Forum Etiquette -Rudeness not well tolerated

[Amanda_931]

Edited by Glenn ----Note from Glenn at end of posts.




If the demand water heater works for less than 1/2 an hour a day, is your system going to be stressed by a power vent?  Or are you going to need it to run a whole lot more because you heat with radiant hot water in the floor?

Do you have enough water pressure to run it?  I think people trying to skimp here are the ones who scream and rant on the subject of how much they hate the demand heaters.  Apparently the "minimum of 20 psi" is rather less than enough to run it successfully and all the time.  Some brands may be better than others.

I may ask tonight when I see them what a friend has in the way of a water heater.  I think it's a combination emergency generator/water heater running on propane.  I know they don't have the pressure to run the demand heater.  These are the off-grid people who run water up to a tank not much if any above the level of their second floor.  With a home-built ram pump.  So they have plenty of water, even in dry years like this one when I ran short.  They run the excess into a water feature in their garden, and thence back to the little stream.

Or, if you've got running water upstairs at all could you run your hot water from there--like directly above the kitchen and laundry and (other) bathroom?

[glenn kangiser]

I'm using the Bosch HX 125 on an outside wall with shelter over it and no vent pipe - it is vented to the outside through the green house.  I know a fire chief running one in the attic with no vent out -he thinks it is OK but plans on venting it someday.

I don't know what to call your bumpout except a bumpout with a shed roof.  Possibly mechanical room bumpout with a shed roof or utility room with a shed roof.  I'm actually a steel guy who volunteers here to keep the natives in line so don't be too mean to me. :-/

[John Raabe]

Flyer:

You could do a cantilevered pop-out supported back onto double studs in the wall. I have a detail for such a pop-out window seat in the Universal Cottage (2 story 20' wide) plans. It can give you about 3' of depth. I call it a pop-out and others might call it a bump out. There is no exact technical name for this so cut the folks some slack.  

That said about the bump/pop-out, I don't know why you would need it. Most of the tankless heaters I have used can mount on the outside of the wall. They don't need a chimney to the roof.

See this earlier thread for more information: http://www.countryplans.com/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1100110715/0#0

[PEG688]

For being a god memeber you don't read very well - I want to know what the design of having the bump in the wall is called so I can do more research on it.

I have done all of my research regarding the water heater and my solar capabilities.

 #1: Dog house :   Just about any bump out with a roof can be called a dog house. It could house a zero clearance stove / hot water tank , etc .

 #2: Plumbing/ vent/ chimney   [highlight]Chase[/highlight]: generally no roof/ roof-let involved. It dies out under / Thur the existing eave using the main roof as it's cover.

Try googling those nomenclature's.  

 The forum program assigns the members status , although Glenn can sometimes talk , type like he thinks he's is    

[glenn kangiser]

 The forum program assigns the members status , although Glenn can sometimes talk , type like he thinks he's is    

That's why John made me an administrator - He didn't want me to have a chance of ever becoming a God Member.  Thought it would go to my head and ruin my humble personality.  :-/  

Then the only one who would know of my low self esteem would be my wife. :-?

[benevolance]

Flyer

We disagree here sometimes...Just ask Peg and I to talk a little politics But we try to keep it polite and civil...

The learn to read comment was a bit much man....Keep it easy going here...Guys like Peg, John, Glenn know a lot about a lot and they will help you...They have all helped me and numberous others...Free of charge of course

Amanda is a essential member to this community. John's quote says it all...None of us is as smart as all of us..

Cheers,
-Peter

[PEG688]

Goes ta show ya how well I read I was thinkin the new guy was pickin on Glenn's reading ability    Amanda's more of a C/P's GODDESS BTW

And yes we won't go into politics , eh Peter, I'd  hate to put you on my ignore list , well seeing we don't have that option on this forum,  I have to use my own restraint/ self will to say outta those threads  



So can't we all just get along?   Good ole Rodney , if he could just stay sober he'd be all right.  
  G/L PEG  

[Amanda_931]

My friends only have their little propane generator underneath their plain old tank type water heater.

It truly sounded like a nice idea.

[Sassy]

So Peg, ya mean you don't read all my wonderful political postings?   Well, at least Amanda does...    She usually sheds some extra light or reveals a different angle on a topic that I hadn't thought about - besides knowing lots about a lot of things.   8-)

[glenn kangiser]

Actually, Amanda, there is no reason anyone on our forum should have to worry about whether what they say is a good idea and applies exactly or doesn't apply exactly.  This is the internet and passing messages back and forth doesn't always get directly to an answer until sufficient information is posted.  None of us are getting paid to help people.  They can take what applies and reject the rest.  There is no reason to get rude about any answer given here.

A rude remark toward someone who offers as much help and information as you do - some applying directly and some in a bit of an abstract manner should not and will not be well tolerated here.

The help and information given here is done by volunteers who are kind enough to take their time to try to help.  There are no guarantees.  Exact guaranteed answers cost money and must come from a local professional such as an engineer or architect who can survey all conditions and design accordingly.

For those of us not requiring more than brainstorming, we can handle it.

Biting the hand that feeds you just doesn't make sense.

There are plenty of rude forums around - most of us don't go there.  So carry on Amanda.  Thanks for the help and time you put into this forum.

[glenn kangiser]

My reading and typing ability, PEG - I can barely do either - :-/--- but I'm fast enough to  keep this forum messed up.

[benevolance]

Glenn

For the record my advice and tips are guaranteed.... Guaranteed to be worth what they cost

carry on,

[glenn kangiser]

The member who started this post has apparently removed themself from the forum.  I didn't do it -

They apparently couldn't take criticism of their rude reply to a nice answer that didn't exactly fit what they wanted to know.  

Telling someone to "learn to read" when they are getting free help doesn't make a lot of points here.  We are friends and treat each other with respect -- not that we always agree with each other.  There are plenty of forums that allow rudeness out there.  They can go there to post snotty remarks.  If they want to stay here all they have to do is lose the attitude- I wouldn't have even erased the rude remark or responses too it.  I wouldn't have banned them from posting unless they continued their attitude or got worse.

In my opinion all of your responses to his rude remark were appropriate and if they choose to leave rather than change their ways that's their choice. Our members chose to not tolerate his behavior.  [highlight]Good for you[/highlight].

Note that I censor myself more than anyone on here.  Posting - rethinking - are all fine -- anyone can take back things they feel were inappropriate.  You can edit your own posts or I can do it.  We can't do anything about people who have read it before it gets edited but later readers will never know you made a boo-boo.

I don't often edit or remove items from posts unless they are way out of line.  Neither does John.  

In this case I left the remark and the jury of our members decided that attacking one of our family members wasn't going to be tolerated.  

No walking on eggshells here - just play nice.  Be civil - keep from tearing each other up and if you're mean, at least be polite about it.

[Amanda_931]

Thanks.

I was going to say that I've been in the situation where I mentioned something (running water usually) offhand, and got asked why I didn't do such and so to get real water to the trailer.  I really had thought it all out, explored a bunch of options,  so I would get a bit offended.  But then there was the off chance that somebody could really come up with a simple effective answer.  So I usually answer that one nicely.

Very similar to what happened to Ozarkflyer there, but I was on the other side.

And it didn't help at all that I was dead wrong about my friend's generator.  

[glenn kangiser]

There are so many times here that we find an answer to something from some other comment that someone makes that is slightly off to the side of the topic or related in a vague way.  Postings are free -there just doesn't seem to me to be any reason to snap at someone for trying to help - who knows  -- we may learn something other than what we were first trying to learn.  There's always room to ask another question until we find the answer we were looking for.  In the meantime we can enjoy learning something new or having a laugh.  

If the question doesn't get answered the first time -ask again -- our fees are the same regardless of how long it takes to get an answer out of us.  Our answers are worth as much as the fees we charge also.  $0.0 per answer - one price fits all.

Thanks for hanging in there with me -

I try to handle these things gently but after thinking on this one for the day it seemed a little more clarity was in order.  Looks like everyone agreed with me.

[desdawg]

Well, I didn't care for the attitude either but I bit my tongue. There aren't too many situations I can't make worse with very little effort. As a wise man once said "Sometimes it is better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt."

[glenn kangiser]

I know what you mean, desdawg.  That is why I'm a bit slow to comment sometimes on something like this.  I usually try to figure out a way to get both sides to be happy but it doesn't always work out.  

We had an obnoxious inspector on here a while back - on a mission from god--- I asked him to lighten up a bit but he wouldn't - I didn't kick him off but made it clear where we stood and he decided that If he couldn't be mean he would leave voluntarily.  Some people are just that way.

I'd love to have an inspector on here, but send me a nice one-- not one on a power trip.

My goal for this forum is for it to be a place where no one is intimidated no matter how little they know.  I have left many clubs, forums etc. because of people on power trips - rudeness, bullies etc.  It will not happen on my forum without something being done about it.

[PEG688]

I'd love to have an inspector on here, but send me a nice one-- not one on a
power trip.

quote]

Rare as hens teeth , well almost ,I've met one that I remember in 30 or so years of building  

Maybe Ozak will come back under a new screen name , or heck just come back and play nice / get along yadad yada yadad.

There choice really , Hey I was a arse when I first came here, maybe I'm still considered one by some   :-/ But I do try to be nice , really

PEG

[glenn kangiser]

Some decide to be nice and stay - some don't --  

Glad you decided to be nice and stay-- I don't know what we'd do without you.

I knew that under that ornery facade you were a great guy.  (Nearly all the time).

[John Raabe]

I think this has probably worked out for the best. We have not ignored the problem (which might have left resentment and hurt feelings). We've discussed the ways we feel people should be treated and have supported our "troops". In short, the community has pulled together.

Now, I don't think Flyer made so big a boo boo that he couldn't make a simple quick apology and move on. That is what I would have liked to see.

Some folks only have experience with what I'll call "Jerry Springer" type forums — the ones where the louder you scream and the more ruthless and rude you can be the more likely you are to be heard.

I am personally very gratified that for some unknown reason this forum has not gone that route. Instead, we have developed the character of a small town community where people do small favors for each other and where, if your car breaks down, the next person along the road will stop and help you fix it.

[glenn kangiser]

That's the way I felt about it too.  I wish Flyer would have just said, Oh sorry - I just had a bad hair day, or some such thing.  He could have been here with the rest of us and no one would have given it another thought.

We just will not deteriorate to the level of dissonance allowed in the other forums. Not because we want a bunch of rules.  Just because we want this to be a nice place.  We don't want anyone to wish they hadn't come here, or hadn't attempted to help another member with a problem---- or even fearful of asking a question because of fear of someone making a rude remark.  

[benevolance]

John

I too have noticed the Jerry Springer mentality in dealing with people in the automotive industry....

I think where this board differs is that even though we disagree we have great amounts of respect for each other. This respect has been earned....We put time effort and thought into this board. We use our experiences and share valueable information with each other.

The Jerry Springer mentality goes down the line where Respect is not earned...Meaning violence or the threat of.. yelling theatrics equal earning respect.

In the real world and in here that does not work.

I think a lot of people would agree with the statement that they are proud to be part of this community.

And we can disagree and get upset and still have respect for each other....Just ask Peg...If we start talking politics we might want to attack each other with sawzalls....But it does not mean we would ever discount the other person's ability to contribute to this board.

We did not exactly jump down that guys throat....But I am glad that the general consenus of the board was that rudeness is not welcomed.

If Flyer wants to come back fine....He can have a shot at earning our respect and being part of the community. This place is like most other things in life...you get back based on what you put in. His first experience was less than spectacular because from the get go he did not use common sense and refused to play nice. It played out according to his actions....It was all ultimately up to him to rectify the problem or to remain a poster here.

And for the record Glenn you have removed and editted a lot of my posts in the past....you must see me as a black helicopter inducing fanatical do you?

Or maybe you were just looking out for me like a long lost father? If that is the case your long lost son is out of money on the house project and needs an advance on his allowance.....got internet and been working in the house...I will update the thread later tonight....Off to Lowes to get a new set of taps and a shower head....Wife did not like the 1940 shower head...Bad water pressure.. yada yada yada

[glenn kangiser]

Well, son--- you sometimes get a bit of a potty mouth so I'm just looking out for you.  Right after I quit spending all my money on equipment and toys, I'll be cutting you an allowance check.

As I remember, a few of your rants were based on my rants which didn't come off so well and were removed also.  I guess if we could be good I wouldn't have to remove or edit our postings. :-/

[benevolance]

Well

I do have a potty mouth a little...Get me talking about politics after I have had a few beers and the old sailor talk will come out...

It is your fault Glenn....you and Pegs....making this place so political

[williet]

I've learned a great deal from each and everyone of you.

This is the internet and in an open forum, any and all ideas are food for thought. Your discussions inspire thought and that's the point isn't it? For very specific answers, very specific questions should be ask .... and even then one should remember ... this is the internet.

Thanks for the discussions, the answers to specific questions and the photos. ALL of this inspires me to march on with my building plans.

This is a wonderful forum.