20 x 30 Single Story in Central NY

Started by Squirl, August 03, 2011, 02:41:42 PM

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BRUTAL

LOOKING REALLY GOOD, YOURE DEALING WITH TOO MUCH WATER. WE IN SE TEXAS ARE IN A 100 YR DROUGHT :-\
IVE HAD ABOUT 20% OF THE TREES ON THE PROPERTY DIE THIS YR AND WHO KNOWS WHAT WON'T MAKE IT PAST LEAFOUT IN THE SPRING...
http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=11116.0
making mistakes along the way and wishing Ide been here sooner :)

archimedes

Looking good.  You'll be framing before you know it.     d*
Give me a place to stand and a lever long enough,  and I will move the world.


Squirl

A few lessons learned so far from doing the block.

1.   Clearing the mortar out of the joint with a tool or finger is to hide imperfection in the block or block work.  It is harder for an eye to notice any edge of a block is not perfectly aligned with the block next to it with mortar missing in a concave joint.  I noticed this by taking a really close look a professionally done block walls, and comparing my wall to theirs.  They had the same mistakes and imperfections, just your eye could not readily see them from a distance.
2.   Blocks are imperfect.  They can easily vary from 1/16 to 1/8 inch to any edge.  Most are strong, but every so often you will get one that will just shatter.
3.   There is a top and bottom to the block. The top is the wider end for a nice thick area to mortar too.
4.   Mortar calculators lie out of their a**.  They told me to estimate 10 blocks for each bag of mortar.  I have been going with extra thick 3/4 joints to get even close to that.  I am 2/3 of the way done with my wall and I'm not even 1/3 of the way through my mortar.
5.   Another thing that seems like a waste of mortar is mortaring the center between blocks.  Because of how center and corner blocks are designed the center of the block never lines up over anything on the block below.  I didn't even see it in the Sakrete instructional video. Only do this for the first row.
6.   A hand mixer (drill and 2" paddle) is fine for an amateur.  I/3-1/2 of a 5 gallon bucket is all I can get through before the mortar starts to set.  It is also easy to lug around.  A full bucket breaks the handle.  I add the mortar to the water mixing a little as I add.  It gets the best mix.  Quikrete also states you should add the mortar to the water.
7.   A tape measure and a rock are an excellent way to cheat and keep your joints even as you go.  This is great for an amateur.  This will destroy a retractable tape measure. I'm not sure if this is from the dust and dirt or the spring being pulled out for hours at a time.  Be prepared to throw it out when you are done.  A 25 ft measure will work great for a 30 ft wall.
8.   Don't use expensive small tools around the wall.  They will end up falling down the holes.  At this point I have a line block and tape measure that will be Hoffa'ed into the wall.  If the wall was a little taller, I would be adding a torpedo level and another tape measure to that list.  I still might.
9.   Buy extra line blocks. They are cheap.  $2.50.  Changing the string back and forth between the 20 and 30 ft walls is a PITA.
10.   Buy lots of string.  From the batter boards to the line blocks, I went through a lot. 
11.   Set your corners either the night before or at least two blocks in a row.  A line block strung tight enough for no sag, will pull a corner block off its' base even after a few hours.
12.   A 20 x 30 is a perfect block foundation size.  There are 22 blocks on the two 30 ft sides. By alternating the 20 ft sides by 14 and 15 blocks every other course you will have a perfect running block wall with no cut blocks.
13.   I prefer the cheap cloth gloves with the plastic palms.  They keep your hands dry with the wet mortar, and are not deteriorated by the caustic nature of Portland cement.  I had both expesive and cheap leather gloves fall apart equally as fast.  I also found that I can use my fingers to joint the blocks with the plastic gloves.

If I remember any others, I will share.

bikeralan

Squirl,
Just finished a crawl space, bought a house that was moved to our land in two pieces.
I used a couple mortar tubs from Home Depot, they worked good you can skid them around easily.
Also a friend gave me a couple line holders that are metal and slide on top of the blocks, they are well worth it check at a concrete place, they don't put near the strain on the block and you can set them inside or outside so you don't have to lift block over the line. Also get a thing called a sled, a long striking tool for the joints, it hides a LOT of sin lol.
Good luck
Alan

Don_P

 w* bikeralan
One other thing about striking joints is that you should wait till they are thumbprint hard and then strike them with a tool, this compacts and strengthtens the surface of the joint helping it to wear better over time.


Squirl

w* Alan

Thank you for the insight.  I saw those metal clamps in videos and books and had no idea where to find them or how they worked.  I have a mortar tub too.  The 80lb bags are heavy and too unwieldy for me.  I like to empty half into the tub and work with it from there.

I called the building inspector and got the go ahead to balance backfill to grade. 
I'm looking into using all of the extra mortar as a stucco scratch coat over the above grade block.  Sakrete's mix is specifically advertised for both.  I have a local brand and am not sure of its versatility.

Also I changed the venting design to four missing blocks.  One would be near each corner within the top row of blocks on the east and west walls.  The wind blows from west to east over my ridge.  Does anyone know if they make vents the size of a concrete block?

Alan Gage


RIjake

Squir, I wonder if what I installed in my crawlspace would work for you.  Mine are 6"x18" and should fit right in.  They have louvers inside screening and they operate on a bimetal spring.  Here's the link.
http://www.airvent.com/homeowner/products/foundation-auto.shtml


duncanshannon

hey squirl - nice lessons learned. very insightful, and even a little funny!  ;)
Home: Minneapolis, MN area.  Land: (no cabin yet) Spooner, WI area.  Plan: 20x34 1 1/2 Story. Experience Level: n00b. 
Build Thread: http://countryplans.com/smf/index.php?topic=10784.0


Squirl

Those are interesting articles Alan.  The first address a foam vapor barrier on the bottom of the floor joists, but not plastic.

I don't have a lot of choice.  I discussed these with the inspector when I called about changing the venting arrangements.  He was familiar with all the different schools of thought.  He said no for my place.  Something about the soil drainage, it won't work.

UK4X4

I can't imagine your face when you turned up at the site to see that pool of water

well done for persevering !

Don_P

There are 8x16" vents that fit in a block space. Use a jamb bloack, the ones with a smooth end and a vertical groove, on each side of the gap. Fill the block below solid.

Squirl

I tried filling in the backfill this weekend.  I started by hand with a pickaxe and shovel on the clay mounds.  I got about 3 hours in and tired out.  As an office worker, I am not used to a full day of manual labor.  I took a break and tried working on getting my tractor to start to use the front end loader.  I spent most of the rest of the day tooling around with it.  I spent four hours the next day hand filling dirt in and the rest of the time tinkering with the tractor.  I couldn't get it to start.  I only got half one 20 ft wall done in 6 hours of shoveling by hand.  Rather than spend my time taking a risk on getting the tractor started, I think I may look at renting a unit.

For those interested in the tractor story.  It ran great when I bought it.  It would start right up from a cold start in November.  Pretty good for an 8n.  That tells me that it is probably not a compression problem.  It was giving me a little trouble starting after the winter.  The person who 12V converted it, didn't screw in the key holder very well.  As I turned the key it shifted the whole switch and shorted out on the body.  It melted all of the wires around it.  I rewired it and I now have 12v to the coil.  I replaced the plugs, but am getting spark only some of the time.  I think the short damaged the electrical system and I'm probably going to have to replace it all.  Luckily it is an 8n.  Simple and plentiful parts.  The problem is it has a front end loader, which these tractors were not designed for.  I may have to disassemble half of the tractor to redo the electric.

RIjake

Squrl how did you make out with the venting?  Did you check out those vents?

Glad you got the tractor sorted out too.  I've loved those old Ford tractors since I was a kid.  I almost bought an 8N this summer.  A guy less than a mile from me had one in his yard for sale.  It had a tiny little bucket on it.  The loaders don't work well?


Squirl

When I returned the pallets from the block this weekend, they had the automatic vents you had posted.  I picked up four.  They were $15. 

The loader works great when the tractor is running.  But if you need to work on anything, even refueling, it is a pain, because the aftermarket loader supports block everything.

I was able to access the starter switch, coil resistor, coil and distributor cap this weekend.  I may have to disassemble the tractor if I have to do the points.

new land owner

squirl

  Do you see any reason those vents could not be installed vertically?  I also bought 4 but they are too wide for a 16" on center PT wall?

Squirl

I don't see why not.  Venting is pretty broad in all the definitions I read.  There are about a dozen variations in the code of "or" not "and".  The important thing is to get it near the corners of the building for some cross flow.  There is no requirement for height or automatic closing of the vents. A hole covered in hardware cloth is considered acceptable.  A lot of the cheaper $5 vents seemed to be pretty close to that. Also it seems like it would be easy enough to fix.  That part of the foundation is above grade by so many inches.  You could easily block and patch it if it doesn't work out.

Squirl

I rented a walk behind loader.  It worked pretty well.



I filled the outside.



Then leveled and filled the inside.



All leveled and filled.


archimedes

Looks good.

How many more rows higher are you going to go with the block?
Give me a place to stand and a lever long enough,  and I will move the world.

Alan Gage

Maybe it's not as bad as it looks but I cringe every time I see that ground you have to work with. It looks like it would be impossible to keep anything clean. I suppose when it's not soaking wet it's hard as a rock.

I know from my experience this spring that after the hassle of the foundation it feels really good to start working with wood and getting walls up. Good luck.

Alan



Squirl

Four more rows before the floor.  I have the corner blocks set for the fourth row except the northwest corner, which is the corner at the front in the last picture.  As you can see it is freshly mortared block.  I tried balancing the fill as I went.  A little on one side, a little on the other.  Well without the fill filled up to the top on the outside, as I brought the machine to the edge to fill the inside, the ledge gave way.  The machine came crashing down into the block and I cracked off the corner blocks.  I checked the figures and even with the heaviest soil, the wall could handle 4 ft of unbalanced fill without rebar.  The wall is 3'-4".  So I filled the outside then the inside.  The areas the machine could reach from the outside edge such as the north, south, and west walls I filled in from the outside.  Areas that it could not reach, I used the inside fill to fill them.  I was originally shooting for 12" of unbalanced fill, but ended up with 8"-12" depending upon the spot.  This will give me a crawlspace of 2'-8", instead of 3'.  With the addition of the centerbeam the center will be at 2ft clearance.


Squirl

Quote from: Alan Gage on October 04, 2011, 09:10:42 AM
Maybe it's not as bad as it looks but I cringe every time I see that ground you have to work with. It looks like it would be impossible to keep anything clean. I suppose when it's not soaking wet it's hard as a rock.

I know from my experience this spring that after the hassle of the foundation it feels really good to start working with wood and getting walls up. Good luck.

Alan


So do I.  I've completely ruined the interior of my Jeep.  The mud is mostly a fine red clay that stains everything and does not come out of plastic. I'm usually covered in mud the entire weekend. It rained part of the time and rained most of last week and will rain the beginning of this week.  The mud in the center turned into a slurry that I could pushed around like too wet mortar.  When the sun came out Sunday and dried it, I would need point to move it.  Two neighbors came by and commented on my determination (stubbornness).  They said they would have given up a while ago.  It has been the wettest year ever recorded.  One neighbor is in his 70's and lived across the street most of his life.  He never remembered it being this bad.  The whole field has turned into a swamp.

CjAl

Sucks to work in but makes a sweet mud bog!! Can i bring my jeep?

UK4X4

I found washing detergent and a good scrub brush good for getting ground in dirt out of car interiors and plastics

don't ask me how I know  >:(

Only popped out for a 3hr mud plug on sunday morning with some colombian friends - we eventually got back to terra firma Monday night at 6.00pm


0530hrs after sleeping in the trucks overnight with no food water or sleeping bags " we'll be back in the pub by 4"

Squirl

So I went for a final push before the snow sets in.  The first night temperatures dipped below freezing so I had to do some cold weather mortar work.

First I heated the water to just under 100 degrees.  Luke warm.  Just enough to comfortably put my hand in.



Then I would add some calcium hydroxide.  This was only for mortaring the blocks because there was no steel.  Otherwise the calcium hydroxide would be out.



Sill bolts have to be 1/2" bolts, 7" deep, 6 ft O/C or less.
http://publicecodes.citation.com/icod/irc/2009/icod_irc_2009_4_sec003_par010.htm

I filled the lower block with paper.  The empty mortar bags work great.



I then filled them with mortar.



I then measured 7" on a 10" J bolt.



I then set the bolt in the mortar to the line.



Finished laying block.  Now to build the crawlspace access and the center beam.