust from the mill. Crib a area over it and bed that area with a 16 - 18 or more inches of sawdust.  It is wet I know but it will help.  Or you can mix it with pine straw or needles if you want to gather a bunch up and does reduce fire risk under you trees.  It also will produce some heat as it starts to decompose.  Also works to keep stuff cool in the summer.  sort of a poor man insulation.  I would also put a swallow layer of soil over it to prevent a spark or match or ........ 

Sure sound like you are getting the kinks worked out and finding the weak links.  Next winter if you are still there I know you will be going in to it a lot more confident.  Actually your doins' are a great study or experiment for those who might want to do the homestead thing.  I know you have some a lot better ideas of thou shalt and shalt nots now than when you started this.       
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 07, 2014, 07:51:56 AM
No need to drain if it's deep enough and well insulated ;)  That's the key really and I need it working next year so I'll do it 'right'.  At least right in my mind ;)

My neighbor has a water line from his well that hasn't frozen in 30 years.  It rises to enter the well to about 36" after backfilling on top of it.  He left a lot of pine needles and grass fill on top and let the weeds grow in that...the insulation has proven more than sufficient but he always hopes for 4" of snow to insulate the ground better.  In my case I just didn't plan to use the grey water in winter and had no means on hand to dig it deeper when installed....that will change ;)

A neighbor has a backhoe now and I have a mill....he wants some lumber, I want a deeper pipe...you get the idea!  The deal is struck so I'm good.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/greywater-gone_zps2ad20f91.jpg)
Pipe removed finally.  Had to wait for the ground to warm up more.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/anewpipe_zps3a2407aa.jpg)
New pipe installed.  It must be much deeper but for now it's workable.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/ATank_zpsd1dc9af6.jpg)
You can see the frozen tubes from the old pipe.  It was solid for nearly 20 feet despite days in the sun.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Backfilled_zps1dfbf37c.jpg)
Backfilled for animal and light freeze protection:  note, if the system is working then there is no water in this pipe normally.  It drains into the tank and from there into the drywell which allows it to drain to the ground.


Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 07, 2014, 09:50:38 AM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Ahotwater_zps5be53b63.jpg)
Old hot water heater repaired by an HVAC tech works fine :)  I'm back to hot water!!!!  c*

That means SHOWER! :D

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Atractorandlogs_zps947bd4c2.jpg)
Got 5 more logs to mill set up on the landing.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Alogs_zps4dcf3324.jpg)
I've got about 12 logs on the landing now and about 4 or 5 trees to buck up (another 15 to 25 logs depending on the trees)....

So I'll be BUSY this spring!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 14, 2014, 04:49:59 PM
I did it!  I pulled the trigger on the LumberJack Tenon cutter set that's onsale right now (saves about $30 of reg price).  Got the 1", 1.5" and 2" Tenon cutters and bits (already had the bits but extras don't hurt).

Now I plan to go get a door ordered and to buy a drill press etc.

Can't wait to get making railings!

Next up:  fix my water!  I hope the ground is finally thawed enough to get it done.  Was a bit tough last attempt but I got close so I hope that since a weekend has passed it ought to be good to dig and repair now.  Let's hope anyway, as I plan to get milling also.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 19, 2014, 11:55:06 PM
SOLD!  The 'Road Warrior' that is ;)  My old jeep has a new home.  Just couldn't let it sit any longer and I drive the truck these days since my wife has a new Outback.

Now I think I'll buy that new Auger I want for the tractor ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 21, 2014, 08:38:30 AM
Solving my winter issues has become a great experience thanks to the folks at 'The Natural Home' where I bought my grey water drain system.n  First was o address the problem of the tank freezing over near the surface and causing the lines to back up and freeze.  To prevent this they suggested this little jewel:  http://www.amazon.com/Allied-Precision-7521-Floating-500-Watt/dp/B0006HRQNG/

It does draw 1500 watts so can't be run all the time but I plan to set it up on a 'generator only' power circuit so when the generator is running to charge the battery bank (or when I choose to manually run it) the heater will come on and thaw any ice in the tank.  I'll have to install the de-icer guard so it won't burn the side of the tank but that's cheap also and I can add one of these: http://www.amazon.com/Farm-Innovators-TC-3-Thermostatically-Controlled/dp/B0006U2HD2/ref=pd_bxgy_lg_text_z/181-4350895-8220355 to turn the power on when the outside air temp drops to a temp that I know will freeze the tank etc.

Then, I'll install a heat tape inside the 4" pipe running from the cabin into the tank but only make use of that when necessary.  I'll do the same for the drain from the tub which runs under the cabin, that way if it freezes I can thaw it out easily enough.

Finally, I'll bed in the pipe and tank better with some gravel from drainage away from both, lower them 24" and add a layer of R10 foam to the ground above the gravel bedding and a triple layer of foam above the tank (I'll make it look like a well above the tank and foam the lid above and below) so it is well insulated.  This way when I do run the heater it ought to hold that heat well and keep from freezing.

I think we these measures I should be able to survive the winter next year and actually have usable drains and running water etc all winter long (which will be rather nice).
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on April 21, 2014, 09:54:53 AM
If using a tank heater or heat tape on a GFI outlet I would sure change that out.  Sooner or latter the GFI monster will bite you.  Voice of experience....

Tanks heater guards are usually a wire cage of sorts.  Simple and are held on by a couple sheet metal brackets.   

WOW I don't know if I would heat tape inside the four inch pipe.   ???  And I am a fan of heat tape and tank heaters.....  but the thou shalt and shalt nots heat tape is sort of weird.  What you can get away with and not.  However it would not be a dwelling fire safety issue so I might try it but I would also be concerned of it starting to dam and hold back the scum and 'stuff' that goes with gray water.

Hermiston or Pendleton lost a garden supply business last winter with a heat tape malfunction.  Shortly after Boise lost a house or dwelling of some type due to heat tape so I went redid a bunch on the fifthwheel.  I had it way too insulated.  It never froze ....  So all was well....Wink   

   
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 21, 2014, 10:23:00 AM
I was told heat tape is designed to go inside the pipe actually and figure that since it would only be used if things started to freeze up then it would be unlikely to cause issue as it would not be used more than the time the generator ran to thaw things out.

The GFI monster?  Not sure I understand??  Ground Fault Interrupts are designed to protect for grounding specifically in wet locations but I didn't mention GFI's at all....just that I'd set up a generator only circuit for when I needed to heat the tank to keep it from freezing or thaw it back out.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on April 21, 2014, 10:50:40 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on April 21, 2014, 10:23:00 AM
I was told heat tape is designed to go inside the pipe actually and figure that since it would only be used if things started to freeze up then it would be unlikely to cause issue as it would not be used more than the time the generator ran to thaw things out.

The GFI monster?  Not sure I understand??  Ground Fault Interrupts are designed to protect for grounding specifically in wet locations but I didn't mention GFI's at all....just that I'd set up a generator only circuit for when I needed to heat the tank to keep it from freezing or thaw it back out.

Yep you never mentioned GFI's but just in case.  They will trip when you lest notice it and most need them....  So raises the GFI monster.   

I did a bunch of direct burial 12 / 2 when we set this up up here.  We scattered out like seven frost frees and where we put one I ran 12 / 2 direct burial with an outlet.  On the farm / ranch setting some of us try and sort of stay with in code.  At least I do........  went to the electrical supply store and was going to pick up GFIs for all the outlets.  Like seven of them.  I ended up with a sort of off the cuff talk with one sales person.  He sort of knows me and that we have the ranch.    He sort of cautioned me.  With heat tape, tank heaters and engine block heaters, anything on a thermostat or a pump like a sump pump that cycles a lot they sooner or latter will trip out a GFI outlet.  He was not wrong.  GFIs are now all gone.       
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 21, 2014, 12:13:37 PM
Quote from: rick91351 on April 21, 2014, 10:50:40 AM
Yep you never mentioned GFI's but just in case.  They will trip when you lest notice it and most need them....  So raises the GFI monster.   

I did a bunch of direct burial 12 / 2 when we set this up up here.  We scattered out like seven frost frees and where we put one I ran 12 / 2 direct burial with an outlet.  On the farm / ranch setting some of us try and sort of stay with in code.  At least I do........  went to the electrical supply store and was going to pick up GFIs for all the outlets.  Like seven of them.  I ended up with a sort of off the cuff talk with one sales person.  He sort of knows me and that we have the ranch.    He sort of cautioned me.  With heat tape, tank heaters and engine block heaters, anything on a thermostat or a pump like a sump pump that cycles a lot they sooner or latter will trip out a GFI outlet.  He was not wrong.  GFIs are now all gone.     

OIC -- good info!  In my case I can see NOT wanting that to happen.  Would be a serious waste of propane if nothing else.  I want the heater and heat tape to work during the short window they will be in used (3 to 5 hours usually) without having to constantly check
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 28, 2014, 08:17:55 AM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_1004640x480_zps64c82138.jpg)
After MUCH too long I moved everything off this side of the cabin floor and cleaned it thoroughly.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_1005480x640_zpsf121e770.jpg)
The OSB was looking a little worse for wear having been left untreated for over 4 years and I thought it about time to do something about it.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_1010640x480_zps2b96b729.jpg)
Got down and painted the floor with 'deck floor' paint which is supposed to protect the floor and take a beating.  My plan is to protect the floor until I can get actual 'flooring' installed.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_1011480x640_zps05bad0ee.jpg)
At least it brightens up the place ;) and it should be easier to keep clean.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_1013640x480_zpsa5f89f48.jpg)
While I was at it the hail came crashing down!  I got over an inch of the white stuff and temps dropped to near freezing.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_1040640x480_zps42f02c27.jpg)
When the hail stopped I managed to get my auger assembled and mostly ready for action.  I still need to fill the gear box and secure the set screw but then it's ready for work.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_1043640x480_zps5f4ffcbf.jpg)
When I left today temps dropped to freezing and it actually snowed!

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 28, 2014, 08:24:15 AM
I thought to add that in the last 4 years in April at the cabin this has been the coldest.  I even went back and looked at all my pictures from each year and was amazed to see how much more green there was in previous years!  COLD start to spring this year!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 29, 2014, 01:47:05 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/CabinDeck_zps38f1cf3d.jpg)
I posted this in my thread about attaching the ledger to the cabin and decided to post here while I discuss some of the challenges I face.


Something else I'm struggling with is that I have 10' walls but need to come under the eaves (12" out from the walls) so I'm figuring I have about 9'4" of rise I can use to the bottom of the rafters (I plan to flash from the old roof to the new one).  If I can get 9'9 3/8" of rise I'd have a 3x12 pitch and with a 7' ceiling at the outside edge I'd only have to lower the floor a few inches. 

So, bringing the floor of the deck to just under the cabin floor joists gives me an additional 6" of rise, push that to 7" and I have a 1" gap below the bottom of the joists to the deck floor but gives me 9'11" of usable rise.  That's within 2" of what I think I have and gives me plenty of room to sheet the roof with 1x6 or 7/8 OSB and roofing.  With flashing I ought to have a seemless transition from the cabin roof's 12x12 pitch to the 3x12 pitch of the deck roof.

Next I need to figure what size rafters I need to use.  Somewhere I mentioned I'm short on room but I'm wondering about that, after all if I lowered the floor 7" just to get the pitch I want and to meet the rise I have I suppose I could add 1 3/4" and go to 2x8" rafters on the deck or drop 3" and I can use 2x10's (dimensional).  The only problem with all of this is that each drop lowers the visible area from the cabin windows.  With the top of the windows sitting about 6'8" if the deck roof is 7' from the deck I'd have only about 5'11" from the floor of the cabin.

Doesn't sound like a good plan. ???
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 29, 2014, 02:41:21 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/CabinDeck_zpsa3b5cbb3.jpg)
Here is a better rendition with about a 2x12 pitch

To get 3x12 I have to lower the deck which obscures the view from the inside even more.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 08, 2014, 09:59:50 AM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Erikpeeling_zps22bff1f6.jpg)
Peeling logs for our gate.  I hope to get it installed today :)

We shall see!  Otherwise we're enjoying our week long vacation at the cabin and working hard!  More to come....
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 08, 2014, 06:27:17 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Darciatwork2_zpsc018c0e9.jpg)
My wife got in on the peeling for a bit too ;)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/AnEntrance_zps357bea2d.jpg)
Using the tractor for the first 3/4 of the way up (it only goes up about 9 feet) and brute strength for the last bit I got the new entrance stood up :)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/ErikandDarci_zps45ec31ad.jpg)
We then set two posts and nailed up some 2x6 rough sawn boards for fencing.  Now we just have to carry the wood fencing 10 feet (or so) in either direction along the property line and then I'll start the barbed wire from there.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/AnEntranceFinished_zpscbe156bf.jpg)
This is the view as you drive up.  It's this way because the property actually runs north to south but the driveway / entrance comes in at an angle so I set the 'gate' inside the property with the right (north) main post on the line and the left (south) fence post on the line.  So if you drew a line from the shorter fence post on the south side to the tall gate post on the north side you have the property line :)

It adds strength this way too and we poured cement (dry) mix into the holes both under and around the posts.  Figure when it rains it will set them a little.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 09, 2014, 04:25:09 PM
Gate is ordered  ;D My wife likes red so we will have a red farm gate.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 10, 2014, 09:31:34 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/ALiveSawnSide1_zpsf075117a.jpg)
Got some siding done today

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/ALiveSawnSide_zps13a5f4d9.jpg)
View from the back
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 11, 2014, 11:33:00 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20140511_151907_759_zps9vzcgxib.jpg)
Finally 'turned that corner' in the panelling on the ceiling and made it up 11" of ceiling today.  I'd finally cleaned out the 'shed tent' now 'workshop' and reorganized it so I could easily pull out tools and get them into action.  I pulled out the table saw and ripped some panelling down at a 45 degree angle so it would fit at the junction of the wall & ceiling and then installed it (which is a chore alone).  Then added another row of panel before I had to start making some.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20140511_162002_283_zpsg0gzooht.jpg)
Got the planer out and took down 16 boards after ripping 1x12's into a 6" and 5" board for panelling.  Filled up the shop vac in a hurry and added the sawdust to one of the fruit trees (they will all get some this spring as it makes good mulch).

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20140511_165750_535_zpsxtk2ec4j.jpg)
Once I'd planed the boards down I clamped them to the work bench and routered tongues and grooves into them.  I prefer doing it this way rather than using a router table as it seems easiler and faster this way.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20140511_170354_181_zps4vsxo2hr.jpg)
This is what my shirt looks like after making panelling for an hour! lol

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20140511_172129_215_zpsg5iez2ic.jpg)
Here you can see the tongue and groove -- my amana bit really does a nice job but it might be getting a little dull.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20140511_180325_986_zpsnxbj5d9c.jpg)
64 board feet of panelling done today :)  Now I just need to do this a few more times and I should be able to finish the ceiling.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 11, 2014, 11:39:09 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/IMG_20140511_182654_293_zpsobedrjcb.jpg)
Our neighbor made this sign for us a couple years ago but we had no where to put it yet.  My wife got it painted today and I hung it once it had dried enough.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/IMG_20140511_182637_344_zps4j3t1aen.jpg)
We will get the same neighbor to make our 'ranch sign' to hang on the cross bar of the entrance (or place above or both).  Can't wait to have it up!

Also, I'll get the gate in on Tuesday so I can install this week also :)

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 13, 2014, 10:46:04 PM
Got the gate installed today.  Was a bit darker Red than my wife wanted but she can paint it ;)

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 13, 2014, 10:59:59 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/gate1_zps86538e44.jpg)
Here's a shot of the gate

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/gate2_zps9d3a3a1e.jpg)
As you see it when you arrive
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: UK4X4 on May 14, 2014, 04:07:54 AM
looking good !
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: pocono_couple on May 14, 2014, 04:11:29 AM
you wife has good taste..red was the right color for the job!  looking good...
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 14, 2014, 07:35:57 AM
Thanks.

Always feels good to get more done :)  Over the next couple weeks I need to get some milling done but my wife also wants me to get panelling and flooring done.....so I'll be busy when I'm here as long as the weather holds!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 14, 2014, 12:17:10 PM
Saw a Moose trotting down our road this morning  ;D :) [cool]

I was really surprised because I hadn't seen any around me before and here was this guy (or gal) running down the road.  Couldn't get a picture as I was too slow.

Saw one (or might have been two) on Monday across the mountains from me too.  I was heading east and it was on the North side of the road, then on my way back west a few hours later I saw one (perhaps the same Moose) in the swamp on the south side of the road.

Gotta love it!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on May 14, 2014, 07:32:22 PM
 [cool]

I took the grand kids for a ride on the fourwheeler the other day seen two BIG DEER PA PA.  (Two cow elk) Yesterday took the trash to the dumpsters seen a bull elk in the velvet nib stage. 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 15, 2014, 09:48:56 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3roQ9U3mNOI&feature=youtu.be (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3roQ9U3mNOI&feature=youtu.be)
Peeling logs for the entrance...my wife shot this video while I was hard at it...
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 18, 2014, 07:40:00 PM
My Crimson Beauty has buds on it!  Some look damaged (perhaps from a snap freeze as it was still getting to freezing when I left Wednesday) but some have survived.  If that's all the flowers that it will produce I'm guessing it might only give me 2 or 3 apples this year but that's a start!

Only one branch had buds on it though so I don't know if it will toss more out or not (most likely not I'm thinking).

None of the others have flowers yet but they are still pushing leaves too so maybe they are late bloomers.

All of the trees in the orchard and awake now so I should see some furious growth now which means I also have to get the deer protection moved out so they have room to branch etc...lots to do!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 18, 2014, 10:20:53 PM
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00G9EHGDK/ref=wl_it_dp_o_pC_S_ttl?_encoding=UTF8&colid=1BOS6JGYXO0OE&coliid=I1486O1YWENNTX
I think considerations had something like this.

I'm seriously thinking it would be good as I'm not always heading home for the weekend and could use some light laundry washing.  I can use it during the day when the suns up and can hang on a line.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 18, 2014, 11:16:41 PM
http://www.cals.uidaho.edu/edComm/pdf/BUL/BUL0867.pdf
Goo article on high altitude fruit growing in our area
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 20, 2014, 07:43:08 AM
http://www.amazon.com/Panda-Compact-Portable-Washing-Automatic/dp/B00JJZBHK4/ref=pd_rhf_dp_p_tnr_3
This one is tempting.  11lbs capacity is maybe 2 pairs of jeans instead of one.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on May 20, 2014, 08:43:01 AM
She had a Haier.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on May 20, 2014, 08:46:30 AM
Quote from: MountainDon on May 20, 2014, 08:43:01 AM
She had a Haier.

Dang you beat me to it MD I went looking ......... and you had found it when I got back .....  Great minds   :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 20, 2014, 10:29:24 AM
I'll check those out too.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on May 20, 2014, 01:14:03 PM
Quote from: rick91351 on May 20, 2014, 08:46:30 AM
Dang you beat me to it MD I went looking ......... and you had found it when I got back .....  Great minds   :D

At times I surprise myself with the details I remember. At other times I am shocked I can not find where I put my (enter elusive object here)  down. 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 20, 2014, 11:39:28 PM
Finally started my rail for my ships ladder stairs.
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Post4_zpsf72485a1.jpg)

I took the chain saw down the hill below the cabin and found a tree that was dead and the right size, cut it down and hauled it up to my 'shop tent' and began stripping the bark off the first log I'd cut 45" long....note to self, strip the entire log first.

Once the post was cut to 44" (2" over the rail hight of 42") I took it inside and marked where I needed to cut it to inset it onto the stringer.
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Post3_zps02e02596.jpg)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Post_zps491f798d.jpg)
All in all I think it worked out pretty well.  Now, can I do it a second time?

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Post2_zpsca4e733e.jpg)
I need to get shorter lag bolts and inset them into the post so I can pretty much hide them when I'm done.

Once I have the two posts made and installed I'll mark and drill the mortices.  That will be a challenge but with my new drill press I think I can make it happen.

After that I have to measure, cut and strip the railings which I hope to use from the same tree and finally I have to drill them with mortices for the stiles which I'll use my lumberjack tools tenon cutters to make.

And of course, I have to actually install it all and sand and stain and......can I get a long weekend soon? lol
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 21, 2014, 11:54:18 PM
Got the second post done but Photobucket is down for maintenance so I'll have to post tomorrow, I also got the irrigation in the garden sorted so each tree will get up to 14 gallons of water in an hour and the sprayers I installed will cover an 18 square foot area so should really saturate the ground a lot better than the dripper heads I was using.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 22, 2014, 07:53:50 AM
Took some pics of the process I went through to make the second railing (which was more or less the same as the first)
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/MakingRail_zpsd8a0939b.jpg)
First step was to measure and mark where to cut/notch the post.  I used a hand saw for most of the cutting though I did use a miter saw for some of it I found the hand saw much better for this work.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/post2-2_zps32846893.jpg)
Once the cuts were done I knocked out the better part of the wood with my hammer and then used the chisel to get down to a flatter surface.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/post2-3_zps43c42878.jpg)
Next I dragged out the draw knife and used it like a plane.  It does a pretty decent job of getting things even and planing off material that is sticking up.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/post2-4JPG_zps14f378a2.jpg)
Finally I get out my Timber Framing Slick and smooth the surface around the angled cut a but more.  It's amazing how well it works if you take some time and go slow.  No hurrying in this kinds of work.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Post2_zps4ce6982c.jpg)
Standing the post up and clamping it in the vice helps with this step.  Once secured I ran the router around the top of the post to radius the edge a bit.  I like the way this turns out with the drawknife cuts showing in the radius.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/post2-6_zps5aae0c6c.jpg)
Finally after securing the post in the drill press and driving holes through it where I want to secure it to the stairs I mount and secure :)

Of course I still have to sand and stain and varathane but not until I've cut the mortices for the railings.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on May 22, 2014, 08:14:46 AM
Yeah I was wondering why you didn't recess the lags (either direction) and plug them to hide your fastners.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 22, 2014, 01:09:36 PM
Quote from: Redoverfarm on May 22, 2014, 08:14:46 AM
Yeah I was wondering why you didn't recess the lags (either direction) and plug them to hide your fastners.

That's the plan.  Just roughing in at this point.  Both have to be removed, treated, stained, coated, drilled etc etc and the railings have to made too.

More or less this was a test fit.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Adam Roby on May 22, 2014, 05:52:09 PM
Maybe it's just the angle, but that looks like a stairway to nowhere....   :-\

Very nice work.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 22, 2014, 07:57:40 PM
Quote from: Adam Roby on May 22, 2014, 05:52:09 PM
Maybe it's just the angle, but that looks like a stairway to nowhere....   :-\

Very nice work.

LOL a long time ago I had this debate with my kids and wife as to where the stairs should run.  I wanted them to run either onto a landing out from the wall a couple feet or perhaps the opposite way however the kids and wife won and I installed them the way the ladder originally was placed.  It actually works this way and takes up a lot less room but for taller folks is a bit of a pain.  My hope is that once the railing is in it will be a lot easier to get on and off them.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 25, 2014, 05:04:16 PM
OK so after digging and digging (to try to find what I thought was a broken or plugged line) and not getting very far (pun not intended) I finally gave in and pulled up the pump from the well (it was 83 feet down). Darci thought maybe there was a problem with it.....a short or something....I pulled it up because I noticed when I flipped the switch on it pumped fora second and then stopped....

After pulling up the pump I finally, after much fiddling and testing, tool the water proof connection apart and found  corrosion (from water) and a broken positive! Needless to say I ought to listen to my wife before digging a big hole! lol

After fixing the wiring and getting everything back into the well etc we began pumping....more than 40 minutes later water starting filling the cistern and an hour after that we are half full. I'm about to go out and check it again (I want to get the float re-attached to the system so I don't need to watch it any longer) and am THRILLED to have water again!

SHOWERS TONIGHTS! WHOHOO! After two days of digging in the dirt it will be nice to have a hot shower
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 27, 2014, 07:34:30 AM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/ARail3_zpsff023583.jpg)
Well it's not what I wanted or planned but it's 'ok' for now.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/ARail2_zps89503a48.jpg)
I goofed big time on the upper post but recovered 'ok' on it afterwards (started my mortise in the wrong angle).

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/ARail_zpsfbe616a3.jpg)
The 58 degree angle of the stairs proved VERY tough to drill even with the drill press I bought which has a rotating deck that I can set to 58 degrees.  It was just too steep to work with and to clamp the post to.  I have some ideas on how to improve the design but may have us the drill and chisel method to properly mortise the rails.

It can wait though.  This is solid and will give something for people to hold on to when climbing the ships ladder like stairs.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 05, 2014, 10:41:21 AM
Broke out the Panda washing machine last night and did some laundry.  I'm VERY impressed!
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Washer_zps7fd93ff7.jpg)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Washer2_zps4e9bc590.jpg)
Left side is the washer which really agitates the clothes, the right side is the spin dry side and it gets them nearly dry.  This is not your mom's old ringer washer!

So far I'm pretty impressed and VERY happy we purchased it for the cabin.  Uses about 330watts during the wash and rinse cycles though it isn't constant (cycles on and off).  Time to wash for most things is 3-6 minutes, same for rinse cycle.  Spin cycle is a little less time but more often (one load might require 3 loads of spin cycle) and the spin cycle uses about half the power.

While doing laundry I managed to dig the trench for my new foundation footing.  Yes I know it isn't down below the frost line but I've had no heave in 5 years and a neighbor above me has also had no heave (in nearly 40 years)...maybe it's the soil, dry climate, who knows but I'm comfortable with the footing being down only 12" though I'll be adding back fill a little to get it closer to 16".
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Trench_zps5064da15.jpg)

This will be a 16"x8" footing which will support an SBC wall 16" tall

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Trench2_zps147cd7e1.jpg)
Above the SBC wall I'll build a 2x6 pony wall to the underside of the cabin and I'll secure a ledger to it with ledger lock screws to hang the deck off of.  My plan is to build the deck with rough sawn 2x6 joists spanning 5' to a 4x8 beam and another 5' to a second 4x8 beam.  I think that ought to be plenty strong ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on June 05, 2014, 10:18:20 PM
You sort of hit on a key issue.  Dry ground.  Pretty hard to see much movement if there is nothing to freeze.  Lots of people do not understand the northwest and its moisture cycles.  Basically the hard freezes are done when the snow starts to melt.  As the snow melts the ground gets moist.  Cycles through the summer by fall dry as a bone.  Goes back in to a cold cycle yet dry cycle.  This does not stop the ground from freezing just very little movement.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 05, 2014, 10:29:59 PM
And in this area where there is only about 14 inches of rain a year (most in March through June).

Was going to work on the foundation but decided to work on the sprinkler heads for the orchard and test out the new sprinkler on the rye grass I planted this year.

Then ran the bush hog for a couple hours until I hit a rock (BANG!!!) and called it a night.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: UK4X4 on June 06, 2014, 02:14:31 AM
There's not only frost depth to consider, but the soil its self

looks to me like your still in top soil with live plant matter and haven't reached a stable compacted soil in that trench
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Lindym on June 10, 2014, 12:36:12 PM
WOW! You have actual dirt! On our side of the Valley we have rock, oh, and more rock..... We're not sure what we are going to do for planting fence posts.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 10, 2014, 01:40:12 PM
Ya don't kid yourself! lol there is rock, then um, more rock.

Sure some places appear to have some 'dirt' but in reality it's just deposited on top of rock -- lots and lots of rock.

I 'might' get that trench down a little deeper but it's unlikely.  Heck, I couldn't even drive a ground rod down more than 5 feet in this area...it took driving one at 45 degrees and beating it to heck and back to get it all the way in...I've been told they often look like cork screws when pulled out because of the rock...much of which is about the size of a small house, or cabin.

We dug trenches for the original post and pier foundation with an excavator and just found rock, rock an more rock.  I only went down about 12" then and haven't had any movement that I can tell so I've decided to go with that hear too figuring it will be a stronger and sturdier foundation either way.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 10, 2014, 01:56:09 PM
(http://oikos.com/esb/43/foundation.gif)

Perhaps I should consider doing this to push the frost line away a little
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 14, 2014, 03:09:56 PM
Much work later....

So I decided to see if I could lower the footing a little and managed a few more inches however the rock is getting tough to move.  One of the problems with this soil is that it's glacial till (I think that's what it's called) which means you have lots of rock....rock rock rock.  I can take a long time to hand dig anything becuase as you get deeper you just run into more rocks -- big rocks, some the size of your car.

In this case I managed to get down about 16" without having to move too much rock but ran into a lot more at this level so I stopped.  Pounded the ground tight and set the form.

After a lot of messing around, wideing the trench etc I managed to finally get the form under the center of where the wall needs to be (I forgot that I needed to account for a 2x6 wall under the rim joist of the cabin which meant the form needed to be centered 3 3/4" under the cabin in order to put the center of the footing directly center of where the 8" block wall will go.

I then had to remember to pull the form out away from the wall the correct distance so I can turn the corner and keep the footing the correct distance out from the outer wall. 

Now I just need to drill some holes, bend an place some rebar and then finally I should be ready to mix and pour concrete.....12 bags alone should be a synch right?  lol tell my arms that!  My forearms are already mad at me!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 14, 2014, 06:44:39 PM
After reading a little about Glacial Till and decided that I couldn't do much without an excavator and moving the cabin it was time to shrug it off an finish what I started.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/APorchSupport_zpsd8afe997.jpg)
First Iifted the SE corner of the cabin 1/2" and moved the post in a little, fixed a support and leveled the corner a bit better.  That corner has always been a problem because the pier block was not put in perfectly level (I've brought this up before).  Once done I moved to the porch and using my 20ton jack I supported the porch beam so I could move the post and pier back out of the way of the new foundation.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/AForm_zps863bb0f7.jpg)
I then bent and cut rebar, tied it together and set some pins for my blocks.  I didn't place plastic under the foundation which I debated doing but I'd never actually done it before and decided to just leave it

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/ASetup_zpsbde60b95.jpg)
Once I finished getting the form and rebar ready I moved my truck into place with the bags of cement on the back so it would be easier to grab them since I'm working alone.  With everything set up and the water on as well as the generator runnning to provide extra power to run the mixer I set to mixing and pouring concrete.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/AFooting2_zps364f07c9.jpg)
Less then an hour later I had this.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/AFooting_zps14fff02d.jpg)
A little more scree work and I decided I was done messing with it.  The mortar will take up any minor bumps or ridges so I'm not too worried anyway.  Though having it level and smooth helps.

Next step is to get the SBC which is on order and start dry stacking :)  Should take long since I'm only doing two courses but I need to make sure I have enough foundation to turn the corner (I think I am short).  If need be I'll get more cement and dig out the next section and pour it too ;)  Took me longer to do the digging then it did to pour and scree the cement.


Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 30, 2014, 08:07:54 AM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Foundation_zpsceb01b15.jpg)
Block placed and mortared

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Foundation2_zps8c1344af.jpg)
Bond Beam poured and ready for extension when new section is added

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Beams_zps6b874ec9.jpg)
Beams placed and joists being added

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Deck_zps92a8df15.jpg)
Finished!

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/DeckAwning_zps2e6ee7f6.jpg)
Taking a break in the rain -- notice the new stringers.

Will post more later but must run!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 10, 2014, 07:35:47 AM
 [cool] c* I might hurt a lot (tendinitis) but man I love this deck!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 17, 2014, 09:40:45 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/1stBearPic_zps4aa5ed13.jpg)
Well hello :)

Got my game cam running again and despite only having 5 pics on it (forgot to dump all the old ones and it was a 512m card) I captured this one...the camera is OLD and SLOW so my wife bought me a new one for my birthday :)  I hope to get some great pics of deer up around the rye field....will post when I get some.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 27, 2014, 10:41:48 PM
Got a pic of a nice buck walking past the cam recently...but there were two and they took their time d* That old cam has to go!

Meanwhile, since I can't do much with my right arm my son came out with my wife and he did some weed wacking to clear stuff around the cabin and a friend worked my driveway and roads down to dirt for fire breaks...I then (after ten days of nonstop work) managed to get a couple hours to start grading my driveway/road up which is in desperate need.

I'll be working a lot still but not as much as I was so perhaps I can get some tractor work done now :)

O and we harvested some cereal rye to :)  Not much, but perhaps enough for a loaf of bread or two
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on August 04, 2014, 08:38:43 AM
Tendinitis really is the pits.  I hope your arm heals up quickly, altho it will simply take time and not using it much...

From what I've been able to tell the fire is 100% contained now, and didn't get any closer than about 5 or 6 miles from my place - it stayed south of 20, thankfully.

Thanks for the link to the page with the info.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 04, 2014, 09:54:55 AM
http://inciweb.nwcg.gov/incident/3967/
82% contained and improving.

Yes, Tendinitis sucks!  Had it before (pretty severe) and this is a bad one with my right arm very painful for over a month now but it is getting better.

Now if it can heal before the winter so I can put up some firewood!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: pocono_couple on August 05, 2014, 05:31:00 AM
looks like you have some neat neighbors!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 06, 2014, 06:34:49 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Buck_zps90366ef9.jpg)
Newest game cam -- cheaper one but still works well in good light...night vision is a bit crappy but better than my old one.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Buck2_zpse4924da1.jpg)
Another shot from the Tasco

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Buck_zps18d19712.jpg)
Cam my wife bought me :)  Much better game cam

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Buck2_zps1208fef7.jpg)

I think I've seen both these bucks in here before so I'm fairly certain they live here...I also only see them in the middle of the night.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 13, 2014, 10:53:03 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/DreadedCanadaThistle_zpsf3955e3b.jpg)
My neighbor to the east is a young guy (an his sister) and he tore up his place playing in the mud last year (and the year prior) and then left and hasn't been back much for the last 18 months or so.  Thanks to his tearing up the grass some Canada Thistle has taken hold and I couldn't leave it be as it's invasive and will take over in no time.  I found at least 200 square feet of thistle and spent an hour or so treating it with round up.

I'll let his uncle and grandpa know (they live out here too) and perhaps they will help treat the problem before it takes over the area.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/LookingDown_zps12a9a667.jpg)
I took this tonight on my walk about the property.  I'm looking north towards my place and you can just barely see the roof (left 3rd) as well as my neighbor (the uncle mentioned above) in the right 3rd.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/BearScat_zps471fa722.jpg)
No bear on the game cam but found some scat so I know he's prowling around still.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/CerealRye_zps94c427b0.jpg)
The Cereal Rye has been dry for nearly a month now and should drop all it's seed soon.  The animals haven't eating much of it yet which might be good as they should hit it hard during hunting season (I hope)

It's good to be back at the cabin :) gotta admit that I love being here.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 20, 2014, 09:45:21 PM
Oh how I love this place!  Can't say enough how awesome it is to be here and to have been able to live here for most of the last year.  Alas, living here isn't meant to be for now so I'm settling for 2-3 days a week or every other week (on the company dime mind you).

Despite having a very sore arm (that is healing however) I managed to get a door made for the outhouse today!  I've been dying to do this for a while no and just decided it had to be done (sore arm be dammed).
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/OuthouseDOor_zps16315589.jpg)
This outhouse is rarely used (maybe 6 times in the last 8-9 months) and will remain mostly as a backup for those rare times we have guests and need the extra capacity (and ladies prefer if the gents use it anyway).  However I still need to get it sided and finish the roof etc.  At least now it has a door though!

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Door4_zpsee51fa16.jpg)
I'll be honest, this is my first door!  I also did it with just a couple power tools (skill saw and drill) since my miter saw, table say and everything else is in the back of my truck some 180 miles from me (to keep it out of harms way in case the fires get too close).  I also made this with rough sawn 1x's of random widths and didn't plane them etc.  I just cut them to length, glued them up, screwed down the cross pieces and braces and called it good ;)

All in all, for a rustic outhouse door I'm pretty happy :D and I can see making a much nicer version for the bathroom inside the cabin.

I should also turn that handle right side up too! lol  d* not sure why I put it in that was...guess I was looking at it upside down.

While up here today the propane guy came and filled up my tank so I'm back to 400 gallons which ought to last me until next summer (and beyond).
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/PropaneTruck_zpsd99f97c7.jpg)
Our gate is a little narrow and short but at 12'6" there was more than 2 feet of spare headroom and a foot to either side (plus some) and the truck had no problem.  That's a 2800 gallon propane truck built on what looks like a Kenworth frame (I didn't check)...it's about as big a trck as I'd expect to get in here so I'm happy with that....and since the driveway up is only 9 feet wide I'd say I'm golden ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 20, 2014, 09:58:02 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/PropaneTruck3_zpsfd37cd00.jpg)
That big truck really has to squeeze down the driveway here...

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/PropaneTruck4_zps1d05eba9.jpg)
Wide enough here but steep...

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/PropaneTruck2_zpsb4c5134a.jpg)
This spot leaves only 6" on either side of the truck but is short enough to not cause much of an issue (or stress)...

But we managed to get him up and down without a worry so I think we're good to go and I won't worry about the driveway or ranch entrance any longer :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 30, 2014, 09:13:25 AM
Back at the cabin for the long weekend to get some things organized and maybe get some firewood cut for the winter (if my arm allows since I have tennis elbow pretty bad).

One thing I need to remember is to get some old D's and string them up to keep the wood peckers away!  They like to roost under the eves and it's ticking me off! lol

ON a side note I forgot to bring some bread for sandwiches etc so I just made some ;)
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Spelt2_zpsa2f0e569.jpg)

It's not only great tasting (1/5th stone ground spelt flour & 4/5ths white bread flour) and better for you than store bought but the cabin smelled divine while it was baking (and the rest of the evening) :)  SO ya, I think I'll have some toast today!

Cheers
Erik
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on September 01, 2014, 02:56:32 PM
Looks like some really nice bread!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 01, 2014, 07:22:43 PM
Quote from: JavaMan on September 01, 2014, 02:56:32 PM
Looks like some really nice bread!

It was ;) thanks :)  In fact I made a second batch in case I had company but I ended up working on the place too much to visit.  Though one neighbor popped by for a couple drinks and a nice visit on the new deck :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 01, 2014, 07:37:24 PM
Have had a great weekend and a productive weekend at the cabin :)  Oh sure, I know I'm here more than most can be since I live here at least part time but much of that time I have little time to get stuff done and this weekend was all about 'getting stuff done!'.

I post pics but photobucket seems to be having issues so I'll post those later.  In all honesty I have to try to think back to Friday when I arrived and try to think of what I did.....what did I do? lol

I moved in, walked about, made bread and had a relaxing evening.  Saturday I started by cleaning out the rat infested shed and organizing it for use again.  I managed to get some felt up to protect the OSB whihc was now devoid of house wrap (that was on it 5 years ago when we bought the place) and used hardware cloth, spray foam and cement mix to fill in holes under the shed to start making it much harder for the rats to get into it.  Then I set to getting firewood split, then went out and cut down some dead trees for more firewood.  I also fell some trees in a spot I needed to thin them.

At some point I shifted gears (probably because my tendinitis keeps me from doing too much of one thing for very long) and even got my truck unloaded (it was full of all my power tools from when the fire was getting close).

Sunday on a stroll around the property I ran into some bear tracks and took some pics.  Looks like a sub-adult about 150 lbs or a small adult.  Then I got back to working on the firewood by hauling down a bunch of 'flitches' from the sawmill site (also called slabs) and bucking them into firewood.  Eventually I set to making speaker boxes which I finished today :)

I also split and stacked a bunch more wood.  I'm almost ready for the winter now!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 01, 2014, 08:20:33 PM
On a side note I had an issue with my AIMS inverter/charger that I think I've resolved now.  It would not kick on the charger to charge the batteries when the generator came on any longer.  I couldn't figure it out and had to reset the inverter to make it kick the charger on until today!  I'd switched it over to 'shore power mode' previously and even though I'd flipped the switch back to battery mode it appeared to not take.  I had to flip the unit off, switch to battery mode and then turn the unit back on and now it works again!

I think it was just stuck in shore power mode and when in that state it will not kick back onto the shore power until it passes a timer setting to ensure the power is stable which is what I think was happened.  It also may wait for the batteries to drop to specific voltage first too (I'd have to go back and read). Anyway, it's working now so I'm pretty happy with that.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 13, 2014, 11:21:46 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Boxed_zpse87f1b8c.jpg)
Speaker box

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Tractor-Lock_zpscd4d56e4.jpg)
Tractor helping secure the shed

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Woodshed2_zps77fd1af5.jpg)
Woodshed getting there
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 13, 2014, 11:26:11 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/ADoor_zps696ec157.jpg)
Made a door for the back room.  It's not installed yet but at least it's made now!

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Awindow2_zps581810cb.jpg)
Getting some window trim done

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/AMantel_zps042ca412.jpg)
Got a mantel made out of some live sawn pine we planned on using for a shelf...other shelves also done.

Been a good weekend (long) and my battery is dying so I'm done!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on September 13, 2014, 11:53:29 PM
The work never seems to end.  Nice looking shelf.  Are you going to need a shield on your stove pipe that close?

We have had a couple chilly mornings down here how about up there? 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 15, 2014, 12:10:13 PM
With the stove burning I felt no heat at the shelf but remember looking into the clearances a while back and should be fine.  I'll have to check when it's really cranking out the heat though in the dead of winter to know for certain.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 15, 2014, 12:14:36 PM
Ahhhh vacation!  How I wish I were still on it ;)  Still much was accomplished.  I added another row (plus) of firewood tot he shed -- all very dry -- and have at least another 30 feet of a big dead fir to buck, split and stack so I'll be good for the winter now :)  Also managed to get felt paper on the shed where the old house wrap had blown off and covered the outhouse in felt also (except the roof).  During our 5 day stay at the cabin we also topped off the batteries with distilled water (they were getting low but still good), cleaned some terminals and exercised the transfer switch a few times (it was working each time too).  I also realized the system (at least the original components anyway) was now 4 years old!  The batteries are hanging in there and I think I have another year or two in them yet.

With the deck stained (one coat), doors stained and back side of the small room stained I'm feeling better about the upcoming winter.  Still have lots to do but with time and effort I'll be more prepared this year :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on September 16, 2014, 01:15:46 AM
I think it is a good feeling to have a lot of wood laid.  And plenty of food a few books that you always wanted to but just never.....  Then let it snow and blow....
Oh wait your not retired  ;D forgot about the job thing!  Oh well there is always weekends..... 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 17, 2014, 07:28:17 PM
Very good feeling!  Will be even better when it's FULL :D  And knowing I won't be here all winter makes me feel good about not needed the 400 gallons of propane that we have in the tank ;)

I'll be shutting the place down for weeks at a time this winter as my main office is in Moses Lake now.  However, today I'm here (And loving it) for work and will be back next week and weekend too :)  I plan to get some work done then but tonight I'm just relaxing.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 25, 2014, 07:57:47 AM
You have to love a job that allows you to live (at least part time) in your cabin :)  I'll be here until Sunday at least and hope to get some work done around the place.  Have a milling job to do near by also but with luck I'll get a little wood put away or some panelling worked on etc.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 27, 2014, 10:54:36 PM
Well I never managed to get any cabin work done this week/weekend but I did mill up about 700 board feet of Fir for a neighbor to use as panelling.   I'll be back to mill some more in a couple week so I might not get much work done at the cabin this fall but at least I'm earning a few extra bucks to pay for things like fixing my plow blade!

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Milling/1stlog175bf_zps7af319e8.jpg)
This monster was so big I had to whittle it a little with my chainsaw to get the mill past it on the sides!

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Milling/lastlog13bf_zps93bb3284.jpg)
Last log of the day milled into a CANT

Didn't have time for many pics so this is all you get ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 11, 2014, 10:21:20 PM
Watched a monster buck from 260 yards today.  He was getting ready to bed down and now I know where he's sleeping ;) 

Then I milled up a bunch of lumber for my neighbor.  Not getting anything done for myself mind you so that has to start soon!  I have much to do before the winter sets in but time has flying past!  I did however order the stock tank heater and extras for the grey water tank and in a week or so I'll come back and start putting that together and maybe add a foot of dirt on top of the piping, insulate the down pipe, add some heat tape and then perhaps wood chips etc to try to keep things from freezing up.

I've also though to building an 30 lid for the grey water tank too, that way it will be less likely to freeze and the warmth of the stock tank heater (which will only run when the genny runs) will help a lot more.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on October 14, 2014, 02:29:20 PM
Sorry we didn't swing by or let you know we were heading up ... it was still a bit iffy even at the last minute if I was going to pull it off, and once we got there, we were planning on simply working our tails off with very little down time.

If I can find transport in the snow up to my place, I may decine to take a long weekend (or two) and see if I can't get it buttoned up completely so that all that will be left is inside the place.  That would be good because then I could figure out a way to heat it and stay warm while I'm up there.

Anyway - I see you were up this last weekend, also!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 14, 2014, 03:35:10 PM
Up now too :)  I spend a lot of time up here because I have an office in Omak  c*

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 14, 2014, 09:43:55 PM
I'm thinking my 4 yr old abused GCB's are probably at the end of their lives.  Seems with little sun and not much use they draw down from 24.8v to 23.0v in just a few hours when I kick on the fridge (which does draw a lot of wattage when cooling down on first run) etc.  Gen came on after the sun went down and while it won't run at all for two weeks if the cabin is empty and only the phone, inverter, 120mm, 90mm dc fans and Genset battery charger are running (30-200w depending on what's doing what) it sure comes on as soon as I start to really use the bank.

So while I was planning on replacing this year but didn't, I'm thinking next year it will be a must.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 16, 2014, 07:50:10 AM
Another trip to the cabin for a few days and nothing done.  Honestly I just felt like relaxing in front of the wood stove and getting to sleep early for a good nights rest.  Sure, it is always enjoyable to be here but alas, I didn't have the energy to make it a productive trip (probably because it was raining and I had to work during the day).

I'll be back again soon and perhaps on my next 'weekend trip' I'll actually do something ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on October 16, 2014, 09:29:06 AM
OJ Speaking of stoves you have a Vermont Castings? 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 17, 2014, 10:50:32 AM
Yes, Vermont Castings Aspen.  I think it's a good little stove though frankly it could be better starting with the removal of the low particulate portion and changing the incoming draft to the front door (or both sides of the front) above the ash pan.

I can get it to burn for 9+ hours which is a good thing when living with the stove and while it does require a lot of cleaning (I burn crap wood -- Ponderosa Pine -- a lot) once you have a system down it works pretty well over all.

In the winter my routine looks like this:  come home after work, shovel out ash and dump tray, remove air cover plate and sweep out ash (if air channels are filling then vacuum out), replace air cover plate, prime stove (have two 90 degree bends), light stove and burn hot until good coal bed is formed then fill with logs (large round if possible) and tamp down full.  In the morning I bring it back to life (normally with little effort) and burn hot until I leave when I stuff it with wood and tamp down again.

Seems like a lot of effort but that's all because it is a state mandated low particulate stove and a very small one at that ;)  I know others who have a lot more trouble with their stoves.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on October 17, 2014, 01:16:11 PM
We also have the VC Aspen with a straight up and out chimney. Straight is easier to get started. For some reason we do not have any issues with ash build up in the air channel. I've only cleaned that once a year in 6 winters. Might have something to do with my add-on fresh air blower I use to get things going quicker. The stove and chimney is a tight enough fit that we never have had any smoke leaks. We burn P. Pine too, very dry... seasoned 2 years minimum as a rule. Of course we are in a relatively low humidity area and that helps get the wood dry in a normal years time.

Side Note: All wood has virtually the same BTU content when dry. The wood has to 'ring' when 2 pieces are knocked together. No thuds allowed; that = moisture content. Virtually the same BTU per pound; oak being denser than pine has more BTU per equivalent volume of wood.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 17, 2014, 01:30:16 PM
Thanks for the post Don (someone else reads my blather? lol  d*

I often wonder about the ash and if a fan would prevent it...might be in order.

I try to burn Fir and am in a very dry place also but have to season wood for two years.  I do however try to cut as much standing dead wood as I can.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on October 17, 2014, 02:26:12 PM
 [cool]  I have a Dutch West from Vermont Castings.  It goes straight up out of the top.  It is the largest model.  So anyway just wondered what you had and about the care and feeding there of ...... 

We did purchase a blower fan for this.  So far well pleased other than easy right now with 50 degree temps to over stoke it.  Open goes the doors and the windows.  Says volumes for the insolutation. 

Also thanks Don.  We always try and season our wood a couple years but............ 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on October 17, 2014, 02:42:44 PM
Our firewood needs are modest so it doesn't take much work to get ahead of the curve.  ;D

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 28, 2014, 12:50:13 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on October 17, 2014, 02:42:44 PM
Our firewood needs are modest so it doesn't take much work to get ahead of the curve.  ;D

This will likely be me in the coming years as I no longer live in the cabin.  I spend long weekends there about every other weekend though and it's always nice to have extra firewood.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 30, 2014, 05:57:47 PM
Got back to the cabin today and brought up this:
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Scraper_zps5da324c7.jpg)
It's my old plow blade that broke last winter and is now officially a 'scraper' :)

lawmanonline.com removed the old broken center bolt and replaced with a 3.5" scd40 pipe inside of a 4" sch40 pipe and remounted the lock plate, added 4" of blade to the top and beefed things up.
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Scraper2_zps212b6a11.jpg)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Scraper3_zpsaf8ccdb7.jpg)
I took it for a spin down the road and it did a nice job of scraping the driveway and cleaning it up.  I have no concerns with plowing snow now! :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 01, 2014, 08:05:06 AM
http://solarelectricityhandbook.com/solar-angle-calculator.html
I last set my panels in September I think as I seem to recall setting them to 41 degrees.....was thinking it was time to adjust them and that my generator was running more tan I would like (though it has been overcast and raining) so I went to my favorite site for adjusting my panels and it says 25 degrees now....hmmm..... better get to it! lol
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 07, 2014, 07:48:04 PM
Genny has been running more than I'd like lately (and I wasn't here) but then it's been raining and I didn't adjust the panels...guess I better do that tomorrow!

County assessor has been by too which means our taxes will go up (I'm guessing triple).

Back at the cabin for the weekend and hoping to get a little wintering done as well as some other work.

Looking forward to the weekend :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 08, 2014, 10:29:08 AM
Just in time I'd say!  Going to be in the teens next week...high on Veterans day is only forecast to be 20F and I'll be leaving the day before and not coming back a while......so it's good I'm here this weekend as I'll be able to shut down the water etc and prep the cabin a bit for the cold weather.

With luck I'll leave it ready for a deep freeze and won't have frozen water, broken hot water and frozen drains when I return! lol
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 08, 2014, 12:57:56 PM
Looking up my solar angle again just to be sure I thought "this seems awfully steep" because I'd read (back when I was first building my system) that the sun varies about 15 degrees between extremes and to get maximum generation at those times you would add or subtract that from your latitude (mine is 48.69) and you'd be set.  Thus in winter if I were at 33.69 degrees (I rounded to 33+) you'd get max generation and that's what I did.

Now looking at these calculators that's not quite right.  The sun angle for my panels according to two different calculators (one uses lat/long based on zip code, the other uses country, state, city nearest you or on the same plane) my angle should actually be 24.82 degrees (using altitude also) and as steep as 18 degrees in the middle of December.

So I'm going to go out and adjust the panels and see what that gives me ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 08, 2014, 11:12:04 PM
 [cool] :) ;D

I am happy to report that I've FINALLY fixed the 'state of charge' lights on my Charge Controller.  I discovered that I had ONE dip switch in the off position instead of 'on' which prevented the controller from excepting the settings I was trying to give it.  Now it's working as it should :)

On a side note I've had almost NO float charging going on in the last few weeks (clouds and rain etc) which is unusual for up here even this time of year and I'm hoping that we get some good solar production weather despite the cold.  After all, I'll need it to keep from having to run the genny so much!

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 09, 2014, 07:56:37 PM
After much procrastination I managed to finally get the new jet installed in the Housewarmer 8000BTU heater in the back room and the heater re-lit.  I also noticed that the heater did not come on when on 'low' and about 40-45 degrees in the room (good thing).  So I've reset my remote thermometer which I use to monitor the room and will see how the heater does on low while I'm gone (going to be in the teens for a while so it will get a work out).

Also got the composter rotated and the drawer emptied and refilled so it's also ready for me to leave :)

Did some road work so the driveway in at the steepest section is nice and graded with some crown to it.  I like to get it smoothed out a bit and crowned before the freeze so it will be easier to plow once it snows.

Worked the ground around the grey water drain too and added a good 6" of fill on top of the drain from the cabin which should help and buried the dry well better also (and removed the drain I'd mistakenly installed in it).

I'll have to come back tomorrow after getting the troops out working and shut the water off and drain the lines and hot water heater, then I should be ready to leave the cabin for a week or three without having to worry about frozen pipes etc.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on November 12, 2014, 12:10:00 PM
And we're planning on heading up to my place this weekend ...  d*  Guess I'm a glutton for punishment.  I want to get gable ends done and windows and doors in.  Should be fun.

Looks like you're all set for winter.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 13, 2014, 12:22:44 PM
Quote from: JavaMan on November 12, 2014, 12:10:00 PM
And we're planning on heading up to my place this weekend ...  d*  Guess I'm a glutton for punishment.  I want to get gable ends done and windows and doors in.  Should be fun.

Looks like you're all set for winter.

It will be COLD.  No snow likely as it appears that it will be clear but the temps will be in the single digits at night.  BE PREPARED!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 05, 2014, 09:17:35 PM
It's been a few weeks since I was here and actually staying long enough to do anything and.....

Brrrrr...got to the cabin and it was well below freezing inside.  The power was OFF and the generator was in alarm (over crank).  With the power down to 22vdc I knew have to get lucky to get the generator running since the cabin power keeps it's battery charged but after a few attempts on manual it finally cranked!

Note to self:  don't leave the auto start switch set to 22.5vdc as it clearly is too low!  I'll reset to 23.5v tonight after I put it back on auto mode and with luck won't have this problem again.

Meanwhile the 3 coke cans in the fridge exploded (they were fine Monday when I stopped by) and made a nice frozen mess for me that I cleaned up enough for now (when I have running water I'll have to wash it out).

I then went out to get some water (since the water is off) but the 'frost free' spigot was frozen and I couldn't get it to work!  Grrrrr.....but the main valve is freeze from ice (there was water down there when I shut it off (probably from the frost free when I shut it off) so I think once the cabin is warmed up above 50F I should be able to turn the water back on and at least have cold water until tomorrow when I put the hot water heater back online.

The back room was 44F so I also need to turn up the heat in there a little but at least it was working.

So now, for the next couple hours I'll just have to relax by the wood stove and wait for the temp to rise to a comfortable range (it's 42F now).  Fortunately I have the back up heater which is helping a lot to get the cabin up to temp much faster than if I only had the wood stove.

So, time to watch TV and chill (no pun intended) I guess.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on December 05, 2014, 10:29:48 PM
Yep never fails that when things go wrong you are not there to check on them.  Wondering if the propane would not flow right because of the temperature/and or low capacity that caused the generator to overcrank but not start. Might be something to consider.

You should also have a LBCO on your inverter.  My Magnum does which will not allow it to drop below the Low Battery setting which would help not dropping the battery voltage too low.

I have been experiencing "low oil pressure" alarm on mine which happened last fall for the first time thus causing the generator to not start until I reset the controller.  It has happened several times this past summer and fall but there is sufficient oil capacity but not getting the oil pressure as required.  Have replaced 3 different components(pumps and sensors under Warranty) which would cause this but as of now they have not rectified the problem.  Have one more component to swap out and then a new motor is in order. 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 06, 2014, 09:50:14 AM
Sorry to hear your troubles!  Sounds like an oil pressure gauge fittd to the generator might be of use.  Then when it gives the low pressure alarm you can see what it's actually getting and make a determination as to whether it's a bad sensor or actual low pressure.  My guess is sensor even if it was replaced once already -- or a blockage in the feed to the sensor.

I used to run into this problem with old British sports cars all the time ;)

In my case the propane is at 60% (or was on Monday when it was 24F out -- so actually it was probably around 65%) and it's worked all the way down to -20F so I'm certain that's not the issue.  Which leaves the battery.

I found last year that I couldn't leave the inverter in sleep mode because it wouldn't charge the battery on the generator which would cause it to crank for a bit and then stop  and then try again (the magnum ato start tries 3 times) causing an overcrank alarm.  So this time I lef the inverter on but set the auto start too low and the inverter went into 'low batt' alarm and shut down which in turn shut down the charger on the genny and the above occurred.

When I got here the inverter was off and in alarm and the genny took 3 or 4 manual cranks before it fired and even then took a little to fire up.

I'm going to go back to 23.5v auto start and set it to two hours run time.  That way it will give a boost to the battery bank when it drops down (usually in the early morning if there wasn't much sunlight) and since it will run more often it should remain ready to fire when needed...I hope anyway since I'll probably not be back for a few weeks again.

With Christmas coming I'm likely to not get back until New Years but am thinking of making arrangements with my neighbor to check on the place for me so I don't have to go through this again ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 06, 2014, 10:06:41 AM
Ahhhh cabin life:)

Slept in until 6am (if you can call that sleeping in considering I was up at midnight at 4am stoking the fire) and the cabin was 72F degrees finally :) 

Water is running at all taps now and I can turn on the hot today but will need to put the stock tank heater into the grey water tank to thaw it out and I'll need to build an insulated lid over it to help with that. 

I think I'll also tackle something that's been long in coming:  installing a breaker panel for the generator power inside the back room.  It will have to breakers so the generator can supply power off one to the inverter/charger and off the second to an outlet for 'generator only' power.  It's on this 'gen only' outlet that I'll put the stock tank heater on and that way every time the generator runs the heater will come on and thaw the grey water tank.  The generator comes on nearly daily now too and while it won't run for more than 3 hrs each time hat ought to be enough to keep the tank thawed out unless it really gets cold and then maybe it will keep it somewhat thawed so that when I arrive and kick the generator on for 5 hours it will fully thaw. 

That's the plan anyway but we'll have to see how well it works.  If it doesn't work well enough then in the spring I'll lower the tank two feet and that ought to resolve the issue.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on December 14, 2014, 03:39:07 PM
We never made it up to the property that weekend ... I am going to post it in my thread...

You woes with genny and water are instructive.  I can now think of a million (ok, a few anyway) things I need to take in to account when I finally put water in my place.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 18, 2014, 01:45:45 PM
Guess I should do an update! LOL

I only managed to build a 'well' of sorts around the grey water tank using cinder blocks I had on hand.  I then covered the tank lid with silver insulating blankets (several of them) and some 2" foam, then black plastic and a lid of plywood.  I'd already installed the stock tank heater which worked very well so I know this will hold me over until the spring.

Unfortunately my repaired instant on hot water heater broke again even though I'd drained it using the stock drain valve.  I guess it doesn't drain that well and some water was in the pipes in spots and one split before I got the heater adjust right in the room to prevent this.  Luckily I have a spare hot water heater so I can install it when I'm back and want to use hot water.

Beyond that I shut the power down to 'sleep' mode figuring I wasn't going to be there any time soon and there was no sense in running the generator so much.  With luck the system will be fine like that until I make it back which will be another week or more putting me at about 3 weeks away assuming I make it back before the new year.

I also managed to do a little snow plowing to clear the roads up enough that what was left can melt in warmer weather so I'll have less to deal with now that it's snowing again and I cleared some branches that overhung the worst part of the driveway.

All in all I had a good trip to the cabin at the beginning of the month but life, work etc has kept me away since even though I'm actually still working part time in Omak.  These days I make it up for a few hours and don't drive to the cabin despite being so close!  I do hope to spend more time there in the new year though.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: nailit69 on December 25, 2014, 12:01:08 PM
Ol'J... i've been reading your posts about your adventure in the Okanogan and building an off grid cabin... interesting reading as well as being very educational.

My daughter just bought 20ac. out that way, a little north of Tonasket.  Plans are to build an off grid cabin up there for her, she's planning on living there year round so I plan on building a bombproof cabin capable of withstanding the chilly winters.  I'm a professional builder so the structure isn't my concern as much as keeping the lights on and water flowing is.

You mentioned that yours' was an unpermitted cabin... I wasn't going to build permitted due to time constraints as well as the typical BS that's involved with the entire permit process.  Any backlash from the county for not getting a permit?

Although I have extensive construction experience, I've never built in cold country.  The frostline appears to be 24" per the county site... is this deep enough to keep things from freezing up at -20F?  The plan is for a 14'x24' with a loft and a buried and insulated cement block foundation with 6'+/- headroom for systems and storage.  Based on your experience and assuming it's properly insulated, would that be deep enough to keep things from freezing?

I also see you have a composting toilet... how do you like it?  Any recomendations?  What brand is it?  Is it suiting your needs as far as capacity?  How is maintenence to deal with?  I'm looking into a "Sun-Mar"... as long as it works as advertised, it looks like a good investment.  Most of the time it'll be 2-3 people with year-round use.

For now at least, I plan on putting a 250 gallon freshwater tank in the basement with 110V and 12V pumps to move the water.  A second 125 gallon greywater tank attached to some sort of drywell/drainfield.  Drinking water will be brought in from town and stored in the basement as necessary.  I'm hoping that with a little heat from the woodstove being piped down there it'll be enough to keep it thawed.

Everything else will be pretty straightforward, standard construction, 2x6 walls, good insulation, good windows, etc..  I've got a good certified woodstove, it'll be way too much for the space but it's what we've got to work with for now.  Also have a small propane heater for backup, 5 burner cooktop, propane fridge, etc., all the comforts of home.  Solar power and year round water will probably be next years project... for now it'll be fires for heat, generators for power, lanterns for light, and hopefully she won't have to tap out 1/2 way thru winter. 

Worst case scenario... she has to board up the windows, open the drains, lock up, and leave until spring.  I'm planning on having a couple of valves capable of emptying the system completely in minutes assuming it's not frozen.

Any other advice or tips you have for surviving the winters would be much appreciated

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 27, 2014, 01:35:23 PM
I wouldn't run any water lines less than 4 feet and would recommend deeper if possible unless you are down in the valley.  Where I am at it is not uncommon for lines buried 2-3 feet to freeze up in the winter if there is no snow cover.  In my case we ran all lines 4' down with a few exceptions (areas we couldn't get lower than 3' (maybe a little deeper) and I didn't have an issue last winter when it dropped to -20F.

Trucking in water can be a bear if the roads are bad but others do it also.  Just remember that for one person to fill up 250 gallons it would take a LONG time without a large tank on the back of a truck -- and if the weather is well below freezing it will be tough to fill said tank much less empty it.

A shower can take 5-10 gallons depending on how frugal you are (a shower head that shuts off can lower that to 3-4 if you take a 'Navy Shower') to figure that in if she works.  If she doesn't and plans to shut in most of the winter then showers can be less frequent thereby saving water.  However, living with a wood stove in a drier climate means keeping a large pot of water on the stove to put some humidity back into the cabin - at least 2 gallons a day (figure 3+ to be safe).  That same water can be used for washing dishes etc (hair) to save propane.

Make sure the grey water drain system is deep enough (put the main pipe feeding it down 3' or more if possible) and put a stock heater into the tank in case you have to thaw it out (mine works well for that).

The composting toilet must remain 50F or better to work properly and their site (Sunmar) has all the information you'd need on one.  If she is squeamish she might not like emptying it but otherwise it's no issue really.  Ours has treated us well but buy a pallet of chips for it to be sure and insulate the 4" vent to protect the 12v fan inside of it (from freezing up).

Septic is better if you are living there full time and can afford it.

Back up propane heaters are good for various reasons like:  when you are sick and don't have the energy to fire the wood stove up, when you first arrive after a time away and need to reheat the cabin, when you are gone for long periods to keep it above freezing.

Make sure the wood shed is close by and there is a place to put wood under cover right outside the door for those 20 below nights when it's dark and you just need a load of wood.

Consider solar porch lights / security lights

over estimate solar power needs -- then add 10%

I'll add more as I get time.
Erik
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Gary O on December 27, 2014, 08:30:34 PM
Y'know what's really cool?
Getting on the OJ thread after several months.
Pure inspiration.
cheers
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: nailit69 on December 27, 2014, 08:45:46 PM

I wouldn't run any water lines less than 4 feet and would recommend deeper if possible unless you are down in the valley.  Where I am at it is not uncommon for lines buried 2-3 feet to freeze up in the winter if there is no snow cover.  In my case we ran all lines 4' down with a few exceptions (areas we couldn't get lower than 3' (maybe a little deeper) and I didn't have an issue last winter when it dropped to -20F.

She's about 2500'.  Won't have any water lines buried until there's a legit well and we should have a piece of equipment when we do to at least install the line deep enough... 3-4' was my thought too.  Do you think that in a basement the lines will be likely to freeze if there's a heat source keeping things at 50-60F?

Trucking in water can be a bear if the roads are bad but others do it also.  Just remember that for one person to fill up 250 gallons it would take a LONG time without a large tank on the back of a truck -- and if the weather is well below freezing it will be tough to fill said tank much less empty it.

She'll have a 125 gal. transport tank in the truck to fill from.  She's used to a semi off grid lifestyle so collecting and conserving water is nothing new to her and she works from home so daily needs should be fairly low.  I figure she'll use 3-5 gallons a day for personal and dish use and will most likely pack in bottled water for drinking and cooking with... 250 gallons could potentially last for 90 days or more... maybe one more tank is in order

A shower can take 5-10 gallons depending on how frugal you are (a shower head that shuts off can lower that to 3-4 if you take a 'Navy Shower') to figure that in if she works.  If she doesn't and plans to shut in most of the winter then showers can be less frequent thereby saving water.  However, living with a wood stove in a drier climate means keeping a large pot of water on the stove to put some humidity back into the cabin - at least 2 gallons a day (figure 3+ to be safe).  That same water can be used for washing dishes etc (hair) to save propane.

Showers will be her call... she knows what a "spit bath" is.  A kettle on the woodstove is a must, you could use the water to clean with if it doesn't all boil away first... what about using snow for boiling/humidity?

Make sure the grey water drain system is deep enough (put the main pipe feeding it down 3' or more if possible) and put a stock heater into the tank in case you have to thaw it out (mine works well for that).

3' was going to be my minimum burial depth.  I'll be sure to put a stock heater in... never heard of one but makes perfect sense

The composting toilet must remain 50F or better to work properly and their site (Sunmar) has all the information you'd need on one.  If she is squeamish she might not like emptying it but otherwise it's no issue really.  Ours has treated us well but buy a pallet of chips for it to be sure and insulate the 4" vent to protect the 12v fan inside of it (from freezing up).

Septic is better if you are living there full time and can afford it. 

She'll have to tuff it out with the composter.  We can afford a septic as well as install it... i've done a few in my day, but I'd like to get a certificate of occupancy to possibly/potentially re-sell at some point so we'll probably wait on a septic system until then.

Back up propane heaters are good for various reasons like:  when you are sick and don't have the energy to fire the wood stove up, when you first arrive after a time away and need to reheat the cabin, when you are gone for long periods to keep it above freezing.

Backup heat we do have... small wall mounted unit w standing pilot and T-stat.  How much propane do you suppose it would take to maintain a 50F temperature over a long winter assuming nobody was there?  .

Make sure the wood shed is close by and there is a place to put wood under cover right outside the door for those 20 below nights when it's dark and you just need a load of wood.

Plenty of firewood stored nearby is a must... I/we live in a pretty small place now (600+ sq.ft.) and burn so we know and love firewood well.

Consider solar porch lights / security lights

Planning on security lights at each corner... probably on a remote start genny to up the commotion level in the event of an intruder... battery/solar for everything else.  She is well armed and knows her way around iron.

over estimate solar power needs -- then add 10%

0 experience with solar so i'm learning what I can.  I want to be able to have a system capable of running more than a few lights as well as charging electronics and running a TV now and again.

I'll add more as I get time.
Erik


Thanks for your input... looking forward to more
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 27, 2014, 09:22:49 PM
Occupancy permits in OK county require building to code with a permit.  The use of a composting toilet was not permitted without a full sized septic tank (ostensibly for grey water) with capacity for a 1500 square foot home.  So, to do a temp occupancy permit you must pull permits to build, have no running water (unless septic is installed) etc.  You can msg me for better details.

Keeping the basement 50-60 in the winter should be no problem with a wood stove above and if you can do that then there is no worry  I have mine set up so it isn't too hard to drain but I need to improve on that a little.  Basically if you can keep it drained then no worries.  Have heat tape on hand to thaw it if you don't get it completely drained when you return.

Melting snow takes countless hours and scoopfuls.  A 5 gallon bucket might yield half a gallon (not sure what it is exactly but it's not much) so after messing with that a while you'll give up unless desperate.

Would take a lot of propane to keep a cabin warm on propane alone with no one there over the entire winter but why do that?  Only time I left the heat on while living there in the winter was when I wouldn't be gone more than a couple weeks.  Then an 18000btu heater kept the place 50+ (and prevented freezing) and used about 25 gallons a week if memory serves (I'd have to go back and look).

I'd not want my genny to run if there was an intruder, but that's just me ;)  This ol jarhead prefers the quiet when dealing with 2 legged types...noise is good for the 4 legged ones though.

My solar setup does the trick for the most part and with the auto start genny, 500 gallon propane tank (really 400 gallon since you can only fill 80%) it handles the load I put on it 'ok' in the winter (genny runs daily when it's cloudy all the time).

For me, with fridge, tv, modem, laptop, cordless phone, led and cfl lights DVR etc I would be fine with 1000AH @ 24vdc and about 1000watts of solar charging power.  I'd still need the genny in the winter but experience has taught me that I am not too far off now with 660AH (GCB's so probably less really) and 615watts of solar.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: nailit69 on December 27, 2014, 10:08:42 PM

Occupancy permits in OK county require building to code with a permit.  The use of a composting toilet was not permitted without a full sized septic tank (ostensibly for grey water) with capacity for a 1500 square foot home.  So, to do a temp occupancy permit you must pull permits to build, have no running water (unless septic is installed) etc.  You can msg me for better details.

Not going there... i'll just do what I want... here we go with the typical permitting BS... LOL.  It'll be built to code... that's just how I do things, but i'm probably not getting a permit.  My Granfather always said "It was easier to ask for forgiveness than it was to ask for permission"

Keeping the basement 50-60 in the winter should be no problem with a wood stove above and if you can do that then there is no worry  I have mine set up so it isn't too hard to drain but I need to improve on that a little.  Basically if you can keep it drained then no worries.  Have heat tape on hand to thaw it if you don't get it completely drained when you return.

I think it'll be fine too.  I've done a lot of plumbing and can get almost every last drop of water out of my systems... P-traps w/drain plugs, low point drains, etc... a little heat tape cant hurt either.

Melting snow takes countless hours and scoopfuls.  A 5 gallon bucket might yield half a gallon (not sure what it is exactly but it's not much) so after messing with that a while you'll give up unless desperate.

She may have quite a bit of time on her hands over the winter to collect and melt snow... or just put a 5gal. pot full on the stove... haha

Would take a lot of propane to keep a cabin warm on propane alone with no one there over the entire winter but why do that?  Only time I left the heat on while living there in the winter was when I wouldn't be gone more than a couple weeks.  Then an 18000btu heater kept the place 50+ (and prevented freezing) and used about 25 gallons a week if memory serves (I'd have to go back and look).

Probably wouldn't be for more than a few days or more... just don't want to come back to havoc... been there, done that.

I'd not want my genny to run if there was an intruder, but that's just me ;)  This ol jarhead prefers the quiet when dealing with 2 legged types...noise is good for the 4 legged ones though.

I was speaking of 4 legged intruders... the 2 legged ones get the dogs, the night vision, the rifle, and absolute silence.  There's a couple of year round neighbors up there that seem very nice and I don't expect many 2 legged types up there.  But hey, i was a military raised boy scout (we did the coolest shit) and my old man taught jungle survival in the military so I generally go very prepared and/or ready to improvise if necessary.  We kind of live out in the boonies now so this is nothing new for us but want to get a little farther away from the city.

My solar setup does the trick for the most part and with the auto start genny, 500 gallon propane tank (really 400 gallon since you can only fill 80%) it handles the load I put on it 'ok' in the winter (genny runs daily when it's cloudy all the time).

For me, with fridge, tv, modem, laptop, cordless phone, led and cfl lights DVR etc I would be fine with 1000AH @ 24vdc and about 1000watts of solar charging power.  I'd still need the genny in the winter but experience has taught me that I am not too far off now with 660AH (GCB's so probably less really) and 615watts of solar.

WOW!  More than I had planned on running but that just about covers the full range of devices that can be run on solar.  I've got a line on a well equipped and ready to run 48V setup but it just seems to be more than I would ever use, and I don't have a firm price on it either and i'm guessing that kind of solar isn't all that cheap.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 28, 2014, 12:29:56 AM
48v would be better than 24v IMHO and all systems are tending to head that direction these days anyway.

The batteries are the big expense which is why I went with GCB's (Golf Cart Batteries)/ Solar panels run about $1/watt or less these days (specially for non-UL rated Blems at places like sunelec.com) so 1000watts is $1000 or less these days (plus shipping of course), then of course you need cables, combiner boxes, breakers etc etc...inverters like mine run about $1400 (4000 watt pure sine with 1200watt charger) and a controller for the panels runs about $600 and up....batteries can run $1000 for 12 GCB's to $3500+ for good solar batteries (more AH too) and the genny I run is about $3500 if I remember right...

Just to give you some ball parks.

I love the solar though.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: nailit69 on December 28, 2014, 09:42:56 AM
The setup this guy has for sale is 6 good sized panels (don't recall the wattage) 16 batteries (again, don't recall what type),  heated/insulated battery storage box, 2-5000w inverters, breaker panel, all associated wiring, manuals, backup genny, etc., claiming it was a 60a-220v setup.  That's a lot of solar power... hell, my on grid cabin now is 100a service.  Seemed like a boatload of power and equipment to transport and setup.

Like I said before, I have ZERO solar experience short of putting a solar charger on the gate opener... it was plug n play... not sure that counts as experience.  I don't know what to look for or what questions to ask.  I think solar will be a good project after the cabin is up and running. 

Is there any "special wiring" necessary for solar or does it work on standard 14ga. house wire?  I plan on wiring it like a normal house and plugging it into a genny for now but if I need anything special in the future i'd like to be ready for it.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 28, 2014, 11:55:13 PM
We have a forum topic here on off grid power which might help, and some pretty smart guys that I learned a lot from ;)

House wiring is standard, the solar power setup just replaces the utility power in an off-grid setup.  So think of it that way.

Without knowing more about that system none of us can really comment.

My system, which utilizes 3 205 watt 12v panels in series (using 10awg wire with connectors to match the panels and 10awg wire from the panels to the combiner box) feeds a charge controller which charges the battery bank.  The batteries supply power to the inverter which in turn provides the 120vac power to the cabin.  There are some good installers in the OK county area though, if you went that route.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: nailit69 on December 29, 2014, 09:08:05 AM
I'll look into it more after the cabin is done.  It's not going to happen this year... not in the budget... maybe that can be one for '16.

Thanks for the advice
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 29, 2014, 04:06:29 PM
Some time ago someone posted a link to making a soda can solar heater and I'm seriously considering this now.  I believe I can build a 48" x 72" 'heater' that mounts to the wall on the outside of the cabin and draws air from the floor inside the cabin through the wall and exhausts warm air out the top (which would be below the ceiling / loft floor.  My thought is that if I can get some solar heating to provide heat to the cabin in the winter particularly when I'm not there, it might keep the cabin a little warmer and perhaps even above freezing year round.  It wouldn't be a critical system, just something to provide additional heat during the winter when no one is around with the hope that I could keep the cabin warmer during the day without me being there.

Seems like they are pretty simple to build and very cheap but I don't drink pop for the most part and it might take me a long time to get the 200 cans or so that I'd need (maybe I can get the kids to save theirs).

Just something I'm pondering these days.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: UK4X4 on December 29, 2014, 06:28:58 PM
We had a south facing large window on our trailer, during the day we had 20 oC  inside with no heat on, outside was -20 at night but probably 10 oC  during the day in a sunny area
the window was single glazed, so at night all the heat exited as quick as it had come in...

Unless we got back and covered the windows with double bubble foil, the gained heat was swiftly lost

I think solar, radiant heated systems do function, but collecting and protecting the heat is difficult

How the system works, how the heat is distributed and stored, insulated is a pretty technical thermal guesstimate!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: nailit69 on December 29, 2014, 08:37:22 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on December 29, 2014, 04:06:29 PM
Some time ago someone posted a link to making a soda can solar heater and I'm seriously considering this now.  I believe I can build a 48" x 72" 'heater' that mounts to the wall on the outside of the cabin and draws air from the floor inside the cabin through the wall and exhausts warm air out the top (which would be below the ceiling / loft floor.  My thought is that if I can get some solar heating to provide heat to the cabin in the winter particularly when I'm not there, it might keep the cabin a little warmer and perhaps even above freezing year round.  It wouldn't be a critical system, just something to provide additional heat during the winter when no one is around with the hope that I could keep the cabin warmer during the day without me being there.

Seems like they are pretty simple to build and very cheap but I don't drink pop for the most part and it might take me a long time to get the 200 cans or so that I'd need (maybe I can get the kids to save theirs).

Just something I'm pondering these days.

I've seen that setup... i've got plenty of cans and i'm definitely going to build and test one... the unti I saw was pumping out 120F air with a small PC style fan drawing air into it during winter.  I want to experiment with all sorts of alternate energy sources... mostly for fun but if something works, use it.

Saw a home mede solar water heater that worked so well that water went in but only pure steam would come out the end.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: nailit69 on December 29, 2014, 09:32:14 PM
Quote from: UK4X4 on December 29, 2014, 06:28:58 PM
We had a south facing large window on our trailer, during the day we had 20 oC  inside with no heat on, outside was -20 at night but probably 10 oC  during the day in a sunny area
the window was single glazed, so at night all the heat exited as quick as it had come in...

Unless we got back and covered the windows with double bubble foil, the gained heat was swiftly lost

I think solar, radiant heated systems do function, but collecting and protecting the heat is difficult

How the system works, how the heat is distributed and stored, insulated is a pretty technical thermal guesstimate!

Double pane windows are the key piece... My cabin now has all double pane windows but before I installed the last 2 it would get so darn cold in here I had to run the heater almost non-stop... huge difference now that they're all in. 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 30, 2014, 08:43:40 AM
Insulation :)

My cabin has Low E windows which help a lot and we keep the curtains closed when gone (and the south facing ones are thick to keep the heat out in the summer.  The cabin doesn't lose heat quickly so I believe a properly set up solar heater might well help with the cabin inside temp.

Today, if the temp falls to -5 the cabin will eventually get down there or close to it.  The sun might warm it up some but it's well insulated and it takes more sun to do that than what's hitting it currently.  So, often enough anyway, I can arrive at the cabin and it's COLDER inside than out.  Not always of course, but it does happen and I think it's because there are a lot more hours of cooling than heating.

Most of the time, however it's slightly warmer.  The porch, which is only partly insulated (3 out of 4 walls -- no roof or floor insulation yet) is always 10 or more degrees warmer because it has three uncovered double pane windows.  The sun warms it up, and while it loses a lot of heat it always seems to only lose enough to be 10-12 degrees warmer than outside air (night/morning)....during the day it can be many degrees warmer.  So when I arrive a lot of the time I open the door to the porch and use it's heat to help heat the cabin ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: nailit69 on December 30, 2014, 09:36:05 AM
Ol'J

Do you stay up there year round or do you close up in the winter?  I'd love to spend a winter up there but I would also want to be more than prepared with plenty of supplies, firewood, a snowmobile, fuel, etc..  I spent a few years in Chicago so i've got a really good idea of how cold negative temps can be.  If I rathole some money over the summer I could certainly afford to be unemployed for the winter thus not having to leave the house everyday.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 30, 2014, 01:51:10 PM
I lived there full time from October of last year through to September of this year but my job changed a little and I now office in Moses Lake instead of Omak.  I still have an office in Omak though so go up every week or two and spend a few days.

I enjoyed my time living there and was pretty well set when I was there (back a few pages - or more - and you'll see posts from that time).  I had to commute 45 miles to work daily but it wasn't a bad drive and I was able to leave work early a lot or work from the cabin so it was pretty nice.  I also have a 50hp 4wd tractor and plow blade so I was able to keep the roads clear.  The place is well insulated now too and I didn't burn much wood.  There were some challenges but I was up for it :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: nailit69 on January 04, 2015, 09:31:42 AM
Well, it's official... the papers have been signed on a 20ac. piece of paradise up there in the Okanogan.  I'll have to start my own thread now... LOL ;).  I only wish this could have happened a few months earlier in the year... before winter.

My brother and I are chomping at the bit and want to get up there and start building something.  We've got trucks, a trailer, a Kubota tractor, a small Komatsu excavator, generators, tools, even some of the foundation materials ready to go. 

I'm going to guess that daytime highs only being in the upper 20s and the ground frozen solid, that those aren't the most ideal conditions to attempt to dig or build a foundation, just keeping the ground and the water for the cement thawed will be impractical if not impossible.

We're probably going to hold off on digging/building until spring when things thaw out and daytime highs get into the 40s or 50s... April or so hopefully.  How are things up there around April?

We do want to go back over soon and walk it again... we drove a VW Golf up there and only had about an hour to look around and talk w/the sellers rep the first time we were there... i'm thinking my 4x4 and a couple of days to look around and see what else is up there should be adequate this time.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 04, 2015, 03:20:17 PM
Lows in the mid 20's right now but the ground is always hard as a rock this time of year...frozen solid.  Like concrete.  I wouldn't contemplating digging unless I planned a big burn first and concrete now is almost out of the question.

Best bet is to wait.  4x4 with good chains depending on location/roads etc.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 07, 2015, 02:49:25 PM
Looking forward to seeing the cabin this week :)  Heading out to spend a long weekend there and work in Omak.  I'm expecting some snow but it sounds like the foot plus we had mostly melted in the Chinook that blew in.  Guess I'll find out when I arrive.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: nailit69 on January 07, 2015, 09:06:39 PM
Let me know how things are over there... I'm thinking about heading back over next weekend to look around if I can swing it.  I've got an interview with the county I live in now for a nice office job (Plans Examiner) so i'll have to work around that.  Steady pay with paid time off and 28 paid vacation and personal days each yr... my sister works in the same dept. so I have an insider, lol.  Just might get this old(ish) carpenter out off the jobsite yet.  I'll miss it... just not that much  ;).  Actually i'll miss it alot... just not always having to hustle up work and making sure I get paid ontime.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 08, 2015, 08:41:38 AM
Nothing wrong with a good staying paying job ;)

I'll post some updates from the cabin :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 08, 2015, 06:32:32 PM
Arrived safely at the cabin

It's about 32 degrees out and the snow is only a few inches deep now (hd more I'm told but melted in a Chinook). The roads were pretty good and when I arrived the cabin power was at 26vdc so nicely charged up however the generator battery was dead and I'm waiting for it to be charged enough to get it running now.

Inside cabin temp was 39F when I arrived and it's now up to about 52F so rising nicely. While waiting for the cabin to warm up I managed to get most of the driveway plowed so it will be much better to drive on specially if it snows this weekend.

Next up is to check the game cams and see if the genny will start. Then with the cabin temp rising I'll turn the water on and cross my fingers and finally bring in some wood for the stove and think about making some dinner

So far all is well and it looks like a great time to be at the cabin.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 08, 2015, 06:34:14 PM
Happy to report the generator fired up on the 2nd try and is charging the bank and providing power.  Also happy to note that I have running water too :)

This weekend I'll replace the broken water heater with my spare and I'll run the heater in the grey water tank so I can use the sinks etc and take a shower :)

Life is good when you have power, water, heat and good food and drink when at the cabin :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: nailit69 on January 08, 2015, 08:26:34 PM
Glad to hear things are generally in order up there... makes me feel better about the average winter east of the mountains.  I'm picturing scenes from "Life Below Zero" everytime I show up but it doesn't sound to bad (most of the time)... once I have a foothold up there I think we'll be fine.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 09, 2015, 07:21:29 PM
It's quite doable :)  My neighbor has been off the grid and living full time up here for over 30 years!

Day two at the cabin and getting it warmed up after being gone at work all day.  It was a reasonable 60F degrees inside so that's good and fortunately the generator didn't run all day either (not since this morning) so I'm feeling better about that for sure.

Power is at 23.7vdc with about a 90 watt draw on the system and showing 96% of capacity on the meter.  I'll probably set the generator to run soon and set it to run 5 hours so the bank gets a good solid charge and than hopefully the batteries will hold all night (I think they will since they held through the day though there would have been at least a little solar charging going on).

Perhaps tomorrow I might put some insulation in the porch roof which should help it stay warmer during the day which will allow the batteries to provide more capacity.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 09, 2015, 07:39:50 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Winter_zps43e9d48e.jpg)
How things looked when I arrived.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Porch_zps37014bbb.jpg)
Since much of the snow melted it was easy to clean off the deck

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Plowed_zps1efb4170.jpg)
Got the driveway plowed

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Dec2014_zpsd9636d1a.jpg)
Game cam pick -- oh how I want to see this guy during hunting season! lol

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Coyote_zpsa146bef4.jpg)
Yote(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Plowing_zps9422f575.jpg)
Caught on the game cam plowing

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: nailit69 on January 10, 2015, 08:46:06 AM
Sure does look peaceful up there.  Can't wait to get back over there. 

I remember when I first moved out where i'm at now...it was so quiet, and peaceful.  I live "out of town" a few miles on a lake at the end of a dead end rd. which is off the end of another dead end rd. and while it's pretty quiet out here most of the time, I have neighbors... 20' each side of me and a rd. across the lake that gets busier by the day.  Winters are pretty quiet out here... summertime is chaos on the water, really popular place for wakeboard boats and jetskis. 

Since I moved in 8 yrs ago, the (only) next door neighbor kid is now an adult and there's a whole new batch of kids from 5-13 that run around on the previously quiet street, the neighbor a few houses up has 2 pre-teen sons that just got new dirtbikes for X-mas and things are getting a bit noisy and crowded for me.  Don't get me wrong... I love the kids... love the boats... love the dirtbikes... love the neighbors, most of them anyway but it's just a little busy for me.

Last summer we did have some suspicious (drug) activity and a few cars were prowled, presumably by the sh!tbags that rent a summer cabin a few doors down (pretty sure it was them)... first time in years i've worried about locking my doors.  We (the neighbors) made it very clear that would not be tolerated in any way, shape, or form... they left 2 weeks later.  Being raised in the country I never even took the keys out of the car, now I have to remember to lock the doors and nail down anything that might grow legs and walk away... my shed is on constant lockdown which is where my dryer is and with a load of laundry in my arms, it can be a PITA if I forget to unlock the door.

I'm ready to get away ...

 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 10, 2015, 11:01:39 AM
Ahhh yes peace :)  My nearest neighbor is about half a mile as the crow flies ;)  I had dinner and drinks with them last night too :)  I have great neighbors all around and while we'll all help each other and get together quite a bit we also have our own places to tend etc and spend a lot of time alone on our land.  It's a good place to be :)

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 10, 2015, 11:17:36 AM
So, I left for work at 6am yesterday and dreaded what might happen throughout the day while I was gone.  My power was good at 24.85vdc but the genny had run for 2 hrs in the middle of the night early morning (I shut it off at 5am).

When I returned, envisioning my generator running all day because I thought the battery bank was dying a fast death on me I was pleasantly surprised to see it had not run in the 9+ hours I was away and while there was some solar charging during the day (very little with the clouds and fog we had all day) my batteries were as mentioned above at about 24.4v.  Around 23.5v I set the genny to run (just changed the auto start setting to 23.5v) and adjusted it to run a full 5 hours.  I had a great dinner and visit with neighbors and returned to a nice quiet evening in the cabin (minus the genny which is actually very quiet).  The batteries were already in float so I knew it had taken a decent charge.

This morning the bank was at 24.3vdc after 9 hrs through the night (fridge, inverter, fans running) and while this is not really good considering I'm supposed to have 3 days worth of reserve power I realize that my badly abused batteries which are now 5 years old, are doing ok all things considered.

Using Don's PV calculator I'm using approximately 10,228 watt hours per week of AC power and 13,440 watt hours of DC power.  On a 24v system with 3 days of reserve and 40F where the batteries are (which is close to what it was during the day anyway) and using 220AH GCB's the calculator tells me I need 12 batteries (8 would do) to meet my needs.  I've worked this calculator over a LOT and plan to work on some of the figures a little more but I think the 660AH's it tells me I need is probably pretty accurate.

Next using 4 hours of solar charging per day and my 205watt panels it tells me I need 4 panels to keep up with charging demands.

So, in theory my system is pretty close to what I need considering I went through a lot of changes to it and to it's intended use (vacation cabin use to full time living use).  My plan moving forward is to increase solar production by at least buying something in the 300watt range (times 3) and replacing my 205watt panels (which I'll save for a time when I can add another MPPT controller and use them also) and get new batteries like some Trojan L16's which I intend to NOT abuse LOL

Truth is I read recently that a lot of solar builders recommend using GCB's first for new solar users because they are cheap and you'll likely damage them in the learning process and I can't disagree really.  After all, I've let mine drop to pretty much 100% discharge at least 3 times in the last 5 years.

Guess I should be happy that they are still holding the 9hrs under use! LOL
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 10, 2015, 11:25:29 AM
Just changed the PV Calc to use Trojan L-16-RE-B 6V, 370AH (20HR) batteries and it gives me 8 batteries to meet my needs (740AH vs the 660AH I have in theory now) which I think is probably just right.

My thought is that these batteries will last a LOT longer (they are about twice the size of my GCB's) and the increased AH's will probably be noticed a LOT more because it's likely more accurate than the GCB's rating (I've read that the GCB's aren't rated as well -- quality control type thing -- and that you have take their 220AH rating with a grain of salt but I don't know).

So for about $3000 I can put in 740AH of L16's which should give me 3 days of battery reserve before I hit the 80% level and the generator needs to come on.

I'll have to start planning to do that this spring -- one added benefit is that 8 batteries will take up less footprint than the 12 I have now since the L16's have the same footprint (more or less) than the GCB's, they are just taller.  With that bonus it will be easier to install them in the back room where I can keep them around 50F in the colder months and 70F in the hottest months.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 10, 2015, 11:30:24 AM
Interesting.  A little searching and I found some 420AH L16's for 319ea.  So for a little over $2500 I could have 840AH of reserve...doesn't sound like a bad thing ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 10, 2015, 11:47:57 AM
Just looking at some Rolls-Surettes and comparing them to the L16's and it appears the Trojans have a much higher cycle rating.  Rolls shows about (looking at graph) 2000 cycles on their graph at 20% of discharge and Torjans show 4000 cycles.

Batteries compared:
Trojan L16RE-B 370Ah, 6V Deep Cycle Battery vs Rolls S-550 428AH, 6V Deep Cycle Battery.

Price of the Rolls was $340 s $348 for the Trojan (just on these websites).  I looked at the data specs for both and the Rolls was 123lbs vs 118lbs for the Trojan.

I find it interesting that batteries that close in weight, size etc (AH rating wasn't that close though) would have such different cycle ratings.

Either way, it appears the trojan may be a better battery overall as it should last longer if it can cycle 4000 times at 20% discharge.  That's 10yrs worth of use assuming no abuse and maintain that level  discharge.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 10, 2015, 11:53:45 AM
Woke up to the sound snow and once the light was bright enough I saw that we'd gotten a very light skiff of snow on the ground.  Hopefully it won't snow around 10am to 2pm as I could use some solar production specially on the well as my cistern is starting to run dry and I've not pumped into it in a while since I shut off the pump a couple months ago to protect the system during the coldest weather when I am not here.
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Snowing_zpsd3905a0f.jpg)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 10, 2015, 12:48:52 PM
time (UTC)   Flags   Vb_max_daily   Vb_min_daily   Va_max_daily   Pout_max_daily   Ahc_daily   Whc_daily
2014-12-09T15:27:46.000+00:00   no flags   26.04   23.98   68.81   3774   14.6   370
2014-12-10T15:27:46.000+00:00   no flags   24.59   23.44   63.59   459   1.8   50
2014-12-11T15:27:46.000+00:00   no flags   24.95   21.97   65.41   1278   5.1   120
2014-12-12T15:27:46.000+00:00   no flags   22.68   22.1   61.51   168   0.9   20
2014-12-13T15:27:46.000+00:00   no flags   24.19   21.86   65.52   718   7   170
2014-12-14T15:27:46.000+00:00   no flags   27.15   21.86   70.25   5062   19.1   490
2014-12-15T15:27:46.000+00:00   no flags   27.66   21.78   70.94   5195   19   490
2014-12-16T15:27:46.000+00:00   no flags   28.22   22.24   70.77   5226   20.7   540
2014-12-17T15:27:46.000+00:00   no flags   24.98   21.3   65.56   497   6.4   160
2014-12-18T15:27:46.000+00:00   no flags   23.05   21.31   65.6   434   4.1   100
2014-12-19T15:27:46.000+00:00   no flags   23.55   19.7   65.18   576   5.2   120
2014-12-20T15:27:46.000+00:00   no flags   25.98   19.82   69.01   4430   17.1   420
2014-12-21T15:27:46.000+00:00   no flags   23.71   22.12   65.43   583   3.3   70
2014-12-22T15:27:46.000+00:00   no flags   28.03   21.77   69.69   5624   17.7   460
2014-12-23T15:27:46.000+00:00   no flags   28.21   21.61   70.31   5208   18.3   480
2014-12-24T15:27:46.000+00:00   no flags   25.72   21.44   67.81   1487   9   220
2014-12-25T15:27:46.000+00:00   no flags   23.34   19.65   64.19   397   5.7   140
2014-12-26T15:27:46.000+00:00   no flags   29.09   19.84   70.16   6231   24.4   630
2014-12-27T15:27:46.000+00:00   no flags   28.99   21.91   70.48   4790   22   580
2014-12-28T15:27:46.000+00:00   no flags   25.04   19.68   65.25   525   6   150
2014-12-29T15:27:46.000+00:00   no flags   28.39   19.82   70.48   5015   16.1   410
2014-12-30T15:27:46.000+00:00   no flags   23.54   19.63   70.87   1492   3.9   90
2014-12-31T15:27:46.000+00:00   no flags   25.84   19.75   71.66   1771   8.2   190
2015-01-01T15:27:46.000+00:00   no flags   28.1   19.72   71.6   2944   13   340
2015-01-02T15:27:46.000+00:00   no flags   30.1   19.71   71.24   4191   26.7   720
2015-01-03T15:27:46.000+00:00   no flags   26.02   21.44   71.09   2203   11.3   290
2015-01-04T15:27:46.000+00:00   no flags   29.91   21.66   71.05   4244   19.2   490
2015-01-05T15:27:46.000+00:00   no flags   22.14   19.65   58.78   57   0.2   10
2015-01-06T15:27:46.000+00:00   no flags   25.59   19.74   67.52   1740   9.5   230
2015-01-07T15:27:46.000+00:00   no flags   23.43   19.81   64.08   395   3.7   80
2015-01-08T15:27:46.000+00:00   no flags   28.65   19.8   70.07   5851   21.1   550
2015-01-09T15:27:46.000+00:00   no flags   30.04   21.94   70.69   4554   25   640
2015-01-10T15:27:46.000+00:00   no flags   30.01   22.08   68.41   1187   19.1   480
2015-01-10T17:27:46.000+00:00   no flags   30.01   26.55   61.7   181   0.3   10

If you an read his it is the logs from my charge controller over he last month and clearly shows the problem (and the reason it's better to buy GCB's when you start out perhaps).  Obviously leaving my inverter in sleep mode was a big mistake as it drew enough power (I guess) to draw the batteries down to 19.6vdc on several occasions.  Looking at the logs I had no (0) absorption time and no float time so what little charging I got was in bulk/boost only and wasn't enough to get the battery bank back to 100%.  I also see that despite setting my auto gen start to come on at 23vdc the controller is actually seeing 22v so something is strange there and I'll have to see if I can determine which meter is right.  I suspect the auto start is though as I was looking at it last night when I kicked on the generator and power was at 23.7vdc not the low of 22.08 shown.  Strange, but then this is my second Morningstar controller and I see it's also freaking out over the cold weather like the first one did (showing temps of 255c on the coldest days).  Morningstar support sucks and I'll never buy another of these.  Chances are I'll buy an Outback and stick this one in the back of the closet as a spare incase I'm desperate some day.

Anyway, clearly the batteries have cycled down to pretty much 0% of charge several times just in the last month so I'm calling them shot.  Sure they hold for 8-10hrs under use but they should hold for 2-3 days under use after a complete charging cycle.  I'll take some SG readings today to see what they look like also since I've been running the gen all morning.  Perhaps an equalize will help a little but frankly I think I've killed these puppies.

note to self:  Just shut down all power when you leave the cabin and let the batteries rest/charge/rest while you're gone.  At least then you'll know they won't get killed in your absence.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on January 10, 2015, 01:49:51 PM
Wow.  I wish I could get up to my place more - especially this winter.  You're making me green  ;)

The good news is that when things warm up I'll be able to finish the place and then I'm going up whenever I can.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 10, 2015, 06:44:09 PM
In time you may be able to :)  Just a matter of funds!  Fortunately my wife and I have been fortunate enough to be able to afford a tractor to plow the roads and our location is close enough that we can walk in the last 1/4 mile or so if roads are bad.  Heck, we could walk that last couple miles if need be but that would be a challenge in very bad conditions unless we had snowshoes.

I spent part of the day shooting with a neighbor and am happy to report I can still hit the broad side of the barn without my reading glasses ;)  With them I can hit the doorknob of the barn door at 15 yards but I can't see anything past the front sight so it's a bit of a challenge. 

I then went out and plowed the last section of my driveway and put down a few bags of icemelt then plowed again.  The road is now much nicer to drive up and there is less 'pucker factor' on the steepest section ;)

Cabin is VERY warm and I'm not in the mood to do much so I think I'll read a little and see what the neighbors are doing later (I was invited to watch the game but don't watch sports so did the shooting and plowing instead).
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 10, 2015, 08:10:45 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/NewLight_zps37636754.jpg)
Finally got around to installing this new light fixture & light.  It's a 9.4watt LED (that really uses 10 watts) and I'm pretty happy with it.

On a side note my 9.2 watt LED bulbs actually use 9.4 watts so they appear a little more efficient but either one is better than the 13 or 18 watt CFL's.  In fact, with these LED's I can run TWO of them at the same wattage as one 18 watt CFL (give or take).  I'm pretty happy with that.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 11, 2015, 08:47:31 PM
Looks like a young cougar decided to sniff me out today.  I had no idea it was here an even heard it when it went under the cabin I think (had a couple odd bumps under the area where my bed is but figured I was hearing things or snow was falling off the porch...that aint 'snow tracks batman!

It picked up my trail near the well and followed me back to the cabin, then wandered all around and under the cabin looking for me.  Even came up onto the porch to peak in the window.  My guess is that I was too busy reading, doing dishes or shaving when it came by...I hadn't been in that long either so I'm guessing I was just an hour or so ahead of it.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Cougartrack_zpsd99b2702.jpg)

I should note that at first I thought "wolf or dog" but considered cougar too.  When I started looking at pics online and reading about the differences I realized this was a cat.

I did a little target practice on a stump with my .45 to let the kitty know I was on TOP of the food chain so to 'p!$$ off.  My guess is it is long gone now which would be good as I'd rather not have to deal with it in the dark tomorrow when I head out.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 11, 2015, 10:33:35 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Cougarpaw_zps06f556aa.jpg)
Classic cougar paw!  You can clearly see the three lobes at the base of the paw.  A dead give-away for a cougar.

We think there are TWO!  Strange that a mother would bring her cub on the hunt for a man???  I find that odd really as you'd think she would be telling it to stay clear of man.  Either way, we found two sets of prints, one much smaller than the other -- oh, I said WE but didn't explain:  my neighbor came of to cover my 6 while I was out turning off the water, putting memory cards in game cams and generally checking the place out.  In the process we saw many many prints all over the flipping place!  Seems these cats are pretty hungry or they wouldn't have pent so much time going over every inch of my place.  They must have spent hours watching me and sniffing about.

Makes me wonder now just how long they have been about???

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Cougarmud3_zpse879d51e.jpg)
This is one of the bigger prints.  Neither however is very big so I'm guessing the bigger cat is not much over 100 punds if that and the smaller one is probably the size of a small dog.

Incidentally both of those prints were taken by the generator, one in the snow in front of it and the other where the exhaust melts the snow into mud.  One of them also walked between the genny and the cabin which is just perhaps 12 inches of space...they walked between the shed tend and a pile of wood and all sorts of other places that would hide them as they moved about.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 11, 2015, 11:59:25 PM
The plan tomorrow is to turn off the generator though it won't make much difference.  Only way to prevent the battery from dying is to disconnect it and then of course the system will be down hard but it might protect the battery from dying like it did this time.

Once that's done I'll shut the inverter off too and leave the batteries to power the fans in the back which don't draw much power, then at least I should have full power when I return and at least the batteries won't die while I'm gone.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Texas Tornado on January 12, 2015, 06:12:22 PM
We had a momma bring her baby to our place, lived here for a long while, she had real odd behavior and would mark our house and trees, she slept on our back deck and had a habit of following me all over the place, she did not show any aggressive behavior and kept a decent amount of real estate between us on my walks. Game warden and I discussed it in length and he suspected she had been hand raised and turned loose when she got to expensive to feed.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 13, 2015, 03:07:04 PM
My neighbor went in and disconnected the ground on my generator to save the battery for me.  Now I need to think about doing something for the batteries to get them to hang in there for a few more months
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 13, 2015, 06:00:45 PM
BRAIN FART!  d* d* d*

Working on what my battery requirements are I realized I'd made a BIG mistake when using the PV Calculator!  I'd left the depth of discharge set to 0.8 which mean an 80% DISCHARGE!  Not the 20% (80% of cap) I'd thought I'd input.....meaning I need a LOT more battery capacity than previously thought.

No wondering I'm having all sorts of issues  d* d* d*
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 13, 2015, 06:15:15 PM
Between Trojan's site and the PV Calculator I have concluded that I should at least consider the Trojan L16B 370AH battery and two strings which gives me 740AH of capacity and seriously look at my power consumption.  In reality to get just two days without sun I'd need a lot more capacity (1310AH) which would mean changing to 2v batteries and spending a LOT more money.

Seems I now understand what my problem was:  way too little capacity.

Fortunately I don't live at the cabin and can size the battery bank to 1 day autonomy since I don't mind the generator running once a day on days with no sun and as we only get 14 inches of rain a year that vast majority of time at the cabin it will be sunny (pretty much never need the generator in the summer even with my small bank).

So ya, I have a lot of thinking to do.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on January 14, 2015, 08:31:42 AM
Last time up at my place we saw some cat track and scat.  Seems to be a bit more of them this year than I remember in years past.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 15, 2015, 02:34:30 PM
Did some reading and it appears my battery bank did fine last year and ran as much as 3 days before dropping to 24v and kicking on the generator.  I think I might have set the genny to come on too late over this year and thus allowed the batteries to drain too much, thereby reducing their life.  Today they drop so fast the genny runs daily.

I was thinking that if I used 140AH of power in a day then I'd need 420AH of reserve power ABOVE the level I'm willing to drop to in that three days to give me the right amount of power reserve.

On that same vein, if the Trimetric meter reads a draw of 140AH on a 660AH system it should be at 60% of capacity regardless of what the voltage reads.  Conversely if it was reading 90% at 24vdc than I must assume the draw was only 66AH or 10% of rated cap.  This makes sense to me when thinking of the battery bank like a tank of water.  If there is 55 gallons in the tank and I use 5.5 gallons I have 90% of cap regardless of what the water level shows (voltage).  So perhaps that's the sort of thing they were trying to explain about meters that show a percentage.

I believe, since I had the gen start at 24v previously and it seemed to work well, that had I left it there it would have been fine.  The strange thing is that's the highest voltage the auto start will allow me to set it to.  Perhaps because they know that if the bank were left for 6+ hours it would recover to a much higher voltage thus matching the voltage of the bank at the rated percentage.  I'll have to conduct an experiment there.

My thought now is that I need to look at the Trojan L16's and go with the 740AH bank I'd planned, then set the genny to run at 24v and if it runs daily in cloudy low light days so beit.  Better to burn propane than replace the batteries in a few years.

Perhaps I should do some math ;)  My gen uses about 1/2 gallon of propane per hour and seems to do fine running for 3hrs at a time.  So if it ran 3hrs per day for 21 days per month November through February but only 10 days in Oct and Mar and rarely afterwards then I can calculate a rough estimate of 272 gallons of propane in the winter months (most likely well over but better to be liberal here) which would cost me about $550 a year in propane to run the generator.  In actuality I've only used 150 gallons so far this year and most of that for my heater but I'm doing a worst case scenerio to see what happens dollar wise.

So $550 a year in propane vs a 3rd string of batteries ($1400) means I'd not save a dime building the smaller battery bank if I lived at the cabin year round.  Hmmmm

On the other hand if it runs only every 3 days for 6 months of the year that's about 183 gallons of propane or $368 (67% of the above).  Still more expensive to use propane.

I might have to think about getting the 740AH bank and planning on added a 3rd string a year later.  After all, I made it fine with GCB's and approx 660AH of cap last winter so I think, in reality I could get by with the 740AH specially if I didn't run the TV at all.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 20, 2015, 08:49:52 AM
Research research research   ???

I've spent plenty of time yapping and typing and reading about systems like mine and have concluded that 740AH to 1110AH is about right for my needs and location.  If I was living at the cabin I'd want the 1110AH but I'm just not living there anymore so at least for the next year or less I'm going with 740AH which will not only be more than I had before but likely a lot more considering the GCB's may not be that accurate.

I'm also going to plan on adding possibly 4 of these: http://sunelec.com/solar-panels/24v-solar-panels/astronergy-310w-solar-panel.html which when combined with my 3 205 watt panels should give me all the solar I need to keep the bank topped off when in use.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 21, 2015, 02:10:39 PM
Heading back up tomorrow :)  Always enjoy being at the cabin specially if I get something done other than just hanging out and enjoying the peace.  This trip I plan to do two things:

1.  Add Charge It to by batteries.  I know many say it doesn't work but I figured that since they barely manage to make it 9-10 hrs under moderate use (maybe 30ah of use) and I plan to replace them soon I might as well see if the stuff helps them survive until March/April when I plan to get new ones.  Worst case it doesn't work at all and I wasted the small amount of money to try it.  Best case they survive a few more months and I run the genny less.  I'll report back on what I find.

2.  Work in the loft to get some paneling installed.  This will be a change for me since I haven't done it in a while and I have to move from installing 8' lengths (when I had help) to shorter lengths (4').  I find trying to do 8 footers alone was just too much hassle so decided to shorten them up and try 4 foot sections.  With luck it will go well.

On that note I must admit one of the drawbacks is that I have to move the saw and vacuum into the loft and while I can clean up the mess it just gets pretty dusty when I run the mitre saw inside the cabin....ahhh well ;)  Cabin Life!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 23, 2015, 08:39:19 AM
Back at the cabin and all is well :)  No obvious cougar tracks and no cougar pics on the cams (must have left after I set them -- bugger).

Got to the cabin with a little pucker factor as the snow was deeper and a little wet (34F out) so it was a bit slippy even with 4WD and Studded tires but I managed and was happy to get to the cabin earlier enough to get stuff done while it was still daylight out.

First step was to add ChargeIt to the batteries.  I started by added 3.5oz ea (2oz if for car batteries so I guessed GCB's are about double the electrolyte) but after the 1st 4 realized two bottles wasn't enough so dialled it down to 2oz each for the rest.  However I noticed before (and again this time) that the sulfation is most prevalent on just some of the batteries, not all so made sure those got more juice in hopes that it would help them a bit.  The bank was 27.7v when I arrived so the sun was doing it's job through the clouds even at 3pm.

While leaving the bank sit (inverter off) I went out and hooked the neg term back up to the genny and reprogrammed it, then came back to the batteries and kicked on the inverter (says to give them 20 mins if possible but that's to wait before trying to start a car so I wasn't worried and it was 20 mins).

Next up was to get the cabin warm and bring my trash in.  I'd already turned on the propane heater and now started the wood stove.  With it going I dragged in my stuff and since I'd already started my tractor went out to try to drive my truck up the hill to forward my work phone (cell) to the cabin.  Then promptly got stopped due to the snow and had to back up, turn around and head back to the cabin for the tractor (hence starting it right away to give it a chance to warm up).

Got the road plowed to 'cell phone point' (also known as 'buck knob'), made my call to forward my phone and then jumped back on the tractor and plowed my driveway out so I'd not have trouble tomorrow (today).

With all that done I invited the neighbors over and began to finish unloading.  By the time they arrived I was moved it and it was 70F inside the cabin :)  When they left we turned off the genny (I'd had it running since 3:30pm and it was now 7:30) and turned on my water which ran nicely in the bathroom :)  Life is good.

After the neighbors were gone I reset my Battery Monitor to use 420AH of cap instead of the 660AH the batteries would have at 70F.  Now at least it should be closer to what they have when it's 32F in the battery room.  I then set to checking the amp draw on the place and found:

The inverter, fans and one light (LED) draw 3.1Amps, turning off the light shows 2.9Amps so that's my baseline.  In 24hrs I will use 70AH (I rounded up) of capacity just with fans an the inverter running (and 24-12v converter).  Next I checked when the Fridge ran and it used 5Amps and ran for 10 minutes then shut off and went 1 1/2hrs before coming on again, ran for 10 minutes and waited another 90 before coming on again.  I can surmise from that that it will run 16 times in a 24hr period and use 13.33AH a day.  So with my Fridge running as well as the inverter, fans etc I will use ~84AH of battery cap.  Assuming the bank is fully charged at 3pm (which it appeared to be yesterday) then I can figure I'd use that 84AH if I do nothing else in 24hrs and that the ~420AH battery bank (at 32F) would be drawn down 20% at which time I should kick on the genny to recharge.

On a side note the bank normally sits around 42-45F during the day in the winter and dips to 32 at night which is why I chose 32F as my set point for % of cap.

While I checked other measures and will note them later it's clear to me that in the winter when it's cold out and the sun is low on the horizon I'd better plan on running the generator at least daily but that it won't take but a couple hours of running to top off the bank.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 23, 2015, 12:57:11 PM
Using my latest figures (from watching the amp draw off the bank while turning on lights etc and when the fridge ran) I was able to recalc my PV spreadsheet.  I also set the temp value to 50F as I think I can keep the batteries there in the winter with my plans for passive solar heat etc.  With the latest research on loads etc here is what the PV Calc shows me:

740AH will work fine as I should only need 720AH to go three days without charging and be at 50%.  My goal isn't to get to 50% very often, if at all but I wanted to see what I could do with 3 days autonomy and this would work.

I would need 4 9amp panels according to the calc spreadsheet.

This was with two hours of TV and internet per day which is a little heavier that I typically use but I like to be cautious.  I think my plans will work very nicely and I should be able to limit the gen run time to about 3 hours every 2-3 days in the winter.  I can live with that :)

It shouldn't run at all in the summer :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 24, 2015, 10:55:44 AM
OK, starting to learn more and more but still much to learn. 

Arrived at the cabin just before 6pm last night (long day at work) and the generator was running.  Not having any idea how long it had been running I set the dial to 5hrs because I knew I'd want to abuse the power with it on (cabin runs off the genset when it's running) and figured it wouldn't hurt to run an extra hour or two to float the batteries a while.

I didn't really abuse the power much but left the gen running until about 10 PM (maybe 9:30 - should have written it down) and went to bed later having checked the voltage but not recording it (I swear I did but can't find it now).

This morning the voltage read 23.9v at 7am and I did some calcs based on previous findings as well as some checks last night and figured I'd used 35AH overnight.  I then checked the meter and it read 92% of cap based on 420AH I set it at.  I then did some quick math an came up with this:  420AH - 35AH = 385AH and 385AH = ~92% of 420AH

So the meter reads the amp draw over time and shows percent of capacity based on the setting you gave and the amount drawn from the system over time.  Makes sense to me now actually and should be a good indicator of actual capacity under use than voltage or PG readings are since both are inaccurate unless the bank has been sitting completely idle for at least 6 hours (preferably 24hrs according to Trojan and Trimetric both).

Now, had the batteries been sitting idle for at least 6 hours and remained at the 23.9v then the bank would be 60% discharged not the 8% calculated.

This appears to be where the biggest confusion is as to where to set ones generator to run and has been the center of many discussions on these boards for some time.  If you set the generator to come on at 24v which I originally did because I assumed that at 24v I would be about 50% DOD (depth of discharge) which I didn't want to go beyond and because I could not set the switch to start higher, than according to Magnum Research, AIMS Manufacturing, TriMetric and even Trojan you're setting the switch too high for a system under load and overusing your generator.

Magnum and AIMS both said something on the order of 22.5 would be quite safe but I honesty couldn't wrap my head around it because I've never draw the bank down to that voltage and then stopped charging/discharging and let it sit long enough to check voltages and SG readings to see what happens.  By extrapolation it sounds like what should happen (should being the operative word) is that the batteries should recover a fair amount of voltage and sit much closer to 50% DOD instead of the 100% you'd think.  Note:  23.02v on a Trojan T105 is 90% DOD for open circuit voltage and after a rest.  Their note reads:  For accurate voltage readings, batteries must remain idle (no charging - no discharging) for at least 6 hrs, preferably 24hrs.

I think this is the key to much confusion.

So at this point I at least understand how the meter works and can understand what I'm reading now and can at least adjust the meter to tell me the percentage of cap remaining based on a battery bank at the lowest temperature I'm likely to see while here.  Meaning that even though I should have 660AH of capacity if the bank drops to 32 degrees Trojan tells me their GCB's are at 65% of cap which in this case would be 420AH.  So by doing this I can set my generator to come on at 85% of cap (it's a voltage setting but I can watch the cap % drop until it hits that 85%) of a battery bank my size at 32F and I should (should again being operative here) be safe and not abusing the bank too much.

Of course I have to consider that the bank is likely sulfated a fair amount and even with 'Charge It' in the system it's undoubtedly at lower cap than I think unless a good EQ charge and the Charge It works to get rid of most of the crystals.

Today I plan to disconnect the battery bank once it's charged up and I'm ready to do something else, and let it sit for 6hrs, then I'll check the SG readings and voltages for each battery (and record them) and see where it's at and if it's really out of whack.  Next I'll equalize the system and see what that does to overall performance.

What am I looking for here?  I'm looking for good and even SG readings and a bank that shows 25.46v after a 6hr rest an having been fully charged.

Somehow I doubt I'll get it but then who knows?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 24, 2015, 11:34:11 AM
OK, messing with the Tr-Metric meter I set it a little closer to what I think it should be.

1.  Charged setpoint voltage:  29.2v (Based on the absorption charge target of 29.6v from Trojan's T105 Battery -- no I don't have T105's but they are the closest I could find to my Costco GCB's)
2.  Charged setpoint Amps:  10Amps (this one is tricky and is set at 2% of battery bank AH cap which I changed to 490AH based on 40-45F which the bank sits at most of the time)
3.  Battery Capacity in AH:  490 (Yes I changed from the 32F above but after thinking about it realized they are staying at 40+ most of the time now and will likely.  Of course, this is not the 660AH they are supposed to be so I might be doing this wrong but we'll see).
4.  Primary Display:  Amps (vs Watts)
5.  Days before 'time to recharge':  set to the recommended 5
6.  Days to Equalize:  OFF
7.  Operation Level:  L1 (this one I need to investigate next).
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 24, 2015, 12:50:43 PM
According tot he historical data on my Tri-Metric meter (which I've only just checked for the 1st time) it has been 5 days since the system was last fully charged (assuming I am reading it right) or the cycle length (from charge 100% to discharge to charge 100%) was 129hrs.  However this is odd since my MPPT controller tells me that 5 days ago the max voltage was 30 volts and the system went into absorb for 1 hr but did not float.  This should in theory have been fine since the system was not in use.  Battery low voltage went to 24.42vdc with only a very small draw on the system (DC fans running in back room that draw very little -- I need to check but I'm thinking something like 10ths of an amp) so the system should have easily hit 100% of charge/cap every day for the last 5 days.  Here are the AH's produced by the panels over this time:

Amp Hours: 16.8, 24.2, 21.8, 26.2, 26.7

So each day during this period the PV system produced plenty of charging to recharge a bank that is in very limitted use (almost not used at all since only the Tr-Metric meter, MPPT Controller, 24v-12v converter and two 90mm 12vDC fans are running when I am gone --I'll find what that draw is shortly as I Can do this by merely killing the Inverter and MPPT controller to see what the draw is).

The Minimum voltage on the meter shows 20.9 volts (which is a concern) but the MPPT controller shows the min volts during this period as 22.46v.  Now the controller does compensate for temp but I don't think that should change the voltage reading -- am I wrong here?  There is a 1.5v difference in the two which concerns me.

I'll go look to see what it is now and report back...but before I do I observed some other things:

The length of cycles in hours shows: 129 (most recent), 556, 47.2, 72.9 and 86.5 (most distant)
This suggests that the system say 100% of cap/charge 129 hours before I took the readings which I find strange since I ran the generator on the Thursday I arrived which is just 41 hours (roughly) since since charging the system to 100% on Thursday but the system reached 100% twice on Friday and again this morning so if I understand the system correctly it should have read only about 10-12 hrs for the last cycle.  Perhaps I'll reset the system and see if it shows me tomorrow that it's been less time.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 24, 2015, 12:56:46 PM
A quick check of voltages reveals:

27.09v MPPT Controller
27.1v   Tri-Metric Meter

So this appears to be the same (virtually)

3.7Amps Charging on the MPPT Controller
2.9Amps Charging on the Tri-Metric Meter

Currently the generator is running as well as the MPPT Controller but the gen tends to drop to 0 when the system is fully floated and the Controller is charging in float.

So the voltages reported are basically the same at this time so I'm confused why they would be different over the last 5+ days.  I'm going to reset the system to see if I can start fresh while I'm here.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 24, 2015, 08:08:43 PM
OK, so after charging the system to what should be a full charge I took SG readings to see how bad things were.

1st string: 
Batt 1:  1.225/1.225/1.225 @~45F so possibly 1.209-1.211
Batt2:   1.225/1.225.1.225
Batt3:   1.225/1.235/1.230
Batt4:   1.220/1.220/1.200

2nd String:
Batt 1:   1.250/1.250/1.250
Batt 2:   1.240/1.240/1.240
Batt 3:   1.200/1.200/1.200 (at this point I changed SG testers because I was having trouble reading the tester accurately.
Batt 4:   1.220/1.220/1.220

3rd String:
Batt 1:   1.235/1.240/1.235
Batt 2:   1.220/1.220/1.220
Batt 3:   1.222/1.221/1.230
Batt 4:   1.221/1.221/1.230

At this time I realized those readings were pretty much all over the place and decided to equalize so I set my inverter/charger to Equalize (desulfator selection) and let it run for 3 hrs (the default time for an equalize on my MPPT controller.  The inverter times out at 4 hours but I decided to go with 3 hrs to see how it turned out.

Afterwards I took some more readings:
String 1:
Batt 1:   1.230/1.230/1.232  (rise of 0.005+ on each cell)
Batt 2:   1.226/1.228/1.230 (rise of 0.001 on cell one, 0.003 on 2 and 0.005 on 3)hmmmmm
Batt 3:   1.234/1.234/1.236 (rise of 0.009/-0.001/+0.001)
I was then interupted for a good 30 mins and the voltage on the bank had dropped before I could get back to the bank and so my next reading may or may not be accurate:
Batt 4:   1.218/1.222/1.218 (-0.002/+0.002/+0.018)

I decided at this point that it might not be the best indicator since time and system usage had taken place from the 3rd to the 4th battery so I decided to stop here and consider the results of the 1st 3 Batteries and wait until the morning to see what the bank it at after a night of no charging/discharging.  I plan to shut the system down overnight (and put my food in cooler on the porch) and give it a full 6-hrs of non-use to get accurate readings.

Looking at those readings I have to say that it appears that after running on the charger for a few hours and then running on the equalize setting for 3 hours the batteries were still at only about 55% of cap.

The trojan doc I have says the following:  subtract 0.004 per 10 degrees below 80F to correct readings to 80F for voltage equivalents.

So looking at the above I'd have to subtract about 0.012 from each reading.

This: Batt 1:   1.230/1.230/1.232
Becomes this: Batt 1:   1.218/1.218/1.214 and roughly 55% of charge and a voltage of ~24.3v

Not really good for a system that had 5-6 hours of real charging and just finished 3 hours at 31v

I have to ask this now:  if I'm at only 55% of capacity now then should I calculate my capacity at 55% of 660AH (original AH rating of system)?  If so then I have only 363AH of cap and a usage of 35AH puts me close to 10% DOD.

However, in all honesty the bank appears to be all but dead at this point so perhaps I should bother looking at it that way and should just set the genset to come on at 23.5v under a load and hope that I can limp it along for a couple more months.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on January 24, 2015, 10:39:56 PM
Equalizing before the majority of the cells have reached a fully charged state is not really EQ'ing. It's more like a bulk charge until the voltage reaches the EQ voltage set point.

If it was me, I would remove all the big loads and run the charger as long as it took to reach the absorb set point. Maybe I would even boost my absorb set point a little. Watch the temperature and the electrolyte level.

If the readings remain out of whack then, IMO, there is little point in trying to get the Trimetric calibrated. The batteries are simply working against you and the Trimetric.

I would do everything I could to ensure that one way or another the new batteries would not be run down to 50% or less and also ensure that they can reach full charge every normal day of use.

My all time favorite hydrometer has been the Hydrovolt for some time now. NAWS sells them at the best price I have seen. (http://www.solar-electric.com/midnite-solar-battery-hydrometer.html) I have 2 of them now; one at the cabin and one at home. Automatic temperature compensation and very easy to read even with bifocals or whatever.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 25, 2015, 12:51:45 PM

OK after 8 hours of resting the battery bank went from 24.4v (I had not fully charged it since 3pm when I stopped the equalize) to 24.7v at 8am.  I then checked voltages and SG readings.

I realized afterwards that I should have charged the bank up but at least I had a clear picture of the condition of the batteries (I think) when I was done.  Here are the results:
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/BatteryReadings_zpsa7a07b33.jpg)
As you can see I have some batteries with 'ok' readings and some that are clearly much lower.

My thought is that the equalize didn't do much for me but again, I failed to fully charge the bank before shutting down the power.  Perhaps that was a mistake but I think I can assume that the readings are accurate and the bank was at 75% of capacity by 8am.

It's clear the voltage under a light load drops about 0.3v from what it will rise to and I can assume that it's likely 1-2v under what it really is when under a load that I'd typically see (Fridge running, lights on etc).  This at least tells me that setting the generator auto start at 23.5v that it's probably closer to 24.5v without the load (the generator senses the drop to target voltage and waits to make sure it's not just a negative spike -- I believe it waits 2 minutes before starting at the target voltage.

My thinking is that if I take the best of the batteries and reduce the bank to 8 batteries then I'll have 440AH (if new and at 80F) and the 20Amps of charging I have should be able to handle that when it isn't in use.  When it is I have the generator to back up the solar.

My typical use of 80amps MAX in a day would put me close to 20% DOD and with the generator coming on around there it should hold up for a couple months I think.

So, what do you think?  My thought is to take the batteries with 1.22SG or better and use them and discard the ones below that.

I may also choose to get GCB's again as the money savings is tempting and with my new knowledge of batteries and my past 4+ years experience should give me more years of use though the trojans are still very tempting.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 25, 2015, 12:59:35 PM
 I noticed that the batteries which connected to the positive bus were the most abused.  I found this very interesting and wondered if I should reverse the strings?  I figured that if that battery took more abuse for some reason then by putting the best batteries there (reversing them) then perhaps I'd get more life out of the strings.  I also noticed that the two string with the lowest SG readings were the two original strings.

Either way it's clear the newer string may just be better and it's clear that the positive side of the bank draws down the battery nearest it the most for some reason.

Anyway, those are my thoughts.  I'm interested in any ideas and here's a question:

Should I conduct this experiment again by charging the batteries until the system floats and then kicking on the equalize setting to equalize, use the string until around 7PM then charge it again until 10PM so I know it's full and finally letting it rest overnight again?  I am not sure I can do this as I have to work tomorrow but I'm interested in your thoughts on that.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: nailit69 on January 25, 2015, 01:01:07 PM
Man... solar sounds complicated.  I'm gonna have to do some serious research/studying/reading on the subject.  I guess I thought it was a little more like the ronco cooker... "just set it and forget it" lol.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 25, 2015, 01:20:49 PM
It's not really complicated LOL just you can't abuse it and get away with it! LOL A well set up system with regular maintenance and no abuse should be pretty simple but I've made some mistakes.  For example, when I built my system I planned a system with 660AH at 12vdc and 615watts of charging.  The MPPT controller could take that and put 40amps into the battery bank (roughly) and the system should have managed that just fine.  But I abused that system and decided to add 2 more batteries which took me to 880AH @12v.  Now the system was a little under what I probably needed but again, had I been careful it would work.  I did however drain the bank a couple times when I was away by leaving something on I should not have.

Next I converted the bank to 24v and added 4 more batteries.  It was more than 3 years and you really should avoid adding batteries but I found 4 that were close in age and use (so I beleived anyway and I appear to have been mostly correct) and added them.  Now I had 660AH @24v and needed about 60Amps of charging but only had 20.  That's a bit of a problem but the backup generator can handle that.  However I made mistakes again and hereI am today looking at a rebuild.  My lessons learned:

1.  Size the bank for more than you think.
2.  Think in AMPS not WATTS.  It's Amps in vs Amps out pretty much. 
3.  Don't let the bank die EVER!  If you aren't there to protect it then don't use it or have the genset ready to back it up when you are gone (in my case I'm ok with that for the most part).

it's really not so bad ;) and I enjoy having it.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 25, 2015, 01:22:09 PM
If I group the best 8 batteries by volts/SG to keep the relatively close to one another than the strings should look like this:
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/NewStrings_zps0d67f588.jpg)
Of course that means one string will be better than the other but perhaps with some equalizing I can improve that a bit.

Thoughts?

I could take the last battery on the 2nd new string and swap it with the highest battery on the 1st string to keep them closer together but am not sure what affect that will have.  I'm also thinking of putting the better string first since the closest string to the bus (#3 in the first sheet) seems to take the most abuse.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: nailit69 on January 25, 2015, 01:28:03 PM
Thoughts???... not from me...

I'll have to pick your brain a little more when the time comes... I have no idea what any of this means.  Sounds reasonably simple in theory but my Dad is a battery freak (mostly cuz of RV'ing) he has all the hygrometers and digital analyzers and volt/amp meters and that yellow and green voltage table thingy and I still have never been able to grasp onto it.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on January 25, 2015, 02:31:05 PM
Nailit69,  when you come to planning your system, you can do a couple things to make life easier and the batteries last longer.

Forget about a 12 volt system, unless you will absolutely for certain never want to use large draw items like microwave ovens,fridges, and so on. 12 volt battery systems may be good for a few lights and a TV. Go for a 24 volt system at least.

Do not put any batteries in parallel. Series only. That may mean you have to forgo using golf cart batteries and step up to something larger like L-16's. Or go to a 48 volt system with all batteries still in series.

Estimate power use as honestly as possible and do plan on use growing. It always does grow. Keep in mind that heating anything with electricity that comes from solar and batteries is quite expensive power.

Reduce power needs as much as possible. For  example, 120 VAC lighting LED's are now cheap enough to not bother with CFL's at all. Incandescent is, of course, out of the picture.


OJH,  I think dropping a string of the worst batteries is a good idea.  As for what batteries should go in each string, perhaps it would be best to try and make the voltage of one string match the other, at least as close as possible. That way the CC and inverter/charger might see voltage that is closer to the "truth". That's just theory.

And yes, I would try to charge the chosen batteries as much and as long as possible in order to try and get them as even as possible.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 25, 2015, 04:57:57 PM
Figured that might be best Don.  Thanks

On the topic of parallel batteries I did a bunch of reading articles by battery engineers and came to the conclusion that 2-3 strings are fine.  To be honest we run 2-3 strings in central office back up systems (HUGE systems that use 2v 3600AH batteries and 24 of them in series to get 48v -- incidentally we run -48v systems -- and 2-3 strings, possibly more I'd have to go look again to get the kind o reserve power a CO needs if the power goes out.).

I know many in the solar biz claim that you should only use a series setup but I'd argue that while that might be an excellent way to go it also has limitations.  For example, in a series parallel system you can shut down one back to work on it while the others continue to provide power.  This is something that happens all the time in the CO's.  You switch out one bank, get it back online and then switch out the next.  Means you're never out of power.

One thing I read though was that the wiring from each bank should be as close to exactly the same as possible.  Electricity takes the path of least resistance so having the inverter/charge controller/charger at one end of a bank and the strings laid out moving away from them isn't the best idea.  My idea for my new bank is to put all the main connections in the center of the bus and the battery strings the same distance from that point (one above, one below so to speak) so there isn't a difference.

So far I've left the bank alone since I have so much to get done but I think I'll leave it as is until my next trip out.  It seems to do fine when nothing is drawing off of it and the panels can keep it charged while I'm gone since the draw from the fans in the back is so small.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 27, 2015, 02:46:34 PM
Spoke with Bogart Engineering today on their meter and learned the following:

1.  The meter determines the system is at 100% when the P1 value (29.2v -- .4v under Absorption target voltage on MPPT controller) and the P2 Value (14amps -- 2% of battery capacity) -- this I knew but wanted to confirm.
2.  The capacity should be left at 660AH regardless of temperature. -- What he advised was that if you knew that it was 32F outside then 84AH of use would be about 20% of the battery bank capacity vs at 80F when it would only be 12%.  He suggested that if you only wanted to allow a maximum of 20% DOD then setting the system to kick the generator on at a shown 12% DOD in the winter would be better than leaving it until a full 132AH were drawn from the system (which would show 20%DOD on a 660Ah system).  I think this is key to understanding how to use the meter and is something I've struggled with.
3.  Capacity shown on the meter (in %) represents your overall AH cap minus all AH used on the since when not being charged.  So, as I suspected after I'd done a bunch of reading on the meter last weekend, a reading of 94% on a cap of 420AH (which I'd adjusted it to) meant I'd used 6% of 420AH

So in short, regardless of voltage on the system since you can't really trust it when under a load, it's best to watch the capacity percentage as a gauge of used AH's AND pay attention to voltage as a way of gauging battery health -- meaning that if the system uses only 25AH of capacity and is drawing down to 23.5v than something is clearly wrong since it really shouldn't drop much at all even on a 420AH bank.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 28, 2015, 04:14:35 PM
Came up with a cut list for my next stage of the deck.  I'll be adding another section that is 8 feet deep and 22 feet long then putting a roof over it.  My plan is to frame the roof with 3x6 rafters (due to the low headroom I'll have at the end in order to get some kind of decent slope to the roof.  I think I can get the slope better than 2:10, maybe 3:10 but it will be close and that will be with a 6'6" ceiling at the low end.  My dad is 6'4" so that will be a bit close but going higher means a much lower slope.  Perhaps I could consider deeper rafters and a lower slope though.  If I went with 2x8's rough sawn then I would have a stronger roof than the 3x6's I believe but I'd lose some height and go with less slope...this is my dilemma.

On a side note, the 2x8's would mean I'd get 4 out of each 8x8 cant which means they would mill faster whereas 3x6's would give me just 2 out of an 8x8 cant though with the 3x6's I'd also get one 2x8 out of the cant which I'd need for other things....hmmmm   ???

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 29, 2015, 05:37:43 PM
Since deeper is better I'm now thinking that I'd be better off with 2x8's for rafters on the porch (vs 3x6's) and making the roof pitch shallower.  Looking at the span tables I should be fine with about a 2:12 pitch and spanning 10' on 24 centers.  These would be set on a ledger screwed to the cabin with ledger locks and then will rest on 6" D-Logs which will be set on 8+" log posts with log railing between them.  The log posts will be set at either 4' or 6' centers (haven't decided yet but 6' appears to be fine with the tables I've seen).  To do this I'd mill two 12' D logs 6" deep (width will be whatever the log width is but greater than 6" (most likely 8-10").  Then along the next section I'll run the same setup but the span will only be 8' since the deck is narrower on that side of the cabin (and around back will also be 8').
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 01, 2015, 03:41:13 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Cabin2015800x407_zps4bc3cf80.jpg)
My latest sketchup.  Started over as I wanted to clean up some lines but this is what I'm working towards now.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 01, 2015, 05:13:07 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Cabin2015-w-solar_zps1ff2f03f.jpg)
This is what I'm aiming for :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 06, 2015, 10:18:14 PM
Back to panelling in the loft but the going is SLOW d*

Seems putting up he panelling on the underside of a 12x12 pitched ceiling is tough work!  I've managed to get ONE row in so far but came down to check on the power.  I set the generator to come on at 24v so it will provide me with plenty of power but the battery bank is still at 24.6 despite running my miter saw and shop vac for every cut.  Takes a lot of power (I'm guessing about 2500 watts both combined) but the 4000 watt pure sine AIMS inverter is taking it just fine and the batteries are holding :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 07, 2015, 01:00:46 AM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/riverroad_zps18f01ab1.jpg)
Flooding!  It's been in the low 40's during the day and the snow is melting off.  Rivers running down the driveways and roads out here.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Fan2_zpsa924c4f1.jpg)
Shot of the new fan (200mm) and hot water heater installed.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Blue_zpsb63eeaa8.jpg)
Blue LED's in the fans don't draw much power but add some light in the back room.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/NewPanelling_zps7f19cf5f.jpg)
Some panelling I got done tonight (ceiling)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 07, 2015, 06:03:32 PM
Finished a couple more rows of panelling until I ran out of 4, 5 and 6" stock then got busy installing our 12v ceiling fan.  It's working nicely now and might also be ok on 24v since it has both written on the instructions (24v by hand, 12v by factory)...perhaps it's like the 24v Sureflo pumps that can run half speed on 12v.

Either way it's nice to have some air moving in the cabin now and it doesn't seem to use much power at all.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: nailit69 on February 09, 2015, 09:04:16 AM
I'm liking the porch.  We managed to make it up to our place this weekend... still 6-8" of snow on the ground but the higher sunny hills and south facing slopes are clear.  It was so much fun  [cool]
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 10, 2015, 12:31:00 PM
I managed to get 4 trees felled and bucked into logs giving me (with one I'd previously dropped) about the 24 logs I needed for the new porch section and roof.  Most were dragged to the mill landing also though I still have a half dozen or so laying around the area and a lot of slash to stack and burn.

We'll be gone a while (longest in over a year) but should be back in early March to start milling.  My plan is to mill all the rafters, beams and floor joists and decking etc by mid april at the latest so I have have them dry for a while.  Then I'll start on the log posts and railings and with luck also get the D-Log beams set in place.  If I can get all that done by mid-may than I should be able to start framing the roof on the original deck and begin working on the foundation for the new section.

Needless to say I have A LOT of work to do this spring!  Need to have it done by July 10th if at all possible since I have a big family party that weekend at the cabin :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 13, 2015, 02:22:29 PM
It's been forever since I've been to the cabin but I hope to be there in a week or so.  After our vacation in Italy we had to start packing up our home to sell as we'll be moving 80 miles closer to our cabin (moving to the town I have been working in and where my wife found work) so we're going to be stretched pretty thin between house hunting, selling our home and of course continuing to work on the cabin!

Life will be busy but I still hope to get my milling done and deck framed complete with roof -- I think I'm going to need some luck! lol
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 20, 2015, 05:22:05 PM
Managed a 2nd overnighter at the cabin :)  Love to see the place but hate to only get an overnight stay before leaving again though at least my job does cause me to do that ;)

Interestingly the power seems to be doing fine and held to 24.6vdc overnight and bounced back to 24.7vdc immediately after turning off the inverter before leaving.  At least I have some time before I must get those batteries replaced.  Maybe a few months at least ;)

Meanwhile, I need better reading glasses!  I checked the oil levels in the genset and thought I saw them low so added oil to all three (yes three) fill points until I saw oil on the dipstick -- though I thought it was still low -- then fired up the genny to make sure all was well and it smoked!  Burned oil for several minutes before giving clear exhaust again :(  d* hopefully no damage was done but it seems to run fine now...and then I was gone :(

Next trip I hope to spend some real time there but first I must get the house on the market.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 20, 2015, 06:40:48 PM
Managed to snap a couple shots before leaving this morning :)
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_2400_zpsfgs0ut1w.jpg)
Spring is definitely here but we're still getting down pretty coll in the am.  My cherry is showing signs of waking up now but the apples are all still asleep

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_2402_zpsfisyzvi8.jpg)
The place looks a mess (ok it IS a mess) but with luck I'll get it cleaned back up soon!

Gotta love the smoke coming out of the chimney :)  Just something about a cabin warmed by a wood stove...it's in the blood I guess :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: nailit69 on April 21, 2015, 08:31:49 AM
Place doesn't look that bad... a few hrs. work should have it looking pretty sharp.  We're heading back up to our place next weekend to finish filling the block w/cement and to start building the floor.  I'd like to have some more dirtwork done too but it can wait if it has to.

I can't wait til there's smoke coming out of our chimney and I can spend a night there indoors and in front of the fire... hopefully by fall
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 24, 2015, 11:56:57 AM
:)  Oh I know ;)  I just hate seeing it that way but this time of year the grass is just starting to come in and the greenery is only beginning to bud.  In a couple months it will look much nicer ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 26, 2015, 07:27:14 AM
Had a great weekend at the cabin BUT discovered that gophers can kill an orchard in no time flat :(
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_2490%20800x600_zpsya3aagpv.jpg)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_2491%20800x600_zps01tawaho.jpg)
Out of 8 trees we have 3 still sstanding and I think one of those is likely toast already (leaves are small and growth is poor but it's still solid in the ground so who knows?

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_2492%20800x600%202_zpsoreuasng.jpg)
I had no idea gophers could do this!

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_2493%20800x600_zpshjcpqkad.jpg)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_2496%20800x600_zpsg3rms4pd.jpg)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_2498%20800x600_zpss0kl7f8f.jpg)

After 5 years of working and investing in this little orchard I'm pretty depressed specially since the trees came from St. Lawrence Nursary which is now out of business (retired).  It may be hard to replace the trees let alone the years of growing them.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: UK4X4 on May 26, 2015, 08:32:07 AM
http://homeguides.sfgate.com/start-tree-branch-clipping-22190.html

might be of some help, no harm in trying !
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on May 26, 2015, 10:13:38 AM
WOW Eric I sure hate to see that....  I never had an attack of that - only one from a rodent.  Tried a root graph that did not work.  If I find any more cold weather trees I will be sure to send them your way.   


Quote from: UK4X4 on May 26, 2015, 08:32:07 AM
http://homeguides.sfgate.com/start-tree-branch-clipping-22190.html

might be of some help, no harm in trying !

That will work - my dad and my grandmother seemed to get anything going like that.....  Me - I have never had much luck.  willows  - poplars - aspen.  But I have heard you can try it. (apples)   But there is a problem doing so with a fruit tree.  Especially the hardy verities - rootstock cultivar.

Literately every apple - peach and pear you eat - you buy in the store or a tree from a nursery does not grow in its own foundation - The starts are whacked and grafted to a specific rootstock cultivar.  My orchard was started ignorant of this.  Our losses were great the first year nearly 25 out of 50 trees.  So then I started making phone calls and asking questions. Sitting up and reading - making more phone calls.   

In our succeeding plantings our mortality went way down.....  Love the root stock that Jarhead found and I think we planted about twenty trees or so from them. So like a quarter of our trees are from that nursery.  They love that spring time black sticky mucky clay soil up here.  They do not mind the summers of very little water other than what we give them during the summers.  Fall they get ready for winter better than most rootstocks that we have.  Then winters is what you buy them for they thumb their noises at 30 and 40 below (F) WOW I guess we are pretty close to that in Celsius as well... I can not say enough about there vigor and doing as advertised.  However the root stock or cultivars were born in Russia and Siberia.    However as he said this year was their last because retirement and no one to take over the reins.         

Rootstocks and cultivars are a science to themselves.  Something on this forum I always am yammering about.  Please if you want a orchard or a apple tree or two up at your camp or cabin do not go into it blind.  PM me or post on my site I can guide you to a nursery or two that has been way way above and beyond when it come to getting people lined up with what you need.

or sit down and read through some of this and a few others besides.....
 
http://ucanr.edu/sites/ctfa/category/Rootstocks/   
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 26, 2015, 10:58:37 AM
I guess the worst part, asside from losing all the trees, is that St Lawrence Nuseries retired the business and they are no longer filling orders. :(

So hard to replace these trees I think.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 26, 2015, 11:21:22 AM
So after all that sad news (losing the orchard) we did managed to do some good stuff this weekend though!

We had this big pine right in front of the cabin that was leaning in the wrong direction and making me somewhat nervous so I decided it was time to come down but needed to delimb some of it first.  So along comes Steve :)  one of my techs
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Steve2_zps4zu7hdsn.jpg)
Steve is a pole climber and has been doing this sort of thing for nearly 40 years...and he's good at it ;)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Steve_zpsygdielrk.jpg)
He went up about 50 feet and took down the limbs that were weighing the tree to the wrong side, then he fell the tree while I tugged it in the direction I wanted it to go with a rope and a tractor :)

We fell it where we wanted it to go and then I began to get to work on it :)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_2489%20800x600_zpsiwwjo0r0.jpg)
By late Saturday I had the first log milled into rafters for the deck :)  With this tree down and another I dropped I've got enough logs to mill all the wood needed to extend the deck and build the roof :)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_2500%20800x600_zpsziqmsl7f.jpg)
I also managed to get the last piece of roofing on the wood shed :)  It's a mess right now but so nice to have that last section roofed!  No more rain in the wood shed now :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 27, 2015, 11:30:19 AM
Should be heading back tomorrow :)  Going to try to work from the cabin for a few days and while there hope to do some clean up, milling and maybe a little slash burning.

We move into our new home in a month so I'm trying to get all the cabin time in now that I can ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 27, 2015, 11:42:29 AM
Before finding this instruction set:  http://www.rusticwoodworking.com/uploads/6/7/3/3/6733546/ratchet_strap_clamp_plans_june2014.pdf

I purchased an EZ Log Clamp which I hope to make use of SOON.  My plan is to make my railings for the deck so that I can start putting up my posts.  I need the railings as I plan to put up a post, insert railings into the mortices and then install the next post onto the railing tenons and so on.  This way the railings and posts will be assembled as one unit when done -- I plan to use liquid nails and screws to add some rigidity to the railings also.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 30, 2015, 09:03:38 PM
So I grabbed my chainsaw this morning and a tape measure and hiked off into the woods in search of a dead Fir about 4 inches in Diameter.  I'd learned previously that this works great when it's damp out.  Just find a dead tree, cut it down, take what you want and use the rest for the fire :)

Once I'd found my 'post tree' I cut out a nice post and headed back to the cabin to begin making a post for my railing.  Once I had the post peeled (after strapping to the stairs with a ratchet strap) I remembered seeing someone use a grinder to smooth out posts and since I'd recently moved mine I even knew where it was! ;)

It worked like a charm and once I had the post smoothed out I set up my drill press (clamped to the deck) and drilled two 2" mortices (holes) for the tenons that would be the ends of the railings.  Then off I went back into the woods for some more material.  I found a decent pine and another fir (both dead) that I could use for a post and railings and cut them down. 

After dragging those back to the cabin I set about turning them into nicely shaved and sanded pieces for my log railing.  Then I dug out several saplings I'd cut down 4 years earlier and left to 'rot' (nearly) in the wood shed while waiting for just this day, and turned them into stiles.

End result?
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/railing2_zpsus3wbcx6.jpg)

Even with just some screws holding the posts to the loft floor it's pretty solid but I'll admit I learned a ton and the next two sections should be MUCH better ;)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/railing3_zpswbzuypn5.jpg)
Walking up and down the ships ladder stairs is a lot easier now!

Now to enjoy some decent bourbon and a quiet evening at the cabin :)

After I put away the tools I suppose! ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Gary O on May 30, 2015, 09:23:56 PM
Man, OJ, You just can't post enough pics of yer place.

Thanks for the show

and, cheers
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on May 30, 2015, 09:59:02 PM
Where is the like button?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 31, 2015, 08:33:01 AM
Thanks guys :)

Truth is I could have posted more of the operation ;) but decided not to inundate you with al the pics of the 'how to' section of what I did.  I learned a lot though and might actually have the hole 'tenon cutting' thing down now.  In fact I think I do but only just figured out the way to clamp the logs down at the very end.  I'll probably do some pics today of that sort of thing if my sunburn doesn't prevent me from making the 2nd railing ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 31, 2015, 12:12:27 PM
https://youtu.be/njsstFxdiEM
Here I am making a tenon with my 'field expedient' set up :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 31, 2015, 10:20:41 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Railingbelow_zpsgg8m180t.jpg)
After a very long day I managed to get the 2nd section of railing up.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/railingbelow2_zpserqjeiax.jpg)
My day started with me going out and finding some material, bringing it back, hand sawing some of it to size, saying 'to heck with that' and firing up the generator and using my miter saw to cut the rest.  Then, with 38 'logs' for balusters I set about making tenons, stripping the bark and sanding the balusters.  I completed 19 of them and set them aside so I could work on rails.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/railing3_zps0tvrygij.jpg)
Once I had the rails sized and ready to drill I marked them and set about drilling them on my drill press.  It worked pretty well despite me having to hold a 7 foot log/rail and 'eyeball' the location of the holes somewhat.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Railing2_zps6opmocfb.jpg)
In the end, tired and plum tuckered out I manged to get the rail installed and the mess cleaned up until the next trip out :)  But I'm liking the progress :)


Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on June 09, 2015, 08:28:45 AM
That tenon "bit" looks like it works quite slick!

Been thinking of getting that kit myself recently - do I need to get a 1/2 drill or will a 3/8 work ok?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 09, 2015, 11:56:58 AM
Quote from: JavaMan on June 09, 2015, 08:28:45 AM
That tenon "bit" looks like it works quite slick!

Been thinking of getting that kit myself recently - do I need to get a 1/2 drill or will a 3/8 work ok?

Yes you need the big monster drill :)  Not sure the RPM's on mine but it's a Rigid from HD so probably similar to the Rigid's sold on Lumberjacktools.com

I like the bits and once you learn how to use them (yes it takes some practice) you can knock out some tenons pretty quickly.  I will admit, though, that a stand with drill guide would be nice!  but for $400 (sale price) the ones Lumber Jack Tools sells is a bit too steep for me so I'll keep doing mine by hand and work harder at getting a good center before starting.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Pine Cone on June 11, 2015, 12:25:06 PM
Sorry to see your tree damage.  It may not be gophers, look to see if you have a mountain beaver problem.  http://wdfw.wa.gov/living/mtn_beavers.html (http://wdfw.wa.gov/living/mtn_beavers.html)

If you do have boomers/mountain beavers you should try and control them or you will continue to lose trees.  On some of the forestry properties the company I work for manages boomers will pretty much kill all the planted trees if we don't trap and kill them. 

Your railings are looking great.  I use a "Hole Hawg" clone from Harbor Freight to make mine.  http://www.harborfreight.com/compact-2-speed-1-2-half-inch-right-angle-drill-97622.html (http://www.harborfreight.com/compact-2-speed-1-2-half-inch-right-angle-drill-97622.html)

I have also used the Logman router version of tenon makers which is great for larger tenons (over 1" diameter) http://www.baileysonline.com/Woodworking/Log-Home-Furniture/Tenon-Maker-Accessories/Logman-Log-Furniture-Tenon-Maker.axd (http://www.baileysonline.com/Woodworking/Log-Home-Furniture/Tenon-Maker-Accessories/Logman-Log-Furniture-Tenon-Maker.axd)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 11, 2015, 02:07:34 PM
I actually have a logman cutter also but much prefer the Lumber Jack tools tenon makers.  Much much faster and a much nicer tenon IMHO.  Still the logman has its uses too.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 11, 2015, 02:09:22 PM
We do have beavers in the Okanogan but but they are down damming up the creeks a few miles away.  In this case all the damage is subgrade and lots of mounds nearby.  I treated all the mounds and hope to see some improvement this weekend.  I'll flatten the earth then too and in a week I'll know if I've gotten the buggers.

The plan is to replant next spring after I do some work on the orchard to improve it a little :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Pine Cone on June 11, 2015, 05:10:59 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on June 11, 2015, 02:09:22 PM
We do have beavers in the Okanogan but but they are down damming up the creeks a few miles away.  In this case all the damage is subgrade and lots of mounds nearby.  I treated all the mounds and hope to see some improvement this weekend.  I'll flatten the earth then too and in a week I'll know if I've gotten the buggers.

The plan is to replant next spring after I do some work on the orchard to improve it a little :)

The mountain beaver is not a beaver at all, just shares a common name which is why most foresters and loggers call them boomers instead of beavers.  Totally different creature with different habits.  Check out the link for ways of identifying their damage.  Unlike real beavers which require a special permit to kill or remove, you don't need any permits for killing boomers.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 12, 2015, 06:29:52 AM
Interesting but we're far from moist in Eastern WA and the evidence I have is something smaller (coke can sized holes).  I think it's gophers but I'll keep my eyes open in case some boomers decided to move to the dry country ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on June 12, 2015, 01:16:17 PM
Quote from: Pine Cone on June 11, 2015, 05:10:59 PM
The mountain beaver is not a beaver at all, just shares a common name which is why most foresters and loggers call them boomers instead of beavers.  Totally different creature with different habits.  Check out the link for ways of identifying their damage.  Unlike real beavers which require a special permit to kill or remove, you don't need any permits for killing boomers.

???  I am not seeing any links.....  I did not know of such a critter.....

However I have been around pocket gophers all my life and never seen them do that type of damage.  These however I am familiar with are all in the irrigated Boise Valley.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on June 12, 2015, 01:26:22 PM
One map I found does reach in to you area Jarhead. Look like a hardware cloth ring would be a great idea! 

(https://i593.photobucket.com/albums/tt15/rick91351/Orchard/DSC_0344_zpsef0af31a.jpg)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 13, 2015, 11:39:54 PM
The rings do not help.  The damage is all below ground a good 6 to 8 inches and more.

The gophers are tunnelling under the orchard and then eating the root balls completely off the tree.  I've learned that others have had this problem with gophers as well. 

Since getting the gopher probe and bait I've seen no new hills around the orchard so I'm thinking I got rid of them for now.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 13, 2015, 11:42:32 PM
I should note that I have been using hardware cloth 'rings' around each of the trees up until this passed winter when I forgot to put them on again.  However as mentioned above, my trees are not ringed but rather devoid of any roots about 6 to 8 inches down.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 15, 2015, 12:01:58 PM
Had a busy and yet not so busy weekend at the cabin ;)

My plans, of course, were changed when I realized we didn't have water (again) inside the cabin.  I was puzzled as I thought the problem was cows beating up the pump house wiring but this time it wasn't the case.  Instead if was a leak (evidenced by the small sinkhole near the water main).  So I dug up the main, found the leak but couldn't repair just yet.  Repairs should be done next weekend.

We needed to relax a bit since the selling and buying of a house was stressing us out but I did get more done ;)  Just not what was planned  d*

At some point as I was just finishing up bucking some branches smaller so my wife could clear them away she said "it's too bad you can't level off the top of that stump and make a table out of it..."
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Stump_zpstkv5s58g.jpg)
Challenge accepted and met ;)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Bar_zps9un8szmk.jpg)
I grabbed some 3x6 and made a small table top I'm going to call the 'field bar' and frankly I love it :)

Of course then she said "you'll have to make some stump stools now too!

Hmmmm     d*
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: troy on June 18, 2015, 10:36:16 AM
Nice looking table!!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 21, 2015, 10:37:49 PM
Thanks Troy :)  It was kinda fun to make :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Adam Roby on June 22, 2015, 08:45:38 AM
Very cool, but you know once the stools are done you'll have to build a gazebo around the table...  there may be no end to this project.  :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 22, 2015, 12:33:00 PM
Quote from: Adam Roby on June 22, 2015, 08:45:38 AM
Very cool, but you know once the stools are done you'll have to build a gazebo around the table...  there may be no end to this project.  :)

LOL aint that the truth!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 22, 2015, 12:39:07 PM
After moving out of our home and moving all of our stuff into another storage unit (two now) we finally made it to the cabin for a weekend of relaxing....or at least someone relaxed ;) while I worked! LOL

I managed to get some mowing in which was desperately needed though I only managed about an acre or so but at least that much was done...I also fixed the water (valve was broken) which meant I could have a shower after getting covered in dust when mowing and then I finished making the railing for the loft (still needs finish work but it's in place now).
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Railing1_zpsmj1jcpzs.jpg)
My wife was able to assist in putting this railing together so it went a bit better and the new log clamp was excellent

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Railing_zps9zyefdxu.jpg)
Truth is I could do a lot better but this will work for now.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Railing2_zps5hzcef6v.jpg)
I've learned a LOT making this railing :)  For one, using curved rails makes predicting baluster length very hard ;) in a perfect world my 34" balusters would be fine but with these bent rails they were short or long depending on where I put them.  My mistake was impatience ;)  Later when I have a shop and can take my time I can see making this much nicer but I doubt I'll take them down now! LOL

My guess is that my deck railings will be much better ;)  Still, I like these and will stain and varathane them soon.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 22, 2015, 12:40:40 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Railing3_zpskvfknraz.jpg)
By the way, the rough work on the post here was done with a chainsaw (the 45 degree cut etc) and a grinder was used to sand everything and do a little shaping on knots etc.  The tenons were with Lumber Jack tools home kit and the forstner bits suck (I'm looking for much better ones)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 28, 2015, 10:10:14 AM
http://www.amazon.com/Designed-Intelligently-Outside-Available-Temperature/dp/B008Y9U266/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&qid=1435503490&sr=8-5&keywords=low+profile+window+fan

This looks like it might be a good option for the cabin!  We got up to 86F (briefly then it dropped to 85F) inside the cabin yesterday though it had gotten to about 100F outside which wasn't too bad but I noticed that even with all the windows open and the ceiling fan on high the cabin stayed warmer than it was outside after the outside air temp dropped below 80F.  It was 79F outside and 85F inside.....dropped closer to 70 outside and still 80F inside and so on....with the windows all open it finally got down to 71F inside (this morning) but it was 61F outside.  So it seems I need to come up with either a window fan to drive in the outside cool air or something like the above (uses a max of .5A) to get the cabin cooled down in the evening.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 28, 2015, 10:50:49 AM
Of course it might also help if I finished the venting on the cabin as I have not yet drilled out the eve vents which are currently blocked.  I have bird block screen to install but as I have not drilled out those vents there is no way for the cool air under the eves to be drawn up by convection as the hot air rises an leaves via the ridge vent....so ya, I need to get to work.

However, I tweaked my back again this morning :(  Something I do with regularity when I am not in shape and keeping my core (abs) strong.  So I took some Ibuprofin and the wife dumped the icy hot on and wih luck in an hour or so I'll have the pain down enough to load the car and leave and will have to consider things like eve venting on the next trip.....
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: nailit69 on June 29, 2015, 07:10:08 AM
Not sure i'd vent my roof with screened "bird blocks" out there in the woods... if there were ever a fire, that convection could pull hot embers into your roof and with no way to extinguish them you place would almost certainly burn to the ground.  There are some newer venting products i'm seeing out on the jobsite that install in the roofing... it's to meet fire code too.  Midway probably carries it or something similar for metal roofing.  I might use it on my cabin.

Living in a small cabin... i've been able to figure out a couple of things to keep this place as cool as possible.  I rarely use the A/C at my place unless the temps hit the upper 80s.  When it's 100 out, there's just not a lot you can do w/out A/C but the obvious ones are good insulation, good windows opened early in the morning to pull in all the cool air you can. 

The best trick by far has been Hops... Golden Hops.  I planted some Golden Hops on the west side of my house about 4' away from the wall along the deck walkway and built a trellis for it to grow on and extended it with some plastic geo-textile mat attached to the peak of the roof.  Mine hits 25' usually by the first week of June, everyone stops to admire it and always asks what it is.  I let mine get about 10' wide but it will get bigger every year if you let it.  It's 250+ sq. ft. of shaded wall not absorbing that heat for 1/2 the day... it helps a lot.

Long story short it dropped the temps in my place by at least 10 degrees, I think the secret is the airspace behind it.  It grows really fast, won't tear anything up, dies out each year, and looks really great all summer long (w/watering) and if you like to make beer...  ;) just sayin.  I rigged mine up on ropes and pulleys so I can raise and lower the geotextile mat from the ground, it usually takes 20-30 minutes to set it up and 1 hour or so to lower it and strip the old hops off at the end of the year.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 27, 2015, 11:08:23 AM
After long last I now have a garage!  One big enough to be a shop :) (800sqrft)

So, while I'm not completely moved in and settled I was able to get some work done on trim that I've been holding off on for some time.
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20150726_214941817_zpszaah3ocu.jpg)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20150726_214948918_zpsbgmnrnvq.jpg)
Yes that one piece is a bit warped but I'm hoping to use it still because it has so much character.  Not sure it will work but I'm thinking I might be able to screw it down tight and then plug the holes to hide the screws since it's for window trim.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20150726_214914227_zpsevte8vzt.jpg)
This stuff is all blue stained windfalls that I milled up with a chainsaw about 4 years ago and have been waiting to rip down and make into window trim :)  We love that beetle holes and stains specially when it's stained with Golden Oak and varathaned.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 31, 2015, 11:18:15 AM
Took a stroll around the property last night and found some great prints.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Wolf2_zpsqaup1ijr.jpg)
Little big for a yote so I'm saying 'wolf' on this one.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/SmallCabinCat_zpsisszny7q.jpg)
Bobcat I'm thinking.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Coyote2_zps6mbzqbf0.jpg)
Yote -- notice how small that one is.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/CAt_zpsbtlegups.jpg)
Cougar!

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Cat2_zps90bb34a4.jpg)
Another cougar

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/View_zpsawgl8zl0.jpg)
My view last night :)

I'm hoping this trip to get some morning milling done to catch up on all the milling I've missed this year and then I think I'm going to build a bed frame the way Don did his :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on July 31, 2015, 01:13:04 PM
I've always wanted to get some shoe treads with big bear paw soles...  ;)

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 01, 2015, 09:50:31 AM
63F in the cabin this morning :)  Coffee brought that up to 64 so I've opened up the windows again in hopes of bringing it back down a little.  This is how cabin air conditioning works ;)  You get the cabin as cool as possible over night and then lock it down before the days heat starts to come on by closing windows and curtains and limiting use of the door (either in or out but darn sure don't keep opening the door) that way the nice cool morning air in the cabin will remain throughout most of the day and give some respite later when it's 90+ out and you're beat from working in it :D

That's cabin life ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on August 01, 2015, 10:05:03 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on August 01, 2015, 09:50:31 AM
.......................... give some respite later when it's 90+ out and you're beat from working in it :D

That's cabin life ;)

Sound like growing up....  only air co we knew was someone that had huge $$$.  But hey we lived....  Mostly in the rivers - canals and ditches...

I still love just going out and shading up by the creek when it gets like that and watching the hillsides for the stuff that make the fore shown tracks.....



Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 01, 2015, 01:09:25 PM
Quote from: rick91351 on August 01, 2015, 10:05:03 AM
Sound like growing up....  only air co we knew was someone that had huge $$$.  But hey we lived....  Mostly in the rivers - canals and ditches...

I still love just going out and shading up by the creek when it gets like that and watching the hillsides for the stuff that make the fore shown tracks.....

Yp me too!  We NEVER had AC when I was a kid and for a while we lived in a trailer and that was murder -- took till 3am to cool down.

It's 90 in the shade now and predicted to get HOT today but 66 in the cabin so I'll take a break after milling some 2x stock down to 4" and 6" rough for the bed frame.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: nailit69 on August 02, 2015, 07:28:14 AM
Growing up... the only person we ever knew w A/C was Grampa and it was in his Lincoln Continental.  We've been lucky enough to live in PNW for most of our lives and never had to use much A/C... until this year that is.

Your place is looking great Ol'J... the garage is always a nice place to work on a hot day. 

I've been trying to get back up to our place but life keeps happening around me and messin up my plans.  I was hoping to have a shell up by the end of the summer and was waiting on some extra money to build and now I don't have the time to do the work before winter sets in. 

I'll probably just hold off until spring.  I think i'm just going to go up and backfill my foundation and do something on the inside to protect the footing from freezing... straw bales around the interior perimeter is about the best I can come up with... anyone have any other ideas?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 02, 2015, 08:45:51 AM
You may find, like me, that you can build right into early December up here (if you're hardy folk) but life, of course may yet be in the way!  That was my problem this year.  Selling our home, buying a new one 80 miles closer to work (as in within a few miles of work) and moving took 4 months out of my year!  I pretty much lost my milling season, mowing season and some great cabin work weather but that's ok, I now have a nice big garage I can use to make things for the cabin in the winter :)  With heat even  c*
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 02, 2015, 09:00:03 AM
Some time ago, perhaps 4 years, MountainDon built a frame for his queen sized bed.  After reading his posts I filed it away in the back of my mind that someday I would do exactly that (or darn close to it) and finally, after long last I set about copying Don's great idea (thanks Don!).

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0054_zpsu1vsactr.jpg)
First I went to one of my piles of milled lumber and dragged out a bunch of rough 2x stock in 2x6 and 2x8 sizes.  Most of it was milled 2 or 3 years ago and sitting under tarps so it was high time I made use of it. 

I ran it up to the mill and edged it down to 2x4 and 2x6 (rough) because at the time I wasn't sure what Don had used for his rails and figured if it was 2x4's I could always use the 2x6's for something else.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0059_zpsb0ns9jut.jpg)
I have a few of these sorts of piles of wood around the cabin so I'm able to go out and find the thickness I need and just rip it down to the width desired etc :)  It's great to have a small mill and your logs to mill.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0053_zps95fftihe.jpg)
After using my 13" plane to take off the rough edges I then ran the stock over the jointer to take out the cant some the stock managed to get when I was edging it (seems I hadn't noticed the boards were canted when I edged them on the sawmill)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0055_zpsznznck4a.jpg)
Oops!  d*

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0057_zpsrimblznk.jpg)
Much better ;)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0063_zpsfciyyg7f.jpg)
Once everything was ready I first nailed two 2x4's together to make my 4x posts and then assembled the box with deck screws.  Nothing fancy, just good old simple.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0065_zpsprc4bkre.jpg)
I do like the blue stain though and while most of this is meant to not be seen I'll probably stain and varathane anyway; besides that will preserve it better.

Thanks Don for getting back to me on the rails.  I'd looked more closely at your pictures and was pretty sure they were 2x4's so went with that but was happy to learn I was right.  Seems the 2x4's have plenty of strength too though mine are rough sawn so actually 2" thick and 4" wide which may help a little.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0070_zps8xt3f8n6.jpg)
Finally I screwed the two 30x80 frame boxes together and put some 3/4" OSB flooring on top though I only had enough of the flooring to cover 5 feet of each box so I'll be filling in the last 20" with some 3/4" pine I have laying about ;)

Last night was the first night testing out the new frame (I put some temp 3/4" pine in the gap I need to fill today just to get by) and I must admit I am very happy!

The height was chosen by measuring the largest tote we put towels in and it was just shy of 13" tall so I made the gap under the bed 14" making the total height 18" (18" minus the 4" rails).  Now we can put clear totes under the bed with winter clothes, towels etc and store them there rather than stacking them here and there to get them out of the way :)

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 02, 2015, 09:47:04 AM
Next step is to remove all 12 batteries from the power system and haul them home to replace :)  We're going to do all 12 at once.

Since I'll be removing them all I'll work on the battery bay and wiring to get it cleaned up and maybe, just maybe I'll work on the console for my remotes and stereo (remotes for the solar equipment that is).

My plan is to set the buss bars on opposite sides of the battery bank so there is no chance of crossing them and to run the remotes for the inverter, auto gen start and the Tri-Meteric meter all over to a 'console' by my chair in front of the wood stove where I'll also mount my stereo.  I may have to bring them all home to work out placement etc in my new garage shop and bring them back with me ready to install... should be a fun project :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on August 02, 2015, 05:01:14 PM
One thing I have found to be very handy are my wrenches that have the handles well wrapped with insulating tape. The battery terminal nuts need a 1/2" wrench as do the bolts and nuts that connect the cables to the buss bars. I bought two individual 1/2" combination wrenches so I could have a dedicated pair left in the battery house. Only the closed end of the wrench is not taped. So when I forget to watch the end that is swinging around as I loosen or tighten it can contact the other buss or whatever and I do not get the shower of sparks, the wrench welded and so on.  I used 10 mil PVC tape that is used for taping underground gas pipe fittings. It sticks well and has not come loose.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

12 GC-2?   

Ours are still working okay for the most part.  They are now one month into their 7th year; 73 months of service, albeit is part time use service. They normally are connected to the charge controller all the time, even when we are absent. That ensures they stay charged. Last week when we were at the cabin we were ahving so much lightning activity that I had the incoming lines from the PV disconnected much of the time. (I have a 12 foot separation between the CC and a power pole that has the end of the 300+ foot run from the PV.  It allows a gap that I hope is large enough to prevent a lightning jump if the PV array gets a hit.)

Anyhow the forecast was for a week or more of continued lightning activity. That prompted me to leave the system with the incoming line disconnected. The batteries were virtually full; 99% by the meter. When we get back there in a day or so I'll take some sp. gr. readings to see how they have fared just sitting there with no charging or discharging. I have not left them sit w/o being on charge, mostly float, since the lightning hit.  I'm reasonably sure they will be fine over a short time.


OTOH the ATV sat un-used for a month in July. It was self discharged enough to not have enough "grunt" to start the ATV. A new AGM battery will be soon installed.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 02, 2015, 06:51:15 PM
You've taken better care of yours ;)  I've drained mine a few times and recently when checking sg readings I found some cells were very low but then I knew that was coming from my last checks.  These are only 5 years old but very abused and my plan is to replace them all and treat them right.

I also plan to install about 40amps more of solar charging but I need to get the roof on the deck first and that may not happen this year as I've not had a chance to do any milling etc in order to facilitate that.  Now that the weather is SO hot I won't mill because the lumber will dry too fast and warp on me.  So I'll have to wait another month or so before I start milling again but I have the logs ready to go.  Once I get milling I can start planning on the roof and maybe even get it done this fall but I'm not holding my breath.

I will probably buy the panels soon though so I get them at a decent price.  I'd hate to wait and see them go up! 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 04, 2015, 03:48:35 PM
Well the batteries are out and I'm feeling good about that :)  After all I abused them with several mistakes  d* over the years and did, after all, add 4 used batteries roughly the same year and 'maybe' similar usage after the intial 3 years (1st 6 batts, then 1yr later 2 more, then 2 years later 4 more)....so with 12 all new GCB's and the information and knowledge I now have I think I can make them last a lot longer ;)

Specially if I add these: http://sunelec.com/solar-panels/24v-solar-panels/astronergy-310w-solar-panel.html

With 4 of those I'd more than triple my solar charging but I doubt I'll add them until next year now since I need a place to mount them and a controller etc etc...though I've toyed with the idea of trying to mount them on the rack I have now after removing the 3 that are there.  If I could offset them by 1/2 of a panel on each end I could probably get all 4 up there, or maybe just add some aluminum rails across the rack to mount them too.  After all, that would double my capacity immediately and I'd only need to install the 3 205w panels onto the roof of the porch....I'll give it some thought -- oh and I could probably then use the same MPPT controller for the new panels for the time being.  I'd just need to add a set of cables since the voltage would be too high with all 4 in series.  I've already got a combiner box so I would just have to run a set of new cables to the rack through the conduit and add 1 breaker to the combiner box and I'd be set.

Sure would beat spending all the money to do it all at once so I'm going to seriously consider it -- and the extra 20amps of charging power might make a whole heck of a lot of difference.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 08, 2015, 11:25:11 AM
After 5 days with no charging and after pulling the batteries around noon (so at least two hours of bulk charging and some trickle charging -- early morning to 10am still charges off solar but not the amps needed to boost) the batteries show 6.2v (one at 6.1 and one at 6.3) which is about 75% of cap (Trojan shows 6.19v as 70% and 6.25v as 80%). However the batteries were showing over 91% capacity so it is telling to see them at only 6.2vdc.

Wish I'd brought my SG tester with me!  It would be nice to see what the batteries are showing now since they've had lots of time to settle.

Either way I'm getting new batteries and will get them installed and charged and see how they perform with me paying a LOT more attention to them ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 08, 2015, 11:59:38 AM
Note: for the meter to show that it means I used 60+ amp hours since last full charge.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 09, 2015, 01:00:01 AM
Picked up 12 Costco (Interstate now) GC2 RC107 batteries today :)  Interstate shows them as 208AH batteries at the 20hr rate so I'll have to change my meter to read 624AH@24vdc

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/GC2_zpsnzarnfzu.jpg)
That's from Interstate -- now I can be sure I have the right charging specs (I was using a Trojan spec before which was pretty close actually).
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on August 09, 2015, 09:26:21 AM

It is good to have the manufacturers exact charging specs as thy do vary a little between brands. Do they also spec the specific gravity... there can be differences there at times too? 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 09, 2015, 11:22:49 AM
Quote from: MountainDon on August 09, 2015, 09:26:21 AM
It is good to have the manufacturers exact charging specs as thy do vary a little between brands. Do they also spec the specific gravity... there can be differences there at times too?

Haven't found that yet but I'm thinking I'll email them to get that info
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: troy on August 10, 2015, 10:37:44 AM
Eric,  I do hope you nail this solar stuff good.  I'm still trying to figure out a way to get to the 'hood and will likely need a ton of help when it's time to set mine up.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 10, 2015, 11:20:49 AM
So far I've managed to do pretty well and while I certainly abused the battery bank I don't think what I did was out of the ordinary for non solar-techy types. ;)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20150810_071706898_zpshzklvsol.jpg)
New batteries waiting to be delivered (yes crappy pic but they are just strapped into the back of the pickup for now).

Plan is to get them up to the cabin later this week and put them back where they were before with a few mods in the setup (moving the bus bars for example and stair stepping the batteries).

I still need to get a battery room worked out but for now they'll go back onto the porch.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 10, 2015, 11:38:48 AM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20150810_092941445_zpsp9iuswr7.jpg)
The RC 107 seems to denote a 208AH battery but I must admit Interstate doesn't have the best online resources that I can find.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 10, 2015, 12:03:54 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/BattCap_zpsj0lqlu5h.jpg)
For those interested I found this on Interstate's site which seems to say that Costco GC2 batteries that have an RC of 107 Minutes (at 75Amps) are a 208 AH capacity battery.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 10, 2015, 01:04:56 PM
http://www.flowsystemsusa.com/water-miser-vent-cap.html
Last post for a while ;)  Got work to do.

Anyway, anyone using these?  Will cost me $200 to get them but I'm thinking they've got to be worth it.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on August 10, 2015, 05:13:01 PM
I've seen them advertised, but have never been tempted enough to purchase them.

I question their claim of a reduced need for equalization. That, and the cost, are my main stumbling points.

I've been taught that equalizing is needed to help reverse any sulfation build up and to bring any low drifting sp. gr. readings back into line with the other cells. Equalizing also helps rid the cells of any stratification; where acid in the cell bottom is more concentrated than at the top. That is more of a problem in tall batteries than short ones (like GC-2's).

Now, I understand how the water miser caps can eliminate, or greatly reduce, the electrolyte misting that causes battery tops to be moist.  They contain plastic beads that provide a large surface area for the mist / vapor to collect on and then drip back into the cells. But I fail to understand how water miser caps can stop sulfation or stratification. If you have any ideas on that I am interested in hearing.

One more thing. I have no data to support this. If you had these caps installed and if you wanted to run an equalization cycle, would the water miser caps potentially be a problem? The are supposed to stop all misting of fluid out of the battery. Does that mean they would restrict the escape of the extra amounts of hydrogen and oxygen that is produced during equalization? If you had to remove the water miser caps if you equalized then you lose much of what they do as without a cap in place there is plenty of "bubble splash" out the cell openings.   ???


There are also Hydro Caps. They have a catalyst in the cap that causes the gaseous hydrogen and oxygen to recombine into water.  They have their own set of issues. They are even more money. They wear out eventually. And their instructions clearly state they must be removed to equalize.


I generally have only had to add water 2 or three times a year. I do spring and fall for certain and maybe half way through the summer, depending on fluid levels. I plan on peaking in the cells this week when I take and record the sp. gr. of all cells a few times a year anyhow. So when I have the cell caps off it's a simple enough matter to add water using the auto stop dispenser.  That's an additional reason I have not felt compelled to buy either system.

I'm hoping to get another couple of years out of our GC-2's. Then I hope to be able to find LFP's (lithium ferrous phosphate) cells have become a little more reasonable in price.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 11, 2015, 08:09:47 AM
QuoteYou can keep them closed. They are engineered to vent the additional pressure during equalization.

This from the manufacturer.

I think the part that I like the most and may pay the money for is that they retain more electrolytes and you have to fill and check less often.  With the sun we can get up here I find my batteries can need water often enough to be a pain ;)  Just something I have to always check and while I would still check it sounds like I'd lose less with the extended version of these things.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on August 11, 2015, 08:22:30 AM
Extreme water use / loss is a sign of old, crapped out batteries. The new ones should use a lot less water. 

Excessive water use / loss is also indicative of overcharging.   

The caps can't hurt anything but I'm just not convinced they are necessary. But that is just what I think about my situation.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 11, 2015, 10:48:34 AM
I always wonder about over charging but I think the MPPT controller isn't over charging them.  After all, I only have 20amps of charging power (max) for a 600AH battery bank so I'm thinking it was because of the abuse I gave them.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 11, 2015, 12:04:37 PM
No word from Interstate yet on SG readings but I did order the 2000ex watermizer caps for my batteries.  Yes the $200 for all 36 (after shipping) is a bit steep IMHO but I'm thinking these will be a good addition as they should help retain more of the water in the batteries, prevent the loss of electrolytes, reduce venting and help keep things much cleaner.  They will also make it easier to check SG readings I think since you just flip up the top (no more removing caps and laying them on the batteries etc).

I also ordered propane for the tank which is down to 20%.  Cost today is $1.90/g so better than last year and as I need 300 gallons it isn't as bad as we'd planned so the savings bought the caps :D

Now to get up there and re-install the batteries.  It's supposed to rain a lot this weekend (we need it!) so my plan is to run the genny for 3 to 5 hours after installing the bank to get it charged up.  Then I can reset the meter to the 608AH of cap and fully charged (after the charger hits float) and will be able to see how things go over the weekend with little sun etc.

I hope to get some road work done too as it will be damp and that's the best time.

Finally I plan to haul back as much wood as I can to make paneling at home in my new shop between cabin trips with the plan of getting it all done so I can bring it back and finish off the paneling this late summer/fall.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 13, 2015, 09:13:34 PM
Back at the cabin :)

First thing I noticed was the bear tracks in the driveway right up to the gate (leaving)
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/BearPrint_zps6vurhvsd.jpg)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/BearPrints_zpscneb6mv8.jpg)
Here he cross the driveway right between two game cams but just enough between them that they didn't catch him!  I moved one after that!

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/BearPrint2_zpseexvdkyt.jpg)
I have big hands....those are pretty good sized prints!

Once I was at the cabin and was done looking at bear tracks I got busy moving the bus bars for the batteries (one to either side instead of right above each other) and got the batteries installed so I could get the power going and cool the fridge down.  I was about 95 outside in the shade so that was the priority!

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/NewBatteries_zpsxaneirjr.jpg)
I need to get some new cables and move them all close to the cables to the breaker so they are all drawing pretty much the same at all times but for today this will suffice.

Next I went out to check the generator.  I'd forgotten to disconnect it's battery and discovered it was at 3.8v YIKES!  Ya I knew it was likely so I grabbed some jumper cables and charged it back up with the tractor...only the darn thing would not come to life!  ???

I checked everything out and the feed from the inverter was working, the ground was good and the battery was fully charged and on a jump...nadda.  Dead screen.  Never seen this before  ??? ???

I put a call into the nearest Generac service place about 90 minutes away and am hopeful they can come out this weekend and service the unit and fix whatever is wrong.  Of course, it's supposed to cloud over and rain too which while excellent for this time of year is not so much when no genny is available to help charge the batteries up!  Let's hope I get some sun tomorrow because I'll use a good 60 AH tonight which will draw the bank down to 90% or so and while that's ok I can't do that too much or I'll drop to 80% and have to kill power as I DO NOT want to draw these new batteries down too far.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 14, 2015, 11:45:18 AM
Nearest provider won't help but also says he wouldn't be much help and thinks the control board may have died :(  He advised I call Generac direct and see if they have any ideas....to replace the control board, which I'm told is pretty easy, will cost me a good $500!

yes OUCH!  FLIPPING OUCH!  d*
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 14, 2015, 12:09:34 PM
So far Generac hasn't been able to help me.  Their support has sent me to their industrial support to see if they can help but it sounds like the control board has quit.  It also sounds like they may replace it under warranty but want a service rep to go to the site...only the nearest says "NO WAY, too far too rugged, too busy"

So now I wait on hold to see what Industrial can come up with.  What I'm hoping is to get them to send me a new control board so I can swap it out and send back the old one if that works....we will see.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on August 15, 2015, 09:29:00 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on August 14, 2015, 12:09:34 PM
So far Generac hasn't been able to help me.  Their support has sent me to their industrial support to see if they can help but it sounds like the control board has quit.  It also sounds like they may replace it under warranty but want a service rep to go to the site...only the nearest says "NO WAY, too far too rugged, too busy"

So now I wait on hold to see what Industrial can come up with.  What I'm hoping is to get them to send me a new control board so I can swap it out and send back the old one if that works....we will see.

Their "Customer Support" has a lot to be desired.  It seems they want to go through their certified dealers to make all the repairs.  Don't give up.  A lot of telephone time to get your desired results.  They should develop a case # and all references will use this #.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 16, 2015, 09:09:56 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/NorthStar8-16_zpskkyqa3rr.jpg)
The North Star fire is now just about 6 miles south of the cabin and still heading north albeit slowly (knock on wood).

I've cut some fire lines around the cabin and removed most of my tools but expect to go back soon in order to work some more around the cabin to try to ensure we don't lose our place in this fire!

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on August 16, 2015, 09:29:20 PM
Dang. That sucks!   That is very unnerving; been there, done that. Three times in total. We wish you all the best luck.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: pmichelsen on August 16, 2015, 11:10:08 PM
Last year the fires were close to me as well, this year (so far) they have been a fair distance away. A few weeks ago Cal Fire came by and gave me the thumbs up and thanked us for keeping our property clear.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on August 17, 2015, 01:58:45 PM
Best of luck Erick - stay safe.  However if the winds are half way sane and you have disk for your tractor.  You  can lay down a lot of ground fuel and slow down or kill a fire. Trim up on your laddering fuel as high as you can with your chain saw and pile the brush away - a long ways away or laid out in low wind-rows work well as well...   

Have not seen anything around your digs in the photos that was real spooky.  Maybe the wood shed but so long as the fuel is pulled way back.....  Main thing man is stay safe and hope and pray for high humidity and low winds...

My renters they dumped out a bunch more cattle here hopping to eat down more fuel on the 180 acres that the house is built on. 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 17, 2015, 05:11:30 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0087_zpsqgkan94u.jpg)
Got more dirt now around the cabin :)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0090_zpstwg4pwvb.jpg)
Most of the area around the propane tank is now dirt, even on the far side and lots between and behind the generator and cabin (20 feet or so).

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0089_zpsvoqjlyqf.jpg)
Literally threw stickers on a wood pile that I still need to move, in order to get more dirt between the cabin and fuel

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0088_zpslisplety.jpg)
Most of my tools are out and as you can see more dirt :)  Tractor and ATV parked amidst several yards of bare ground.  Need to do more but I'm getting there.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0097_zpsnsn7amjt.jpg)
Taken from the top of the property.  That's 3 to 5 miles south of me and heading my way.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0098_zpsoamwzyzw.jpg)
No hills between us and that but still a lot of valley and homes etc so I'm hoping they stop it there before it gets into the more populated areas.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on August 17, 2015, 05:23:28 PM
It's always nice to have other homes between you and a wildfire... you know the fire fighters will be trying hard. Let's hope the winds are kind and the fire fighters fortunate and that nobody's homes get burnt. 



Can you see fires in the dark?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 18, 2015, 08:11:29 AM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/NorthStar8-18_zpsmdhqhz8r.jpg)
Not much between us now  :o :(

Can't get up there today but plan on being there tomorrow.  It's 2.8 miles south of me now (was 6.8 just a couple days ago) and I have a plan with my neighbors to put in some fire breaks.  We have 3 tractors and a cat between us to get to work and a neighbor down the hill has a tractor too....we're damn sure gonna try to stop that sucker!  Or at least make it go around us.

Have chainsaws ready!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on August 18, 2015, 09:19:12 AM
Black is your best friend now (good well aimed back fire)  - next best dust and dirt.  The USFS neighbor we have - in the 92 Foothills Fire (largest in the nation) roared through here. He and the fire boss had a plain and he did catch the wind just right.  He set his own back burn that knocked down enough fuel to force the fire around our properties.  Pretty much saved our bacon!

Be very careful when it comes to running at piece of farming equipment on USFS or BLM property.  If you get caught disking a fireline on their property = $$$$$ in fines if they see you.  At least that is the way it is here.  Common sense goes right out the window with most of the eco bosses.  Three or four bosses got in a shouting match with one - then almost a fist fight in the 2013 fire up here.  Just to get one to claim down and drive off.......  It is not over with from what I understand.  Statute of limitations are about over with in days I think!           

We here seem to have ample help around houses and cabins.       
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 18, 2015, 09:54:09 AM
Don:  Haven't been up there at night to look yet but my neighbor above me says "yes".

Rick:  Only firebreaks we'll put in will be on private land and we won't back burn...so dry here we'd probably burn everyone else out.  Our plan is to divert the fire around us as much as possible and to give the firefighters a reason to help us save our places ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on August 18, 2015, 10:20:23 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on August 18, 2015, 09:54:09 AM
Don:  Haven't been up there at night to look yet but my neighbor above me says "yes".

Rick:  Only firebreaks we'll put in will be on private land and we won't back burn...so dry here we'd probably burn everyone else out.  Our plan is to divert the fire around us as much as possible and to give the firefighters a reason to help us save our places ;)

Don't get me wrong I am NOT advocating any private back burn.  Terry our neighbor the guy that set the 92 backburn is a USFS trail and timber guy but all and all pretty smart fireguy as well.  He will stop in and if you ask give you a good critique   -  BTW I seen way too may back burns go bad.  More went bad in the 92 fire than good.  I mean they went real bad....  From their little golf ball or ping pong ball fire starters out of helicopters to the guys on the ground they just went stupid wrong that year.  Fact I told them when they wanted to back burn this in the 92 fire  to take a hike.  My dad and a couple neighbors about choked when I told them that.....2013 fire they were way more better it lighting them and not letting them get away.  However they the firefighters will all tell you black is the best color right now.....
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 18, 2015, 11:29:08 AM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20150817_125838111_zps86ykxuqc.jpg)
Back side of the cabin was one of my main concerns but at least now there is dirt between it and anything combustable (for the most part anyway).  I plan to do more work here this week.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20150817_125825512_zpsj0xxk8ii.jpg)
Another shot behind the cabin showing the propane tank.  I put in those bricks as a temp wall though I doubt they do any good I figured they can't hurt.  I've got more and plan to put some behind the tank too.  I'm thinking they might work as a bit of a heat shield if nothing else.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20150817_125748706_zpsiws66hrd.jpg)
Shot from the other side of the tank.  Still need to remove some of the saplings near the tank and get more dirt in there.  That's the next phase.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 18, 2015, 11:39:30 AM
Generac has called and agreed to replace the controller on the generator under warranty :)  Now we just need to wait for the fire concern to abate a little before making that move ;)

Meanwhile I ordered a battery cutoff switch so it will be easy to disco the battery when I leave the cabin with the inverter off.

With luck we'll have the gen back up and running in a couple weeks and of course, with a little more luck the fire will have been contained!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on August 18, 2015, 11:56:56 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on August 18, 2015, 11:39:30 AM
Generac has called and agreed to replace the controller on the generator under warranty :)  Now we just need to wait for the fire concern to abate a little before making that move ;)

Meanwhile I ordered a battery cutoff switch so it will be easy to disco the battery when I leave the cabin with the inverter off.

Good news from Generac.

Eric does your inverter have a SOC setting.  On mine if I disconnect the batteries the generator has to run on manual to get it out of the "thinkin" mode and establish what 100% SOC is again.  Once that is established I can switch it back to Auto.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on August 18, 2015, 01:25:33 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on August 18, 2015, 11:29:08 AM

Back side of the cabin was one of my main concerns but at least now there is dirt between it and anything combustable (for the most part anyway).

A suggestion.... too late for right now, but assuming the fire bypasses you, file this away for future thought.

The reason we skirted the bottom of our cabin was for keeping windblown wildfire embers from being blown under the cabin. Wildfire embers are not what we see when we have a campfire. They can be as big as your fist. Even bigger.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 18, 2015, 04:29:41 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on August 18, 2015, 01:25:33 PM
A suggestion.... too late for right now, but assuming the fire bypasses you, file this away for future thought.

The reason we skirted the bottom of our cabin was for keeping windblown wildfire embers from being blown under the cabin. Wildfire embers are not what we see when we have a campfire. They can be as big as your fist. Even bigger.

Sadly that has been a plan for some time but I've just not gotten it done!  I think I may put some wood skirting in to try to limit that problem....good idea!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 18, 2015, 04:30:44 PM
Quote from: Redoverfarm on August 18, 2015, 11:56:56 AM
Good news from Generac.

Eric does your inverter have a SOC setting.  On mine if I disconnect the batteries the generator has to run on manual to get it out of the "thinkin" mode and establish what 100% SOC is again.  Once that is established I can switch it back to Auto.

Nope.  I use a battery meter that does all that.  It uses AH removed, charging voltages and amps going in (drop off point etc) to determine 100% soc
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on August 18, 2015, 05:08:58 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on August 18, 2015, 04:29:41 PM
Sadly that has been a plan for some time but I've just not gotten it done!  I think I may put some wood skirting in to try to limit that problem....good idea!

Got tin?  Even old with holes will work. 

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: kenhill on August 18, 2015, 06:39:40 PM
We had a fire 7 miles away from our cabin in Willow, Alaska.  A neighbor was wiping the ash off of the white seats on his platform boat.  He said some of them left scorch marks.  Very scary.  many have hooked up water pumps to sprinklers on their cabin and plan to run them if there is a fire.  There is no power, so all of it would be run by generators.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 18, 2015, 11:16:37 PM
Sadly no old tin.  Only old plywood but I can wet it...I can berm up sand though and put bricks down too and rocks...I'll be working it!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 19, 2015, 09:14:02 AM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Fires%208-19_zpswuxyefmf.jpg)
Getting pretty crazy in the Okanogan!

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/NorthStar8-19_zpscnnech4j.jpg)
Less than 2 miles from me now and I'm heading back today!  Wish me luck!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on August 19, 2015, 09:37:07 AM
Fingers crossed Eric
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 19, 2015, 08:05:51 PM
Put in more fire break roads and filled a 2nd 55gal drum of water.  Installed a hand pump on one drum and filled 4 5 gal buckets and set on the deck.  Also put a sprinkler on the deck so I can turn it on if needed.

Fire is close and wind is not going the way we want right now but also not directly at us so it's a toss up.  They are evacuating or recommending to do so, the area around me but also from Riverside (north of Omak) all the way to Tonasket and wast to Waukonda so it's really tough to say where is safe these days.  At a fire meeting though they basically said they just wanted people out of the way but if you wanted to protect your home you could do that.

Meanwhile the Tunk fire is headed north now and there could be an issue with it but it's a lot further away.  At this point I plan to stay and work until I feel it's just no longer safe.  Wish me luck! (and thanks Don!)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: John Raabe on August 19, 2015, 08:47:55 PM
Sending you cooling thoughts from Puget Sound. Even Whidbey Island has high fire danger this year.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on August 19, 2015, 10:44:45 PM
Quote from: John Raabe on August 19, 2015, 08:47:55 PM
Sending you cooling thoughts from Puget Sound. Even Whidbey Island has high fire danger this year.

Was just up your way John and it was the great brown out in Emerald City.......  But I remember when I was a kid some summers up there were very hot and dry when visiting my grandmother.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on August 19, 2015, 10:52:55 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on August 19, 2015, 08:05:51 PM

Meanwhile the Tunk fire is headed north now and there could be an issue with it but it's a lot further away.  At this point I plan to stay and work until I feel it's just no longer safe.  Wish me luck! (and thanks Don!)


Need not say this but will - just do not forget to give yourself a safe bug out route.  As some one that has been there a couple times...  Best of luck my friend........



Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: UK4X4 on August 20, 2015, 09:35:36 AM
Hope all goes well Eric, I'll send some of our special horizontal rain from Scotland !
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: upa on August 20, 2015, 12:06:23 PM
Sorry to hear of your troubles Eric. Know how you feel we had to deal with this same problem 3 years ago, fires came within 3 miles of our cabin. Did what we could but ultimately felt helpless. Best wishes.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 20, 2015, 02:03:19 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Fire1_zpsczoiubjp.jpg)
Looking South
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Fire2_zpsm0l0joev.jpg)
Closer look -- trees were blowing up on that hill last night and it's 1.5m south of me

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/FireSE_zpstpqoeguf.jpg)
South East

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Cabin2_zpsqmaicjk8.jpg)
Staging water

Still at it and hoping to get more done.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: UK4X4 on August 20, 2015, 02:19:00 PM
Going by the map it looks like the valley between you and the fire is a road and has less tree's in the valley,  are they prepping a fire defence line ?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 20, 2015, 09:52:10 PM
I've pulled out.  We had a madatory evac and I had water problems on top of it so left.  Good thing I did!  The Tunk fire (several miles east of us) jumped north over 4 miles!  They have closed the hiway out of Tonasket for 12 miles east to Aeneas Valley road (where our place is) and if that fire jumped 4 miles in that short time the fire south of us must have also!  That would mean it jumped right through us if it went north.

They are evacuating Tonasket and telling them all to go to Brewster which is about 50 miles south!  Things are getting out of hand!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on August 20, 2015, 09:59:37 PM
 :(
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 20, 2015, 10:03:44 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Fires%208-20a_zps6aztnuon.jpg)
The fire on the left is the original Okanogan Complex Fire and the Tunk Fire which have now merged.  The Tunk portion jumped over 4 miles in the last few hours and went North over the hiway (20) which they've now closed.  The fire below the cabin was a LOT closer than that so I'm now very worried!

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Fires%208-20_zpsx2qaqlnu.jpg)

QuoteThe Omak-Okanogan County Chronicle

The Tunk Block Fire has jumped state Highway 20 east of Tonasket. The highway is closed from Tonasket to the Aeneas Valley turnoff.

Let's hope all my dirt work pays off!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 20, 2015, 10:05:14 PM
http://www.mappingsupport.com/p/gmap4.php?ll=48.700931%2C-119.443359&z=11&t=h%2CWind_in_6_hrs%2CMODIS_thermal%2CCurrent_fire&q=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.propertylinemaps.com%2Fp%2Fpublic_land_map%2FUSA%2FUSA_wildland_fire.txt

Scary map. 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on August 20, 2015, 10:25:15 PM
I've been using. http://inciweb.nwcg.gov. but it can lag behind

Heartfelt very best of luck to you
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on August 20, 2015, 10:44:09 PM
Eric from some of the photos I got the last couple days from a couple loggers up your way you did right...  Not to mention the tragic loss off life yesterday. So sad...  That is one crazy hot rolling windy fire.  92 Foothills Fire was one of those we are just lucky we never lost any lives.   But it was spotting fires several miles ahead of the main inferno.  Keep us posted..... 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Kyo on August 20, 2015, 11:03:26 PM
Got my fingers crossed for your cabin! Way to many fires this year. My Great Grandma and great aunt Live not to far from you on Cape Labelle just off Aeneas valley road. Last I heard they left there place around 5pm. My great uncles place west of riverside is now gone from what my grandfather told us on the phone just now, luckily his family was out of town. Not to mention the firefighter's that have been lost. I hope this all takes a turn for the better. The wind they are forecasting is not going to help any..
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 20, 2015, 11:05:39 PM
Tunk jumped but no news of North Star so it might not have.  We had some reversing of the winds so maybe we got luck...we can hope!

Cape Labelle is right above me more or less -- though you'd access it via Aeneas a few miles west....good thing they got out when they did!  The road is closed now.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on August 20, 2015, 11:08:18 PM
Three firefighters up at Twisp, Washington gave their all, four more injured.  it is one crazy fire anyone up that way stay safe....

Posted to FB and gleaned from there photographer unknown.....

(https://i593.photobucket.com/albums/tt15/rick91351/11885185_430904940451685_5080780819278135895_n_zpsyrdq2783.jpg)

(https://i593.photobucket.com/albums/tt15/rick91351/11903759_430904943785018_6552457608516924986_n_zpseszfgtxs.jpg)

 



Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 20, 2015, 11:16:28 PM
Very sad Rick :(  Heard that yesterday and I think a 4th has passed away now too.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Fires%208-20b_zpsso8v946k.jpg)
Looking at this data set on Google Earth I noticed something -- WE may have dodged a bullet!!!!!!  Look at the red blocks, those represet the newest part of the fires...Tunk moved North towards (and already across just not on this map) HWY20 BUT North Star pushed EAST!!!!  If that is what happened and it holds through tomorrow I might dodge one huge bullet!

I'm off to bed and will be hoping and praying on this one!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 21, 2015, 08:26:35 AM
Looks like I was right when looking at the sat data last night and the fire moved East away from me!  WhooHoo!  Tunk still worries me, as does the fire south of me but so far so good and a north wind is coming!

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Fares-OK-8-21%20800x497_zpsoepk5cps.jpg)
First the map used by the local PUD to show the extent of this massive fire.  Anyone with cabins or homes in the Okanogan is in danger right now :(

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Fires%208-21_zpscmydmsim.jpg)
Next a closer in of where I am.  So far so good. 

I'll watch it today and see how it develops but it looks like I can get back in tomorrow and fix my water and stay there
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: kenhill on August 21, 2015, 11:47:50 AM
Hope your place is passed over....
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 21, 2015, 12:14:19 PM
So far so good!  However the winds are blowing 30+ mph to the south and hammering Omak and Okanogan with a fire storm!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on August 21, 2015, 01:45:24 PM
Got'a catalog from St Lawrence Nurseries - one of the one people on staff decided he wanted to buy it.  Bill and Diana MacKentley will be hangin' 'round advising.....  Just handling apple trees this year!!!     [cool]

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 21, 2015, 02:15:43 PM
Quote from: rick91351 on August 21, 2015, 01:45:24 PM
Got'a catalog from St Lawrence Nurseries - one of the one people on staff decided he want to buy it.  Bill and Diana MacKentley will be hangin' 'round advising.....  Just handling apple trees this year!!!     [cool]

YAY!!  THANKS for telling me!  I'll order RIGHT AWAY!!!  Man oh man that is super news! :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: nailit69 on August 22, 2015, 08:49:12 AM
Glad your place is safe... looks like the main fire is quite a ways south of our place but I hear Tonasket has been evacuated.  We cleared about 100'  around our place when we did the foundation and it's in a short grass valley so hopefully it's safe... it's the aspen grove behind us that worries me, there's a lot of big tinder dry trees back in there. 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 22, 2015, 10:52:08 PM
Tonasket was for a short time but it's not now.  Aeneas Valley is still level 3 but it appears to be pretty calm right now though the smoke is very thick!  From what I can tell there isn't any new fire action my way and the winds are calm.  The temps are dropping to and are expected to get to the mid 30's tonight.  I actually needed to use a heater to warm the cabin a little as it was a little too chilly for me.

I'm staying here tonight and hoping that isn't a bad decision but I've looked at the fire maps, talked with locals and fire crews etc and am fairly certain that I'll be fine for at least the time it takes to get some sleep ;)  My feeling is that as long as the wind stays down and the temps are down the fire 'should' behave the way it has so far. Which is to say that it tends to calm down more at night for some reason (temps and calmer winds I'm guessing) and doesn't seem to move a lot at night. 

I also have burned area between me and the active fire so I'm thinking we probably pretty safe.  Can't say I like being alone in the midst of the potential dangers (no one to warn me) but again, I've done my homework and am fairly certain it's ok.

I sound crazy right? LOL but there are people below me camped in campers in what they feel is a safe area and the store owner (a member here) also seems confident and he's providing the fuel for the trucks so has about as good a scoop as anyone.

So I'm going to relax and try to get some sleep before getting back at it tomorrow.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 22, 2015, 11:19:00 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Fire8-22_zpsefks8rbw.jpg)
Latest fire map.  Looks ok but of course a great deal of caution is important.  I'll sleep lightly and check the status in the middle of the night.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 23, 2015, 05:43:56 AM
THe smoke is too much for me...I'm going to head to less smoky ground
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 23, 2015, 11:23:56 AM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Fire/8-23am_zpsj7z8emad.jpg)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on August 23, 2015, 05:12:44 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on August 23, 2015, 05:43:56 AM
THe smoke is too much for me...I'm going to head to less smoky ground

I don't blame you.  I hate it when I can see the crap in the air I'm breathing. Or see it falling out of the air and settling on anything horizontal.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 23, 2015, 07:18:14 PM
Going to spend the night at a friends in town after grabbing a few things from the cabin and shutting down the power.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on August 24, 2015, 12:37:45 PM
I looks like it's flashing up again to the east of you - thankfully it's quite a ways east of your place.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 24, 2015, 12:44:47 PM
Yup, trying to surround me!  But I saw aling of bulldozers to the west of me working to put the brakes on the Tunk fire....your area is NOT looking good this morning!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 26, 2015, 05:33:43 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Fire/Fares-OK-8-26_zps1xtlhqcs.jpg)
Things look much better!

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Fire/Fires%208-26_zpswk8lm21y.jpg)\
I think we're looking very good with all fires 5 or more miles away now!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: SkagitDrifter on August 26, 2015, 05:55:45 PM

Fingers crossed for you OJH.
Be safe out there.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on August 27, 2015, 01:11:54 AM
yeah, your place looks pretty good.... checked the map again tonight when I got home (a few minutes ago) and it's back on top of me again.  Seems to pick up in the late afternoon/early evening.  Apparently the inversion almost puts it out during the day, but fails to extinguish it completely
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 27, 2015, 08:16:59 AM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Fire/Fires%208-27_zpsapto7n1q.jpg)
Not so fast it seems....sheesh can we catch a break?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 27, 2015, 08:37:46 AM
Winds out of the south and south west today with gusts as high as 25mph and low humidity with high heat....shat!  :(  No break, no rest for the weary.  We need that bloody rain.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: SkagitDrifter on August 27, 2015, 09:27:46 AM

Hang in there Erik- good things happen to good people.
Prayers sent for you, your neighbors and the fire crews.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on August 27, 2015, 12:31:17 PM
yeah, I wish they'd get this knocked down.  I know they are doing a great job, and it's got to be frustrating for them, too.  It's just really hard sitting here 6 hours away and not being able to do much or see much. (which is why I really appreciated you driving up Buzzard Lake road, OJH - I owe you a few brews for that - or their equivalent in whatever liquid currency you enjoy  ;) :D)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 31, 2015, 08:39:05 AM
Work has kept me busy lately and the Level3 Evac and massive smoke kept me from the cabin (where I usually stay when working up there) but I managed to get by yesterday and all was well.  Heck, even the sun was out ;)

Fire activity seems to be very minimal at the moment and we've had some rain and cooler weather so here's hoping it continues to get better :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on August 31, 2015, 10:34:53 AM
Eric it sounds as if you dodged the bullet on this one.  Hopefully you will have plenty of time to prepare for the next (hoping there isn't) one.  Always think you are prepared and then you have one of those "I should have done this or that" moments.  Well now you know exactly what can be done.  Hope the smoke clears.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 31, 2015, 10:55:28 AM
Thanks and yes!  Much to do but I'm hopeful we don't go through this again for a while!!!  Sheesh two years in a row!  Yikes.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 31, 2015, 02:12:47 PM
And now for something completely different ;)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0203%20800x600_zpsz2vaprcb.jpg)
I recently purchased this off Amazon for my generator.  My plan is to install it so I can easily and quickly disconnect the generator when I won't be around and don't want its battery to die because the power is off and not charging.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0206%20800x600_zpslln9nxgs.jpg)
It's a simple disco switch

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0207%20800x680_zpsd6luod2w.jpg)
I just have to flip it up and the battery will be disconnected.  Then when I return I flip it down to reconnect the battery and the generator will be back in action and available for backup power.

No more dead battery! :D

Can't wait to install.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on August 31, 2015, 04:26:08 PM
 [cool]  On negative terminal, right.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 31, 2015, 05:13:05 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on August 31, 2015, 04:26:08 PM
[cool]  On negative terminal, right.

ah yup
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on September 07, 2015, 09:39:20 PM
I noticed there was still some area burning out your way ... at least the satellite map was showing it.  How are things up your way?  I've not been up yet, the home front is a bit wacky lately
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 08, 2015, 08:32:19 AM
Just heard that we are now level 1 :)  I'm going up Friday if all goes well and will report but so far so good!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Aeneas_Valley on September 09, 2015, 11:00:11 PM
Hello folks. I'm getting ready to close on some property just off Aeneas Valley Rd. Was bummed to find out that 200 sq ft was the "max" size of a detached bldg, with 1 floor and you can't sleep in it. Planned on building a 16 x 24 shed/cabin for starters. Said you need plans and have it inspected too. There aren't any buildings on any of the surrounding properties, so I'm thinking it might be easier to ask for forgiveness, rather than permission? Was going with composting toilet, water storage and a generator and solar for starters. Thoughts please?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: nailit69 on September 11, 2015, 07:50:04 AM
Quote from: Aeneas_Valley on September 09, 2015, 11:00:11 PM
Hello folks. I'm getting ready to close on some property just off Aeneas Valley Rd. Was bummed to find out that 200 sq ft was the "max" size of a detached bldg, with 1 floor and you can't sleep in it. Planned on building a 16 x 24 shed/cabin for starters. Said you need plans and have it inspected too. There aren't any buildings on any of the surrounding properties, so I'm thinking it might be easier to ask for forgiveness, rather than permission? Was going with composting toilet, water storage and a generator and solar for starters. Thoughts please?

Aeneas, you should start your own build thread... that way we can follow your project, cuz trust me... we all love to follow along.

I've also got property out that way... near Loomis.  I had a short conversation with my "neighbor" about permitted vs. non permitted and he suggested we just build and ask for forgiveness if it ever becomes an issue.  There aren't many "permitted" structures out near me.  If you're remote, I wouldn't worry about it... if you've got unfriendly neighbors you might want to weigh your options a little more carefully.  Not sure how it works but I believe you can get a 30 day cabin permit but if you don't get one and they don't know you're there who's to say how long you've been there?  If you start installing septic or drilling a well... they're probably gonna want to talk to you.  Mine is zoned Agricultural so i'm building a "Barn"... for my horse ;)... pack it in, pack it out.

I'm building an unpermitted (to code) 14'x24' w/full basement and loft, 1200 gals. of stored water, composting toilet, genny/solar powered, woodstove heat, etc..  I'm a professional carpenter and I know what i'm doing so i'm not too worried about being up to code but I also circumnavigated the permit process.  I just didn't have the time to go through the process or the extra money to be honest.  I've got the foundation in and ready to build on but i'm putting my project on hold until spring rather than building half of it and leaving it exposed to the winter elements... i'll hit it hard about April or May next year and should have a cabin about July 4 2016... that was the plan this year but other things happened.

Everything you need can be found locally for pretty reasonable prices, friendly and helpful folks in town, great place it seems...  all I think about when I have to leave is how soon I can get back.

Good luck and looking forward to following your project.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 11, 2015, 06:40:33 PM
Thanks Nailit -- good post.

As someone said to me once "don't worry, the tax man will come, re-asses and raise your taxes" which is exactly what happened.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 12, 2015, 06:42:59 PM
Finally after entirely too long I got around to installing (mostly) the fresh air intake on my woodstove).
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/InstallingAirIntake_zpsjyx37ppt.jpg)
Trying to drill the hole through the hardy board dulled my cheap holesaw....so I finished it with a razor knife.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/InstallingAirIntake3.JPG.JPG_zpsggwungyi.jpg)
Installed the air box which I got a LOT cheaper on ebay ;)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/AirIntake_zps6txxrztf.jpg)
Dryer vent installed through the wall and secured with a roofing screw since I could see no other way to secure it to the box.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Vent_zpsyovthnkd.jpg)
Simple vent which should help keep most bugs out (it is screened on the inside) and those that make it in will be incinerated so to heck with them.  It's louvred to keep the water out and sealed with Trempro.  I'll trim it at some point.

This took me a lot longer becasue of the dulled hole saw causing me to finally give up and cut the outside hole with a sawsall (which worked well since I had the grooves cut by the holesaw.  Now I just need some high temp sealer for the inside and maybe, just maybe 'll get to installing the brick soon!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 13, 2015, 07:14:42 PM
Busy day at the cabin today. Managed to get a lot of wood stacked in the back of the truck after squaring up a bunch of it on the mill. Watered the orchard (what's left of it) and set the timer to water it every 72 hours again now that I'm not as worried about the fires) and got tools put back in the shed. Then washed off the deck (after cleaning it and sweeping off most of the ash the bear dumped on it) and generally just cleaned up etc. Then had a shower and shave to feel human again and did the dishes too :)

Now I'll read for a bit then will visit with the neighbors on the deck and watch for wildlife  c*
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on September 13, 2015, 11:55:37 PM
Wish I could make it up there myself ... being out of work has once more put a financial crimp in my style.

Hopefully I can save up a few extra $$ and gas will drop a bit further and I'll make it up. If I do, and you're up, we'll have to have coffee to somthing
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Yonderosa on September 14, 2015, 07:20:59 AM
Glad your place escaped the fire OJH. 

It just missed us too.  Burned halfway through the 20 acre parcel next to me. The little bit of rain we had came just in time and been able to keep the lid on for the most part since.

NOT what you want to see anywhere near your cabin.
(https://i1115.photobucket.com/albums/k542/WhitSpurzon/Yonderosa%202015/1-021_zpspuknwgpq.jpg)

A few of my neighbors were not so lucky.

(https://i1115.photobucket.com/albums/k542/WhitSpurzon/Yonderosa%202015/1-Fire%20B%20043_zps056kwqry.jpg)

(https://i1115.photobucket.com/albums/k542/WhitSpurzon/Yonderosa%202015/1-Fire%20039_zps9mewmbx1.jpg)

I'm not sure what the number actually was but I now for a fact it was higher than what the officials were reporting.

We didn't have much of an official response on our side of the hill initially. Ranchers did their best to save their places and stock with irrigation equipment they had.  Two members of our community had purchased fire trucks and we did the best we could with them.

(https://i1115.photobucket.com/albums/k542/WhitSpurzon/Yonderosa%202015/1-Fire%20B%20047_zpshruheglf.jpg)

(https://i1115.photobucket.com/albums/k542/WhitSpurzon/Yonderosa%202015/1-Fire%20B%20028_zpsiv74bs1w.jpg)

Not fun.
(https://i1115.photobucket.com/albums/k542/WhitSpurzon/Yonderosa%202015/1-fire%20and%20critters%20052_zps1ijciqtf.jpg)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 14, 2015, 07:39:41 AM
Yonderosa!  I've been thinking of you and wondering how you faired as you were in the eastern side of the Tunk fire if you are where I think you are.  I kept thinking "I sure hope Yonderosa's place survived!"

SO I'm very glad it did!  Now we just have to hope Jeff's place made it through and I suspect there are others out there in CP Forum that are in the area too.

Crazy stuff!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Yonderosa on September 14, 2015, 05:48:36 PM
I've got two friends that are your neighbors in the valley that (so far) have escaped the flames.  Larry came pretty close and they are still doing back fires in his local, and Rob is actually moving stuff back in. Dang scary for a while, he squirted so much water on his place the door swelled to the point there weren't no opening it.

I heard the Forest Service road between us was closed to fire suppression activity and fallen timber. It was a big one.  Already screwed up hunting, though I do have a concentration of Whitetail Does and fawns on my place.  What was shaping up to be a stellar Grouse year looks like maybe not now.  Already seen quite a few Bears taken, unfortunately it's been because of fenders. I don't think I've ever seen so many road killed bears before.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 14, 2015, 06:08:47 PM
I've seen more bears this year on my side of the valley and figure the fires might be pushing more animals my way.

You spending more time up at the cabin this year?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Yonderosa on September 15, 2015, 07:47:34 PM
We've been up every month for at least four days at a time.

Haven't seen many living Bears this year.  Got a few on trail camera.  Kept the baby Moose streak going. This is the last picture I got before the fire.

(https://i1115.photobucket.com/albums/k542/WhitSpurzon/Yonderosa%202015/Yonderosa%20critter%20cam%20315/1-Yonderosa%20critter%20cam%20B%20025_zpsvndhwmfz.jpg)

Got one of these hanging around again.

(https://i1115.photobucket.com/albums/k542/WhitSpurzon/Yonderosa%202015/1-Yonderosa%20Critter%20Cam%20C%20111-001_zpsn8iuftxy.jpg)

He's real tough on the Turkeys.

Lots of Deer, both Mulie and Whitetails. Plenty of Coyotes of course.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on September 17, 2015, 10:19:12 AM
Quote from: Yonderosa on September 14, 2015, 05:48:36 PM
  Already seen quite a few Bears taken, unfortunately it's been because of fenders. I don't think I've ever seen so many road killed bears before.

That must take some skill!  I'm not sure I could kill a bear with a guitar... Although I think I'd prefer Ibinez instead  d*
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: knopfarrow on September 17, 2015, 11:32:33 AM
JavaMan: do you remember Quick Draw McGraw's alter ego "El Kabong"?!

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quick_Draw_McGraw

He could take down a bear with a guitar, but only when swinging from a rope.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Scotdark on September 17, 2015, 10:47:44 PM
Ok now this threads getting good.. Quick draw McGraw really?? That's reachng
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 18, 2015, 08:14:49 AM
Quote from: Scotdark on September 17, 2015, 10:47:44 PM
Ok now this threads getting good.. Quick draw McGraw really?? That's reachng

That is sorta insulting but I realize some are trying to have fun here ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on September 18, 2015, 05:00:57 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on September 18, 2015, 08:14:49 AM
That is sorta insulting but I realize some are trying to have fun here ;)

Normally this type of behavior is linked to full moons........  earth quakes and change of season.  Oh ya and the Sockeye run!!!   :D  Happens all the time.  Yeppers!!!  But you want to talk guitars Trigger - Willies old Martin rules.  It will be one that is elected into the Hall of Fame in its own right and merit! Seen it up close and personal this summer.   [cool]  I am still having flash backs!!!  Must a been somethin' in the air!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 19, 2015, 09:00:44 AM
LOL I was having a little fun with that "this thread is starting to get interesting" comment ;)

So good to be back up here.  I realize I'm up here a lot and say that a lot but then that ought to say something!  LOL

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 21, 2015, 11:38:45 AM
http://www.graystove.com/
I've been looking for some small wood stove options for guest cabins.  This might be the way to go!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: tommytebco on September 21, 2015, 04:01:32 PM
or, for light duty, this one is almost an order of magnitude less expensive

http://www.sportsmansguide.com/product/index/hq-issue-outdoor-wood-stove?a=1884248
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 21, 2015, 04:04:45 PM
That might work but I think the Gray is a much better built (re: longer lasting) and permanent type stove.

My thought is that one day I'll build those bedroom cabins and would like a small simple woodstove for them.  As well as when I get a bedroom addition onto the main cabin since it will be far enough away from the main stove that on cold winter nights it may need some additional heating (like minus 20 degree nights) ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: nailit69 on September 22, 2015, 03:01:33 AM
Kind of small but I love the Gray... I really like the rivets and contrasting colors.  I wonder if he builds any bigger/higher BTU models... that would look real nice in my cabin.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 22, 2015, 11:23:57 AM
Quote from: nailit69 on September 22, 2015, 03:01:33 AM
Kind of small but I love the Gray... I really like the rivets and contrasting colors.  I wonder if he builds any bigger/higher BTU models... that would look real nice in my cabin.

I think they do custom work but the Vermont castings Aspen works pretty well and is even an approved stove in WA albeit expensive at $1k or so
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: nailit69 on September 22, 2015, 07:26:50 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on September 22, 2015, 11:23:57 AM
I think they do custom work but the Vermont castings Aspen works pretty well and is even an approved stove in WA albeit expensive at $1k or so

I've got an older Sweet Home airtight that i'll probably repaint and use up there... it'll heat my shop up in about 20-30 minutes so im sure it will do good out in the Okanogan, been in the family for close to 30 yrs and I know it very well.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 09, 2015, 08:21:52 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Night-Bear_zpseh2emjbc.jpg)
Recent visitor to the cabin
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on October 10, 2015, 06:40:23 AM
Eric I had one like that at the cabin (for the second time) but he was a little camera shy.  I had three logs left from the initial construction which I stacked along the drive.  They had been there for 6+ years to the point they had rotted.  The bear pulverized them looking for grubs. 

(https://i220.photobucket.com/albums/dd161/redoverfarm/hightop/101_5139_zpspsekldhr.jpg) (https://s220.photobucket.com/user/redoverfarm/media/hightop/101_5139_zpspsekldhr.jpg.html)

If you look in the upper center you will see one similar lying on the ground.  They were 6"X8" originally.  Since then he/she returned and rolled it over also.  But again it didn't enter into the view finder.  Oh yes I found undisputed evidence behind the cabin in the yard but I won't post it because it looks like Crap.  ;)  I showed a picture to my son and his comment was "thats a big bear" because of the size (10" X 10").  I told him maybe he just found a lot of grubs.  ;D

Seems due to the sightings and recent activity that their population is increasing in this area.  Good mass this year.  I had a neighbor that came to the house the other evening and asked me to cut a tree out of the road leading to their cabin some 4 miles past mine.  Just before I got to the location I seen three running up the road in front of me as I rounded a turn just before the downed tree.  Note to self " take out the trash when leaving the cabin".
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 10, 2015, 10:14:54 AM
Yup, this is the year of the bear me thinks.l  I've seen more this year than in the last 6.

Hmmm....I do like bear done in a crock pot ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on October 10, 2015, 11:01:06 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on October 10, 2015, 10:14:54 AM
Yup, this is the year of the bear me thinks.l  I've seen more this year than in the last 6.

Hmmm....I do like bear done in a crock pot ;)

I usually don't care much for the meat but there is an exception.  One of the old timers wife that my son plays music with has got the patent on edible bear meat recipe.  She uses a cooking bag, roast beef seasoning and bakes the shoulder.  Delicious!  But the key according to her is to absolutely trim all the fat off first.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 10, 2015, 05:20:08 PM
Not unsimilar to what I've done:  cook shoulder in crockpot for 4 hrs after trimming fat.  Cook in beef gravy and seasonings

Meanwhile back at the cabin:
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/NewCaps_zpsuyonk5et.jpg)
I wasn't sure I posted this before but here is a shot of the new battery bank installed right before the fire.  I put the caps on during the fire (at a point I thought I'd be ok) and actually am pretty darn happy with them.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 10, 2015, 05:28:18 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Cookies2_zpsadwprvpr.jpg)
Managed to mill up two cookies today.  One is pretty badly checked so may not be usable but as these are the first I've done it was a bit of a learning experience.  I plan to plane, stain and varathane.  Then if all appears good to go with them I'll put some mortices in them and stick legs on them for end tables or stools.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/White-Spelt-Bread_zpso8ukw7fr.jpg)
Had a hankerin for a sandwhich made with fresh bread today so I made the bread :)  1/4 Spelt flour the rest white.  Darn good!  At half the 1st loaf already! lol

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/White-Spelt-Bread2_zps7ucaaxhk.jpg)
My recipe is VERY easy to make and I have to admit I love the fact that I have it on hand and ready to mix up, rise and bake whenever I'm here.  Sorta just adds to the fall trips :)

Recipe:

5 cups of flour (bread, all purpose, whatever.  Best if made with 4 cups of white and one cup of spelt, wheat or rye for flavor)
1 TBS & 1tsp of Fast Acting Yeast
~2tsp of sea salt (no iodine)
2 cups warm water.

Mix well then knead in bowl until easy to pick up (might be a little sticky -- but should be light to the feel)
Knead some more on an oiled surface until you feel it's a little rubbery (or stretchy might be a better word)

Place in pans to rise (or make a ball and let rise on a cast iron frying pan) until about double in size.
Preheat oven to 425F

Bake for ~30-35 minutes (bread should be 190F in the center when done but I've made it for so long I just bake until I decide it's done which is about 30 minutes at that temp unless you want a crispier and thicker crust then 35 or so.

Let cool for 15 minutes or more and enjoy
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 13, 2015, 04:55:55 PM
It's been a while!  I've been back and forth to the cabin but haven't done much work other than installing the cutoff switch on the Genny and doing a little winter prep.  However I have been getting some woodwork done at home:

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20151112_160542819%20449x800_zps3a2pql3k.jpg)
This will be an end table for the cabin.  I'm making one for each side of the bed but they can double as, you guessed it, stools ;)  Truth is the small log I made the cookies out of was just my first time doing this and in the future I'll be doing larger cookies, trust me :)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20151112_160558632%20597x800_zpscsbgsndm.jpg)
Another angle -- I'm gluing up the legs etc here and will likely also pin them a bit.  I'm still learning how to get a good tenon with the Lumberjack Tenon Cutters as they are somewhat adjustable and one can make the tenons a little small.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20151112_160629486%20800x475_zpsvspdbeon.jpg)
While the round tables will be burl coated (thick poly) this 'coffee' table I'm working on is being coated with Spar Varathane instead.  Here it can be seen with 8 coats.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20151112_160635200%20800x460_zpshn7t1pfd.jpg)
Loving it though :) 

Anyway, lots going on when I have the time just not lots at the cabin ;)  Yet.

Oh and the generator started working again out of the blue!  I'm still waiting to have the controller replaced under warranty but it was delayed because of the fires.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 14, 2015, 03:09:02 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20151114_115730225%20521x800_zpsmq7lildv.jpg)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20151114_115825798%20521x800_zpsko50vqy9.jpg)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20151114_115931162%20557x800_zpsf9nacyoz.jpg)

A few pics of the table.  Can't wait to get it coated and start on the next one.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 17, 2015, 09:04:00 AM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0307%20800x757_zps7lt3anaj.jpg)
Starting to shape up!

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0308%20800x787_zpskwqcwhb7.jpg)
Some minor air bubbles still in there :( but very hard to see and this is my first ever 'burl coat' so I'm very happy with it.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0306%20633x800_zpsn7kswlwk.jpg)
One coating is like 60 coats of varathane :)  It's awesome!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 17, 2015, 09:19:05 AM
I should note that the legs are not coated except where they were dripped on.  I'll be spraying those with Spar Varathane when the main coating is fully cured.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Scotdark on November 17, 2015, 09:54:48 PM
If you use a heat gun or a hair dryer it'll remove most air bubbles when still wet... Not sure if you knew that or not
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 18, 2015, 12:11:43 AM
Thanks!  I didn't know that!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: astidham on November 18, 2015, 01:52:24 PM
Looks great, where did you get your tenon cutter?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 19, 2015, 08:59:27 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2VYeJQfoYDM
Saw this today.  Gotta admit I love it!  I have been thinking about trying to plane down the larger of the two 'cookies' I cut for end tables and after grinding off some of the epoxy to fill cracks I decided to do a little research and saw this video.

Now it's time to make a similar sled for my tables :)  I plan to make one big enough to work on 24" cookies because I hope to get a chance to make some as well as on large slabs (like 24" x 36" x 3") for coffee tables etc.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 21, 2015, 10:36:31 AM
http://www.amazon.com/PEAK-PER0A3-RV-Marine-Antifreeze/dp/B00BGS2HLK/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&qid=1448120002&sr=8-5&keywords=rv+antifreeze
Not being an RV'er I've never heard of this stuff and for the last couple winters (since putting in the drains etc) I've had problems with either gas coming up drained traps or cracked traps in the spring....and then a neighbor pointed me to this great stuff! 

It's cheap which is good, and can take the cold (won't freeze above -50).  You just pour it down the sink I'm told, and walk away.  Gotta love it!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on November 21, 2015, 10:44:33 AM
Been using it for years. Check with Walmart.  I just bought 4 gal for cabin and RV for $2.46 gal.  The cabin I usually blow the lines out but add it to the toilet and traps. 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 21, 2015, 09:03:58 PM
Quote from: Redoverfarm on November 21, 2015, 10:44:33 AM
Been using it for years. Check with Walmart.  I just bought 4 gal for cabin and RV for $2.46 gal.  The cabin I usually blow the lines out but add it to the toilet and traps.

That's where I got mine actually - just used the amazon link as a info post -- should get a pic and post instead.

What's even better is that I found a sink faucet to hose adapter and we were able to blow out the lines 100% today!!!  We also came up with the idea (ok my neighbor came up with it) to put the pressure up to 50PSI and open up the main valve after the lines were clear.  What this did was push the water back past the main valve and completely out of the line coming into the cabin.  To check we opened the frost free spigot which sits just before the main (uphill side) and air was coming out of it so we closed the main and I danced a jig :)

Yup, I'm pleased!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 14, 2015, 01:11:24 PM
It's been a while!

Not much done at the cabin this fall but I did get the controller on the generator replaced, the knife switch installed and I've made one small end table for the cabin also.
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20151121_141452604_zpsug5isf9p.jpg)
Knife switch installed and connected.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20151121_141458574_zpsdxd97fgi.jpg)
Opened.

This makes it VERY easy for me to disconnect the generator when I'm going to be gone for a long time and the power will be shut down.  It prevents the generator battery from being killed when no power is feeding the charger.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20151117_104754945_zpseouhdtvp.jpg)
One finished end table.  I have another I'm about to sand and stain and put legs on and a 3rd that just needs legs.

Once those are done I have another table project going that will round out this winters 'furniture' build for the cabin and then I'll get back to paneling and flooring :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: berestie on December 15, 2015, 05:20:18 AM
 ;D ;D ;D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 16, 2015, 12:45:35 AM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20151215_213206_zpschlbm6k7.jpg)
This one is just varathaned with Spar Varathane so not as thick. 

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20151215_213228_zpsi2vpgfvo.jpg)
Still need to sand and stain legs, then glue them up and coat with Spar.

This is a narrow table (7" at the narrow end and 9" at the wide end) but the idea was to make use of the thick slab I had and the cabin is small so small end tables are nice!

The legs are set at 5 degrees of angle to provide a little extra support which I think will be fine.  My round table is at 10 degrees but I think that's more aggressive than needed -- we shall see!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: knopfarrow on December 16, 2015, 01:30:26 AM
This site needs a "like" button for posts. I would like this!  [cool]
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 16, 2015, 11:10:59 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20151216_195928306%20800x533_zpsnubef7gc.jpg)
Getting there.

I need to adjust my tenon cutters and do some test cuts in the future as the tenons are a tad loose.  Nothing Elmers can't solve though ;)

Next step is to let the stain dry, then glue up (and clean up) and finally the finish coats of varathane -- then on to No.3
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 19, 2015, 10:49:59 AM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0318%20800x572_zpsyb4mwyl9.jpg)
Table number three is my 'coin table'.  I was given these coins while serving in South Korea (all but the Marine Corps coin which an older veteran gave me more recently).  Each one represents 'excellence' and the Army does this for those who stand out.  I received one from the Division Command Sergeant Major for being the only Signal Corps soldier who graduated as 'Class Honor man' of the PLDC course in Korea though to be honest and fair I am a Marine who served in Light Armored Infantry years before so really I wasn't a normal or usual Signal Corps Soldier! LOL  I also received the big medallion and another coin from the Battalion Command Sergeant Major for both the graduation from PLDC as Honor Man but also for a few other things and finally I received one from the Battalion Commander for Excellence as well as the Company Commander.  I wasn't in the Army too much longer so these are all the coins I received (served just shy of 3 years).

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20151219_070824284%20800x730_zps4uxvf0l8.jpg)
For years these coins were tucked away and all but forgotten but in the move to our new home (and town) they came out.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20151219_070831842%20800x456_zpsxxhz1ivo.jpg)
Now they will be seen at the cabin by anyone who drops in :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: garyc on December 19, 2015, 05:03:49 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on December 16, 2015, 11:10:59 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20151216_195928306%20800x533_zpsnubef7gc.jpg)
Getting there.

I need to adjust my tenon cutters and do some test cuts in the future as the tenons are a tad loose.  Nothing Elmers can't solve though ;)

Next step is to let the stain dry, then glue up (and clean up) and finally the finish coats of varathane -- then on to No.3

What you can do to get a tighter tenon is to cut a slice across it like you do a hammer handle and start a wedge in it and hammer the leg into the tenon hole. The deeper the leg goes into hole the tighter it will fit.     
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 19, 2015, 05:33:10 PM
I can adjust me cutters and just got lazy! LOL
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: garyc on December 20, 2015, 10:13:36 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on December 19, 2015, 05:33:10 PM
I can adjust me cutters and just got lazy! LOL

I'm the same way! I get lazy doing a job and it cost me more time to get it done. I guess I'm to old to learn.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 20, 2015, 07:41:20 PM
Ah yup!

Mixing up a batch of Parks Super Glaze I saw there were really too many bubbles and thought "I'll work them out" when I should have dumped the glaze and stared with a fresh batch and been more careful...It was probably $8 worth of glaze though so I went with it....result?  Bubbles in the finish :(

Wife says no one will notice but I WILL!  d*

Next step is to work off the edges a bit after damming up the glaze and then with luck a final pouring will smooth things over, hide the bubbles and give a nice edge too.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: UK4X4 on December 21, 2015, 08:49:26 AM
RV antifreeze.....don't believe the label, we had whole solid bottles of it when we opened the trailer last year in CO......we had winterized the trailer by blowing out the water with air,
would not like to consider what the pipes would have been like if we'd used it as designed...

I have a pic somewhere when I find it, temps were -20oC at night, only -4oF.....

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 21, 2015, 09:11:25 AM
That's scary.  My neighbors use the stuff and swear by it though so I'll hope and pray ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on December 21, 2015, 09:20:25 AM
Solid block like water would be?   The polypropylene RV is can get thick but does not expand enough to crack pipes. According to the label on the bottles I have used.  It does work as I have used it and in some very cold weather; -30F in Canada     Do an experiment and place a small container in your fridge freezer at home.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: UK4X4 on December 21, 2015, 10:05:56 AM
yep solid block......of RV antifreeze.....you can see the air at the bottom.....had to be a reason I took a photo of the bottle...!

(https://i56.photobucket.com/albums/g165/POshaughnessy/Colorado/DSC_8067_zpsfbdi8sw9.jpg)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on December 21, 2015, 11:15:49 AM
Apparently there is a difference between freeze points and burst points....

http://www.jamestowndistributors.com/userportal/document.do?docId=1144&title=Antifreeze+101+Understanding+Burst+Points+and+Freeze+Points+-+StarBrite

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on December 21, 2015, 10:12:39 PM
I have seen the name brands not solid but pliable down to around minus 30 F.  Then after that really do not know.  I do know though when we had our first camper it was blow it out....  I trust RV Antifreeze in both my fifthwheels.     
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: upa on December 24, 2015, 12:12:19 PM
I put the RV antifreeze in the toilet and p trap typically in November. The out door temperatures can go into  -40 Celsius range during the winter but lowest  temperature I have recorded indoors is -28C , the antifreeze looks like its a Slurpee consistency. The toilet or the p trap have  yet to crack over the last several winters, so I am going to say it does what it claims.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 28, 2015, 10:58:11 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0350%20800x569_zpspalaxi2s.jpg)
Just need some spar on the legs and a little touch up and we're done.  This one will go against a wall near a chair.  It's small but will fit nicely out of the way in the cabin.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0348%20800x580_zpsnpybuuuh.jpg)
Getting there.  Unfortunately I did not see the left over tape glue from damming the top up one coat back and poured the new coat on over it!  Yikes!  I can hope it covers well.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0349%20800x695_zpsdfdxkoov.jpg)
I believe one more coat tomorrow will finish this off -- at least I'm going to say it's done then!

Next will be the legs.  With luck I'll have it ready for New Years :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Adam Roby on December 29, 2015, 10:22:20 AM
That really looks fantastic, it is almost like you dipped the wood in liquid plastic.
If the wood is not completely dry, is there any chance it can rot or cause the varathane to bubble or peel off?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 29, 2015, 02:11:25 PM
Thanks -- it looks pretty awesome up close :)

The wood is completely dry so I don't think there is an issue there.  If you are thinking of doing the same thing I'd suggest being sure the wood is completely dry.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 04, 2016, 08:14:20 AM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0400%20800x600_zpsf5rkjtfz.jpg)
Perfect Fit:)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0398%20800x759_zpsennyx8pf.jpg)
These worked great!  Can't wait to finish the last one and begin the next project

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0401%20800x600_zpshwo6bkuv.jpg)
Winter at the cabin :)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0404%20800x600_zpsegpjipah.jpg)
We just love all the snow -- so awesome :)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0412%20800x600_zpstrf2v49b.jpg)
Can't wait to go back!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on January 08, 2016, 01:06:02 AM
Those pics make me jealous a bit...

I can't wait to get back up to my place either!  But unless I get a snowmobile (which I might), I am going to have to wait until May or June.  I think this is the year, tho.  At least I hope so.

How are things otherwise?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 09, 2016, 09:10:40 PM
Finally got some time to organize the new shop a little and get some work done :)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0429%20800x600_zpsvap05qyb.jpg)
Ripping down to 4", 5", 6" and 7" boards for paneling

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0435%20600x800_zpsy3iq5htt.jpg)
11 1/2" pine ready to rip

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0436%20800x600_zpszfx7xtvs.jpg)
Getting there

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0432%20800x600_zpsxnzv3xlj.jpg)
Stock

I also cut all the trim pieces into kindling so I'll have plenty for the rest of the winter :)

Now to get planing and putting the T&G on :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 13, 2016, 11:17:50 AM
Several bags of pine chips later I have most of the paneling planed and ready for T&G.  One thing I've noticed is that when the band on the mill gets dull it cuts in waves leaving a wavy edge or wavy board.  Most of this can be rectified by planing and squaring with a table saw but I must admit it's a bit frustrating.  Note to self:  don't ever let that happen!  Change the darn blade on the mill ;)  d* d* d*

On a side note though, the finished boards look great because they have some obvious mill marks on them giving them that rustic look :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: nailit69 on January 13, 2016, 08:53:42 PM
Any wood for sale?  I need about 1,000 sq.ft.(+/-) of cedar 3/4"x 8"x10' channel siding or board and batt for my place come summer.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 15, 2016, 09:16:04 AM
Sorry :(  No cedar over here that I know of and I don't have any wood for sale.

I do (sometimes) mill onsite for people though ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: nailit69 on January 15, 2016, 09:40:08 PM
Plenty of cheap Cedar siding on the West side of the mountains but getting it there (to the cabin) can make any savings on this side cost more than just ordering it from the lumber store over there... had to ask. 

My brother has a friend with a mill but again... getting it to the east side and then back can be spendy.  I'd also like to bring my dads Kubota tractor over but the cost of fuel and trailer to get there and then getting it back to the westside is almost as much as renting a mini excavator for a week, and I can do more with a mini in a week than I could with the Kubota in a month.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 18, 2016, 06:34:28 PM
https://youtu.be/0_HMTtfIIBA
Making T&G paneling for the cabin
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 18, 2016, 06:46:27 PM
https://youtu.be/xPm01fDmEEs
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 19, 2016, 02:09:36 PM
 d* d* d*

Seems I forgot the extra shims and cutter for my router bit at the cabin so I can't make the tongues until after I go get the rest of it!  DOH!  d* d* d*
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: minnowcat on January 19, 2016, 02:56:15 PM
I've been a silent 'lurker' here for a while !

Very impressed with your effort, keep the good work up sir  8)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 19, 2016, 03:16:03 PM
Quote from: minnowcat on January 19, 2016, 02:56:15 PM
I've been a silent 'lurker' here for a while !

Very impressed with your effort, keep the good work up sir  8)

LOL I am no longer a lurker but was when I started this thread about 6 years ago ;)

Thanks for the input :)  It's a labor of love :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 21, 2016, 01:38:04 PM
More snow at the cabin I hear -- I'll find out soon ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: nailit69 on January 21, 2016, 08:37:19 PM
I texted my Okanogan neighbors the other day... they said there's about 3' of snow up there at our place.  No word on the Hippies but I guess I didn't ask either.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 22, 2016, 10:52:49 PM
Lots of snow here but not 3 feet.  Maybe 2 feet where it hasn't melted otherwise down around a foot or 15".  Very warm today (40) so it was a slushy slidy mess on the way up (with chains on the front) but I made it and plowed my drive after getting settled.  Might have to plow the road too if the neighbor doesn't get his cat out! It is a mess but I don't really want to plow with the front end loader all 2.7 miles!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on January 23, 2016, 08:06:23 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on January 22, 2016, 10:52:49 PM
Lots of snow here but not 3 feet.  Maybe 2 feet where it hasn't melted otherwise down around a foot or 15".  Very warm today (40) so it was a slushy slidy mess on the way up (with chains on the front) but I made it and plowed my drive after getting settled.  Might have to plow the road too if the neighbor doesn't get his cat out! It is a mess but I don't really want to plow with the front end loader all 2.7 miles!

Eric you need to find a plow blade for the front of your tractor.  Would make plowing so much easier.  I use to try with the bucket and it is a real pain to keep off loading what is pushed ahead.  As for us we are getting dumped on now.  Probably 18-24" and still coming down.  I hit it last night with 4-wheeler and 8".  Probably have to break out the more serious equipment today.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 23, 2016, 12:05:39 PM
I've toyed with some options like a front plow blade or a much much heavier rear blade.  I don't mind the rear blade but need one that won't break so easily!

And yes plowing with the FEL is a pain but with split breaks it isn't too bad ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on January 23, 2016, 12:58:05 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on January 23, 2016, 12:05:39 PM
I've toyed with some options like a front plow blade or a much much heavier rear blade.  I don't mind the rear blade but need one that won't break so easily!

And yes plowing with the FEL is a pain but with split breaks it isn't too bad ;)

I got a used truck blade and modified my bucket to hook up.  Works real nice and in a pinch I can rotate the bucket and still use it with the snow blade attached for moving heavy piles.  Sort of the best of both worlds.  The only down side is that I need a wider blade as on the angle setting it dumps the snow right in front of the wheel to the short side.  Also a wider blade would allow me to get closer to edge of the road.  If I get a chance I will take a picture and send it to you on what I have.  Maybe get some ideas. 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 23, 2016, 02:09:17 PM
I've seen some that attach to the bucket an wonder how well they work.

I checked pricing on one skidsteer blade (I have a skid steer type quick attach on the FEL) and they ran about $3000 new for hydraulics and $200 less for manual.  That's too steep for me!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: minnowcat on January 23, 2016, 03:33:33 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on January 19, 2016, 03:16:03 PM
LOL I am no longer a lurker but was when I started this thread about 6 years ago ;)

Thanks for the input :)  It's a labor of love :)

Sounds fantastic! Keep us updated  :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on January 23, 2016, 05:57:21 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on January 23, 2016, 02:09:17 PM
I've seen some that attach to the bucket an wonder how well they work.

I checked pricing on one skidsteer blade (I have a skid steer type quick attach on the FEL) and they ran about $3000 new for hydraulics and $200 less for manual.  That's too steep for me!

Find a machine shop/welder and they can fabricate a quick disconnect mount to use on a standard truck blade and I would say you would be good to go for less than half that.  The biggest expense would be the blade if you had to buy one new. Check Craigslist/Ebay or local and pick one up for $200-400.  Mine is manual which is a little PIA but not for the difference in price.  Mine does not have quick disconnect ( wish I had) so without unbolting the bucket this was my solution.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 23, 2016, 07:00:35 PM
Hmm not a bad idea.  I have a friend who is a metal fab guy who could do that easy.  I'll give it some thought and might just do it.  Sure would be just a bucket but I also have to think about break aways they put on front plows.  They prevent damage and might be worth it.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Plowing_zpsg1dqyoxc.jpg)
Here I am plowing my way to the game cam.  14" of snow pack and 3" of fresh today.  It melted a LOT yesterday or we'd have two feet easily and if it hadn't melted at other times I'd say we'd have well over three feet!  This will be VERY good in the spring when it melts since we need the water.

On a different note I checked the water in the batteries today (all 12) and it was good!  Hard to tell if any has been lost at all actually and it's been 5 months or so since I put on those caps!  I think they are worth the investment now!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on January 24, 2016, 03:17:52 PM
Eric I finally got slowed down enough to post the pictures I promised.  Had to plow two people out.  First was a mile and second was 1/2 mile one way.  Both had uphill grades so I just tram up hill with the blade 1/2 depth and did the majority down hill.  Went much better and wasn't as hard on the tractor.

Here is my set up.  Pretty much on the cheap side but operational.  Just need a wider blade. Only thing I did was weld an 2" angle to the lip of the bucket and the ears for the plow to attach.  The a second set of ears mid center on the bucket (bucket turned over to plow) for the lift mechanism.

(https://i220.photobucket.com/albums/dd161/redoverfarm/scenes/country%20plans/100_2617_zpsuqzaeek8.jpg)
(https://s220.photobucket.com/user/redoverfarm/media/scenes/country%20plans/100_2617_zpsuqzaeek8.jpg.html)

(https://i220.photobucket.com/albums/dd161/redoverfarm/scenes/country%20plans/100_2616_zpsfwxdh5et.jpg) (https://s220.photobucket.com/user/redoverfarm/media/scenes/country%20plans/100_2616_zpsfwxdh5et.jpg.html)

Here is a picture of a friend/farmer in the upper part of the county.  Shows that he fabricated a quick disconnect for his deer.  Not sure he used the complete blade or not and not sure he can tilt the blade.  Haven't seen him to ask.

(https://i220.photobucket.com/albums/dd161/redoverfarm/scenes/country%20plans/Gums%20plow_zpstidikj4x.jpg) (https://s220.photobucket.com/user/redoverfarm/media/scenes/country%20plans/Gums%20plow_zpstidikj4x.jpg.html)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 24, 2016, 08:07:03 PM
Nice setup.  That would work pretty well specially with being able to tilt it left and right.  Out here, though, with all the rock I think I'd break it (I've broken FEL mount bolts even) without a beak away setup.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 24, 2016, 08:14:58 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/TractoLights2_zpspfib1qqf.jpg)
Got the new ROPS LIGHTS on the tractor and wired into the rear lights.  It won't stay that way but for now it gives me light to plow in the dark which is normally when I'm doing it.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/TractorLights_zps7mzvht5q.jpg)
These things are amazingly bright!

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Roadwork2_zpsgvihdve8.jpg)
Dug up some dirt and spread it on the dangerous section of the driveway.  Thank god for the tractor!  Otherwise I'd not be coming out here in the winter unless I snowshoed in like Don.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Cabin_zpsljg4zrp1.jpg)
Lots of work done today.  Shovelled off the deck and cleared the driveway as wel as a lot of the area in front of the cabin.  Widened the road a bit and generally just worked all day!  It was a good day.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on January 25, 2016, 09:27:41 AM
I had to put two additional lights on mine as well.  Seems the front end loader brace blocked the tractor headlights.  I got two 27W LED's and mounted then similar to yours.  Sure makes a difference at night.  In regards to the blade.  Mine is spring loaded so that if I hit something the blade just tilts forward until it passes over and then springs back.  With the exception of the driveway most of my plowing toward the cabin is a gravel road and comes with it's fair share of outcropped rocks as well.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 26, 2016, 02:35:37 PM
So ready to get back to cabin work!  I now have the rest of my router bit so I can finish making my T&G paneling and I hope to get it done my the time we head up the first weekend of Feb.  The plan is to run the panel and saw up and maybe begin putting it up.  Then I'll have it there and ready to work on subsequent trips until it's done.

I have decided to run the panel up the walls to the peak, then run some under the rafter ties (like a ceiling in the loft) but to leave some of the area open.  This will allow access to the new 'attic' space in the loft (I'll add some OSB flooring above the ties so we can put stuff up there).  By leaving some of the area open to below we'll have access but it will allow the warm/cool area to mix up there whereas, had I closed it off completely it would get pretty hot in the summer I think.  It also means I'll have easier access if some wasps or something decides to move in up there.

Once the weather begins to improve I'll start milling again too.  I have a LOT of logs to mill and plan on spending some weeks working up there (for my real job) so I can do some milling in the evenings during the week like I did a couple years ago.  I can get a lot of milling done that way even if I only mill one or two logs a day.  With luck I can have all the lumber for the new deck section done as well as all the lumber to frame in the roof.  I'll just have to get the posts put in and D logs on top of them so I can run rafters from a ledger to the outside post/beam of the deck.  I may mill 1" pine and fir for the roof instead of using OSB as it will look much better ;)

Then, if time allows I plan to start milling 4x8's for a log cabin I plan to build (small bedroom cabin) using a dovetail jib to cut the logs.  It's going to be a Scandinavian style log cabin -- at least the walls anyway.  All roughsawn and chinked.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 30, 2016, 03:29:11 PM
https://youtu.be/kFfrQULq4hw
Still at it :)

Now that I have the rest of my bit pieces I can get the T&G finished for next weekends cabin trip!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Adam Roby on January 30, 2016, 03:39:46 PM
Its coming along nicely.

Planning something slightly similar... I am thinking of building an outhouse this spring.  The plan was to start the work in March at home, then as soon as the snow melts bring up the cut pieces to the land and start building (well, maybe wait to be able to dig 4' by hand as well). 
I was thinking of using 1x6 fence boards, and on each one cut a 45 degree angle on both length edges, so that there would be a drip edge and I could do the side walls with that.  Looks like a lot of work, and a lot of sawdust...  and considering it's PT'ed... hmmm.   

Not as fancy of a cut as you are doing, but a lot of repetition...  would you benefit from setting the router into a table? 
I had purchased a small router table that my standard router can be bolted to underneath... does help keep things straight with less gouging and angle issues.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 30, 2016, 06:24:16 PM
I have a router table but I found with the right bits it's faster and plane better to do it by hand ;)  The bits I use are Rockler bits and they have bearings in them to help guide the bit along the wood edge so you don't cut too deep etc.

I've used three set ups:  home made router table, Ryobi router table and no table at all and the last option is the best.

As for siding the way you mention, I'd just leave it the way you get it and lap it up.  No need for further edging at all.  Treat and forget :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 01, 2016, 12:36:16 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20160201_070452958_zpsz3qxxmv3.jpg)
Finished all the paneling I had in the garage to complete :)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20160201_070459479_zpsyedj8p80.jpg)
4,5,6,7 and 8" Pine T&G completed.  A lot of it is blue stained to some degree but we like that ;)

Can't wait to get it up to the cabin and installed!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 04, 2016, 01:39:54 PM
Drove up to the cabin yesterday and boy the road was treacherous!  Solid ice in the worst places but made it up and down 'ok' without too much pucker factor ;)

Now I just need to load up the truck and get it ready for the trip with the chains easily accessible.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on February 04, 2016, 03:21:15 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on February 04, 2016, 01:39:54 PM
Drove up to the cabin yesterday and boy the road was treacherous!  Solid ice in the worst places but made it up and down 'ok' without too much pucker factor ;)

Now I just need to load up the truck and get it ready for the trip with the chains easily accessible.

You sure you don't live around here?  We have went from easy going in and out to white knuckle drifting.......  Just hoping not to meet up with someone on the corners.  Did a 360 the other day with the Powerstoke  and had my healer with me she got so excited - she wanted to do it again - me well not so much......

Tongue and grove project worked out well it looks......
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 05, 2016, 02:01:00 PM
Not looking forward to chaining up ini the dark tonight but the truck is nearly ready and I've chained up plenty of times in the dark -- and it's better to chain up then to spin out! lol
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on February 05, 2016, 09:25:02 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on February 05, 2016, 02:01:00 PM
Not looking forward to chaining up ini the dark tonight but the truck is nearly ready and I've chained up plenty of times in the dark -- and it's better to chain up then to spin out! lol

[waiting]  As many times a person is over a road one pretty much knows where you might as well put the iron on.  Other at night and if it is freezing really tight you can often cheat a little.  That said I sure would rather chain up sitting in the middle of the road than down in the barrow pit and digging yourself out as well.  Just so much fun there......   
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 06, 2016, 12:26:18 AM
Yup.  Chained up at the bottom and had no worries on the way up :). One neighbor struggled a bit but he had his chains on the back ;) I learned long ago fronts up backs down and it makes a big difference.  Now we are here and warm ;). Drink in hand and life is good!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on February 06, 2016, 01:17:49 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on February 06, 2016, 12:26:18 AM
Yup.  Chained up at the bottom and had no worries on the way up :). One neighbor struggled a bit but he had his chains on the back ;) I learned long ago fronts up backs down and it makes a big difference.  Now we are here and warm ;). Drink in hand and life is good!

Myself if I am going very far. Like ten miles or better, they are going on the rear and have a couple hundred pounds back there......  (Furthest this year thirty two miles in foot deep snow- we beat the plow out....) Normally we would have stayed home but there was this got to thing going  ???  grandkids! At least it was not Black Friday.  One neighbor lady she hurried up and followed us out - Never seen her but she called and thanked us for braking trail. 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 06, 2016, 09:40:48 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Panel3_zps2mne94td.jpg)
Four more feet of panelling installed :)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Panel_zpsmd7fpzun.jpg)
Had to stop on the right since I didn't bring my jigsaw to cutout around the light.  Stopped on the left because, well, I was getting a little beat and cut a 6" piece of panel for a 5" run....ya time to quit and drink some bourbon :D

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Panel2_zpskdaldyre.jpg)
You just can't buy this stuff....well maybe you can but I wouldn't want to pay for it! :D

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Panel1_zpszsem471i.jpg)
Lovin' it :)  I'll get it up past the collar ties next trip and plan to use some of the collar ties as 'shelves' for storage.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 10, 2016, 02:01:56 PM
I started planning my next trip while still at the cabin ;)  DO others do this?

I'm planning on finishing the paneling in the ceiling and getting the end walls done plus some trim.  To be honest I just can't wait!

I've also got to get milling and the snow appears to be melting now (rain and temps in the high 30's now during the day).  With luck I can begin milling the 30 plus logs I have by the first weekend in March :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on February 10, 2016, 03:47:47 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on February 10, 2016, 02:01:56 PM
I started planning my next trip while still at the cabin ;)  DO others do this?

I'm planning on finishing the paneling in the ceiling and getting the end walls done plus some trim.  To be honest I just can't wait!

I've also got to get milling and the snow appears to be melting now (rain and temps in the high 30's now during the day).  With luck I can begin milling the 30 plus logs I have by the first weekend in March :)

Indeed we use to do just that .....  Now that we are full timers we have to go to town and it is considered an inconvenience and wish to hurry up and get back.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 12, 2016, 01:53:12 PM
I get the fever a lot it seems ;)  Now I'm trying to plan my trip by setting tools and stuff aside.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 20, 2016, 09:05:06 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Milling/2016-2_zpsaortjlth.jpg)
Should be saying goodbye to the old custom sawmill tomorrow!

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Milling/2016_zpsk0wiatcq.jpg)
Got it ready for a serious buyer who is coming tomorrow.

Have 3 or 4 seriously interested buyers so figure it will be gone tomorrow or Monday at the latest.

Then Wednesday I pick up my new LT40HD! :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 21, 2016, 08:37:48 PM
Mill is sold!  Man that was fast!  But I guess since these things pay for themselves easily it shouldn't surprise me...Wed I pick up  the new mill and am over the moon!  Can't hardly sleep!  I've got over 30 logs to mill now and this new mill out to handle those in 1/4 the time the old one would...going to be fun learning on them while I mill up lumber for my deck expansion and roof over the deck :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Adam Roby on February 21, 2016, 08:56:42 PM
No wonder it sold so fast, it looked like it was new, perfect condition... 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 22, 2016, 08:34:46 AM
LOL well not exactly!  It has a lot of the paint rubbed off the top of the rails from rolling big logs on it and the paint is faded some (WM Orange fades a lot over the year)...but ya, it's in pretty darn good shape!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 23, 2016, 02:09:14 PM
Heading out early tomorrow to pick up the new mill! :D  I'm dying here waiting to get off work and plan for the trip!  Then Sunday I plan to drive it up to the cabin and start milling in style :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 25, 2016, 12:15:48 PM
Good morning ;)  (says a rather tired old marine with a cup of coffee in hand)....

WoW!  :o  Holy crap batman!  :o ;D  This thing ROCKS!  8)  WhooHoo!

I woke up around 2:30am and forced myself to sorta sleep until 4:30.  Then I got myself up and moving.  I needed to leave around 6am so my son had some rack time  and I would arrive at his place about 7:30am.  So 80 miles later I picked him up and away we went.

Arrived to meet the new mill around 11am and some 275 miles later :)


 (http://www.forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/22463/IMG_20160224_113357269_28800x45029.jpg)

Waiting to greet us was a Forestry Forum member who didn't give me his nick on the forum but he gave me a nice FF sticker and a mug.   Gotta love forums like these (I've met only one FF member but a few CP members and they have always been great people).

Once the paperwork was finished and the books were went through -- WOW!  Now those are manuals!  We headed out to the woodlot (funny thing, I backed up the truck to tow the mill out and Karl looked at me funny and said he'd use the forklift for that.  I'm just so used to moving MY mill I was ready to keep that going! lol).
(http://www.forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/22463/IMG_20160224_153337623_28800x45029.jpg)

Next we loaded up a log and got into the fun part :)  Making sawdust!
(http://www.forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/22463/IMG_20160224_153920774_28800x45029.jpg) 

(http://www.forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/22463/IMG_20160224_161514283_28800x45029.jpg)
That me making 1x's after Karl (1st) and I made a cant out of the log.  He was very nice and also willing to say "why did you" in a way Marines understand! lol  Learned a lot from him and was very impressed with his thorough approach to maintenance and possible issues later -- we went over this baby with a fine toothed comb!

](http://www.forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/22463/IMG_20160224_161520490_28800x45029.jpg)

(http://www.forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/22463/IMG_20160224_161550454_28800x45029.jpg)
I did run the stabilizer arm into the log clamp on the last cut -- DOH! -- but recovered once I understood what occurred and made a mental note to remember.

Now I need a great deal of coffee and to get to work!  All hell broke loose while I was gone yesterday so I know today will be a tough day to be at work, specially since I'd rather be milling!!!

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Adam Roby on February 25, 2016, 05:35:37 PM
Congrats!   [cool]
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 25, 2016, 07:18:50 PM
Thanks :)  I'm so stoked and can't wait to start putting it through its paces!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: astidham on February 25, 2016, 10:04:03 PM
Very nice. I cant wait to get a mill.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: rick91351 on February 25, 2016, 10:21:19 PM
Looks like a great mill...   [cool]  stay safe and count your finger once in a while........ 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: garyc on February 25, 2016, 10:28:14 PM
 [cool] You need to make a video when you get it set up at your place .
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 26, 2016, 10:29:54 AM
Got off work yesterday and decided to unhook the mill and go through a set up.  Pavement isn't a nice place to do this me thinks (since it's hard and allows movement too easily) and it's on a slight slope towards the log loading side but for now it's just me playing with the mill a bit until I can get it to some logs.
(http://www.forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/22463/IMG_20160225_153943627_28800x45029.jpg) 

Another shot of it.  Lots of 'shims' under the outriggers but that's because I need to mill some thinner ones! :D
(http://www.forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/22463/IMG_20160225_153920010_28800x45029.jpg)

I'm heading back to the cabin with the mill this weekend and plan to mill a log or two Sunday afternoon.  Then with luck I'll get to mill Wednesday and Thursday...then with a little more luck I'll get to do some milling the week after.  Still trying to get the time to be at the cabin but work and life keep getting in the way! :D

I'll make some videos as soon as I get the mill home to the cabin and starting making sawdust :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 28, 2016, 10:55:48 PM
Too tired to post much but here is a short vid of me milling with the LT40.
https://youtu.be/65UFUXkPIQQ
I goofed at the end of the cut where I should have just lifted the head an inch and a half and drawn back for the next cut, where you hit 'down' and it sets itself to make the next cut but you get the idea anyway,
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: garyc on March 02, 2016, 06:09:01 PM
 [cool]
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Adam Roby on March 02, 2016, 07:04:06 PM
Wow, goes through the wood like butter... that's insane. 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 03, 2016, 09:44:41 PM
Sure does!
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Milling/LT40HD_zpskknfgu9v.jpg)
There it sits waiting for more logs after chewing up two logs in 40 minutes :) and I'm still learning :)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Milling/Making2xs_zpssnmhcn5c.jpg)
After milling a 12"x12' log and a 15"x10' log in 40 minutes :)  Milling alone no less!  I can see doing 350bf/hr without issue once I get it down
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 05, 2016, 05:59:34 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JjneKQDe9O0
Showing off the new mill :)

Lots to learn still but things are going well.  Have cut all my 2x8's for the rafters on the deck (and a few extras) and started on both 1x's for the roof sheathing and 2x6's for the deck expansion :)  Lots of logs to go, just not enough time on the weekend -- though this weekend I actually came home to the wife since she was gone all week...
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Danfish on March 06, 2016, 09:59:15 AM
What a sweet machine...makes me want to run out and buy one, LOL.

Thanks for sharing!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 12, 2016, 06:53:54 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3YNRXfLrFPs
Here's another video for ya ;)  (lots more on the youtube page.

Milling up some blue stained pine I'll use for deck flooring and trim etc.....and yes I said deck flooring but at 2" x 6" real dimension, under a roof and coated well it seems to do just fine :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 26, 2016, 09:14:31 AM
(http://www.forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/22463/IMG_20160317_152856848.jpg)
Spent a week in Baker City OR doing a Snow Cat and Winter Survival Course for work that turned out to be a great course!  Heck, I could have spent another week with those awesome guys!  One was a former operator (that's me saying that because I've been around them and I KNOW he was some kind or another but he never actually admitted it), another was a rancher out of Wyoming who grooms trails all winter, ranches, and runs an excavating company, and the last used to run search and rescue on Mt Hood and other places.  All three were top notch individuals with vast experience in their fields and frankly, I think gave the best winter training I've had to date! (and I've had other courses on a number of occasions).  I was literally sad to leave!

Now I'm back at the cabin milling up lumber for my deck extension and roof.  I'm just about there with what I need though I did change my rafters from 3x6's which I thought would be strong but give me just a couple inches more headroom, to 2x8's (full cut) because, as Don would say 'deeper is better'.  I'll just make the pitch a little shallower.

I am debating 16" vs 24" centers though.  I am fairly certain my full cut 2x8's will carry the weight of a dimensional 2x10 though it would be nice to find a span table that allowed full cut vs nominal input.

Anyway, I put my first BIG log on the mill yesterday.  It was a 16 1/2 foot pine that was 17" (inside the bark) at the small end and about 20" at the big end.  Must have weighed over 1200 pounds and the tractor, with no rear ballast had a hard time moving it up to the mill on the forks.  It would pick it up but the slightest bump with lift one or both of the rear tires momentarily!  The mill on the other hand just picked it up and set it on the deck :)  Love that!  Took me 44 minutes to mill it up into lumber and that was with a few different challenges along the way and handling all the lumber myself!  With an off bearer it would have taken maybe half and hour putting my milling rate over 400bf/hr!  As it was I milled about 350bf in 90 minutes which translates to 230bf/hr
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: nailit69 on March 27, 2016, 09:21:45 AM
So you have to take Sno-Cat and winter survival courses for work?  What exactly do you do for "work"?  Cuz it sounds like fun.

My dad taught Vietnam era jungle training and survival courses in the P.I. back when I was a kid (late 60s/early 70s) and always took us on "survival trips" long after he got out of the military. 

We'd get all kitted out in camo and go out for the weekend with only what we could carry in our pockets, eating fruit or other things we foraged, trapped or speared...  I miss those days.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 28, 2016, 08:12:23 AM
Believe it or not, I work in Telecom :)  I'm your phone company (depending on where you live).  In many locations we have microwave towers, or we feed cell towers, that up on mountains which get snowed in during the winter and when they break people are mighty upset if we don't go out and fix them ;)  So we snocat in.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Adam Roby on March 28, 2016, 08:39:25 AM
You wouldn't think working in Telecom would be a life threatening job, but when you think about the remote places you need to go, anything goes wrong and suddenly you are in survival mode.  I guess its also a good way to see the country... 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 28, 2016, 11:02:38 AM
Very true.

While Urban phone guys may spend their careers inside city limits, rural phone guys will find themselves in all manner of remote locations, alone and on their own if anything goes wrong.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: nailit69 on March 28, 2016, 06:55:26 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on March 28, 2016, 08:12:23 AM
Believe it or not, I work in Telecom :)  I'm your phone company (depending on where you live).  In many locations we have microwave towers, or we feed cell towers, that up on mountains which get snowed in during the winter and when they break people are mighty upset if we don't go out and fix them ;)  So we snocat in.

Hiring?  Sounds like my kind of job... anthough my telecom experience is strictly end user unless you need concrete poured or something built  ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 28, 2016, 07:13:33 PM
https://youtu.be/cW_MqjCqSbA
and now for some fun with a little Bo Diddly on this side :)

Made myself a bunch of lumber this weekend from 2x8x16 rafters (for the corners of the deck) to 2x6x8 joists and planks and 1x's for the roof sheathing.  Now I need to get back and make some 4x8's for the deck foundation and I'll be set!

Oh ya, and those pesky 6x6x12's I need.....
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: pmichelsen on March 29, 2016, 07:18:43 AM
Love the comments on rolling the log.  ;D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 29, 2016, 08:11:44 AM
I've actually rolled a big log like that once or twice on the old mill -- and nearly thrown out several joints -- so ya, I sometimes think I still need to....then wake up! lol
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: nailit69 on March 29, 2016, 05:38:49 PM
That's pretty slick... a friend of mine has the previous model you had... or similar (looks the same).  I have only watched his once for just a few minutes but rolling a big log looks like a pain... your new saw with the "log roller" is really cool though.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 04, 2016, 07:39:28 AM
Miled up the 4x8's and 6x6's  needed for the deck and am pretty much done now.  I'll mill some more 2x's today and finish stickering the last of it and then won't need to mill for myself again for a while (this spring anyway) so I'll prep the mill and mill box for the next customer job and head home for a needed break :)

But not till after I spend another evening at the cabin :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: nailit69 on April 04, 2016, 06:42:35 PM
I hear ya on the R&R...  I'm getting pressure from family that wants to come along and help build the floor, to make a "speed run" up there and try to blow it out in one day then turn around and leave the next morning. 

Don't get me wrong... I work all the time and work very hard but i'm getting tired of going up there just to work without taking time to "smell the roses".  I understand there's a lot to be done and some of us are on tighter schedules than others but I want a day or two to kick back a little, check out the area, put my feet up, throw a line in the water, and toss back a cold beer.

They may just have to take another rig if that's thier plan cuz i'm tryin to spend a couple days doing nothing and return on the fourth day.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 04, 2016, 09:32:36 PM
Amen to that!  I did it more than my fair share I think but after seven years of coming out here I'm happy to relax at least some of the time I'm out here....as for fishing, I don't get too many chances but hope to get out this year..I have a canoe and Crawfish has the fish.....you bring the beer, I'll bring the bourbon and we'll toss a line in and float around on the lake snagging rainbows!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: nailit69 on April 05, 2016, 06:24:35 AM
I might have to take you up on that one of these days when we're both there at the same time.  I've got a 12' rowboat i've been thinking about bringing up and stashing in the basement for the summer too.

I just want to make it a point to spend a little time up there with my dad too... he's been going to the Okanogan for years and he turned 70 this year and probably doesn't have many summers left (his own words) so it'd be nice to take time out to hang with him.  I know he wants to see this cabin up too but he'd probably rather have a cocktail and fish... I think I agree with him.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on April 11, 2016, 09:32:35 AM
Amen to all of that, guys!   A friend of mine had a 9' boat for sale with a tolling motor - it was a great deal ($200) so I'm going to snatch it up.  I need a trailer to put it on, but I need a flatbed trailer anyway, so there you have it.

Gonna float the lake down the hill from my place at least a little bit this summer.  As Ol' Jarhead knows, I have a BIG project going this summer, but I do want to stop and enjoy it a bit, too
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 11, 2016, 11:14:51 PM
Been milling up a storm this weekend :)  So far I've milled some 30+ very large logs and about 4100 board feet of lumber for a customer in Riverside. It's been downright awesome and my mill is chewing through the 20" plus 20 foot logs no problem :)

Burned you say?  Ya, we do that :)
Got lumber?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 28, 2016, 07:34:38 AM
Spent a wonderfully quiet evening at the cabin :)

Came out for work and managed to sneak off a little early (truthfully, I'll flex out my time and worked from the cabin a little too so it isn't really sneaking) and arrived in the early afternoon.  After 'moving in' and getting the power on I turned up the temp on the hot water which was just a little too cool before and is now a little too hot (which is much better since I can turn on cold and cool it to where I want it).  I rotated the composter drum and flipped the battery switch on the genset so it's available though never needed on short trips.  At least the battery got a good nights worth of charging this way and that seems to be working very well now.

Took some wood chips from planing paneling this winter over to the orchard and dumped them around the three remaining trees which seem to be doing well.  The cherry is about to explode with blossoms too!  [cool]  I'm still pretty tore up over the gophers eating my apples so I went and got the gopher rod and bated the mounds I saw they'd made into the orchard.  Darn things!  I will fight them back again!

I was too late in ordering new trees from St Lawrence Nursery so have to wait until the fall or spring to get more.  I'll order 2 more apples, a crab and if they have anything else I might toss a pear in again but last I checked they were doing apples only and none of the ones I lost :(

Seems to me it's green up here a lot more than the last 6 years so all the snow and now rain we've gotten is paying off :)  Usually it can be pretty dry in April (or was) and now it's about perfect.  Looks like a month later really.

Anyway, it's almost 7 years since we first looked for property out here!  Can you believe that?  I'm still not finished with the cabin but that's ok :)  It's finished enough that I can come out anytime, fire up the power and enjoy a visit like this one :)

Got some pics I'll share later, but for now I must get moving and head to work (leave around 6am when I'm at the cabin)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 12, 2016, 09:52:58 AM
Made a short trip to the cabin and got some fertilizer stakes in by each tree and tested the watering but found a cracked connection so I'll fix that next trip and turn on the spigot for the rest of the season.  So far though the last three trees seem to be doing well :)
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20160511_152505198_zps5pincydb.jpg)
My plumb is doing well :)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20160511_152733596_zpswpmw36h6.jpg)
Last apple is also doing well

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20160511_152545878_zpsjwsm0zwh.jpg)
The cherry is all blossoms

The ants are back but I think I hit them early enough with the Home Defense Max.  Hope so anyway.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: nailit69 on May 13, 2016, 06:42:57 AM
The trees are looking good...  [cool]

I'm heading back up to my place next weekend to do a little work. I need to pour 8 footings (4 ea. side) for my porch roofs and do some more backfilling in prep for my framing.     
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on May 17, 2016, 11:04:58 AM
Looking good!

Thinking of heading out to mine next weekend (5/28). Not a working trip, but one to just assess things and get some additional motivation.  ;D  Might only be for an overnight, if I can get out on Friday early enough.

Of course it's Memorial Day weekend, so if I get the itch to do anything, maybe they can deliver the excavator and I can get started on doing SOMEthing up there.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 17, 2016, 02:01:39 PM
Oh take the whole weekend!  COME ON!

My wife and will be at the cabin that weekend too.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on May 18, 2016, 04:36:26 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on May 17, 2016, 02:01:39 PM
Oh take the whole weekend!  COME ON!

My wife and will be at the cabin that weekend too.

Well, things got a little bit more interesting...

The company I'm working for is moving the office ... and the present office will be closed beginning next Tuesday.  The new office won't be available until the middle/end of the first week of June.  So we're all supposed to work from home.

It is quite tempting to head up this weekend, do some stuff, work from the east side all next week, and then do stuff on the weekend before coming home for the move to teh new office.

I am sorely tempted on this one.

Who knows, maybe this is the time to get the project moving!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: nailit69 on May 18, 2016, 06:01:33 PM
Sounds like oppurtunity is knocking... oh, it's for you JavaMan
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 18, 2016, 07:29:40 PM
Many a day I worked from the cabin :)  But I have power (solar) and internet (Huges) as well as a landline phone that I can forward my cell too :)

But if you're up working and need a break, shower, or just to visit let me know your schedule and I'd be happy to have you over for a meal if you find yourself working all week out there...but let me know ahead of time as I'm more often than not in Moses Lake and running back and forth a couple days a week ;)

But I am always looking for an excuse to go to the cabin! :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on May 21, 2016, 12:00:22 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on May 18, 2016, 07:29:40 PM
Many a day I worked from the cabin :)  But I have power (solar) and internet (Huges) as well as a landline phone that I can forward my cell too :)

But if you're up working and need a break, shower, or just to visit let me know your schedule and I'd be happy to have you over for a meal if you find yourself working all week out there...but let me know ahead of time as I'm more often than not in Moses Lake and running back and forth a couple days a week ;)

But I am always looking for an excuse to go to the cabin! :D

Well, it would seem that there are a LOT of folks encouraging me to head up to the cabin sometime during the next couple weeks.  I havfe a friend here that says I should go up as long as I'm back for Friday activities.  Unfortunately I wasn't thinking and scheduled lunch tomorrow with a different friend.

So, perhaps I will head up Saturday afternoon.  If push comes to shove, I'll just have to head into town to find the local starbucks in Omak... I think it's in the Safeway there. ... Ideally, my Karma will find a signal up on the property.  That would be awesome.  With the genny in the back of the truck, and the Karma, I'd have internet for work during the day.  And with the long days I might actually get some stuff done "after work"!

I'd love to be able to rent the excavator and at the very least get the road/drive cut in up to the building site.  That would actually put me ahead of schedule!

I'll Im/email/or call if I head that way - maybe one day we can get together for lunch or something.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 31, 2016, 08:50:41 AM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0757%201024x768_zpsouqwuizi.jpg)
Spent a great weekend at the cabin mostly burning slash and cleaning up

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0747%201024x768_zpsohuaue6q.jpg)
On the first day I fell the tree that was right in front of the wood shed.  I'd planned on that for some time and finally got to it (you can just see the stump).  Then I bucked it into saw logs and set them in a deck for the next day.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0734%201024x768_zpscniyxyei.jpg)
On Saturday one of my guys brought out some birch that I milled up for him and then I milled some 1x's and another 6x6 for the deck roof framing and sheathing.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0758%201024x768_zpsnytx2cfq.jpg)
We continued to clean up the slash that was let from previous trees I'd felled and got most o the hill south of the cabin cleaned off :)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0698%201024x768_zpsjrlxkn0l.jpg)
I'm always so amazed at how green it is this time of year :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on May 31, 2016, 03:30:06 PM
Sorry we missed you !

I went up to my place, and at the (poor) advice of someone went Saturday morning early.  Wound up pretty much blowing the entire day and was unable to rent an excavator top get stuff done.

But it worked out ok.  I picked out at least two drive routes to the building site.  Also saw the fire damage.  Spotty on my place - there will be a few large trees that can come down to be milled up - maybe plenty enough of dead ones to use for the cabin.

The guy south of me appears to have kept his horse barn, but lost the cabin.  At least from what I can tell.

Hopefully we can connect next time!  Your place is looking really good  :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 31, 2016, 03:53:17 PM
Sorry I missed you!  My wife told me she received a text from you when we came down from the property (she has my old number) and I meant to msg you my new number (it's been a few years since we last got together it seems!).

Glad to hear your place survived!  I was thinking it probably did but was a close call!

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 15, 2016, 11:29:08 AM
Even short trips to the cabin inspire me :)  and I just had another.  It was almost wintry when I arrived with all the hail on the ground but soon burned off and the day was decent enough that I was able to get the water line to the trees fixed and the timer set up to water them.  Then I planted 8 mounds of winter squash in the hope that it will grow well in the order with the water I have there.
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20160614_135126355_zpseouqmdxc.jpg)
The cabin still needs a lot of work but at least I can go and enjoy a short visit when I want to :)  It also got down to 31F last night!  Wow!  Hoe the cherries didn't mind!

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20160614_134724334_zpstc8h93rm.jpg)
This cheap timer has worked well with my low water pressure and keeps the trees happy in the dry months.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20160614_134900656_zpsmtxf8kzb.jpg)
My last apple is doing well this year!  No buds this time but it wouldn't matter anyway since no other apples survived to pollinate it.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20160614_134846897_zpsnjm2l64h.jpg)
The plum is doing well too

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20160614_134851510_zps45zru7p8.jpg)
The cherry is loaded but it also has afids on it so I sprayed it with soapy water to see if that would help

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20160614_121005040_zpsej07ybgh.jpg)
You can the little black bugs everywhere on it.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20160614_134743050_zpsein0zx2z.jpg)
Lots of rain this year so I'll need to mow soon!

All in all a good short visit and I enjoyed reading in fron tof the wood stove all evening :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: troy on June 15, 2016, 02:28:22 PM
Place is looking amazing, makes me want to pack up and move out that way.  I hear that nailit69 is offering to build cabins for hippies.  Maybe I can buy something near him, grow some long hair, and throw up some big blue tarps all over the place.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 26, 2016, 08:30:42 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0769%201024x899_zpsorkx6u1y.jpg)
Despite going to the cabin for the Forest Owners Field Day to show off the mill I did get a few hours today to put the posts and beams up for the roof I'm building over the deck (which I guess makes it a porch)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0773%201024x768_zpsxiwglq79.jpg)
My new bark spud worked great to strip off the dead bark off these year old logs :)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0770%201024x781_zpsovd37mls.jpg)
And my 6x6's were plenty dry to screw them down to the top.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0772%201024x768_zpsfmfgoo1a.jpg)
I have plans to get around the corner (just need to cut the beam so I can fit the second into it)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0775%201024x768_zpssp5tchm7.jpg)
Once the beams and posts are all up I'll set the ledger on the cabin just lower enough to sneak the new roof up under the old one.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0774%201024x768_zpshggdsyzu.jpg)
Then I'll install railings between the posts :) and relax!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: pmichelsen on June 27, 2016, 09:49:26 AM
Will the porch roof replace the roof on the entry? Looks like it should be nice and beefy.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 27, 2016, 11:16:03 AM
Quote from: pmichelsen on June 27, 2016, 09:49:26 AM
Will the porch roof replace the roof on the entry? Looks like it should be nice and beefy.

Yes :)  The porch was built about 5 years ago and the deck was added later....not I plan to have just one roofline from the porch around the covered deck/porch that was added and will be continued around the cabin
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 27, 2016, 01:55:56 PM
Some more pics from yesterdays work :)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20160626_082718700%201024x908_zpsrtd8n7cj.jpg)
My tools for peeling logs and cutting off branches.  The bark spud really worked great on the dead bark that was rotting off already but I haven't tried it on newly felled trees.
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20160626_082730852%201024x575_zpscfds0v2l.jpg)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20160626_095620162%201024x575_zpsvjhmt5pp.jpg)
Tools for mounting posts to the deck.  I used Timberlock screws (6" and 8") and made use of the brace to screw them in.  It was very handy.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20160626_095628140%20642x1024_zps6azieuha.jpg)
First pole set up and secured.

Now to get the rest of the job done!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 07, 2016, 07:42:11 AM
Got up to the cabin at 2:30pm yesterday and after getting settled in and most importantly, making sure the cordless phone and answering machine were hooked up (I pull the battery when I am gone and plug in a land line style phone so it will ring without power and I can answer if I arrive and it's ringing before I can switch them out).  I do this for my work as it's important that I am available all of the time day and night.

Once settled I went into the orchard where I'd planted some winter squash near the irrigation line for the trees.  I put in some drip irrigation and noticed that at least 4 or 5 of the 8 mounds had 2 inch plants in them :)  Some were pretty dry so I'm hoping my adding water will get them going too.  I then did some pruning on the trees and checked the cherry.  Seems the afids are dead from the spraying I did and many of the cherries appear to be surviving and may yet yield edible fruit.  Next I got the weed eater out and mowed down the grass and weeds in most of the small orchard.

I bought a new rifle and wanted to test it out (no sites yet but hey, who can blame me?) so I ran through a couple mags (30ea) and managed to hit my target despite the lack of sites :D  Felt good to pop off a bunch of rounds like that and much of what I learned and practiced over the years came back like riding a bike :)  I'll clean it up and attach sites which should be arriving today, then maybe zero this weekend.

Finally, with the important stuff out of the way I got to work on the deck.
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Porch3_zpscqtzekm5.jpg)
I grabbed the tractor and went and picked up two suitable logs I had laying in the old log deck, peeled them and after running around looking for a tape measure which I realized was in my 'mill box' but managed find a crappy one I had used previously to measure the depth of the water in the cistern years ago.  It worked and I soon had both logs peeled and cut to length.  Then I stood them up, one at 6 feet from the corner (as planned) and the second right on the corner.  This one will move later when I get the deck extension done but it will do for now as is.  Finally I cut the first beam at 45 degrees in the corner and then cut the next beam to match (more or less) and stuck it on top of the posts.  I was down to my last two 8" Timberlock screws so screwed it to the two new posts with those and used some 4" deck screws to tie it in the corner to the other beam.  I'll bring more 8" and 6" timberlocks back this weekend to finish screwing it down but for now it's secure.

The next step is to install the ledger on the cabin wall and set some rafters.  If all goes well I can have the roof framed before long :)

Once that was done I rigged the tractor for mowing and mowed an acre of field or so before busting the sheer pin and calling it a day :)  4 hours of effort an I feel a lot was done! :D

Just relaxed last night and though I head home today (after getting some work done in town) I'll be back Friday to mill in the valley so I'll spend a couple nights at the cabin.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 07, 2016, 11:05:43 PM
Now I just need to find a simpson bracket for a 4x8 rafter  to attach at the end of the wall in the corner
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 07, 2016, 11:11:05 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on July 07, 2016, 11:05:43 PM
Now I just need to find a simpson bracket for a 4x8 rafter  to attach at the end of the wall in the corner

I found this: http://www.homedepot.com/p/Simpson-Strong-Tie-18-Gauge-2x-Hip-Corner-Plate-HCP2/100375181 but it's for a single rafter (hip)....I have a long span (about 13 feet) and though I am using 1 3/4 x 8" rafters I thought the span was too much for them and that I should double them up to give me a 3 1/2" x 8" hip.  Using these is probably about like using 2x9's since they are stronger than 2x8's but not quite the depth of a 2x10....anyway, maybe I don't need to double up the hip....
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: ChugiakTinkerer on July 08, 2016, 01:05:22 PM
It seems that you could make that bracket work if you had no other choice.  It probably voids the warranty or whatever, but would it change the strength properties overly much to bend the tabs out a ways on that Simpson bracket so that it's wide enough to fit your 4x?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 08, 2016, 01:29:19 PM
Quote from: ChugiakTinkerer on July 08, 2016, 01:05:22 PM
It seems that you could make that bracket work if you had no other choice.  It probably voids the warranty or whatever, but would it change the strength properties overly much to bend the tabs out a ways on that Simpson bracket so that it's wide enough to fit your 4x?

I wouldn't use it on the 4x and may not need the 4x anyway.  Looking at span tables it seems the span length is fine for the hip rafter actually so I was probably over engineering the span.  In my mind though, since many jack (?) rafters will be attached to it, it should be stronger....some call for 2x10's but those are 1 1/2 x 9 1/4 and this is a 1 3/4 x 8 so it's very close, I surmise, in strength to a nominal 2x10
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: ChugiakTinkerer on July 08, 2016, 04:01:23 PM
Your rafter looks to be pretty close to a 2x10 in performance.  You can check a general beam calculator and plug in the dimensions of your rafter here:

http://www.forestryforum.com/members/donp/beamclc06b.htm

Picking some arbitrary numbers, I did a few calcs to see how your rafter compares.  For a Doug fir #2 with a 12' span, 300 lbs live load and 100 lbs dead load, the deflection calculation is as follows:

2x8 nominal deflects 0.1637"
1.75 x 8 actual deflects 0.1044"
2x10 nominal deflects 0.0788"
Double 2x8 deflects 0.08184"
Double 1.75 x 8 deflects 0.0522"
Double 2x10 deflects 0.0394"

You could actually run your porch dimensions through this calculator and see how your rafter will hold up to the snow load as a single or as a double.  Using the Doug fir again and a span of 156", your rafter in single mode can withstand 850 lbs before it fails.  Assuming 24" rafter spacing that means a rafter in the middle is supporting 26 square feet of roof.  850 divided by 26 isn't much, only 32 lbs a square foot.  Your snow load probably exceeds that.

If you double up your rafters like you mention, then running a 3.5 x 8 beam through the calculator allows up to 1710 lbs, which allows you to double your total load on the roof to 64 lbs.  If you need more support you should consider a different rafter or a spacing of 16".  Also, that's based on the physical properties of Doug fir #2.  Your wood may be better (or worse) and should be taken into account.

Edit: I reread your comments above and realize you're just looking at whether to double the hip rafter.  Given the calcs above I would definitely double it.  Oops, also realized my all calcs were using 144" span.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 08, 2016, 04:26:06 PM
All good points.

I've been looking at a 19.2" spacing vs 24" and using singles except at the hips.  I'll check the calculator out.

Incidentally, I have an old shed on the property (was there when we bought) that has 2x4 rafters (insane right?) which have managed to hold up the roof though they are sagging.  I've seen a number of 2x6 rafters used in lower pitches than my main roof (12:12) but felt I needed to go as close to 2x10 as possible with the logs I had available to mill.  I went with 2x8's at 1 3/4 x 8" to get inside simpson strong ties but learned today most ties are NOT 1 3/4 but rather 1 9/16 and you have to order the wider ones.....but then I discovered many use joist hangers (much cheaper) and notch the rafter like you would for setting it on top of a ledger.....which leads me to think:  Hmmm....maybe I should just set them on top of a ledger.

I think what I'm going to do is use the ledger and simspon strong-ties (joist) and notch the rafters assuming I can get the 1 3/4" ties (vs the nominal ones).

I'll go over to FF and check that out (I'm there every day and was thinking I should check there too! DOH!)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 08, 2016, 04:47:49 PM
With Ponderosa Pine #2 B&S I show 600lbs Allowable Fiberstress in Bending (Fb)(psi) -- I don't see another reference to 'shear'
With Doug Fir #2 B&S I show 875Lbs

Span is 10' 1 11/16" for the main rafters.
Deflection shows: 0.0701"
Max Moment (ft-lbs) - 380lbs
Shear -- 16PSI (which I calc as 192lbs per square foot (not sure I did that right but I multiplied by 12)
20 square feet per rafter


The hip is 14' 2 5/8 and if single:
Deflection:  0.19088"
Max Moment (ft-lbs) - 532lbs
Shear -- 16PSI

Not sure if I did that wrong and haven't quite figured it out yet....

Double that hip gives me a Deflection of 0.09"
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: ChugiakTinkerer on July 08, 2016, 05:04:54 PM
For unsupported spans for rafters, you just look at the horizontal distance, not the roof pitch distance.  Is your deck 10' deep?  If so, then the unsupported span will be 10' less the thickness of the ledger and less the depth of the beam on top of the log posts.

I'm slowly getting a handle on your design concerns.  Give me long enough and it starts to sink in.  The beam calculators at FF have been really helpful for me in figuring out some of my girder spans.  As I understand it you'll attach a ledger to the cabin and run your rafters off of that.  The one corner of the house is going to be taking more load than it probably was designed for, so you might consider a post or other support on the corner, supporting the ledger board.

That corner for the hip rafter looks to be roughly 10' by 8'.  There's some artful way to figure out exactly how much area of the roof the hip will be supporting; all I know is it will be something south of 40 square feet.  If you use 40 s.f. as an upper bound, then you can put a number on the load to use in the beam calculations.  The more I look at this, the more I wonder if a doubled rafter will be sufficient.  What happens when your main roof sheds some snow onto the porch?  Is double the ground snow load a realistic number?

Edit: OK, probably the snow shed from the cabin roof won't put a load on the hip rafter, but it will on the straight rafters.  You'll want to make sure they are beefy enough to withstand that.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: ChugiakTinkerer on July 08, 2016, 05:31:11 PM
The diagram here ( http://www.beamchek.com/loadbook/img165.gif ) shows what I mean about figuring out what area of the roof will be bearing on the hip rafter.  That diamond shown is 50 s.f.  I think for your situation it will be slightly less, but I'm no structural engineer so don't hang too much on my guesswork.  Also because of the shape of the load, it won't actually be evenly applied along the length of the hip rafter.  More weight will be focused on the center portion.  I leave that derivation for the diligent student to figure out.   ;D

if you've got a 50 lb per s.f. snow load, the total live load will be 2500 lbs on that hip.  It will also be supporting the dead load of itself and the roof area, but half the weight of the jack rafters as well.  For a simple beam calculation, I'd consider using 3,000 lbs for an evenly distributed load and figure that will put you in the right ballpark.  Scale up or down if your snow load is different.

Edit: Using 3,000 lbs and a span of 168", it looks like three 2x12 is what it takes to support that load.  That seems like overkill, and maybe I'm way wrong in my head-scratching. 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 08, 2016, 06:21:59 PM
The deck is 10 feet deep and 8 feet past the wall of the cabin.  Beam is 6" supported every 6 feet by 6+" posts (many are 8").  So the span will be 10 feet minus the 6" beam and the 1 3/4" ledger so ~9'4 1/4"

The 12:12 pitch will slough the snow off onto the porch but primarily only in the section below the roof and maybe a little past it so that will be carried entirely (unless I'm missing something) by the rafters from the corner back along the face of the cabin.  This is also the southern face.

So, looking at that I need rafters to support the snow load there.  I know many using 4-6" logs as well as 2x6's and having no trouble with current snow loads but I'm certain if we got snow like there was in the 70's and 80's things would be different for them ;)

Closest snow load I can find is Republic which is 54 but it's a lot wetter there.  Tonasket is 25 but it's lower in elevation though closer in climate.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 08, 2016, 06:28:32 PM
On the cabin framing, the foundation under that corner is a concrete footing with a surface bonded cement block wall and 2x6 wood framed wall on top of that.  Should be pretty strong for the corner but I could put a post under the hip rafter by cutting out the corner of the post and setting it against the wall and then using timber lock or ledger lock screws to secure it.  That ought to support the hip pretty well.  It  will span just shy of 13'6".
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 08, 2016, 06:32:21 PM
http://www.seaw.org/assets/docs/WhitePapers/WABO-SEAW%20Snow%20Load%20White%20Paper.pdf
For those in WA State this helps.

Of course it doesn't account for the differences inside some of our larger counties like Okanogan where snow loading could be as high as 100 in places (or perhaps more) and very low in others.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on July 08, 2016, 06:44:33 PM
Member medeek has interactive maps available for many states. Washington state is located here (http://design.medeek.com/resources/snow/washingtongroundsnowloads.html).   It offers more precision than data in tables.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: ChugiakTinkerer on July 08, 2016, 07:14:52 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on July 08, 2016, 06:44:33 PM
Member medeek has interactive maps available for many states. Washington state is located here (http://design.medeek.com/resources/snow/washingtongroundsnowloads.html).   It offers more precision than data in tables.

Medeek's stuff is just amazing.  After looking at that WA snow load page I am even more impressed.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Gary O on July 08, 2016, 07:29:55 PM
OJ, yer place looks marvelous.

Lotsa work


...and it shows

keep a fire
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 08, 2016, 09:10:44 PM
Thanks Don.  His site shows this:
Normalized Ground Snow Load = 0.0170 psf/ft.
Pg = 0.0170 x 3101 = 52.8 psf

As close as I can get it to my place anyway (if I could zoom in more I could get closer but this is close enough I think).
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 08, 2016, 09:11:25 PM
Quote from: Gary O on July 08, 2016, 07:29:55 PM
OJ, yer place looks marvelous.

Lotsa work


...and it shows

keep a fire

Thanks Gary :)  It is a lot of work but I enjoy it :)  Keeps me young as they say (though I don't know who they are and the aches and pains don't seem to agree either)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 09, 2016, 11:47:50 PM
Quote from: ChugiakTinkerer on July 08, 2016, 04:01:23 PM
Your rafter looks to be pretty close to a 2x10 in performance.  You can check a general beam calculator and plug in the dimensions of your rafter here:

http://www.forestryforum.com/members/donp/beamclc06b.htm

Picking some arbitrary numbers, I did a few calcs to see how your rafter compares.  For a Doug fir #2 with a 12' span, 300 lbs live load and 100 lbs dead load, the deflection calculation is as follows:

2x8 nominal deflects 0.1637"
1.75 x 8 actual deflects 0.1044"
2x10 nominal deflects 0.0788"
Double 2x8 deflects 0.08184"
Double 1.75 x 8 deflects 0.0522"
Double 2x10 deflects 0.0394"

You could actually run your porch dimensions through this calculator and see how your rafter will hold up to the snow load as a single or as a double.  Using the Doug fir again and a span of 156", your rafter in single mode can withstand 850 lbs before it fails.  Assuming 24" rafter spacing that means a rafter in the middle is supporting 26 square feet of roof.  850 divided by 26 isn't much, only 32 lbs a square foot.  Your snow load probably exceeds that.

If you double up your rafters like you mention, then running a 3.5 x 8 beam through the calculator allows up to 1710 lbs, which allows you to double your total load on the roof to 64 lbs.  If you need more support you should consider a different rafter or a spacing of 16".  Also, that's based on the physical properties of Doug fir #2.  Your wood may be better (or worse) and should be taken into account.

Edit: I reread your comments above and realize you're just looking at whether to double the hip rafter.  Given the calcs above I would definitely double it.  Oops, also realized my all calcs were using 144" span.

The more I run the numbers the more it looks like a true 3.5" x 8" beam is darn close to a 2x12.  Perhaps that will be more than enough for a ~13' span.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 11, 2016, 07:39:09 AM
After much reading and research I decided to just use a ledger and when I got to the cabin did some math, used some online calcs and set the ledger to give me a 3.3:12 pitch.  Couldn't quite get to 3.5 but am close enough that the difference is negligible when it comes to cutting the angle on the rafter ;)
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20160710_132043934_HDR%20800x450_zpsdmql1ric.jpg)

With the temp ledger setup I was able to make my 'template' rafter and then set about making 4 more.  Marked the template 'do not use' and put it back on the top of the lumber pile (under cover) so it will be there when I get a chance to make more

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20160710_132046577_HDR%20800x450_zpsfawbu6o5.jpg)
Checked the seat and saw that my outer wall was either set originally a little out or had moved slightly when I installed the side.  But I couldn't move it by hand so I nudged it with the tractor bucket (yes I did! lol).

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20160710_163052796_HDR%20800x512_zpsjsp4q0ss.jpg)
After playing a little with the rafter seats and the wall I was able to nail them in place and call it a day :)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20160710_163252790%20450x800_zpss0rycmok.jpg)
I think with this angle the 12:12 roof will slough the snow right off to the ground actually ;)  I could be wrong but if I am than these rafter should hold it.  They are Ponderosa and I mill them to shrink 1/8
to 1 3/4 (max) but found they have not shrunk at all really and measure 1 7/8".....either that or I forgot and milled them at 2" because I swear I intended to make them smaller but they are not so who knows.  They are lighter (by a LOT) and have been drying a while so should be close to 20-22% which is typical for air drying so perhaps I did mill them at 2".  Anyway, they are beefy and should take the load.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20160710_164035045%201024x576_zps8wrnufuo.jpg)
Until the cows come home ;)

I just need to get the hip made now but my plan is to run both ledgers right to the corner (one over the other) and set the hip on top of them (like the rafters).  I may set a post under the ledger, just not sure yet but I am using 'Ledger Lock' screws so it ought to take the weight.  I plan to miter the end of the hip at 45 degrees / 84ish degrees to fit right on the corner but I'm not sure how well it will anchor if I do that.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Weather_zpscnhjftkw.jpg)
Meanwhile.....yes it's July folks....yes we've never seen weather this cold in July....can't really complain but am totally amazed.  It's been a VERY cool spring and summer so far.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on July 11, 2016, 08:28:17 AM
Eric at least you got the pitch at 3/12 or a little above so it is applicable with metal roof.  Manufacturer requires it to be at least 3/12.  If not some other roofing should be used.   

Yes the 12/12 will shove the snow on the 3/12.  At least mine did.  But it all depends on the surface area of the 12/12 above the 3/12+.  The only problem area will be the "hip" portion.

TWT (tweak with tractor) is more common than you think.  I recall using mine several times when person power was not quite enough. d*
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 11, 2016, 09:39:40 AM
Ya, I figured the 3.3:12 pitch would give me just that little extra downward slope that the big 12:12 will push it off.  The hip is not under the big roof so won't benefit from any of it's 'push' but on the other hand won't get snow from it anyway.  It will only carry what is dumped on it by nature ;)  But with a 4"x8" hip I think it will be able to take the punishment since that's actually stronger than a 2x12 (I'm fairly certain since a 3.5"x8" beam/hip is almost the same).

My only figuring now is whether or not to bevel the top of the hip for each slope.  Easy rafters shows two angles, one for the 3.3:12 pitch and the other for the 4.5:12 pitch on the end wall.  Never considered this before but it makes sense to me at the moment.  I'm guessing it just gives a flat surface to nail to on each side.

I am hoping to get the hip built on my next trip and maybe some jacks installed.

On a side note, since I had to come in from the corner a little to allow room for the hip and the rafter tail above, the rafter to the right of the hip will be a little closer to the next than my normal 19.2" centers and I can set the first jack closer to that one which should help bear a little more of the snow load.....somethign to ponder anyway.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: ChugiakTinkerer on July 11, 2016, 01:19:34 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on July 11, 2016, 07:39:09 AM
...  Marked the template 'do not use' and put it back on the top of the lumber pile (under cover) so it will be there when I get a chance to make more


I should try that trick on my next project.  I have the bad habit of setting a board aside for a specific use, and then 10 minutes later picking it up and using it for something else.  Making notes on the lumber would save a lot of grief and do-overs.

As far as that hip rafter goes, it looks like you're good with the doubled 1.75x8.  My seat of the pants estimate is that the tributary load area on the hip rafter is 36.4 square feet.  At 50 lbs snow load and 6 lbs dead load, that's a total load of 2040, dead load 218 lbs.  For a 3.5x8 beam spanning 156", it passes the beam calc with select P Pine and just fails with #1 P pine.  So pick your prettiest rafters and use those.  On that calculator the deflection fails for a floor (1/360) but passes for a roof (1/240).

You may not want to cut anything off the hip rafter to get the bevel, as it's just beefy enough doubled up.  You could cut some beveled shims on the table or band saw to get the angle you need.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 11, 2016, 03:35:43 PM
Good point on the hip.  I just grabbed stuff I'd milled for the rafters and realized some of it wouldn't pass muster :(  Gotta pay better attention next time!  And need to watch that when milling.

Sometimes it's hard to get the knots into the center of the board, or impossible, with knotty wood and really it should be milled into panelling and not construction lumber but it's a cabin ;) and if it doesn't appear to hold up I'll replace those rafters if need be or add more but I don't think it will be an issue really.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 12, 2016, 07:19:12 PM
One thing I've been debating is whether or not I should bevel the top of the hip.  Seems most don't do it but with a 3.3:12 pitch running into a 4.5:12 pitch I wonder if it might be better so the sheathing can land flat against the hip.  Maybe I'm overthinking it?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: bac4uw on July 12, 2016, 11:23:48 PM
"Meanwhile.....yes it's July folks....yes we've never seen weather this cold in July....can't really complain but am totally amazed.  It's been a VERY cool spring and summer so far."

No doubt! The usual PNW July 5th magical 'summer time' switch is a bit late this year. I'm fine with it while I'm working / building, but it's unusual.

Your place is looking great! I love that part of the state. I think we're going for a red metal roof as well.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: ChugiakTinkerer on July 24, 2016, 02:51:29 AM
Hey. Don_P blessed me with a link to the AWC Wood Frame Construction Manual, and it has a section on hip and valley beams.  Not sure if you've looked at it, but here's the link: http://www.awc.org/pdf/codes-standards/publications/wfcm/AWC-WFCM2015-ViewOnly-1510.pdf

Page 301 of that document spells out what is recommended for a hip beam.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 24, 2016, 11:09:02 PM
Thanks -- I'll check it out!  I've been milling (two weekends in a row plus a couple days) and am back at the cabin Thursday but once again to run the sawmill so unlikely to get any cabin work done.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Milling/IMG_20160723_172320084_HDR%201024x576_zpstmcqkfln.jpg)
I was set up in Wellpinit this weekend and milled up 30 logs for a customer :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 26, 2016, 12:42:57 PM
Get to be back at the cabin Thursday through Tuesday :)  Maybe the Cherries will be ripe (and not overripe or eaten by bears or birds) and I can pick them :)

I'm milling all weekend through so no time for cabin work :(  Soon though!  I swear it!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 08, 2016, 03:08:57 PM
Ordered a new chainsaw today :D

Got the Husky 576XPW with 32" B&C

Will buy a 24" or 28" B&C for it also but decided to go with the big bar for some large logs I need to buck up right now ;)  And that will give me some extra bar for a BIG pine I need to fall (yes I know a 24" bar will work for falling a 48" tree but I like a bar that bites deeper than 50% of the tree -- maybe because I don't fall for a living ???

Anyway, excited to add this new saw to my stable of tools :D  The 455 Rancher I have is a great saw and the 576 should be a good 'big' brother to it :D and it's a pro grade saw so expecting good things from it :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on August 08, 2016, 06:08:56 PM
Awesome! I brokedown and saved a few dollars and got the 455 like the one you have with the 24" bar (I think it is).  Used it today for the first time. Awsome!

Up at my place probably the rest of the week. I will have big machines here tomorrow ( I am hoping it will only be a 10 hour +/- job). Going to get the road to the top of my his done and the hole dug. I am stoked! And pumped!   d*

It is downright cold for this time of year!

If you were closer i'd invite you over...
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: nailit69 on August 08, 2016, 07:18:43 PM
Quote from: JavaMan on August 08, 2016, 06:08:56 PM
Awesome! I brokedown and saved a few dollars and got the 455 like the one you have with the 24" bar (I think it is).  Used it today for the first time. Awsome!

Up at my place probably the rest of the week. I will have big machines here tomorrow ( I am hoping it will only be a 10 hour +/- job). Going to get the road to the top of my his done and the hole dug. I am stoked! And pumped!   d*

It is downright cold for this time of year!

If you were closer i'd invite you over...

Javaman...  Glad to see you're back at your place and making some forward progress... it seems your project stalled out for quite some time and I was starting to get a little bummed thinking you'd sort of given up on it. 

IIRC, you mentioned in a post that you live up near Brownsville or Keyport? We're sort of neighbors at both places... I live in Olalla and my cabin is up near Palmer Lake.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 08, 2016, 07:35:22 PM
Jeff I'll give you a call when I head up (tomorrow is the plan) for a short stint.  Would be a good time to visit your place :)

Glad you like the 455 :)  I love mine!  It is my sawmill saw now for the most part but I have used it a ton in the last 5- years
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on August 09, 2016, 07:59:11 PM
Quote from: nailit69 on August 08, 2016, 07:18:43 PM
Javaman...  Glad to see you're back at your place and making some forward progress... it seems your project stalled out for quite some time and I was starting to get a little bummed thinking you'd sort of given up on it. 

IIRC, you mentioned in a post that you live up near Brownsville or Keyport? We're sort of neighbors at both places... I live in Olalla and my cabin is up near Palmer Lake.

Yeah, i am very glad to be back at it! Yes, i USED to live near Brownsville.  Was told last week that i need to puckup my stuff from the house... All my stuff.

Sigh.  Ah well.  I will lose myself in the projects that were put on hold.

The road was put in today and it is awesome! Well worth the mobey i am paying the guy...there were tines i was watching him I thought for certain he was going to tip right over...but didn't.  I am pretty sure it would have takene three times as long.

He'll be back tomorrow to dig tue hole for the foundation and pretty up the road.  He is bringing a compactor and is going to have me run that.  Should be fun. 

The plan tomorrow is to drive the truck to the top.  Walking it has become an order of magnatude easier
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 09, 2016, 08:01:07 PM
Note to self:  when cutting the birdsmouth on a rafter remember to set the angle of the rafter and cut 90 degrees to it rather than just measuring down, marking the beginning of the 6x's the mouth will rest on and then cutting out the mouth d* d* d*

After doing this I smacked myself.  Don't be a hurry!

As it is I had to fiddle with the angles a bit and went from 12.5 degrees (actually 77.5) to 10 degrees and that seems to match the roof better though I may end up back closer to the called for 77.5 once I have the birdsmouth correct.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on August 09, 2016, 08:02:59 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on August 08, 2016, 07:35:22 PM
Jeff I'll give you a call when I head up (tomorrow is the plan) for a short stint.  Would be a good time to visit your place :)

Glad you like the 455 :)  I love mine!  It is my sawmill saw now for the most part but I have used it a ton in the last 5- years

I am looking forward to it!  Currebtly about to have dinner in Omak
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 09, 2016, 08:03:21 PM
Glad to hear Java!  I'm at the cabin now but leaving tomorrow to pick up my new saw (Husky 576xpw -- pro saw) but may be back on Thursday.  THis rain shut me down or I'd be working on my hip rafter still!

Now all you need is to fix that roof!  Or at least tarp it so you can stay inside the cabin instead of your truck
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: pmichelsen on August 09, 2016, 11:16:05 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on August 09, 2016, 08:01:07 PMDon't be a hurry!

This is something I try and remind myself of constantly. Take it slow and do it right the first time, or rush through it and do it two, three, or maybe four times  ::)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 10, 2016, 07:22:31 AM
Quote from: pmichelsen on August 09, 2016, 11:16:05 PM
This is something I try and remind myself of constantly. Take it slow and do it right the first time, or rush through it and do it two, three, or maybe four times  ::)

Ha!  At my age you're supposed to do that and know that but I just know it....doing it takes me reminding myself!

Ahhh well, I have extra 2x8's and can cut this one down for jack rafters in the end ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 10, 2016, 07:25:56 AM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20160809_171945463_HDR_zpsfvmhlae4.jpg)
Getting close.  If you look carefully you can see the birdsmouth is off :(  Angle is off slightly too but I'll get it right.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20160809_171929552_zpsrnj5ylqw.jpg)
My plan was to get this hip done, then use it as a template for the 2nd that will be nailed to it.  It will basically be a template for itself AND the next hip as I messed up the birdsmouth but at least I'm getting it done.

The rain stopped me as it was coming down in buckets (never seen that in August before).
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: nailit69 on August 10, 2016, 08:22:33 AM
Just for future reference... your angle on the hip is different (less) than the common rafter angle... the rise/run on a common is 3/12, the rise/run of that pitch on a 45 degree angle is 3/17.  Looks like that may have been where your mistake was made.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 10, 2016, 09:29:31 AM
Quote from: nailit69 on August 10, 2016, 08:22:33 AM
Just for future reference... your angle on the hip is different (less) than the common rafter angle... the rise/run on a common is 3/12, the rise/run of that pitch on a 45 degree angle is 3/17.  Looks like that may have been where your mistake was made.

My commons on the front are 3.3/12 and the side roof will be 4.5/12 but using easy rafters I was able to get very close.  The problem I have, I think, is that I didn't believe easy rafters and reworked the angle of the face cut (cabin side) before fixing the birdsmouth.  I'll have to first recut the birds mouth (as best I can) then check and likely recut the face angle.  Once I do that though I should be able to then make a new hip with the right cuts and set it up.  I'm close now though (as you can see with the 1x that shows only a slight difference in angle (lifted about 3/16ths of an inch at the top side vs the commons).

In the end though, it's a cabin! lol
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Gary O on August 11, 2016, 06:22:20 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on August 10, 2016, 09:29:31 AM
In the end though, it's a cabin! lol

My mantra

Ohhhh yeahhh
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 11, 2016, 08:07:01 AM
Quote from: Gary O on August 11, 2016, 06:22:20 AM
My mantra

Ohhhh yeahhh

Glad I'm not the only one! ha!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 11, 2016, 09:30:48 AM
New saw assembled and ready for work :)
(http://www.forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/22463/IMG_0825_28800x39929.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1470923765)

Not a lot of difference in the two saws though the small one is the 'home owners' type saw (455 Rancher) vs the 'pro' saw I just bought :)
(http://www.forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/22463/IMG_0824_28800x79829.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1470923765)

Now to get the big saw out and cut some logs up with it!  (and to order another bar and chain (or two chains for that matter)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: pmichelsen on August 11, 2016, 09:49:31 AM
Man, that's a good looking saw! Wish I could justify one, but my little 440e seems to be all I really need at my place.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 11, 2016, 10:29:10 AM
I abused my 455 for several years and it does great for 90% of what I do but with some big logs to work and the need to slab stuff too big for the mill this saw was a must :)  at least that's what I told the wife! ha!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on August 11, 2016, 05:39:38 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on August 10, 2016, 09:29:31 AM
My commons on the front are 3.3/12 and the side roof will be 4.5/12 but using easy rafters I was able to get very close.  The problem I have, I think, is that I didn't believe easy rafters and reworked the angle of the face cut (cabin side) before fixing the birdsmouth.  I'll have to first recut the birds mouth (as best I can) then check and likely recut the face angle.  Once I do that though I should be able to then make a new hip with the right cuts and set it up.  I'm close now though (as you can see with the 1x that shows only a slight difference in angle (lifted about 3/16ths of an inch at the top side vs the commons).

In the end though, it's a cabin! lol

Reminds me of mine .... "It's just a shed!"

But the next one will be "Just a cabin" LOL
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 16, 2016, 09:19:58 PM
Back at the cabin for a couple days.  All I've done so far is ride around on the ATV, put some gopher 'bait' out to stop them from killing the rest of the orchard and just basically chilled out.

Noticed this is the 3rd most viewed thread in the owners forum!  over 500,000 view! WOW!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on August 17, 2016, 03:46:21 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on August 16, 2016, 09:19:58 PM
Back at the cabin for a couple days.  All I've done so far is ride around on the ATV, put some gopher 'bait' out to stop them from killing the rest of the orchard and just basically chilled out.

Noticed this is the 3rd most viewed thread in the owners forum!  over 500,000 view! WOW!

That's just me hitting "refresh" a bunch of times a day  d*

J/k ... I am debating heading up this weekend and starting the form "framing"
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 17, 2016, 09:28:09 PM
Ha!  ;D

Should be cooler this weekend but if your place is like mine it's cooler anyway ;)  88F when I got up here after work today and it was 100F down in town!  ??? 8) ;D

Got a couple hours in today!  FINALLY got some more hardware cloth under the cabin to stop the rats etc from stealing insulation.  I'd started this years ago and never seemed to finish it.  Didn't like the way I was doing it etc and just let it go.  But I finally brought my brad nailer out and ran another 25 feet of the stuff in the worst location.  Won't stop them in other spots but will at least keep them at bay at the edges.  Next trip I'll do more but I want to get a better nailer.

Then I started on the hip rafter.  Took the old one down after taking a few measurements and made a new one.  It went right up into place almost perfect! :D  It's a cabin right?  And no way anyone will notice the 1/8th of an inch or so it's out so I'm callin' it!
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20160817_185930067_zpsilqc9rwr.jpg)
Now I just need to get some more nails for the air nailer and then I'll finish securing this one, make a second and set it beside it and nail them together to give me the 4x8 I'm looking for.  Then I can get to work on the jack rafters.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20160817_190110866_HDR_zpss7bf7r43.jpg)
Shouldn't take me long now as I've got my angles set and know what I did wrong before.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20160817_185954753_HDR_zps9ykbb86o.jpg)
With luck I'll have the framing done to the old porch and on labor day I can remove the old roof and finish this one across the entire porch, sheet it above the old porch (sealed up) and string 1x6 across the rest (not fully sheeting it, just setting 1 1x6 every 24" up to the roof I've decided as it's just a covered deck).
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on August 26, 2016, 09:38:17 AM
Don't forget to unchain the ATV before you go riding it!  LOL

I have a friend that has a line on a FREE (like beer) JOBOX that I will probably take up next spring.  That way I won't have to haul a lot of tools back and forth but I'm going to need to chain it to something.

And you're right - that week I was up there and the temps in Omak got to the high 90's, it was still only in the high 70's-lower 80's up at my place.  The nights were downright cold!

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on September 01, 2016, 01:13:49 PM
How's the porch roof coming?  Got it done by now?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 02, 2016, 07:06:59 AM
Sadly, it sits as is :(  Haven't had a chance to get to it but am heading up today!  [cool] ;D

My wife is bringing the grandsons this evening and while it's supposed to rain I do hope to get some of the roof framing done anyway, do a little hunting (birds) with the boys and generally just enjoy the weekend :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 04, 2016, 11:22:13 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Gettingthre_zpssk5h4d8o.jpg)
Need to do some work on the rafters on the west side (left) but it's getting there.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 04, 2016, 11:23:47 PM
By the way, the 3 close together rafters in the middle are due to me screwing up and cutting a jack rafter too short, the wife realized it would fit between the other two and said "what else are you going to do with it?" without a good answer I nailed it in there and said 'screw it'!  It will make the roof stronger! ha!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on September 05, 2016, 09:37:14 AM
Looks like progress!  How's the weather up that way been lately?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 05, 2016, 07:23:25 PM
Weather was pretty nice actually though it rained pretty heavily on Sunday.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20160905_120253200_HDR%201024x780_zpsznoqf6rf.jpg)
Pulled off those rafters and redid them all.  I couldn't leave it as it was and am happier now :)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20160905_134003762_HDR%20756x1024_zpsirroktcu.jpg)
Got some blocking in too

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20160905_133917537%20725x1024_zpsuc8u8zcg.jpg)
Next trip I hope to get more of this section of the roof done (blocking, fascia, strapping) so I'll be ready to install the metal roofing before removing the old porch roof and continuing over it.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Gary O on September 05, 2016, 11:13:23 PM
every time I see pics of yer cabin I loose track of time and end up catching myself with my mouth open

I may have drooled a little bit this time....keyboard is a bit moist
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 06, 2016, 08:25:31 AM
Quote from: Gary O on September 05, 2016, 11:13:23 PM
every time I see pics of yer cabin I loose track of time and end up catching myself with my mouth open

I may have drooled a little bit this time....keyboard is a bit moist
Ha!  All that mess?  I love your place so it's mutual :)

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 06, 2016, 09:43:16 AM
What did I do the rest of the weekend?  Well the grandkids came along so there was things we had to do (like teaching them to look for grouse, riding the tractor and ATV etc).

I managed to clean up the road with the tractor Friday evening and a bit on Sunday and bucked and split a bit of that big pine.  Still have lots of splitting to do and more of the log to buck up but got a good start on it and this new saw rocks!

(http://www.forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/22463/CHainsaw.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1473172393)  (http://www.forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/22463/IMG_7811.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1473172564)
Couple shots of sawing up the big fir.  Saw never slowed down, just kept going and going :)

This log is the one I tried to buck up with my 455 and it just didn't have the ooomph to do it though admittedly the chain was not sharpened well and it wasn't cutting straight either so it probably would have done better but still, it barely made it through this in several minutes....in the same amount of time with the big 576 I bucked the log up into several rounds.  Still need to get back and finish the work as half the tree is left to buck up but I'll get it before the snow flies!

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on September 06, 2016, 02:41:17 PM
Sweet!  The plan (and we all know about plans, right?) is to head up to the property Thursday right after work, and work remote Friday. And then be there all next week.

Of course, I STILL haven't got the truck back from the shop....  ???
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 09, 2016, 10:01:16 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20160909_124415826_HDR%201024x576_zps9r0mhuvi.jpg)
Stopped by the cabin to grab my cell phone carrier and take some measurements so I could order the roofing ($570 at Mideway)....

Now I just need to get back next week and do some more blocking and strapping and get ready for the final weekend of the month when I rip off the old porch roof and finish the new one complete with roofing :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 14, 2016, 08:49:25 PM
I had originally planned to be here at the cabin much earlier in the day and wanted to take a half day today so I had some time to work on the new deck roof but alas, I didn't get here until after 3pm.  BY the time I was moved in and set up it was 4:30 so I spent an hour working on blocking.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20160914_172025107_HDR_zpsxsdkhfzl.jpg)
Not the best pic but you can see the blocking on top of the beam on the west wall.  I started coming around to the south (right in the pic) but ran out of time as I knew it would be a while to tear down etc before I could make some dinner and get a fire going in the stove.

I put in one brace on a post to try out my idea of notching out the post enough to set a 2x6 brace in it but found that I'd have to take off more than I want to so I chiseled out a quarter inch or so and tapered the 2x6 to the post to see how that would work....it's ok and for now I may try this as a simple way to brace the posts.

Meanwhile I managed to get my bracing in and though I need a new miter saw blade (which I'll get tomorrow) the new table saw blade was great!  I'd been using the same two for some years now so it's time to replace them both.

Tomorrow I plan to take a half day and get back to the cabin around noon or one and then I'm going to finish the blocking, set one more rafter and strap the roof.  If time allows I'll pull off some of the metal roofing on the old porch and start sheeting the new roof with it (in the corner) as I'll be using two of those old 4 foot pieces (or were they 5'?) for the corners since I'll need to cut them to fit.  I also picked up a metal blade for my skill saw so I'll have no problem cutting them to fit.

Oh and the box of 3 1/4" galvies I picked up for my air nailer???  Ya they were 2"....not sure how I did that but I'll take them back and get the right ones tomorrow.

Otherwise the fire is going, the cabin is warming and the bourbon is cold and in the glass :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 15, 2016, 08:52:39 PM
Got most of what I wanted done today.  Just failed to get the old roof stripped of one set of panels and didn't get the last rafter in but otherwise got much done.
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20160915_174054508_HDR_zpss2rhrcig.jpg)
Blocked and strapped including fascia.  Now just have to do some staining to protect the wood and get the roofing on this section before stripping the old porch roof off and continuing past it to cover it up with the new roof and build the ends on it.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Gary O on September 15, 2016, 09:44:31 PM
appreciate the pics, OJ

good times

the best


cheers
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 15, 2016, 11:08:14 PM
Thanks :)  I'll post some more tomorrow.  I'm pretty much over the moon now with what I've gotten done!  Can't wait to stain it all and get the roofing on and of course finish this project.  It will chain things a LOT!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 16, 2016, 10:03:22 AM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20160915_190134356_zpsbccmrug5.jpg)
Just some pics of the framing.  I'm not the best carpenter but this is a cabin! ha!

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20160915_190315348_zpsyc27tfsr.jpg)
I plan to box in the eves when the roof is done and put in vents.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20160915_190122142_zpsvjvujsit.jpg)
Pretty sure this is the way I'm going to brace the posts.  It's simple and should work.  Basically 2x6's set 1/4" into the posts (to give a flat surface) and set at a 45 degree angle.  Not too intrusive and should look good (once I use better wood, this was a test brace on a post that will be moved later)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20160915_190146166_zps2gppmxo8.jpg)
Need one more rafter put in and decided to strap the short span to it separately as I'll have to remove it all when I extend the porch (the strapping not the rafter) to tie it in but it will sit that way for several months to a year)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20160915_190223119_zpsofkq2ifd.jpg)
Next I need to clean off the posts etc and stain.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 20, 2016, 01:37:16 PM
Oh Lord I have the bug!  I've been milling a LOT this year (met my goal for the year a couple weeks back so am pretty happy with that) and have not had as much time to work ont he cabin as I would like but I'm dying to get back up there now and am just biding my time waiting for Thursday!  I'll pick up my roofing material and head the cabin in the afternoon with the hope of staining the rafters and beams first, then starting the roofing in the corner and working my way to the old porch.  Friday I'll likely be roofing and doing some light framing as well as stripping the porch roof down to felt if the weather holds.  Then Saturday I'll remove the old roof (sawzall and elbow grease I imagine) then I'll frame the new roof and sheet it with 1" boards I milled up.  Once done, I'll stain, let that dry then felt and install roofing.

With luck I can be done by Sunday evening...

So ya, I'm dying here ;)  even went through the 1st 40 pages of this 106 page thread!!! just to relive some of the early moments of cabin framing :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: poppy on September 21, 2016, 09:41:25 AM
I have been following your thread since the beginning and have very much enjoyed the detail and the pics.

There are those on here with much more knowledge and experience than I, but I think the bracing for the porch posts are redundant and just decorative.  What with being tied into the main cabin plus having triangles all over the place, that porch isn't going anywhere.  This comment is worth exactly what you are paying for it.

I really like your sawmill; wish I had one.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: ChugiakTinkerer on September 21, 2016, 11:11:00 AM
Poppy may be right about the post bracing being more ornamental than structural, but I sure like it.  Have you thought about peeling some small logs and using those for braces, rather than the sawn wood?  It seems like it might make for a more fetching front porch.

Did I mention I'm real good at suggesting ideas that require yet more work?   ;D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 21, 2016, 01:33:54 PM
Ha!  More work!

The roof does move side to side when I walk on it, hence the bracing. 

I have thought of logs and may also give that a try as I like the idea a lot.....let me think about it! ha  d*

We shall see how it goes tomorrow!  I'm heading back up for the weekend (taking Friday off) and can't wait to get metal on that roof and extend it over the old porch ;)  Good times!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on September 21, 2016, 03:19:12 PM
QuoteThe roof does move side to side ...

That is one of the things sheet goods are good at stopping.  ;D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 21, 2016, 05:46:32 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on September 21, 2016, 03:19:12 PM
That is one of the things sheet goods are good at stopping.  ;D

Imagine so, but with all the 1" strapping I'd hoped to see some improvement...it is stiff in the framing but clearly the posts need some bracing.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Gary O on September 21, 2016, 08:43:04 PM
'Just some pics of the framing.  I'm not the best carpenter but this is a cabin! ha!'

I

am not alone

Keep a fire, fellow cabiner
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: pmichelsen on September 22, 2016, 09:40:15 AM
Quote from: ChugiakTinkerer on September 21, 2016, 11:11:00 AMHave you thought about peeling some small logs and using those for braces, rather than the sawn wood?  It seems like it might make for a more fetching front porch.

This was the first thing I thought of as well. I seem to remember you having one of those tenon makers for small logs, or am I making that up.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 22, 2016, 01:22:42 PM
Quote from: pmichelsen on September 22, 2016, 09:40:15 AM
This was the first thing I thought of as well. I seem to remember you having one of those tenon makers for small logs, or am I making that up.

I do and originally planned to make the railings with it but today I have some other ideas in mind (mostly due to time it would take vs other options).  Best bet for the pole supports I think would be 45 degree angles and some notching.  Faster for sure anyway
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 23, 2016, 07:52:14 AM
5:45am and I've been up an hour  ??? maybe it's age setting in ;) or just the excitement of knowing I'll get a bunch done today (god and weather permitting).

I managed to get the roofing to the cabin without much excitement (ok I had to stop a couple times and push it back onto the pickup bed before I finally got smart and strapped around the back of the roofing to something prevented it from moving out of the bed (wasn't an issue on the road, was an issue on the 'off' road)... d* but I got it up here and after some work (that thing I do to pay for all this fun stuff) I set about staining as much of the framing as I could.  I got most of it done but will need to finish some this morning when it's above 40 degrees. 

Meanwhile, I can get some rafters made for the section over the old porch so they will be cut and ready to install as soon as the roof comes off and the ledger goes up.  I can also get that last rafter installed on the other side of the roof and start installing roofing over the now stained section of the roof so I'll have a place to set my saws etc that will be protected from the weather should any more in.

All in all it should be a good day! :D  Can't wait to get started but it's still dark out.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on September 23, 2016, 11:10:46 AM
Can you use the tractor bucket to lift the old roof off?  Probably would not have enough height.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 23, 2016, 04:03:52 PM
Not enough height.  I'm going to have to pull the nails out of the sheeting and then lift it off, then I'll have to pull and cut nails out of the framing so I can remove it.  Once done I can install the new ledger and rafters and get busy sheeting it with 1x's.  Cover with 30# felt and finally roof.  I think I can install the ends after that.

So far so good today.  I've only made one mistake that will take some fiddling to correct (installed the roofing edge OVER the lip rather than under it on the first couple sheets on the long roof.  Other than that and having to remove a few panels on the west side and reset them so they are square it's been ok though cool with some rain and lots of clouds.

Supposed to get warmer and sunny the rest of the weekend though so I should be good to go.  After I get some lunch I'll get back at it and finish the roofing I can do now (almost done now) then I can get to making rafters if I have time today (hoping to get at least some made before quitting time).
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 23, 2016, 05:49:20 PM
Taking a break in the cabin (which is nice and warm thanks to the fire in the wood stove) as it began raining but I'm making progress.
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20160923_152701547_HDR_zps2ugpqamg.jpg)
If you look closely you might see the flashing.  You may also notice the ridge cap is a bit flat at the top but that's because I wanted it to go under the flashing (didn't really know what I'm supposed to do there actually) and with it under the flashing I don't expect water or snow to get under it.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20160923_152514980_zpsysu0oepv.jpg)
A little view from under the roof :)  It's dry under here now :D

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20160923_152544044_HDR_zpsocmftjlo.jpg)
Lots to do still but with the crappy weather it's slow going...and I'm getting sore!  It's been a long day of going up an down the ladder over and over again....take up a sheet, measure and mark it for cutting, bring it down, cut it, take it back up, check it, screw it down, go back down, get another sheet, take it up, measure and mark it, take it down and then back up to screw it down...repeat all day then drink whiskey! ;)  It helps with the pain
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 23, 2016, 09:01:31 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20160923_181958080_zpspdfvcetc.jpg)
Got the last rafter on and strapped after fiddle farting (and some cussing) around with the flashing which I finally got installed.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20160923_181717935_HDR_zps3quubpg1.jpg)
Once the rafter was in I installed the 2nd to last piece of roofing over it.  Still have one more on that side to put in but want to wait until the front is finished

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20160923_181634955_HDR_zpsrbrylspw.jpg)
Starting to take shape.

Now I'm smoked so it's time to take a shower, have a drink (or two) and wait for my wife to arrive (she's coming out for the weekend to keep me company while I bust my hump getting the roof done.

I'm pretty sore now so likely will start slow tomorrow but hope to really get a lot done!  The big challenge will be removing the roof off the old porch but once that's done it should go pretty well since it's a straight set of rafters with no corners, no cutting roofing, no tricky miter cuts etc :)

Here's hoping!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Gary O on September 24, 2016, 06:29:58 AM
'It's been a long day of going up an down the ladder over and over again....take up a sheet, measure and mark it for cutting, bring it down, cut it, take it back up, check it, screw it down, go back down, get another sheet, take it up, measure and mark it, take it down and then back up to screw it down...repeat all day then drink whiskey! ;)  It helps with the pain'

You sure yer not me?

Luvin' this thread, OJ

Keep on keepin' on
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 24, 2016, 08:14:32 AM
Nah!  You're up at 3:30am!  I never get up before 4 LOL
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 25, 2016, 08:24:08 AM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20160924_183527794_HDR_zps6xmdnpwm.jpg)
Teaser for the day ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: pmichelsen on September 25, 2016, 09:20:44 AM
Looking good!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on September 25, 2016, 03:19:28 PM
Lookin' GOOD!  Wishin' I was as far along on my place... but next year - beginning in the spring.

Yeah, that looks like a good beginning to a wrap around porch/deck  ;)  I'm guessing that late next year, that bug will probably bite you - after all... you need a place for the hot tub!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 25, 2016, 10:58:55 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20160925_143008587_HDR%201024x576_zpsylsei3q5.jpg)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20160925_143046861_HDR%201024x576_zpsdsj3haf5.jpg)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20160925_143213081%201024x576_zpsz6jlyipa.jpg)

Not quite finished but getting there :)  Have to come back to finish the porch walls (to the rafters) so the bugs can't get in but for now it's secure (more or less) and won't get wet inside ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 26, 2016, 11:33:20 AM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20160924_183401118_zpsykcrhoz4.jpg)
One of my challenges is that I did not think about placing the rafters over the walls of the old porch.  I just marked off 19.2" and nailed them down...I also didn't think about blocking placement  d*  I just kept going (in a hurry) and placed the blocks in the line I'd started.  I should have stopped and placed the blocks over the porch wall I think.

So now I have to decide how to build the walls on the porch to get up to the roof so I can sheet it in and insulate the whole thing...I'm still pondering this.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 26, 2016, 11:49:01 AM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_8130_zpsa0s8jzvx.jpg)
Action shot :)

My knees and back are sore...come to think of it so are my hands and just about everything else!  But I managed to get a lot done :)  Even cleaned the chimney, rotated the composter drum and added compost...heck, probably did other stuff too but my mind is a fuzzy thing today...I need to work to recover from this cabin trip! lol
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: pmichelsen on September 26, 2016, 03:33:26 PM
Would it work to just attach a top plate to the bottom of your 1X and then fill in with studs where needed. Since it's not supporting any weight you really just need something to hold the sheathing right? You'd just have to notch your sheathing around your blocking.

After doing my roof the back of my knees were extremely tender from my knee pads, not sure if it would have been worse or better without wearing the pads.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 26, 2016, 03:51:53 PM
Quote from: pmichelsen on September 26, 2016, 03:33:26 PM
Would it work to just attach a top plate to the bottom of your 1X and then fill in with studs where needed. Since it's not supporting any weight you really just need something to hold the sheathing right? You'd just have to notch your sheathing around your blocking.

After doing my roof the back of my knees were extremely tender from my knee pads, not sure if it would have been worse or better without wearing the pads.

Kneepads -- this is why I don't always wear them!  Just kills me but I should have opted for them this weekend as the knees are sore...it's a trade off I guess.

On the walls -- yes I think I could have done that or any number of other ideas ;)  Just mashing them around in my head to decide what's best.  I'm using my own lumber for sheeting too though so notching is a little more difficult since each piece is a 1x6...but there are ways around all that ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Gary O on September 26, 2016, 09:22:21 PM
Love watching you work, OJ.

Knees;
I pal from a tire company told me sewing a pocket to yer levis over the knee, then stuffing them, beats heck outta pads or no pads

keep a fire
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: ksBrandon on September 27, 2016, 02:48:35 PM
I've always liked the look of your place, but that porch makes it look even better!  Almost as jealous of you lighting fires in the stove already...  As I read that post the other day, it was around 90 here in Kansas.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 27, 2016, 03:46:53 PM
Quote from: ksBrandon on September 27, 2016, 02:48:35 PM
I've always liked the look of your place, but that porch makes it look even better!  Almost as jealous of you lighting fires in the stove already...  As I read that post the other day, it was around 90 here in Kansas.

Got down to 35F the other day ;) and I love the woodstove when it gets cold :D

I have to admit that the porch is making a HUGE impression on me!  Can't wait 'till I can sit there and have my morning coffee....or just hang out waiting for deer to come by!  ha!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on September 27, 2016, 04:03:08 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on September 27, 2016, 03:46:53 PM
Got down to 35F the other day ;) and I love the woodstove when it gets cold :D

I have to admit that the porch is making a HUGE impression on me!  Can't wait 'till I can sit there and have my morning coffee....or just hang out waiting for deer to come by!  ha!

Oh, I'm glad to hear about that temp.... I'm guessing it was at least another 5 degrees colder (at least) at my place... which means the concrete would have been exposed to freezing overnight.  Glad I made the call I did.

Your place is looking more and more like an honest-to-goodness homestead!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 27, 2016, 10:58:27 PM
Quote from: JavaMan on September 27, 2016, 04:03:08 PM
Oh, I'm glad to hear about that temp.... I'm guessing it was at least another 5 degrees colder (at least) at my place... which means the concrete would have been exposed to freezing overnight.  Glad I made the call I did.

Your place is looking more and more like an honest-to-goodness homestead!

Nope.  It may well have been warmer.  I am often a couple degrees warmer in the winter than down in the valley below me (500 feet or so) but much colder than down in the OK valley (2000 feet or more below me).

Remember, while it is colder in the mountains, cold air flows downhill ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on September 28, 2016, 01:00:18 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on September 27, 2016, 10:58:27 PM
Nope.  It may well have been warmer.  I am often a couple degrees warmer in the winter than down in the valley below me (500 feet or so) but much colder than down in the OK valley (2000 feet or more below me).

Remember, while it is colder in the mountains, cold air flows downhill ;)

True, but only as long as the air below is warmer  ;D  And yeah, my place seems to always be colder than down in the OK Valley (especially down near Omak) by at least 15-20 degrees
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 03, 2016, 09:26:13 AM
While not at the cabin I did manage to work on some projects that will affect it :)  For one, I brought our old ATV (we have two) home on the last trip and stripped it down.  I replaced the ignition (new keys too) which had been cut off by a 'friend' who was trying to hot-wire it (I said he could hot-wire it and that was a mistake) and pulled the battery which was toast so I ordered a new one.  Next step is to get it running again after replacing a fuel line and cleaning it up, then I'll run it over to a friends who used to own a motorcycle shop and he will clean and rebuild the carb and then I'll rebuild the breaks and make even get the spray bombed paint off it....lastly I think I'll replace the seat cover or the whole seat and pain the metal to protect it.  Once done it can winter at home in the garage.

Next I set to rebuilding my broken chainsaw.  I've got it torn down and partially rebuilt but had to order a gasket for it so when that comes in I can finally get it finished.  Seems it came with the carb settings set too lean and not knowing that I ran it too hot, didn't break it in right and burned it up.  Should have been a warranty thing but I didn't learn that until after I tore it down so it's on me.

Not much else going on except some garage organization which will help set me up to do some wood working at home when away from the cabin :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 03, 2016, 06:31:41 PM
First afternoon of sitting on the deck in the rain :) I like hearing the rain on the metal roof above me and being able to sit here enjoying a drink and relaxing to the quiet of the woods :)

Too bad my Honey couldn't be here with me but she does plan on coming out later in the month ;)

I managed to get the broken snow plow down to the neighbors and he has a plan to rebuild it so it will be good to go before the snow flies! I then got some plastic on the east wall of the porch -- the only wall that might have a chance of getting some rain in through it as it's covered by only a foot (or a little more) of roof and the top of the wall is still open. Won't get any major construction done today as I don't have the time to pull out all the tools, get work done and get it all back in the shed before dark. And as I'm off grid when it gets dark you're done! No extra lighting around here.

I may get in the loft and work on some paneling though since my Kindle is dead and I'm charging it up now so I can read later.

Otherwise I may just relax on the porch and enjoy the rest of the afternoon
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 03, 2016, 10:13:34 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20161003_194924655_zpsininrn5j.jpg)
Finally got around to doing a little paneling.  This was a section I was having a little trouble with in my head but when it came down to it, it was actually pretty simple and I did it with a hand saw and knife!

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20161003_195026320_zpsux7xpqtb.jpg)
Having notched the first row under the ties I started the upper row but stopped as I need to fix the insulation before continuing but since I now know it's actually pretty easy to do I'll get to it this fall and have it done this winter :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: ChugiakTinkerer on October 05, 2016, 10:49:45 AM
I really like the look of the paneling.  Is that some of the T&G you were working on a few months back?

[cool]
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 05, 2016, 07:15:30 PM
Yup :)  I was working on it this past winter so I could finish off the interior.  It all came from Ponderosa Pine on the property that I cut down, milled, dried, planed and routered :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 07, 2016, 11:34:22 PM
https://youtu.be/FPl3kNtzgQE
Got my saw back together :)  I hope to use it a little to break it in on Sunday on a milling job.  I'm now running pre-mix 40:1 in it to help provide some better lube and plan to mod the carb jet screws so I can fatten it up a bit (since they are EPA mandated lean running saws today that have been 'fixed' so guys like me can't fix their saws by making  them run a little richer #@#@

d* d* d* ??? ??? ???
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 08, 2016, 12:16:23 AM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Tools/IMG_20161007_220118014%20576x1024_zpssklokftw.jpg)
Another project of mine :)  This is our old Yamaha Big Bear 350 2x4 ATV that we bought for $200 and a couch about 8 years ago.  It's sat for 3 or 4 years since someone (a friend actually) cut the ignition off in an attempt to 'hotwire' it when the key was lost.  Sadly, I let it sit and sit so now I have it home in the garage and the work has begun!  I've stripped off the stupid spray bombed black paint the last owner put on it (still need to do the rear end) and replaced the ignition ($29 and I have two keys now :) ) and battery.  Once done it will get a carb tune up, some brake work and new paint and fluids and it will be ready for use again :)

I plan to keep it in the garage this winter with the Honda that I will bring back soon too.  Both will be gone over and kept warm and dry this winter.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 09, 2016, 09:29:03 AM
The old beast lives! :D  Now I just need to replace the fuel shutoff and rebuild the carb both of which leaked fuel onto my driveway.  Otherwise it ran just fine and shifted gears in an out and moved too.

Needs a muffler though!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: ChugiakTinkerer on October 09, 2016, 12:00:11 PM
I recently opted to replace the carb on my old Suzuki King Quad.  I know rebuild kits are cheaper but a new one didn't cost much more.  That Husky saw looks sweet, makes my 455 Rancher have some compensation issues.  ;D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on October 10, 2016, 12:17:21 AM
Sadly, I seem to have to pass up a few nice deals on quads lately because I have no place to store it! (or the trailer to tow it on)  :(

Well, plenty of time until late May or early June.  Good to see the Husky is back in action (altho they should have a cougar saw for that side of the state) ;D

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 14, 2016, 04:33:21 PM
One thing I'm considering is placing some R10 foam board on the outside of the cabin, north side, over where the water lines run.  I find when it's below zero out it's harder to keep those lines from freezing unless the cabin is pretty warm (70+).  I wonder how much of a difference that would make?

I'm also considering boxing in the P Trap for the tub which runs under the cabin.  If I box it in and insulate with R10 foam (2 or 3 layers) and leave the floor insulation out I'm wondering if the heat from the cabin will keep the box around the P Tramp from freezing even in sub zero weather?

Thoughts?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on October 14, 2016, 05:50:02 PM
For the question regarding how much R-value would be needed on the exterior of the wall read this. (http://www.greenbuildingadvisor.com/blogs/dept/musings/calculating-minimum-thickness-rigid-foam-sheathing)

It depends on the climate zone rating for the location. The srticles point is to determine the amount of exterior insulation required to make the inner face of the foam stay warm enough to prevent condensation of moisture from the interior air.  Of course the article is premised on the idea that the building is heated as a full time residence, or at least kept warm, above freezing inside. But I would think that once your interior is warmed then the thinking in the article should apply well. 

Insulating under the p trap and not above should help. But the air space under the floor / above the insulation will be very slow to warm up unless there is some air exchange.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 14, 2016, 07:46:32 PM
According to the article R10 will be more than enough to prevent moisture build up and I don't have any plastic on the inside (kraft faced bats and drywall in this case) so it should be able to dry to the inside just fine.

This leaves me to think R20 will be more than enough and perhaps even R10 to provide the added insulation needed to protect the pipes.

For the box I've wondered about that myself since cold air goes down to the lowest point which would be the box.  One thing I could do / consider would be to build the box longer and put a small register at the other end with a 12v fan I an flip on to run warmer air (circulate) though the box to warm it up. 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 18, 2016, 07:09:10 AM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20161017_161328413_HDR%201024x675_zpsq8crnlj1.jpg)
Fuel shutoff/switch replaced :)  New battery, new grips, new fuel line and paint removed from 90% of the body.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20161017_161310518_HDR%201024x698_zpskpn1iq89.jpg)
Running and driving well (considering it sat for a few years I'm happy with that -- over the moon really!)

Now to recover the seat, replace a few nuts and bolts and maybe some fuel lines, possibly rebuild the carb and replace the muffler and tear the brakes down as well as some paint but I have all winter :)

This $200 machine is more like a $1000 machine today (maybe more) since I also replaced the tires and shocks several years ago (and battery as well but that one was toast).  Still, it's a lot cheaper than a new one and continues to provide us with a great little ATV to use at the cabin :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: ChugiakTinkerer on October 18, 2016, 11:03:12 AM
Two yards of black upholstery vinyl does wonders for an old 4-wheeler seat.  I did mine a couple years ago and its holding up great.  There were a few guys with videos on Youtube showing how they did theirs.  Pretty much just vinyl and a stapler.  Kind of like a fresh coat of paint, it's a cheap fix that has great return on investment when it comes to appearance.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Colorado Eric on October 18, 2016, 04:47:08 PM
OJH - Thank you so much for the excellent documentation of your build and all the fun you guys have out there. Took me about 3 weeks but I went through each and every post! You sure know what you are doing. This gave me so much inspiration and served as a learning tool for everything from tractors to solar. Family and I have been looking for around 2 years here in CO but haven't pulled the trigger on any parcels yet, these awesome builds just get me more and more excited. Just want you to know there are still loads of us eagerly following your progress. Thanks again!

Eric
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 18, 2016, 07:27:52 PM
Quote from: Colorado Eric on October 18, 2016, 04:47:08 PM
OJH - Thank you so much for the excellent documentation of your build and all the fun you guys have out there. Took me about 3 weeks but I went through each and every post! You sure know what you are doing. This gave me so much inspiration and served as a learning tool for everything from tractors to solar. Family and I have been looking for around 2 years here in CO but haven't pulled the trigger on any parcels yet, these awesome builds just get me more and more excited. Just want you to know there are still loads of us eagerly following your progress. Thanks again!

Eric

Thanks Eric (with a 'C') :)  I'm glad someone still enjoys my foibles! ha!

Good luck and stay motivated!  I love being out at the cabin and often reflect on those early trips staying in the tent trailer trying to get the box framed up!  Now I'm dying to get back to finish the porch walls and get some more work done around the place this weekend :)  It's hunting season but only thing I'll be shooting is the nail gun :)

Cheers
Erik
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 18, 2016, 07:28:38 PM
Quote from: ChugiakTinkerer on October 18, 2016, 11:03:12 AM
Two yards of black upholstery vinyl does wonders for an old 4-wheeler seat.  I did mine a couple years ago and its holding up great.  There were a few guys with videos on Youtube showing how they did theirs.  Pretty much just vinyl and a stapler.  Kind of like a fresh coat of paint, it's a cheap fix that has great return on investment when it comes to appearance.

Thanks ChugiakTinkerer, I'll have to check that out!  I was trying to find foam but without it I can get a seat cover for $30 on ebay that is a staple on form fit one.  I may do that.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: ChugiakTinkerer on October 18, 2016, 10:19:57 PM
I actually did the foam too.  Picked something up at a hobby shop, probably Michaels.  Two types of foam worked good for me.  Heavier stuff on bottom and some lighter stuff on top.  Spray adhesive onto the seat, then spray adhesive onto the first layer of foam to attach the second.  Trim to the preferred shape with a bread knife.  I was probably all in for less than $50-, and a replacement seat was over $300.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 18, 2016, 11:07:59 PM
Cool
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 21, 2016, 09:59:28 AM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Tools/IMG_20161021_065849105_zpsqlx18xry.jpg)
A few years back (or more) one of the boys broke my splitting maul.  I couldn't find the right handle but bought a similar one that ended up not fitting but came with the epoxy to secure it so I tried using that witht he old handle and it mostly drained out the bottom.  So the ax sat for a while until I finally found some epoxy I thought would work and finally got it done.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Tools/IMG_20161021_065916443_zpslov9u5za.jpg)
This has been a good ax and I'll see if the new epoxy works this weekend.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Tools/IMG_20161021_065950550_zpscnelbk4a.jpg)
My old (6yrs) Harbor Freight compressor has treated me well under the rough conditions I've used it but the cover and handle were made with cheap plastic and broke.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Tools/IMG_20161021_065955348_zpsgzcrloot.jpg)
I've epoxied them back together and bought a new handle for it but can't bnuy the cover nor the broken fan on the back.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Tools/IMG_20161021_070001762_zps1qi1szkm.jpg)
Then I found a Rigid at HD for $129 so I bought it.  It's got an 8 gallon tank vs the 10gallon on the el cheapo and is almost have the HP but gets to 150psi quickly vs the el cheapo which can only do 100psi.  It's also got two outlets and apprently has a much better warranty and reputation.  I'll use this one as my 'portable' and use the cheapo in the garage at home until it quits and I buy a new one.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20161021_070014762_zpsj0jarrnt.jpg)
Getting closer with the old ATV too

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20161021_070022896_zpsjc1ah8tq.jpg)
Plan now is to rebuild the carb and fix the bumper.  Then replace the headlights and recover the seat as well as redo the brakes.  Then it should be ready for many more years of use :)

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 23, 2016, 10:55:16 PM
So far the axe has held up nicely though I didn't use it much.  The new compressor, a steal at $129 if you ask me (HD) is working like a charm and I'm, thinking better than the 4hp 10gal HF cheapo.

I managed to get the walls framed and sealed as well as covered in 15lbs felt this weekend so I'm ready for phase two which will be to insulate them and to place some bird screen in the eves above and then stuff insulation in them also.  Once the walls are fully insulated and the ceiling as well I'll get the ceiling sheathed though I plan to install a heat vent and some insulated heat duct to the outside wall for the future solar can heater I plan to build this winter.

I also got the last piece of roofing on but it's too long and is only temp anyway so I'll leave it.

Should be able to post a few pics tomorrow.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 24, 2016, 09:23:32 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20161022_192619973%201024x576_zps8zigb8ru.jpg)
Inside wall of the porch (now that it's framed and sheathed).

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20161022_192607153%201024x576_zpsest8cb9a.jpg)
I used 1x6's I milled up this spring and sealed them up with foam where there were gaps

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20161024_132314057_HDR%201024x576_zpsg8ieqidy.jpg)
Unfortunately the framer didn't think to match the rafters to the walls of the original porch  d* so there are wider walls up top but that just means more insulation right? lol

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20161024_132321981_HDR%201024x576_zps6fukyore.jpg)
15lb felt covering all the walls.  I'll side it later

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20161024_132340393%201024x575_zpstaycbsrb.jpg)
Still work to do but I'm happy with this.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20161024_133026879%201024x648_zps2e5w5qps.jpg)
Last bit of roofing on.  I didn't trim it but it will come off next year anyway.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20161024_133207737%201024x575_zpsgxicmnj5.jpg)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Gary O on October 25, 2016, 06:22:18 AM
luvin' this thread

just thought I'd say Hi

'Hi'

oh,

and how much are you able to use that solar set up?
Folks around here aren't too hep on solar, even though some have quite the set ups
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 25, 2016, 10:40:19 AM
I use it all the time.  Mine is a little undersized for the winter but I don't spend as much time up there as I did when I lived there so it isn't much of an issue and the backup gen works great.

Frankly I love the solar power I have and it's pretty well sorted now so almost maintenance free (hope I didn't jinx myself!).  I added water to the batteries yesterday but they didn't need much at all.  The caps I put on the batteries were well worth the money!

Maybe next year though, I'll add the next 40amps of charging power to set me up better as I use about 8% of the bank in one night of use (about 52AH of use).  This means I can only go two days without a charge from the sun so my battery bank is a little too low at 660AH.  Should really be about 880AH but I make due and with 60amps of charging I'd get the bank back up in a shorter period of time so it would work better in the winter with just two hours of real charging.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 25, 2016, 11:27:55 AM
So I have a problem with my water I'm scratching my head over.

Last year I blew out the lines with an air compressor.  I remember my neighbor saying he used only about 50psi to do so as higher pressures could cause problems.

Then this spring when I turned the water back on the cold side was low on volume at the kitchen sink but fine in the bathroom sink and tub,  but my hot was just fine.  My main line comes into my back room via a 1" pvc pipe and splits into two 3.4" feeds.  One goes to my cold header and the other goes to my hot water tank (instant on).  I have a shut off valve on the hot water side so I can remove the hot water tank without killing the water.  Then the hot feeds into an identical header (as the cold) and via 1/2" pex to each tap.  My cold also feeds via 1.2" pex to each tap.

I lived with the cold volume this summer as it wasn't that much of an issue but a couple weeks ago I blew the lines out again and when my wife and I went back to the cabin this past weekend and I turned on the water I had almost NO volume on two taps (kitchen and bath sink) but fine on the tub (lowest point in the system).

I think I put closer to 90PSI the last time I blew out the lines (DOH  d* ) so am not sure what that would do.

This weekend I blew the lines out again but at 50psi again.  When I did I noticed it took a while to get the air past the main valve and I went long and pushed it all the way to the cistern as it took some time to get water back to the frost free (which is before the main). 

Is it possible I've created an air lock in my cold water header?

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Water_zpsah1wjglb.jpg)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 25, 2016, 11:54:41 AM
I should add that I installed things this way to give max volume to the hot water heater as it barely runs with the water pressure I have which is not much over 20 lbs.  With the tank set at low pressure it works though and I can get VERY hot water with decent volume.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 25, 2016, 11:59:05 AM
Also, when I blow out the lines what I do is I blow them out by the kitchen sink tap.  I hope the compressor up to the tap and turn on the cold (with the main valve off) and open up the bathroom sink and blow the lines free, then close the bathroom tap and open the tub.  I repeat until it's just air coming out.  I then turn off the cold and open the hot at the kitchen sink and repeat the process.  Once that's done I go to the hot water tank and open it's drain valve and blow out the lines inside the tank (instant on).

When this process is completed I open the cold again and go open the main valve and then the frost free.  When air comes out the frost free I know I'm pushed the water past it and close the main valve again.  When water comes back out the frost free I know it's operational and I go shut off the compressor and remove it from the lines.  I open the lines and make sure there is no pressure in them and then close them.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 30, 2016, 12:01:17 PM
QuoteSuntech    STP300 - 24/Ve    Poly    72    B    300    0.52    $156
Found those at Sun Elec.  They put out 35.9Vmp and 8.36Imp so if I get six of them I should be looking at ~50Amps of charging power from them (I'll run them series/parallel so I'm only feeding the Outback controller with 72vdc and 50amps or perhaps 108vdc if I run three in series and two sets in parallel) which when combined with my 3 current panels running on the Morningstar controller will provide me with the total capacity I really needed all along :) (should be put right about 70Amps of charging power and the battery bank is 660AH).

I plan to get the Outback FlexMax FM80 for these which negates the need for a separate controller to turn on my battery box fan (I believe the FM80 has a 28vdc feed coming off it just for this use).  I'll need racking for the roof of the deck as well as cables, a combiner box and another break in the main DC panel but otherwise install shouldn't be much of an issue :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 02, 2016, 07:05:02 AM
Still working on getting my order placed and may be milling this weekend which will help (probably mean I'll get the roof mounting hardware and get the panels on the roof sooner rather than later).

I've come up with what I think will be a sufficient battery box idea (I'll draw something up).  Basically I'll finish boxing in the batteries, then I'll put a 'roof' or lid on them facing away from the electronic (since I haven't moved anything yet) that I can remove to work on the batteries.  This lid will slant towards the south wall of the porch (front) where the vent will be located so any hydrogen gas should then be sucked outside by the new fan I'll order soon (all controlled by the Outback flexmax 80).

This will allow me to finally seal the room up tight with insulation etc so that I won't waste any heat inside the room which I hope to provide via a solar can heater which I estimate should produce around 9000BTU's.  The solar can heater will be placed at the front of the porch just under the eves and tilted at 63degrees to match the sun on the winter solstice.  It will be fed by an insulated duct from under the porch that I plan to box in (later) with R10 foam and plywood and it will feed the room hot air through the same type of insulated duct boxed in via R10 foam to reduce heat loss as it passes the 3 1/2 feet of open space before getting to the enclosed porch.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 02, 2016, 03:19:45 PM
Picked up a 1" T, 1" water hose (3/4" ID 175PSI hose for water lines), connectors for those and a brass tap.

My plan is to cut the 1" PVC main coming into the cabin and place the T fitting into it, then run the Tap off the T so I can drain the cabin lines into a bucket as well as out the taps.  It will give me a place to blow the lines out the taps from the main also as well as a place I can attach a hose if I want.

I'll then remove a section of 3/4" PVC that goes to the hot water tank and add in the hose as it's flexible and will allow removing the tank and replacing it in the future with much greater ease.

I'm hoping, by doing this, that I can eliminate the issue I'm having which appears to be a vapor lock as I don't have this issue on the hot side which I can drain and blow out from the tank (vs just taps).  With luck I'll get my volume back on the cold side.  This will also allow me to blow out the lines thoroughly without having to blow out past the main which I will have off but not free of water (on the house side) since I have heat in the back room which will keep the main from freezing while I'm gone.  I'll just have to turn the main valve back on and water will be right in the back room ready for use vs having to blow the lines out past the main valve like I do today.

Confused yet?  Maybe I'll draw it up ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 02, 2016, 03:30:38 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Water2_zpsr9rn3tbu.jpg)
The cistern (left) is a 325 gallon tank and is about 50 feet above the cabin.  The main line coming down is a 2" line that feeds a 2"x1 1/2" T for the Frost Free (off the 1 1/2" leg) and is reduced to a 1" line where the main valve is for the cabin (so the frost free always has water pressure).  The 1" main comes into the back room and rises about 3 feet where it goes into a T that feeds two 3/4" PEX lines.  One that rises to the cold water manifold between the water heater and the bathroom, and the other into the hot water heater (instant on) which in turn feeds a hot water manifold behind the tank where the cold water header is.  Then 1/2" pex feeds each tap.

With the new tap (green below water heater) I will be able to shut off the main valve outside and then open the tap draining the lines inside the cabin via gravity.  Then I can put air pressure on the lines via the sink tap or the tap in the back room (same one) and blow the water lines out via that tap or vise versa.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: astidham on November 02, 2016, 07:39:20 PM
Could your frost free be the culprit?  A buddy of mine has went through about 4 of them,  some how developing a leak at the bottom.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 02, 2016, 10:10:15 PM
No becuase the problem only impacts the cold side and not the hot and both are fed from the same 1" main past the frost free.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 03, 2016, 01:34:57 PM
Just spoke with SunElec and have a quote coming for three CSun 305 watt panels (VMP44.7vdc IMP8.97Amps), Outback FlexMax FM80 controller, Midnight Combiner box and breakers and cables (of course).

This will take me to over 70Amps of max charging  [cool]
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on November 09, 2016, 11:24:16 AM
Erik, I had something similar in the past in the house.  It was dirt in the faucet... I hooked up a water hose and flushed it out backwards. 

I had found that not only was there a screen in the faucet right at the sink, but inside the valve assembly ( which was under the sink) there was another screen and dirt from someplace would get stuck there.

I shut off water to the valve at the wall, disconnected the feed lines and hooked a hose from outside in through the door and back flushed it into a bucket.

If it is only on the cold side at one or two faucets it may be something like that.

Just thinking
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 09, 2016, 11:50:51 AM
Certainly could be.  I'm hoping to get the new tap installed so I can flush the other direction.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 09, 2016, 02:08:42 PM
My solar panel order finally completed :)  Bought six 305 watt 36v panels (supposed to be 24v but I noticed open voltage was around 45v so I need to check that again not that it matters really) at $178/panel and picked up an outback FlexMax 80 with them as well as combiner and 3 breakers plus cables.

Now I just need to source an inexpensive roof mount system or get one made.  I want one that will life the front of the panels about 12" off the roof and that will allow them to tilt up to 63 degrees and down to 33 (to let me adjust in different seasons).

I'm pretty exited about this as it will bring me up to just above 10% of battery bank cap vs solar charger cap (660AH batter and about 70A charging).
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 22, 2016, 05:23:22 PM
My panels and controller etc arrived! :D  [cool] c*

Now I just need to find an inexpensive roof mounting kit or at least a good design.  I want to mount them 12" off the roof at the base and have them setup so I can tilt them at 63, 48 and 33 degrees to adjust during different times of the year.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 22, 2016, 05:46:54 PM
https://www.solarroofhook.com/product/17648?parent=17648&id=656
I found these today and realized that I could use them to mount the panels to the roof of the main cabin instead of on the deck roof.  It would put the panels at 45 degrees which isn't ideal but would be cheap and ease to use I think (by looking at them it appears you mount to the bottom of the panel and then screw them to the roof ridges but I need to look at the installation PDF
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 22, 2016, 06:04:20 PM
https://www.altestore.com/store/solar-panel-mounts/roof-mounts-for-solar-panels/standing-seam-metal-roof-mounts/s-5-versabracket-47-p10399/
This option may be a less expensive option but again, keeps the panels at 45 degrees which will cost me charging power in the winter when I need it most.

I'm still looking to see if there is a way to mount the panels on a steeper angle but this may have to do.  Mind you, with a total of 9 panels vs the 3 I have now (my current three can only produce 20amps in perfect conditions while all 9 will be able to produce 70amps) I probably won't even miss the added production frankly.

Thoughts?

https://www.altestore.com/store/solar-panel-mounts/roof-mounts-for-solar-panels/standing-seam-metal-roof-mounts/s-5-versabracket-67-p10398/
These are 1" taller (about) than the others and maybe I could mount them up top to tilt the panels a little more to get closer to 48 degrees.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on November 22, 2016, 06:29:50 PM
I believe panel angle is of less importance when there are lots of panels like you will now have.  I stopped adjusting the angle for seasonal differences a few years back. The batteries always reach float on a normal day and that makes me happy.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 22, 2016, 06:57:26 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on November 22, 2016, 06:29:50 PM
I believe panel angle is of less importance when there are lots of panels like you will now have.  I stopped adjusting the angle for seasonal differences a few years back. The batteries always reach float on a normal day and that makes me happy.

This is my thinking because I don't adjust my current panels as much anymore either though in the winter I tilt them close to 63 degrees because it helps keep the snow off and I need every bit of charging I can get but with the 6 new ones I won't have to worry as much.  The last brackets are under $4ea so for $100 or less I can mount all 6 panels on the 12/12 pitch and do the happy dance ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 23, 2016, 03:25:30 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on November 22, 2016, 05:46:54 PM
https://www.solarroofhook.com/product/17648?parent=17648&id=656
I found these today and realized that I could use them to mount the panels to the roof of the main cabin instead of on the deck roof.  It would put the panels at 45 degrees which isn't ideal but would be cheap and ease to use I think (by looking at them it appears you mount to the bottom of the panel and then screw them to the roof ridges but I need to look at the installation PDF

Spoke with the manufacturer about these and they do appear to be the best option to mount the panels to my 12/12 [pitch.  I'll need a rail to go across them to mount the panels to but after that I'll be set.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 23, 2016, 04:36:35 PM
I found for my six STP305-24/Ve panels I can get a roof mounting system from Ironridge for about $380 (their site but I'm sending out and RFQ to distributors so maybe less).  This would give me the rails and mounts plus grounding lugs and wire clips.  Then I'd just need to install on the roof and wire it up to the outback etc....of course that means I'll have to stand on a low sloped metal roof which aint gonna happen if it's iced up!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 23, 2016, 04:38:48 PM
Also, those panels are actually 36.2v VMP and 8.43A IMP
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 23, 2016, 05:03:35 PM
Some thoughts on the PV calculator spreadsheet:

Using this spreadsheet and my old numbers on what I expected to use it shows me needing 140AH daily.  However, I know that if the bank is 100% charged (based on my Trimetric meter) at sundown I will use right about 66AH overnight or 10% of the battery bank capacity at 70F.  Of course, I'll still use some of that power during the daylight hours though not as much since I won't have lights on etc and generally do not use the internet, for example, during the day.  Furthermore, while the sun is shining the panels will provide some or all of my power requirements AND recharge the batteries back to 100% if they have 4-5hrs of sunlight (this makes sense as my current panels provide ~20A IMP so over a 4-5hr period they should be able to replenish that 66AH and run the cabin at the same time).

When I add in the new panels which provide 50.58A IMP I will then have as much as 70A IMP with full sun and optimal conditions (note:  I realize that's not real world and it may be as low as ~60A in the real world) so in theory they will be able to charge up the battery bank within two hours or less and provide enough charge during sunlight hours to power the cabin without draining the batteries.

So anyway, I see the spreadsheet calls for more usage than I actually have so I played around a little with it and it shows me I'd need 12 batteries (which is what I have) and 3 of the 305W panels to provide me enough power to go three days without sun and drawing down to 50% DoD (not something I want but I may run into -- on a side note I have my generator set to come on at 24vdc under load so I shouldn't hit 50% DoD).  This makes me pretty happy as I'll have 9 panels (3 205-FA2's and 6 STP305's) which should ensure excellent charging in the dead of winter (when the panels provide the most power too) which is where I always had trouble in the past.  Heck, I might even be able to watch TV a little more often without the genset running or use the freezer in the summer when we like having ice etc).

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 27, 2016, 10:38:07 PM
Back at the cabin for a milling job up near Java's place :) No snow where I'm milling and maybe only a couple inches up by Javaman's (if that now) but more expected soon.

Not much solar production today so running the gen.  Would be nice if I had the new panels up as my three panels just held the batteries at 91% since this morning (so they produced enough power to keep it from dropping lower than it was at 6am but that's it).  The new ones should be able to recharge the bank completely on a day like today so I'm looking forward to getting them put up!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: CabinNick on November 30, 2016, 07:30:41 PM
I was looking back through your previous posts where you were routing T&G into your pine boards for interior paneling.  Would you do it again?  Trying to decide whether to mill and finish my own T&G or just buy it.  On one hand I would really like to have interior paneling that I have cut and milled from my own trees but on the other hand it seems like a lot of work to finish the rough cut lumber and you can find T&G pine for as cheap as $0.33/ln ft. 

On another note, this summer I was talking to a guy is Washington about buying his woodmizer LT10 that he had purchased 6 months earlier and had posted on craigslist.  Looking at your posts I am pretty sure it was your old sawmill!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 01, 2016, 11:11:32 PM
Absolutely I'd do it again -- and intend to :)  Once you have the setup it's pretty simple and not much trouble at all.

My old mill?  I saw that he was selling it and wondered what happened?  It's good little mill and worth every penny if you ask me! :D  For a small cabin owner who is willing to do the work that mill will produce (I made a lot of lumber with it)....it won't, however, keep up with my new mill ;)  I've milled a sustained 400bf/hr on the new mill with big logs and a good crew...couldn't touch that with the SMLT10 but then it's not a big production mill either and my mill cost 5 times what that little mill is worth ;)

If you buy it, I'd be happy to pass on any info I can on how to produce with it (I did manage short bursts of 200bf/hr on it but that takes a really good crew and good logs etc...my new mill will do that without breaking a sweat ;)

I'm at the cabin this week milling up near JAvaman's place (he could get in still actually but there is snow on the ground)...I'll post pics when I get a chance but so far I've milled up 7500 board feet of lumber out of burned logs for a customer who is rebuilding after the fire.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on December 14, 2016, 11:41:03 AM
Thanks for the report on things up near my place, OJH.  Interesting to see that it could possibly be accessible in mid-December! The winter part of the project is going according to plan, so count on being out there again this summer ;)

Good to see your panels keeping up with electron production, even this close to the solstice.  Once I am all dried in next fall, I will be looking at solar so will need to pick your brain for info on that.

Stay safe, and I am looking forward to those pictures!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 14, 2016, 09:49:32 PM
Probably could still get in as there hasn't been much snow yet.  Most I know of so far around your place was 4" and not much has fallen since...it's coming though, and coming fast!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 20, 2016, 09:01:21 PM
Quick trip to the cabin today to check on things and work on the tractor.
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0826%20768x1024_zps9ynhrifs.jpg)
Can I say WOW! :)  I love this place and look at that sky!

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0825%201024x768_zpskeqn6v6p.jpg)
That shading on the panels isn't good!  It's just about noon so I need to do some tree removal.  However the new panels are going on the roof and the batteries were at 100%
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 27, 2016, 04:10:01 PM
Got a quote for Ironridge solar panel mount and rack system for the roof and it's about $250 so I plan to order soon :)  Just need to have a day when the roof is dry enough to climb up on it and put the mounts in.  Basically you screw them to the rafters (through the roofing) and then bolt on the aluminum rails that the panels are mounted to.  I'll have 22 feet of rails on a 26 foot roof!  Two rails, then put up the panels and run the wiring to the midnight solar combiner box and from there to the DC panel and Outback.

Shouldn't take long to get it all done but at the moment they sit in the garage waiting for me to order the racks and get the tractor running so I can plow the driveway.

Might get up there next week for a couple days if the parts come in for the tractor.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 30, 2016, 02:24:56 PM
Wow!  Just realized this is the 2nd most replied to thread and 3rd most viewed!  Ofcourse, a lot of that is probably me! LOL

Maybe I'm just more active at posting these days as it is kinda quiet in here.  Still, cool stat I think.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: CabinNick on December 30, 2016, 11:02:41 PM
Enjoy reading your posts and following your adventure - keep it up!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 08, 2017, 06:21:35 PM
While the snow comes down (about 5" so far here in Moses Lake) I've been working on my solar can heater :)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0957%201024x767_zpsyxywhorj.jpg)
I started out drilling both the tops and the bottoms.  This was a real challenge and despite buying better bits and trying different methods I was really having trouble with the tops.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0961%201024x619_zpspgizpain.jpg)
Then my wife suggested a can opener....at first it didn't work very well and then, strangely enough I tried going backwards!  WOW!  That was the trick and I was really cooking on the tops.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0963%20789x1024_zps1k3oeao1.jpg)
Tops and bottoms done I'm boxing up all the cans to get them ready for washing etc but I need 289 cans so I have some work ahead of me!

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0972%20646x1024_zps0lhokjht.jpg)
My myself a template/guide for the can tubes.  Once all the cans are ready and I have the box done (4' x 8') I'll glue them up with high temp silicone in this and once dry I will transfer to the box for painting and final assembly.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0973%20768x1024_zpsn2qcim2e.jpg)
Pretty simple design ;)  Two boards, a stop and some screws :D

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0976%201024x616_zpshy8o7yqz.jpg)
Some might notice the P38 in this pic ;)  I've carried it since the 80's and am always amazed at the uses let alone how effective it can be.  IN this case when the can opener doesn't fully cut the lids off I use the P38 (also sometimes called a 'John Wayne') to finish the job.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0977%201024x591_zpsxveuuyjc.jpg)
Darn near pro now :)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0978%201024x767_zpstcoe49ec.jpg)
In case you missed it ;)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0980%201024x767_zpslk5rjef5.jpg)
I suppose I could recycle these?  I'll have some 300 of them when done.

I hope to have the whole thing done in a week or two and then plan to take it to the cabin to mount and install.  With luck I'll see some heat production this winter from it :)

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on January 08, 2017, 07:23:23 PM
So where's a link to the esign of this solar heater?  :D

Not that I drink ANY pop (or soda depending on the part of the country you're from), but I think I might be able to get some.  You'll have to let me know how well it works!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 09, 2017, 12:20:16 AM
http://www.builditsolar.com/Projects/SpaceHeating/GregCanCol/Can%20Colllector.pdf
This is one link that's decent but he didn't use headers and should.  Lots of stuff out there though, just search for 'solar heaters'.

I don't drink a lot of the stuff but I do like some with my bourbon in the evening and it builds up over time.  However it takes a LOT of cans so I ask others for theirs ;)  Anyone and everyone I worked with or visited with often enough (at the cabin etc) I asked for theirs.  Didn't take too long to get a few hundred (actually about 2 years but could have done it faster, I just wasn't in a big hurry).

I know one the size I'm making can produce about 9000btu's but that's in sunlight....dead of winter with only a few hours of good sun?  Might not be enough to do too much but I suspect it will help.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on January 11, 2017, 08:19:47 PM
Hmmm... I wonder if PVC pipe would work in a similar fashion.

Might be something I'll investigate eventually.

And as far as efficiency, or efficacy, I figure as long as it's not actually cooling the place and adding even just a little heat, it's a win!   ???
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 12, 2017, 12:07:27 AM
PVC wouldn't work well enough.  The reason the cans work so well (as do down spouts and other similar items though the best I hear is a screen) is that the cans are aluminum and transfer heat very very quickly.  In just a few minutes one of these heaters can crank out full power.  It's amazing from what I've seen but there are other options (like I said, I think some of the screen models are even better) out there for those who can't get cans.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 14, 2017, 09:31:07 AM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20170113_114638239_HDR%201024x576_zps8esqbszx.jpg)
Got out to the cabin yesterday for a quick trip to remove the bad part on the tractor and just make sure all was well still.  It was 2F out and I couldn't stay but I plan to be back soon!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on January 14, 2017, 02:29:14 PM
What a great picture!  All that's needed is a horse-drawn sleigh ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 15, 2017, 12:58:09 AM
Amen brother!  Amen
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 15, 2017, 01:07:09 AM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0995%201024x645_zpsnfvrwxhx.jpg)
Finally for to building the box for this solar heater

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0996%201024x767_zpspp4ubvcg.jpg)
I used some pine stock I had in the garage and glued two 1x's together (one with about 3/4" smaller width to accommodate the plywood (OSB actually) backing and poly-carbonate glazing) then mounted the backing on them.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_0999%201021x1024_zps7crj7coa.jpg)
Stapled and screwed and glued -- ya a little overkill but that's me ;)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_1000%201024x767_zpsfthpiety.jpg)
I wasn't kidding  d*

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_1002%201024x559_zpskdfr4z5f.jpg)
Ready for insulation!

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_1003%201024x767_zpsb3uvm6nx.jpg)
But first I used some old silicone to seal the corners

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_1006%201024x768_zpsl557760h.jpg)
Next I used liquid nails for foam board

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_1007%201024x768_zpseuescox9.jpg)
And glued down the foam board (1") insulation after trimming it to fit.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_1011%201024x768_zps3vpmofpn.jpg)
A little weight to ensure it stays glued ;)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_1014%20767x1024_zpskf4ygrye.jpg)
Clamping the side insulation in with a backer board -- worked great

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_1019%201024x688_zpsjktndhzt.jpg)
Working out the headers

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_1020%201024x998_zpsbbplt80y.jpg)
Airflow needs to be pretty good so I drilled extra holes in the support

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_1024%201024x706_zpshrc0uafc.jpg)
Shaping up!

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_1025%201024x768_zpsam5upaih.jpg)
Gotta make 13 more tubes, paint the box and the tubes and get everything assembled which will be tough since the tubes don't come out the same length -- I guess a little extra glue/silicone in 17 cans cna cause that -- which can cause some problems with assembly but I'll make it work with extra silicone ;)

Might be a couple weeks before this is done but I'm steadily working on it now ;)

one thing I'm thinking about is placing two strips of insulation behind the can tubes to support them -- so they can't sag.  Other than that it's pretty standard issue for one of these.

Oh and I need to install the snap switch (which tuns on the 4" DC duct fan when temps rise above 110F) and drill the 4" inlet and outlet holes.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 15, 2017, 10:32:22 AM
Having had trouble getting my order in at St Lawrence Nurseries on time the last two years I finally went to The Orange Pippin and placed a small order for 3 apples (1 crab, 1 Antonovka and 1 Crimson Crisp) so I'll at least have a chance at seeing some apples at the cabin in the future!  This time, however, I will need to keep the gophers at bay!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 15, 2017, 01:29:51 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_1028%201024x767_zpsophs71jz.jpg)
Getting there.  You can see the box is insulated now and I've trimmed out the edges with aluminum tape

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_1029%201024x768_zpscbjlp4nb.jpg)
Better shot of the taping

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_1032%201024x586_zps7cslm3x1.jpg)
Cans are a bit tight but should work.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_1033%201024x768_zpsrxqjcvrz.jpg)
Airflow should be very good :)  Now to get the stacks done (having some issues there lately with them breaking -- going to use some liquid nails and see how it does).
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on January 15, 2017, 02:32:37 PM
There's always the handy-man's friend ... duct tape   d*
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 16, 2017, 12:00:47 AM
Quote from: JavaMan on January 15, 2017, 02:32:37 PM
There's always the handy-man's friend ... duct tape   d*

Funny thing, I was thinking the aluminum tape I used around the edges would work well as a repair for the can tubes that cracked apart a bit....but bought some liquid nails I'm going try next.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 16, 2017, 05:44:23 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_1035%201024x668_zpsvhponejz.jpg)
Got the box painted and the 4" inlet and outlet's drilled and installed.  I set these 1 foot from opposite ends of the box so the air has to flow through the box from one side to the other in an attempt to ensure I get decent flow through all tubes.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_1043%20768x1024_zpstjhbxumg.jpg)
Test fitting the tubes.  Once I have all 17 made I'll silicone them into place and paint them black with the same high temp BBQ flat black paint I used inside the box.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_1045%20768x1024_zpsf0arpdqz.jpg)
You can see the header and the outlet placement

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_1046%20644x1024_zpse6yjfngz.jpg)
Switched from silicone to liquid nails after checking that the liquid nails could take fairly high temps.  It is working a lot better than the silicone and should hold the cans well.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 17, 2017, 06:25:32 PM
Up at the cabin and it's looking like more snow.  Was 23F when I got here and warmed up to maybe 25.  The inside of the cabin was slightly warmer and with both the woodstove and the heater going I've managed to get it above 60....took a few hours but I think I'm up to 65F now:) and the backup heater is back to pilot only.

Back room has stayed above freezing with the 8000btu heater turned down very low so I'm happy with that.

The bad news is that the tractor battery is completely dead and no attempt to revive it has worked.  So after 3 or 4 hours (more like 4) of trying to jump the tractor I gave up, pulled the battery which is still dead, and called it a day.  At least I replaced the kill switch, for al the good it did me!

Now, with luck and a new battery maybe I can get the tractor running again.

Batteries were at 100% when I arrived and I ran the generator for the last 4 hours to give it a good running.  I'll shut it off soon and disconnect it before going to bed so I don't have to deal with it in the AM.  Then I'm leaving again tomorrow but I may be back in a week to once again try to get the tractor running.  If not, I'll be back the 3rd with my wife to try to install the new heater on the porch.  This should be a big improvement as the batteries have been dropping to 0F or lower (the controller doesn't seem to like that and no longer reads the correct temps which is a problem I had on the first Morningstar controller I had.  It's showing temps of 249-255 again and it seems that when the batteries drop to 0F or lower this starts to happen though it took a month or two this time.

Otherwise the batteries have been holding around 24.6vdc at their lowest over the last month or two and getting to 30v daily but rarely getting a good absorption charge.  Looking at my solar production it appears I've had many days of only 2-5AH with a smattering of 10-15AH days.  Obviously this is an issue that my new panels should resolve but I can see some trees that are hiding the sun when it's this low on the horizon.  I'll have to get them down this winter as soon as the tractor is running.  Then, when the weather is good enough to get up on the roof I'll get the new panels installed and more than triple my solar capacity not to mention install the Outback charge controller which should give me some better info :)

I'll also have to get the batteries boxed in and the vent fan installed (I'm going to buy one from Backwoods Solar that the Outback can kick on at 28v).

Otherwise, it's getting warm in the cabin and it's good to be here -- oh, and the porch?  Awesome!  Having a nice big covered deck/porch this time of year is worth it's weight in gold!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 18, 2017, 06:32:33 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_1051%201024x768_zpscpjldjb0.jpg)
When I arrived at the cabin it was a beautiful day!  It was also warm at 23F :D

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_1052%201024x768_zpsokqku9dd.jpg)
Gratuitous snow pics :)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_1055%201024x768_zpslwiezte1.jpg)
I'm liking the porch!

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Solar%20minmax%20volts_zpsmjzs8gkj.jpg)
Made this from my solar logs from October to present (for some reason the controller did not have logs from May 2015 to October 2016   ???

This is the max voltage (blue) and min voltage (red) the batteries have seen.  Haven't seen them drop below 24v but am frankly a little surprised by the lower voltages shown as there is very little draw on them when I am not there.  Sure, I have 3 very small DC fans in the back room (computer fans) running and the 24v to 12v converter as well as the battery monitor but those shouldn't draw much power at all.....kinda scratching my head here  ??? but suspect it's just due to the lack of solar production.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 18, 2017, 06:40:39 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/AH%20Daily_zpstxgz8ie7.jpg)
Amp Hours Daily -- this sorta tells a tale on why the batteries aren't staying charged me think ;)  I can't wait to get the new panels up!

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/Absorbtion-Float_zpsp6hvbr3h.jpg)
The real tale might be in the Absorption and Float numbers...notice float disappears late November and doesn't recover.  So I'm getting very little Absorption and no float since.  Yup, need more panels (but we all knew that ;) )
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 20, 2017, 09:26:39 AM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_1064%201024x873_zpsiel9velg.jpg)
Getting there!  Should be ready for glazing this weekend but the glazing won't be in until Monday or Tuesday.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 21, 2017, 01:56:34 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_1079%201024x768_zps44ycgpwj.jpg)
Waiting for the liquid nails to cure so I can paint the cans :)  I'll paint tomorrow, today I'll finish a few minor details in the header.

The lexan is supposed to arrive the 27rd through to the 3rd of Feb so I have to wait :( before completing this heater.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 22, 2017, 04:51:59 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_1087%201024x838_zpsjf2wvreh.jpg)
Figuring out my snap switch and how I will get it into and perhaps out of the heater.  My intent is to be able to remove it so I can replace it with a different one if need be, or just fix it or replace it if it fails.  So, I drilled a 4 1/8" hole through the header (same size for the 4" ducts) and used the 'plug' to make this.  I've got smaller scews to mount the switch with, those were just handy ;)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_1093%201024x792_zps0znij0g6.jpg)
Getting the pain done!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 22, 2017, 05:51:41 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_1103%20768x1024_zpsrakpct4p.jpg)
Now you can see the snap switch installed

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_1109%201024x792_zpswwwbc78a.jpg)
And it's placement in the completed box/heater (missing glazing still)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_1111%201024x767_zpsjis0plsf.jpg)
The backing on the 'plug' that the snap switch is installed on is larger than the hole (6" square).
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Toyotaboy on January 22, 2017, 09:54:11 PM
Hi Oljarhead,
Watching your build on this solar heater. Super interested. What is the snap switch for and you mentioned a fan? I'm totally interested in all of your solar stuff too. I have an unfished thread on this site that I need to update. We got broke into during the build and got shy about posting anything. But have not had any problems since. I'm interested in the solar because we have no heat except for a wood burner. Our cabin was 20 degrees when we got there last weekend and took 5-6 hours to warm up. Wondering if a solar heater might help keep it above freezing here in northern Wisconsin.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 22, 2017, 10:08:17 PM
Sorry about the break in.

The snap switch is a thermostatic control.  It is normally open until 110F then closes and stays closed until temp drops to 90F.  The idea is when the heater gets to 110F it is ready for some forced air.  It closes a circuit to the fan which is connected to a solar panel.

Once the fan is running the solar heat production will continue to rise the temp in the heater to about 150F and remain around there as long as there is direct sunlight (or close enough to it).

Sun goes down heater stops, fan stops and you wait for the sun.

In reality these heaters can provide a lot of heat but in order to actually heat a place with them you'd have to have some way to store the energy or at least prevent it from leaving.  Sure, the 8-9000btu's would warm up a small space for at least 3 to 5 hours on sunny days but the rest of the day the temps will drop.....I will do some testing to see how well this works but in my world just 10 to 20F difference is worth the effort and once the cabin is warm the heater should help to keep it there longer.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Toyotaboy on January 24, 2017, 10:32:52 PM
Thanks for the info. I will definitely watch your progress on this. Your plan is too keep your battery room warmer with this? Yes, I agree that a 10-20 degree swing can sure make a difference. When I got back from the woods the wife had it up to 80 on the main floor. Must have been 95 in the loft. All the snow, about a foot deep on the metal roof slid off of the west side all at once. Scared the hell out of us!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 25, 2017, 04:57:23 PM
First the battery room / porch.  But if the heater works well enough to raise the temp above 70F significantly then I have a plan to install two 6" ducts with motorized baffles in the wall to the cabin that will open at 70 or so and allow the warmth in the porch to warm the cabin.  I will also build another of these to put on the south wall of the cabin to help warm it also.  My hope is that I can keep the cabin fairly warm once the fire goes out in the wood stove.  During the winter it's always on my mind when I leave at 6AM and the cabin is 70+ but it's below zero outside.  If I don't get back early to restart the woodstove the place can lose temp pretty fast.  Not real bad (it usually only loses around 7 or 8F overnight with the woodstove tamped down all the way in very cold weather but after that, with no heat going it might drop into the 50's or lower and take longer to warm when I get back).

The challenge is to keep the cabin above 65F when I am not there to keep the stove going and the little stove won't run full on for more than a few hours or tamped down all the way for more than about 7 hours.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: icanreachit on January 27, 2017, 06:01:14 AM
Have you thought about passing the outgoing air through some cinder blocks inside? This may give you more of the thermal battery you are looking for.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 27, 2017, 01:16:56 PM
Difficult to do at ceiling height.  if I had the room I'd consider a large water barrel to 'heat sink' the energy but no room for that either unless I remove the freezer.

Best I can do is insulate well and see how this heater does.  I bought a temp data logger to be able to see how the heat production goes with this one and what the inside temps do.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 01, 2017, 05:08:40 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_1133%201024x767_zpskofwaefm.jpg)
First test!  Panel was not at optimal angle and the sun began to hide behind clouds but before it went behind the clouds I saw temps rise to above 152F coming out of the top outlet.  That with outside air temps at 30F!!!

So a 120F degree rise in less than optimal conditions.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/1sttest_zps9ytyxtpg.jpg)
With clouds in the way I was finally able to get the logger to work and recorded the above.  Not as good as in the full sun but still plenty to warm the porch :D

Note:  I started the logger inside the house and took it out and placed it into the heater so the start temp was off as it hadn't cooled down to house temps before I took it back out and stuck it in the panel in hopes of recording something.

So far the logger is not making me real happy as I can't get it to start off the button unless it's connected to a PC.  I'll see if I can get it working on my linux box I use at the cabin.  If I can then I can use it to see how it performs there which is my hope.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 01, 2017, 06:07:54 PM
I think I have the logger working finally!  I also saw temps of 154F before realizing the logger wasn't working.  It's an el cheapo model so I guess I can't complain but so far it appears to be recording again and I expect to have some pretty sweet data to share.

Now, I have the software working in Linux but the USB port didn't seem to see the logger when connected to the machine.  After getting some more readings I'm hoping I can solve that problem as the logger really needs a PC to make it work.  Worst case I'll take my kids unused win laptop with me to the cabin so I can get the logger recording when the panel is installed and in full sun.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 01, 2017, 06:28:19 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/2nd%20test_zpsxxy9dkba.jpg)
SUCCESS!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Toyotaboy on February 01, 2017, 08:08:50 PM
So you are going to mount this where on the cabin? At an angle for the sun?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 01, 2017, 08:09:27 PM
Going to mount it in front of the deck just under the eves and at about 63 degrees so it catches the most sun in the dead of winter....or that's the plan anyway.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Toyotaboy on February 01, 2017, 08:32:02 PM
Very cool. Can't wait to see how this all comes together and works. You really have an awesome place. Your thread has been inspiring.
  My place is sort of designed after Skagdrifter's place who has a thread on here near your place. I'm trying to figure how to get heat to the first floor bedroom which is on the north side of the cabin.  With the high peak, all the heat is in the loft. Looking to maybe run a vent pipe up the wall thru the floor with a low voltage fan to suck some of the hot air out of the loft. It would have to run off a battery during the night as we turn off the generator for bed. Or one of those wall mounted gas heater units. But then I'm buying propane which I really don't want to do.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Toyotaboy on February 01, 2017, 08:37:54 PM
 Here is my build but needs an update

http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=11982.msg154092#msg154092

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 01, 2017, 08:45:41 PM
I long thought about that very problem myself though my place is smaller.  In the end I settled for a 24vdc fan in the loft to push the heat down and the wood stove in the lower portion.

These heaters appear to work very well though, so I can imagine a few of them would make some difference during the daylight hours.

I use a propane heater for backup when I need it but normally it's off.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 03, 2017, 01:00:50 PM
Thank Heaven!  St Lawrence Nurseries had some overstock in apples and I was able to order a Sofstaholm Apple, White Winter Pearmain, Crimson Beauty and Maidenblush to replace my lost trees!!!!  Now I can get the orchard going again :D  Still have the Cherry and Plum so will need a pear but at least I'll have 5 apples again and who knows, maybe they will even produce in 5 years or so!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 06, 2017, 12:05:39 PM
Happy to report that after installing the heater on the cabin I saw the temp at the top of the heater reach 44.5F despite the 21F outside air temps.  Time will tell if this thing does what it is supposed to do but I think it will.

Still need to hook up the fan and complete the insulation in the porch etc but I'm getting there.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Toyotaboy on February 06, 2017, 03:26:38 PM
Any pics?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 06, 2017, 04:31:02 PM
Yup ;)  I'll post some later today when I'm back home :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 06, 2017, 09:47:18 PM
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_1162%20768x1024_zpsm1pfof25.jpg)
Just getting it situated.  It's amazing just how big this monster is! LOL

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_1169%20768x1024_zps4uwgpiwz.jpg)
I settled on some simple ties to the porch and blocks under it since there is no way to make a permanent mount right now.  Have to wait for the ground to thaw.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_1163%201024x768_zpsgx1apeno.jpg)
It does take up a large space but if it keeps the room warm I'm all for it.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_1179_zps39pqhrtt.jpg)
We got another 8" of snow after we left (neighbor told me) and another 5 or 6 coming so it's going to be interesting to see how it sheds the snow.  My thoughts now are that it needs to be further out from the porch so the snow coming off the porch roof doesn't cover it but I'll have to play with that a bit and see how it goes.....heck I may make it moveable so I can move it away in the summer and place it back for the winter.  Who knows.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Toyotaboy on February 07, 2017, 09:07:24 AM
Great pics. Wow! That is a behemoth! Looks good though.

Good call on the snow coming off the roof. That could be a concern. What did you use for face of it. Plexiglass? I didn't see it, or missed it in your thread about the build.

Toyotaboy

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 07, 2017, 12:53:22 PM
I used Lexan for the glazing (cover) and R8 insulated 4" duct to plumb it into the porch.  Still need a baffle to prevent back feeding cold air at night and need to get the fan installed but so far it does seem to be making a difference.

The snow can be an issue but I'm not 100% sure how to correct it.  I may stand it straight up instead which would help but reduce the angle to the sun in a way that might imipact it negatively.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Toyotaboy on February 07, 2017, 06:58:09 PM
Maybe a snow rake on the roof right above it. Wouldn't help when you are not there but may help with any massive build up that would slide down. Just another winter chore.

On another note, I will be headed to our place in two weeks for our lumberjack weekend with large group of guys. I have three cousins that own hunting land less than a mile down the road. We get together in Feb. and cut wood on several properties. Then each hunt camp gets lots of wood. We also have some Amish friends who bring two teams of horses to skid out the lumber. That is impressive to watch. Way better than a tractor. Then the guys attack it with chainsaws and another crew runs a log splitter. We get lots done in two days. Then drinks and stories in the evenings.  Best part is no bugs to deal with this time of year.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 13, 2017, 02:42:57 PM
Will be up there today :)  Guess I'll find out just how much snow felt and weather or not the heater worked (or is working since the sun should be out today)....here's hoping all is well.  I'll get pics though and report back
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 13, 2017, 07:26:16 PM
Arrived at the cabin this afternoon after having to chain up for the last 1/4 mile.  Road was very narrow with 2 to 3 foot banks of snow from the neighbors plow!  Lots of snow up here now but it's still only about 2 feet deep due to some rain and warmer temps (low 30's) and snow compressing.  The solar heater was reading an incredible 199.9F though so that tells me it's really making some heat!

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_1212_zpsb4ny3zay.jpg)
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_1216_zpsk5cpxpfa.jpg)
THe solar panel is a 24v panel that I thought was a 12v panel so I'll remove it and just use the battery bank instead.  I'll save the panels for something else (I have 4 of these).

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_1217_zpsfjqeispl.jpg)
Looking down at the bottom of the heater you can see the insulated duct.  I will be boxing this in and insulating it even more this summer.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_1218_zps9zrmdww6.jpg)
THe top duct will also be boxed in and super insulated as well.  Those wires will also all be done better when I have time but this was a quick fix to get the can running.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_1219_zpss8a5q4ny.jpg)
Another temp install (I hate those but it's what time allowed me).  THe fan really cranks out the air!  It ran for several minutes but the sun had dropped behind the trees and the panel had dropped from 199.9F to 130F when I hooked up the fan.  With no sun it didn't take long to drop the temp below the 90F switch point when the fan cut off.  I know it works though and with the fan not hooked up the room was only 50F without outside air temps at 32F so I'm sure the fan will change that a bunch.  Question is whether or not it will heat the room over 70F.  If it does I'll pipe some of that heat into the cabin too.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Toyotaboy on February 13, 2017, 10:35:00 PM
199.9 that is really cranking it out. Is there anyway to tell what the overnight temps are once the sun disappears? Where does your vent tube on the bottom go? That is the intake for the heater? 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Toyotaboy on February 13, 2017, 10:44:03 PM
Any chance you have a close up of that fan? I'm curious about the built in mounts and where you got it. Sorry for all the questions.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 14, 2017, 10:53:47 AM
I put a register in the floor for the cold air to drop into the bottom of the heater.  I'll post something on the fan later.

At the moment I just had the temp logger in the heater.  Next step will be to see what the temp does in the porch.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 14, 2017, 03:55:48 PM
CURSES!  My data logger did not record any data :(  Nothing to show and I'm PO'd about it.  Sending it back for a refund (piece of #$@#).....

Guess I'll have to find something that works.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Nate R on February 23, 2017, 10:50:42 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on February 14, 2017, 03:55:48 PM
CURSES!  My data logger did not record any data :(  Nothing to show and I'm PO'd about it.  Sending it back for a refund (piece of #$@#).....

Guess I'll have to find something that works.

What datalogger did you try/buy?  Might be able to recommend one that's worked very well for me.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 26, 2017, 12:31:05 AM
Perfect Prime TH165
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Nate R on February 27, 2017, 10:42:41 AM
Ahhh, OK.

I'm using a Lascar EL model. (EasyLog). I use a model that has an LCD display, and has a thermcouple input. Cost me about $90, but has been rock solid for many uses for me so far. Grill temperatures, refrigerator, outdoor, etc.

I see they have a version that has on board temp sensor, etc for about $50. Quite a bit more than the one you have, but I wouldn't hesitate to recommend them based on my experiences. The battery is a bit oddball, but lasts a long time.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 04, 2017, 01:12:24 PM
After working with Perfect Prime I have learned that the unit does indeed work but it isn't that user friendly.  Basically you have to set it up to work when the start/stop is pressed and held for a few seconds and it only works once per logging event.  Then you must not do ANYTHING with the unit until it is plugged into the PC and the data is downloaded.

Once set up it will wait for you to tell it to start logging and the amount of time it has to wait does not seem to matter so I should be able set it up, drive to the cabin, install it and tell it to start logging, pull it some time later and bring back home and download the logs.  I will give this a try next trip.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 14, 2017, 08:21:24 AM
Managed a very quick trip to the cabin to check on things and put my temp logger back into the heater for one more attempt at getting some readings.  It was 37F at the cabin and the heater was showing 59F at about 11am.  First thing I noticed (besides all the snow) was that the bricks had fallen over under the heater.


They placed in the snow so I anticipated this and had placed a 1x6 'leg' for extra support to prevent the heater from falling.

Got them back up and shimmed up under the heater.  I'll make this permanent in better weather ;)


Now that the snow is off the roof I can order the solar panel racks and get my new panels up and working.


Place looks about two weeks behind where it usually is this time of year (meaning colder and more snow)

This is very encouraging as it should mean lots of water in the mountains again this year (which means less chance of big fires).

I'm milling the next few weekends so won't have time to do much at the cabin but with luck I can get the tractor going again and start falling some trees for milling up for this years projects.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 16, 2017, 11:21:11 AM
Got back to the cabin yesterday for a quick overnighter and had to 4 wheel through a washout.  This morning I couldn't make it through and had to backtrack to another road which took me a few miles out of the way but allowed me to get out.  Need to get my tractor working again!

The heater logger has been working and showed a high temp of 101F and a low of something like 32F.  It's been very overcast and the angle will reduce efficiency this time of year but I think when the sun comes out I should see some good results.  It's sunny today but I'm gone now until next week sometime so hopefully can get some good readings.

it does seem to be helping though as the porch was about 10 degrees warming than the outside and since the windows no longer collect solar heat (covered by the deck roof now) I think that's a good sign.

Of course it won't do much good on cloudy days but those aren't as often up there usually and certainly not on the coldest days.

Can't wait for spring!  It is warming and melting off the snow but it's still pretty cold at night
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Toyotaboy on March 16, 2017, 06:43:14 PM
I looked at that data logger. Very cool. Might get one to just log the temps in the cabin. So I have some sort of idea of the fluctuations.
Can you tel me more about the fan you have hooked up? AC/DC ?  Cost ?


Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 19, 2017, 11:09:25 AM
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B003BMATFK/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o02_s01?ie=UTF8&psc=1

That's the fan I bought.  It's a DC fan and somewhat loud but that's what you would expect from something that forces that much air right?

The logger is supposed to be improved in a new release that will make it a little more user friendly but now that I understand it's idiosyncrasy's I'm ok with using it and price wise I am not sure it can be beat.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Toyotaboy on March 21, 2017, 10:45:39 PM
I looked at the reviews on the fan and you are right. Moves a lot of air but noisy. I'm going to need something quieter I think. Thanks.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 27, 2017, 07:39:17 AM
I was out turning logs into lumber all weekend


But once I set the mill up I headed off to the cabin and was hoping to find my solar heater temp logger had worked....


First successful test of the solar pop can heater! Once I worked with the manufacturer on the temp logger I bought to get it to work I placed it at the cabin and turned it on...two weeks later I picked it up and can see clearly what the heater is doing.

You can see where the temp rose to 110F and the fan came on causing a small drop in temp which was expected, then what appears to be clouds causing a short duration drop then the climb to an amazing 185.2F before some clouds drop the temp a bit again and finally the end of the day when I suspect the sun dips behind the trees to the south west of the cabin.

All in all a success! Now I just need to seal in the porch nice and tight to keep all that heat in! Then I need to make a second and stick it on the south wall of the cabin.


Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Toyotaboy on March 27, 2017, 09:24:44 PM
I'm really finding this whole solar heater build very interesting( well your whole build actually). Will you use a data logger to measure the cabin temps? Once you have your south side one built?

What type of logs were you milling?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 28, 2017, 10:47:57 AM
As soon as I get the porch insulated I'll use the logger in there to see how it does, then, yes, I'll do the same in the cabin once I have a heater on it too :)

With luck I can keep the cabin warm during the day when I'm away without having the stove running all day (which it won't anyway)....that is the hope anyway :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 28, 2017, 11:16:29 AM
OH and I was milling Fir for barns and shops :)  Milled over 10,000 board feet this weekend.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Toyotaboy on April 02, 2017, 08:49:11 PM
That's a lot of board feet. Yikes!  [cool]g
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 04, 2017, 12:32:38 PM
It was the most I've milled in 3 days!  ALL big logs :)

Did around 6000bf this weekend (2 days)....

(http://www.forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/22463/IMG_20170403_185301262_281024x57629.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1491315356)
The bulk of my weekends production :)

(http://www.forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/22463/IMG_20170403_105137990_281024x57629.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1491315355)
Hard at it

(http://www.forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/22463/IMG_20170403_104944263_281024x57629.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1491315354)
Making sawdust :)

Still have to do the math on the weekend.  Day one was 2370bf I believe and about 1/3rd of that pile.....

No wonder I'm not getting much cabin time ;)

Truth is I'm having my new (to me) F350 fitted with Timbren's and Torklift camper tie downs right now and hope to find a nice camper to slide into the box soon so I don't have to drive so much or stay in hotels.  As it is now I set up the mill, drive to the cabin (up to 70 miles away), spend the night and head back in the early AM to start work...repeat as many days as necessary!  My hope is to stop all that driving and get some more relaxing time in as well as more milling time since I won't be driving so much.

I'm looking for an 8 foot or 8'6" camper that weighs around 2000lbs (no need for a 4000lb behemoth and besides my trucks only rated at 3370 total payload anyway)....with luck I'll still get 8mpg with the camper and I know a guy who knows a guy who does complete ERG deletes (exhaust, intake, programming and removal of said ERG) for $2500....claims they are getting 800flbs of torque out of 6.4s with the delete (and I've read that elsewhere too)....makes them darn near as powerful as the 6.7's and everyone I've spoken with claims to get 2-3mpg better when towing.....of course, that's on a race truck as no one would want to do it to a LEGAL road truck ;) ;)  d* :o ???
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: pmichelsen on April 05, 2017, 09:23:46 AM
I've been wondering, did you consider building your own temp logger with an Arduino setup? I've been playing around with a few Arduino boards for some projects I have brewing and one of the projects in the online course I'm taking was basically a temp logger.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 05, 2017, 09:35:04 AM
Nah...I figured out the one I bought and it did the job :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 13, 2017, 08:19:30 AM
My trees should arrive today and since it's quite a bit warmer here then at the cabin I'm going to have to head north RIGHT away to stick them in the colder ground...hoping these will survive the shock and gophers!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 26, 2017, 08:18:20 AM
Forgot to post that I made it up to the cabin (just barely) with my 4 new trees and got them planted
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20170414_122325069_TOP%20576x1024_zpszglls5ww.jpg)

Seems like the gophers may have killed the plum (I'm getting tired of them) and we've ordered some of those solar repellers to add to the bait I put down.  Maybe that will work.

Meanwhile we've had so much water that I practically had to 'mud bog' to get in!
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20170414_122733939%201024x576_zpsliwxlhah.jpg)
This was taken after I did some work with the tractor in an attempt to reduce my chances of getting stuck

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20170414_122747603%201024x576_zpsziaqjilo.jpg)
Notice the left turn right after the gate?  Yup, I made a new driveway section around the deepest mud!  This are is not normally like this and in 8 years I've not seen it like this even remotely......and I'm told snowfall and rainfall is closer to normal up there this year! lol

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20170414_123025356%201024x576_zpswaghsia2.jpg)
That's the bottom of my driveway -- this was a week or two ago (can't even remember now....) so who knows if the driveway is even passable now!

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20170414_123051273%201024x576_zpspjtokabt.jpg)
There is a culvert under the driveway here...it's just too small to handle all of this water!

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20170414_124339230%201024x576_zpsp8qqgaeo.jpg)
The road in isn't looking much better

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20170414_124422931_HDR%201024x576_zpsnfl0vtap.jpg)
I've been milling a lot so haven't had much time at the cabin this year but hopefully will soon.  I plan to order my solar panel mounts (to mount to the roof) and get up there to install them in the next few weeks providing I'm not still milling every weekend.  Gotta make hay when the sun shines though! :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: nailit69 on May 25, 2017, 01:36:50 AM
Ya... finally made it up to my place today but not without DRAMA... we've had the trailer loaded up and ready to go for a week and pulled out of the shed and noticed a destroyed tire missing 12" of tread. We Bought 2 new tires from the sudden service team but only had one rim. Only made it 20 miles before 1 new tire blew... leaky stem that we were charged for a replacement and clearly wasn't . About 230am  the local semi truck tire guy finally shows up and gets us on our way... Mad props to my boy Pete for makin shit happen... thx GoodYear.

Got here about 730 and actually did some work... got a lot of supplies unloaded for my next trip up and got a crude kitchen rigged up with a gas cooktop and sink, fancy. Tomorrow ill finish installing the cooktop and sink and then move on to the deck... game changer there. I'll take pics and pkst asap. Can't wait to get back up in a few weeks.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 25, 2017, 02:39:02 PM
Got back to the cabin yesterday and worked on my road for a few hours (pics later) and when I got the cabin the fan in the porch was roaring from the heater and the temp was above 85F in there!  I opened the door to the cabin which was at 63F and let the solar heater bring the temp up a few degrees while the sun was out.  It was 55F outside and I haven't finished the insulation etc in the porch.  In fact, most of the heat was going outside!  I will definitely need to install ducting into the cabin so the heater can heat both the porch and the cabin.

Amazing how well this thing works and I will definitely make a second for the cabin itself.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 25, 2017, 05:30:42 PM
https://youtu.be/Broq0IAOI-c
Yes this fan is LOUD!  This is how I found it when I got to the cabin.  Pumping out the heat!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 28, 2017, 09:38:09 AM
Came up to the cabin Friday and got settled in like I usually do :)  It was late and cool so I had a small fire in the stove to warm the cabin a bit and crashed for the night after a nice Elijah Craig Small Batch in front of the wood stove.

Saturday I awoke after a very decent sleep (thanks to the still cool cabin) and after my morning coffee and relaxing set out to work on the road up.  It's three miles of pretty rough sections after the winter and spring damage.  After a few hours cleaning up a section I visited a neighbor and soon we were both down there working on the road.  Two tractors are definitely better than one!

After that I spent the late afternoon reading in the cabin contemplating what I may or may not do the next day (today)...in the end I settled on very little as I have bursitus in my right shoulder and some milling to do so I decided I'd try to do the milling today and relax at home tomorrow -- which means I need to get some clean up done and moving.

Maybe I'll get some pics for ya later ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 29, 2017, 11:25:46 AM
Didn't get much done but road work and relaxing as I have bursitis in my right shoulder and really needed to not work it too hard ;)
(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/IMG_1603%201024x768_zpsccgip6wc.jpg)
My driveway is much better now as well as the road up to my place which I graded in several spots.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/IMG_1611%20768x1024_zpsvsdazl2d.jpg)
The fruit trees appear to be waking up finally!  They are a good month behind up here.

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/IMG_20170528_084328944%201024x825_zpsjkpziuiw.jpg)
This blue berry has really taken off since the two big trees by it were removed a few years ago!  If I can get them before the bears do (and it's RIGHT behind the cabin) then maybe I'll make some jam with them ;)

(https://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y442/emcvay2/Cabin/IMG_20170528_092716467_HDR%201024x576_zps26cnila7.jpg)
So much to do and so little time.  But I'll get there!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Rys on May 29, 2017, 11:43:12 AM
I have driveway envy!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 31, 2017, 01:54:19 PM
One thing I need to figure out is how to shut off the solar heater this time of year.  My thought is to make a white cover of some kind to clamp over it with some space to allow heat to rise up on the outside of the heater -- I may also have to make a diverter to allow any heat in the heater to escape via outside air.  At this point I've just left a window open a bit to allow the warm air to leave the porch and keep the porch cooler.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on June 02, 2017, 01:50:43 PM
Got up to my place last weekend finally, and the melt/runoff was not finished.  Still had water running down the road in - made it really bad.  I did get up to my site on the drive I had put in last fall - so happy about that.

Your place looks great!  I wish I had a few fruit trees, but you'll have blueberries for sure.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Adam Roby on June 03, 2017, 08:40:11 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on May 31, 2017, 01:54:19 PM
One thing I need to figure out is how to shut off the solar heater this time of year.  My thought is to make a white cover of some kind to clamp over it with some space to allow heat to rise up on the outside of the heater -- I may also have to make a diverter to allow any heat in the heater to escape via outside air.  At this point I've just left a window open a bit to allow the warm air to leave the porch and keep the porch cooler.

It should soon (eventually) be possible to convert that extra heat into cooling the home.
https://www.technologyreview.com/s/423466/using-heat-to-cool-buildings/ (https://www.technologyreview.com/s/423466/using-heat-to-cool-buildings/)

If you were to cover it, say with a white sheet or tarp, I imagine that would significantly lower the temps.  You can also unplug the fan... so the heat at least does not get blown into the cabin.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 06, 2017, 08:41:07 PM
https://woodmizer.com/Store/Home/PersonalBestDetails?id=1364
For those who liked my solar heater you can vote on it on the above link for Woodmizers Personal Best contest :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: azgreg on June 06, 2017, 08:54:29 PM
I voted for you but you've got some stiff competition there.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 08, 2017, 08:47:06 AM
Oh let's be honest!  Those guys are serious pros!  I put my heater in just because it's unique but it isn't anything like the stuff some guys have built ;)

Still, it's cool so I hope to get some good vote counts ;)

Thanks
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Adam Roby on June 08, 2017, 08:52:31 PM
You got my vote already...  :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 08, 2017, 10:37:07 PM
Thanks guys!  Raining at the cabin but that means a food might for a book and a drink ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Tickhill on June 09, 2017, 06:52:05 AM
I put my 2 cents in for you!

Tickhill
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 09, 2017, 07:41:25 AM
Thanks :)
At he cabin this weekend. Started early due to work so was able to check on the orchard and do a little cleanup before my honey arrives today.  We're going to burn slash and clean the place up since it's in dire need.

The fruit trees seem to be doing well and the last surviving apple blossomed this spring!  Hopefully it won't take 5 years before the new ones I planted do but if it does, oh well.  Not much I can do now since the gophers killed the other 4 apples I had.

Now we have solar gopher repellers in the orchard and they seem to be doing the trick.

I also picked up a pair of white roofing panels (the plastic type) to mount over the solar heater for the winter.  The next step on this one is to make it permanent but I've not had much time out here to do much with it yet.  So, hopefully I can take a weekend a month to work on that, put up the solar panels and a few more projects I wish to get done this year.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 09, 2017, 05:05:44 PM

This is the result of the temp logger left in the porch just above the batteries.

Nights were in the 30's and the porch is not well insulated (nothing in the floor or ceiling and some of the wall space not insulated).  With day time temps mostly in the 60's with the occasional reach into the low 70's the cabin porch hit over 90F several times.  Night temps down in the 30's didn't matter much as the heater warmed the room significantly enough to allow for the drop in temps outside leaving the porch as much as 20F warmer than outside air temps.

I'm shutting it off this weekend but plan to see what the porch does without it to compare.  However, I am VERY impressed with this heater!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 12, 2017, 08:16:21 AM
A few pics from this weekend :)  We burned slash, picked up trash, installed new funny pipe in the orchard to provide water to the trees and generally relaxed and enjoyed the weekend :)  Hope is to return again soon to get more done but I've injured my shoulder running the mill recently so am trying to take it easy until it recovers.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on June 19, 2017, 12:16:41 AM
Still raining up that way? wow - I think it's been a very wet summer so far.

Injured your shoulder? Well, take it easy as I am pushing my milling needs back a few weeks ;) ... just have not been able to get up there as often as I'd like... hoping to fix that, tho.

Your place looks awesome all greened out like that!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 06, 2017, 11:06:39 AM
Seems photobucket is toast these days.  Need to find a new place to host (or make my own).

Got my white roofing over my solar heater so that should help with keeping the heat down this summer.  Thing is at 65 degrees and still puts out a LOT of heat!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: navybobunderway on July 12, 2017, 09:39:47 AM
OK Jarhead, this thread is wicked long, but I'm working on catching up. Seems like we are practically neighbors as soon as we start building........
Thanks for chiming in on our thread as well. I'm with you, spent the weekend in Omak a couple back, and being on Whidbey for the last 10 years or so
has done NOTHING for my ability to handle anything like real heat.....it was definitely "warm" while we were shopping parcels.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on July 12, 2017, 01:25:31 PM
Welcome to the neighborhood, NavyBob!  I'm building up in Okanogan as well! Always good to see a new neighbor.

OJH ... how's your injury healing?  I hope it hasn't slowed you down much.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 13, 2017, 11:53:23 AM
Hard to say Java.  It's healing but slowly and I'll know better this weekend as I am remote milling in Mazama
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on July 14, 2017, 12:58:00 PM
No rush  OJH ... Just was hoping you were on the mend!  I've managed to fall behind.  I've moved closer to the ranch, and am currently in the Ellensburg area

Should shorten the drive to teh property immensly!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 19, 2017, 07:13:20 PM
Please note, I have deleted my photobucket accounts.  They just got too ridiculous.  Sorry!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Toyotaboy on July 20, 2017, 08:09:16 AM
I saw all my stuff went belly up with Photo bucket too.

What recommendations for a host now?

???
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: azgreg on July 20, 2017, 09:15:49 AM
I'm using postimage right now. So far so good.

https://postimages.org/
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 26, 2017, 07:42:15 AM
I'm updating my own site (dartplayer.net and sewa-darts.com) to add a gallery and will just host my own ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: navybobunderway on July 28, 2017, 12:04:50 AM
So I replied in my post, but real question is, how much for milled lumber? Not super familiar with rough cut, but learning....also asked about equipment operators, shopping a loader/backhoe, and or tractor, but maybe a local with the gear is money well spent. We have 20 acres, like to "tame" about 5 of it....it's sloping, but not awful....
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 01, 2017, 02:32:56 PM
Milling runs anywhere from $250/Mbf to $500/Mbf depending on where you are etc.  I charge by the hour for remote milling ($85/hr) which falls within that price range (to get down around $250 you have to have good logs, site and help).

If in the Okanogan I can recommend a couple fallers that are young and hard working but I don't know how available they are as they both fight fires too.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: navybobunderway on August 02, 2017, 06:50:03 PM
Hey thanks for the reply, we don't have a lot of trees for felling, was more wondering if you have rough cut for sale?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 03, 2017, 12:52:30 PM
Quote from: navybobunderway on August 02, 2017, 06:50:03 PM
Hey thanks for the reply, we don't have a lot of trees for felling, was more wondering if you have rough cut for sale?

Nope sorry! 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 11, 2017, 03:05:46 PM
Soon heading back up to the cabin for a short visit.  I do a fair amount of overnighters at the cabin since moving down south as I still maintain an office in Omak.  This trip, like most, I'll try to get a little work done and a little relaxing :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 26, 2017, 07:15:13 PM
So I finally pulled the plug and bought the battery fan and relay for my battery bank :)  I chose the relay even though I will be installing an outback charge controller (which I bought last year for the 6 panels I bought) because I can get it up and running sooner with this relay than if I waited.

Now, the next phase of my solar improvements is the following (at least these are my thoughts and I am looking for feedback):

1.  Move the inverter and charge controllers inside the cabin (just inside the wall instead of in the porch above the batteries
2.  Once the inverter and charge controllers are inside the cabin (where they will be warmer, less dusty and no longer near the batteries) I will complete the battery box around the batteries and install the fan and relay.
3.  Move the Trimetric battery monitor inside the cabin
4.  Consider getting a second monitor or just a voltmeter for the porch so I can see where the batteries are when I arrive and before entering the cabin (my preferance).
5.  Install a 12v or 24v porch light inside and outside the porch (today I turn on the power and the light comes on as it's left on when I am gone (switch is inside) so it will come on when I turn on the power.

One thing I need to research is the right cable size for the inverter.  It's a 4000w pure sine inverter that can peak at 12000w and has a 50amp charger built into it (24v).  I have been using the same cables (2-0 if I remember right) from when I built the system as a 12v system.  I'm thinking I can stick with 2-0 and install 36" cables from the batteries to the disconnect and inverter (disconnect will remain in the porch at this time).  The cables I have now are too stiff so I'm looking at ordering a set of these (or similar): https://www.solarpanelstore.com/solar-power/wire/inverter-cables/ul00black36.html

I will cut down the copper buss bars to a much smaller bar and tie the batteries all to the bar at the same point (instead of seperating them the way I did before) thereby reducing uneven usage (however small) and less room required for the bus).

I'll still have to decide if I want to leave the auto-gen switch and 24v-12v converter in the porch or move inside (don't have much room but thought it would be better to have the inverter, at least, inside if not also the controllers).

Then I'll need to start working on the 'command' center where my controls and meter will reside (near my chair by the wood stove has been the plan).

Thoughts?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 26, 2017, 08:08:40 PM
Aims manual says 1/0 for the 4000watt inverter when 24v and up to 3 meters.  So if I go 3 feet I will be Good!  Now just need to check lengths I need before ordering the flex cable I want
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 01, 2017, 05:37:11 PM
https://youtu.be/zZ97RhRiyIg
Meanwhile in the woods somewhere other than my cabin ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 01, 2017, 11:04:53 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on September 26, 2017, 08:08:40 PM
Aims manual says 1/0 for the 4000watt inverter when 24v and up to 3 meters.  So if I go 3 feet I will be Good!  Now just need to check lengths I need before ordering the flex cable I want
https://theinverterstore.com/product/inverter-cable-set-10-awg-lugged-ul-listed/
They also sell them in different lengths but the prices seem pretty steep.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 03, 2017, 09:50:35 PM
Crap!  The cold has arrived and I have not blown out the water lines at the cabin!  Just saw it's down to 25F...I think it will be fine though the hot water heater may be blown again...shoot I need to get there ASAP!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 10, 2017, 06:35:50 PM
(http://xenf-test.dartplayer.net/index.php?media/rat-damage.6/full)
So I arrived on Thursday afternoon to discover a rat made it into the cabin!  It's been years since I started this build and this is the first time they made it in.

(http://xenf-test.dartplayer.net/index.php?media/rat-hole.7/full)
Rat ran across the rafter tie and made this small hole.

(http://xenf-test.dartplayer.net/index.php?media/rat-damage.8/full)
This had me wondering....

(http://xenf-test.dartplayer.net/index.php?media/rats-made-it-in.9/full)
First step was to find how they got in.  I figured it out and put in new screen and some foamed in steel wool.

(http://xenf-test.dartplayer.net/index.php?media/rat.10/full)
Then I found the bugger dead.  Guess the poison worked!

(http://xenf-test.dartplayer.net/index.php?media/img_2119-1024x768.11/full)
With the rat gone and the hole plugged I removed all the insulation that was R19 on the north wall and placed the vent board and refilled the bays with R21 bats that I'd planned on placing anyway.

(http://xenf-test.dartplayer.net/index.php?media/img_2126-1024x768.12/full)
Even put that light in finally!

(http://xenf-test.dartplayer.net/index.php?media/img_2131-1024x768.13/full)
With this work done I can now finish the ceiling.  I've been waiting to get the insulation done so maybe the rat did me a favor?

(http://xenf-test.dartplayer.net/index.php?media/img_2132-1024x768.14/full)
Next task was to start working on the insulation in the porch.  I couldn't get 19.2" insulation for stuffed 1" foam board on one side

(http://xenf-test.dartplayer.net/index.php?media/img_2134-1024x768.15/full)
With the narrowed bay to fit R21 for 16" walls done I stuffed R10 rigid foam in to the ceiling to take up the extra space.  Once the R10 foam and the 1" is all in place I'll put in R21 bats to give me an R31 ceiling in the porch :)

(http://xenf-test.dartplayer.net/index.php?media/img_2137-1024x768.16/full)
Next project, which I plan to do at the same time is to remove all the batteries, cut down the copper bus bars and reposition, then build a battery box and install the vent fan.  Once done I will no longer have to worry about hydrogen venting :) and can completely seal up the room!

(http://xenf-test.dartplayer.net/index.php?media/img_2138-1024x768.17/full)
I've also ordered 3' and 4' flex cables for the inverter and batteries to disconnect.  I'll put the inverter and charge controllers inside the cabin (other side of the wall) and clean up the wiring.

(http://xenf-test.dartplayer.net/index.php?media/img_2139-785x1024.18/full)
And I'll take the meter seen here, and place it inside the cabin as well.

That should take place soon but first I plan to install the new solar panels THIS WEEKEND!  Can't wait!



Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 16, 2017, 08:25:46 AM
Spent the weekend at the cabin :)

Got more paneling done :)  One more row above the rafter ties on the south side and I'm back to 'easy' work :)  Can't wait to hit the peak!

I'm liking it :)


Got the first of the rails up.  Two more to go but I can now get some panels on the roof!  This was a major challenge to do alone (my help bailed).  I ended up putting some plywood on the rail (bottom) for the ladder to rest on so it didn't push the rail down when my weight was on the ladder (tabs hitting the rail and putting more force on it)....didn't get a pic sorry!  But I need longer ladder hooks for the roof as the ones I have crush the ridge vent.  I will need much deeper/longer ones so I can bring the ladder up the North side to finish off some venting.  But I wasn't going to stop now.


This was a major pain!  I was not happen with the rails.  They are NOT one man installation.  This panel is sorta just resting between some clamps...couldn't hold it and secure at the same time without more arms....


Necessity is the mother of all inventions right? 


And it worked!  One down!  5 to go!


2nd panel went up easier.  Maybe 20 minutes with my ratchet strap trick :)


Noticed I had some issues inside the heater.  I'll have to pull off the lexan and fix some tape that has come loose.  It's putting out a lot of heat though.

(http://xenf-test.dartplayer.net/data/xengallery/0/34-8971c8af6ba58701d4c047c6b7a29363.jpg) (http://"http://xenf-test.dartplayer.net/index.php?media/img_2211-1024x768.27/")
First three panels up!  I can now hook them up to the charge controller and get it working.  So if I don't get help fir the next three I can at least add some charging power to the system with these.

(http://xenf-test.dartplayer.net/index.php?media/img_2232-1024x766.28/full)
Those are 305 watt 24v panels so will considerably boost my charging power considering the old panels are 205watt 12 volt panels :)  Even with just these panels I should be adding about 25amps so pretty much doubling my power....the next three triple it!

Now if I could only find some help...my helper who said he would be there this weekend was no where to be found.  The next two rails I 'may' be able to sort out alone but I'm not sure how I'm going to secure the panels up there alone....unless I get my tractor back :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 16, 2017, 08:38:56 AM
One issue I had that MUST be corrected is that my CSUN305-72P-M156, 4BB, panels are 50mm thick NOT 40mm....the clamps for the panels are 50mm clamps!  d* d* d* ??? ??? ???

Not sure how that happened but I have asked Iron Ridge to help me sort the issue.  With luck I can have new clamps shipped to me ASAP and I can go out and put the correct ones in.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 05, 2017, 09:40:22 AM
(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/looking-south.21/full)
Got back to the cabin this weekend for a quick trip to deliver the tractor and blow out the water lines.

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/solar-heater.22/full)
The solar heater is working great even if I haven't completed the install yet (story of my life lately). 

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/big-red.23/full)
Rats ate more wiring than I had realized so $800 later the tractor is back and ready to plow snow none too early!

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/cabin-nov-2017.25/full)
Love these parting views of the cabin!

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/cabin-2017.26/full)
So much work, so little time but my new motto is 'little victories!' :)

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/gate.24/full)
Saying goodbye to the place.  I was there just overnight as my wife has been at her mom's all week (her sister has leukemia) and I thought I'd better be close to home.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on November 05, 2017, 04:07:40 PM
Hey Jarhead! It's looking good!

I am chomping at the bit now for the spring to come ...

Glad to see that you're place is still coming along good
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Toyotaboy on November 07, 2017, 10:51:22 PM
That light dusting of snow just makes it gorgeous..!

What is the plan to keep the snow off the panels mounted on the peaked roof?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 08, 2017, 11:48:05 AM
Thanks Guys,

The panels?  the 45 degree angle will help a lot I believe.  The roof never usually gets much buildup at all except on the porch where it can get 12-18" deep where the two meet.  For the most part though, it's gone as soon as the sun comes out (on the 12:12 pitch, not the porch) so I'm not too worried.

Is there anything you can do?  I can't imagine but am open to ideas ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Gary O on November 10, 2017, 08:36:07 PM
Luv the pics, the place, the gorgeous entry...and the tractor

I shalt covet thy tractor
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 12, 2017, 02:09:53 PM
With the snow we've already had (a few inches this week I guess -- but I wasn't there) I'm coveting the tractor too! :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Beavers on December 08, 2017, 08:41:35 PM
Hey Jarhead do you have a link to where I could check out your photo's?   You were just starting on your build last time I was around. Would love to see how it all turned out.  [cool]
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 10, 2017, 07:31:33 PM
Hate to say it but since Photobucket bombed on us I don't have many online now.  Just the last few posts I think.

I may yet get something going but haven't at this point.

Sorry! and welcome back :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Beavers on December 10, 2017, 07:53:05 PM
Looking at your last couple of pics it looks like it turned out real nice.  [cool]
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 11, 2017, 09:08:18 AM
Hmmm thought there were more but here are a few of my latest.  I've been working on the porch to get it insulated and finish the interior paneling but I've also not been there in the last month or so :(

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/img_2119-1024x768.11/full)
First run of paneling above the collar ties after removing the rat and fixing the insulation (replaced all the old remaining R19 with R21)

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/img_2126-1024x768.12/full)
Finally up to the ties on the south side.

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/img_2131-1024x768.13/full)
And above them on the north :)

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/img_2134-1024x768.15/full)
using R10 rigid foam to fill the top of the rafter voids in the porch and then will stuff R21 under that.  This should give me a decent ceiling in the porch but I also need to finish the battery box and install the vent and fan before going too far.

So much to do but so little time
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Toyotaboy on December 14, 2017, 10:19:05 PM
Looks great so far. Noticed your window isn't done with the finished trim. None of my windows are done and we have been in for 3 years. Going to my place in January to just finish up the windows. My wife is tired of old bed sheets and nails for curtains.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 15, 2017, 09:11:22 AM
Ah Yup ;)  But I do have the wood finished for them....does that count?  d*
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 27, 2017, 08:11:50 PM
Was 14F degrees when I headed up the hill to the cabin! Colder here and dropping fast but I have the generator running and both the heater and woodstove going.

Winter storm warning in the forecast so we'll see how much snow comes down but with luck it won't be too much before we come back Friday.

Took two hours to get the cabin above 40F but it's warming up and should be a comfy 75F by the time I crash for the night.

On a side note the batteries were so cold that at 100% charge they were only 24.3! The generator is set to come on at 24v and I'll leave it hooked up and ready to run when I leave so with luck the batteries will stay charged up. I'll open the door to the porch when the cabin warms up too which will warm up the batteries and maybe I'll get more insulation in there. If not I'll do it this weekend. One way or another I need to get that done though because with these cold temps the batteries just can't keep up with cabin power demands without the generator running. So I better get with it soon!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 03, 2018, 07:10:19 PM
(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/power-station.29/full)
Spent the weekend at the cabin and did some wiring work on the solar power.  I've replaced the old stiff cables I originally installed with flex cables to the battery bank and inverter.  I also replace the cables for the charge controller.  Now I can install the new breakers for the new charge controller etc and wire in that darn lightening protection!

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/new-cables-in-the-disconnect.30/full)
Looking cleaner now :)

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/charge-controller.31/full)
New 4AGW cable to the controller (replaced an old battery cable)

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/new-cables.32/full)
Tied down each battery string to the same stud on the bus to eliminate any distance issues with strings not equidistant from the draw/charge.

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/positive.33/full)
Close up.  I was seeing a slightly different usage on the string furthest from the draw so this should solve that.

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/winter-at-the-cabin.35/full)
Next I climbed up to the roof and cleaned some snow off, then fished out the cables from the 3 new panels and attached them to the 10agw cables that go to the Midnight Solar Combiner box (not installed yet)

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/the-cabin-dec-31.36/full)
Still have snow to remove but I'm hoping this will help the remaining snow slide off in sunny weather.  If not I'll work to get the rest off the panels so they can generate power once connected.

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/cabin.37/full)
A future change to the solar heater will be to raise it to 90 degrees (straight up) so it will no longer collect ice and snow.  It won't be as efficient as it is now when the sun shines but it will always be able to generate heat instead of having to melt it off first.  I took the time to install a back draft damper in the bottom duct also because I noticed a strong reverse draft at night.  This should now stop.

Did a little more insulation work but must now finish the battery box and install the vent before finally plugging all the drafty holes off (don't want hydrogen build up).

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/cold-air-inlet.39/full)
That's where the damper went.

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/power-station.29/full)
Still have some wiring to clean up but at least installed the new rocker panel to allow switching 12v systems on and off seperately and moved the 24v-12v converter as well as the Magnum Research Auto Gen start switch.  Once the box is done and all is completed in here the panel, meter and remote switches will all go inside.

Still haven't decided whether or not to put the inverter and controllers inside.  Just not sure about that yet.

Was a great weekend at the cabin, though cold and got some plowing done too.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: SouthernTier on January 04, 2018, 08:08:46 AM
Could you move the roof solar panels to the other end of the roof?  There is no porch roof below that.  The porch roof is probably holding back the snow so that it doesn't slide off as well.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 04, 2018, 09:01:05 AM
Nope.  You see I have 3 more to put up there which will extend over that section.

Just need one of those avalanche snow removers for the roof I think ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 29, 2018, 08:57:38 AM
So I've finally settled on what I'm going to do with the floor!  I'm going to nail down planed pine boards (with some character in them, at least I hope) and not make T&G.  I will however biscuit join the ends and plan to keep them to 2, 4 and 6 foot lengths (random) and random widths.  I will be nailing down with Tremont nails (old world nails made today) and then treating with dark Tongue Oil (first coat) and then just Tongue Oil (both mixed 50/50) from the Real Milk Paint folks :)

Now to start yanking out all the 1" stuff I have and planing it down to make it mostly smooth.

Of course I still have much else to do too but this is a start on the process (I've ordered the nails and Tongue Oil).

Also, I plan to start felling trees to thin them out on the property, if I get at least 60 logs in the 12 to 18 foot range that are at least 9" at the small end then I plan to mill them into D Logs and make a Butt and Pass cabin for guests.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 01, 2018, 11:59:55 PM
Since photobucket is done I'm thinking of doing something of my own (a cabin blog if you will) on the build since we lost all the pics in the posts and if I have to edit, I might as well do it blog style :)

But for now I'll post some vids of making the solar can heater for those interested ;)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qNmjuTPznGU
At first I tried using a beer coozie to hold the cans which I'd seen others do.  It doesn't work well.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TwmihYly1Uw
Then I came up with a new method...no coozie but a leather glove but first some fun ;)  A few of the 'spin outs' for you.

and now, for the truly bored (or those really wanting to know how I managed to successfully drill out 238 cans for my heater...
https://youtu.be/Ftcycqy7DJc

more to follow

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Beavers on February 02, 2018, 08:05:45 AM
I like the video idea  [cool]

Wow 238 cans... :o
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 02, 2018, 09:24:24 AM
Correction!  289 cans.  I had to redo the math on that one after watching one of the videos.  LOL so ya, a LOT of cans!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 03, 2018, 12:18:34 PM
https://youtu.be/dnXHrPFils4
Some of these were not edited too well (or much) and just 'raw' filmed while I worked.  I tried to explain what I was doing and in this case I edited the video a little but to speed things up etc.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 03, 2018, 03:16:41 PM
https://youtu.be/Pfs9JgCEoqA
and the last one I did (as far as I can tell)...
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Adam Roby on February 04, 2018, 10:07:22 AM
I find this cool, I would like to give it a try one day, but the sheer amount of work involved just seems overwhelming.
I wonder if you could easily substitute the cans for some other cheap alternative.  I can't think of any good ideas off hand... but maybe the tube roll from wrapping paper, wrapped in tin foil, or some other metal tubing...  I wonder if the characteristics, gauge of metal, diameter of the can, all play a role on the amount of heat this can generate.  If someone had the time, money, and desire to test this with larger cans (I'm thinking those king cans of beer) and then again with smaller cans (like the little V8 cans) to see which works best or if the only real factor that counts is the overall size of the panel (amount of sunlight trapped).  If it is just a matter of square footage, then a single sheet of metal might work just as well.... must be some scientists on this forum that can help out.  :)

I had once tried something, cost me a couple hundred in hose, to make a solar heater for our pool.  The thing weighed a ton (dry) and even more with water filled.  I started with a hole in the center of a wooden frame and gradually circled a garden hose around and around making a spiral of hose.  I can't remember now, I think it was 400-500 feet of hose.  Then it was all spray painted black, and a sheet of plexi-glass laid over top.  When you first started to run water through it, the water was hot from sitting there... but that heat quickly dissipated with flow.  I never got the right speed down, needed to run a valve off the main pump diverting water... just was more trouble that it was worth, and it weight so bloody much that I couldn't move it around to face the run and was afraid to put it on the roof of my shed. 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on February 04, 2018, 11:13:09 AM
Just FYI, we used to have a pool and a solar pool water heater. It was a store bought unit. The basis was a black rubber-like mat that was molded with grooves in the material. IIRC it was about  4 or 5 feet wide and 12 feet long with the grooves running lengthwise. The grooves were sized to hold black tubing with a 1/4" ID to be press fitted into them. The tubing ends fitted to a length 2 inch PVC pipe. Lots of fittings glued into holes in the PVC. Two header pipes; one for water going in and one for water exiting.

The black mat absorbed the heat, the tubing circulated the water. I don't recall the heat gain but it was enough to get the water hot enough to over heat the pool on a summer day. It used the standard pool pump.

The aluminum can solar air heater works because the aluminum can material is very thin. Heat transfer from the outside to the inside almost instantly. Thicker material would likely work but maybe not so well in less than optimal sun. It works because there is lots of surface area to transfer the heat and many air channels to spread the air flow out. A single sheet of flat metal would require a method to provide many separated air channels to ensure the air flow was spread out.

I made an air collector back in the 80's. I used light gauge sheet aluminum (4 ft wide x 10 ft long) that a local sheet metal shop bent lengthwise with a series of alternating 90 degree bends. (Wish I had a picture) About 2 inches between bends. When viewed from the end it has a zig zag appearance. Both sides were painted flat black. The sheet fitted into a metal box the shop also made. The back side of the box was insulated with rigid fiberglass insulation and covered over with HD aluminum foil. The "accordioned" aluminum sheet was fitted tightly against the foil covered insulation. Header boxes were constructed at both ends with 6 inch air duct fittings. The front face was sealed with a clear fiberglass sheet. That was a problem until I found panel material that would not yellow after a few years. It did work but we took it down a few years back when we needed to reconfigure that side of the house for parking a travel trailer. The solar panel had been mounted on that side wall of the house and was no longer going to have the sunshine. I sold it off and have no idea where it now is.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 04, 2018, 02:19:32 PM
Aluminum down spouts work well I've read.  Actually, the best results are from black window screen I believe.  But this was something I wanted to try so I began to collect cans :)  I'm going to make another soon and will get more video.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 04, 2018, 02:21:47 PM
(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/solar-heater-test.53/full)
Here is the result I logged at the cabin.  Heater is set at 65 degrees and facing south.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 04, 2018, 02:25:11 PM
That is 65 degrees of angle.

Temp logger shows 4hrs of production above 100F and about 3.5hrs of real heating.  Enough to heat up the porch for sure once it's fully insulated.  Actually, it heats the porch, the lack of insulation however let's it out.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on February 04, 2018, 06:18:32 PM
Aluminum down pipe should be great.   They sell gutter to trough adapters so making headers should be easy enough.  We don't drink pop and I only drink bottled beer, save for a few Guinness.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: apiratelooksat40 on February 05, 2018, 10:08:07 AM
I've also seen variations of these where flexible dryer hose or ducting is used in-place of the cans.  Just snaked through the box so it takes up as much of the inside as possible.  Painted flat black.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 05, 2018, 10:46:47 AM
I think anything aluminum will work really.  Just a matter of making sure the air is slow enough through the system to heat up and the outlet has a good fan on it to suck the air through once hot.  Mine does very well in the sun as it is so I plan to make another (we've collected a lot of cans for it).

Takes a fair amount of work but is pretty cheap.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: jayceevee on February 05, 2018, 02:32:09 PM
google low profile solar hot air project.  site owner is scott .  downspouts, black screen, fans, efficiency charts, etc.  good forum.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 07, 2018, 09:29:36 AM
Done that :)  I googled, Binged, Yahood and generally searched far and wide for all sources.

https://youtu.be/rAzUMeK9bKE
here is a new one for you.  Just trying to narrate (a first for me) the build in pictures.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Beavers on February 07, 2018, 09:43:53 AM
Free heat is really cool  [cool]

Will it work passively or do you have to use the fan?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 07, 2018, 10:46:50 AM
It works well as a passive unit but the fan will draw more air into the unit thereby creating more heat.  The fan units are pretty inexpensive and easy to set up but I have a large battery bank to run a fan off so it was an easy thing to do.  I plan a passive unit,  though I may add a fan later, for the south wall of the cabin.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 09, 2018, 08:12:25 PM
https://youtu.be/YYyf-5bJqhg
Here's a new one for you.  Nevermind the mess (it seems I never have time on these short trips to clean up and organize but I will soon!)

Note:  Outside air temp at 6am was 20F.  So in reality the heater is responsible for rising the temp in the porch over 60 degrees!!!

Once I finish this install and get the porch finished (I plan to do so this spring and will start next weekend on the battery box) I do believe this heater will raise the temp in the porch to above 90F!  If so then I think my plan to stick ducting through the wall into the cabin (two 6" baffled ducts with 24v motors on them to open the baffles) should actually work!  I figure once the porch reaches 90F at the inverter I could open the ducts and let them remain open until the porch drops to 70F then close them to retain the rest of the heat overnight.

Then I plan to install a second one of these on the south wall of the cabin (to the right of the porch) and plumb it into the cabin with a 12v computer fan (4") hooked up to a snap switch and 12v solar panel to move air once the panel warms up.  It won't be as effective as this crazy mass air moving monster of a fan but it will be quieter (and I may find something smaller that works similarly).  With luck, I should be able to arrive to a cabin that isn't 18F when it's 10F outside and the sun is shining.  That's the idea anyway :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on February 09, 2018, 08:55:54 PM
good luck... I'll watch for updates.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Beavers on February 10, 2018, 02:20:14 AM
Your posts inspired me to read up on solar air heaters.  Seems like in a small well insulated cabin they could provide a large percentage of the heat. 

Thanks for sharing these videos...now I have another project to add to the list.  :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on February 11, 2018, 12:47:34 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on February 04, 2018, 02:19:32 PM
Aluminum down spouts work well I've read.  Actually, the best results are from black window screen I believe.  But this was something I wanted to try so I began to collect cans :)  I'm going to make another soon and will get more video.

And I thought it was the beer inside the cans you really wanted  ???
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 11, 2018, 09:53:42 AM
LOL except I don't drink beer....I think I've had maybe 3 in the last decade.

Now if there was a way to make a heater out of Evan Williams bottles ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Adam Roby on February 11, 2018, 10:24:24 AM
That would mean A LOT of bourbon!   That is partly why I asked about different options.  I don't drink anything out of a can, in fact I don't drink beer or soda pop, even water I drink from the faucet and not from a bottle.  I think I may play with some of these on a small scale and see how they work.  For the passive/active part, I had purchased some solar powered fans a couple years ago for an outhouse project that never got started.  I wonder if that might be a good option, since you only really want circulation when there is sun present, so having the fans activate when the sun is out and stop when the sun goes away might be a good option. 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Mike 870 on February 11, 2018, 06:26:36 PM
What is your channel's name?  I wanted to subscribe but couldn't seem to navigate there from the embedded video.  I'm 50 Acres & a Cabin.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: pmichelsen on February 11, 2018, 10:48:03 PM
Quote from: Mike 870 on February 11, 2018, 06:26:36 PM
What is your channel's name?  I wanted to subscribe but couldn't seem to navigate there from the embedded video.  I'm 50 Acres & a Cabin.

This should take you to his channel: https://www.youtube.com/user/TheOljarhead/featured
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 12, 2018, 09:02:44 AM
Quote from: Adam Roby on February 11, 2018, 10:24:24 AM
That would mean A LOT of bourbon!   That is partly why I asked about different options.  I don't drink anything out of a can, in fact I don't drink beer or soda pop, even water I drink from the faucet and not from a bottle.  I think I may play with some of these on a small scale and see how they work.  For the passive/active part, I had purchased some solar powered fans a couple years ago for an outhouse project that never got started.  I wonder if that might be a good option, since you only really want circulation when there is sun present, so having the fans activate when the sun is out and stop when the sun goes away might be a good option.

The screen (black) is the most efficient of them all I believe.  But any aluminum can, downspout etc, will work.

The fans should still have a snap switch the heater can first build up heat before the cans come on.  When my box hits 110F the fan kicks on and usually drops about 10F at first but then the sun overpowers the can and it rises well above 180F.  Having the snap switch between the panel positive (or neg) and the fan is all that would be needed.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 12, 2018, 09:04:30 AM
Quote from: pmichelsen on February 11, 2018, 10:48:03 PM
This should take you to his channel: https://www.youtube.com/user/TheOljarhead/featured
Thanks for sharing.

I don't do a lot of videos really, maybe a few a year at most but I try to make them on something I find interesting :)  I'm no pro though!  Pretty much just an el cheapo canon digital camera, cheap tripod and away I go.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Mike 870 on February 12, 2018, 01:40:34 PM
Cool thanks,  I'm subscribed. I'm about in the same boat.  I'm hopeing to to get better at it as I go along.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Adam Roby on February 15, 2018, 08:04:19 PM
I looked up snap switch but couldn't find very much.  Do you think these (https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Free-shipping-5pcs-KSD9700-45-50-55-60-65-70-75-80Degrees-Normal-open-Temperature-Controller/32788286857.html?spm=2114.search0104.3.246.517a5d79XtIbCF&ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_3_10152_10151_10065_10344_10068_10130_10342_10547_10343_10340_10548_10341_10084_10083_10618_10139_10307_5722316_5711211_10313_10059_10534_100031_10103_10626_10625_10624_10623_10622_10621_10620_10142,searchweb201603_1,ppcSwitch_4&algo_expid=548e58dc-01be-469a-982e-725c91631eb9-34&algo_pvid=5) might do the trick?  They have them at many different temperature settings...

(https://img3.banggood.com/thumb/view/2014/xiemeijuan/06/SKU230932/SKU230932a.jpg)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 15, 2018, 08:42:38 PM
https://www.amazon.com/Emerson-3F01-110-Snap-Disc-Control/dp/B0028ATE5C/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&qid=1518745316&sr=8-5&keywords=snap+switch
This is the one I used.  I know I've found them cheaper though!  But still, $10 isn't bad.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 15, 2018, 09:05:02 PM
Quick trip to the cabin today to prep it for the weekend.  The idea is to go up at 'lunch' from work and kick on the power, hook up the generator and run it briefly, turn on the back up heater and get the wood stove going.  One the wood stove is going well and stoked nicely so it will heat for about 4 good hours it's off and running again back to work.  Then tomorrow night when we arrive late (around 9PM) the cabin should be at least 50F inside (thanks to the propane backup heater since the stove will be long since cold) and won't take too much to get warmed up before hitting the hay for the night.

It was 29F outside when I arrived with full sun on the solar panels and heater and I could hear the heater fan running in the porch.  Once I got into the porch I found the temp sitting right about 62F which was nice since there couldn't have been much more than an hour and a half of good sun on the heater to produce heat.

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/porch-11-40am.65/full)

It's about 11:40am and 62F inside the porch.  I'm pretty happy with that!
(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/cabin-11-40am.66/full)
Cabin temp on arrival.

Ten minutes with the door to the porch open to the cabin allowing that heat to help warm the cabin and having kicked on the backup propane heater the temp is rising nicely
(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/cabin-11-50am.67/full)

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/porch-11-50am.68/full)
There was a ten degree drop in porch temp due to the heat escaping into the cabin or the cold air being drawn out of the cabin and into the heater

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/cabin-12-16pm.69/full)
26 minutes later and the temp is rising nicely and I have a fire going to help the heater out.

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/porch-12-16pm.70/full)
Better sun at 12:15pm means more heat and since the heater and woodstove are going in the cabin I'm guessing that helped the porch temp rise a bit.  Not bad though since it's still nearly 20 degrees colder inside the cabin.

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/porch-12-47pm.71/full)
At 12:47pm and ready to leave the porch is already passed it's arrival temp and up to 64F despite the heat loss into the cabin!  I did close the door for a short period though while the generator ran but it wasn't more than 20 minutes.  Nice to see that bounce up in temp in such a short period.

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/cabin-12-47pm.72/full)
Wood stove going strong, backup heat set to kick off about 50F and it's time to head back to work and home.

I do believe this heater works well but I have some repairs to do to it.  Still, I will get a second made sometime this spring (I hope).

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/20180215_115614-1024x957.73/full)
I'll be back tomorrow!

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/20180215_115617-1024x768.74/full)
Can't wait to get back and adjust these panels and begin working on the porch.  I hope to get a battery box completed this weekend.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 19, 2018, 12:18:44 PM
Spent the weekend at the cabin and am sore today!  d* ???  Maybe it was all the moving of batteries that got me ;)

Anyway, got started on the porch.  First step was to finish paneling up the South wall of the porch at least to a height above all the electronics on the wall (east) that the batteries were up against.
(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/img_0420-768x1024.75/full)

Since I started with that wall I wanted to finish it to at least above the door.  Next was to build the framing for the battery box and get it assembled.  I got the idea to rip 2x4's down from my camper build and figured this box didn't need a big heavy wall.  Once I had the framing sorted for what I wanted I removed the batteries from the porch and began working on the paneling on the wall behind after getting insulation in there too.

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/img_0421-1024x768.76/full)
Once I had enough of the wall insulated and paneled my generator quit (because it has to be tied to the battery bank ground to properly function and I'd disconnected it) so I brought the batteries back in and got them all set up.  I had the new wall for the box installed and called it quits for the night.

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/img_0422-1024x768.77/full)
I'd shortened the bus bars also since there was no need for them to be so long and tidied things up.  Sure makes a difference!

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/img_0424-1024x768.78/full)
One big advantage to all this work is the room I've gained!  I gained over 6" to the right so the freezer could be turned and now takes up less room and the batteries are closer to the walls so I have more room in frot of them.

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/img_0431-1024x768.79/full)
Was greeted with more snow and cold temps the next morning but planned to get some work in anyway

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/img_0432-1024x768.80/full)
Had to sweep snow off the saw and deck often to keep a decent work area.  This did cause me to slow down a bit and eventually give it up!

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/img_0435-768x1024.81/full)
Mother nature just wanted to remind us that Winter was NOT over yet!

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/img_0438-1024x768.82/full)
However, I kept at it and got the box about 90% complete!

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/img_0440-1024x811.83/full)
You can see it pretty well here.  Eventually the side will be paneled and the front will just have a gap at the base to allow air flow.  The front and top will be mounted via studs and wing nuts when complete so they can be removed for maintenance.

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/img_0441-1024x768.84/full)
The fan goes there.  It will have a 2" riser to bring it up a little more (above the electrical box) and then will be vented outside.  Since venting under the window wouldn't be best I'll have to turn it down the wall a bit I think and then vent it away from the window.  I'll have to finish the paneling up the wall behind the disconnect box and charge controller and then get the conduits installed to clean up all the wiring.  I'll also have to seal up the penetrations so hydrogen doesn't vent into the porch anymore but I think I've made a giant leap forward here now :D

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/img_0444-1024x768.85/full)
We left just before noon once I decided mother nature won and it was time to head home.  We're pretty excited though and are planning to get more paneling made and the flooring ready!  WhooHoo!

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on February 19, 2018, 02:12:06 PM
 [cool]

I wish we had that much snow. There's still not enough snow on the ground to need 4WD let alone chains or a plow.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 19, 2018, 07:15:26 PM
Ha!  We've got plenty if you want some ;)

Was coming down hard when we left too.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 19, 2018, 07:18:34 PM
(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/img_0442-768x1024.86/full)
Thought I'd add this one.

I'm really loving the room we gained and seeing the panel go up finally!

Now I just need to make more!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: redside on February 23, 2018, 11:15:58 AM
Love the blue stain in the t&g panels.......looks really nice.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on May 28, 2018, 12:48:59 PM
Lookin' good there!

Did you get up to your place this weekend?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 31, 2018, 08:22:31 AM
Nope :(  We went camping instead.  I popped up for an overnight a week or so ago but no major trips planned right now as it's milling season and I'm off milling two weekends this month with more trips coming in for July etc.

Trying to keep the milling down to two weekends a month and or some mid week stuff though so I can plan a trip to the cabin for work.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 23, 2018, 08:26:28 PM
Crap!  Looks like the generator brains are gone :(  and the phone base is also dead.  Lightening struck not too far away but nothing else impacted.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 25, 2018, 08:28:18 AM
Turns out the tractor PTO isn't working too!  Is that 3 things?

We arrived Friday night with no real clear plans other than to do 'something' while there and relax while we were at it but it had been a while since we were at the cabin and getting much done so hoped to accomplish something.  It was also our anniversary Sunday and we were determined to enjoy the cabin while there :)

After settling in Friday we had a nice evening and crashed early (happens when you are in your 50's I guess LOL).  Saturday found us 'sleeping in' until 6am (and that took work!) but once up and having had coffee we were off to take a walk around the property and then get started on the day.  Truth is I don't remember what occurred when but I was able to get the battery box vent installed and all the batteries topped off with distilled water.  That's when I discovered the battery was dead in the genny and then the brains quit too!  So I get the tractor ready to mow and that didn't work out either.  My wife did some weed eating and spraying round up around the cabin while I was working on the tractor and once I couldn't mow out came the chainsaw and I bucked up several logs for firewood, then split a large round and finally said 'to heck with it' and poured some Old Forester 100 proof and called it a day ;)


(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/20180623_183949-1024x768.188/full)
Battery box vent installed.  Since the genny was not working and there was not much sun I did not get a chance to see it working but it's in and 'should' work.

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/20180623_184013-1024x768.185/full)
The outlet still needs a 90 degree elbow installed and some bug screen and I didn't have any foam to seal up the gaps but I'll do that soon.

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/img_1059-1024x767.186/full)
A good start on this winters firewood :)  I've got to split it all this summer and get it into the shed but it's a start!

One thing I did attempt to do without success was blow the air bubble out of the bathroom cold water line.  At least I'm assuming it's an air bubble as it's not worked since blowing out the line two winters ago.  To attempt this I opened the bathroom cold water tap and put pressure on the kitchen thinking the air would have to blow out the tap right?  Nope.  Just didn't happen :(  I got some air out of it but it did not solve the problem.  This tap worked great two years ago but doesn't work at all now.  Not sure what's up but will have to come up with a new plan soon!

Sunday I was up early and after cleaning up some of the wood pile and 'stickers' I had somehow left laying near the pile in the past I got the forks on the tractor and we loaded a ton of wood into the truck to take home.  This will become flooring and paneling (depending on the thickness) and I hope to get it ready in the new month or so.  Our plan is to actually get the floor in this summer.

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/img_1067-860x1024.189/full)
This is a mix of pine and fir and I plan to plane it all, put a tongue and groove in it and use tongue oil to treat it.  It will be a softwood floor but hey, it's a cabin :)

We did more cleanup, did some relaxing and also put the white roofing over the solar heater.  I hope to get back soon to get more done but for now it was a good weekend with a good start on cleanup and prep for the year.
(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/img_1064-1024x768.187/full)
Lots of work to do yet but it's a start :)  Now to get the darn tractor and generator fixed!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 25, 2018, 07:35:32 PM
The good news is that GENERAC is telling me the brains are under warranty :D

Now to get the genny fixed (next month) and the tractor fixed (need a trailer for that and time) and well, everything else done....back to cleaning the shop I guess ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on June 25, 2018, 08:08:00 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on June 25, 2018, 07:35:32 PM
The good news is that GENERAC is telling me the brains are under warranty :D

That is extremely good news!

You mentioned a nearby lightning strike... do you have Midnite Solar's SPD's??  Surge Protection Devices (http://www.midnitesolar.com/products.php?menuItem=products&productCat_ID=23&productCatName=Surge%20Protection%20Devices).  They are real equipment savers.  I have replaced a couple of SPD's after their indicator LED's stopped, but have not had any other damages since the big strike a few years back. Every time I return to the cabin property I note whether the SPD LED's are lit. I have 2 spares on hand, a DC and an AC.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 25, 2018, 09:00:54 PM
I have one I have never installed...I better get it done!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Toyotaboy on June 26, 2018, 08:38:33 AM
Ol Jarhead & Don,

I will be installing a 45 watt 3 panel system this summer to run the fan on the composter when we are not there. Hooked to a single battery. Where are the SPD's to be installed (never heard of them before)?  Solar system only? The cabin is wired to a panel and then to a generator plug hook up. I also have ground rods installed as required. We run the gennie for power as needed when we are there and turn it off at night. Sorry to hijack the thread.

Toyotaboy 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on June 26, 2018, 01:40:43 PM
I have one MN SPD at the PV panel along with one Delta arrestor. They use different technology.

I also have a MN SPD at the charge controller and batteries, 325 feet away.

A third MN SPD is located on the AC service panel.

We have a small array; three panels. If I had more panels I would likely double the number of MN SPD's.

Nothing will protect against a direct hit.  I believe the big hit a few years ago was direct and sent an ultra high energy bolt from the PV to the cabin where it danced around all over. Burn marks visible on a PV panel top corner and the cabin eves as well as inside where a heater fan was plugged into a 120 VAC outlet. Fan motor survived but the snap switch blew apart.


SPD'sneed a good solid ground to shunt the energy surge to.  I have several 5/8" x 8 foot ground stakes driven in as well as a 2 sq ft area copper plate buried several feet down in a place where rain water is directed to, in an attempt to increase the conductivity.  I did that at the array and similar at the cabin itself.

Not to mention a separate installation of air terminals on the roof peak and ground rods and plates (lightning rods)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Toyotaboy on July 01, 2018, 07:30:32 PM
Thanks Don. Looks like I have more homework to do. :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 20, 2018, 07:17:33 PM
(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/battery-vent-fan.213/full)
Baby steps :)

I finally installed the fan (mentioned earlier) and this trip saw it actually working :)  Still need to get the pipe sealed up and protected from critters etc but at least it's venting now.

The generator battery was bad (5 yrs old and abused a couple times) so I replaced it and the brains came back to life.  Still having them replaced and the generator serviced (Tues) and then I hope to get back to finishing the solar panel upgrade (but arthritis has reared it's ugly head so we shall see).
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 24, 2018, 10:23:07 PM
Pics to follow.....

So I got out to the cabin today with two plans:  1.  Get the generator back online and 2. install the Outback FlexMax80 and the 3 panels on the roof.

The generator guy showed up about an hour late but that was ok.  He arrived with a new controller unit and set to getting it installed.  The old one, while now sorta working (showing the readout etc and allowing the gen to run but not charging the battery) was bad and he replaced it.  However he ran into several issues getting it working again and discovered another bad part (a motor that controls the fuel air mix) which may have gone bad right when he replaced the controller since it seemed to be working before hand.

As for the outback controller I installed it inside the cabin (which is what I planned on earlier but wasn't sure I was going to do until today) and while I did drill one of my conduit holes on a poor angle, I managed to get all the cables run and the solar panels providing power to the controller and the controller hooked up to the batteries.  I do find it odd to run two controllers tied down to the same lug on the main disconnect but I'm told that's fine.  Weird thing though, with the solar array offline I was getting voltage at the PV ports on the controller.  Not sure how that's possible frankly since they were wired to the PV combiner box and the breaker was off and the panels were NOT wired to the terminals ???

Anyway, on a hunch that it was ghost voltage I wired the PV array into the combiner and flipped the switch and it read 110vdc coming in and 25.1vdc going to the batteries.  Light was low and it was late so only a trace amount of charge was being sent to the batteries but it was something.

Now the interesting thing is that the combiner provides a 15a breaker which since the panels are 8.5amps and in series (so it should still be 8.5a but the voltage combines to be as much as 108vdc (35.9vdc max per panel and 3 in series) the folks I bought these components off felt I should not run 3 in series in the winter as they felt under ideal conditions they might push the votlage up close to the 150vdc max of the FlexMax80 but I have to wonder if they can really increase THAT much from 108 to 150???

Anyway, I digress a little, with the 15amp breaker at the combiner I continue to wonder if I really need a 2nd breaker at the disconnect panel for the array?  I'll have 2 or 3 sets of panels (2 or 3 in series) running into the combiner and each set of panels (array) goes into 1 15amp breaker then they are combined which will increase the amperage to ~17amps and keep the voltage where it is (108vdc) assuming two arrays (3 would make it 25.5amps after the combiner and 71vdc).  So do you really need a second breaker after the combiner?

The way everything is set up is that the panels hit the combiner and each array is then combined (parallel) and sent to the controller (PV- and PV+) then from the controller the BAT+ goes to the main disconnect (which is a 250a disco) and the Bat- goes to the shunt (side opposite batts) and of course ground to ground.

I'm running the FLexMax80 through a 100amp DC breaker so you have the 15amp breakers on each array on the input side (PV) and a 100amp breaker on the Battery side.  Why isn't this enough?

Anyway, I have room to install another breaker and can get one -- I'm thinking that a 60amp breaker will work as I shouldn't see more than 25.5amps coming in at 71vdc, assuming I really need it.

Also find it odd that I can run two seperate controllers to the same lug on the main disco but I'm guessing they sense whatever voltage there is at that point reguardless of how it's getting there and decide what to do based on that (so if the Outback's array gets sun first it will start bulk charging and the Morningstar will start later and see voltage is already up to or nearing the desired point and will work to get there.

I also need to make certain both are programmed with the same set points as it wouldn't make much sense to try to hit 29.6v on one controller while the other is trying to get to 28.8.....

Just me rambling on but I'm thinking I'm getting there.  I'll be back to get the last 3 panels up and wired in and then I'm going to have to really work on getting conduit installed so everything is cleaned up!  As it is now it's a bloody mess!  Grrrr but it works ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 24, 2018, 11:05:00 PM
One mistake I made already is that I used the 6awg wire I had to run from the controller to the batteries.  This should be fine while I'm only running 3 panels (915watts@35.5v is only 25amps if memory of how to calculate is right and since each panel is 8.5amps and there are 3 if they were in parallel it would be 25.5a so I should be right) but once I am running all 6 that would take me up to 71amps of potential power output from the controller which means I should be running (as recommended by the manufacturer) 4awg wire (2awg for more efficiency but I won't likely be putting out that much power and the run is only 24" or so making me think 4awg wire should be fine).

Anyway, I think we're ok since I won't have the PV array to push the wire size until the next 3 panels are in but I better plan to change it out next trip.

So I need more ground wire to tie the PV combiner box ground to the ground stake, 4awg wire from the controller to the batts and possibly a 60amp DC breaker to install after the PV combiner box (in the DISCO box) as well as more conduit etc so I can clean up all the wire mess.

If I can get all this accomplished in the next few weeks I'll be a happy camper!  After all, it means going from an absolute max of about 16amps of charging power (3 205w 12v panels in series) to something like 67amps of charging power which brings me right about the 10% mark (10% input of total battery bank AH capacity -- bank is 660AH@24vdc).  The battery bank is a tad small for my usage (I can use about 50AH overnight bring the bank down to about 92% or a usage of 8% overnight -- which means I don't have the capacity to run more than one full day with no sunlight at all before I hit about 80%) so getting the solar array (s) up to snuff for recharging has been a critical thing for me.  After all, I don't want to run the generator EVERY day in the winter.

Finally, I learned the generator has an exercizer built into it in the new controllers!  I can now set it to exercize once a week for an hour to help keep it running well (it isn't good to have them sit for long periods).  It does mean I need to leave the power on all the time but I'm going to try that for the rest of the summer and the fall to see how it goes.  After all, in the winter all the power will be running is the inverter and generator charger (which is very low wattage) so in theory, with the exception of very poor charging days it should be fine and when the weather starts to get that bad I can turn off the exercizer and disconnect the battery again and leave it that way until the spring.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 25, 2018, 12:20:52 PM
(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/20180724_155654-1024x876.214/full)
Outback FlexMax80 Charge Controller placed inside the cabin opposite the porch where the batteries are.

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/20180724_181929-768x1024.215/full)
I ran 6awg wire to the PV breaker and buss and to the Disconnect ground buss and then realized I did not have 4awg wire for the controller to the batteries so I ran 6 gauge again and will change out next trip.

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/20180724_190515-768x1024.216/full)
Up and running on 3 panels.  Notice the voltage!  I had no sun and it was getting dim out but I was surprised to see the voltage that high and even saw it hit 110vdc. 

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/20180724_190520-768x1024.217/full)
I found it odd that it showed 'out' when there were no amps.  This seemed to very closely match battery bank voltages.

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/20180724_190525-768x1024.218/full)
I didn't like the coat hook location anyway :)  But seriously, I'm happy with this install though the 'click click' when it goes from snoozing to tracking to low light and back to snoozing in the evening might be a little to get used to though it's barely noticeable.

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/penetrations.219/full)
I really need to run slightly larger conduit which may be tough since there is a stud slightly protruding into the penetration (and notice the upward angle  d* ) the combiner is on the outside of the far wall and you can see the penetration there.  I will need to place a junction box at each penetration location and then conduit between them and to the disconnect.

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/250amp-disco.220/full)
Once the paneling is completed I can re-install the combiner box and original controller and put some conduit between them.  It will be nice to complete that work!

The breaker on the upper left is the 100amp breaker for the Outback and the two on the lower right are for the morningstar and the original panels.  I don't really think the original panels need that breaker though since they have a 15 amp breaker in the combiner box and they are in series (so nothing to combine).  My thinking is I could remove one or the other and be just fine.  If that is the case I could take the 60amp breaker in the disconnect box from that array and give it to the new one since it will be 3 arrays combined into one.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 26, 2018, 09:01:08 AM
One of my new considerations is this:
https://www.repeaterstore.com/pages/cell-phone-signal-booster-guide#rec
and
https://www.3starinc.com/50_foot_telescopic_push-up_antenna_mast_ez_tm-50.html
or
https://www.cableandwireshop.com/50-foot-telescopic-push-up-tv-and-wireless-internet-antenna-mast

I currently pay about $50/mo for a landline and $65/mo for Huges internet (satellite) and figure that even a $1200 install for a booster would pay for itself in a year.  The problem I face is that I can only get 1 bar at about 60 feet above the ground at the cabin.  The cabin is 20 feet at the peak though so I'm thinking a 40 foot antenna might just get me high enough but then I have to deal with guy wires and grounding and of course lightening becomes more of an issue.

Thoughts?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on July 26, 2018, 09:27:18 AM
Guy wires and lightning are a PITA and a reality. 

If the antenna is mounted on the roof peak the installation can be difficult. I know I would not want to be handling the 45 lb antenna on a peaked roof such as yours and have to deal with the guy wire installation as well.  An on-ground antenna makes installation easier in some ways but means an even larger antenna is needed.  Then the guy wires get in the way at ground level not to mention having to thread them among trees.

There is a good chance lightning protection will cost more than the antenna.

However, it sure is nice to be able to have a working cell phone at one's cabin.  We have 3G service, usually 1 to 2 bars...  reliable for voice and SMS but graphics heavy webpages can be slow at times. That's with no booster or external antenna.



Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 26, 2018, 06:46:25 PM
Folks at the repeater store turned me on to LTE Discovery and asked that I go out (good advice) and check signal.  I'll go all over and see what I can get and where as I might not need to go very high to get a signal strong enough to boost.

They also advised that what some do is they set up a remote booster where they can get signal but in my case, to my knowledge, that's 500 feet away which is a long way to drive even 120v I think.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 26, 2018, 06:54:35 PM
Did a little check and actually I should be able to run 550 feet of 10awg wire to a spot I can get signal and direct bury it and stay under a 5% voltage drop.

Quote1 conductors per phase utilizing a #10 Copper conductor will limit the voltage drop to 4.81% or less when supplying 5.0 amps for 550 feet on a 120 volt system.
So in theory, I could run 120v out to a short antenna where I know I can get signal.  Of course, the problem is that my research so far tells me it would run close to $500 to get wire out to the cell booster and then I'm not sure how I get that signal back the 500 feet to the cabin but I'll keep looking.

I'm very hopeful I will find a solution as I'm tired of paying the $120 a month I now pay for phone and internet that is rarely used.  it's just a big waste of money but I need it for my job.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on July 27, 2018, 10:38:53 AM
have you looked into long distance WiFi providers in the area.  I know Okanogan County has a few that will put up a link.  I've looked into them and they tell me they don't have service out my way, but I want to get a "war driving" app and see if I can receive and of them out my way.  The down side is they may not publish the SSID.  For me it's not a huge rush because I get cell service (and it seems to improve every year since I've bought the place), but I do want something a bit faster than 4g/LTE at some point.

I don't recall if you're still in Okanogan county, but if you are, you can check this page out for providers in the area that do wireless.  Also someplace on that site (or one of the providers site), I seem to recall seeing a map of where the various access points were located

https://www.okanoganpud.org/content/retail-service-providers-rsp
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 27, 2018, 10:53:28 AM
I know folks that get NCI datacom but I am in a hole a d dont want to pay more for phone or internet.  If u can get a cell booster to work I would be good. ;)  and yes still in the Okanagan
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 01, 2018, 08:11:08 AM
First test was a bust :(  No cell coverage even where I normally have it.  Wonder if the forest fire smoke has anything to do with it  ???

On the otherhand the Outback was putting out 5amps when I arrived and the Morningstar was too.  Outback said "charged" not long after and stopped putting out anything to the batts while the Morningstar picked up the amps to 8amps.  I found that interesting and will need to look further into the outback programming.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 09, 2018, 08:21:46 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on July 24, 2018, 10:23:07 PM
Weird thing though, with the solar array offline I was getting voltage at the PV ports on the controller.  Not sure how that's possible frankly since they were wired to the PV combiner box and the breaker was off and the panels were NOT wired to the terminals ???


and the answer is...."The PV voltage will slowly rise to the battery voltage level even when the PV breaker is off – this is normal as the PV capacitors charge up. "
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 09, 2018, 08:27:26 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on August 01, 2018, 08:11:08 AM
First test was a bust :(  No cell coverage even where I normally have it.  Wonder if the forest fire smoke has anything to do with it  ???

On the otherhand the Outback was putting out 5amps when I arrived and the Morningstar was too.  Outback said "charged" not long after and stopped putting out anything to the batts while the Morningstar picked up the amps to 8amps.  I found that interesting and will need to look further into the outback programming.

and the answer here is:  "Charged   
There is an external DC source other than PV keeping the battery above the Float voltage set point (see page 26).  The FLEXmax will stop charging because it is not needed.  The display may also appear when the cycle is transitioning from Absorbing (upper target voltage) to Floating (lower voltage). "

That other DC power source is the Morningstar MPPT controller doing it's thing and since the panels are in different places and the Morningstar doesn't know better it will just maintain float but clearly the Outback will 'wake up' if the Morningstar stops getting enough light to maintain float.

I can say at this point my setup appears to be charging up the batteries in record time! :D and I still have 3 panels to go!  Only thing I might add some day is a 3rd controller (another outback) and then convert the morningstar for diversion loading.  After all, if I have enough power to maintain the batteries in the winter why not divert power to a heater in the porch or cabin?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 14, 2018, 07:00:43 PM
Got up there today to check on the power and meet the gen guy but got the date wrong and need to go back tomorrow.  Good thing I showed up though as power was in alarm and the inverter was off so the generator battery was dead  ??? d* >:(  I think this may have happened when the generator tech came out to replace a part and something must have gone wrong (over volt maybe?) and kicked the inverter into alarm.  I reset it and all seemed fine but the gen batt was at 10.5v so I left the cabin hoping it would be fully charged tomorrow when the gen guy arrives and we take a look to see what's going on.

I'm not liking this aspect frankly, as there should be nothing wrong since they changed out the main processing/controlling unit but who knows.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 16, 2018, 05:42:35 PM
Sheesh.  They sent the wrong controller so I have to wait another week.

Meanwhile the outback combined with the Morningstar are charging the batteries at record rates despite the smoke :)  Saw 25amps at noon and it was climbing....and 3 panels aren't up yet :D  I did see the batts at 29.6vdc though for much longer than I thought they should be so I need to check that and map what's going on.

Checked cell and in the smoke got -103dbm about 80 feet above the ground at the cabin so roughly 60 feet above the cabin.  Not what I was hoping for but more checking to do.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 26, 2018, 11:06:17 AM
It's difficult to get good pictures of the flooring in the shop but I'm finally working on it :D

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/flooring.230/full)
It will be a mix of ponderosa pine (seen here) and doug fir stained with 2 coats of dark tung oil and 5 or 6 of the clear (which is kind of honey colored actually). 

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/floor-stain-3rd-coat.231/full)
This is two coats of dark and 1 clear.  It's actually a little darker with more honey in it to the naked eye but the lights were pretty bright in the shop

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/kindling.232/full)
After using the mill to remove any crown in the boards and trimming them all to the same size I took all those trimmings and made some kindling for the cabin :)  Best kindling ever!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on August 26, 2018, 02:39:04 PM
Good kindling!!  You can almost never have too much.  ;D   Though I use less than I used to since I started using pine needles instead of paper as the starter.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 27, 2018, 07:43:24 AM
Sure is nice to use.  Haven't tried the pine needles yet (I actually forgot about your doing that) and need to.

Still no work from Generac/Energy Systems on when I will get my new controller  ??? sorta makes me worried.  I need to get up there this week to check on the place and my wife and I will be up this weekend to split wood and work on the porch.  Might be able to bring up some flooring too.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Nate R on August 27, 2018, 12:24:58 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on August 27, 2018, 07:43:24 AM
Sure is nice to use.  Haven't tried the pine needles yet (I actually forgot about your doing that) and need to.

Still no work from Generac/Energy Systems on when I will get my new controller  ??? sorta makes me worried.  I need to get up there this week to check on the place and my wife and I will be up this weekend to split wood and work on the porch.  Might be able to bring up some flooring too.

The way it's going, you won't need the generator anymore with all those panels!  ;) ;D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 27, 2018, 03:09:29 PM
That is the hope! :D  Though winter is always a time of low solar production regardless but I'm hoping to see massive improvement :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 31, 2018, 08:18:08 AM
and this time the generator is fixed!  4th time's a charm I guess ;)  d*

Seems they did indeed bring the wrong controller and after the first 3 attempts to get it working it was realized (one letter difference on the part number and an owner -- me -- insisting there was nothing wrong but the control board).  Now things are back to normal and I can get back to it!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 02, 2018, 04:32:19 PM
So the outback controller goes into in 'charged' and stops trying push electrons into the batteries but the Morningstar says "not so!" and keeps pushing into the string.  I can adjust the Morningstar to not add 30m of absorption but am not sure.  Maybe I should looks closer at the Outback programming.  What I see is both controllers ramp up to 29.6v on the bank and then run for about two hours before the Outback backs off and heads to float and the Morningstart continues to push into the bank for up to 3hrs.

Have to do some thinking here about how to make two controllers work together perhaps
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on September 02, 2018, 06:23:41 PM
I've never used a Morningstar but I have used Outback FM's and Midnite charge controllers. They can be set to do absorb by time or by end amps.  Does the Morningstar allow the absorb time to be programmed?  If they both can be set for absorb time then they should go to float within a minute or so of each other, assuming the bulk voltage is set the same on both and they are both charging the same battery bank.

???
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 03, 2018, 06:26:37 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on September 02, 2018, 06:23:41 PM
I've never used a Morningstar but I have used Outback FM's and Midnite charge controllers. They can be set to do absorb by time or by end amps.  Does the Morningstar allow the absorb time to be programmed?  If they both can be set for absorb time then they should go to float within a minute or so of each other, assuming the bulk voltage is set the same on both and they are both charging the same battery bank.

???

Yes.  I figured out the issue, i think.  The MS controller allows 30m longer in absorb if the bank drops to 25v or below.  So, while the Outback stops absorb the MS continues for 30m longer (assuming the absorb on the OB is 150m)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 11, 2018, 06:53:11 PM
Working on the flooring now :D  Can't wait to get it ready to install and took 10 days off in October to either hunt or get the darn floor in (or both).
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Gary O on September 11, 2018, 08:41:27 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on September 11, 2018, 06:53:11 PM
Working on the flooring now :D  Can't wait to get it ready to install and took 10 days off in October to either hunt or get the darn floor in (or both).

Tough choice

The floor looks gorgeous!!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 16, 2018, 08:35:52 AM
Arrived on Friday after work in hopes of completing the floor this past weekend and maybe getting a few more things done.  Got all the flooring warmed up in the cabin and then installed it.  I know it's best to let it sit for a couple weeks to acclimate to the cabin but I didn't have time.  So I laid down some 15lb tar paper to provide a barrier between the floor and the OSB subfloor and went to town.  Took me a large part of the day but I got it done.
(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/new-floor.245/full)
Now just need to make another 25-30 boards more so I can finish the floor.

Next up was the solar heater which I wanted to reposition.  I was able to do it by myself with the tractor forks and it is now secure and plumbed a little better.  Only issue is that it literally vaporized some of the insulation which I pulled out (what was left of it) but it still works.  I also fixed the fan setup which I may show later.

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/new-panels.246/full)
Final task for the weekend was to get the last three solar panels up and wired in!  It's done!  After long last I know how a LOT more power going to the batteries :D  I saw 35amps at 1pm after the batteries had been charging already for a few hours so I'll have to see what I get there in the early part of the day when they really need it.  Still, I've NEVER had that much power and these panels should all more.    I'm running 3 strings of two panels each at 305wx36vx8amps (72v -- actually I was seeing open voltage of 80v -- and 8amps).

Next up is to get some hardware cloth under the cabin that I had not completed in the past and the rodents have discovered, and the finish the insulation in the porch.  Then who knows, maybe I'll see about hunting a little :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Toyotaboy on October 16, 2018, 09:31:51 AM
Flooring looks great! There is always something to do!

I finally finished up my window woodwork and hung the ceiling fan that had been sitting there for a year!

My wife did an awesome job on the curtains too!

Hoping to do outside stuff next year and do a little hunting too!l

Your panels look great! That will be my next project.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 19, 2018, 05:07:31 PM
It's been a day of cleanup.  Tell the truth I'm not really into this trip -- that doesn't usually happen but for whatever reason I'm not inspired right now LOL.... ???

Could be all the rat crap etc that I had to work around and all the trash I put in the back of the truck.  The rats are really getting to me and I noticed the old shed is pretty much in need of a rebuild or a fire at this point and the fire idea is sounding better.

I pulled out 95% of all the tools and put them in my truck with the plan to take it all home and clean and organize them as well as all the screws, nails, nuts and bolts etc etc.

I did however, make some changes to the Morningstar MPPT controller which I saw was set to go into Abosrbtion Extension for 3 hrs if the batteries dropped below 25vdc.  This was contradicting the Outback MPPT controller's 1hr absorb time and I realized it was the reason I was seeing 3hrs or more at 29.6vdc in the past.  So I have set the Morningstar to 1hr absorb and 2hrs extension at 25vdc -- I still think that's wrong but need to do some research.

Here is what I saw happening today since it's the first time I've seen both systems in action with full sun and all 9 panels running:

At 10:46am the Morningstar (MS) was at 15.8amps and bulk charging, the Outback (OB) was at 33.4amps and in bulk also.  The Tri-Metric Meter was showing +44.3amps which indicates ~5amps is being used by the inverter, fans, controllers etc.   So, by 10:45am we were getting 44amps of charging and the system had dropped to 90% overnight from my usage.  That means I used ~66AH and the system would need about 1.5hrs to replace that into the bank.

So, if I understand the math right and in 1.5hrs I would have put back in 66AH the system should be in float by then right?  That's my thought anyway.

So, I checked again at 1050am and was seeing 45.2amps going into the batts and the sun was not fully on the main panels yet.

By 11AM the OB controller was in Absorb and pushing 28.5amps while the MS was at 16.5amps and the meter showing 40amps going to the batts.

At 2:15pm, the next time I checked the system the OB controller was at 0amps and showing charged while the MS controller was floating at 3.9amps -- the meter showed -1.7amps due to what was running.

I was thinking that the OB could float longer or float if needed but need to research that.

SO, with this imformation I'm thinking the Absorb time for both could be 1.25hrs with no extension.  That would give me 62.5AH going into the bank before going into float and I suppose I could make that 1.5hrs to make sure it's enough as I should see 75AH going in for that period.  Then float for longer -- maybe 3-5hrs (why not?).

Wonder if MD is around to read this?  THoughts?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 19, 2018, 05:18:40 PM
Oh and the meter was at 100%

an the porch was 90F at 2:00pm with the new solar heater position.  I need to do more insulation as that will help keep things warm but meanwhile I am going to try this:

Absorb for 1.5hrs and float for 3hrs.  I should be able to bulk and absorb from 10:30am to 2:30PM without issue this time of year and float until 5pm really.  I will also start to trickle charge the system from 9am to 10:30am but I haven't sat and worked out the exact charging curve there yet.  I say 'trickle' though because there isn't enough sun to crank the amps up but the system is pushing some amperage into the batteries -- maybe just enough to run the appliances etc but not enough to bring volts up to much until closer to 10:#0
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 08, 2018, 10:05:50 AM
Howdy all,

Haven't been milling for some time now (months it seems) in part due to my arthritis and GWI but also in part because I decided to take a break and do some other things (while I could enjoy them LOL)....all is reasonably well though and I have used the mill a few times as an oversized table saw :D 

What was I using it to rip down?  Well funny you should ask:
(http://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/22463/20181013_173356_281024x76829.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1543186127)
Flooring of course :)
(http://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/22463/20181013_170307_281024x76829.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1543186126)
I'd been planning this for some time and finally broke out the tools and after hauling a bunch of 1" pine and fir home I made the flooring for the cabin.
(http://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/22463/20181013_170251_281024x76829.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1543186126)
It's all T&G which I though would be best and once the weather warms I'll give it a light sanding and cleaning and then will be treating it with Tung Oil.

Having completed the flooring (1st half done above, 2nd half coming) I ordered some 1" split conduit for the mill and after cleaning it and oiling it up I applied the duct to protect the rail.  I plan to get some 3/4" for the chain and a motorcycle cover for the head.  I think that might be better than a tarp which inevitably blows in the wind etc etc.

Then after a couple weeks I got the 2nd half done :)

(http://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/22463/IMG_1592_281024x76829.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1543186075)
 


(http://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/22463/IMG_1287_281024x76829.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1543975265)
 
(http://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/22463/IMG_1292_281024x76829.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1543975265)
 
(http://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/22463/IMG_1296_281024x76829.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1543975266)
 
(http://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/22463/IMG_1307_281024x76829.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1543975266)
 

(http://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/22463/IMG_1308_281024x76829.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1543975267)
 
Finished!

For those interested I made all of the flooring T&G with a router and used a biscuit joiner at the ends (except that last 3 rows because I forgot it at home).

We love the floor and can't wait to put the finish on it (when it gets warmer).


Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Adam Roby on December 08, 2018, 11:12:44 AM
Looks great, nice job. 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Toyotaboy on December 22, 2018, 10:49:23 PM
Your place looks great! How many btu's is your gas wall heater?
I'm thinking about putting one in my bedroom on the north wall.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 24, 2018, 09:27:08 AM
Thanks Guys,

The heater is 18000btu's and I only use it to help raise the temp when we arrive or keep it up when we are gone as it is not a vented unit.  If I were to use it more often I'd get the vented through the wall type like I have in the composter room.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 10, 2019, 08:43:58 AM
OK, pics coming soon!  I am now working on a coffee table and beside table made from live sawn pine that is well stained as well as some blue stained pine placed in the middle to widen it up.  Basically I took a 13" and 10" piece of live edge blue stained pine I'd sawn a few years back (ok maybe 5 or 6+) and used the mill to rip it down the middle.  Then I planed it as well as some 5" 2x's I had that were pretty heavily stained.  Used the jointer on the edges to square them up and will soon bond them together to make the top of the table.  Once bonded and stained I'll affix to some 'rite leg' company coffee table legs (we like the look) and then pour with Parks Super Glaze.

We're also going to do, make that I am also going to do a bar and stools for the cabin to have instead of a table.  More to come :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Rys on January 12, 2019, 06:27:17 PM
Love the floor!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 12, 2019, 10:45:41 PM
Thanks :)

So I've finally started on a Coffee Table for the sitting area and a bedside table for my wife.  Here are some progress pics of the coffee table:

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/img_1600-800x438.261/full)
Originally the two outside live edge boards were one but it was too thin for a coffee table so I ripped it down on the sawmill and used some blue stained 2x's for the middle to widen it.  This way we get live edges and blue stains but wide enough for our needs -- sure I could mill something wide but I had this in stock at the moment.

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/img_1603-800x563.262/full)
After using the jointer/planer to make sure the edges were square I cut in some biscuit joints and glued up the first half.

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/img_1604-800x600.263/full)
Not sure I really need them but I like the security of a little more, well, secure bond.

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/img_1607-800x423.264/full)
Getting it glued up

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/img_1612-800x600.265/full)
Made this simple sled for squaring up the boards where the jointer couldn't easily accomplish what I wanted.  This worked nicely.

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/img_1614-800x600.266/full)
The two sides glued and curing.  Tomorrow I'll plan them just to take off any differences with one or two passes through the planer and then I'll bond them together for the complete top.  Then, once completely dry (24hrs) I'll stain and place a 1" crosstie under them for mounting on the legs (give them more strength since the legs (Rite Leg Co) are only 12" wide and this top will be about 20".
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 14, 2019, 12:28:01 PM
When making the final joint I discovered my tablesaw was not square!  Took a little work but got the blade set back to zero (and have no idea how it got out) and made the final edges squared up for gluing etc.

Put it together and noticed movement in the wood already :(  Must be do to the temp change so I cut in the biscuits, glued it up and clamped it together.

Now I'm looking for some hardwood to make a bowtie or two in the center to make sure it doesn't pull apart at the cabin.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Rys on January 15, 2019, 06:59:40 AM
I think the bow ties will only accent the beauty of the wood.    [cool]
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 16, 2019, 10:06:10 PM
Agreed!  I did this one out of Red Oak (wanted it strong) and it's placed in the center of the Blue Stained Pine which moved on me...hoping this will hold it now but if it doesn't that's ok since it was a learning experience and this is for the cabin anyway.

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/img_1616-800x600.268/full)
Never had a use for this Craftsman 1/4" router until now.  It was left behind by someone long ago and he didn't want it back so I kept it thinking one day maybe I'd use it (I have more powerful plunge router with 1/2" chuck that I use often).

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/img_1615-800x600.267/full)
Took a fair amount of hand work to get it right.

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/img_1619-800x437.269/full)
So far so good!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Rys on January 17, 2019, 02:51:45 PM
Nice! 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: GaryT on January 17, 2019, 03:51:19 PM
"bowtie" also known as a "dutchman".  Have no clue why....finger in the dike kind of thing?
Gary
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 17, 2019, 08:23:02 PM
called butterflies too...but 'bow-tie' I think because they look like that...maybe?  ???
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 21, 2019, 10:26:00 PM
(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/january-2019.270/full)
Had a nice weekend at the cabin.  Didn't do much but fall a couple trees to start the thinning I need to do and burned some slash.  Other than that we stayed warm and enjoyed ourselves :)

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/coffee-table.271/full)
Back home and the legs for the coffee table arrived.  They are seriously stout and I'm very happy with them!  Logrite makes great tools and now they also make great table and bench legs under 'Rite Leg' company.

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/epoxy-resin.272/full)
Charcoal added to the epoxy to make it dark.  It will dry and be covered with another coating after being scraped off with a sharp chisel.  In the end I should have some dark holes and cracks before staining and pouring on the Parks Superglaze
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Rys on January 22, 2019, 05:19:26 PM
Those legs look seriously stout! Very nice.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 23, 2019, 09:44:25 AM
Well this has been interesting.  The darn wood is still moving.  Just when I thought I was almost ready to start staining and put on the glaze the wood moved again and lifted in one corner.  Now I'm looking at planing off the top and bottom and bolting it down to see if that will stop it.

Wood  d* d* d* ??? ??? ???
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 23, 2019, 06:07:04 PM
OK so I decided to give it one more go.  I planed off the top and bottom of the table using my sawmill (one big saw :D )
(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/milled-off-the-top-and-bottom.273/full)

You can clearly see what happened here.  It may be due to the way the grains were oriented or just too much moisture and later heat ???

Either way, it's flat now and I have the table legs on and things are pretty good albeit needed some shimming to keep things level.  If it doesn't work I'll make an outside bench out of it and make a new top this spring!

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/small-end-table.274/full)
While I had the mill out I decided to make these legs level the easy way.  I need to make more of these and do a MUCH better job of placing the legs but it was fun and looks cool so I'm ok with it -- just don't tip it over with a drink on it! lol

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/making-black-epoxy.275/full)
Next up was to make some shiny black epoxy.  I came up with this after learning people added charcoal to epoxy...well I had brickettes handy so why not right? 

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/nice-and-black.276/full)
Ready to fill the holes and cracks

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/holes-filled.277/full)
I'll sand off the excess with some 80 grit paper and then maybe smooth things a little (or not -- doesn't really matter).  Then the table gets stained (again) and with luck the wood gods will be kind and I'll put the super glaze on it in a few days.

Wish me luck!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 24, 2019, 02:36:39 PM
(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/stained.278/full)
Getting there and pretty flat (as well as can be expected I think) and level at this point (after some shimming).
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 30, 2019, 09:37:33 AM
Parks Superglaze poured on and curing
(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/img_1657-800x600.279/full)
This is after 12hrs or so.  It needs 72 to cure fully.

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/img_1660-800x600.280/full)
48+ hrs of curing and just one more day to go and then we can take to the cabin.  I placed the 'coin top' table beside it.  This was the 2nd of two chopping block round tables I made for the cabin and I just never finished this one until my recent leveling of the legs on the mill (above).

I have much to learn on making legs sit at the right place and able and will experiment more when I have time.

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/img_1665-800x529.281/full)
A little better look at the legs and the top (you can see some of the glaze drips)

We are working on some pine shelves at the moment but two of them should be interesting as they are corner shelves for above and below the TV which is not in the middle of the corner.  Once done they will provide a location for the modem, router and DVD player :)

But for now, we have a coffee table and end tables and that is a BIG step forward!  I need to finish the bedside table still, which poses some challenges too and should be fun and I need to mill some dead pines for the bar top and perhaps stools.

Fun stuff :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Rys on February 01, 2019, 07:23:44 PM
I know there's a long standing tradition of doing a jig when a builder gets their decking on.
I believe your table would hold up to that!    ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 02, 2019, 02:41:14 PM
Thanks.  It certainly is worth a jig!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 14, 2019, 02:32:17 PM
Guess I need to post some pics :D  Got some windows trimmed and the table up etc and plowed the driveway etc etc...was a great weekend but alas, cut short because of Snowmageddon in WA State.  Decided to head back early to shovel snow at home.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Adam Roby on February 14, 2019, 09:26:10 PM
That table came out really beautiful.  Just showed my wife and now she wants one too...   
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 18, 2019, 08:11:55 AM
Thanks Adam :) and have fun!  We did!

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/img_1695-800x600.282/full)
When we arrived at the cabin it was cold and there was another 4 inches of snow on the ground (or so) since I'd been there the morning before.

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/img_1710-600x800.283/full)
The tractor just looked cold!

We 'moved in' for the weekend and got the stove going to warm the place but I'd left the backup heat on Thursday morning when I left (was up for the night Wed for work) so it was about 54F inside the cabin and easy to get it warmed back up.

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/img_1724-800x600.285/full)
Got started on the windows the next day as I'd brought up trim and casing boards prepped and ready to go.  This window I'd left the trim behind with the intent to measure it and then cut and place but decided on a different method and simply cut the ends off and nailed on afterwards.  What am I talking about?  This...

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/img_1723-800x600.284/full)
My original idea was to router out the boards and lay them in this way kinda like making a log cabin but found in the end cutting them at 45 degrees and placing them separately (the end pieces) worked much faster and tighter.  I'll do that moving forward.

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/img_1725-800x600.286/full)
I did, however, forget ONE piece!  d*

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/img_1737-600x800.287/full)
Finished the 4 foot window too since it had not been trimmed out and place the shelf above the TV.  It's a live edge shelf with bark still on it cut to fit the corner roughly the same way the TV fits the corner.  It's for the DVD player and a bigger one will go below it for the Router and Modem.  You can also see the new coffee table which worked out nicely :)  I use the shelf below a lot but my wife said "lay your pistol on the table and put two drinks on it for a picture"...she's into the image LOL but then it's not far from what was going on at the time anyway, the pistol was set below on the shelf and her drink was on the coin top as she likes to sit in front of the wood stove while I'm on the couch lounging after a long day's work :D

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/img_1739-800x757.288/full)
The coin top table finally made it's way to the cabin! :D

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/img_1751-800x600.289/full)
After a couple hours plowing snow, as we'd gotten a few more inches of the stuff, I took a stroll about and saw the clouds were leaving and the sky was clearing.  Was going to be a cold night for certain but we'd be warm :D

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/img_1780-800x600.290/full)
The next morning was promising with the sun coming out early and causing beautiful imagery but we had to leave early as we'd seen 'Snowmageddon 2019' had hit full force and high winds had caused bad drifts and many road closures.  TO be sure we'd make it home (so we could shovel snow) we headed out as soon as we were ready.

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/img_1784-800x600.291/full)
The road out is always a bit of a question mark, even with ice chains it causes a little pucker factor in the winter...you just don't know when it's THAT steep.

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/img_1794-800x600.292/full)
But our big F350 is heavy and with those chains it's a pretty safe bet it won't move around much ;)

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/img_1797-800x600.293/full)
But that road!  ;D

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/img_1805-800x600.294/full)
We just love where our cabin is and can't wait to get back and get more done.

Cheers
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Toyotaboy on March 17, 2019, 07:55:52 PM
The table looks awesome!  I love the legs too. The window trim is very cool.

Your place looks awesome with the snow cover.

We got stuck at our place 3 weeks ago. Blizzard with 18 inches of snow. 4 pick ups trucks stuck. Lucky the neighbor came by with his little

Ford tractor and pulled us out. Driving home in a blizzard was stupid. We should have stayed an extra day.

Toyotaboy
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 20, 2019, 07:40:59 AM
Thanks :)  Finished a second table made from the same slab of wood but this one was for the home.

Haven't been back up to the cabin in part due to the late winter weather we've had and other commitments (it takes more time and energy to go to the cabin in the winter vs other times of year so when I am busy I tend to go up less).

Glad you got out of the snow safely!  I keep snowshoes in my rig just in case that kind of thing occurs and I have to hike in to get the tractor!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Toyotaboy on March 20, 2019, 09:07:54 AM
That is one thing I do not own, snowshoes.  d*

But after this year, I will have a pair.

It takes about a day and a half to get my place really warmed up with the wood burner.

Toyotaboy

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Nate R on March 20, 2019, 12:21:02 PM
Quote from: Toyotaboy on March 20, 2019, 09:07:54 AM
That is one thing I do not own, snowshoes.  d*

But after this year, I will have a pair.

It takes about a day and a half to get my place really warmed up with the wood burner.

Toyotaboy

I bought a pair this year, and am glad I did!

Is your floor insulated? Or the crawlspace walls? Curious about the heating time vs insulation/thermal mass.
Hoping to start my 20x30 Northern WI build soon.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on March 20, 2019, 02:33:32 PM
Regarding warm-up time: with the floor insulated (R25) as well as walls (R19) and ceiling (~R50) we can raise the interior temperature 20 degrees an hour average using a small wood stove (VC Aspen) and a wall mount direct vent propane heater. The propane heater is rated at 18000 BTU but with the altitude correction is will have a maximum around 14000 BTU. The 8800-foot altitude will also reduce the output of the Aspen wood stove from its max of 18K to around 14K as well.  The ceramic tile floor is warmed nicely after 24 hours; becomes almost barefoot friendly.

If there is a lot more thermal mass than average on the inside of the insulation the warm-up time will be extended. Air leaks, drafts, will also make it slow to become comfortable.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Toyotaboy on March 20, 2019, 04:15:36 PM
Nathan,

The 4 ft crawl space in not insulated but the overhead in the crawl space is. 14 inch I beams with insulation keeps the floor warm after it's warmed up. The rest of the place is 2x6 construction with insulation and drywall. All UDC to code.

We were so air tight that we had oder problems with the composter toilet when using the wood burner. I ended up making a nice floor
vent directly under the front of the wood burner to the crawl space. This alleviated the draw from the bathroom. But I have to remember to close it when we leave.

What also helps in the ceiling fan to push the warm air down from the loft.. This has been a tremendous help in circulating the air and helps with warming the whole place up. 

Sorry to jack the thread Oljarhead.

Toyotaboy
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Nate R on March 21, 2019, 12:32:37 PM
Thanks for the feedback Don and Toyota! Interesting to hear.

I'm doing an insulated slab on grade, and am hoping to use that thermal mass for comfort in the warmer summer days (cool nights, usually), but know I'll be paying a price in winter warm up time. (Weekend/Recreational use). So interesting to hear you're achieving 20 deg/hr or so, Don.

I'm getting the equipment together to datalog the thermal performance of my structure, mostly for my own curiosity. I intend to record inside and outside temperature and humidity, as well as the slab temperature and soil temperature around 4" depth. Probably at 1 hr increments, so I can see how cold/warm things get when unoccupied and when occupied, etc.
I may be able to integrate my solar datalogging into that too to roughly see how much impact sun has, etc.

<highjack over/>
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 22, 2019, 07:36:03 PM
No problem on the highjack :D

I use a cold air intake on my stove that comes from the outside so it drafts that way and doesn't cause issues.  The floor is R21 and the walls are R19 with an R21 roof and it takes about the same amount of time as Don's.  I can warm it above freezing from 18F interior in about an hour or so and after 6 hours or so it will be about 65-70F depending on the inside temps.  I use an 18k BTU propane heater to augment the stove (same stove as Don's) and at 3200 feet have a little more heating power than Don does.

I do find, however, that it takes a full 24hrs or so to heat every surface, cupboard etc and that's just how things work but I do that without the propane heater.  I only use it until the cabin hits 60F then I shut it off and only use wood.

Once it's warmed up it's very easy to maintain the warmth with the little stove.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: KodiakRanch13 on April 01, 2019, 07:12:51 PM
Appreciate all the good posts Gents.  Newbie here, I purchased some property in Aeneas Valley a few years ago and hope to get started on a small build this Summer, 12x16 are my first thoughts as I want to avoid permitting etc.  Little research and general word of mouth has been 200SF and less wont require a permit for my shed, if I'm wrong let me know!  Thanks again for all your info and maybe I'll run into yall one of these days.

-Kodiak (from Eastern Washington)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 02, 2019, 07:19:52 AM
Welcome to the neighborhood ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 27, 2019, 08:56:35 AM
Did I ask this before?  I'm looking for ways to connect a D Log wall to a standard frame wall.
(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/cabin_withaddition.295/full)
The idea is to make the addition with D Logs.  It will be 12 feet deep to the back of the cabin and come even with the current deck roof.

My though was to create a recess into the 2x6 wall for the stacked logs to be secured to but other than that I'm just not sure.

Thoughts?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 27, 2019, 08:41:05 PM
(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/cabin_withlogs.296/full)
My thought is that I can cut out the 8" needed for the log wall to be recessed into the framed wall and then frame the wall with 2x6's on either side and one 2x8 across them (so like a 6x8" pocket inside the wall) then cut the D logs square at that end and slide them into the wall.  I can then chink them at the corner to ensure a good seal but leave them free floating inside the wall to allow for shrinkage that likely will occur.

In essence I'd build the back wall (12' deep) then the outside wall and the front wall (to the porch) and a log wall back to the main cabin (beside the porch) giving basically 3 walls with the corner walls of the cabin being the inside.  This addition would be L shaped around the corner of the cabin and made with 8" D logs.  The roof would be a 3.3x12 pitch to match the front porch but rise to 3.3x12 pitch (or higher) on the back side (in order to match the pitch and keep it reasonably strong).  I'll just run the rafters on the front back to the hip which will be set back from the corner to allow the 3.3x12 pitch of the porch to continue across the front.

The front will remain at 10 from the cabin like the porch but the side being 12' out will need a stronger roof.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 17, 2019, 03:16:02 PM
While I am working on getting logs ready to mill etc for the addition I'm working on other parts of the cabin.  In this case a door!

My bathroom hasn't had a door and the opening is just 25" so I'm making a 24" door to fit the opening with pine I've milled up myself.  In this case the frame is made of 1" pine boards glued up to give me a thicker frame.  Some appear to this this is stronger than making the styles and rails with 2" stock but all I had was 1" rough cut so that's what I'm using.  Actual dimension will be 1 1/2" thick due to planing.

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/moritse.297/full)
After gluing up the styles and rails I had to set about making the mortise and tenons for the frame.  I used a router with 3/4" bit and a chisel.

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/tenon.298/full)
Tenons were done with a dado on the tablesaw and a jigsaw

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/door-frame.299/full)
I made a down and dirty Jig so I could use the router and be accurate.  The result is a fairly tight fit of all rails but I have to do the 2nd style still.

Then I'll cut T&G grooves in the styles and slot T&G pine boards for the panels.  Center board will have two tongues so the outer two will have tongues in the styles and grooves to match the middle board.

The idea is to have it look like the cabin walls more or less :D  and to be home made.

I plan to pin the tenons with oak dowels after gluing it all up for added strength and the hinges will be face mounted (ala barn door style) and face mounted on the wall.  The door will swing out and have a slide lock.

Heck, it might even be civilized soon at the cabin ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 21, 2020, 07:44:17 PM
Been a while!  I finished that door so better post a pic for y'all...and then fought a rat for a while (or more than one) but was there last night and all is well and I'm working on some new projects for the cabin still :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on January 21, 2020, 09:18:50 PM
Rats can be formidable foes.  They can be clever. I had one a couple of years ago that I caught in the act of entering under an eve/hole.  It seemed to look at me as if I was the intruder and didn't back off while each stood our ground.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: pmichelsen on January 22, 2020, 11:54:37 AM
The mice have been a real problem at our place, they've built nests in most of our clothes and we find droppings everywhere. It's always something. 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: greg49 on January 22, 2020, 12:49:28 PM
I build my own mousetraps, simple, cheap, and effective. The best part, though, is that I have caught up to a dozen mice overnight, without any attention until it's time to dump the dead mice in the morning. I am sure this contraption could be sized-up to work for rats, but I haven't done that.

The first thing I need is a 5-gallon plastic bucket half full of water. This will be the trap, and this is the part that probably needs to be larger for rats. Now I just need to convince the mice to jump in. Fortunately that is much easier to do than it sounds.

I use a short piece of 2X4 or 1X4 about 3 feet long, a clothes hanger, a couple of small fencing staples, a can with a tight fitting plastic lid that peanuts or lemonade mix or something came in, some duct tape, and some peanut butter. 

Then I will put something together that looks kind of like a paint-roller with the can as the roller, the 2X4 as the handle, and the coat hanger and staples to hook them together. I use the duct tape to make sure the plastic lid stays on the can. Then I smear peanut butter on the 2X4 to make a nice, wide scent trail all the way to the end of the board. After I have smeared most of the upper surface of the board with a very thin layer of peanut butter, I put a heavy coat of peanut butter on the can that acts as a roller. I usually use the old-fashioned kind of peanut buttter that separates and has to be stirred, and smear it as heavily as I can onto the roller.

Then I just set this up, one end of the 2X4 on the floor and the other leaning on the top of the bucket like a ramp, in the area the mice are most active in. As can be seen from the ingredient list, there is nothing in this contraption that will harm pets, but a curious pet could spill the container of drowned mice and make a big mess, so I always make sure my dog can't get at the trap.
Happy hunting.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 22, 2020, 01:57:54 PM
Them rats!  d* d* d* :o ???  I've fought them a lot but have them stymied for now and will work on some other things for them this spring summer.  Here are some pics of the door:

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/door1.306/full)

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/door.305/full) 

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/door2.307/full)

(http://www.dartplayer.net/index.php?xengallery/door3.308/full)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: greg49 on January 22, 2020, 02:17:09 PM
That is a very nice looking door, nice and solid too.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 22, 2020, 08:14:10 PM
Quote from: greg49 on January 22, 2020, 02:17:09 PM
That is a very nice looking door, nice and solid too.

Thanks :D  and made with a saw that didn't cut straight lol  d*

Got a new table saw now :D  Making a table for sister before getting back to furniture for cabin but have to slow down a bit.

I have plans to put a D log addition on the cabin too.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: greg49 on January 23, 2020, 12:21:00 PM
Yeah, a man needs new tools every once in a while.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 24, 2020, 08:19:47 AM
Amen to that! and because I have the best wife ever I also just bought a Woodriver No.7 hand plane! :D  WhooHoo!

The door was something I always wanted to do.  That is, make a door entirely without any hardware to hold it together; just glue, mortise and tenon and nothing else (except maybe the dowel pins).  Now I need to make the bars and some wainscotting and of course, finish all the other stuff inside and out so I can finally start on the addition!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 30, 2020, 02:06:39 PM
Going to order some square hole drill bits too :)  Can't wait to see how well I can make mortises with them.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 14, 2020, 07:49:03 AM
Not much cabin work going on and some life/work changes have us using it again for long weekends and a get-away place so we're there less often :(  But I have plans to get the sawmill up there soon and to start milling paneling (for other projects as well) and D logs for an addition and a 2nd cabin :)

Hope everyone is fairing well in this crazy time
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 03, 2020, 11:13:26 AM
So I thought I would write down my cabin trip update for the record since it's been a while!  No pics to share at the moment but perhaps some later.

I Arrived at the cabin about 2:30 and it was 100F, which I have not seen in several years, maybe even 10 or 11.  I had not mowed other than the driveway and I was pretty worried about the tall grass and recent fires.  1st task was to get the mower off the tractor and then down to Eric Juniors (that's what I refer to him as since he's younger than both me and my other neighbor named Eric) and hook up the box blade he fixed for me.  He wasn't home but I got the blade installed and started a 3 plus hour blading session.  During this period I managed to get the entire driveway and road to the top of the hill cut to dirt other than a few sections which I could do more on.  At about 6pm I took a break and rinsed the dust off my arms and face and poured a stiff drink (tall) to cool off with (still had plenty of ice in the cooler).  It was nice to kick back on the deck and listen to the wind in the trees.  Its breezy but at these Temps that's not necessarily a good thing.  While it helps cool you down it can be dangerous if a fire kicks up.  Hence all my tractor work.

It was warm and I wasn't in a hurry so I enjoyed the cold drink and light breeze and watch the thermometer and my watch that I'd set on the deck to get a reading off (it's one of those Casio's with the barometer etc on).  After a few minutes my watch finally gave a temp of 91.8F which I suspect is about right.  Funny, it feels a little cool compared to when I arrived.....it may have been over 100 as it was 108F in OMAK...

I got myself back on the tractor and got back to working in the driveway and fire brake roads I make to help protect the place and spent more time around the cabin with some weed eating and tractor work.  I gave up around 9pm, had a shower and a couple cold drinks and hit the sack in the 80F cabin with the windows open and hopeful a cool evening breeze would cool the place down.

By morning it was 74F inside the cabin and while that's much better I would have liked 64!  I had coffee and got back on the tractor shorlty after 8am (I'd slept in since I was up reading a new book later into the evening).

Since it was cooler and morning I decided a little mowing wouldn't hurt and got right to it.  I mowed a section by the fire brake/road but thought better of it after a short while and took the mower off.  I was worried about hitting a rock and starting a fire!

Next I got the old disk's hooked up and headed back along the 'road' to disk up as much as I could.  I spent a few hours at it and then moved the mill and disk's down the cabin where I had some raw dirt to set them on with a decent amount of space for fire protection around them.  I knew from past fires that the firefighters will try to protect/save anything where the home owner tries to provide a 'defensible' space.  Finally, I got the box blade back on the tractor and hit the road again to widen it to about 20 feet in most places.  It's not perfect but it will provide some help I hope! 

Left the place with the gate open (in case the firefighters have to get in there) and headed home.  We moved back to the Tri-Cities so I am once again 4.5hrs away but that's ok.

Anyway, no major fires in the area yet and we can hope they don't come but this is life with a cabin in these woods!

Cheers
Erik
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on August 03, 2020, 08:44:36 PM
Hi Erik.   No fires in our neck of the woods either and for the past week - 10 days we have been enjoying some rain. Enough to be able to burn some slash legally but not enough to require road repairs on hills. The forest was dry enough unti recently that it was locked up. That made for some real quiet. Hardly any aircraft traffic either because on reduced airline travel. Usually planes are going over leaving contrails at 30,000+ feet but hardly at all now.

55F  or so overnight is nice. Days maybe high 70's. Nice too. 

Lots of elk (maybe some deer but there is a good amount of fresh elk droppings) passing through. I got a new game camera this week so we'll hopefully see what animals have beed making all the tracks we see.

Take care. Cheers.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Gary O on August 04, 2020, 09:29:18 AM
Sounds like a very good trip

No fires to speak of here, either

But......no rain....for months

Temps in the 80s and cooling to the 40s....and into the 30s

Storms in the forecasts.....which means lightening

Keep a fire

Out....keep a fire out
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 05, 2020, 03:26:28 PM
Nice to hear from you both!  and glad there are no fires!

I sure hope to get back there soon but it may not be until Labor Day at the rate I'm going...but darnit!  This fall I better get more cabin time or I'm going to retire! ha!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 05, 2020, 03:29:06 PM
Oh and the hot spell has calmed down a tad now :D

Quote
This Afternoon Sunny, with a high near 90. South wind 7 to 10 mph.
Tonight Mostly clear, with a low around 58. South wind 5 to 9 mph becoming calm in the evening.
Thursday A 30 percent chance of showers after 11am. Partly sunny, with a high near 80. Light and variable wind becoming south 11 to 16 mph in the morning. Winds could gust as high as 25 mph.
Thursday Night Mostly cloudy during the early evening, then gradual clearing, with a low around 47. Southwest wind 6 to 14 mph becoming northwest in the evening. Winds could gust as high as 23 mph.
Friday Sunny, with a high near 76. Light and variable wind becoming northwest around 5 mph in the afternoon.
Friday Night Partly cloudy, with a low around 49.
Saturday Sunny, with a high near 79.
Saturday Night
Mostly clear, with a low around 49.
Sunday Sunny, with a high near 82.
Sunday Night Mostly clear, with a low around 52.
Monday Sunny, with a high near 84.
Monday Night Mostly clear, with a low around 54.
Tuesday Mostly sunny, with a high near 84.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on August 05, 2020, 06:02:07 PM
We started thinking about retirement in mid-March when covid-19 caused the public schools to close. Then when people we know in the education and childcare department told us what we could likely expect in new regulations that confirmed for us that retirement was a good idea.

I don't think this virus is going away easily or quickly and we will all be having a new normal for some time.



Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 10, 2020, 04:09:15 PM
Spanish Flu is still around :) aint likely this one will kick it any sooner.

So I guess in the end we all have to decide what we're willing to give up for the rest of our lives ;)  After all, there still is not a complete Flu vaccine....lest folks not realize, it's a 1 in 3 vax that might work if you get the right flu an all...but won't if ya don't....

Guess they could do the same for this coronavirus and call it a vax so we can get back to it ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on November 14, 2020, 12:53:36 PM
Ok, so here's a voice from the past! 

Hello all (figured this is just the place to show up after such a long hiatus - good as any, I guess)

I too, was pretty much forced to retire because of this thing that is commonly called corona virus... altho I've heard it called many other things (no, real scientific names, not the other ones  c* )

I have a story to tell, but will save that for my own post.

Java
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 05, 2021, 06:38:31 PM
Quote from: JavaMan on November 14, 2020, 12:53:36 PM
Ok, so here's a voice from the past! 

Hello all (figured this is just the place to show up after such a long hiatus - good as any, I guess)

I too, was pretty much forced to retire because of this thing that is commonly called corona virus... altho I've heard it called many other things (no, real scientific names, not the other ones  c* )

I have a story to tell, but will save that for my own post.

Java

So where's the post?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: JavaMan on January 05, 2021, 07:25:05 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on January 05, 2021, 06:38:31 PM
So where's the post?
https://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=15313.0
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 06, 2021, 09:05:11 AM
Rogo!

Well after some 6 years or so of not having a jeep I finally couldn't take it anymore and bought one! :D  Woot!  [cool] :) ;D

Was looking for a Ruby (Wrangler Rubicon) and wasn't that interested in new ($$$) so kept my eyes open for something not new but not too abused....found a 2013 Rubicon and went and checked it out.  Had 22k miles on it (yes!) and was basically new.  Had some curious badges and things about it and the salesman thought it was aftermarket work....the wife and I both loved it and brought it home (after a little, but not much, price haggling)....

Here's an article on this particular model:  https://www.fourwheeler.com/vehicle-reviews/129-1302-2013-jeep-wrangler-rubicon/

In truth I kept looking at the hood and thinking something was off as it wasn't flat...did some research (after bringing home) and discovered it was a limited addition!  It was ALL STOCK (except the winch which I am guessing a dealer installed or a pro shop as it's darn excellent install work).  We also paid about $4500 under what it's worth as the dealer had no idea what they were selling and the 10th Anniversary addition sell for a lot more than a box stock standard Ruby does!

Ya, we're excited and I'll post some pics soon! :)

We're off to the cabin for the weekend in it and can't wait to kick in the lockers and see how it does in the snow :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 06, 2021, 09:36:14 AM
https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?topic=113489.0
Can't link the pics from FF anymore so here's a link to my post there with pics of the Jeep :D

Too bad all the old servers are gone :(  None of my pics are up anymore and I hadn't thought of that.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: ChugiakTinkerer on February 15, 2021, 11:17:22 PM
You had a post demonstrating your passive solar collector on here a while back, but I can't seem to find it.  Do you recall what year that was?

Or was that at FF?

Anyhoo, I'm thinking about using one to keep a generator shed warm in the dead of winter.  As I recall yours worked great.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 26, 2021, 08:13:05 AM
Mine worked too well! lol  d*  I made a YouTube on it...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rAzUMeK9bKE

My advise is to use the best high temp insulation you can!  Mine just wasn't good enough and it vaporized (I tried a baffle to stop cold air coming back in at night -- which wasn't a major issue) and the fan quit....so without the fan to force the baffle open it just got so hot it vaporized the insulation!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: ChugiakTinkerer on March 16, 2021, 08:38:34 AM
Most excellent, thank you!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 30, 2021, 04:53:14 PM
You bet!

I just posted a look back video on my sawmilling adventure for those interested ;)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TTmq8QUrgEI
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 15, 2021, 11:48:19 AM
Did another video, a short one, on milling
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6lXTOhNTrhs
and ordered a drone to get some cool shots of the cabin build, milling and other things.

Should be fun!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 08, 2021, 07:39:07 AM
Gotta get back to the cabin soon!   I've been doing some Jeeping and camping lately (and ghost town hunting) but need to get back to milling.

I've decided to move to 6" D Logs for the addition like the extra cabin I plan to build after my ghost town hunt in Montana as many of those old log cabins were 6" logs and some were hand hewn down to 4"!  Amazing.

Anyway, for the curious, here is one of the vids I did on the ghost town trip and there are a couple more on my YT page.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6MuPeu-w3lQ
Soon I will be back at the cabin milling more logs!  I promise!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on June 08, 2021, 09:15:02 AM
 [cool]
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 09, 2021, 07:29:07 AM
Thanks :D  We had a GRAND Time!  I shared 3 vids from that trip.

Now, to get back to the cabin!  I plan to get at least one night up there this weekend to check on things and run the sawmill a bit.  I really need to get back to it!

And I need to get working in my shop too!  Finally, for the first time in my life I have a big woodshop but work has been too much lately (took 61 calls in about 9 hours day before yesterday) to leave me much to get out into the shop with....but I'm starting to get the itch big time and need to get back to projects like making T&G paneling!

So this cabin trip I will likely grab a truckload of pine to start working :D  Woot!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 10, 2021, 11:42:05 AM
Meanwhile I sent this in to the contest!

https://project.woodmizer.com/contest/Home/ProjectDetails2021?id=2341
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: jsahara24 on June 10, 2021, 12:01:43 PM
Quote from: OlJarhead on June 10, 2021, 11:42:05 AM
Meanwhile I sent this in to the contest!

https://project.woodmizer.com/contest/Home/ProjectDetails2021?id=2341

Very nice!  I voted for you..
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 14, 2021, 07:14:24 AM
Thanks!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 14, 2021, 11:33:51 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WOmMzFoIQVU
I am trying to get enough D-Logs to make an addition on the original cabin and a 2nd 14x14 cabin....got to mill a LOT more logs than this but you have to start somewhere, right?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 07, 2021, 05:41:50 PM
Going to be delayed on the cabin milling  :( ??? someone called with 80 logs for me to mill so.... :o 8) Gotta drag the mill over there and earn a few $$$'s :D

But then, darn it, I'm back to milling!

Meanwhile, I've been out Jeeping instead :D  [cool] d*
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 21, 2021, 09:21:00 AM
At least I did get up to the cabin, serviced the tractor, cut in some fire breaks (and ate a lot of dust through my approved face covering lol  d* ??? ), topped off the batteries with distilled water (they were very low but not below the plates thank god!), did clean up, hauled out a load of pine and dragged the mill home :D

I also got a new toy (hint, I promised I would on my YT channel) and did a little update for those interested or just bored LOL
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FJce3KHcO_w
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 26, 2021, 09:31:38 AM
Planning another cabin trip this month but first have to do some milling, then maybe get back to the cabin just to do some work around the place.  Meanwhile I've been doing this too! :D

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0uWTgb2bPT0
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 29, 2021, 11:37:25 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YCwWP2frW1s
Yeehaw! :D

Now I need to get back to the cabin
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 02, 2021, 02:25:43 PM
Next cabin trip this coming weekend!  No plans!  Just go, check the place out, hang out and enjoy it and who knows?  Maybe do some cleanup or just walk around and enjoy the place...no idea really :D

Meanwhile for those of you who want or have a sawmill for your cabin build, here is a mod you really want to do!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bpu9WmZy_dc
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 09, 2021, 11:19:15 AM
Didn't make it to the cabin :(  But I did work on some wainscoting for the house!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iRVlhyH2TLE





Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 17, 2021, 07:52:33 AM
Fires are within 10 miles of our cabin now and still heading in that direction.  I am hoping the weather turns and we get more rain as that should help slow them down!

Waukonda has been hit pretty hard it appears and there are fires elsewhere but so far, this year, despite the heatwave, hasn't been as bad as it could have been!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on August 17, 2021, 03:42:33 PM
I do hope that works out okay for you. 10 miles in these dry conditions can get eaten up too fast if the winds pick up. So far this year ee've had a good fire year and just lately even got some rain. All the best to you.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 17, 2021, 04:34:21 PM
Thanks MD!  I've seen fires travel 60 miles in a couple hours so you are 100% right!  Scary to be just ten miles away though I've seen much closer (watched the trees crown across the valley from me not much over 1/2 a mile away back in 2015.

Sure hoping this one stays north of the highway ..... guess I better check Inciweb!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: jsahara24 on August 20, 2021, 08:09:33 AM
Having to deal with fires every year must be draining for everyone out west, being on the east coast it is hard for me to really understand as I can barely light up a fire in my firepit most nights....

Hoping all goes well and the rains arrive!  Good luck!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 23, 2021, 10:58:08 AM
Thanks bud,

In truth, pine forest burn about every 5 to 7 years naturally.  The problem, as I see it, is when man goes out and starts fires!  Sheesh!  In Cali I saw that there was arson involved in their big fires!  And back when Australia was burning?  Yup, arson (2500+ fires lit by arsonists back then) and last year in the Okanogan?  You guessed it, arson.

It's bad enough when it's dry and the lightening strikes but then some wack jobs decide to help nature along via 'fire bombs'......I'd string em up!

Anyway, I digress!  We've had a little rain so I am hopeful....and inciweb seems to indicate the fires are pushing west right now.  If they went south I'd be in trouble.

Meanwhile, I made a run to Kaloutus to do a little milling.... d*
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nvFy-wcvhUg

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 03, 2021, 11:52:54 AM
Still trying to get to the cabin but I finished the wainscotting at our house!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vJIeEDrmgwM
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 28, 2021, 09:33:40 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ucqtpiUWIsU
The rematch!

I'm heading to the cabin this weekend to check on things but since I had to fight off Covid for a couple weeks (actually, pneumonia that Covid caused) I haven't had a lot of energy to do much!  I did this logzilla just before testing pos for covid and going into a two week battle.

Good now though!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 05, 2021, 05:02:23 PM
Oh man, what a fantastic weekend at the cabin!  I don't have a pic posting place (I don't use Insta or FB -- and MEWE doesn't seem to let me share)....but I think I will do a vid of our trip to share.

I need a new place to host pics though! 

Anyway, arrived on Friday and got the woodstove going to warm up the place....that little Vermont Castings that I paid $1k for about 12 years ago (and is about $2500 now) continues to work awesome :D  Once cabin was warm and we'd had some evening drinks we hit the hay and were up early Saturday. 

On Saturday I got the battery maintenance done -- 6+ years running now!  Thanks MD!  Still running about 25vdc overnight when we are not there with a light load but it's been that way for ages.  My extra panels do a great job of getting them back up to 100% in no time as well and I rarely need the genny.  Anyway, got the batts topped off, cleaned up and covered again.  Then split a half a cord or more of wood and stacked it up and cleaned up the place nicely.

Had a great meal and relaxing evening (wife slept most of it -- that mountain air can do that) and Sunday were greeted with 10 nice fat Turkey's cruising around the solar panels :D  Nice to see them!

Got some wood covered and cleaned up more on Sunday before rolling out and wishing we stayed longer!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on October 05, 2021, 06:36:18 PM
Quote
QuoteI need a new place to host pics though!
I use imgbb.com now


Quotethat little Vermont Castings that I paid $1k for about 12 years ago (and is about $2500 now) continues to work awesome
We still love ours too. I never realized they have gone up that much. Wow!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Redoverfarm on October 05, 2021, 07:17:14 PM
Quote from: MountainDon on October 05, 2021, 06:36:18 PM

I use imgbb.com now

Don I thought you used Imgur.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on October 05, 2021, 07:55:26 PM
I have used it.  Imgur was recently bought out by a media company that has a history of buying ailing brands. Some of their acquisitions have not fared well. I jumped ship.  Maybe an unnecessary change.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 06, 2021, 04:37:41 PM
testing

(https://i.ibb.co/KW3zgDc/20200412-104438.jpg) (https://ibb.co/rH1fh3K)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on October 06, 2021, 08:47:13 PM
:)  You still have trees, always a good sign in a western forest.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 07, 2021, 07:15:06 AM
LOL ahhhh.....it's always a worry because arid pine forest naturally burn every 5 to 7 years but I do a lot to protect our place like you do and then hope for the best!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on October 07, 2021, 07:58:10 AM
The FS has another contractor thinning a thousand acres just south of us. This is wonderful to see as the area is horribly overgrown.

(https://i.ibb.co/09Y1fzz/20211003-075822.jpg)

Early morning a week ago. They had to widen an old dirt track that was in really bad shape. Bad enough that the road had been scheduled to be decommissioned several years ago. The road is good too as it will provide another route in another direction to escape in case of fire.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 11, 2021, 01:47:54 PM
Cool and it looks clean!  Out here they did a job and left a lot of slash which caused a beetle problem!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Umv42KA1G2A

Meanwhile, I did this video to share our last cabin trip!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: cbc58 on October 31, 2021, 08:39:39 AM
Great video.  Thanks for posting this.   
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 03, 2021, 08:07:49 AM
Thanks!

I used to share a lot of pics and may try to share more moving forward now that I have a place I can do that but since I'm doing a lot of YT stuff for the sawmill I find it easier to justs do a vid of cabin stuff....just working on one now actually ;)

Cheers
Erik
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 09, 2021, 08:16:46 AM
Here's a new one...winterizing the cabin and a bit of discussion on the solar heater and what not ;)
Man I have a lot of work to do up there!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_xVNH7SSccU
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 18, 2021, 08:50:05 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xvqT_7sMefg
Here's a new one....my next will have a LOT more on the cabin interior than any previous video and I hope to have it out Monday....and I'll be at the cabin this weekend milling more lumber and doing more work on the porch!

I have some free time coming up so plan a LOT more cabin trips in the near future!  woot!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 26, 2021, 09:53:23 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NjUaNtAMom0

Well that was an adventure!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 28, 2021, 11:15:51 AM
Ok!  So after fixing the above (Ridge Cap) that I'd left improperly affixed I now know that I don't HAVE to go back up and fix anything now :D  However I am contemplating sending another young buck up to remove the entire ridge cap, place some hardware cloth and then fix it all back down again.  Just to prevent rodents from getting in there again.

I also added an insane 4 1/2 gallons of hydraulic fluid to the tractor and parked it up hill to prevent it from dripping (seems to have worked).  It appears to have a rear seal leak that is allowing the fluid to run to the front of the drive train and leak out of the skids....darn it!  So, next spring I need to haul it to the tractor shop and bite the bullet on getting it fixed (4wd also doesn't work)....that's going to hurt!

Last thing I did while there was to fix a piece of flashing under the roof above the stairs to the porch.  It's been a pain as the melting snow drops to the 2nd to last stair and causes it to become so covered in ice that it's nearly impassable!  So, having realized that not having a gutter isn't as much an issue as I thought, I just fixed some flashing under the drip line and set it on a steep enough angle to allow the water to run off to one side and not onto the step!  DOH!  Wish I'd done that years ago LOL

So, now it's time to make paneling that I can haul back up there on top of my jeep (hmmmm there's a picture).....at least that's the plan.

Wish me luck!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 09, 2022, 09:11:41 AM
Happy New Year folks!  May 2022 be a great one!

I haven't made it to the cabin for my usual New Years trip but do hope to get there soon.  I'm working on some wainscoting for the bathroom wall (outer) and hope to get the door trim done as well.  I'm also working on some paneling that I hope to get up in the porch on the next trip.

The neighbors reported over 2 feet of snow before the last dump so this is likely the most snow at the cabin in the last 12 years!  Needless to say I'm dying to get the jeep up there to test it out and to check on the roof on the porch etc to make sure all is holding up!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on January 09, 2022, 09:32:02 AM
Yes, a belated Happy New Year!  The FS is doing some serious thinning almost right to one corner of our property so that is making the wildfire danger look the best it has been in decades. There are been enough snow to make me not want to bother trying to drive to the cabin though. We can really use a lot more snow for the water but the long-range forecast does not look good for that.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: jsahara24 on January 10, 2022, 09:59:03 AM
Happy New Year!   It is currently snowing at my cabin, Lake Effect off Lake Ontario, currently 18" and still going strong.  Looks like snowmobile season can finally get started, about a month late unfortunately....
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 11, 2022, 05:32:19 PM
MD -- good news it sounds like, though I hate not getting to the cabin enough to keep an eye on it so I understand!

jsahara24 -- my snowmobile days are over ;) but not my Jeepin' days and I hope to get The Old Jarheads Jeep up there very soon!  It will be interesting to see how it does in three feet of snow! (unless some melts off and it isn't that deep.

My biggest worry is getting up to the cabin and sliding my way down -- I'll have to see if I can find chains for 35's!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 20, 2022, 05:47:31 PM
Going to test fit a set of chains for the jeep tonight and if all goes well I'll have them on hand for my up coming cabin trip.  I have 315x75R17's which measure 34" (they are almost the same size as 35x12.5's on my wifes jeep but hers are on 18" wheels and measure maybe 1/4" taller) and the club member with the chains he's willing to loan said they were made for his 34's -- here's hoping!

I really didn't want to buy chains now (I have 2 pairs for 16" wheels and 265's and a set for 32" tires as well as for my truck which has thinner 17's) due to the ridiculous cost and the fact that I just wouldn't use them much but hate to head to the cabin and it's icy roads without them!  The driveway leading up onto our property is VERY steep at about 21% at it's worst and it ices up a LOT so it's always a concern.  Here's a video of driving down from it in the jeep last year with the stock wheels and tires:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q6fvwwJWQCo  It's the first minute of an otherwise boring video LOL

I'll try to do a better one this winter if I get a chance now that I have better camera setups!

Anyway, I have some wainscoting to install as well as some paneling so I'm hoping to get up and check on the place and then do some work! 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 21, 2022, 05:30:57 PM
Ended up making a set of chains out of two others.  Had four ice chains for the old jeep and now have two for the new one.  Basically just cut the old chains and spliced in a section from one of the spares to make them longer.  They are a tad narrow but still wrap over all the tread and slightly down the side.  As long as I don' go crazy and they are tight I think it will be fine and I'll try them out this Sunday when I head up there.

Meanwhile, for those who've seen my sawmill, I milled up a nice black walnut this week and it was amazing!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Adam Roby on January 23, 2022, 10:36:29 PM
+1 liked.

That would make a beautiful electric guitar. 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 26, 2022, 09:54:32 AM
Absolutely!  Amazing stuff!

Just got back from the cabin!  Had a great trip and got some things done like the wainscoting, some insulating in the porch and paneling, adjusted solar panels and topped off the batteries :D

Had a bit of a scare with a sink that was dripping while I was gone and a the drain froze causing the sink to overflow!  But I got it cleaned up and thawed out so it drained.  Shut of the valves to stop any dripping (not sure how that happened actually since the water was off but got it stopped and the drains filled (again) with antifreeze.  It's always something!

Drove the jeep to the top of the hill in close to two feet of snow too and some deeper drifts :D  It was an awesome trip!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Adam Roby on January 26, 2022, 10:48:09 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on January 26, 2022, 09:54:32 AM
...It's always something!

I know what you mean.  Our cottage is rented in the high season, and every time I show up after a rental there is something to fix (I hate plumbing).  I was COVID border locked from my cabin in NY state for 2 years, finally made it down before the holidays only to see a huge hole in the roof (raccoons ate  away at the roof to gain entry because I had blocked off their usual ingress in the eves).  Now we are blocked again... so that is a mess I will have to deal with at some point... maybe with a match and just start from scratch.  I might put in a few large traps inside the cabin, hopefully deter they a little.. or some poison... not sure what's legal, need to check.  That or just sit there with a 22 for a weekend in a blind and take them out one by one.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 26, 2022, 05:39:01 PM
I have laid waste to a lot of wood rats for that reason lol but eventually (knock on wood) figured out how to keep them out! ha!

Sorry to hear about the cross border trouble.  My son, two sisters and my dad live North of the border and I can't go see them (survived Covid so don't need a vax) until Herr Trudeux stops being and Brandon too......well never mind but you get the idea.  Meanwhile, I'm planning my next trip up in two weeks :D  Actually a week and a half as my lady wants to make a trip up with me this winter :D  We'll take her Jeep this time and see how it does....or maybe we won't!  I have a winch and that beats no winch all day long :D

I'm working on a vid of driving up there and doing some snow wheeling then another on my time at the cabin which I hope to have out soon ;)  Got more done and super stoked to get back and do even more :D and relax in front of the fire again and just read!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 29, 2022, 10:44:56 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v8Ke_eGDAqo
WhooHoo!  Now THAT was a trip to the cabin!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Adam Roby on January 29, 2022, 11:55:52 AM
Great video, looks like a lot of fun.  I thought your wife would be with you on that trip, but I misunderstood that she'll be on the next one.
Definitely not a drive I would take with my old Toyota Corolla.... even in the summer!

You seem to be well equipped for YouTubing, with all the cameras.  Anytime I've tried to document a build or trip, I forget to take certain steps or angles and the quality is never quite up to snuff.  You also have a good radio voice, which helps with the narration.   I'll be watching out for future videos.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 30, 2022, 04:54:49 PM
Wow thanks :D

Truth is I start with a cell phone and a crappy Kodak 5 megapixle camera a dozen years ago....then got a free to me El Cheapo Vivitar 'sport cam' which is what you see on the hood of the jeep -- with the ziptie holding the door closed! hahaha -- but I told my subs I'd buy a new GoPro at 200 subs and did that.  It's my main camera still ;) 

I'm trying to learn to get more B roll and get more angles etc but it's a learning experience....meanwhile a new vid drops tomorrow!  It's the old jarhead sitting in front of the woodstove talking about this 12 year build.  Part one drops tomorrow, part two hopefully within 24hrs!   Took me a week though just to get part one done! LOL  One hour of video edited down to 15 to 20 minutes when it's all talking has been a real challenge.

Anyway, thanks again and stay tuned!  More to come :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 30, 2022, 04:59:03 PM
PS.  yes the wife is coming out this trip (Friday)...she hates being on camera though so may not be seen ;)

OH and I still use a cell phone now and then but the GoPro9 has been very good.  I'm almost at 500 subs which surprised me LOL since I did this mostly to show customers my milling stuff and to share cabin and jeep stuff with folks in forums like this -- it's actually easier in some ways than trying to take pics and share them LOL.

And John, if you are still around, I plan to do a short one on the plans I used...will have to think about it a little but plan to do something about your plans and the forum since it's really the best place for cabin builders and dreamers :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 01, 2022, 08:27:53 AM

Part one of my Cabin Build discussion for those interested ;)
There is a link at the end to part two if you are interested :) though as members here you probably know most of it now.  But if not....
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Adam Roby on February 03, 2022, 03:26:23 PM
Thanks for the honest talk, even if going against some of the more hard stances against certain foundation types, etc.
I tried to post on your YouTube directly, but couldn't figure out how to.

I see it similar to you, in that I can not afford to do a big $50,000 build.  I put away a fixed amount automatically every pay, and whenever I reach my next goal of money needed for another step, I withdraw and do the work.  Right now it is a bit demoralizing, what with border closings and raccoons eating away at my roof, but you've re-inspired me somewhat.  Once we are back to normal and allowed to freely travel again, I am going to make an extra effort to get my build back on track.  I know a lot of people would have given up on my shanty, but I still think it will be easier to gut and redo than starting fresh, even if it takes me another 10 years to get it done.  If not, then at least I had 10 years of being out in the woods doing something instead of rotting in front of the TV.  Now to go watch your flood video... 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 09, 2022, 08:48:34 AM
Yup - we mere mortals have to do things on a budget, one step and paycheck at a time! ;)

I am heading back up this weekend to try to finish the paneling in the porch.  I may do some video on my solar system as many seem interested in how I cobbled it together LOL though I always advise them to come here to the off-grid thread/forum discussion as there are folks far more knowledgeable than me there!

Anyhow, can't wait to get back but in the meantime, I finished this table for our living room at home.  It took a LONG time to finish but mostly because I had to dry it first since I milled the logs and then moved and had to build a shop in order to get back to it!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 17, 2022, 08:16:17 AM
SO we had this sink that exploded.....and a sewage pipe that was frozen solid....But it was a great trip to the cabin! ha!

A rough weekend at the cabin is better than a good week at work!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 17, 2022, 06:47:41 PM

Here ya go!  My latest rather eventful cabin trip!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 26, 2022, 07:34:40 AM
Time to fix a sink!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 02, 2022, 09:18:02 AM


We made it up there and got the sink fixed!  Also figured out why I have no cold in the bathroom (the tap is the problem so I'll have to pull it again to fix it).

Heading back up soon to spend a week working on things, watching the grands play and running the sawmill :D

Here's hoping for good weather!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 14, 2022, 03:45:56 PM
Spent a week at the cabin mostly milling, relaxing and splitting wood :D  It was blissful!

Then I quit my job!  Woot!

Going to mill and YT instead ;)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: jsahara24 on April 15, 2022, 06:43:30 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on April 14, 2022, 03:45:56 PM

Then I quit my job!  Woot!


Congrats and good luck!  I am definitely jealous, my job has been getting in my way for quite a while now...ha
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 15, 2022, 10:22:11 AM
Thanks!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 18, 2022, 04:22:52 PM
Here's a couple vids from our last two trips!



and...

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 19, 2022, 11:11:30 AM
Now I just need to get up there, work on the thinning project and get the tractor out so I can get it fixed but I'm concerned it may not happen this summer :(  If not, I'll survive but it's been too long already!

Anyway, more to come as I try to get back to the cabin for some milling and getting more done!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on July 19, 2022, 04:18:33 PM
Get the thinning done and remove the duff around anything important.  Our work paid us back off with the wildfire dropping to the ground and just burning off some grass as it approached our cabin. We have 60+ pines around our cabin that still have glorious full green tops even though the lowest 5 or 6 feet of the trunks are blackened. The grasses in that area have grown back. We are waiting on the logger to begin clearing out all the dead trees where we had not thinned as much or removed all the fallen needles and duff. That should be early august. He has 40 acres to the east, then another 20 belonging to someone else before working westwards to us.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 20, 2022, 07:55:24 AM
I saw that on your thread!  Awesome!

Every year I drive it down to dirt around our cabin and the forester advised that they would definitely work to save our place if they got to it in a fire because of the work we've done so far but we have much to do still so we'll be at it again this summer...hopefully before the smoke flies!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 10, 2022, 07:19:40 AM
It's been a while!  I am heading back to the cabin this weekend -- after more than two months away!!!  Yikes!  It's been a crazy year with both mom's injuring themselves (mine broke her pelvis in a couple places and her arm though the pelvis break wasn't as bad as it sounds it did put her in a rehab place for several weeks -- my wifes mom broke her wrist)...They are doing well now though still sporting casts and needing assistance etc so we're less able to freely travel as much as usual and then I've been milling on the road some as well (I retired in April so I could go milling -- ok, I quit and call it retiring lol)...

Here's a vid from one of my adventures!


I also started a DNR thinning plan for 6.3 acres and will hopefully begin some of that this weekend.


I'll be testing out a new Echo battery powered saw this weekend too!
More to follow
Hope all is well.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on August 10, 2022, 08:21:28 AM
 [cool] It can pay off.  I have not watched the video; maybe later.  Who owns the land around yours? Hopefully, they are also thinning, cleaning up deadfall, etc too.   
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 10, 2022, 10:00:07 AM
Funny thing, a couple of other 'Erik's' own the land around me (and one Patty)...Eric the Seal, Eric Junior, and Erik the Old Jarhead! lol

JR plans to do the same and the Seal did a bunch on his place so it will help I think.  The Forester felt my place was in pretty good shape and said he'd bring in two tenders and a crew to my place if a fire broke out becuase it was a good defendable space and had lots of work done already.

I plan to get up there this weekend and the weather looks good!  Lows in the low 50's and highs in the low 80's.  If that holds it will be good weather to break down the ground around the cabin to dirt and get some sapplings felled!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on August 10, 2022, 01:14:14 PM
Great! Two of our neighbors had done nothing. They both got burned to the ground. Sadly they are not even having the logger clean up the still marketable standing burnt to dead pines. He's done one 40 acre property that was toasted 98% and will finish a second property of 20ish acres, about 2/3 burned. Then ours next week, depending on rains. No charge to us, he gets the timber and it goes to the pueblo sawmill and wood pellet mill. Plus enough trees felled and laid across slopes for erosion control. There have been a couple of rains that have caused trouble as the water runs off the vast burnt areas of nat forest in many places.

 Hopefully you will be untouched by fires and that if fire does come you will share in our good fortune.

Going up for a few days after dinner today
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 11, 2022, 06:05:41 AM
Thanks!  All we can do is hope and work!  Now, to get packing so I can go up and get it prepped! :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 26, 2022, 07:09:21 AM
It's been a whirlwind since that tip and a short one following it!  I have a fair bit of video to put together but I did this little review when we were there.  If you don't have a battery powered chainsaw, check this out!  WOW!  I am impressed.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 07, 2022, 06:30:57 PM
And we finally got the tractor out so we can get the 4wd fixed!


When we return we will be adding a SureFLo RV style pump to the water system with a small pressure tank to increase pressure a bit.  We've lived with it at the low end of 20lbs (maybe a tad more) for a long long time but decided it was time to improve things a little.

With the pump, pressure tank and a strainer in place I hope to actually have the kind of pressure to keep the hot water going when the cold gets turned on ;)  No more 'exciting' showers where it gets scalding hot then suddenly freezing cold!  We hope anyway.

If it works, we're golden, if not then we'll get a new Hot water heater as maybe the el cheapo Mary heater was just, well, too cheap.
Cheers
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: dragonslayer82 on September 20, 2022, 09:06:59 PM
Long time lurker, took the plunge on the property and spent the summer in Aeneas Valley. I love the north winds out of the valley that push the temperature over 102 on some days/weeks.

Building permits for the house are awaiting a well; we already made our deposit for a driller, but the dates have moved from summer to Fall, and now winter. Others are saying maybe four years as of last week.

Anyhow not sure where to ask but here I go:
1) What size of a building actually requires a building permit. Some things say 120sqft, others say 200sqft. Nothing in Okenagon Building Department site makes this clear unless I talk to them (which I want to avoid to stay off the radar).
2) What does the health department have against bulk water delivery to private residences? The experience/phone/emails was less then warm, yet the building department has told others that the state allows water delivery for a building permit, and if they can find a delivery company that would suffice.
3) Is it a mistake to live off grid while awaiting well/permits for a house? Need a better structure then the RV for winter.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 21, 2022, 07:29:23 AM
HI,

Welcome to the neighborhood....it's rare I see it over 100 but maybe I'm higher up?  Usually 90's in August is about what we see...and not uncommon to see 40's overnight at the same time ;)  But it is an arid pine forest in the Okanogan :D

Permits....ya, well, PM me ;)  Cheers!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: dragonslayer82 on September 21, 2022, 11:13:07 PM
You might have to PM me, it's telling me I'm not allowed to
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 22, 2022, 03:04:21 PM

Finally got started!  Woot!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 28, 2022, 02:16:51 PM
WhooHoo!  We're going to seriously step up the thinning game now!

Got the tractor back (after getting it fixed) and a new grapple to make life easier on our thinning project and well, a lot of other things at the property.
Cheers!
Erik
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 27, 2022, 01:29:54 PM
Man this year has raced by!  I didn't get back up to the cabin to do much thinning or, frankly anything else!  Until recently when we made the mad dash up for an overnighter to top off the batteries and do a general checkup on the place and get the plow blade on the tractor.  Here's a vid I did of this trip:


Now, if all goes well I will get up to the cabin again this year at least for a long weekend and then in the spring start going up a little more often.  Part of the issue this year is that I went back to work :(  d* After retiring for all of 6 months I had an offer I couldn't refuse and went back to work.  Probably just for a year to 14/15 months but it was too good to turn down so I'll take it and run for a year or so and get more goodies for the cabin and tractor! ha!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 22, 2022, 07:56:05 AM
Going to be an interesting trip next weekend to spend New Years at the cabin....4 plus foot drifts block the way!  over two feet of snow on the ground....going to have to sled in and dig out the tractor and then try to plow the drive back to our road (about a half mile) so I can get the jeep in....good times!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Bretzel.logic on December 22, 2022, 09:16:43 AM
Hello, I'm new to the forum and am wondering if I'm the only one that can't see images on this thread? 

I can see them on some (not all) of the other ones. Tried Chrome and Safari browsers. Would love to be able to see this build! 



-Brett  
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: jsahara24 on December 22, 2022, 11:02:04 AM
Good luck....I just hired my neighbor to plow me out for our new years trip, we have about 2.5' on the ground....
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 30, 2022, 04:34:33 PM
Hi, sorry about the lost pics!  This thread goes back to the photobucket days and since they changed all their policies the pics were lost (sorta)...I then had my own server a while and had to dump that finally....so, currently no pics on this thread in the early parts...I've often wondered if anyone would be interested in me going back and fixing that...but I'd need a host to put them on first ;)

I have videos of the cabin on my YouTube channel www.youtube.com/@theoldjarhead instead of pics these days

As for the snow, ya, we had to cancel this trip.  I think I'd make it in actually, since I've wheeled the jeep in over 3 feet of snow but I'm worried about a couple places where I'd have to winch in....we were planning a trip with a friend on his snow mobiles but then a neighbor told me they were snowed in and his snow plow was stuck!  With 4 to 5 foot drifts blocking the way and over two feet on the ground he said "I'll let you know when the road is better, but for now I'm waiting to dig out myself so I can plow again --- he's since advised that I can now get within a quarter mile of my place lol  We'll try next weekend or the one after.

At least the solar panels are fee from snow! :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 13, 2023, 02:56:42 PM
So you might be thinking about a small chainsaw...check this out
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 20, 2023, 01:42:01 PM
Heading back up tomorrow!  Wish me luck!  We will likely run into DEEP snow but we'll find a way!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on January 20, 2023, 05:21:44 PM
Best of luck. Chains? Too much snow here for me to be bothered with right now.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 27, 2023, 09:07:10 AM
We made it in!  Had to walk in the last 1/4 mile or so which wasn't too bad as the snow was frozen with a hard surface on top and the neighbors kids had packed down a lot in the field below our place with their sleds.  So for the most part we walked in on top of hard frozen snow (I know snow is frozen lol but I'm talking a hard surface on top frozen).

Then we got the cabin warming, started the tractor and eventually I drove down to the steep hill (with chains on the front of the tractor) and drove the jeep back to the cabin.  Once I got up the hill it wasn't too bad and just 'drove in' to the cabin despite the more than a foot of snow and in places undoubtably two feet!  I just drove on top of it :D

Then I learned the batteries had DIED while we couldn't get up a week or so prior :(  8 years on these batts and we had so much snow over the last month that the panels got covered, there was too much cloud cover and the two 120mm 12v fans, one 90mm 12v fan and the charge controllers were too much for the batteries and my 24vdc bank dropped to an EYE POPPING 9.9vdc!!!!  OUCH!

It stayed down between 10 to 13v over a few days and then got enough sun on the panels to bring it back up to 23.8-25.8v and eventually higher.

So I ran the genny for 5-6hrs and made sure they got a good charge but after 8hrs with the fridge and inverter running (shut the gen off around 8pm) and a few lights for an hour or so, the gen kicked back on at 4am because the batteries dropped to 23.8v under load.  I suppose not terrible since I have the gen set higher than most (I don't want the batts dropping below 20% DoD)...

After getting a LOT of snow off the deck/porch roof but not all of it, and tilting the ground panels over more (to 65*) to ensure they shed and collect some reflected light (off the snow) we left with the inverter running and gen set in auto mode.  The hope is that it doesn't need to come on every day lol but we'll see how things go when we return on the 10th.

I unplugged the fridge and MW to ensure as little a draw as possible and set the gen to a 2.5hr run time and we'll see how things go.

Incidentally, the generator is in it's 10th year!  (shhh don't tell it that! lol) 

We shall see but I'm expecting to have to replace the batteries this summer :(  

I think I'll probably shut down the fans which are in the composter room to move the heat around from the small heater I have in there -- basically I have it set to keep the composter from freezing and usually have it set to keep the room at 50F at the floor so the composter works in the winter and the piping is kept from freezing (sewage) but this year I let it drop to around 40F figuring we wouldn't be there much this winter (since I went back to work).

If I shut down the heater etc and let it all freeze I can keep the fans off and just turn things up when needed....might help keep the batteries safer next winter....or I just need to leave the inverter on and the generator set to autorun as needed...maybe to a lower voltage just to prevent catastrophic failure like we just had.

???
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on January 30, 2023, 05:45:01 PM
8 years on GC-2s is pretty good, very likely to have given trouble this year. We made it into the 9th year and issues began that gave more trouble than I cared to deal with.  My next battery purchase may be lithium, leaving them disconnected from everything over winter. They self-discharge very little and can't be charged below freezing in most cases anyhow. But I don't need or desire to leave anything electrical operating.

I don't know that I would be comfortable with leaving a generator to start and stop by itself over the winter.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 01, 2023, 07:35:48 AM
Thanks Don,

and ya, I don't like the genny doing it too much.  I've left it for a couple weeks before when I was living there so I'm ok with short runs but this next trip we will see.

I may have to make sure they are fully charged and then disco the entire thing when we leave.  I've always had them left hooked up so the little 12v fans could run in the back room to keep the heat circulating a little.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on February 02, 2023, 07:13:54 PM
I have been leaving the PV array and charge controller working and connected to the GC-2 batteries every winter since 2009. Everything has worked fine all that time. I hope my luck holds. For the last few years when we leave in early to mid-December, we don't get back until maybe April. Leaving the CC work ensures the batteries don't self-discharge to a dangerously low level. The inverter and all DC uses are disconnected with proper disconnects; no reliance on an on-off switch on the inverter. Some of those leave a low parasitic drain.

When or if we go lithium at the cabin I will pull all the incoming disconnects too and leave the lithium batteries at mid-charge or thereabouts. My experience with lithium batteries here at home shows very little self-discharge over several months on non-use. I do leave the CC disconnected when we are absent from the  cabin during the lightning season (July thru early Sept.

 

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 03, 2023, 02:03:41 PM
I'd love lithium but the cost is so high!  Plus the need to keep them warm enough to accept a charge.

I am, however, contemplating AGM's for the maintenance free aspect.  I'm getting old LOL.  I'm also looking at 370AH batteries but I think they will be too heavy so may just have to find the highest AH GCB's I can and continue using those.

With the 24v bank I've got to have 3 strings to get enough power for the cabin and have some reserve and it's worked well for me but I'm struggling to find a reasonable alternative for $3k or less....GCB's have run me around $1200 a bank and even with inflation it wouldn't be much over that today vs. AGM's or bigger batteries all seem to run in the $3k plus range...and then I have think about weight since the batteries are in the porch which isn't as sturdy as I'd like if I had to go up in weight....heck, I might have to consider a box like you have and keep them down on the ground but then it will be hard to keep them warm which I prefer to do in the winter with my pop can solar heater and the insulation in the porch.

Options?  I'm open to anything at this point!

I'm also thinking of adding a 24vdc windmill if I can find a decent one that will trickly charge at 2 to 4mph 'breeze' as we don't get much wind but we do get a little.

Hope all is well?
Erik
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 05, 2023, 11:16:49 PM


Meanwhile I finally got the jeep out for a little wheeling
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 22, 2023, 05:08:34 PM
So I'm definitely looking at LiPo4 batteries now.  $3500 should get me into 360AH of LiPo battery bank and as these can be drawn down 80% without damaging them that means I can use as much as 288AH of power before worrying about it :)

That should mean I can set the generator to come on a LOT lower (about 22vdc under load I'm thinking) which means a LOT less genset runtime, less propane as well.

In fact, I'd say it's unlikely I'd need the genset 75% of the year.

The only think I have to consider now, I think, is how to make sure they don't get draw down 100% in the winter and held there for a week (which happened with my GCB's this winter)...however, they have a power shutoff to protect them so I may not have to worry.

I've also got a place to keep them WARM!  Woot!  The back room was originally intended to house batteries until I realized no amount of venting would make me happy.  With the LiPo's they will be in the back room, kept warm and hidden :D  

I'll have to put the Inverter back there too but should be able to leave the charge controllers where they are for now and run the inverter switch to the porch so I can turn it on upon arrival just like I do today.

This will also give me a LOT more useable space in the porch and solve another issue I had which was dealing with venting which is currently through the wall, when I build the addition.  Now I can make some changes without concern.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 23, 2023, 12:33:40 PM
And hey!  Here's my last cabin video!  We've Got Too Much Snow On The Roof! Off-G (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CWsfGLAMGK8)
rid Cabin In Winter. - YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CWsfGLAMGK8)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 28, 2023, 01:23:03 PM
Woo!  Just ordered 360AH of LiPo battery power! :D

Can't wait to install and gain space back on the porch, stop having to water and not worry about using too much power :D :D :D 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 06, 2023, 12:10:16 AM

The start of another cabin adventure!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 09, 2023, 10:48:15 AM

Woot!  Gotta love a good fire!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 14, 2023, 01:05:40 PM
The new batteries arrived!  Since I don't currently have a pic host (I am using Instagram now though so maybe I can share from there??) I can't share but they are impressive!  Not too big or two heavy and come with wheels on the bottom and a rope handle on top!  NICE!

I plan to do a review or three of them (I like to do a review of things early on and then later so you get a better idea of how well they perform over time) and think I can even help folks get a discount if they want some!  (I'm working on an affiliate link so you can get a discount but don't have enough details yet).

More to come!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 15, 2023, 12:46:29 PM
For those thinking about having a sawyer come out, here's one I did on whether or not to dry logs first :D

I started my sawmilling adventure for the cabin build and I keep thinking I need to revisit this thread and try to find a way to put pictures back in...would be a monumental task I think LOL but maybe possible.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 28, 2023, 02:50:28 PM
Planning on a week at the cabin at the end of April!  Can't wait!  Plans for that week are:

1. Install 12v RV water pump into system to boost the gravity pressure to 35psi (it's around 20psi now) to include installing a debris screen and small pressure tank.  With luck this will solve my shower issue (hot then cold, then hot, then cold!).
2.  Tear apart bathroom and kitchen faucets and unplug clogged valves.
3.  Fall at least 1 or 2 big pines and do some sawmilling
4.  Clear small trees per our DNR plan and burn as ,much slash as possible.

Oh and have FUN! :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: jsahara24 on March 29, 2023, 07:38:14 AM
Sounds good, but I thought for sure you'd be installing your new batteries!  
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 29, 2023, 05:27:28 PM
LOL I may....but I need to do some wiring changes to do that so I'm thinking I'll begin working on the back room (forgot to add that I think) and am planing some paneling for it now.

I need to finish the room with some new wiring to accommodate the change in battery location and I need to make something to put the batteries up on (just in case of a flood of some kind) and probably seal them inside of (bugs shouldn't hurt them but maybe they could and I want to be sure nothing gets at them!

So I have work to do but I'm stoked to get them installed! :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 17, 2023, 01:12:53 PM
OK I decided to go ahead and hook up the new batteries next week in the same location as the old ones and will have to hope they don't grow legs ;)  Truthfully I've always worried as remote cabins are just, well, remote and crack heads can find them.  But we'll risk it and get them installed.

I still plan to put in the back room which won't technically be more secure but it will be 'out of site, out of mind' so that might help ;)  It will also be warmer year round which will be good but since I'm working a little longer now I don't have the time to get the room ready before the summer hits so we'll go with this and move on.

Here's hoping they work out great!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: jsahara24 on April 18, 2023, 01:41:37 PM
Makes sense to me, get them up and running and maybe you'll find you want to set something up differently anyway....

I had trouble with theft when I first bought my place, ended up catching the guy who stole my atv trailer and long story short he went to jail for 2 years (lots of priors).....After he got put in jail, and thankfully after he got out, i haven't had an issue since.....

Anyway, good luck....
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on April 21, 2023, 05:44:34 PM
Glad you got it sorted!  I'm stoked to get them up there :D  Gotta put them back in the packing for safe travel (and they weight 80lbs ea) so that will be fun, and then I have to LIFT them onto the truck bed and back onto the pallet (at least I have a tractor up there to take them off with).

With luck I'll get everything up to the cabin safely and be able to get something done finally!  WOOT!  

We are planning almost an entire week up there (Sunday to...some day NLT Sunday) depending on how things go and what we get accomplished and if I can get the new pump installed in the water system so my wife is happier with the cabin water pressure (I'm putting in a Sureflow 12v RV pump inline with an expansion tank and a gravel filter).

I also need to blow out or somehow clean out the sink taps as two of them are plugged up.  

Good times! :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 01, 2023, 12:24:41 PM
Awesome week at the cabin!  Got 7 trees felled, a log deck (for the sawmill) built and stacked, some logs milled, lots of slash burned and a lot of clean up done as well as the new batteries installed and charge controllers sorted out.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 12, 2023, 11:27:05 AM
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 18, 2023, 02:09:51 PM

For those thinking about getting a grapple, here's my take on the LS grapple I bought and you get to see more cabin stuff :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on May 21, 2023, 11:36:15 AM
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on June 20, 2023, 09:25:26 AM
Well due to some health issues I haven't made it back to the cabin as planned but managed to get someone else to do some milling for me.  I am hoping to make it back to the cabin the weekend of June 30th/July 1st to at least check on the new batteries as it sounds like they didn't connect the way they should have and one is blocked out -- apparently the BMS of each batter will connect them all together but if it thinks one of them is not exactly the same voltage than it will block it out and not allow power draw from it so I'll have to see.

Also, I need to turn off the charger on the inverter as it does not have a setting for LiFePo4's and instead I will need to install a 110v charger that will run off the generator and provide a constant 29vdc to charge the batteries up.

That's the plan anyway, and maybe, if I'm lucky, I'll tow up a better running sawmill and cut a little lumber too!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 17, 2023, 11:52:24 AM
Made it back up, may have balanced the batteries, got some ground work done and enjoyed the visit!  Video coming!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 30, 2023, 10:17:10 PM
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on July 31, 2023, 06:30:21 PM
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 02, 2023, 09:13:07 AM
Whew!  It's been a while and I'm trying to catch up!

The 1st of those two videos was in July (mid) when we finally got back to the cabin and did some work to protect it from fires (not enough through really so I need to get back) and worked on the battery bank.

The 2nd video was of a fire, not very far from the cabin, that cut short our trip by a day and created a little 'excitement' (not of the good kind).  So far that fire is slowly increasing in size and is at 15,000 acres but it does appear they are working it well though it's only 10% contained.

Temps are in the upper 80's which is actually kinda cool for this time of year and there is a little rain possible at the end of the week (we can hope), otherwise, it might be a while before we get the kind of weather that will shut down a big fire (usually the rains start in September or October).

So, we'll keep and eye on things and hope and pray the work we did is enough and the fires stay away!
More to come!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 06, 2023, 11:22:29 AM
lots of rain in the forecast this week!  [cool] :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 08, 2023, 07:15:08 AM
Meanwhile, how many amongst us have ever worried about EMP or lightening strikes?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 15, 2023, 03:06:34 PM
A little different but something I went through recently on a trip to BC
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on August 26, 2023, 09:16:08 AM
Getting ready to head to the cabin!  I will be taking the sawmill up with me this coming week and then Darci and I will be there all of the following week!  Lots to do and I'll be sure to get video for you all!

Meanwhile, after being convinced lightening was my issue (not direct but indirect) I decided to protect my sawmill and will be doing it to my cabin soon!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 11, 2023, 03:12:44 PM
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 14, 2023, 09:23:05 AM
Wow!  Awesome week at the cabin!

Managed to get 15 logs milled up, new pump in the back room (sureflow pump to add some water pressure) plus a filter/screen as well as an expansion tank/pressure tank that I forgot to pressurize.  I think I have to blow out the system, or empty that side anyway so I can pressurize it and see how it works).

Have a new water heater to install soon and put in some outdoor screens/blinds on the deck to help with the afternoon and evening sun which tends to bake us during the hot time of year.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on September 14, 2023, 06:25:35 PM
Cattle act the same in NM. As if they oen the forest..
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 15, 2023, 07:26:54 AM
Right?  Litterally just stare at you like "what?  me move?  no! You Mooove!"
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 17, 2023, 09:24:02 AM
Another day thinning trees for fire prevention 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 19, 2023, 05:55:53 PM
Got a fair bit of milling in at the cabin this week and took advantage of that to make more video :D

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on September 29, 2023, 10:59:58 AM
Meanwhile back at the cabin 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 03, 2023, 07:00:28 AM
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 13, 2023, 06:47:42 AM
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 13, 2023, 02:07:50 PM
and if you suffered through that video ;) there's a new one out tomorrow that shows some of the progress on the DLog construction (stacking and waiting period as I mill them) at the end.

Hope all are well!  I plan to get back to the woods next week to FINALLY shut down access to the floor by the pesky rodents (something I've fought with far far too long).
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 14, 2023, 09:13:33 AM
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Mike10gs on October 14, 2023, 09:50:38 AM
Hey good morning, you told me to come to your thread. Wow you have done alot over the years. 
It's my parents first year on the property in pateros. We have so much work to do. 
You said there's ways to find the pipe easier?
I've been digging holes by hand following the pipe. Only got about 15 to 20t away. Didn't do a trench, I've been digging holes every 5ft or so and hope the pipe is still on the same path. 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Mike10gs on October 14, 2023, 10:00:38 AM
Also,just checked out your YouTube channel. Very nice property, wish my parents was a little more hidden with trees. There is not many trees at all besides the orchids around. 
We need to Invest in some machinery as we are doing all by hand at the moment. 
You have definitely motivated me though, you do alot of work on your property. Very nice!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 15, 2023, 08:48:35 PM
HI,

You would need a locator in order to do it but there are plenty around that might be willing to come out for a few bucks to do it for you.  Basically, the easiest way is to stick a 300 foot 'pull tape' (made of steel) down the pipe as far as you can, then the locator gets hooked up to it and the person with the locator just finds the signal and follows it to where ever it goes.

Some also try witching rods.

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 15, 2023, 08:49:54 PM
Quote from: Mike10gs on October 14, 2023, 10:00:38 AMAlso,just checked out your YouTube channel. Very nice property, wish my parents was a little more hidden with trees. There is not many trees at all besides the orchids around.
We need to Invest in some machinery as we are doing all by hand at the moment.
You have definitely motivated me though, you do alot of work on your property. Very nice!
Thanks!

We started with pretty much just hand tools so totally get it!  An ATV can be a useful tractor like tool ;) and a chainsaw but without too many trees then maybe a tractor for blade and bucket work.

Good luck! and I'm happy to answer any questions I can!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 17, 2023, 06:59:57 AM
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 19, 2023, 07:44:14 AM
And now we're fixing this up!  So happy to have done this and more yet to come!  Heading back up today!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on October 24, 2023, 11:03:20 AM
Just returned from another awesome weekend at the cabin (4 days actually) and got much done!  First, this is from a couple weeks ago...
Now at least the outhouse is one step closer to being fully protected!

I just need to remove the log posts up front, the porch floor, replace the floor and posts and protect the floor from water (not sure how yet - maybe linoleum) and then roof it :D

And finish the siding, interior and and...lol that's how it goes.

Then I fixed my tractor:
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 03, 2023, 12:28:59 PM
Got lights?  These are awesome! 
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 14, 2023, 07:56:51 AM
Finally!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 16, 2023, 08:10:20 AM
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on November 20, 2023, 07:45:57 AM
Got light?

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 14, 2023, 08:48:25 AM
Got the tractor protected, not to do a service on the generator this weekend and lift it up onto a pallet while I'm at it.  Then maybe do the EMP Shield on it too!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 15, 2023, 07:58:25 AM
Heading back to the cabin today!

Hope to get the generator lifted onto a plastic pallet (until I can get the concrete poured next spring/summer) and a service done, burn some slash and mill some lumber.

Also will be interesting to see how the LiFePo4 batteries are doing but so far I am SUPER HAPPY I got them!!!

Cheers
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 19, 2023, 08:01:10 AM
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 19, 2023, 10:24:47 AM
Turkey's, Coyotes, Horses, Bucks and Cougars oh my :D

Got the baffle for the solar heater so I think I may be able to solve that issue!

More to come!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 21, 2023, 08:26:48 AM
and for those wondering....
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on December 28, 2023, 08:08:35 AM
After ten years something had to be done!

Ten years!?  Wow!  Now that I think about it, that's just, well, crazy!  Ten years!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 04, 2024, 08:26:04 AM
Here's a quick cabin update for everyone :D
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 08, 2024, 06:15:54 PM
Great weekend at the cabin!

Got some milling done and will have some new cabin update videos as well! Here's a few pics from this weekend thanks to Adam for working on the gallery!  Whoohoo!  A place RIGHT HERE to store pics so I can share them again!  Woot!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 09, 2024, 08:30:32 AM
New video out today!  However, the weather is going to get COLD again like it hasn't since the winter of 2013/14!!!  That worries me as I did not get my batteries into the back room.  My solar heater was doing ok and I insulated the floor of the porch and thought I'd slide by this winter and now I'm hearing temps could drop to the minus teens!!!  ??? ???

I'll call Big Battery today and see what they think but may need to get up there and turn everything off while the super cold weather hits.

 Meanwhile...
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: Adam Raabe on January 09, 2024, 10:21:18 AM
Quote from: OlJarhead on January 08, 2024, 06:15:54 PMthanks to Adam for working on the gallery!  Whoohoo!  A place RIGHT HERE to store pics so I can share them again!  Woot!

Glad you're able to post directly to the forum now! (as should be true now for all members)

If anybody else still has a problem posting images/files please send me a direct message and I'll try to get it working for you.

Best!
Adam
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 09, 2024, 02:51:51 PM
Thanks!  I appreciate that feature!

So I'm in trouble :( These temps are a worry for my fancy new LiFePo4 batteries and I now will have to quickly head back to the cabin to move the batteries from the porch where the pop can solar heater isn't working well enough to keep them above 20F in extreme cold temps and move them into the back room where I planned to move them anyway...I just need to do it NOW!

Kinda worrisome really but at least I have a plan to get it done (I think) as long as I can get the help I'll need to transport them to the back room as they weight in at 80lbs each!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 11, 2024, 09:28:44 AM
The saga continues with -15F predicted tomorrow night now!!!  Yes folks, the race is on!  Tim Flaten and I will at least try to move the batteries from the porch into the back room where I have a heater that keeps the room from freezing.  If we can do that we will then move the 24v to 12v converter so the fans in the back room will run as they are needed to keep the heat circulating inside the room (otherwise it just rises to the roof and the floor freezes.

I figure we can place the batteries on some insulation blanket (the silver stuff) to further insulate them from the floor and hook up the converter.  Then we just have to run some 10awg wire from the Morningstar charge controller to the back room, move the DC Connect panel and hook it all up so they will get a charge from the ground panels which is really all they should need when we are not there.  Of course, then we could run from the Outback Charge controller and the roof panels as well just because that would be better.

If that's all we manage it will be enough to save the batteries.  If we don't want to try to do the rest I can do it in warmer temps.  Or, if we have the energy we can move the inverter etc to the back room and start changing out the wiring to make it all work.

Meanwhile here's the latest cabin video!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 16, 2024, 03:33:00 PM
Meanwhile at the cabin :)
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 23, 2024, 09:01:06 AM
Free Heat?  Sure!  But I have this issue...
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: MountainDon on January 23, 2024, 09:24:35 AM
A link to the baffle?
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 24, 2024, 08:16:28 AM
Good catch!  DOH!  Fixing now!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 24, 2024, 08:17:59 AM
https://amzn.to/3u403D6

I forgot to add this into the video but thanks to MD I just did!

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 24, 2024, 08:54:39 AM
A little 'cabin life video'
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 29, 2024, 07:47:31 AM
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: jsahara24 on January 29, 2024, 11:10:27 AM
Little chilly eh....haha....Glad you got it worked out..
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on January 29, 2024, 01:41:40 PM
:) Yup!  Met too!

Just got back from another trip working on the new location.  Lots to do but getting there!  Now, about the water seeping into the back room...  ???
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 01, 2024, 07:54:52 AM
and we went back!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 05, 2024, 08:46:28 AM
I forgot to post this one...meanwhile, since moving everything, I'm finally forced to make the console I planned on making so I can have my Tri-Metric meter, Autogen start switch and AIMS Inverter remote all located inside the cabin where I usually sit.  So, I'll be working on that this week (already started) and hope to get at least some of it installed this coming weekend!  Wish me luck!

Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 07, 2024, 06:54:34 PM
Finally after all these years I am working on a console for my solar power and car stereo.  I'm not a cabinet maker by any stretch but I think this will turn out fine for my uses :D

Once the glue dries I'll give it a light sanding and stain it and with luck, maybe even get some varathane on it before we head to the cabin with it Friday.  Otherwise I'll have to leave it as is (stained anyway).   

The open space below is for fire starting stuff (papers, dryer lint, tools etc).  The top will just be a place to set things.
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 08, 2024, 08:15:23 AM
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 12, 2024, 06:31:59 PM
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 17, 2024, 10:58:25 AM
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 20, 2024, 08:15:30 AM
Hoping to get back Friday to fix my sawmill and get back to making D-Logs and other lumber for the addition.  Meanwhile...
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 27, 2024, 09:10:30 AM
You really should check out those lights!  They are awesome...meanwhile...
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on February 29, 2024, 08:13:49 AM
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 01, 2024, 10:03:51 AM
Alright!  Heading back today!  Two weekends in a row is awesome :D  Starting to feel like this year might be a good year of getting stuff done at the cabin!

This trip plans are to fix the sawmill (new alternator and belt), install hooks and organizers inside the cabin cupboards (Darci wants them more organized) and maybe get some slash burned but the weather might make us just spend time indoors too.  Hard to say!
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 05, 2024, 09:51:13 AM
Two weeks ago...
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 07, 2024, 11:44:25 AM
I had a lot of fun with this one -- note:  It's supposed to be a little funny and entertaining (well, hopefully very funny but you might need more backstory).
Title: Re: Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)
Post by: OlJarhead on March 14, 2024, 06:53:57 AM
We're back at the cabin and hoping to get the sawmill fixed and...well, I'll explain it here: